WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - October 25th, 2024 0:00:02.480 --> 0:00:06.800 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 0:00:08.520 --> 0:00:12.880 This is Bloomberg Business. Wait inside from the reporters and 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:16.600 editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus 0:00:16.680 --> 0:00:20.840 global business, finance and tech news. The Bloomberg Business Week 0:00:20.880 --> 0:00:25.800 Podcast with Carol Messer and Tim Stenebeck from Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:26.800 --> 0:00:29.680 Hi, everyone, Welcome to the Bloomberg Business Week Weekend podcast. 0:00:29.960 --> 0:00:32.479 The countdown to election Day. It is on, and as 0:00:32.520 --> 0:00:35.520 we approach the final home stretch to November fifth, we'll 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:39.080 hear why one outspoken billionaire Trump supporter is now the 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:41.120 democrats new supervillain. 0:00:41.360 --> 0:00:43.040 We're talking, of course, about. 0:00:43.000 --> 0:00:46.600 Elon and speaking of Elon Musk, big tech earning season 0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:51.040 it is here. Tesla reported a solid quarter. Maybe that's 0:00:51.080 --> 0:00:54.080 an understatement. More in the company's results just a little. 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:56.560 Later on bit of a surprise, safe to say, okay, 0:00:56.640 --> 0:01:00.880 from Tesla to its Chinese competitor that Elon Musk once mocked. 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:04.160 We talk next hour on BYD's rise from battery maker 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:05.400 to auto colossus. 0:01:05.760 --> 0:01:09.720 Plus she's responsible for banking, supervision, consumer protection and fintech 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:12.280 in Italy. The Deputy Governor of the Bank of Italy 0:01:12.319 --> 0:01:13.479 stops by all. 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:15.680 Of that to go, and we begin with US politics. 0:01:15.920 --> 0:01:17.640 We are a little over a week away from the 0:01:17.760 --> 0:01:21.360 US presidential election between Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. As 0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:25.119 the nominees enter the final stretch, both are deploying novel tactics, 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:28.959 from podcast cameos to star studed concerts as both try 0:01:29.000 --> 0:01:32.959 to scrounge up undecided voters and basically win this election. 0:01:33.480 --> 0:01:37.080 Another tactic writing a giant million dollar check to persuade 0:01:37.120 --> 0:01:40.160 voters to turn out. That's what Elon Musk has been doing, 0:01:40.200 --> 0:01:43.280 and it's raised the question from some federal officials as 0:01:43.280 --> 0:01:46.160 to whether or not it's actually legal. The latest federal 0:01:46.200 --> 0:01:48.560 filing show that Musk has poured at least seventy five 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:51.720 million dollars into his America pack, making him one of 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.200 the top donors overall this cycle, and that. 0:01:54.200 --> 0:01:57.080 Has caught the ire of Democratic voters, who now view 0:01:57.160 --> 0:02:02.760 him as a political supervillain. Bloomberg BusinessWeek national correspondent Josh Green. 0:02:03.120 --> 0:02:05.600 Josh is also the number one New York Times bestselling 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:08.200 author of Devil's Bargain, Steve benn and Donald Trump in 0:02:08.240 --> 0:02:11.679 the Storming of the Presidency, and more recently, The Rebels 0:02:11.800 --> 0:02:14.640 Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders aoc in the rise of the 0:02:14.680 --> 0:02:15.480 New Left, but. 0:02:15.440 --> 0:02:19.760 In terms of politics, he has become so fiercely identified 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:23.320 with MAGA and with Donald Trump. The Democrats and liberal 0:02:23.400 --> 0:02:26.600 groups have stood up and taken notice, and he's such 0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:29.760 a polarizing figure and so emblematic. I think of the 0:02:29.880 --> 0:02:34.560 kind of rich, dark money billionaires that liberals like to 0:02:34.600 --> 0:02:37.720 demonize in their political ads that Elon has been popping 0:02:37.800 --> 0:02:40.320 up in more and more ads across the country, whether 0:02:40.360 --> 0:02:45.160 it's from Kamala Harris's campaign, or congressional candidates, or unions 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:48.760 or liberal super packs, more and more of them are 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:52.080 featuring Elon in their political ads. A lot of them 0:02:52.080 --> 0:02:56.240 are even featuring the same footage of him in a tuxedo. So, 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:59.200 as I write in the piece, he's kind of eclipsed 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:04.200 the kochbra as the leading villain among Democratic ad makers, 0:03:04.200 --> 0:03:06.640 and it's clear that it's resonating with liberal voters. 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:09.720 Without giving the full piece away, because of course, we 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:12.600 want everyone to go read Bloomberg Business Week, you know, 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:16.160 what are some of those tactics that the Democratic parties 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:20.200 using when they are painting Elon Musk as the super 0:03:20.280 --> 0:03:21.799 villain here? What are they really touching on? 0:03:22.600 --> 0:03:26.200 Well, there are two themes that democratic ad makers really 0:03:26.360 --> 0:03:30.280 key in on, and Elon happens to encompass both of them. 0:03:30.520 --> 0:03:30.720 You know. 0:03:30.760 --> 0:03:35.880 The first is Democrats obviously for decades have been going 0:03:35.920 --> 0:03:39.440 after what they would call, you know, greedy corporate billionaires. 0:03:39.880 --> 0:03:44.000 Elon Musk is the world's richest man, certainly fits that billing. 0:03:44.320 --> 0:03:46.840 The other thing that I think has become more popular 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.400 among liberal ad makers in the time of Trump is 0:03:50.640 --> 0:03:54.480 raising fears of kind of right wing media manipulation, and 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:58.520 of course Musk, with his ownership of Twitter, also fills 0:03:58.600 --> 0:04:01.000 that bucket. So in a lot of way, he's kind 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:05.560 of emerged as this cycle's perfect democratic villain. And the 0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:10.440 fact that he arouses such intense emotions and liberals causing 0:04:10.440 --> 0:04:13.720 them either to click and give money or to volunteer 0:04:13.760 --> 0:04:17.160 for democratic campaigns, I think just shows that he's really 0:04:17.200 --> 0:04:19.680 an important new player in politics the cycle in a 0:04:19.680 --> 0:04:22.040 way that most people I don't think would have anticipated 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.320 even a year or two ago. Yeah, I think that's 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:26.880 certainly fair to say, Josh, you mentioned that it's resonating 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:29.919 with Democratic donors, with the electorate. What do we know 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:32.880 about polling in the way that Democrats versus Republicans feel 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:37.320 about Elon Musk well, perhaps not surprisingly, Elon Musk is 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:41.960 very very unpopular with Democrats and especially younger liberal Democrats. 