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Speaker 1: Hello everybody, this is our classic episode. We'd like to

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Speaker 1: say hi, not just to our fellow conspiracy realists, but uh,

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Speaker 1: hi to your search history. How's that do? How's how's

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Speaker 1: your search? What's what's weird? Let's be to Daily's eyegeist

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Speaker 1: about it? Noel, Matt, What's what's something weird from out

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Speaker 1: our search histories that you feel comfortable disclosing? Let me shick,

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Speaker 1: let me check my history. Oh wait, it's deactivated. Oh

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Speaker 1: that's weird. You're you're you're an incognito mode kind of guy. No,

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Speaker 1: just I've got it turned off, which means just that

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Speaker 1: you can't see it. That's right exactly. My history is

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Speaker 1: pretty boring. It's just a bunch of audio nerd stuff currently.

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Speaker 1: And I've got how many firefighters are pyromaniacs? Legitimately. I

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Speaker 1: don't know why I added legitimately at the end. There,

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Speaker 1: I've got a search term here, guys, I did find one.

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Speaker 1: It just says, ohio accent. I'm not sure why. Perfect.

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Speaker 1: So we're talking about this because our classic episode today

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Speaker 1: is about whether or not you can actually delete your

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Speaker 1: Internet history. You know, we know a lot of people

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Speaker 1: ran into this when Facebook got caught continually doing really

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Speaker 1: sketchy things to track people. In this episode, I think

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Speaker 1: we also collaborate with our pals Mangesh had a couture

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Speaker 1: and a guy who now is our boss will pierce it. Oh.

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Speaker 1: I just want to listen for the like, just to

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Speaker 1: hear those guys. Oh Man, the nostalgiaz flooding through my

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Speaker 1: system as we speak. From UFOs to psychic powers and

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Speaker 1: government conspiracies. History is riddled with unexplained events. You can

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Speaker 1: turn back now or learn this stuff they don't want

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Speaker 1: you to know. Welcome back to the show. My name

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Speaker 1: is Matt, my name is no. They call me Ben.

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Speaker 1: You are you? And that makes this stuff they don't

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Speaker 1: want you to know. However, this is not your ordinary

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Speaker 1: episode of stuff they don't want you to know. Actually,

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Speaker 1: you know what, We should change that language, you guys,

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Speaker 1: because we I don't know if we've ever done an

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Speaker 1: ordinary episode. Have we never? We have never, and we

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Speaker 1: won't start now. This is a team up episode, a collaboration.

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Speaker 1: If you will, and we hope you do. We are

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Speaker 1: partnering with our buddies, colleagues, co workers, and friends. Will

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Speaker 1: end Mango from Part Time Genius to explore some of

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Speaker 1: the most important, pertinent and pressing questions about the online world.

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Speaker 1: The most important question that they are asking is what

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Speaker 1: does the Internet know about you? How much stuff? The personal,

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Speaker 1: the really personal, the things that you wouldn't share with

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Speaker 1: anybody else, you know, just talking to somebody on the street.

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Speaker 1: How much does the Internet know about you? And where

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Speaker 1: does it live? Yes, so, immediately after checking out this episode,

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Speaker 1: head on over to Part Time Genius to learn exactly

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Speaker 1: what the Internet already knows about you, and it's it's

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Speaker 1: a lot. Yeah, it's too much. Really, even if you

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Speaker 1: think you know, it's way more than you probably bargain for.

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Speaker 1: Before we begin answering our question and launching our exploration today,

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Speaker 1: let's fill in some context. First things First, oh, friends

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Speaker 1: and neighbors, if you are listening to this show, it

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Speaker 1: is almost certain that you have an Internet presence. I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously you're listening to podcast. Yeah, how would you know

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Speaker 1: what a podcast is if you were not connected to

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Speaker 1: the Internet. I guess there are shirts. Now, maybe you

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Speaker 1: just randomly saw a stuff you should know shirt on

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Speaker 1: somebody in the subway. There are a lot of those. Yeah. Second,

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Speaker 1: you might be on the Internet via social media of

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Speaker 1: any sort. And finally, even if you just happen to

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Speaker 1: be hanging out with some friends and one of them

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Speaker 1: happens to turn on our show just while you were

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Speaker 1: in the room, and you never once logged in or

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Speaker 1: signed up for any social media Facebook, Google, Twitter, Instagram,

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Speaker 1: friends to Tumblr, live journal, GeoCities. Yeah, was that a

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Speaker 1: social media your own page and you could connect other

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Speaker 1: pages to your page. Wasn't it just kind of like

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Speaker 1: a rudimentary like web hosting. Yeah, but come on, man,

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Speaker 1: it's the it's the stars a city. It was the

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Speaker 1: start of remember they all had they all had like

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Speaker 1: different neighborhoods. Yeah, depending on your region. Anyway, I digress.

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Speaker 1: So any of those things you got no interest, never

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Speaker 1: signed up, never gave them a lick of information, even

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Speaker 1: if you've never even had an email address. No, several

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Speaker 1: things are certain. At least a portion of your purchasing

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Speaker 1: history exists in online record. If you've somehow managed to

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Speaker 1: just pay cash money for every single thing in your love,

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Speaker 1: you're one of those um off the grid types. You

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Speaker 1: are still not safe, and that's because various public records

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Speaker 1: of your life are digitized. You guys, I was at

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Speaker 1: the bank recently trying to do some bankery, and it

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Speaker 1: came up on their screen, pages and pages of my

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Speaker 1: personal documents. I just happened to be able to see it.

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Speaker 1: I was like, Oh, that's my marriage certificate. Oh that's

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Speaker 1: that's my mortgage, you know, all of this stuff. And

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Speaker 1: I understand that when you submit that stuff, you know,

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Speaker 1: into the public record, it's somewhere. But I was a

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Speaker 1: little bit taken aback at how easily they were able

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Speaker 1: to just boot pop it up on their screen. Was

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Speaker 1: this routine bankery. It was routine bankery. It was transferring

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Speaker 1: a check to someone, and they had to verify identities

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Speaker 1: and they had to find a document that had the

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Speaker 1: made name of the individual question. But yeah, I know,

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Speaker 1: I was just kind of a little bit taken aback

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Speaker 1: by how quickly that stuff popped up on the screen.

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Speaker 1: So all of that stuff exists. You got court and

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Speaker 1: government agencies that have been posting public records online since

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Speaker 1: like the nineties, right, Ben, Yeah, the motor vehicle records,

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Speaker 1: voter files, property tax assessments, professional licensees, and of course

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Speaker 1: court files are all up there in the cloud. And

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Speaker 1: just to pump the brakes really quick, just to the

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Speaker 1: social media thing, we skipped over something really important here. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: what happens if you don't have a social media profile, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, because maybe your friends do. And guess what.

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Speaker 1: Most of these social media platforms or apps that you

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Speaker 1: end up downloading, they ask for your contacts in your phone,

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Speaker 1: especially if you're on your phone, and if your number

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Speaker 1: happens to be in your friends phone, your email address,

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Speaker 1: your address, your physical address, all of that stuff is

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Speaker 1: accessible by these apps and by these social media So

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Speaker 1: maybe the platforms are taken a look at you, just

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Speaker 1: in case, maybe in the future you make an account,

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Speaker 1: or they can just take that information and sell it

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Speaker 1: to somebody else who fits that persona right or a

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Speaker 1: construction persona. Okay, yes, these are this is the background

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Speaker 1: of the Grand painting. Right, So it's obvious that meeting

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Speaker 1: one of these exceptions would be pretty uncommon, right, Meeting

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Speaker 1: all of them would be downright extraordinary, on the level

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Speaker 1: with a superpower. Most people have some sort of Internet presence,

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Speaker 1: whether consensual or non consensual, even if it's only a

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Speaker 1: footprint found in various public records. As Null mentioned, And

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Speaker 1: for this episode, let's call this series of ones and

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Speaker 1: zeros the digital you so here, you are, here, we are,

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Speaker 1: It's the twenty first century, and you, like Walt Whitman,

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Speaker 1: contain multitudes. Several several compelling studies indicate that our online

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Speaker 1: personas often contradict our physical personas in a number of ways.

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Speaker 1: And one great example of this is you know, you'll

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Speaker 1: see studies that say image somebody creates or or exhibits

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Speaker 1: on Instagram or Facebook is a little bit more happy

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Speaker 1: or cool than the image they project in real life.

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Speaker 1: It's like curating your life, you know, and how people

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Speaker 1: perceive you. It's sort of cultivating an image that you

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Speaker 1: see as being the best you, putting your best foot forward,

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Speaker 1: even though we're all sad, sad sacks of waste. M Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can remember specifically my Xbox Persona. For a long time,

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Speaker 1: I was avid into the first person shooters, and I

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Speaker 1: was not very nice. I went through a time where

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Speaker 1: I was not very nice as a kid, playing people's mothers.

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Speaker 1: Oh I so did I talked to so much? I was.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't a troll, but I was intense and very competitive.

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Speaker 1: I could I could see this obviouly enough. Well, I

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Speaker 1: had to. I had it separated so far from the

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Speaker 1: know my walking around persona. It was so different when

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Speaker 1: I got that controller in my hand that I this

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Speaker 1: is so true, and you are like the nicest person Nolan.

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Speaker 1: I know. Yeah, oh yeah, I have a feeling you're

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Speaker 1: exaggerating a bit. I bet if we experienced your online bullying,

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Speaker 1: we'd be like, that is the nicest online Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: what was it was like, pardon me, I couldn't help

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Speaker 1: but point out that your mother uned, you got cuned

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Speaker 1: and your mother is wayward. I would. I would do

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Speaker 1: accents a lot of the time. That was quite a

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Speaker 1: bit of fun to do accents. I really appreciate you

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Speaker 1: playing this out, Matt, because you are right, there is

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Speaker 1: a There is a difference, and this difference can grow

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Speaker 1: over time, so that from some perspectives, people become almost

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Speaker 1: two different versions of themselves. You listening to this right now,

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Speaker 1: you are almost two different people. Perhaps more than that,

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Speaker 1: you might even have online personalities that you strive to

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Speaker 1: keep entirely separate from your physical life, or multiple identities,

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Speaker 1: like our superproducer Tristan McNeill. Sorry I forgot to mention

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Speaker 1: that at the top man Tristan probably has numerous identities.

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Speaker 1: For the sake of anonymity. Yeah right, Yeah, he's nodding

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Speaker 1: has five five or he's waving at us a high five.

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Speaker 1: In today's episode focuses on these identities and their creation

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Speaker 1: and their deletion. Today's episode ask what happens when you

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Speaker 1: want to delete this information? Could you do it? And how?

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Speaker 1: Or more disturbingly, why not. So let's get into the Internet.

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Speaker 1: How many users are there in twenty seventeen of this

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Speaker 1: whold thing called the Worldwide Web and all of its

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Speaker 1: associated stuff. Well, there's an estimated fifty one percent of

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Speaker 1: the world's population that has some kind of access to

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Speaker 1: the Internet, roughly three point eight nine billion human beings.

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Speaker 1: It's begun to become looked at more as like a

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Speaker 1: human right. Yes, and it's considered that in a lot

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Speaker 1: of places, and the United Nations is actively well. Factions

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Speaker 1: in the United Nations are actively pursuing it to be

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Speaker 1: listed as a human right, along with clean water and

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Speaker 1: shelter and food and safety from harm. Remember the Google loon,

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Speaker 1: not the Google loon. It was some kind of loon,

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Speaker 1: but it was an Internet balloon that would be an

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Speaker 1: access point that would go over more rural, hard to

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Speaker 1: reach densely jungled areas and yeah, so I mean like

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Speaker 1: we're coming up with all kinds of wacky inventions to

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Speaker 1: make this possible because we see it as being so important.

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Speaker 1: So it's not even looked at as like a luxury

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Speaker 1: or like a thing for fun. It's allowing you to

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Speaker 1: be connected in a way that is, you know, very important.

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Speaker 1: We're evolving, you guys. Think about it. In only seventeen

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Speaker 1: years since the year or two thousand, we've increased this

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Speaker 1: by so much. Seven percent of the population had access

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Speaker 1: in the year two thousand. I remember the first brand

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Speaker 1: you had that had the Internet and fully understand what

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Speaker 1: it was at first absolutely, Oh can we get a

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Speaker 1: sound clip of that dial up modem? Oh, don't do it, Tristan,

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Speaker 1: don't do it. My brain, Oh, so many different I

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Speaker 1: had a friend who's both mom and dad were like

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Speaker 1: high level surgeons or doctors, and they had Prodigy, which

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Speaker 1: was like an early service provider, and it was all

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Speaker 1: like message boards and stuff in those days. And it

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Speaker 1: wasn't until years later when I was like a teenager,

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Speaker 1: like in middle school, that you could get images and

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Speaker 1: print them out and slowly, Yeah, anticipation building as it

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Speaker 1: goes down. Yes, and Matt to your point, this is

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Speaker 1: this growth is unexpected, unprecedented in many ways. Because you

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Speaker 1: said only seven percent of the population had access in

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Speaker 1: two thousands. Yeah to fifty one seventeen years later. That's crazy.

