Speaker 1: M now vastation. He's watched the gap if you actually
Speaker 1: the drink, How does it feel to be walking? It's nice,
Speaker 1: it's nice, it's exciting. I love being here. Well, you
Speaker 1: can just smell the power in the hallways, can't you,
Speaker 1: or the lack thereof. But the question is is Washington
Speaker 1: more like deep or House of cards? It's a little
Speaker 1: of each Ryan fishing, manipulation, calculation that's on veep right,
Speaker 1: and then a lot of um. What's the word, Brian?
Speaker 1: When you really suck up to someone, you just think
Speaker 1: of the best words, Katie. A lot of sick of
Speaker 1: fans or sick of fancy. Have you guys ever been
Speaker 1: to the Capitol? I mean you see all these politicians
Speaker 1: on TV giving speeches, kissing babies, eating a lot of
Speaker 1: unhealthy junk at State Bears. But there's a place where
Speaker 1: our representatives are actually doing their work office buildings in Washington,
Speaker 1: d C. That you can walk right into. Well after
Speaker 1: the metal detector, that is, you can get a snack
Speaker 1: in the cafeteria, peek backstage and see how our government
Speaker 1: really works. You want to just describe where we are. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it feels a little like Old Home Week for me.
Speaker 1: Because here we are in the heart Senate office building.
Speaker 1: When I lived in Washington, I covered a lot of
Speaker 1: stories here and uh, I have to say it's a
Speaker 1: beautiful building. It is. It was very famous for cost overruns,
Speaker 1: for a huge delay and its construction. It costs more
Speaker 1: than three million dollars to build. How do you know that?
Speaker 1: A little research beforehand, and this is named after Gary Hart,
Speaker 1: No Phil Hart, longtime senator from Michigan. I was wondering
Speaker 1: that my friend and co host Frank Goldsmith and I
Speaker 1: recently traveled here to the heart of the Capitol to
Speaker 1: talk with Senator Al Franken. Now, most of the time
Speaker 1: on the show, we talked to our guests in the studio,
Speaker 1: but this time we went on a little field trip. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you did make my mom signed that permission slip. That's right,
Speaker 1: And we should let you know that we were there
Speaker 1: at a pretty important moment, just a couple of weeks
Speaker 1: before the Democratic Convention, a few days before the Republican Convention.
Speaker 1: That's right. Bernie Sanders had just endorsed Hillary right, and
Speaker 1: it was the week right after the tragic shootings in Baton,
Speaker 1: Rouge St. Paul and Dallas that had captured all of
Speaker 1: our attention. People immediately came up to talk to you.
Speaker 1: How are you nice to see you? Yahi Texas. We're
Speaker 1: in Texas and four praying a lot awful, awful, I
Speaker 1: mean obviously lived close by, seriously and like we weren't
Speaker 1: going out anywhere, Like I wasn't going to leave the house.
Speaker 1: I got two kids and his son, and it's just
Speaker 1: a sense of hate. I mean it's the only words
Speaker 1: like it's awful. It's just you can and feel safe
Speaker 1: to walk out of your house because some dumass is
Speaker 1: gonna shoot somebody, you know, like it's it's awful, just
Speaker 1: going on our knees, praying, praying for old officers that
Speaker 1: we know what senseless, senseless murders. How do you feel
Speaker 1: about the African American men who were who were shot
Speaker 1: as well earlier in the week. Honestly, I feel like
Speaker 1: I feel like we cannot socuss on a specific race
Speaker 1: because it's happening everywhere. White, black, kissman. I mean, there
Speaker 1: are murders everywhere. As a nation, everybody's life matters no
Speaker 1: less than anybody else's, no more than anybody else's. So
Speaker 1: it infuriates me that anybody has died that anybody has
Speaker 1: been singled out, that anybody feels like their life is
Speaker 1: more important than anybody else's, because it's not. We're all equal,
Speaker 1: And until everybody starts to believe that this hate will continue.
Speaker 1: It felt like everybody was a little fragile on the
Speaker 1: day we went to Washington, and people had a lot
Speaker 1: on their minds and some really important things to talk about.
Speaker 1: As a mom, my first thing is to protect my child.
Speaker 1: So I teach him to be respectful no matter what.
Speaker 1: Um that's just not about it that I want to
Speaker 1: have to fight. And I don't want him to have
Speaker 1: to fight. So if they say sit down, you sit
Speaker 1: if they say you know. And it's hard as a
Speaker 1: woman to teach him that because I don't want him
Speaker 1: to feel like he's being demeaned or he's left in
Speaker 1: But I don't want to have to identify my child
Speaker 1: one day, as you know, in the morgue. So I
Speaker 1: teach him you say, yes, sir, you, I don't care
Speaker 1: if you didn't do what you just do what they
Speaker 1: tell you to do, because it's a matter of that.
