Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin, and you were listening to Here's the Thing.
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty six, Yon Winner, suburban Jewish son of
Speaker 1: a businessman, dropped out of Berkeley. Neither a rebel nor
Speaker 1: a flower child, he was drawn to rock the music
Speaker 1: of generational grievance. Winner would become the baby boomers go
Speaker 1: to analyst of that music and the culture that produced it.
Speaker 1: He just needed his mouthpiece. A year after leaving college,
Speaker 1: from a small apartment on San Francisco's Petrero Hill, Winner
Speaker 1: decided to found a magazine. I borrowed money from my
Speaker 1: mother in law, my stepmother, and scraped together and we
Speaker 1: just sort of got some free office space in the
Speaker 1: printer in San Francisco and had no expenses, no salaries, nothing,
Speaker 1: just kind of hand him out for a while, and
Speaker 1: you published how What What? We had enough money to
Speaker 1: pay the printer's bill, and since it was printed on
Speaker 1: twenty four pages a really cheap newsprint, the bill was
Speaker 1: relatively low. So you have something that resembles what Now
Speaker 1: What did Rolling Stone then look like? It looks like
Speaker 1: it looks like a tabloid size, you know, like a
Speaker 1: village voice size, with paper paper and with a front
Speaker 1: page rather than a cover, which was a later kind
Speaker 1: of thing that we put on. And uh, it was
Speaker 1: twenty four pages and we sat up in the corners
Speaker 1: Our price is Cheap, which I took from Mad magazine. Um,
Speaker 1: and what change? How does it start to build? What
Speaker 1: do you attribute that too? Well? I think that it
Speaker 1: started to build because of the editorial excellence. Because in
Speaker 1: n seven the leading edge of the baby boom was
Speaker 1: just during the Beatles were still in their mop pop face.
Speaker 1: Dylan was doing Highway sixty month, so rock and roll
Speaker 1: wasn't covered in the newspapers or television. In the movie,
Speaker 1: it was nowhere else except on the jukeboxes on the radio.
Speaker 1: It started to build because we started to do articles
Speaker 1: about music that musicians and serious music fans we're recognizing
Speaker 1: as being really important stuff. Stuff they want to know
Speaker 1: from musicians about how they created their music, what they
Speaker 1: were trying to say, and other kinds of stories about
Speaker 1: cultural issues that people recognize as being really good. I mean,
Speaker 1: within our first year, we had presented a two part
Speaker 1: interview with Pete Townsend, a big long interview that I
Speaker 1: had done with him in which he articulated Tommy for
Speaker 1: the first time we had Mick Jagger on the cover
Speaker 1: and now reminding you with this tiny little thing in
Speaker 1: San Francisco. And for our first anniversary issue, John and
Speaker 1: Yoko gave us the naked picture of themselves that was
Speaker 1: banned on their Two Versions album. How do you get
Speaker 1: them to do that? They liked the magazine, They saw
Speaker 1: what we were doing. They liked it. They didn't. I
Speaker 1: didn't know any of them, you know, I, you know,
Speaker 1: you kind of met no and there was no yet
Speaker 1: and then there was no publicity machinery, no record company.
Speaker 1: All this stuff we now called the starmaking machine didn't
Speaker 1: really exist. Then. You know that the communication went channeling
Speaker 1: directly with artists and we'd send cops issues. Don't see
Speaker 1: it and they go, oh, I like that. You know,
Speaker 1: John Yoko, that magazines about music is taking it seriously.
Speaker 1: You know it's taking us seriously. Yeah. We were reviewing
Speaker 1: Beggars Banquet and the same way we thought of that
Speaker 1: in their Satanic magazine. We got a letter from Charlie
Speaker 1: Watts early on saying, jeez, we're sorry you didn't like it.
Speaker 1: We'll try and do It's funny. It wasn't to any
Speaker 1: business acumen. It wasn't because I knew how to market
Speaker 1: or knew anything about business. I knew nothing about business
Speaker 1: or complished nobody who helped you take it to the
Speaker 1: next level? How does it kind of grew on its own?
Speaker 1: You know, through trial and error. I made so many mistakes,
Speaker 1: name one, Oh my god, let's see, spending fortunes in it,
Speaker 1: make moving into huge offices without no idea how we're
Speaker 1: going to pay for the overhead, Hiring the wrong people,
Speaker 1: putting on a campaigns that you know, the wrong time.
