1 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: Get in touch with technology with Textile from how stuff 2 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: works dot com. Hey there, everyone, and welcome to tech Stuff. 3 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:16,799 Speaker 1: I'm Jonathan Strickland and I'm Lauren Bock Obama, and we 4 00:00:16,840 --> 00:00:18,599 Speaker 1: thought we'd take another one of our looks at a 5 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 1: big company that's in the world of tech and uh 6 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:23,320 Speaker 1: and you know, it's been a while since we've done 7 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: one of these, And we also thought we talked about 8 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: a company that's involved in video games. It's one that 9 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 1: has a long history in video games and a controversial 10 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 1: one at times. This also has been something that numerous 11 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:37,920 Speaker 1: listeners have requested over the years. If you do not 12 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:41,680 Speaker 1: like video games, you have our permission to just, you know, 13 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: listen to an old episode. Wait, but we promised that 14 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: we're going to try to make it interesting, even for 15 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:47,880 Speaker 1: those of you who don't care that much. Yeah, because 16 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,040 Speaker 1: there's a lot of impact that this has on the 17 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: entire industry. And it's really this particular story is pretty interesting. 18 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: We're specifically talking about Electronic Arts or e A, which 19 00:00:57,240 --> 00:00:59,680 Speaker 1: a lot of people view these days as some sort 20 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 1: of megalomaniacal corporation bent on dominating the entire video game industry. Yeah, 21 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: and it's uh, yeah, well, I mean we'll we'll get 22 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 1: into it later on, but but it but it is 23 00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: one worst company in America twice, two years in a row, 24 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:15,400 Speaker 1: two years in a row. Yeah yeah. But but to 25 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 1: start off, you know, it's it didn't start off as 26 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:22,559 Speaker 1: as this uh company that was bent on on having 27 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 1: a stranglehold on the video game industry. And I'm not 28 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 1: saying that that's what he has now or that's goal, 29 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: that's what's goal is, but that's what that's the popular 30 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: perception that is. Well, you know, to be fair, it 31 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:37,440 Speaker 1: does as twenty five million registered players and is operating 32 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 1: out of seventy five countries, so it's not doing to shadowy. 33 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: But but it had had interesting beginnings. Now to really 34 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 1: understand how A started, you actually have to go way 35 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 1: back before e A was a thing. Uh. And my 36 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 1: first date that I wrote down was in nineteen fifty 37 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 1: three because that's when William M. Trip Hawkins the Third 38 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: was born. Now, this guy is going to be the 39 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: founder of e A when we get up to that point, 40 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 1: but um, he was. It was his idea to start 41 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 1: up a video game company, and uh, and you know 42 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 1: the way he came about this was as he was 43 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:18,119 Speaker 1: growing up and going to school, he started to get 44 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:22,920 Speaker 1: really interested in uh, computers in general and games as well. 45 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:27,640 Speaker 1: In fact, in nineteen seventy he designed a board game. 46 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 1: It was a football board game called ACU stat Pro Football. Yeah. 47 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: He borrowed five thousand dollars from his father to get 48 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 1: this off the ground. And it was a complete commercial failure. Right. 49 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 1: It was his first entrepreneurial attempt and it and it failed, 50 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 1: which often we can learn a lot more from our 51 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:48,320 Speaker 1: failures than our successes. But it teaches us a couple 52 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:51,360 Speaker 1: of things about Hawkins that he's interested in games, and 53 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 1: he's interested in football in particular, which becomes extremely evident. 54 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 1: And during the the evolution of e A right, right, 55 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 1: and he had started kind of designing stuff. He was 56 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:03,360 Speaker 1: a big D and D player from what I understand 57 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:05,919 Speaker 1: and um and was really interested in how all of 58 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:08,440 Speaker 1: the math and statistics worked. But noticed that a lot 59 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 1: of his friends were not interested in doing that at all, 60 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:14,680 Speaker 1: and so he was kind of thinking like, hey, what if. Yeah, 61 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: he was looking at at different ways of creating sets 62 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 1: of rules and statistics and and also at the same 63 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: time he was starting to get interested in computers. Now 64 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 1: in the early seventies. This is predating the personal computer. 65 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:30,560 Speaker 1: If you were interested in computers, it's because you had 66 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 1: a job at Uh, there were computers at your job, 67 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:36,240 Speaker 1: or maybe you were attending university and they were computers 68 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:38,520 Speaker 1: there right right in in seventy when he had his 69 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 1: first interaction ever with a prototype micro computer, this was 70 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:43,880 Speaker 1: over a friend's house and uh, and that kind of 71 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,119 Speaker 1: set him up for a couple of years later. Yeah, 72 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy three, he has access to a d 73 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: E C PDP eleven mini computer and he creates a 74 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 1: program written in the Basic programming language that was designed 75 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,800 Speaker 1: to run simulations of football games, so exactly a fully 76 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: interactive gaming experience. More like, if I put in every 77 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: player's stats and then set this to go and have 78 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 1: it play out as if it were a game, what 79 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: would the results be? And he tested it by running 80 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:16,479 Speaker 1: a simulation of what was going to be at that time, 81 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventy four Super Bowl game, and it turned 82 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 1: out that his his game ended up predicting the final 83 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: score fairly closely. Uh. In his game, it said that 84 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,440 Speaker 1: the Dolphins would win over Minnesota twenty three to six, 85 00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 1: and the real score was actually twenty four to seven. 86 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 1: So at least in that sense, the statistics seemed to 87 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:44,159 Speaker 1: hold true. Now, of course, we all know that in reality, 88 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:46,359 Speaker 1: from a day to day basis, statistics can give you 89 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: an indication of how things might go, but there's no 90 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,279 Speaker 1: guarantee that's how they will go, right, Yeah, So so 91 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:55,839 Speaker 1: Luck could have certainly been involved in that one, but 92 00:04:56,120 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 1: you know not. Nonetheless, he was a student at Harvard 93 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: at the time. He graduated with a self designed major 94 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: in a strategy and applied game theory. That's an interesting 95 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:10,920 Speaker 1: major right there. Especially fore right, he says that he 96 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:13,080 Speaker 1: spent a couple of years convincing Harvard to to let 97 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 1: him get that degree because that was what he wanted. 