Speaker 1: That's not about it that I want to fight. What
Speaker 1: do you think hat needs to happen to to improve
Speaker 1: this situation, because it seems like the country is such
Speaker 1: a tender box right now, and no one wants to
Speaker 1: see police officer slain. That was such a tragedy, But
Speaker 1: no one wants to see people of color being mistreated
Speaker 1: by the police. And what do you think needs to
Speaker 1: happen to make the situation less combustible? If you will,
Speaker 1: I think it goes back to that saying seek first
Speaker 1: to understand them, to be understood. It is about all
Speaker 1: lives matter. But you have to remember that black people
Speaker 1: as a community have been the less than group for
Speaker 1: two I mean, we've been fighting and so at some
Speaker 1: point you just get tired. Now is it appropriate to
Speaker 1: retaliate and slaughter officers just because you're mad and frustrated. No,
Speaker 1: So that sets us back for what we're fighting force,
Speaker 1: none of us against them police brutality is the issue
Speaker 1: is not the police. It's not white Americans, it's not
Speaker 1: black people. It's we want to be treated the same
Speaker 1: way as another person who stopped for our traffic stop.
Speaker 1: If my son is out and he gets stopped by
Speaker 1: the police, I shouldn't be in fear and in tears
Speaker 1: about what's going on with my son if he's not
Speaker 1: at home. Do you you agree with that? I learned something
Speaker 1: and I hadn't even left the lobby. This is the
Speaker 1: kind of energy I think you get in this building
Speaker 1: so much Washington, I really appreciate. One of the perks
Speaker 1: of my job as a journalist is that everyday people
Speaker 1: come up to me like this and share their personal thoughts.
Speaker 1: Another perk is that I get to have serious face
Speaker 1: time with the people who said policy and make the
Speaker 1: laws that affect our lives. Are we going up? Sorry?
Speaker 1: Don't kill us? And you hate when people do that.
Speaker 1: I always want to close it like clothes, clothes, clothes.
Speaker 1: I know not everyone gets this kind of access. I'm
Speaker 1: really lucky. I done, and I want to share it
Speaker 1: with you. Nice. Oh yeah, Marge Gunderson, Hey you bet shot.
Speaker 1: How you guys doing. Nice to see you. Thank you.
Speaker 1: No Minnesota treats. What are Minnesota treats? So we used
Speaker 1: to have post it? Oh yeah, I know, really delicious,
Speaker 1: lots of fiber. I really like the sticky part. Yeah, hey,
Speaker 1: how are you? Nice to see you? Senator are you?
Speaker 1: That's Al Franken. He's a senator from Minnesota. But that
Speaker 1: may not be why you know his name Because I'm
Speaker 1: good enough, I'm smart enough, and dog on it. People
Speaker 1: like me. He went from comedy to political talk radio
Speaker 1: broadcasting live from Minneapolis, Minnesota. The Al Franken Show is
Speaker 1: on the air to the Senate everybody. But he nearly
Speaker 1: didn't make it there. He squeaked in in two thousand
Speaker 1: eight by just three hundred and twelve votes. And I
Speaker 1: am so excited to finally be able to get to
Speaker 1: work for the people of Minnesota. But now in his
Speaker 1: second term, Senator Al Franken is one of the people
Speaker 1: shaping the world we live in. So I asked him,
Speaker 1: after seven years, are you still jazzed about coming into
Speaker 1: this office we're sitting in. No, not my own office.
Speaker 1: But but if I when I look at the Capitol,
Speaker 1: I do when I get over there the Capitol, I
Speaker 1: get I go on, holy mackerel, I do that a lot.
Speaker 1: We saw go my own office. You know it's my office.
Speaker 1: I mean, quite lovely, I should say. One of the
Speaker 1: things we noticed is to photos of Senator Paul Wellstone
Speaker 1: of Minnesota, who died in two thousand two in a
Speaker 1: plane crash eleven days before the election, and ironically he
Speaker 1: went to my high school, Senator Wellstone in Arlington, Virginia,
Speaker 1: and I know he is and continues to be one
Speaker 1: of your role models. Sure why, Well, he was a
Speaker 1: special guy. He was a passionate guy. He um cared
Speaker 1: about the little guy that was. And he said some
Speaker 1: things that are mantras or uh. He said, uh, we
Speaker 1: all do better when we all do better, and uh
Speaker 1: Minnesotan's Minnesota dfl ER's that's the Democratic Farmer Labor Party.
Speaker 1: We say that all the time. But it's interesting when
Speaker 1: I say that around the country, especially to Democrats, they
Speaker 1: think about how simple and profound that is, because we
Speaker 1: do we do all do better when we all do better.
Speaker 1: Where I grew up middle class. You know, I was
Speaker 1: born in UH. I grew up in in Singalis Park,
Speaker 1: Minnesota entering suburb. We had two bedroom, one bath house.
Speaker 1: My dad didn't graduate high school, mom didn't graduate college.
Speaker 1: I thought I was the luckiest kid in the world
Speaker 1: because I was because I was growing up middle class
Speaker 1: in St. Louis Park in Minnesota, in America, and I
Speaker 1: felt like I could do anything I wanted and I
Speaker 1: and it's because the middle class everything was expanding them.