Speaker 1: There were small mistakes, then they got to be larger
Speaker 1: and larger over the year. But you're learning the magazine
Speaker 1: your father was not unpublished, not at all. My mom
Speaker 1: was a writer and she taught me how to kind
Speaker 1: of edit and a lot about writing. But I was
Speaker 1: the editor of my high school year book, okay, And
Speaker 1: then I worked for NBC News so as a when
Speaker 1: I was in college. So I had journalistic experience, but
Speaker 1: absolutely no business experience, you know. And it was really
Speaker 1: it was trial there, you know, and we would only
Speaker 1: spend what we cash that we had on hand. You
Speaker 1: have to go. You didn't look for investors and people
Speaker 1: to be in at various times. But after the fact
Speaker 1: and always at the point which we didn't really need it,
Speaker 1: but it seemed like a good idea. You know, I've
Speaker 1: worked in movies and television for years, and you always
Speaker 1: hear people talk about the music business as being the
Speaker 1: worst of all these businesses in terms of the corruption
Speaker 1: and the terms of the you know, the old Paola
Speaker 1: and people trying to launch musical careers that way. Did
Speaker 1: you find that that was a big problem for you
Speaker 1: as the magazine got to be more successful, as people
Speaker 1: wanted to use you to enhance people's careers. I mean, obviously,
Speaker 1: you know, there were some pressure to cover the cover
Speaker 1: onness I got a good review, but very little. I
Speaker 1: mean through the first ten years of rolling stuff. We
Speaker 1: were in San Francisco, before we got to New York.
Speaker 1: We were relatively isolated from the music business, which was
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles and the so we were kind of afterthought.
Speaker 1: You know, we weren't. If we had been in l
Speaker 1: A and been in the thick of the music business,
Speaker 1: things would have been much difference. But we weren't. We
Speaker 1: were isolated, and by the time we became a bigger factor,
Speaker 1: and by the time we got to New York, our
Speaker 1: reputation was that we weren't going to be persuaded by
Speaker 1: money or favors or interviews or anything that that we
Speaker 1: were independent and fiercely so and we just say whatever
Speaker 1: the fun, whatever we wanted to say, and we weren't
Speaker 1: we're gonna be held back. So if you were to
Speaker 1: try and approach us and bribe us with something or other,
Speaker 1: I'm sure they tried, though not really because by this
Speaker 1: time it was very clear you didn't do that to
Speaker 1: Rolling Stone. You know, Rolling Stone was gonna if you
Speaker 1: do that, we're gonna write about it. So that never
Speaker 1: was a problem, strangely enough. And I'd say one other
Speaker 1: thing about the music business, I just thought it was
Speaker 1: a great business, as opposed to say the television business,
Speaker 1: where my experience in television was I had never seen
Speaker 1: so many two faced people of my life. In those
Speaker 1: days of networks. They were low is common denom there
Speaker 1: and the people were a little as common there. And
Speaker 1: then people in the records were always having fun, you know,
Speaker 1: hanging out with the Stones and the Beatles and weather.
Speaker 1: And that's what I gravitated towards what's changed in terms
Speaker 1: of because the music business now is it just doesn't
Speaker 1: resemble the music business. When I started with pretty much
Speaker 1: independent labels run by the people who founded those labels
Speaker 1: were founded the music business like I guess the early
Speaker 1: days of the movie business, you know, and they had
Speaker 1: a lot of control. Over the years, it's evolved into
Speaker 1: there are four major record companies. They're owned by huge corporations,
Speaker 1: and they have sound business practices and accounting standards that
Speaker 1: have to meet in the New York Stock exchanged type
Speaker 1: publicly listed company things. So the opportunities are not there.
Speaker 1: And on top of that, they're not they're not the
Speaker 1: dominant factor in selling records anymore. What is well radio
Speaker 1: radio play continues to be. But all this internet stuff,
Speaker 1: streaming services, downloading services, are you know, huge distributors of music.
