WEBVTT - Should the Pirates be buyers at the deadline? 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:10.600 What's up, everybody. 0:00:10.680 --> 0:00:13.520 Welcome back to another episode of Bucko Territory, presented to 0:00:13.520 --> 0:00:15.040 you Vibe Foul Territory Network. 0:00:15.040 --> 0:00:15.800 I'm Noah Hiles. 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:18.480 Joining me as always are my co host platinum Key 0:00:18.520 --> 0:00:20.520 aka Mark and Josh Harrison. 0:00:21.360 --> 0:00:22.760 We got a big show for you today. 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:26.759 The Pirates go three and three on a trip out west, 0:00:27.560 --> 0:00:30.639 probably one of their more winnable road trips on the year, 0:00:31.440 --> 0:00:33.840 and they're coming off of avoiding. 0:00:33.400 --> 0:00:36.840 A sweep against the always daunting and tough to beat 0:00:36.880 --> 0:00:40.400 Colorado Rockies. So we're gonna talk about that. We're gonna talk. 0:00:40.280 --> 0:00:42.440 About the state of where they are this year and 0:00:42.560 --> 0:00:46.000 if they should by at the deadline. We're gonna talk 0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:48.879 some catchers as well. There was a trade since we 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:53.040 last recorded. We'll talk about that, We'll talk about Henry Davis, 0:00:53.320 --> 0:00:55.320 and then we will always wrap it up like we 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:58.760 do on Monday with platinum Key's Key of the Week. So, guys, 0:00:59.640 --> 0:01:04.560 I know when every fan watching this show sees that question, 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:08.119 should they buy, It's a no brainer to them, right, 0:01:08.200 --> 0:01:11.840 Like of course, you add, right, like this team needs help, 0:01:12.280 --> 0:01:17.600 it needs to get better. I see how That's why 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:21.880 I see the way they feel on that right But 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:24.679 if you look at this from an objective standpoint, do the. 0:01:24.640 --> 0:01:30.880 Pirates really deserve further investment right now now? 0:01:30.920 --> 0:01:33.319 If you're trying to win, Sure, But like I'm asking 0:01:33.360 --> 0:01:36.760 from like just an overall baseball standpoint, because in a 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:39.800 lot of ways you're paid to evaluate what is best 0:01:40.120 --> 0:01:46.080 for the organization. Is what they're going to add at 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:48.800 the deadline, Because let's be realistic, I don't expect them 0:01:48.840 --> 0:01:53.200 to add Yard aunt Alvarez or Trek Scubele or Erotis Chatman. 0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:57.160 So let's just assume they add. 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:01.440 You know, two war worth of value the deadline. Is 0:02:01.480 --> 0:02:03.320 that enough to get this team to the playoffs? 0:02:03.680 --> 0:02:07.600 And if not, I mean what what? 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:10.840 Why would you bo? I'll open up the Florida either 0:02:10.880 --> 0:02:11.720 one of you guys. 0:02:12.040 --> 0:02:16.280 Yeah, I'll start here just because I think it matters. 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:19.800 Like those two War players where they fill in. If 0:02:19.840 --> 0:02:23.760 you're adding two War to this bullpen, I feel a 0:02:23.800 --> 0:02:26.280 little bit more confident. But if you're adding two War 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:30.200 anywhere else outside of the bullpen, that that made me 0:02:30.400 --> 0:02:32.680 make me a little apprehensive as far as their chances. 0:02:32.720 --> 0:02:36.040 And I get what you're saying, no, because you look 0:02:36.080 --> 0:02:41.000 at like the series against Colorado and this team. Are 0:02:41.000 --> 0:02:45.320 they built to, you know, go deep, like beyond just 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:48.760 making the playoffs. And I think if it was any 0:02:48.760 --> 0:02:51.320 other team, a lot of teams would just be like, 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:53.720 you know what, this is in the year. We'll wait 0:02:54.240 --> 0:02:57.639 and invest next year with improvements to all of our 0:02:57.680 --> 0:03:02.560 young stars. But this is the Pittsburgh Pirates and a 0:03:02.639 --> 0:03:06.680 fan base that has been starved just for a modicum 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:09.959 of success like this. People are still talking about the 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:14.120 twenty thirteen wild Card game, right, and not to diminish 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:17.360 the accomplishments and like how awesome that