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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: So we're talking with the Mandy ben wal lead and

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Speaker 1: with Jeremy Cohen. You'll find out more about them at

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Speaker 1: our website Coast to Coast am dot com and link

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Speaker 1: up to talk death. So, Okay, I like to think

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Speaker 1: that there are innovations, and I think i'd like to

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Speaker 1: think we're past the point of bearing people with really

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Speaker 1: expensive stuff Like it always breaks my heart when I

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Speaker 1: see somebody with like a sixty two Corvette and they're

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Speaker 1: bearing the dad and the behind the wheel corp. What

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Speaker 1: what Dad would have wanted? And I think, Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: premate Dad, put him in the put him in the

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Speaker 1: glove box, let's seal it up, and I'll drive him

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Speaker 1: around for the rest of forever. You know, I don't

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Speaker 1: want to waste their car like that. So what are

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Speaker 1: some of the innovations that are coming and will they

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Speaker 1: bring a reduced cost at a time when people are

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Speaker 1: emotionally vulnerable. Well, I think that what you said before

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Speaker 1: the last break was really interesting about how important rituals

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Speaker 1: are and about how important gathering is, and you know,

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Speaker 1: it made me think of something that that came up,

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Speaker 1: you know, really during the lockdown period was actually virtual

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Speaker 1: funeral started happening, right, and so this is when you

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Speaker 1: don't So there's actually different types. There's totally virtual where

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Speaker 1: everyone is online, and then there's also hybrid and that's

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Speaker 1: something that we're seeing a lot more now, where you

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Speaker 1: have people in person. Then you have people who maybe

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Speaker 1: just can't travel right, maybe they can't afford to, maybe

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Speaker 1: they don't maybe they don't have the health to be

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Speaker 1: able to travel. And we're seeing that a lot now.

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Speaker 1: And what's really interesting with this is that they actually

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Speaker 1: these services are so much more personalized, more beautiful. I

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Speaker 1: worked with a company called Keeper and we we do

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Speaker 1: this for families and it actually started because I had

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Speaker 1: to do a service from my grandmother who died from

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Speaker 1: COVID right at the beginning of it. And it was honestly, like,

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Speaker 1: I didn't think that getting together on Zoom with my

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Speaker 1: family for like a memorial service would be anything special,

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Speaker 1: and it was more. It was more meaningful than any

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Speaker 1: funeral we had gone to for our family. It was

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Speaker 1: very interesting. And that's just one small change that we saw,

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Speaker 1: you know, within the last two years, and it's so

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Speaker 1: much more affordable and it's so much more personalized. And

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Speaker 1: so that's just one like a first example that came

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Speaker 1: to mind. How about you, Jeremy, Well, there's also an

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Speaker 1: increasing interest in green and natural burial. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: this isn't necessarily a disruption in the sense of saving money,

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Speaker 1: but in terms of the environment and in terms of

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Speaker 1: you know, disrupting the industry itself, we're seeing a lot

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Speaker 1: of interest. So you know, fifty five percent of people

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Speaker 1: that have been pulled have been expressed interest in having

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Speaker 1: a green burial. And this is you know, a burial

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Speaker 1: that occurs either at a cemetery dedicated to this or

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Speaker 1: within a space at a regular cemetery where you are

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Speaker 1: buried with either you know, no casket, just in a

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Speaker 1: shroud or in a wicker casket. Um, there are no

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Speaker 1: embombing fluids that are used, ideally no cement vault. Either.

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Speaker 1: You are returned to the ground in as naturalist state

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Speaker 1: as is possible. And I think that this is something

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Speaker 1: that we're going to see more and more and more.