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:46.039 And we know this because the Bloomberg News Morning Consult 0:04:46.120 --> 0:04:50.119 Swing State poll actually went last month and asked people 0:04:50.160 --> 0:04:54.120 about their favorable and unfavorable ratings on Elon Musk the 0:04:54.160 --> 0:04:56.960 same way they would with a politician like Trump or Harris. 0:04:57.040 --> 0:05:01.039 And sure enough, Elon is becoming viewed in much the 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:04.920 same way that a partisan politician would, where Republicans their 0:05:05.040 --> 0:05:07.159 views of him have improved, a lot of them like 0:05:07.200 --> 0:05:09.760 what they hear from him, where as Democrats, who are 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:12.880 once very positive about Musk because of his association with 0:05:12.960 --> 0:05:17.039 Tesla and electric cars and environmentalism, now have turned on 0:05:17.160 --> 0:05:21.600 him very sharply. And he's deeply underwater. I think something 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:24.320 to the extent of seventeen percent are favorable and something 0:05:24.400 --> 0:05:27.880 like seventy nine or eighty percent unfavorable. So he's every 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:31.039 bit as unpopular or almost as unpopular with Democrats as 0:05:31.160 --> 0:05:31.960 is Donald Trump. 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:35.360 And what do we know so far about how effective 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:38.920 it is for the Republican Party to be using Elon 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:42.040 Musk in a positive light as opposed to the Democratic 0:05:42.040 --> 0:05:45.080 Party kind of using him in negative campaign advertisements. 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:47.560 Well, it's a great question. I mean, we do have 0:05:47.640 --> 0:05:52.120 some indications that Elon is effective. That Donald Trump's campaign 0:05:52.279 --> 0:05:58.920 sends out literally daily emails offering to sell the Elon 0:05:59.040 --> 0:06:02.320 Musk Dark Mind hat, the black make America Great hat 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:05.800 that Musk wore his rally with Trump and Butler Pennsylvania. 0:06:05.839 --> 0:06:08.960 A couple of weeks ago. I get a barrage of 0:06:09.000 --> 0:06:12.360 emails from the Trump campaign touting is association with Elon 0:06:12.960 --> 0:06:17.320 or Elon's offer to match funding. And so the Trump 0:06:17.360 --> 0:06:20.120 campaign seems to feel that he's a very effective fundraiser 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:23.080 because they keep pumping out these emails. So, you know, 0:06:23.320 --> 0:06:26.640 as one of my Democratic sources told me in the piece, 0:06:26.720 --> 0:06:29.760 you know, Elon is basically a walking content factory you 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:32.240 can't look away from. So I think the story here 0:06:32.279 --> 0:06:35.200 really is that whether you're a Republican campaign or a 0:06:35.240 --> 0:06:40.080 Democratic campaign, Elon Musk has become such a central figure 0:06:40.600 --> 0:06:43.520 that it's advantageous to put him in political ads, whether 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:47.719 that's touting his association with Donald Trump or attacking his 0:06:47.760 --> 0:06:50.320 association with Donald Trump. It can raise money either way. 0:06:50.520 --> 0:06:52.560 Josh, I think what's notable about this is you know, 0:06:52.640 --> 0:06:54.120 your story comes out on the same day that The 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:56.920 New York Times writes about how somebody like Jamie Diamond 0:06:56.920 --> 0:07:00.640 over at JP Morgan is supporting Kama Harris, but his 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:03.120 resident reticent to come out and even say so for 0:07:03.160 --> 0:07:06.200 fear of alienating and people who work for and for 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:10.400 fear of alienating customers and the like. Elon Musk doesn't 0:07:10.400 --> 0:07:14.120 show any of that fear, and he runs or is 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:18.200 at the helm of several companies. And you don't often 0:07:18.280 --> 0:07:22.560 see people in positions in business take a stand such 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:26.160 as Elon Musk is doing. And I wonder what your 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:28.760 view is on that and what's unique about this case 0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:31.520 and unique about Elon Musk. The Koch brothers certainly had 0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:33.600 the money and they were donating the money, but they 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:36.280 weren't out there jumping around on stage at rallies. 0:07:36.920 --> 0:07:40.280 Yeah, that's right. Look, the kind of old style democratic 0:07:40.360 --> 0:07:45.000 villain were these reclusive fossil fuel billionaires like the Koch brothers, 0:07:45.080 --> 0:07:46.960 who didn't want to be in the media, didn't want 0:07:46.960 --> 0:07:50.200 to be featured. And you know, now we have this 0:07:50.320 --> 0:07:54.520 new style villain in an Elon Musk, who seems as 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:56.120 eager to be out there and in front of the 0:07:56.160 --> 0:08:00.160 cameras and being the center of attention as anybody's maid, 0:08:00.200 --> 0:08:03.760 the Democrats job really easy for them. As to why 0:08:04.480 --> 0:08:09.920 Musk has decided to identify himself so strongly with the 0:08:09.920 --> 0:08:12.560 MAGA movement Donald Trump, I really can't say. I mean, 0:08:12.600 --> 0:08:14.280 I know anecdotally and you can see it in the 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:17.720 polling numbers that we have that liberal Tesla owners are 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:21.400 very upset about this. Democrats don't like him. Presumably this 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:23.920 is going to have some effect on the margins of 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:28.679 his companies, but he has decided for whatever reason, maybe 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:30.880 because he has so much money, maybe because he's such 0:08:30.920 --> 0:08:32.880 a true believer in Trump and what he stands for 0:08:33.440 --> 0:08:34.719 that he doesn't care and he's going to go out 0:08:34.720 --> 0:08:36.960 and do this anyway. And I think that's one reason 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:40.720 why Musk has unexpectedly emerged as one of the most 0:08:41.040 --> 0:08:44.880 fascinating figures and my bead of presidential politics. He's a 0:08:44.920 --> 0:08:47.480 new character. He's out there and he's demanding that the 0:08:47.480 --> 0:08:49.880 spotlight be on him, and I think as a result, 0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:52.000 it is on him, and we're seeing all the different 0:08:52.160 --> 0:08:55.040 influences and effects that he can have on a presidential race. 