Speaker 1: The middle class was expanding, and I do believe that
Speaker 1: we grow the economy from the middle. And what we've seen, uh,
Speaker 1: in the last thirty forty years has been this tendency
Speaker 1: to grow things at the top and hollow out the
Speaker 1: middle class. And I think that's why people are so
Speaker 1: so angry the middle class. The bottom seems to have
Speaker 1: fallen out. Robert Reich did a whole documentary just Bryan
Speaker 1: and I were talking about it called Inequality for All
Speaker 1: and basically saying liddle class is what fuels the entire
Speaker 1: economy because that those are where the consumers are, right,
Speaker 1: of course. I mean, if if the middle class is
Speaker 1: buying stuff, the economy works, and if the middle class
Speaker 1: is hollowed out, if you're really, really, really really rich,
Speaker 1: you can buy only so much stuff, you know, I
Speaker 1: mean that there is a limit to how much you
Speaker 1: can buy, I guess. I mean, but the real economy
Speaker 1: is fueled by those in the middle. Do you think
Speaker 1: the fact that the middle class is struggling so much
Speaker 1: and the bottom has fallen out is one of the
Speaker 1: reasons we're seeing this upswing populism during this Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: I think there's been a lot of anger, especially uh,
Speaker 1: you know, There was an interesting statistic that came out
Speaker 1: or finding by some Princeton economists or something a few
Speaker 1: months ago that we're seeing life expectancy drop for white
Speaker 1: people and a lot of it was suicide and opioids
Speaker 1: and that kind of thing, and it hadn't dropped for
Speaker 1: Latinos or blacks, and I think it was it's partly
Speaker 1: in that white working class middle class who have expected
Speaker 1: things to get better and not seen it happen. I
Speaker 1: think that that maybe in a sad way, that black
Speaker 1: and Latinos or don't expect things necessarily. Isn't part of
Speaker 1: your inheritance that things automatically get better and then you'll
Speaker 1: be better off than your than your parents, or more importantly,
Speaker 1: that your kids will be better off than you. And
Speaker 1: I think there's real a feeling of betrayal there. You know,
Speaker 1: you saw Bernie and you saw Trump, and I think
Speaker 1: Bernie's analysis is well, first of all, it's an analysis,
Speaker 1: and Trump's is whatever it is, So I think Bernie
Speaker 1: was closer to the truth. But the fact is, this
Speaker 1: is globalization, automation, unions under assault. Rice talks about that
Speaker 1: definitely in that in his book and and in his
Speaker 1: documentary all these things are contributing too. You know, there
Speaker 1: aren't a lot of jobs where you get a really
Speaker 1: good living and work for forty years at the same
Speaker 1: job anymore. And the traditional political answer, at least for
Speaker 1: the last couple of decades, has been, oh, well, we
Speaker 1: can't reverse globalization, so we need to train workers for
Speaker 1: the jobs of the future. Is that enough? Is that sufficient?
Speaker 1: And if it isn't, what else should be done? Well,
Speaker 1: first of all, it's that's a really good idea. We
Speaker 1: we do need to train people for those jobs. And
Speaker 1: this is something I believe in workforce training. I believe
Speaker 1: that you don't have to go to a four year college,
Speaker 1: that you can go to community and technical college and
Speaker 1: get credentials and start working in some advanced manufacturing UM
Speaker 1: facility and with a company and continue to get your
Speaker 1: education get paid for by your employer. I've seen this
Speaker 1: a lot, and I've seen at Minnesota a lot. And
Speaker 1: I remember, right I took office a little late, because
Speaker 1: you might remember his close election, And right after I
Speaker 1: got into office the first recess, I went back to
Speaker 1: Minnesota and I was in Alexandria, Minnesota, which is an
Speaker 1: UH served central western north central western Minnesota and in
Speaker 1: Douglas County, the county seat of Douglas County, unemployment was
Speaker 1: about two and a half points lower than in the
Speaker 1: rest of the state. And part of the reason was
Speaker 1: they had a great community and technical college, one of
Speaker 1: the highest ranked in the country. And they have a
Speaker 1: food packaging industry there. There's the Silicon Valley of food packaging.
Speaker 1: Someone had to figure out how to get potato chips
Speaker 1: into a bag without breaking them, and they figured that out,
Speaker 1: and they have a number of companies, manufacturers, advanced manufacturers
Speaker 1: to do that, and they had the high school. During
Speaker 1: the summer, kids would take industrial arts, had an industrial
Speaker 1: arts camp. So and I said, this is working here.
Speaker 1: These kids have these there are these adults now have
Speaker 1: these advanced skills, and there's a ladder where you can
Speaker 1: move up. So that isn't the whole answer, but it's
Speaker 1: part of the answer. Is like anything, it's silver buckshot,
Speaker 1: not a silver bullet. It's one thing to train young people, right,
Speaker 1: but what about these middle aged workers who are suddenly
Speaker 1: finding themselves without a job. And that's a real issue.
Speaker 1: You're right, the fifty year old guy who got you
Speaker 1: hit uh. We had a summit at the White House
Speaker 1: sort of on rehiring people have been unemployed for a while,
Speaker 1: and I went back to Minnesota do roundtables on it.
Speaker 1: So many of these people were in their fifties because
Speaker 1: people don't want to hire necessarily people in their fifties,
Speaker 1: and much harder job market for them. So you're absolutely right.
