1 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff Mom Never told You From House upboards 2 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Kristen 3 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: and I'm Caroline and Caroline. A few years ago we 4 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 1: did a podcast on women in the military, and this 5 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: was as the tides were starting to turn for women 6 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: being allowed to fight in combat roles, and we wanted 7 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 1: to do another episode, an update on women in the military, 8 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:42,519 Speaker 1: a because it's been a while, but also because on 9 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:51,120 Speaker 1: January two thousand thirteen, something happened. Yeah, just something, just something. Yeah, 10 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 1: I know that the ban on women in combat was 11 00:00:53,720 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: officially lifted, and this, of course is despite the fact 12 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: that there were already women in very danger situations in 13 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 1: combat situations. But officially the ban was lifted and the 14 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: services have until January to implement the changes. Yeah, right now. 15 00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 1: Just to get an idea of what role women play 16 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 1: in the military. They make up fourteen percent of the 17 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 1: one point four million active military personnel, and this combat 18 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:27,240 Speaker 1: exclusion ban being lifted opens up a potential two hundred 19 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 1: and thirty eight thousand jobs, mostly in infantry, armor, and 20 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 1: special forces. And it's really with the infantry, those the 21 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 1: ones who are on the front lines. Although we we'll 22 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: get into this more. The question is with modern warfare, 23 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 1: are there really front lines? Um, but those are the 24 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:47,120 Speaker 1: used to be dudes exclusively, dudes out there face to 25 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:50,520 Speaker 1: face with the enemy on hunt and kill missions and 26 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 1: things like that. So what was the reaction to this 27 00:01:57,080 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: combat band being lifted? Obviously on the want him, plenty 28 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 1: of people were psyched about this. Not everybody was, though 29 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:09,680 Speaker 1: a lot a lot of people raised some issues that were, um, 30 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:13,360 Speaker 1: maybe maybe not the best best issues. Uh. Some people 31 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 1: called it an untested social experiment and that more women 32 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:20,839 Speaker 1: would mean more sexual assault and misconduct in the military. 33 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: Penny Nance, who's the president of Concerned Women for America 34 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:27,359 Speaker 1: Legislative Action Committee, is one of those people. She said, 35 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: it's placing social experimentation and political correctness over combat readiness. Yeah, 36 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:37,840 Speaker 1: the price. There are three primary arguments that against women 37 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 1: in combat, and these have been banded about for years 38 00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:44,799 Speaker 1: and pretty much any negative reaction will fall into one 39 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 1: of these buckets, which is a that women can't meet 40 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:50,959 Speaker 1: the physical requirements, and a lot of that deals with 41 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 1: discrepancies between upper body strength in particular between men and women. 42 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:59,799 Speaker 1: There's also the argument that women simply don't belong in combat. 43 00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 1: On moral grounds were very squeamish about the idea of 44 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: putting women in the line of fire. Uh. And we 45 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: talked about some of that, those those kinds of moral 46 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 1: debates in our episode on heroism a while ago, and 47 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 1: how it's more of a male construct um. And then 48 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 1: there's also the idea that women will disrupt unit cohesion 49 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: and battle readiness because men and women together. Oh, that's 50 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:26,600 Speaker 1: gonna cause a lot of wacky rom com scenario. It's 51 00:03:26,639 --> 00:03:29,200 Speaker 1: just like mash all over again. Well, and it's also 52 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 1: I mean, it gets into these these arguments that people saying, well, 53 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 1: men won't be able to control themselves, which it is, like, 54 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: that's hey, come on that that's a major disc on 55 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: these male soldiers whose lives are structured around discipline. Yeah, 56 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 1: I mean yeah, it totally takes away any indication that 57 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 1: they have any sort of self control of any kind. Yeah. 58 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:57,520 Speaker 1: And essentially, due to changes in our culture, changes in technology, 59 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 1: and changes in the nature of modern warfare, all three 60 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,600 Speaker 1: of those main arguments have been dismantled to the point 61 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: that the military says, you know what, it's time. Yeah. 62 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:13,360 Speaker 1: Megan mackenzie in a great article for Foreign Affairs at 63 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 1: the end of last year took a look at what 64 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: some of the societal, cultural, military changes are that are 65 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:22,600 Speaker 1: making this ban this band that was just lifted irrelevant. 