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Speaker 1: Hey, Latino USA listener, it's Maria and today we want

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Speaker 1: to share an episode from a new podcast series hosted

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Speaker 1: by two friends of Latino USA, Award winning New York

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Speaker 1: Times writer Eric Callindo and best selling author Patti Rodriguez.

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Speaker 1: The podcast series is called Out of the Shadows Children

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Speaker 1: of eighty six. It's produced by Michael Dura and iHeart

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Speaker 1: Podcasts now. In nineteen eighty six, the lives of millions

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Speaker 1: of immigrants and their children were changed by one lucky

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Speaker 1: stroke of a pen by an unlikely ally Republican President,

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Speaker 1: Ronald Reagan. Out of the Shadows looks at the ripple

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Speaker 1: effects of the nineteen eighty six Reform Bill. It's going

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Speaker 1: to dive into the lives of first generation kids of immigrants,

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Speaker 1: navigating intergenerational mobility and transforming the cultural landscape. Give the

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Speaker 1: following episode a listen and don't forget to subscribe.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Hi, listeners, just a quick heads up. Out of

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Speaker 2: the Shadows tell stories of people fleeing and living in

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Speaker 2: sometimes violent environments.

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Speaker 3: There's an old fated photo of me that captures a

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Speaker 3: moment at a party in Mexico, my birthday party. To

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Speaker 3: be exact, my mouth is slightly open. I am wearing

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Speaker 3: pigtails and a fluffy blue dress. I'm in my dad's

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Speaker 3: arms and he's carrying me and my little brother John.

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Speaker 3: The moment is filled with movement, my uncle in the

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Speaker 3: back playing the accordion. Other kids running around could be

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Speaker 3: my cousins standing off to the side, trying to peek

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Speaker 3: over my dad's shoulders. And one of them is just

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Speaker 3: staring at the camera like a deer in headlights. And

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Speaker 3: right as the camera shutters, my dad blinks. The back

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Speaker 3: of that photo is stamped November nineteen eighty six. I

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Speaker 3: didn't know it yet, but back in the States that

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Speaker 3: same date that is stamped on the back of that photo,

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Speaker 3: November nineteen eighty six, the most unlikely ally to immigrants

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Speaker 3: just signed ERKA, the Immigration Reforming Control Act, into law,

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Speaker 3: allowing millions of immigrants and their children and their children's

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Speaker 3: children to plant roots in this country. I've had this

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Speaker 3: realization that my life, my parents' life, and possibly even

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Speaker 3: your life wouldn't have been possible. Hello, hey, Eric, So

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Speaker 3: I've been thinking about.

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Speaker 4: Our lives, hey, Patty, and.

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Speaker 3: It's starting to make sense. So I need you to

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Speaker 3: hear me out. I think our lives would have been

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Speaker 3: impossible without Ronald Reagan.

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Speaker 2: El Salvador is nearer to Texas than Texas is to Massachusetts. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that guy, damn.

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Speaker 3: That's my co host and also best friend, Eric, Eric G.

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Speaker 2: Lindo.

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Speaker 3: We've known each other since we were eighteen selling shoes

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Speaker 3: at jac Penny. You know, back then we didn't have

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Speaker 3: people to look up to, and now we're a force.

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Speaker 3: I'm Patti Rodriguez.

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Speaker 4: And I'm Eeric Galindo. And this is Out of the Shadows.

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Speaker 4: Children of eighty six.

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Speaker 3: Immigrants and their children have long lived in the shadows

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Speaker 3: of America. Their destinies aren't just shaped by where they

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Speaker 3: come from, but by their particular place in history.

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Speaker 4: In nineteen eighty six, the lives of millions of immigrants

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Speaker 4: and their children were changed by one lucky stroke of

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Speaker 4: a pen by an unlikely ally, President Ronald Reagan.

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Speaker 3: This podcast will examine the ripplelypics the bill had on

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Speaker 3: first generation kids of immigrants, who are navigating intergenerational mobility

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Speaker 3: and transforming the cultural landscape.

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Speaker 4: This is an untold story of luck, timing, triumph, opportunity, survival.

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Speaker 3: And of course hope. I never thought of asking my

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Speaker 3: parents why they came here. I mean, I knew they

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Speaker 3: came here to the US undocumented, and I also knew

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Speaker 3: that at some point they got a green card, and

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Speaker 3: the green card meant being legal, legal to be here

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Speaker 3: in this country without fear of being deported.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Same, I mean, I knew it happened, and I was thankful.