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:58.480 And of course one of those influences is the money involved. 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:01.720 Tim had mentioned this. Latest federal filings show that Musk 0:09:01.760 --> 0:09:06.480 has poured at least seventy five million dollars into the 0:09:06.520 --> 0:09:10.199 pack that supports Donald Trump. How does that stack up 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:13.240 with other donors and then other campaigns that we know 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:14.880 Musk has been involved in. 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:18.240 Well, it immediately makes him one of the single largest 0:09:18.240 --> 0:09:22.520 donors in American politics. You know, it's remarkable. Before this cycle, 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:25.640 he wasn't known as a major donor, and in fact, 0:09:25.720 --> 0:09:28.080 he was kind of reputed among people in DC in 0:09:28.120 --> 0:09:30.559 my world to be kind of a chief skate who 0:09:30.679 --> 0:09:33.120 talked a lot but didn't write a lot of checks. Well, 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:35.280 now he has decided that he wants to be one 0:09:35.320 --> 0:09:38.920 of the biggest donors in American politics. And I think 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:42.240 you can see the effect that that's had. Just in 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:44.800 the opening segment you guys showed of all the clips 0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:48.200 of Trump mentioning Elon Musk, he brings him up again 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:50.480 and again in public and in private. And so if 0:09:50.520 --> 0:09:54.280 Trump is elected, I think that Musk stands to be 0:09:54.320 --> 0:09:57.440 a very important figure in the Trump administration and that 0:09:57.520 --> 0:10:02.400 he'll essentially have bought himself a level of influence that 0:10:03.400 --> 0:10:06.840 most people, even very very rich people are reluctant to do, 0:10:06.960 --> 0:10:09.800 to try and come out publicly and declare their association 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:13.840 give this much money. Elon is really plowing new ground 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:15.559 here and it'll be interesting to see what kind of 0:10:15.600 --> 0:10:17.679 effect that has if Trump makes it back into the 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:18.199 White House. 0:10:18.320 --> 0:10:20.559 Yeah, I do wonder what he would want to see 0:10:21.280 --> 0:10:23.520 when it comes to his own influence or what he 0:10:23.559 --> 0:10:25.720 would want to do, Which brings me to my next 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:28.680 question about unions, Josh, because they play a central role 0:10:29.120 --> 0:10:32.200 in your story, and Elon Musk has had a contentious 0:10:32.320 --> 0:10:35.760 relationship with unions given that Tesla is not a union shop, 0:10:35.800 --> 0:10:39.040 and other US automakers are talk a little bit about 0:10:39.040 --> 0:10:41.000 that and what we've heard from unions when it comes 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:41.720 to Elon Musk. 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:46.520 Yeah, I started noticing a few weeks ago Elon kind 0:10:46.559 --> 0:10:49.120 of popping up in these political ads, and I remember 0:10:49.200 --> 0:10:51.000 thinking to myself, like, this is not something we would 0:10:51.040 --> 0:10:53.559 have seen before this cycle. So I wound up doing 0:10:53.600 --> 0:10:57.120 a very deep dive looking at the Elon Musk political ads, 0:10:57.120 --> 0:11:00.960 and some of the earliest ones that ran were buy unions. 0:11:01.200 --> 0:11:04.200 The Service Employees International Union was one of the first. 0:11:05.160 --> 0:11:08.600 They had run ads around Elon even before his MAGA 0:11:08.600 --> 0:11:12.800 and Trump associations because he was sort of the personification 0:11:12.920 --> 0:11:17.320 of what they would consider the greedy, corporate union busting boss. 0:11:17.760 --> 0:11:20.840 He was in a big fight with Swedish unions at 0:11:20.840 --> 0:11:24.319 a time, and I think that really kind of gained momentum. 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:24.480 You know. 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:27.520 I found other ads from Teamsters against Trump and all 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:33.000 sorts of local unions using Musk to kind of highlight 0:11:33.080 --> 0:11:38.200 this idea that greedy bosses are screwing union workers and 0:11:38.280 --> 0:11:40.920 Elon Musk sort of stands for everything we're fighting against. 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:42.960 I talked to one union president for the piece who 0:11:43.040 --> 0:11:47.080 says he Musk is the personification of everything that our 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:51.560 polling tells us middle class, ordinary workers don't like, and 0:11:51.600 --> 0:11:54.040 so it's very easy for us to feature him in 0:11:54.080 --> 0:11:56.719 our political ads because he tells the story that we're 0:11:56.760 --> 0:11:57.400 trying to tell. 0:11:57.679 --> 0:12:01.120 Hey, Josh, speaking of stories, you wrote the book on 0:12:01.200 --> 0:12:03.120 Steve Bannon, and we'd be remiss if we didn't ask 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:05.680 you about Steve Bannon and his influence or lack thereof, 0:12:05.760 --> 0:12:08.480 on the election this time around, Given that he's been 0:12:08.880 --> 0:12:12.000 serving a one hundred and twenty day sentence in federal prison. 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:16.000 He set to be released from that next week, what 0:12:16.040 --> 0:12:18.520 are your thoughts on how Steve Bannon's influence, who had 0:12:18.559 --> 0:12:21.000 such a big one in twenty sixteen, has loomed over 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:21.720 this cycle. 0:12:22.440 --> 0:12:23.920 You know, it's a great question. I think if you 0:12:24.040 --> 0:12:28.520 look at how outrageous some of the Trump claims have been, 0:12:28.600 --> 0:12:32.360 some of the events, the kind of lack of inhibitions 0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:35.480 that we see in Trump's campaign visa vi what we 0:12:35.480 --> 0:12:38.360 would see from an ordinary Republican candidate. I think a 0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:40.400 lot of that goes back to Bannon and the style 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:43.640 of politics that he pioneered. From what I understand, he's 0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:45.800 getting released from prison in a week, so he will 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:47.679 be here for the final week of the campaign. And 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:50.120 you know, who knows, wouldn't surprise me at all to 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:53.440 see him out at a Trump campaign rally on stage 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:56.600 with Donald Trump leading on the crown in the days 0:12:56.600 --> 0:12:58.559 before the election, But we'll have to wait and see. 0:12:59.240 --> 0:13:02.240 We also just gotten news that Donald Trump is expected 0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:05.160 to record an interview with Joe Rogan at his studio 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:08.440 