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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to

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Speaker 1: the whitetail woods, presented by First Light, creating proven versatile

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Speaker 1: hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First Light,

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Speaker 1: Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host, Mark Kenyon,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the.

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Speaker 2: Wired to Hunt podcast.

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Speaker 3: This week on the show, John Eberhart and Greg Godfrey

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Speaker 3: are detailing for us their recipe for success for hunting

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Speaker 3: pressured white tails during the peak of the run. All right,

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Speaker 3: welcome back to the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to

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Speaker 3: you by First Light and their Camo for Conservation Initiative,

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Speaker 3: and we will still be providing you our hunting songs

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Speaker 3: of sorts, big white tails and the most Wonderful Time

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Speaker 3: to Kill Deer, but we're to put them at the

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Speaker 3: end of the episode because my buddy further aka Josh

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Speaker 3: doesn't know how to fast forward through parts of the

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Speaker 3: podcast he doesn't want to listen to, so to make

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Speaker 3: it easier for him, we're going to put at the

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Speaker 3: very end of the show. So if you enjoy those songs,

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Speaker 3: you can still catch it after our show here today.

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Speaker 3: But we do have a great podcast for you. We're

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Speaker 3: talking the rut, the peak of the rut the super

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Speaker 3: Bowl of our season. It is here, it's going on

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Speaker 3: right now, and our guests today are going to help

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Speaker 3: us explore a number of different ways to have success

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Speaker 3: this time of year, especially if you hunt in places

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Speaker 3: where there's a lot of hunting pressure. My guests have

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Speaker 3: been on the show before. John Eberhardt is a legend.

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Speaker 3: It's likely that you know him. He's the author of

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Speaker 3: many books. He's been on this podcast five or six

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Speaker 3: times over the years. A absolute og when it comes

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Speaker 3: to killing mature bucks in places like Michigan or other

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Speaker 3: heavily pressured states. He's also proven these techniques they'll work

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Speaker 3: in other states too. He goes to Indiana, Ohio, Kansas, Illinois, etc.

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Speaker 3: And then our second guest today is Greg Godford. He's

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Speaker 3: one of the co founders of Tethered and another guy

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Speaker 3: who's proven to be successful in many different parts of

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Speaker 3: the country, especially with this mobile hunting strategy that he's

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Speaker 3: really perfected with his saddle system there at Tethered. So

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Speaker 3: that's what we have in store for you today. And

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Speaker 3: we have had John on the show a number of

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Speaker 3: times and we've touched a little bit on some of

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Speaker 3: his rut techniques. But today we are getting into a

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Speaker 3: level of detail that we've never before. The entire show

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Speaker 3: today is just getting into the nitty gritty of how

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Speaker 3: he and Greg think about hunting the rut. So we

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Speaker 3: cover everything from the various types of locations you'll want

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Speaker 3: to focus on during this time period of the year.

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Speaker 4: We get into a lot of.

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Speaker 3: The philosophy around deciding how long you should stay put

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Speaker 3: in a location versus moving and you know, being mobile,

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Speaker 3: get into a number of other techniques, decoys, calling, all

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Speaker 3: sorts of good stuff. This one will be very actionable,

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Speaker 3: very useful for you in the upcoming days, whether you

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Speaker 3: hunt in Michigan or Pennsylvania or Georgia or Wio. Whatever

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Speaker 3: it is, we got you covered here. It's gonna be

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Speaker 3: a good one. John and Greg co authored a book

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Speaker 3: that just came out recently. It's called The Ultimate Guide

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Speaker 3: to DIY Books. Here it is right here for those

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Speaker 3: of you watching. There's actually three books. It's a three

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Speaker 3: volume set, so we cover a lot that's mentioned in

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Speaker 3: that book as well, So check out those after the

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Speaker 3: podcast if you want more from Greg and John. And

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Speaker 3: I think that is it. I think we can get

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Speaker 3: right into our show today. I will mention that there's

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Speaker 3: a new film from myself over on the media or

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Speaker 3: YouTube channel, so you can check out my Nebraska whitetail

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Speaker 3: hunt from last year. It was a really exciting hunt.

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Speaker 3: Things got turned upside down from what I thought they

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Speaker 3: were going to be. I had to kind of create

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Speaker 3: a brand new plan on the spot found to get

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Speaker 3: on some deer on the ground without trees. It's an

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Speaker 3: interesting one. You can find it. You can watch it

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Speaker 3: at the Meat Eater YouTube channel. I appreciate that, and

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Speaker 3: that is it. I think we should get into our show.

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Speaker 3: If you are out there hunting right now in mid

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Speaker 3: November or that second week, whatever it is, I'm wishing

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Speaker 3: you the best of luck. Stuff should be great out there.

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Speaker 3: This is what we have waited all year for, so

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Speaker 3: enjoy it. Putting the time, stay optimistic. Just remember anything

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Speaker 3: is possible this time of year, so I'll be pulling

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Speaker 3: for you. That said, let's get to my chat with

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Speaker 3: John and Greg. All right here with me back on

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Speaker 3: the line. Both of these gentlemen are returning guests. I've

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Speaker 3: got Greg Godfrey and John Eberhart. Gentlemen, thank you for

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Speaker 3: making time to do this right in the heat of

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Speaker 3: the rut and all the excite and that's about to hit.

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Speaker 5: Thanks for the opportunity. Always appreciate being on your show.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, it's always fun to talk to Mark, one of

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Speaker 6: the uh what I call the ogs of white Tail

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Speaker 6: podcasting content. I think Mark, you kind of started it

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Speaker 6: way back in the day, back in the in the

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Speaker 6: early Wired to Hunt days, So it's uh, I'm always

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Speaker 6: well've been on the show once, but it's really cool

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Speaker 6: to be invited back. It means a lot to me personally.

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Speaker 6: Well right back at you guys, I appreciate it. And

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Speaker 6: and Greg, your product and ideas around that product have

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Speaker 6: changed my hunting in a big way. And John, you

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Speaker 6: know I've said this to you a thousand times, but

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Speaker 6: your your early books and everything were instrumental in my

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Speaker 6: journey too. So all the way around this is this

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Speaker 6: is good stuff. It's exciting stuff.

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Speaker 3: And as we just said, you both have been on

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Speaker 3: the podcast before, but we have never done a podcast

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Speaker 3: that was strict all things. Let's dive deep into the

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Speaker 3: rut and that's what I want to do here today

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Speaker 3: because when this podcast drops, it will be November seventh,

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Speaker 3: so for a lot of people that's going to be

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Speaker 3: like peak rut. This is their rut cation, this is

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Speaker 3: when they're taking their time off. There's a lot of

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Speaker 3: people over the next couple weeks that are looking at

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Speaker 3: this as their super Bowl. And I know you guys

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Speaker 3: put some extensive time and effort into discussing this timeframe

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Speaker 3: in your latest book series, and so I wanted to

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Speaker 3: take this opportunity to kind of dig into the nitty

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Speaker 3: gritty of that, and maybe the place to start would

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Speaker 3: be in breaking down how you guys look at the

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Speaker 3: rut and how dear behavior changes through that, because within

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Speaker 3: your book or books, I should say, rather you kind

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Speaker 3: of separate it out into three different phases. Everyone's got

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Speaker 3: different ways they like to define the rut and how

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Speaker 3: they break it down. But you guys kind of broke

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Speaker 3: it down by pre rut, peak rut, post rut. Before

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Speaker 3: we get into the actually how you set up and

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Speaker 3: hunt each one of those different things, maybe John, would

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Speaker 3: you kick us off by just walking me through how

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Speaker 3: you think about dear behavior changing through those three periods

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Speaker 3: of the rut and what the timeframe is that you

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Speaker 3: are kind of breaking those three chunks into.

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Speaker 5: Yes, pre rut is probably my favorite time of the

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Speaker 5: season and the rut in general is like the playoffs.

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Speaker 5: You know, it's like, you know, making the playoffs in

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Speaker 5: a sport activity, because that's where you want to focus

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Speaker 5: your most attention. If you're gonna get any vacation time,

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Speaker 5: that's when you want to spend it in the woods.

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Speaker 2: But during pre.

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Speaker 5: Rut, the mature bucks, which if primarily if you're in

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Speaker 5: a pressure area of any semblance, it primarily been pretty

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Speaker 5: nocturnal outside the security cover of their betting areas. So

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Speaker 5: as testosterone rises throughout the early season and through the

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Speaker 5: October lull, it kind of reaches its peak during pre

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Speaker 5: rod and those mature bucks actually start searching for early

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Speaker 5: estras doves. If you're in an area that's got quite

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Speaker 5: a few deer, there's always going to be a dough

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Speaker 5: or two here and there to come into estras early,

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Speaker 5: and those the testosterone has risen to the point and

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Speaker 5: they haven't bred since last year and they want to

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Speaker 5: get out there and breed.

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Speaker 7: So the cool thing about the pre.

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Speaker 5: Rod is not all the not a majority of the

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Speaker 5: dos are coming into heat at the same time, where

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Speaker 5: during pre rod or i mean peak rut, mature bucks

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Speaker 5: typically going to be doughed up most of the time

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Speaker 5: he's going.

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Speaker 7: To typically be with breeding estras does.

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Speaker 5: Because there's so many dogs in the area, usually in

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Speaker 5: a pressured area, that probably the three and a half

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Speaker 5: year old and older.

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Speaker 7: Bucks two other deer.

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Speaker 5: You know, be doze bawns, a year and a half

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Speaker 5: and two and a half year old bucks. The ratio

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Speaker 5: is probably forty or fifty to one. So once an

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Speaker 5: extra cycle of the dough he's breeding is over, it

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Speaker 5: doesn't take him long to pick up the next estra's dough.

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Speaker 5: If he crosses her sentence she's with another buck, he

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Speaker 5: just follows her and takes her dakes her away. So

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Speaker 5: peak rut to me because the mature bucks are doped

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Speaker 5: up so much it's hard to get on one. And

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Speaker 5: then also the routines are totally out the window because

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Speaker 5: they're with doughs, so they're following dough roads or they're

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Speaker 5: in where doors are betting, so pre rut they're following

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Speaker 5: set routines. All those scrapes that you find in the woods,

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Speaker 5: you know, that's what they're visiting. Because the scrapes that

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Speaker 5: they make are always near some sort of area where

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Speaker 5: there's a lot of heavy dough activity. An influx of

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Speaker 5: DO activity. Usually it's by oaks, apple trees, whatever the

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Speaker 5: mast or fruit trees you might have on your property

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Speaker 5: are going to be or if you have property and

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Speaker 5: you have food plots, there's going to be.

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Speaker 7: DO activity at the food plots.

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Speaker 5: So that's typically where you're gonna find scrapes along field edges,

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Speaker 5: crop field edges, So they follow a routine during pre

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Speaker 5: run because they're not breeding.

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Speaker 7: They're not breeding those all the time, and so it's.

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Speaker 5: Much easier to kill a buck during pre rug, which

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Speaker 5: I termed the pre rock running about October twenty five

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Speaker 5: to November five up here in the Midwest, and it's

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Speaker 5: just easier to get on a pattern if you hunt

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Speaker 5: those active scrapes and they have the adequate security cover

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Speaker 5: for mature buck activity during daylight hours, you know they got,

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Speaker 5: you know, from a betting area to transition out of

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Speaker 5: a betting area to these scrape areas. As long as

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Speaker 5: there's adequate security cover, they're going to visit those during

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Speaker 5: daylight hours. A lot of times it's during midday, so

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Speaker 5: pre run's my favorite time. I think a lot of

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Speaker 5: hunters mess up their rut phase locations by by hunting

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Speaker 5: their rut phase locations too early and they alter the

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Speaker 5: dot traffic.

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Speaker 7: And therefore, once you alter the dough traffic that you're hunting.

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Speaker 5: Location during the October low by hunting it too much,

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Speaker 5: that altered dot traffic is also going to alter the

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Speaker 5: mature buck activity at that location when they start pursuing

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Speaker 5: ester shows. As far as the post rut, post ruts

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Speaker 5: really kind of interesting because there's only a few states

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Speaker 5: in the country where you can go and hunt bow hunt, and.

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Speaker 7: We're ball hunters primarily.

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Speaker 5: There's only a few states in the country where you

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Speaker 5: can go and physically bow hunt bucks before the gun

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Speaker 5: season because if you're in a heavily pressured state and

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Speaker 5: gun season opens up like Michigan's October fifteenth, I think

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Speaker 5: Missouri is the second Saturday in November, so it's Nebraska,

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Speaker 5: so you know, their gun seasons are during the peak ruts.

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Speaker 5: So by post rut, those mature bucks are pretty nocturnal.

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Speaker 7: Not moving much during daylight hours.

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Speaker 5: So the only states really that you can do some

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Speaker 5: good post ruck bull hunting would be Iowa, Kansas with

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Speaker 5: your draw states, what other draw states or what other states.

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Speaker 8: Ohio also has a late dune season, so those those

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Speaker 8: are the three primary big buck states where you can

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Speaker 8: hunt hunt mature bucks during polst rut and still have

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Speaker 8: a good gence.

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Speaker 3: So that's that's helpful, John. I guess what I what

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Speaker 3: I'm curious about, and maybe maybe this is the best

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Speaker 3: place to start. Actually, let me take a time out

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Speaker 3: and step one step back, because I forgot one thing

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Speaker 3: I did want to ask you, Greg related to what

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Speaker 3: John just said, which was, I know you have experienced

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Speaker 3: down in the South where rut timing and rut stuff

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Speaker 3: is just a little bit different.

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Speaker 4: Have you seen anything in your time in.

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Speaker 3: Georgia or anywhere else down there where that dear behavior

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Speaker 3: is different from pre to peak to post from what

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Speaker 3: John's described, or is it basically the same but just

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Speaker 3: different calendar dates because of the weird stuff across different

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Speaker 3: states down there.

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Speaker 6: I think it's option B. I think the deer still

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Speaker 6: respond in the South pretty similarly to what John described,

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Speaker 6: but the calendar dates are all wonky. For instance, in

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Speaker 6: Georgia where I live. In South Georgia and Savannah where

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Speaker 6: I live, our rut starts in middle of October and

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Speaker 6: it goes through the end of October. It's much more

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Speaker 6: aligned with more of a southern deer who, like the

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Speaker 6: deer in Florida, can rut as early as August, July

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Speaker 6: and August, and in the southeast corner of Georgia they

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Speaker 6: rut in October. Well, if you move more towards the

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Speaker 6: middle of the state, where a lot of the deer

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Speaker 6: were imported in the seventies, sixties and seventies from the

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Speaker 6: northern states like Wisconsin, those deer have more of a

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Speaker 6: traditional November rut. And then the further west you go

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Speaker 6: in the state closer to Alabama, you get a later

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Speaker 6: rut where they rut in January. So in Georgia you

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Speaker 6: can hunt running deer from October all the way through

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Speaker 6: the new year.

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Speaker 3: That's crazy. I can't imagine that. So okay, So that's

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Speaker 3: that's good to know. So everyone wherever you're listening, you should,

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Speaker 3: you know, take this and adjust date specific based.

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Speaker 4: On your region.

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Speaker 3: But in your in your guys's books, the way you

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Speaker 3: broke it down was kind of the standard Midwest and

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Speaker 3: upper two thirds of the country timing, which is kind

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Speaker 3: of that pre rut being late October through maybe the

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Speaker 3: first week of November. And then I think you guys

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Speaker 3: defined peak rut is somewhere in that middle of November

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Speaker 3: week or two period, and then post route was kind

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Speaker 3: of like maybe Thanksgiving ish on for a little ways.

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Speaker 3: So with that in mind, the next thing I wanted

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Speaker 3: to kind of steer us towards was some of the

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Speaker 3: specific focus areas you guys detailed as far as rut

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Speaker 3: hunting locations, and something I'd be curious each as we

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Speaker 3: go through each one of the would be you guys

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Speaker 3: to share with me how you would hunt these kinds

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Speaker 3: of spots, but then also how that might shift through

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Speaker 3: those three phases of the rut. So for example, something

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Speaker 3: I know, John, you've talked about a ton in the past,

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Speaker 3: and you guys wrote about in the books where you're

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Speaker 3: focusing on scrape areas, So maybe let's start there.

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Speaker 4: Could you talk about.

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Speaker 3: Hunting around primary scrapes scrape areas and detail for us,

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Speaker 3: you know, how that shifts throughout the various phases of

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Speaker 3: the rut, and specifically like how you find these and

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Speaker 3: identify these but then also actually set up on them.

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Speaker 3: Because I think people generally understand, you know, hey, if

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Speaker 3: I find some great scrapes back and cover, I should

284
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Speaker 3: hunt that, but fewer people know the right way to

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Speaker 3: do that. So I'd love to start with this and

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Speaker 3: then we'll have a similar conversation around several other rut hotspots.

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Speaker 3: You guys detail, But John, can you kick us off

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Speaker 3: with your thoughts here on scrapes since that's so key

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Speaker 3: for you.

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Speaker 7: I'm old and that's hard to remember all that stuff.

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Speaker 4: Give me the loadout on primary scrapes.

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Speaker 5: Well, yeah, scouting is a huge issue to me. To me,

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Speaker 5: scouting is eighty ninety percent of the game, you know,

294
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Speaker 5: And I do the majority of the vast majority of

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Speaker 5: my scouting during postseason because after deer season's over, you

296
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Speaker 5: can scout places the foliages down the scrapes are still

297
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Speaker 5: very obvious looking branches, rubs or everything is really obvious,

298
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Speaker 5: you know, before greenup. So I'm looking for scrape areas

299
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Speaker 5: of scrapes and mass trees, cruit trees, whatever the case

300
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Speaker 5: may be. And when I find scrapes in there in

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Speaker 5: you know, if you're walking through a woods like on

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Speaker 5: public land, and you're out in relatively open timber and

303
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Speaker 5: you might find a couple of white oaks or something

304
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Speaker 5: with some scrapes there, you know that that is meaningless

305
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Speaker 5: to me because for scrape activity that I find to

306
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Speaker 5: be worth hunting, it has to have adequate security cover

307
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Speaker 5: around that kill zone where those scrapes are, and it

308
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Speaker 5: has to have adequate security cover to a known betting area.

309
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Speaker 5: So a lot of times those scrapes I find will

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Speaker 5: be around perimeters of betting areas. It's very common to

311
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Speaker 5: find active scrapes around a crop field during post season

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Speaker 5: pick cornfield, and those scrapes were made during you know,

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Speaker 5: if you were going to hunt that those scrapes, you'd

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Speaker 5: have to hunt them prior to the corn being picked. Okay,

315
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Speaker 5: so once the corn's picked, with those scrapes being on

316
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Speaker 5: the edge of an open field with pitcorn, the buffer

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Speaker 5: mature butck's going to feel too vulnerable to visit during

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Speaker 5: day late hours. You're and a half and two and

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Speaker 5: a half's yes, if that's what you're after, you know

320
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Speaker 5: you could hunt those, But when you're hunting mature bucks,

321
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Speaker 5: scrapes have to have some semblance of security cover around them,

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Speaker 5: an adequate security cover to a known betting area, or

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Speaker 5: be around the perimeter of the betting area or in

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Speaker 5: a betting area for me personally to hunt them, whether

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Speaker 5: it be fre rut, peak rut, or puls drive.

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Speaker 7: So the security cover aspect of scrapes is a big deal.

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Speaker 5: And at least a very minimum of fifty percent of

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Speaker 5: the bucks I've killed over the last i'd say forty

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Speaker 5: years have been scrape oriented, so it you know, typically

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Speaker 5: it's it may be at a mass tree that has

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Speaker 5: some scrapes and apple tree that when it was dropping apples,

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Speaker 5: you know, the doors were feeding there, so that's why

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Speaker 5: the bucks made the scrapes there, or a chestnut tree

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Speaker 5: or some white oaks along the edge, you know, and

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Speaker 5: as long as it has the adequate security cover for

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Speaker 5: daytime mature bucket activity and movement, you know, that's what

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Speaker 5: I'm going to hunt.

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Speaker 3: Does that change at all once we get into that

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Speaker 3: peak rut time when it's November seven or ten or

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Speaker 3: thirteen and we're right in the heat of it, Are

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Speaker 3: you still king in on primary scrape areas or does

342
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Speaker 3: that shift as November plots along.

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Speaker 5: As the rot phase plots along. I don't hunt the

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Speaker 5: peripheral scrapes that I would have hunted during pre rud

345
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Speaker 5: When the root phase comes, I'm in betting areas a lot,

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Speaker 5: you know, because bucks, the mature bucks are going to

347
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Speaker 5: push those estra stows into security cover. That's where they

348
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Speaker 5: want to breed them where they feel safe, you know,

349
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Speaker 5: every twenty minutes or half hour, forty minutes getting up

350
00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:29,719
Speaker 5: and breeding, you go and you know, pushing her around.

351
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:32,600
Speaker 5: They want to feel safe and secure. So I love

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Speaker 5: hunting betting areas during the physical rut phases or just

353
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Speaker 5: inside the perimeter edge of the betting area. But during

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Speaker 5: pre rod you know, I'll hunt scrape areas along edges

355
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Speaker 5: of cornfield as long as there's security cover butting up

356
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Speaker 5: to the cornfield in the timber or swamp bordering the cornfield.

357
00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:53,000
Speaker 5: Or I'll hunt an apple tree or white oak tree

358
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Speaker 5: that's got adequate security cover around the area and adqut

359
00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:59,520
Speaker 5: security cover to a known betting area. But your question

360
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:06,120
Speaker 5: was during peak ruts. During peak rut, those peripheral scrapes

361
00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:09,120
Speaker 5: outside the betting areas, they lose the majority of their

362
00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:13,359
Speaker 5: activity because the mature bucks are with doughs most of

363
00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:16,080
Speaker 5: the time because the buck to dope mature buck to

364
00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 5: dough ratios are so skewed it doesn't take them long

365
00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:20,320
Speaker 5: to pick up another dough and they're with them a

366
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,560
Speaker 5: lot time. So obviously there's no requirement for them to

367
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:26,480
Speaker 5: make strapes or visits rates. So that's why I like

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Speaker 5: to be within the betting run.