game was, but 0:03:18.200 --> 0:03:21.520 this fan base needs a reminder that this team can 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:24.640 win and can do that. And you only have so 0:03:24.720 --> 0:03:27.960 many years with Paul Skins. Obviously, now we have counter 0:03:28.000 --> 0:03:32.320 Griffin locked up, so that window is at least a 0:03:32.320 --> 0:03:35.160 little extended with Griffin, But the window to win with 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:39.680 Skiings is so limited that I feel like you have 0:03:39.760 --> 0:03:42.080 to try this year. And it might not be worth 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:44.440 it for any other team, but it would be worth 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.560 it for I think this Pirates franchise and especially this 0:03:47.640 --> 0:03:48.360 front office. 0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:54.960 And I'll pig you back off of that, just to 0:03:55.000 --> 0:03:56.160 go a little bit off of that. 0:03:57.800 --> 0:04:00.280 You know, as a player, you know you have you're 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:02.320 going to be realistic about where you are, you know, 0:04:02.360 --> 0:04:04.320 as a team and where you stand in a division 0:04:04.400 --> 0:04:07.680 wherever that is. But at the same time, when you 0:04:07.760 --> 0:04:09.560 know you're just in a little bit of the thick 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:11.400 of it, you know, maybe just in a little bit. 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:11.720 Of a hunt. 0:04:11.720 --> 0:04:15.960 Obviously where they stand right now, division doesn't look like 0:04:16.000 --> 0:04:18.960 it's gonna be you know, possible. But at the same time, 0:04:19.200 --> 0:04:20.800 we know what I think, eight and a half games 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:23.400 anything can be. But I'm looking more at the wild card. 0:04:23.680 --> 0:04:26.039 I think there's a mix of quite a few teams 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:29.080 that are you know, that one one and a half game, 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:32.440 and you know there's a lot of teams that are 0:04:32.440 --> 0:04:36.000 gonna be having that same conversation, you know, do we 0:04:36.080 --> 0:04:38.120 add and if we do, how much do we add 0:04:38.320 --> 0:04:40.440 vices verse? You know, there's gonna be some teams that's 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:44.720 just gonna stand pat But you know, just looking at 0:04:44.720 --> 0:04:48.520 the you know what Mark said with Pittsburgh, obviously you 0:04:48.520 --> 0:04:51.400 have Paul schemes, you got Connor, but uh, with them 0:04:51.440 --> 0:04:53.400 being a game game and a half, you know, around 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:56.400 that wildcard, you still don't have a fully healthy team. 0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:59.760 You know, sometimes teams look at you know, guys coming 0:04:59.760 --> 0:05:02.480 off the injured list as you know, trade deadline because 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:05.840 you're getting something that you didn't have. So in that case, Mark, 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:08.080 when you're saying if they are to add a piece, 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:12.360 I think obviously bullpen is where they're gonna need to add. 0:05:12.520 --> 0:05:15.360 And if they are in this situation to say if 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:19.400 we are going to spend money, obviously you have to 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:21.719 look at the bullpen because you look at O'Neill and 0:05:21.760 --> 0:05:24.839 connor being gone. You could also say we're buying when 0:05:24.880 --> 0:05:25.880 those guys get healthy. 0:05:25.880 --> 0:05:26.800 But at the same time, you. 0:05:26.760 --> 0:05:29.600 Also know that you know time is ticking and those 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:31.599 guys aren't there right now, so you still need to 0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:33.120 think about if they're not there. 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:35.920 But we know offense isn't the issue. 0:05:36.120 --> 0:05:38.719 Even with those guys being out there have still found 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:41.600 a way to you know, put some runs across. So 0:05:41.720 --> 0:05:44.400 the question is going to be remained is you know 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:47.479 you around that wild card game or you know that 0:05:47.480 --> 0:05:49.479 that one one and a half game range. 0:05:50.080 --> 0:05:51.480 How aggressive are you going to be? 