WEBVTT - Episode 2: Me and My Scammer 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:01.240 Hello, This is Evan. 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:09.239 My name is Matthew with Healthcare Solicia. How are eating today? 0:00:10.039 --> 0:00:12.680 Hey, Matthew, I'm doing well, Thanks for asking. How about you? 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:15.920 Fantastic a mass of fine? 0:00:15.920 --> 0:00:16.640 Thanks for asking. 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.239 This call is about hospital indemnity plan that is designed 0:00:20.280 --> 0:00:23.160 to cover a hundred percent of your hospital and medical 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.439 expenses and also cover you as co pasee and provide 0:00:26.480 --> 0:00:28.320 you additional money. 0:00:28.360 --> 0:00:31.640 Is scam. You may have encountered one like it. If 0:00:31.680 --> 0:00:33.600 you haven't, someone you know probably has. 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:36.040 You get a call out of the blue pedaling a 0:00:36.120 --> 0:00:40.080 home or car warranty or cable renewal discounts, or in 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:44.600 this case, a hospital indemnity plan. Either way, it's someone 0:00:44.640 --> 0:00:47.080 you don't know selling you something that's at a minimum 0:00:47.120 --> 0:00:50.319 a ripoff and more likely just doesn't exist at all. 0:00:50.680 --> 0:00:53.600 So for the qualification purpose, I now what's your age? 0:00:53.600 --> 0:00:58.200 How old are you? That sounds really interesting, Matthew. I'm 0:00:58.200 --> 0:00:59.240 forty five years old. 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:04.280 Forty part And do you make your own financial decisions? 0:01:05.959 --> 0:01:06.199 Yes? 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:06.520 I do. 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:09.640 I get these kinds of calls a few times a week. 0:01:10.000 --> 0:01:13.600 They're pretty irritating, but my voice agent the phone line 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:15.720 I set up using a clone in my voice powered 0:01:15.720 --> 0:01:16.919 by an AI chat pot. 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:19.080 It gets them constantly. 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:21.000 In the past two years. Do you have any major 0:01:21.120 --> 0:01:26.000 or minor health conditions like heart attack, congestive part failures, cancer, diabetes, 0:01:26.600 --> 0:01:29.640 lung disease, chronic li or chronic kidney disease, or any. 0:01:29.480 --> 0:01:37.479 Other Nope, none of those, all right, and. 0:01:37.160 --> 0:01:39.000 We are also providing you cash benefits. 0:01:39.080 --> 0:01:41.280 The difference between the cloned me and the real me 0:01:41.840 --> 0:01:45.200 is that my agent doesn't mind talking to scammers. In fact, 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:48.720 not to anthropomorphize it, but sometimes I think it enjoys 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:49.720 getting these calls. 0:01:50.480 --> 0:01:54.600 Do you have any any bank accounts, I mean, such 0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:58.440 as a checking and saving accounts to receive cash benefits? 0:02:00.440 --> 0:02:02.160 Yes, I do have a checking in savings account. 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:03.640 That's a big qualification question. 0:02:04.360 --> 0:02:05.960 Yeah you have, all right. 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:06.960 And what's your ZIP called? 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:15.920 It's nine zero two one zero nine zero two one zero, right, yep, 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:16.640 that's correct. 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:17.399 All right. 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:20.120 So you're residing in Beverly Hills, California. 0:02:21.320 --> 0:02:24.480 Yes, that's right, Beverly Hills, California. 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:28.919 All right, So, without great suspicious time, I'm gonna connect 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:30.919 to you with my products Spaci Live. 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:36.640 What you're hearing is how these scams often work. You 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:39.359 get an initial call, they gather some information from you, 0:02:39.760 --> 0:02:42.080 make sure you're a good mark, get you interested and 0:02:42.120 --> 0:02:44.400 on the hook. Then they pass you off to a 0:02:44.400 --> 0:02:48.400 product specialist or a manager or whoever to seal the deal. 0:02:48.880 --> 0:02:51.640 They get you to supply your bank account information, or 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:54.320 maybe they send you off to buy gift cards. Come back, 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:57.720 read off the number to them, and then poof your 0:02:57.760 --> 0:02:58.560 money is gone. 0:02:59.040 --> 0:02:59.919 Thank you for a holding. 