Speaker 1: M. This is the Anxiety Bites podcast and I am
Speaker 1: your host, Jen Kirkman. Welcome to another episode of Anxiety Bites.
Speaker 1: I am your host, Jen Kirkman. Today it's just you
Speaker 1: and me as I answer some listener emails and go
Speaker 1: from there. So let's just get right into it. By
Speaker 1: the way, thank you all for sending me listener emails.
Speaker 1: If you want to be part of a future Anxiety
Speaker 1: Bites listener email episode, you may send me an email
Speaker 1: at Anxiety Bites Weekly at gmail dot com and I
Speaker 1: could read your email on air. You can ask me
Speaker 1: anything to do with this podcast and anxiety. If you
Speaker 1: want advice, if you want clarification of something, and if
Speaker 1: you have any tips and tricks and coping mechanisms and
Speaker 1: skills and inspiration from your experience with anxiety recovery, please
Speaker 1: share it on the podcast and I will read it
Speaker 1: and you will inspire all of the listeners. Okay, let's
Speaker 1: just get to some emails where people are saying thank you,
Speaker 1: and then we'll get into the two topics today, which
Speaker 1: is the Sunday scarys and finding a therapist and what's
Speaker 1: the difference between counselors therapist psychologists? All that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: I'll answer both to the best of my abilities. This
Speaker 1: is an email from someone named Heather who wanted to
Speaker 1: tell me about a weird dream she had about a pool. Jen.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your Anxiety Bites podcast. It
Speaker 1: has really helped me out when I've probably needed it
Speaker 1: the most. I'm recovering from a head injury and I'm
Speaker 1: still dealing with it. I was in speed therapy, occupational therapy,
Speaker 1: physical therapy, and also talk therapy. Lost my insurance, no
Speaker 1: longer able to get any further treatment, and just trying
Speaker 1: to pick up my pieces. On your last listener email episode,
Speaker 1: there was a woman that wrote regarding her sixteen year
Speaker 1: old daughter going through anxiety with high school issues. You
Speaker 1: mentioned to her to get a cognitive behavior therapy work book. Well,
Speaker 1: I had no idea that even existed. I looked one
Speaker 1: up and found a book for myself and ordered it
Speaker 1: from Amazon. I'm barely into chapter one, but I see
Speaker 1: that it will be very beneficial for me. I know
Speaker 1: this email is pretty long already, but I just wanted
Speaker 1: to share with you my experience, and you can use
Speaker 1: my name if you read it on this podcast. I
Speaker 1: don't mind. Good thing that she said that because I
Speaker 1: did say her name, But don't worry, I had already
Speaker 1: read this email before I knew it was okay. I've
Speaker 1: had a continuous recurring dream where there's always a pool. However,
Speaker 1: the situation is always different, but the premise is always
Speaker 1: the same. There's a pool in the distance, and I
Speaker 1: try to avoid it at all costs. I feel very
Speaker 1: anxious around this pool and to be near it. I
Speaker 1: had one person say I should just jump in at
Speaker 1: the time, and until recently, there was no way I
Speaker 1: was going to be near the pools in my dream.
Speaker 1: The feelings I got from the pools in my dreams
Speaker 1: a great dread, anxiousness, laundry list of things I have
Speaker 1: to do to take care of this pool, making sure
Speaker 1: that it was clean, able to use, and sanitize. I
Speaker 1: didn't have the ability to cope with this pool in
Speaker 1: any way. When I used to have these dreams, I
Speaker 1: would wake up not feeling the best, and I hated
Speaker 1: that pool. But since I've gotten this cognitive behavioral therapy workbook,
Speaker 1: the first night, after reading just a few pages, I
Speaker 1: have the dream, and I was able to see this
Speaker 1: pool and be in it and be okay. With it.
Speaker 1: I was wearing a swimsuit in my dream. I've never
Speaker 1: been able to be next to or near the pool,
Speaker 1: but this time I was okay with it. I don't
Speaker 1: know exactly this representation of the pool and what it means.
Speaker 1: Maybe I'm coming to fruition with myself. I don't know,
Speaker 1: but I feel like I am on the right path
Speaker 1: for once. Thank you so much for using your platform
Speaker 1: to help others. I've given you five stars on Spotify
Speaker 1: and I tell everyone about your Anxiety Bites podcast. Heather,
Speaker 1: you are an exemplary listener. Thank you everyone. You can
Speaker 1: give this podcast five stars on Spotify. Now they do
Speaker 1: allow reviewing, and of course on Apple podcasts. Why is it?
Speaker 1: Because I want attention and love. No, to be honest,
Speaker 1: I try to stay away from reviews, positive or negative,
Speaker 1: because honestly, it's just it's best to just do the
Speaker 1: work and not worry about what people think, unless you
Speaker 1: know I'm doing something so egregious that I need to
Speaker 1: make a change. But what the reviews do is they
Speaker 1: help more people find this podcast. If you think about
Speaker 1: if you're on social media and a million people respond
Speaker 1: to someone's tweet, that tweet gets a lot of attention,
Speaker 1: you suddenly can see it, Whereas if everyone just ignored
Speaker 1: it but thought to themselves, that's an interesting tweet, it
Speaker 1: would probably never make its way into your timeline. So
Speaker 1: this way, the more people that review five stars five
Speaker 1: stars only please, the more it gets pushed up in
Speaker 1: the algorithm, and so it climbs the charts on Apple
Speaker 1: Podcasts and Spotify and more people find it. And I
Speaker 1: would love to do another season of this podcast, but
Speaker 1: I think they will only want to do another season
Speaker 1: with me if enough people are listening, So let's keep
Speaker 1: it going. We do have a lot of listeners, and
Speaker 1: it's worldwide, which is so exciting. I realized every podcast
Speaker 1: is worldwide. I'm not trying to, you know, brag here
Speaker 1: or say we're doing something different, but let's kick it
Speaker 1: up a notch. So thank you have there. You know,
Speaker 1: I know that most people get very board annoyed when
Speaker 1: people talk about their dreams, but I'm hoping, because this
Speaker 1: is an anxiety podcast, that we can understand. We're talking
Speaker 1: about the dreams we've had in a way to sort
Speaker 1: of explore our subconscious and what might be going on
Speaker 1: with our anxiety in real life. Hopefully it's different than
Speaker 1: when your friend goes, oh my god, the dream about
Speaker 1: you last night. Wait, I can't remember was it last night?
Speaker 1: Oh god's like slipping from my mind as I'm talking
Speaker 1: about it. I was at your house, but it wasn't
Speaker 1: your house, you know what I mean? It was like
Speaker 1: and then um, who was there? It was like you,
Speaker 1: but it wasn't you. You know, we're not doing that hopefully,
Speaker 1: but um, it's interesting that how theyre sent this email
Speaker 1: because I I put it together in you know, my
Speaker 1: preparation for today, and I had this dream last week
Speaker 1: that was so intense and looking at how there's dream
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know what the representation of the
Speaker 1: pool means. And I'm sure maybe a therapist, a psychiatrist,
Speaker 1: a PhD, a dream analyst could analyze the dream. And
Speaker 1: if you want to write in with your analysis, please do.