98 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: And I would go on to get an MBA from Stanford. Yep. 99 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 1: And when he graduated in ninet with that NBA, he 100 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: went to work for a little company called Apple, and 101 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 1: at that time it really was a little company. Yeah, 102 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:30,400 Speaker 1: they had just just about fifty employees at the time, Yeah, 103 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:33,479 Speaker 1: fifty employees. He had joined early on. This is, of course, 104 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 1: you know, right at the very onset of the personal 105 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,880 Speaker 1: computer era. The Apple two was the first computer from 106 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:42,719 Speaker 1: Apple to really hit it off in the market. The 107 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:46,520 Speaker 1: first Apple was mostly adopted by people who were hobbyists 108 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 1: or really had a fascination with computers, but it was 109 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: not a commercial success. What didn't run away with the market, 110 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:54,279 Speaker 1: Apple two was a totally different story. That was the 111 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:58,920 Speaker 1: one that a larger niche began to get interested in 112 00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: personal computers. It's still was still, you know, kind of 113 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:06,280 Speaker 1: in the hobbyist era, but uh, it was a looser 114 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: definition of hobbyists at that point, not just people who 115 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 1: were obsessed with computers. And I mean that in the 116 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 1: nicest way. I come from a family that's part of 117 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:18,279 Speaker 1: this niche. So yeah, Hawkins has said that in seven 118 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:21,000 Speaker 1: he saw an Apple two at a computer fair and 119 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 1: realized that this was kind of you know, he had 120 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 1: been churning around this this concept of of games and 121 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: computers and programming for a couple of years and decided 122 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:31,839 Speaker 1: that Apple was, yes, the way to go. He's not 123 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 1: the only one either. There were a lot of early 124 00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:37,359 Speaker 1: game developers who were looking at personal computers as the 125 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 1: platform of choice, and many of them, uh showed an 126 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:45,279 Speaker 1: early preference for the Apple to Richard Garriott of Origin 127 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:49,480 Speaker 1: also had that same fascination. So Hawkins works for Apple. 128 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 1: By two, he was the director of strategy and marketing 129 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:58,360 Speaker 1: at Apple Computers. So from yeah, that those humble beginnings, 130 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: and of course by then Apple was doing very very 131 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 1: well and had already had its initial public offering, which 132 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: netted Hawkins quite a bit of money. And so he 133 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: made a big, risky decision. He decided that his fascination 134 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 1: of games and computers needed to really be indulged, and 135 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: so he left Apple Computer. Well, he supposedly had had 136 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 1: decided almost a decade prior that in two would be 137 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: the year for him to start a business, to start 138 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: a computer business, and that that that would be the 139 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 1: year that that the home computing market had caught up 140 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 1: to his desire to plan it. Now, now, I both 141 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 1: of us honestly don't know whether or not that's truly 142 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:41,760 Speaker 1: what he thought. That's some of the stuff. Some of 143 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: the stuff he says, he says, well after the time, right, 144 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: it could be retcond is all I'm saying. I'm not 145 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 1: saying he definitely did do that. I'm just I have 146 00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: a little bit of skepticism either either way. On two 147 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: fun fact, the day before I was born, Um, in 148 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: case anyone needed to feel really old right now, thank 149 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 1: you you're welcome. Um. He he incorporated Electronic Arts, and 150 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 1: and this was not going This was not the original 151 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 1: name that he had thought of for the company. No, no, 152 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:17,920 Speaker 1: he actually originally wanted to call it Amazing Software, but 153 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 1: that just didn't seem to really click. He got a 154 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: bunch of people together to try and uh brainstorm and idea. 155 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 1: He had actually used two thousand dollars of his own 156 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:31,920 Speaker 1: money to fund this early part of the company, UH 157 00:08:31,960 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 1: and he they started thinking about other possible names. One 158 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 1: of the names they came up with was soft Art, 159 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 1: but the head of another company that was called Software 160 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: Software Arts asked him if he would reconsider naming his 161 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 1: company that just to avoid any confusion, and he agreed 162 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,559 Speaker 1: to do that. Had another brainstorming session and that came 163 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: up with Electronic Arts. Along with a team of other 164 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:55,560 Speaker 1: folks and marketing people as well an outside marketing company, 165 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:58,560 Speaker 1: and Electronic Arts was born. They would actually receive by 166 00:08:58,559 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 1: the end of nineteen eight two two million dollars in 167 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: venture capital from Sequoia Capital, and Sequoia Capital even gave 168 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: them some office space to work out of before they 169 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 1: had any sort of physical headquarters right right. Very Originally, 170 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:14,439 Speaker 1: I think he worked out of his own home when 171 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: he was hiring his first couple of people, and uh, 172 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: all of these people that he was hiring at the time, 173 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 1: and and the naming of the company kind of came 174 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: about because he really wanted UM. He really believed that 175 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:30,320 Speaker 1: computer games are an art form and wanted UM wanted 176 00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 1: the game company to operate kind of like a music 177 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:34,920 Speaker 1: label UM. And this is really evident in some of 178 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 1: their early marketing campaigns and attempts. You know, they would 179 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: get these game developers together and pose them like rock 180 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:44,040 Speaker 1: stars have, have rock music photographers come in and do 181 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 1: these gorgeous photographs of them and and really concentrate on 182 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:50,559 Speaker 1: the software artist. Yeah, even the art they would use 183 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: in their the games they sold, which in those days 184 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: games didn't come in boxes yet. They were in usually 185 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 1: plastic bags, and you had some r that would be included. 186 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: But it it looked pretty looked like a lot of Yeah, 187 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 1: it looked like a lot of these games came out 188 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 1: of someone's garage. And here's here's a fun fact. A 189 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,840 Speaker 1: lot of them did. UM. But uh e A. They 190 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:14,680 Speaker 1: took an approach where they really put a lot of 191 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:19,319 Speaker 1: graphic design work into the art that was included with 192 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: the games, and there were several sources I read that 193 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,959 Speaker 1: likened the the art on the games too. Album you 194 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,160 Speaker 1: would see on what we used to you know, buy 195 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 1: music on, which were these giant vinyl albums. I actually 196 00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 1: kids are doing that again now. But there was a 197 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: while where I would say vinyl album and I just 198 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 1: get that blank stare um. Those days appeared to have 199 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 1: disappeared again for at least a while, but I'll see 200 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,920 Speaker 1: that keeps up. Uh. They actually moved to the headquarters 201 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 1: in San Mateo, California, and they were there for quite 202 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: a few years. Ultimately they ended up moving again. But 203 00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:59,240 Speaker 1: and also you know, e A expanded greatly, But we'll 204 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 1: get into all of at So they're early early efforts 205 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 1: were concentrated on a few titles, uh, and they wanted 206 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 1: to produce all of their games. Internally, they wanted to 207 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:16,199 Speaker 1: be a publisher, a developer, and a distributor. So these 208 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:20,679 Speaker 1: are all different parts of the the video game industry. 