1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace vanished. A beautiful young mom 2 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:10,440 Speaker 1: just twenty six years old. 3 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 2: A mom of one goes missing after getting into a 4 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:18,880 Speaker 2: pickup with two mystery men. Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace. 5 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:20,920 Speaker 2: This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for 6 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:21,639 Speaker 2: being with us. 7 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:25,280 Speaker 3: Sarah Ebersoll vanished after getting into a black pickup truck 8 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 3: in Reddick, Florida, and was never seen again. 9 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:34,240 Speaker 2: Where is Sarah behind in the wake of her disappearance, 10 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 2: is her little girl wanting mommy listen to this? 11 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 4: Sarah Gail Ebersoll, twenty eight, is missing from Reddick, Florida. 12 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 4: The young mom has not been seen or heard from 13 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 4: since March third, leaving a house party just a mile 14 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,400 Speaker 4: and a half from her home. Sarah's five foot one, 15 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,840 Speaker 4: one hundred and sixteen pounds with blonde hair and blue 16 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 4: eyes as a small cocapelly tattoo on her right hip. 17 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 4: Marion County Sheriff's believe Sarah is in danger. If you 18 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 4: have information on Sarah Gail Ebersol, please call Detective Ryan 19 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,399 Speaker 4: Smith at three five two, three six eight three five 20 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 4: four to two. 21 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,839 Speaker 1: Where is this beautiful young mom? 22 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: Why was she spotted in a pickup truck with two 23 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,520 Speaker 2: so called mystery men joining me an all star panel. 24 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 2: But first I want to go out to her sister, 25 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 2: who has been leading the search for Sarah, Michelle Tullis, Thank. 26 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 1: You for being with us, Thank you for having me. 27 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 2: Michelle, when you first learned that your sister was missing, 28 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 2: what went through your mind? 29 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:33,119 Speaker 1: And how did you find out? 30 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:35,320 Speaker 5: Well? I knew it wasn't normal behavior. I tried to 31 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 5: contact Sarah. She wasn't responding for twenty four hours. She 32 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 5: also had not responded to her roommate, so then we 33 00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:43,320 Speaker 5: tried to reach out to the Mary County Shaf's department immediately. 34 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 2: You know, she was always so reliable, never missed work, 35 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:52,440 Speaker 2: loved her little girl. I'm just trying to think through 36 00:01:52,800 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 2: the facts surrounding Sarah's disappearance. Everybody take a look at 37 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 2: Sarah Ebersol. It's just a stunning young woman, a young 38 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 2: mom in love with her little girl. What went wrong? 39 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:12,520 Speaker 2: As of tonight, no sign of Sarah? So what do 40 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 2: we know? We've backtried her movements. 41 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 6: Listen, when Sarah Ebersol gets off work at seven pm, Thursday, 42 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 6: March second, she grabs a ride home from a coworker 43 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,640 Speaker 6: Sarah's roommate, Deborah, is out of town and Sarah tells 44 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 6: her about trash pickup. Deborah tells her to get their 45 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 6: friend Lonnie to pick up the trash. Nothing out of 46 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:34,640 Speaker 6: the ordinary. At nine forty five pm, Sarah walks to 47 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 6: a corner store near her apartment, but realizes she won't 48 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:40,680 Speaker 6: make it before they close at ten pm. Still wanting 49 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:43,239 Speaker 6: to grab a few items, Sarah gets Lonnie to drive 50 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 6: her to a Circle K a mile up the highway, joining. 51 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 2: Me in All Star Pound to make sense of what 52 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 2: we are learning tonight. You have already met Sarah's sister Michelle, 53 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 2: now straight out to Giovanni Dias, investigative reporter of WFTV 54 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 2: nine in Florida, professor of Valencia College. Giovanni, thank you 55 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 2: for being with us. I'm just thinking in terms of 56 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 2: a mom Okay, That's how I'm seeing this, and as 57 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 2: a crime victim myself. A lot of the scenarios surrounding 58 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 2: Sirah's disappearance doesn't make sense to me, but I want to. 59 00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:20,239 Speaker 1: Start with her walking. 60 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 2: She gets to ride home with a coworker, and then 61 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,239 Speaker 2: she realized she wants to go to the convenience store 62 00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 2: Circle k now. I don't know if circle k's are 63 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 2: all around the country, but in quasi rural areas it's 64 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 2: normal to walk half a mile to the circle K 65 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:40,200 Speaker 2: and walk back home with your stuff. Very normal. When 66 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 2: I was growing up in rural Georgia, middle Georgia, that 67 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 2: was commonplace. We would walk to the corner store or 68 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:51,840 Speaker 2: the MacBride's grocery store, which was a little bit further, 69 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 2: and or would take our bikes. 70 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 1: It was no big deal. 71 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 2: So explain to me, Giovanni, that night, she gets home 72 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 2: from work and she needs to go to the grocery store, 73 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: so she wants a ride to circle K. 74 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: Is that correct? 75 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:10,160 Speaker 7: That's exactly correct. Thanks for having me, and that you 76 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 7: refer to this as someone who's been a victim yourself 77 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 7: and also as a mother, and I actually approached this 78 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:17,719 Speaker 7: as someone who also lost his sister. You know, I 79 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:20,359 Speaker 7: also lost my sister. And I actually applaud Michelle for 80 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:22,839 Speaker 7: all the work that she's been doing she's been doing 81 00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 7: on the on behalf of her sister here, because she's 82 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 7: really been pushing this story and pushing for investigation into 83 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,160 Speaker 7: what happened to Sarah. But that's exactly correct. She actually 84 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 7: basically vanished and nobody really knows what happened to her. 85 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 7: I actually went to the store where she was last 86 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 7: seen at the time. People are aware of her disappearance. 87 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 7: They know the story. When I got there and I 88 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:47,520 Speaker 7: mentioned what I was doing there, I try to gather 89 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 7: information about Sarah. People know the story. If people know 90 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:55,160 Speaker 7: about Sarah, they are just as stunned about her disappearance 91 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 7: as everyone else is, especially folks from her family. But again, 92 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 7: really there's at this point, which is the most outrageous 93 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:05,960 Speaker 7: part of this case is that we still don't have 94 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:08,799 Speaker 7: any leeds into where Sarah is and this is still 95 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 7: a case of miss a missing person. 