1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:01,280 Speaker 1: Taking a Walk. 2 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:05,120 Speaker 2: I was touring with Steely Dan, touring with Linda Ronstadt again, 3 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,360 Speaker 2: I'll playing with Schney Rodriguez, and I was on tour 4 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 2: with the Doobies in England. We were playing at Networth, 5 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 2: the Big Networth Festival, and I talked to the guys 6 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 2: in Steeley DWN. I talked to Walter and Donald and 7 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:20,480 Speaker 2: they had said, hey, that we're just don't on a 8 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:25,159 Speaker 2: tour anymore. I said, well, okay, I enjoyed touring. I 9 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:26,119 Speaker 2: thought that was fun. 10 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 3: Welcome to the Taking a Walk Podcast. Joint host Buzz 11 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 3: Night on this episode with a guitar legend responsible for 12 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 3: some of the greatest riffs in music history. Jeff Skunk 13 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 3: Baxter is known for his work with Steely Dan, the 14 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 3: Doobie Brothers, Linda Ronstatt, and a host of others. He 15 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 3: was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame 16 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 3: with the Doobie Brothers in twenty twenty. Skunk also works 17 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:53,200 Speaker 3: as a defense consultant and advises members of the US 18 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 3: Congress on missile defense. He's an amazing storyteller and an 19 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 3: artist still committed to his craft. Let's join Buzz Night 20 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,680 Speaker 3: and Jeff Skunk Baxter next on taking a walk. 21 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 4: I welcome Jeff Skunk Baxter. 22 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 1: Thank you for the kind words. I appreciate. Thank you. 23 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:14,919 Speaker 5: So you have quite a history in the Boston area. 24 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:19,600 Speaker 5: What was the music scene like when you were roaming 25 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 5: around the mean streets of Boylston Street and the back 26 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:24,959 Speaker 5: bay of Boston. 27 00:01:25,959 --> 00:01:30,520 Speaker 2: It was alive and well and it was very eclectic. Boston, 28 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:33,119 Speaker 2: believe it or not, in the whole New England area 29 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 2: had a very large country Western presence. I think part 30 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:40,680 Speaker 2: of it came because the trucks that would come up 31 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:45,119 Speaker 2: ninety five, you know, they'd be listening to WWVA coming 32 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 2: out of West Virginia and they'd be coming up Route 33 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 2: ninety five, and when they get to Boston, they were 34 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 2: looking for, you know, music, and there was a huge 35 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 2: country presence. And then again I actually did some int 36 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 2: interesting gigs. I played at a place called Paul's Mall, 37 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:07,680 Speaker 2: a jazz workshop. I was asked to do something called 38 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 2: who is this guy Gershwin? Anyway, which was someone had 39 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:15,720 Speaker 2: put together a wonderful I think it was Jeff Lass 40 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 2: who had put together a wonderful evening of Gershwin songs 41 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 2: sung by different actors and actresses. And the four of us, 42 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 2: we had a four piece band would play arrangements of 43 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:31,480 Speaker 2: the Gershwin stuff and we were doing this every night, 44 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:35,239 Speaker 2: like five, six nights a week. So besides the rock 45 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 2: and roll scene and the blues scene, which was huge 46 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 2: in Boston, there was a psychedelic supermarket, there was again 47 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 2: Paul's Mall, Jazz Workshop. There was so many clubs and 48 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 2: places to play in Boston. There was something for everybody. 49 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:57,240 Speaker 5: And that's when you got into really the mechanics of 50 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 5: guitars and the work that you did in the shop 51 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 5: there and everything is that correct. 52 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:05,919 Speaker 2: Well, actually, I grew up in Mexico City, so there 53 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 2: was nobody to repair anything, so. 54 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: Pretty much, I guess. 55 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 2: If you want to figure out which way the electrons go, 56 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:17,799 Speaker 2: you stick a knife into the toaster. 57 00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: You figure that out pretty quick. 58 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 2: And I was an older gentleman who was a TV 59 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:28,440 Speaker 2: radio repairman that I met a Mexican gentleman who had 60 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:30,680 Speaker 2: let me spend some time in his shop, taught me 61 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 2: a few things, and the rest of it was just 62 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 2: hunt and peck until I figured it out. And then 63 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 2: I had a little bit of knowledge at that time 64 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 2: because while I was in Mexico, I was going to 65 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 2: boarding school in Connecticut and my parents. Sometimes I wouldn't 66 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 2: fly home all the way to Mexico City simply for 67 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 2: a short vacation, so I would spend it in New 68 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 2: York City, either work at a Jimmy's music shop or 69 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: eventually working for Dan Armstrong who was the guru of 70 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 2: guitar customizing, and learned pretty much the bulk of my 71 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 2: knowledge about guitars and especially about guitar electronics, and so 72 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:20,280 Speaker 2: taking that to Boston working with folks at EU Worldzer 73 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 2: and Dave Scheckter and I had our own guitar shop. 74 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:31,440 Speaker 2: Day went on to found Scheckter Guitars, and yeah, just 75 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:35,880 Speaker 2: getting into your right, getting into the ins and outs 76 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 2: of which way the electrons go. 77 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,719 Speaker 5: But you've always really had this sort of change agent 78 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 5: approach to whether it be music or other things in life. 79 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,839 Speaker 5: When did you discover that you're a change agent? 