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Speaker 4: But as a kid, I had never really asked my

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Speaker 4: parents how or why they came here.

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Speaker 3: Right, I mean I never sat down and reflected on

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Speaker 3: how it happened or or the wild fact that both

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Speaker 3: my parents, my deals, my theas, and millions of other people,

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Speaker 3: including your parents, Eric, received legal residency all at the

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Speaker 3: same time.

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Speaker 4: And thank god they did, because this country as we

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Speaker 4: know it today wouldn't be the same because Latinos, Latinas, Latine, Hispanic, LATINEX,

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Speaker 4: whatever you want to call us, we're here.

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Speaker 1: When my grandmother got here, she never could have imagined

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Speaker 1: one of her grandsons would be standing with you here

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Speaker 1: today to say these words.

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Speaker 2: I am a candidate for President of the United States

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Speaker 2: of America.

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Speaker 5: For the first time in history, no candidate political party

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Speaker 5: could reach the White House without the Hispanic port.

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Speaker 1: Latinos play a key role in economic growth as their

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Speaker 1: buying power jump to more than one point seven trillion

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Speaker 1: dollars in the last.

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Speaker 2: Ten years alone, the number of Latino business owners has

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Speaker 2: grown forty four percent, compared to just three percent for

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Speaker 2: all others.

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Speaker 5: Aura is the momento.

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Speaker 4: Momento.

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Speaker 5: Okay, this is our moment.

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Speaker 4: There's no better example of the success of LATINX people

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Speaker 4: than Boulevard Market in La.

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Speaker 3: Boulevard Market is a food hall made of converted shipping containers.

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Speaker 3: It's just east of downtown Los Angeles and Monabelo, the

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Speaker 3: heart of LA's San Gabriel Valley. It opened in twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty and it's so special to me. It's a place

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Speaker 3: where LATINX families come every day to spend money on tacos,

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Speaker 3: fresh seviche and melt in your mouth pupusas. But it's

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Speaker 3: so much more than food. There's life, music, art, culture,

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Speaker 3: and most importantly community. Thousands of people come here every

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Speaker 3: month to live their best life. It's a reminder of

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Speaker 3: how far we've come that we can have spaces that

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Speaker 3: are built by us and for us.

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Speaker 6: You got Cafe Santo that's from Wajaka. You have vitos

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Speaker 6: that are Salvadorian, pupusas, pescantina, which is coastal Mexican. You

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Speaker 6: have Nola, which is New Orleans food. You have Los

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Speaker 6: Takero Muco, which is you know, Mexican and Guatemalan tacos.

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Speaker 6: They're fused together.

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Speaker 3: This is Barney Santos. He owns Boulevard Market. He's giving

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Speaker 3: us a tour of the place. You know.

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Speaker 6: As simple as this idea sounds, it's kind of It

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Speaker 6: was kind of a radical one when we start it right,

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Speaker 6: like to say, like, okay, we're gonna build this hybrid

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Speaker 6: entrepreneurship social enterprise that is Latino owned, that focuses on

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Speaker 6: black and brown founders, that creates a platform.

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Speaker 4: Growing up, we used to create our own spaces in parks,

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Speaker 4: dirt lots, or swap mates wherever we could find it.

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Speaker 4: Really nothing was permanent. Everything felt fleeting. All of that

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Speaker 4: is here, living and breathing and eating tacos at Boulevard Market.

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Speaker 4: Being here feels like establishing permanence. Like now we own

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Speaker 4: our own spaces. It's a big deal. Barnie's an entrepreneur,

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Speaker 4: a hustler, and he got his entrepreneurial spirit from his parents,

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Speaker 4: who immigrated to the US from El Salvador.

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Speaker 6: Like just to come to this country as entrepreneurial in

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Speaker 6: itself right, and then being in this country, like my

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Speaker 6: mother and my father both were always doing something some

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Speaker 6: side hustle, selling perfume, selling clothes. My dad would make

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Speaker 6: bracelets and I would go with him to Santa Monica

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Speaker 6: to sell them to people. You know, So I learned

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Speaker 6: about like sales and entrepreneurship from them. I wouldn't be

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Speaker 6: who I am if it wasn't for that entrepreneurial spirit

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Speaker 6: that they had and for the opportunity that we were

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Speaker 6: able to even just be here in this country because

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Speaker 6: of everything that happened politically in the eighties. So my

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Speaker 6: mother became a citizen because of the amnesty.