66 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:25,600 Speaker 1: One of them is what Kristen mentioned. It's this increasing 67 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: counterinsurgency warfare that we're dealing with in the Middle East 68 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:32,080 Speaker 1: has virtually erased the the concept of combat front lines. 69 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:36,839 Speaker 1: There is there's danger everywhere that they're going um. Female 70 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:41,160 Speaker 1: soldiers contributions to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were undeniable. 71 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:44,760 Speaker 1: There's also been increasing support from within military leadership, not 72 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:47,600 Speaker 1: just not just outside the military, and there have been 73 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 1: changes in public attitudes also about women's capabilities and roles 74 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:55,480 Speaker 1: in war. However, it's interesting that argument about women disrupting 75 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,680 Speaker 1: the boys club at the front lines is something that 76 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:01,240 Speaker 1: my friend's father said to me because my parents had 77 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 1: a Christmas party and invited everybody in the neighborhood and 78 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:06,880 Speaker 1: he he's an old school military dude, and I asked him, 79 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 1: you know what his opinion on the changing tide was, 80 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 1: and he was like, oh, no, no, no, sweetheart, no no. Women. 81 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:20,159 Speaker 1: Women will will interrupt the way that men interact. It's 82 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 1: it's really a brotherhood and and women just won't be 83 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:26,359 Speaker 1: able to, uh, to take part in that. Well. And 84 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: it's not just male soldiers who have said things like that. 85 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: Speaking in this was reported in the New York Times, 86 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: but I'm not sure if she gave this direct quote 87 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:40,520 Speaker 1: in to the New York Times or another outlet, But nevertheless, 88 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:44,279 Speaker 1: Brigadier General Lori E. Reynolds said, uh. In terms of 89 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:47,119 Speaker 1: whether or not women should be involved in combat mission, 90 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:49,919 Speaker 1: she said, I don't think they should close with and 91 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 1: destroy the enemy, describing the hunt and kill mission of infantryman, 92 00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 1: when you go out and see what the infantry does, 93 00:05:56,560 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 1: the way they live, the way they train, it's good 94 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 1: that it's all male. But you could also say that 95 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: since she is so high up, possibly she just had 96 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: to make that official stance of yes, the military's right, 97 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: this is how it is. But it does kind of 98 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 1: stink that that sentiment is coming from a high ranking woman, right, 99 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 1: I mean, and and she and she's certainly not the 100 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:21,360 Speaker 1: only only female soldier who was echoed those things of 101 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:24,000 Speaker 1: falling back on the old gender stereotype of saying, you 102 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: know what, there's a line and we at some point 103 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 1: just let the dudes do it. It's this, you know 104 00:06:30,440 --> 00:06:33,359 Speaker 1: that that's where that's where they belong and where we 105 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: don't necessarily belong. But before we get into more of 106 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 1: those contemporary issues of how how things have changed, let's 107 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: step back briefly to see where we've been in terms 108 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 1: of the military's inclusion of women. Yeah, the nineteen forties 109 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 1: was a big time for women's involvement in the military. 110 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: It was in this decade that Congress created the Women's 111 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: Army Auxiliary Corps, which was converted to full status in 112 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 1: three so they dropped the auxiliary part. Uh. These were 113 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: the first women in the army aside from nurses, and 114 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 1: by the end of the decade, WAX as they were called, 115 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: are enrolled in the whack Regular Army and the Organized 116 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: Reserve Corps. And in towards the end of the decade, 117 00:07:14,760 --> 00:07:18,960 Speaker 1: the Women's Armed Services Integration Act created a permanent core 118 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 1: of women in all the military departments. This was considered 119 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: a step forward at the time, but it actually limited 120 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,240 Speaker 1: to two percent of the total service members the number 121 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: of women who could participate and formally excluded them from 122 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: combat duties. Yeah. So so there we have, like with 123 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 1: it's like a celebration, but also only to a point. 