Speaker 1: There are people that got hit by the Great Recession
Speaker 1: right at the wrong moment in their careers, and a
Speaker 1: lot of these people that were still unemployee. We're doing
Speaker 1: certain kinds of training, but a lot of them were
Speaker 1: really employable, I mean, really had a great experience, and
Speaker 1: you'd go, oh, my goodness, you should, you should, I'd
Speaker 1: hire you. I wasn't hiring at the time. Some of
Speaker 1: their manufacturing firms were moved to China, moved to other
Speaker 1: countries and in Mexico and Mexico. Yeah, well, this is
Speaker 1: the trade issue, and this is why Trump tapped into
Speaker 1: something that was very against sort of conservative Republican um
Speaker 1: uh philosophy. If I were a fifty year old guy
Speaker 1: and my company moved overseas and I was left high
Speaker 1: and dry, I'd be pretty piste off too. Well, there
Speaker 1: there are I know a lot of those people, and uh,
Speaker 1: you know in Minnesota we're we're recovering. But I gotta
Speaker 1: tell you that, you know, I'm against TPB, and I'm
Speaker 1: against it for a reason. I don't think they um
Speaker 1: the labor provisions in it or right, I don't think um.
Speaker 1: The currency manipulation has been taken care of. But people
Speaker 1: are very emotional about this subject. It's really a conundrum,
Speaker 1: isn't it. How do you become part of the global
Speaker 1: economy and yet protect your own There in lies the
Speaker 1: rub right, Well, yeah, and it's about enforcing. It's about
Speaker 1: writing good agreements and enforcing them. It strikes me that
Speaker 1: you have to know so much center, Frank and about
Speaker 1: so many issues in your job. Do you ever get overwhelmed?
Speaker 1: And did you? Never? Never? Now that never happened because
Speaker 1: I stay on top of everything. You always wanted to
Speaker 1: be a politician. You ran for president of your seventh
Speaker 1: grade class with a very unique campaign slogan. Do you
Speaker 1: remember what it was? Don't spit in a man's faceless
Speaker 1: his mustaches on fire, that's right, dinging? And I lost, no,
Speaker 1: no waittment, no no, no, I won. I won that.
Speaker 1: Then I lost eighth grade, and then I ran for
Speaker 1: vice president a ninth and I got that. My sister
Speaker 1: ran for president of our elementary school and my mom
Speaker 1: put up a campaign poster above the water fountain and
Speaker 1: it said free water courtesy Emily Current. All nice, clever
Speaker 1: she did. Well there you go. YEA good slogan really helps.
Speaker 1: I remember I felt very bitter because I lost. I
Speaker 1: got us a mixer. That was my big achievement. I
Speaker 1: got a mixer muzzle. Yeah, thank you, And it was
Speaker 1: the Beatles were very big. This was when the Beatles
Speaker 1: were big. And the theme of the mixer was peace
Speaker 1: peas me and it was the value of the Jolly
Speaker 1: Green Giant, which is in Minnesota. It was. It was
Speaker 1: a very successful mixer, and yet I was not re elected.
Speaker 1: You are fairly new to the Senate, and I'm wondering
Speaker 1: if if you know, well relatively I mean some and
Speaker 1: I'm just curious, what did you think you're getting yourself into?
Speaker 1: And are you disillusioned? Um? Well, uh, you know, I
Speaker 1: wish I could remember what I thought it was going
Speaker 1: to be, because then I could tell you whether I'm disappointed.
Speaker 1: But I really enjoy this. I get things done. Paul
Speaker 1: Wellston said politics is not about winning. It's about improving
Speaker 1: people's lives, and that's what I tried to do in
Speaker 1: so many different ways, and I've been successful in many
Speaker 1: of them, and then others. It's incredibly frustrating. Of course,
Speaker 1: it's very frustrating. What's the most frustrating thing right now?
Speaker 1: I don't know what we're doing to address that. I
Speaker 1: just haven't heard name any real attempt to address just
Speaker 1: what's happened this last week in terms of I mean,
Speaker 1: we know that people of color get profiled, and we
Speaker 1: know there's something we need to do about this, and
Speaker 1: I don't feel like we're I've heard us addressing it here.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about the police shootings that we've seen witnessed
Speaker 1: in this I guess you could describe fourth of July
Speaker 1: week in America is a very different kind of hell week.
Speaker 1: Two shootings FIR Saint Baton Rouge and then in St. Paul,
Speaker 1: and then the shootings of those police officers in Dallas.
Speaker 1: Is Capitol Hill really the right place to come up
Speaker 1: with a solution for this or should police departments across
Speaker 1: the country start really acknowledging there's an issue here? I think,
Speaker 1: you know, ironically, I think Dallas is a police department
Speaker 1: that did do that. It's true, but we need to
Speaker 1: address this. And it's a national problem that doesn't get
Speaker 1: fixed by something some one piece of legislation or a
Speaker 1: number of piece of legislation gets fixed one community at
Speaker 1: a time. And Falando Castile was your constituent. There was
Speaker 1: an a p story that came out a couple of
Speaker 1: days ago that he was stopped at least fifty two
Speaker 1: times by police before he was shot. What can be
Speaker 1: done about that sort of thing? Well, uh, we we
Speaker 1: we one. We have to. I think we have to
Speaker 1: have police the composition of police forces reflect the composition
Speaker 1: of the communities that they serve. I think that would
Speaker 1: be very helpful. You know, it's interesting to me that
Speaker 1: the Black Lives Matter movement makes some people so angry.
