WEBVTT - Rethinking Cannabis: What Science Tells Us About Legalized Marijuana 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:04.680 Really now, really. 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:11.040 Really now, really well and welcome to really know really 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:13.560 with Jason Alexander and Peter Tilden. He remind you that 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:16.799 subscribing to our show gives many listeners they sustained and 0:00:16.920 --> 0:00:19.720 euphoric high and speaking of getting high. 0:00:19.960 --> 0:00:21.520 As of November twenty. 0:00:21.200 --> 0:00:24.680 Twenty four, recreational cannabis is legal in twenty four states 0:00:24.800 --> 0:00:28.200 and is available medically and or decriminalized in an additional 0:00:28.240 --> 0:00:31.880 twenty Clearly, the floodgates have opened and the normalization of 0:00:31.920 --> 0:00:34.440 marijuana's positive benefits has taken hold. 0:00:34.560 --> 0:00:37.800 But what do we really know about the effects of potts? 0:00:38.240 --> 0:00:41.720 Is there science based evidence demonstrating what happens after long 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:45.280 term consumption? Is it true that teen emergency room visits 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:48.600 are up, suicides and psychotic episodes are up, and that 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:52.680 schizophrenia may perhaps be linked to cannabis? These questions became 0:00:52.880 --> 0:00:55.440 very personal for us here really know really when co 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:58.600 host Peter Tilden realized he had become addicted to cannabis 0:00:58.680 --> 0:01:03.120 during the pandemic. Struggled to stop, and so doctor Bertha Madras, 0:01:03.160 --> 0:01:07.080 the director of the Laboratory of Addiction Neurobiology at McLean Hospital, 0:01:07.120 --> 0:01:10.120 Professor of Psychobiology, at Harvard Medical School and one of 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:13.679 the nation's leading experts on marijuana, came by to answer 0:01:13.800 --> 0:01:15.600 all of Peter and Jason's questions. 0:01:15.640 --> 0:01:17.760 And if you smoke weed or know someone who. 0:01:17.600 --> 0:01:20.399 Does, you may be surprised and shocked by what you're 0:01:20.400 --> 0:01:21.319 about to find out. 0:01:21.720 --> 0:01:24.640 Really, no, really, here's Jason and Peter. 0:01:26.880 --> 0:01:29.360 Good Hello, Hello to you, sir. 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:31.920 You must say good morning, and you finally right because 0:01:31.959 --> 0:01:37.000 I realize people, yeah, they also I also know this. 0:01:37.000 --> 0:01:39.200 This is what I've learned after listening to our podcast 0:01:39.240 --> 0:01:41.000 for whether we got eighty five in? 0:01:41.360 --> 0:01:42.959 Ready, can I anticipate what you're gonna say? 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:46.000 Yeah, this will be edited, that's right, So saying it 0:01:46.040 --> 0:01:47.240 doesn't matter because no one's hearing. 0:01:47.319 --> 0:01:53.800 We spend minutes doing glorious repartee winds up on somebody's floor. 0:01:53.880 --> 0:01:55.520 You know, we should do glory cuts it right in. 0:01:55.680 --> 0:01:57.400 We should do an entireties whatever. 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:03.480 It is she's against it, and that you insert it 0:02:03.680 --> 0:02:06.360 and that way, that's the only way this repartee will 0:02:06.360 --> 0:02:07.120 be in the show. 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:10.240 We should do a very special episode that's just cut 0:02:10.280 --> 0:02:12.919 together all the openings, every opening. 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:15.960 So here's here's my question to you as we start 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:20.000 this episode today about I'm estimating I've lost all sense 0:02:20.040 --> 0:02:22.640 of time, but three months ago, maybe a little more. 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:28.520 You hold turkey, you're a marijuana use. You're off, you're done, 0:02:28.600 --> 0:02:29.399 You're out. 0:02:29.960 --> 0:02:32.360 To be totally honest. Yeah, I slipped a couple of 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:37.120 times and was upset that I did under ten circumstances, situation, 0:02:37.560 --> 0:02:37.960 some stuff. 