80 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:52,040 Speaker 1: Wow? 81 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:56,080 Speaker 2: I probably didn't understand the term until my dad explained 82 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 2: it to me when I was very young, and I 83 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:03,359 Speaker 2: didn't really see my myself as a change agent. Many 84 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 2: times I saw myself as getting into trouble because of 85 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 2: I guess the idea I want to do something else, 86 00:05:11,880 --> 00:05:16,799 Speaker 2: or this is not writer. Pardon me for saying something here. 87 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 2: I guess probably in the Boston area when I started 88 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 2: to customize guitars and try to get guitar players help 89 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:34,480 Speaker 2: them customize their sound and give them to help them, 90 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 2: give them the tools, and some of the things we did, 91 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:40,320 Speaker 2: I mean were really nuts. I had a good friend 92 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:45,919 Speaker 2: of mine who kept putting cigarettes up on the headstock 93 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:48,719 Speaker 2: of his guitar, you know, while I was smoking, and 94 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 2: they would burn down and they would you know, burn. 95 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: The finish on the guitar. So I thought, that's that's 96 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 1: not good. 97 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 2: So I hunted around, found one of those circular astrays 98 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 2: from the thirty nine Buick and installed it in his 99 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,640 Speaker 2: telecaster so he could just have it out there and 100 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 2: put his cigarette there. 101 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: Why I was playing, you know, I just I guess 102 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 1: things like that. 103 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 5: When you were in high school, you worked in New 104 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 5: York at was it Manny's Guitar shop, Jimmy's Jimmy's, Okay, 105 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 5: and you ran into this other Jimmy there named Jimmy Hendrix. 106 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 4: Is that correct. 107 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,479 Speaker 1: Yeah, he was calling himself Jimmy James at the time. 108 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 5: Yeah, And what was your take on him when you 109 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 5: first met him? 110 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 2: Quiet, reserved, thoughtful, introspective, and when I finally got a 111 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 2: chance to hear him play, I was absolutely stunned. But 112 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,600 Speaker 2: a very nice guy, really a nice guy is. 113 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 1: The wrong word. 114 00:06:54,960 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 2: A very very deep, intense and open and thoughtful person. 115 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 1: Yeah. 116 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 5: I heard him described as sweet by Felix Cavaliery from 117 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:11,119 Speaker 5: the Rascals. 118 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 4: He said sweet was the way he described them. 119 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, he had. 120 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: All he wanted to do was play music, and he 121 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 2: also served in the military. So it was interesting at 122 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 2: the time, the rift that was opening an American society 123 00:07:31,120 --> 00:07:35,320 Speaker 2: because of the Vietnam War. Certainly many I would say 124 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 2: the bulk of the musicians were somewhat anti war for 125 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 2: good reasons, but Jimmy kept quiet about it. 126 00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: I didn't discuss it. 127 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,040 Speaker 2: And I think when he played his version of the 128 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 2: Star Spangled Banner at Woodstock, he did it because deep 129 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 2: down inside he cared about his country. 130 00:07:59,040 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 1: He was a patriot. 131 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:02,640 Speaker 4: Did you ever get to sit in in him with 132 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 4: him with. 133 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 2: U I did for a couple of songs, and of 134 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 2: course that blew up into you know, I played with 135 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 2: Jimmy Henry, but very very, very very and when I 136 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 2: say open, there's something amongst musicians that I call musicians etiquette, 137 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 2: where when you play together, you listen to the other musician. 138 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 2: You don't just jump in, you know, you listen, You 139 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 2: get a feel for what's going on, and you try 140 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 2: to add to the overall experience. Not to be a 141 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:43,679 Speaker 2: pun ful here, but to the overall experience. 142 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 1: And he was like that. 143 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,439 Speaker 2: Certainly he could have held his own and he could 144 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 2: have dominated anything, but for the most part, he was 145 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:57,679 Speaker 2: very He had a great amount of etiquette. Music etiquette, 146 00:08:57,920 --> 00:08:59,160 Speaker 2: I guess I would say. 147 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:04,959 Speaker 5: As that departed these days, music etiquette or etiquette in general. 