96 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 2: You know, Giovanni, I'm trying to process everything you just said. 97 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 2: You got me drinking out of the fire hydrant. That 98 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 2: was too much, too fast. So you've been to the 99 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 2: circle k where she was last spot and in fact 100 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 2: spotted on video. We know she was there, we know 101 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 2: what time she was there was timestamped. And this was 102 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 2: not an irresponsible mom. She showed up to work every day, 103 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:36,599 Speaker 2: she took care of her daughter, and I mean she 104 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 2: was back and forth with the roommate. The roommate, Deborah 105 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 2: was at an annual women's veterans retreat. They were texting 106 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 2: back and forth about trash pickup and that seems so 107 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 2: normal and somewhat mundane. And you know what I've noticed, 108 00:05:55,520 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 2: don't move Giovanni Diaz too. Doctor Leslie Dobson joining US 109 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:02,720 Speaker 2: clinical forensics psychologists and host of a brand new podcast, 110 00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:07,239 Speaker 2: Intentionally Disturbing. You can find her at Dr Leslie Doobson 111 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 2: dot com, author of The Friend Cleanse. Doctor Leslie, thank 112 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 2: you for being with us. Just something Giovanni said. We 113 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 2: were talking about that she needed to go pick up 114 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:19,359 Speaker 2: things from. 115 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:23,040 Speaker 1: Circle K, that she was texting back and forth with. 116 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 2: Her roommate who was at this female veteran's get together 117 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:30,840 Speaker 2: over the weekend, about the trash pickup. You know, I 118 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 2: think the bulk of my text with my husband, pick 119 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 2: up this from the grocery store? 120 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 1: Are you getting the twins? Roll the trash out? 121 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 4: Do this? 122 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 1: Did you turn off the coffee pot? 123 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 2: It's part of a rhythm, right, It's seemingly to everybody 124 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:49,880 Speaker 2: else it's mundane, but it's our world. And it always 125 00:06:49,880 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 2: shocked me so much when my fiancee was murdered. Everything 126 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 2: was just fine, everything was fine, and then all of 127 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 2: a sudden life stopped. 128 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 1: It's like the world exploded, and that's the way it 129 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: is here. 130 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 2: One moment, this mother of one is texting, hey, when's 131 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 2: trash pick up? The next thing you know, she's gone, 132 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 2: and she hasn't been saying since that dichotomy, Doctor Leslie, 133 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 2: is very hard for the human mind to take in. 134 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: Definitely. 135 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:20,640 Speaker 8: You know, it's a concept we call ambiguous loss, where 136 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 8: we don't have closure until we figure out what has 137 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 8: happened to the individual. So I commend her sister for 138 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 8: trying and continuing through this, But the pain is almost 139 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 8: worse than actually finding out the result, right. The pain 140 00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 8: of carrying the weight of not knowing is so traumatic 141 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 8: and horrible for everyone involved. 142 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, doctor Leslie, I'm just thinking about what 143 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 2: her little girl is going through. You know, she's going 144 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 2: to have birthdays and Christmases without mother. I'm less Siah's found. 145 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 2: Michelle tell us when it actually sinked into you jumping 146 00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 2: off what Doctor Leslie. Dobson just said that she didn't 147 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 2: just let her phone die. 148 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 1: She just wasn't out of range. She wasn't at. 149 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 2: A party or having a great first date with someone 150 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 2: and not picking her phone up when it really hit you, 151 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 2: my sister is missing. 152 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:20,720 Speaker 1: I guess the closest. 153 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:22,840 Speaker 2: Person in the world to me, next to my twins 154 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:26,600 Speaker 2: and husband, is my sister. We grew up together, very 155 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:32,920 Speaker 2: much alike, look alike everything. How did what happened when 156 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 2: you realized she just doesn't. 157 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:36,680 Speaker 1: Have a flat tire and her phones? 158 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 9: Did? 159 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 1: She's really gone? Great? 160 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 5: My sister had actually messaged me before she went missing. 161 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 5: So when I messaged her saying, hey, Sarah, where are 162 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,839 Speaker 5: you at, she's not responding. I knew something immediately was 163 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 5: wrong because maybe twenty four hours of her phone you 164 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:52,560 Speaker 5: needed to charge or she broke it and get a 165 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:55,160 Speaker 5: new one. But never with Sarah just not respond She 166 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:56,680 Speaker 5: just wasn't your responsible like that? 167 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:59,319 Speaker 1: Where is Sarah? 168 00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 2: Sarah Abersoon, her life in front of her just twenty 169 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:04,679 Speaker 2: six years old too? 170 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:05,120 Speaker 8: Do you? 171 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 2: Vannie Diaz joining me investigative reporter WFTV nine in Florida. 172 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 2: When you went to the circle, K, I mean I 173 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 2: can envision it because they're all over the southeastern part. 174 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:21,679 Speaker 1: Of the country. Tell me about it. 175 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:23,440 Speaker 2: Is there a big parking lot in the front, on 176 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:25,280 Speaker 2: the side, is there a parking lot in the back? 177 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 2: Is there a heavily wooded area behind it. Is there 178 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 2: a spot for dumpsters where things could be thrown? Are 179 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:37,440 Speaker 2: there businesses on either side? Just describe it for us. 180 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:39,960 Speaker 7: It really is exactly how I mentioned, except so that 181 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,080 Speaker 7: there is not a lot of businesses around. It really 182 00:09:42,160 --> 00:09:46,320 Speaker 7: is just one single location surrounded by wood and you know, 183 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:50,200 Speaker 7: it's a very heavily wooded area and a big parking 184 00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:52,120 Speaker 7: lot right in front of it. Actually, when I went 185 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:54,960 Speaker 7: in there, and you know, I told folks that I 186 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 7: was a news reporter trying to find more information about 187 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 7: the case of Sarah, they asked me if I knew 188 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 7: what had happened to her, There was any like there 189 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 7: were any updates on the story, there were people are 190 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 7: questioning about it. And as I was doing, you know, 191 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 7: walking around trying to piece together the path that she 192 00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:15,080 Speaker 7: followed that night. And you see, and once again a 193 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:17,400 Speaker 7: lot of props to Michelle for the work she's been 194 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:21,280 Speaker 7: doing on this case, because there are signs with the 195 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 7: phone number please reach out to us if we have 196 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:26,120 Speaker 7: any information about Sarah. There is like there was a 197 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 7: reward put out for any information regarding her location at 198 