Speaker 1: But using everything I've learned about anxiety so far, for me,
Speaker 1: a lot of times I don't need to know what
Speaker 1: anything means. I just need the anxiety to stop. I mean,
Speaker 1: when you have a dream like this, yeah, it's not
Speaker 1: pleasant during the dreaming hours, but it does follow you
Speaker 1: when you wake up. You feel different when you've had
Speaker 1: a dream that really affects you, good or bad. Have
Speaker 1: you ever had a dream that you're in love with
Speaker 1: someone and you wake up you feel like you're in
Speaker 1: love with them? But the negative side is if you
Speaker 1: have a terrible dream, it can kind of stay with
Speaker 1: you all day. And a lot of times dreams mean nothing,
Speaker 1: and a lot of times they might be the key
Speaker 1: to something. But in the sense of anxiety, dread, anxiousness, feel,
Speaker 1: you know, feeling like you have this laundry list of
Speaker 1: things to do just to cope. If in your dream
Speaker 1: you conquer that, it will change the way you feel.
Speaker 1: Dare I say, maybe a little neuropathway in your brain.
Speaker 1: I can't prove that, but it does change something inherently
Speaker 1: inside of you, and then you wake up and you
Speaker 1: feel different. I mean, here she is looking at some
Speaker 1: cognitive behavioral therapy stuff stuff I'm so eloquent, and then
Speaker 1: she has a dream, and in this dream she's has
Speaker 1: what she needs to deal with the pool, including a swimsuit.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know, so in other words, do
Speaker 1: we do we need to know what the pool represents?
Speaker 1: Maybe it just represents this that blob of thing that
Speaker 1: we have, you know, where you feel overwhelmed, but you
Speaker 1: don't know why you If you were to sit down
Speaker 1: and list everything you had to do and get done,
Speaker 1: it would be a manageable list, especially if there is
Speaker 1: no deadline exactly on anything. But you still feel this overwhelmed.
Speaker 1: That's that's a lot of how I feel a lot,
Speaker 1: but you sort of handle it in a dream. I
Speaker 1: I think that's something, But I think we don't need
Speaker 1: to know exactly what the pool represents. Does it represent
Speaker 1: your mother or your boss? I mean, I don't know
Speaker 1: what figuring that out does, but it seems like she
Speaker 1: did the most important thing, which is figure out I'm
Speaker 1: going to come to this problem with just some basic tools,
Speaker 1: and the problem is going to shrink. So I thought
Speaker 1: that was cool. But my dream that I'm now looking
Speaker 1: at in a different way was this dream that I
Speaker 1: adopted a child. Now, if anyone knows me, I don't
Speaker 1: have children. I've never wanted children. I don't regret it
Speaker 1: at all. I'm forty seven. I don't even want to adopt.
Speaker 1: I hope I don't sounds like I'm being a cold person.
Speaker 1: I just it's not for me, and it's definitely not
Speaker 1: something I could fit into my schedule, my lifestyle where
Speaker 1: I don't even live in one place, and my constant
Speaker 1: sense of overwhelm. And yeah, obviously I love children. I
Speaker 1: have a niece and a nephew. I have two nephews
Speaker 1: and a niece. But one of my nieces and one
Speaker 1: of my nephews have had babies in the last few months,
Speaker 1: and so I've become a great aunt twice. And I
Speaker 1: have been doing a lot of shopping for baby clothes online,
Speaker 1: which is really fun because it's like real outfits, but
Speaker 1: they're ten dollars. So great aunt Jen, great aunt Jen,
Speaker 1: as we say in Massachusetts, I just been shipping baby
Speaker 1: clothes all over this country. Oh my god, and little
Speaker 1: baby sunglasses don't get me started. So I've got babies
Speaker 1: on the brain right in the sense of I'm loving
Speaker 1: unconditionally these babies I haven't met, and I'm excited for
Speaker 1: my nieces and nephews. And I'm not, um someone who
Speaker 1: gets excited when people have kids. I don't want to
Speaker 1: go to your baby shower, but you know I'm related,
Speaker 1: you know how that goes. And so I have this
Speaker 1: dream that I'm on some kind of Facebook page and
Speaker 1: this woman is complaining about this baby that she just
Speaker 1: adopted and saying it's really hard to take care of
Speaker 1: and she never knew it would be so hard. And
Speaker 1: I wrote in the comments, I'll take it, you know,
Speaker 1: as a joke. And then I was going about my
Speaker 1: life and my doorbell rang and there was a child
Speaker 1: at the door. But it wasn't a baby. It was
Speaker 1: like a four year old. And long story short, the
Speaker 1: four year old had the vocabulary and the attitude and
Speaker 1: the language skills, the verbal skills of a fourteen year old.
Speaker 1: So I have this little four year old boy and
Speaker 1: I forget his name, and and who had a fourteen
Speaker 1: year old, you know, verbal skill suddenly in my home
Speaker 1: And I said where did you come from? And he
Speaker 1: said you left that comments saying you'll take me, so
Speaker 1: here I am. And somehow, within the reality of this dream,
Speaker 1: that was a binding contract. It was as though I
Speaker 1: had gone through the adoption process. And I was so
Speaker 1: overwhelmed because I thought he was going to be a baby,
Speaker 1: and I didn't have any of the supplies you would
Speaker 1: need for a four year old, and every single thing
Speaker 1: I was about to do, I thought, well, actually I
Speaker 1: have an appointment right now, and something in my brain
Speaker 1: went well, you can leave him here, and then something
Speaker 1: in my brain went, no, you don't ever leave a child. Okay,
Speaker 1: I have to take him with me. Okay, well we
Speaker 1: need to get soap and things for the bath and clothes,
Speaker 1: and I guess I need to start telling people in
Speaker 1: my life. And I was completely overwhelmed. And I I
Speaker 1: was visiting my family last weekend in Massachusetts, and I
Speaker 1: remember thinking in the dream, I have to bring this
Speaker 1: kid with me and suddenly just throw a child into
Speaker 1: this visiting of my parents, and but they're gonna be overwhelmed.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was completely overwhelming, and yet the love
Speaker 1: I felt for this kid was truly profound. You know,
Speaker 1: he made a mistake. I think he said a swear
Speaker 1: word to me. He said, you're fucking idiot. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: This dreams almost over. And I said to him, you
Speaker 1: don't talk to me that way that and I explained
Speaker 1: why you don't talk to your mom that way or anybody,
Speaker 1: and he started to cry and I said, why are
Speaker 1: you crying? And he said I'm ashamed, and I said
Speaker 1: that's okay, and he said he was sorry, and I said,
Speaker 1: it's really brave of you to tell me that you're sorry,
Speaker 1: and he said it is, and I said yes, because
Speaker 1: you're admitting yours. And know, it was this whole deep
Speaker 1: conversation that parents out there listening are like, yeah, right,
Speaker 1: Like like you'd ever have a conversation like that with
Speaker 1: the four year old or even a fourteen year old.
Speaker 1: I know, again it was a dream. But I was
Speaker 1: too overwhelmed to um keep this child that had shown up,
Speaker 1: And so I went back to the message boards of
Speaker 1: the Facebook kind of thing, and I said, if anyone
Speaker 1: who really has always wanted to be a mother, this
Speaker 1: is an amazing child who you will love and you know,
Speaker 1: contact me and and I figured something out and he
Speaker 1: went to a better home. But what I'm realizing the
Speaker 1: dream is about is that a child, to me represents
Speaker 1: the ultimate overwhelmed in terms of it's always there. And
Speaker 1: for me, what's always there is is my fear around money,
Speaker 1: and my fear around career and and having the kind
Speaker 1: of job as a TV writer and a performer and
Speaker 1: a podcaster, or that I always have to do three
Speaker 1: jobs at once. Sometimes it's it's a seventy year work week.