Speaker 1: How is that for you? In terms of is it
Speaker 1: the eighties? The is it the nineties? When you say
Speaker 1: to yourself, I'm not really keeping up with this anymore,
Speaker 1: it evolves slowly. Absolutely, the phenomenal's true, like what is
Speaker 1: going on today and today in music by today's artists,
Speaker 1: artists have developed of last five or six years, I'm
Speaker 1: not really that up. I'm I'm totally up on you too,
Speaker 1: for example, But that's and they've got a new record
Speaker 1: out and it's great. And I just finished at this
Speaker 1: very table doing an interview with Bono uh last week,
Speaker 1: which is gonna be the next cover. So I'm still involved,
Speaker 1: you know, with the things I love, but I don't
Speaker 1: when you have people to keep up, obviously younger people,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm all, you know, like Lauren, I'm an
Speaker 1: old guy. I mean, there was a time when you
Speaker 1: could predict what was gonna be on SNL, that we're
Speaker 1: gonna be the same thing that we were doing on
Speaker 1: the cover of Rolling Stones. So people would come to town,
Speaker 1: they'd be go to thirty Rock for that stuff. They
Speaker 1: come on to our shop which is a block away
Speaker 1: and do that, and um uh I when I see
Speaker 1: what's Lawrence got on SNL. Now, I don't really know
Speaker 1: who most of them are, except for the occasional what
Speaker 1: do you call a heritage jack like you two, you know,
Speaker 1: but the great things about heritage access there's vital as ever.
Speaker 1: I mean, Springsteen is just brilliant and more relevant than ever.
Speaker 1: Did you see Springsteen show? Ye? You did? What you
Speaker 1: what do you think? I think it's great haunting. I mean,
Speaker 1: Bruce can shake the last seat in the highest rafters
Speaker 1: in a place that's got sixty people in it, and
Speaker 1: so put him in a place he's got eight hundred people,
Speaker 1: and the intensity of his performance and his personality and
Speaker 1: Bruce is just a remarkable I'm having luce with them.
Speaker 1: In fact, sin as we're done. What is it about
Speaker 1: that period? Something happened there with the Beatles, the Stones
Speaker 1: and Dealing all be on the stage at the same time.
Speaker 1: There is reminiscent of Paris in the twenties when you
Speaker 1: had Picasso, Matise, sla All working at one of artists
Speaker 1: that don't ever hasn't happened since may happen again in
Speaker 1: the other field in ten year or something like that.
Speaker 1: But you have that, then you also have the situation.
Speaker 1: The phenomena, which is what you listen to between the
Speaker 1: time you're eighteen and twenty two, is your favorite music
Speaker 1: for the rest of your life and will remain at always,
Speaker 1: And that's why you will always turn to that, Because
Speaker 1: after twenty two, as you get into the business of working,
Speaker 1: having a family, you know, your ability to spend so
Speaker 1: much time involved with that music it gets more and
Speaker 1: more limited. You get less familiar with it, and of course,
Speaker 1: then there's the evolution of the music itself into forms
Speaker 1: and formats that are technologically driven or commercially driven, and
Speaker 1: I order youth driven. You know that are different than
Speaker 1: what your imperatives are. Now, I don't myself. I'm not
Speaker 1: a big rap fan. I've listened to it. I understand
Speaker 1: the genus of it and the absolutely importance of it.
Speaker 1: I mean talking about a tribal telegraph that communicate with
Speaker 1: a different, disenfranchised group of people. I mean, if you
Speaker 1: were listening to in w A, it's profound important. When
Speaker 1: did you mark that when Rolling Stone became rome ing Stone, Well,
Speaker 1: early on, I mean we we took us our franchise
Speaker 1: popular culture at large, thinking that we were gonna learn
Speaker 1: more about what society is about from what was happening
Speaker 1: in Probably culture is saying that what was happening in
Speaker 1: the church or in politics. And then of course we
Speaker 1: started covering politics early on, and and our first big
Speaker 1: hit and politics was in seventy two Hunter Thompson at
Speaker 1: to cover the presidential campaign. What did you make of him?
Speaker 1: Because it because the Thompson for me only exists as
Speaker 1: like Johnny Depp and some baroque kind of movie what
Speaker 1: was he really like? Hunter was a one. I mean,
Speaker 1: Hunter was crazy person in many ways, but on the
Speaker 1: end of it's really responsible, you know, thoughtful. He was
Speaker 1: that southern gentleman, a charmer, uh and extraordinarily talented and charismatic.