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,559 Speaker 7: this point, and people just stop us to ask, can 199 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,719 Speaker 7: you do you know, do you know anything about her? 200 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:38,400 Speaker 7: Do you know if you know what's happened. Is there 201 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 7: any new development on this case, because the whole community 202 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 7: there in the area and really across central Florida is 203 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 7: watching to see what happened, because, as you mentioned, it 204 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 7: really is astounding to imagine that this girl was just 205 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 7: going to work. She was just a normal person doing 206 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 7: her thing, and she's here now and five minutes later 207 00:10:57,480 --> 00:11:00,160 Speaker 7: she's gone. We do know that she took a final pick, sure, 208 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 7: and I think we just showed that picture there that 209 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 7: was one of the final pictures that that Sarah took. 210 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 7: And then after that really there you can. 211 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: See in the background the Sitgo gas tank. 212 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 2: I want to jump off what Giovanni Dia has just 213 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 2: told us WFTV nine Joining me now, Ashley Wardlaw, private investigator, 214 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 2: chief operation officer at Nathan's Investigations in the Florida jurisdiction. 215 00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 1: Ashley, thank you for being with us. 216 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 2: What Giovanni just said presents another problem now. It sounds 217 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 2: very much like I said, where I grew up in 218 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 2: Middle Georgia, rural, rural Middle Georgia, and we would have 219 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 2: to walk literally just under a mile to get to 220 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 2: the corner store. Then Ashley, we couldn't go there anymore 221 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 2: because they started selling beer on Sunday and Mom was like, 222 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,360 Speaker 2: in oh, we are never setting foot in there again. 223 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:56,160 Speaker 1: Okay. 224 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 2: Then we had to walk to the PEP station, which 225 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 2: is a gas station that sols snacks, or all the 226 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 2: way to macbrian's. 227 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:06,560 Speaker 1: Grocery store, which is even further. So what I'm saying 228 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 1: is there's nothing around it. 229 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 2: You don't have additional surveillance on either side, like if 230 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 2: you're in Manhattan or if you're in the city of Atlanta, 231 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:21,199 Speaker 2: where you can see how investigators can put together a 232 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 2: video of montage. Okay, they went by this red light, 233 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 2: then they came to this store, then they passed this 234 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:32,079 Speaker 2: security video and you see the vehicle or the person 235 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:34,079 Speaker 2: traveling along and you can trace them. 236 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:38,839 Speaker 1: It's not hard, but not here in this jurisdiction. 237 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:45,040 Speaker 10: Yes, Nancy, working cases in these rural or country areas, 238 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 10: it definitely can be difficult for an investigator when you 239 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:51,880 Speaker 10: don't have the goal tobes, which would be let me 240 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 10: check surveillance, let me check the neighbors surveillance, let me 241 00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 10: you know, pull footage from another nearby business. When the 242 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 10: nearby business is miles away. So the best thing for 243 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 10: an investigator to do would be to use time. You know, 244 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:09,040 Speaker 10: time is of the essence for a case like this 245 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:13,679 Speaker 10: checking with people who was at the gas station because 246 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,840 Speaker 10: memory fade, right over time, the memory fade, So we 247 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 10: have to canvas, We have to do interviews immediately if 248 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 10: there is you know, some type of phone evidence that 249 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:27,319 Speaker 10: we need to examine, that needs to be done immediately. 250 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 10: And I think with this case, just you know, time 251 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 10: would would slip away when you know someone's being told, 252 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:37,520 Speaker 10: you know, come back a week later instead of you know, 253 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:42,679 Speaker 10: jumping immediately into doing the investigation. But yeah, these these 254 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:45,719 Speaker 10: rural areas, it can get difficult, but it's not impossible. 255 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:51,600 Speaker 2: Where is twenty six year old mom of one Sarah Ebersoul? 256 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 2: What I'm about to tell you will make you cringe. 257 00:13:57,920 --> 00:13:59,839 Speaker 1: Second verse sam. 258 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 4: As of Listen Inside the Circle K, Sarah meets up 259 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,720 Speaker 4: with two cowboys. Her new friends invited her to a 260 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:09,719 Speaker 4: party at ten eleven PM. Sarah takes a selfie from 261 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 4: inside a black pickup truck and texts the picture to 262 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 4: her sister Michelle with the caption, girl, I just jumped 263 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:18,320 Speaker 4: into a random car with some cowboys, and I hope 264 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 4: they take me on a ride. 265 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 2: Joining me in addition to the guests you've already met, 266 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 2: Matthew Burhoma joining us out of LA. Veteran trial lawyer 267 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:31,720 Speaker 2: with power trial lawyers. Matthew, thank you for being with us. 268 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 2: Can you take off your defense hat just one moment? 269 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 2: Do you just groan or grimace when you hear about 270 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 2: another innocent woman who thinks, Okay, that's gonna be fun 271 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 2: and goes with guys she's never met before to a party? 272 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 11: Of course, absolutely. I mean, you know, there seems to 273 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 11: be that there's relationships that are they're strangers, they just met. 274 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:05,040 Speaker 11: Maybe if you that wouldn't necessarily care for your well being, right, So, 275 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 11: there's certainly a lot of questions that I have from 276 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 11: LA perspective about who these individuals are, how did they 277 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:17,160 Speaker 11: come to meet, and how well do they care about 278 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 11: each other and know each other? 279 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,760 Speaker 2: Guys, we have heard this story over and over again. 280 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:25,680 Speaker 2: As of right now, we don't know where Sarah Ebersol is, 281 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,600 Speaker 2: we don't know who took her, we don't know if 282 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:32,240 Speaker 2: she's still alive, but the search for her is ongoing 283 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:36,760 Speaker 2: right now, largely by her sister joining us tonight, Michelle. 284 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: But again it's the second. 285 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 2: Verse same as the first, is the name Natalie Holloway 286 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:42,600 Speaker 2: ring a bell. 287 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 12: Natalie Holloway is among more than one hundred seniors on 288 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 12: a graduation trip to Aruba from Alabama. The night before 289 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:52,760 Speaker 12: their trip home, Natalie and her friends go to Carlos 290 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 12: and Charlie's, a restaurant and nightclub frequented by tourists. The 291 00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 12: teens head back to their hotel rooms. No one notices 292 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 12: that Natalie isn't with them. 293 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 9: When I first got the call and the caller said 294 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 9: that Natalie was missing and no one had seen her, 295 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 9: and that she missed her flight. And in that instant, 296 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 9: I knew. I knew instantly that something was terribly wrong. 