209 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: And you can have a company that's just one of 210 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:25,280 Speaker 1: these things, or you can have a company that does 211 00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 1: multiple roles here, but to break it down, essentially, you 212 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,200 Speaker 1: have publishers that these are the companies that fund the 213 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:36,280 Speaker 1: development of video games. Now, they might have a development 214 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:39,439 Speaker 1: team within the publisher, or they may pay an independent 215 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 1: developer to create a game. But they are the ones 216 00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: who say, here's some money, we believe in the project 217 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:48,599 Speaker 1: that you have pitched, why don't you go ahead and 218 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 1: build that game. Then you give us the game, and 219 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:54,719 Speaker 1: we will make sure the game gets to distributors who 220 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 1: will then make sure the game gets two stores. And 221 00:11:57,280 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: then the way it generally works, if it if you're 222 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:02,320 Speaker 1: talking about a dependent developer and a publisher, the publisher 223 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 1: will give an advance to the developer, and that advance 224 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: is against any future royalties that the game sells until 225 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 1: you pay off that advance, and then you usually have 226 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,600 Speaker 1: some sort of royalty sharing program where the publisher gets 227 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: a certain amount of the money from sales and the 228 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 1: developer gets another, you know, a percentage of those sales 229 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: as well, But the advance has to be paid off first, 230 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 1: because that's the initial investment the publisher makes to the developer. 231 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: Developers are of course, those are the people who developed 232 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 1: the games, are the ones who actually build the games. 233 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:34,280 Speaker 1: So again, it can be an independent company, it could 234 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:35,920 Speaker 1: be part of a publisher, it could be part of 235 00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:39,200 Speaker 1: a distributor. Uh. Either are all different types of models 236 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:41,440 Speaker 1: out there, but these are the people actually building the code, 237 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:46,079 Speaker 1: making the art, writing the games. That's that's yeah. Then 238 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 1: you've got the distributors. Now, these are the people who 239 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 1: are responsible for delivering finished games from publishers and delivering 240 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 1: them to retail establishments and other outlets, so they sell gain. 241 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 1: The publishers sell their games to distributors, and then the 242 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: distributors take those games and sell them to the retail operators, 243 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,679 Speaker 1: who then sell them to the public. So U e. A. 244 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:10,800 Speaker 1: Was all three of these things right. And at the time, 245 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: Hawkins has said that he had done a lot of 246 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 1: market research and that a hundred and thirty five of 247 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: his competitors were doing the same thing um, which which 248 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: seems like an awfully large number, although at the time 249 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: we were just on the verge of a little bit 250 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:29,000 Speaker 1: of a market crash A little bit. A little bit 251 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:31,800 Speaker 1: is a little bit is understating it. Yeah, but but 252 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 1: but but during this boom, there were there was a 253 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 1: lot going on. Um and uh. And also the concept 254 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 1: reminds me a lot of Apple's Apple is a really 255 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: terrific example of vertical integration and um and from his 256 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 1: time at Apple, I feel like probably that's one of 257 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:50,320 Speaker 1: the places where he picked up this concept. Yeah, and 258 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 1: and those early titles that first came out. The first 259 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:59,120 Speaker 1: six titles from e A included games called Hard Hat Mac, 260 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 1: which was kind of like Mario Clone. Um It's or 261 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 1: Donkey Kong Clone. I really should say not Mario, but 262 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 1: a Donkey Kong clone. It was a platforming game a 263 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 1: side not even a side s calling it was, you know, 264 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: it's kind of like Donkey Kong. Then you had the 265 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: pinball construction set. There was a game called which you 266 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 1: Don't let you build pinball systems. Then you had arcn 267 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: which was kind of a weird fantasy strategy game that 268 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 1: was part chess, part action game. The idea being that 269 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: you have two sides. Uh. Two sides have different pieces 270 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 1: that are kind of like chess pieces. Uh. The different 271 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 1: pieces have different abilities, and you try to take over 272 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 1: your opponent's territory. Whenever one of your pieces comes in 273 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: contact with an opponent's piece, you then have a little 274 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:50,920 Speaker 1: arcade like battle between the two right, and depending upon 275 00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: what your pieces, you might be able to really whoop 276 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 1: up on your opponent because you're faster, or your shots 277 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: do a lot more damage. Uh and and so it 278 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: was all about strategy, like I want to make sure 279 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: this piece goes up against my that piece my opponent has, 280 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: so I can I can win the game. You can 281 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 1: kind of tell that I played the heck out of 282 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 1: this game by the way. I also owned the Pinball 283 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: Construction set and I owned hard hat Mac. Then there 284 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:20,240 Speaker 1: was a Mule, which was another strategy game. A lot 285 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: of people who enjoyed this really like things like a 286 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 1: war gaming where you would have the big table with 287 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,200 Speaker 1: all the hexagons and you move the pieces around. Mule 288 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 1: was kind of the computer version of that. Yeah. It 289 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: was really built for four players, which at the time 290 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:37,320 Speaker 1: was was kind of unheard of. Yeah, and I never 291 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 1: got into it because my brain does not work that way. 292 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 1: I can. I can do well enough in our con 293 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 1: because even if my strategy skills aren't that great, my 294 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: twitch skills were good enough to help me get by, 295 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:51,440 Speaker 1: but Mule not so much. Then there was Worms, which 296 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:53,640 Speaker 1: was kind of a high concept game where you would 297 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 1: train these what they called worms, these these these lines 298 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: of light to behave in a certain way in order 299 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 1: to progress in the game. And it's very difficult to explain. 300 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 1: And I've always seen people who say, if you want 301 00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:10,560 Speaker 1: to play the game, if you want to try it out, 302 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:12,440 Speaker 1: find a copy of it and give it a whirl. 303 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: I mean, you can find stuff like this on the internet. 304 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:18,080 Speaker 1: Uh you should do it without reading the instructions, just 305 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:20,160 Speaker 1: to see if you can figure out what the heck 306 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:23,160 Speaker 1: is going on. Um And I mean I read a 307 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: description of this, and I'm not sure I would be 308 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:27,600 Speaker 1: able to figure it out. But maybe it's more intuitive 309 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 1: than the descriptions would give you. Uh that, then the 310 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 1: descriptions seemed to indicate. And then the last of the 311 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 1: six titles that they launched with when they the company 312 00:16:38,040 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 1: was first offering up games was Murder on These zinder Kneuf, 313 00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:45,720 Speaker 1: which I know nothing about. I did not own that one. Yeah, 314 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:47,920 Speaker 1: I I should put in that I have played zero 315 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: of these games. Well, they you know, right around when 316 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:55,280 Speaker 1: you were one, so I'm not surprised, uh so. But 317 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 1: I I had most of these games because they came 318 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 1: out for the Apple too, and we had an Apple too. 319 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:05,440 Speaker 1: And actually what happened was a local school had purchased 320 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:07,639 Speaker 1: a bunch of games and then they gave them to 321 00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 1: me to test and tell them which ones were educational 322 00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:13,800 Speaker 1: and which ones were not really educational. So I did, 323 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: and then I returned all the games and they said, 324 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:18,600 Speaker 1: all right, you can keep all the ones that aren't educational. Yeah, 325 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 1: so as a kid, I was like ching and um 326 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: and so yeah, I ended up with a lot of 327 00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:27,680 Speaker 1: a lot of early games. That's also how I ended 328 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:30,480 Speaker 1: up learning about the Ultimate series because Ultimate two was 329 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:34,400 Speaker 1: one of those games. But uh uh, yeah, so there 330 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:38,800 Speaker 1: was That was the initial launching title, but there were 331 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:41,760 Speaker 1: some other ones that came out shortly thereafter. There was 332 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 1: the Last gladi Eator, which is a game I also owned. Um, 333 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:48,680 Speaker 1: so that one didn't come in the batch. I wanted 334 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 1: that one as a as a part of a lip 335 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:56,439 Speaker 1: sinking contest. Yeah, well, what pray tell? Were you lip sinking? 