369
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Speaker 4: Am I right though?

370
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Speaker 3: In thinking that things shift again once you get to

371
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Speaker 3: the post rut because the post rut's kind of similar

372
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Speaker 3: to the pre rup. There's fewer doughs ready to breed,

373
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Speaker 3: so bucks kind of return to that same seeking type behavior.

374
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Speaker 5: You're one correct, but again, if you're in a pressured state,

375
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Speaker 5: that post rut activity is almost totally not ternal. So

376
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Speaker 5: you know in those states I mentioned before, Ohio, Kansas,

377
00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:09,760
Speaker 5: and Iowa, Yeah, post ruts exactly like hunting pre rod.

378
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:14,200
Speaker 5: In fact, when I we did drawn for Kansas this year,

379
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 5: we got drawn for Kansas, and we like it going

380
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 5: during post ruck. We prefer post rut because the mature bucks,

381
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:26,199
Speaker 5: they've been breeding for two weeks solid, you know, at

382
00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:31,600
Speaker 5: least two weeks solid, they're worn down, their eyes are glassy,

383
00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:37,400
Speaker 5: they've somewhat lost a lot of their security cover or

384
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 5: I don't know what the word is of their cautiousness,

385
00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:46,000
Speaker 5: I guess, and now the majority of the dose are bread.

386
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:48,280
Speaker 5: So now they have to do exactly what they did

387
00:21:48,359 --> 00:21:51,400
Speaker 5: during pre rod and go out and physically leave those

388
00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:55,199
Speaker 5: betting area haunts, and now they'll start working their strapes

389
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 5: again wherever there's no activity, and they'll have a routine

390
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:00,480
Speaker 5: just like they did during free right.

391
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:06,880
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's it's kind of like they get they're so preoccupied, uh,

392
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:11,320
Speaker 6: for the past two weeks of breeding doz that they

393
00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 6: they they lose a little bit of that safety concern

394
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,120
Speaker 6: that they've had for the rest of the year, and

395
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:23,280
Speaker 6: so oftentimes you see those big mature bucks making a

396
00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:26,720
Speaker 6: mistake at exactly the time period when you've talked about John,

397
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:30,080
Speaker 6: when they're they've been screwing around with does for two weeks,

398
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,360
Speaker 6: they're tired, they've been in a whole bunch of fights.

399
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,600
Speaker 6: They've been kicking their buddies' butts, fighting back and forth

400
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:38,399
Speaker 6: up and down every ridge, and they kind of lose

401
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 6: a little bit of their safety concern and it's a

402
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,920
Speaker 6: great time to find those big mature bucks that don't

403
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:47,120
Speaker 6: make mistakes, uh throughout the rest of the year.

404
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:52,400
Speaker 5: Yeah. Great. Can I throw a stat in there real quick, Mark?

405
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 9: Yeah?

406
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:53,879
Speaker 7: Please do them.

407
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:59,440
Speaker 5: Get to give people an idea of runt face hunting.

408
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,040
Speaker 5: Midday is a big part of my broad face hunting

409
00:23:02,280 --> 00:23:04,679
Speaker 5: because when you're hunting in security cover areas, whether it

410
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:09,760
Speaker 5: be pre rock or during the peak rut, I just

411
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:10,640
Speaker 5: lost my train of thought.

412
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:11,920
Speaker 7: That's what sucks about getting old.

413
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 5: Mid midday, midday big part of my kill strategy. I'm

414
00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,640
Speaker 5: getting to the point where I can't hunt all day

415
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,199
Speaker 5: like I used to as many all day sits. But

416
00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,560
Speaker 5: to give you a stat of my twenty Michigan bucks

417
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,960
Speaker 5: that I've taken the made book that I took between

418
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 5: November one and November fourteen with a bowl, seven of

419
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,080
Speaker 5: them were shot between eleven and three o'clock in the afternoon,

420
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:45,560
Speaker 5: while statistically less than eight percent of my time spent

421
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,200
Speaker 5: on stand was between eleven and three.

422
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 7: O'clock in the afternoon.

423
00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:52,479
Speaker 5: So that's thirty five percent kill rate with less than

424
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,440
Speaker 5: eight percent of on time stand. But it's got it

425
00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 5: has to be. People will just go out there and

426
00:23:57,560 --> 00:23:59,679
Speaker 5: hunter in midday and they're just hunting, you know, in

427
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 5: open timber or whatever.

428
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 7: That's a total waste of time.

429
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 5: It has to be in security, government, a betting area,

430
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 5: or transitions one between a.

431
00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:07,800
Speaker 7: Betting area and another betting area.

432
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's pretty eye opening. I was gonna I want

433
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 3: to continue down that line, John, when it comes to

434
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 3: your midday hunting strategy. But before we leave scrapes really quick,

435
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 3: I got to ask you, Greg, John has been like

436
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 3: the profit of scrapes for thirty years now, been preaching

437
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 3: the benefits of primary scrape areas and everything like that.

438
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 4: Are you as.

439
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:37,160
Speaker 3: Bought into hunting primary scrape areas and deepen the cover

440
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 3: scrapes during the rut as he is, or do you

441
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 3: have a different take?

442
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,520
Speaker 6: I would say the answer to both of those are yes.

443
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 6: When John says it about deer hunting, you can pretty

444
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 6: much believe it that he knows what he's talking about

445
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:54,160
Speaker 6: and that he's killed seven book bucks in the most

446
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:57,440
Speaker 6: popular or most heavily pressured states and he's figured out

447
00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:01,040
Speaker 6: a way to get done. So that's the first part. Yes,

448
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 6: listen to John before you listen to me. Listen to John.

449
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,880
Speaker 6: John knows what he's talking about. But I do have

450
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 6: a little different take on it. I agree with everything

451
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 6: that John said, and he's right. I like to focus

452
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 6: more on those transition areas me personally, John likes to

453
00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 6: get deep into a bedding area and the most the

454
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,239
Speaker 6: hardest place for a hunter to get one of the

455
00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:30,159
Speaker 6: One of the analogies that John uses in his books,

456
00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,280
Speaker 6: as he says that I've read in the past bow

457
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 6: Hunting Pressured white tails is he says, I like to

458
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,320
Speaker 6: pretend like I'm a deer and all the hunters are

459
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 6: trying to kill me, and where would I go?

460
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 2: And that's a useful exercise.

461
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 6: And that's how John he A lot of his a

462
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,280
Speaker 6: lot of his tactics and strategies revolve around that, which

463
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:52,399
Speaker 6: makes perfect sense. I tend to like to hunt those

464
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:58,400
Speaker 6: little transition spots that are oftentimes terrain related, a saddle

465
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:02,200
Speaker 6: in a hilltop, a pinch point because of a river.

466
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:06,439
Speaker 6: I tend to like to focus on areas like that

467
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 6: that give me a very decided advantage that also contained

468
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:16,879
Speaker 6: the things that John talks about. So my ideal rut

469
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:21,120
Speaker 6: spot would be a big betting area here, a big

470
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,520
Speaker 6: betting area here with a big ridge that separated them

471
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,920
Speaker 6: in a low spot for a buck to cross easily.

472
00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 6: And in that low spot there's security cover and.

473
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 7: Scrapes.

474
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,720
Speaker 6: That's like my number one spot to find. I like

475
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 6: spots that I can get into with bulletproof entry and exit.

476
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 2: Bill Wink wrote an article many, many.

477
00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 6: Many years ago in Bowhunter magazine, probably twenty five years

478
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:51,639
Speaker 6: ago and the whole article was about access, and he

479
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,120
Speaker 6: talked about how there are tons and tons of good

480
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 6: spots out there that hunters screw up because they aren't

481
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 6: concerned learn with their access. So I love a spot

482
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 6: that I can get into and out of without being detected,

483
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:09,160
Speaker 6: and it is going to be more of a transition

484
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:12,480
Speaker 6: spot than a destination spot. That's the only thing that

485
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:15,439
Speaker 6: I would say I rank higher on my on my

486
00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 6: hunt now factor is that it's which is basically the

487
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 6: same as John, but it's just a little nuanced.

488
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:28,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's interesting. I I wanna I want to touch

489
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:33,600
Speaker 3: on transitions that you just described there. But another scrape

490
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,880
Speaker 3: relay question came to mind that if I don't ask now,

491
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 3: I will forget to do it. John, you had you

492
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 3: had talked about and maybe this is in the book

493
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:44,640
Speaker 3: that you guys were talking about this, but when hunting

494
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,600
Speaker 3: scrape areas or primary scrape areas, really this this actually

495
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 3: could apply to many different types of locations. But but

496
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 3: there had been discussion around the volume of hunts that

497
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 3: you should give a given scrape or a given betting area,

498
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,119
Speaker 3: and oftentimes we want to hunt new spots all the time.

499
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:06,359
Speaker 3: That's one of the benefits of the mobile style of

500
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:10,439
Speaker 3: hunting that all three of us use. But it seems

501
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:13,879
Speaker 3: like sometimes you have to give a location time to

502
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 3: actually produce. Can you discuss that a little bit, John,

503
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 3: as far as how many hunts you would throw at

504
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,119
Speaker 3: a good looking primary scrape area or a good looking

505
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 3: betting area before you'd say, Okay, I need to move

506
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 3: on because I've educated too much here, or I need

507
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 3: to seek out greener pastures.

508
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,119
Speaker 5: Well, first off, when I'm hunting betting areas during the

509
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:37,439
Speaker 5: pre or rut or the rut phase, I'm I'm in

510
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 5: the past.

511
00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 7: Anyway, I don't do it as much now.

512
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 5: I always like to do all days sits where I'm

513
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 5: in the tree an hour and a half before daylight,

514
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 5: so to make sure I'm not spooking anything with my entries.

515
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,240
Speaker 7: They're not in there yet, and I.

516
00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:51,760
Speaker 5: Usually like to leave about a half hour after dark

517
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 5: so I'm not spooking them with my exit. Usually with

518
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 5: an half hour after dark, they've left the betting area.

519
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 5: So and also I'm a big, huge sunt lock fan.

520
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 5: You know, I have used sunt lock since nineteen ninety six,

521
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 5: and I pay zero attention to the wind.

522
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 7: I don't get winded.

523
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,680
Speaker 5: Deer can cross my trail whatever, So I'm not altering

524
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 5: dough traffic by being in a location. And when I

525
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:18,240
Speaker 5: get in the tree and get down out of the tree, I'm.

526
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 7: Still leaving residual odor at the spot.

527
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 5: So if you come in later or pass by later,

528
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,719
Speaker 5: they still smell human odor and then they will avoid

529
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 5: that spot. So I think the second control for me

530
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 5: makes a huge difference in what I can get away

531
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 5: with now during the rut phases.

532
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 7: If I have a scrape area.

533
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 5: And it's it, you know, it might have been active

534
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 5: during pre rut, but it's not active during peak rut,

535
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 5: and it's along the edge for betting area or in

536
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 5: transitions on between two betting areas, that's something.

537
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 7: I will hunt multiple times.

538
00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 5: I may hunt that force sits in a row because

539
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:58,120
Speaker 5: during peak rud the buck that I'm after may be

540
00:29:58,280 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 5: with the dough.

541
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 7: He may be with a lockdown in lockdown with a

542
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 7: hot dough.

543
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 5: So you know that's going to run twenty eight to

544
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 5: thirty some hours, and so if I hunt it multiple times,

545
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 5: there's a good chance once he's finished with that does cycle,

546
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:17,000
Speaker 5: there's a chance that he's gonna, you know, go visit

547
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 5: those scrapes to find his next dell. He usually doesn't

548
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 5: take him very long. But you know that's where the

549
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:27,120
Speaker 5: percentages lie is. You know that's that's a spot he's

550
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 5: going to go look because that's a spot where there's

551
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 5: heavy dot traffic is where that scrapes at. So Pope,

552
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:35,960
Speaker 5: during peak rout, I'll hunt a spot easily four times

553
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 5: in a row as long as I know I'm not

554
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 5: altering any dough traffic at that location. During pre ROD,

555
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 5: I move around a lot. I'll go into season with

556
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,480
Speaker 5: almost fifty trees ready to hunt on public or I've

557
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:52,480
Speaker 5: got two private parcels that I hunt, So I move

558
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 5: around a lot. I don't like to burn any of

559
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:57,360
Speaker 5: my locations out during pre roud, So usually during pre

560
00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:59,000
Speaker 5: rod five hundred.

561
00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 7: The morning in an evening, that's going to be it.

562
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 4: Okay, Greg, how do you? Yeah?

563
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 3: Greg, how do you think about that? Because especially, I

564
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 3: mean John, you're the same way because you use the saddle.

565
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 3: But but Greg, with you guys having saddle setups and

566
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 3: you hang out with a bunch of saddle hunters and

567
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 3: all of you guys are mobile first guys that want

568
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,480
Speaker 3: to get around, want to hunt. A bunch of different places.

569
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 3: We are all steeped in the gospel of running gun

570
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 3: freelance hunting. Go make a move based on what you

571
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 3: see when you get into the rut, the peak rut,

572
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 3: when it's really on. How do you think about this?

573
00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 3: How do you balance that urge or the benefits of

574
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 3: hunting new places versus the possible downside of of missing

575
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 3: out on the action in a given place because you

576
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 3: just didn't give it enough time.

577
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 4: How do you handle that?

578
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:53,880
Speaker 6: It's a great question, and I constantly I've heard you

579
00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 6: talk about this before, Mark in your in your podcast,

580
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 6: about how you're an adventure heart and you're always wondering

581
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 6: what's over the next ridge. And you know, I have

582
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 6: a little bit of that same disease, where there's always

583
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 6: a booner around.

584
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 2: The next bend in the river.

585
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:15,680
Speaker 6: And while that can be beneficial, it can also it

586
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 6: can also hamstring you. And so I make concerted efforts

587
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:26,959
Speaker 6: to try not to limit myself into only being a

588
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,360
Speaker 6: hop around hunter, I guess, for lack of a better term,

589
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 6: a mobile hunter.

590
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 5: Uh.

591
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 6: For instance, I was just hunting in the suburbs of

592
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:40,840
Speaker 6: Atlanta this past week, and I hunted the same tree

593
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 6: every single hunt. I didn't bounce around at all because

594
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 6: of the spot. So this particular spot, the access was bulletproof.

595
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 6: Now I'm not I believe in sintlalk. I used scenttwalk.

596
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 6: Matter of fact, one of John's suits that he designed

597
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:00,959
Speaker 6: called the wind brace from cent. I don't even think

598
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,760
Speaker 6: they make it anymore, but John got me turned onto

599
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 6: that scentlock suit and I still use it to this day.

600
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 6: So I believe in in that, but I don't use

601
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 6: it religiously like John does. I still do pay attention

602
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:14,040
Speaker 6: to the wind Anyway. The point of this spot was

603
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 6: I could get in and out of this tree with

604
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:21,280
Speaker 6: zero interactions with deer. It was basically bulletproof because I

605
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 6: was able to access through a waterway and a swamp

606
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 6: where there were no deer living pop out and I

607
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:30,120
Speaker 6: was in a bulletproof setup and it was a transition zone.

608
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 6: There wasn't a whole lot to keep deer in this

609
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 6: particular area, but there were on either sides and it

610
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 6: was a perfect little transition spot. So I hunted it

611
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 6: every day since. Since the deer and Georgia right now

612
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 6: are starting to get in their pre rup phase, they're

613
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:50,200
Speaker 6: getting a little bit cruisy. We had one of the

614
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 6: guys I was hunting with shot a deer that came

615
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 6: in trailing a dough on full grunt mode, just grunting

616
00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:56,320
Speaker 6: with every step he took.

617
00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 2: So that tells me that the deer there were starting

618
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 2: to get a little fired up up.

619
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:03,080
Speaker 6: And I thought that if I, if I sat in

620
00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 6: this one spot is perfect transition zone, that I could

621
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 6: catch a big one moving through there.

622
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 2: I didn't, but that's okay.

623
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 6: So you I think, I think Mark, you're right, you

624
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 6: have to be cautious of moving too much. But you also,

625
00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 6: you know, if you're not seeing deer, you got to move,

626
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 6: so you you you gotta you gotta find that fine

627
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:31,439
Speaker 6: line of of being mobile but also being patient. And

628
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 6: I'm not always good at it because I tend to

629
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:38,760
Speaker 6: want to be more mobile, so I have to self regulate.

630
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:42,640
Speaker 6: And I think that's good advice for for hunters to

631
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:46,520
Speaker 6: hear both perspectives. And in that John saying you know, hey,

632
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 6: it's okay to hunt these spots over and over again,

633
00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:52,240
Speaker 6: I would add to the caveat of that it's okay

634
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 6: to hunt them over and over again as long as

635
00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 6: you're as long as your access is bulletproof and you're

636
00:34:58,200 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 6: not spooking deer.

637
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:01,160
Speaker 2: Like John said the on the in and out.

638
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 6: I'm totally okay with hunting the same spot over and

639
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 6: over again as long as those other conditions are true.

640
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,480
Speaker 7: Yeah, but you also have to be you also have

641
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 7: to be proactive.

642
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 5: I mean, the biggest buck I've ever shot in my life,

643
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 5: one hundred and eighty inchure. I was on an all

644
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 5: days sit and by ten o'clock I was seeing a

645
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:22,360
Speaker 5: lot of deer activity a.

646
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,439
Speaker 7: Couple hundred yards away. Because it was during the rut

647
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:25,399
Speaker 7: of foliage was.

648
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,719
Speaker 5: Done, I had a long viewing distance, and so I

649
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:32,719
Speaker 5: got down at ten o'clock. I pulled my steps. When

650
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 5: I came down and I moved, I had a decoy out.

651
00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:37,399
Speaker 5: I left that there for my exit. When I was leaving,

652
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:40,880
Speaker 5: and I went back in and I found a scrape

653
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 5: area from hell. There was three monster scrapes, you know,

654
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 5: fifteen yards zone. I set up in it. I was

655
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 5: in that tree set up by noon. I would say

656
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 5: someone around noon, and I had deer funneling by me

657
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:58,319
Speaker 5: all the time, And at four o'clock I shot that

658
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 5: big buck. And then when I early in my hunting

659
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 5: career in nineteen seventy six. I still scouted during postseason

660
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,880
Speaker 5: back then, and I prepped the tree and it was

661
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 5: a red oak, And when I went back to hunt it,

662
00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:14,799
Speaker 5: I didn't go do a speed tour to see if

663
00:36:14,840 --> 00:36:17,600
Speaker 5: it was had masked and was dropping masks. I didn't

664
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 5: do any of that. So when I went into the

665
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 5: hunt it, it wasn't didn't have any acorns, so there

666
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,960
Speaker 5: wasn't a deer activity, and so I just freelanced back

667
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:28,799
Speaker 5: into the woods farther where I'd never been before. I

668
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,120
Speaker 5: found a white oak that actually was dropping acorns and

669
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,799
Speaker 5: had a lot of droppings underneath it, and I set

670
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:37,920
Speaker 5: up in that tree. I actually climbed the climbed the

671
00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:41,200
Speaker 5: tree physically. They didn't have steps and stuff they have nowadays.

672
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 5: And I shot at ten points. So you know, freelancing

673
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 5: when when something's not happening and you know their seed

674
00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:53,880
Speaker 5: better activity, or you go back to a tree and

675
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,239
Speaker 5: it doesn't have it doesn't look good. You know, you've

676
00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:59,080
Speaker 5: got to be proactive as long as you've got the

677
00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 5: gear there to make that move. So I agree with

678
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:06,399
Speaker 5: everything you said, Greg, But yeah, and you always that's

679
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,040
Speaker 5: the cool thing about postseason scouting and post season scouting.

680
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 5: You can cover every inch of everything you want to

681
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 5: hunt on public land because spooking deer is irrelevant. But

682
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 5: during the season, spooking deer is not irrelevant, so you

683
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 5: have to be very cautious on how you do that.

684
00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 6: I think there's another little clarification. I would say to

685
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 6: my previous comments, you got macro moves and you got

686
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 6: micro moves, So macro move is going to a completely

687
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 6: different area, completely different ridge system, go around the next bend, whatever.

688
00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 6: But I also think I can illustrate what John is

689
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 6: talking about with my very my first first time I

690
00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:49,400
Speaker 6: went to Missouri, out of state hunt for me in

691
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:54,640
Speaker 6: the pre run public land in Missouri, and I would

692
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 6: say I did a micro set of moves. So day one,

693
00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,360
Speaker 6: hunting the tree, see movement like John just described, in

694
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:06,040
Speaker 6: a different different area, but still within you know, I

695
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:09,440
Speaker 6: call it my macro area where I was well, I

696
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:13,440
Speaker 6: moved fifty yards closer and it wasn't quite there. I

697
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,880
Speaker 6: wasn't quite in the right spot. So I made another

698
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 6: micro move, probably another forty yards into this one little

699
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 6: tiny zone and that ended up being the spot where

700
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 6: I tagged out. So John's point is is absolutely right.

701
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 6: Sometimes you don't have to go a long way, but

702
00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:34,720
Speaker 6: sometimes you have to refine your positioning with a micro

703
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 6: move inside the betting area, the transition area, the if

704
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:41,360
Speaker 6: it's a it's a crop field, whatever it is that

705
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 6: you're key and n on. Sometimes those micro moves can

706
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 6: really pay off in a big way.

707
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:49,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a great point.

708
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:55,800
Speaker 3: So so if I were to summarize when someone should

709
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,320
Speaker 3: volume hunt a location, So coming out of this little

710
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 3: bit of our conversation, you're someone still thinking to themselves, well,

711
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:03,439
Speaker 3: how do I know when I should be bouncing around?

712
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,120
Speaker 3: Versus how do I know when I should hold tight?

713
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:09,359
Speaker 3: I would say to summarize what you guys have all said.