in Austin, Texas. That's according to Politico. What do you 0:13:08.480 --> 0:13:11.880 make of that? I mean, how effective is going on 0:13:11.920 --> 0:13:15.360 a podcast as big as Joe Rogan's. And the political 0:13:15.400 --> 0:13:17.800 report also said that Kamala Harris is also in talks 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:20.040 to go on that podcast as well. 0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:22.440 Yeah, look, I mean I think it's smart for both 0:13:22.480 --> 0:13:27.079 candidates from the standpoint that young men in particular tend 0:13:27.160 --> 0:13:30.480 to be low propensity but Trump friendly voters, So Trump 0:13:30.520 --> 0:13:32.520 going on Joe Rogan makes a lot of sense to 0:13:32.600 --> 0:13:35.840 kind of reach these young men and try and motivate 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:38.400 them to get up off the couch and show up 0:13:38.440 --> 0:13:42.000 at the polls on November fifth. For Harris, I think 0:13:42.000 --> 0:13:44.000 the story is very much the same, is that the 0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:45.960 reason she would go on that show would be to 0:13:46.000 --> 0:13:49.080 try and make a last bid to these young men 0:13:49.320 --> 0:13:52.360 not to go support Donald Trump, but maybe to find 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:54.880 a reason to support her, or at the very least 0:13:55.280 --> 0:13:58.760 not be so outraged and provoked by her that they 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:00.599 decide to go vote for Donald Trump. I think for 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:02.880 a lot of Harris people, they would be fine having 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:06.000 Joe Rogan's listeners just stay at home, But basically they 0:14:06.040 --> 0:14:08.920 want to fight Trump to a draw when it comes 0:14:08.960 --> 0:14:10.760 to winning the hearts and minds. 0:14:10.440 --> 0:14:11.120 Of young men. 0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:14.679 So it looks like now that Joe Rogan's podcast is 0:14:14.760 --> 0:14:17.160 kind of going to be the arena for that battle 0:14:17.160 --> 0:14:20.640 to be fought, you know, ten fifteen days before voters 0:14:20.640 --> 0:14:21.280 go to the polls. 0:14:21.400 --> 0:14:23.360 Josh, last question. I'm not going to ask you to 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:26.600 make a prediction here, but given your reporting and what 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:29.880 you've heard from your visits around the country as you 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.800 report out your stories, is the election indeed as close 0:14:32.800 --> 0:14:33.880 as the polls are telling us? 0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:35.040 Yeah? 0:14:35.080 --> 0:14:37.120 I mean, I've been privy to a lot of private 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:40.680 polling from Democrats, Democratic groups, and some Republicans over the 0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:43.360 last couple of weeks. Everyone that I've seen shows the 0:14:43.440 --> 0:14:47.080 race to be absolutely as close as the public polls 0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:49.920 that we're seeing. So my assumption is that those polls 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:51.800 are largely accurate, and that we mean to not know 0:14:51.880 --> 0:14:53.920 for a day or even several days who the winner 0:14:53.920 --> 0:14:54.960 of the election actually is. 0:14:55.320 --> 0:14:57.880 All right, Josh Green, Hopefully we get him one more 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:01.920 time before polls close two weeks from tonight. Josh, really 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:04.320 appreciate you taking the time. Josh Green is Bloomberg Business 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:06.520 with National Corresponding. He's the author of the number one 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:09.120 New York Times bestseller Devil's Bargain, Steve benn and Donald 0:15:09.160 --> 0:15:11.760 Trump and the Storming of the Presidency. Also The Rebels 0:15:11.800 --> 0:15:14.760 Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, AFC and the Rise of the 0:15:14.880 --> 0:15:15.440 New Left. 0:15:22.240 --> 0:15:25.760 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us 0:15:25.800 --> 0:15:29.040 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen 0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:31.240 on Apple car Play and then brought Auto with a 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:35.400 Bloomberg Business Act or watch us Live on YouTube. 0:15:36.440 --> 0:15:39.720 I do want to give some some rough estimate, which 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:43.640 I think twenty to thirty percent vehicle growth next year, 0:15:45.280 --> 0:15:47.840 you know, notwithstanding negative external events. 0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:50.680 That's Elon Musk from this week's Tesla earnings call, as 0:15:50.680 --> 0:15:53.720 the company reported better than expected profits in the third quarter. 0:15:54.160 --> 0:15:57.040 Now Tesla's shares surge the most in more than three 0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.840 years after the carmaker reported surprisingly strong earning and forecast 0:16:01.200 --> 0:16:04.320 as much as thirty percent growth in vehicle sales next year. 0:16:04.400 --> 0:16:06.400 Elon's saying that on the earnings call. 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:09.440 The third quarter results were boosted by the cybertruk generating 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:12.760 a profit for the first time, lower material costs and 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:16.280 expanding energy business, and sales of regulatory credits to automakers 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:19.600 that need help complying with emission's limits. With more on 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:22.560 Tesla's surprisingly strong earnings, we were joined by Bloomberg News 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.280 Global Autos editor Craig Trudell. 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:27.600 Musk was in sort of rare form. I think you know, 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:31.960 you often can sort of can count on him being 0:16:32.440 --> 0:16:38.040 quite positive, and you know, sometimes he gives people reasons 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:41.120 to bid the stock up. Other times, you know, he's 0:16:41.240 --> 0:16:47.120 less careful. I think he wasn't necessarily careful. He at 0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:49.280 one point said something about, you know, I'm going to 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:53.120 take a risk and offer you know, this upbeat outlook 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:57.080 for next year. He also, you know, sort of couched 0:16:57.080 --> 0:17:02.440 this later on he talked about, you know, his forecast 0:17:02.520 --> 0:17:05.480 for how many cyber cabs they'll make, you know, a 0:17:05.480 --> 0:17:07.919 couple of years out as just his best guesses. So 0:17:09.040 --> 0:17:11.000 that being said, you know, there was a lot to 0:17:11.160 --> 0:17:13.840 like about this quarter in terms of, you know, sort 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:17.320 of the breadth of what went well. I think expectations 0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:20.399 were quite low in terms of what revenue and earnings 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:24.040 were going to be, and they beat expectations on a 0:17:24.080 --> 0:17:26.280 lot of metrics, and it was kind of widespread. It 0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:28.520 wasn't just the car business. They're doing well on the 0:17:28.640 --> 0:17:29.680 energy side as well. 0:17:30.040 --> 0:17:30.200 Well. 