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Speaker 1: And you know, here's the thing. People have, you know,

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Speaker 1: up until the year two thousand, had a certain expectation

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Speaker 1: of privacy in their lives. What we do. I got

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Speaker 1: shades on my windows for a reason because I don't

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Speaker 1: want you looking in at night when I'm doing whatever

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Speaker 1: it is I'm doing, even if I'm just making a

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Speaker 1: ham sandwich in the nude. Mom perhaps, Hey, I know

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Speaker 1: how you roll. I mean, look, nakey time is a

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Speaker 1: special time. Nay time, nakey time. Yeah, you guys don't

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Speaker 1: have nakey time is in a k e y Yeah,

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Speaker 1: nakey time. You'll have kids one day, Ben oh man,

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Speaker 1: you haven't seen that, Dana Carvey stand up. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: what I was referring to. It's nake time, y'all have

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Speaker 1: seen it. Know what that sound does. Well, it's a

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Speaker 1: healthy thing to have naked baby time in our house

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Speaker 1: where my son gets to run around just in his

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Speaker 1: diaper and just really feel the world against his skin.

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Speaker 1: That's not nake though. If he's wearing the diaper, dude, well,

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Speaker 1: I know, but we come on, he's he would pee everywhere.

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Speaker 1: And in a few decades he's probably going to look

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Speaker 1: back and say, hey, I don't want videos of young

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Speaker 1: me running around being and having naked time time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's there's a strict no photos of videos during nakey

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Speaker 1: time instituted in our house, so according to and he'll

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Speaker 1: thank you later. Because according to a Few Research Center study,

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Speaker 1: ninety three percent of adults today say it's important that

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Speaker 1: they be able to control who can access information about them,

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Speaker 1: and nine percent also say controlling what information is gathered

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Speaker 1: about them is also important. Oh, the illusion of control. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and also we know that in addition to just generic internet, right,

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Speaker 1: one of the biggest avenues of encountering online society or

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Speaker 1: just the online world is social media, sometimes to the

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Speaker 1: exclusion of other Internet points. Like there's some people who

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Speaker 1: live entirely on you know, Facebook or Twitter or something

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Speaker 1: like that. Well, here's the thing. Yeah, like you're saying, Ben,

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Speaker 1: I think social media ends up at least to younger

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Speaker 1: people in the newer generations. It is probably the biggest

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Speaker 1: draw to be connected for anything, because you're not really

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Speaker 1: using it for a lot of utility access that maybe

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Speaker 1: an older adult would do to check on finances or

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Speaker 1: do any of that kind of stuff. You're getting on

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Speaker 1: there so you can connect to your friends. And you know,

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Speaker 1: Facebook is still the largest company in the social media field,

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Speaker 1: however not so much for the younger generation. You get

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Speaker 1: things like What's App. There are a lot of other

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Speaker 1: by the way, What's App owned by Facebook, So great job,

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Speaker 1: because I think that's number two, isn't it. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: believe so at this time. And so for a little perspective.

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Speaker 1: In twenty twelve, Facebook surpassed a billion monthly active users,

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Speaker 1: and earlier this year, this like monolith of social media

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Speaker 1: hit two billion monthly active users and co and like What'sapp,

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Speaker 1: which they own as well as at this to their

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Speaker 1: portfolio is sporting little more than half of that at

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Speaker 1: one point two billion. So even you know, at second place,

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Speaker 1: it's it's you know, pales and comparison to the Facebook numbers,

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Speaker 1: which is insane, especially when we consider if we look

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Speaker 1: at countries by population, if the users of Facebook, now

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Speaker 1: we're a country, they would be the most populous country

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Speaker 1: in the world, and What's App would be number four,

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Speaker 1: so it would be Facebook, China, India, What'sapp and just

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Speaker 1: by a little bit as a number four. I have

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Speaker 1: a little confession, guys, I've never actually seen What'sapp. I

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Speaker 1: have no idea what it looks like. I guess I

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Speaker 1: don't understand the appeal. I was turned onto it because

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Speaker 1: a friend of mine was traveling internationally and apparently it's

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Speaker 1: an easy way to stay in text kind of communication

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Speaker 1: with somebody that's international. And it looks all like just

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Speaker 1: a text chat app. And I think it has video chat.

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Speaker 1: That's great, but it's a really basic thing. It doesn't

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Speaker 1: really have any of the bells and whistles that like

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Speaker 1: a face book has that's a little bit more multifaceted.

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Speaker 1: What's App seems to me to be a little more

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Speaker 1: kind of barebones. It's getting it done, man. That's maybe

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Speaker 1: why it's popular, because it's it does a job, and

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Speaker 1: it does it well. And I know a lot of

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Speaker 1: people even use it professionally in chat groups and stuff.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, let's get on What'sapp. This is not advertisement.

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Speaker 1: And still, whether or not it has bells and whistles,

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Speaker 1: it's doing the most important thing, which is aggregating data

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Speaker 1: about you, y metadata, where you're calling, from, what time

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Speaker 1: you're calling, who is in the conversation with you. Here's

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Speaker 1: the thing about social media. Each social media site overwhelmingly

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Speaker 1: is a privately owned entity. The social media platforms that

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Speaker 1: we most likely use are all privately owned. And unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: if you are like most of us, by which I

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Speaker 1: mean the vast majority of us, you did not read

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Speaker 1: the terms of service before you agreed to have that profile.

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Speaker 1: I definitely scrolled all the way to the bottom of

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Speaker 1: the document before it made you do that. Yeah, don't

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Speaker 1: act like you know the ones that don't make you

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Speaker 1: do that. You definitely don't do that. Yeah, by you,

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Speaker 1: I mean like literally everyone general you. Uh. These terms

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Speaker 1: of service agreements can have some perfidious stuff inside. Obviously

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Speaker 1: if you are listening to stuff, then once you know,

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Speaker 1: you're familiar with it. But we found a great website

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Speaker 1: called terms of Service Didn't Read less dr and it

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Speaker 1: presents in plain language some of the positive and negative

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Speaker 1: aspects of various social media or Internet organizations. So let's

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Speaker 1: let's give let's give everybody a couple of examples. Google.

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Speaker 1: We'll start with the the Goliath, the Giant, the Leviathan.

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Speaker 1: Google itself keeps your searches and other identifiable user information

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Speaker 1: for an indefinite period of time. So at their pleasure, yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: at their at at his man edges these pleasures well.

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Speaker 1: And they can also share that information with other parties

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Speaker 1: like they that's in the terms of service. We can

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Speaker 1: do whatever we want with this information. Yes, and can

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Speaker 1: use all your content for all of their existing and

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Speaker 1: or future services. Now think think about how much you

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Speaker 1: pump into Google services right now, Just imagine personally. Calendar

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Speaker 1: information is in there, email information is in there. I

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Speaker 1: mean YouTube, think about our our YouTube show, and you

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Speaker 1: know all that stuff, all your all your weird searches

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Speaker 1: at three am when you wake up from a strange dream. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know all your What does this animal mean? Why

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Speaker 1: is it wearing socks? They know your Google Drive, anything

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Speaker 1: that you're backing up there, oh boy, tracks you on

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Speaker 1: other websites. And then also there's a YouTube and Google

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Speaker 1: and YouTube have the right idea. It's like giving people

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Speaker 1: all this free stuff, and everyone's really they stoked and

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Speaker 1: grateful at version. It's like Google YouTube, thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for these this free services. But you're giving them

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Speaker 1: something way more valuable in their giving you. I mean,

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Speaker 1: one could argue in terms of like ultimate financial worth.

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Speaker 1: And it's very true. And we've had our own issues

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Speaker 1: with the old YT and you know, some of their

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Speaker 1: terms are a bit strange, and they have it written

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Speaker 1: in the terms that they can change them at any time,

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Speaker 1: and they can also remove your content at any time

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Speaker 1: and they don't have to tell you about it. They

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Speaker 1: can also demonetize your stuff, right I'm telling you. And

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Speaker 1: if you decide to delete a video YouTube doesn't actually

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Speaker 1: delete it. We will get into the surprising gray area

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Speaker 1: of what it means to delete something. Even if they

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Speaker 1: remove it for one reason or another, they still they

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Speaker 1: still have it. They still have it. And you know,

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Speaker 1: not to plug anything on this show. But on this

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Speaker 1: website it shows duck duck go the search engine. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and all it says is no tracking with a little

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Speaker 1: thumbs ups sign duck dot go is a is a

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Speaker 1: good alternative for people who don't want Google searches recorded.

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Speaker 1: Be aware, of course, that your Internet service provider or

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Speaker 1: your ISP will still be tracking what you do, but

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Speaker 1: duck dot go is a good way to get around Google.

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Speaker 1: There was also a thing I haven't visited it in

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Speaker 1: a while called Scrugle scr o O g l E,

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Speaker 1: and it does Google searches without the web scraper, he says.

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Speaker 1: Scrugle dot org is gone forever, says the site owner.

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Speaker 1: Oh well they mustn't. They must have got popped by

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Speaker 1: the man. Facebook tracks you on other websites, automatically shares

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Speaker 1: your data with many other servers, uses your data Shakira

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Speaker 1: style whenever, wherever. And additionally, however, it wants bonus for

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Speaker 1: all you Android app users out there. It can record

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Speaker 1: sound and video from your phone at any time without

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Speaker 1: your consent. I remember when we learned about this. Think

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Speaker 1: about all the times you've been in a stall and

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Speaker 1: a bathroom. It's just listening to you use the restaurant,

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Speaker 1: dropping a hot mixtape. Let's call it that surf and

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Speaker 1: read it on your phone, not to be two crass.

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Speaker 1: And lastly, for examples, Twitter, right, Oh yeah, so Twitter.

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Speaker 1: Let's say you're gonna cancel your account on Twitter. It's

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Speaker 1: gonna keep Twitter in. The service, is gonna keep a

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Speaker 1: lot of that information. It keeps at least the rights

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Speaker 1: to anything you've posted through their service, So it doesn't

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Speaker 1: matter if you've deleted it and it's gone there, maybe

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Speaker 1: they still have it on a server. Maybe they can

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Speaker 1: use it for you know, anything in the future. And additionally,

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Speaker 1: evidence indicates that all social media entities will cooperate with

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Speaker 1: law enforcement for information request. Right at the most basic level,

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Speaker 1: this is a good thing, right theoretically, yeah, However, in

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Speaker 1: practice it's helping intelligence networks take a vacuum cleaner approach

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Speaker 1: to gathering the stuff. So it ultimately does not matter

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Speaker 1: whether you are innocent of any suspected crime, right, because

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Speaker 1: there's this leap frogging. There's this leap frogging system that's

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Speaker 1: in play, and you know, the game Six Degrees of

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Speaker 1: Kevin Bacon or whatever. I don't know enough about celebrities

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Speaker 1: to play it, but this is like a sith version

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Speaker 1: of that. So, for instance, our producer Tristan is an

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Speaker 1: innocent guy. Look just look at that faces understanding. You know,

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Speaker 1: if he knows someone who knows someone who knows someone

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Speaker 1: who's implicated in certain types of crime, right or certain

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Speaker 1: networks of that, then boom, Tristan's info is up for

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Speaker 1: grabs too, and he doesn't He may never even know why,

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Speaker 1: He may have never met um, what's a good what's

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Speaker 1: a good name that sounds like a criminals name. Sam T.

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Speaker 1: Garden he may have never met, They may have never met. Uh,

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Speaker 1: call him Sam the sham, Sam the sham T Garden. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: But now now simply because he is at best tangentially related,

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Speaker 1: his information is now up for grabs. Yeah. So well,

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Speaker 1: we we do know that there have been a lot

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Speaker 1: of historic cases going through the court system of the

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Speaker 1: United States looking at what the you know, what law

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Speaker 1: enforcement can get, how much they can actually ask you

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Speaker 1: to pull out of their website. There's a recent case

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Speaker 1: about UM a group that was anti I think it

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Speaker 1: was an anti Trump website that was organizing a bunch

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Speaker 1: of protests and stuff, and the FBI was looking to

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Speaker 1: get access to pretty much every user that had ever

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Speaker 1: been on that website, anybody who had ever checked it out.

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Speaker 1: And it's going through the court system right now to

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Speaker 1: see constitutionally what can be asked for. So thankfully, the

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Speaker 1: situation may change depending on the time that you are

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Speaker 1: hearing this episode. If so, if you're listening in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and twenty eight or whatever, and we haven't still

412
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Speaker 1: be around, send us an email and ask us for

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Speaker 1: an update if Big Brother allows you to do so,

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Speaker 1: and also what social media is hot right now in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty eight. Yeah, now this episode is a time capsule. Well,

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Speaker 1: we've talked about We've talked about some of these pernicious

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Speaker 1: at times I would argue purposefully misleading terms of service.

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Speaker 1: I've talked about what exists around you or what traces

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Speaker 1: you leave on the Internet, and of course check out

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Speaker 1: our friends part time I'm genius for more in depth. Look,

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Speaker 1: but we haven't yet talked about how to remove this

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Speaker 1: information or attempt to do so. Removing information is unfortunately

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Speaker 1: not a silver bullet kind of scenario. It's a case

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Speaker 1: by case basis. And we'll give you some pointers. After

425
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor, and we're back to quote

426
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,240
Speaker 1: Mac with no delay. Yes, I don't know why I

427
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 1: love that so much. I don't know why you said it.

428
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,680
Speaker 1: One time you said one time you said we're back

429
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 1: with no delay, and the way you said it that

430
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 1: just made me happy in my heart. Well, i'm talking

431
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: about audio plug ins. Obviously, maybe we need a little delay. Yeah,

432
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:55,400
Speaker 1: can we get a rent? Are you taking away? That's awesome? Yes,

433
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: I think we should. I think we should keep that

434
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,800
Speaker 1: in our back pockets, for one thing, get a little dull.