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:02.200 I'm on the line. This is Isaac high doing. 0:03:03.480 --> 0:03:05.280 Hey, Isaac, I'm doing great. How about you? 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:09.639 I am also fine? 0:03:09.720 --> 0:03:10.280 Thank you. 0:03:12.080 --> 0:03:16.639 We are appointed with an independent insurance brokerage. They're disappointed 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:21.760 with forty different insurance companies licensing all over fifty two states, 0:03:21.760 --> 0:03:24.760 helping about ninety thousand families. 0:03:24.760 --> 0:03:27.640 This product agent, though, he seems to suspect that I 0:03:27.680 --> 0:03:28.560 might be messing with him. 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:29.880 So can I ask you? 0:03:29.919 --> 0:03:30.800 How old are you? 0:03:32.880 --> 0:03:36.480 I'm forty five years old? Oh? 0:03:36.560 --> 0:03:36.920 Really? 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:42.160 Who told me you are forty five? Well? My birth 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:42.880 certificate did? 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:46.200 Oh? 0:03:46.240 --> 0:03:51.160 What should you do? Birth? It's December fifteenth, nineteen seventy seven. 0:03:54.240 --> 0:03:57.560 Oh really, man, you are born in nineteen seventy seven. 0:03:57.640 --> 0:03:58.600 You don't have a good. 0:03:58.480 --> 0:04:03.520 Meth brother, Oh, I must have gotten my math mixed 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:07.520 up there, My bad okay, you got me there. In 0:04:07.560 --> 0:04:09.600 a way, it's a relief to me that the large 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:12.680 language model AI version of me is even worse at 0:04:12.720 --> 0:04:16.400 math than I am. Of course I am messing with him, 0:04:16.760 --> 0:04:18.640 but not in the way he suspects. 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:19.560 By the way. 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:24.000 Brother, oh, brother, brother, brother, listen to me, brother, Yes, brother, 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:27.479 what's up? 0:04:27.520 --> 0:04:28.520 How are you doing today? 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:29.080 My friend? 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:32.159 I'm doing great. Thanks for. 0:04:33.640 --> 0:04:34.720 I don't care how. 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:35.760 Long you're going to talk with me. 0:04:36.720 --> 0:04:39.360 I am getting paid to talk with people, all right. 0:04:40.800 --> 0:04:42.000 Nice sounds like a good gig. 0:04:45.279 --> 0:04:48.520 Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, my friend. So, my friend, 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:50.120 what do you do for living? 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:54.720 I'm a writer and journalist. Keeps me busy and curious. 0:04:57.000 --> 0:04:58.000 You are a journalist? 0:05:00.200 --> 0:05:00.760 Yeah, that's right. 0:05:00.800 --> 0:05:02.320 They're putting videos on TikTok. 0:05:04.279 --> 0:05:04.680 Not really. 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:07.640 I mostly write articles and books. TikTok isn't really my thing. 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:13.080 TikTok is not a good thing. 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:13.359 You know. 0:05:14.000 --> 0:05:15.600 They are just waste of time. 0:05:17.320 --> 0:05:19.160 I hear you. It's definitely not for everyone. 0:05:20.800 --> 0:05:23.159 When I first created my voice agent in episode one, 0:05:23.760 --> 0:05:25.720 I refined it by making a bunch of calls to 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:29.520 real customer service lines like United Airlines and Discover Card. 0:05:30.160 --> 0:05:33.400 Eventually I worried I was wasting the representative's time. But 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:35.760 then I thought of another type of person I could 0:05:35.839 --> 0:05:38.640 use them on the type of person who calls us 0:05:38.880 --> 0:05:42.479 wasting our time or worse, trying to trick us into 0:05:42.480 --> 0:05:45.680 parting with our money. People like Matthew and Isaac from 0:05:45.680 --> 0:05:46.960 the hospital indemnity plan. 0:05:47.480 --> 0:05:50.920 For this guy, Paul, Hey, this is Paul with a 0:05:51.000 --> 0:05:54.080 tax relief center. I'm following back up on your request 0:05:54.200 --> 0:05:58.720 regarding our fresh Start tax production program. I was able 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:01.080 to get you an approval to get your outstanding patch 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:03.160 downs reduced so that I think that you're really going 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:06.919 to like give me call back at seventy one six. 0:06:06.960 --> 0:06:11.599 I didn't make any request. I have no back taxes, Paul. Yes, 0:06:11.640 --> 0:06:13.960 I'm talking about the people who clog your voicemail with 0:06:14.000 --> 0:06:17.640 offers you don't want, and scare your grandma and try 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:19.279 to get you to put your life savings into a 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:23.800 fake cryptocurrency. I've covered scams large and small for years, 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:25.680 and I can tell you that we are living in 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:30.640 a golden age of scamming, phone scams, texting scams, romance scams, 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:35.800 money transfer scams, individual bank accounts, drained goods that never arrived, 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:40.680 business fortunes transferred away with a single click. American consumers 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:43.880 alone lose more than eight billion dollars to scams every year, 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:46.520 a number that grew thirty percent from twenty twenty one 0:06:46.560 --> 0:06:51.200 to twenty twenty two. In other words, scamming is big business. 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:54.920 Calls like these generally aren't some lone wolf con artists. 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:57.600 They're done on an industrial scale. 0:06:57.640 --> 0:06:58.279 There are quite. 0:06:58.200 --> 0:07:01.400 Literally warehouses in many corner of the globe with hundreds, 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:05.800 even thousands of people on headsets, products specialists on calls 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:08.919 all day, every day trying to reel in marks on 0:07:08.960 --> 0:07:11.680 the other side of the world. A lot of the 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:13.920 spam and scam calls we get these days don't even 0:07:13.960 --> 0:07:15.760 start with people on the other end of the line. 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:18.800 They open up with recordings which help narrow the pool 0:07:18.840 --> 0:07:20.520 of victims down to the more likely ones. 0:07:21.160 --> 0:07:24.120 When you get this message, it's time to act. This 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:26.520 is the final attempt to reach you from Fiscal Freedom 0:07:26.560 --> 0:07:30.360 Initiative regarding a thirty six thousand dollars financial hardship loan. 0:07:31.120 --> 0:07:33.679 This loan can be used, and that's why AI driven 0:07:33.720 --> 0:07:37.440 voice agents are the technology that spammers and scammers. 0:07:36.960 --> 0:07:37.800 Have been dreaming of. 0:07:38.640 --> 0:07:40.720 The tools I've been using to clone my voice and 0:07:40.760 --> 0:07:45.360 create semi autonomous voice agents. They're completely public, anyone can 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:47.160 use them, so why wouldn't scammers? 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:49.200 Well they are. 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:53.600 Scammers are already using voice cloning to run voice impersonation scams. 0:07:54.200 --> 0:07:56.760 They take a snippet of someone's voice, clone it, and 0:07:56.800 --> 0:07:58.680 then use it to call that person's family and say 0:07:58.680 --> 0:08:01.040 they're in trouble and need money. You may have heard 0:08:01.080 --> 0:08:05.800 this called a deep fake, or the grandparent scam, grandparent. 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:09.360 Scams, and the so called grandparent scam a grandparent scam 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:12.239 ring who allegedly stole more than two million dollars. 0:08:12.400 --> 0:08:15.080 The bad guys can now clone a voice using only 0:08:15.120 --> 0:08:17.480 a couple of seconds worth of actual. 0:08:17.200 --> 0:08:19.920 Sound, maybe just an innocent video you post to TikTok 0:08:20.000 --> 0:08:20.680 or Instagram. 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:23.240 They can also grab your voice from videos you have 0:08:23.400 --> 0:08:26.800 up on social media. Keep that in mind. To be honest, 0:08:26.880 --> 0:08:27.600 I'm not convinced. 0:08:27.720 --> 0:08:30.640 All these cases on the local news where people suspect 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:34.240 their grandkids' voices have been cloned or really clones, some 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:37.200 are probably just scammers randomly impersonating kids and hoping they 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:37.800 hit the mark. 0:08:38.440 --> 0:08:39.400 My wife's grandma. 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:41.520 Gets these and her strategy is to say something like, 0:08:42.120 --> 0:08:45.200 is this my grandson Fred when they say yes, it's me, 0:08:45.480 --> 0:08:48.280 she says aha, I don't have a grandson Fred and 0:08:48.360 --> 0:08:52.000 hangs up. But there's no question that this scam is 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:54.880 real and scary and easy to fall for in a panic. 