336 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:00,359 Speaker 1: Me and my dad did a lip sinking routine to 337 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 1: raise stevens the Pirates song, which is all about a 338 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,880 Speaker 1: pirate who wants to sing and dance and wear bright 339 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 1: shiny pants. Well that's that's a that's awesome. Yeah. We 340 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 1: won first place, which was a fifty dollar gift certificate 341 00:18:15,320 --> 00:18:18,719 Speaker 1: to a local comics store. And I don't read comic books, 342 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,920 Speaker 1: so I bought all their computer games instead, and one 343 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: of them was The Last Gladiator, And that was a 344 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 1: game where you play as a little gladiator and all 345 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: these different monsters come out and based upon whatever weapon 346 00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 1: you have at your disposal, you have uh you know, 347 00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:34,120 Speaker 1: decent chances against them. It gets more and more difficult 348 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:35,720 Speaker 1: as the game goes on. You know, it's kind of 349 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:41,919 Speaker 1: a typical Arcady experience. Um. They also had they launched 350 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:43,479 Speaker 1: a game that would end up being sort of the 351 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:46,680 Speaker 1: genesis of e A sports. Dr J and Larry Bird 352 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 1: Go one on one. I'm told this is from a 353 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:52,919 Speaker 1: sport called basketball and so one that's one with the 354 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:57,639 Speaker 1: orange round thing. Correct. Uh I want to say yes, yeah, 355 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 1: this this was one of the earliest Uh well, it 356 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:03,960 Speaker 1: was the earliest sports game from e A and Hawkins 357 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 1: really struck on a brilliant idea. He had decided to 358 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:10,840 Speaker 1: try and approach people who were famous in various sports 359 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: and to license their their names. Yeah right, Yeah, they 360 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: get a promotional tie in from famous famous athletes, I 361 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:22,680 Speaker 1: mean Dr J and Larry Bird or especially at the 362 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,720 Speaker 1: world famous and and which is interesting because the world 363 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 1: famous since they were playing an American sport that was 364 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:35,240 Speaker 1: almost exclusively played in America. UM, they ended up that 365 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: they ended up paying off big time. Ended up being 366 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: a strategy that e A still to this day employees. 367 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: They also established a new policy which was to in 368 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:48,480 Speaker 1: order to keep more of the profits that it would 369 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:51,239 Speaker 1: get from its uh from the sales, it was going 370 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 1: to reduce the discount it gave software distributors for its games, 371 00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 1: meaning that UH they were essentially selling their games at 372 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:02,879 Speaker 1: a higher cost. Two stores saying all right, well, you know, 373 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:05,520 Speaker 1: we're no longer going to sell this game to you 374 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: at ten dollars a copy. We're gonna sell it to 375 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: you for thirty dollars a copy. And UH, and you 376 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,240 Speaker 1: know it's your trump. Uh, it's your problem to figure 377 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:16,640 Speaker 1: out how to sell this. So if you're if you 378 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 1: usually sell your games at forty dollars, now you're paying 379 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: thirty bucks to sell it for forty, your profit margin 380 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: has shrunk. As a software district, a software retail store. UM, 381 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: you know, do you continue trying to do that? Do 382 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:31,400 Speaker 1: you hike your prices up and hope that people are 383 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: willing to pay it? Uh. E A's point was that, hey, 384 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:36,919 Speaker 1: we're starting to make a name for ourselves. People know 385 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:40,400 Speaker 1: our product and they like it. So if if they 386 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:42,520 Speaker 1: like it and this is the only way they can 387 00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:45,080 Speaker 1: get it, then you're gonna have to play ball with us. 388 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 1: And this is sort of the first example of e 389 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:51,280 Speaker 1: A really throwing its weight around. Yeah. This was also 390 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:53,600 Speaker 1: the year that it made its Conferdence debut at the 391 00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: Consumer Electronics Show, and so, yeah, they were really really 392 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:01,359 Speaker 1: getting out there in the public and starting to make ways. Yeah, 393 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: and keep in mind this is all in the first 394 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,320 Speaker 1: year that they're actually offering games. You know, they had 395 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,720 Speaker 1: been a company for a while, but of course, you know, 396 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:10,399 Speaker 1: as soon as they became a company, it didn't mean 397 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 1: that they had games to offer everybody them. Uh. They 398 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: also had established these ideas that you know, every single 399 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:20,040 Speaker 1: person who worked on the game was going to be credited. 400 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:21,920 Speaker 1: If you were the creator of a game, your name 401 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 1: was front and center on the game's uh screens. It 402 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 1: would let you know that this was a game developed 403 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:31,399 Speaker 1: by so and so. And that was a response to 404 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 1: a lot of the the activity they were seeing on 405 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:39,440 Speaker 1: the console market, particularly with Atari UH, and that there 406 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: were people who were essentially anonymous game developers who had 407 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 1: put in hours and hours and hours of time to 408 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:49,160 Speaker 1: create video games, but there was no sign of credit 409 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,720 Speaker 1: for them on on the actual video games. It was 410 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 1: just you know, is this is you know ex title 411 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: from X company? Sure. Yeah. The word that I've seen 412 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:01,879 Speaker 1: Tasta owned and a lot of articles about it is 413 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,680 Speaker 1: is surfs. That these people are being treated like surfs. 414 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 1: Andran and Hawkins was saying that you know, some of 415 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 1: these kids that he had met out at Apple were 416 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:14,880 Speaker 1: were and I quote legitimate divas and and that they 417 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:18,840 Speaker 1: deserved better than that. Yeah, and they Let's make it clear. 418 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: E A was not the only company doing this. There 419 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,440 Speaker 1: were other companies that split off from Atari, for example, 420 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:29,800 Speaker 1: that were founded by developers who wanted to have more uh, 421 00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: more control and more credit for the work that they 422 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 1: were doing. So e A is one example of that, 423 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: but it's by no means the only example of that now. 424 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:45,200 Speaker 1: UH In n four, Larry Probst joined the company as 425 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 1: the vice president of sales, and he will become really 426 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,920 Speaker 1: important to e A. He was already important at that point, 427 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 1: but becomes even more so over the years. UH and 428 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:57,200 Speaker 1: e A begins to distribute games from other companies, not 429 00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,719 Speaker 1: just their own companies. So now they're becoming a distributor 430 00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:04,000 Speaker 1: for other UH publishers, and one of the first ones 431 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 1: was Lucasfilm Games. There was also s s I and Interplay. 432 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:12,880 Speaker 1: They all used Electronic Arts as a distributor. So now 433 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,639 Speaker 1: they're bringing in money not only from the games that 434 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 1: they are developing in their their own house, but also 435 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 1: from other developers. Yeah. This was this was the year 436 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 1: that the that the video game market really crashed or 437 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:27,720 Speaker 1: was really feeling all of the effects of the crash. 