124 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: Um and as these female soldiers gained more and more recognition. 125 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: I mean, the wax being included as part of the 126 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 1: regular Army was a recognition of their major contributions in 127 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: World War Two. But in the postwar periods, um, you know, 128 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: it's it's a slow but sure sort of lime towards equality. 129 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: For instance, we have in nineteen seventy one women are 130 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 1: authorized to commandment, except of course, in combat units. And 131 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: in ninety men and women began training in the same 132 00:08:12,720 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 1: basic training units at some forts like Fort McClellan um. 133 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: And then in nineteen eighty, just to give you an 134 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: idea of the numbers of women in the military, women 135 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: made up nine point one per cent of the army. 136 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 1: And moving back for a second. In one the policy 137 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:32,760 Speaker 1: of excluding women from combat was reinforced from the Supreme 138 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:35,960 Speaker 1: Court rule that the all male draft didn't constitute gender 139 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: based discriminations since it was intended to increase combat troops. 140 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:41,199 Speaker 1: And they're like, and hey, women aren't supposed to be 141 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: in combat, so it's not discrimination. I'm just imagining the 142 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 1: Supreme Court justice is being like, hey, that's what that's 143 00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 1: what their brief stuff cookies, ladies, And then they shrug 144 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: and high five and go out for drinks, but still 145 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: with their robes off. Yeah. I digress. But things start 146 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: to progress a little bit, you see. You see the 147 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: dial shifting in when the military adopts something called the 148 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 1: Risk Rule, which allowed women to be kept out of 149 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:12,600 Speaker 1: even non combat positions if they were likely to be 150 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:15,320 Speaker 1: at risk of being fired on or captured. So you 151 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: see that protectionist rule being implemented. But then a few 152 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:25,319 Speaker 1: years later, nine the Secretary of Defense Less Aspen, basically 153 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,439 Speaker 1: dismantles the Risk Rule. He announces a new policy directing 154 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:33,199 Speaker 1: the services to train and assign women on combat aircraft 155 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:37,199 Speaker 1: and most combat ships. Though yet again that combat exclusion 156 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,839 Speaker 1: ban is kept in place. No direct ground combat is 157 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: to be had for women, right, and that direct combat 158 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:47,559 Speaker 1: rule excluded women from seven point three percent of army positions. 159 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:51,079 Speaker 1: It also had the effect, as you know other combat 160 00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:55,240 Speaker 1: bands had, of limiting career paths and promotion opportunities for 161 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 1: women and contributing to gendered stereotypes about the war being 162 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:04,679 Speaker 1: the business of men. But even within those tighter parameters, 163 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 1: women certainly were able to climb through the ranks of 164 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,480 Speaker 1: the army. Um In two thousand eight, General and E. 165 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,880 Speaker 1: Dunwoodie became the first female four star general in military 166 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: history and also became the first female to lead in 167 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 1: major army command. And it's it's it is kind of 168 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 1: one of those milestones where you say, yeay, oh my god, 169 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: it took that long. Why did it take that long? 170 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: And it's because of combat exclusion bands, because you're not 171 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,319 Speaker 1: allowed to get in those positions that you need to 172 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: get to to get those kinds of promotions. Right. Well, 173 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:39,480 Speaker 1: going back just a little bit, you know, we talked 174 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 1: about how while women have already sort of been involved 175 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 1: in this kind of combat activity already back in two 176 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: thousand three, quote unquote, Lioness Teams were deployed to assist 177 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 1: combat units in Iraq searching for women are searching i'm sorry, 178 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 1: women in those countries for weapons and explosives. And then 