297 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 2: That's my friend, Natalie's mother, Beth is speaking, and it 298 00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:24,120 Speaker 2: did not have a good ending. 299 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: Listen to yourn Vandersloot. 300 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 13: Tells me she doesn't want me to feel her up. 301 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 13: I insist I keep feeling her up either way, and 302 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 13: she needs me sense of kneeing me in the crotch 303 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:44,680 Speaker 13: When she needs me in the crotch, I get up 304 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 13: on the beach and I kick her extremely hard in 305 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 13: the face. 306 00:16:53,720 --> 00:17:01,800 Speaker 14: Yeah, She's laying down unconscious, possibly even even dead, definitely unconscious, 307 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 14: and I see right next to her, there's a huge 308 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 14: cinder block laying on the beach. 309 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 2: Two Doctor Leslie Dobson joining us, author of intentionally disturbing 310 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 2: Doctor Leslie. It all seems fun and innocent at the time. 311 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 2: When Natalie Holloway met your Van der Sloot and his friends, 312 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 2: the Kalpo brothers, everything was fine. She was on a 313 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 2: high school trip down to Aruba. Everyone was enjoying the night. 314 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 2: It was the night before they were coming back home 315 00:17:33,119 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 2: to the US, to Alabama, and they were going to 316 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:37,600 Speaker 2: go down to the beach. 317 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,400 Speaker 1: What could go wrong? I've seen a lot. 318 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:46,359 Speaker 2: Of victims shaming Dr Leslie, But remember these are young people. 319 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:47,720 Speaker 1: Natalie was a teen. 320 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:52,200 Speaker 2: Sarah has just turned twenty six, right, and she meets 321 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:55,840 Speaker 2: these guys, And why should she think that anything's wrong 322 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 2: about going to a party. Why should she just assume 323 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 2: something horrible or the farius is going to happen to her? 324 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 1: Exactly. 325 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:05,880 Speaker 8: We should be able to go about our lives safely 326 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 8: without the risk of losing our life or disappearing. And 327 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:13,399 Speaker 8: it's horrifying, But it is such a sad part of 328 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 8: this world that. 329 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 1: We have to deal with. 330 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:20,400 Speaker 8: And I mean people saw her, people saw her, somebody 331 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:24,159 Speaker 8: saw her last. Somebody needs to answer for this. 332 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 1: This is not her fault. Guys. 333 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:30,919 Speaker 2: Let's advance the knowledge of what we have right now 334 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:32,080 Speaker 2: about what happened to Sarah. 335 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 6: Listen. 336 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:36,240 Speaker 3: James Bubba Robinson shares a duplex with couple Jimmy Shawler 337 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 3: and Tisha McDermott. Bubba and Sarah spend hours socializing with 338 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 3: Jimmy and Tisha, with Sarah documenting their time together with 339 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:46,040 Speaker 3: numerous cloud saved photos both outside and inside the home. 340 00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:49,440 Speaker 3: At one twenty four am, Bubba Tech's a friend, Tyrone 341 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:53,640 Speaker 3: Mormon Mormon invites himself over to Bubba's house. Sarah's Gmail 342 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:57,440 Speaker 3: shows she was watching YouTube videos around two forty am. 343 00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 3: At two fifty seven am, Sarah's phone sinks for the 344 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:01,880 Speaker 3: last time. 345 00:19:01,760 --> 00:19:05,639 Speaker 2: Two fifty seven am. We know she did go to 346 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 2: a party. Michelle Tullus, this is Sarah Ebersol's sister, because 347 00:19:10,119 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 2: she was having fun and taking selfies and she was 348 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 2: enjoying the evening at this party, this house party with 349 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:22,920 Speaker 2: another couple, Jimmy and Tisha. We know that because they 350 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:27,480 Speaker 2: have photos together, selfies they were taken together. We know 351 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:31,920 Speaker 2: she was there until around two forty am. 352 00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:33,160 Speaker 1: Is that correct, Michelle? 353 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 5: Yes, Jimmy provided photos from his device when I requested 354 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 5: them April of twenty twenty three. 355 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 2: You're seeing the photos we were showing of that evening, 356 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:47,919 Speaker 2: the last evening. We can place her whereabouts. It was 357 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 2: all innocent. Everything was fine. Couples were having fun, they 358 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:57,119 Speaker 2: were listening to music, they were taking selfies. When you 359 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 2: don't know where to go, you go back, try to 360 00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 2: figure out who is your victim, Who was her inner circle? 361 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 2: Who was she with when she goes missing? Who is 362 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 2: Sarah Ebersol? 363 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:11,199 Speaker 1: This is what we've learned. 364 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 3: Sarah Van born and raised in Florida, The youngest of 365 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 3: seven siblings, spends most of her childhood in Sarasota, but 366 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:19,840 Speaker 3: in her teen years moves to Danellen with sister Michelle. 367 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 3: At just eighteen, Sarah Mary's her first love, Thomas Ebersoll. 368 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:26,399 Speaker 3: The young couple quickly realizes they moved too quickly and 369 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:30,640 Speaker 3: part ways amicably just a year later. Sarah keeping the Ebersol. 370 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: Name crime stories with Nancy Grace. 371 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 2: Matthew Barhoma joining US federal trial lawyer out of LA 372 00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:45,920 Speaker 2: that's what we call a starter marriage. 373 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,399 Speaker 1: Don't read too much into it, right, right, And she 374 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 1: kept the last name, So she did. 375 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 2: She kept Ebersol as the last name, and the two 376 00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:58,960 Speaker 2: split amicably, and then she finds love listen. 377 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:03,119 Speaker 6: After her first marriage, Sarah begins seeing Joseph Meeton. The 378 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 6: couple is soon expecting a baby girl, but while pregnant, 379 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:10,520 Speaker 6: Sarah obtains a restraining order against Meeton after a physical assault. 380 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,159 Speaker 6: The parents are in court for custody decisions before Sarah 381 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:17,119 Speaker 6: even gives birth. In just a few days after her 382 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,520 Speaker 6: daughter's birth, Sarah changes her name from Dahlia Van to 383 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 6: Cora Meeton at the father's demand. 384 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 2: With me Sarah Ebersill's sister Michelle tell Us, who has 385 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 2: led the search for her own sister. That relationship that 386 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 2: is the baby girl we're talking about, baby Coora, Sarah 387 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:43,600 Speaker 2: struggle to get along with Mayton Joseph Matonkora's dad. The 388 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 2: two split. What was the main problem? I understand Sarah 389 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:52,520 Speaker 2: Ebersill had to get a restraining order against the husband. 