438 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: Um And this was due to a lot of a 439 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:32,560 Speaker 1: lot of things, but um but but mostly you know, 440 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 1: Atari had been kind of sort of driving the market 441 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: into the ground for a minute. Yeah, Yeah, the market 442 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:43,400 Speaker 1: was completely flooded with games, and and not good games necessarily. Yeah, 443 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,040 Speaker 1: there were some there's some great titles that were among 444 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 1: the ones that came out that year, but there were 445 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 1: Atari had essentially lowered the bar so far for anyone 446 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 1: to submit games to the console that it was flooded 447 00:23:57,359 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: with games that were just rushed the bad art that 448 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 1: we're poorly constructed, that were impossible to play. Um and 449 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,960 Speaker 1: and this made people stop wanting to buy games because 450 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:13,280 Speaker 1: they were just not fun. Right. And also there were 451 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:15,479 Speaker 1: so many consoles on the market, you know, it had 452 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: kind of boomed, and and these things cost four to 453 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 1: eight hundred dollars in today's in today's concept of the dollar, 454 00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: and so you know, yeah, it was it was not 455 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 1: sustainable at the time with the quality of games that 456 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: were coming out. And there was such an early boom 457 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:31,680 Speaker 1: that it was just a rush, right, and then the 458 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:34,400 Speaker 1: rush was followed by a bubble bursting, which we see 459 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 1: all the time, not just in technology but in all 460 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,600 Speaker 1: kinds of markets. And uh and so you know, as 461 00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: of a game company, Electronic Arts had a tough year 462 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,919 Speaker 1: ahead of it because you know that was it was 463 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,080 Speaker 1: affected to even though a lot of its games were 464 00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:54,680 Speaker 1: being made for computers. I was saying PCs, but really 465 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 1: at this time we weren't really calling the PCs yet, 466 00:24:57,119 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: but yeah, they were being made for computers, it still 467 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:02,479 Speaker 1: was effect did because uh, you know, a lot of 468 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,000 Speaker 1: consumers got jaded on the concept of games in the 469 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:07,679 Speaker 1: first place. That was, however, the year that they published 470 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,359 Speaker 1: a game called The Seven Cities of Gold, which I 471 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 1: also owned. Uh yeah, I was. I was known for 472 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: being a terrible, terrible colonists colonialist. I guess I should 473 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: say I would go in and reek havoc on the 474 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:28,200 Speaker 1: various Mayan and Aztec cultures and plunder them. Yeah, I've 475 00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: heard that it was a very educational game, edutainment, edutainment. All. Yeah, 476 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 1: I want to say that I bought that one and 477 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 1: that one was not part of the package, because if 478 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:38,000 Speaker 1: it were part of the package, and then obviously I 479 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:41,440 Speaker 1: fipped about it being educational. Um. And then e A 480 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 1: began to switch its strategy at this point when the 481 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 1: video game market had crashed, and instead of marketing games 482 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,639 Speaker 1: as being from specific creators the way they had been 483 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:54,080 Speaker 1: where they had made these developers rock stars, Uh, they 484 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:58,679 Speaker 1: were instead going to look at creating actual brands and genres. 485 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,160 Speaker 1: So instead of saying from the mind of so and so, 486 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 1: they said, why don't we find a game that really 487 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: resonates with people and then just continue to create games 488 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 1: within that brand or or even just within that type 489 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: of gameplay. Uh. This would actually end up being something 490 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 1: that people would criticize the A four years later to 491 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 1: the point where they well, they've they've taken it to 492 00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,120 Speaker 1: something of an extreme, but we'll get into that. Yeah, 493 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: Like yes, and they also decided to start making games 494 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 1: for lots of different platforms. So besides the Apple two, 495 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,880 Speaker 1: they started looking at the Macintosh, which was brand new 496 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:40,320 Speaker 1: in uh, the Amiga, the Commodore sixty four IBM compatibles, 497 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 1: which were just starting to take off right around then. Uh, 498 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,280 Speaker 1: the Atari eight hundred, and the Atari st So that's 499 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 1: kind of where we are post video game crash, and 500 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 1: there's a lot more to cover. But before we get 501 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 1: into the second half of part one of the e 502 00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: A story, let's take a quick break and thank our sponsor. 503 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:02,919 Speaker 1: All Right, we're back, and let's go back into what's 504 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:06,879 Speaker 1: going on with the e A. So comes round and 505 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:09,920 Speaker 1: h e A starts releasing a bunch of games, including 506 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:15,119 Speaker 1: some that were really famous in the fantasy gaming genre. Uh, 507 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 1: the big one being The Bard's Tale, which I also owned. 508 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:23,879 Speaker 1: I did, I did not? I think, Well, it was 509 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 1: very Dungeons and Dragons ish. You would control a party 510 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 1: of players. You would you would generate characters and then 511 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 1: put them together in a party, and uh, this was 512 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: kind of standard for a lot of other video games 513 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 1: at the time. Wizardry was very similar in this respect, 514 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 1: where you would have certain number of fighters, a certain 515 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:45,679 Speaker 1: number of magic users, maybe a thief or even a 516 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: bard who could affect the way the party performed by 517 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 1: playing different songs. That was one of the big innovative 518 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,680 Speaker 1: gameplay elements of The Bard's Tale. So you know, play 519 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:57,879 Speaker 1: a little song and then everyone gets gets all amped 520 00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:00,159 Speaker 1: up and they fight better, or you play another their 521 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:02,240 Speaker 1: song and everyone's starting to feel kind of chill and 522 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: they start healing and faster. That's terrific, useful Bards, that's crazy. Yeah, yeah, 523 00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: as opposed to and uh, there's this guy guys singing again. 524 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: We can't get them to shut up. We've broken four 525 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 1: loots and he doesn't get the hint. Uh. Well. The 526 00:28:16,119 --> 00:28:18,439 Speaker 1: other the alternative title for the Bard's Tale was Tales 527 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 1: of the Unknown Volume one, when it was a fantasy 528 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: RBG and you there was something really creative about the 529 00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 1: Bard's Tale series, which was that you could import players 530 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: from other games all right on certain platforms app Apple 531 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:35,680 Speaker 1: two is one of them. Yeah, um yeah, you can. 532 00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 1: You could pull in things from from Ultima, which was 533 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 1: from Origin Systems that was not part of Electronic Arts 534 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: at that time, or from the aforementioned Wizardry, which was 535 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,560 Speaker 1: from Surtech, also not part of e A. So these 536 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:52,240 Speaker 1: are games made by other companies and allowed interoperability in 537 00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:54,320 Speaker 1: the sense that you could pull like if you had 538 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:56,800 Speaker 1: played this other game and you had these characters that 539 00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: you had developed some sort of emotional attachment to and 540 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:02,280 Speaker 1: you had really invested in this game, you could then 541 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:05,640 Speaker 1: pull those characters into The Bard's Tale and use them 542 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 1: again in a totally different game, which was kind of 543 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 1: an