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:56.720 And obviously with the Pirates obviously spending a lot more 0:05:56.800 --> 0:05:58.600 money than they have in the years past to start 0:05:58.640 --> 0:06:01.560 the season, no I get why you say, like is 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:04.479 it worth it? But Mark, on the flip side, you 0:06:04.520 --> 0:06:06.599 only got so many years of Paul schemes in this, 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:11.000 so they're in a tough spot. So as a player, 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:12.760 it's like should you buy you know you asked. Most 0:06:12.760 --> 0:06:14.160 of the guys are going like, man, we got what 0:06:14.200 --> 0:06:16.400 we need here when we're healthy. But at the same time, 0:06:16.800 --> 0:06:19.159 you know, you know, you're a few pieces here they're missing. 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:23.400 So if they're gonna have to get creative because if 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:26.919 you're within that wildcard, you have to be able to 0:06:27.560 --> 0:06:27.960 say that. 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:28.920 We're trying to win. 0:06:29.400 --> 0:06:31.840 And you know, I think for this team to try 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:33.440 to win, I think it's more about getting some book 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:35.400 pen pieces that are going to help you and you 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:36.960 have to try to do your best with that. 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:41.800 Yeah, I just look at it. I don't think I 0:06:41.880 --> 0:06:44.039 have an answer one way or the other. 0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:48.120 I mean, like what I like to see them by, Yeah, 0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:51.680 what I like to see them by? Absolutely, because it 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:53.800 it's more fun, right, It's more fun to write about 0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:56.039 a team that's going for it. It's more fun for 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:58.320 the fans, it creates a better atmosphere in the ballpark. 0:06:58.360 --> 0:06:59.920 It's just more enjoyable to write it. 0:07:01.760 --> 0:07:05.360 But like if I am in the Pirates' front office, 0:07:05.480 --> 0:07:08.800 I'm just letting these next couple weeks play out and 0:07:08.800 --> 0:07:11.240 figure out what's gonna happen here, because I mean, the 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.800 reality is there's three and a half games to separate 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:16.440 eight teams. And when I read down the list of 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:23.600 these teams Cardinals, Phillies, Cubs, Padres, Marlins, Nationals, Diamondbacks, Pirates, 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:25.960 how many of these teams are The Pirates better than 0:07:26.360 --> 0:07:29.520 They're not better than the Cardinals, They're just not Like 0:07:29.560 --> 0:07:31.720 I've been waiting for the Cardinals to fall apart all year. 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:34.760 They're not better than the Phillies. So those are two 0:07:34.800 --> 0:07:39.080 teams that are just better than you. The Cubs. I mean, 0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:41.400 the Cubs won the division last year, or no, they did, 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:42.400 but they made. 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:44.840 The playoffs last year. Padres are a playoff team last year. 0:07:44.880 --> 0:07:47.640 Marlins are one of the best teams in baseball this month. 0:07:48.720 --> 0:07:52.720 The Nationals Diamondbacks, I mean, I don't know how good 0:07:52.760 --> 0:07:54.800 they are, Like I think the Pirates are probably in 0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:57.520 that tier, but they're they're part of that. 0:07:57.440 --> 0:07:59.400 Like next tier out right now. 0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:02.520 And I know they're a little banged up, and I know, 0:08:02.600 --> 0:08:04.160 I mean, it's not my money. I don't care how 0:08:04.280 --> 0:08:07.400 much of Bob Nutging's money gets spent. Like I think 0:08:07.440 --> 0:08:10.760 that that's great, but it's just like, realistically speaking, it's like, 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:12.400 what are you looking to achieve here? 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:14.040 Are you looking to just get to the playoffs? 