1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: back to the show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always 3 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,960 Speaker 1: so much for tuning in. This is a fun when 4 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 1: it's it's a weird one. I think we could call 5 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 1: this an historical case of somebody having their heart in 6 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:44,519 Speaker 1: the right place. They're doing their best. Old Henry the 7 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: what is it the fifth? I'm so bad at Roman numerals, Ben, 8 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: I'm Noel, by the way, bad at Roman numerals Brown. 9 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: But yeah, we're gonna have ourselves a good old fashioned 10 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: ridiculous history. Love nd today in the form of a 11 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: like you said, been very misguided yet well intentioned attempt 12 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 1: at just getting everyone to get along, you know, during 13 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: a little thing called the War of the Roses, which 14 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 1: was like a century long pissing contest essentially between royals 15 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:16,839 Speaker 1: who are vying for the throne. Isn't that about sum 16 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,560 Speaker 1: it up? Yeah? Yeah. If you were to ask me, hey, Ben, 17 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:24,120 Speaker 1: what what is the Song of Ice and Fire slash 18 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:28,479 Speaker 1: Game of Thrones universe loosely based on, then I would 19 00:01:28,480 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: say the Wars of the Roses because George R. R. 20 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:35,959 Speaker 1: Martin said that as well as we dive into what 21 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 1: is known as Loveday. Let's give a shout out to 22 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 1: our own aristocrats of ridiculous history are super producers Casey 23 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: Pegram and Max Williams. Know you're right. This is a 24 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: story of political intrigue. This is a story of weird diplomacy. 25 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: This is a story of King Henry the six a 26 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:08,240 Speaker 1: attempts to keep the peace. Loveday was this symbolic reconciliation, 27 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 1: and this particular love day happened between warring factions of 28 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:17,919 Speaker 1: English nobility. But before we dive into this, we should 29 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: mention that Henry did not make love day up. This 30 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:25,760 Speaker 1: was a thing that already existed in medieval England and 31 00:02:25,919 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 1: was meant to resolve legal differences under arbitration instead of 32 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: common law, which we'll we'll dive into in just a bit. 33 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 1: But we're talking about particular love day today, aren't we know? 34 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,079 Speaker 1: The love Day of fourteen fifty eight indeed, and what 35 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:42,919 Speaker 1: a lovely love day it was. But before we get 36 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: into that, I think we should backtrack a little bit 37 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: into the history of Henry the sixth himself, who was 38 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 1: the youngest king of England, uh and not particularly good 39 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: at it. He was fine at being young and just 40 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,519 Speaker 1: wasn't particularly good at being the king. He was born 41 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: in fourteen twenty one. He inherited the own as a 42 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 1: wee baby, a literal infant, you know, and then he 43 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: grew into it and at least in terms of growing 44 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:10,360 Speaker 1: into you know, essentient being, but he never quite grew 45 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:14,240 Speaker 1: into the role and was considered quite incompetent and was 46 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: blamed historically for the War of the Roses kind of 47 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: from the get go, right. Yeah. See, that's the thing 48 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:26,040 Speaker 1: about a monarchy versus a meritocracy. Because you become the 49 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: ruler based on your bloodline rather than your qualifications, you 50 00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: can end up in release surreal situations. Henry the sixth 51 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: did become King of England on September one, fourteen two, 52 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: but he was only nine months old at the time. 53 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 1: He automatically became king because his father, Henry the fifth, 54 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:50,000 Speaker 1: passed away. He did have other people governing the day 55 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:55,160 Speaker 1: to day stuff in England until about fourteen thirty seven. 56 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 1: By that point he was considered old enough to rule. 57 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:02,000 Speaker 1: He was, as he said, the youngest person to ever 58 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:05,800 Speaker 1: inherit the English throne at that point, and then he 59 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: got promoted. How office space is this just to two 60 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: years after he got the English throne, his grandfather, King 61 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 1: Charles the sixth, died on October twenty one, and boom, 62 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:23,280 Speaker 1: Henry becomes King of France. That's right, he became. He 63 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 1: was a double king. That's never occurred to me, but 64 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 1: it sure seems potentially problematic. So he's proclaimed king of 65 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:34,279 Speaker 1: France because of something some some terms established in the 66 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:40,040 Speaker 1: fourteen twenty Treaty of Troyes, where the military success of 67 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:46,919 Speaker 1: his father essentially turned France into territories of England. But 68 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: it was a little more complex than that, because you know, 69 00:04:49,279 --> 00:04:51,839 Speaker 1: you can declare things territories, but you also have to 70 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:55,240 Speaker 1: govern them successfully and keep hold of them. H And 71 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 1: at the end of the Hundred Years War, England had 72 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,600 Speaker 1: essentially lost all of the French territories and was left 73 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 1: with only one called Calais, which I always think of 74 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 1: as like a fancy like for like English vacation destination. 75 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:10,919 Speaker 1: There's also that what is it from the jabberwockie or 76 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: it's like calloo Calais O fraptious day or something like that. 77 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:17,600 Speaker 1: That right then, yeah, yeah, it's spelled a little differently 78 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: but pronounced roughly the same. So here we are Henry six, 79 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: through no fault and no effort of his own, has 80 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:30,279 Speaker 1: become the king of two countries. Heavy weighs, the head 81 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 1: that wears the crowd and soften said. And in August 82 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 1: of fourteen fifty three, Henry the six contracted a mysterious illness, 83 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:43,719 Speaker 1: due perhaps in part to the stresses of being a monarch. 84 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 1: He fell into what is described as an inertia that 85 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,919 Speaker 1: lasted more than a year, lasted eighteen months according to 86 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: history extra dot com. This remains the subject of some 87 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:02,040 Speaker 1: no small amount of speculation the part of historians. Some 88 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: historians will tell you that he was suffering from catatonic schizophrenia. 89 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: The symptoms of this condition include things like stupor, catalepsy, 90 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:15,520 Speaker 1: loss of consciousness basically, and mutism. But other historians have 91 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:19,560 Speaker 1: just said, no, he had a mental breakdown. There was 92 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: genetic precedent for this. We know now his maternal grandfather, 93 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 1: Charles the sixth of France, also suffered from bouts of 94 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: mental illness for the last three decades of his life. 95 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:32,800 Speaker 1: And not to get too highly speculative here, but there 96 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: was mental health galore, and these sort of let's call 97 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:40,280 Speaker 1: them closed systems of breeding. That's a very diplomatic way 98 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:44,119 Speaker 1: to put it. The problem with in breeding is that 99 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 1: it can lead to any number of damaging medical conditions 100 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 1: or damaging genetic conditions. If you want to see the 101 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 1: extreme version of this in European royalty, check out the Habsburg. 