435
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 1: You know, this is something I'm happy with the Internet

436
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 1: knowing about me that I'm a fan of these sorts

437
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:07,600
Speaker 1: of effects. Yeah, we just want to punch it up

438
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:12,199
Speaker 1: a little bit, you know. So how can you get

439
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:17,880
Speaker 1: rid of your Internet presence? That's where we're at right now. Right,

440
00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 1: So we went through and kind of compiled some recommended

441
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 1: steps for removing your various social media accounts. We'll start

442
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 1: there and then we'll get a little more granular as

443
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,520
Speaker 1: we go on. But this these all came from the

444
00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:37,399
Speaker 1: various help centers of these different social media sites. So

445
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: here we go. Facebook says that if you don't think

446
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:44,080
Speaker 1: you'll ever use Facebook again, you can request to have

447
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 1: your account permanently deleted. You hear that you can request

448
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: request to the language is everything also deleted? Yeah? And

449
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: help more like help. So it says here, I'm going

450
00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: back to the quote. Please keep in mind that you

451
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 1: won't be able to reactivate your account or retrieve anything

452
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 1: that you've added. But before you do this, you may

453
00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: want to download a copy of your info from Facebook. Then,

454
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 1: if you'd like your account permanently deleted with no option

455
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: for recovery. You can log into your account and let

456
00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 1: us know. Yeah, exactly, let Facebook. Wait there's more, Yeah,

457
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:25,200
Speaker 1: there's more. So when you delete your account, UM, folks

458
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 1: won't be able to see it on their respective Facebook. Ye.

459
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,040
Speaker 1: You're a phrasing here, But it doesn't necessarily go away.

460
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 1: It's just kind of hidden, ye, hidden from other users. Uh.

461
00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:41,520
Speaker 1: And it may take up to again from the from

462
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: the article here, ninety days from the beginning of the

463
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 1: deletion process to delete all of the things you've posted,

464
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: like your photos, status updates, any data that's stored in

465
00:28:53,360 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 1: Facebook's UM surely absurdly gigantic backup systems. And while you're

466
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 1: deleting this information, it is inaccessible to other people using Facebook. Again,

467
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 1: more of a hiding feature than an actual deletion. So

468
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 1: some of the things you do on Facebook aren't actually

469
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: stored on your account. And now this is true. You

470
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 1: can think about this in terms of like messenger, Facebook

471
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: messages or even I would be interested to double check this,

472
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: but I would imagine if you delete your account, do

473
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 1: comments you've made on other threads and other people's pages

474
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 1: disappear or does it just like it still lives there,

475
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: but your picture maybe goes away or something like that.

476
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: I honestly don't know, but I think your comments would

477
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 1: probably go away and then they go away. Okay, well

478
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 1: that'd be cool. I think you own your comments because

479
00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 1: you're able to go through an individually delete them. That's true,

480
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,840
Speaker 1: and you can also set them to you can. Now

481
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: you can't really set comments to be private. Yeah, I

482
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: don't know about that, but I do know when you

483
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: send a message to somebody else, it's received by the

484
00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 1: other person and it's in their inbox. It's kind of

485
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 1: like entangled information has two owners, which is why, um,

486
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 1: I don't know. Also, Facebook is I don't want to

487
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 1: derail us, but Facebook is tremendously manipulative, like when you

488
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:17,640
Speaker 1: try to mess with your privacy stuff, your quote unquote privacy.

489
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: It has a dinosaur as icon, and then the way

490
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 1: the it steers people with the parameters of what you

491
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:30,480
Speaker 1: can and cannot say. So if you try to remove

492
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: a tag the choices you're given, or you know this

493
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 1: is offensive or it's mislead blah blah blah, you know

494
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 1: you can't. There's no option to say just remove it.

495
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:44,880
Speaker 1: That's called other. Is there still another I don't know.

496
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 1: I don't. I think No. In several cases they took

497
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 1: away other really yeah, I thought other yea God always

498
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:52,840
Speaker 1: have another would align to let you, but that that

499
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 1: it would be a manipulative tactic though, to like, these

500
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: are your choices, and your choices are only these. It's not.

501
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:01,560
Speaker 1: It's not wood it's a hypos is there. This bis

502
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:05,320
Speaker 1: pretty interesting though, because, as we know, because of I

503
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 1: guess largely laziness, you connect to other apps using your Facebook.

504
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:11,959
Speaker 1: It gives you that lovely little option where it's like, hey,

505
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:14,840
Speaker 1: you don't want to make an account, just give us

506
00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 1: access to your Facebook information. Yeah, because those those social

507
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:21,520
Speaker 1: medias or apps are paying Facebook to do that so

508
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:24,400
Speaker 1: that they gather they have all that other information attached

509
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 1: to Facebook within their system. Yeah. But if you delete

510
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 1: your Facebook account and then you accidentally log into one

511
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: of these Facebook connected accounts like Instagram or Spotify or

512
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 1: Twitter or any number. I mean like I did a

513
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 1: sock membership box thing today and it allowed me to

514
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 1: connect to it via Facebook. So ye, it goes pretty deep.

515
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:49,680
Speaker 1: If you do this, though, it will log you back

516
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 1: into your Facebook account and the deactivation slash deletion process

517
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 1: starts all over again. I love the use of the

518
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:01,440
Speaker 1: term deactivation. They don't even call it delete, it's deactivation.

519
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,240
Speaker 1: And it reminds me of like I watched Blade Runner

520
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: last night or the first time in years, and instead

521
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 1: of murdering replicants, they retire. Yeah you geez. And Instagrams

522
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,600
Speaker 1: know better. If you go to the delete your account page,

523
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: if you're not logged in, they'll last you log in.

524
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,239
Speaker 1: You have to go on your desktop. You can't. You

525
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 1: can't do it from the app. And also, which is weird,

526
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 1: because you can't really use Instagram on the desktop exactly.

527
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: How strange is that? And I can only imagine that

528
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 1: there are a lot of people out there who don't

529
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,280
Speaker 1: even really have a desktop system anymore set up anywhere

530
00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: in their house. You have to Yeah, you have to

531
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,360
Speaker 1: select a option from a drop down menu, so and

532
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 1: re enter your password. So the option to delete the

533
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 1: account only appears after you've selected a reason when you

534
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 1: delete the account. This is at least explicit. When you

535
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 1: delete your account, your prof file, photos, videos, comments, likes,

536
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: and followers are permanently removed. And then, just like Facebook,

537
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 1: you can temporarily disable your account. But I'm gonna go

538
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: ahead and say I don't trust it. Yeah, oh man.

539
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 1: And then we get to one of my absolute favorite

540
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 1: pseudo social media's LinkedIn. Do you guys still have them?

541
00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:24,320
Speaker 1: LinkedIn accounts? Professional LinkedIn accounts? I mean, I don't even

542
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:28,520
Speaker 1: know what did do with it. I deleted mine earlier today.

543
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 1: Liberating it was awesome. I mean, you sorry, LinkedIn, but

544
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 1: you've sent away too much email. Okay, so you can

545
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 1: close your account directly from this one page. Here's the thing.

546
00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 1: You won't have access to any of your you know,

547
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:46,960
Speaker 1: any of the information you've collected or people you've connected

548
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 1: to your profile will no longer be invisible on LinkedIn. However,

549
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 1: search engines, we're talking things Yahoo's and probably Googles, they

550
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 1: might still display your information temporarily, because you're talking about

551
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 1: information that's cashed, that's just sitting there, and you can

552
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,880
Speaker 1: find it still through search results. And the one thing

553
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 1: with LinkedIn, though apparently people pay for premium memberships, which

554
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:12,279
Speaker 1: i is something I've never done. But if you do that,

555
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 1: you have to change up your premium account license and

556
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:19,479
Speaker 1: resolve that whole thing before actually closing your account, which

557
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,320
Speaker 1: makes sense because it's probably there's probably a payment involved.

558
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 1: Who knows you have to wait. You have to do

559
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:30,800
Speaker 1: what you have to resolve the accounts or like your

560
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 1: your pay your pay for LinkedIn accounts before you can

561
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 1: close your basic account. That's the idea. Pretty soon, it's

562
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,759
Speaker 1: simple overall. Here's the thing, guys. Did you have my

563
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 1: Space accounts when you were younger? Did I? Ever? Yeah?

564
00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 1: I had like the flickering gift background all day, the

565
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:55,320
Speaker 1: MIDI track that would trigger. Yeah. And you have probably

566
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,400
Speaker 1: had my Space band accounts too, or some kind of

567
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,360
Speaker 1: music accounts that my old band, Uh, my Space is

568
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:02,040
Speaker 1: actually still that everyone's check it out. It's a band

569
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 1: called the Cubists. Nice and our MySpace still stills in

570
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: around Hey mine, two Lions and Scissors. Check it out.

571
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 1: But anyway, getting away from the plugs, I wanted to

572
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 1: delete my personal MySpace account, so I tried to go

573
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 1: and do that today and found out that it was

574
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 1: linked up to my old AOL email address that I

575
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 1: I got that email address in nineteen ninety seven in

576
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 1: my parents' basement. It was awesome for a time. It

577
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:32,839
Speaker 1: really got got me through everything. Anyway, I got you

578
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,479
Speaker 1: through everything? Yeah, it really did. Every email I sent

579
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 1: for years was through AOL. You probably loaded it with

580
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:39,919
Speaker 1: like one of those floppies that came in them. I

581
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: did you multiple times, right, they gave you the free

582
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 1: upgraded every time every point oo change. So what happened?

583
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:50,879
Speaker 1: What's happening with your AOL account now? Okay, so check

584
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 1: it out. In order to delete the MySpace, go to AOL.

585
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: In order to get to AOL, I had to change

586
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: my password I logged in. Apparently, if you don't access

587
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: in AOL account for one hundred and eighty days, they

588
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: deactivate that thing NOL. Yeah, that's kind of nice, right,

589
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 1: deactivate your account if you're not using it. But I

590
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,400
Speaker 1: was really nervous because my personal information is still in

591
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:14,720
Speaker 1: that thing from all those years ago, and if anyone

592
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,719
Speaker 1: wanted to hack it or easily get into it, it's there.

593
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,359
Speaker 1: It's just sitting there. So I tried to delete that.

594
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 1: I was just on a spree today. Anyway, you can't

595
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 1: delete your AOL account, your free AOL account, at least

596
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:30,000
Speaker 1: I could not. There's supposed to be a place that

597
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: says cancel account, and that button was not there on

598
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 1: three different browsers. Well, and you're a tech savvy guy too,

599
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:41,280
Speaker 1: so I mean, can you imagine someone that maybe was less. Yeah,

600
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,399
Speaker 1: even attempting to do any of this stuff. I went

601
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:46,879
Speaker 1: through every help center thing that existed on AOL trying

602
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 1: to find it. Ended up calling AOL. I took my

603
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 1: phone and I called AOL and talked to somebody who

604
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 1: walked me through all the security steps and he said

605
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,239
Speaker 1: he deleted my account. Sorry, you called AOL? Does their

606
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 1: phone number still work? Their phone number works for customer service?

607
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:03,360
Speaker 1: Was it just some guy? Like four guys in a

608
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 1: call center and who knows? Was it just one guy

609
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,600
Speaker 1: at his house? I have to say they picked up

610
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 1: my call really fast because they didn't have anything else

611
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 1: to do. Well, you know, I who's to say how

612
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:15,880
Speaker 1: many people are working there and how many you know

613
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:17,919
Speaker 1: what their call volume is? Probably that guy you could

614
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:21,480
Speaker 1: have asked him, well, well it worked for me. So

615
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:23,480
Speaker 1: if you're out there and you've got an AOL account

616
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 1: from nineteen ninety seven, you want to get rid of it,

617
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 1: you can. There's a website you can go to and

618
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: you can find their their number, it's one eight hundred

619
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 1: eight two seven six three sixty four. You could do

620
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 1: it right now if you want to do it. And

621
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:40,439
Speaker 1: Steve really wants a friend to talk to you. Yeah,

622
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,600
Speaker 1: just give him a call and uh yeah, not Steve

623
00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 1: the not Steve our ongoing in sa intern is Steve

624
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:52,439
Speaker 1: the AOL tech support Yeah, yeah, we're pretty Steve rich here.

625
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 1: It's stuff they don't want. You didn't know. I want

626
00:37:54,040 --> 00:38:01,480
Speaker 1: to say. His name is Rico, So okay, So just

627
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,759
Speaker 1: just call that number, ask for Rico or Steve. Yeah. Yeah,

628
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 1: tell them Matt sent you. They'll know, right, You've got

629
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:11,360
Speaker 1: to be the only Matt they called it in a while. Yeah.

630
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 1: There's another thing that's should be an episode all its

631
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:18,160
Speaker 1: own that we may have to explore in the future,

632
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:21,200
Speaker 1: and that is Google's Oh my god, there is a

633
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:26,000
Speaker 1: search console help site. But it gets very complicated, very quickly.

634
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:30,839
Speaker 1: Google has its hooks in you, all up inside your

635
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,959
Speaker 1: digital you. Oh yeah, that's the thing. It's all about

636
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:37,320
Speaker 1: indexing because Google everything that gets posted everywhere, it indexes,

637
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:41,240
Speaker 1: and you can go and ask Google to remove stuff

638
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 1: and take it out of search results. But ultimately you're

639
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:47,520
Speaker 1: talking about websites that are being hosted. Like let's say

640
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:50,400
Speaker 1: there's a news article written about you that you object to.