Speaker 1: And you love being with him, not only because he
Speaker 1: was so charming and so funny, but also if you're
Speaker 1: close and you felt when hanging out with it, your
Speaker 1: this is as close to the danger zone and the
Speaker 1: edges you've ever get, truly, you know, and so there's
Speaker 1: an excitement. I mean we once one night we're driving
Speaker 1: from in Massachusetts from Cambridge up to Maine where we're
Speaker 1: going from staying in dick Win's. Dick Goodin's has came
Speaker 1: to seem Norman Mailer Maine, and we drive up the
Speaker 1: middle of the night, headful of acid, you know, both
Speaker 1: of us in the car, and and always only once
Speaker 1: he turns off the headlights. He liked playing pranks and
Speaker 1: being a jokester and practical jokes on people, and so
Speaker 1: he was enormously fun and enormously talented. He was difficult
Speaker 1: to work with because he was time consuming and a
Speaker 1: little bit unforgiving Uh in his demands on you as
Speaker 1: an editor. But I loved every minute demands in terms
Speaker 1: of his expensive especially it was in the word count
Speaker 1: was great. I just let him run in terms of
Speaker 1: just the demands on your time and your emotional strength
Speaker 1: and your say, needy, I mean at three o'clock in
Speaker 1: the morning, your phone rings, you know, well I this,
Speaker 1: God damn it, and you know I'm running out this
Speaker 1: and what you are? You know, I mean Hunters three
Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning, I'm sleeping. I don't. He doesn't
Speaker 1: even hear you say that. So it was it was
Speaker 1: a full time job to edit Hunter, and during that
Speaker 1: campaign and send me to the whole business of Rolling
Speaker 1: Stone came to a hall because I couldn't pay attention
Speaker 1: to All I could do was add a Hunter for
Speaker 1: a year, you know, and pay attention to him in
Speaker 1: his needs, and then, you know, on the side run
Speaker 1: the company. And it was worth it right right right here.
Speaker 1: We became just dearest friends forever and ever until he
Speaker 1: killed himself. And and uh, which where were you? I
Speaker 1: was in sun Valley, you know, in my house, and
Speaker 1: somebody called me and you know, made me cry and
Speaker 1: all that stuff, and you were no because Hunter by
Speaker 1: that time had was virtually unable to walk, he was incontinent,
Speaker 1: he had had a series of real serious health setbacks
Speaker 1: between all the drug use, and you see it done
Speaker 1: to his body world. And he was really, honestly within
Speaker 1: two months or so, being committed to a hole, I
Speaker 1: mean where he would in falling apart, aren't. Yeah, he
Speaker 1: was falling apart and he wouldn't be and he be,
Speaker 1: And once he was committed, he'd be trapped. I never
Speaker 1: second guess, but you mentioned you're driving down the unlit
Speaker 1: road with him, and everybody's dropping acid. Obviously drugs. Was
Speaker 1: that another thing that you had to keep an eye on,
Speaker 1: which was that you didn't go down the tubes like
Speaker 1: these other people. I mean, I think that it was very,
Speaker 1: very destructive for some people. Hunter destroyed him. I mean
Speaker 1: it gribbled and physically men but also really killed his
Speaker 1: ability to write. But luckily most people finally, somehow other
Speaker 1: found the means to get it uner of control. For myself,
Speaker 1: I just you were built differently, maybe built differently, or
Speaker 1: more sense of responsibility, or I had an adgenuous I
Speaker 1: had to move to rolling Stone was becoming incompatible with
Speaker 1: drug use. But I think it has to do with
Speaker 1: age and getting worn out, and certainly it has to
Speaker 1: do with having kids. I mean, if you have kids
Speaker 1: and you want to you cannot be getting up and
Speaker 1: you can't. Yeah, you'll never see him, right, So we'll
Speaker 1: look at taken away from here or they get taken anyway.
Speaker 1: So it's kind of an abrupt thing. And I think
Speaker 1: the amount of drug casualties we've seen are relatively really few,
Speaker 1: given the size of the scope of the drug use.
Speaker 1: And yet you resist, you know, you don't go well,
Speaker 1: I mean I didn't altogether resist, but overall overall, yeah,
Speaker 1: it could have been worse. It could have been worse. Nice,
Speaker 1: you know, I saw many people go through this and
Speaker 1: come out fine, you know. But I mean, if you
Speaker 1: look back at all the cocaine used, you have to
Speaker 1: say part of it was fun, you know, And that's
Speaker 1: that's a real true story of our times. There was
Speaker 1: a period where everybody we knew was taking cocaine. You
Speaker 1: couldn't go out without running into at least in arts,
Speaker 1: you know, circles that uh, that end and it's forgotten.
Speaker 1: Now explore the here's the thing archives. Lord Michaels runs
Speaker 1: his own kind of empire and it's all on television
Speaker 1: for me, commercial television and those boundaries. I like it.
Speaker 1: I like that you can't use certain language. I like
Speaker 1: that you have to be bright enough to figure out
Speaker 1: how to get your ideas across in that amount of time,
Speaker 1: with intelligence being the thing that you're you hope is showing.