714
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 3: Number one, listen to the deer. So if the deer

715
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,279
Speaker 3: are telling you, hey, it's actually you're a little bit

716
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 3: off the X most of the actions fifty yards over

717
00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 3: that way, then then yes, make the move if you

718
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:20,600
Speaker 3: have to make that micro move, because listen what the

719
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:21,200
Speaker 3: deer are telling you.

720
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:22,240
Speaker 4: But vice versa.

721
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 3: If you're sitting in the place and then you feel

722
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:27,399
Speaker 3: the urge to move just because you feel like you're

723
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 3: supposed to bounce, but the deer are still telling you, hey,

724
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 3: we're here. If you are still seeing steady movement. If

725
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,759
Speaker 3: you are still seeing young bucks coming through, or you know,

726
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:39,799
Speaker 3: if it's happening, don't assume you have to leave if

727
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 3: you have that good access and exit, YadA YadA, and

728
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:42,960
Speaker 3: the deer On'm figuring it out.

729
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 4: So there's number one.

730
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:47,400
Speaker 3: Number two, if you are in the peak of the

731
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,600
Speaker 3: rut activity time period as you describe, John, if it's

732
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 3: that time when bucks might be locked down, you if

733
00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 3: you leave too soon, you might not have given that

734
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:58,279
Speaker 3: buck an opportunity to circle through because he didn't get

735
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 3: off his dough yet. So that's number two. And then

736
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,799
Speaker 3: the third situation where I think it might make sense

737
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,279
Speaker 3: to volume hunt, and I believe you guys wrote about

738
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 3: in your book, would be in low deer density areas

739
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 3: right where there's not a lot of deer. If you

740
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 3: sit a spot for a day and you don't see

741
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,800
Speaker 3: anything come through and then leave already, that just simply

742
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 3: might be because these bucks travel long distances in low

743
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,399
Speaker 3: deer density areas, and he might be a mile away

744
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:23,319
Speaker 3: right now, but if you gave it two or three days,

745
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 3: he would eventually cycle through.

746
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 4: Am I right on that, John? Did I describe that quickly?

747
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 5: When you go to hill country or areas with low

748
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 5: low deer densities. Yeah, the bucks, the mature bucks have

749
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 5: a lot bigger core areas, especially during the run. They

750
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:41,840
Speaker 5: may cover a five mile core area. An excellent example,

751
00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 5: and I'll be briefed. One of the guys that manages

752
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:47,520
Speaker 5: Jay's Sporting goods, Chad sterns, he was up in the

753
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:51,440
Speaker 5: up gun hunting and when he went up on top

754
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 5: of this oak ridge, he bumped a big ten point

755
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:56,920
Speaker 5: on the other side of the ridge and it just

756
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 5: he just watched his big antlers and body go over

757
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 5: the ridge.

758
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:04,919
Speaker 7: So he hunted it the next day that saying because

759
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 7: there was a scrape there. There was a big scrape.

760
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:10,319
Speaker 5: Where he was at, and he called me and he said, John,

761
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:12,560
Speaker 5: I saw this big buck on this in the scrape

762
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:14,400
Speaker 5: on this ridge. And I said, Chad, he said, what

763
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:17,759
Speaker 5: should I do? I said, Chad, you know what, that's

764
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:20,920
Speaker 5: an active scrape. There's no activity because he said he

765
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 5: was seeing does. I said that buck will be back eventually,

766
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:27,360
Speaker 5: I said, just I know, you hate to sit in

767
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:29,080
Speaker 5: one spot for day long. But he was a big

768
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 5: sentline guy too, so he wasn't worried about his scent.

769
00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 5: He sat in that spot and on the seventh day,

770
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:39,479
Speaker 5: Sunday morning, the last day of his hunt, that buck

771
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:40,840
Speaker 5: came back and he shot it was one hundred and

772
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,359
Speaker 5: forty two inch ten points. It took him that long

773
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:45,399
Speaker 5: to circle back to that spot because he had such

774
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:46,280
Speaker 5: a big horror area.

775
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's hard in those situations.

776
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 6: Well, and I think trail camera, my experience with trail

777
00:41:54,640 --> 00:42:00,120
Speaker 6: camera trail camera data would it supports that right in

778
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,719
Speaker 6: my experience. Maybe it's different for other people, but in

779
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 6: my experience, it's pretty common to see a buck for

780
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 6: a couple three days and you get a picture of them,

781
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:13,440
Speaker 6: you know, morning, evening wherever, and then he seems like

782
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 6: he disappears for three to five days, ever week or

783
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 6: whatever it is, and then a lot of times they

784
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 6: come back. It feels like these deer they work on

785
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 6: little circuits. And I think all of the deer studies

786
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:31,080
Speaker 6: that I've read, either from MSU or for the deer

787
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:34,520
Speaker 6: studies that have happened that I've seen in Pennsylvania, seems

788
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 6: to kind of correlate with that. That is specifically in

789
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,759
Speaker 6: the rut that these these bucks they kind of like

790
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:42,880
Speaker 6: they have the little circuit and they're here for a

791
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 6: few days, and then they kind of move to the

792
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,200
Speaker 6: next place, and they're here for two days, and then

793
00:42:47,239 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 6: they move and they kind of just make a little

794
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:53,840
Speaker 6: circuit around their core area. And I think that's a

795
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 6: real thing, and patience, you know, can sometimes be the

796
00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:57,760
Speaker 6: better part of valor.

797
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's especially the case during peak rut. During pre

798
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:08,200
Speaker 5: rut they tend to stay in tighter core areas. They're

799
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:12,279
Speaker 5: not branching out as far. But during pre rout they're

800
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:14,839
Speaker 5: much more routine. You're much more apt to catch them

801
00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 5: on camera more routinely, maybe every three days.

802
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 7: You'll get a picture for four four days coming.

803
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:24,960
Speaker 5: Through with regularity, there's some consistency to it, whereas during

804
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 5: peak rut it's a crap shoot.

805
00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:38,839
Speaker 3: So, Greg, a second ago, you had mentioned that one

806
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:41,719
Speaker 3: way you vary from John a little bit is that

807
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 3: you might prefer those transition zones a little bit more.

808
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 3: And if I might kind of broaden this idea of

809
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:50,040
Speaker 3: transition zones, I think the way you were kind of

810
00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:52,319
Speaker 3: referring to it would be not just like a transition area,

811
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:54,520
Speaker 3: but more like transitions from place to place, that being

812
00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 3: like travel corridors or pinch points, funnels. You said the

813
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:01,680
Speaker 3: description of like a saddle between two betting areas, So funnels,

814
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 3: pinch points, travel corridors, that is like bread and butter

815
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:09,840
Speaker 3: rut hunting location. Anyone who's studied deer or been deer hunting,

816
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:12,480
Speaker 3: or listened to a few podcasts know that hunting a

817
00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:15,319
Speaker 3: pinch point or a funnel during the rut is a

818
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:19,839
Speaker 3: solid game plan. But the details of how to do

819
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:22,879
Speaker 3: that well, or the specifics of setting up on one

820
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:25,600
Speaker 3: in a smart way, there's a little bit more nuance there.

821
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:28,880
Speaker 3: Could you share with me a little bit more of

822
00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 3: how you approach those types of setups? What makes a

823
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:35,960
Speaker 3: really really good travel corridor or rout funnel set up

824
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:40,160
Speaker 3: for you? Any examples would be really helpful. Basically looking

825
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:42,880
Speaker 3: for that next level of depth on something that generically

826
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 3: everybody gets, but maybe we don't understand the details as well.

827
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 6: That's a great question. I would say a lot of

828
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:55,959
Speaker 6: it revolves around pressure, a lot of these transition. Maybe

829
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:59,440
Speaker 6: we're using the wrong terms, but these pinch points, these funnels,

830
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:05,520
Speaker 6: these corridors that link different travel patterns. A lot of times,

831
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:08,360
Speaker 6: they're really easy to spot on a map if you

832
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:13,240
Speaker 6: understand satellite imagery. Not every hunter does, but if you don't,

833
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:15,480
Speaker 6: you should learn. You should learn how to read a

834
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,279
Speaker 6: topo map. If you're a hunter and you don't know

835
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:21,080
Speaker 6: how to read a topo map, you are wrong. You

836
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 6: need to learn how to read a topo map. Watch

837
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 6: a YouTube video. You'll get it and it will open

838
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:30,200
Speaker 6: up your eyes to how deer use an area. See,

839
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,520
Speaker 6: deer are creatures of habit. They want to use the

840
00:45:33,560 --> 00:45:37,799
Speaker 6: path of least resistance, and it's oftentimes not that difficult

841
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 6: to pinpoint those on a map. A saddle, a bench

842
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 6: that follows a ridgeline. Those are the places that deer

843
00:45:46,040 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 6: are going to use with regularity. The trick is finding

844
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:56,080
Speaker 6: ones that other hunters aren't king in on, okay, because

845
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:58,400
Speaker 6: they're oftentimes very easy to find.

846
00:45:58,840 --> 00:45:59,959
Speaker 2: So what I have.

847
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:04,319
Speaker 6: Found to be useful for me is finding ones that

848
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:08,840
Speaker 6: make sense, yet they're hard to access, either because you

849
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:12,440
Speaker 6: got to go over water, or it's a long walk,

850
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:17,319
Speaker 6: or it's really close to a parking lot somewhere that

851
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:21,800
Speaker 6: hunters are overlooking for whatever reason could be hard to find.

852
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:25,239
Speaker 6: It could be so simple that nobody thinks that it

853
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:26,080
Speaker 6: could actually work.

854
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:26,839
Speaker 8: Uh.

855
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:31,280
Speaker 2: That happened to me in Missouri as well.

856
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:38,840
Speaker 6: I used a bridge to access a really obvious funnel.

857
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 6: It was super obvious. Any hunter with any experience could

858
00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 6: have picked this out. It was really really simple. But

859
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 6: most hunters were they were parking in a different spot,

860
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:51,360
Speaker 6: and they were coming in from a direction, which was

861
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:55,880
Speaker 6: really obvious that a mature buck would he would situate

862
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:59,040
Speaker 6: himself in a bedding scenario to where he could watch that, right,

863
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,200
Speaker 6: because I sure deer knows where the hunting pressure come from.

864
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 6: That's that's the reason they're four or five years old.

865
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:07,320
Speaker 6: They've been through these hunting seasons. They know where hunters

866
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:10,800
Speaker 6: come from, so they will oftentimes bed in a location

867
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,759
Speaker 6: that will allow them to see that pressure coming and

868
00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 6: then they'll pop smoke and they'll take their exit route. Well,

869
00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 6: I think the reason that I was successful in this

870
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:24,080
Speaker 6: particular hunt was I came in from a weird way

871
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,400
Speaker 6: and I climbed out from underneath the bridge and crossed

872
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:29,719
Speaker 6: the road where not anybody else was doing that. So

873
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 6: a lot of times it's about creatively accessing those spots

874
00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 6: and or finding ones that they're just not They're just

875
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 6: not as no brainers on a map, you know, It's

876
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:50,000
Speaker 6: it's really obvious to identify a lot of these places

877
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:52,759
Speaker 6: and if it's a really obvious pinch point and it's

878
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,800
Speaker 6: seventy five yards off a trail, like it's gonna get pounded,

879
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:58,919
Speaker 6: mark it off, don't hunt it. It's not gonna work

880
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:03,480
Speaker 6: for the most part. But look for those little pinch

881
00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 6: points that maybe are harder to find on a map

882
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:10,360
Speaker 6: or oftentimes what I what I find to be true

883
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 6: is if I'm going to a pinch point, a funnel, whatever,

884
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:20,279
Speaker 6: I'll oftentimes find little micro pinch points and funnels in

885
00:48:20,680 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 6: that area. And a great example of that is you

886
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:24,920
Speaker 6: might get into a into a pitch point called a

887
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 6: saddle on a ridge system that's an easy spot to cross,

888
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 6: but maybe there's a down tree that would funnel a

889
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 6: deer into a really specific spot. Little stuff like that,

890
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:39,840
Speaker 6: little micro terrain features can often make a big difference.

891
00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:44,440
Speaker 6: It's really about putting boots on the ground and going

892
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:50,200
Speaker 6: in and and really understanding the terrain. Uh, That's that's

893
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:51,360
Speaker 6: kind of what I focus on.

894
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:57,120
Speaker 3: Okay, John, would you add anything when it comes to funnels,

895
00:48:57,440 --> 00:48:59,920
Speaker 3: pinch points, and kind of the next level of depth

896
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 3: than just the generic.

897
00:49:02,280 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 7: Yeah, definitely.

898
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:05,839
Speaker 5: You know, a lot of hunters follow what they watch

899
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 5: on TV, and in my personal opinion, most TV guys

900
00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:11,560
Speaker 5: that they had to puntulic land wouldn't have a clue

901
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:13,920
Speaker 5: what to do. You know, I think fifty percent of

902
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 5: the bowl owners in the country could probably killed deer

903
00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:18,840
Speaker 5: the same deer that TV guys are hunting, if they

904
00:49:18,840 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 5: were hunting the same property, because it's all ultra managed.

905
00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:26,040
Speaker 5: So when you follow what TV guys do, you know,

906
00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 5: TV guys can they can look at aerial maps and

907
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:31,879
Speaker 5: topo maps, and they can pick out spots on their properties,

908
00:49:33,239 --> 00:49:35,680
Speaker 5: and you know, they can go to them and they

909
00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:38,279
Speaker 5: know nobody else has ever been there. So it's very

910
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 5: likely that they can go to a pinch point between

911
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 5: two areas of timber where there's some adequate cover from

912
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:48,480
Speaker 5: point A to point B, and set up there and

913
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:52,560
Speaker 5: kill something. A normal hunter hunting public land or heavily

914
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 5: pressured areas where there's twenty homesteads in a six hundred

915
00:49:56,520 --> 00:49:58,920
Speaker 5: and forty acre section and every homestead's got hunters on it,

916
00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:00,120
Speaker 5: that's a pressured areas.

917
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,480
Speaker 7: Well, you can't do that.

918
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:05,719
Speaker 5: That's why scouting is such a big part of being

919
00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:10,640
Speaker 5: a successful mature buck hunter. Scouting when you're out there

920
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:14,120
Speaker 5: postseason scouting or even preseason scouting. I hate scouting during

921
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:16,279
Speaker 5: pre season, but I do once in a blue move.

922
00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 5: You can see what kind of hunter activities there. You

923
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 5: can see marks on trees from stands or climbers or

924
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:26,880
Speaker 5: whatever the case may be. Or if it's super easy

925
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 5: to access, you can be guaranteed.

926
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 7: Other hunters are going to mess it up.

927
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:35,520
Speaker 5: So when I'm looking at pinch points, I'm looking at

928
00:50:35,880 --> 00:50:38,279
Speaker 5: a lot of times river funnels. I've mentioned this on

929
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:41,320
Speaker 5: your podcast before. River funnels don't People don't pay attention

930
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:43,400
Speaker 5: to that kind of stuff. But when you walk a

931
00:50:43,520 --> 00:50:46,840
Speaker 5: river way, a lot of times the river will make bends,

932
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:49,520
Speaker 5: and every time it makes a bend, there's going to

933
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 5: be a cliff, you know, where the water washes the

934
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:55,879
Speaker 5: way the dirt under the bend. And then you may

935
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 5: go a quarter of a mile or half a mile,

936
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 5: whatever the case may be, and there'll be a one

937
00:51:00,600 --> 00:51:03,440
Speaker 5: hundred yard or a fifty yard flat area. Well, when

938
00:51:03,480 --> 00:51:06,200
Speaker 5: you get to those flat areas, the river's usually wider

939
00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:08,200
Speaker 5: and it's shallower, and that's where the deer are going

940
00:51:08,280 --> 00:51:10,560
Speaker 5: to cross, and they don't have to worry about the

941
00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:12,360
Speaker 5: cliffs on all the bends.

942
00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:15,120
Speaker 7: So you know, it's just like a trout fisherman.

943
00:51:15,160 --> 00:51:17,920
Speaker 5: If you're a trout fisherman, you know exactly if you

944
00:51:18,000 --> 00:51:20,440
Speaker 5: fish it spot a while where you can cross the

945
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:22,879
Speaker 5: river the easiest, and deer know the exact same thing

946
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:27,319
Speaker 5: where they live, where they reside, So I look for that,

947
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:32,560
Speaker 5: and then any any funnel or transition zone has to

948
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:35,560
Speaker 5: have I can't say this enough security cover.

949
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 7: Security covered, security cover.

950
00:51:36,920 --> 00:51:39,239
Speaker 5: If you're after mature bucks and there's any semblance of

951
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:42,319
Speaker 5: pressure in the area you're hunting, a mature buck is

952
00:51:42,520 --> 00:51:45,480
Speaker 5: very rarely going to make himself vulnerable in an open area,

953
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:48,879
Speaker 5: even if it's in a transition zone like the river

954
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 5: funnel and they have to cross through fifty yards of

955
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,560
Speaker 5: open timbered across the river there and then go into

956
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 5: some security cover.

957
00:51:55,360 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 7: They're not going to make that fifty.

958
00:51:56,480 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 5: Yard vulnerable movement during daylight hours, so it'll be that'll

959
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 5: be an after dark spot. So no matter the transition

960
00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:05,200
Speaker 5: zone you're in, if you're after mature bucks in it's

961
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:08,680
Speaker 5: somewhat pressured area, it has they have adequate security cover

962
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:12,640
Speaker 5: from mature buck to transition, either through the security govern

963
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:15,000
Speaker 5: or along the edge of the security govern They always

964
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:18,720
Speaker 5: like they have a quick two or three second exit

965
00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:24,400
Speaker 5: where they're out of a kill range.

966
00:52:23,640 --> 00:52:25,759
Speaker 6: Which is why it's so great to focus on the

967
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:29,520
Speaker 6: ret phase because that is when they start letting their

968
00:52:29,560 --> 00:52:33,600
Speaker 6: guard down right, and and that's when they will That's

969
00:52:33,640 --> 00:52:36,839
Speaker 6: when these bucks. Because John is one thousand percent right,

970
00:52:37,000 --> 00:52:40,400
Speaker 6: I could not agree more. They just don't make many mistakes.

971
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:43,279
Speaker 6: That's how they get to be five four or five

972
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 6: six years old and last through several seasons. But once

973
00:52:48,239 --> 00:52:51,399
Speaker 6: they get in breed mode, they will sometimes make those

974
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,960
Speaker 6: stupid mistakes, and that's how you can capitalize on it.

975
00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:56,959
Speaker 7: Yeah, if they're with a hot dough, they might follow

976
00:52:57,000 --> 00:52:57,760
Speaker 7: her into Walmart.

977
00:52:58,920 --> 00:52:59,319
Speaker 2: They would.

978
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 3: So with these funnels, with these pinch points, I can

979
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:07,240
Speaker 3: imagine someone being out there in the woods, maybe public land,

980
00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:10,000
Speaker 3: maybe a permission farm, whatever it might be, and he's

981
00:53:10,040 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 3: out maybe he's going out to hunt that day in

982
00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:14,920
Speaker 3: a new area, and he's kind of scouting his way

983
00:53:14,920 --> 00:53:17,640
Speaker 3: into a hunting location. Maybe, let's hypothetically say, and he

984
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:21,040
Speaker 3: comes across some spots they thinks maybe could be good

985
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:23,279
Speaker 3: pinch points or funnels. They look like they could be

986
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:26,960
Speaker 3: one of these micro funnels you mentioned, Greg, and they're

987
00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:29,120
Speaker 3: trying to confirm, like, man, is this the kind of

988
00:53:29,120 --> 00:53:31,960
Speaker 3: spot that a mature buck would move through, and maybe

989
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:34,279
Speaker 3: he's looking for security cover like you mentioned, John, But

990
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 3: I gotta believe some people will be thinking, hey, I

991
00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:40,319
Speaker 3: need to see sign that will confirm that, yes, this

992
00:53:40,520 --> 00:53:42,400
Speaker 3: is a good place, Like the terrain looks right or

993
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:46,160
Speaker 3: the cover looks right, but what is the ruts? What's

994
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:50,440
Speaker 3: the sign that matters to you during this time of

995
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:53,920
Speaker 3: the year November seven through twenty or somewhere in November.

996
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 3: What sign do you need to see. We'll start with you, John,

997
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 3: when you're trying to say yes, this sign tells me

998
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:06,440
Speaker 3: that mature bucks will use this funnel.

999
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:10,279
Speaker 5: To security cover if it's a funnel and it has

1000
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 5: security cover, and it's between two betting areas, which typically

1001
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,840
Speaker 5: during the rod. If a mature buck's moving during daylight hours,

1002
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:19,760
Speaker 5: he's looking. If he's not with a dough, he's looking

1003
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:22,319
Speaker 5: for a dough. So he's going to be checking a

1004
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:25,560
Speaker 5: betting area within his core area, and then he's going

1005
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:28,120
Speaker 5: to take the best available transition security cover to the

1006
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:31,040
Speaker 5: next betting area that may possibly within his be within

1007
00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:35,319
Speaker 5: his core area, so you know, and also in a

1008
00:54:35,360 --> 00:54:37,840
Speaker 5: betting area, to me, when you are physically in a

1009
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:40,880
Speaker 5: betting area during the road phases. That's where bucks, mature

1010
00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:45,879
Speaker 5: bucks push the doughs into to do their breeding. So

1011
00:54:46,320 --> 00:54:49,759
Speaker 5: if you go set up in a betting area, those

1012
00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:52,600
Speaker 5: bucks are going to breed those doughs every twenty minutes

1013
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:55,080
Speaker 5: to forty minutes, and they're going to get up and

1014
00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:57,080
Speaker 5: you know they're going to bed maybe fifteen or twenty

1015
00:54:57,160 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 5: yards downwindo the dough after a breeding, after the breed,

1016
00:55:00,360 --> 00:55:03,680
Speaker 5: and then maybe twenty minutes and whatever the case may be,

1017
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:05,799
Speaker 5: he'll get up and he'll go and nudge er and

1018
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:08,439
Speaker 5: they'll play a little thirty to one hundred yard chase game.