0:08:55.320 --> 0:08:57.920 The FCC has warned that quote bad actors can now 0:08:58.000 --> 0:09:01.960 use artificial intelligence technology commonly known as AI and a 0:09:02.000 --> 0:09:05.840 short audio or video clip to clone a loved one's voice. 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:08.560 There are also documented cases of scammers using the same 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:12.680 voice cloning technique to call businesses, impersonate their CEOs and 0:09:12.720 --> 0:09:16.120 try to arrange a money transfer. But even setting aside 0:09:16.120 --> 0:09:20.280 the sophisticated cloning stuff for a moment, telemarketers and scammers 0:09:20.320 --> 0:09:22.480 are starting to use voice agents just to do the 0:09:22.520 --> 0:09:25.959 normal pedaling and scamming they do every day, the tax 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:29.120 relief and the extended car warranties and the life insurance. 0:09:29.600 --> 0:09:31.880 Why wouldn't they when it enables them to call a 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:34.679 whole bunch of people at the same time. And that's 0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:38.320 the thing about these scams the time, even if they 0:09:38.320 --> 0:09:40.600 don't make off with your money, they take your time. 0:09:41.120 --> 0:09:44.600 Time wasted talking to them, time wasted blocking them, time 0:09:44.679 --> 0:09:47.640 spent wondering if this unknown caller is going to be them? 0:09:48.040 --> 0:09:50.320 You may not even answer your phone anymore, ceding your 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:57.320 voicemail to these disembodied characters. So what does all this mean. 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:00.080 It means that whether you believe AI is going to 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:03.680 transform humanity or it's an overhyped fad, I think I 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:06.319 can tell you with one certainty, is that it's going 0:10:06.360 --> 0:10:09.280 to make some things that are already annoying much more annoying. 0:10:11.360 --> 0:10:14.080 On this week's show Game, I turned my doppelganger on 0:10:14.120 --> 0:10:16.959 the people who are always at the forefront of technological adoption, 0:10:17.559 --> 0:10:20.679 the tricksters and the crooks, and we find out how 0:10:20.720 --> 0:10:23.520 they react when they face my voice agent in a 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:24.680 battle of wits. 0:10:29.760 --> 0:10:43.040 And now soul Teller travels too. 0:10:47.240 --> 0:10:51.960 Episode two, Me and my scammer. As I mentioned in 0:10:52.000 --> 0:10:55.200 episode one, my own voice is already all over the place. 0:10:55.559 --> 0:10:58.400 There are hours and hours of it available online for 0:10:58.440 --> 0:11:01.480 anyone to grab and clone and use, which is part 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:04.320 of the reason I decided to clone myself. If I 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:07.079 and my family were already vulnerable to scammers, I figured 0:11:07.440 --> 0:11:10.480 why not beat them to the punch. There were some hurdles, 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:14.040 though I'd been letting my Evan clone call customer service 0:11:14.080 --> 0:11:16.800 from my own phone number. I like the realism of it, 0:11:17.320 --> 0:11:19.840 but when it came to scammers, that started to feel naive. 0:11:20.640 --> 0:11:24.920 I didn't want angry scammers having my actual phone number. Luckily, 0:11:25.240 --> 0:11:27.160 it was easy to get a clean number from VAPPI, 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:29.920 the service I was already using to make and control 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:33.240 my AI voice agents. But this presented hurdle number two. 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:36.719 How to find the scammers, or really, how to make 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.720 sure they found me. With a brand new number, I 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:41.920 wasn't going to show up in the databases or data 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:45.760 leaks that scammers rely on to find their marks. Turns out, 0:11:46.040 --> 0:11:49.160 it just took a little digital grunt work. I started 0:11:49.160 --> 0:11:53.000 giving out the number everywhere online. I applied for insurance quotes, 0:11:53.200 --> 0:11:57.040 registered for free raffles, signed on for digital coupons that 0:11:57.080 --> 0:12:00.199 probably didn't exist. I had my voice agent call eight 0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:03.400 hundred numbers I found online for common scams just to 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.480 get my number in their databases. Honestly, it was scary 0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:08.520 how quickly it worked. 