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:39.920 Yeah, but yeah, I'm out. I'm out. Okay. 0:02:41.639 --> 0:02:44.040 First of all, how was it? How was it getting off? 0:02:44.120 --> 0:02:46.840 It's still difficult, still difficult in what way? 0:02:48.000 --> 0:02:48.720 It was a crutch. 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:50.920 You use it as a crutch, and it helps you 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:52.679 get through the day because you don't have to you 0:02:52.720 --> 0:02:55.640 don't have to deal with the stuff that you should 0:02:55.680 --> 0:02:57.960 be dealing with. Because it puts you you can nap, 0:02:58.160 --> 0:03:00.640 puts you out, You feel a little bit better. The 0:03:00.720 --> 0:03:03.200 problem was I was doing it so much that it 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:07.480 was acting not to help me. It was making me nervous. 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:10.720 It was making me jittery, which which was the beginning 0:03:10.880 --> 0:03:13.200 of the reason for this episode. 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:15.840 Right, we had somebody on because it was not going 0:03:15.919 --> 0:03:16.440 to come for me. 0:03:16.680 --> 0:03:19.280 I'm you know, except for when I drove with a 0:03:19.320 --> 0:03:22.040 trunk full of marijuana that could land me in a 0:03:22.080 --> 0:03:23.360 federal one. 0:03:24.360 --> 0:03:28.760 Early guests, But what I started realizing, is that the 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:33.160 floodgates have open and they're legalizing this, and as use 0:03:33.240 --> 0:03:36.680 goes up, the perception of harmfulness decreases. 0:03:36.840 --> 0:03:39.240 So it becomes it becomes normalized. 0:03:39.600 --> 0:03:42.440 Yeah, And I wondered, because this shows really not really 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:46.360 is there any evidence backed science to this. So I 0:03:46.400 --> 0:03:50.160 reached out to one of the nation's top experts on marijuana. 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:54.120 Because you keep hearing reports on emergency room visits, especially 0:03:54.160 --> 0:03:57.840 by teens is way through the roof dichotic episodes, schizophrenia. 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.360 They don't know what THHC long term can do to 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:03.920 you all kinds of other repercussions. So I want to go, 0:04:04.040 --> 0:04:06.520 wait a minute, we should at least know. I'm not 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:09.480 saying you should stop, not stop. I just would like 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:09.800 to know. 0:04:09.960 --> 0:04:13.280 We don't proselytize no, we don't preach no, which is 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:13.880 the same thing. 0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:15.520 By the way, proselytizing and. 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:18.400 Preaching don't be condescending, which means to talk down to 0:04:19.480 --> 0:04:21.599 So I wanted to get an expert on to get 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:26.200 science based knowledge to go, what what do we know 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:29.400 about marijuana at this point and what should be concerned about? 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:30.840 That's all you just want to know if you can 0:04:30.920 --> 0:04:32.880 go back. That's what I think part of the part 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:34.720 of the big, big part of that back a little bit. 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:37.960 She opens's what's the you know what is the teter totter? 0:04:38.080 --> 0:04:42.560 How much before I start to flag goes down? If 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:44.040 she says go for it. 0:04:44.160 --> 0:04:47.320 Yeah, So and you realize this is I am a 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:49.760 complete non user because I'm allergic to it. 0:04:50.600 --> 0:04:52.080 What do you get when you smoke? 