1019
00:55:08,719 --> 00:55:10,920
Speaker 5: And it's all within security government. So if you're in

1020
00:55:10,920 --> 00:55:13,880
Speaker 5: a betting area, you know, as long as you're in

1021
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 5: an area where there's runways going by, there's always the

1022
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:21,799
Speaker 5: chance at any time of day to get an opportunity

1023
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:25,240
Speaker 5: in the mature buck. The only downside for most hunters

1024
00:55:25,239 --> 00:55:30,400
Speaker 5: when they're hunting within within a betting area is the wind.

1025
00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:32,880
Speaker 5: You know, if you don't have a set control regiment,

1026
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:36,719
Speaker 5: typically on average, fifty percent of the deer you see

1027
00:55:36,719 --> 00:55:38,919
Speaker 5: are going to be downwind w because there's no rhyme

1028
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 5: or reason in a betting area Obviously, if you're in

1029
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:43,799
Speaker 5: a betting area and you have the option of being

1030
00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:46,879
Speaker 5: in an oak tree that's possibly dropping acorns, or at

1031
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:49,200
Speaker 5: a scrape area that's within a betting area, you know

1032
00:55:49,239 --> 00:55:51,200
Speaker 5: that's where you'd want to set up as long as

1033
00:55:51,239 --> 00:55:55,520
Speaker 5: there was signed there from the you know, there's deer signed.

1034
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:57,399
Speaker 7: There and droppings in the area.

1035
00:55:57,440 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 5: But the set control things is a pretty big b

1036
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:03,080
Speaker 5: because you're going to have deer down wind of you.

1037
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 5: But death in betting areas to me people that leaves

1038
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:09,840
Speaker 5: betting areas as sanctuary areas.

1039
00:56:09,840 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 7: If you own your own property and you own a

1040
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:12,720
Speaker 7: lot of property.

1041
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 5: And you've got a ten anchor betting area, yeah you

1042
00:56:14,920 --> 00:56:16,879
Speaker 5: can leave it as a sanctuary area because you don't

1043
00:56:16,920 --> 00:56:18,520
Speaker 5: have to worry about anybody else.

1044
00:56:18,400 --> 00:56:22,279
Speaker 7: Killing the deer. You know, on your property, they're staying there.

1045
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:25,920
Speaker 5: So if you're not in that, if you don't have

1046
00:56:26,040 --> 00:56:28,839
Speaker 5: that opportunity to own land and you're on public land,

1047
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:30,600
Speaker 5: you've got to be back in the junk where the

1048
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:32,840
Speaker 5: bucks are going to be breeding the dogs during the

1049
00:56:32,920 --> 00:56:36,640
Speaker 5: rut phases and so you know, and they and when

1050
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,359
Speaker 5: they're pushing those doughs in those betting areas, a lot

1051
00:56:39,360 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 5: of times as you guys well know it's on uncharted rows.

1052
00:56:42,440 --> 00:56:44,719
Speaker 5: You know those those aren't always following runways, they're just

1053
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:46,239
Speaker 5: running through the swamp or.

1054
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:49,920
Speaker 7: Whatever the case may be. So jawning about the ruck.

1055
00:56:50,640 --> 00:56:54,160
Speaker 5: The run is something that anybody during the long spot

1056
00:56:54,200 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 5: could kill something just by accident.

1057
00:56:57,400 --> 00:57:03,280
Speaker 6: Yeah, question right, which you define a betting area as

1058
00:57:03,360 --> 00:57:06,920
Speaker 6: as how you're describing it? Would you would you just

1059
00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 6: talk about all that. I'd like to hear your your

1060
00:57:10,239 --> 00:57:12,000
Speaker 6: explanation of what a betting area is.

1061
00:57:13,800 --> 00:57:17,720
Speaker 5: I get that question so much, you know, security government

1062
00:57:17,720 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 5: betting areas because betting.

1063
00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:22,480
Speaker 6: Areas already already answered, but I want to I want

1064
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:25,080
Speaker 6: to hear you say it for all the listeners because I.

1065
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 2: Think it will be useful.

1066
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:29,960
Speaker 5: Yeah, betting areas can change from area to area, Like

1067
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:32,959
Speaker 5: if you're in if you're in hill country, they don't

1068
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:36,000
Speaker 5: have swamps like Michigan does and Lake Ohio does and

1069
00:57:36,080 --> 00:57:39,520
Speaker 5: some of the other Midwestern states, uh, you know, Southern Ohio,

1070
00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:42,840
Speaker 5: Southern Indiana, southern you know that's all hill country or

1071
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:44,480
Speaker 5: West Virginia.

1072
00:57:44,600 --> 00:57:46,880
Speaker 7: You know, and bucks there will bed up on the

1073
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:48,040
Speaker 7: tops of the hills.

1074
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:50,480
Speaker 5: You know, they'll bed where the if the wind's coming

1075
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 5: over the hill, they'll bed where they can smell anything

1076
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:55,560
Speaker 5: coming up the other side, and then they'll have a

1077
00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:58,680
Speaker 5: visual down down the side they're betted on it on

1078
00:57:58,880 --> 00:58:02,640
Speaker 5: the other side of the So that type of a

1079
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:06,600
Speaker 5: betting or is different than where I live, which is,

1080
00:58:07,120 --> 00:58:10,200
Speaker 5: you know, betting areas are very identifiable. It's the thickest area,

1081
00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,200
Speaker 5: the densest area in the area. You know, that's where

1082
00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:15,760
Speaker 5: the bucks are going to be. I mean, I'm not

1083
00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:17,920
Speaker 5: talking about like a blueberry marsh where you have to

1084
00:58:18,680 --> 00:58:19,840
Speaker 5: crawl over the brush.

1085
00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:21,720
Speaker 7: I'm talking about just areas where.

1086
00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:27,080
Speaker 5: There's autumnolives or red brush or briar bushes, sparse stuff,

1087
00:58:27,360 --> 00:58:32,360
Speaker 5: you know, marsh grasses, some cat tails spotted here and there, hemlocks.

1088
00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:32,920
Speaker 7: You know.

1089
00:58:33,840 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 5: Betting areas are basically, if you were the deer and

1090
00:58:39,400 --> 00:58:42,080
Speaker 5: everybody was trying to kill you, where are the heaviest

1091
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:45,600
Speaker 5: places of security cover on the property, where you think

1092
00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:47,320
Speaker 5: you could go in and feel safe.

1093
00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:50,120
Speaker 7: Moving during daylight hours. That's the betting area.

1094
00:58:50,200 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 5: So in that with that scenario, betting areas are different

1095
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:58,480
Speaker 5: from area to area depending on the topography, but you

1096
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 5: always want to look at it as that's the dnsest area.

1097
00:59:01,160 --> 00:59:04,080
Speaker 5: In the safest place where I would feel comfortable moving

1098
00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:08,600
Speaker 5: during daylight hours, within this mile section or within this

1099
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:11,520
Speaker 5: public land, and that's where I would I would set up.

1100
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:16,040
Speaker 3: So okay, here's another one we here we already talk

1101
00:59:16,120 --> 00:59:18,400
Speaker 3: We talked about pinch points funnels. That's another one that

1102
00:59:18,960 --> 00:59:22,919
Speaker 3: everyone knows. Betting areas. Everyone knows you should hunt betting

1103
00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 3: areas during the run, especially spots where there's lots of

1104
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:28,600
Speaker 3: does betting. Right, that's we know, go where the does

1105
00:59:28,640 --> 00:59:31,320
Speaker 3: are betting. There's gonna be bucks checking them. But it's

1106
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 3: harder to pick the right spot.

1107
00:59:33,120 --> 00:59:34,520
Speaker 4: In a betting area.

1108
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 3: Can you discuss how both of you guys like to

1109
00:59:37,360 --> 00:59:40,040
Speaker 3: do that? So how do you find the X within

1110
00:59:40,200 --> 00:59:43,280
Speaker 3: a betting ear or around a betting ear, however.

1111
00:59:43,000 --> 00:59:44,120
Speaker 4: You each like to do it.

1112
00:59:45,120 --> 00:59:47,520
Speaker 3: Because there might be a two acre zone where there's

1113
00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 3: a whole bunch of deer betted, and when you're bow hunting,

1114
00:59:50,120 --> 00:59:51,840
Speaker 3: that's a large area. It might be ten acres, there

1115
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:54,320
Speaker 3: might be a court aker. Obviously they're all different. But

1116
00:59:55,120 --> 00:59:58,000
Speaker 3: how do you think about choosing the right spot like

1117
00:59:58,080 --> 00:59:59,680
Speaker 3: this spot within the spot.

1118
00:59:59,520 --> 01:00:02,120
Speaker 4: Of a doll betting area during the rut?

1119
01:00:02,160 --> 01:00:04,680
Speaker 3: Because this is really really important for people to have

1120
01:00:04,680 --> 01:00:08,760
Speaker 3: success this time of year or one of the best places. John,

1121
01:00:08,880 --> 01:00:10,400
Speaker 3: you want to want to kick it off, continue your

1122
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:11,960
Speaker 3: thoughts there, I'm started.

1123
01:00:12,040 --> 01:00:14,200
Speaker 7: All the only ones you go for it? You don't.

1124
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:19,280
Speaker 6: Great, So what what I would do. Let's let's say

1125
01:00:19,280 --> 01:00:22,800
Speaker 6: there's a big marsh and big cattail marsh and you

1126
01:00:23,440 --> 01:00:25,040
Speaker 6: it's obvious that there are dos.

1127
01:00:24,800 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 2: And bucks betting in there. Uh.

1128
01:00:27,400 --> 01:00:30,120
Speaker 6: You Sometimes you don't have to make it more complicated

1129
01:00:30,120 --> 01:00:32,600
Speaker 6: than it needs to be. I'm bad about that. I'm

1130
01:00:32,600 --> 01:00:35,280
Speaker 6: bad about making things over complicated. But what I would

1131
01:00:35,320 --> 01:00:38,360
Speaker 6: do and what I have done in states, uh, where

1132
01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:41,200
Speaker 6: I would encounter a situation like that, So I would

1133
01:00:41,200 --> 01:00:44,880
Speaker 6: scout the edges and I would look for the heaviest

1134
01:00:45,080 --> 01:00:48,800
Speaker 6: trails runways coming in and out of those spots that

1135
01:00:48,880 --> 01:00:50,160
Speaker 6: are marked with sign.

1136
01:00:51,640 --> 01:00:52,120
Speaker 2: You're talking abo.

1137
01:00:53,440 --> 01:00:57,080
Speaker 5: You're talking scouting in season, not post in season scouting.

1138
01:00:57,120 --> 01:00:59,160
Speaker 2: Which is that's right?

1139
01:00:59,200 --> 01:01:01,640
Speaker 6: Which is which is a little different than the way

1140
01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:06,840
Speaker 6: John typically hunts. Typically, not always, but typically John has

1141
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:11,360
Speaker 6: his spots scouted and prepped in the preseason or what

1142
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:16,440
Speaker 6: John says postseason January February March, whenever snow goes away

1143
01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 6: and before green up a lot of times when I'm

1144
01:01:19,680 --> 01:01:22,439
Speaker 6: hunting the rut, I'm in a different state that I've

1145
01:01:22,480 --> 01:01:26,480
Speaker 6: never been before, and that's a little different than the

1146
01:01:26,480 --> 01:01:29,320
Speaker 6: way John does it, which is fine. But what I

1147
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:33,400
Speaker 6: do typically is scout the edges and I'm looking for

1148
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:37,960
Speaker 6: sign that's telling me when or where a buck is

1149
01:01:38,080 --> 01:01:41,120
Speaker 6: choosing to enter and exit that and then typically I

1150
01:01:41,160 --> 01:01:45,280
Speaker 6: would set up on that not real super complicated, find

1151
01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:49,160
Speaker 6: the betting area, take your best guess at how that

1152
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:52,760
Speaker 6: deer that buck is entering and leaving, and then set

1153
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,760
Speaker 6: up on it and then adjust fire. Other people would

1154
01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:59,120
Speaker 6: call that like an observation hunt, like Dan Infult, he

1155
01:01:59,240 --> 01:02:02,680
Speaker 6: kind of popular rise that term on the Hunting Beast forum,

1156
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 6: and so he would say, you know, you would make

1157
01:02:05,640 --> 01:02:08,439
Speaker 6: an observation sit where you might hang back a little

1158
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:11,880
Speaker 6: bit further than you typically might, see how the deer

1159
01:02:12,080 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 6: using that area, and then move in. I've seen my

1160
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:19,800
Speaker 6: buddies from the hunting public do that all over the country,

1161
01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:22,520
Speaker 6: and they will go to a new state, they will

1162
01:02:22,560 --> 01:02:25,120
Speaker 6: hang back, they'll see how the deer are using this

1163
01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:27,680
Speaker 6: particular area, and then they'll move in on the next

1164
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:28,640
Speaker 6: hunt for the kill.

1165
01:02:29,000 --> 01:02:30,040
Speaker 2: It's very effective.

1166
01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:32,520
Speaker 6: You have to be aggressive you have to be willing

1167
01:02:32,560 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 6: to blow out the area, and when you're going in

1168
01:02:35,840 --> 01:02:36,960
Speaker 6: for a kill like that.

1169
01:02:37,840 --> 01:02:40,880
Speaker 5: For freelancing, you almost have to do that, because for

1170
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:44,400
Speaker 5: free lancing, you can't go in in the afternoon into

1171
01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:47,840
Speaker 5: physically into the interior of a betting area and scout

1172
01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:50,680
Speaker 5: it for signed because obviously.

1173
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:51,560
Speaker 7: You're going to blow the deer out of it.

1174
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:55,320
Speaker 5: So when you're free lancing, you almost are tied to

1175
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:58,640
Speaker 5: doing the perimeter stuff or doing it from a distance

1176
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:03,680
Speaker 5: one day, that's right, readjusting the next. But when when

1177
01:03:03,680 --> 01:03:07,360
Speaker 5: I'm postseason scouting and I'm physically going in betting areas

1178
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:09,439
Speaker 5: and I'm covering every inch of it, I can blow

1179
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:11,560
Speaker 5: every deer out of there. I could care less. I'm

1180
01:03:12,040 --> 01:03:14,880
Speaker 5: I'm six months from deer season. Those are all going

1181
01:03:14,880 --> 01:03:16,480
Speaker 5: to be back in there. Everything's going to be cope

1182
01:03:16,520 --> 01:03:20,439
Speaker 5: SETI back to normal by deer season, so I can

1183
01:03:20,640 --> 01:03:23,720
Speaker 5: scrutinize every inch of that betting area and every inch

1184
01:03:23,720 --> 01:03:26,040
Speaker 5: of the property I want to look at without concern

1185
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:29,120
Speaker 5: about spooking deer like like you'd have to be, you.

1186
01:03:29,080 --> 01:03:29,920
Speaker 7: Know, during season.

1187
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:32,680
Speaker 5: So when I'm going into a betting area, I'm looking

1188
01:03:32,760 --> 01:03:35,280
Speaker 5: for master trees, a lot of times when I cross

1189
01:03:35,400 --> 01:03:38,520
Speaker 5: river with waiters or go across a lake, you know,

1190
01:03:38,560 --> 01:03:40,360
Speaker 5: in a boat or a canoe or whatever the case

1191
01:03:40,440 --> 01:03:44,240
Speaker 5: may be, I've lost a lot of hunters right there.

1192
01:03:44,360 --> 01:03:47,480
Speaker 5: By using waitershi boots and boats. You've lost probably at

1193
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:49,040
Speaker 5: least ninety to ninety.

1194
01:03:48,840 --> 01:03:50,040
Speaker 7: Five percent of your competition.

1195
01:03:50,120 --> 01:03:53,280
Speaker 5: When we were in Indiana last year, I saw in

1196
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:56,040
Speaker 5: that complete, huge area, I saw one other hunter.

1197
01:03:55,920 --> 01:03:59,400
Speaker 7: In a boat, right, do you remember that where we

1198
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 7: were last year?

1199
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 5: Just nobody else does that because it's more work. So

1200
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:08,600
Speaker 5: once you get back into those areas, a lot of

1201
01:04:08,680 --> 01:04:12,200
Speaker 5: times they open up. You know, they'll have brush along

1202
01:04:12,240 --> 01:04:14,000
Speaker 5: the edge of the river when you cross it, but

1203
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:15,400
Speaker 5: a lot of times you get back into there and

1204
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:18,040
Speaker 5: they open up into a little bit more open, sparse,

1205
01:04:18,480 --> 01:04:22,040
Speaker 5: sparse brush and stuff. And you know, I look for oaks.

1206
01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:24,040
Speaker 5: I look for the same sign I would look for

1207
01:04:24,160 --> 01:04:27,280
Speaker 5: for hunting early season. I'm looking for mass if it's there,

1208
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:31,160
Speaker 5: and if there is, I'll look at to see what

1209
01:04:31,240 --> 01:04:31,920
Speaker 5: kind of sign was.

1210
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:34,280
Speaker 7: There from the previous runt. You know, is there rubs

1211
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:35,360
Speaker 7: around that area.

1212
01:04:35,200 --> 01:04:38,560
Speaker 5: Is there possibly a couple of old scrapes by these oaks,

1213
01:04:39,040 --> 01:04:41,960
Speaker 5: or maybe there's a little opening in a betting area

1214
01:04:42,080 --> 01:04:44,440
Speaker 5: and it's got a multiple runways.

1215
01:04:43,960 --> 01:04:44,800
Speaker 7: Converging through it.

1216
01:04:44,840 --> 01:04:47,120
Speaker 5: I kill the Bucking two thousand and four this way

1217
01:04:47,120 --> 01:04:49,640
Speaker 5: in an automolive patch with a twenty yard opening in

1218
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:53,680
Speaker 5: the center of it. So I'm just looking for congested

1219
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:58,560
Speaker 5: sign rubs, you know, I'm looking for taller rubs, possible scrapes.

1220
01:04:58,560 --> 01:05:00,520
Speaker 5: But usually when you're in betting areas, you don't see

1221
01:05:00,560 --> 01:05:03,240
Speaker 5: a lot of scrapes. It's pretty rare actually to see

1222
01:05:03,680 --> 01:05:05,400
Speaker 5: to see scrapes in a swamp.

1223
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:08,360
Speaker 7: So I'm just looking for the most.

1224
01:05:08,120 --> 01:05:11,520
Speaker 5: Congested sign because i know if I'm hunting there during

1225
01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:13,520
Speaker 5: the run the bucks are the mature bucks are going

1226
01:05:13,560 --> 01:05:15,760
Speaker 5: to be pushing the dose around, so they're going to

1227
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:16,760
Speaker 5: be those dos and.

1228
01:05:16,760 --> 01:05:18,919
Speaker 7: Bucks are going to be moving around during the course

1229
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:19,439
Speaker 7: of the day.

1230
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:23,800
Speaker 5: And wherever if I'm in the most congested sign and runways,

1231
01:05:24,240 --> 01:05:28,000
Speaker 5: I can find odds are And I'm a percentage guys.

1232
01:05:28,040 --> 01:05:31,320
Speaker 5: I hunt according to percentages. The percentages are higher that

1233
01:05:31,440 --> 01:05:34,440
Speaker 5: something's going to go through that more congested runway area

1234
01:05:34,440 --> 01:05:36,400
Speaker 5: that I'm at than someplace else.

1235
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:40,520
Speaker 3: Now, John, I know you don't. You don't factor wind

1236
01:05:40,560 --> 01:05:44,000
Speaker 3: direction into your strategy when it comes to avoiding deer

1237
01:05:44,320 --> 01:05:47,880
Speaker 3: winding you because of your sink control. But does the

1238
01:05:47,960 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 3: wind Does the wind direction impact where you want to

1239
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:53,160
Speaker 3: hunt in a betting area at all? Because many times

1240
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:56,320
Speaker 3: folks talk about bucks preferring to check a betting area

1241
01:05:56,360 --> 01:05:58,920
Speaker 3: on the downwind side so they can more efficiently do

1242
01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:02,280
Speaker 3: travel and check places. Does that is that something you

1243
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:02,680
Speaker 3: can in.

1244
01:06:02,600 --> 01:06:03,000
Speaker 4: It at all?

1245
01:06:03,640 --> 01:06:09,080
Speaker 5: I actually will set up places where I assume deer

1246
01:06:09,120 --> 01:06:11,560
Speaker 5: her coming in from the down wind side because I

1247
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:13,280
Speaker 5: know I'm not going to get winded, and I'll beat

1248
01:06:13,280 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 5: that opportunity. So in Michigan, I've killed two one hundred

1249
01:06:19,120 --> 01:06:22,160
Speaker 5: and fifty inch bucks because I was hunting at a

1250
01:06:22,160 --> 01:06:26,000
Speaker 5: scrape area. And I set when i'm when i'm hunting

1251
01:06:26,000 --> 01:06:28,640
Speaker 5: in a scrape at a scrape area, if it's in

1252
01:06:28,680 --> 01:06:32,640
Speaker 5: a bedding area and a transition zone that's relatively wide,

1253
01:06:34,160 --> 01:06:37,520
Speaker 5: that has adequate security government if there's a tree on

1254
01:06:37,560 --> 01:06:40,240
Speaker 5: the south side or southeast side, because winds typically out

1255
01:06:40,240 --> 01:06:42,840
Speaker 5: of the north or northwest in the predominantly in the fall,

1256
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:45,240
Speaker 5: I will set a tree up about twenty to twenty

1257
01:06:45,240 --> 01:06:47,240
Speaker 5: five yards on the down wind side of the scrapes

1258
01:06:47,240 --> 01:06:49,440
Speaker 5: where I have a twenty five yard shot to the

1259
01:06:49,440 --> 01:06:52,160
Speaker 5: physical scrapes, and I have the twenty five yard because

1260
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:54,200
Speaker 5: I'm only shooting forty pounds, so I only have twenty

1261
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:57,640
Speaker 5: five yard distance. And I also make a shooting lane

1262
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:01,680
Speaker 5: twenty five yards to the south or southeast of the tree.