179 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: in two thousand nine we have the development of several 180 00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 1: other female only units, included those female Engagement teams that 181 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:04,720 Speaker 1: are written about often. During their first year of operation, 182 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 1: these teams conducted more than seventies short term search and 183 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: engagement missions in Afghanistan alone, but the military specified that 184 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: these units could not contribute to hunt and kill foot 185 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,359 Speaker 1: patrols and had to stay at combat posts only temporarily, 186 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:22,959 Speaker 1: So okay, I see what you're doing. However, in practice, 187 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: what they did is that female soldiers were required to 188 00:11:26,400 --> 00:11:29,680 Speaker 1: leave their combat basis for one night every six weeks 189 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 1: and come back immediately the next day. Yeah. There was 190 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 1: a profile on these Marine female engagement teams in the 191 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 1: New York Times in two thousand and ten, and it 192 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:42,719 Speaker 1: talked about how they would go in and do all 193 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:44,920 Speaker 1: this work. And then, since this was one of the 194 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:46,680 Speaker 1: first to go in there, it might have actually been 195 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 1: the first that this New York Times reporter was following. 196 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: The Marine Legal Review team went back and said, Okay, no, 197 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: you gotta get out of here, because we you know, 198 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:59,080 Speaker 1: they had the toe the line of this combat exclusion 199 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: ban and it at this time all of this conversation 200 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 1: was starting in the military about the fact that front 201 00:12:04,720 --> 00:12:08,160 Speaker 1: lines were blurred. They were having to, you know, make 202 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: all of these kind of loopholes for women to get 203 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:16,360 Speaker 1: in there, but not too close. And uh, it was 204 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,560 Speaker 1: around the round two thousands when we started hearing more 205 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 1: direct lines out of the military hinting at the fact 206 00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:26,559 Speaker 1: that that combat exclusion ban would at some point be lifted. 207 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: And Zoe Baddell, who was one of the pointiffs in 208 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 1: an A c l U lawsuit involving the Combat Exclusion 209 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:37,800 Speaker 1: Band and will talk about, was one of the members 210 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: of that first female engagement team in the Marines. I 211 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: didn't know that. Um yeah, four service when women. Zoey 212 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 1: Bedell was one of four service women who filed this 213 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:52,959 Speaker 1: lawsuit in federal court in San Francisco on November and 214 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 1: a challenge to the band. They challenged it as a 215 00:12:55,880 --> 00:12:59,120 Speaker 1: violation of the Fourteenth Amendment guarantee of equal protection under 216 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: the law, and the lawsuit says that the Constitution forbids 217 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: the government from imposing a blanket ban on women's participation. 218 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 1: And so those women we should name them Major Mary Jennings, Tigar, 219 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 1: Jennifer Hunt, Zoe Badell who we mentioned, and Colleen Farrell 220 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:18,400 Speaker 1: who is a podcast She is a podcast listening what's up? 221 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: Uh yeah. For instance, Zoe Bedell, who I mentioned, was 222 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: a Princeton graduate. She's a former Marine captain who was 223 00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: part of that one of those female engagement teams going 224 00:13:30,040 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: into some of the most dangerous parts of Afghanistan. But 225 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: she ended up leaving active duty after she decided that 226 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:40,200 Speaker 1: her only future as a woman in the Marines was 227 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: a lifetime of logistics or support units. Essentially, she you know, 228 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,719 Speaker 1: it's like taking a job and realizing that you're never 229 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: going to get beyond a mid level manager position. You 230 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 1: got to move on, right, And they point out that 231 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:57,600 Speaker 1: of the women who have served since September eleven report 232 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 1: having served in a combat center area where they received 233 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: combat or imminent danger pay. They also argue that the 234 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: band was putting women in danger because in many cases, 235 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:10,680 Speaker 1: women fight alongside men, and these female engagement teams that 236 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 1: we talked about, they endure the same conditions, but because 237 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:18,320 Speaker 1: they're not deemed combat eligible, they don't receive proper training. Yeah, so, 238 00:14:18,400 --> 00:14:21,640 Speaker 1: in a way, the