0:04:52.320 --> 0:04:55.520 I had two experiences in high school when you're first 0:04:55.560 --> 0:04:59.640 introduced to this stuff. The first time I got I 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:01.839 don't get migrants, but I got what I assume is 0:05:01.839 --> 0:05:05.920 like a migraine like headache and hives. I broke out 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:08.680 in hives, and I went, oh, this is awful. I'm 0:05:08.680 --> 0:05:10.839 never doing that again. Went to another party a couple 0:05:10.920 --> 0:05:13.240 months later and somebody was passing a joint and I 0:05:14.000 --> 0:05:15.880 don't think this is I get a thing from this, 0:05:15.920 --> 0:05:18.200 and they went, oh, no, that was bad stuff. 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:20.360 This is the good that's the other thing. This is 0:05:20.400 --> 0:05:20.960 the good stuff. 0:05:21.000 --> 0:05:25.479 So I tried this one and worse, worse, migraine, more hives, 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:26.680 and I went, it's a plant. 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:28.320 I'm allergic to a lot of plans. 0:05:28.320 --> 0:05:30.560 We want to know what the scientists, so hopefully definitive 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:34.279 today we will at least explore the reality of what 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:38.440 they know. Research was right about the positives of pot 0:05:39.000 --> 0:05:40.640 if they can measure them. I mean, when you have 0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:44.159 a migraine, does a doctor go two joints of sativa? 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:49.039 Five hits and three hail marys? Yeah, I'm with you totally. 0:05:49.120 --> 0:05:51.840 So let's find so, let's find out who our guests today. 0:05:51.880 --> 0:05:52.839 Shall we introduce her? 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:57.080 Why wouldn't we? Why wouldn't we? So you're more familiar 0:05:57.120 --> 0:05:58.920 with this lady than I am. I just love her name, 0:05:59.000 --> 0:06:03.600 doctor Bertha. I love that name, Doctor Bertha Mandras. Do 0:06:03.640 --> 0:06:05.040 a strength, say it loud. 0:06:05.160 --> 0:06:08.640 And it's almost like praying, we can't afford that. I 0:06:08.680 --> 0:06:10.200 know that, And it's almost like saying. 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:14.120 She's a director of the Laboratory of Addiction Neurobiology at 0:06:14.200 --> 0:06:18.360 McLean Hospital and is professor of psychobiology at Harvard Medical School, 0:06:18.360 --> 0:06:23.640 and she's considered one of the premier leading experts on marijuana. 0:06:24.400 --> 0:06:28.360 Well, let's get high and welcome doctor Bertha Madras. 0:06:28.360 --> 0:06:30.160 Hello, doctor Madras. 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:33.200 Hello, Hello, greetings, tool, thank you. 0:06:33.279 --> 0:06:37.000 Welcome to really know really where Peter is not stoned? 0:06:37.040 --> 0:06:39.240 And I'm not sure if you even would rather be 0:06:39.320 --> 0:06:39.880 at this point. 0:06:40.040 --> 0:06:43.600 Peter well, again, I really was truly addicted to marijuana. 0:06:43.640 --> 0:06:45.000 We've talked about this that I would do it to 0:06:45.000 --> 0:06:47.280 go to The setup was I'm doing this to go 0:06:47.279 --> 0:06:50.320 to sleep. Yeah, then it's I'm doing it dinner time. 0:06:50.400 --> 0:06:52.360 Then I'm doing it at lunchtime. Then I'm doing it 0:06:52.400 --> 0:06:55.200 to kind of dull out any aggravation that I have 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:55.400 to do. 0:06:55.480 --> 0:06:59.680 You're basically explaining how I use cake exactly the same thing. 0:06:59.800 --> 0:07:01.919 So why don't we turn it over to you? Because 0:07:01.960 --> 0:07:04.760 you've researched it. What have you found? What do we know? 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:06.080 What do we know for sure? 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:10.880 Well, first of all, the first myth that I would 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:14.880 love people to hear about is it's only a plant. 0:07:15.560 --> 0:07:19.160 That's what you hear commonly among kids, among users and 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:24.160 saying it's nature's own sedative, it's nature's own sleep medicine, 0:07:24.200 --> 0:07:26.920 it's nature's own So let me just give you a 0:07:26.960 --> 0:07:30.760 little bit of background. They're over three hundred thousand plants 0:07:30.800 --> 0:07:35.400 on this earth, and humans consume only about three hundred 0:07:35.440 --> 0:07:39.280 of those three hundred thousand. And the reason we consume 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:42.480 only a few of the many that we have a 0:07:42.600 --> 0:07:47.120 choice is because most plants are poisonous to human beings. 