1263
01:07:02,040 --> 01:07:04,960
Speaker 5: So if a deer circles and comes in from down

1264
01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 5: wind because he doesn't want to be strape areas are

1265
01:07:07,560 --> 01:07:09,960
Speaker 5: always in a little open area, and a lot of

1266
01:07:10,000 --> 01:07:11,640
Speaker 5: times when sure bucks don't want to be in that

1267
01:07:11,720 --> 01:07:13,920
Speaker 5: open zone during daylight hours.

1268
01:07:14,440 --> 01:07:15,840
Speaker 7: So I'll set that up.

1269
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:19,520
Speaker 5: And I've on two different occasions I've had monster bucks

1270
01:07:20,160 --> 01:07:23,160
Speaker 5: come in and circle down wind and I've shot them

1271
01:07:23,640 --> 01:07:24,960
Speaker 5: on the down wind side.

1272
01:07:25,520 --> 01:07:27,160
Speaker 7: That's the cool thing about sun control.

1273
01:07:27,200 --> 01:07:29,000
Speaker 5: Also, if you can set up on the down wind

1274
01:07:29,040 --> 01:07:31,680
Speaker 5: side and you can use bucks coming in from the

1275
01:07:31,680 --> 01:07:33,840
Speaker 5: down wind side to your advantage because you're not worried

1276
01:07:33,840 --> 01:07:34,680
Speaker 5: about getting there.

1277
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:37,919
Speaker 3: Greg, what about with you when it comes to wind

1278
01:07:37,960 --> 01:07:41,440
Speaker 3: direction and that helping your your kind of scout the

1279
01:07:41,560 --> 01:07:45,240
Speaker 3: edge find the sign approach. But I'm assuming wind direction

1280
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:46,680
Speaker 3: factors into that as well though too.

1281
01:07:49,200 --> 01:07:49,439
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1282
01:07:50,000 --> 01:07:55,040
Speaker 6: John pretty much outlined it very succinctly there. But the bucks,

1283
01:07:55,080 --> 01:07:57,360
Speaker 6: even if you're John and you don't pay attention to wind.

1284
01:07:57,520 --> 01:08:00,280
Speaker 6: The bucks are one hundred percent They live in die

1285
01:08:00,280 --> 01:08:02,000
Speaker 6: by their noses, so to.

1286
01:08:02,000 --> 01:08:04,240
Speaker 2: Ignore that is not smart.

1287
01:08:05,400 --> 01:08:09,360
Speaker 6: I have seen way too many times, and buddies in

1288
01:08:09,440 --> 01:08:12,160
Speaker 6: camp that I've been hunting with have seen way too

1289
01:08:12,200 --> 01:08:17,000
Speaker 6: many times these bucks cruising the down wind side of

1290
01:08:17,080 --> 01:08:20,960
Speaker 6: a betting area. They check the whole thing literally just

1291
01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:24,839
Speaker 6: by kind of slowly walking down the edge, sniffing the trails,

1292
01:08:25,240 --> 01:08:27,719
Speaker 6: and they know everything that is in that betting area,

1293
01:08:27,800 --> 01:08:30,160
Speaker 6: so they don't even necessarily have to go in there.

1294
01:08:30,560 --> 01:08:33,800
Speaker 6: So using that to your advantage and setting up on

1295
01:08:33,920 --> 01:08:37,360
Speaker 6: the down wind side in a place that it's a

1296
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:40,280
Speaker 6: little easier for John since he doesn't worry as much

1297
01:08:40,280 --> 01:08:43,320
Speaker 6: about the wind, so his placement is a little bit easier.

1298
01:08:43,360 --> 01:08:45,519
Speaker 6: But for those of us that do pay attention to

1299
01:08:45,600 --> 01:08:51,559
Speaker 6: our wind direction and getting busted, it's a little harder

1300
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:53,320
Speaker 6: to set up on that route because you have to

1301
01:08:53,320 --> 01:08:55,519
Speaker 6: really pay attention to where you're at and where your

1302
01:08:55,520 --> 01:09:02,519
Speaker 6: wind's going. Understanding thermals, understanding how wind currents work is important.

1303
01:09:02,680 --> 01:09:06,040
Speaker 6: It's it's a bit of an advanced kind of strategy

1304
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:08,960
Speaker 6: or tactic that hunters need to learn, kind of like

1305
01:09:09,080 --> 01:09:11,320
Speaker 6: reading a topo map. I would say, if you don't

1306
01:09:11,439 --> 01:09:14,840
Speaker 6: understand thermals how they rise and how they fall, and

1307
01:09:14,880 --> 01:09:18,559
Speaker 6: how it impacts how the deer use the area, then

1308
01:09:18,640 --> 01:09:21,120
Speaker 6: you need you need to spruce up your game there, hunter,

1309
01:09:21,240 --> 01:09:23,920
Speaker 6: because you need to understand that because bucks do and

1310
01:09:23,960 --> 01:09:27,000
Speaker 6: they always use the wind of their advantage, so you

1311
01:09:27,160 --> 01:09:29,280
Speaker 6: got to find a way to use that against them.

1312
01:09:29,280 --> 01:09:31,960
Speaker 6: And if you know that there's a betting area in

1313
01:09:32,040 --> 01:09:34,479
Speaker 6: a bottom like a lot of times the does will

1314
01:09:34,520 --> 01:09:38,320
Speaker 6: bed congregate in bottoms, especially in like hill country, right,

1315
01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:41,679
Speaker 6: they'll they'll that's usually the thickest part of the area

1316
01:09:41,720 --> 01:09:43,519
Speaker 6: down in the bottom. It's where all the briers are,

1317
01:09:43,560 --> 01:09:45,880
Speaker 6: It's where all the brush is, all that stuff is

1318
01:09:45,920 --> 01:09:48,320
Speaker 6: typically in the bottoms, and that's typically where a lot.

1319
01:09:48,200 --> 01:09:48,920
Speaker 2: Of does bed.

1320
01:09:49,400 --> 01:09:51,720
Speaker 6: The bucks typically don't want to go in there just

1321
01:09:51,760 --> 01:09:55,799
Speaker 6: for fun. They would rather skirt the edge, smell everything

1322
01:09:55,840 --> 01:09:58,120
Speaker 6: that's in there by coming on the down wind side,

1323
01:09:58,400 --> 01:10:00,680
Speaker 6: and then if there's nothing in there that it's excitesome,

1324
01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:03,320
Speaker 6: they just move on to the next spot. So I

1325
01:10:03,640 --> 01:10:07,519
Speaker 6: definitely factor wind in into every hunt, both how I

1326
01:10:07,560 --> 01:10:10,840
Speaker 6: can use it to my advantage and how a buck

1327
01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:14,080
Speaker 6: in the area would use it to his advantage.

1328
01:10:21,840 --> 01:10:22,960
Speaker 4: You mentioned the thermals.

1329
01:10:23,000 --> 01:10:26,800
Speaker 3: Greg, One of the rut locations you guys discuss in

1330
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:31,080
Speaker 3: the book are thermal hubs or thermal draft hubs, key

1331
01:10:31,120 --> 01:10:33,599
Speaker 3: thing like you mentioned in hill Country. Can you talk

1332
01:10:33,600 --> 01:10:36,840
Speaker 3: a little bit about why the first? What does that mean?

1333
01:10:36,880 --> 01:10:39,080
Speaker 3: What for folks that aren't familiar, can you describe a

1334
01:10:39,080 --> 01:10:41,280
Speaker 3: thermal hub? How do identify it? And then how to

1335
01:10:41,360 --> 01:10:45,519
Speaker 3: hunt it? Because as you mentioned, the wind can be

1336
01:10:45,560 --> 01:10:48,599
Speaker 3: tricky in these types of locations, and as you describe,

1337
01:10:48,640 --> 01:10:51,160
Speaker 3: you need to understand the thermals. But also even with

1338
01:10:51,240 --> 01:10:53,599
Speaker 3: an understanding of the thermals, it's still kind of tough

1339
01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:55,880
Speaker 3: because there's certain parts of the day when the thermals

1340
01:10:55,880 --> 01:10:57,760
Speaker 3: are going to hurt you in these locations, certain parts

1341
01:10:57,800 --> 01:11:00,479
Speaker 3: of the day when the thermals will help you. Navigetting

1342
01:11:00,520 --> 01:11:03,280
Speaker 3: that timing and where to set up your stand or

1343
01:11:03,320 --> 01:11:06,160
Speaker 3: saddle within that location is not simple.

1344
01:11:06,360 --> 01:11:07,639
Speaker 4: Can you can you touch on all that?

1345
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 7: So?

1346
01:11:09,960 --> 01:11:13,240
Speaker 6: Yeah, and yes, it's a great question. So first of all,

1347
01:11:13,320 --> 01:11:16,840
Speaker 6: let's define a thermal hub and it's different for everybody. John,

1348
01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:19,840
Speaker 6: why don't you define a thermal hub as as we

1349
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:22,880
Speaker 6: talk about it in the book, And then I'll talk

1350
01:11:22,920 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 6: about my experience hunting around it has that work for you.

1351
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:26,360
Speaker 7: That'll be fine.

1352
01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:30,080
Speaker 5: Thermals in the morning are going up, there's the temperatures rising,

1353
01:11:30,240 --> 01:11:34,679
Speaker 5: thermals are rising, your order is rising. In the evening

1354
01:11:34,800 --> 01:11:38,360
Speaker 5: is once the temperatures start cooling, your thermals are going down.

1355
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:41,200
Speaker 5: So if you're hunting hill country and let's say you're

1356
01:11:41,240 --> 01:11:42,920
Speaker 5: on the you're on a side hell and you've got

1357
01:11:43,080 --> 01:11:45,160
Speaker 5: a runway up above you, and you've got a runway

1358
01:11:45,160 --> 01:11:48,559
Speaker 5: down below you. No matter whether you're hunting morning or evening,

1359
01:11:49,040 --> 01:11:52,200
Speaker 5: one of those runways, there's an excellent possibility of getting

1360
01:11:52,200 --> 01:11:56,439
Speaker 5: winded because either way, something's going to be downwind of

1361
01:11:56,439 --> 01:11:58,920
Speaker 5: you or thermally downwind of you.

1362
01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:04,639
Speaker 7: So a hub is let's say, let's say in the evening,

1363
01:12:04,800 --> 01:12:08,599
Speaker 7: when thermals are falling, a buck can actually come down

1364
01:12:08,920 --> 01:12:12,360
Speaker 7: in the lower side of in a saddle on the

1365
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:15,400
Speaker 7: bottom side of a hill, and because all the thermals

1366
01:12:15,439 --> 01:12:18,680
Speaker 7: are going down, they can actually smell if there has

1367
01:12:18,720 --> 01:12:20,920
Speaker 7: been any dough activity up on the side of that

1368
01:12:21,080 --> 01:12:25,160
Speaker 7: ridge when they're because all that wind is coming down

1369
01:12:25,200 --> 01:12:27,880
Speaker 7: into that saddle, and that's a thermal hub. That's a

1370
01:12:27,880 --> 01:12:31,760
Speaker 7: collection area basically for all the thermals coming down the

1371
01:12:31,800 --> 01:12:35,400
Speaker 7: side of that hill. I did want to say one

1372
01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:37,599
Speaker 7: thing about the cell lock, and I've got a very

1373
01:12:37,640 --> 01:12:41,880
Speaker 7: interesting statistic, and I'm not tied in the world of

1374
01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:45,040
Speaker 7: cell lock home, but it's the only clothing company because

1375
01:12:45,080 --> 01:12:47,280
Speaker 7: they own the pad. I'm using the activated carbon, and

1376
01:12:47,320 --> 01:12:49,679
Speaker 7: in my opinion, activated carbon is the only thing.

1377
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:54,280
Speaker 5: That works it controlling your human odor. From nineteen sixty

1378
01:12:54,280 --> 01:12:58,559
Speaker 5: five through nineteen ninety six, I killed ten record book

1379
01:12:58,600 --> 01:13:03,360
Speaker 5: Bucks when I started using sunt lock correctly, because I

1380
01:13:03,400 --> 01:13:05,559
Speaker 5: used sunt lock in ninety six, but I wasn't using

1381
01:13:05,600 --> 01:13:08,320
Speaker 5: it properly and taking care of it properly when I

1382
01:13:08,520 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 5: was in ninety seven. From nineteen ninety seven up until

1383
01:13:12,280 --> 01:13:15,040
Speaker 5: last Sunday, I killed.

1384
01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:18,439
Speaker 7: Forty six book Bucks. So I've killed forty six.

1385
01:13:18,240 --> 01:13:21,439
Speaker 5: Book Bucks while using sunt lock from ninety seven through

1386
01:13:21,479 --> 01:13:25,120
Speaker 5: twenty twenty four so far, and ten from sixty.

1387
01:13:24,800 --> 01:13:28,840
Speaker 7: Five through ninety six. You do the math. That's a

1388
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:29,960
Speaker 7: pretty healthy difference.

1389
01:13:31,720 --> 01:13:32,160
Speaker 4: True.

1390
01:13:33,720 --> 01:13:36,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1391
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:39,479
Speaker 6: What I was going to say about thermal hubs is

1392
01:13:39,680 --> 01:13:42,559
Speaker 6: maybe to define it a little bit more clearly. So

1393
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:45,599
Speaker 6: if you think about like some you think about where

1394
01:13:45,680 --> 01:13:49,960
Speaker 6: multiple mainly in hill country, where multiple ridge systems kind

1395
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:53,679
Speaker 6: of dump into one Like if you can imagine satellite image,

1396
01:13:53,720 --> 01:13:56,080
Speaker 6: you typically would have a bottom and it kind of

1397
01:13:56,080 --> 01:13:58,720
Speaker 6: meanders and you got ridges on both sides. And then

1398
01:13:58,880 --> 01:14:04,360
Speaker 6: typically that bottom will terminate at a kind of a

1399
01:14:04,439 --> 01:14:08,160
Speaker 6: bowl where there will be multiple ridge systems that kind

1400
01:14:08,240 --> 01:14:14,479
Speaker 6: of dump into one main bottom. And and that that

1401
01:14:14,760 --> 01:14:20,479
Speaker 6: confluence of multiple ridge systems dumping into one location is

1402
01:14:20,479 --> 01:14:23,360
Speaker 6: what is typically referred to as a thermal hub. And

1403
01:14:23,400 --> 01:14:26,160
Speaker 6: if you think about the math of it, right or

1404
01:14:26,240 --> 01:14:28,639
Speaker 6: the physics of it, when the wind, when the when

1405
01:14:28,680 --> 01:14:32,040
Speaker 6: the wind is the thermals are kind of falling everything,

1406
01:14:32,080 --> 01:14:34,680
Speaker 6: it's gonna follow those low those low points. So it's

1407
01:14:34,680 --> 01:14:36,960
Speaker 6: gonna the wind is gonna is gonna drop into those

1408
01:14:37,040 --> 01:14:39,960
Speaker 6: ridges of the cuts, ravines, whatever you how, whatever you

1409
01:14:40,000 --> 01:14:42,719
Speaker 6: call them in your region, and the wind the thermals

1410
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:45,120
Speaker 6: are gonna fall into those low points, and it's gonna

1411
01:14:45,200 --> 01:14:47,320
Speaker 6: follow the ridge system all the way down, and it's

1412
01:14:47,320 --> 01:14:50,559
Speaker 6: gonna all congregate right there in that bowl. And what

1413
01:14:50,640 --> 01:14:53,719
Speaker 6: a buck can do is he can he can skirt

1414
01:14:53,840 --> 01:14:56,200
Speaker 6: that thermal hub. A lot of times he'll do it.

1415
01:14:56,880 --> 01:15:00,519
Speaker 6: Uh in the mornings, he'll be low. It's skirting that

1416
01:15:00,560 --> 01:15:03,360
Speaker 6: because in the mornings, before the sun comes out, before

1417
01:15:03,400 --> 01:15:06,920
Speaker 6: it starts heating up the air, your thermals are falling, right,

1418
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:10,479
Speaker 6: they fall in their cold and they rise when they're hot.

1419
01:15:10,840 --> 01:15:14,320
Speaker 6: That's it's it's it's thermal activity. So in the morning,

1420
01:15:14,840 --> 01:15:17,519
Speaker 6: before the sun comes up, your thermals are falling and

1421
01:15:17,560 --> 01:15:21,400
Speaker 6: they're going down into that into that little thermal hub.

1422
01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:24,080
Speaker 6: As soon as the sun comes up and starts warming

1423
01:15:24,160 --> 01:15:27,439
Speaker 6: up the air, your thermals start to rise. So a

1424
01:15:27,560 --> 01:15:30,160
Speaker 6: rule of thumb that I've kind of learned through the

1425
01:15:30,280 --> 01:15:34,400
Speaker 6: years and watching a lot of people have success, is to.

1426
01:15:34,479 --> 01:15:35,880
Speaker 2: Hunt low early.

1427
01:15:37,080 --> 01:15:41,240
Speaker 6: And then move as the sun warms up. Move because

1428
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:44,919
Speaker 6: once the wind switches and those thermals start rising, anything

1429
01:15:45,000 --> 01:15:48,080
Speaker 6: that comes above you, any buck that comes above you, you're busted.

1430
01:15:48,160 --> 01:15:49,240
Speaker 2: You're not gonna get away.

1431
01:15:49,320 --> 01:15:51,479
Speaker 6: Unless you know you have a full scent locked routine

1432
01:15:51,520 --> 01:15:54,360
Speaker 6: and you are confident in it, then that's a different story.

1433
01:15:54,400 --> 01:15:58,920
Speaker 6: But for for folks that don't have that system, as

1434
01:15:58,960 --> 01:16:00,759
Speaker 6: soon as that wind is, as soon as the thermals

1435
01:16:00,760 --> 01:16:04,400
Speaker 6: start rising, you gotta move. And I can illustrate this perfectly,

1436
01:16:05,360 --> 01:16:08,280
Speaker 6: my good buddy Carl. Last year, John, you were there,

1437
01:16:08,360 --> 01:16:11,639
Speaker 6: you saw this happen we're hunting Indiana on public land.

1438
01:16:11,720 --> 01:16:16,599
Speaker 6: And he did that strategy to eight. So Carl found

1439
01:16:16,720 --> 01:16:20,200
Speaker 6: a thermal hub, uh so, a ridge system that all

1440
01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:23,320
Speaker 6: dumped down into one spot and it was shredded with

1441
01:16:23,400 --> 01:16:28,240
Speaker 6: sign all around the thermal hub. Call it the bottom

1442
01:16:28,360 --> 01:16:30,640
Speaker 6: third of the hillside. So you know you got a

1443
01:16:31,479 --> 01:16:34,519
Speaker 6: two hundred foot hill. The bottom third of that is

1444
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:37,280
Speaker 6: where all the sign was in this particular thermal hub.

1445
01:16:37,760 --> 01:16:38,960
Speaker 2: Carl figured that out.

1446
01:16:39,040 --> 01:16:42,240
Speaker 6: He found it by scouting, and he realized that he

1447
01:16:42,360 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 6: had this opportunity to hunt low in the morning in

1448
01:16:44,800 --> 01:16:48,120
Speaker 6: case that buck came through there in the morning. He

1449
01:16:48,200 --> 01:16:50,760
Speaker 6: had a plan. He called his shot. He said, look,

1450
01:16:50,840 --> 01:16:54,400
Speaker 6: the wind, the thermals are gonna switch at like eight

1451
01:16:54,479 --> 01:16:57,320
Speaker 6: thirty in the morning. That's when you know the forecast

1452
01:16:57,400 --> 01:17:00,360
Speaker 6: is to change. And he said, I'm gonna move up

1453
01:17:00,400 --> 01:17:03,559
Speaker 6: the hill as soon as my wind shifts, and I

1454
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:06,320
Speaker 6: found another spot that I think a bench that I

1455
01:17:06,360 --> 01:17:09,160
Speaker 6: think that buck is going to walk once it warms up.

1456
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:11,840
Speaker 6: That's what he did. He went in the morning in

1457
01:17:11,880 --> 01:17:15,840
Speaker 6: the dark, and he set up low. About two hours later,

1458
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:18,200
Speaker 6: when the wind started to switch and the thermal started

1459
01:17:18,200 --> 01:17:21,320
Speaker 6: to rise, got down, he moved up and he shot

1460
01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:24,200
Speaker 6: that buck on the exact trail that he called about

1461
01:17:24,240 --> 01:17:27,120
Speaker 6: ten minutes after he got in that tree. So it's

1462
01:17:27,160 --> 01:17:29,880
Speaker 6: a general rule of thumb you can hunt low in

1463
01:17:29,880 --> 01:17:32,280
Speaker 6: the mornings, but then you have to move. You have

1464
01:17:32,320 --> 01:17:35,080
Speaker 6: to get out of there before your thermal switching. Then

1465
01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:36,360
Speaker 6: everything above you screwed.

1466
01:17:36,960 --> 01:17:39,360
Speaker 3: So okay, well I want to take that one step further.