148 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:07,560 Speaker 1: I don't think it's changed all that much. 149 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 2: There is always a group of musicians who feel it 150 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:18,760 Speaker 2: necessary to dominate whatever situation that they're in for whatever reason. 151 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 2: That won't get you very wear As far as a 152 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:24,960 Speaker 2: studio musician, we know, we had a saying back in 153 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 2: the seventies when you know, some guy would come in 154 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:30,720 Speaker 2: and brand new and he was just you know, wouldn't 155 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:34,199 Speaker 2: shut up, and you go, hey, man, I really did 156 00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 2: what you're trying to do, which was sort of a 157 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:40,439 Speaker 2: backhanded you know, you know, knock it off. 158 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 4: Kind of the equivalent to bless your heart. 159 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:47,319 Speaker 1: Right there, you go, that's it right, that's it. 160 00:09:50,000 --> 00:09:53,000 Speaker 5: So how tell me the story how you fell into 161 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 5: this work with these guys Becker and Fagan otherwise known 162 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 5: as the founder with you and others of Steely dan Well. 163 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:08,920 Speaker 2: I was working in Boston. I was spending playing in 164 00:10:08,960 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 2: a bunch of different bands. I was playing bass for 165 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 2: Tim Buckley. I was in the Holy Modal Rounds, which 166 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 2: was the craziest band ever, more fun than anybody should 167 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 2: ever be allowed legally to have. And I was doing 168 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 2: a lot of work in a place called Intermedia Sound 169 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:28,959 Speaker 2: on Newberry Street. 170 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 1: And I wasn't the house guitar player. 171 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 2: By any means, but because I was spending so much 172 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 2: time there, people would say, oh, we need a guitar part. 173 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Skunk's over, Okay, let's you know, he'll come 174 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 2: in and do it. And I was doing something and 175 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 2: I'm trying to remember whether it might have been for 176 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 2: Jonathan Edwards. 177 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: I wasn't. I don't, I can't quite remember. 178 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 2: But there was a band called The b Game, which 179 00:10:55,840 --> 00:11:01,679 Speaker 2: was a Boston based band, wonderful band, great guitar player. 180 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 2: John Sheldon is just one of those musical bands. And 181 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 2: a gentleman named Gary Katz was producing that band, and 182 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 2: I guess he stuck his head in when I was 183 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 2: doing a session with somebody and later on that day, so, 184 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 2: I'm doing a project in New York. Would you'd be 185 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 2: willing to come down and work on the project. And 186 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,440 Speaker 2: I was doing session work both in Boston and New York. 187 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 2: I was commuting, living in Boston, but I was commuting 188 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 2: back and forth, and I said sure, so I went 189 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 2: down there. He introduced me to a wonderful lady named 190 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 2: Linda Hoover who was doing a record in New York, 191 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 2: and a good chunk of the material was by a 192 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:51,840 Speaker 2: pair of songwriters named Walter Becker and Donald Fagan. And 193 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:55,560 Speaker 2: as we started working on the record, I got to 194 00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 2: know Walter O'donald a little bit. 195 00:11:57,840 --> 00:11:58,719 Speaker 1: And afterwards they. 196 00:11:58,679 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 2: Said, you know, we've never heard anybody play guitar quite 197 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 2: like that. I said, well, gentlemen, I've never heard music 198 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 2: like this. And so there was this sort of Okay, 199 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: whoever gets their nose under the tent calls everybody else 200 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 2: and will form a band. So Becker and Fagan managed 201 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,480 Speaker 2: to get a publishing deal through Gary Katz with ABC 202 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:27,120 Speaker 2: Records in Los Angeles, and I was already moving out 203 00:12:27,160 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 2: there to play with other bands. Anyway, I was playing 204 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 2: Pedal Steel. Actually was working at the Palamino Club and 205 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 2: doing session work and guitar repair out in Los Angeles, 206 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 2: and somehow or other, after they got the publishing deal, 207 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 2: we thought about putting together a band, and that's how 208 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 2: it happened. They said, do you know any drummers? Said yeah, 209 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 2: the drummer for the Bead Game, Jimmy Hatter. Do you 210 00:12:56,480 --> 00:13:01,959 Speaker 2: know any lead singers, Yeah, Dave Palmer, and of course 211 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 2: Danny Dials was a friend of theirs as well, So 212 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 2: there you go. 213 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 4: Wow. You know, they've recently been unearthing and re releasing 214 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:22,160 Speaker 4: a lot of those midnight specials from Birch Sugar and 215 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:31,199 Speaker 4: the Steely Dan episodes are absolute knockouts. What was your. 216 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 5: Recollection of how the audience felt about what they were seeing? 