Speaker 1: Take a listen at Here's the Thing dot Org. I'm
Speaker 1: Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing now.
Speaker 1: More from my conversation with Rolling Stone owner for Now
Speaker 1: Yon Winner, he's decided to put the magazine up for sale.
Speaker 1: This turning point as a chance to reflect on the
Speaker 1: artists he spent his life among. Are you like the
Speaker 1: head of an agency or you like the head of
Speaker 1: a studio where these people are your friends? But it's
Speaker 1: more business and it's kind of the cloak of friendship
Speaker 1: around it. In terms of business, well, there's always the
Speaker 1: initial introduction is always about business, you know, and uh,
Speaker 1: after many years of knowing something really well, all that
Speaker 1: kind of drops away. It's really about just a friendship
Speaker 1: and the relationship and the vacations together, all that stuff.
Speaker 1: So there's a number of i'll not throp the names now,
Speaker 1: very rare thing from pick a couple of people who
Speaker 1: I bet you've been royalty and music who impressed you?
Speaker 1: All the best people impressed me. I mean you're talking
Speaker 1: about people are incredibly talented and creative, and people are
Speaker 1: incredibly in talent and creative, are generally fascinating, charismatic personalities
Speaker 1: and great fun to hang out with, you know. And
Speaker 1: I am uh in awe of talent. I really cherish it.
Speaker 1: It's valuable as something that I celebrate. It's what Rolling
Speaker 1: Stone celebrates. But for me, for instance, I've known Mick
Speaker 1: for forty nine and fifty years and he's his own uh,
Speaker 1: he's suey generous. I mean, he's as extraordinary individual. There's
Speaker 1: no one else like him who has that love of charisma,
Speaker 1: who's not on his talent as an artist and a singer,
Speaker 1: but also as a businessman, a producer of the concerts,
Speaker 1: the producer of everything. I mean. So he's something that
Speaker 1: kind of hold mom on the and awe and still do.
Speaker 1: On the other hand, we have vacation together so many times,
Speaker 1: you know, and we've been into each other's house so
Speaker 1: much and as such a good nice friendship. What the
Speaker 1: hell do you do on vacation? With Mick Jagger, you
Speaker 1: guys like you cook, you have people who cook, You
Speaker 1: have people what do you do well? Like? Uh, you
Speaker 1: there's a lot of boats if you're going to the Caribbean,
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of sailing, and there's a lot
Speaker 1: of hanging out, and there's a lot of meals, you know,
Speaker 1: and sometimes they're a little smoking and dope and then
Speaker 1: watching movies. The most fun with Nick in the way
Speaker 1: I mean doesn't haven about that is sitting around the
Speaker 1: campfire singing where he brings his guitar. We go for
Speaker 1: a picnic, you know, five six, seven or eight of
Speaker 1: us and then I want to say the campaire then,
Speaker 1: you know, and I say, well playing expectations. He does
Speaker 1: that and then we sang a Dylan song together, and
Speaker 1: you know, it's just rare and extraordinary times. An interesting
Speaker 1: thing for me because you know, Jack are really really well.
Speaker 1: Is so the Beatles are red hot and they're really
Speaker 1: producing records for it is not less than two through
Speaker 1: seven and the Stones go on forever. What's the difference.
Speaker 1: Why does one band? Well? You know, I think with
Speaker 1: the Beals you had very evolved personality, and John you
Speaker 1: had an extraordinary level of popularity and intensity that nobody
Speaker 1: has ever had before or since. And I think that
Speaker 1: that that pressure made it really difficult for them to
Speaker 1: stay together and they and when as drugs came along,
Speaker 1: that's when they broke up, you know, And I think
Speaker 1: drugs exacerbated their differences. How do how do the Stones
Speaker 1: survive fifty years? First of the Stones broke up? Really
Speaker 1: nobody knows it, but they you know, throughout the eighties,
Speaker 1: you know, they didn't where, they didn't make records. You know,
Speaker 1: they were functionally broken up. And I think that Mick
Speaker 1: as a is was really persistent about wanting to find
Speaker 1: the opportunity when they could get back together again, and
Speaker 1: he was able to affect a reconciliation with Keith. And
Speaker 1: you know, but that whole period again, drugs, that whole period,
Speaker 1: Keith was taking drugs for ten and twelve years and
Speaker 1: impossible to work with, you know, I mean, if somebody
Speaker 1: Stone all the time, you just can't go in the studio,
Speaker 1: you can't write together, you can't do anything together. You
Speaker 1: can't actually you can't even plan a tour together. You
Speaker 1: don't know if the guy's gonna be busted in Canada
Speaker 1: or not, or is it gonna show up on stage.