0:07:47.400 --> 0:07:51.120 Why is that the case is because plants don't have teeth, 0:07:51.440 --> 0:07:54.440 they don't have fists, they don't have legs to run away, 0:07:54.680 --> 0:07:58.560 they have no protection, so they produce substances that can 0:07:58.600 --> 0:08:02.960 disable the people, the humans, the animals, and the insects 0:08:02.960 --> 0:08:07.840 that consume them. Now, marijuana happens to have in it 0:08:08.200 --> 0:08:14.920 THHC delta nine tetrahydrocannabinol, which is a psychoactive compound that 0:08:15.120 --> 0:08:22.280 interferes with normal brain communication. And it is likely, because 0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:25.960 an experiment was done recently in India, it is likely 0:08:26.040 --> 0:08:30.680 that the plant uses THHC to interfere with the nervous 0:08:30.720 --> 0:08:35.760 system of things that consume it, and so it is 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:41.160 probably one of marijuana's protective factors. Wow, it's as simple 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:44.680 as that. Now, the thing that I would love to 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:48.840 emphasize here is the number of parents, the number of 0:08:49.280 --> 0:08:53.959 young people, adolescents, young adults that have told me over 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:58.760 and over again, if only I knew before they went 0:08:58.880 --> 0:09:04.960 down the path that led them to addiction, psychosis, loss 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:07.920 of motivation. I can go on and on. 0:09:08.840 --> 0:09:12.000 All right, So let's talk about the medicinal benefits. Do 0:09:12.040 --> 0:09:15.360 we know scientifically? Do we know long term effects? 0:09:15.600 --> 0:09:20.080 So if there are definitive positive uses for marijuana. 0:09:20.880 --> 0:09:26.880 Okay, so there are no definitive studies that provide evidence 0:09:27.400 --> 0:09:35.439 that marijuana the smoke plant has any strong medicinal benefits period. 0:09:36.240 --> 0:09:40.240 All the meta analyzes, all the papers say that it 0:09:40.320 --> 0:09:47.000 may be a mild pain reducing substance. It may induce sleep, 0:09:47.040 --> 0:09:52.280 but it also could promote sleep disorders eventually with chronic use, 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:56.360 and so on and so forth. It may prevent vomiting, 0:09:57.040 --> 0:10:02.960 but after very high dose frequent use, it can promote vomiting. 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:09.480 Cannabis hyper emesis syndrome is not frequent, but people have 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:13.640 these symptoms. They have to go to emergency departments. They 0:10:13.679 --> 0:10:16.040 have to take hot showers to get rid of them. 0:10:16.600 --> 0:10:22.040 Almost every therapeutic benefit that has been touted for marijuana, 0:10:22.200 --> 0:10:26.600 first of all, does not have potent, high quality signs 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:33.680 behind it. And alternatives exist that are generally safer than marijuana. 0:10:33.000 --> 0:10:36.840 And doctor Anders, does that include the reported pain relief 0:10:37.120 --> 0:10:38.120 benefits of use. 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:44.199 The reported pain reliefs We don't even have side by 0:10:44.280 --> 0:10:50.640 side comparisons with over the counter medications like ibuprofen or 0:10:51.160 --> 0:10:56.960 other non steroid lantine flammatories. But marijuana is a very 0:10:57.200 --> 0:11:03.000 mild pain reducing substance, and people began to promote it 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:08.200 in the early twenty twenty twenties as a substitute for 0:11:08.280 --> 0:11:13.760 the opioid crisis, and that was pure, pure fiction. It 0:11:13.800 --> 0:11:18.000 does not substitute for opiods. It cannot reduce pain to 0:11:18.040 --> 0:11:22.400 the extent that opioids do, and the alternatives that are 0:11:22.520 --> 0:11:25.200 over the counter are much safe. 0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:29.600 Alcohol metabolize a certain way in the system. Does how 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:32.920 does THC or And when I say TFC, I understand 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:36.640 there are like three hundred chemicals in marijuana if you 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:38.960 can address that, but how does it metabolize? What happens 0:11:38.960 --> 0:11:41.160 when somebody takes it in as a posed alcohol the 0:11:41.160 --> 0:11:42.200 comparison there. 