1467
01:17:39,479 --> 01:17:41,880
Speaker 3: So if you were going to hunt during the rut,

1468
01:17:41,960 --> 01:17:44,400
Speaker 3: and you're hunting a thermal hub location as you just

1469
01:17:44,439 --> 01:17:46,720
Speaker 3: defined it, where you've got like a bowl and a

1470
01:17:46,760 --> 01:17:49,680
Speaker 3: bunch of ridges dropping down to the bottom. Usually at

1471
01:17:49,680 --> 01:17:52,160
Speaker 3: the bottom there there's oftentimes a big hub scrape too,

1472
01:17:52,240 --> 01:17:54,880
Speaker 3: or a primary scrape. You know, that's also a concentration

1473
01:17:54,960 --> 01:17:57,000
Speaker 3: of sense. So a lot of deer like to hit

1474
01:17:57,040 --> 01:17:59,519
Speaker 3: those scrapes and ends up being created there. So you've

1475
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:01,880
Speaker 3: got all these things happened there in the early morning,

1476
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:05,559
Speaker 3: So you're recommending hunt low in the early morning. I

1477
01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:08,800
Speaker 3: imagine where the best convergence of those trails is, or

1478
01:18:08,800 --> 01:18:10,920
Speaker 3: where that big scrape is or whatever it is, and

1479
01:18:10,920 --> 01:18:13,240
Speaker 3: you're hoping that the thermals that are dropping will keep

1480
01:18:13,280 --> 01:18:15,479
Speaker 3: your scent pooled down low with you and you can

1481
01:18:15,560 --> 01:18:19,200
Speaker 3: kill a deer before he gets down there. When you

1482
01:18:19,240 --> 01:18:21,360
Speaker 3: were to move later in the morning for the rest

1483
01:18:21,439 --> 01:18:23,839
Speaker 3: of the day. Now you've got a lot of options.

1484
01:18:23,840 --> 01:18:25,680
Speaker 3: It's simple when you're trying to hunt down at the

1485
01:18:25,680 --> 01:18:28,160
Speaker 3: bottom where that big scrape is or where that convergence

1486
01:18:28,200 --> 01:18:30,960
Speaker 3: of all the trails is. But in the afternoon, now

1487
01:18:30,960 --> 01:18:34,200
Speaker 3: you've got maybe four different points that are all dropping down.

1488
01:18:34,240 --> 01:18:37,120
Speaker 3: You've got ridges on either side all around you. You

1489
01:18:37,160 --> 01:18:38,960
Speaker 3: could pick any one of those and you will out

1490
01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:41,479
Speaker 3: have an entire hillside to pick from and or a

1491
01:18:41,560 --> 01:18:44,479
Speaker 3: ridgetop to pick from. How do you pick the spot

1492
01:18:44,640 --> 01:18:48,320
Speaker 3: for your afternoon with the rising thermals when you have

1493
01:18:48,360 --> 01:18:50,200
Speaker 3: so many more options, what are you thinking about that?

1494
01:18:52,880 --> 01:18:56,799
Speaker 6: It's way harder to pin it down. And that's why

1495
01:18:56,880 --> 01:18:57,599
Speaker 6: the phase of.

1496
01:18:57,520 --> 01:18:59,120
Speaker 2: The rut is so important for this.

1497
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:01,640
Speaker 6: When you want to when if you're gonna move up

1498
01:19:01,680 --> 01:19:04,760
Speaker 6: and hunt, you're exactly right mark where the deer have

1499
01:19:05,640 --> 01:19:08,840
Speaker 6: way more options to go. What you really want to

1500
01:19:08,880 --> 01:19:10,840
Speaker 6: be is in the say, in the seek phase of

1501
01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:13,040
Speaker 6: the rut, the pre rut, where the deer are really

1502
01:19:13,080 --> 01:19:17,120
Speaker 6: covering ground, because your chances of a deer walking through

1503
01:19:17,160 --> 01:19:22,000
Speaker 6: there are much better as opposed to the peak rut

1504
01:19:22,040 --> 01:19:23,599
Speaker 6: where they are traveling less.

1505
01:19:23,800 --> 01:19:26,000
Speaker 2: As we learned about earlier the way John.

1506
01:19:25,760 --> 01:19:29,519
Speaker 6: Described the peak rut, the deer start moving less, and

1507
01:19:29,560 --> 01:19:33,240
Speaker 6: then the post rut when they start traveling again. To

1508
01:19:33,439 --> 01:19:36,680
Speaker 6: seek out those that haven't been bred. That is your

1509
01:19:36,680 --> 01:19:40,679
Speaker 6: best opportunity to hunt higher on and I would find

1510
01:19:40,880 --> 01:19:44,040
Speaker 6: uh what, let's just use Carl's example is what he

1511
01:19:44,080 --> 01:19:47,839
Speaker 6: did and it worked. What he did is he found

1512
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:51,800
Speaker 6: a small little bench that gave the deer. It was

1513
01:19:51,840 --> 01:19:55,200
Speaker 6: at the top third of the hillside. So on the

1514
01:19:55,240 --> 01:19:58,240
Speaker 6: top third he set up on a bench that would

1515
01:19:58,240 --> 01:19:59,479
Speaker 6: give a buck and.

1516
01:19:59,560 --> 01:20:02,840
Speaker 2: Advantag for travel. Because they're lazy, just like us.

1517
01:20:02,880 --> 01:20:04,760
Speaker 6: They don't want to walk on the steepest terrain as

1518
01:20:04,760 --> 01:20:07,000
Speaker 6: possible if they can avoid it, they're going to find

1519
01:20:07,000 --> 01:20:09,320
Speaker 6: a little bench or something like that that's going to

1520
01:20:09,360 --> 01:20:14,400
Speaker 6: give them an advantage. And if you think about, a

1521
01:20:14,439 --> 01:20:19,719
Speaker 6: buck could walk that ridge system on the top third,

1522
01:20:19,880 --> 01:20:22,920
Speaker 6: and when the wind is blowing towards him, where the thermals

1523
01:20:22,840 --> 01:20:26,479
Speaker 6: are rising, he can smell the entire valley below him,

1524
01:20:26,840 --> 01:20:30,799
Speaker 6: the whole thing just by slowly walking down the ridge.

1525
01:20:31,120 --> 01:20:34,720
Speaker 6: So what it takes is a little bit of experience

1526
01:20:34,880 --> 01:20:37,439
Speaker 6: to understand where bucks like to do that and they

1527
01:20:37,439 --> 01:20:40,120
Speaker 6: typically like to do that on the top third of

1528
01:20:40,160 --> 01:20:42,920
Speaker 6: the ridge. And this isn't my idea. I didn't come

1529
01:20:43,000 --> 01:20:45,280
Speaker 6: up with this. Lots of people preach this. You can

1530
01:20:45,320 --> 01:20:48,400
Speaker 6: read books about this. Hunters have known this for decades.

1531
01:20:48,560 --> 01:20:52,000
Speaker 6: Right that top third of the ridge where the thermals

1532
01:20:52,040 --> 01:20:54,240
Speaker 6: are rising. That is, if you can find a little

1533
01:20:54,240 --> 01:20:57,280
Speaker 6: bench or some sort of little pinch point in that zone,

1534
01:20:57,640 --> 01:20:59,800
Speaker 6: that can be gold for a rut phase.

1535
01:20:59,840 --> 01:21:03,320
Speaker 5: Look, yeah, you can mind the does don't have to

1536
01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:07,479
Speaker 5: physically be there. If they pass through within an hour

1537
01:21:07,600 --> 01:21:10,680
Speaker 5: or two earlier, their sen's going to still rise up,

1538
01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:13,799
Speaker 5: you know, in the morning, up the side of those hills.

1539
01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:18,120
Speaker 5: One one really cool way of trying to explain thermals

1540
01:21:18,600 --> 01:21:21,240
Speaker 5: is if you're sitting around a campfire after dark. Okay,

1541
01:21:21,280 --> 01:21:25,680
Speaker 5: the temperatures are dropping, so that means your thermals or

1542
01:21:25,800 --> 01:21:29,639
Speaker 5: thermals are coming down. So you've got your fire which

1543
01:21:29,720 --> 01:21:34,200
Speaker 5: is hot, so it's hot, so the thermals are going

1544
01:21:34,280 --> 01:21:39,200
Speaker 5: up because of the fire, and the thermals environmental thermals are

1545
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:42,360
Speaker 5: coming down, so they're clashing with each other.

1546
01:21:42,800 --> 01:21:44,160
Speaker 7: And that's why.

1547
01:21:43,920 --> 01:21:46,920
Speaker 5: When you're sitting around a fire, even if there's no wind,

1548
01:21:47,720 --> 01:21:50,840
Speaker 5: the smoke from the fire tends to move around the area,

1549
01:21:50,880 --> 01:21:52,960
Speaker 5: and you're always getting up and moving if you want

1550
01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:56,120
Speaker 5: to stay out of the smoke. It's because the thermals

1551
01:21:56,160 --> 01:22:03,600
Speaker 5: are clashing with the environmental temperatures dropping against the thermals

1552
01:22:03,600 --> 01:22:06,960
Speaker 5: from the fire heat going up, and they clash, and

1553
01:22:07,000 --> 01:22:09,679
Speaker 5: then the wind's just going different direction. Even if there's

1554
01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:13,439
Speaker 5: no wind, you know, zero wind on your cell phone

1555
01:22:13,439 --> 01:22:14,000
Speaker 5: when you look.

1556
01:22:13,840 --> 01:22:15,240
Speaker 7: At aci weather or whatever it may be.

1557
01:22:15,880 --> 01:22:19,000
Speaker 6: Yeah, and I know that that that's a very it's

1558
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:22,400
Speaker 6: a pretty basic concept. But I talk to hunters all

1559
01:22:22,439 --> 01:22:25,120
Speaker 6: over the country who don't know what thermals are. They

1560
01:22:25,320 --> 01:22:28,320
Speaker 6: they has never heard of it, or you know, whatever

1561
01:22:28,400 --> 01:22:32,599
Speaker 6: the reason might be. But as a general rule, your

1562
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:36,040
Speaker 6: thermals are they're a slave to the temperature. If the

1563
01:22:36,120 --> 01:22:40,479
Speaker 6: temperature is falling, thermals are falling. If the temperature is rising,

1564
01:22:40,880 --> 01:22:44,200
Speaker 6: thermals are rising. It's just a general rule. It's an

1565
01:22:44,240 --> 01:22:47,719
Speaker 6: easy way to think about it, uh for a hunter.

1566
01:22:47,800 --> 01:22:50,800
Speaker 6: If you're if you're not, if you if you've never

1567
01:22:50,960 --> 01:22:54,320
Speaker 6: understood wind currents and stuff like that. I'm not a meteorologist,

1568
01:22:54,439 --> 01:22:57,679
Speaker 6: but I do know that when temperatures fall, thermals fall,

1569
01:22:58,000 --> 01:23:01,160
Speaker 6: and when temperatures rise thermal it's an easy way to

1570
01:23:01,200 --> 01:23:01,680
Speaker 6: think about it.

1571
01:23:01,720 --> 01:23:03,760
Speaker 5: In no country, you better to know how to hunt

1572
01:23:03,840 --> 01:23:08,679
Speaker 5: thermals in flat land. It's not yeah, white as as bad,

1573
01:23:09,080 --> 01:23:12,880
Speaker 5: but still in the it's if there's no wind and

1574
01:23:12,960 --> 01:23:14,120
Speaker 5: you're in flat country.

1575
01:23:14,840 --> 01:23:15,360
Speaker 7: You know, in the.

1576
01:23:15,320 --> 01:23:19,720
Speaker 5: Evening, you got to be cautious, you know, because your

1577
01:23:19,800 --> 01:23:22,960
Speaker 5: thermals are falling and if something comes close to your tree, uh,

1578
01:23:23,160 --> 01:23:26,000
Speaker 5: they could very well win you because of the thermals

1579
01:23:26,040 --> 01:23:26,559
Speaker 5: coming down.

1580
01:23:27,120 --> 01:23:29,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, tricky. Thing isn't like a hill country set up

1581
01:23:29,640 --> 01:23:32,120
Speaker 3: like you just described, Greg. You have two shifts that

1582
01:23:32,160 --> 01:23:34,639
Speaker 3: happened during the day. So you've got like you want

1583
01:23:34,640 --> 01:23:36,439
Speaker 3: to have a want to have a low spot early

1584
01:23:36,439 --> 01:23:38,400
Speaker 3: in the morning, but then part way through the morning

1585
01:23:38,439 --> 01:23:40,200
Speaker 3: warms up, so now you want to move high. And

1586
01:23:40,240 --> 01:23:42,760
Speaker 3: then that works pretty good until primetime in the evening,

1587
01:23:42,840 --> 01:23:44,559
Speaker 3: and then again they're falling again, so then you want

1588
01:23:44,560 --> 01:23:47,920
Speaker 3: to move low again. So it can be tricky if

1589
01:23:47,920 --> 01:23:50,599
Speaker 3: you're trying to chase that. But it could be tricky. Yeah,

1590
01:23:51,400 --> 01:23:53,120
Speaker 3: you're not just chasing the thermals.

1591
01:23:53,160 --> 01:23:57,160
Speaker 5: You're chasing how the bucks use the thermalsh You're not

1592
01:23:57,840 --> 01:24:01,840
Speaker 5: right and they're gonna Yeah, they're going to definitely they're

1593
01:24:01,840 --> 01:24:04,320
Speaker 5: going to definitely move according your thermals in the yellow country.

1594
01:24:04,400 --> 01:24:08,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm heading to hunt some Kentucky public

1595
01:24:08,120 --> 01:24:11,920
Speaker 3: land next week, hill country, just like we're describing.

1596
01:24:12,000 --> 01:24:13,599
Speaker 4: And this is not my bread and butter.

1597
01:24:13,800 --> 01:24:15,840
Speaker 3: So I'm asking a lot of questions about this because

1598
01:24:15,840 --> 01:24:19,360
Speaker 3: I'm trying to get spruce stuff and ready for it making.

1599
01:24:21,200 --> 01:24:21,400
Speaker 7: Yes.

1600
01:24:21,640 --> 01:24:25,840
Speaker 3: Yes, Okay, So we have a bunch of things that

1601
01:24:25,840 --> 01:24:28,040
Speaker 3: we have not gotten to cover yet that I wanted to,

1602
01:24:28,160 --> 01:24:30,080
Speaker 3: but we are using up a lot of your time,

1603
01:24:30,160 --> 01:24:31,960
Speaker 3: So I want to kind of shift into like a

1604
01:24:32,080 --> 01:24:35,200
Speaker 3: rapid fire type mode here, guys, where I'm going to

1605
01:24:35,280 --> 01:24:38,200
Speaker 3: ask you guys for your quick thoughts on a topic

1606
01:24:38,400 --> 01:24:40,840
Speaker 3: and in your mind, try to do like the one

1607
01:24:40,880 --> 01:24:43,600
Speaker 3: minute summary, like the fast here's the most important thing

1608
01:24:43,640 --> 01:24:45,000
Speaker 3: you got to know about this one thing, and we're

1609
01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:47,639
Speaker 3: going to try to rapid fire roll through a few

1610
01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:50,599
Speaker 3: more important rut things just to make sure someone listening

1611
01:24:51,000 --> 01:24:54,280
Speaker 3: on November seventh, twenty twenty four has a little bit

1612
01:24:54,280 --> 01:24:56,080
Speaker 3: of everything they can use over this next week.

1613
01:24:56,120 --> 01:24:57,680
Speaker 4: Okay, So.

1614
01:24:59,280 --> 01:25:03,680
Speaker 3: Rapid fire greg really quick calling during the rut. What

1615
01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:06,639
Speaker 3: are your few couple quick most important thoughts for calling

1616
01:25:06,800 --> 01:25:07,799
Speaker 3: during peak rut.

1617
01:25:10,400 --> 01:25:10,960
Speaker 2: I love it.

1618
01:25:11,200 --> 01:25:16,360
Speaker 6: I love rattling. I'm not afraid to rattle. I don't

1619
01:25:16,360 --> 01:25:19,640
Speaker 6: typically get real super aggressive with it. I typically like

1620
01:25:19,720 --> 01:25:21,680
Speaker 6: to do a little bit more of like a sparring

1621
01:25:22,240 --> 01:25:25,240
Speaker 6: type session that I actually learned from John. He describes

1622
01:25:25,280 --> 01:25:26,960
Speaker 6: it in some of his other books, and we talk

1623
01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:30,839
Speaker 6: about rattling in this book. But yeah, I love rattling.

1624
01:25:31,000 --> 01:25:31,719
Speaker 6: I am a fan.

1625
01:25:31,960 --> 01:25:32,599
Speaker 2: I do it.

1626
01:25:32,520 --> 01:25:35,960
Speaker 3: Frequently, John, same question to you. Quick thoughts on calling

1627
01:25:36,120 --> 01:25:36,719
Speaker 3: during the rut.

1628
01:25:36,960 --> 01:25:40,280
Speaker 5: Okay, we have a complete chapter on using fake tactics

1629
01:25:40,280 --> 01:25:45,280
Speaker 5: in the book. But I exactly like Greg described I

1630
01:25:45,360 --> 01:25:48,040
Speaker 5: it's pretty rare if I'm hunting in the interior of

1631
01:25:48,040 --> 01:25:50,600
Speaker 5: the vetting area during the rut that I don't do

1632
01:25:50,680 --> 01:25:53,120
Speaker 5: a couple of sparring sequences early in the morning, maybe

1633
01:25:53,520 --> 01:25:57,040
Speaker 5: forty five minutes after daylight, you know, sometime around eight o'clock,

1634
01:25:57,439 --> 01:26:01,760
Speaker 5: and do two sequences on an evening sin about an

1635
01:26:01,800 --> 01:26:05,639
Speaker 5: hour before dark. So I'm not a big grunt called guy.

1636
01:26:05,720 --> 01:26:10,760
Speaker 5: I've had a lot more success doing spiring sequences. When

1637
01:26:10,800 --> 01:26:14,880
Speaker 5: I'm out of state, I will do more aggressive rattle

1638
01:26:14,920 --> 01:26:17,240
Speaker 5: sequences because there's a lot more mature bucks. They're used

1639
01:26:17,240 --> 01:26:20,200
Speaker 5: to hearing that aggressiveness like you see on TV. But

1640
01:26:20,600 --> 01:26:23,960
Speaker 5: when I'm hunting in Michigan, it's almost always subtle sparring sequences.

1641
01:26:24,160 --> 01:26:25,960
Speaker 5: I think that arouses their attention and.

1642
01:26:26,160 --> 01:26:28,920
Speaker 6: One one other, one other thing before we go to that,

1643
01:26:29,160 --> 01:26:33,320
Speaker 6: before we go Uh, don't rattle. If you're in an

1644
01:26:33,320 --> 01:26:35,800
Speaker 6: open area where the deer can see, where a buck

1645
01:26:35,840 --> 01:26:36,880
Speaker 6: can see you from.

1646
01:26:36,760 --> 01:26:38,960
Speaker 2: A long way away, it won't work.

1647
01:26:39,360 --> 01:26:41,240
Speaker 6: What that buck will do is he will come to

1648
01:26:41,280 --> 01:26:43,920
Speaker 6: the point just close enough to where he can see

1649
01:26:43,920 --> 01:26:46,800
Speaker 6: where the where the rattling came from, and if he

1650
01:26:46,920 --> 01:26:49,880
Speaker 6: does not confirm it with his eyes, he will not

1651
01:26:50,000 --> 01:26:53,280
Speaker 6: come in. So do not rattle in a big open woods.

1652
01:26:53,360 --> 01:26:56,080
Speaker 6: It won't work at least for a mature deer maybe

1653
01:26:56,080 --> 01:26:57,920
Speaker 6: a one year older two year old to come in,

1654
01:26:57,960 --> 01:27:00,439
Speaker 6: But a big deer isn't coming in. You have got

1655
01:27:00,439 --> 01:27:04,320
Speaker 6: to be obscure. Your location has to be obscure. So

1656
01:27:04,360 --> 01:27:06,960
Speaker 6: a thick betting area's thick something. If you're going to

1657
01:27:07,040 --> 01:27:09,439
Speaker 6: rattle for that buck to come in in bowl range,

1658
01:27:09,880 --> 01:27:11,639
Speaker 6: he can't see the source of the noise.

1659
01:27:11,760 --> 01:27:13,160
Speaker 2: That is important because you.

1660
01:27:13,120 --> 01:27:16,400
Speaker 6: Will screw it up like I have done many times

1661
01:27:16,439 --> 01:27:18,040
Speaker 6: by rattling 're deer.

1662
01:27:17,840 --> 01:27:22,160
Speaker 3: Conceiving now maybe though maybe there is an asterisk next

1663
01:27:22,160 --> 01:27:27,000
Speaker 3: to that, which is unless you are using a decoy possibly,

1664
01:27:27,680 --> 01:27:30,800
Speaker 3: And that was okay, fair, That's the next question I

1665
01:27:30,840 --> 01:27:34,720
Speaker 3: had because I grew up by living by the Gospel

1666
01:27:34,920 --> 01:27:37,680
Speaker 3: of Precision Bow Hunting by John and Chris Eberhart, and

1667
01:27:37,720 --> 01:27:40,519
Speaker 3: within that book early on, one of the major themes

1668
01:27:40,560 --> 01:27:44,040
Speaker 3: in that book is to not use a lot of

1669
01:27:44,120 --> 01:27:46,639
Speaker 3: things that draw attention to you in places like Michigan,

1670
01:27:47,040 --> 01:27:49,680
Speaker 3: so decoys being a perfect example of that. So I

1671
01:27:49,720 --> 01:27:52,760
Speaker 3: grew up for a long time being terrified by the

1672
01:27:52,760 --> 01:27:55,960
Speaker 3: idea of using decoys because I thought it would spook

1673
01:27:56,000 --> 01:27:58,160
Speaker 3: every deer in the world in a heavily pressured place

1674
01:27:58,240 --> 01:28:01,120
Speaker 3: like Michigan. But I see in one of the chapters

1675
01:28:01,120 --> 01:28:03,840
Speaker 3: in your new book, John, you're talking about using dough decoys.

1676
01:28:04,080 --> 01:28:08,120
Speaker 3: So I'm curious, real quick, fast summary, what's your evolved

1677
01:28:08,200 --> 01:28:09,639
Speaker 3: view on decoys these days?

1678
01:28:10,600 --> 01:28:14,280
Speaker 5: Not really, it's not really evolved. I still very, very

1679
01:28:14,400 --> 01:28:18,240
Speaker 5: rarely use a decoy in Michigan. I use decoys a lot.

1680
01:28:18,040 --> 01:28:18,880
Speaker 7: When I go out of state.