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Speaker 3: Standing in Boulevard Market, when I see all of this,

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Speaker 3: I think of two unbelievable things. The first one is

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Speaker 3: that I own a small piece of this me a

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Speaker 3: first generation daughter of immigrants from Lynnwood, from Southeast LA.

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Speaker 3: I invested in this place, and wow, it belongs to us.

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Speaker 3: And the second thing I think about is that none

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Speaker 3: of this would be possible if it weren't for Ronald Reagan.

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Speaker 3: That's right, the guy who's considered a god in conservative

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Speaker 3: circles and a devil in most of Latin America. This

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Speaker 3: that's why this is so complicated. He created a type

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Speaker 3: of poverty and the war on drugs that devastated my community.

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Speaker 3: But also in nineteen eighty six, he signed a bill

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Speaker 3: that would eventually grant amnesty to three million undocumented people.

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Speaker 3: That three million people that came out of the shadows

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Speaker 3: and built the America we are seeing today. We weren't

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Speaker 3: supposed to come out of the shadows, but we.

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Speaker 2: Did out of the shadows. Will be right back now,

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Speaker 2: back to the show.

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Speaker 3: So what exactly is ERCA? Eric Can you break it

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Speaker 3: down for us?

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Speaker 4: Yeah? For sure. Erica is basically what I like to

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Speaker 4: think of as the street name for the Immigration Reform

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Speaker 4: and Control Act of nineteen eighty six. If you're wondering

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Speaker 4: why congressional bill has a street name, well, shit was

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Speaker 4: monumental on these streets. It's the first comprehensive immigration reform

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Speaker 4: law of its kind in US history. But URCA is

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Speaker 4: like an mc escher painting. What you see when you

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Speaker 4: look at it may depend on your reality. On one hand,

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Speaker 4: ERKA gave three million people, many of Latino descent, amnesty.

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Speaker 4: That means three million Green cards establishing a pathway to

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Speaker 4: citizenship for undocumented immigrants, a way to establish roots without

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Speaker 4: the constant fear of deportation. But there was one catch.

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Speaker 4: You had to prove that you were in the US

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Speaker 4: before nineteen eighty two. But ERCA was an effort to

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Speaker 4: curb the flow of immigration by providing sanctions to employers

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Speaker 4: who hired undocumented immigrants. It was not that amnesty plus

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Speaker 4: heavy fines in strict border enforcement would stop the flow spoilers.

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Speaker 4: No sanctions were issued, the flow didn't stop, and enforcement

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Speaker 4: has only gotten more punitive. You see, America has his

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Speaker 4: unchecked addiction to cheap labor. Most of that comes from

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Speaker 4: undocumented immigrants. Most of them come from Mexico and Central

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Speaker 4: America to pick and harvest our produce, make our clothes,

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Speaker 4: and clean the homes of middle class and wealthy Americans.

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Speaker 4: Despite how vital immigrant labor is to our industries agricultural

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Speaker 4: aka the food we eat, garment, the clothes you wear,

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Speaker 4: domestic the people who landscape, clean and build your houses,

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Speaker 4: and raise and take care of your children. That's not

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Speaker 4: even mentioning the contributions to the economy. Despite how vital

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Speaker 4: immigrant labor is to our industries, this country refuses to

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Speaker 4: recognize them as citizens, even as residents. To put it

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Speaker 4: in a different way, the US needs the cheap labor

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Speaker 4: of immigrants, but won't allow them to be part of

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Speaker 4: this country. So ERCA was supposed to be a one

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Speaker 4: time deal the immigration reformed to end all immigration reform.

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Speaker 4: But it wasn't that simple. On this podcast, you're gonna

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Speaker 4: hear from some of the people who were there, like

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Speaker 4: Alan Simpson, one of the principal sponsors of ERCA in

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Speaker 4: the Senate in nineteen eighty six.

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Speaker 5: Let's not do a story for the audience. Let's just

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Speaker 5: do an honest story, and then the audience.

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Speaker 4: Will either pick it up or understand it, or they won't,

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Speaker 4: but we'll get into that later. Nonetheless, for millions of

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Speaker 4: undocumented sons, daughters, dels primos, Abuela's parents, ERCA was a chance,

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Speaker 4: a shot of becoming an American and stepping out of

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Speaker 4: the shadows.