Combat Exclusion Band is putting female 239 00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 1: soldiers at greater risk when they're out there. And as 240 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: Time magazine reports, at least eight hundred and sixty female 241 00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 1: troops have been wounded in a hundred and forty four 242 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 1: have been killed in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. So, 243 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 1: even though they might not officially be fighting in combat roles, clearly, 244 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:42,800 Speaker 1: because of the changing nature of modern warfare, it's it's 245 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: not protecting them from it's not guaranteeing them and they're 246 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: not going to be hurt or killed. Right, And because 247 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:51,680 Speaker 1: of all this wink wink, nudge, nudge, you're in combat 248 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 1: but you're not really, let's not talk about it. I mean, yes, 249 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:56,440 Speaker 1: that does, as we talked about, you know, prevent these 250 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: women from rising through the ranks, but it also prevents 251 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:03,360 Speaker 1: them just from being recognized from their heroism and their accomplishments. Yeah. 252 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:06,000 Speaker 1: Major Mary Jennings Hagar, who was one of the a 253 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 1: c l U plantiffs as well, received a Purple Heart 254 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 1: and the Distinguished Flying Cross for quote outstanding heroism and 255 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:17,720 Speaker 1: selfless devotion to duty after she rescued her helicopter crew 256 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 1: after their helicopter was shot down in Afghanistan. But at 257 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 1: the same time, even though she did all of that, 258 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:30,400 Speaker 1: she didn't receive recognition for fighting in a combat role. 259 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 1: And so it's it's the same thing of like, no, 260 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 1: we're we're doing We're doing all of this, and we 261 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 1: can do all of this. And I think I think 262 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,960 Speaker 1: we also need to mention that Representative Tammy Duckworth, who 263 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: is a Democrat in Illinois UM has been one of 264 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 1: the leading politicians who has been advocating for the Combat 265 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 1: Exclusion Band to be lifted and she lost both legs 266 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: flying a helicopter in Iraq in two thousand four, and 267 00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 1: so she can tell you firsthand that, yeah, we might 268 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 1: not be tech chnically fighting combat roles and might not 269 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 1: be in the infantry, but we are certainly in the 270 00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: line of fire. Yeah, exactly, there are I mean, speaking 271 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:13,080 Speaker 1: of dangerous situations, there are some developments that are very 272 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: beneficial or will be very beneficial when they are implemented. 273 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 1: And one of those is that women's body armor is 274 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 1: being tested. And you might think, okay, well, so what no, 275 00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 1: I mean, we really have not had women's body armor. 276 00:16:24,680 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: We've had women wearing small men's body armor, which is 277 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 1: not the same thing because women are shaped differently. Women 278 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 1: have hips, oh my gosh, boobs. So yeah, they would 279 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: even when they wore an extra small men's body armor suit, 280 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 1: it would still be too long, leave gaps that left 281 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:46,480 Speaker 1: them vulnerable. And a lot of women were saying that 282 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 1: they would get severely bruised because the armor would rise 283 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:52,360 Speaker 1: up on their hips and sit there uncomfortably, so they 284 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: would just be, you know, bruised all over at the 285 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 1: end of the day. Yeah, and those those gaps left 286 00:16:57,160 --> 00:17:00,720 Speaker 1: them more open to bullets and shrapnel, which a test 287 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:06,560 Speaker 1: to me to the hutzpah of these female soldiers who 288 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: were nevertheless wearing these highly uncomfortable, improved outer tactical vests 289 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: and doing their jobs anyway at a heightened risk. Um. 290 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:18,600 Speaker 1: But the innovations in the and the resources that the 291 00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:22,119 Speaker 1: military has been pouring into developing this body armor for 292 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:27,159 Speaker 1: female soldiers has been a an indication that yet again, 293 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:30,359 Speaker 1: you know, they were taking steps forward to lift the 294 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 1: combat band, and some of these developments and inventions are 295 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,640 Speaker 1: going to make the whole um strength and size discrepancy 296 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:41,280 Speaker 1: argument a completely moot point. Yeah, there's been a lot 297 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:44,400 