217 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:40,960 Speaker 5: Because the performance is spectacular. You had the two ladies 218 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:45,680 Speaker 5: with the flapper hats singing and skunk, you know, just 219 00:13:45,800 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 5: wailing away. And I mean what I was struck with 220 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:52,080 Speaker 5: For a band that for so long didn't look like 221 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,840 Speaker 5: it was always having fun when they were in front 222 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 5: of people, it looked like a lot of fun. 223 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:01,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, First of all, we had a great time, and 224 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:06,360 Speaker 2: the background singers were David Cassidy's background singers, and they 225 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 2: were phenomenal, phenomenal singers. Plus Ross Jones, who was playing 226 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:18,080 Speaker 2: percussion and also singing backgrounds. Royce would step up to 227 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:24,200 Speaker 2: sing any major, dude, and wherever we were. 228 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 1: Immediately turned into a club. 229 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 2: His delivery and his vocal style was so inviting. This 230 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 2: guy was an incredible singer. Everybody was an amazing musician. 231 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:42,960 Speaker 2: And I think there's a bit of mythology that perhaps 232 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:50,400 Speaker 2: was promoted by Walter and Donald that they didn't like 233 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:53,720 Speaker 2: to play live and that there was something about that 234 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:59,040 Speaker 2: that was less than I can't find the word to 235 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 2: describe it, but just wasn't worthy as being in the studio, 236 00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:08,800 Speaker 2: And that's really not true. We had a great time, 237 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:12,560 Speaker 2: and we were a band, and there's something about the 238 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 2: chemistry between musicians who worked together. Certainly Steely Dan's later 239 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 2: works with just Walter o'donald hiring studio musicians, of which 240 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 2: we were all anyway was excellent. But there was something 241 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 2: special about the chemistry and you could see it, you 242 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 2: could feel it, and I don't know, we were having 243 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 2: a ball. 244 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: I'm not quite sure what the problem was. You know. 245 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 4: It's the performances are spectacular. Oh my god, it just 246 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 4: knocked me out. 247 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 5: And I've watched it half a dozen times and shown 248 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 5: it to people, and you're just blazing on that one 249 00:15:58,960 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 5: for sure. 250 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 1: Oh thank you, sir. I was having a good time. 251 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 4: So then the Doobie Brothers kind of was flowing. 252 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 5: You were doing session work right with them, and you 253 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:13,400 Speaker 5: were still part of Steely Dan. But it looked like 254 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 5: things were going to kind of go in a direction 255 00:16:16,280 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 5: where Steely Dan would get off of touring. So was 256 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 5: that how you ended up making the decision to go 257 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 5: from session player to full time Doobie brother. 258 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 2: Well, we had the band Steely Dan. I was also 259 00:16:30,440 --> 00:16:35,080 Speaker 2: playing in Lynda Rostott's band, playing Steel Pedal Steel and 260 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:39,440 Speaker 2: out touring with Jinny Rodriguez, and then you know a 261 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 2: bunch of just all I wanted to do was play. 262 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:44,680 Speaker 2: Spent all my time playing, whether it was in the 263 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:50,800 Speaker 2: studio or with other bands. And Steely Dan was opening 264 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 2: for the Doobie Brothers on a number of concert tours 265 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 2: and very nice guys they said, Hey, would you like 266 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:05,639 Speaker 2: to sit in for a couple of songs? Sure, and 267 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 2: then it was four songs, and then it was six songs, 268 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:12,679 Speaker 2: and then it was half the show, and then finally, 269 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:13,920 Speaker 2: would you like to go out on. 270 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:14,960 Speaker 1: Tour with us? 271 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:19,400 Speaker 2: I said sure, And so I was touring with them, 272 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 2: touring with Steely Dan, touring with Linda Ronstadt again, I'll 273 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 2: playing with Hide Rodriguez. And I was on tour with 274 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,720 Speaker 2: the Doobies in England and we were playing at Nedworth, 275 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:37,919 Speaker 2: the Big Networth Festival, and I talked to the guys 276 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,960 Speaker 2: and Steely done. I talked to Walter and Donald and 277 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:42,920 Speaker 2: they had said, hey, that we're just don't on a 278 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 2: tour anymore. 279 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 1: I said, well, okay. I enjoyed touring. 280 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:52,280 Speaker 2: I thought that was fun, and I again it was 281 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,720 Speaker 2: the mythology of well, what's the problem here. So when 282 00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:58,320 Speaker 2: I hung up the phone, I said, well that's kind 283 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,919 Speaker 2: of it for me and Steely Dan, and one of 284 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 2: the members of DeBie Brothers said, well, now you're in 285 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 2: the Doobie Brothers. 