102 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:02,520 Speaker 1: You know what, just google hapspurg Chin. That's all you 103 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: need to see, exactly right. So yeah, that you know, 104 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,640 Speaker 1: there are some accounts that kind of shed some light 105 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,400 Speaker 1: onto what this might have felt like at the time. 106 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 1: One thing that you know, whatever you might want to 107 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 1: call this, whether it be a mental breakdown or these 108 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,760 Speaker 1: recurring kind of fits of mental health issues, what we 109 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 1: do know is that Henry was not particularly interested in 110 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 1: engaging with the real world as it existed around him. 111 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: And that also means not particularly interested in engaging in 112 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 1: the day to day duties that are you know, governing. 113 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: I mean there's a lot to that you kind of 114 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 1: have to be with it or at the very least 115 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,040 Speaker 1: delegate it to somebody. Right, he doesn't seem like he 116 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: was doing either of those things particularly well. And there's 117 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 1: an account from this London merchant of when Henry essentially 118 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 1: was introduced to his newborn son and kind of speaks 119 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: to perhaps the way he viewed the world and others 120 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 1: outside of his own mental bubble. And this is what 121 00:08:01,160 --> 00:08:04,600 Speaker 1: he said. He looked on the prince and cast down 122 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 1: his eyes again, and then he goes on to say 123 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 1: they could obtain no word or sign from Henry, essentially 124 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: saying he just kind of moved on, you know, I mean, 125 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: it's his own flesh and blood, it's his son, he's 126 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: meeting for the very first time, and he just sort 127 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: of regarded the child as an object and then kind 128 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: of was like take it away. That about the shape 129 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, he wasn't really talking to people. And 130 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:31,960 Speaker 1: this lasted, as we said, for a period of eighteen months, 131 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 1: waxed waned. Visitors to the king came to court to 132 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:39,440 Speaker 1: tell him that the Archbishop John Kempet died a few 133 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:43,400 Speaker 1: months later, and they couldn't get him to talk, or 134 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: it didn't even look like he was listening. He was 135 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 1: just sort of sitting there. And when he finally got 136 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: out of this funk or he recovered, you know, maybe 137 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:55,560 Speaker 1: it was just incredibly depressed, but at some point he 138 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 1: came out of this state and get this, folks. He 139 00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:03,079 Speaker 1: was astonished to find that his wife had given birth 140 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: to a son, because Edward, right, nol you had just 141 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:10,320 Speaker 1: said how Henry was introduced to his own son and 142 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: was kind of like, uh yeah. Later later he goes, oh, wow, 143 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: I have a kid. Uh Edward, Why didn't anyone tell me? Right? 144 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:23,160 Speaker 1: Edward was born in October fourteen fifty three, so that 145 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: would have been just a few months after Henry the 146 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: sixth became unwell. But there's a sidebar here and special 147 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,680 Speaker 1: shout out to our research associate, Gay Bluesier. A lot 148 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 1: of historians and scholars described Henry the six as pious, simple, 149 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: and puritan. The label does fit, and well we'll tell 150 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,480 Speaker 1: you why. But there's this theory we can call it 151 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 1: that perhaps he was shocked that he had a son 152 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:57,559 Speaker 1: because he was well clueless in the bedroom, clueless when 153 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 1: it came to matters of path should. He spent a 154 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 1: lot of his free time meditating on the sufferings of Christ. 155 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 1: He stayed in monasteries, he practiced something called Devoco Maderna, 156 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:14,960 Speaker 1: a movement for religious reform that was all about humility 157 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: and obedience, and an historian named Lauren Johnson revealed that 158 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: his his bedroom stuff may have been a lower priority 159 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:27,480 Speaker 1: for him to the point where he needed help. Right, Yeah, 160 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:31,680 Speaker 1: apparently he employed these services of a sex coach literally 161 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: in the one time he was like required to, you know, 162 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:39,720 Speaker 1: consummate a relationship in his marriage bed. And Johnson, who's 163 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: a scholar specifically investigating King Henry the sixth Private life, 164 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 1: she says that she found some evidence in the National 165 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:52,760 Speaker 1: Archives and in the Royal Household, you know, records that 166 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 1: indicated that Henry and his wife Margaret of Andrew were 167 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 1: actually attended on by these coaches essentially during the marriage Act. 168 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: Do my best to be very diplomatic today with these terms, 169 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:13,439 Speaker 1: but this is what Johnson told the Observer. Right, was 170 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 1: it because the famously chased Henry didn't know what he 171 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:18,839 Speaker 1: was doing? I think it's entirely possible that it had 172 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:22,280 Speaker 1: reached a certain point where it perhaps became necessary to 173 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: make clear to him what he should be doing that 174 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 1: couldn't be done in a public way at all. The 175 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:29,240 Speaker 1: King's chamber is the most private place where you could 176 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:32,719 Speaker 1: be having this conversation or indeed checking what was going on. 177 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: These are the days before sex head, you know, and 178 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:41,120 Speaker 1: it is definitely a tricky situation to have to tell 179 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: a monarch what to do with such in such an 180 00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 1: intimate moment. He wasn't just checked out of the bedroom though, 181 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:53,079 Speaker 1: you know, harshly due to this illness, But overall he 182 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: was checked out as a ruler for quite a while, 183 00:11:56,679 --> 00:12:08,840 Speaker 1: and during his reign tensions skyrocketing. You know, when he 184 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:12,760 Speaker 1: was out for eighteen months, the government was leaderless and 185 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 1: largely ruddered less. And that's when the Duke of York, 186 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: who was the cousin to the King and himself has 187 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 1: a claim to the throne, was appointed Lord Protector and 188 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:26,120 Speaker 1: first counselor of the realm. That Duke of York was 189 00:12:26,400 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: Richard Plantagenets. So when the King found himself in better 190 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:35,680 Speaker 1: spirits on the other side of his affliction in fourteen 191 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: fifty four, the protectorship of York and his powerful allies 192 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:47,560 Speaker 1: the Neville family ended, but the partisanship in the government remained. 193 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 1: York was mad because he was increasingly excluded from exercising 194 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,800 Speaker 1: royal power. He questioned Henry the sixth ability to perform 195 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 1: royal duties, mainly because he was often unwell, but also 196 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:05,680 Speaker 1: because he was, as history hit dot com put it, 197 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 1: infamously gentle, yet an infamously gentle nature. So York was 198 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:13,440 Speaker 1: the Duke of York is like, this guy is way 199 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:15,719 Speaker 1: too nice to be king. Yeah, well, I mean and 200 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:19,839 Speaker 1: infamously gentle. Again we're into we're deep in diplomacy here 201 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: is basically just weak, right, It's just saying that he 202 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 1: is a weak He doesn't have the constitution or the 203 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: stamina or the like, you know, drive to like do 204 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 1: the job. You've gotta be brutal and relentless and then 205 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:33,920 Speaker 1: not you know, have too many scruples when it comes 206 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:35,839 Speaker 1: to ruling. You also have to kind of have the 207 00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 1: ambition to to do it and to the very least, 208 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 1: you know, care a little bit and pay attention. But 209 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:44,280 Speaker 1: I gotta ask um, you know how in our government 210 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:48,200 Speaker 1: takes a lot to depose a ruler. You know, we 211 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 1: we've had some wes situation in our previous president where 212 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 1: there were some questions about his mental stability or psychological 213 00:13:55,559 --> 00:13:59,559 Speaker 1: ability to do the job correct and it was very difficult. 