641
00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 1: There's really no way to get Google to do anything.

642
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:56,239
Speaker 1: You got to go to the people who posted the thing.

643
00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 1: Now you just say, hey, Google, delete my Internet presence

644
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:04,320
Speaker 1: right one day? That might be a thing, but probably

645
00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:06,800
Speaker 1: wasn't that the voice command for the stupid Google glass

646
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:11,240
Speaker 1: You had to say, hey, hey, glassy Google. Yes, but

647
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:16,800
Speaker 1: probably if that command ever exists, as you're saying, that's

648
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:20,800
Speaker 1: going to be the domain of a very small group

649
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 1: of people. Oh sure, ability of you know, very high

650
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:30,160
Speaker 1: level execs or maybe bankers like Rothchild level stuff. Because

651
00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 1: privacy is going to be one of the ultimate luxuries,

652
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: as we've explored in past episodes. So we're talking about

653
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 1: we've given some examples about how you can attempt to

654
00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: remove some of this information from search engines, from social media.

655
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:52,759
Speaker 1: This leads to perhaps the most important query, the most

656
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:56,360
Speaker 1: important question here, the most important interrogative. I'm just thinking

657
00:39:56,360 --> 00:40:02,959
Speaker 1: of sending the billion and Ben bucks ask, Okay, does

658
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: any of this actually work? We'll answer that question after

659
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:16,720
Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor. Here's where it gets crazy. So, Ben,

660
00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 1: it looks like I'm going to delete my Internet history. Right. No, no, no,

661
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: you fool a penguin, You silly boy. It's not gonna happen.

662
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:38,120
Speaker 1: You've gotten too far. Right. At this point, there is

663
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:42,200
Speaker 1: virtually no chance that you, Matt, will be able to

664
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,640
Speaker 1: completely erase all of your data from the Internet, and

665
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:48,000
Speaker 1: don't take out hard There's no chance that I would

666
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:49,840
Speaker 1: be able to, or Noel would be able to, or

667
00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:52,400
Speaker 1: Tristan would be able to. Even if it seems that

668
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,800
Speaker 1: we have deleted information from a particular part of the Internet,

669
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: the owners of that site or that organization might have

670
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:03,319
Speaker 1: just change the access to the info. So for most

671
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,919
Speaker 1: of us, right deletion or a rasuer means just that

672
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:11,719
Speaker 1: they complete irreversible removal of a given thing. Ah Yet

673
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 1: we know from our recycling bins on our computers that

674
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 1: when you delete something, it just goes somewhere else temporarily.

675
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:22,880
Speaker 1: And then you know, there are programs that are specifically

676
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:26,800
Speaker 1: designed to like write ones and zeros over that data.

677
00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 1: But when you just do a right click delete empty

678
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 1: recycled bin, it just kind of scatters the little fragments

679
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:34,480
Speaker 1: of it all over. That's why I think Apple machines

680
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 1: do it automatically. But you know with PCs you have

681
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 1: to defragment your hard drive down then because it literally

682
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:44,200
Speaker 1: has bits of data just kind of strewn willy nilly.

683
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 1: Maybe in any computer scientists out there. Call me a

684
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 1: dummy if I'm not saying it right, but that's my

685
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 1: understanding of it. And then you get into data recovery stuff,

686
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:54,920
Speaker 1: which it is possible to go back in time on

687
00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 1: that hard drive. Data forensics. Yeah, it's dark art. Yeah.

688
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 1: As shown in some of our earlier examples, the actions

689
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:09,200
Speaker 1: that private entities allow us to take don't actually delete information. Instead,

690
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 1: they make it so that you can no longer see

691
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: your info and other people might not be able to

692
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:18,440
Speaker 1: see it as easily. The illusion of control, the illusion

693
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 1: of controls. Once you've accepted those terms, you're kind of

694
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:26,160
Speaker 1: accepting them in perpetuity, aren't you. Yeah, you're up the creek.

695
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 1: I mean it's done. So whatever whatever they choose to

696
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:32,480
Speaker 1: do with that stuff, you know, you put faith in

697
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:35,400
Speaker 1: them not doing anything nefarious. But you're taking a bit

698
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 1: of a leap there, if we're being honest. But yeah,

699
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 1: I mean you're kind of kidding yourself and thinking that

700
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,080
Speaker 1: information is just vanished and that you're the one who

701
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:45,080
Speaker 1: decided to make that happen. You know what it is?

702
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:48,440
Speaker 1: Every time you delete a part of your digital self

703
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 1: and angel gets its wings, you're not actually killing well,

704
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 1: maybe gets his pizza. Yes, for sure that one. But

705
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:59,360
Speaker 1: you're not actually deleting anything or killing anything. You're just

706
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,720
Speaker 1: making a ghost because you're that ghost is then able

707
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: to go through you know, some kind of data aggregation

708
00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 1: thing through whatever service you were using, and then they're

709
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:13,719
Speaker 1: taking it and creating a new version of you. But

710
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:16,440
Speaker 1: it's just a couple more ones and zeros, right, and

711
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:20,040
Speaker 1: this the remains of your digital self. I like this

712
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:24,840
Speaker 1: ghost analogy, Matt, your ethereal digital self will be used

713
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 1: for various purposes, targeting for ad campaigns. Right. Then they

714
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 1: may not know Matt Frederick anymore, but they certainly know

715
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:39,080
Speaker 1: American male twenty five to thirty six or something like that.

716
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: And then they know and then that is the new

717
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:46,879
Speaker 1: label for your ghosts. They also learned social networks and preferences.

718
00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:50,040
Speaker 1: We don't need to know, Like if we all just

719
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: become American male, agx to why or whatever, and we're

720
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:56,840
Speaker 1: all connected with a social network, they don't need to

721
00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:00,560
Speaker 1: know our names to influence that social network. This can

722
00:44:00,640 --> 00:44:05,320
Speaker 1: also go into aggregate electoral data right or election data right.

723
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:08,200
Speaker 1: This makes it dangerous in the real world because it

724
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 1: ties into public sphere influence and we have a great

725
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 1: example of that in recent history, right, like the whole

726
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:22,480
Speaker 1: Russia Facebook thing. Yeah, where Russia created these profile or

727
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:27,799
Speaker 1: Russian hackers. How many caveats we have to I'll play

728
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:34,640
Speaker 1: the game. Allegedly, Russian affiliated hackers went into Facebook and

729
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:41,200
Speaker 1: created bought personas, and bought or false front organizations to

730
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:48,000
Speaker 1: plant news stories and sway people's political decisions. Additionally, as

731
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:51,160
Speaker 1: I think we already mentioned here, in many cases, information

732
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:54,320
Speaker 1: we share with other people will remain after we attempted

733
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:58,840
Speaker 1: to delete everything else. If if Noel has a picture

734
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:01,720
Speaker 1: of me and it's under his profile and I delete

735
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 1: my profile, it's not going to remove that photo of me.

736
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,640
Speaker 1: It'll remove the tag. It'll maybe remove Yeah, it'll remove

737
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:12,919
Speaker 1: the tag, but you know, we'll see still see my mug. Yeah,

738
00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:15,719
Speaker 1: he was doing the clown face again in a celebration

739
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:18,360
Speaker 1: of it. Did you notice that, right, or as I

740
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:21,200
Speaker 1: like to call it, the Eddie Vedder face. Oh okay,

741
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:25,040
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you about the one. One great example

742
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 1: of this. In the past, celebrities have tasked their PR

743
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:32,600
Speaker 1: teams with removing unflattering photos from the Internet. This rarely

744
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 1: meets with success. One example I remember is there was

745
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:42,440
Speaker 1: an unflattering picture of Beyonce Knowles, uh, the R and

746
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:48,359
Speaker 1: B singer entertainer. Yeah, okay, sure, and this, uh, this

747
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 1: picture was funny and it became part of what people

748
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,880
Speaker 1: call photoshop battles, and they were changing the background and

749
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:55,640
Speaker 1: they were making funny It was a mean, it's kind

750
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 1: of like in a in a mid squat in like

751
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:00,839
Speaker 1: a like a dance move that obviously if you saw

752
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:03,799
Speaker 1: the whole thing in context, it'd be super badass, but

753
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:08,399
Speaker 1: it's one of those like mid face squat things where

754
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 1: it's just just the right moment to make a very

755
00:46:10,680 --> 00:46:16,880
Speaker 1: obviously gorgeous woman appear kind of smanish, kind of she

756
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:19,680
Speaker 1: hulk a little. Well, they actually that was one of

757
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 1: the photoshop ones. They turned her skin green and she

758
00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:24,120
Speaker 1: looks like she's just like, you know, hulking out literally.

759
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 1: But yeah, and then her people took issue with this

760
00:46:28,160 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 1: and attempted to have it scrubbed from the internet, but

761
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,760
Speaker 1: as we know, that's a little harder than it sounds.

762
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:37,760
Speaker 1: The worst thing you can tell people who are spending

763
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:41,360
Speaker 1: their free time on the internet making jokes is, hey, guys,

764
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:44,720
Speaker 1: please don't make a joke about this. Our president actually

765
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:47,879
Speaker 1: did that where there were some unflattering photos of him

766
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 1: that he did not want to be making the rounds,

767
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:56,320
Speaker 1: and you know, the Internet collectively laughed at him. Yeah,

768
00:46:56,360 --> 00:47:01,960
Speaker 1: and rightly so I think if you, I think, unfortunately,

769
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: if anybody is out of touch enough to ask for

770
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:12,080
Speaker 1: that deletion without the power to enforce it, I wonder

771
00:47:12,080 --> 00:47:14,799
Speaker 1: if the executive branch would have the power to enforce it.

772
00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:18,600
Speaker 1: In other countries, governments do have the power to prevent

773
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 1: images from being outside of you know, being out in

774
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:27,400
Speaker 1: the public sphere, but those countries have a different manner

775
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 1: of control over information dissemination. I do want to say

776
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,720
Speaker 1: before we go on, there is one the only example

777
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 1: I can think of someone who is able to keep

778
00:47:37,560 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 1: a lot of their pictures off the Internet. Gary Larson,

779
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 1: the creator of Farside. You can still find a bunch,

780
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:49,320
Speaker 1: but he wrote this really nice letter to people where

781
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:51,360
Speaker 1: he said, hey, guys, I just kind of want to

782
00:47:51,440 --> 00:47:53,520
Speaker 1: keep it in the books if that's okay. And he's

783
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:57,680
Speaker 1: super humble, super funny, of course, is Gary Larson. You

784
00:47:57,719 --> 00:48:00,759
Speaker 1: can still see a lot of it on there, you know,

785
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,960
Speaker 1: just where someone has obviously taken picture of a of

786
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 1: a comic with their cell phone or something. But that's

787
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 1: the only even partially successful version. There's one more wacky

788
00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:22,200
Speaker 1: neighbor type character we haven't covered in the ongoing sitcom

789
00:48:22,280 --> 00:48:26,000
Speaker 1: known as Your Digital Self on the Internet. That is

790
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 1: the government. Oh it's that wacky NSA, the National Security Agency.

791
00:48:33,560 --> 00:48:36,359
Speaker 1: What are they getting up to this week? Well, it's

792
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,680
Speaker 1: formerly a secret government agency we'd like to talk about

793
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:41,959
Speaker 1: on this show. We even have an intern from there

794
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 1: that hangs out with us and listens to every little

795
00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:46,440
Speaker 1: thing we do. Big up, Steve, you'll get through that

796
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:52,600
Speaker 1: chemistry class. They collect data signal intelligence. Oh that sounds good.

797
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 1: It's very very good. Here's the thing. They're great at

798
00:48:56,719 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 1: it so great, they're the best in the biz. It's

799
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:02,640
Speaker 1: all so really good at find those loopholes ways around

800
00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: original mandates. Oh and all of this is in the

801
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:11,920
Speaker 1: name of national security. So longtime fans of the show

802
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 1: and privacy advocates around the world, you guys are hopefully

803
00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:19,600
Speaker 1: aware of the NSA's official stance, which is the NSA's

804
00:49:19,719 --> 00:49:23,440
Speaker 1: charter limits its powerful surveillance to the rest of the world,

805
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:28,640
Speaker 1: not to US citizens. Okay, I think we're done with

806
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 1: that bit. Okay, but by now most people are at

807
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:37,680
Speaker 1: least you know somewhat aware that the NSA's legal abilities

808
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:42,400
Speaker 1: and real world actions not entirely syncd up. So a

809
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 1: good example would be that up until twenty seventeen, the

810
00:49:44,800 --> 00:49:50,880
Speaker 1: NSA was essentially able to surveil domestic sources with a

811
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 1: kind of sketchy interpretation of the seven O two provision

812
00:49:54,719 --> 00:49:57,880
Speaker 1: of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. You may know it

813
00:49:57,960 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 1: as FICOP. We love the acronyms here on stuff they

814
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 1: don't want you to know. They searched their massive network

815
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:09,799
Speaker 1: of wire taps for keywords, which they called selectors, and

816
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 1: if any part of that communication passed outside of the

817
00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 1: US for any reason whatsoever, boom, they suck the data

818
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:21,120
Speaker 1: up into the what like their Internet data rabbit hole

819
00:50:21,239 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 1: out in the middle of nowhere in Utah, Ah. That's

820
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 1: where that lives. And any reason here literally means any reason.

821
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 1: So you made a lame terrorist joke and it passed

822
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:35,320
Speaker 1: through a server in any other country counting Canada, boom,

823
00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:37,839
Speaker 1: You're up for grabs. And no, it does not matter.