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:12.240 When you get this message, it's time to act. This 0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:14.719 is the final attempt to reach you from liability. 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:18.000 This is Jennet from Legal Finance Group has been attempting 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:21.079 to contact you regarding your Hello. 0:12:22.040 --> 0:12:25.240 Hello, hey there, what can I do for you? Today. 0:12:26.640 --> 0:12:29.280 After a week I started getting calls for services and 0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:34.120 discounts I'd never registered for, and inbound callers hawking health 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:37.480 benefits and debt relief and obvious scams. 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:41.920 Like yeah, this is James Henry from both claiming departments. 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:42.959 How are you doing today? 0:12:43.960 --> 0:12:49.040 Yay, James, I'm doing pardon sorry about that. I was 0:12:49.040 --> 0:12:51.600 just saying I'm doing well. Thanks for asking. How about you? 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:54.360 How can I assist you today? 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:57.200 Yeah? I'm going to find Thank you, Brackbin. Okay, this 0:12:57.320 --> 0:12:59.600 call is in regard to a prize that is here 0:12:59.679 --> 0:13:02.600 for you from the publisher's clearing stouts Did they call 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:05.040 you and provide you with the details that you have 0:13:05.120 --> 0:13:07.199 won a Sweet. 0:13:06.920 --> 0:13:11.120 Sticks prize from the publisher's clearing house? My voice agent 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:12.600 wasn't totally buying it. 0:13:13.160 --> 0:13:13.480 I see. 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:15.959 Thanks for reaching out, James. No, I haven't received any 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:17.960 such call or details. It seems like there might be 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:18.720 some confusion. 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:22.840 Okay, this is and is this your first time receiving 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:24.320 a call from the company? 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:30.960 Actually, my apology, no problem at all, no worries, James. 0:13:31.000 --> 0:13:32.800 I was just saying that this is indeed the first 0:13:32.840 --> 0:13:35.199 time I've heard from the company. 0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:39.800 Okay, what did they send you any notifications letter in 0:13:39.840 --> 0:13:41.840 your mail to inform you that you are a second 0:13:41.840 --> 0:13:42.400 phase winner. 0:13:43.600 --> 0:13:46.480 No, I haven't received any notifications or letters about winning 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:50.280 a prize. It looks like there might be some confusion here. 0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:56.840 Okay, because okay, it is said in the computer here 0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:59.760 that you are a second place winner, all white, and 0:13:59.840 --> 0:14:02.400 you will be received a total of five point five 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.880 million dollars, all right, and also a brand new two 0:14:05.920 --> 0:14:09.240 thousand and twenty four Mercedes Friends that is registered under 0:14:09.280 --> 0:14:12.839 your name. Okay. And I'm also seeing a bonos price 0:14:12.920 --> 0:14:16.040 for twenty five thousand dollars every month for the rest 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:16.840 of your life. 0:14:17.160 --> 0:14:21.000 That's five point five million dollars twenty five thousand dollars 0:14:21.080 --> 0:14:24.160 every month for the rest of my life, and the Mercedes. 0:14:24.600 --> 0:14:24.960 All right. 0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:27.120 So what I would like to know is would you 0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:29.400 like to move forward and get into informations and how 0:14:29.400 --> 0:14:31.200 you could claim your prize. 0:14:35.720 --> 0:14:38.480 Wow, that sounds amazing, James, But I think there might 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:40.920 be a mix up here. I haven't entered any contest 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:43.760 or received any notifications about winning such a prize. It's 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:45.680 probably best to clear this up and find the right 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:51.120 person who actually won. I like imagining the two of 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:54.440 them getting together to track down the real winner, but 0:14:54.520 --> 0:14:58.280 virtual Evan Ratliffe was unpredictable. The same outfit called again, 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:01.560 and this time he was eager to claim the prize. Wow, 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:04.120 that sounds like an amazing prize package. Can you provide 0:15:04.120 --> 0:15:07.160 me with more details on how to claim it? 