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:32.320 That's what I wondered, you know, Craig, is this a 0:17:32.400 --> 0:17:36.080 report where we were all managed so well going into 0:17:36.160 --> 0:17:40.040 it and had very low expectations, and so when Tesla 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:44.040 comes in stronger than forecast and above those low expectations. 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:46.679 We were all just like, WHOA really surprised? 0:17:46.840 --> 0:17:49.600 Or is this a report where Tessa the business is 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:50.840 actually doing well? 0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:52.760 I think it's a little bit of all the above. 0:17:52.800 --> 0:17:55.600 I mean, is it a you know, twenty one percent 0:17:55.720 --> 0:18:00.000 move up in the shares sort of report. I'm sure 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:01.639 oct by this, but you know, what do I know, 0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:06.320 I'm just a journalist. I think uh, I think it is. 0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:09.560 It is, you know, the case that the stock has 0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:12.520 has gotten, you know, roughed up a little bit the 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:15.680 last couple of weeks since the ROBOTAXI unveiling. I think 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:20.440 there was really high expectations going into that because Musk, 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:24.359 you know, had sort of spent months hyping up you know, 0:18:24.440 --> 0:18:26.840 all the work that they've done on AI and and 0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:30.240 you know years now on on self driving. Uh, and 0:18:30.480 --> 0:18:34.440 we don't actually have you know, necessarily clear indications that 0:18:34.840 --> 0:18:37.840 you know, some of the promises he's made or uh, 0:18:38.119 --> 0:18:41.760 you know predictions that he's made are close. You know, 0:18:41.840 --> 0:18:44.920 you you do. You don't have to look very far 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:48.479 to see you know, people who use the product that 0:18:48.520 --> 0:18:52.040 the company calls full self driving, you know, acting up 0:18:52.440 --> 0:18:55.800 not working so well. You know, they recognize some revenue 0:18:55.800 --> 0:18:59.600 this past quarter from deferred revenue related to that business. 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:01.640 And and you know, one of the features that they 0:19:01.760 --> 0:19:07.119 rolled out actually smart Summon, which is an interesting acronym. 0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:10.840 You know, we're seeing reports of people trying to summon 0:19:10.920 --> 0:19:13.720 their cars and parking lots and getting into scrapes, and so, 0:19:14.880 --> 0:19:17.840 you know, there's there's still you know, a lot left 0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:21.679 to be said about you know, just how much longer 0:19:21.760 --> 0:19:24.280 this company, you know, needs to work on this technology 0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:25.520 to get it to where it's safe. 0:19:25.680 --> 0:19:27.639 Hey, Craig, there were a lot of questions ahead of 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:29.840 the earnings call you about whether or not analysts would 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:34.840 ask any questions related to Elon Musk's political activities, the 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:37.680 seventy five million dollars he's given to the America pack 0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:41.359 and support of foreign President Donald Trump during this election cycle. 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:45.200 What did we hear from Musk on the call about 0:19:45.200 --> 0:19:48.080 a potential second Trump administration? How did he weigh in 0:19:48.119 --> 0:19:48.840 on politics? 0:19:49.240 --> 0:19:51.040 Yeah, it was it was interesting. I think you know, 0:19:51.160 --> 0:19:55.240 Tesla solicits investor questions, you know, going into these calls, 0:19:55.280 --> 0:19:58.359 and there were a lot of questions submitted having to 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:02.760 do with politics and wanting to you know hear Musk 0:20:03.520 --> 0:20:07.120 address his support for Trump and just how outspoken he's been. 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:12.000 He didn't utter Trump's name at once, which was a 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.960 little surprising to me. But he did allude to this 0:20:15.080 --> 0:20:17.840 idea of, you know, maybe if he were to be 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:22.480 appointed the head of the government efficiency department that he 0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:25.639 and Trump talked about on X a while back, and 0:20:25.720 --> 0:20:30.280 maybe he would work on you know, national rules for 0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:34.200 getting robotaxis on the road. So he sort of gave 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:37.560 investors a little bit of a taste of how he would, 0:20:37.640 --> 0:20:39.760 you know, potentially be able to tip the scales after 0:20:40.800 --> 0:20:43.960 after becoming such a huge benefactor of Donald. 0:20:43.720 --> 0:20:47.359 Trump, investors who wanted something today got better than expected 0:20:47.400 --> 0:20:50.280 profit and guidance for growth on deliveries and deliveries that 0:20:50.359 --> 0:20:53.520 was from Gene Munster over a deep water asset management. 0:20:53.600 --> 0:20:56.199 He said, the long term investors got the golden carrot. 0:20:56.600 --> 0:20:59.480 So is the golden carrot on the delivery numbers? 0:20:59.560 --> 0:20:59.960 Is that what it is? 0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:02.560 I think that was a big one. I mean, you know, 0:21:02.880 --> 0:21:06.360 there's there's I think real legitimate concern as to whether 0:21:06.440 --> 0:21:09.120 or not the company will deliver more cars this year 0:21:09.160 --> 0:21:11.960 than it did last year. You know, through the first 0:21:12.000 --> 0:21:15.920 three quarters of the year that that the deliveries are down, 0:21:16.080 --> 0:21:19.960 and they're going to need a real substantial jump in 0:21:20.040 --> 0:21:23.040 the fourth quarter to get to where they're They're positive. 