0:11:42.720 --> 0:11:46.440 There are over seven hundred chemicals in the marijuana plant 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:51.280 and over one hundred and seven cannabinoids that the marijuana 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:56.439 plant produces. The primary ones are THHC and cannabidiol. When 0:11:56.480 --> 0:12:01.440 a person consumes marijuana, the the thing you have to 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:07.080 know is the chemistry of THHC is completely different than alcohol. 0:12:07.600 --> 0:12:11.400 Alcohol is a substance that dissolves in fat. It dissolves 0:12:11.440 --> 0:12:15.440 in water, so within one to two hours, depending on 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:19.520 what you've eaten, alcohol clears from the body. So one 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.920 during per hour, one drink every two hours, and the 0:12:22.960 --> 0:12:27.920 effects are gone. Because marijuana's chemistry is such that it's 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:33.199 very fatty. It loves to stick in fat, it dissolves 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:37.360 in fat. The brain is a fatty organ The brain 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:41.920 uses fats to insulate its wires so that it doesn't 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:46.480 get wiring mixed up. Marijuana accumulates in the brain and 0:12:46.679 --> 0:12:51.520 it can last for at least eight to twenty four 0:12:51.559 --> 0:12:57.439 hours before it clears entirely. Heavy users you can still 0:12:57.480 --> 0:13:03.880 detect THHC in their blood after three to four weeks 0:13:03.920 --> 0:13:07.000 because it's going to be absorbed by the fat and 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:10.200 it'll be slowly, slowly leached out. 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:14.440 Well, and now you said there's seven hundred chemicals in 0:13:14.480 --> 0:13:18.160 the plant. Yes, And it was wondering with today's regulations. 0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:20.439 Is it regulated to the point that when you go 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:23.800 to a dispensary and you buy something that you know 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.320 that there's some kind of quality assurance to it or 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:27.920 is that complete nonsense? 0:13:27.960 --> 0:13:29.720 Does that mean nothing still the wild West? 0:13:30.240 --> 0:13:37.160 Complete nonsense? There are regulations in place, for example, in California, 0:13:37.240 --> 0:13:43.199 where you are somebody. A study was just done analyzing 0:13:43.360 --> 0:13:49.840 samples of marijuana from dispensaries. They found pesticide they found her. Besides, 0:13:50.400 --> 0:13:54.440 they've found all kinds of junk in the marijuana, and 0:13:54.840 --> 0:14:00.520 they and other studies have shown that the PERCENTHC that's 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:06.000 on the labels is completely fiction. In some cases, it's 0:14:06.360 --> 0:14:11.160 very very rarely accurate. It's either they either toute that 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:14.880 it has more THHC than the present or much less 0:14:14.920 --> 0:14:18.680 thchc than it's actually present in what you buy. The 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:25.640 regulations are sound ideal, they're fictitious in terms of reduced 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:30.160 to practice, costs a lot of money to analyze every dispensary, 0:14:30.520 --> 0:14:33.480 every sample, and a lot of states are not doing 0:14:33.600 --> 0:14:34.440 due diligence. 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:37.920 So dog I wanted to ask a question in regard 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:41.760 to the addictiveness of this how addictive or not is 0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:42.440 this substance? 