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.080 And how much help do you need to even get 0:08:16.120 --> 0:08:20.840 to the playoffs, because like if you can add you know, 0:08:20.840 --> 0:08:22.600 if you had the crystal ball, and it's like, all right, 0:08:22.640 --> 0:08:24.880 you just trade a couple of double A prospects outside 0:08:24.920 --> 0:08:27.240 your top ten and you can get a couple of 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:30.440 solid relievers Connor Griffin and O'Neil Cruz get healthy. 0:08:30.840 --> 0:08:33.720 This team wins eighty five games, it's the final wildcard team. 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:37.360 Everyone's happy, obviously you do that, but like, right now, 0:08:37.440 --> 0:08:39.320 to me, like I think this team needs a little 0:08:39.320 --> 0:08:41.440 bit more than just a little help, and I'm not 0:08:42.600 --> 0:08:46.960 I'm not sure it's smart to trade away any prospect 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:49.920 in your top ten this year because it's like what 0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:51.960 if you do that and you don't even make the playoffs? 0:08:51.960 --> 0:08:54.880 Because I don't think they're a playoff team and I 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:57.200 don't think they're one good player away from a playoff team. 0:08:57.280 --> 0:08:59.600 I used to think that, but just watching them this month, 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:03.640 then I know again they're missing Griffin and Cruise, but 0:09:04.800 --> 0:09:07.600 it's been bigger than that, So I just still. 0:09:08.080 --> 0:09:08.559 I don't know. 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:12.520 Yeah, I mean, I think the number one objective that 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:15.400 would be on my mind is find someone to get 0:09:15.600 --> 0:09:18.880 Ozuna if you can get that payroll off your books, 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:21.480 even if it means pairing him with a prospect, which 0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:25.120 happened with Larryano. I believe in sixteen they traded Frankie 0:09:25.400 --> 0:09:27.800 or yeah, it was in sixteen they traded Lariano with 0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:31.240 a prosper Rice Maguire Yeah to Toronto. 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:34.280 Yeah, And like, sometimes you have to do that, and 0:09:34.960 --> 0:09:36.679 that to me is the. 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:38.680 Better route because A, I think he's just You're just 0:09:38.720 --> 0:09:41.000 a better team if he's not on the roster. And 0:09:41.040 --> 0:09:43.760 b now you have twelve million dollars that you don't 0:09:43.760 --> 0:09:46.880 have to ask Bob Nutting for because he already gave 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:50.000 you that twelve million dollars, so you can reallocate. 0:09:49.440 --> 0:09:52.040 That and it's a lot easier to get your team better. 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:56.040 I just like just having covered the team, and I'm 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:58.000 not reporting anything, it's just going. 0:09:57.760 --> 0:10:01.120 Off of it. Like it felt like they've already. 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:05.880 Invested in a comfortable amount for this organization into this 0:10:06.440 --> 0:10:08.160 and I don't think they've proven to. 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:11.520 Be anywhere near good enough to ask for more money. Again, 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:12.240 I hope. 0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:15.000 I'm rop I hope Bob Nudding gives them plenty of 0:10:15.000 --> 0:10:16.600 more money to spend and they go out and they 0:10:16.679 --> 0:10:20.920 get Trek Scugle, a Rhotis Chapman, they trade everyone. But like, 0:10:21.040 --> 0:10:24.400 I just don't think this is a club that's been 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:28.959 good enough to deserve that type of additional investment. Yeah, 0:10:29.040 --> 0:10:32.360 if you're looking at things objectively, so that's. 0:10:32.160 --> 0:10:32.720 All I see it. 0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:34.559 You can be to me in the comments on Twitter 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:37.040 about what I just said, and that's okay, We're gonna 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:37.960 take a quick break. 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:39.120 Oh did you have anything yet? 0:10:39.600 --> 0:10:41.520 I was just going to throwing that if the Pirates 0:10:41.600 --> 0:10:45.080 do go on to run here so trade deadlines August third. 