286 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:09,119 Speaker 1: Okay, great, thank you, and away we go. 287 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,040 Speaker 4: And what's some of your favorite memories from the work 288 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:16,440 Speaker 4: with the Doobie Brothers and how did you bring Michael 289 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:17,639 Speaker 4: McDonald into the band? 290 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 1: Well? 291 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:23,879 Speaker 2: I had great memories simply because there was great interaction 292 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 2: at the time when Tommy was still in the band 293 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 2: Tommy Johnston, all of us had a pre election for 294 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,840 Speaker 2: three guitar players because one of the bands that all 295 00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 2: of us admired was Moby Grape. I think they were 296 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:44,879 Speaker 2: probably the best American rock and roll band ever, and 297 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 2: they had three guitar players, and they figured out how 298 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 2: to do that without creating a traffic jam. I always said, 299 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:55,600 Speaker 2: it's like a three masted schooner. And everything was working 300 00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 2: just fine, and the three of us playing together with 301 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:06,880 Speaker 2: very different styles I think, created almost like a guitar orchestra. 302 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 2: So that was tremendous fun. And one day we were 303 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:20,280 Speaker 2: about to perform at Louisiana State University when tom got 304 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:24,439 Speaker 2: extremely ill. He had an ulcer attack or something and 305 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:29,399 Speaker 2: couldn't go on stage. So I don't know, sometimes you 306 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:33,040 Speaker 2: gotta make a command decision, right, So I walked out 307 00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:34,120 Speaker 2: on stage and said. 308 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:35,359 Speaker 1: Everybody gonna have their money back. 309 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:38,520 Speaker 2: They're probably I don't know, forty thousand people there or something, 310 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 2: or you can wait ten days and we'll. 311 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:42,080 Speaker 1: Put on a show. 312 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:45,400 Speaker 2: So I got off stage and said, well, well, okay, 313 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,880 Speaker 2: so now that I pull that trigger. So I got 314 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:51,399 Speaker 2: on the phone called Michael McDonald, who had been touring 315 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:56,640 Speaker 2: with us in Seelie Dan. I'm playing keyboards and singing background. 316 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,679 Speaker 2: And said, Michael, you really need to do this. This 317 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 2: would be great. And he said, Okay, there's a one 318 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 2: way ticket. Wait before you at the airport, get on playing, 319 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 2: come out to New Orleans. So we rehearsed for eight 320 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:15,880 Speaker 2: to ten hours a day for eight days and went 321 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:20,159 Speaker 2: out and played the show got five encores and I thought, Okay, 322 00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:22,400 Speaker 2: maybe I made the right decision here. 323 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:24,600 Speaker 1: I love it. 324 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:31,159 Speaker 5: Talk about your time with Linda Ronstat, What a magical 325 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:34,879 Speaker 5: moments that must have been in your life. 326 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:36,440 Speaker 1: Well, first of all, it's hard. 327 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 2: It's hard to describe Linda as anything but the consummate 328 00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 2: female vocalist. She didn't try to be a man. 329 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:47,120 Speaker 1: She was I. 330 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 2: Think her idol not idle, but her heroin would have 331 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 2: been Patsy Cline. She loved Patsy Kline and we did 332 00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:00,760 Speaker 2: a lot of Patsy clinb songs in the set. She 333 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:04,959 Speaker 2: was very sweet, She wasn't a wallflower. She knew what 334 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:10,000 Speaker 2: she wanted, but she also relied on the talent and 335 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,080 Speaker 2: the capability of the musicians in the band. You know, 336 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 2: John Boyle and playing keyboards, Richie Heywood on drums, you know, 337 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:22,760 Speaker 2: Andrew Gold playing guitar, Bobby Wharford playing a guitar and 338 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:25,479 Speaker 2: polstring guitar. 339 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 1: I mean, what a band. 340 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 2: Actually, I think we ended up sort of leaving Linda's 341 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 2: employ because the band was so powerful, kind of steamroller 342 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,960 Speaker 2: every once in a while. But we had a ball 343 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 2: because we were again a unified group of guys. Everybody 344 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,880 Speaker 2: was pretty much a studio guy. I mean everybody had 345 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 2: worked in the studios as well as their own bands. 346 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:56,680 Speaker 2: And Richie Heywood, God, what a drummer, little feet please 347 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 2: you know. So where we played, everyone loved her. It 348 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:09,199 Speaker 2: was like I had never seen anyone walk out or 349 00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,919 Speaker 2: be unhappy at all with her music, and she was 350 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 2: enthralling her her spirit and her voice really got inside 351 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 2: your DNA and it was beautiful. I mean there were 352 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,440 Speaker 2: times when I thought maybe I should just not play 353 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 2: and sit back and enjoy this, but you know, you gotta, yeah, 354 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:31,920 Speaker 2: I gotta play. 355 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: I was playing pedal steel in the band. 356 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:36,479 Speaker 4: Did you teach yourself pedal steel? 