Speaker 1: of stuff coming out of DARPA, the Defense Advanced Research 298 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:50,479 Speaker 1: Projects Agency UM building exoskeletons and robots that can go 299 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:56,439 Speaker 1: in and into battlefields and lift very heavy objects. So 300 00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: either like sending a robot in or having these exo 301 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:03,400 Speaker 1: skeletons that the soldiers can actually put on to get 302 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:06,840 Speaker 1: them superhuman strength like Iron Man. You now, the video 303 00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: of the robot Mule is actually unintentionally hilarious. Did you 304 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: watch it? It's just it's completely silent. There's no music 305 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 1: or narration or anything. It's just this robot mule headless 306 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: headless robot mule. That is like they're showing how I 307 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,159 Speaker 1: can go up hills and over rocks and through bushes 308 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 1: and stuff, and it's just well, it's unintentionally hilarious, and 309 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,879 Speaker 1: I recommend that you google it. Yeah, because the upper 310 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:36,480 Speaker 1: body strength is something too. When we were looking at 311 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,160 Speaker 1: reactions from a soldiers saying, you know what, like when 312 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 1: you are out and you have a soldier down, you've 313 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:44,240 Speaker 1: got to run out there. You have all of your 314 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:49,640 Speaker 1: gear on, which ways a million pounds estimated, and and 315 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,639 Speaker 1: women don't have the strength to pick someone else up 316 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 1: toss some over the shoulders. But then there are other 317 00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: people who say, you know what, I've actually seen it 318 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 1: in the battlefields of female soldiers doing this. So I mean, 319 00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:06,240 Speaker 1: if anything, though, it's good that there there's technology moving 320 00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:10,440 Speaker 1: moving that forward to make that more of a moot point. Yeah, 321 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: and there is. I just like to point out a 322 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 1: Teddy Bear robot that goes in and save soldiers. It 323 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: has a Teddy Bear on it, well not really a 324 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 1: teddy Bear, but it's got like a bear head, so 325 00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,480 Speaker 1: that it's supposedly more comforting when you're saving a terrified 326 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 1: soldier and in response to those concerns over unit cohesion, 327 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:29,320 Speaker 1: whether men and women can you know, stand side by 328 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 1: sound the battlefield and not you know, have emotions or 329 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:37,399 Speaker 1: sex get in the way. UM. There have been numerous studies, 330 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 1: and this was pointed out in that article from Foreign Affairs. 331 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 1: There have been numerous studies coming out of the U. 332 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:46,520 Speaker 1: S Army Research Institute of Environmental Medicine and the US 333 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 1: Government Accountability Office UM, along with various military and academic 334 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:55,879 Speaker 1: experts UH that find over and over again that women's 335 00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: impact on unit cohesion and their physical abilities is negligible. 336 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:04,200 Speaker 1: In other words, the conclusion that most of these stays 337 00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:06,040 Speaker 1: reach are that, yeah, I guess what, male and female 338 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:08,800 Speaker 1: soldiers can get along just fine, and they can stick 339 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: to the mission and complete it. Maybe we need a 340 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:20,280 Speaker 1: when Harry met Sally on the battlefieldield get it now? Okay? UM, 341 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 1: So moving on from me making terrible, half hearted jokes. UM, 342 00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 1: America is far from the first country to let women 343 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:32,160 Speaker 1: into the military. Yeah. I mean, that's that's another argument 344 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,840 Speaker 1: of Hey, you know what, there are twelve other countries 345 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:41,880 Speaker 1: already doing this and they're doing just fine. Yeah. Canada, Hey, Canada, 346 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 1: women were allowed into all military roles there in seven 347 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:47,159 Speaker 1: and as of two thousand six, more than two d 348 00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 1: women were part of the regular combat force and more 349 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 1: than nine hundred were part of the Reserve combat force. Yeah. 350 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: Internet genius Hilary Riisenberg over at BuzzFeed UM itemized all 351 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,400 Speaker 1: of these countries that have already let women in combat. 