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:47.960 Obviously there's that group of eight teams all in the 0:10:48.040 --> 0:10:53.040 NL wildcard rates. If things clarify, the Pirates gain an advantage, 0:10:53.400 --> 0:10:56.800 some teams fall off. They do have like the prospects 0:10:56.960 --> 0:10:59.599 to make these big moves. I mean, I don't know 0:10:59.600 --> 0:11:03.520 if you want trade and Edward Florentino orz but for 0:11:03.559 --> 0:11:06.480 this team, not for not for the but I mean 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:10.439 they do have options if those. 0:11:10.240 --> 0:11:12.680 Are guys that you trade when you're a player away 0:11:12.679 --> 0:11:13.640 from the World Series. 0:11:14.120 --> 0:11:17.960 This team's two players away from go ahead. 0:11:17.800 --> 0:11:20.360 Josh, No, I was gonna say, the team has to 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:24.760 put themselves in a position and make yeah, like, yes, 0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:28.360 you got to put yourself in a position to say, like. 0:11:30.040 --> 0:11:32.239 If they were the first place team in the Wildcard, 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:37.040 I still wouldn't be considering trading Florentino or Cethernandez. 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.720 Like that's a move you trade that. Again, that's like 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:43.640 we are one big player away the World Series. 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:47.040 They are in no scenario are they ever going to 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:48.680 be better than the Braves or. 0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:50.400 The Dodgers or the Brewers. They're just not. 0:11:51.120 --> 0:11:53.199 Their ceiling is being the fourth best team in the 0:11:53.280 --> 0:11:55.880 National League. They're not even close to that ceiling right now. 0:11:56.160 --> 0:11:57.880 So I mean, I'm at a point where it's like 0:11:57.880 --> 0:12:00.760 I don't know if I would trade I don't. 0:12:00.520 --> 0:12:02.800 Even know who their number ten prospect is right now, but. 0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:04.800 Like yeah, got Sanford or something. 0:12:05.080 --> 0:12:07.760 Yeah, Like I mean maybe, but like it would have 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:09.719 to be for somebody with multiple years of control. I 0:12:10.440 --> 0:12:13.400 don't know if I'm thinking just about twenty twenty six, 0:12:13.720 --> 0:12:17.600 which again isn't probably how Ben Sherrington's thinking. It's definitely 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:19.640 not how the fans are thinking. Yeah, but like in 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:21.600 a pure baseball sense, I just don't. 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:24.679 We've watched this team play like I don't know how 0:12:24.720 --> 0:12:25.120 many games. 0:12:25.200 --> 0:12:28.160 We're almost halfway through the season now, and they've just 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:29.320 proven to be average. 0:12:29.480 --> 0:12:31.560 So we're gonna take a quick break. 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:33.520 When we come back, we're gonna talk about something that 0:12:33.600 --> 0:12:36.280 has not been averaged. 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That's 0:13:36.160 --> 0:13:38.400 m A C K W E L d O N 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:40.679 dot com code foul. 0:13:43.160 --> 0:13:48.280 All right, backstop talk is what this segment is named. 0:13:48.559 --> 0:13:52.640 And we've got us have some talks because right now, guys, 0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:56.280 I was talking with a friend who works in UH 0:13:56.800 --> 0:13:59.959 for another team in their baseball operations office, and I say, 0:14:01.240 --> 0:14:02.640 or I asked him, I said, if you were the 0:14:02.640 --> 0:14:05.520 Pirates heading into the offseason, what is your number one 0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:09.240 area that you're addressing. I was expecting infield depth. I 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:13.640 was expecting bullpen help, maybe even starting pitching. He said, 0:14:13.720 --> 0:14:17.200 if I were running the Pittsburgh Pirates, I would be 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:21.520 looking for a starting catcher. And I actually really like 0:14:21.640 --> 0:14:25.160 that take, because in reality, listen, I feel like I've 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.840 been someone who's defended Henry Davis more than most in 0:14:28.880 --> 0:14:32.680 the Pittsburgh media. Not to say that like he's I 0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:35.440 never said he was like an amazing player or anything. 