awesome idea. I will say that from my own 544 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 1: personal experience from playing Wizardry and then pulling characters in 545 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,960 Speaker 1: from Wizardry into The Bard's Tale, they ended up being 546 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,760 Speaker 1: a tad overpowered, like to the point where the whole 547 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,880 Speaker 1: first section of the game was pointless to play because 548 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:31,239 Speaker 1: you just would you know, yeah, essentially like if I 549 00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:34,640 Speaker 1: were to encounter a moth and you were to give 550 00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 1: me a sledgehammer. Uh, you know. That's kind of the 551 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,280 Speaker 1: way it felt. But it was still a really cool 552 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 1: game mechanic. Now in six and in they would release 553 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:47,960 Speaker 1: sequels to the Bard's Tales. You get bards Tale two 554 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,440 Speaker 1: and Bard's Tale three. I remember Bard's Tale three in particular, 555 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,480 Speaker 1: that was the one I played the most. And in 556 00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 1: two thousand four we saw the release of The Bard's Tale. 557 00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 1: But this is a game that was not released by 558 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 1: e A nor was it connected directly to the Bard's 559 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: Tale games, but it was created by someone who had 560 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: worked on the first two. That's right, Yeah, that one 561 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,640 Speaker 1: of the people who helped develop the maps in the 562 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 1: first two bards Tale games was the developer behind the 563 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,000 Speaker 1: Bard's Tale the two thousand four games. So I remember 564 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:21,960 Speaker 1: being excited when that game came out because I thought, oh, 565 00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 1: they're relaunching this, this franchise that I loved as a kid. Yeah, 566 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 1: it was more just the name. I was still a 567 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:32,520 Speaker 1: fantasy RPG and you played a character who was very 568 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: snarky thief. Bard character voiced by Carrie El was. Oh, man, 569 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:40,600 Speaker 1: well that sounds that sounds worth playing just for just 570 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 1: for that. It was. It was entertaining. You had first 571 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: five minutes, you had a narrator, and you had Carrie 572 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:49,800 Speaker 1: Ell was this character, and they would bicker as you played. 573 00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,080 Speaker 1: So that was kind of fun. But it again didn't 574 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 1: relate back to the Bard's Tale games of my youth. 575 00:30:56,360 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 1: So I was tricked. They're Tricksy was also an e 576 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 1: A released their first productivity application, which was called Deluxe Paint. 577 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 1: It's a program for the Commodore Amiga, which was known 578 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: as a machine that was particularly powerful when it came 579 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:17,120 Speaker 1: to graphics and sound. When you compared it against the 580 00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:20,920 Speaker 1: other computers, the Amiga blew them away. As far as 581 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 1: that well, I mean I had a friend who had Amiga, 582 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 1: and I remember just being completely flabbricased that a computer 583 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:28,800 Speaker 1: could do what his Amiga could do as far as 584 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,640 Speaker 1: graphics and sound. We're concerned because when you compared it 585 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 1: to my Apple two or my two eighties six, it 586 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,240 Speaker 1: just it outperformed him hands down in that. So it 587 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: was a great game platform. But this was a painting 588 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 1: platform or a painting application, I should say, And it 589 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 1: was based off of an in house art development tool 590 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:54,360 Speaker 1: that that e A had been using that they called Prism. 591 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:57,200 Speaker 1: So they essentially took this in house tool and then 592 00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:00,320 Speaker 1: packaged it and changed it a bit for consumers. So hey, kids, 593 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 1: kids would be into this too. Yeah, like, you know, 594 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:04,560 Speaker 1: we're using this to develop games, but I think people 595 00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 1: would really be interested in using this for themselves. So 596 00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:09,720 Speaker 1: I'm sure they tweaked it so that would make sense 597 00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:14,000 Speaker 1: to a consumer. But hopefully yeah, or not just release 598 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,120 Speaker 1: it the way it was, Because you know, things, things 599 00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:19,680 Speaker 1: make you have different kinds of tools for people who 600 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:21,959 Speaker 1: are professionals in an industry and people who are just 601 00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,720 Speaker 1: interested in it. Yeah, but yeah, that was an interesting 602 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:29,320 Speaker 1: departure from just creating games. Um, I don't have anything, 603 00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: and I should say I didn't say this at the 604 00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 1: top of the show, but we're not going to cover 605 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 1: every release e A ever made, because first of all, 606 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: that would take us about five hours, I think, just 607 00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 1: to list every game, And second of all, that would 608 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: that would be a really boring podcast. That would be 609 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,480 Speaker 1: that would be like like, yeah, even for our threshold, 610 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:50,200 Speaker 1: that would be boring. So we don't want to I'm 611 00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:53,480 Speaker 1: just kidding. I'm just kidding. But no, I I agree entirely. 612 00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:56,080 Speaker 1: And so we're gonna mention some of the big ones, obviously, 613 00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: especially the ones that ended up being disruptive to e 614 00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 1: A or to the industry. Re but um, but in 615 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: this case, we're we're just kind of skimming through some 616 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 1: of the big ones and not hitting every single one. 617 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:12,040 Speaker 1: Son was when e A set up a European division 618 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,960 Speaker 1: to market PC games. Now, at this point it was 619 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: just to kind of be a marketing firm, not a 620 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: development house, but uh, they saw a lot of opportunity 621 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 1: to expand into Europe. Uh. The problem with Europe was 622 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:31,760 Speaker 1: that it was being very it was very slow to 623 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:35,640 Speaker 1: adopt consoles. It was this is true later on when 624 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:38,920 Speaker 1: we started getting into the advanced consoles, to the ones 625 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: like are the current generation, Yeah, PlayStation forward Europe. It's 626 00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 1: not that Europe was not interested in it's just it 627 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,720 Speaker 1: was slower to adopt it than other markets. So e 628 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,480 Speaker 1: A was trying to really invest in what they saw 629 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 1: as being a huge area for opportunity. So so that's 630 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: that was the beginning of that. And in a released 631 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: waste Land, which was a post apocalyptic role playing game 632 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,800 Speaker 1: that's pretty you know, innovative. There were some other post 633 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:13,560 Speaker 1: apocalyptic RPG type stuff that was out for computers. Some 634 00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,840 Speaker 1: of them were just text based games, not even graphics games. 635 00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,160 Speaker 1: But but yeah, wait, Wasteland is one that that I 636 00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,080 Speaker 1: still we are still not in the era of me 637 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,480 Speaker 1: playing video games that are not um, maybe super Mario Brothers. 638 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:30,120 Speaker 1: But but but but I but I A lot of 639 00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:32,080 Speaker 1: my friends speak with speak of it with a lot 640 00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:35,080 Speaker 1: of nostalgia. See. The reason why I know so many 641 00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:38,239 Speaker 1: of these e A titles is because I followed the 642 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:41,160 Speaker 1: same kind of pathway that e A did, and that 643 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:46,880 Speaker 1: I abandoned consoles shortly after the Atari era and moved 644 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:50,319 Speaker 1: on to PCs because I saw it as being a 645 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,400 Speaker 1: platform that would allow for more sophisticated types of games. 