352 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:05,400 Speaker 1: I mean we're behind, like Romania, Poland Finland. I mean 353 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 1: you might say, well, no, I mean this is the 354 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,320 Speaker 1: the American Army, the U s Military is the most 355 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: elite military force in the world. It's huge. You know, 356 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,919 Speaker 1: we can't apples to oranges. We're talking about Poland Finland 357 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:21,680 Speaker 1: or you know, Sweden offense to Poland, Finland or Sweden. UM. 358 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:27,120 Speaker 1: So of course it would take a longer time. But uh, 359 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:30,160 Speaker 1: I think that there are plenty of people, such as 360 00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,360 Speaker 1: those four a c l U lawsuit plaintiffs, who would 361 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 1: say it's past do for this to happen. And as 362 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:43,879 Speaker 1: far as I know, that lawsuit is still pending because 363 00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 1: they sued Leon Panetta, the Secretary of Defense. UM. And 364 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:53,520 Speaker 1: I'm not sure how the lifting of the combat solution 365 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,359 Speaker 1: band affects that lawsuit. UM, but I believe it is 366 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,359 Speaker 1: still in court that it didn't just magically just appear. 367 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 1: I mean not to be too informal about this, but 368 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 1: if Colleen Farrell would like to write and if she's 369 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:10,399 Speaker 1: listening and talk to us about it, let us know. 370 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,399 Speaker 1: Let us know well. And and when we when we 371 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,920 Speaker 1: posted about the combat exclusion band being lifted on our 372 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: Facebook page, there there were a couple of people amid 373 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 1: all of the High five who said, sarcastically, oh great, well, 374 00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,359 Speaker 1: now women are you know, equal opportunity to be shot 375 00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:32,440 Speaker 1: at and killed? And there are you know, moral arguments 376 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 1: that well, should we really cheer on women being involved 377 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:40,479 Speaker 1: when war is wrong and this is violence and it's 378 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:45,640 Speaker 1: it's a product of you know, a testosterone fueled culture 379 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:50,200 Speaker 1: and all of these negative things. UM, And I can understand, 380 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:55,480 Speaker 1: I can understand people's moral opposition to war, but I 381 00:22:55,560 --> 00:23:02,160 Speaker 1: cannot agree with um gender discrimination in the workplace, which 382 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: is what this spoils down to. So it'll be interesting 383 00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,920 Speaker 1: to see, though, between now and January, whether or not 384 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: exclusions will still be put in place. Because the government said, hey, 385 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,080 Speaker 1: you know, if you you have until twenty sixteen to 386 00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 1: implement this, but you can still make a compelling case 387 00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: for saying, hey, you know what special ops forces. You know, 388 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,960 Speaker 1: we want to keep it to these super elite forces. 389 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,399 Speaker 1: We're going to keep them to two men only. And 390 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 1: I have a feeling that there will be still some 391 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:36,359 Speaker 1: that women are kept out of. So military personnel listening, 392 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:39,120 Speaker 1: I know that you're out there. I want to know 393 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: what's going on on on the ground. Because of course, 394 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: there were so many media stories after that getting reactions 395 00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 1: from soldiers, and I wonder now that the dust is settled, 396 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: just a little bit, um if if it makes that 397 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:53,360 Speaker 1: big of a deal. There were some people who were 398 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,359 Speaker 1: saying kind of in the same reactions to the donuts 399 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 1: don't tell policy being lifted, where it was like, it 400 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 1: doesn't change anything day to day, We're still doing our jobs. 401 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: I would like to hear how widespread my friends father's 402 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 1: opinion is. I feel like there's a lot of that. Yeah, 403 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,119 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, it is the whole band of 404 00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,640 Speaker 1: brothers kind of thing. I I can. I can understand 405 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 1: that I have a military personnel in my family. I can. 406 00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,199 Speaker 1: I can see that. Um. But again, when it's like 407 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: a skills based thing, and if women have the skills 408 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 1: and they should be able to apply for and get 409 00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 1: the job, if they're qualified, So send us your letters everyone, 410 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,119 Speaker 1: what what do you think? And even if you're not 411 00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,240 Speaker 1: in the military, what what do you think about all 412 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,919 Speaker 1: of this mom stuff. Discovery dot com is where you 413 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 1: can send those letters. And now onto some letters. Well, 