357 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:40,439 Speaker 1: Yeah? Yes, I didn't. 358 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 2: I couldn't find any books and I figured, like guitar, 359 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:49,879 Speaker 2: you just shed spend the time listen to everything that 360 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:54,879 Speaker 2: you possibly can learn from it. And because I was 361 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 2: repairing guitars, and I was also repairing steel guitars, so 362 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 2: I understand the mechanics of it. 363 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 1: So it helped me. 364 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 2: I practice a lot even when I wasn't playing the instrument. 365 00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:09,640 Speaker 2: That's what I do when I play the guitar too. 366 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:13,199 Speaker 2: I'll look at the music and I'll be flying on 367 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 2: a plane somewhere and I'll have learned the song by 368 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:19,680 Speaker 2: the time I get there, because I just practice virtually. 369 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 2: And so I spent every waking minute that I had 370 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 2: the time practicing, whether it was actually on the instrument 371 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:28,120 Speaker 2: or in my mind. 372 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,720 Speaker 5: I see some guitars in the background. Do you just 373 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 5: pick up guitars all throughout the day and play around. 374 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,880 Speaker 2: When I have the time, when I have the time, 375 00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:43,960 Speaker 2: and then yeah, there's back there, there she is. You know, 376 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 2: there's my baby right there, my pedal steel. Much love 377 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,280 Speaker 2: for that instrument. I think the pedal steel is the 378 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 2: most beautiful instrument in the world. It seems like it 379 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 2: has uncanny ability to get inside people's DNA. I did 380 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,560 Speaker 2: something the other day for MAUI for some to raise 381 00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:11,919 Speaker 2: some money, and I did a pedal steel part on 382 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:16,959 Speaker 2: Amazing Grace. I turned around and there were two ladies 383 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,120 Speaker 2: in the room and they were like, sobbing. I went, 384 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,719 Speaker 2: did I screw something up? And they were no, It's 385 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:32,000 Speaker 2: just so beautiful. The instrument has a special magic to 386 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 2: it when it's played right. 387 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:39,600 Speaker 5: I would imagine you saw Garcia play pedal steel at 388 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 5: one point and Sneaky Pete played pedal steel. 389 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,600 Speaker 2: Oh what a great steel player, Sneaky one. There was 390 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:49,679 Speaker 2: a guy was right right out of the out of 391 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:52,600 Speaker 2: the What can I say, the no holds barred for 392 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 2: Sneaky Absolutely. 393 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,680 Speaker 5: You're talking about, you know how beautiful the pedal steel is. 394 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:03,040 Speaker 5: And you know, we produced this other podcast it's called 395 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:07,879 Speaker 5: Music Save Me. It's about music and sort of the 396 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 5: healing forces. Do you believe music has healing supernatural powers? 397 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:20,879 Speaker 2: I would have to we would have to have a 398 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,360 Speaker 2: separate discussion about the use of the word supernatural. 399 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 1: But other than that, absolutely. 400 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:34,440 Speaker 2: What many people don't understand is why music has such 401 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:40,679 Speaker 2: an effect. From a purely physiological point of view, brain 402 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:52,159 Speaker 2: operates on a cocktail of neurotransmitters oxytocin, adrenaline that's oppressing serotonin. 403 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 2: All of these neurotransmitters each trigger a specific or a 404 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 2: set of specific emotions, So when you mix them in 405 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:11,640 Speaker 2: a cocktail, you then have the opportunity, if you can 406 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:17,879 Speaker 2: stimulate that secretion of those neurotransmitters, the opportunity to actually 407 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:23,439 Speaker 2: map out and produce emotions in people. So when you 408 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 2: fall in love, mostly you fall in love, or at 409 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:32,920 Speaker 2: least physiologically and biologically you fall in love because both 410 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:38,400 Speaker 2: of you are manufacturing hefty amounts of oxytocin. They call 411 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 2: it the love drug that bonds you to that other 412 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 2: person or binds you, depending on where you're coming from. 413 00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 2: So there's no doubt in my mind. And I've had situations. 414 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 2: It's been kind of fun. I've had crusty guys, you know, 415 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:56,639 Speaker 2: marine corps generals, you know. 416 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:00,960 Speaker 1: Ah, yeah whatever. I said, Okay, man, sit down here. 417 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,199 Speaker 2: I'm going to pick up this guitar and I'm going 418 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:08,879 Speaker 2: to run you through a whole spectrum of emotions. And 419 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:12,119 Speaker 2: they go, ah, all right, and by the end of 420 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 2: it they're going WHOA. I said, well, this is how 421 00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 2: this works. The different combination of frequencies coherent oscillations that 422 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:27,800 Speaker 2: emanate from the instrument are what stimulate the neurotransmitters in 423 00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 2: your brain and what people A lot of people, it's 424 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:33,959 Speaker 2: not that they don't understand it, they just never nobody's 425 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,879 Speaker 2: ever sat down and explained it to the linearity of 426 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:45,040 Speaker 2: frequency from zero to pure energy somewhat embodied an Einstein's 427 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:50,399 Speaker 2: equation equals mc square energy equals mass times the speed 428 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:51,960 Speaker 2: of the square of the speed of light. 