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Speaker 1: I've officiate memorial services or funerals a couple of times,

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Speaker 1: and sometimes, you know, this is so sad, and you

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Speaker 1: really work very hard to bring the meaning out so

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Speaker 1: that it becomes a cathartic experience and people feel like

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Speaker 1: they had a chance to express themselves. And other times, though,

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Speaker 1: it's really interesting to hear, as you said, Mandy, people

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Speaker 1: who are just well, I mean, they really personalized it,

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Speaker 1: and they're not waiting for permission from some officiate at

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Speaker 1: you know, from a church or something to tell them

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Speaker 1: it's okay to personalize it. They're going to whether you

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Speaker 1: like it or not. And I remember one service that

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Speaker 1: was nominally Christian when I was a seminarian, and I

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Speaker 1: could hear as I was reading the prayers, I could

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Speaker 1: hear the sounds of beer cans opening, and it was weird,

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Speaker 1: and you heard the and I could. I looked out

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Speaker 1: and there were people who were drinking at the funeral,

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Speaker 1: and I think, well, that's interesting because that sort of

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Speaker 1: hearkens back to the idea of the wake, when people

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Speaker 1: used to keep around the dead for a period of

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Speaker 1: time to make sure they really were dead, and they

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Speaker 1: would and they would tell stories, and they would be

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Speaker 1: with the body before they put it in the ground.

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Speaker 1: And I think, well, that was kind of very organic.

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Speaker 1: I thought, reach back to what might have been a

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Speaker 1: family tradition of drinking at a funeral. One of the

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Speaker 1: best parties I've ever been to was a funeral and

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Speaker 1: it was the exact same situation. There was a live band,

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Speaker 1: there was a buffet, and it was an opportunity for

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Speaker 1: everyone to get to know each other, get to hear

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Speaker 1: stories of the decease. And you know, given that we

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Speaker 1: are living in an increasingly secularized world, we are searching

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Speaker 1: for these new types of rituals, in these new ways

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Speaker 1: of not only connecting with the living, but also connecting

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Speaker 1: with the dead. And I think that people are going

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Speaker 1: to search these things out and are searching these things out.

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Speaker 1: And it exists now too, like we have essentially event

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Speaker 1: planners for funerals now where it doesn't necess really matter

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Speaker 1: what the means the final disposition is. Oftentimes we voted

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Speaker 1: that it's with cremation, but it'll be at you know,

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Speaker 1: I've done funerals at art galleries, at parks, at golf courses, right,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be this traditional stuffy church or parlor. Right. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: In fact, stuffy is something which I think is weird.

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Speaker 1: And when my godmother, who is Jewish, died, her wish

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Speaker 1: was to have me stand there in front of her

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Speaker 1: casket at the Jewish Cemetery in Skokie, Illinois, and to

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Speaker 1: tell everybody who gathered that day that she had converted

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Speaker 1: on her deathbed to Christianity. And she did it as goodness. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: one final joke. One And they came up at some people,

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Speaker 1: some of the mourners came up, but they were mad

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Speaker 1: because she had died in a She was the president

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Speaker 1: of her of her of her congregation, and I mean

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Speaker 1: she was and and my I was like I really

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Speaker 1: had to hold myself because I could just feel people

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Speaker 1: just angry. And I stood up there and I said, well,

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Speaker 1: I just want to let you know Lois asherman Um

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Speaker 1: had converted on her death Christianity. And and then and

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Speaker 1: I would said, you know, we had somebody there. We

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Speaker 1: had a canter there to sing the kadish because I

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Speaker 1: couldn't do it but Um. But before I we did that,

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Speaker 1: I said, by the way, psych and I said, Lois

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Speaker 1: got you one last time. And it was such a relief,

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Speaker 1: and they felt so connected to Lois again because they

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Speaker 1: know that's just what my godmother would do. It's just

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Speaker 1: a typical joke that she would play on her friends

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Speaker 1: and I love that. It's a little hard to formalize

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Speaker 1: that in a ritual, however, I wish I would have

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Speaker 1: met her. She sounds awesome. That's so great. I love it.

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Speaker 1: She's all right. So what are some of the other

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Speaker 1: ways that people are doing. What do you think that

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Speaker 1: when you mentioned the organic I've heard about this. This

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Speaker 1: is where, you know, you put people out into an

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Speaker 1: area that's marked off for burial and they become part

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Speaker 1: of the soil and whatever. But that's not everywhere, is it, Jeremy, No,

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Speaker 1: it's not. It's you know, the right now, only about

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Speaker 1: six percent of dispositions are green or natural burial, although

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Speaker 1: it is something that is legal everywhere. You can have

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Speaker 1: a green burial anywhere in North America, but you have

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Speaker 1: to search for it. There's around three hundred and fifty

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Speaker 1: cemeteries that offer green burial, either within a designated area