Speaker 1: So all those difficulties drove them apart, and they just
Speaker 1: had to wait out the drug period. And now I
Speaker 1: think both Keith and mc went solo, tried to see
Speaker 1: what it was like and it wasn't gonna and that
Speaker 1: people wanted to see them together, and so they you know,
Speaker 1: despite all and despite Keith's book, they being able to
Speaker 1: work again together and and they do and the able
Speaker 1: happened to love being on the road. You know, Mick
Speaker 1: loves to sing. He he's a musician. I mean, in
Speaker 1: the end of the day, Mick likes to sit around,
Speaker 1: play guitar, talk about music. And Mick apparently uh functions
Speaker 1: as kind of an almost quasi management, yes component where
Speaker 1: you look at the Beatles and you say, when Epstein died,
Speaker 1: they didn't have Everything started to fall apart and it's
Speaker 1: a vacuum. Who's going to tell everybody what time to
Speaker 1: go to the studio? We gotta get a record where
Speaker 1: you gotta do this year we got There was a
Speaker 1: struggle over the leadership might call on to be in charge.
Speaker 1: John led him, but it was a complaint they didn't
Speaker 1: have a wise voice telling what to do, and Nick
Speaker 1: is among all the things is crely sober, smart business
Speaker 1: smart businessman, you know who who sees the bigger picture.
Speaker 1: I did this interview with Mick the only big long
Speaker 1: end he's ever given, which we did find because he's
Speaker 1: not a guy given to that type. But I just
Speaker 1: finally said to this took place out in long and
Speaker 1: him against it. You know, we really should do this
Speaker 1: because I mean, we know each other so well, and
Speaker 1: we kind of owe it to history too to sit
Speaker 1: down and take the opportunity to down who wrote this
Speaker 1: and wrote that. And you know, I mean, nobody's better
Speaker 1: to do that right now than I mean, we trust
Speaker 1: each other. So anyway, so we do the interview. One
Speaker 1: of the questions was he said, what do you think
Speaker 1: about when you're on stage, you know, and you're singing?
Speaker 1: You know, when do you get in the moment when
Speaker 1: you're at the moment. This is most of the time
Speaker 1: I met there, singing along and I think thinking of myself, God,
Speaker 1: did I remember to get the leaves out of the
Speaker 1: gutter back home? It's like everybody, he said, mostly though
Speaker 1: I'm looking at the girls now. Uh. Lennon obviously was
Speaker 1: he somebody were close to as well? No, not nearly
Speaker 1: as close. No, No, I mean, first off, he died.
Speaker 1: I met him in the late sixties and we began
Speaker 1: a correspondence in the quaint Steps and he visit his house.
Speaker 1: He came out to San Francisco to a visit with us,
Speaker 1: and then I did that big interview with him. Uh.
Speaker 1: And after that we had a little bit of falling
Speaker 1: out because I print that interview as a book. He
Speaker 1: didn't want to publish as a book, but I felt
Speaker 1: it was my right to publish this book and it
Speaker 1: was a SuperH historic document. Net book is still in print,
Speaker 1: and in fact, the last edition of it. Yoko wrote
Speaker 1: the introduction to it, and you know, and it's an
Speaker 1: interesting book and interesting interview because he and he talks
Speaker 1: about how it was the first time he had ever
Speaker 1: discussed the Beatles and what it was really like inside,
Speaker 1: what pain and misery was for him at that time.
Speaker 1: But he's like all of when we did an interview,
Speaker 1: I was like twenty four and he's like twenty seven
Speaker 1: or something like that, and it's this were so young
Speaker 1: making such big pronouncements about life. But after that I
Speaker 1: didn't wasn't really friend. We would be in touch and
Speaker 1: you know, communication letters back and forth. But he was
Speaker 1: living in New York. I was living in San Francisco.
Speaker 1: Didn't see much of it at the end. But I
Speaker 1: consider him to have been a friend and ally, I
Speaker 1: mean he was. He did many great things rolling Stone,
Speaker 1: in addition to he gave us that interview and the
Speaker 1: two versions cover and all sorts of things throughout there.