824
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 1: We checked. It does not matter if it was you

825
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:45,399
Speaker 1: and another American working on puns or whatever, or trying

826
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:48,480
Speaker 1: to make funny acronyms The good news is that, as

827
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:50,880
Speaker 1: of twenty seventeen, the New York Times reports that the

828
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:55,440
Speaker 1: agency will no longer collect certain Internet communications that merely

829
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 1: mention a foreign intelligence target, and will instead limit such

830
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:03,640
Speaker 1: collection internet communications they're sent directly to or from a

831
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:08,719
Speaker 1: foreign target. That's disturbing because that means before then, if

832
00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:15,399
Speaker 1: Matt had sent a text about Osama bin Laden, that's

833
00:51:15,440 --> 00:51:18,680
Speaker 1: the target. I'm mentioning a target for the sake of argument, right,

834
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:21,640
Speaker 1: And it was to one of his friends who was

835
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:25,720
Speaker 1: in say, let's say Ben Bolin, and we were discussing

836
00:51:25,719 --> 00:51:29,399
Speaker 1: an episode on said bin Laden. Yeah, yeah, I was like, well,

837
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:33,000
Speaker 1: when I get back from the ancestral home in Romania

838
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:36,520
Speaker 1: and then we'll do an episode on isis or something.

839
00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:39,680
Speaker 1: That would mean that everything on those phones is now

840
00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:45,640
Speaker 1: subject to search for time immemorial. There's another wrinkle in

841
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:50,480
Speaker 1: the plot here. So the NSA can't gather information on

842
00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:54,880
Speaker 1: you if you are if you live in the US. However,

843
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:59,399
Speaker 1: foreign intelligence agencies can gather that information on you and

844
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:02,640
Speaker 1: then through a network like five Eyes, share it with

845
00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:06,240
Speaker 1: the NSA. So the NSA can be like, oh, no,

846
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:09,400
Speaker 1: no harm, no foul, not checking up on you. But Canada.

847
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:13,920
Speaker 1: However over there, he sorry, yeah, it's dodgy. Reminds me

848
00:52:14,000 --> 00:52:16,839
Speaker 1: of do you guys remember those the controversy over made

849
00:52:16,840 --> 00:52:20,600
Speaker 1: in America tags where it turned out that some stuff

850
00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:27,359
Speaker 1: was being made in the atrocious sweatshop conditions in some

851
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:31,960
Speaker 1: islands in the South Pacific. That we're American territories, so

852
00:52:32,000 --> 00:52:35,400
Speaker 1: they can still say made in America or assembled in

853
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:39,920
Speaker 1: the USA. So there is more good news. However, once

854
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:43,720
Speaker 1: the NSA ends its bolt collection and storage of millions

855
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:46,800
Speaker 1: of Americans phone records later this year, it will also,

856
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:51,640
Speaker 1: it says, eliminate analyst access to five years worth of

857
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:56,800
Speaker 1: old info. So anything you did dodgy in the last

858
00:52:56,840 --> 00:52:59,879
Speaker 1: five years, apparently the NSA is not going to allow

859
00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:04,399
Speaker 1: it's analyst to look at it. That's nice. Yeah, yeah,

860
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:08,160
Speaker 1: it is. However, technical personnel and that's in quotes. We'll

861
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 1: be able to access it for another three months to

862
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:15,120
Speaker 1: verify the records produced under the new system. Yeah, okay,

863
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:18,600
Speaker 1: it seems above board. They're just going to verify all

864
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 1: the stuff is right as rain, right, it's it's meeting

865
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:25,880
Speaker 1: the new goals. Also, ongoing court cases surrounding the program

866
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:28,480
Speaker 1: require the NSA to hold onto the data until the

867
00:53:28,560 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: cases are finalized in court. Okay, I yeah, that seems fine.

868
00:53:35,160 --> 00:53:38,640
Speaker 1: I'm okay. Well, all above the board, right above the breadbox.

869
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:45,480
Speaker 1: So this is just a brief overview of what happens

870
00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 1: when you try to remove your information. And we we

871
00:53:51,320 --> 00:53:54,240
Speaker 1: have a couple of conclusions, and I guess the first

872
00:53:54,239 --> 00:53:56,560
Speaker 1: one I don't know. Are you guys rip the band

873
00:53:56,560 --> 00:54:00,640
Speaker 1: aid off people or slowly appeal it got a rip? Man?

874
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:05,480
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I can tell you the conclusion. Okay,

875
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:08,160
Speaker 1: you don't even need to try and delete your information.

876
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:11,360
Speaker 1: If it's gone up online. It's up online. If somebody,

877
00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 1: if one of your friends has a camera phone and

878
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:15,719
Speaker 1: a Facebook account, there's probably pictures of you, and you

879
00:54:15,760 --> 00:54:17,880
Speaker 1: probably got tagged, even if you don't have an account,

880
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:20,399
Speaker 1: and there's nothing you can do about it, and your

881
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:23,880
Speaker 1: public records are probably going to stay online. That's the

882
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: scariest thing there's Unless you're the wheel of a powerful

883
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:32,000
Speaker 1: intelligence agency or some organization that we don't know about,

884
00:54:32,040 --> 00:54:35,520
Speaker 1: with abilities that we don't understand, there's virtually no way

885
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:38,480
Speaker 1: you'll be able to delete your online presence entirely. The

886
00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:42,239
Speaker 1: digital you will not only survive your efforts to delete it.

887
00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:45,960
Speaker 1: Your digital you will most likely survive after the physical

888
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:48,919
Speaker 1: version of you is gone, and like a ghost, gotta

889
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 1: have a legacy haunt it. Yeah, it's a very black mirror, right,

890
00:54:53,920 --> 00:54:56,560
Speaker 1: and it will probably remain after your children are gone

891
00:54:56,680 --> 00:54:59,200
Speaker 1: as well. You know, in the near future you may

892
00:54:59,239 --> 00:55:04,880
Speaker 1: beat their be some way to construct a real ghost

893
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:10,439
Speaker 1: capable of programmatic responses, and so your children might even

894
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:12,920
Speaker 1: be able to talk to you, or talk to some

895
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:17,839
Speaker 1: version of you. You can, however, delete at least some

896
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:20,920
Speaker 1: of your data and make more of it increasingly difficult

897
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: to find, so much so that only the very committed

898
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:26,120
Speaker 1: or connected people will be able to learn more than

899
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:29,799
Speaker 1: the most basic facts about you. Privacy settings are your

900
00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 1: friend on everything you use. I just have to say

901
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:34,560
Speaker 1: that if you want to still use social media and

902
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:37,600
Speaker 1: connect to friends, just amp up those privacy settings so

903
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:40,160
Speaker 1: you're only talking to people you have directly connected to

904
00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:44,560
Speaker 1: and purposefully said okay, I know this person. Even then,

905
00:55:44,560 --> 00:55:47,040
Speaker 1: it's a little dangerous because accounts can get hijacked and

906
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 1: all that, and then they have your info, but you know,

907
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:52,759
Speaker 1: play as safe as you can. You can also use

908
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:58,200
Speaker 1: private services to help clean up your online presence. We

909
00:55:58,280 --> 00:56:02,200
Speaker 1: strongly suggest you research the thoroughly before choosing one, and

910
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:04,759
Speaker 1: also understand that they do not have the power to

911
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:08,600
Speaker 1: force other website owners to remove anything, especially when those

912
00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:12,600
Speaker 1: sites are in countries with relaxed rules on consumer protection.

913
00:56:13,080 --> 00:56:16,240
Speaker 1: Very great point. And if you're really feeling strongly about

914
00:56:16,719 --> 00:56:20,400
Speaker 1: you know, pursuing further levels of anonimity or you know,

915
00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:27,160
Speaker 1: completely shutting off the information spigot altogether, you're really going

916
00:56:27,200 --> 00:56:30,319
Speaker 1: to have to change your lifestyle. You know. It's like

917
00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:33,280
Speaker 1: what they say about losing weight and all that stuff.

918
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:35,279
Speaker 1: You can't just there's no magic way to do it.

919
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 1: You got to just change your habits. That's right, every day.

920
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:40,400
Speaker 1: And if you want to learn more about that stuff,

921
00:56:40,680 --> 00:56:43,120
Speaker 1: you can check out an earlier episode we did on

922
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:46,400
Speaker 1: whether or not it's actually possible to be on the

923
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:49,000
Speaker 1: Internet in any kind of anonymous way. And what does

924
00:56:49,000 --> 00:56:51,120
Speaker 1: that lifestyle look like, guys? I mean, like it would

925
00:56:51,120 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 1: just it would kind of be like not leaving your apartment. No,

926
00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:58,200
Speaker 1: you just won't. You don't have a cell phone, starters,

927
00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 1: you don't let people take picture of you, don't hang

928
00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:03,719
Speaker 1: out with friends, don't participate in it with any you know.

929
00:57:03,880 --> 00:57:07,360
Speaker 1: I mean there's a lot here, I guess be a hermit,

930
00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:12,839
Speaker 1: only take jobs at paying cash, which means that you

931
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:15,520
Speaker 1: would also be on the fringes of I'm saying you'd

932
00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:17,360
Speaker 1: be like a pariah kind of. I mean, this is

933
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:20,800
Speaker 1: like the lowest of the low. Our society has evolved

934
00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 1: into a place where you have to have this technology,

935
00:57:24,080 --> 00:57:25,600
Speaker 1: you have to participate in this stuff. I mean, I

936
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 1: have a friend who has chosen to not be on Facebook,

937
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,520
Speaker 1: and he's always astonished when I find out something that

938
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:33,600
Speaker 1: he hasn't found out, and I'm like, dude, just get

939
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:35,400
Speaker 1: on Facebook. He's like, yeah, now I'm not doing that.

940
00:57:35,840 --> 00:57:37,960
Speaker 1: And I'm like, come on, man, like why and he's like,

941
00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:39,680
Speaker 1: I just I just don't want to do it. I

942
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:41,960
Speaker 1: don't want to be that guy. And he's older, but

943
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:45,240
Speaker 1: like he you know, feels very strongly about like just

944
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:48,000
Speaker 1: this not being a part of his life. Yeah, I

945
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:51,080
Speaker 1: mean I can understand where he's coming from. Another thing

946
00:57:51,080 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 1: you could do if you wanted to change your life

947
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:55,200
Speaker 1: still in this way is to get a law degree

948
00:57:55,720 --> 00:58:00,520
Speaker 1: in uh contracts and digital agreements. That way you can

949
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:02,920
Speaker 1: actually read the terms of service every time and then

950
00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:06,000
Speaker 1: decide maybe I don't want that. But here's the thing too,

951
00:58:06,560 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 1: there's this great article in The Guardian about the terms

952
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,560
Speaker 1: of service debate and a lot of it. It dealt

953
00:58:13,560 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 1: with several layers of this, one of which being the

954
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:20,360
Speaker 1: word accept versus join or opt in or whatever that

955
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:24,000
Speaker 1: all matters, and you know they're trying to feed into

956
00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:29,320
Speaker 1: this past habit of just click through, you know, don't

957
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:32,560
Speaker 1: even pay it a second glance. But there, you know,

958
00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:36,720
Speaker 1: there there's discussion of like, should we change where the

959
00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:39,960
Speaker 1: terms fall in the process of signing up for a service.

960
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,680
Speaker 1: Should it be right up front so before you know,

961
00:58:42,880 --> 00:58:45,280
Speaker 1: you don't have instant gratification because it's always at that point,

962
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:47,600
Speaker 1: right before you get the thing, you click it because

963
00:58:47,600 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 1: you're just like ready to have the things so you

964
00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:50,960
Speaker 1: don't even think about it. So, you know, trying to

965
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:53,840
Speaker 1: maybe steer people into possibly reading the terms a little

966
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:56,280
Speaker 1: more carefully since there's some really heavy stuff in there.

967
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 1: But this article talked about how it was in The Guardian,

968
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,400
Speaker 1: written by David Barrabee. It posed the question of you know,

969
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:07,080
Speaker 1: when you when you go to the doctor, you don't

970
00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:10,480
Speaker 1: necessarily sign a contract or agree to the terms of

971
00:59:10,560 --> 00:59:14,240
Speaker 1: services of being worked on by a doctor, but you

972
00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:20,200
Speaker 1: expect the doctor to uphold their doctorial duty, the hippocratic

973
00:59:20,240 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 1: oath or whatever and not you know, screw you over.

974
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:27,160
Speaker 1: And it's almost like this article suggested that maybe society

975
00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:31,520
Speaker 1: could almost influence some of these companies to be a

976
00:59:31,520 --> 00:59:35,880
Speaker 1: little more responsible and not sell your stuff to third

977
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,880
Speaker 1: parties instantly, you know, there's so much money in it though,

978
00:59:39,000 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 1: or at least to be good better stewards of your information.

979
00:59:43,880 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 1: And there is some good news if you live in

980
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 1: some countries, if you live in the European Union, you

981
00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:51,400
Speaker 1: may be able to take advantage of something called the

982
00:59:51,480 --> 00:59:55,200
Speaker 1: right to be forgotten. Do check it out. It's the

983
00:59:55,320 --> 00:59:59,959
Speaker 1: idea that you are ultimately the owner of your own death,

984
01:00:00,240 --> 01:00:03,320
Speaker 1: your own creation. There's a fantastic fact sheet Bend that

985
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:06,080
Speaker 1: you posted here for us, that you can find online

986
01:00:06,560 --> 01:00:09,000
Speaker 1: from the European Commission, and it goes through all of

987
01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 1: these different rules like what kind of has to be

988
01:00:11,760 --> 01:00:15,440
Speaker 1: met for you to take on this right to be forgotten? Sure,

989
01:00:15,560 --> 01:00:19,200
Speaker 1: and it's fantastic. You can find it if you search

990
01:00:19,240 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: for it. Still not a silver bullet, and if you

991
01:00:22,120 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 1: are listening in the United States, it's not gonna help you.