429 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 1: So that they're one and the same. 430 00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 2: Music is just a portion of the spectrum that stimulate 431 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 2: human beings. Why does art stimulate human beings? Why are 432 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:12,040 Speaker 2: the colors in certain combinations so effective. Well, if you 433 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,479 Speaker 2: strike the A string on a guitar, it vibrates at 434 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 2: four hundred and forty times a second. In other words, 435 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 2: it goes through four hundred and forty full cycles, and 436 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 2: that we recognize as the note A below middle C. 437 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:36,959 Speaker 2: If you multiply that times two, the harmonic of that 438 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 2: is eight hundred and eighty cycles per second, So you 439 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 2: hear A an octave above that note. Multiply it again. 440 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,920 Speaker 2: Every time you go up you get a higher note 441 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 2: an octave above, which is just the physics of it. Well, 442 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,280 Speaker 2: you know what happens when you multiply A four forty 443 00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,080 Speaker 2: times ten to the twenty third power. You know what 444 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 2: the super harmonic is, it's green. The color green. All 445 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 2: that is is the super super harmonic. The frequency four 446 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:19,360 Speaker 2: and forty cycles per second, vibrating millions of times, so 447 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:27,200 Speaker 2: it's all connected, so color, light, sound. When you go 448 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 2: up the frequency scale, and the human being there's sensor 449 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,640 Speaker 2: package is only attuned to certain parts of the frequency spectrum. 450 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:39,200 Speaker 2: So after you get past about twenty twenty five thousand cycles, 451 00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 2: your ears don't hear anymore. Then you start to move 452 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:43,880 Speaker 2: up the spectrum and all of a sudden your skin 453 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,880 Speaker 2: gets warm. Ah, you're in the infrared. And then if 454 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:50,480 Speaker 2: you keep going, you get past the infrared into the 455 00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 2: visible spectrum red, all the way through yellow, green, and 456 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 2: then all the way to blue. Then it disappears again 457 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 2: because your central acting is only attuned to a particular amount, 458 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 2: till finally you're ending up with gamma rays, and you know, 459 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:12,400 Speaker 2: billions of frequency, frequency of vibrating abillions of times a second, 460 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:17,479 Speaker 2: and that's where you get things like the crushing of 461 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:24,720 Speaker 2: hydrogen atoms into helium and releasing tremendous amounts of energy. 462 00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 1: That's how star works. 463 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:31,719 Speaker 2: What bind SEB atomic party goes together, frequency electromagnetism. 464 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 1: It's all the same. 465 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:36,920 Speaker 2: People said, well, how did you get involved in all 466 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 2: this defense stuff? I mean, how do you know anything 467 00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 2: about that? Said, hey man, radar is just an electric 468 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:46,600 Speaker 2: guitar on steroids. Physics is all the same. Once you 469 00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:51,000 Speaker 2: understand the physics of it, it's all the same. It's 470 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 2: beautifully organized and euristic. 471 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 4: May I call you doctor Baxter? 472 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,200 Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, no, I don't deserve that. 473 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 5: Are you still doing defense work or the war college 474 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:07,160 Speaker 5: kind of work? 475 00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:08,480 Speaker 4: Wargame stuff? 476 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:12,720 Speaker 2: Absolutely, a lot of war gaming, and I mean I 477 00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 2: can't I gotta be careful, but I do a lot 478 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 2: of work that has to do with space and space 479 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:32,080 Speaker 2: warfare and ISR intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance, unconventional warfare, things 480 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 2: that are a little to the left or right of 481 00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 2: conventional thinking. I think that's why they keep me around. 482 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:45,360 Speaker 5: Let's talk about the work you're doing musically now and 483 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,920 Speaker 5: how it excites you, because you know, we got the 484 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:52,000 Speaker 5: dates coming up. I know you love being out there, 485 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:55,479 Speaker 5: you know, talking to people and playing in front of people. 486 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 4: But talk about the work now that you're doing in 487 00:31:59,120 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 4: the studio. 