Speaker 1: Sometimes there is no social life most of the time.
Speaker 1: In the last six months, there hasn't been and it's unsustainable, right.
Speaker 1: I don't want to live this way, But there are
Speaker 1: periods in my life where it looks like this, and
Speaker 1: then there are periods where it looks like there's absolutely
Speaker 1: nothing and it's not enjoyable because you need to work,
Speaker 1: but there's just nothing coming in. And so you've heard
Speaker 1: the expression feast or famine, and it's hard to live
Speaker 1: that way. The other hand is that I don't get
Speaker 1: to work in the fields I work in at all,
Speaker 1: I guess. So there's three choices. I am so successful
Speaker 1: that I like have five million assistants who do everything
Speaker 1: for me, and I don't have to take every job
Speaker 1: that comes along, and I'm worth millions and millions. That
Speaker 1: would be great, but that's just not what's happening. I
Speaker 1: don't think it's overly realistic to get upset that that's
Speaker 1: not happening. That's not however, that's not how most people
Speaker 1: in the entertainment business end up. It's like two, So
Speaker 1: the and then the other option would be not to
Speaker 1: work in it at all, which I think would make
Speaker 1: me feel really bad. And then the middle version is
Speaker 1: exactly what it looks like, which is, yeah, it's overwhelming.
Speaker 1: At times, it's amazing. At times there's so much to
Speaker 1: be grateful for a lot of times it's overwhelming, but
Speaker 1: I can totally handle it. And then a lot of
Speaker 1: times it's like what am I even doing? And I'm
Speaker 1: not saying that that's what it's like to have a kid,
Speaker 1: but I'm saying that where the kid represents this for
Speaker 1: present responsibility, so does the notion of taking care of
Speaker 1: my own self in my own life. And sometimes I'm
Speaker 1: just overwhelmed, you know. To me, the whole point of
Speaker 1: the dream is when I wrote to the message board
Speaker 1: and described the wonderful qualities about the kid, that was
Speaker 1: me reframing the wonderful qualities of my life, and that
Speaker 1: I don't know. I just I had a whole new
Speaker 1: view of it after reading this email, and it really
Speaker 1: is about I'm stressed and overwhelmed and I need to
Speaker 1: do something about it in my life. If anyone wants
Speaker 1: to analyze my child dream, you can accept um. Please
Speaker 1: don't tell me that I secretly want a kid, because
Speaker 1: I promise you I make things happen. If I wanted
Speaker 1: a kid, but get one, I'd take yours at the
Speaker 1: grocery store we'll be right back. Okay, Hello Anxiety Bites podcast. Jen.
Speaker 1: My name is Ian. I'm twenty three, and I fundamentally
Speaker 1: had no clue how anxious I was until I listened
Speaker 1: to episode twenty. For a while, anxiety was always a
Speaker 1: bad word in my household. I don't think it was
Speaker 1: intentional on my parents parts, but that's how it resolved. Anyway,
Speaker 1: I would use anything else to describe myself. I'm not anxious.
Speaker 1: I'm just hired, or I just need to eat and
Speaker 1: I'll feel fine afterwards, stuff like that. So I found
Speaker 1: your TikTok recently, or you can all follow me on
Speaker 1: TikTok at Jen Kirkman, and you posted a highlight about
Speaker 1: having an anxious attachment style. And that is from my
Speaker 1: episode with therapist Katherine de Fatah when we talked about
Speaker 1: all of the different love attachment styles that may identifying them.
Speaker 1: They help you realize where you've gone right and gone
Speaker 1: wrong for yourself in love relationships. And again that is
Speaker 1: episode twenty, and it's called anxious and Love. If for
Speaker 1: some reason, you haven't heard that one yet anyway, Ian says,
Speaker 1: I had never heard of that before. So I listened
Speaker 1: to the clip and it was like you put a
Speaker 1: bucket on my head and hit it with a hammer.
Speaker 1: I immediately went to listen to the full episode and
Speaker 1: it really connected with me. I had never realized that
Speaker 1: constant overthinking and paranoia when people don't respond isn't a
Speaker 1: typical response. That's the specific moment that got to me.
Speaker 1: Normalizing talking about mental health is super important, and I'm
Speaker 1: thankful that I came across your podcast. It's been a
Speaker 1: process to relax a bit when texting with people, especially
Speaker 1: a new friend or whatever. On top of everything, I
Speaker 1: am truly worried about blowing up their phone to the
Speaker 1: point that they don't want to talk to me anymore.
Speaker 1: And I assumed everyone had that in them, and just
Speaker 1: knowing that there's an alternative is enough, at least for now.
Speaker 1: I recently moved across the United States by myself, and
Speaker 1: it's been an adjustment for sure. I've got a lot
Speaker 1: of time on my hands and that lends to more
Speaker 1: time overthinking, especially with the move. I'm happy to be
Speaker 1: finding my footing as an adult. That and I have
Speaker 1: a new podcast to check out. Thank you for the hammer,
Speaker 1: Jen best Ian, This is an amazing email. This is
Speaker 1: exactly you know social media makes me cuckoo and putting
Speaker 1: clips of this podcast on social media so that people
Speaker 1: can find it. Thank you, Ian, you just proved to
Speaker 1: me that it does or and yeah, I mean I
Speaker 1: would suggest you go back and listen to every episode
Speaker 1: because there's little nuggets of things and everything you've said
Speaker 1: in this email that I'm thinking, Oh yeah, that reminds
Speaker 1: me of the episode I did with Dr Lauana Marquez.
Speaker 1: Oh that reminds me of Dr what Dr Angela Neil
Speaker 1: Barnett said. So I think you will get a lot
Speaker 1: of bread crumbs and you can follow your own path
Speaker 1: down whatever seems to resonate the most with you. Okay,
Speaker 1: so let's talk about the Sunday Scary's. Hey, Jen, I
Speaker 1: have to say I've identified with so many things most
Speaker 1: of your guests have had to say, but the thing
Speaker 1: that resonated with me most recently was when Chelsea Handler
Speaker 1: talked about reactivity. Yes, I think that's an episode from
Speaker 1: the week of Valentine's Day called it um. I think
Speaker 1: like Reactive and Love or something. Do I even know
Speaker 1: the name of my own podcast? Could I look it up?
Speaker 1: I guess I could. But if you're listening on your
Speaker 1: favorite podcast app. Right now, you can scroll back and
Speaker 1: see the name of that episode. But as long as
Speaker 1: I brought it up and got it wrong, let me correct. Um.
Speaker 1: It's episode nineteen Love and Reaction with comedian and my
Speaker 1: friend Chelsea Handler. Um. Anyway, that's been my m O
Speaker 1: for such a huge chunk of my life, reaction reactivity,
Speaker 1: and it's probably kept me from getting out of my
Speaker 1: own way more than anything. Can't tell you how many
Speaker 1: times I've sent an email that I should have waited
Speaker 1: to send, or not sent at all, or made a
Speaker 1: phone call I shouldn't have made too whine about something
Speaker 1: that I was more than likely blowing out of proportion.