390 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:54,479 Speaker 5: He did have to get a restraining order. He has 391 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,199 Speaker 5: physically assaulted her, well pregnant. So then she went to 392 00:21:57,600 --> 00:21:59,959 Speaker 5: the court to obtain that restraining order to protect her 393 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 5: her unborn child. It was in asked for six months. 394 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,320 Speaker 5: He left and went to another state, and then after 395 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 5: six months he showed back up in Florida where Sarah 396 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 5: and her daughter were living with me, and that's where 397 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 5: the custody battle started. 398 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:18,080 Speaker 2: So I understand that to keep the peace, Sarah changed 399 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 2: the baby's name. At first, she didn't have the maiden 400 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:27,800 Speaker 2: last name, but at the dad, the biodad's request, she 401 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:32,520 Speaker 2: changed Cora's name to Cora Maytan from Dollia Van. 402 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:33,280 Speaker 1: Is that correct? 403 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:35,120 Speaker 5: That's right before she heard one years old. 404 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,159 Speaker 6: Marion County sheriffs tracks Sarah to a Circle K convenience 405 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 6: store two miles from her home in Reddick, Florida. Security 406 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,280 Speaker 6: footage captures Sarah inside the store, then saying goodbye to 407 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,879 Speaker 6: Lnnie and getting in one of the men's black truck 408 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:52,360 Speaker 6: at ten ten pm. Several smiling selfies with the men 409 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 6: indicate Sarah left with them willingly. 410 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:59,639 Speaker 2: How many times have we heard the same scenario? Now 411 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 2: it's there at Ebersol, who goes missing after a night 412 00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:06,359 Speaker 2: partying with new friends that she meets at the Circle K, 413 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:11,399 Speaker 2: having no idea she may never see her little girl again. 414 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 2: Very often, we as investigators and prosecutors see the same 415 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 2: scenario unfold, where unwittingly you end up with someone you've 416 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:24,960 Speaker 2: never met before, like Kristin Smart. 417 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 4: Kristin Smart was enrolled at cal Poly in San Luis Obispo, California. 418 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,960 Speaker 4: As Memorial Day weekend rolled around, Smart made plans to 419 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 4: attend a birthday party for a fellow student. Students Cheryl 420 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 4: Anderson and Tim Davis walk Smart back to her dorm. 421 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 4: Along the way, another student from the party, Paul Flores, 422 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 4: joins their group. He offers to help Smart get to 423 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 4: her dorm rooms safely. 424 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:49,880 Speaker 2: You know that makes me think, to doctor Leslie Dobson, 425 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 2: joining US psychologist, I don't like the way that Sarah 426 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:55,960 Speaker 2: Ebersol has been portrayed. 427 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:58,919 Speaker 1: She met some guys. 428 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:02,399 Speaker 2: They invited her to a party, a house party that 429 00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 2: was hosted by another couple, and she went somehow as 430 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,199 Speaker 2: you hear Kristen Smart's mom say, I don't like the 431 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 2: way they refer to my daughter. Is that drunk girl 432 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 2: that was not Christa Smart. 433 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 1: She was brilliant all A's. She went to a. 434 00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 2: Get together and was walking home with friends and then 435 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,680 Speaker 2: they peeled off and the only one walking her home 436 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,879 Speaker 2: then was her killer now convicted. 437 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 1: I mean that was through no fault of her own. 438 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 2: And I see the same smear job dragging Sarah Ebersol 439 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,800 Speaker 2: through the mud in this case because she went to. 440 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:40,120 Speaker 8: A party exactly and as somebody who worked at cal 441 00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 8: Poly and I walked by that dorm room where she 442 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 8: was killed. And Paul Flores has a pattern. So many 443 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 8: people came out and spoke out about Paul Flora's after 444 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:55,920 Speaker 8: that happened. There is somebody surrounding this case with Sarah 445 00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 8: who has a history, and history is our indication of 446 00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,240 Speaker 8: what sure is going to lead to. 447 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,760 Speaker 2: To Michelle tell Us joining me, this is Sarah's sister, Michelle. 448 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:08,200 Speaker 2: The way that Sarah has been portrayed, I. 449 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 1: Don't like it at all. 450 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,879 Speaker 2: She did nothing wrong, yet somehow it's easier to go, oh, 451 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 2: she met these guys in a circle k and took 452 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 2: off and they are black. 453 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 1: Pickup. This is all on her. It's not all on her. 454 00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:22,639 Speaker 1: Do you ever get tired of hearing that? 455 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 5: I do. Sarah was such a kind spirit. She would 456 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 5: have immersed herself in anything the world had to offer. 457 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,600 Speaker 5: She thought everyone was a new personality and a new experience. 458 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: What more do we know? 459 00:25:34,720 --> 00:25:41,760 Speaker 2: We know that somehow someone tried to reset her password 460 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 2: that night. 461 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:44,280 Speaker 1: Listen. 462 00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 6: Sarah's Google account history shows she was on YouTube until 463 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:51,400 Speaker 6: two forty am March third. Later that day, the account 464 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:55,560 Speaker 6: history was viewed and deleted. Just before two pm March third, 465 00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:59,439 Speaker 6: someone tries to reset sarah snapchat password. The new login 466 00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:02,399 Speaker 6: link was sent to her email, but it's unclear if 467 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 6: the attempt was successful. 468 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:05,000 Speaker 1: There has been no. 469 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 6: Further digital activity on Sarah's emails, social media, or bank 470 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:09,679 Speaker 6: accounts since. 471 00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 1: To Giovanni Dias WFTV. 472 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:16,359 Speaker 2: Nine, could you explain that in slow mo for me, 473 00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:19,800 Speaker 2: someone's changing her password and deleting her search history? 474 00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,199 Speaker 7: What and at this point, that's all we really have, 475 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:27,439 Speaker 7: all those records of her digital footprint. Right as the 476 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 7: one of your guests just mentioned, there was no videos nearby, 477 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,480 Speaker 7: There was no other businesses nearby to kind of pinpoint 478 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,800 Speaker 7: what happened to her after the moment she was picked 479 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,159 Speaker 7: up by that you know, for that ride that she 480 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 7: went into. So at this point, all the investigators into 481 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,720 Speaker 7: this case have is basically all those digital marks from 482 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 7: phones and every you know, all of those pictures that 483 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 7: were taken and the attempt to change that password. That 484 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:57,680 Speaker 7: email actually was sent to her to Sarah, because that's 485 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 7: the standard how when you try to change your password 486 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 7: on your phone. And Michelle was actually able to find 487 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 7: that later on because of her personal investigation into this case. 488 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 7: And that's as much as the investigators have. I actually 489 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:17,239 Speaker 7: interviewed the Marion County Sheriff's Department about this case, and 490 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,760 Speaker 7: they wouldn't really give me a lot of information about this. 491 00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,440 Speaker 7: They only said that they have a lot of leads. 