Speaker 1: And I was interviewing somebody when I walked into the
Speaker 1: building before we sat down from Fort Worth, and she
Speaker 1: was saying, you know, all lives matter, it shouldn't just
Speaker 1: be one group. I don't think that person is quite
Speaker 1: understanding the context. I mean, And and but you hear
Speaker 1: that time and time again, you know, but what it
Speaker 1: means is is that black what black lives matters is
Speaker 1: saying like this is happening, It's happened, It's historically happened.
Speaker 1: We now have videotape, but this is historically happened, and
Speaker 1: it matters. It's as if black lives don't matter. That's
Speaker 1: what they were. I know I'm not explained, yes, but
Speaker 1: I'm trying to explain to the listener here, But how
Speaker 1: do how do we keep and white Americans from being alienated?
Speaker 1: But former Mayor Juliani said the other day on whatever
Speaker 1: show he was on, fascination about you know, black Lives
Speaker 1: Matter is a racist? Is inherently racist? He's not. He's
Speaker 1: either deliberately not getting it or isn't paying much attention.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back to our conversation with Al Franken
Speaker 1: after a quick break. Let's get back into our conversation
Speaker 1: without Franken. So we're sitting here in your center office. UM,
Speaker 1: why don't we kind of go back to before you
Speaker 1: enter this profession, and UM cover some of the years
Speaker 1: between that failed eighth grade class president campaign and the
Speaker 1: successful Senate one. Hum I stopped running after that for
Speaker 1: about forty years, But you got bit by the political
Speaker 1: bug very early. You were I think always engaged in
Speaker 1: these issues. How did that start? Start with my parents?
Speaker 1: As I think it probably usually does. Uh, we ate
Speaker 1: dinner on trade tables watching the news. So we watched
Speaker 1: either Cronkite or Huntley Brinkley, and my mom was been
Speaker 1: good night Chet for that. I used to say that
Speaker 1: to my mom and dad before I went to bed
Speaker 1: at night. Ideal goodnight David, and ideal goodnight Chet. Well,
Speaker 1: maybe that's why you went into what you went into. Um.
Speaker 1: By the way, these were not TV dinners. My mom
Speaker 1: was a really good cook. So I just want to
Speaker 1: make sure because people have gotten the idea that we
Speaker 1: ate TV dinners on these trade tables. No, no, this
Speaker 1: is we always had a fresh vegetable and a protein anyway,
Speaker 1: So we would watch. When I was eleven ten eleven,
Speaker 1: twelve years old, watched civil rights demonstrations in the South,
Speaker 1: and when the sheriffs would put fire hoses or dogs
Speaker 1: or billy clubs on the demonstrators, my dad would point
Speaker 1: to the TV and say, no jew can be for that,
Speaker 1: No jew can be for that. My dad grew up
Speaker 1: in New York and he also inhaled a pipe for
Speaker 1: fifty years. He sounded like that, no Jew can be
Speaker 1: for that, and um, I knew, we knew exactly what
Speaker 1: he meant because we as I said, I think I
Speaker 1: said in fifty one, the Holocaust was pounded into our heads.
Speaker 1: And this is my dad had been a Republican, he
Speaker 1: was like Jacob Javitt's Republican. And um he became a
Speaker 1: Democrat that year because Barry Goldwater in six four anyway,
Speaker 1: and I didn't never look back. So so that was it.
Speaker 1: It was basic, the basic It's the same damn issue.
Speaker 1: If you think about it, do you think that something's
Speaker 1: been lost in our country? You know, you describe this
Speaker 1: almost idyllic scene where you're watching the evening news with
Speaker 1: your family, talking about things, learning about the world. That's
Speaker 1: really not done so much anymore because of the changing
Speaker 1: landscape of more. Um, well, there's that. There's we all
Speaker 1: don't have only three networks to watch and listen to,
Speaker 1: and so we don't have that shared experience. And then
Speaker 1: what what you have is, you know, the sorting out
Speaker 1: of America where people tend to live with people who
Speaker 1: have the same political views that they do watch the
Speaker 1: people who Foxes and some much MSNBC and so much CNN,
Speaker 1: UM and some listen to MPR and some listen to
Speaker 1: Russia Limball. What was the title of your book about
Speaker 1: Russia Limball? It was called Russia Lima was a big,
Speaker 1: fat Idiot and other observations, And the intent was to
Speaker 1: talk about the loss of civility in our discourse. It
Speaker 1: was really if if you read the book, that's what
Speaker 1: it was about. And it was ironic and a lot
Speaker 1: of what I did in comedy and still do and
Speaker 1: my every is irony. And during my uh first race,
Speaker 1: a lot of that was a lot of my humor
Speaker 1: went through the de humorizer. What's the what's the demizer?
Speaker 1: It was a fifteen million dollar machine that my opponent
Speaker 1: put together using uh, some Soviet era technology that stripped humor.