1681
01:28:18,920 --> 01:28:21,200
Speaker 5: I would never go out of state without taking a

1682
01:28:21,240 --> 01:28:26,639
Speaker 5: decoy with me, a hard body three D decoy. They're

1683
01:28:26,720 --> 01:28:29,040
Speaker 5: they're paying to carry around. But I'll tell you what,

1684
01:28:29,400 --> 01:28:31,400
Speaker 5: if you're doing a rattle sequence and you're in a

1685
01:28:31,400 --> 01:28:33,960
Speaker 5: more open area, and I've done multiple times in i

1686
01:28:34,120 --> 01:28:36,840
Speaker 5: Went Kansas, if you put a decoy out and a

1687
01:28:36,920 --> 01:28:40,080
Speaker 5: deer is coming and it's one hundred yards away and

1688
01:28:40,200 --> 01:28:42,599
Speaker 5: he sees it, he'll come right in.

1689
01:28:43,120 --> 01:28:45,000
Speaker 7: If he's not with a dough, he'll come right in.

1690
01:28:45,120 --> 01:28:47,720
Speaker 5: I've actually put a decoy out on the corner of

1691
01:28:47,720 --> 01:28:51,040
Speaker 5: a big cornfield in Iowa where you know there's like

1692
01:28:51,120 --> 01:28:53,519
Speaker 5: here's here's a corner, and I had the decoy up

1693
01:28:53,560 --> 01:28:56,040
Speaker 5: here so you can see it from either direction, and

1694
01:28:56,120 --> 01:28:57,439
Speaker 5: I had to come out.

1695
01:28:57,960 --> 01:29:00,439
Speaker 7: I bet it was. I'm here half a mile probably

1696
01:29:00,680 --> 01:29:02,920
Speaker 7: three eighths of a mile down the field edge. He

1697
01:29:03,000 --> 01:29:05,200
Speaker 7: saw that decoy and he came right to it.

1698
01:29:05,240 --> 01:29:09,400
Speaker 5: But in Michigan, because we've got so many dos and

1699
01:29:09,439 --> 01:29:12,560
Speaker 5: we've got just got so many deer, the odds of

1700
01:29:12,600 --> 01:29:15,320
Speaker 5: a doe coming in and spooking from the decoy, coming

1701
01:29:15,320 --> 01:29:18,120
Speaker 5: in within three to five yards and doing the peekaboo

1702
01:29:18,160 --> 01:29:21,920
Speaker 5: deal and then blowing and then running off is really

1703
01:29:21,920 --> 01:29:26,480
Speaker 5: really high. So I don't do it in Michigan very

1704
01:29:26,720 --> 01:29:30,479
Speaker 5: very often, because unless I'm in an area where I know.

1705
01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:35,200
Speaker 7: I'm only gonna see a couple of deer, then I

1706
01:29:35,280 --> 01:29:35,760
Speaker 7: may use it.

1707
01:29:35,800 --> 01:29:37,880
Speaker 5: Bit if I'm in an area where the chances of

1708
01:29:38,000 --> 01:29:41,599
Speaker 5: seeing multiple dos and bonds and some ordnan bucks where

1709
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:43,719
Speaker 5: they might come in and hit it with their antler

1710
01:29:43,760 --> 01:29:45,400
Speaker 5: and then spook and blow.

1711
01:29:46,479 --> 01:29:48,720
Speaker 7: I just rarely use them in Michigan anymore. I've killed

1712
01:29:48,720 --> 01:29:49,439
Speaker 7: a couple bucks.

1713
01:29:49,280 --> 01:29:52,400
Speaker 5: With him in the you know, in the eighties, but

1714
01:29:52,560 --> 01:29:54,439
Speaker 5: they were two and a half year olds, so on

1715
01:29:54,520 --> 01:29:55,280
Speaker 5: three and a half.

1716
01:29:55,439 --> 01:29:57,240
Speaker 7: Older bucks in Michigan, I don't use the bit out

1717
01:29:57,240 --> 01:29:58,160
Speaker 7: of state. I use them a lot.

1718
01:29:58,920 --> 01:30:03,800
Speaker 2: Greg, and a decoy I don't have with decoys, So.

1719
01:30:05,560 --> 01:30:08,960
Speaker 6: I'm sure John is one hundred percent right in that

1720
01:30:08,960 --> 01:30:11,880
Speaker 6: they can be very effective. But I'm a minimalist at

1721
01:30:11,960 --> 01:30:15,360
Speaker 6: heart with gear, so I don't. I don't carry stuff

1722
01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:20,080
Speaker 6: like that ever, so I can't speak to that. I

1723
01:30:20,520 --> 01:30:23,200
Speaker 6: can say that without a decoy, if you're in an

1724
01:30:23,200 --> 01:30:25,160
Speaker 6: open area and you need a big buck to come

1725
01:30:25,160 --> 01:30:28,160
Speaker 6: in mature into bowl range and he can see your

1726
01:30:28,200 --> 01:30:31,200
Speaker 6: area from one hundred yards away, he ain't coming in.

1727
01:30:31,560 --> 01:30:33,120
Speaker 2: Yeah without a decoy.

1728
01:30:33,680 --> 01:30:38,920
Speaker 3: Okay, another one for you, then, Greg advice for making

1729
01:30:39,040 --> 01:30:45,320
Speaker 3: all day sits more comfortable or enjoyable, especially especially if

1730
01:30:45,320 --> 01:30:47,479
Speaker 3: you're doing what we do. Let's just hunt in a saddle.

1731
01:30:48,439 --> 01:30:51,400
Speaker 3: Any any advice on saddle hunting, comfort tips for all

1732
01:30:51,439 --> 01:30:53,599
Speaker 3: day or or any other part of the all day piece.

1733
01:30:54,000 --> 01:30:58,639
Speaker 6: Quick thoughts here, It's just hard, you know, an all

1734
01:30:58,720 --> 01:31:02,040
Speaker 6: day sit. I I used to love listening to your

1735
01:31:02,760 --> 01:31:05,960
Speaker 6: live the early days of Wired to Hunt, when like

1736
01:31:06,040 --> 01:31:08,679
Speaker 6: the Holy Field days, when you would you would start

1737
01:31:08,720 --> 01:31:12,000
Speaker 6: talking about, okay, it's like time for all days since

1738
01:31:12,040 --> 01:31:15,160
Speaker 6: to start, and there was always this little trepidation with

1739
01:31:15,360 --> 01:31:19,040
Speaker 6: you because you're like, you know, It's like it's like,

1740
01:31:19,120 --> 01:31:22,160
Speaker 6: I know I need to sit all day, but it sucks.

1741
01:31:22,479 --> 01:31:27,720
Speaker 6: It's hard, and it feels like grinding. I've yet to

1742
01:31:27,720 --> 01:31:30,320
Speaker 6: figure out a way around that. Maybe a box line

1743
01:31:30,479 --> 01:31:33,960
Speaker 6: would do that with maybe a fridge in there, find

1744
01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:37,720
Speaker 6: maybe some Wi Fi. Yeah, maybe that would make an

1745
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:41,960
Speaker 6: all days sit easier. But man, they're just hard. So

1746
01:31:42,240 --> 01:31:47,639
Speaker 6: I find myself almost never sitting all day. I haven't

1747
01:31:47,760 --> 01:31:51,559
Speaker 6: sat in the in a tree from daylight to dark

1748
01:31:51,960 --> 01:31:55,320
Speaker 6: in several years. Now, I will hunt all day, meaning

1749
01:31:55,439 --> 01:31:56,519
Speaker 6: I won't leave the woods.

1750
01:31:56,960 --> 01:31:57,679
Speaker 2: I'll come down.

1751
01:31:57,920 --> 01:32:00,840
Speaker 6: I'll maybe move to a different air, yeah, maybe move

1752
01:32:01,320 --> 01:32:03,840
Speaker 6: one hundred yards away, or do a little mid day

1753
01:32:03,920 --> 01:32:07,120
Speaker 6: scouting and slowly kind of slip through an area and

1754
01:32:07,160 --> 01:32:09,800
Speaker 6: then find another spot for the last four or five

1755
01:32:09,840 --> 01:32:12,800
Speaker 6: hours of the day. But man hunting all day in

1756
01:32:12,880 --> 01:32:17,000
Speaker 6: the same tree without getting down, it's just hard. It's

1757
01:32:18,280 --> 01:32:21,160
Speaker 6: more discipline in mind and willpower.

1758
01:32:20,640 --> 01:32:21,720
Speaker 2: Than it is anything else.

1759
01:32:21,760 --> 01:32:24,599
Speaker 6: Because I don't care what saddle you're in, what tree

1760
01:32:24,640 --> 01:32:27,160
Speaker 6: stand you're in, you are gonna get uncomfortable.

1761
01:32:27,479 --> 01:32:28,599
Speaker 2: I don't care who it is.

1762
01:32:28,800 --> 01:32:31,000
Speaker 6: You are gonna get uncomfortable, and you just have to

1763
01:32:31,040 --> 01:32:34,360
Speaker 6: grit your teeth and go through it. And I'm soft.

1764
01:32:34,520 --> 01:32:37,880
Speaker 6: I don't like to be uncomfortable, so I I find

1765
01:32:37,880 --> 01:32:40,000
Speaker 6: myself not doing much of that anymore.

1766
01:32:40,360 --> 01:32:43,599
Speaker 4: All right, John, what would you say on that one?

1767
01:32:43,680 --> 01:32:45,920
Speaker 5: Well, as you do, Mark, I've done a ton of

1768
01:32:45,960 --> 01:32:48,360
Speaker 5: all day sets, and I've killed a lot of bucks

1769
01:32:48,439 --> 01:32:51,320
Speaker 5: during the middle of the day. Hunting all day is

1770
01:32:51,520 --> 01:32:54,760
Speaker 5: very grueling, especially if it's sunny out, because it gets

1771
01:32:54,840 --> 01:32:56,840
Speaker 5: so hot in the middle of the day and you

1772
01:32:56,880 --> 01:32:58,360
Speaker 5: don't see a lot of deer in the middle of

1773
01:32:58,400 --> 01:33:00,680
Speaker 5: the day, and so many hunters will give all day

1774
01:33:00,720 --> 01:33:03,639
Speaker 5: sits maybe one or two shots, and because they don't

1775
01:33:03,680 --> 01:33:06,120
Speaker 5: see much, they give up on it. Well, if you

1776
01:33:06,240 --> 01:33:08,800
Speaker 5: went out as a hunter, an avid hunter, and you

1777
01:33:08,880 --> 01:33:12,360
Speaker 5: hunted two evenings in a row and you didn't see

1778
01:33:12,439 --> 01:33:14,599
Speaker 5: much for deer activity, would you quit hunting evenings?

1779
01:33:14,600 --> 01:33:15,920
Speaker 7: Of course you wouldn't.

1780
01:33:16,040 --> 01:33:19,360
Speaker 5: But you know, I'm a percentage guy, and like I said,

1781
01:33:19,400 --> 01:33:22,000
Speaker 5: I've killed seven out of my twenty book bucks in

1782
01:33:22,040 --> 01:33:24,880
Speaker 5: Michigan that were shot between November one and fourteen. We're

1783
01:33:24,920 --> 01:33:28,000
Speaker 5: during eleven to three o'clock, so I know the advantage

1784
01:33:28,040 --> 01:33:32,680
Speaker 5: of hunting midday an all day sit, you know, if

1785
01:33:32,720 --> 01:33:35,280
Speaker 5: it's in the right type of area, and it's during

1786
01:33:35,320 --> 01:33:36,040
Speaker 5: the rut phases.

1787
01:33:36,600 --> 01:33:40,080
Speaker 7: So I don't have any issues with this comfort.

1788
01:33:40,200 --> 01:33:42,519
Speaker 5: I can go to the bathroom one or two in

1789
01:33:42,560 --> 01:33:45,800
Speaker 5: my saddle, either way, it doesn't matter without getting out

1790
01:33:45,840 --> 01:33:46,280
Speaker 5: of my tree.

1791
01:33:46,320 --> 01:33:47,240
Speaker 7: I always take food.

1792
01:33:47,640 --> 01:33:50,240
Speaker 5: I on an all day sit will I will literally

1793
01:33:50,400 --> 01:33:53,120
Speaker 5: change my clothes four times on an all day sit

1794
01:33:53,600 --> 01:33:57,880
Speaker 5: because I will walk in really light clothed. You know,

1795
01:33:57,960 --> 01:34:00,280
Speaker 5: we're very light, slight on overheat. Once I it up

1796
01:34:00,280 --> 01:34:03,519
Speaker 5: in the tree, my body cools off. I'll take off

1797
01:34:03,520 --> 01:34:07,360
Speaker 5: my salte jacket, put on some undergarments, put my sun

1798
01:34:07,439 --> 01:34:09,800
Speaker 5: lot jacket back on, and then when it gets like

1799
01:34:09,840 --> 01:34:13,080
Speaker 5: ten or eleven o'clock that starts heating up, I'll do

1800
01:34:13,200 --> 01:34:15,400
Speaker 5: the same. I'll take off my salat jacket, take off

1801
01:34:15,400 --> 01:34:17,800
Speaker 5: my undergarments, put them in my backpack.

1802
01:34:17,520 --> 01:34:19,760
Speaker 7: So I'm lighter, so I'm not overheating. In the middle

1803
01:34:19,760 --> 01:34:19,880
Speaker 7: of the.

1804
01:34:19,920 --> 01:34:22,920
Speaker 5: Day, two three o'clock, as it starts to cool, I'll

1805
01:34:22,960 --> 01:34:24,800
Speaker 5: rechange and put my layers back on.

1806
01:34:25,640 --> 01:34:27,599
Speaker 7: This is only on my top, now my bottom. It's

1807
01:34:27,680 --> 01:34:28,479
Speaker 7: top the top.

1808
01:34:29,000 --> 01:34:31,960
Speaker 5: And then before I get out of the tree, because

1809
01:34:31,960 --> 01:34:34,479
Speaker 5: I'm gonna have a long walk out, I will again

1810
01:34:34,600 --> 01:34:37,320
Speaker 5: take off my jacket and take off my undergarments so

1811
01:34:37,400 --> 01:34:39,040
Speaker 5: I don't overheat and sweat on my ass.

1812
01:34:39,160 --> 01:34:44,600
Speaker 6: You're insane that you are insane, Jo man, you are insaney.

1813
01:34:44,640 --> 01:34:45,240
Speaker 7: Comfortable.

1814
01:34:47,760 --> 01:34:48,439
Speaker 4: I just can't.

1815
01:34:48,479 --> 01:34:51,200
Speaker 3: I'm over here having a hard time not breaking down

1816
01:34:51,280 --> 01:34:57,639
Speaker 3: laughing here you're doing it. I just I just want

1817
01:34:57,680 --> 01:34:59,320
Speaker 3: to make sure I heard right. Did you say that

1818
01:34:59,400 --> 01:35:01,800
Speaker 3: you're going number two while staying in your cell?

1819
01:35:02,720 --> 01:35:06,479
Speaker 7: Absolutely? Yeah? You want to have them?

1820
01:35:07,040 --> 01:35:07,320
Speaker 10: You know.

1821
01:35:09,240 --> 01:35:11,839
Speaker 7: You don't want to. I don't know. It's so easy.

1822
01:35:12,439 --> 01:35:14,920
Speaker 2: Oh no, don't don't do it.

1823
01:35:15,240 --> 01:35:15,840
Speaker 11: Don't do it.

1824
01:35:16,080 --> 01:35:17,040
Speaker 4: Just don't do it.

1825
01:35:17,160 --> 01:35:19,400
Speaker 7: Yeah, blog bagg and you take the saddle.

1826
01:35:19,520 --> 01:35:23,240
Speaker 12: You either pull it up under your shoulders, under your armpits,

1827
01:35:23,640 --> 01:35:26,160
Speaker 12: or you slide the saddle down above your knees and

1828
01:35:26,280 --> 01:35:28,240
Speaker 12: you just under your pants and go in the bag

1829
01:35:28,360 --> 01:35:31,680
Speaker 12: and then wipe and put the bag back in your

1830
01:35:31,680 --> 01:35:33,800
Speaker 12: back back and pull your pants off and pull a

1831
01:35:33,840 --> 01:35:34,880
Speaker 12: saddle back up card.

1832
01:35:36,280 --> 01:35:37,439
Speaker 7: It's literally easy.

1833
01:35:37,600 --> 01:35:39,479
Speaker 4: So remember it's amazing.

1834
01:35:39,800 --> 01:35:43,040
Speaker 6: So the first time I heard this story, Mark John

1835
01:35:43,240 --> 01:35:46,760
Speaker 6: told us at hunting camp that that he likes to

1836
01:35:46,880 --> 01:35:49,479
Speaker 6: take craps in gallon ziploc bags.

1837
01:35:49,960 --> 01:35:51,920
Speaker 4: And then I had the part that got us.

1838
01:35:52,360 --> 01:35:53,840
Speaker 2: It broke us down.

1839
01:35:53,880 --> 01:35:57,719
Speaker 6: While he said, but he squeezes all the air out,

1840
01:35:57,880 --> 01:36:00,120
Speaker 6: you know, to like zip it up, so there's I

1841
01:36:00,160 --> 01:36:03,040
Speaker 6: through them in all that all the ship smell is just.

1842
01:36:04,560 --> 01:36:06,280
Speaker 4: And then he puts it in his bag.

1843
01:36:09,960 --> 01:36:12,760
Speaker 11: This is this is one of the this is one

1844
01:36:12,760 --> 01:36:15,439
Speaker 11: of the all time, all time best Wired Hunt moments

1845
01:36:15,479 --> 01:36:18,200
Speaker 11: in all the decade plus years who've done these episodes,

1846
01:36:18,280 --> 01:36:20,639
Speaker 11: that right there, that's one of the best.

1847
01:36:20,720 --> 01:36:25,800
Speaker 3: Thank you for that, John, welcome, I'm sure multiple times.

1848
01:36:27,120 --> 01:36:31,840
Speaker 6: So there's it. Whenever we do an update on the

1849
01:36:31,880 --> 01:36:35,560
Speaker 6: books for version two, we'll make sure that John details

1850
01:36:35,600 --> 01:36:39,400
Speaker 6: that process with illustrations in detail to show you how

1851
01:36:39,439 --> 01:36:43,280
Speaker 6: to get maximum crap air out of your ziploc bag

1852
01:36:43,360 --> 01:36:45,360
Speaker 6: to take up the less room in your past.

1853
01:36:46,439 --> 01:36:47,560
Speaker 2: Greg Donald's.

1854
01:36:50,439 --> 01:36:51,240
Speaker 7: That's in the book.

1855
01:36:51,640 --> 01:36:54,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was talking about it.

1856
01:36:54,920 --> 01:36:59,599
Speaker 6: The detailed, the detailed process about it with illustrations and everything.

1857
01:37:00,360 --> 01:37:03,920
Speaker 7: That's amazing. It's really easy to do, to be honest with.

1858
01:37:04,280 --> 01:37:09,280
Speaker 3: Absolutely amazing, And I think maybe that might be the

1859
01:37:09,280 --> 01:37:15,080
Speaker 3: best place to end the whole episode right there. There's

1860
01:37:15,280 --> 01:37:19,479
Speaker 3: there's so much in these books. Because you guys are crazy.

1861
01:37:19,520 --> 01:37:21,919
Speaker 3: You don't just write one book and release it. You

1862
01:37:22,080 --> 01:37:23,599
Speaker 3: launched three at a time, so there's.

1863
01:37:23,439 --> 01:37:24,120
Speaker 4: Three of these.

1864
01:37:25,520 --> 01:37:28,280
Speaker 3: Can you give me a quick rundown other than what

1865
01:37:28,280 --> 01:37:30,040
Speaker 3: we've talked about. We've covered a lot of the rut

1866
01:37:30,080 --> 01:37:32,160
Speaker 3: side of things, and there's still more that we haven't

1867
01:37:32,160 --> 01:37:34,719
Speaker 3: got to cover, and then so so much more outside

1868
01:37:34,720 --> 01:37:38,240
Speaker 3: of the rut could could one of you or both

1869
01:37:38,240 --> 01:37:40,679
Speaker 3: of you give me a quick take on what folks

1870
01:37:40,680 --> 01:37:42,639
Speaker 3: can expect to see in the book and then where

1871
01:37:42,680 --> 01:37:43,120
Speaker 3: they can.

1872
01:37:42,960 --> 01:37:49,840
Speaker 2: Buy it there is, Greg, I would love it if

1873
01:37:49,880 --> 01:37:50,400
Speaker 2: you would go jo.

1874
01:37:50,520 --> 01:37:53,200
Speaker 5: Everything to do with deer hunting and whether you're a

1875
01:37:53,200 --> 01:37:57,439
Speaker 5: ball hunter, a gun hunter, crossbow, muzzleoder, everything to do

1876
01:37:57,479 --> 01:37:59,759
Speaker 5: with hunting deer. I don't care what type of property.

1877
01:38:00,080 --> 01:38:03,639
Speaker 5: If you're un managed property, public land, you know, heavily

1878
01:38:03,680 --> 01:38:06,120
Speaker 5: pressured rural areas.

1879
01:38:06,600 --> 01:38:08,840
Speaker 7: The information is in this book.

1880
01:38:09,080 --> 01:38:12,960
Speaker 5: Uh Now, the book's key on hunting pressured areas because

1881
01:38:13,680 --> 01:38:17,599
Speaker 5: once you become successful at hunting any semblance of pressured

1882
01:38:17,640 --> 01:38:20,479
Speaker 5: areas for mature bucks, you can go any place else

1883
01:38:20,479 --> 01:38:23,880
Speaker 5: in the country and be relatively successful and be a

1884
01:38:23,920 --> 01:38:27,320
Speaker 5: threat to the mature bucks you're hunting because when you

1885
01:38:27,320 --> 01:38:30,720
Speaker 5: go to a less pressured area, it's just easier, and

1886
01:38:30,880 --> 01:38:33,400
Speaker 5: you've got all the foundation for running pressured areas, so

1887
01:38:33,400 --> 01:38:34,400
Speaker 5: it's that much easier.