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:38.480 But I said, I don't care about Henry Davis's offense 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.120 as long as he's good defensively, as long as he's 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:43.840 getting the best out of Paul Skeens and Mitch Keller 0:14:43.880 --> 0:14:47.720 and whoever else they pair him with, that's where his 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:52.680 value comes into play. Well, right now, Paul Skeens isn't 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:54.720 pitching to the best of his abilities. 0:14:55.400 --> 0:14:58.560 Right now, Henry Davis is a negative war player. 0:14:59.560 --> 0:15:02.800 And there's a difference between being a number two catcher 0:15:02.840 --> 0:15:09.560 defensive specialist and being a total nothing at the plate. 0:15:10.080 --> 0:15:12.280 Right now, Henry Davis, I don't even need to look 0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:15.760 it up. I mean, I think he's hitting below one forty. 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:19.480 That's yeah, it's one thirty six. Josh, when you were playing, 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:22.320 you had teammates who were pitchers that had a better 0:15:22.360 --> 0:15:25.320 batting average than that. People who did not even. 0:15:25.200 --> 0:15:27.280 Work had a better batting average thing. 0:15:28.040 --> 0:15:30.280 By like sixty to seventy points. 0:15:30.520 --> 0:15:33.240 Like Hedges was under two hundred, but like, I don't 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:36.280 think he ever got below one fifty, and one fifty 0:15:36.400 --> 0:15:38.000 is like unacceptable. 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:43.680 But against his edge, eighteen hits, eighteen hits the entire season, and. 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:46.480 Hedges is one of the best defensive players of any 0:15:46.480 --> 0:15:52.440 position pounds for pound in baseball, so you're getting value there. Again, 0:15:52.560 --> 0:15:57.080 Henry is a below replacement level player, hitting like worse 0:15:57.120 --> 0:15:59.360 than Madison Bumgardner did in his prime. 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:03.400 It's it's it's just borderline on it. It's not borderline. 0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:05.400 It's just unacceptable and. 0:16:05.600 --> 0:16:06.400 You gotta be better. 0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:09.920 And I know it's one of the things we highlighted 0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:14.120 obviously a lot of times throughout you know, conversations we 0:16:14.160 --> 0:16:18.080 have we've had about you know, offensive production from behind 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:19.880 the plate, and oh man, if these guys can just 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:22.800 you know, get the staff through and you know, be 0:16:22.960 --> 0:16:24.960 a rock for those guys being anchor and you know, 0:16:25.440 --> 0:16:27.320 lead them to the promised land. You know, you guys 0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:30.280 can hit two hundred well, as you said, one thirties, 0:16:30.360 --> 0:16:35.440 not two hundred. And like it's not like you're asking 0:16:35.600 --> 0:16:40.000 for this outrageous production to say we want to seventy 0:16:40.080 --> 0:16:43.080 with ten to fifteen. It's like, man, you can just 0:16:43.160 --> 0:16:46.720 hit the mendoz A line. And that's kind of that's 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:49.720 kind of crazy saying right now, because before the season 0:16:50.560 --> 0:16:53.000 I want to say, Noah, you might have even said, man, 0:16:53.040 --> 0:16:56.200 if he hit around the Mendoze line, I'd be fine, yep, 0:16:57.640 --> 0:17:00.760 and that's not really like set up a high bar. 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:04.240 But I think I was talking to somebody and even 0:17:04.280 --> 0:17:06.720 diving too the numbers, which is even more alarming to me, 0:17:06.760 --> 0:17:09.560 which is also goes back to one of the conversations 0:17:09.560 --> 0:17:12.920 we had is I don't think he strikes out a lot, 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:18.720 and that is so it's like, I mean, it's hard, 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:22.160 like I get it. Guys go through stretches where it's like, Okay, 0:17:22.200 --> 0:17:24.520 this dude went oh for twenty this dude w Chris 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:25.520 Davis crush had. 0:17:25.640 --> 0:17:27.960 He had one of the weirdest streaks ever. 0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:30.639 You know, So we're not we're not saying that you 0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:34.359 can't go through these funks, but it seems as if 0:17:34.680 --> 0:17:36.880 through the course of his career it has always been 0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:39.280 underperformance on the offensive side. 0:17:39.359 --> 0:17:42.840 And then no, you made a big point. 