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Speaker 3: And two of those people were my parents. And it

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Speaker 3: all started with my mom and a wild, terrifying chase

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Speaker 3: through the Sonoran Desert.

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Speaker 5: My name is Paula Sapatam and I'm here in the

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Speaker 5: USA for forty two years.

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Speaker 4: Is you know one story.

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Speaker 3: Wherever you foot the world, do you remember, Do you

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Speaker 3: remember when you arrived for the first time?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I remember.

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Speaker 3: The first time my mom came to this country was

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Speaker 3: in nineteen seventy nine when she crossed the river. My

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Speaker 3: dad was already here working for a few years, and

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Speaker 3: my mom, who was sixteen at the time, came to

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Speaker 3: meet him. She came with nothing more than a backpack

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Speaker 3: full of clothes and dreams of becoming a mariachi singer.

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Speaker 5: Oh, we closed the river at night and the water

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Speaker 5: covers me up to my shoulders.

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Speaker 3: After she crossed, my mom lived in easte Las with

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Speaker 3: matiore Mundo, who managed musicians. She take care of my

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Speaker 3: cousins on weekdays and sing mariachi on weekends.

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Speaker 5: It was like made me very happy to sing, you know,

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Speaker 5: in public with the mariachi.

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Speaker 3: A few years later I was born. She got a

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Speaker 3: job in the garment industry through a family friend. She

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Speaker 3: lied to employers and told them she was eighteen.

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Speaker 5: I used to leave Patti and bed in order to

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Speaker 5: be a better person, you know, to have skills, because

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Speaker 5: in this country it was so hard to find a job.

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Speaker 5: You don't have a good English, or you don't speak English,

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Speaker 5: you know, with my bad English, but they gave me

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Speaker 5: the opportunity.

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Speaker 3: My mom was trying to finish night school, but then

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Speaker 3: she got pregnant again and had my brother John, the

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Speaker 3: one from the photo. Around this time, my dad got

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Speaker 3: into an accident. He couldn't work, needed medical attention, and

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Speaker 3: was scared of being deported, so we all went back

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Speaker 3: to Mexico. After all that, crossing the river, dodging La Migra,

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Speaker 3: struggling with two kids in a country where they didn't

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Speaker 3: know the language, they just went back home. But my

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Speaker 3: parents were actually happy in Mexico. They bought a house.

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Speaker 3: My mom had dreams of starting her own business. I

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Speaker 3: was a toddler and John was just a baby. But

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Speaker 3: my mom had her parents there to help, something she

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Speaker 3: didn't have here in the States, so there was no

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Speaker 3: need to give up her dreams. There was no need

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Speaker 3: to stop her education or quit jobs for us.

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Speaker 5: You know, I was very happy because it was maybe

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Speaker 5: the the house, uh you know, my dreams.

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Speaker 4: You know, it was big.

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Speaker 3: So this brings us back to that photo I mentioned

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Speaker 3: on the top of the show. Life seemed good for

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Speaker 3: my parents, and then I got sick.

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Speaker 5: So the doctor told me, you need to go back

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Speaker 5: to USA because she's gonna die here. So we just

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Speaker 5: took a bus to tj to try to you know,

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Speaker 5: to pass to a yosai again to Los.

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Speaker 3: Angeles once again. My mom decided to sacrifice her life

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Speaker 3: in Mexico, sacrifice her home, her dreams for a better

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Speaker 3: life for her kids, to literally save my life. So

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Speaker 3: in November of nineteen eighty six, my dad, my mom,

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Speaker 3: my brother John, and I take a bus to Tijuana

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Speaker 3: to meet a coyote. We were told to meet at

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Speaker 3: a house in the desert and when we got there,

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Speaker 3: it is packed with people just like us, who were

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Speaker 3: all going to cross.

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Speaker 5: I remember there were a lot, a lot of people

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Speaker 5: in a house, you know, sleeping on on the floor,

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Speaker 5: and me and my kids as well, John and Patty.

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Speaker 5: They had a big band and they said, we are

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Speaker 5: going to cross the border and the bank. So you guys,

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Speaker 5: so we are going all that way. You know, we're

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Speaker 5: going to dry you know, all that way to Los Angeles.

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Speaker 5: We are not going to stop.