Speaker 1: Bob is another case. Bob. Bob is UH I consider
Speaker 1: a friend and uh a colleague. And we've had a
Speaker 1: wonderful relationship for years, for the whole history of Rolling Stone.
Speaker 1: And it's not like we hate he has come. He
Speaker 1: did come to my house once and we spent the
Speaker 1: day together and ida was fantastic, and I watched him
Speaker 1: playing guitar with my little son and and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: But we've had a really good supportive relationship. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think the mission of Rolling Stone and Greatpa was
Speaker 1: always to present Bob to an audience, to his audience,
Speaker 1: the audience in large, I mean his name rolling Stone,
Speaker 1: after all, and we viewed him and I viewed him
Speaker 1: as really the most important writer of our times and
Speaker 1: uh most talented songwriter, and I mean above and beyond
Speaker 1: everybody else, and so we were kind of an ambassador
Speaker 1: for him to his audience. And I felt part of
Speaker 1: our mission was always to be presenting Bob to audience.
Speaker 1: And and I think Bob saw that and understood that.
Speaker 1: Despite all the reputation Bob being reclusive and silent all
Speaker 1: the time, He's done fourteen major interviews over the years
Speaker 1: of Rolling I've done two of them myself, and we
Speaker 1: have cherished him and support him, criticized him as necessary
Speaker 1: where our writers didn't like self portrait or didn't like
Speaker 1: this thing and that thing, but been supportive. I mean,
Speaker 1: without Bob Dylan, nothing, you know. I mean there's no
Speaker 1: Rolling Stone, There's no rock and roll, you know, without him. Now,
Speaker 1: what's the provenance of the name Yon for a Jewish
Speaker 1: kid from northern California? Where does where does Yon come from?
Speaker 1: My parents like fans of Yon Sibelius, that composer, so
Speaker 1: we doname of Sibelius. My mother played piano, she played
Speaker 1: classical music. We grew up listening ever play Mozart and
Speaker 1: Chopin and all that kind of stuff. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of classic news. They also had these that's of seventy
Speaker 1: eight records and like books like sleeves and and I
Speaker 1: remember off hand, South Pacific, Odetta, you know, a couple
Speaker 1: of other musicals, Billy Holiday, no jazz. It was, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of show tunes, classic music and folk music. And
Speaker 1: that's what I grew up and up. I grew up
Speaker 1: with that. And then when the rock and roll thing
Speaker 1: came around, when I was about eight or nine, was
Speaker 1: about you know, I was eight and Graham hold of
Speaker 1: what first record I ever bought was Rock around the
Speaker 1: Clock by Bill Haley, and along with my first forty
Speaker 1: five record player. And I was eight years old the
Speaker 1: time or seven, and this kind of group got into
Speaker 1: that rock and roll thing in the radio and all
Speaker 1: this stuff, and at the time with Pat Boone and
Speaker 1: Elvis Presley and Everley's and we hear all that, and
Speaker 1: that's still music today. That can still know every word
Speaker 1: to every song. And the first one for me was
Speaker 1: Twist and Shout. Now, certainly these last many years, there's
Speaker 1: been changes in the cultures, has been changes in your
Speaker 1: life as well. And Elton John kind of authorized you
Speaker 1: too out him in the magazine and yet you were
Speaker 1: living your life completely different way back then. Correct. Was
Speaker 1: it difficult for you? No, it wasn't really your life
Speaker 1: the way you formerly did. Was it was it stressful? No,
Speaker 1: you know, I never I was never that conflicted about
Speaker 1: it because, uh, it wasn't that big an issue. I
Speaker 1: kind of had a happy marriages, that's who you were.
Speaker 1: That jobs fine and you know all that. And I
Speaker 1: wasn't really think of doing anything anything radical or coming
Speaker 1: out or throwing my life obout. I met somebody, I
Speaker 1: you know, it felt natural and it felt easy because
Speaker 1: I was kind of in a circumstances where these things
Speaker 1: are relatively easy and I didn't think at all through
Speaker 1: I'm impulsive, and the environment was supportive, and it was
Speaker 1: a little crazy at first, you know, with all the
Speaker 1: publicity was trying to swirl around about it and all
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, but you know, a similar you know,
Speaker 1: everybody kind of reconciled to the idea and accepted it.
Speaker 1: And I never I never lost a friend because of it.