Speaker 1: Instead of taking a beat and waiting for the impulse
Speaker 1: to pass. Reacting in the moment has very rarely led
Speaker 1: to the sort of results I was hoping for, and
Speaker 1: usually ended up digging a deeper hole for myself. I've
Speaker 1: fortunately gotten much better coming to terms with the fact
Speaker 1: that it's a big behavior that completely intertwined with my
Speaker 1: tendency to catastrophize UM to amplify modest to moderate problems
Speaker 1: into full blown crisis. I also think the old search
Speaker 1: real and prescription has helped a great deal search real
Speaker 1: and I don't know that drug, so I will mispronounce it. Recently,
Speaker 1: I've been amazed at the number of reactive emails I've
Speaker 1: written or partially written, and then deleted before I had
Speaker 1: the chance to hit send. That's progress, as far as
Speaker 1: I'm concerned. I don't really have a point other than
Speaker 1: to say thanks for continuing to shine a spotlight on
Speaker 1: anxiety related behaviors in such a relatable way. One more
Speaker 1: unrelated issue. Has anyone ever conquered the Sunday scarys? This
Speaker 1: is probably one of the most irrational psychological phenomena that exists,
Speaker 1: but it's incredible how it continues to persist in my
Speaker 1: life and the lives of just about everyone else with
Speaker 1: a Monday through Friday work schedule. There's this shroud of
Speaker 1: dread that hangs over me every Sunday, and it's so
Speaker 1: pronounced sometimes that I'm reluctant to get out of bed
Speaker 1: on Sunday morning because I know how much it's going
Speaker 1: to dominate my day. I actually hate Sunday more than
Speaker 1: I hate Monday. The rational part of me knows that
Speaker 1: no week has ever turned out to be merely is
Speaker 1: bad or even bad at all, as the level of
Speaker 1: dread would suggest. But even though I know that from
Speaker 1: my experience, this scaries continue to rage on. I just
Speaker 1: don't get it. Keep doing what you do, Jeff, Well, Jeff,
Speaker 1: I do think I may have some advice to offer
Speaker 1: about even though you know not to dread Monday and
Speaker 1: it never turned out as bad as you think, but
Speaker 1: the Sunday scary still get you. I'm going to get
Speaker 1: to my advice, but let's discuss these Sunday scaries. So, y'all,
Speaker 1: I had I had felt this phenomenon, especially as a kid.
Speaker 1: You know, sometimes I would dread going back to school
Speaker 1: on Monday, especially if I had I don't know, a
Speaker 1: test or some kind of homework that I did do,
Speaker 1: but it probably didn't do that well, you know, a
Speaker 1: book report that i'd faked a little bit. But it's
Speaker 1: really just about if you work, then normal Monday through
Speaker 1: Friday week and the weekend is some sort of time
Speaker 1: where you have more freedom. All Monday represents going right
Speaker 1: back to the grind. And so I I know, I
Speaker 1: used to think of Sundays when I was a little
Speaker 1: kid is sort of a depressing day because more often
Speaker 1: than not we would drive up to visit my mom's mom,
Speaker 1: my grandmother, who I loved and still love that she's
Speaker 1: just no longer with us, Nana Jeanette. But I had
Speaker 1: this sort of melancholy vibe. You know. We'd make tea,
Speaker 1: we'd watch Star Search, and then we'd drive home as
Speaker 1: the sun was setting, and then it was time to
Speaker 1: have dinner at home and watch what did I watch
Speaker 1: on Sunday nights? The Thiglight Zone Amazing Stories, which honestly
Speaker 1: had kind of a bizarre melancholy vibe too, and then
Speaker 1: go to bed and get ready for the week. And
Speaker 1: so there was always melancholy feeling on a Sunday. Oh
Speaker 1: and then you know, I used to have to go
Speaker 1: to church in the morning, so Sunday was like sometimes
Speaker 1: Monday didn't even feel better, was like church driving at Nana's.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'd rather take a test. But then I
Speaker 1: got older and I didn't have to do what anyone
Speaker 1: told me on Sundays anymore. And then social media comes
Speaker 1: around and I see people start talking about this thing
Speaker 1: called the Sunday Scaries, and I realized that as adults,
Speaker 1: we still have this sort of Sunday dreading Monday feeling
Speaker 1: because right, a lot of times our work week will
Speaker 1: mimic the the hours in a school week, at least
Speaker 1: in the sense of the Monday through Friday things. So
Speaker 1: there is a website called Sunday Scaries dot com. Now
Speaker 1: I don't know who these people are, not vouching for them.
Speaker 1: I just googled it and and it came up. Um.
Speaker 1: I actually think it's a cb D company, And I'm
Speaker 1: not trying to promote them. I know nothing, but they
Speaker 1: just did a good job of sort of summarizing what
Speaker 1: the Sunday scaries are. They're real, You've experienced them. They're
Speaker 1: one of the most common ailments in modern society. Multiple
Speaker 1: studies suggest over Americans suffer from the Sunday scaries on
Speaker 1: a regular base. This the Sunday scary start between three
Speaker 1: and five pm every Sunday, when your fun weekend vibes
Speaker 1: start to transform into anxiousness for your impending Monday work responsibilities.
Speaker 1: Sunday scaries are known by numerous other names, like the
Speaker 1: Sunday blues, Sunday syndrome, and Sunday dread. The Sunday scaries
Speaker 1: has even transformed into Monday scaries, and some circumstances when
Speaker 1: it takes longer than a Sunday night to fully recover
Speaker 1: from your weekend. One LinkedIn study found that eight percent
Speaker 1: of professionals get the Sunday scaries before Mondays, which is
Speaker 1: linked to workload balancing to dues, and agonizing over projects
Speaker 1: you didn't complete the previous week. One Sleep Judge study
Speaker 1: found that of their participants experienced Sunday scaries and anticipation
Speaker 1: of the Monday doom. The top symptoms were anxiety, poor sleep,
Speaker 1: depressive mood, increased irritability, and insomnia. What's more, almost half
Speaker 1: didn't even have a drink of alcohol on Sunday and
Speaker 1: still felt anticipatory anxiety for Monday meeting. I'm shared a
Speaker 1: Sunday Scaries article based on a study which found that
Speaker 1: eight percent of the two thousand participants felt anxious Sunday
Speaker 1: night before Monday morning, and that caused scent of the
Speaker 1: study participants to admit that the Sunday scaries caused them
Speaker 1: to stay up later than they should Sunday evening and
Speaker 1: said their sleep schedule was derailed by the end of
Speaker 1: the weekend. There is something called um like sleep defiance syndrome.
Speaker 1: I've read about it. It's like you stay up late
Speaker 1: for no reason, You're defying something even though it's only
Speaker 1: going to hurt you. So back in the early nineteen hundreds,
Speaker 1: there used to be something called Saint Monday and Sunday
Speaker 1: scaries originated from the evolution of our modern day weekend.
Speaker 1: The weekend didn't always start on Friday evening, and Sunday
Speaker 1: was historically the start of our work week, not day
Speaker 1: three of our weekend. It was only two years ago
Speaker 1: that the weekend was only Saturday. So there's this whole
Speaker 1: thing about, you know why, how the weekend came about,
Speaker 1: which we don't really need to get into. But during
Speaker 1: the Industrial Revolution, St. Monday was the term adopted from
Speaker 1: Monday absentee is um after a Sunday of debauchery, so St.
Speaker 1: Monday simply meant workers took another day of leisure to
Speaker 1: recover from their drunkenness and relax. They also referred to St.