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:50.160 Well, it's very interesting and I'm smiling because the statistics 0:14:50.160 --> 0:14:54.440 are coming out now that are so I mean, they're 0:14:54.480 --> 0:15:00.480 almost astonishing, but for me they probably shouldn't be. Right now, 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:05.920 some of the best epidemiologists in the country have reported 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:12.960 that twenty nine percent of people who use marijuana, either 0:15:13.440 --> 0:15:18.880 for recreational purposes or for medical purposes, have a cannabis 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:19.760 use disorder. 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:24.440 A third of the people. Now, why is that so 0:15:24.720 --> 0:15:29.240 because people using it for so called medicinal purposes are 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:33.920 using daily or five times daily or ten times daily. 0:15:34.840 --> 0:15:41.120 And the risks of becoming addicted to marijuana increase depending 0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:43.760 on how frequently you use. So if you use daily, 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:46.840 the risks are about thirty to fifty percent. 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:52.240 And when you have this condition that you're addicted to it, 0:15:52.320 --> 0:15:53.320 what are the signs of that? 0:15:53.360 --> 0:15:54.240 What are the symptoms of that? 0:15:55.000 --> 0:16:01.000 Well, the symptoms are standard symptoms for use disorder substance disorders. 0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:06.200 It means not meeting commitments. It means being disinterested in 0:16:06.520 --> 0:16:12.360 in uh in things and things that you normally are. 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:18.080 It means trying to quit and being unable to quit frequently. 0:16:18.400 --> 0:16:23.040 There are eleven criteria for for substance use disorders. The 0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:28.440 interesting thing is somebody in UH in the National Survey 0:16:28.480 --> 0:16:33.600 and Drug Use in Health compared the symptoms of alcohol 0:16:33.680 --> 0:16:38.680 used disorder with cannabis use disorder and they've found that 0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:44.440 the symptoms that are categorized as more moderate in this 0:16:44.920 --> 0:16:49.960 moderate to severe category are higher for marijuana than for alcohol. 0:16:50.680 --> 0:16:53.520 And alcohol there are more numbers of people in the 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:55.680 mild to moderate range. 0:16:57.160 --> 0:17:00.600 Wow, So when I used it and was really using 0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:04.359 it a lot, I started having anxiety, I started to 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:08.760 have disinterest. I started also aggression, like I would snap. 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:12.520 My personality change. And now I hear that er visits 0:17:12.560 --> 0:17:17.560 are up, especially among young people with psychosis suicidal planning. 0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.520 I mean that is that accurate? And to what extent 0:17:20.600 --> 0:17:23.560 what percentage of marijuanas can be attributed to that? 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:30.120 Well, psychosis has been a very controversial issue until I 0:17:30.160 --> 0:17:33.119 think the data that has come in in the past 0:17:33.200 --> 0:17:38.800 ten years. So psychosis, as you know, there's there's many 0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:43.520 causes of psychosis. Some of them are and some of 0:17:43.520 --> 0:17:46.880 them could be metabolic, some are drug induced, and so on. 0:17:47.560 --> 0:17:54.000 But the association between psychosis, schizophrenia which means an enduring psychosis, 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:57.880 and marijuana is getting so strong that more and more 0:17:58.000 --> 0:18:03.920 people are claiming that it's a cause of schizophrenia, not 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:09.920 just an association. That's right, And why is that? First 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:12.959 of all, it's dose response. The more you use, the 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:16.199 more frequently you use, the more likely you have to 0:18:16.320 --> 0:18:23.160 develop schizophrenia. Secondly, in seven countries at least where they 0:18:23.200 --> 0:18:27.240 have looked at people with early onset marijuana use, the 0:18:27.440 --> 0:18:32.160 risks of developing schizophrenia are higher that if you never 0:18:32.760 --> 0:18:39.959 touched marijuana during your young young adolescent or a young adult. So, 0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:44.920 and there's a six criteria for causality and marijuana, I 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:47.040 think fulfills at least five of those. 