214 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 1: It was discussed the idea of invoking a clause I 215 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:06,640 Speaker 1: believe in the Constitution that would allow someone who is 216 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: not fit to serve to be you know, forcibly removed 217 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 1: and replaced. What allowed the Duke of York here to 218 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 1: just come and it was literally just like a power grab. 219 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 1: Well essentially, you know, you you could look at it 220 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: that way. And also, of course we're referring to the 221 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 1: twenty five Amendment here in the US, which has actually 222 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 1: been used in the past, but maybe that's a story 223 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 1: for another day. You're right, there are some power grabs 224 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 1: here because Richard essentially said, you know, my cousin Henry 225 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,520 Speaker 1: would be better off as a monk. I am the 226 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 1: person would be the best suited to be the king. Here. 227 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 1: There's a lot of action that seems to be preemptive, 228 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:51,960 Speaker 1: right to assume the actions of other rivals and try to, 229 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: you know, get to the fight before they do. For instance, 230 00:14:55,560 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: in May of four, Richard leads an army again King 231 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: Henry's Lancastrian army, in a bloody surprise attack that's now 232 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: known as the First Battle of St Albans. And he 233 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 1: did this because he believed that another duke, the Duke 234 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 1: of Somerset, was going to ambush him if he didn't 235 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,400 Speaker 1: act first. And why do they call it the Wars 236 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:26,040 Speaker 1: of the Roses. Well, the Yorkist like Richard, were represented 237 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: by a White Rose and the House of Lancaster to 238 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:33,720 Speaker 1: which Henry the Six belonged was represented by a red Rose. 239 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 1: So essentially this grab from the Duke of York was 240 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:42,480 Speaker 1: kind of because Henry the Six was such weak sauce, 241 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: you know, as a as a king and was doing 242 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 1: such a poor job, he kind of opened up this 243 00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:51,840 Speaker 1: power grab situation essentially. Yeah, yeah, I think you could 244 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: say that the personal enemies of York and his allies, 245 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,720 Speaker 1: the Nevill's where the Duke of Somerset, the Earl of 246 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:03,479 Speaker 1: Northumberland and Word Clifford. All three of those individuals perished. 247 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 1: And although this first battle is kind of a smaller 248 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 1: deal in military terms, it was explosively important on a 249 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 1: political level because King Henry got captured, he was a pow. 250 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: He got escorted to London and then York was appointed 251 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 1: capital p capital e Protector of England by Parliament just 252 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 1: a few months later. But he had a problem. Got 253 00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: him a little bit of power he got. He got 254 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 1: a temporary boost, you know what I mean, like when 255 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: you get the star in Super Mario. Yes, he didn't 256 00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 1: get a permanent increase in power. He didn't get you know, 257 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 1: a mushroom or one up. That's right. He did get 258 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 1: this kind of temporary boost, you know, all of the 259 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:49,440 Speaker 1: Mario Star, but he wasn't really able to make it last. 260 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: He did get a second Protectorate ship that was also 261 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:57,600 Speaker 1: quite short lived, and Henry the six ended it himself 262 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:00,880 Speaker 1: in fourteen fifty six because at that point he had 263 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: a male heir in the form of Prince Edward, which 264 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:06,640 Speaker 1: I believe was that baby that he's so uh, kind 265 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:10,000 Speaker 1: of casually disregarded, right, but then when it came time 266 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: for him to be a political pawn, he's like, oh cool, 267 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:16,200 Speaker 1: I'm gonna play this one. And that was his again, 268 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:19,120 Speaker 1: the daughter of his wife, Margaret of Andrew, and she 269 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 1: actually emerged as a pretty significant power player in the 270 00:17:24,600 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: Lancastrian revival. Yeah. Yeah, she's making moves. But war always 271 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 1: has consequences, and just two years later, Henry and his 272 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:44,159 Speaker 1: government realized that they have an unfinished problem from that 273 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 1: conflict at St. Albans, those three Yorkist lords who had 274 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:53,680 Speaker 1: died along with other people. Of course, they had children, 275 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: and those younger magnates wanted revenge. You know, there's a 276 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:02,320 Speaker 1: princess bride moment. My name is Snigo Montoya. You killed 277 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,720 Speaker 1: my father, right, that's the that's how these guys feel, 278 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:09,439 Speaker 1: and they can rally forces of their own, So noblemen 279 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: on both sides of the conflict start recruiting these retinues 280 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:18,920 Speaker 1: of armed followers. This is also occurring in the context 281 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:23,199 Speaker 1: of the ever present threat of the French right, who 282 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:26,879 Speaker 1: also probably want their stuff back. So Henry is thinking, 283 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:30,760 Speaker 1: we need to bring these Yorkists back into the fold. 284 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 1: We need to make some sort of peace. As we said, 285 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: he had been described as infamously gentle. Know what you said, 286 00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 1: you felt that was another way of saying week. I 287 00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:45,440 Speaker 1: think that would be also a way of saying, uh, timid. 288 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:48,720 Speaker 1: You know, he's not like a bloodthirsty coonan to the 289 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:52,080 Speaker 1: barbarian kind of guy. He likes to hang out and 290 00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 1: you know, pray. So he instead of punishing people or 291 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:02,320 Speaker 1: starting another conflict, he tried to make peace. Once he 292 00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 1: ordered a deceased traders impaled body parts to be taken down, 293 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:10,719 Speaker 1: and he said the following He said, I will not 294 00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:14,399 Speaker 1: have any Christian men so cruelly handled for my sake. 295 00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: And that's kind of classy, you know what I mean, 296 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:19,600 Speaker 1: Like I don't want people to associate me with mutilated 297 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 1: body parts. And then on good Friday. In fourteen fifty two, 298 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,439 Speaker 1: he issued almost a hundred and fifty pardons a hundred 299 00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:30,320 Speaker 1: and forty four following an attempted rebellion by the Duke 300 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 1: of York. Yeah, I gottapplaud him for his kind of 301 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:35,640 Speaker 1: focus on the zen of it all and like trying 302 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: to convince people to just get along. But you also 303 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:40,680 Speaker 1: have to remember this is in the midst of a 304 00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 1: bloody conflict and and an absolute power grab, and it's 305 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 1: almost like he's not quite getting it, you know what 306 00:19:47,240 --> 00:19:49,639 Speaker 1: I mean. Yeah, he almost kind of feels sorry for 307 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:52,639 Speaker 1: him in the one hand, because he really does seem 308 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:56,560 Speaker 1: like completely oblivious and disconnected from the reality that is 309 00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,119 Speaker 1: the situation that he finds himself in the center of 310 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,919 Speaker 1: and maybe doesn't even realize how perhaps in danger his 311 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 1: own life might be. Yeah. I hate to say it 312 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:10,359 Speaker 1: because I'm probably never going to meet him, but what 313 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,440 Speaker 1: we're learning about this guy makes me think that he 314 00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:16,639 Speaker 1: was very sheltered, you know, in a way only a 315 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:21,479 Speaker 1: king could be. And there it seemed like for a 316 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 1: lot of his life there were other people controlling him 317 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:27,120 Speaker 1: and telling him what to do, whether on the throne 318 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 1: or in the bedroom. So in that kind of case. 319 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,480 Speaker 1: You could see how he may not be accustomed to 320 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 1: making his own decisions, especially if they were tough decisions 321 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 1: that can result in injury or death for other people. 