0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:45.439 To say that his values kind of lie, you know, 0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:47.639 placed into you know, how he handles the staff and 0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:50.320 what he does, and when that's not going well, what 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:53.280 value does he have? Right and on a team that 0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:57.360 is already struggling, you know, with health, struggling, defensively, struggling, 0:17:57.440 --> 0:18:00.840 with pitching behind the plate is the more most important 0:18:00.840 --> 0:18:01.840 position on that field. 0:18:02.800 --> 0:18:05.640 I've played that is the most important position behind that field. 0:18:05.640 --> 0:18:07.480 Branded you're gonna have guys that go down and you 0:18:07.560 --> 0:18:09.960 got but you need to have you're speaking of a 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:11.440 number two. You got to have a good number two, 0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:12.760 and you need to have a good number three and 0:18:12.840 --> 0:18:15.200 number four that just a can pop in and fill 0:18:15.200 --> 0:18:18.520 in because catchers take a beat him. But if you 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:23.080 don't have continuity behind that plate, that is tough. And 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.439 then if you're not getting much offensive production makes it 0:18:25.440 --> 0:18:28.280 even tougher because it's like, how do you justify, you know, 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:32.199 having this guy in here, you know, or these guys 0:18:32.320 --> 0:18:35.320 and they're not producing. Like they may be great guys, 0:18:35.480 --> 0:18:37.719 you know, but like at some point you have to produce. 0:18:37.920 --> 0:18:39.840 And as I said, it's not to be asked to 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:42.679 produce at this All Star level, it's just to be 0:18:42.800 --> 0:18:46.320 produced to say, hey, you're giving something of value. But 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:49.560 eighteen hits at this point the season, with as many 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:52.560 at bats as he had, and given his track record, 0:18:53.280 --> 0:18:56.560 I'm not one to doubt anybody because I've played the game. 0:18:56.600 --> 0:18:57.720 I know it can turn. 0:18:57.800 --> 0:18:59.520 But at the same time, at this point you kind 0:18:59.560 --> 0:19:02.000 of are who you are, and at what point do 0:19:02.119 --> 0:19:05.199 they continue to you know, run him out there and 0:19:05.240 --> 0:19:07.680 not give other guys a chance, or as you said that, 0:19:07.840 --> 0:19:10.080 one person said they'd be going after a catcher. 0:19:11.480 --> 0:19:14.560 Yeah. And last episode we were talking about Andie Rodriguez 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:19.080 stepping up, and I think Andy's a fine backup, you know, 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:21.960 number two catcher. Yeah, but I don't know if you 0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:24.240 can trust him being your starting catcher right now, right 0:19:24.280 --> 0:19:26.240 so I don't think that's in the options. 0:19:26.520 --> 0:19:27.560 And I don't think so. 0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:31.439 Yeah, And just to really quickly touch on too, we 0:19:31.440 --> 0:19:35.840 haven't Joey Bart was traded since we were last recorded, 0:19:35.920 --> 0:19:39.840 and I thought that decision was somewhat intriguing because a 0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:41.560 lot of people were saying, like, is a time to 0:19:41.640 --> 0:19:44.520 send Henry Davis down to Triple A? Is that going 0:19:44.560 --> 0:19:48.359 to solve anything? Do you think like or like Josh said, 0:19:48.400 --> 0:19:50.000 you know, is this just who he is? 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:54.520 It's always and real quick on Bart. 0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:58.800 I mean one, they're clearing up salary clearly to add 0:19:58.840 --> 0:20:00.040 another bullpen orm. 0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:02.760 And I viewed that he's out. 0:20:02.600 --> 0:20:07.199 Of options, and I mean long term value, like Henry 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:10.840 is Paul's catcher, so you're not you're not trading him. 0:20:10.880 --> 0:20:13.800 And Andy Rodriguez is playing the best of the three 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:14.720 this year. 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:16.360