0:18:47.200 --> 0:18:47.720 Do you guys? 0:18:47.760 --> 0:18:50.199 As I'm listening to this, all I'm hearing is like 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:53.320 from my past of bringing this stuff up. Oh, these 0:18:53.359 --> 0:18:56.040 guys have an agenda. They went into this for a reason. 0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:58.359 Did you get into this one any kind of agenda? 0:18:58.440 --> 0:18:58.920 Number one? 0:18:58.920 --> 0:19:01.240 And number two? What kind ofushback do you get? Because 0:19:01.280 --> 0:19:02.240 you must get pushback. 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:07.639 So, first of all, agenda, I am not a drug user. 0:19:09.280 --> 0:19:12.479 I don't use alcohol. It's not that I have an 0:19:12.520 --> 0:19:16.840 aversion to alcohol. It's that I simply don't. I just 0:19:16.920 --> 0:19:21.080 fall asleep with it. So there's no point in missing 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:23.200 the party if you're going to go to sleep, right. 0:19:24.359 --> 0:19:28.280 I have always observed when I was a kid, I 0:19:28.359 --> 0:19:34.200 observed what happens to people using drugs. And in my childhood, 0:19:34.200 --> 0:19:38.359 which was one hundred years ago, we had one or 0:19:38.400 --> 0:19:41.720 two kids who started using marijuana and they went downhill 0:19:41.840 --> 0:19:45.840 very fast, and I was stunned by that. That didn't 0:19:45.880 --> 0:19:49.639 inject into me a passion about it until I was 0:19:49.680 --> 0:19:53.320 a graduate student and I started to I was asked 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.959 to try to find out how LSD works, and I 0:19:57.040 --> 0:20:01.160 started to read the literature on psychiatry uses of LSD, 0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:07.040 and they were malevolent the effects of LSD, And gradually 0:20:07.119 --> 0:20:10.760 I became more and more interested in trying to protect 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:15.679 the human brain. My real passion is the magnificence of 0:20:15.720 --> 0:20:19.359 the human brain. It's the one thing that makes us human. 0:20:19.800 --> 0:20:24.880 It's the repository of our humanity, and drugs can interfere 0:20:25.000 --> 0:20:30.439 with normal human brain function and derail people's potential. That 0:20:30.600 --> 0:20:36.879 became my motivation, and after that I volunteered. I am 0:20:36.920 --> 0:20:39.720 not in the payroll of anyone whatsoever. 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:42.200 So what about the pushback. 0:20:43.280 --> 0:20:44.760 The pushback I've received? 0:20:56.840 --> 0:20:58.639 So what about the pushback. 0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:05.399 The push back I've received? Obviously, the drug policy alliance 0:21:05.840 --> 0:21:10.959 of people who are users, reporters and the media who 0:21:11.040 --> 0:21:16.400 are users. Many people who use casually have no consequences, 0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:20.680 and so they say, because I personally have no consequences, 0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:23.840 there is nothing wrong with the drug. That's not how 0:21:23.920 --> 0:21:29.080 science works. Science works on the basis of epidemiology. They 0:21:29.119 --> 0:21:32.359 look at vast numbers of people. They look at the 0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:37.160 consequences to vast numbers of people, not to individuals. That's 0:21:37.240 --> 0:21:40.600 how the FDA works when it approves drugs. It doesn't 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:43.480 go up to a person with a microphone and interviews 0:21:43.480 --> 0:21:47.000 them and says, did marijuana make you feel good? And 0:21:47.080 --> 0:21:50.560 did it reduce your pain? Okay, then will approve it. No, 0:21:51.280 --> 0:21:55.400 it works on the basis of statistics and vast numbers 0:21:55.400 --> 0:21:59.560 of people. And so the science is on the side 0:21:59.640 --> 0:22:04.360 of what I'm saying. Because I'm just quoting manuscript after manuscript, 0:22:04.400 --> 0:22:07.960 each one of which I can send you the citations, right, 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:12.840 but I've had pushback. It doesn't bother me because basically 0:22:13.600 --> 0:22:20.560 my foundation, my base is data, and the data disclaims 0:22:20.960 --> 0:22:25.520 some of the folks who are heavy lifetime users. 