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:10.800 Okay? What I could do, sir? I could actually tell 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.120 you to get your sofay clean sheet of paper and 0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:15.440 a pen. So like, what gave you a number that 0:15:15.480 --> 0:15:18.480 you can call so you can actually get everything started 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:19.200 on for today? 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:22.600 Great, I have my pen and paper ready. Please go 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:24.240 ahead and provide me with the number to call to 0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:28.200 get things started. I have my pen and paper ready. 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:31.720 This always cracked me up when this completely virtual entity 0:15:32.000 --> 0:15:34.520 very confidently lied and said it was doing something in 0:15:34.560 --> 0:15:38.720 the physical world. Generally speaking, the moral underpinnings of my 0:15:38.800 --> 0:15:42.080 voice agent seemed pretty flimsy. Give it enough time and 0:15:42.120 --> 0:15:46.120 it would say, sure, I'll collect this prize. But then again, 0:15:46.400 --> 0:15:49.040 were we that different? There were days when I hope 0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:51.360 someone would call out of the blue with some pot 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:53.280 of unearned money and make all my. 0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:54.120 Troubles go away. 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:57.040 The voice agent I'd set up at Vappy to receive 0:15:57.080 --> 0:15:59.760 these calls and return them was designed to be in 0:15:59.760 --> 0:16:03.320 three husiast. I prompted it to be chatty, interested in 0:16:03.360 --> 0:16:06.120 whoever was calling and whatever they had to offer, and 0:16:06.160 --> 0:16:08.680 then I just said it loose. It took calls while 0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:10.960 I was busy making other calls, while I was off 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:16.680 having fun, while I was sleeping. For me, opening up 0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:19.760 that each day and checking the inbound recordings, it reminded 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:21.880 me of when I was a kid setting out crab 0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:24.640 traps at the beach with my dad. A few days later, 0:16:24.720 --> 0:16:27.400 there'd be this glorious moment of anticipation when we pulled 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:29.440 them up and found out what had crawled in. 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:31.760 Hello, this is Evan. 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:36.760 This is an important call. This is Jenny from Legal 0:16:36.800 --> 0:16:40.440 Finance Group has been attempting to contact you regarding your 0:16:40.480 --> 0:16:44.200 potential federal financial arrears. This message is to inform you. 0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:46.560 Of course, I could have used any AI voice for 0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:49.880 these calls. It didn't really have to be me, but 0:16:49.960 --> 0:16:51.680 I liked the idea of a version of me just 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:54.080 sitting by the phone waiting for it to ring. 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:56.680 The AI me was. 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:00.360 Always awake, always eager, always prepared to listen to choice. 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:00.840 Press one. 0:17:00.920 --> 0:17:03.600 Now, oh wow, that sounds serious. 0:17:03.600 --> 0:17:06.200 I haven't been contacted by anyone from the Legal Finance Group, 0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:09.440 and I'm not aware of any federal financial arrears. Can 0:17:09.480 --> 0:17:11.000 you provide more information about this? 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:24.720 There's actually a whole. 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:26.840 World of vigilantes who do this kind of stuff all 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:30.760 the time, called scam baiters. They take calls or emails 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:33.800 from scammers or at least people they suspect their scammers, 0:17:34.240 --> 0:17:36.600 and they try to tie them up waste their time. 0:17:37.520 --> 0:17:39.440 Scam Baden goes back decades. 0:17:39.760 --> 0:17:42.560 Me Anthony Desano, a computer repair. 