Speaker 1: I've never changed friends. And your adult kids and my
Speaker 1: kids were in high school and we're in grammar school
Speaker 1: at that time, and all those kids there. Remember my
Speaker 1: one of my kids going out and said, Daddy, dad school,
Speaker 1: They told me you were They said you were being
Speaker 1: gay with someone. But you know, it's the right thing
Speaker 1: to do. And and Elton, I remember I saw that
Speaker 1: he had said that, and I did come and say,
Speaker 1: you sure you want to say this? You know what
Speaker 1: you're saying. Just the double check, you know, because it's
Speaker 1: personal private and I think in a great sense one
Speaker 1: part of our job is to be a protective of artists,
Speaker 1: you know, and and and nurture there are you know.
Speaker 1: Um so I just wanted to give him that courtesy. Uh,
Speaker 1: but a lot it's worked out. But so you're married,
Speaker 1: I'm married. So you met, he married three kids together?
Speaker 1: What went into that decision? I don't think you both
Speaker 1: wanted Yeah, yeah, you wanted another round of that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I love children. I wanted to have a big family,
Speaker 1: and you know, I had three children with Jane and
Speaker 1: then um Matt helped raise them when they were at
Speaker 1: least split the map the time, and he was deeply involved.
Speaker 1: And while gone and he's from a family of ten kids.
Speaker 1: Where is he from Detroit? What kind of work does
Speaker 1: he do raise the family now? But before that he
Speaker 1: was working for Calvin And you know, kids are if
Speaker 1: you if you love him, they're great. You know. Wait,
Speaker 1: these are special guest stars. Who's this. Oh are these both?
Speaker 1: Are both yours? Are these both yours? Oh? My god? You?
Speaker 1: Who did I write there? Who's which one's? Jude? I
Speaker 1: wrote your autograph here and I wrote I'm Alec by
Speaker 1: the way, nice to me too, how were you? And
Speaker 1: I wrote to you? I wrote, why would you want
Speaker 1: my autograph when your dad is yonon Winner because he's
Speaker 1: met you. I haven't stop there. What's very nice to
Speaker 1: We're talking all about you kids. I watch every one
Speaker 1: of your Trump skits. My god, isn't it crazy? It's
Speaker 1: so crazy. It's so I'm not doing right, But I
Speaker 1: must say I'm getting very tired of it. You know,
Speaker 1: the Trump, the Trump stuff has been brilliant, like it
Speaker 1: was more slapsticky Trump and a shower. Didn't silly, didn't
Speaker 1: get the thing that made has made Trump so great
Speaker 1: indition your skillet is that has gotten such at the
Speaker 1: truth of who he is and what he does. It's
Speaker 1: this almost real. You can't you're not endangered a threatened
Speaker 1: by probably losing them. Hey, guys, it's nice to meet
Speaker 1: you both. It's very nice to meet. I call what
Speaker 1: you're described what I call is. I mean, I'd say
Speaker 1: it's the miracle of human life that you see every
Speaker 1: day and to watch them grow is a miracle. And
Speaker 1: you're as a parent, you're exposed that on a constant basin.
Speaker 1: That that's what's so glowing and special about it. And also,
Speaker 1: let's say so at your age, At my age, I
Speaker 1: tell people all the time, how many more premiers can
Speaker 1: I go to? How many more reward shows do I
Speaker 1: need to go? I've done enough of that in the
Speaker 1: last thirty years. But anyway, Um Graydon has walked away. Uh,
Speaker 1: Tina Brown is not publishing anymore. She's looking more into
Speaker 1: multi media. And now you're gonna the remaining piece you
Speaker 1: owned you want to sell, We're gonna sell it. But
Speaker 1: I don't anticipate walking away from it. You know. I'm
Speaker 1: still have contributions to make and still understand certain things,
Speaker 1: so you know, I mean, that's slow. I doesn't look
Speaker 1: away from it. What's a rolling stone cover that John
Speaker 1: Winner might have on the wall above his probably is
Speaker 1: that famous pictures and he took of John Yoko the
Speaker 1: weekend that he was killed, then curled up together. It
Speaker 1: was that same weekend. That was that weekend, Yeah, just
Speaker 1: like twenty four hours before she shot that Hey, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: So if I show up at the campfire with you
Speaker 1: and Mick, you said you, and Nick was saying he'd
Speaker 1: back up the guitar, and seeing no expectations at immediately
Speaker 1: called and tell Nick, please tell him save us space
Speaker 1: on the log for me by the fire. Okay? Deal?
Speaker 1: That was Rolling Stone founder Yon Wenner with cameos from
Speaker 1: Noah and Jude. I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to
Speaker 1: here's the thing.