0:22:26.520 --> 0:22:30.399 What I'm hearing anecdotally from people now, both users and 0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:34.680 people in your profession. The catchphrase is, you know, the 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:39.719 pot today is not your grandfather's pot. Are growers and 0:22:39.800 --> 0:22:45.400 distributors actually trying to grow more powerful strains of marijuana? 0:22:45.680 --> 0:22:48.399 Why has it become so much more it's. 0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:50.320 Much more powerful? Of course they are. 0:22:51.800 --> 0:22:52.080 You know. 0:22:52.440 --> 0:22:57.360 There's a very well known principle in biology that the 0:22:57.400 --> 0:23:02.200 faster a drug gets into the brain and stronger the hit, 0:23:02.400 --> 0:23:06.520 meaning the higher the dose, the addictive potential goes up. 0:23:07.600 --> 0:23:15.640 Now everybody in drug industry, alcohol, tobacco, marijuana, they all 0:23:15.680 --> 0:23:20.080 know a verius and cocaine opioids. They know a very 0:23:20.119 --> 0:23:24.479 simple principle. The more powerful the drug, the more you 0:23:24.560 --> 0:23:27.920 get people addicted. The more people are addicted, the more 0:23:28.000 --> 0:23:32.720 you have a cache of people who are chronic users, 0:23:33.040 --> 0:23:37.480 who are going to be your main source of profit. 0:23:38.240 --> 0:23:42.160 And that's basically what it is. So in the sixties 0:23:42.240 --> 0:23:47.760 and seventies, the concentration of THHC in the marijuana plant 0:23:48.359 --> 0:23:51.679 was anywhere from believe it or not, as low as 0:23:51.760 --> 0:23:55.480 one percent up to four or five percent with hashiesh 0:23:56.760 --> 0:24:00.800 it is now bred to be about twenty percent THC 0:24:02.280 --> 0:24:06.879 and dabs and shatters, which is an increasing market share, 0:24:07.560 --> 0:24:11.119 which is highly concentrated THHC can be up to ninety 0:24:11.280 --> 0:24:12.320 percent THC. 0:24:15.800 --> 0:24:18.280 I just want to ask you about the other popular 0:24:18.280 --> 0:24:23.920 component of marijuana, CBD. Are there similar Are there? There 0:24:23.920 --> 0:24:26.720 seems to be in cosmetics and sleep aids and different 0:24:26.800 --> 0:24:31.120 kinds of things pain relief, topical pain relief. Is CBD 0:24:31.640 --> 0:24:34.479 a different story altogether or or there are also problems 0:24:34.480 --> 0:24:34.800 with that. 0:24:35.840 --> 0:24:40.399 CBD is an entirely different story in terms of it 0:24:40.440 --> 0:24:45.040 is non addictive, It does not have psychoactive properties. It 0:24:45.080 --> 0:24:51.720 does not intoxicate you. It functions in ways that are cryptic. 0:24:52.920 --> 0:24:57.040 People really don't quite know how it works. From that 0:24:57.200 --> 0:25:01.720 point of view, it's much safer. The problem with CBD 0:25:02.000 --> 0:25:05.920 is that it can also have drug interactions with other 0:25:06.040 --> 0:25:10.960 medications that you take. That's a problem, and there is 0:25:11.040 --> 0:25:17.160 some evidence of liver toxicity. The thing that is really 0:25:17.480 --> 0:25:23.080 disconcerting is that it's being marketed under false premises because 0:25:23.560 --> 0:25:27.080 there is a claim that it is a painkiller. The 0:25:27.119 --> 0:25:30.359 evidence is very weak. There's a claim that it puts 0:25:30.440 --> 0:25:33.920 you to sleep. The evidence is very weak. It can 0:25:34.040 --> 0:25:37.399 be sedating, but it's not a good sleep aid. And 0:25:37.520 --> 0:25:42.159 yet it seems to have taken hold. People are buying 0:25:42.200 --> 0:25:45.240 it like the droves and making all kinds of claims 0:25:45.240 --> 0:25:47.680 that have no basis in science. 0:25:48.720 --> 0:25:53.120 Are you completely disconcerted about the fact that the ship 0:25:53.160 --> 0:25:55.680 has sailed? Do you feel like there's that we can't 0:25:55.680 --> 0:25:57.960