992
01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:30,439
Speaker 1: But I guess we would be remiss as we're drawing

993
01:00:30,440 --> 01:00:32,160
Speaker 1: towards the end here, we would be remiss if we

994
01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:35,280
Speaker 1: didn't point out there are also advantages to having information

995
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 1: online in the cloud, locating loved ones and emergencies, arguably

996
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:46,240
Speaker 1: convenience and of course medical processes. Right and in some

997
01:00:46,480 --> 01:00:51,120
Speaker 1: to dovetail the point that you and know we're making earlier, Matt,

998
01:00:51,640 --> 01:00:54,840
Speaker 1: this does all come down to a matter of trust. Indeed,

999
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:57,560
Speaker 1: as we said earlier, faith. How can you trust but

1000
01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 1: verify the claims of private companies such as ISPs and

1001
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:04,200
Speaker 1: social media platforms. How can we trust the statements of

1002
01:01:04,200 --> 01:01:06,480
Speaker 1: a government when we're aware of the actions it is

1003
01:01:06,520 --> 01:01:09,960
Speaker 1: taken in the past. Spoiler And this is just my opinion,

1004
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:15,640
Speaker 1: you cannot. I think arguments based on faith are not

1005
01:01:15,720 --> 01:01:19,200
Speaker 1: the strongest. It's tough to imagine a company, or a government,

1006
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:22,760
Speaker 1: or even an individual willingly giving up all the power

1007
01:01:22,800 --> 01:01:30,120
Speaker 1: implied in this great amalgamation of fortune. And if you're

1008
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:33,000
Speaker 1: not prepared to completely divest from the Internet, I mean,

1009
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:35,400
Speaker 1: because it is a heck of a lifestyle change that

1010
01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:38,720
Speaker 1: we were describing here, then perhaps your best bet is

1011
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:41,680
Speaker 1: to treat everything you post online, no matter how ephemeral

1012
01:01:41,720 --> 01:01:44,600
Speaker 1: and arbitrary it may seem, as part of your permanent record.

1013
01:01:44,640 --> 01:01:48,200
Speaker 1: Do you guys remember those threats? Absolutely? Yeah, it's going

1014
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 1: on your permanent record. This photo of you doing a

1015
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:56,000
Speaker 1: beer headstand, I felt like that was something that was

1016
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 1: just like in like Nickelodeon shows about you know, being

1017
01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:02,680
Speaker 1: in high school. That's going on, yeah, permanent guy. I

1018
01:02:02,720 --> 01:02:06,600
Speaker 1: can assure you all you kids listening out there, that

1019
01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:10,200
Speaker 1: permanent record is very real and anything you do is

1020
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:12,680
Speaker 1: going directly on it. So be on your best behavior.

1021
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:15,360
Speaker 1: Your kid doesn't listen to the show man. Not yet.

1022
01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 1: We hope that you have enjoyed this episode. I know

1023
01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:23,920
Speaker 1: we went a little longer than usual. As we're exploring

1024
01:02:23,960 --> 01:02:27,360
Speaker 1: this stuff, we want to hear from you. Are you

1025
01:02:27,440 --> 01:02:31,240
Speaker 1: a person who has been contemplating hopping off the grid?

1026
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:34,920
Speaker 1: Do you have a weird story about some internet voodoo

1027
01:02:34,960 --> 01:02:37,960
Speaker 1: that occurred to you? Or are you a person who

1028
01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:41,080
Speaker 1: came in from the cold where you formerly off the grid?

1029
01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:43,280
Speaker 1: Did you have the kind of parents who never gave

1030
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:45,560
Speaker 1: you a Social Security number? I know a couple of

1031
01:02:45,560 --> 01:02:48,880
Speaker 1: folks like that in the crowd. If so, what has

1032
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:53,120
Speaker 1: your experience been. I got creeped out recently. I got

1033
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:56,560
Speaker 1: a video gaming system, which I sound like I'm in

1034
01:02:56,600 --> 01:03:00,000
Speaker 1: the eighteen hundreds when I say stuff, yeah, Vigi gamer system, Yeah,

1035
01:03:00,080 --> 01:03:05,120
Speaker 1: I have a PlayStation and just the built in erosion

1036
01:03:05,160 --> 01:03:08,040
Speaker 1: of privacy stuff there. You know that there's a button

1037
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:14,600
Speaker 1: just to automatically share things out, Yeah, to start streaming? Yeah, yeah,

1038
01:03:13,800 --> 01:03:17,200
Speaker 1: I don't know. It's a different world, right, But we

1039
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,120
Speaker 1: want to hear your stories about that, and we'd like

1040
01:03:20,280 --> 01:03:23,760
Speaker 1: to hear any advice that you have for your fellow listeners.

1041
01:03:23,960 --> 01:03:26,080
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, have you tried to delete something? Did you

1042
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:27,920
Speaker 1: find a really great way to do it or a

1043
01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:30,840
Speaker 1: way to get through the the Google webs all the

1044
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:34,560
Speaker 1: spider webs at Google has let us know, yes, and

1045
01:03:34,800 --> 01:03:38,880
Speaker 1: let your fellow listeners know as well. Speaking of your

1046
01:03:38,920 --> 01:03:42,760
Speaker 1: fellow listeners, that reminds us it's time for god Conna.

1047
01:03:45,160 --> 01:03:49,920
Speaker 1: But not just your average garden variety shout out corner

1048
01:03:50,040 --> 01:03:54,200
Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen. No, not a bit. I don't know why.

1049
01:03:54,360 --> 01:03:58,120
Speaker 1: Postumatically we're doing a physical shout out. We're gonna shout

1050
01:03:58,240 --> 01:04:02,000
Speaker 1: toward an actual human face. Yes, that's right. Remember earlier

1051
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:04,640
Speaker 1: in the show we mentioned that this episode is a

1052
01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 1: team up, a collaboration with our colleagues over at Part

1053
01:04:09,440 --> 01:04:14,200
Speaker 1: Time Genius. We are lucky enough to have one of

1054
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:18,200
Speaker 1: the host of Part Time Genius, Will Pearson here live

1055
01:04:18,320 --> 01:04:20,800
Speaker 1: on the show in person. Will thank you for coming.

1056
01:04:20,840 --> 01:04:22,680
Speaker 1: Hey guy, it's great to be here. Will we promise

1057
01:04:22,720 --> 01:04:24,880
Speaker 1: we're not actually going to shout him your fikay? Thank you?

1058
01:04:25,240 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 1: I really really wanted to, just for fun the way, Well,

1059
01:04:28,840 --> 01:04:31,480
Speaker 1: it's because you're full of rage, Matthew. No, it's I'm

1060
01:04:31,560 --> 01:04:33,800
Speaker 1: very happy, excited. I'm happy to be here. I may

1061
01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:37,960
Speaker 1: shout at you guys, just out of enthusiasts. Please my pad,

1062
01:04:38,160 --> 01:04:41,640
Speaker 1: please direct the shouts the shouts toward me. I'd probably

1063
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:44,720
Speaker 1: have the worst hearing of the three of us, so

1064
01:04:45,560 --> 01:04:51,680
Speaker 1: will you. I'm part Time Genius explored a subject that

1065
01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:58,240
Speaker 1: is kind of a rabbit hole and a fantastic complimentary

1066
01:04:58,360 --> 01:05:01,120
Speaker 1: exploration to our own that we just had earlier in

1067
01:05:01,160 --> 01:05:06,360
Speaker 1: this episode, whereas we were asking what can a person

1068
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:09,479
Speaker 1: delete off the Internet, or if it's possible to do so,

1069
01:05:10,280 --> 01:05:14,880
Speaker 1: you and your co host Mango were exploring what information

1070
01:05:15,120 --> 01:05:18,680
Speaker 1: actually exists about a person online? Right right? And this

1071
01:05:18,760 --> 01:05:21,000
Speaker 1: idea for us came about because one of our listeners

1072
01:05:21,000 --> 01:05:24,200
Speaker 1: wrote in after having an experience being at a grocery

1073
01:05:24,200 --> 01:05:28,360
Speaker 1: store buying a product going home and despite having never

1074
01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:31,600
Speaker 1: looked up that product, on looking up that product online,

1075
01:05:32,000 --> 01:05:35,160
Speaker 1: they started being targeted with ads about that product. And

1076
01:05:35,200 --> 01:05:37,520
Speaker 1: it was not a common thing. It was some sort

1077
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:40,640
Speaker 1: of independent soda or something like that, and they thought,

1078
01:05:40,680 --> 01:05:42,960
Speaker 1: this is weird, like is this coincidence or am I

1079
01:05:43,080 --> 01:05:46,320
Speaker 1: actually being targeted in some way? And so that's really

1080
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:48,240
Speaker 1: what we started exploring more. You know, it's one of

1081
01:05:48,280 --> 01:05:51,320
Speaker 1: those things that I don't think most people are surprised that,

1082
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:53,800
Speaker 1: you know, they're being tracked online when they visit a

1083
01:05:53,840 --> 01:05:57,400
Speaker 1: website and that then maybe they're targeted with ads because

1084
01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:00,600
Speaker 1: of that behavior online. I think what most people don't

1085
01:06:00,680 --> 01:06:03,360
Speaker 1: fully recognize and that we didn't even fully appreciate, was

1086
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:06,280
Speaker 1: the fact that all of your interactions, even in the

1087
01:06:06,320 --> 01:06:08,080
Speaker 1: real space, you go to a grocery store, you go

1088
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 1: to any other kind of store, you swipe that membership card.

1089
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:14,760
Speaker 1: The way that data is then exchanged among so many companies,

1090
01:06:14,800 --> 01:06:17,800
Speaker 1: so you're you're making a purchase there, that email address,

1091
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:20,520
Speaker 1: that phone number is matched up with what Facebook or

1092
01:06:20,560 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 1: some other property has as your email and phone phone number,

1093
01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:26,800
Speaker 1: and all of it's syncd and they know that much

1094
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:28,800
Speaker 1: more about you, and it's that much easier for them

1095
01:06:28,800 --> 01:06:31,040
Speaker 1: to try to target you with products and things. And

1096
01:06:31,080 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 1: in our episode we talked a good bit about the

1097
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,800
Speaker 1: idea of accepting those terms of use right and a

1098
01:06:36,880 --> 01:06:39,920
Speaker 1: lot of that is you basically saying I'm okay with

1099
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:43,400
Speaker 1: this right right legally speaking. Yeah, absolutely, I mean, that's

1100
01:06:43,480 --> 01:06:45,640
Speaker 1: that's one of the things that we talked about as

1101
01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 1: studies that are showing that, yes, we know that this

1102
01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:50,120
Speaker 1: information is all out there and that they know this

1103
01:06:50,240 --> 01:06:52,880
Speaker 1: information about us. But at the same time, you know,

1104
01:06:52,880 --> 01:06:55,360
Speaker 1: it's pretty nice to be connected, and it's pretty nice

1105
01:06:55,400 --> 01:06:57,480
Speaker 1: to have this convenience. So do we really want to

1106
01:06:57,480 --> 01:06:59,760
Speaker 1: give that up? And most of us say no, would

1107
01:06:59,760 --> 01:07:04,520
Speaker 1: you would you say, for the uninitiated in this strange

1108
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:09,200
Speaker 1: web of info bartering, would you say that maybe your

1109
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:14,320
Speaker 1: common brick and mortar loyalty cards are symptomatic or part

1110
01:07:14,320 --> 01:07:17,240
Speaker 1: of this network. Absolutely, So you've provided, you know, the

1111
01:07:17,320 --> 01:07:20,280
Speaker 1: cashier with your phone number or your email address. And

1112
01:07:20,320 --> 01:07:22,439
Speaker 1: then there are companies and just to give a couple

1113
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,080
Speaker 1: of examples, like there's a company called Data Logics which

1114
01:07:25,080 --> 01:07:28,240
Speaker 1: works with these grocery stores or other brick and mortar

1115
01:07:28,600 --> 01:07:31,880
Speaker 1: they're purchasing this data. They're then turning around and selling

1116
01:07:31,880 --> 01:07:34,760
Speaker 1: it to a place like Facebook. And so Facebook has

1117
01:07:34,840 --> 01:07:39,040
Speaker 1: this ad programming division called Atlas that's very sophisticated, much

1118
01:07:39,080 --> 01:07:41,640
Speaker 1: more so than I think we even realize. That they

1119
01:07:41,720 --> 01:07:45,120
Speaker 1: then have this data and when that information is SYNCD up,

1120
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:48,520
Speaker 1: they knew that that friend purchased that can of soda

1121
01:07:48,600 --> 01:07:50,919
Speaker 1: because they had to either swipe their card or given

1122
01:07:50,920 --> 01:07:53,400
Speaker 1: their phone number, or that it was likely to be them,

1123
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:55,640
Speaker 1: and that's how they knew to target them with ads

1124
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:59,360
Speaker 1: not only on Facebook, but any site, any page that

1125
01:07:59,440 --> 01:08:02,520
Speaker 1: has a Facebook like button or share button that they

1126
01:08:02,600 --> 01:08:06,040
Speaker 1: have the opportunity to show ads on those those pages

1127
01:08:06,080 --> 01:08:08,400
Speaker 1: as well. So it's definitely part of that. I can't

1128
01:08:08,440 --> 01:08:12,760
Speaker 1: wait for the Augmented Reality Minority Report add placements like

1129
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:14,880
Speaker 1: that when you're just walking through the bus station and

1130
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:17,040
Speaker 1: it's giving you all the stuff you bought a harbor,

1131
01:08:17,240 --> 01:08:19,000
Speaker 1: or like in that Black Mirror episode where you have

1132
01:08:19,040 --> 01:08:21,880
Speaker 1: to spend your hard earned credits to skip the ad

1133
01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:24,880
Speaker 1: because it's actually projecting it constantly in your field of

1134
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:26,920
Speaker 1: vision and in order to make it go away you

1135
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:30,040
Speaker 1: have to spend money or credits, like in the episode

1136
01:08:30,040 --> 01:08:33,479
Speaker 1: It's Merits is nine million merits or something like that,

1137
01:08:33,479 --> 01:08:36,720
Speaker 1: which is great, great episode, very very bizarre and impression.