492 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 7: They're still looking into potential connections with other people that 493 00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:29,040 Speaker 7: kind of were located in the nearby area. But at 494 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 7: this point, and that was the last time I interviewed them, 495 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:33,639 Speaker 7: they said they could not share a lot about this 496 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,359 Speaker 7: case because it is still under investigation, which to me 497 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:39,879 Speaker 7: seems a little problematic because we have made no further 498 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 7: discovery into this case. 499 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:47,720 Speaker 2: Michelle, regarding discovering you discovered not police, not law enforcement, 500 00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 2: not some detective, but you discovered someone to try to 501 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:52,320 Speaker 2: change her password. 502 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:53,600 Speaker 1: How did that happen? 503 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 5: I gaged access to there as teleccount and when I 504 00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:59,040 Speaker 5: figured Marin County wasn't taken this seriously as in the 505 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 5: same person's case, and I could see the ascess to 506 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,879 Speaker 5: the Slasha, which I notified them immediately, and then throughout 507 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,640 Speaker 5: the investigation, I even continued to go ahead and get 508 00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:10,840 Speaker 5: into other accounts, email in her iCloud where you can 509 00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 5: see the video interacting throughout the night. And I also 510 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 5: Surrell and Theariam located the truck that I just forgot into. 511 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,440 Speaker 2: Where is twenty six year old Sarah Ebersol, the mother 512 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:26,120 Speaker 2: of one little girl? Now we learn that fateful night 513 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 2: when she was last seeing, last seeing in a circle 514 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,719 Speaker 2: K video, and last seeing taken selfies at a party 515 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 2: with the other couples that were there that very evening, 516 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:41,360 Speaker 2: someone went into her digital account and tried to change 517 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 2: her password. Not only that, her account history was viewed 518 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 2: and deleted. Now why would someone go in to reset 519 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:56,520 Speaker 2: your Snapchat password? We know that because a new login 520 00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:00,239 Speaker 2: was sent to her email, But I wonder if that 521 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 2: person couldn't access her email to make it complete a 522 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 2: complete change. Very reminiscent of fraudulent activity on murder victim 523 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 2: Gabby Petito's cell phone. 524 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:19,280 Speaker 4: In the aftermath of Gabby Potito's murder, the Potito family 525 00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,880 Speaker 4: alleges that Brian Laundry used Gabby's phone to send text 526 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:26,000 Speaker 4: messages to her family in an attempt to deceive them. 527 00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 4: Among the messages Brian Laundry is believed to assent is 528 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 4: a text message to Gabby's mother, Nicole Schmidt, about Gabby's grandfather. 529 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:37,719 Speaker 4: In the text, he refers to Gabby's grandfather as Stan. 530 00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 4: Schmid has stated Gabby never called her grandfather by his 531 00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 4: first name and that the text was highly suspicious. 532 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:49,960 Speaker 2: Michelle, this is Sarah's sister? Was that normal? Would Sarah? 533 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 2: Did she frequently change her passwords? 534 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 5: This particular access to the snatchat happened on an account 535 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,480 Speaker 5: she had not leased in twenty seventeen, so it would 536 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 5: not be an account. Give with attempt. 537 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. 538 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 2: Actually Wardlaw joining US private Investigator Chief Chief Operations Officer 539 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 2: Nathan's Investigations Actually again. 540 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. 541 00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:27,040 Speaker 2: That is a multi step process to go through view 542 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 2: your search history, delete your search history, you know, line 543 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:36,000 Speaker 2: by line, then go through the hoops of trying to 544 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 2: change a password. 545 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:38,640 Speaker 1: That takes a lot of effort. 546 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,120 Speaker 2: And I find it really hard to believe that at 547 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 2: a party, this twenty six year old mom of one 548 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,560 Speaker 2: is sitting at the party, changing her password and deleting 549 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:48,360 Speaker 2: her search history. 550 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:50,120 Speaker 1: That did not happen, Ashley. 551 00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:55,040 Speaker 10: Yes, that's very very suspicious, Nancy, for someone to take 552 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 10: the initiative to even start the process to recover a password. 553 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,840 Speaker 10: It is a multi step process, right. You just don't 554 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:05,160 Speaker 10: go and click for gap password and you get to 555 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,600 Speaker 10: make a new one. You have to go through loopholes 556 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 10: nowadays to get access to an email to reset the password. 557 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 10: Sometimes they send you text messages to be able to 558 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 10: authenticate you who you are to reset this pass code. 559 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,960 Speaker 10: So it's very very suspicious that that was going on 560 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:24,880 Speaker 10: at the time when she's supposed to be partying. 561 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:29,280 Speaker 2: Interesting that Sarah's sister has to lead the charge in 562 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:30,160 Speaker 2: finding her. 563 00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,840 Speaker 4: Listen, Sarah's sister, Michelle Tullis, begins searching the area for 564 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 4: the black truck. She doesn't have to look hard. A 565 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,040 Speaker 4: black truck matching the surveillance footage is parked at a 566 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 4: home less than a tenth of a mile from the 567 00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:45,040 Speaker 4: circle k. The owner, Leonard Anderson, recognizes a photo of Sarah, 568 00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 4: saying she accepted his buddy James Robinson's invitation to a 569 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,160 Speaker 4: house party and he dropped them off at Robinson's home 570 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 4: next door the night of March second. 571 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:57,240 Speaker 2: Okay, so once again we're corroborating those photos that we 572 00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 2: already see about the house party at the couple's home. 573 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 1: There's more. Listen. 574 00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 3: Leonard Anderson and James Robinson are happy to speak to 575 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:07,959 Speaker 3: Marion County Sheriff's about Sarah. Robinson says Sarah joined him 576 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:10,520 Speaker 3: in his roommates for a small house party. Photos Sarah 577 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,400 Speaker 3: took that night's show her posing with Robinson, James Shaller, 578 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 3: and his girlfriend Tisha McDermott. The girls even took turns 579 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:20,240 Speaker 3: modeling outfits from Tsha's closet. One twenty four am. Robinson 580 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 3: text friend at Tyrone Mormon about the party and Mormon 581 00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:26,560 Speaker 3: decides to come over. Robinson says when the party wound down, 582 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 3: Mormon offered to get Sarah home. Robinson says he helped 583 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:33,640 Speaker 3: Sarah to his car between three and five am. 584 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:39,520 Speaker 2: So bring me up to this point, Giovanni Diaz WFTV nine. 585 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 2: So they're stating they are with her, they partied into 586 00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:50,160 Speaker 2: the night, and they're all going back to his car 587 00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 2: at between three and five am. 588 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 1: Is that correct? 