322 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: And so we come to Henry the six big bright idea. 323 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 1: He realizes he has to do something, and so he says, 324 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,280 Speaker 1: let's have a love day. You know, as you mentioned 325 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 1: at the top, a love day was a thing that 326 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:02,080 Speaker 1: already existed. We know the name sounds kind of uncreative now, 327 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 1: but in the context of a love day, this arbitration period, 328 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 1: love doesn't mean romantic love. It means an agreement or 329 00:21:11,400 --> 00:21:15,639 Speaker 1: a settlement. And day in the legal sense of the time, 330 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 1: just meant a case opening instead of a you know, 331 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,399 Speaker 1: a strict twenty four hour period. So this kind of 332 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 1: case could you know, it could go on. It wasn't 333 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,359 Speaker 1: like a single physical day. So our Henry the Stix 334 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 1: was definitely a lover, not a fighter, and he felt 335 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: that it would be entirely possible to convert everyone else, 336 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,719 Speaker 1: all of these fighters in the world, to be lovers 337 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:41,959 Speaker 1: like him, if only he could get them to just 338 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:44,720 Speaker 1: you know, demonstrate to to just like you, put forth 339 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 1: a gesture of goodwill towards each other, right, the lank 340 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:52,919 Speaker 1: Astrians and the Yorkists, and gosh, ben when when I 341 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:58,200 Speaker 1: look at Lankstrian, I mean that's basically Lancaster from freaking 342 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:02,280 Speaker 1: Game of Thrones. I mean, has to be that. I see. 343 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:07,439 Speaker 1: That's a good point. Excuse me, Lanisterister, Lanister Lancastrians. I 344 00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 1: think there has to be a connection there. But he 345 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:13,680 Speaker 1: wanted to demonstrate, you know, publicly, some sort of perceived 346 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: goodwill between the Lancastrians and the Yorkists. So on March 347 00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:22,640 Speaker 1: he attempted to do just that. He organized a parade 348 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,600 Speaker 1: or something, a procession, a promenade, what have you, where 349 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 1: leading members of the Lancastrians and the yorks would go 350 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:38,560 Speaker 1: through the streets while holding hands. Yeah. Literally a come on, people, now, 351 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 1: smile on your brother kind of moment. And it does 352 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,399 Speaker 1: seem a little bit naive. But let's let's return to 353 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:50,679 Speaker 1: our historian here, Lauren Johnson. Writing in BBC History Magazine, 354 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:56,439 Speaker 1: Johnson speculates a little bit more about why Henry the 355 00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:00,399 Speaker 1: sixth was so conflict diverse, and she points out quote 356 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,919 Speaker 1: his uncles were ambitious men who blighted Henry's youth with 357 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,400 Speaker 1: their sometimes violent disputes time and again, Henry was called upon, 358 00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:12,440 Speaker 1: despite his youth and inexperience, to resolve their quarrels, expected 359 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:16,240 Speaker 1: to serve as a final arbiter of complex adult dynamics 360 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:19,040 Speaker 1: that had taken form before he was born. As he 361 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:21,879 Speaker 1: was a sensitive, serious child. It's little wonder that he 362 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 1: shrank from conflict in later life. So he had always 363 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:30,239 Speaker 1: been asked to make these judgment calls, and as far 364 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:32,520 Speaker 1: as we could tell, he hated it. He was like, 365 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 1: very reasonably, hey stopped killing each other. But that is 366 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: an argument that has failed time and time again, not 367 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,879 Speaker 1: just in the history of the British monarchy, but in 368 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:49,000 Speaker 1: human history, I would argue. And also it's a little 369 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,439 Speaker 1: bit of a folksy solution in the context of this time, 370 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 1: because love day is like Loveday was something for like 371 00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:00,320 Speaker 1: local matters, you know, like someone killed a cow or 372 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:04,960 Speaker 1: someone you know is letting their dog poop in your yard, right, 373 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,439 Speaker 1: and I would imagine that, you know, with let's just 374 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,680 Speaker 1: say the more colloquial version of this situation, right, Let's 375 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,680 Speaker 1: say like two farmers have a dispute over the loss 376 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:16,719 Speaker 1: of pf property and in the form of a cow, 377 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:19,560 Speaker 1: maybe you know, one farmer at kills the other one's cow. 378 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:21,440 Speaker 1: We know that the wars have been started over less 379 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: right or specifically, there was one involving a pig, if 380 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,159 Speaker 1: I'm not mistaken that we recently talked about. But you know, 381 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 1: before this love end would take place in the streets, 382 00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,119 Speaker 1: kind of sealing the deal. Imagine some money would have 383 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,239 Speaker 1: had to change hands, and then this was kind of 384 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 1: just like the icing on the cake to publicly let 385 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: people know, Okay, these two farmers are now friends again 386 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,959 Speaker 1: and we can go along our merry way. Yeah. Yeah, 387 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,800 Speaker 1: and sometimes this had really happy endings, things that could 388 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 1: be seen as quite endearing. So, as I said, love 389 00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: days were meant to settle things in a peaceful fashion. 390 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 1: It's kind of the equivalent of saying, hey, we don't 391 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:00,359 Speaker 1: have to go to court over this, and you, Julie. 392 00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: They're traditionally a love day on a local level, not 393 00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:07,680 Speaker 1: evolving that you know, the upper echelons of society would 394 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: end in a party like imagine being able to resolve 395 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,720 Speaker 1: your disputes and then having a pizza party at the end. 396 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:18,440 Speaker 1: That's kind of what this was like. Josephine Water has 397 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:23,399 Speaker 1: been a medieval scholar, noted that one feast, according to 398 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 1: the terms of the agreement, required more than five hundred 399 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 1: gallons of gas, hoon and wine. That's the mall back, 400 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: as well as too fat oxen and twelve fat sheep 401 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:37,199 Speaker 1: to be consumed in what both parties agreed would be 402 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: quote a regular English jollification. And they were gonna they 403 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 1: were gonna party. They were gonna party down because they've 404 00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 1: figured out their pasture dispute. I am going to start 405 00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:51,639 Speaker 1: referring to parties as jollifications. Ben, I think it's a 406 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:53,199 Speaker 1: good one. I think you should go with that. That 407 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 1: could be big for us. I think so too. But 408 00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:58,760 Speaker 1: as you know, kind of was indicated from the start here, 409 00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 1: this one didn't really turn out that way. There was 410 00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,480 Speaker 1: a lot more at stake and a lot more at 411 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 1: play than anything this kind of touchy feeling could have 412 00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 1: probably sorted out. Right. Yeah, this is seriously taking a 413 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 1: local dispute resolution tradition and applied it to a full 414 00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:24,920 Speaker 1: blown civil war. It's like, imagine if trying to think 415 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,879 Speaker 1: of a way to say this, so imagine if a 416 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:35,080 Speaker 1: civil war broke out in the US and Joe Biden said, Okay, guys, everybody, 