646 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:56,080 Speaker 1: And that's something that Hawkins himself had said as well. 647 00:34:56,239 --> 00:34:58,160 Speaker 1: It's one of the reasons why e A in its 648 00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:02,200 Speaker 1: early days focused on comput uters not on consoles. There 649 00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,120 Speaker 1: were other reasons as well, like, if you want to 650 00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:06,880 Speaker 1: build a console or a game for a console, it 651 00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:09,400 Speaker 1: gets pretty expensive from a production standpoint, because you have 652 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,040 Speaker 1: to manufacture the cartridges, you have to build the ROMs 653 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 1: directly onto chips, you have to build the cases, all 654 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:18,080 Speaker 1: this kind of stuff. Um, and so there were higher 655 00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:23,239 Speaker 1: costs associated with producing a video game cartridge than a 656 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:28,439 Speaker 1: computer disk. So, uh, they had their own reasons for 657 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,200 Speaker 1: really focusing on computers versus consoles. Also, yeah, the console 658 00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 1: market didn't really recover until until the n S came 659 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: out Tonyeah, yeah, right around the round eighty eight, that's 660 00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:42,800 Speaker 1: when e A started to reevaluate this position of focusing 661 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:46,759 Speaker 1: on PC only instead of or computers only, since PC 662 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:50,040 Speaker 1: we tend to think of as anything that runs DOS 663 00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:54,120 Speaker 1: or Windows. But anyway, at that that time, that's when 664 00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:55,640 Speaker 1: e A was starting to really look at the n 665 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,719 Speaker 1: e S and say, well, maybe there's a reason to 666 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:01,880 Speaker 1: get into this. Uh. Now, entering into any kind of 667 00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:05,399 Speaker 1: agreement with Nintendo was something that Hawkins was a bit 668 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:09,919 Speaker 1: reluctant to do because Nintendo had very strict licensing agreements 669 00:36:10,080 --> 00:36:13,160 Speaker 1: and standards that you had to meet because Nintendo did 670 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:16,480 Speaker 1: not want another video game crash. They absolutely they're being 671 00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:19,279 Speaker 1: very careful about what they published exactly. They did not 672 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: want the market flooded with bad games. Not to say 673 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,719 Speaker 1: that every game that came out for the NES was amazing, 674 00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:28,480 Speaker 1: but they were trying to keep as much of a 675 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:31,359 Speaker 1: control on that as possible. And you know, that's something 676 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:35,120 Speaker 1: that publishers are or or game developers might view as 677 00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: being a barrier. You know, they might go through the 678 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 1: trouble of developing a game only to hit a roadblock 679 00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 1: with the licensing problem, and then you've got all this 680 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,040 Speaker 1: time and energy and money that was spent on something 681 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:49,560 Speaker 1: that you can't actually sell. So there was a big 682 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,200 Speaker 1: issue there. But they did decide to start developing games 683 00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 1: for the NES, and the first one was Skate or Die, 684 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,560 Speaker 1: which my friends who had an e S is they 685 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 1: loved that game. I did not have in ne S, 686 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,359 Speaker 1: so I was largely ignorant of it. I was still 687 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: playing the computer games at that time. UH and UH. 688 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:10,719 Speaker 1: Instead of just publishing the game directly and distributing it, 689 00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:13,879 Speaker 1: they actually licensed it out to Konami. UH and then 690 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 1: Hawkins said that the console market was still just unproven, 691 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:21,080 Speaker 1: that that the crash from before was so devastating that 692 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:23,719 Speaker 1: you could not be certain it wouldn't happen again, and 693 00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,279 Speaker 1: also again said that consoles were kind of underpowered when 694 00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:30,919 Speaker 1: you compared them to computers. UM. Now they would later 695 00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:35,520 Speaker 1: really revisit this, especially once the Sega Genesis came out, 696 00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:39,640 Speaker 1: UH and and their their tune changes dramatically, but at 697 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:42,040 Speaker 1: that time they were really saying, computers are really that's 698 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,880 Speaker 1: that's our main focus, consoles or something we might do 699 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:49,480 Speaker 1: as a side project. So they released a game that 700 00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:53,560 Speaker 1: became one of the most important franchises in the company's history. 701 00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:57,320 Speaker 1: And I am, of course talking about John Madden Football 702 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 1: UH Hawkins has a lot of There are a lot 703 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,240 Speaker 1: of interviews with Hawkins where he talks about his fond 704 00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: memories of developing that game, about bringing John Madden into 705 00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:09,680 Speaker 1: the experience, and saying that you know, we would show 706 00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:11,399 Speaker 1: him how we were doing things, and then he would 707 00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 1: spend the next twenty minutes yelling at us about how 708 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:16,000 Speaker 1: we got it wrong. And but it was always in 709 00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:18,680 Speaker 1: an effort to make sure the game was as good 710 00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:22,319 Speaker 1: as it possibly could be. So while Madden's approach was 711 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:27,319 Speaker 1: what some people might call aggressive and meant that they 712 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: were working on making a really good football game, or 713 00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:32,400 Speaker 1: at least that was there. That was the goal, and 714 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 1: it did become one of the most successful franchises in 715 00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:39,640 Speaker 1: his history. Yeah, as their twenty four games out and 716 00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:44,279 Speaker 1: it's sold million units. Now we'll talk more about some 717 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,759 Speaker 1: controversy with Madden Football, but that really plays in a 718 00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:51,560 Speaker 1: few years down the line. Uh in Night nine, they 719 00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:54,279 Speaker 1: began to develop games for the Sega Genesis console, and 720 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:56,840 Speaker 1: this is when they started to really rethink that approach 721 00:38:56,840 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 1: and say, all right, maybe consoles are actually important enough 722 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:03,280 Speaker 1: for us to consider it being a main line of business, 723 00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:05,640 Speaker 1: not just some little side business where we can make 724 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 1: a little extra money. There might be some serious cash 725 00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:11,759 Speaker 1: in this business. Hawkins has said that that this deal 726 00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:13,279 Speaker 1: that he made with with Sega was kind of a 727 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:17,080 Speaker 1: crowning moment and has has said that he had been 728 00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:20,319 Speaker 1: um kind of stealthily reverse engineering the sixty pit Pecho 729 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:23,320 Speaker 1: Genesis for a couple of years, and that when Sega 730 00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:27,400 Speaker 1: found out about this, um, you know, it's it's it 731 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:29,439 Speaker 1: could have gone one of two ways. Either Sega could 732 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,400 Speaker 1: have sued him a whole lot, or they could have 733 00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:36,880 Speaker 1: created this this kind of awesome contract for for creating 734 00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,239 Speaker 1: games and and it went. Hawkins has said that, yes, 735 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,640 Speaker 1: that this is one of his big wins in life. 736 00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,880 Speaker 1: He essentially said that that he negotiated an incredibly favorable 737 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:49,880 Speaker 1: deal for electronic arts. This was something he could not 738 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:52,560 Speaker 1: do in Nintendo because Nintendo held so much of the 739 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:55,920 Speaker 1: power in that relationship. And uh, you know, when it 740 00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 1: comes to big business guys, you know whoever holds the 741 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 1: power that that becomes an importan and part of any deal. 742 00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 1: And it was certainly something that Hawkins was very concerned about. 