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:45.960 Shop owner of Providence and an email scammers worst nightmare. 0:17:46.000 --> 0:17:48.879 Anthony is the founder of the scambater dot com and 0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:50.160 there are thousands like them. 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:53.800 They play along and make bizarre requests like please take 0:17:53.800 --> 0:17:55.400 a picture with a fish on your head. 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:57.840 I think scam baters are actually doing us a pretty 0:17:57.840 --> 0:17:58.359 good service. 0:17:58.480 --> 0:17:59.760 Now, don't try this at home, kids. 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:04.200 Scam artists are criminals after all, but as with everything else, 0:18:04.359 --> 0:18:08.200 a combination of new tech, social media and online creator 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:11.919 culture have kind of supercharged it. Now there are scambaters 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:15.200 on YouTube with teams of people who pull incredibly elaborate 0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:18.560 pranks with live streams and millions of views, like this 0:18:18.640 --> 0:18:20.520 guy who goes by kit Boga. 0:18:20.600 --> 0:18:24.560 There are scammers everywhere, from YouTube comments to phone calls. 0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:29.880 I even have scammers pretending to be me at this point. Yeah, 0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:31.520 how many videos? 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:32.960 How many videos have you made? 0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:33.160 Now? 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:33.560 Kit? 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:35.280 On my YouTube videos? 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:36.760 I'm many. I don't even know. 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:38.720 Why do you wear the glasses though? 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:39.400 The glasses? 0:18:39.480 --> 0:18:41.679 I kind of couldn't believe how into scam bating these 0:18:41.680 --> 0:18:44.600 people had become. It was basically a job when they 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:47.000 seem to view is something in between a comedy routine 0:18:47.400 --> 0:18:49.879 and a public service. I have my doubts about the 0:18:49.920 --> 0:18:52.800 last part. I suspected that wasting a few scammers time 0:18:52.960 --> 0:18:56.680 had functionally zero impact on the amount of scams actually perpetrated. 0:18:57.240 --> 0:18:59.399 But either way, my aims were different than the kit 0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:02.560 Bogas of the world world, or at least more expansive. 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:06.520 I did enjoy hearing my agent tie spammers and scammers 0:19:06.520 --> 0:19:08.720 and knots, but I was more interested in how they 0:19:08.760 --> 0:19:11.720 would react to the voice agent, to the AI neus 0:19:11.800 --> 0:19:14.600 of it all. Would they notice it wasn't real? Would 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:15.560 they try to scam it anyway? 0:19:16.720 --> 0:19:16.920 Free? 0:19:17.359 --> 0:19:19.359 And I believe you're being a spot for its enoo 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:22.560 looking at If you think it's apportable free, it's good 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:24.840 for you. You would at least think about it as 0:19:24.880 --> 0:19:27.199 an option for prices. 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:31.000 That sounds really useful. So, like, what's the cost for 0:19:31.080 --> 0:19:31.760 something like this? 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:34.720 That's a wonderful question. 0:19:35.400 --> 0:19:38.119 This is one of those scammers offering my voice agent 0:19:38.280 --> 0:19:40.680 a great deal on a home warranty plan. 0:19:40.800 --> 0:19:43.480 But we have planned starting from the low price, which 0:19:43.480 --> 0:19:46.200 may cost a less than a cup of coffee per day, 0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:48.560 and those pass are going to be a lot of 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:51.879 cheaper than normal repair costs. So let me ask you, like, 0:19:52.000 --> 0:19:54.880 your house is less than five thousand square feet? 0:19:58.359 --> 0:20:00.720 Yeah, it's definitely less than five zero row square feet. 0:20:00.800 --> 0:20:03.040 So what's the next well step to get started? 0:20:05.200 --> 0:20:06.600 What's his post and last name? 0:20:08.400 --> 0:20:10.440 Sure, it's Evan Ratliffe. 0:20:11.600 --> 0:20:13.320 It's al. 0:20:14.520 --> 0:20:15.960 Yep, you got it? How do you? 0:20:16.200 --> 0:20:18.520 How do you spell that your last name? 0:20:18.760 --> 0:20:21.600 Yep, it's r A T l I F F. 0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:24.000