1138
01:08:36,920 --> 01:08:39,920
Speaker 1: On a bright side though, you know, if we're more

1139
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:42,120
Speaker 1: if it's greating on us on how likely we are

1140
01:08:42,160 --> 01:08:44,400
Speaker 1: to do things. It reminds me of like a global

1141
01:08:44,560 --> 01:08:47,320
Speaker 1: version of high school superlatives. You know, maybe it's not

1142
01:08:47,400 --> 01:08:49,679
Speaker 1: all bad, you know, maybe it's not all crime. Maybe

1143
01:08:49,760 --> 01:08:57,240
Speaker 1: I'm like most likely to open for Louis c k whatever,

1144
01:08:57,360 --> 01:09:03,479
Speaker 1: dream big. So that's what I was gonna definitely maybe

1145
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:07,240
Speaker 1: open the door to the bathroom while he's walking in.

1146
01:09:07,400 --> 01:09:11,080
Speaker 1: All right, Well, well we'll fix this in post right, No, sure,

1147
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:16,120
Speaker 1: So speaking of bathrooms, um, I noticed, you know, we

1148
01:09:16,160 --> 01:09:18,000
Speaker 1: have an office. We work out of an office here

1149
01:09:18,040 --> 01:09:20,280
Speaker 1: and it's a shared restroom with everybody on the floor

1150
01:09:20,320 --> 01:09:22,720
Speaker 1: and right, I couldn't help but notice this is a

1151
01:09:22,720 --> 01:09:26,400
Speaker 1: complete side note. By the way, the toilet paper was

1152
01:09:26,400 --> 01:09:29,240
Speaker 1: out again, and you know, nothing against staff here, it's

1153
01:09:29,280 --> 01:09:33,679
Speaker 1: just sometimes a lot of toilet paper is necessary. Yeah, yeah,

1154
01:09:33,720 --> 01:09:36,679
Speaker 1: and uh, well I think maybe you found a solution.

1155
01:09:36,840 --> 01:09:38,519
Speaker 1: Well we've got good news for you here. I mean,

1156
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:41,080
Speaker 1: we know that there are over eight billion items out

1157
01:09:41,120 --> 01:09:43,519
Speaker 1: there connected to the web, and we've been looking into

1158
01:09:43,560 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 1: all of these different types of devices, And there is

1159
01:09:46,240 --> 01:09:48,759
Speaker 1: something which is kind of like the Internet of toilet paper,

1160
01:09:48,760 --> 01:09:51,920
Speaker 1: and it's this new product called roll Scout, and it

1161
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:55,920
Speaker 1: informs you via text or email or app when the

1162
01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,559
Speaker 1: toilet paper is low or out. And I have to

1163
01:09:58,560 --> 01:10:01,160
Speaker 1: admit I made fun of this product when Mango mentioned

1164
01:10:01,200 --> 01:10:03,519
Speaker 1: it on our episode, and then as I thought about

1165
01:10:03,520 --> 01:10:05,639
Speaker 1: it more and I thought, you know, you're a business owner,

1166
01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:07,800
Speaker 1: you're a cafe owner, you're something like that. I mean,

1167
01:10:07,840 --> 01:10:10,840
Speaker 1: this is something that really ticks off a customer, right,

1168
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:14,240
Speaker 1: And so for sixty bucks, you can then keep tabs

1169
01:10:14,240 --> 01:10:16,280
Speaker 1: on this and know when that toilet papers running out.

1170
01:10:16,280 --> 01:10:18,560
Speaker 1: So I'm kind of all in on this thing. Have

1171
01:10:18,640 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 1: you seen those Amazon buttons that you can get. It's

1172
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:24,360
Speaker 1: like a button the specifically tied to a product like

1173
01:10:24,479 --> 01:10:26,720
Speaker 1: Tied or something like that, and you stick it to

1174
01:10:26,800 --> 01:10:29,479
Speaker 1: your washing machine and when you notice that you're getting

1175
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:32,760
Speaker 1: low on Tied, you jam that button and it automatically

1176
01:10:32,920 --> 01:10:35,800
Speaker 1: places an order for you for Tied. So it's like,

1177
01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:38,920
Speaker 1: you know, we participate in this stuff as well, and

1178
01:10:39,400 --> 01:10:41,280
Speaker 1: like these apps and things like that in the button

1179
01:10:41,439 --> 01:10:45,599
Speaker 1: are almost like complicit versions of this tracking stuff where

1180
01:10:45,600 --> 01:10:49,640
Speaker 1: we're like we're kind of participating in this process. And

1181
01:10:49,720 --> 01:10:52,280
Speaker 1: it's like for people, you know, this argument that it's

1182
01:10:52,280 --> 01:10:55,200
Speaker 1: worth it have my info. It's fine. I don't care

1183
01:10:55,240 --> 01:10:57,479
Speaker 1: if you know how many times I order tied Because

1184
01:10:57,560 --> 01:11:00,840
Speaker 1: you even search for things on Amazon right and that's

1185
01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,559
Speaker 1: are getting served up ads like in your Gmail account.

1186
01:11:03,600 --> 01:11:06,280
Speaker 1: It's all connected, clearly, and I think that's one of

1187
01:11:06,320 --> 01:11:08,040
Speaker 1: the things that we talk about in the episode as well.

1188
01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:10,960
Speaker 1: As you know, we focus so much on what are

1189
01:11:11,000 --> 01:11:13,120
Speaker 1: the websites we're visiting and what are we doing on

1190
01:11:13,200 --> 01:11:16,000
Speaker 1: social media, and we're not stopping to think about all

1191
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:18,799
Speaker 1: of the products that are integrated into our everyday lives,

1192
01:11:18,840 --> 01:11:21,200
Speaker 1: which are now connected to the broader web, that are

1193
01:11:21,240 --> 01:11:24,639
Speaker 1: providing data and other information to these companies as well.

1194
01:11:24,800 --> 01:11:26,280
Speaker 1: There was one that kind of made me laugh at

1195
01:11:26,280 --> 01:11:28,320
Speaker 1: first and then it scared me. It's this product called

1196
01:11:28,800 --> 01:11:32,639
Speaker 1: Aristotle from Mattel. It's basically like this three hundred dollars

1197
01:11:32,760 --> 01:11:35,360
Speaker 1: version of Alexa, but for little ones. And so you

1198
01:11:35,360 --> 01:11:37,639
Speaker 1: have it in your room with a baby or a toddler,

1199
01:11:38,160 --> 01:11:41,640
Speaker 1: and it not only has the facial recognition and voice recognition,

1200
01:11:41,720 --> 01:11:44,400
Speaker 1: but it's a machine that's in this room that is

1201
01:11:44,479 --> 01:11:47,640
Speaker 1: able to track pretty much everything that's happening there. So

1202
01:11:47,680 --> 01:11:50,320
Speaker 1: every time a diaper has changed, every time of feeding

1203
01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:54,080
Speaker 1: is occurring, and so from day one, these lives are

1204
01:11:54,120 --> 01:11:56,840
Speaker 1: being tracked, and at some point this data is then

1205
01:11:56,920 --> 01:11:59,880
Speaker 1: available to Mattel to do whatever with right, to decide

1206
01:11:59,880 --> 01:12:02,800
Speaker 1: how we need to be you know, retargeted in some way,

1207
01:12:02,880 --> 01:12:05,240
Speaker 1: or how products need to be customized for us. So,

1208
01:12:05,560 --> 01:12:07,360
Speaker 1: you know, maybe not used in a scary way. But

1209
01:12:07,400 --> 01:12:09,160
Speaker 1: at the same time, it's just so odd to think

1210
01:12:09,240 --> 01:12:12,559
Speaker 1: that from this first day of a baby's life, all

1211
01:12:12,600 --> 01:12:15,040
Speaker 1: of this data is available. It's not it's not scary

1212
01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:17,960
Speaker 1: at all. Well, it's it's the only way we'll be

1213
01:12:18,000 --> 01:12:20,760
Speaker 1: able to make the first real super AI. We have

1214
01:12:20,840 --> 01:12:22,840
Speaker 1: to know exactly what a human is like from the

1215
01:12:22,920 --> 01:12:25,519
Speaker 1: day it is born until it is able to put

1216
01:12:25,520 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 1: its own pants on. You're right, and it's called Aristotle,

1217
01:12:28,120 --> 01:12:30,800
Speaker 1: which sounds very smart. It must be fine. Do you

1218
01:12:30,840 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 1: think all this stuff has affected the field of market

1219
01:12:33,160 --> 01:12:38,200
Speaker 1: research a lot? I mean, can you even imagine orderline replaced? Yes? Yeah,

1220
01:12:38,280 --> 01:12:41,800
Speaker 1: I mean with all of this data there, it's hard

1221
01:12:41,800 --> 01:12:44,160
Speaker 1: to even imagine how much these jobs in that world

1222
01:12:44,160 --> 01:12:47,200
Speaker 1: of market research have changed in the past ten years.

1223
01:12:47,560 --> 01:12:50,240
Speaker 1: You know, how much more data and an overwhelming amount

1224
01:12:50,280 --> 01:12:51,880
Speaker 1: of data that's there and what to do with it.

1225
01:12:51,920 --> 01:12:53,719
Speaker 1: So it's probably one of those things at this point

1226
01:12:53,760 --> 01:12:55,640
Speaker 1: that even the company's coming up with it, they're like,

1227
01:12:56,120 --> 01:12:57,840
Speaker 1: we don't know what we're going to do with this,

1228
01:12:57,960 --> 01:13:01,000
Speaker 1: but we're going to have so much data salivating over that,

1229
01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:04,960
Speaker 1: by gosh, by golly, do no. One of the questions

1230
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:09,080
Speaker 1: that occurred to us when we were listening to your

1231
01:13:09,120 --> 01:13:14,439
Speaker 1: episode was the the concept of whether or not this

1232
01:13:14,600 --> 01:13:19,360
Speaker 1: is inevitable, you know, the has the zegeist already shifted

1233
01:13:20,000 --> 01:13:23,479
Speaker 1: or the badgers out of the bag? So speak, what

1234
01:13:24,040 --> 01:13:26,599
Speaker 1: do you think? Do you think that it's possible that

1235
01:13:26,680 --> 01:13:30,679
Speaker 1: people would somehow rebel against this or is it at

1236
01:13:30,720 --> 01:13:34,559
Speaker 1: this point has it already reached what Malcolm Gladwell would

1237
01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:38,000
Speaker 1: call the tipping point? I mean, you have to feel

1238
01:13:38,040 --> 01:13:41,000
Speaker 1: like this has already past a certain point where again

1239
01:13:41,120 --> 01:13:45,000
Speaker 1: because of the upsides, or what we would perceive as

1240
01:13:45,080 --> 01:13:47,599
Speaker 1: the upsides, you know, the pleasure that's brought to us

1241
01:13:47,640 --> 01:13:50,960
Speaker 1: by having this constant connection with other friends and what

1242
01:13:51,000 --> 01:13:53,760
Speaker 1: people are getting out of that, and the ease that

1243
01:13:53,840 --> 01:13:55,559
Speaker 1: it's you know the fact that I can go get

1244
01:13:55,600 --> 01:13:58,400
Speaker 1: my tide just by pressing that button or whatever it is.

1245
01:13:58,800 --> 01:14:01,400
Speaker 1: I mean that can be. Its means a lot to people,

1246
01:14:01,439 --> 01:14:03,639
Speaker 1: and I think they're willing to sacrifice a whole lot

1247
01:14:03,720 --> 01:14:07,160
Speaker 1: just to m to have those things. So I don't know.

1248
01:14:07,200 --> 01:14:09,439
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's going to continue to be battles over this,

1249
01:14:09,520 --> 01:14:12,160
Speaker 1: and more and more battles over this, But it also

1250
01:14:12,280 --> 01:14:16,960
Speaker 1: feels like we're only seeing the beginning of this complete connectedness.