Speaker 1: Monday as the People's holiday. But in the new factory system,
Speaker 1: workers could also work extra hours to earn enough money
Speaker 1: to take extra days off. And in addition, new railroads
Speaker 1: and technological advances and entertainment like music halls and theaters
Speaker 1: provided exciting new incentives for indulging Sundays and taking Monday off. Notably,
Speaker 1: major industries became accustomed to workers saving st Monday, and
Speaker 1: in general it was well tolerated until Henry Ford came along,
Speaker 1: and he did not tolerate that. So when Henry Ford
Speaker 1: was making his cars, he began giving his employees to
Speaker 1: day weekends Saturday and Sunday. Blah blah blah. So the
Speaker 1: cause of the Sunday scaries can be biological, societal, generational,
Speaker 1: drug related, and personality related. N y U psychoanalyst and
Speaker 1: neuropsychologist Dr Suzanne Cooperman states that the biological causes Sunday
Speaker 1: scaries are rooted in anticipatory anxiety. We've talked a loud
Speaker 1: about that on this podcast. Anticipatory anxiety is a type
Speaker 1: of increased anxiety where you get significantly worried about an
Speaker 1: event or situation in the near future. But a lot
Speaker 1: of times, I'm adding this in that event is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1: It may or may not happen. I mean, yes, your
Speaker 1: Monday will happen, God willing, you're lucky enough to wake
Speaker 1: up on Monday in the world still here. But whatever
Speaker 1: you're really worried about that may or may not happen.
Speaker 1: So here's my advice to you, Jeff. You said, the
Speaker 1: rational part of me knows that no week has ever
Speaker 1: turned out to be nearly as bad or even bad
Speaker 1: at all, as the level of dread was suggest But
Speaker 1: even though I know that from my experience, the scaries
Speaker 1: continue to rage on. I just don't get for me.
Speaker 1: Whenever I know something in my head and yet I
Speaker 1: can't get my anxiety or my body or my subconscious
Speaker 1: to get on board with what I really know, I
Speaker 1: have to write something down because when I look at
Speaker 1: something on the page, it's almost as if someone else
Speaker 1: wrote it, and my brain perceives it differently. When I
Speaker 1: think a problem and then the other part of my
Speaker 1: brain that is ruled by anxiety tries to solve it,
Speaker 1: I'm going to start ruminating, which is like a tire
Speaker 1: spinning in the mud. You have to actually get something
Speaker 1: to remove the car out of the ditch that it's in,
Speaker 1: and for me, that's writing things down. So this is
Speaker 1: my I know I'm giving an assignment, but this is
Speaker 1: my idea, and you can find anything that works for you.
Speaker 1: But maybe this suggestion will get your wheels going and
Speaker 1: you'll find the right thing for you. But what I
Speaker 1: tend to do. I have a journal where I write
Speaker 1: at the top of the new page my fear or
Speaker 1: my belief that isn't true, something like that, a fear
Speaker 1: that limits me, and I will write it out and
Speaker 1: it could be as specific as or I'm dreading I'm
Speaker 1: dreading Monday because I have no free time. I will
Speaker 1: be overwhelmed and I just don't like how it feels,
Speaker 1: and blah blah, you know, the whole thing, and I
Speaker 1: will write it all out and let it go as
Speaker 1: far as it goes. It can go as far as
Speaker 1: why do we even have to have a society where
Speaker 1: we earn money? I mean, it can go. You can
Speaker 1: be just existentially anxious about the fact that you don't
Speaker 1: control the concept of the work week goes all the
Speaker 1: way back to Henry Ford. You know, you can just
Speaker 1: keep writing because usually it is some existential thing that
Speaker 1: just sort of dissipates once we get to what's really
Speaker 1: going on, which is it always comes back to we
Speaker 1: are not in control of anything. From how we're born
Speaker 1: two a lot of things that could happen to us
Speaker 1: in life, and there's little things that amplify that, like
Speaker 1: having a boss, having a work week that you didn't
Speaker 1: come up with, getting on a plane. You know that
Speaker 1: kind of thing. So right down with the fear is
Speaker 1: and then right down under it some thoughts that could
Speaker 1: counterbalance that fear or that dread, which is, I do
Speaker 1: not know what will happen this week. I can decide
Speaker 1: that this will be a really exciting work week filled
Speaker 1: with leisure time as well, whatever your little affirmations are,
Speaker 1: and then at the end of the week you can
Speaker 1: write down if any of your fears came true and
Speaker 1: where you were wrong about what you dreaded. So it's
Speaker 1: sort of like a two part writing exercise. You'll do
Speaker 1: one on Sunday night, and you'll do one on Friday
Speaker 1: night or Saturday morning, and you will just keep your
Speaker 1: Sunday Scary's journal, and I swear after two weeks you
Speaker 1: can look at it and it will form you. You're
Speaker 1: really bumming yourself out on Sundays for no reason. And
Speaker 1: for someone who has the Sunday Scary's you probably love
Speaker 1: leisure and you're being the bummer here. The work week
Speaker 1: isn't cramping your style, You're cramping your own style. And
Speaker 1: so if there's a fun way to look at it.
Speaker 1: It's like, okay, now let's do some practical things. You know,
Speaker 1: let's get out of the anxiety realm and all that.
Speaker 1: Let's do some practical things. I know nobody wants to
Speaker 1: sit and do a guided meditation. I know that already
Speaker 1: you're turning the podcast off right now. But at some
Speaker 1: point on Sunday, I don't know when. Whenever works for you, Like,
Speaker 1: just know you're gonna do it at some point, but
Speaker 1: pick a fun time. You can do it laying in bed,
Speaker 1: Like maybe you set your alarm and then once you
Speaker 1: are ready to wake up, before you just get up,
Speaker 1: you do a little guided meditation while ying down your
Speaker 1: eyes closed. There's plenty of those. Or maybe you could
Speaker 1: make one up and you just think those affirming things
Speaker 1: to yourself that you wrote down in your notebook. I
Speaker 1: don't know whatever it is, but is some kind of
Speaker 1: guided meditation for physical anxiety on a Sunday? Or do
Speaker 1: progressive muscle relaxation. Just do that on a Sunday. What
Speaker 1: you're going to be doing is just helping your body
Speaker 1: not cling to the anxious, dread feelings so much. Do
Speaker 1: your writing exercise now, let's move into the fun and
Speaker 1: let's well, I mean, let's take a look at stuff
Speaker 1: like alcohol. I mean, alcohol is a depressant. If we're
Speaker 1: going to drink on a Sunday, it's like, you just
Speaker 1: have to know that that could cause more anxiety and depression.
Speaker 1: Um and if that feels like a cause of a bummer,
Speaker 1: like Ussie, I can't even have a drink on a Sunday,
Speaker 1: my day off because a Monday, it's like, okay, well
Speaker 1: then you have to learn how to have a drink
Speaker 1: without it spiraling you into why can't every day be
Speaker 1: like this? Like you probably wouldn't enjoy it if every
Speaker 1: day was like that, right, So getting into that perspective
Speaker 1: of weekends are for this and the work week is
Speaker 1: for that, and they both exist in a yin and yang,
Speaker 1: so we can appreciate the there. You might even want
Speaker 1: to make a list of things you love about your
Speaker 1: job or the way you work your job, or the
Speaker 1: people at work. Make a list of ten things you're
Speaker 1: grateful for that happened between Monday and Friday, or that
Speaker 1: happened on a Monday. Let's just say that. Okay, So
Speaker 1: now I think in the back of everyone's mind people
Speaker 1: look at Monday's they don't even know they're doing it.