414 00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: I have an email here from Zara and this is 415 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:58,199 Speaker 1: in response to our podcasts on vocal Fry, and she 416 00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:03,200 Speaker 1: offers a little linguistic insight. She writes, you mentioned switching 417 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:06,199 Speaker 1: your accent and speech patterns to match the person you're 418 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 1: speaking to. This is called style shifting or code switching 419 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 1: by dialectical people. People who use two accents of the 420 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,960 Speaker 1: same language are known to do this, according to their interlocutor, 421 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 1: often completely unintentionally. I know I do it, and it 422 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 1: gets on my husband's last nerve because he says I 423 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,200 Speaker 1: have a fake French accent. I'm a French speaking Quebecer 424 00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 1: with a lot of French exposure, especially when I was 425 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 1: a kid. My French accent has devolved a bit since 426 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:32,959 Speaker 1: it's been a long time since I've been in contact 427 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 1: with French people, but it's still completely unintentional stopping and 428 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 1: actually requires a conscious effort. On top of that, I 429 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: quickly start matching my interlocutors, accent or speech patterns. I 430 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:45,720 Speaker 1: remember when a Belgian friend came over for two weeks 431 00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:47,920 Speaker 1: in Quebec. She stayed with me, and after ten days 432 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 1: I was starting to have a Belgian accent. Oh, I 433 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,320 Speaker 1: wonder if I could master a Belgian accent. That's your 434 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:56,439 Speaker 1: next goal. It's good to have goals. I'm convinced if 435 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 1: you dropped me in Great Britain, I'd acquire a British 436 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: accent quickly. Keep up the good work. So thanks Sarah 437 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:09,479 Speaker 1: Accent Sponge. Here's one from Lloyd Kristen. This is a 438 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:12,919 Speaker 1: Canadian dude listener. He wanted to specify that he's one 439 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,160 Speaker 1: of our guy listeners and we appreciate it. Lloyd says, 440 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 1: I think Canadian upspeak is more subtle than the examples 441 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:21,760 Speaker 1: you gave. It sounded more like Valley Girl than Canadian. 442 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 1: It seems Valley Girl up speak is up on the 443 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:27,640 Speaker 1: second to last syllable than up again on the laugh fillable. 444 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,480 Speaker 1: Canadians seems to be up on the second to last 445 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,040 Speaker 1: syllable than flat, or even down a bit on the 446 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,800 Speaker 1: laugh syllable. I'm gonna need examples, Kristen. I grew up 447 00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:39,280 Speaker 1: in New Brunswick, Canada, and didn't really notice it until 448 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 1: I was away in the US for a number of 449 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,960 Speaker 1: years and would talk to people in the Maritimes, especially 450 00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:46,840 Speaker 1: the rural areas. Given all the Maritimes a pretty rural 451 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:49,119 Speaker 1: I'm not much of a linguist, so I had trouble 452 00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:50,720 Speaker 1: putting my finger on it. But there seems to be 453 00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 1: a difference. Valley Girl just sounds unsure and questioning Canadians 454 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:56,879 Speaker 1: seems to end every sentence with the tonal equivalent of 455 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, but I'm pretty biased. So 456 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,439 Speaker 1: thank you Lloyd. I'm trying to think of what that 457 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,119 Speaker 1: would because he said I would go flat on the 458 00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: second to last levels, like yeah, up on the second 459 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:10,679 Speaker 1: to last, then flat or even down a bit on 460 00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 1: the last level. I will be trying to think of it, 461 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,080 Speaker 1: and when Kristen does, maybe we'll post a video for 462 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:20,480 Speaker 1: accent my yes uh so so. Thanks especially to our 463 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 1: Canadian listeners, hey for writing in to mom Stuff at 464 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,719 Speaker 1: Discovery dot com. That's where you can send your letters. 465 00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 1: You can also send us Facebook messages like us there. 466 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 1: While you're added. You can tweet us at Mom's Stuff 467 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 1: podcast and follow us on tumbler as well at stuff 468 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: mom Never Told You dot tumbler dot com, and you 469 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: can read a lot of articles over at our website 470 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,080 Speaker 1: as well. During the week. It's how stuff Works dot 471 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:53,359 Speaker 1: com for more on this and thousands of other topics. 472 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:59,680 Speaker 1: Does it how stuff works dot com.