488 00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 2: Well, I still do a little bit of studio work. 489 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 2: It's really in my time. It's a time management problem 490 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 2: between my day job working for Uncle Sam and going 491 00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:15,959 Speaker 2: out and playing. I just don't have a lot of 492 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 2: time to do too many sessions anymore. But the solo project, 493 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:26,280 Speaker 2: I've never done anything like it, and it's been a 494 00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,800 Speaker 2: delightful journey to go out and play what I want 495 00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 2: to play, and working with a tremendous musician, CJ. Vanston, 496 00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:39,280 Speaker 2: who was my co producer and we co wrote a 497 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,120 Speaker 2: lot of the music on this record, finally gave me 498 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 2: an opportunity which I had had opportunities before to do 499 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,840 Speaker 2: a solo project, but never either had the time or 500 00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:55,160 Speaker 2: felt that I really wanted to. But CJ and I 501 00:32:55,200 --> 00:33:00,720 Speaker 2: were working on and off in the studio, and I 502 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:05,120 Speaker 2: guess it's like a jar full of pennies. Eventually you 503 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 2: got to roll them up. I mean, you know you're there. 504 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,200 Speaker 2: It's full now. So that's kind of what happened with 505 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 2: this solo project, and I'm having a just a ball. 506 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:20,320 Speaker 2: The musicians I'm playing with are thank god. The drummer 507 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:25,800 Speaker 2: Mark Damien, first call studio guy, younger guy, but in 508 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:30,960 Speaker 2: the pocket he's an old soul. He plays like he's 509 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:35,960 Speaker 2: an old soul. Our bass player Hank Corton from Detroit, 510 00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 2: his first call bass player, great lead singer, also happens 511 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 2: to be the bass player for the Detroit Symphony. I mean, 512 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:51,480 Speaker 2: then our keyboard player cj obviously you know, producer, composer, 513 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:54,480 Speaker 2: you know, incredible musician. He hasn't been able to be 514 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 2: out with us for a while. So our new keyboard 515 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 2: player is a gentleman named Jay Raymond. Who James Raymond, who, sorry, 516 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 2: Jay Raymond was the four star general head. 517 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 1: Of Space Force. I got them all computed. 518 00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:13,279 Speaker 2: James Raymond is David Crosby's Sun and is infused with 519 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:20,799 Speaker 2: musical DNA. Frightening keyboard player, frightening musician. So yeah, I'm 520 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 2: just having way more fun than probably is legally allowed 521 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:28,480 Speaker 2: playing with these guys. And then when we play, I 522 00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:31,120 Speaker 2: get to tell stories because people seem to want to 523 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:34,480 Speaker 2: hear as it seems that as you and I are 524 00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 2: having our discussion here, they want to hear stories. They 525 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,640 Speaker 2: want to hear the next song of things. They want 526 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:45,880 Speaker 2: to know how people interacted and where things come from. 527 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: So we're just having too much fun. 528 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:54,200 Speaker 4: That's awesome. City Winery, November ninth. In closing, I want 529 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:59,320 Speaker 4: to ask you if there's anybody that dead or alive 530 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,160 Speaker 4: that you could have had a studio session with. Who 531 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 4: Who would these people be? 532 00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 2: It's hard to say, because I've had a chance to 533 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:16,200 Speaker 2: play with everybody from Oscar Peterson to Gene Simmons. You know, 534 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:19,959 Speaker 2: I'd have to think about that, and I'm not trying 535 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 2: to be disingenuous. I've been pretty lucky to play with 536 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 2: the folks that I want. I guess one guy I 537 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 2: would have loved to play with was Manita Seplata, the 538 00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:34,160 Speaker 2: classical guitar player. 539 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:36,799 Speaker 1: That guy has. 540 00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:46,600 Speaker 2: Some something, some magic karma, halo energy or something or other. 541 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 2: I would have loved to have been able to be 542 00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:54,040 Speaker 2: inside that energy field. But I've been pretty lucky guy 543 00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:56,640 Speaker 2: to play with a lot of great folks. 544 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 6: Well, I'm pretty lucky to get to talk you, and 545 00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 6: i can't tell you the joy of the music that 546 00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:11,240 Speaker 6: you continue to give us is so appreciated, and the Taking. 547 00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:14,719 Speaker 5: A Walk Podcast is proud to have you on. If 548 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:19,520 Speaker 5: anybody who wants to share this with all their gazillion friends, 549 00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:24,080 Speaker 5: we would really love that we're available everywhere you get 550 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:28,040 Speaker 5: your podcasts. But Jeff skunk back Start's an honor to 551 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:31,120 Speaker 5: talk to you and thanks for being on Taking a Walk. 552 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:33,480 Speaker 1: Thank you very much for your hospitality. 553 00:36:34,719 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a 554 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 3: Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends 555 00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:44,640 Speaker 3: and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking 556 00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:48,600 Speaker 3: a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 557 00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:51,120 Speaker 3: and wherever you get your podcasts.