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Speaker 3: But my mom had this plan. Since my brother and

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Speaker 3: I are natural born citizens, we don't need to cross

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Speaker 3: through the desert with them.

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Speaker 5: I don't want you to put in a risk, you know,

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Speaker 5: because I knew already the first time how dangerous it was.

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Speaker 3: My dad caused his cousin in Los Angeles to pick

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Speaker 3: us up, but he never shows up.

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Speaker 5: So we called Sari Hill and he said, no, no,

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Speaker 5: I can't. He had a recent Probably oh, he was

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Speaker 5: scared because at the time, you know, a lot of

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Speaker 5: people was a scared of everything.

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Speaker 3: A stranger in the house. Here's what's going on, and

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Speaker 3: offers to cross me and my brother with our birth certificates.

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Speaker 3: She promises my mom she'd meet her on the other side,

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Speaker 3: and my mom, desperately in the evening, agrees to hand

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Speaker 3: over her children to her.

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Speaker 2: Out of the shadows. Will be right back now, back

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Speaker 2: to the show.

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Speaker 3: My mom can't imagine her children crossing the desert, but

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Speaker 3: as she's walking away, something doesn't feel right.

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Speaker 5: Maybe God, oh, I don't know, put in mind in

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Speaker 5: my mind and I say, oh, no, I cannot give

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Speaker 5: you my kids. Imagine every time I remember that, I

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Speaker 5: could ask my Patty and Chan if something happened, something

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Speaker 5: is gonna happen, But I want them by me.

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Speaker 2: With me by my side.

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Speaker 3: And here we are, all four of us, and I

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Speaker 3: remember this so vivid when it was our turn. My

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Speaker 3: family got in the van. It was raining that night,

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Speaker 3: and we're packed in this wide cargo van that was

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Speaker 3: never made to drive through the desert, packed just like sardines.

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Speaker 3: The smell of fear, uncertainty, and yes, even hope was

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Speaker 3: permeating throughout. As we begin our track through the mountainous

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Speaker 3: desert terrain, Our heads and bodies bang against the cold,

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Speaker 3: thin walls every time the wheels drive over muddy potholes

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Speaker 3: and slippery rocks. The rain has transformed the ground into

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Speaker 3: a swamp. Suddenly, the van stops. Everyone looks around as

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Speaker 3: panic starts to set in. I can tell something's wrong. Okay,

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Speaker 3: let's think about this. I'm three years old. Because when

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Speaker 3: kids are that age and they see stuff, they they

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Speaker 3: can't really process what's going on, but they feel that's

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Speaker 3: something doesn't feel right. I'm looking around and no one's

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Speaker 3: reassuring me that things are okay. We hear the driver

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Speaker 3: stepping on the gas, the sound of the revving engine,

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Speaker 3: but we're not moving. The sound of rain hitting metal

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Speaker 3: hidens the anxiety. My brother's diaper is soaked and he's crying.

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Speaker 3: Women are praying. My mother's praying, my dad and a

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Speaker 3: couple of other men are forced to get out and push.

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Speaker 3: I follow him, the rain falling heavy on all of us.

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Speaker 3: When we notice one of the tires is very deep,

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Speaker 3: the spinning wheels flapping mud everywhere. Back in the car,

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Speaker 3: somebody screams La migra, and I feel my entire body

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Speaker 3: turning against me. I'm only three years old, but I

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Speaker 3: know what that word means. How do they find us?

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Speaker 3: Maybe they sense the fear radiating from all of us,

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Speaker 3: like sharks drawn to blood. The men are pushing, using

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Speaker 3: their entire weight, slipping on the mud and loosing their footing.

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Speaker 3: The rain and prayers grow louder. This is now or never,

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Speaker 3: and one let's push and the rear left wheel is

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Speaker 3: eventually free from the mud pit. We only have seconds

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Speaker 3: to jump back in. We are being followed. One man

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Speaker 3: armed with herbs and prayers tells everyone to wear the

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Speaker 3: herbs and pray. They'll protect us, he says, but the

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Speaker 3: roads are not kind to the border patrol either. After

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Speaker 3: we put a mile of distance between them, we lose them.

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Speaker 5: It was hard, I mean for them, because probably the

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Speaker 5: migra didn't want to rigs themselves, and for a milec

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Speaker 5: or something they stop following us, and after die everything

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Speaker 5: was good to hear.

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Speaker 3: To this day, we will never know if the herbs

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Speaker 3: and prayers worked, but my mom seems to think it did.