Speaker 1: But it's this constant loop we're in of self improvement,
Speaker 1: which is really shaming ourselves and perfectionism. I know that
Speaker 1: I do this too. Monday seems like a good time
Speaker 1: to start over, doesn't it. Oh I don't like the
Speaker 1: way I handled everything last week. I slept late, I
Speaker 1: never worked out. This week will be different. Oh my god, no,
Speaker 1: wonder you're bumming out about Monday so much pressure. It's
Speaker 1: like we're treating it like a many New Year's Day
Speaker 1: every week, and New Year's Day the dumbest day to
Speaker 1: begin a whole new life when the night before is
Speaker 1: a night where you stay up past midnight and get drunk.
Speaker 1: Why the hell if we decided that the next day
Speaker 1: begins our new habits. I mean, it's just counterintuitive. So
Speaker 1: if you can look at Monday not as this day
Speaker 1: that you're supposed to be, you know, doing all this stuff,
Speaker 1: maybe you do the least on Mondays as much as
Speaker 1: you can control that. So let me put it this way.
Speaker 1: I work a writing job where I have to be
Speaker 1: there from just including commute seven. Okay, but I still
Speaker 1: have this podcast, and I have another podcast that I
Speaker 1: do a lot of times, I would schedule I'm going
Speaker 1: to record my podcast Monday morning before work. Now that's
Speaker 1: doable on other weekdays. But oh my god, I'm laying
Speaker 1: in Vincent and going someone to do tomorrow. I moved
Speaker 1: that I don't record podcast on Monday anymore. I used
Speaker 1: to if I work out a lot, I will take
Speaker 1: a day off. And I used to take Friday's off
Speaker 1: of working out because I thought, well, it's the beginning
Speaker 1: of the weekend, and and I would work out Mondays.
Speaker 1: No Monday is Now I don't work out on Mondays
Speaker 1: because I want to do the least. I want to
Speaker 1: ease back into the week Friday. Why wouldn't I work
Speaker 1: out on a Friday morning get rid of a lot
Speaker 1: of the stress from the end of the week. I
Speaker 1: worked out Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. Yeah, work out Friday, get
Speaker 1: ready for the weekend. Whatever that means. Maybe you think
Speaker 1: of something fun like so I buy flowers every Monday
Speaker 1: morning on my walk to work and I put them
Speaker 1: on my desk. Is there a new thing you can do?
Speaker 1: Can you drop some of the because I guarantee anyone
Speaker 1: with the Sunday scar e's it's not just your job.
Speaker 1: It's all this other crap that you think you have
Speaker 1: to do on Mondays. But can you also prepare yourself
Speaker 1: like I do part of Sunday is some grocery shopping
Speaker 1: and some mild preparing of food so that I have
Speaker 1: it in the fridge for the week. If that's something
Speaker 1: you enjoy, you could do that. Like, the more we prepare,
Speaker 1: the less we feel overwhelmed on Monday. So can you
Speaker 1: drop things you don't like doing from your Monday and
Speaker 1: just let work be the one thing, you know, within reason?
Speaker 1: I understand we have all kinds of responsibilities that aren't
Speaker 1: just our jobs, But can you add fun things and
Speaker 1: or like, if there's a cheat day on your diet,
Speaker 1: can it be Monday. Can Monday be the day that
Speaker 1: you eat a really big breakfast as though you're you know, um,
Speaker 1: having brunch at a restaurant. Can you do something like
Speaker 1: Monday is the day that I get up early, not
Speaker 1: to work out, but to make a fun breakfast. I
Speaker 1: make pancakes on money. Just something that you can look
Speaker 1: forward to, you know. Or Monday morning is the day
Speaker 1: that I get up early and I lay in bed
Speaker 1: and watch an hour of stupid TV before I get
Speaker 1: out of bed. I'm reading this great book and Monday
Speaker 1: mornings are when I don't work out, but I make
Speaker 1: a cup of coffee, I sit fifteen minutes of my
Speaker 1: favorite chair and I read the book like just something
Speaker 1: to look forward to. Just reframe Monday as sort of
Speaker 1: this transition day. You know, as much time as you
Speaker 1: have to yourself in the morning before the job starts,
Speaker 1: can that be completely just made to be fun. You're
Speaker 1: cushoning yourself in bubble wrap. You're treating yourself well, it's
Speaker 1: your spa day. You know, it's the day that that
Speaker 1: needs the most care. You have it tough enough on Monday.
Speaker 1: Don't ruin your Sunday dreading Monday. You can carry that
Speaker 1: Sunday feeling over into Monday. These are just my little
Speaker 1: suggestions because I think not everything is now. Let's talk
Speaker 1: to a therapist, you know, sometimes we just have to
Speaker 1: have fun solutions. Anxiety Bites will be right back after
Speaker 1: a quick little message from one of our sponsors. All right,
Speaker 1: as we wrap up this episode, somebody wrote to me, Jen,
Speaker 1: As far as I know, I don't have clinical depression
Speaker 1: or generalized anxiety disorder. However, I think I experience situational
Speaker 1: anxiety during these times. I have trouble getting out of bed,
Speaker 1: trouble sleeping, and constant thoughts of what I'm stressing about,
Speaker 1: mainly work, that impact my ability to do basic tasks
Speaker 1: throughout the day. That my friend is some rumination doesn't
Speaker 1: mean you have an anxiety disorder, but you're just ruminating,
Speaker 1: which is, like you said, a type of anxiety. It's
Speaker 1: a little different than situational though, because situational anxiety is
Speaker 1: usually task or performance space or you know, you go
Speaker 1: on a date, you're feeling nerves. But if you're thinking
Speaker 1: about something and it's going on and on throughout the day,
Speaker 1: that's going to be ruminating anxiety. And you might want
Speaker 1: to really listen to my episode with Joshua Fletcher, who
Speaker 1: is a therapist in the UK, and we did an
Speaker 1: episode called the Three d S. But he talks a lot.
Speaker 1: It's episode eighteen. He talks a lot about rumination and
Speaker 1: and how that's a different kind of anxiety than just
Speaker 1: our basic you know, all I'm nervous I'm about to,
Speaker 1: you know, walk over this bridge or go on a date.
Speaker 1: So anyway, she continues on a separate note. I'm attracted
Speaker 1: to both men and women. I have known this for
Speaker 1: some time, but the opportunity to be with a woman
Speaker 1: never presented itself and I never sought it out. I've
Speaker 1: decided that I'm going to put more of an effort
Speaker 1: into trying to date women, i e. Signing up for
Speaker 1: dating apps. I recently tried one of the counseling apps
Speaker 1: services that offers telephone and zoom counseling. The reason for
Speaker 1: seeking counseling was to work through the workplace anxiety and
Speaker 1: also addressed the fact that I feel some guilt about
Speaker 1: the fact that I don't have any fear of being
Speaker 1: rejected or not being supported by the people in my
Speaker 1: life if I start dating someone of the same sex,
Speaker 1: when I know that is the case for so many people,
Speaker 1: including some of my friends. Oh yeah, you don't need
Speaker 1: to take on that guilt. They want that for you. Um.
Speaker 1: The counselor was nice and I really liked being able
Speaker 1: to have the session be a zoom. However, the counselor
Speaker 1: I had did what they called patient led sessions. They
Speaker 1: would ask me what I wanted to talk about and
Speaker 1: didn't ask any probing questions. They would just respond saying
Speaker 1: why it was okay for me to feel the way
Speaker 1: I feel, or tell me why the decision I was
Speaker 1: making was acceptable. I did not find this helpful, and
Speaker 1: it just felt like talking to a friend about my life.