Speaker 1: There was that there was a Playboy article, as I recall,
Speaker 1: that got some attention that titled porn Orama and it
Speaker 1: was about there's a reason for what I wrote an
Speaker 1: article for Playboy for their millennial issue. They had asked
Speaker 1: William Buckley, he wrote for it, and Isaac asim Off
Speaker 1: and me and I thought that, Okay, it's a Playboy,
Speaker 1: it's for their millennial issue. Uh, you know, I want
Speaker 1: to do a parody of Playboy, and Playboy would do these,
Speaker 1: um very often doing article do articles on the newest technologies,
Speaker 1: and I figured, since it's Playboy, what would the what's
Speaker 1: this new millennium going to bring in? So it's all
Speaker 1: about kind of virtual sex and things like that, and um,
Speaker 1: if you read the piece, it will prove that I
Speaker 1: was not intending to run for the Senate eight years later.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to google that. Sure, go ahead, Let's
Speaker 1: get back to the Senate out You were talking about
Speaker 1: how dysfunctional the Senate is and how you can't often
Speaker 1: is very dysfunctional. What is the root problem of the
Speaker 1: Senate's dysfunction? Well, I think there are a lot of
Speaker 1: things I think that um our politics. And I was
Speaker 1: kind of writing about this in Russian. Limbaugh is a
Speaker 1: big Fettiti and that's why I really was about the
Speaker 1: breakdown in the civility of discourse. And there was a
Speaker 1: chapter on that on Gingrich who had put a list
Speaker 1: of words for Republicans to to use to talk about
Speaker 1: democrats and it was like sick and trader and corrupt
Speaker 1: and me. It's literally a list of words that was
Speaker 1: sent out to Canada saying you can learn to talk
Speaker 1: like newt And there was also a real run against
Speaker 1: Washington and against government and people in government are bad
Speaker 1: and don't live in Washington. To bring your family to Washington,
Speaker 1: and you know, this town, I guess used to be
Speaker 1: a lot different um. You know, you would bring your
Speaker 1: family to Washington, you live here, and you go back
Speaker 1: to your district when you go back to your district,
Speaker 1: but you wouldn't go back. You wouldn't keep your family
Speaker 1: in your district and go back home on weekends and
Speaker 1: not visit them while you go around your district. And
Speaker 1: what that meant was is that your family, your kid
Speaker 1: might play on the same baseball team as another congressman
Speaker 1: from or senator from a different party is his kid,
Speaker 1: and it's hard to not like, you know your your
Speaker 1: kid's teammates. Father and people had more time, and now
Speaker 1: it's so much fundraising and so much rushing back to
Speaker 1: your eight the campaign and that sort of thing. I
Speaker 1: think that's part of it. I think part of it
Speaker 1: is is that when the senator is up for grab,
Speaker 1: as it is this time and as it was last time,
Speaker 1: that there's more jockeying. And I think there was sort
Speaker 1: of a settled um Democratic majority for a big period
Speaker 1: of time. Uh, during the fifties and sixties and seventies
Speaker 1: that uh, you know that, And that's easy for me
Speaker 1: to say they were Democrats in the majority. But there's
Speaker 1: tended to be sort of a Okay, this isn't about
Speaker 1: the next cycle, this isn't about next November. We're going
Speaker 1: to just actually do our job here. But now it's
Speaker 1: all about re election. Steve Israel wrote about that congressman
Speaker 1: from Long Island about how much time has spent fundraising
Speaker 1: and do you guys hang out? Do you hang out
Speaker 1: with other senators? Do you have lunch in this at
Speaker 1: dining hall and eat Senate bean soup with Republicans? I have,
Speaker 1: I don't do it a lot. I hardly every in
Speaker 1: the signate Senate dining room does anybody, Because to me,
Speaker 1: you've got to have a place where people can congregate
Speaker 1: and get to know each other. One of the things
Speaker 1: that we do we have, and I just came from it,
Speaker 1: the Senate Democratic Caucus lunch. So we have lunch on
Speaker 1: Tuesday and Thursdays essentially as a caucus, and the Republicans
Speaker 1: have it three days a week. Why don't you guys
Speaker 1: caucus together? Occasion, well, I have had. I just did
Speaker 1: a bipartisan lunch with Lisa Murkowski. I've been trying to
Speaker 1: promote these bipartisan activities um them. During my first term, I,
Speaker 1: Franny and I would go out regularly with the end
Speaker 1: zs and the Joe Hands Uh Sarah n Zi from Wyoming,
Speaker 1: Sena Johannes is Left from Nebraska and their wives and
Speaker 1: Tom Udall and Jill and me and Frannie would beat
Speaker 1: all have dinner. We right off going to each other's houses.
Speaker 1: And I'd like to start that again. Let's talk about
Speaker 1: the campaign, because it has just been the most insane
Speaker 1: campaign of my lifetime. Certainly I would assume of yours
Speaker 1: as well. I don't know, uh, you know sixty eight
Speaker 1: was tragic obviously, and but yes, I mean I think
Speaker 1: that that the Republican nominee she what's his name, uh
Speaker 1: is uh is of a just of a different um
Speaker 1: quantum lee different than any other nominee we've had in
Speaker 1: terms of they're they're they're part of what I've seen
Speaker 1: over the last few years. I'm kind of a policy
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think I'm a policy wonk, but
Speaker 1: I do try to get into the areas where we're legislating.