1888
01:38:34,520 --> 01:38:36,719
Speaker 7: There's twenty seven chapters in this book.

1889
01:38:38,280 --> 01:38:41,080
Speaker 5: We actually mark you contribute you to a couple of

1890
01:38:41,400 --> 01:38:43,000
Speaker 5: short kill stories to this book.

1891
01:38:43,040 --> 01:38:44,080
Speaker 7: So did Andy may So?

1892
01:38:44,160 --> 01:38:49,920
Speaker 5: Did Garret crawl from di yt Yeah?

1893
01:38:51,280 --> 01:38:52,840
Speaker 2: And then sports Yeah.

1894
01:38:52,960 --> 01:38:55,200
Speaker 7: Ernie has a couple of kill out. There's eighty four

1895
01:38:55,240 --> 01:38:56,280
Speaker 7: in Greg and myself.

1896
01:38:56,720 --> 01:39:00,000
Speaker 5: There's eighty four short condensed three to five paragraph killed

1897
01:39:00,120 --> 01:39:01,080
Speaker 5: stories within this book.

1898
01:39:01,120 --> 01:39:02,799
Speaker 7: There's photos of the kills.

1899
01:39:04,240 --> 01:39:08,520
Speaker 5: There are in locations within the book that lend credibility

1900
01:39:08,600 --> 01:39:11,439
Speaker 5: to what you're reading at the time. But again, there's

1901
01:39:11,479 --> 01:39:14,559
Speaker 5: twenty seven chapters in When we wrote this it was

1902
01:39:14,600 --> 01:39:16,920
Speaker 5: like going to be eight hundred and some pages, and

1903
01:39:16,960 --> 01:39:18,880
Speaker 5: we just couldn't put it out in a single book.

1904
01:39:19,040 --> 01:39:22,680
Speaker 5: So you know, each one of these, each one of

1905
01:39:22,720 --> 01:39:27,719
Speaker 5: these books is basically the same length as all three.

1906
01:39:27,479 --> 01:39:30,439
Speaker 7: Of the other books I wrote. So we had to

1907
01:39:30,479 --> 01:39:32,280
Speaker 7: do it in three volumes. It's the only way we

1908
01:39:32,280 --> 01:39:36,000
Speaker 7: could do it. And it's it's available on Tethered's websites.

1909
01:39:36,040 --> 01:39:36,439
Speaker 7: So if you.

1910
01:39:36,520 --> 01:39:41,880
Speaker 5: Google www dot tether that's t E t h R

1911
01:39:42,040 --> 01:39:46,040
Speaker 5: D dot com, slash.

1912
01:39:45,680 --> 01:39:48,400
Speaker 7: Di y bucks, it'll take your right to the right

1913
01:39:48,439 --> 01:39:53,280
Speaker 7: to the page and that there's no stone on turned

1914
01:39:53,320 --> 01:39:58,120
Speaker 7: in these books. This covers everything, would.

1915
01:39:57,880 --> 01:40:03,799
Speaker 6: You I'd like to describe it a little bit differently, Mark, Yes.

1916
01:40:03,920 --> 01:40:07,840
Speaker 6: Every single topic that you is even remotely related to

1917
01:40:07,880 --> 01:40:14,839
Speaker 6: bow hunting is in this book. Preseason, postseason, scouting, the rut, scrapes, rubs, everything,

1918
01:40:15,120 --> 01:40:17,280
Speaker 6: how to hunt corn, how not to hunt corn, how

1919
01:40:17,280 --> 01:40:20,400
Speaker 6: to rattle. Everything is in this book. When John came

1920
01:40:20,439 --> 01:40:22,599
Speaker 6: to me a year and a half ago and said

1921
01:40:22,640 --> 01:40:27,160
Speaker 6: he was thinking about writing his final book, of which

1922
01:40:27,200 --> 01:40:30,200
Speaker 6: he's written many and they have influenced me in a

1923
01:40:30,240 --> 01:40:33,559
Speaker 6: great number of hunters a great deal. And John came

1924
01:40:33,600 --> 01:40:36,320
Speaker 6: to me and he said, Greg, I want to distill

1925
01:40:36,479 --> 01:40:40,280
Speaker 6: down my fifty plus years of bow hunting experience into

1926
01:40:40,320 --> 01:40:44,559
Speaker 6: one book. And I was like, holy crap, that's that's

1927
01:40:44,600 --> 01:40:48,400
Speaker 6: got potential to be like the most inclusive book on

1928
01:40:48,520 --> 01:40:51,240
Speaker 6: hunting that's ever been written, and so I was really

1929
01:40:51,280 --> 01:40:55,480
Speaker 6: excited about it. And that's what John did. He distilled

1930
01:40:55,680 --> 01:41:01,559
Speaker 6: fifty years of successful big buck hunting in pressured areas

1931
01:41:01,680 --> 01:41:05,000
Speaker 6: any he distilled it all down into three volumes. So

1932
01:41:05,920 --> 01:41:10,240
Speaker 6: it's a lot of information, but everything you could hope

1933
01:41:10,240 --> 01:41:12,439
Speaker 6: to know about bow hunting is in there. And John

1934
01:41:12,479 --> 01:41:14,720
Speaker 6: put all of his experience in there, and a bunch

1935
01:41:14,800 --> 01:41:17,439
Speaker 6: of us helped him, right like Mark, you helped, I helped,

1936
01:41:17,439 --> 01:41:19,800
Speaker 6: and Andy and all these people helped John do this.

1937
01:41:20,400 --> 01:41:25,559
Speaker 6: But ultimately, what this book is is John's incredible record

1938
01:41:25,600 --> 01:41:29,639
Speaker 6: of success in three volumes. And I promise you every

1939
01:41:29,720 --> 01:41:33,280
Speaker 6: single hunter on the planet will learn something. It might

1940
01:41:33,320 --> 01:41:36,240
Speaker 6: not change your life, it might not revolutionize how you

1941
01:41:36,320 --> 01:41:39,360
Speaker 6: hunt if you're an experienced hunter, but I guarantee you're

1942
01:41:39,400 --> 01:41:41,439
Speaker 6: going to learn things from this book that you didn't

1943
01:41:41,479 --> 01:41:42,280
Speaker 6: know before you read it.

1944
01:41:42,520 --> 01:41:45,160
Speaker 5: Ye will make you think about the way you're hunting,

1945
01:41:45,240 --> 01:41:48,720
Speaker 5: and it'll probably make you want to change a lot

1946
01:41:48,760 --> 01:41:51,120
Speaker 5: of the ways that you are hunting it, and it

1947
01:41:51,240 --> 01:41:55,839
Speaker 5: was written and written in such detail that any novice

1948
01:41:56,160 --> 01:42:01,360
Speaker 5: or experienced hunter can easily understand what we're talking about.

1949
01:42:01,760 --> 01:42:02,480
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1950
01:42:02,520 --> 01:42:04,599
Speaker 3: Well, I know there's a lot of folks who listen

1951
01:42:04,680 --> 01:42:07,080
Speaker 3: to our podcast that we did earlier this year, John,

1952
01:42:07,520 --> 01:42:09,800
Speaker 3: who have been waiting for the books because we kind

1953
01:42:09,800 --> 01:42:11,599
Speaker 3: of tease the books of them, but they weren't available yet.

1954
01:42:11,640 --> 01:42:13,719
Speaker 3: So I know, if folks haven't already seen the news

1955
01:42:13,720 --> 01:42:17,479
Speaker 3: online or somewhere, definitely take note. They're available now over

1956
01:42:17,479 --> 01:42:18,800
Speaker 3: there at the Tethered website.

1957
01:42:19,360 --> 01:42:22,280
Speaker 4: They're great. I haven't got to read every part of every.

1958
01:42:22,160 --> 01:42:25,040
Speaker 3: One of them yet, but I've been looking in various

1959
01:42:25,080 --> 01:42:28,400
Speaker 3: locations for relevant things as I'm thinking through ideas and

1960
01:42:28,400 --> 01:42:30,760
Speaker 3: as I was preparing for this, and as I knew

1961
01:42:30,800 --> 01:42:34,160
Speaker 3: it would be lots of lots of great stuff. And

1962
01:42:34,200 --> 01:42:37,720
Speaker 3: then this wonderful surprise number two tip as well that

1963
01:42:38,040 --> 01:42:41,640
Speaker 3: everyone will have to search for in the book, and

1964
01:42:41,640 --> 01:42:44,840
Speaker 3: and we will will have this moment, this podcast moment

1965
01:42:44,880 --> 01:42:49,280
Speaker 3: will live on forever. I still I still having a

1966
01:42:49,360 --> 01:42:52,479
Speaker 3: hard time processing it. So with that in mind, gentlemen,

1967
01:42:52,640 --> 01:42:54,320
Speaker 3: thank you so much for taking the time to do

1968
01:42:54,360 --> 01:42:56,439
Speaker 3: this for sharing maybe the best story we've ever had

1969
01:42:56,439 --> 01:42:58,679
Speaker 3: in the podcast, and for helping me as a hunter

1970
01:42:58,920 --> 01:43:02,040
Speaker 3: so much over the years. Both of you have been

1971
01:43:02,040 --> 01:43:06,240
Speaker 3: great friends, great teachers, and I appreciate you both.

1972
01:43:06,479 --> 01:43:07,640
Speaker 7: Thanks for the opportunity.

1973
01:43:07,680 --> 01:43:16,320
Speaker 4: Mark all right, and that's it for us today.

1974
01:43:16,680 --> 01:43:19,679
Speaker 3: Again, I'll plug John and Greg's book here, the Ultimate

1975
01:43:19,760 --> 01:43:24,680
Speaker 3: Guide to DIY Books. And without further ado, let's get

1976
01:43:24,760 --> 01:43:27,120
Speaker 3: you out into the woods, into a tree or a

1977
01:43:27,120 --> 01:43:30,160
Speaker 3: blind or whatever you're doing. Get out there, have a

1978
01:43:30,160 --> 01:43:34,120
Speaker 3: great time hunting. Good luck, and until next time, stay

1979
01:43:34,760 --> 01:43:36,200
Speaker 3: wired to hunt.

1980
01:43:43,080 --> 01:43:47,000
Speaker 9: It's that time of the year again. I'm back. Marcus Kenyon.

1981
01:43:47,040 --> 01:43:48,639
Speaker 9: How are you, your son of a gadwall.

1982
01:43:48,680 --> 01:43:52,519
Speaker 10: You look terrible. I'm just kidding a remma. I'm sorry,

1983
01:43:52,520 --> 01:43:54,920
Speaker 10: I'm late. I crashed my recumbent bicycle into the side

1984
01:43:54,920 --> 01:43:56,719
Speaker 10: of a quiz nose and I know what you're thinking.

1985
01:43:57,320 --> 01:44:00,040
Speaker 10: I am as sober as a newborn blue crab. I

1986
01:44:00,120 --> 01:44:03,600
Speaker 10: swear to you, this is just kombucha. I'm watching the

1987
01:44:03,600 --> 01:44:05,599
Speaker 10: gut health. You gotta do it as you get older.

1988
01:44:06,320 --> 01:44:08,760
Speaker 10: And also I'm wearing this ankle bracelet that makes a

1989
01:44:08,760 --> 01:44:12,240
Speaker 10: beep beep sound if I have a drop of the stuff. Also,

1990
01:44:12,280 --> 01:44:15,519
Speaker 10: alerts the authorities, who in turn alert my parole officer.

1991
01:44:15,680 --> 01:44:18,160
Speaker 10: So there'll be none of that in the studio today,

1992
01:44:18,320 --> 01:44:19,000
Speaker 10: I promise you.

1993
01:44:19,720 --> 01:44:23,839
Speaker 9: Let's get go. Oh you're queueing it up already. Okay.

1994
01:44:23,880 --> 01:44:25,920
Speaker 9: I thought we'd learned a lesson this year, but I

1995
01:44:25,920 --> 01:44:27,040
Speaker 9: guess not. Here we go.

1996
01:44:28,280 --> 01:44:35,240
Speaker 13: I love those beagy big big white tages, those bee

1997
01:44:35,360 --> 01:44:41,320
Speaker 13: agie bi big wad tails. I love those be achie

1998
01:44:41,520 --> 01:44:45,960
Speaker 13: b doya eight chats eat eat tales. I love those

1999
01:44:46,040 --> 01:44:48,800
Speaker 13: be achie b wat.

2000
01:44:48,760 --> 01:44:55,320
Speaker 14: Tails, big white tails, big white tails, big white tails

2001
01:44:55,360 --> 01:44:55,920
Speaker 14: are great.

2002
01:44:57,040 --> 01:45:00,000
Speaker 10: Oh, what fun it is to sit in the freezing

2003
01:45:00,080 --> 01:45:01,200
Speaker 10: cold tree all day?

2004
01:45:02,439 --> 01:45:07,480
Speaker 14: Big white tails, big white tails, big white tails are great.

2005
01:45:07,960 --> 01:45:10,960
Speaker 10: Hold, what fun it is to sit in the freezing

2006
01:45:11,000 --> 01:45:16,080
Speaker 10: cold tree all day? Dashing through the woods for the

2007
01:45:16,160 --> 01:45:21,920
Speaker 10: morning light, turns grave across the fields and draws, creep

2008
01:45:22,000 --> 01:45:27,479
Speaker 10: in all the way, climb into the tree. Big bucks

2009
01:45:27,560 --> 01:45:31,439
Speaker 10: are on the wave? What fun it is to sit

2010
01:45:31,640 --> 01:45:33,280
Speaker 10: and wait for my gosh.

2011
01:45:33,000 --> 01:45:34,400
Speaker 9: Dan deer all day?

2012
01:45:34,680 --> 01:45:35,280
Speaker 4: Oh?

2013
01:45:35,360 --> 01:45:41,479
Speaker 9: Big, I'm sorry? What is this? Pisocado strings? Who do

2014
01:45:41,520 --> 01:45:44,040
Speaker 9: you think? I am ya? Get this out here. I

2015
01:45:44,080 --> 01:45:46,720
Speaker 9: don't want to hear it. Thank you, Big.

2016
01:45:46,479 --> 01:45:51,240
Speaker 10: White tails, big white tails, big white tails are great,

2017
01:45:51,640 --> 01:45:54,920
Speaker 10: hold fun it is to sit in the freezing cold

2018
01:45:54,960 --> 01:46:00,000
Speaker 10: tree all day. I hope sand dreams are high.

2019
01:46:00,160 --> 01:46:01,320
Speaker 9: He's finally here.

2020
01:46:02,200 --> 01:46:05,680
Speaker 10: Mark said, it's the most wonderful time to kill o

2021
01:46:05,920 --> 01:46:10,360
Speaker 10: whitetail deer bingch points and pettings. Where you'll find me

2022
01:46:10,439 --> 01:46:14,519
Speaker 10: hanging twenty feet in a tree, grunt tubes, my bowel

2023
01:46:14,640 --> 01:46:17,640
Speaker 10: inspector camos really campy be.

2024
01:46:19,200 --> 01:46:20,439
Speaker 9: He or two ago.

2025
01:46:21,520 --> 01:46:25,720
Speaker 10: I thought that this was fun, But now I'm frozen

2026
01:46:25,840 --> 01:46:29,120
Speaker 10: to my seat, and the good times they are gone.

2027
01:46:29,680 --> 01:46:31,120
Speaker 9: I've ate up all my.

2028
01:46:31,160 --> 01:46:35,800
Speaker 10: Snacks, my hands and toes unnumb and we're gonna climb

2029
01:46:35,880 --> 01:46:39,240
Speaker 10: down from my stand. That son of a but decided

2030
01:46:39,320 --> 01:46:39,960
Speaker 10: to come.

2031
01:46:40,080 --> 01:46:47,840
Speaker 13: I love those beeg beeg white takes, those big bee

2032
01:46:48,160 --> 01:46:49,679
Speaker 13: big white takes.

2033
01:46:50,960 --> 01:46:55,280
Speaker 10: I love those be ig big dug Yeah, eight shot

2034
01:46:55,320 --> 01:46:59,840
Speaker 10: ge eat tails. I love those big white tails all

2035
01:47:00,200 --> 01:47:08,280
Speaker 10: dam I don't know why this is happening, I swear

2036
01:47:08,320 --> 01:47:11,360
Speaker 10: to God, Oh, officer, what seems to be the problem here?

2037
01:47:12,160 --> 01:47:12,320
Speaker 9: Oh?

2038
01:47:12,360 --> 01:47:12,519
Speaker 12: This?

2039
01:47:12,800 --> 01:47:14,240
Speaker 10: I don't know why this is happening. It must be

2040
01:47:14,320 --> 01:47:16,639
Speaker 10: a malfunction, you know. Sometimes it happens when the batteries

2041
01:47:16,680 --> 01:47:18,519
Speaker 10: running low. You don't know, you don't need to smell

2042
01:47:18,560 --> 01:47:22,960
Speaker 10: that that's just kombucha. I okay, yes, you've got me.

2043
01:47:22,960 --> 01:47:25,360
Speaker 10: It's ever clear and Pacific cooler. Caprice Son. I am

2044
01:47:25,479 --> 01:47:29,680
Speaker 10: so so sorry. I don't know why my life has

2045
01:47:29,680 --> 01:47:34,080
Speaker 10: brought me here. Mark Marcus, I'm so sorry. Enjoy the

2046
01:47:34,200 --> 01:47:35,120
Speaker 10: rut or whatever.

2047
01:47:36,200 --> 01:47:41,880
Speaker 9: Good luck boys, Good to see you. Hayden. It's been

2048
01:47:41,960 --> 01:47:43,360
Speaker 9: a while. Hey, sorry, I'm late.

2049
01:47:43,400 --> 01:47:45,400
Speaker 10: I crashed my pontiacastec into a light pull and had

2050
01:47:45,400 --> 01:47:46,240
Speaker 10: to walk through rest of the way.

2051
01:47:46,240 --> 01:47:47,799
Speaker 9: But I'm here now. That's what matters.

2052
01:47:48,120 --> 01:47:50,160
Speaker 10: Give me a glass of scotch, please, Hayden, just two

2053
01:47:50,280 --> 01:47:50,840
Speaker 10: rocks in there.

2054
01:47:50,840 --> 01:47:51,519
Speaker 9: I don't like ice.

2055
01:47:52,320 --> 01:47:55,120
Speaker 10: We're starting already, this is happening. Okay, just give me

2056
01:47:55,120 --> 01:47:56,920
Speaker 10: the give me the glass, thank you. Okay, here we go.

2057
01:47:57,680 --> 01:48:05,160
Speaker 10: It's the most wonderful time to kill deer. With the

2058
01:48:05,360 --> 01:48:09,280
Speaker 10: run now, just starting and dashing and totting and veins

2059
01:48:09,280 --> 01:48:16,640
Speaker 10: cutting clean. It's the most wonderful time to kill deer.

2060
01:48:16,920 --> 01:48:20,799
Speaker 10: There's far too much isonus glass. It's the half happy

2061
01:48:21,240 --> 01:48:25,759
Speaker 10: seeds of all. There's gotta be at least twelve cues

2062
01:48:26,280 --> 01:48:29,679
Speaker 10: with grunting and bleeding and cold fronts and sleeping.

2063
01:48:29,840 --> 01:48:31,439
Speaker 9: The last weeks of fun.

2064
01:48:33,120 --> 01:48:41,400
Speaker 10: It's the half happy seedssin of ame. There'll be pictures

2065
01:48:41,400 --> 01:48:45,080
Speaker 10: for posting and bragging and boasting and truck beds with

2066
01:48:45,240 --> 01:48:46,400
Speaker 10: big Bucks in toe.

2067
01:48:47,320 --> 01:48:48,840
Speaker 9: There'll be narrow miss.

2068
01:48:48,760 --> 01:48:52,639
Speaker 10: Stories and tales of your glories of booner bucks missed

2069
01:48:52,640 --> 01:49:00,840
Speaker 10: with our bulls. It's the most wonderful time to kill dear,

2070
01:49:01,400 --> 01:49:04,560
Speaker 10: not just one baby two. There'll be no dose of

2071
01:49:04,720 --> 01:49:08,719
Speaker 10: blowing and looming knocks glowing and blood trails so clean.

2072
01:49:10,520 --> 01:49:15,360
Speaker 10: It's the most wonderful time to kill deer.

2073
01:49:17,840 --> 01:49:19,600
Speaker 9: Excuse me? Can I have a napkin? Please? I just

2074
01:49:19,600 --> 01:49:22,519
Speaker 9: spilled some scotch on my loafers. I can't have dirty

2075
01:49:22,520 --> 01:49:23,559
Speaker 9: loafers in the studio.

2076
01:49:24,080 --> 01:49:27,920
Speaker 10: Thank you tailgate beers for drinking, and Big Bucks is

2077
01:49:28,000 --> 01:49:33,040
Speaker 10: slinking and chasing and s jacking does They'll be fighting

2078
01:49:33,160 --> 01:49:37,759
Speaker 10: and scraping and no more escaping and arrowshot true hitting.

2079
01:49:37,920 --> 01:49:44,719
Speaker 10: Oh key change. But no one told me that it's

2080
01:49:44,800 --> 01:49:47,479
Speaker 10: the most wonderful.

2081
01:49:46,960 --> 01:49:51,160
Speaker 9: Time to kill deer. I was very unprepared for this.

2082
01:49:51,720 --> 01:49:54,880
Speaker 10: There will be much morning sitting in cold fronts of

2083
01:49:55,120 --> 01:50:02,479
Speaker 10: hitting the down Kristen clean. It's the most swonderful time, Oh,

2084
01:50:02,600 --> 01:50:17,000
Speaker 10: the most swonderful time, Yes, the most swonderful time to kilty.

2085
01:50:19,280 --> 01:50:23,360
Speaker 9: There's too much ice in the glass. Two rocks,