Speaker 1: What I was hoping for was someone that would lead
Speaker 1: the sessions, ask me questions, provide insight into why I
Speaker 1: am feeling certain ways, and provide suggestions on how to
Speaker 1: deal with the feelings I was struggling with. I was
Speaker 1: wondering if you have any tips for sorting through all
Speaker 1: of the options out there for counseling and therapy. And
Speaker 1: she didn't leave her I mean she left her name
Speaker 1: is said to leave her name off, but yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: I've been in therapy long time. I've had different therapists.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure they're supposed to give suggestions on how
Speaker 1: to deal with feelings in the sense unless they could
Speaker 1: give cognitive behavioral suggestions on how to stop that rumination,
Speaker 1: the constant thoughts. They can give you actual it's not
Speaker 1: suggestions like um, their actual techniques, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: So it would be more like akin to a trainer saying,
Speaker 1: do five reps of this dumbbell weight on your arm.
Speaker 1: It wouldn't be someone saying, well, maybe you should try
Speaker 1: thinking of it this way. It's it's it wouldn't be that,
Speaker 1: and that wouldn't necessarily be that appropriate. You know, there
Speaker 1: is something called analysis where you talk and they they
Speaker 1: kind of analyze what you're saying. But the best way
Speaker 1: is this. I mean, I think you have two different
Speaker 1: things going on, like the rumination and the anxiety. Cognitive
Speaker 1: behavioral therapy is really good with that. The fact that
Speaker 1: you want to date women. If I'll label you your
Speaker 1: bisexual and if you come out to your family, you
Speaker 1: know other people's families would disown them, and you don't
Speaker 1: have any fear of that in your own life. Now.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you mean it's because you know
Speaker 1: your family wouldn't disown you or you just don't care um.
Speaker 1: Either way, that's one of an unnecessary guilt of something
Speaker 1: you're carrying on behalf of your friends that have to
Speaker 1: deal with that stuff. I don't know. To me, that
Speaker 1: sounds like a little bit in the codependency area. So
Speaker 1: there's a few different areas and I don't know if
Speaker 1: we can. You know, it's not like you have a
Speaker 1: therapist for each little thing, but there might be things
Speaker 1: that work better outside of therapy, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: So you know, analyzing where does this deep guilt come from?
Speaker 1: Is one going to therapy but then saying I need
Speaker 1: some tools to deal with these thoughts that are ruminating
Speaker 1: all day. That's another kind of therapy. So I will
Speaker 1: just take you through what I have looked up, because
Speaker 1: I don't take my word for anything. This is the
Speaker 1: Northeastern dot e du website. So basically, the term counselor
Speaker 1: is used to broadly refer to a professional trained in
Speaker 1: the fields of psychology, counseling, social work, or a range
Speaker 1: of medical field such as nursing. Mental health counselor specifically,
Speaker 1: are professionals working in a mental health capacity. Now, mental
Speaker 1: health counselors perform many functions responsibilities, and those duties can
Speaker 1: include conducting patient evaluations, providing education and informal resources to clients,
Speaker 1: and making suggestions that the client or patient can use
Speaker 1: to solve the problem they are seeking counseling to address. Often,
Speaker 1: mental health counselors will specialize in addressing a particular issue,
Speaker 1: such as substance abuse, sexual abuse, marriage relationships, family counseling,
Speaker 1: and others. A therapist is an individual that has been
Speaker 1: professionally trained to provide some form of therapy to a
Speaker 1: patient that can address a mental disorder. Examples of therapy
Speaker 1: used in the context of physical medicine can include physical
Speaker 1: therapists and occupational therapist, but in the context of mental health,
Speaker 1: the term mental health therapist and psychotherapists are common. They
Speaker 1: address particular client issues um such as marriage and family issues,
Speaker 1: substance abuse, et cetera. But the difference between a therapist,
Speaker 1: a psychotherapist and a mental health counselor. They occupy the
Speaker 1: same professional space, but there is some difference, and the
Speaker 1: key is in the approach to the treatment. So counseling
Speaker 1: often addresses specific problems, challenges, or behavior in a patient's
Speaker 1: life in a practical way. A counselor working with a
Speaker 1: patient who suffers from anxiety might provide the patient with
Speaker 1: tactics they can use to ward off a pending panic attack,
Speaker 1: or they might give an alcoholic patient a set of
Speaker 1: steps to follow when they feel a crave coming on.
Speaker 1: It's problem solving approach UH Counseling therapists work with their
Speaker 1: patients on similar issues, but the key differences. It might
Speaker 1: go deeper to help the patient understand why and how
Speaker 1: they have these challenges, and that's really, you know, something
Speaker 1: that's up to you. For me, I realized through trial
Speaker 1: and error that a therapist asking me to go back
Speaker 1: into my childhood and what was my first anxiety had
Speaker 1: nothing to do with helping me in the moment when
Speaker 1: I'm having an anxiety attack, and it kept my recovery
Speaker 1: from happening for a long time. Because for me, once
Speaker 1: I conquer anxiety and panic, once I get through a
Speaker 1: situation that used to cause anxiety and panic, and I
Speaker 1: do it enough times, I have now built my own
Speaker 1: self esteem, my own receptacle, my own history of overcoming it,
Speaker 1: and I can just simply look back to, oh, well
Speaker 1: last week when I was on the subway, I did this,
Speaker 1: so it's possible. I don't have to believe that this
Speaker 1: is going to kill me. But if we sit there
Speaker 1: and focus on what happened I was a kid, I'm
Speaker 1: never going to get the tools I need to start
Speaker 1: building my life. I mean, if you think about it,
Speaker 1: it's honestly like there's a problem at your house. Are
Speaker 1: you going to call the cops? Are you're gonna call
Speaker 1: the fire department? Is the house on fire called the
Speaker 1: fire department. Is someone breaking in? Call the cops. Are
Speaker 1: you having a heart attack called the paramedics. You know,
Speaker 1: So you have to get clear with yourself what do
Speaker 1: I want help with? And if you're like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I just want someone to tell me something, I think
Speaker 1: you still have to. As you said, you got very clear.
Speaker 1: I want help with ruminating thoughts and I have this
Speaker 1: weird guilt and a therapist might say, oh, that guilt,
Speaker 1: that's actually this you know. Um So I think when
Speaker 1: meeting with therapists you can you know, because you you
Speaker 1: might be able to her this advice and giving. You
Speaker 1: might be able to narrow down who you want to
Speaker 1: speak to. But I feel like you have to say
Speaker 1: to them, hello, I am here to work through these issues,
Speaker 1: and I would like to know if this is something
Speaker 1: you specialize in. And I would also like to know
Speaker 1: your treatment plan and what our goal is going to be,
Speaker 1: you know, And they might wrangle you back a little
Speaker 1: bit and say, well, you know, you don't really understand
Speaker 1: It's that's fine, but I think you can get You
Speaker 1: just have to gauge is someone trying not to turn
Speaker 1: you away or someone really saying no, I do know
Speaker 1: how to deal with this, and if you're not getting
Speaker 1: what you want, you have to say it in the
Speaker 1: session and they might be able to explain why you're
Speaker 1: quote wrong about that. Don't worry, it's coming, or they
Speaker 1: might say, okay, I don't do that. So it's it's
Speaker 1: like anything else. It's a relationship and it takes some
Speaker 1: time of an effort, so it's like it's first about.
Speaker 1: Most therapists will do a fifteen minute phone consultation or
Speaker 1: something to let you know if they're the right match,
Speaker 1: but so that you're at least going down the right path.