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Speaker 1: or are actually green burial sites, and it's up to

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Speaker 1: the cemetery itself to decide whether or not they want

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Speaker 1: to offer green burial or you know, create a green

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Speaker 1: burial section. But yeah, it is, it's growing in popularity,

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Speaker 1: but it is still it is still not the most

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Speaker 1: popular option out there. But what I think is important

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Speaker 1: to really understand is that regardless of the cemetery you

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Speaker 1: go to, there are still greener options you can select

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Speaker 1: which will also reduce the cost. Right, So embombing is

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Speaker 1: absolutely not is not You do not have to do it,

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Speaker 1: and you can have a simple pine box. Also, there

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Speaker 1: is something that a lot of consumers are not aware

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Speaker 1: of that by law, it is called the funeral rule

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Speaker 1: by the FTC that a funeral provider may not refuse

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Speaker 1: or charge a fee to handle a casket that you

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Speaker 1: purchased from elsewhere. You want to buy a simple pine

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Speaker 1: box from a little cabinet, may down the street and

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Speaker 1: go really simpler by a wicker one, so super simple

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Speaker 1: and green and inexpensive. They are not allowed to refuse

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Speaker 1: you by law anywhere in the US. There are ways

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Speaker 1: that you can reduce your cost and go more green

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Speaker 1: if that's something that you care about. It's just people

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Speaker 1: in those moments they're at the funeral home someone close

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Speaker 1: to them just died. They don't know what they can

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Speaker 1: and cannot do, and the funeral directors are often not

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Speaker 1: very transparent. Why don't we make it a law that

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Speaker 1: they have to be Why don't we make it a

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Speaker 1: truth like lending law. Why don't we make it like

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Speaker 1: calories on the side of a you know, Stoffer's mac

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Speaker 1: and cheese or something, that they have to put a

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Speaker 1: sign up on the what the legality is, what people

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Speaker 1: are entitled to, so that they don't You can't that way,

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Speaker 1: the funeral director doesn't have to say anything, to simply

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Speaker 1: point to it, say here, sign here, initial here that

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Speaker 1: you have read this as options. Yeah, well, so there

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Speaker 1: is the funeral rule. Also part of the FTC that

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Speaker 1: that same rule when that came out, and this is

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Speaker 1: still true today, is that funeral homes are required to

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Speaker 1: provide a general price list for the funeral arrangement, and

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Speaker 1: that consumers have the rights to choose which goods and

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Speaker 1: services they want. There are some exceptions, but you are correct.

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Speaker 1: They don't have a sign saying embombing is not required

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Speaker 1: by law. No, they don't have that. They're trying, the

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Speaker 1: FEC is trying to make it more transparent. They've gotten

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Speaker 1: a certain way, but I think that it can definitely

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Speaker 1: go further. Okay, Jeremy, your thought on the future of

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Speaker 1: funereal technology. Oh, I think one of the most interesting,

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Speaker 1: one of the most interesting technologies right now is aquamation

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Speaker 1: or alkaline hydrolysis. I love this already. I don't even

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Speaker 1: know what it is, but I think that sounds so cool.

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Speaker 1: It's essentially water creamation, and so you are put into

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Speaker 1: a heated vat um that is filled with a water

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Speaker 1: Lie solution and that that is or that water Lie

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Speaker 1: solution is heated and essentially your flesh and muscles dissolved

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Speaker 1: and all that is left are your bones and then

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Speaker 1: that is you know, your bones are are crushed and

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Speaker 1: those are the creamains that are left. And then the um,

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Speaker 1: the water Lie solution with your dissolved remains, gets put

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Speaker 1: down the drain, right and it's totally safe and um,

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Speaker 1: there's no like it's it's basically a base solution and

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Speaker 1: it's actually very safe. There's just the regulations around it

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Speaker 1: have been challenged because it's new, but it is legal

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Speaker 1: in eighteen US states and five provinces right now. And

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Speaker 1: it's also is a greener option as well, in that

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Speaker 1: it takes up so much less energy and has no

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Speaker 1: emission when you compare it to cremation, and so like

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Speaker 1: a nice way to put it is like it's cremation

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Speaker 1: in like a wom bath right is a nice way

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Speaker 1: to put it, but when you read it in the media,