Speaker 1: I like to be a legislator, So in education and
Speaker 1: healthcare in those areas, that's way more way I came
Speaker 1: here than anything. And then in telecommunications, I was against
Speaker 1: the uh Comcast Time Warner deal and that neutrality is
Speaker 1: important to me. But those those are things I care about.
Speaker 1: But I just don't think he thinks about any of
Speaker 1: this stuff at all. I don't think he just he'll
Speaker 1: say I, um, I have a good brain, I know
Speaker 1: more than the general's of Ballet, Syria and the Iraq.
Speaker 1: He'll say that, and it'll be just one of a
Speaker 1: million things he'll say that are just absurd, and yet
Speaker 1: he will be the nominee. How do you explain that? Well,
Speaker 1: I tried to. You know, it's happened so and um,
Speaker 1: observing what's happening, I'm not Uh. I guess he tapped
Speaker 1: into this anger that we were talking came about. And uh,
Speaker 1: he certainly staked out a you know, in any trade,
Speaker 1: which I think is different on his side, and tapped
Speaker 1: into that feeling among those a lot of a lot
Speaker 1: of voters on both sides. Of course. Yeah. I also
Speaker 1: I think he had let some crossover and in many states.
Speaker 1: And I also think that the media contributed to it
Speaker 1: a little bit by having him on constantly. And the
Speaker 1: guy can be funny and can be charming. It's worn
Speaker 1: off a little on me, but um, and fascinating. It
Speaker 1: was kind of fascinating. So I think that, um, a
Speaker 1: lot of America's loves Donald Trump, and a lot of
Speaker 1: America's shaking their hands, that's going like, what's your theory
Speaker 1: on how this happened? Anything? We've talked, and we've talked
Speaker 1: enough about Donald Trump. No, I think we should talk
Speaker 1: only about him for the rest of this A big
Speaker 1: question mark I think about this campaign is whether young
Speaker 1: people who are so enthusiastic about Bernie Sanders are really
Speaker 1: going to come out and vote in November. I think
Speaker 1: they will. I think they will. This is you know,
Speaker 1: I did not see the event with Bernie and Hillary today.
Speaker 1: Lara went well, and I think that's Bernie said he's
Speaker 1: going to do everything in his power to see the
Speaker 1: Trump it doesn't win, and I think that means he's
Speaker 1: going to be stumping for her. I think that that's
Speaker 1: going to help. And I think you know, when you
Speaker 1: look at the issues and you look at something as
Speaker 1: simple as simple, something as important as climate change, and
Speaker 1: millennials know this is a real thing, and there is
Speaker 1: a scientific, overwhelming scientific consensus and the sea levels rising.
Speaker 1: That happens for a reason. Uh, and it is the
Speaker 1: existential issue of her time. And boy, it affects millennials
Speaker 1: more than you know. I mean, I have I have
Speaker 1: grandchildren now, so I'm a senator and I don't want
Speaker 1: my grandson. You know, Joe, I have a three year
Speaker 1: old grandson, and I don't want him fifty years from
Speaker 1: now going, Grandpa, you knew there was climate change. Why
Speaker 1: didn't you do anything about it? And also why are
Speaker 1: you still alive? That's ridiculously, I'll go, Well, because of
Speaker 1: all the scientific developments, well the funding of n I
Speaker 1: h I did instead of on climate change? You and
Speaker 1: Larry King are doing that. What's it called when you
Speaker 1: are frozen? Oh, I'm not doing it. If Flowery is
Speaker 1: doing it, good for him, But I'm not doing it.
Speaker 1: He did it years ago. Actually I got that good.
Speaker 1: So so give us your prediction for the fall. I
Speaker 1: am not a prognosticator. That's not what I do. So
Speaker 1: what I do I thought Cindy Lopera was gonna be
Speaker 1: a lot bigger than Madonna. Do you think Hillary Clinton
Speaker 1: is gonna win? But I don't know what the margin
Speaker 1: is going to be. I don't know. I'm not predicting anything.
Speaker 1: I'm hoping for, you know, I'm hoping for a large win, blowout.
Speaker 1: I'm hoping for that. I'm really I've been working for
Speaker 1: our Democratic Senate candidates, and I want to take back
Speaker 1: the Senate so we can have the agenda here and
Speaker 1: not have to do filibusters to get on a gun
Speaker 1: vote and you know, those kind of things. To last questions,
Speaker 1: I believe of the electorate field that Hillary Clinton is
Speaker 1: not trustworthy. That's a devastating Sorry, how does she fix that?
Speaker 1: I don't know exactly. I can tell you this. I've
Speaker 1: known her for twenty two years, and I find her
Speaker 1: totally trustworthy. I I um. I also, I just know
Speaker 1: her as one of the hardest working, the hardest working
Speaker 1: person I know, uh, someone who is has through their
Speaker 1: career been dedicated to helping children, helping poor people, helping
Speaker 1: uh women. Why don't people trust her? Why don't people
Speaker 1: see that? Well? I think there's been just a ton
Speaker 1: and ton and ton of constant, you know, opposition to
Speaker 1: the Clintons, both her and her husband. I think her husband,
Speaker 1: did you know, unfortunately did something that made people not
Speaker 1: trust him. And I hope she'll have the opportunity to
Speaker 1: be president and and that Americans will learn to trust her.