589 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,480 Speaker 7: That's correct? And that's this point, that's the only person 590 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,080 Speaker 7: in this story that actually connects all of those locations 591 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,920 Speaker 7: and everything that so far we know about what happened 592 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 7: to Sarah, and that's where this is. That's where our 593 00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:11,080 Speaker 7: dead end is. I actually specifically asked this the Marion 594 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,440 Speaker 7: County Sheriff's office when I did this story, what can 595 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 7: you tell us about this person, Tyrone Mormon, and they 596 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 7: basically were very tight lipped about it. And once again 597 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:24,080 Speaker 7: we go back to the digital aspect of this, because 598 00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:27,040 Speaker 7: he also deleted information from his phone. 599 00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 2: Okay, Giovanni Diaz, I don't like the sound of this 600 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 2: guy Mormon deleting things from his own phone. 601 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 1: From that not you know, if you look at my phone, 602 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: I've got seven thousand literally unread messages. 603 00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:46,520 Speaker 2: I'm not picking through all that to delete something specific. 604 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 1: Why was he deleting messages. 605 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 2: It's very very disturbing that he would pick those messages 606 00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:55,840 Speaker 2: to delete. 607 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 1: And that's not all. 608 00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,720 Speaker 6: Listen, Tyrone Mormon refuses to talk. Deputies get a search 609 00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,960 Speaker 6: warrant for his phone, but Mormon misses his appointment to 610 00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,440 Speaker 6: extract the data. Mormon claims he smashed the phone, so 611 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:12,880 Speaker 6: he trashed it. However, Mormon's girlfriend says that isn't true. Tyrone. 612 00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,800 Speaker 6: Mormon is arrested for lying to police. When investigators arrived 613 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:19,239 Speaker 6: to search his home for the phone, he turns it over. 614 00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:22,799 Speaker 6: Information from the device shows Sarah and Mormon stop at 615 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 6: a convenience store in northeast Marion County, but no further 616 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:27,400 Speaker 6: movements are determined. 617 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 1: Okay, right there? Joining me. 618 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:34,960 Speaker 2: Veteran defense attorney Matthew Barhoma joining us out of LA 619 00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:40,200 Speaker 2: at Powertrial Lawyers dot Com. Matthew, I can't wait to 620 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 2: see a defense attorney just like you. 621 00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:44,640 Speaker 1: Try to explain again. 622 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:47,240 Speaker 2: He's not been named a suspect, and he is innocent 623 00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:50,840 Speaker 2: under the eyes of the law until proven guilty beyond 624 00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:54,799 Speaker 2: a reasonable doubt by a jury of his peers. But 625 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,759 Speaker 2: explain to me, give me your best shot at why you, 626 00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:04,919 Speaker 2: Matthew Brahama would delete things off your phone and then 627 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 2: smash your cell phone and then tell police it was 628 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,000 Speaker 2: on the blink so it was all on accident, so 629 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:11,800 Speaker 2: you threw it away. 630 00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:15,759 Speaker 11: You know, Nancy, the beauty of American jurisprudence is that 631 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:16,960 Speaker 11: he doesn't have to answer that. 632 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:19,680 Speaker 1: Okay, That's what the Fifth Amendment right is all about. 633 00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 2: Look around, you, plase Matthew, Matthew, Matthew. 634 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:26,879 Speaker 1: Look around, do you see a judge? Do you see 635 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 1: a box for the jury? You're not in corn, So. 636 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:33,800 Speaker 2: Don't tell me what's coming into evidence on crime stories. 637 00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 2: I'm asking you, how do you explain that technical legal 638 00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:40,000 Speaker 2: term b S. 639 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 1: Did they teach you that in law school? 640 00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:43,600 Speaker 11: Well, I'll tell you what it is. 641 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 14: Okay. 642 00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:48,160 Speaker 11: Deleting information off of your phone is not evidence of murder. 643 00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:51,240 Speaker 11: It just doesn't bring you there, right, It's not evidence 644 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,759 Speaker 11: of foul play, It doesn't bring you there. It's not 645 00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 11: evidence of harboring someone such as Sarah. It doesn't bring 646 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:04,760 Speaker 11: you there. There's still a missing piece of a material 647 00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 11: piece of evidence that's missing that corroborates or that links 648 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:13,359 Speaker 11: mister Mormon and Sarah the victim. So unfortunately, even though 649 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:16,239 Speaker 11: he's deleted these items, and even though he's led to 650 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:17,040 Speaker 11: the police, he's. 651 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:17,480 Speaker 1: Been charging him. 652 00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 2: Right, Okay, you know what, you just tell that to 653 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:25,040 Speaker 2: a journey again. This guy has not been named a 654 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,279 Speaker 2: suspect in this case, but you know who he makes 655 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,920 Speaker 2: me think of. Let me go out to Giovanni Diaz 656 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:35,400 Speaker 2: joining us from Florida. Does the name Madeline Soto Mattie Soto. 657 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,520 Speaker 2: She was just thirteen years old when she was murdered 658 00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:42,239 Speaker 2: by Mommy's live in Stefan Stears. According to police, he's 659 00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 2: presumed innocent. You know what he did. He deleted everything 660 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:51,799 Speaker 2: off of his phone, but ding Dong didn't realize a 661 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,960 Speaker 2: lot of it's up in the cloud, including videos that 662 00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:59,040 Speaker 2: he took before she was killed. See when I hear 663 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:04,120 Speaker 2: eating things off my phone? Why why that night, the 664 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 2: night that he was with Sarah Aberson? 665 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:08,879 Speaker 1: Why delete that of all things? 666 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,200 Speaker 2: And what a koichi day, Giovanni that he's deleting things 667 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:17,040 Speaker 2: off his phone at the same time somebody is trying 668 00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:20,280 Speaker 2: to change Sarah's password and deleting her search history. 669 00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:21,440 Speaker 1: That doesn't bother you. 670 00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 7: It's very interesting that you actually mentioned Madeline Soto because 671 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:26,719 Speaker 7: I was actually in court just two weeks ago for 672 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:32,640 Speaker 7: an update hearing on this case regarding involving specifically information 673 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:36,840 Speaker 7: about deleting data from your phone while investigation is ongoing, 674 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:39,960 Speaker 7: and that's exactly what we were talking about here. Yeah, 675 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 7: as your guest mentioned there, it's not a crime that 676 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 7: he deleted that. It's a crime that he lied to 677 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:50,960 Speaker 7: law enforcement at the time of his connection with police. 