0:21:23.920 --> 0:21:26.840 I think the company surprised people by saying they do 0:21:26.960 --> 0:21:30.080 expect some slight growth for this year, so they're really 0:21:30.080 --> 0:21:33.280 going to have to finish strong and then twenty to 0:21:33.320 --> 0:21:36.800 thirty percent. I think, you know, that sounds great. I 0:21:36.840 --> 0:21:39.680 didn't necessarily get, you know, a strong sense of how 0:21:39.760 --> 0:21:42.919 exactly this company is going to pull that off, because 0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:46.760 they have not specified what sort of product is coming 0:21:47.480 --> 0:21:50.080 that that could possibly you know, paste that. 0:21:50.400 --> 0:21:53.720 What about the affordable more affordable car that was promised, 0:21:53.720 --> 0:21:55.920 and what was the first half of twenty twenty five. 0:21:56.000 --> 0:21:57.440 Didn't we kind of say something about that. 0:21:57.960 --> 0:22:02.560 He's alluded generally to new vehicles, including more affordable models, 0:22:02.640 --> 0:22:06.200 but what those models are, we have no idea. It's 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:08.320 not going to be a twenty five thousand dollars Tesla 0:22:08.359 --> 0:22:10.960 with a steering wheel and pedals, because he was very 0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:15.240 dismissive of a question posed about that. So I, you know, 0:22:15.280 --> 0:22:16.840 I think I think it's pretty clear at this point 0:22:16.840 --> 0:22:19.400 they're going to you know, refresh the model Y and 0:22:19.640 --> 0:22:22.119 you know, maybe offer some cheaper versions of of the 0:22:22.119 --> 0:22:24.440 model y and the Model three and are counting on 0:22:25.560 --> 0:22:28.320 you know that that, you know, getting growth going again. 0:22:28.520 --> 0:22:30.359 And we know Carol that steering wheels and pedals are 0:22:30.400 --> 0:22:32.480 not the future. 0:22:31.840 --> 0:22:34.879 So I'm thinking it's a cheaper cyber truck like you 0:22:34.920 --> 0:22:36.280 get into like discounted version. 0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:39.040 I don't know, No, that's definitely coming to it's got too. 0:22:39.200 --> 0:22:40.719 Yeah, good stuff. 0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:43.399 Craig Drudale, Thank you so much, Global Autos editor at 0:22:43.440 --> 0:22:46.639 Bloomberg News. Joining us from our bureau in London. 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:47.280 Now. 0:22:47.359 --> 0:22:52.040 One especially vocal Tesla shareholder, cyber truck owner, and frequent 0:22:52.080 --> 0:22:55.240 guest on our air is Ross Gerber. He's the co founder, 0:22:55.320 --> 0:22:59.600 president CEO Gerbert Kawasaki Wealth and investment management. Ross in 0:22:59.600 --> 0:23:02.719 recent has expressed doubts about Tesla's ability to meet its 0:23:02.800 --> 0:23:06.760 sales goals, dismissing bullish claims about the company's robotics and 0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:10.280 self driving technology. Well, he joined us right after Tesla's 0:23:10.359 --> 0:23:12.280 latest earnings release on Wednesday. 0:23:12.880 --> 0:23:16.439 You know, really Tesla runs into the problem of cannibalizing 0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:19.720 its other cars, and that I think is what's causing 0:23:19.800 --> 0:23:21.840 them to pause. Now, what I've been saying is if 0:23:22.040 --> 0:23:24.480 they would have put a steering wheel on that robocab. 0:23:24.760 --> 0:23:25.760 It would have been a much. 0:23:25.560 --> 0:23:29.959 More exciting launch for me and I think for customers 0:23:30.480 --> 0:23:33.240 knowing that this two seater, cheaper car could be something 0:23:33.280 --> 0:23:36.320 we could actually just buy and drive. The robotaxi business 0:23:36.359 --> 0:23:38.600 is not a business that I'm excited about. It's not 0:23:38.680 --> 0:23:41.240 really what I think Tesla should be doing. There already 0:23:41.280 --> 0:23:45.120 are robotaxes that exist called Weimo, and Uber is already 0:23:45.119 --> 0:23:49.000 the master of transportation. So to me, Tesla should be 0:23:49.000 --> 0:23:52.200 selling EV's focusing on making great evs with great software 0:23:52.960 --> 0:23:56.080 and not trying to pivot into being some sort of 0:23:56.160 --> 0:23:59.000 robo taxi company. But you know, once again, I think 0:23:59.000 --> 0:24:00.640 people want to buy the car, and if they worried 0:24:00.680 --> 0:24:02.520 about selling the cars, they'll do just fine. 0:24:02.760 --> 0:24:08.200 Russ elon Musk and politics. He's donated, He's one of 0:24:08.240 --> 0:24:12.240 the largest donors to the Trump candidacy, to the Trump campaign. 0:24:12.680 --> 0:24:16.120 He's got his America Political Action Committee as super Pack, 0:24:16.880 --> 0:24:21.400 He's become incredibly active. I'm wondering, from the perspective of business, 0:24:21.600 --> 0:24:25.040 if in a time when we're so divided as a nation, 0:24:25.760 --> 0:24:28.360 if taking such a clear stance and doing so much 0:24:28.400 --> 0:24:30.960 to elect one candidate is a risk to the company. 0:24:33.200 --> 0:24:36.960 Yes, of course, you know why are you laugh strategic? 0:24:37.880 --> 0:24:41.120 Well, because I think it's an absurd risk to put 0:24:41.160 --> 0:24:45.439 your company in that you could avoid. Right, So, you know, 0:24:45.680 --> 0:24:47.960 I've personally tried to stay out of this election. I 0:24:47.960 --> 0:24:51.560 don't get any positive from my clients expressing my liberal opinions, 0:24:51.560 --> 0:24:54.160 which are liberal, and you know, I think people who 0:24:54.200 --> 0:24:57.080 work at my firm know that. And but you know, 0:24:57.160 --> 0:25:00.000 as a business person, it doesn't really serve. My purpose 0:25:00.160 --> 0:25:03.760 has to espouse my liberal beliefs on everybody. And that said, 0:25:04.320 --> 0:25:07.520 Elon's extremely right wing beliefs turn. 0:25:07.320 --> 0:25:08.600 Off a lot of his core demo. 0:25:08.680 --> 0:25:11.000 Now a lot of people don't believe that's happening, but 0:25:11.160 --> 0:25:12.879 I mean, look at what the effort they have to 0:25:12.920 --> 0:25:15.320 do to sell a car today, and they still refuse 0:25:15.359 --> 0:25:16.080 to advertise. 0:25:16.160 --> 0:25:20.200 So taking this stance for Elon is kind. 0:25:20.040 --> 0:25:23.159 Of a lose lose for TESLA because if Trump wins, 0:25:23.280 --> 0:25:25.920 he doesn't give a crap about EV's. He supports oil, 0:25:26.160 --> 0:25:28.280 and Elon's gonna learn about Trump, which. 0:25:28.080 --> 0:25:30.720 Is that he's a liar. And so all this. 0:25:30.720 --> 0:25:33.399 Money Elon's putting into Trump to hopefully have some power, 0:25:35.440 --> 0:25:36.920 he's gonna learn the hard. 0:25:36.720 --> 0:25:39.399 Way about Trump. Just asked Juliani. 0:25:39.760 --> 0:25:44.159 So that's a lose, and if Trump loses, it's a 0:25:44.280 --> 0:25:48.520 disaster for Elon just personally and for his personal brand 0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:51.480 and for everything that he's been working on. And it 0:25:51.560 --> 0:25:54.800 really puts Tesla in a tough position because the administration 0:25:54.920 --> 0:25:57.240 isn't going to do anything to help them, that's for sure. 0:25:57.880 --> 0:26:00.960 So I don't I don't get it other than I guess. 0:26:00.840 --> 0:26:03.560 He thinks the America is in this horrible place, but 0:26:03.600 --> 0:26:06.120 the stock market's hitting all the time highs every day, 0:26:06.160 --> 0:26:08.040 and I think America is in a wonderful place. 0:26:08.200 --> 0:26:10.080 But it's all a matter of perception. 0:26:09.800 --> 0:26:10.040 You know. 0:26:10.480 --> 0:26:14.240 And I think this is the most political I've ever 0:26:14.280 --> 0:26:16.240 seen a CEO. And that's one of the reasons we've 0:26:16.280 --> 0:26:18.560 lowered our position in Tesla is we do think it 0:26:18.600 --> 0:26:22.520 affects sales and affects the brand and ultimately margins. And 0:26:22.800 --> 0:26:25.800 we're excited about margins going up instead of going down 0:26:25.920 --> 0:26:28.879 for a quarter, which is great news, you know. But 0:26:29.000 --> 0:26:31.560 this is coming from the fact that the car market 0:26:31.640 --> 0:26:34.359 is so difficult that the cost of goods has gone down, 0:26:34.680 --> 0:26:37.439 not because Tesla is making more margin because people are 0:26:37.440 --> 0:26:39.040 willing to pay more for a Tesla. 