Speaker 1: Are the ones who don't. Do you think she bears
Speaker 1: any responsibility for that? I think she'll say, you know,
Speaker 1: she she will say, for example, on the email, that
Speaker 1: she made a mistake, and so she does bear some
Speaker 1: responsibility for that. I also think that if you look
Speaker 1: at her responses on these things, I don't think she
Speaker 1: was lying. I think she did not know that she
Speaker 1: sent three classified things because they had partially marked. I
Speaker 1: think that, as usual, there's a battle over this in
Speaker 1: terms of messaging, and they're going to be considered she lied,
Speaker 1: she lied, she lied, and if people know the full story,
Speaker 1: I don't think she didn't. If Paul Wellstone were alive today, Senator,
Speaker 1: what do you think he would make of this whole campaign,
Speaker 1: the players, the rhetoric. Well, I think he'd be out
Speaker 1: there fighting, you know, just like I think I am.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't quite have the There was some
Speaker 1: power that he had and he used to basically the
Speaker 1: last three minutes of his any presentation he gave where
Speaker 1: this real, real energetic tub thumping thing where he'd get
Speaker 1: people on their feet. And the only time I get
Speaker 1: that happen is like if I imitate him doing it,
Speaker 1: I do an impression of him. But I think he
Speaker 1: would be I think he would be amazed and zaddened
Speaker 1: by some of this. Of course, you may not be
Speaker 1: able to compete with Paul Wellstone, but your grandson looked
Speaker 1: pretty in awe of you in a photo we saw
Speaker 1: as we want. I love that photo. It's like my
Speaker 1: favorite photo. What was going on? It was a um
Speaker 1: and my my uh, I got my I was sworn
Speaker 1: in for my second term, and it was just a
Speaker 1: party we had for that, and everybody was there in
Speaker 1: this big hearing room, and he was with his grandma,
Speaker 1: and he just and and and mom and and and
Speaker 1: his dad, and he just walked over to me. And
Speaker 1: it's a beautiful, beautiful photo. For those of you listening,
Speaker 1: I can't it's amazing. He's staring up at you, and
Speaker 1: that's probably, as you said, who you think about when
Speaker 1: you make decisions in this office. And he's older now,
Speaker 1: of course, as we all are, and so now he's three.
Speaker 1: But yeah, being a grandparent is a great, great thing,
Speaker 1: and uh, it does make you think that what we
Speaker 1: do here is important to generations. Be on us. That's
Speaker 1: a nice way to end things. Senator al Frankin, thank
Speaker 1: you for hanging out with us in your office. So
Speaker 1: I really enjoyed that interview. But I'm not sure I
Speaker 1: was surprised by anything he said. I wasn't super surprised,
Speaker 1: but I have to say I was really impressed because
Speaker 1: it reminded me how fluent senators have to be on
Speaker 1: such a myriad of issues, and it made me thank god.
Speaker 1: It's hard to be a senator. And even though he's
Speaker 1: a lot more relaxed and comfortable with the job now
Speaker 1: that he's been reelected and he's not known as landslide
Speaker 1: Al ironically anymore, um, you could still see the weight
Speaker 1: of responsibility on his shoulders. He took the job very seriously.
Speaker 1: Definitely doesn't want to be you know Don Rickles all
Speaker 1: the time. No, no, no, I mean he's clearly a
Speaker 1: highly highly intelligent guy, and I think he believes fiercely
Speaker 1: in the direction he wants to take the country. And
Speaker 1: he talked about Paul Wellstone and talked about being a
Speaker 1: progressive and talking about doing the work. I mean, he
Speaker 1: is a very he's a very funny guy, but he's
Speaker 1: also a very serious guy, and gosh darnette, people do
Speaker 1: like him. So we want to thank Senator Franken and
Speaker 1: his staff for making the interview possible. It was a
Speaker 1: lot of fun and we're gonna do a lot of
Speaker 1: interviews like this. Clearly we want to interview bold face names,
Speaker 1: but also people who just have bold things to say.
Speaker 1: And one of the great things about social media and
Speaker 1: the telephone, quite frankly, is we get to hear from
Speaker 1: you all as well, So we want to know what
Speaker 1: you'd like to discuss, who you'd like us to talk to,
Speaker 1: so you can leave us a message on this line
Speaker 1: nine two to four four six three seven. Brian is standing.
Speaker 1: Body take your calls. I'm just sitting by the phone.
Speaker 1: That number again is four four six three seven. And
Speaker 1: while we're at it, we want to thank the team
Speaker 1: at your Wolf, Chris Bannon, Gretta Cone, the right Reverend
Speaker 1: John Dolor. We want to thank Mark Phillips who composed
Speaker 1: our theme music, which I really love, by the way,
Speaker 1: and one more thing, subscribe, rate and review this podcast
Speaker 1: if you could, because it really helps other listeners find
Speaker 1: the show that does it for us. Brian, this was fun,
Speaker 1: wasn't it, Yes, ma'am. Anyway, thanks for listening and we'll
Speaker 1: see you next time. Yes, we do. Thanks. I took
Speaker 1: a few ashtrays. I hope that's got