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Speaker 1: they're like people are dissolving bodies like in the Manfia

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Speaker 1: in these vats. But it's a really interesting technology that

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Speaker 1: I think is going to become way more popular. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you get more remains as well, you get more creamines

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Speaker 1: using aquamation or outline hydrolysis than you do with traditional

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Speaker 1: fire cremation. When I learned the word cremaines and how

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Speaker 1: we had moved away from ashes, which is not accurate anyway,

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Speaker 1: and we were saying cremines, I've had a problem anytime

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Speaker 1: I was in an office that had cream aura. After that,

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Speaker 1: I cannot stop the association with UM. Well, why not burial,

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Speaker 1: Let's see what's our what's our standard on that? Now

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Speaker 1: the I'm kind of nostalgic for something like that. Why

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Speaker 1: not that baril at sea UM does still exist and

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Speaker 1: you can still have it. There are still people in

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Speaker 1: the military that are able to have it, and UM

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Speaker 1: it is I don't know exactly, it's definitely legal in

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Speaker 1: many parts of the States. I think you just need

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Speaker 1: to find a funeral director and a captain that will

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Speaker 1: take you out to do it. But typically the challenges

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Speaker 1: is having a captain that that will take you out

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Speaker 1: to do it. But what I've learned, yeah, but yeah, Baril,

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Speaker 1: let's see, is still totally possible. And if you do,

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Speaker 1: if you would prefer cremation um, a lot of people

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Speaker 1: will scatter at sea. Or there's even these really cool

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Speaker 1: that are actually made out of like like a peppy

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Speaker 1: machet and it actually would be shaped in like a

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Speaker 1: little boat or a turtle, and so you put the

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Speaker 1: cremator remains inside and then you let it go in

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Speaker 1: the water and it floats and then it slowly dissolves

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Speaker 1: and it's really beautiful as well. There's also companies that

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Speaker 1: are um where you can they're creating reef where you

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Speaker 1: can take cremated remains um and they are brought down

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Speaker 1: to the bottom of the ocean and they become part

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Speaker 1: of that ecosystem. I mean, that's cool. And I like

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Speaker 1: how a little French girl over there said papier mache

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Speaker 1: about all right, So I'm we're going to get to

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Speaker 1: people's questions coming up in just a moment and probably

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Speaker 1: won't have a lot of time to deal with this,

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Speaker 1: but connected very closely to the other side of the

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Speaker 1: funeral industry is the prolonging of life industry. Um, and

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Speaker 1: that's another thing that we may have to wait for

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Speaker 1: another show to do someday, but that was that was

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Speaker 1: durbing process. This amount of you know, the effort that's

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Speaker 1: put into extending life also seems to be sort of

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Speaker 1: anti funereal in a way, which is or even jeremy

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Speaker 1: as you're talking about this belief somehow in immortality that

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Speaker 1: if we give, if we put into chemicals in a person,

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Speaker 1: we put it, we run ont of electricity through them,

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Speaker 1: that we can keep them alive for longer. There their

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Speaker 1: quality of life is very poor or low or non existent,

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Speaker 1: but for some reason we take solace and that and

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Speaker 1: I see those two things as being kind of vaguely connected.

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Speaker 1: What about you, Yeah, absolutely, I mean there is that

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Speaker 1: you know, medicalization where we are trying to prolong life

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Speaker 1: at all costs, and medicine sees death as being you know,

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Speaker 1: the ultimate failure, and you really do want to keep

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Speaker 1: people alive as long as possible. And then yeah, the

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Speaker 1: other side of that is the you know, transhumanism or

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Speaker 1: more the list the people who are trying it at

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Speaker 1: all costs to live forever or the people who are

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Speaker 1: using cryonics, you know, they are When they die, their

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Speaker 1: bodies are cryogenically frozen in the hopes that one day

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Speaker 1: they will be able to be revived and live again

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Speaker 1: in the future. Yeah. I think those two things are

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Speaker 1: absolutely connected, although you know obviously that the goal for

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Speaker 1: immortalists and for people who want to live forever is

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Speaker 1: to also have healthy aging outcomes as well, or to

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Speaker 1: reverse aging completely. Listen to more Coast to Coast AM

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Speaker 1: every weeknight at one am Eastern and go to Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast am dot com for more