678 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,840 Speaker 7: He wasn't arrest Initially, he was questioned about the case 679 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,680 Speaker 7: and he provided false information and that's the reason why 680 00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:00,640 Speaker 7: he now currently faces charges for that, for lying to 681 00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,439 Speaker 7: law enforcement. And that's the reason why we are still 682 00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:06,480 Speaker 7: here at this point trying to understand why he would 683 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:09,879 Speaker 7: do that, and at the same time as he's being 684 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:12,319 Speaker 7: charged with that, but he's out on bond. He paid 685 00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 7: ten thousand dollars to respond to his SLF, so he's 686 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 7: walking free. 687 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:18,360 Speaker 1: I get it. You money. 688 00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:22,879 Speaker 2: Ashley Wardlow also joining us from the Florida jurisdiction, very 689 00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 2: well known private investigator. 690 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 1: Ashley. Now to hear Matthew Mohamma, and I respect him. 691 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,319 Speaker 1: He's a great lawyer. Tell it. 692 00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,000 Speaker 2: That's just you know, I don't have to prove you anything, 693 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,360 Speaker 2: just because I smashed my phone and threw it away 694 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:41,160 Speaker 2: and deleted what happened. Then I was with Sarah Ebersol. 695 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:47,320 Speaker 2: But then he clams up and refuses to speak. I mean, Ashley, 696 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:50,880 Speaker 2: I know I can't comment on this to a journey, 697 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 2: but look around everybody. We're not in a courtroom right now. 698 00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,800 Speaker 2: We can talk about it. Remember that crazy First Amendment. 699 00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:02,000 Speaker 2: We can have freedom of speech, and I am free 700 00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 2: to say when someone refuses to cooperate with police about 701 00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:09,919 Speaker 2: what happened to a missing young mom and you're with 702 00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,960 Speaker 2: her last I would want to say, Yes, I was 703 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,440 Speaker 2: with her. We walked to my car, I drove her home, 704 00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:21,240 Speaker 2: she got out, she waved goodbye, and then I left 705 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 2: and I haven't heard from her since. Why where is she? 706 00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:27,000 Speaker 2: That's what I would think we would hear from him, 707 00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:28,760 Speaker 2: but he's refusing to speak. 708 00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,440 Speaker 1: Does that concern you, Ashley? 709 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,320 Speaker 10: Absolutely, it confirms me, because if you don't have anything 710 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:37,240 Speaker 10: to hide, then why are you hiding something? 711 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 8: Right? 712 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:43,400 Speaker 10: Yes, the actual act of deleting something isn't illegal, but 713 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:45,360 Speaker 10: when it comes down to it, you know, as a 714 00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:48,000 Speaker 10: private investigator, Rich it's really interested. 715 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:51,440 Speaker 1: In what is in that device? What did you delete? 716 00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:54,319 Speaker 10: Because when you think you deleted something, most of the 717 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:55,640 Speaker 10: time we're still able. 718 00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:56,080 Speaker 1: To uncover it. 719 00:39:56,560 --> 00:39:59,480 Speaker 4: The shoes Sarah has seen wearing in photos at Robinson's 720 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 4: home a found inside her home, but her phone and 721 00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:04,920 Speaker 4: wallet are not. There are no signs of a struggle, 722 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,319 Speaker 4: no clothes left out like Sarah changed, and a pack 723 00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:09,840 Speaker 4: of cigarettes and a lighter on the front porch missing 724 00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,839 Speaker 4: from the home. A binder of information Sarah kept on 725 00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:16,880 Speaker 4: her ex's criminal history, legal documentation of her daughter's name change, 726 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,120 Speaker 4: a keepsake teddy bear with a dahlia flower for Cora's 727 00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:23,920 Speaker 4: middle name, and Sarah's toothbrush, hairbrush, and makeup brushes. 728 00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:27,600 Speaker 2: Michelle Tellous joining us, this is Sarah's sister who has 729 00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:33,000 Speaker 2: led the search for her sister. What does that tell you? 730 00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:38,359 Speaker 2: I can see the shoes, Michelle, that Sarah's wearing in 731 00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:42,560 Speaker 2: the photos that night at the house party, at that 732 00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:43,319 Speaker 2: couple's home. 733 00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:47,080 Speaker 1: Can we see that photo. I see the shoes, and 734 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:49,160 Speaker 1: those shoes. 735 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:53,360 Speaker 2: Are found in her home. See those shoes right there, 736 00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:57,799 Speaker 2: those exact shoes are found in her home, which says Michelle, 737 00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:02,680 Speaker 2: she came home. What do you deduce, Michelle, You. 738 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:04,759 Speaker 5: Would presume that my sister made at home and that 739 00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,920 Speaker 5: something happened after she arrived home. Did somebody else pick 740 00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:09,560 Speaker 5: her up or what happened? We just don't know. 741 00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,480 Speaker 1: Was it her cigarettes? Was it her lighter on the 742 00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:13,080 Speaker 1: front porch? 743 00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:18,120 Speaker 2: Yes, it was, because I remember my paternal grandmother would 744 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:22,520 Speaker 2: sneak a cigarette and she would go outside and smoke 745 00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:26,120 Speaker 2: one cigarette and then come back in like nothing had happened. 746 00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:27,920 Speaker 1: But she would leave the. 747 00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:31,960 Speaker 2: Lighter and the cigarettes out there so everybody would know 748 00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:35,160 Speaker 2: she had been out there. So I'm thinking I'm imagining 749 00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:39,919 Speaker 2: Sarah snuck out outside so smoke wouldn't get inside where 750 00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:42,560 Speaker 2: her daughter would be, and had a cigarette. So there's 751 00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:45,719 Speaker 2: a cigarette and the lighter on the front porch. But 752 00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:50,480 Speaker 2: missing is that binder she kept on her ex husband, 753 00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:57,120 Speaker 2: including the docs regarding Cora. Now Cora's name change. Remember 754 00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:00,439 Speaker 2: her name had been Dolia Man and now she changed 755 00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:01,280 Speaker 2: it for the biodet. 756 00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:02,840 Speaker 1: Why would that be missing? 757 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:05,080 Speaker 5: That was the first thing I noticed when we went 758 00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,759 Speaker 5: into my sister's home. It seems like the paper cell 759 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,359 Speaker 5: needed to be the leading of the history between the two. 760 00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:15,360 Speaker 2: The search for missing mom Sarah Ebersol goes on. 761 00:42:16,080 --> 00:42:19,200 Speaker 1: If you know or think you know anything. 762 00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:23,160 Speaker 2: About her disappearance, please dial three five two three six 763 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 2: eight three five four two. We remember an American hero 764 00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:33,840 Speaker 2: Police officer Robert Schisler Deptford Township PD, New Jersey, shot 765 00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:37,720 Speaker 2: and killed in a line of duty. Survived by parents 766 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:44,960 Speaker 2: Robert and Tracy, siblings Ashley and Tyler. American hero officer 767 00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:49,920 Speaker 2: Robert Schissler. Nancy Grace signing off goodbye for