417 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 1: come over, we're gonna get a couple of handles of whiskey. Well, 418 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 1: we're gonna get you know what, what are party things 419 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:47,640 Speaker 1: people do. We're gonna get some fun hats. We're we're 420 00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,800 Speaker 1: gonna get loaded and figure this out together. That I 421 00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:53,320 Speaker 1: love the fact that both of us immediately went to 422 00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,159 Speaker 1: fun hats as party things. But have you ever actually 423 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: attended a party that involved fun hats. It's just sort 424 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 1: of like this idealized version of what a party should be. 425 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 1: Or maybe it's a nostalgic version of it from childhood 426 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 1: where it's all about like, you know, fun cone shaped hats. Uh, 427 00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 1: But it's not really something that you really see much. 428 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,440 Speaker 1: But it is the first thing that our minds both 429 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 1: jumped to. Yeah, you're right, maybe we should we should 430 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,880 Speaker 1: bring that back. I know there are things like cat 431 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 1: parties that exist, and I know, you know over in 432 00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:27,880 Speaker 1: the UK during Christmas celebrations, people do wear those paper crowds. 433 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:31,119 Speaker 1: You've seen those before, right, Absolutely, that's a thing that 434 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 1: you will distribute at a dinner party for example. Um, 435 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 1: and oftentimes they come with these little popper things that 436 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:41,399 Speaker 1: have not not like you know, the drug, but you 437 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 1: know little things that have you know, little surprises inside 438 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 1: like party poppers, you know, and you have you pull 439 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,160 Speaker 1: the string and and it shoots out confetti and maybe 440 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,719 Speaker 1: there's little treats or you know, toys or something like that. 441 00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 1: But the paper hats very much the thing in that world. 442 00:27:55,160 --> 00:28:00,000 Speaker 1: And now that I'm thinking through this, I can imagine 443 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 1: in some of those nobles who had had their their 444 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:07,159 Speaker 1: fathers killed looking askance at this, like, no, I'm not 445 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 1: doing a hand holding parade, dude, my dad's dead. You know. 446 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,920 Speaker 1: That's that's a lot to ask people. And in general, 447 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 1: this was seen as a symbotlic gesture, as you said earlier, 448 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 1: and it's not a very good substitute for revenge after 449 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: the deaths of friends and family members. But they went 450 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: ahead and tried to get this mediation leading up to 451 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: this love day. So two months before this procession, Henry 452 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:42,080 Speaker 1: mediated between these warring factions and it's it's a really 453 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: weird arrangement. They summoned the English peerage to a Great 454 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: Council in London in January four and they wanted, you know, 455 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 1: the last thing they wanted to see was an armed 456 00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,600 Speaker 1: conflict between the people they had brought together. It would 457 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: be a very bad look to have just called them 458 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,160 Speaker 1: all to London and then for there to be blood 459 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:08,080 Speaker 1: in the streets. So city officials maintained around the clock 460 00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:12,320 Speaker 1: armed watch, and these two different sides, the Yorkists and 461 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 1: the Lancastrian lords, were kept separate. The Yorkists got to 462 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 1: stay within the city walls, the Lancastrians had to stay outside. 463 00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: And even with all these precautions, Northumberland, Clifford and Egremont 464 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 1: tried to ambush York and Salisbury as they rode from 465 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 1: London to Westminster. So they had to have these folks 466 00:29:35,840 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 1: under armed guard otherwise they would kill each other. Yeah, 467 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 1: and the king tried to, you know, preside over these 468 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:47,200 Speaker 1: mediations that were super cantankerous of course. And um, there 469 00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:50,600 Speaker 1: were intermediaries that kind of you know, went back and 470 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 1: forth between the two sides, Henry's lawyers or barristers or 471 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 1: whatever you would call them. I guess they were more 472 00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: like mediators counselors. They met the Yorkists inside the city 473 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: at this place called the Black Friars, and that was 474 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,520 Speaker 1: in the morning, and then the afternoons the same mediators 475 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 1: would meet with the Lancastrian lords at the White Friars 476 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:13,240 Speaker 1: on Fleet street. Imagine these are two different monasteries been 477 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: the Blackfriars and the White Friars. It seems very interesting 478 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: that we have literally two diametrically opposing colors of Friars 479 00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 1: where these different warring sides would meet. Yeah. Blackfriars is 480 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 1: an area by the southern fringes of the City of London, 481 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 1: and the City of London is not the same thing 482 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,640 Speaker 1: as London. The City of London is in London, but 483 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,200 Speaker 1: it's kind of its own separate thing. We should make 484 00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 1: an episode on the City of London. Actually have been there. 485 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 1: It's a trip, man. I agree. That sounds so. So 486 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:44,720 Speaker 1: these are this has nothing to do with religious orders 487 00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: or these are literally just two different neighborhoods. Yeah. Back 488 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: in the day, Dominican Friars established a priory on the site, 489 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:56,480 Speaker 1: and so the name Blackfriars dates back to them when 490 00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 1: they came to the capital in twelve one, got it. Okay, 491 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 1: that makes a little more sense. I thought it was 492 00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: pretty interesting that there were It was almost like the 493 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:07,320 Speaker 1: White Lodge and the Black Lodge, you know from from 494 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,040 Speaker 1: Twin Peaks. That's kind of what it made me think of. Okay, 495 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,520 Speaker 1: So they had these deliberations in the morning and then 496 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 1: in the afternoon, and they eventually were able to settle 497 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 1: where the Yorks were to pay Somerset five thousand marks 498 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,280 Speaker 1: and for Warwick to pay Clifford a thousand marks, and 499 00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:30,280 Speaker 1: for Salisbury to not levy these like fines or duties 500 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:34,280 Speaker 1: for hostility against the Nevil's. And then there was a 501 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 1: religious aspect too, because we have to remember Henry the 502 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:41,640 Speaker 1: sixth is arbitrating. Here the Yorkist had to endow the 503 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:45,640 Speaker 1: abbey at St Albans with forty five pounds per year 504 00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 1: for masses to be sung in perpetuity for the souls 505 00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: of the battles dead. The only thing like that on 506 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 1: the Lancastrian side was a payment of a four thousand 507 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,960 Speaker 1: mark bond to maintain peace with the Nevil family, but 508 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: not forever, just for ten years. Here you go, we'll 509 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 1: give you a four thousand marks and then we won't 510 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:13,000 Speaker 1: fight for a decade, and also will determine blame. So 511 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 1: the blame for Saint Albans have been placed squarely on 512 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:20,200 Speaker 1: the Yorkist because they're the ones who launched the surprise attack, 513 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:22,440 Speaker 1: you know, even if they thought they were doing it 514 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,880 Speaker 1: just to beat out another surprise attack. They ultimately quote 515 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,080 Speaker 1: unquote fired the first shot, you know what I mean, 516 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:34,040 Speaker 1: although they obviously didn't use guns. Yeah, conceptually speaking, no, 517 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: I totally get you. So now everything's good, right, We're 518 00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: all solid, Everyone's paid their due, and now it's time 519 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: for that sweet sweet love end right hard to let 520 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:48,960 Speaker 1: the love day commence, let our love flags fly. And 521 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: you know, this was I think Henry the six would 522 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,600 Speaker 1: have seen this as a success, this mediation, and I 523 00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:57,480 Speaker 1: think he probably felt like this was probably his highest 524 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,200 Speaker 1: point of diplomacy where he had actually achieved some sort 525 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: of resolution. Um So, now, in the spirit of that 526 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 1: more kind of like local folksy tradition, in March of four, 527 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:15,880 Speaker 1: hundreds of English lords and ladies assembled at Westminster Abbey 528 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,720 Speaker 1: and walked holding hands through the streets of London along 529 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,280 Speaker 1: the Thames, the western bank of the Thames, all the 530 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:25,360 Speaker 1: way to St Paul's Cathedral. And this was what would 531 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:28,520 Speaker 1: be a traditional kind of love Day procession in order 532 00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:32,160 Speaker 1: to you know, put a sweet red ribbon bow on 533 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: this whole deal and finally put the War of the 534 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:46,720 Speaker 1: Roses to an end. Yeah, that's the idea. It's ambitious, 535 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:50,719 Speaker 1: it's very sweet. It's the kind of plan that you know, 536 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,440 Speaker 1: no offense, Henry. Maybe maybe it is something you should 537 00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 1: just draw on a piece of paper and then put 538 00:33:57,840 --> 00:33:59,800 Speaker 1: up at your house so you can be proud of 539 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:01,520 Speaker 1: your self. I don't want to spoil it. But not 540 00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: everybody is as kiss and makeup and turn the other 541 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:10,439 Speaker 1: cheek oriented as our guy, Henry. But you know, they 542 00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 1: actually did go on this parade. As you mentioned, it 543 00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:18,880 Speaker 1: was set for Ladies Day, a day that memorializes the 544 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,000 Speaker 1: Virgin Mary's hearing of the news that she would bear 545 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: a child. So that's a big day. This day was 546 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:27,560 Speaker 1: also considered the start of the New year at the time. 547 00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:32,759 Speaker 1: It wasn't until seventeen fifty two that England adopted January 548 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 1: one is New Year's Day. This was also meant to 549 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:40,320 Speaker 1: be kind of a commercial for peace, a pr move 550 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:44,359 Speaker 1: for the non nobles of London, you know, because they're 551 00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:48,320 Speaker 1: the ones who are disproportionately affected by the hazards of war, 552 00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,480 Speaker 1: you know, So this is meant to show you, you know, 553 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:55,919 Speaker 1: the average shopkeeper, the average resident of London, that hey 554 00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,439 Speaker 1: wars over this is a time of peace. In fact, 555 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 1: John's Sadler, the author of The Red Rose and the 556 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:05,720 Speaker 1: White who like he literally wrote a history book about 557 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:09,920 Speaker 1: the English Civil Wars. He says, quote it was a 558 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:13,000 Speaker 1: bit Hollywood. There was a lot of pump about it, 559 00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:17,600 Speaker 1: banners flying, drums beating. It was a show. And no, 560 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,480 Speaker 1: we know it's the show because we have an excerpt 561 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:26,080 Speaker 1: of a ballad that was composed to celebrate this. Do 562 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,239 Speaker 1: you do you wanna bless us with a reading? There? Man? Boy? 563 00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:31,360 Speaker 1: Would I ever been before I do the reading that 564 00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:33,719 Speaker 1: I want to say? You mentioned the Hazards of War. 565 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,400 Speaker 1: There is also a quite good Decembrist album called the 566 00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:41,000 Speaker 1: Hazards of Love, and I think that applies here because 567 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 1: it turns out that like forcing people, even if they 568 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: have quote unquote made nice or like awarded each other institutions, 569 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,840 Speaker 1: forcing them to hold hands and like you know, kiss 570 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:55,800 Speaker 1: and make up, it can breed further resentments and the escalations. 571 00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: But let's do this reading before we get to that. 572 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 1: At Paul's in London, with great renown, on our Lady 573 00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:08,120 Speaker 1: Day in Lent, this piece was wrought the King, the 574 00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:12,680 Speaker 1: Queen with lords many one went in procession in sight 575 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:17,920 Speaker 1: of all the commonality in token that love was in heart, 576 00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,439 Speaker 1: and thought, Ben, what is this rhyming scheme, I don't. 577 00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:24,239 Speaker 1: I feel like I was totally missing the boat on. 578 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:27,120 Speaker 1: I see there is a rhyming scheme. We've got renown 579 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:32,600 Speaker 1: and uh what, No, renown doesn't rhyme with anything renown 580 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,399 Speaker 1: maybe because then it's many one. And then you've got 581 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:39,560 Speaker 1: wrought rhyming with thought and procession. Now that's really it. 582 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:43,439 Speaker 1: I don't think there is a rhyming scheme bend. That's 583 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:45,480 Speaker 1: the only one. Though, Well, we have to think of 584 00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:55,440 Speaker 1: pronunciation one procession. You know, there's play with procession common 585 00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:57,960 Speaker 1: but what about commonality that. Yeah, that's just a weird one. 586 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,120 Speaker 1: That's where the beat drops. That's totally where the and 587 00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:04,840 Speaker 1: it's just acapella real quick, and then it picks back up. Uh, 588 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,600 Speaker 1: you're right, you're right. There is a little bit of 589 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:11,520 Speaker 1: a lost in translation vibe there. Sadler says. The women 590 00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:15,839 Speaker 1: in particular would have looked like the fifteen century equivalent 591 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:21,360 Speaker 1: of footballer's wives. Everybody was dolled up. Everybody's dressed the nines, 592 00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: he's saying. But beneath all this pomp and all this 593 00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:29,759 Speaker 1: fancy dress and all these fun, slant rhyming songs, there 594 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:35,000 Speaker 1: was still a lot of tension, and within two years 595 00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:38,799 Speaker 1: of this famous Loveday procession, the majority of the men 596 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,600 Speaker 1: who walked together holding hands in London would be dead, 597 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:49,160 Speaker 1: and these wars would go on for nearly thirty more years. Because, 598 00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:52,400 Speaker 1: as you said, as our pal Gabe said, there are 599 00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:54,800 Speaker 1: a lot of ways to end the war, and making 600 00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:59,080 Speaker 1: people hold hands in public is apparently not the best solution. 601 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,000 Speaker 1: They put up with it, partially because the King told 602 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:06,360 Speaker 1: them to, but they knew it wasn't really gonna work. 603 00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:09,520 Speaker 1: Queen Margaret had already started kind of being the power 604 00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,279 Speaker 1: behind the throne while the king was in and out 605 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,759 Speaker 1: for eighteen months. So she was at the front of 606 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:17,640 Speaker 1: the procession. She was holding hands with Richard of York, 607 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 1: and he hated her. They hated each other. Richard Nelville, 608 00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:25,640 Speaker 1: the Earl of Warwick, held hands with the Duke of Somerset, 609 00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,920 Speaker 1: who was Henry Beaufort in Beaufort's father had been killed 610 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 1: at St. Alban's uh St Albans was the original kind 611 00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,439 Speaker 1: of conflict that was started by the Duke of York. 612 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:37,759 Speaker 1: Then who has made Lord protect her? And if I'm 613 00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:41,760 Speaker 1: not mistaken, correct, correct? And so they had to hold 614 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 1: each other's hands. The people that they hated, probably the 615 00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 1: most in the world, and they had to walk with 616 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:52,239 Speaker 1: them for two miles pretending that it wouldn't make their 617 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,800 Speaker 1: day if the other person was dead, preferably in a slow, 618 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,560 Speaker 1: painful fashion. But I'm sorry, this is gonna sound like 619 00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:00,560 Speaker 1: a really dumb question. But the show is called history, 620 00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:03,759 Speaker 1: so I'm okay with it. The two factions, the Yorks 621 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 1: and the Lancasters, they're not boring over the crown exactly right. 