743 00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:07,640 Speaker 1: Even if you think back to the days of him saying, 744 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,799 Speaker 1: you know, I want this company to be about video 745 00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,880 Speaker 1: games and art, you can tell there's still a cutthroat 746 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:17,920 Speaker 1: businessman lurking underneath that artist exterior there and um, and 747 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:21,239 Speaker 1: so yeah, this was a great example of that. And uh, 748 00:40:21,280 --> 00:40:24,600 Speaker 1: in the Fall of nine, that's when Electronic Arts held 749 00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:27,480 Speaker 1: its initial public offering, the I p OH, that's when 750 00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 1: it became a publicly traded company. And uh, Hawkins decided, 751 00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:35,360 Speaker 1: in order to really justify going public and to to 752 00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:39,800 Speaker 1: get investors excited and invested in the company, and to 753 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,239 Speaker 1: really increase the value of the company, to initiate a 754 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,759 Speaker 1: policy where every single month he expected there to be 755 00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 1: three new games entering into the development process, not not completed, 756 00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,799 Speaker 1: but so you know that that would mean that as 757 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 1: time goes on, you have more and more overlapping games 758 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:00,920 Speaker 1: until some come out for publication. Others are entering the 759 00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:05,400 Speaker 1: development process. It Uh, it's set a pretty tough standard. 760 00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,000 Speaker 1: But and also they were handling games from other developers 761 00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:12,800 Speaker 1: at this point too, so that this didn't even include 762 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,160 Speaker 1: those games, right right. The company at the time it's 763 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,680 Speaker 1: worth about sixty million. Yeah, and uh, and of course 764 00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:20,960 Speaker 1: the the value of the company now is in the billions. 765 00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:23,799 Speaker 1: But will again address that when we get further up 766 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:27,719 Speaker 1: into the timeline. And in ninety one, that is a 767 00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:31,279 Speaker 1: momentous year for both Hawkins and for e A. That's 768 00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:35,560 Speaker 1: when Trip Hawkins decided to leave e A. He had 769 00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,359 Speaker 1: felt that he had accomplished all he wanted with the 770 00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:40,319 Speaker 1: company and that it was time for him to move 771 00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 1: on to something new and challenging. And that new and 772 00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:47,719 Speaker 1: challenging thing ended up being three D O, which was 773 00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:49,759 Speaker 1: you know, the whole idea was he was going to 774 00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:52,320 Speaker 1: create a video game console that would lead the market. 775 00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:56,640 Speaker 1: It would be the most powerful, uh console, and it 776 00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:01,160 Speaker 1: actually it was predictive of the consoles that we see today. 777 00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:03,800 Speaker 1: It was meant to be sort of an entertainment center, 778 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:08,080 Speaker 1: not just a video game console. But it was really expensive, 779 00:42:08,719 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: uh At. Also, the games that first came out for 780 00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:13,880 Speaker 1: the three D O didn't get a lot of critical 781 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:17,280 Speaker 1: acclaim and a lot of them relied heavily on full 782 00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,600 Speaker 1: motion video. That was when full motion video was just 783 00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 1: becoming possible in the computer and console worlds, so people 784 00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:25,880 Speaker 1: were using it a lot, to the point where it 785 00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:28,239 Speaker 1: became a gimmick. You know, you thought that, oh, this 786 00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:31,000 Speaker 1: scheme is good because as full motion video in it then, 787 00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:33,720 Speaker 1: and you know, full motion video, like any other tool, 788 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:35,480 Speaker 1: is just a tool. It's just a tool. Yeah, if 789 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,719 Speaker 1: you're if you're using three D for example, these days, 790 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,560 Speaker 1: it's just just a gimmick. It's just a gimmick. Yeah, exactly, 791 00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:43,160 Speaker 1: so and that was the that was the ultimate problem 792 00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:46,520 Speaker 1: with three d O which spoiler alert, did not take off. 793 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:51,960 Speaker 1: It actually it. Yeah. Meanwhile, back at e A, Larry 794 00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:55,319 Speaker 1: Probst steps in. He becomes the CEO of e A, 795 00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:59,000 Speaker 1: UH and uh. Nintendo that same year and nine one 796 00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,400 Speaker 1: launched the Super Nintendo Entertainment System, the S and E 797 00:43:02,680 --> 00:43:07,839 Speaker 1: s or ness if you insist on pronouncing it that way, 798 00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:10,719 Speaker 1: And then e A began to develop games both for 799 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:14,080 Speaker 1: the Genesis and for Nintendo and in an effort to 800 00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:16,759 Speaker 1: really kind of hit as many fans as possible. They 801 00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:21,200 Speaker 1: also said they prefer there to be lots of different 802 00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:23,799 Speaker 1: consoles competing in the market because that means there's not 803 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:27,319 Speaker 1: one dominant player that can use the leverage against them. 804 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:29,480 Speaker 1: You know, when there are a lot of different players 805 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:33,279 Speaker 1: out there, then e A has the advantage, which has 806 00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:36,880 Speaker 1: been an important part of the company's it's really clever 807 00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:39,840 Speaker 1: business business standpoint. Yeah, it's another one of those things 808 00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:43,080 Speaker 1: that some people get a little I think people want 809 00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: games to be fun and they don't want to think 810 00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:48,239 Speaker 1: about the business end of it because the business end 811 00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:52,160 Speaker 1: is not necessarily fun. It can be pretty pretty pretty 812 00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:56,560 Speaker 1: grand m Yeah, but anyway, that that was that was 813 00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:00,640 Speaker 1: starting to take off right in ninety one, and um 814 00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:04,239 Speaker 1: that was when e A made its first real acquisition, 815 00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:09,560 Speaker 1: which was Distinctive Software. So they bought an outside development studio. 816 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,040 Speaker 1: The idea was to kind of they saw talent out 817 00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,360 Speaker 1: there that they wanted to get, and instead of trying 818 00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:17,520 Speaker 1: to hire the talent away, they thought, well, we're a 819 00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:21,279 Speaker 1: larger company. Now, we're publicly traded, we're highly valued. Let's 820 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:25,120 Speaker 1: use this opportunity to purchase this other company and make 821 00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:29,480 Speaker 1: it part of what we do. And Distinctive Software was 822 00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:33,440 Speaker 1: the company that had created the test Drive series for Accolade, 823 00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,719 Speaker 1: which of course was a competing company to Electronic Arts. 824 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:42,080 Speaker 1: And so this same division ended up creating a new 825 00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,400 Speaker 1: line of games for Electronic Arts called Need for Speed. 826 00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:49,440 Speaker 1: You may have played those games. Uh. And then eventually 827 00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:53,600 Speaker 1: Distinctive Studios was renamed e A Canada and it's it's 828 00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:56,120 Speaker 1: because it was located at in a British Columbia that's correct, 829 00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,719 Speaker 1: over in Vancouver. And uh yeah, that was also the 830 00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:04,560 Speaker 1: year that the e A established a sports as a division. Yeah, 831 00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:08,879 Speaker 1: so now we finally have an actual formal division within 832 00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:12,920 Speaker 1: Electronic Arts that is overseeing the development of sports titles, 833 00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:15,600 Speaker 1: and a lot of big sports titles came out of 834 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:20,560 Speaker 1: that division, Madden Football, FIFA games that were related to hockey, 835 00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,600 Speaker 1: to basketball, um, and of course that will become more 836 00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:27,440 Speaker 1: important as well, But for now, I think one is 837 00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:29,160 Speaker 1: a good time for us to leave off. That was 838 00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,239 Speaker 1: that big year, you know, Hawkins leaving and Probes taking over, 839 00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:35,680 Speaker 1: and we can pick up again in n in part 840 00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:38,680 Speaker 1: two of our story of e A. So, guys, if 841 00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:41,160 Speaker 1: you have a suggestion for future episodes of tech Stuff, 842 00:45:41,160 --> 00:45:43,920 Speaker 1: whether it's a company we should cover, or a particular 843 00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:46,480 Speaker 1: type of technology, or just a concept that you think 844 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:49,120 Speaker 1: we need to really explore, let us know. You can 845 00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:53,000 Speaker 1: send us email our addresses tech Stuff at Discovery dot 846 00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:55,400 Speaker 1: com or drop us a line on Facebook or Twitter. 847 00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:57,960 Speaker 1: Are handled there as tech Stuff H. S. W and 848 00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,279 Speaker 1: Lauren and I will talk to you again about as 849 00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:09,480 Speaker 1: it turns out really soon for more on this and 850 00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:12,120 Speaker 1: thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff works dot 851 00:46:12,160 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 1: Com