0:26:39.080 --> 0:26:41.040 I want to talk a little bit more about Elon Musk. 0:26:41.240 --> 0:26:44.240 Matt Levine calls it the attention auction that you know, 0:26:44.440 --> 0:26:48.760 there's just a lot of things competing for Elon Musk's attention. 0:26:48.960 --> 0:26:51.480 And this has been discussed before, but I am curious 0:26:51.480 --> 0:26:55.119 to hear your opinion on whether or not the fact 0:26:55.119 --> 0:26:58.800 that Elon is so spread thin across these different efforts, 0:26:59.400 --> 0:27:01.600 how you're thinking about that when you're taking to look 0:27:01.600 --> 0:27:02.560 at your Tesla position. 0:27:02.840 --> 0:27:04.720 Well, this is probably one of the biggest issues is 0:27:04.760 --> 0:27:07.760 he doesn't actually work at Tesla, you know, like you 0:27:07.800 --> 0:27:09.840 go to work at your company every day like you're 0:27:09.920 --> 0:27:12.679 the CEO. I don't think that's what he does. And 0:27:12.720 --> 0:27:15.080 I don't think that Elon gets more hours in a 0:27:15.200 --> 0:27:17.560 day than you or I do. So he might sleep 0:27:17.600 --> 0:27:20.159 four hours a day instead of eight. Well, you know 0:27:20.200 --> 0:27:21.840 where that's going to cost him is at the end 0:27:21.840 --> 0:27:24.359 of his life, because it's super unhealthy to live this way. 0:27:24.840 --> 0:27:27.000 You know, there's this sort of opinion that he has 0:27:27.040 --> 0:27:28.440 some superhuman ability. 0:27:28.560 --> 0:27:29.200 He doesn't. 0:27:29.359 --> 0:27:32.480 So he's spending his time working for Trump right now 0:27:32.680 --> 0:27:35.240 and doing politics, and he's not spending his time getting 0:27:35.240 --> 0:27:37.960 his full self driving to work, which it still doesn't 0:27:38.119 --> 0:27:42.360 and So this is really the issue for me as 0:27:42.359 --> 0:27:46.639 an investor is shouldn't the CEO of your company be 0:27:46.800 --> 0:27:50.399 there every day or at least pretend you know. And 0:27:50.440 --> 0:27:53.760 then the second thing is this lack of attention to 0:27:53.840 --> 0:27:56.480 what needs to be done, especially around full self driving, 0:27:57.080 --> 0:28:00.879 is really troubling to me because I s the competitors 0:28:00.920 --> 0:28:03.359 all over the place. I'm here in the heart of 0:28:03.520 --> 0:28:07.800 EVS right and Rohogue Taxis, They're everywhere. They're working in 0:28:07.840 --> 0:28:11.440 extremely difficult driving conditions that my cyber truck can't even 0:28:11.440 --> 0:28:12.520 come close to tackling. 0:28:12.720 --> 0:28:13.040 Russ. 0:28:13.240 --> 0:28:15.600 We gotta go, We gotta let you get back to work. 0:28:15.600 --> 0:28:17.960 We do appreciate you joining us. It's always a treat 0:28:18.080 --> 0:28:20.639 when you are on our air, especially post test learnings. 0:28:20.680 --> 0:28:23.600 Ros Gerber, President and CEO of at Gerber Kawasaki Wealth 0:28:23.600 --> 0:28:24.600 and Investment Management. 0:28:26.160 --> 0:28:30.000 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Listen live 0:28:30.119 --> 0:28:33.320 each weekday starting at two pm Eastern on applecar Play 0:28:33.320 --> 0:28:36.200 and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business ad. You can 0:28:36.240 --> 0:28:39.479 also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New 0:28:39.520 --> 0:28:43.160 York station, Just say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:28:44.360 --> 0:28:45.320 The European Central. 0:28:45.120 --> 0:28:47.960 Bank recently lowered interest rates for the third time this year, 0:28:48.000 --> 0:28:50.840 as a hastier retreat in inflation allowed it to offer 0:28:50.880 --> 0:28:54.160 support to the regions stuttering economy. We got some economic 0:28:54.240 --> 0:28:57.360 news just this past week on showing how the European 0:28:57.480 --> 0:28:58.440 Zone is struggling. 0:28:58.720 --> 0:29:02.440 In an exclusive interview with Bloomberg, ECB President Christine Laguard 0:29:02.600 --> 0:29:05.240 said that the bank is quote rather satisfied with how 0:29:05.280 --> 0:29:08.200 inflation is slowed below the two percent goal, but that 0:29:08.240 --> 0:29:12.520 the central bank will remain cautious and not jump to conclusions. 0:29:12.080 --> 0:29:12.720 At the moment. 0:29:13.440 --> 0:29:16.440 We are not totally unhappy with what we see, because 0:29:16.520 --> 0:29:21.560 it looks very much that inflation is on the right 0:29:21.680 --> 0:29:25.560 track of des inflation. You know, we come from very 0:29:25.640 --> 0:29:28.680 high numbers, as high on average for the whole of 0:29:28.680 --> 0:29:31.640 the euro Area as ten point six percent, and the 0:29:31.760 --> 0:29:35.280 latest reading we had for the inflation in September was 0:29:35.320 --> 0:29:37.720 one point seven and we're looking at a lot of 0:29:37.840 --> 0:29:42.040 data to make sure that this disinflationary process continues to 0:29:42.600 --> 0:29:43.520 be well on track. 0:29:43.720 --> 0:29:47.480 That was ECB President Christine Laguard speaking exclusively on Bloomberg 0:29:47.480 --> 0:29:49.000 Television in Washington, DC. 0:29:49.280 --> 0:29:51.200 We get another view on the rate cut in Europe 0:29:51.240 --> 0:29:54.880 and more specifically the Economy of Italy with Alessandra Petzeli, 0:29:55.240 --> 0:29:58.560 Deputy Governor of the Bank of Italy, the Italian Central Bank, 0:29:58.800 --> 0:30:01.680 Tim and Bloomberg's Emily Garfao began with her take on 0:30:01.720 --> 0:30:03.960 the easy B decision to cut rates. 0:30:04.160 --> 0:30:07.560 Well, you know, this was expected and follows like a 0:30:07.720 --> 0:30:12.320 very long period of unprecedent, you know, very restricting monetary 0:30:12.960 --> 0:30:16.400 policy that has taken us in twenty two, twenty twenty 0:30:16.400 --> 0:30:21.520 three to an unprecedent situation since the Euro was introduced. 0:30:21.680 --> 0:30:25.240 So it's kind of too soon to understand how this 0:30:25.400 --> 0:30:29.160 is going to play both for the banks and for 0:30:29.600 --> 0:30:32.160 the system as a whole, for the stability of the 0:30:32.200 --> 0:30:34.760 system as a whole. What I can say is that 0:30:35.040 --> 0:30:38.520 this was expected and we will see how, you know, 0:30:38.600 --> 0:30:41.960 it goes forward in the coming in the coming months. 0:30:42.200 --> 0:30:46.160 It's clearly a situation that has been quite interesting for 0:30:46.240 --> 0:30:51.240 supervisors like myself. You know, we have been seeing banks 0:30:51.440 --> 0:30:56.480 making unprecedent you know, profitability in the last years they 0:30:56.520 --> 0:31:00.320 were rocket high, something that has of course created a 0:31:00.520 --> 0:31:04.880 number of impacts on the market and has you know, 0:31:04.960 --> 0:31:07.840 given us supervisors a little bit of a red flag 0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:11.040 on everything like credit risk and liquidity risks, and these 0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:15.520 are the issues that right now are under the limelight 0:31:15.880 --> 0:31:20.400 of the ECB, the SSM ARM which is the supervisory 0:31:20.520 --> 0:31:23.960 arm of the ECB, and of course also Bankavilly that 0:31:24.040 --> 0:31:27.760 participates to the Eurozone and in the SSM. 0:31:28.560 --> 0:31:29.160 So we know that. 0:31:29.200 --> 0:31:32.680 Spain, Portugal and Greece are among the countries helping you 0:31:32.760 --> 0:31:35.760 keep the Eurozone out of a recession. How would you 0:31:35.800 --> 0:31:38.080 describe the economy in Italy right now? 0:31:38.480 --> 0:31:42.000 Well, right now, what we've see is, you know, the 0:31:42.400 --> 0:31:47.400 economy is being growing, you know, in the last year. 0:31:48.320 --> 0:31:52.320 Predictions are you also bring in the economy steadily? I 0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:56.800 would say for the next quarters. The banking system in 0:31:56.840 --> 0:32:01.719 Italy has been strong and able to support the economy 0:32:02.120 --> 0:32:04.240 and this is due to the work that has been 0:32:04.320 --> 0:32:07.200 done you know in the last years together with the SSM. 0:32:07.360 --> 0:32:11.360 So we are looking at a you know, with some 0:32:11.480 --> 0:32:17.880 positive expectations as to the next quarter. So I would 0:32:17.920 --> 0:32:21.719 say that between Spain, Portugal and Italy we are you know, 0:32:21.880 --> 0:32:23.600 pretty much going the same direction. 