Speaker 1: These are the questions you asked. Another common job title
Speaker 1: is psychologist, where therapists and counselors may be considered more
Speaker 1: like than different. It's more pronounced for a psychologist. A
Speaker 1: psychologist uses different techniques and frameworks. They're more likely to
Speaker 1: treat patients with with more severe mental disorders, and that
Speaker 1: requires a higher level of education, such as earning a
Speaker 1: PhD in counseling psychology. And then, of course there are psychiatrists,
Speaker 1: and they're more akin to a medical doctor in the
Speaker 1: sense that they can prescribe medication. Nobody can prescribe medication
Speaker 1: except a psychiatrist. The thing with that is, usually psychiatrists
Speaker 1: see you on a fifteen minute half hour basis to
Speaker 1: talk about how your medication is working for you. They
Speaker 1: are not the people you bring your problems to. Although
Speaker 1: they are qualified to help you, that's just not their purpose.
Speaker 1: And so you would usually have a talk therapist. And
Speaker 1: a lot of times your talk therapist and your psychiatrist
Speaker 1: could even be in contact with one another, which would
Speaker 1: be up to you. So these are the things to
Speaker 1: consider when you're looking for a therapist. And I'm getting
Speaker 1: this on the very well mined website. A therapist could
Speaker 1: have really good skills, but their work is only going
Speaker 1: to be effective if you feel connected to them. So
Speaker 1: the you know, a therapist might have done something that
Speaker 1: worked really well for your friend, it doesn't mean it
Speaker 1: will work out for you. So you have to be
Speaker 1: an agreement on the goals of therapy and the methods
Speaker 1: used to teach those goals. And it's called a therapeutic alliance,
Speaker 1: and it was named by someone named Edward Borden. He's
Speaker 1: a researcher. And the relationship between a therapist and patient
Speaker 1: that's essential to good treatment. So an ap a task
Speaker 1: force found that the type of therapy mattered less than
Speaker 1: this therapeutic relationship. Regardless of whether the therapist used cognitive
Speaker 1: behavioral therapy or psychodynamic therapy. Patient improvement depended on how
Speaker 1: well the therapist and the patient got along. Now, this
Speaker 1: is what researchers saying. I have a slightly different opinion,
Speaker 1: which is that getting the right kind of therapy is
Speaker 1: just as important, and then from there the relationship is important.
Speaker 1: So consider who you want to work with. Is gender
Speaker 1: important to you? Do you want to work with a man,
Speaker 1: a woman, or a non binary person? Do you want
Speaker 1: to work with someone older, younger, or around your age?
Speaker 1: Does religion matter if they have a certain affiliation with
Speaker 1: a religion In your case, do you want to work
Speaker 1: with an LGBTQ therapist that might no how to answer
Speaker 1: specific things about your new journey or these feelings of guilt?
Speaker 1: I mean to me, I would just say if I
Speaker 1: were you, I would search out therapists that that are
Speaker 1: l g b t Q themselves or they are um
Speaker 1: expert in that area. And then also who can do
Speaker 1: anxiety cognitive behavioral therapy work. You can start your search
Speaker 1: by checking your insurance, doing online therapy programs, but I
Speaker 1: find for me UM, I always recommend the A D
Speaker 1: A A dot org, the Anxiety and Depression Association of America.
Speaker 1: They have something on their website where you can find
Speaker 1: a therapist and they have a directory all over the country.
Speaker 1: But you could also just google LGBTQ therapists in your area.
Speaker 1: Just I mean literally put the name of your city
Speaker 1: or town and LGBTQ therapist, hit Google and see what
Speaker 1: you get. There are credentials that therapists have. L c
Speaker 1: s W means Licensed Clinical social Worker, l m f
Speaker 1: TEA means Licensed May Origin Family Therapist, NCC National Certified Counselor,
Speaker 1: l c d C, Licensed Chemical Dependency counselor, LPC Licensed
Speaker 1: Professional counselor, l m HC, Licensed Medical health counselor p
Speaker 1: S y d Doctor of Psychology, pH D, Doctor of Philosophy,
Speaker 1: m D Doctor of Medicine. You might want to ask
Speaker 1: your therapist about how they conduct treatment, how they help
Speaker 1: people who are looking to reach goals similar to yours.
Speaker 1: Some therapist, again, they will offer a brief free consultation
Speaker 1: over the phone prior to scheduling your first appointment. During
Speaker 1: an initial session, a therapist will likely explain how therapy works,
Speaker 1: provide you information on confidentiality, you might have designed some forms,
Speaker 1: and then usually they interview you about the problems or
Speaker 1: symptoms you're experiencing and the goals for treatment. The answers
Speaker 1: you give obviously helps them gain an overall view of you,
Speaker 1: but remember that the first appointment is a great time
Speaker 1: to ask any questions about the process as well. If
Speaker 1: you're not feeling it, you can talk to therapist about
Speaker 1: the fact that you're not feeling a connection. This can
Speaker 1: be awkward, but therapists are trained for these kind of conversations.
Speaker 1: They might also be the person that could help you
Speaker 1: find someone better suited to your needs and actually refer
Speaker 1: you to that person. So I hope that at all helped.
Speaker 1: I know it's a lot that I'm throwing out, but
Speaker 1: the basics are. I will put the links in the
Speaker 1: show notes to these articles, but the basics are. There
Speaker 1: will be sometimes a little trial and error, and don't
Speaker 1: be afraid to ask your therapist about their process and
Speaker 1: to tell them exactly what you think you need to
Speaker 1: the best of your ability today and see what they say.
Speaker 1: And don't be afraid if you are in your first
Speaker 1: your second session and you don't think they're doing what
Speaker 1: you need them to do, you can say something to
Speaker 1: them that's sort of kind of want The whole therapy
Speaker 1: process is about is learning to feel comfortable enough to
Speaker 1: advocate for yourself and letting them react how they're going
Speaker 1: to react, which will never be bad. But they might say, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: this is part of the process, blah blah blah, we're
Speaker 1: going to get there, or oh, you know what, I
Speaker 1: think you need someone who does more of this and
Speaker 1: I actually don't do that. Thanks for bringing it up.
Speaker 1: And if they react terribly, well, then there you go.
Speaker 1: You have found a therapist that is not a good
Speaker 1: match for you and might not even be a good therapist.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, have I babbled enough in this episode?
Speaker 1: I think I have. Thank you all for participating in
Speaker 1: my listener email episodes. I will do about one a month,
Speaker 1: and season one of this podcast ends in mid August,
Speaker 1: so there is still time. Please do email me. I
Speaker 1: love hearing from you all, and again, you can always
Speaker 1: ask me to keep the email confidential. I won't say
Speaker 1: your name, of course, I will never say last names.
Speaker 1: I will never give out email addresses, and somebody screens
Speaker 1: these emails for me and just gets it to me,
Speaker 1: so do not worry about me accidentally doing that on
Speaker 1: air or anything like that. Please write Anxiety Bites weekly
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com and again send me any questions
Speaker 1: you have or if you have any recovery insights that
Speaker 1: you would like to share, and you can follow me
Speaker 1: personally on social media. I am on Twitter at Jen Kirkman,
Speaker 1: where I post a lot of audio grams and clips
Speaker 1: from the Anxiety Bites podcast. My TikTok same thing at
Speaker 1: Jen Kirkman and my Instagram same thing. I post quotes
Speaker 1: and all other things. It's all kind of mixed up,
Speaker 1: but you will find some Anxiety Bites content in all
Speaker 1: three accounts, and I thank you for listening and remember
Speaker 1: Anxiety Bites, but you are in control. For more podcasts
Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app,
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