622 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:11,640 Speaker 1: They're not mean because the king is in place and 623 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:13,520 Speaker 1: he's the one who's forcing them to do all this stuff. 624 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,560 Speaker 1: So what exactly are they at odds over? They do 625 00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:19,600 Speaker 1: want control of the throne of England, but the king 626 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:22,640 Speaker 1: is he just too dim to be aware that they're 627 00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 1: vying for like his job? Does he not care or 628 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:28,480 Speaker 1: does he does not see the threat? I'm confused as 629 00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:31,319 Speaker 1: to why he is so flippant and just kind of 630 00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,279 Speaker 1: like clueless about this? Is that? Is it really that 631 00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:36,080 Speaker 1: simple that he just doesn't quite does a click for him? 632 00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:39,719 Speaker 1: He Yeah, he did have mental issues, we believe, and 633 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:43,319 Speaker 1: it was his weak rule. W e A K? I 634 00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:48,040 Speaker 1: mean here that brought the House of York's claim. Richard 635 00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:51,839 Speaker 1: of York's claim to the throne back to the public eye, 636 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:56,040 Speaker 1: gathered more support for it because they people were saying, well, 637 00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,279 Speaker 1: we could do better than Henry the sixth, So so 638 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: more iron fisted monarch would have had these warring factions 639 00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:06,400 Speaker 1: drawn and quartered in the streets to make a statement, 640 00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,400 Speaker 1: as opposed to having them, you know, hold hands and 641 00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:13,759 Speaker 1: skip merrily through the streets together. Yeah, just making sure 642 00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:16,360 Speaker 1: I wasn't missing something entirely, because this all just seems 643 00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 1: completely bonkers to me. So here's the thing. After going 644 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,880 Speaker 1: through the motions of this gesture and holding the parade 645 00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:30,600 Speaker 1: and everything, Henry the sixth retreats politically. Queen Margaret is 646 00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,200 Speaker 1: at the cap bird seat again. She's driving the Loveday 647 00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:39,319 Speaker 1: piece accord. Spoiler alert doesn't work out. This was like 648 00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:42,640 Speaker 1: a soap opera according to our story and Sadler, We've 649 00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:46,719 Speaker 1: got a cast of characters, we've got all their entourages. 650 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:51,160 Speaker 1: They turned these small misunderstandings and all this historical baggage 651 00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:56,960 Speaker 1: into an ongoing, disastrous drama. Less than two months after 652 00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:02,440 Speaker 1: the Loveday, May the Earl of Warwick throwze the agreement 653 00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:05,640 Speaker 1: out and he this is probably my favorite phrase in 654 00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:07,480 Speaker 1: this story, and there are a lot of great phrases 655 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:13,239 Speaker 1: he engages in. Some get this casual piracy along the 656 00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:16,840 Speaker 1: coast of Calais, where he had been exiled by the Queen. No. 657 00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:21,640 Speaker 1: I love the phrase casual piracy. Casual piracy. You know, 658 00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:25,040 Speaker 1: it's you see exactly what it means. It's like going 659 00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:29,480 Speaker 1: to the target with those lists. Just vibes it just so. 660 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:33,040 Speaker 1: I mean, I would assume casual piracy means there wasn't 661 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:36,439 Speaker 1: so much a plan or like some sort of master plan, 662 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:38,520 Speaker 1: or that it was particularly organized. It was just kind 663 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:40,480 Speaker 1: of like, well, we're here, we might as well do 664 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:42,600 Speaker 1: a little smashing and grabbing, perhaps a little ripe it 665 00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,360 Speaker 1: in pillage exactly. That's that's what that's. And I know 666 00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,439 Speaker 1: it's horrible because you know it is piracy, and people 667 00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:52,520 Speaker 1: were injured and probably killed. But I just love the 668 00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:57,160 Speaker 1: idea of someone seeing another boat and going, oh, while 669 00:41:57,200 --> 00:41:59,720 Speaker 1: we're here, you know what I mean, let's do something. 670 00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:03,719 Speaker 1: Well remember totally so mean the War of the Roses. 671 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,640 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, Henry dies of course in May 672 00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:09,840 Speaker 1: one of fourteen seventy one. The War of the Roses 673 00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:12,160 Speaker 1: continues on for quite a long time. I mean, this 674 00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:14,600 Speaker 1: really was sort of the beginning of it. He tries 675 00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:18,080 Speaker 1: to quell it with this gesture of like goodwill, but 676 00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,480 Speaker 1: it obviously doesn't work, blows up in his face, and 677 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:24,080 Speaker 1: then he dies after retreating. Politically, we know this conflict 678 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:26,200 Speaker 1: went on for a long time, right, so how when 679 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:31,160 Speaker 1: did it actually actually end? The actual actual end of 680 00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:34,120 Speaker 1: the Wars of the Roses is generally considered to be 681 00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:41,719 Speaker 1: June seven, meaning the whole thing from Stem disturb lasted 682 00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:46,840 Speaker 1: for thirty two years, three weeks, and four days. We 683 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:50,200 Speaker 1: gotta tell you how how this all broke down. Margaret 684 00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:55,000 Speaker 1: hears about this casual piracy and it's either too casual 685 00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:58,520 Speaker 1: or too formal for her. Maybe it's just because it's piracy. 686 00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,720 Speaker 1: She summons the Earl to London, the Earl of Warwick, 687 00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:05,880 Speaker 1: to answer for his actions. A scuffle breaks out, and 688 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:09,640 Speaker 1: so she takes this opportunity and accuses the Earl of Warwick, 689 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,239 Speaker 1: the Duke of York, and some other nobility on their 690 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 1: side of treason in October of fourteen fifty nine, and 691 00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:21,640 Speaker 1: she says the Duke has most diabolical unkindness and wretched envy. 692 00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:25,200 Speaker 1: She says the Loveday procession is curdled into a Parliament 693 00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,279 Speaker 1: of devils and the Roses were at it again, and 694 00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:33,040 Speaker 1: this would continue for another generation. And as he said, well, 695 00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:38,160 Speaker 1: Henry expires on May twenty one, fourteen seventy one, which 696 00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:44,160 Speaker 1: means he died before the conflicts concluded. And weirdly enough, 697 00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:47,839 Speaker 1: he became more popular after his death than he was 698 00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,840 Speaker 1: when he was alive because he was a nice dude. 699 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:53,680 Speaker 1: He was like a nice guy, but he just he 700 00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:56,239 Speaker 1: was a terrible king. I think that's why a lot 701 00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:58,760 Speaker 1: of this is so hard to wrap my head around, 702 00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:03,080 Speaker 1: is because we're just not you too genuinely nice monarchs. 703 00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,360 Speaker 1: And I think that's because it typically mean you aren't 704 00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:06,960 Speaker 1: suited for the job if you're too nice. And it 705 00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:09,600 Speaker 1: seems like that was a criticism that was thrown in 706 00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:12,600 Speaker 1: him plenty. But like happens a lot of times, you know, 707 00:44:12,680 --> 00:44:16,359 Speaker 1: hindsight being and all that, he has remembered much more 708 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:19,879 Speaker 1: fondly than he was treated when he was alive. When 709 00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:21,400 Speaker 1: he was alive, he was kind of treated as an 710 00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,759 Speaker 1: inconvenience and you know, weakling and this, that and the other. 