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Speaker 3: It is because of my mom's courage that I'm even

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Speaker 3: here today telling her story. But that was just the

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Speaker 3: beginning of my mom's fight to be here. I think

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Speaker 3: back on that photo of my dad holding me and John.

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Speaker 3: My mom must have taken that, and I don't think

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Speaker 3: my parents knew back then that President Reagan had just

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Speaker 3: gotten a bill on his desk that would create a

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Speaker 3: path towards citizenship for millions of families like ours. We

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Speaker 3: were on the verge of coming out of the shadows.

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Speaker 3: But it wouldn't be easy. And just like that first

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Speaker 3: time when she held all her dreams slung over her

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Speaker 3: shoulders while crossing the Raging River, our shot at the

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Speaker 3: American Dream would all hinge on documents in a backpack

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Speaker 3: she carried. When I asked my mom why she had

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Speaker 3: that backpack, she said, in the most innocent tone.

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Speaker 5: I just say, well, maybe just like to remember that

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Speaker 5: I was here, but.

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Speaker 3: We weren't alone.

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Speaker 6: It was an amazing things. The more I've learned about

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Speaker 6: it since like talking to Patty about it back in

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Speaker 6: the day, Like I was just diving deep into it

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Speaker 6: more and more talking to my mom about it, getting

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Speaker 6: her sort of perspective on it. The more I was like, Wow,

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Speaker 6: this is kind of like it was a serendipitous moment

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Speaker 6: that happened in time that kind of allowed a lot

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Speaker 6: a lot of us to kind of build on that

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Speaker 6: legacy and to do some amazing stuff here in the country.

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Speaker 3: The Immigration Reform and Control Act of nineteen eighty six

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Speaker 3: would end up changing the lives of countless of people

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Speaker 3: and birth the circumstances for a latinx renaissance in this

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Speaker 3: country Latini that would wind up shaping American culture, saving

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Speaker 3: its aging economy, and shifting the paradigm. And we're going

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Speaker 3: to tell you how and why it all happened.

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Speaker 4: This season, and out of the shadows, we will explore

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Speaker 4: the legacy of URCA through the eyes of the folks

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Speaker 4: who lived it. How one bill signed by the man

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Speaker 4: responsible for devastating Latin America also gave three million immigrants

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Speaker 4: a piece of hope. What did it take to pass

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Speaker 4: the bill and why was Ronald Reagan the person to

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Speaker 4: do it? This season and Out of the Shadows.

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Speaker 2: Out of the Shadows is written by Caesar Hernandez. It's

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Speaker 2: also written, edited, hosted, an executive produced by Patti Rodriguez

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Speaker 2: and Eric Galindo. It's produced by Betsy Carlinas, Karen Lopez

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Speaker 2: and Gabby Watts. It's sound design, mixed and mastered by

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Speaker 2: Jesse Niswanger. Our studio engineer is Clay Hillenberg. Karen Garcia

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Speaker 2: That's Me is our announcer. Out of the Shadows is

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Speaker 2: the production of Seeing Nea, the Productions and School of

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Speaker 2: Humans in partnership with Iheart's Mike Ultura podcast Network. The

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Speaker 2: podcast is also executive produced by Giselle Banzes, Virginia Prescott,

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Speaker 2: Brandon Barr, and Chad Crowley. Our marketing and our team

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Speaker 2: is led by Jasmine Mehea. Original music by a Arenas

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Speaker 2: and if you loved his cover of Los Caminos Labda

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00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,679
Speaker 2: this podcast theme song, you can listen to it on

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00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:37,159
Speaker 2: all music platforms. Historical audio for Out of the Shadows

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Speaker 2: comes from the Reagan Presidential Library and the National Archives.

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Speaker 2: Special thanks to Ian Vargas, Alex and Ali, Caitlin Becker,

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Speaker 2: gob Chabran, Daisy Church, Angel Lopez Galindo, Juliana Gamis, Ryan Gordon,

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Speaker 2: Brian Mathieson, Claudia Marti, Corena, Oscar Ramirez, John Rodriguez, Juan Rodriguez,

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Speaker 2: Joshua Sandoval, Eric Sclar, Tony Sorrentino, and Megan Tan.

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Speaker 3: For more podcasts, visit the iHeartRadio app or wherever you

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Speaker 3: listen to your favorite shows.