1251
01:14:17,000 --> 01:14:19,840
Speaker 1: In a way, we're in the prequel. If this were

1252
01:14:19,880 --> 01:14:22,040
Speaker 1: a film, this is it. And as stuff gets better

1253
01:14:22,080 --> 01:14:24,880
Speaker 1: than the AI gets more advanced, maybe we won't even

1254
01:14:24,880 --> 01:14:27,639
Speaker 1: have to push the button. It'll just know that we're

1255
01:14:27,680 --> 01:14:30,280
Speaker 1: out of Tide. Based on our habits and our purchasing

1256
01:14:30,600 --> 01:14:34,040
Speaker 1: patterns for Tide or some product, it will automatically know

1257
01:14:34,479 --> 01:14:36,760
Speaker 1: what to send us when, so that we never run

1258
01:14:36,800 --> 01:14:41,000
Speaker 1: out of you know, American craft singles, or even stuff

1259
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:43,800
Speaker 1: that you didn't know you wanted. It will It'll be

1260
01:14:43,920 --> 01:14:48,599
Speaker 1: like just there, like Nold Brown, we have delivered your

1261
01:14:48,760 --> 01:14:55,200
Speaker 1: shipment of Tide and two Ruta bagas. Oh and you

1262
01:14:55,240 --> 01:14:57,920
Speaker 1: sounded just like my wife, which makes it even more creepy.

1263
01:14:58,080 --> 01:15:00,760
Speaker 1: It just leads and gentlemen, you know on this show

1264
01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:04,800
Speaker 1: that we always endeavor to not just provide information, but

1265
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:10,040
Speaker 1: provide opportunities to act. And with this in mind, will

1266
01:15:10,320 --> 01:15:14,200
Speaker 1: we were hoping to ask you easier, I stay hoping

1267
01:15:14,200 --> 01:15:17,320
Speaker 1: to ask. We'll just ask you. Is there is there

1268
01:15:17,360 --> 01:15:21,080
Speaker 1: any like advice or I guess, words of guidance under

1269
01:15:21,200 --> 01:15:23,400
Speaker 1: or words of warning that you could give to our

1270
01:15:23,439 --> 01:15:27,839
Speaker 1: listeners when it comes to their online presence. I think, honestly,

1271
01:15:27,840 --> 01:15:31,120
Speaker 1: it's really just about being aware that this is happening

1272
01:15:31,120 --> 01:15:33,960
Speaker 1: and trying to know what your comfort level is with this.

1273
01:15:34,200 --> 01:15:36,640
Speaker 1: You know, if this is not something that you're comfortable with,

1274
01:15:36,680 --> 01:15:39,519
Speaker 1: these companies having all of this data and a certain

1275
01:15:39,560 --> 01:15:43,240
Speaker 1: amount of this is inevitable, right, But if you don't

1276
01:15:43,240 --> 01:15:46,040
Speaker 1: want that data to be shared, you know, you probably

1277
01:15:46,120 --> 01:15:49,519
Speaker 1: need to avoid signing up for these memberships of various

1278
01:15:49,560 --> 01:15:52,200
Speaker 1: clubs and things that where all of this is exchanged.

1279
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:56,000
Speaker 1: But for the most part, it's making that decision for yourself.

1280
01:15:56,120 --> 01:15:58,519
Speaker 1: Am I comfortable with this information being out there? But

1281
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:01,920
Speaker 1: then just being cautious and knowing that any information that

1282
01:16:01,960 --> 01:16:05,439
Speaker 1: you're providing to one company is going to be shared

1283
01:16:05,479 --> 01:16:09,360
Speaker 1: with several others, and anything any activity that you're participating

1284
01:16:09,439 --> 01:16:13,200
Speaker 1: in online is available to so many others out there.

1285
01:16:13,240 --> 01:16:15,320
Speaker 1: As well. So I don't think there's any sort of

1286
01:16:15,720 --> 01:16:19,200
Speaker 1: like magic thing that you can do. And as you

1287
01:16:19,200 --> 01:16:22,520
Speaker 1: guys have discussed, the idea of trying to just completely

1288
01:16:22,520 --> 01:16:27,479
Speaker 1: wipe the web of your existence is pretty much impossible, right.

1289
01:16:27,560 --> 01:16:30,479
Speaker 1: So I think it's just deciding whether we're willing to

1290
01:16:30,479 --> 01:16:33,280
Speaker 1: participate in the digital world as it is now, and

1291
01:16:33,680 --> 01:16:38,920
Speaker 1: if so, to what extent. I have another question too,

1292
01:16:38,920 --> 01:16:42,880
Speaker 1: to follow up, because it just occurred to me, are

1293
01:16:42,880 --> 01:16:45,960
Speaker 1: there any concerns that parents should have now that they're

1294
01:16:46,080 --> 01:16:51,320
Speaker 1: raising children in an entirely connected world? Right? I almost

1295
01:16:51,360 --> 01:16:53,880
Speaker 1: don't even want to get into that as having as

1296
01:16:53,920 --> 01:16:55,960
Speaker 1: having children and you think about I mean, to me,

1297
01:16:56,760 --> 01:17:00,160
Speaker 1: part of what's scary about that is just more like

1298
01:17:00,160 --> 01:17:02,160
Speaker 1: when we grew up and you came home from school

1299
01:17:02,280 --> 01:17:04,760
Speaker 1: and you shut off the rest of the world and

1300
01:17:04,840 --> 01:17:06,479
Speaker 1: you played and you were just kind of in this

1301
01:17:06,520 --> 01:17:10,080
Speaker 1: other world. There is this need for children now by

1302
01:17:10,120 --> 01:17:14,040
Speaker 1: the time they're in middle school, to be constantly connected,

1303
01:17:14,080 --> 01:17:16,760
Speaker 1: and their brains are almost aren't ready for this are

1304
01:17:16,840 --> 01:17:19,040
Speaker 1: capable of managing that, and so that is one of

1305
01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:21,719
Speaker 1: my concerns. It's, of course, there's all the concerns about

1306
01:17:21,720 --> 01:17:24,200
Speaker 1: what information you're sharing and how exposed you are and

1307
01:17:24,280 --> 01:17:27,120
Speaker 1: making sure that you protect yourself in that sense, but

1308
01:17:27,160 --> 01:17:29,880
Speaker 1: there's also the sense of just helping our children have

1309
01:17:30,120 --> 01:17:33,480
Speaker 1: that necessary break from the outside world and just existing

1310
01:17:33,479 --> 01:17:36,000
Speaker 1: in a world of two or three friends and their family.

1311
01:17:36,479 --> 01:17:38,960
Speaker 1: To me, that's one of the most important parts about

1312
01:17:38,960 --> 01:17:41,479
Speaker 1: this is not having them feel from such an early

1313
01:17:41,479 --> 01:17:44,679
Speaker 1: age that they have to have this twenty four seventh connection.

1314
01:17:44,720 --> 01:17:47,479
Speaker 1: It's just not good for anybody's brain, much less at kids.

1315
01:17:48,000 --> 01:17:49,880
Speaker 1: I'm struggling with that with my kid, and I'll have

1316
01:17:49,920 --> 01:17:53,679
Speaker 1: to just be like, okay, over right, bad time it's done. Yeah,

1317
01:17:53,840 --> 01:17:55,680
Speaker 1: just let it go late, but I have to right,

1318
01:17:55,760 --> 01:17:57,920
Speaker 1: you don't right, you don't have to yeah, And it

1319
01:17:58,040 --> 01:18:01,200
Speaker 1: starts as almost toddlers. She's eight, I mean, you know,

1320
01:18:01,479 --> 01:18:03,680
Speaker 1: but she's you know, sort of a I don't want

1321
01:18:03,680 --> 01:18:05,519
Speaker 1: to sound like I'm tu min home it kind of

1322
01:18:05,520 --> 01:18:08,000
Speaker 1: an advanced eight year old, I suppose, but like, yeah,

1323
01:18:08,040 --> 01:18:10,920
Speaker 1: it's just like it hurts me to see her almost

1324
01:18:10,960 --> 01:18:14,120
Speaker 1: falling into these kind of addictive behavior cycles where I'm

1325
01:18:14,120 --> 01:18:18,120
Speaker 1: just like stop, stop your obsessed, and we're saying stop

1326
01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:22,200
Speaker 1: as we're also peeking off to the email. Is I'm

1327
01:18:22,200 --> 01:18:24,800
Speaker 1: the worst and I set the worst example. And it's

1328
01:18:24,840 --> 01:18:27,200
Speaker 1: like the classic do as I say, not as I do,

1329
01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:29,920
Speaker 1: which I just feel like a total hypocritical jerk. But

1330
01:18:29,960 --> 01:18:32,360
Speaker 1: I'm trying. I'm trying every day as well. But I say,

1331
01:18:32,680 --> 01:18:34,840
Speaker 1: move to the Blue Ridge Mountains. They have some Greek

1332
01:18:34,880 --> 01:18:38,400
Speaker 1: communities out there. You can really disconnect. You move to

1333
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:41,160
Speaker 1: the quiet zone there you go, Yeah, where there's no

1334
01:18:41,240 --> 01:18:45,280
Speaker 1: cell phone, no TV, no radio, nothing, just banges. Yeah,

1335
01:18:45,360 --> 01:18:50,560
Speaker 1: just rocks and sticks. No problems out there. Yeah. Yeah.

1336
01:18:50,880 --> 01:18:54,000
Speaker 1: Also the most stable people that's right in to congregate

1337
01:18:54,040 --> 01:18:58,599
Speaker 1: there too. And that is a story for another day, Kitty.

1338
01:18:58,840 --> 01:19:01,679
Speaker 1: You can check it out right now because we did

1339
01:19:01,840 --> 01:19:05,840
Speaker 1: an episode on our dare I say, Misadventures in the

1340
01:19:05,920 --> 01:19:11,000
Speaker 1: Quiet Zone? And before you do that, will we want

1341
01:19:11,000 --> 01:19:13,639
Speaker 1: to thank you so much for collaborating on the show

1342
01:19:13,680 --> 01:19:18,240
Speaker 1: and for coming in lending your expertise to our friends

1343
01:19:18,240 --> 01:19:20,400
Speaker 1: and neighbors in the audience. This has been a lot

1344
01:19:20,400 --> 01:19:22,200
Speaker 1: of fun. I'm a longtime fan of the show here,

1345
01:19:22,240 --> 01:19:24,639
Speaker 1: so it's really been a blast getting on to work

1346
01:19:24,680 --> 01:19:27,240
Speaker 1: on this together. Unless we forget that this was but

1347
01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:31,120
Speaker 1: a taste of the part time genius perspective on this subject.

1348
01:19:31,320 --> 01:19:34,759
Speaker 1: So where can folks go find the full meal. Hey,

1349
01:19:34,800 --> 01:19:37,120
Speaker 1: this was our brand new episode over part time genius.

1350
01:19:37,160 --> 01:19:39,080
Speaker 1: Come check us out then we hope you enjoy it

1351
01:19:39,439 --> 01:19:43,599
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. Right, Hey, it's nicely done, Matt, Yes,

1352
01:19:43,800 --> 01:19:50,320
Speaker 1: nicely done. That's the line. And this concludes ours but

1353
01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:54,880
Speaker 1: not our show. Matt, Noel, Tristan and I will return

1354
01:19:55,439 --> 01:19:59,920
Speaker 1: next week with something, hopefully, I mean to say, equally fascinating,

1355
01:20:00,040 --> 01:20:03,800
Speaker 1: but maybe a little less disturbing, you know what I mean? Yeah,

1356
01:20:03,400 --> 01:20:08,439
Speaker 1: I'd be okay with that. In the meantime, if if

1357
01:20:08,479 --> 01:20:11,439
Speaker 1: we have not talked to him to trying to quit

1358
01:20:11,520 --> 01:20:13,920
Speaker 1: social media and you know you're still using the Internet

1359
01:20:13,920 --> 01:20:16,720
Speaker 1: to listen to the show just feels so hypocritical. I

1360
01:20:16,720 --> 01:20:20,639
Speaker 1: wish I knew how to quit you right. Yes, although

1361
01:20:20,680 --> 01:20:25,120
Speaker 1: it does it does sound a little bit hypocritical and contradictory.

1362
01:20:25,160 --> 01:20:26,800
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of funny that we're saying at

1363
01:20:26,840 --> 01:20:30,000
Speaker 1: this point you could you could find that you could

1364
01:20:30,040 --> 01:20:32,320
Speaker 1: totally find us on Facebook and it's all up on

1365
01:20:32,360 --> 01:20:37,040
Speaker 1: the internet all over it. Well, what a bunch of roobs. Yeah,

1366
01:20:37,080 --> 01:20:40,200
Speaker 1: you can find is work Conspiracy Stuff, Work Conspiracy Stuff

1367
01:20:40,280 --> 01:20:45,800
Speaker 1: show on Instagram. And that's the end of this classic episode.

1368
01:20:45,840 --> 01:20:49,680
Speaker 1: If you have any thoughts or questions about this episode,

1369
01:20:50,040 --> 01:20:52,160
Speaker 1: you can get into contact with us in a number

1370
01:20:52,160 --> 01:20:54,160
Speaker 1: of different ways. One of the best is to give

1371
01:20:54,240 --> 01:20:56,760
Speaker 1: us a call. Our number is one eight three three

1372
01:20:57,120 --> 01:20:59,880
Speaker 1: std w y t K. If you don't want to

1373
01:20:59,920 --> 01:21:01,760
Speaker 1: do you that, you can send us a good old

1374
01:21:01,800 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 1: fashioned email. We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff

1375
01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:10,679
Speaker 1: they Don't want you to Know is a production of iHeartRadio.

1376
01:21:10,720 --> 01:21:14,840
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

1377
01:21:14,920 --> 01:21:16,799
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.