711 00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:27,040 Speaker 1: But when he passed, like I was saying at May 712 00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:32,440 Speaker 1: one of fourteen seventy one, he started almost being treated 713 00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:35,719 Speaker 1: like a saint. People were coming and making pilgrimages to 714 00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,640 Speaker 1: shirt See Abbey where he was buried. That's before the 715 00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:43,960 Speaker 1: new king, Richard the Third, had Henry's remains moved to St. 716 00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:47,440 Speaker 1: George's Chapel in Windsor. And there was this notion that 717 00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:50,799 Speaker 1: Henry was this like kind of saintly man, not just 718 00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:54,360 Speaker 1: a nice man, but a holy man. And there's a 719 00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:58,440 Speaker 1: fifteen hundred book that showed up that was almost like 720 00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:01,680 Speaker 1: the Gospel of Henry, know, where it talked about his 721 00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:06,400 Speaker 1: ability to perform miracles, including like resurrecting plague victims. It's 722 00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:09,760 Speaker 1: almost this whole mythology that grew up around this dude 723 00:45:09,800 --> 00:45:13,239 Speaker 1: after he died. And again, you know this, We know 724 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:15,640 Speaker 1: that he did do things like have you know body 725 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,960 Speaker 1: parts removed from the city walls, that he pardoned all 726 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,799 Speaker 1: these people. So it seems like there's a grain of 727 00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,560 Speaker 1: truth in this that blossomed and so out and out 728 00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:27,879 Speaker 1: him walking on water and performing miracles. So where did 729 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:31,640 Speaker 1: all this come from? Well, according to and his storian 730 00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:35,799 Speaker 1: named Desmond Seward, a lot of it came from the 731 00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:43,799 Speaker 1: unfortunate circumstances of Henry's death. He was unjustly murdered and 732 00:45:44,000 --> 00:45:47,680 Speaker 1: Seward believes this created widespread pity for a king who, 733 00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:51,000 Speaker 1: after his deposition, was treated like a thief and put 734 00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:54,680 Speaker 1: to death without having committed any crime. He just became 735 00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:59,120 Speaker 1: too much of a liability politically. Also, you know, ridiculous 736 00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:01,920 Speaker 1: historians to the crowd out of a certain age with 737 00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:08,480 Speaker 1: a certain depth of experience. May recall that similar observations 738 00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:11,040 Speaker 1: were made. Whether or not you agree with him, similar 739 00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:14,399 Speaker 1: observations were made about the US President Jimmy Carter. There 740 00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:16,279 Speaker 1: were a lot of people were saying, this guy is 741 00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:19,840 Speaker 1: too nice to be president. Yeah, no, it's true, And 742 00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:24,280 Speaker 1: I get it. History almost took pity on him and 743 00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,560 Speaker 1: kind of created maybe not history, but like those who 744 00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:31,080 Speaker 1: are responsible for writing certain portions of this history, and 745 00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 1: I guess decided to give him some superpowers in the afterlife, 746 00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:42,120 Speaker 1: right right, which is nice. But is it as nice 747 00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:45,800 Speaker 1: as not being murdered? I would say probably not. Maybe 748 00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:50,560 Speaker 1: it depends on your perspective. But this ends the story 749 00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:55,680 Speaker 1: of Henry the sixth. I would say, this noble, if 750 00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:59,000 Speaker 1: misguided effort to make people be a little bit nicer 751 00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:03,160 Speaker 1: to each other. It didn't work, you know, but it 752 00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,239 Speaker 1: was very nice of him to try that really was 753 00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:08,600 Speaker 1: the alternatives, And it's like, you don't even get a 754 00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:13,399 Speaker 1: whiff of the types of megalomaniacal acts the most young 755 00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:17,319 Speaker 1: monarchs tend to absolutely thrive on. You know, I'm thinking, 756 00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:19,799 Speaker 1: we're talking about Game of Thrones. I'm wondering if they 757 00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:23,279 Speaker 1: took this character, maybe this character is common. You know 758 00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:27,799 Speaker 1: who who who is the sweet boy who you know 759 00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:30,839 Speaker 1: ultimately was the younger brother of Jeoffrey, who was an 760 00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:33,600 Speaker 1: absolute monster. So obviously there's some bits and pieces and 761 00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:36,640 Speaker 1: picking and choosing to make it, but I'm really totally 762 00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,879 Speaker 1: seeing the parallels here. But it turns out that we 763 00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:44,799 Speaker 1: in the history had a pretty benevolent, if misguided and uh, 764 00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:48,840 Speaker 1: not particularly suited for the job monarch. But this was 765 00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:50,400 Speaker 1: a cool one. Man. I wonder we should do more 766 00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:53,319 Speaker 1: War of the Roses related stuff. This is there's a 767 00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:56,000 Speaker 1: lot to it. I imagine a lot of different factions 768 00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:59,200 Speaker 1: and in fighting, and this is a great, great primer, 769 00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:02,520 Speaker 1: great place to no real dragons though, but I agree 770 00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:05,040 Speaker 1: with you, No, there is one thing I'd like to 771 00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,640 Speaker 1: leave us all with, which is this, If you would 772 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:11,520 Speaker 1: like to take up some of the practices of the 773 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:15,239 Speaker 1: Cult of Henry the Six there's a very simple thing 774 00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:18,960 Speaker 1: you can do if you want Henry the six they 775 00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:22,399 Speaker 1: come back from the dead and perform a miracle for you. 776 00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:25,080 Speaker 1: All you have to do is take a silver coin 777 00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:29,319 Speaker 1: and bend it as an offering to the saint. Now, 778 00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:31,400 Speaker 1: all we've got to do is find some silver coins. 779 00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:34,680 Speaker 1: What do you think? Wait, so he was officially canonized. No, no, 780 00:48:34,719 --> 00:48:38,120 Speaker 1: not at all. More of god It folks. I love 781 00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:40,360 Speaker 1: a good folks sing and um, I think that's a 782 00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:42,640 Speaker 1: great idea. And this is completely unrelated, but I just 783 00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:47,160 Speaker 1: in the interest of turning folks onto some interesting um cinema. 784 00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:51,000 Speaker 1: I recently saw an a twenty four kind of psychological 785 00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:54,399 Speaker 1: horror film called Sat maud Um, which is also sort 786 00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:56,960 Speaker 1: of about a folk saint. And it is not for 787 00:48:57,000 --> 00:48:59,239 Speaker 1: the squeamish, but I highly recommend it. But does a 788 00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:01,640 Speaker 1: really good job at like looking at mental health and 789 00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:05,000 Speaker 1: kind of you know, the some of the perceptions of 790 00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:08,600 Speaker 1: people with with mental illness. And I highly recommend St 791 00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:12,520 Speaker 1: maud Yeah, I remember that one is well worth the watch. 792 00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:16,000 Speaker 1: Do check it out. And while you're on the internet, 793 00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:18,640 Speaker 1: why not I come say high to us. You can 794 00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:23,359 Speaker 1: find Ridiculous History on our Facebook page. Ridiculous Historians, and 795 00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,200 Speaker 1: you can also send us an email where we are 796 00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:30,120 Speaker 1: ridiculous at I heart media dot com. Huge thanks super 797 00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:34,480 Speaker 1: producer Casey Pegram, super producer Max Williams Alex Williams who 798 00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:38,640 Speaker 1: composed this theme, and of course big thanks with a 799 00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:43,800 Speaker 1: big asterix to our good friends Slash Nemessies Jonathan Strickland 800 00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,640 Speaker 1: a k a. The Quister. Someone bend a silver coin 801 00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:50,480 Speaker 1: for us to win the next time he drops by, 802 00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:52,799 Speaker 1: which hopefully won't be today. I think we gotta cut 803 00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:56,000 Speaker 1: a short we do, but while you're on the internet, 804 00:49:56,040 --> 00:49:58,080 Speaker 1: do yourself a favor and check out our brand new 805 00:49:58,160 --> 00:50:01,759 Speaker 1: sister podcast, Ridiculous Romance with Eli and Diana, getting some 806 00:50:01,800 --> 00:50:04,440 Speaker 1: amazing reviews so far on the Internet, which is not 807 00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:06,879 Speaker 1: known for being particularly nice. So that warmed my heart 808 00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:08,799 Speaker 1: and I'm sure it did yours as well. Then it 809 00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:13,759 Speaker 1: did indeed, and spoiler alert, they're gonna becoming an hour 810 00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:24,040 Speaker 1: show very soon, so stay tuned. We'll see you next time, folks. 811 00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:26,160 Speaker 1: For more podcasts for my Heart Radio, visit the I 812 00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:29,120 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to 813 00:50:29,160 --> 00:50:30,040 Speaker 1: your favorite shows.