0:32:23.960 --> 0:32:25.840 What about when it comes to immigration in Italy? This 0:32:25.880 --> 0:32:28.080 is a huge topic here in the US ahead of 0:32:28.080 --> 0:32:32.320 the presidential election. Our own Bloomberg News team reporting that 0:32:32.920 --> 0:32:35.680 Italian prime Minister Georgia Milleni's government is pushing through new 0:32:35.760 --> 0:32:39.720 legislation to salvage it's controversial plan to curb undocumented migration 0:32:39.800 --> 0:32:42.200 after a court blocked to project to divert asylum seekers 0:32:42.200 --> 0:32:44.680 to Albania. How do you look at the role of 0:32:45.320 --> 0:32:48.880 documented migrants and undocumented migrants in the Italian economy? 0:32:49.480 --> 0:32:53.719 Well, this is a very difficult issue. That's difficult in Italy, 0:32:53.840 --> 0:32:56.360 you know, given also the fact that we have you know, 0:32:56.840 --> 0:33:01.200 borders that can be easily sort of you know, penetrated, 0:33:01.280 --> 0:33:04.080 and this has been an issue that has been brought 0:33:04.120 --> 0:33:08.400 by a number of our governments at European and European level. 0:33:09.800 --> 0:33:12.480 We are I think that we are in the process 0:33:12.560 --> 0:33:16.400 of understanding and this issue of you know, uh, catering 0:33:16.480 --> 0:33:21.720 for external aid in order to take care of undocumented 0:33:22.040 --> 0:33:25.600 immigrants is on you know, as being very much wanted 0:33:25.600 --> 0:33:28.320 by the government. I know there right now there are 0:33:28.400 --> 0:33:32.200 some you know issues that also concern the judiciary is 0:33:32.240 --> 0:33:35.720 a ve that decision. We will see how it goes. 0:33:35.800 --> 0:33:39.160 For sure, this is something that europe needs to tackle together. 0:33:39.440 --> 0:33:42.160 I mean, there isn't something that every single country can 0:33:42.200 --> 0:33:45.160 take care of. It's a European issue. As much as 0:33:45.160 --> 0:33:46.240 an American issue. 0:33:46.320 --> 0:33:48.480 That's it's interesting, That's that's my question because here in 0:33:48.480 --> 0:33:50.320 the US, I think it's fair to say, and you know, 0:33:50.320 --> 0:33:52.680 a lot of economist would agree, there are jobs that 0:33:53.520 --> 0:33:56.560 Americans who are born in America typically will not do 0:33:57.080 --> 0:34:01.240 in the United States, jobs that traditionally go to migrants 0:34:01.240 --> 0:34:05.000 and migrant labor. Do those jobs exist in Italy? 0:34:06.720 --> 0:34:10.000 More and more I would say yes. I think that 0:34:10.480 --> 0:34:13.719 Italians are not, you know, taking those jobs that were 0:34:13.760 --> 0:34:19.239 traditionally there for maybe you know, lower income classes and 0:34:19.320 --> 0:34:24.560 lower income people. It's slowly becoming the same as it 0:34:24.680 --> 0:34:28.640 is here, maybe not with the rhythm and with the 0:34:28.680 --> 0:34:31.239 growth you know, they have seen and experienced in the 0:34:31.800 --> 0:34:32.520 United States. 0:34:34.280 --> 0:34:38.680 I want to pivot to financial regulation because Bloomberg News 0:34:38.760 --> 0:34:42.960 is Laura Nonan had written earlier in October that Germany, France, 0:34:43.239 --> 0:34:46.120 and Italy had urged the EU to show restraint in 0:34:46.200 --> 0:34:51.279 financial roommaking and instead focus on boosting the competitives competitiveness 0:34:51.320 --> 0:34:54.239 of the banking sector. That was the Treasury, and so 0:34:54.280 --> 0:34:57.120 we're wondering if the Bank of Italy kind of shares 0:34:57.280 --> 0:35:00.400 that stance when it comes to balancing competition relation. 0:35:01.080 --> 0:35:03.920 Well, I think that if we look at the last 0:35:03.960 --> 0:35:07.759 couple of years and what happened in Switzerland and what 0:35:07.960 --> 0:35:11.560 happened with the US regional banks, we clearly see that 0:35:11.600 --> 0:35:15.560 there has to be a balance between regulation and competition. 0:35:15.680 --> 0:35:21.080 But regulation is we believe, you know, the most important tool, 0:35:21.120 --> 0:35:24.640 together with supervision in order to keep you know, financial 0:35:24.640 --> 0:35:28.719 stability in the eurosystem. And you know, I think that 0:35:28.800 --> 0:35:34.040 we prove that the full implementation of Basil three has 0:35:34.080 --> 0:35:38.439 given it to supervisors a harmonized set of schemes of 0:35:38.680 --> 0:35:44.080 you know, reporting that has been extremely helpful in the 0:35:44.239 --> 0:35:49.240 years that follow the crisis of twenty oh seven twenty eight. Today, 0:35:49.440 --> 0:35:52.560 if you look at the European banking market, you see that, 0:35:52.600 --> 0:35:55.279 you know, the banks are very stable and able to 0:35:55.320 --> 0:35:58.400 support the economy, and that's exactly the job they should do. 0:35:58.760 --> 0:36:00.840 I want to talk a little bit inv and fintech 0:36:00.880 --> 0:36:04.799 in particular, because here in the United States you have 0:36:05.320 --> 0:36:07.520 regulators trying to figure out the role that fintech should 0:36:07.520 --> 0:36:10.520 play when it comes compared to big banks. For example, 0:36:11.239 --> 0:36:13.040 what do you think the priorities for the next Commission 0:36:13.040 --> 0:36:15.000 should be when it comes to the future of finance 0:36:15.000 --> 0:36:17.440 When it comes to fintech companies that I speak of. 0:36:17.760 --> 0:36:21.800 Well, in Europe, we definitely have to complete the capital 0:36:21.840 --> 0:36:25.279 market union. That is very very instrumental to you know, 0:36:25.440 --> 0:36:28.680 innovation because it creates all the you know, the financial 0:36:29.440 --> 0:36:35.040 tools to finance innovation. What we see happening in Italy 0:36:35.160 --> 0:36:38.239 right now that the competition is shifting, you know, it's 0:36:38.280 --> 0:36:41.560 not among banks anymore, but it's also between banks and 0:36:41.719 --> 0:36:46.400 those tech companies that come from other sides. 0:36:46.239 --> 0:36:50.040 Of other industry. Here in the US, it's the same. 0:36:49.760 --> 0:36:52.080 As in the US, and there's a lot also coming 0:36:52.080 --> 0:36:55.600 from the payment system industry. So if we look at 0:36:55.640 --> 0:36:57.960 the number of licenses that we've been granting in the 0:36:58.000 --> 0:37:02.440 last few years out of like say eighty seven two 0:37:02.600 --> 0:37:05.719 or for banks and eighty five for other type of 0:37:05.760 --> 0:37:11.240 financial institutions. So the thing is really how do banks 0:37:11.280 --> 0:37:14.640 cope with legacy when it comes to the it, you know, 0:37:14.680 --> 0:37:18.879 with it legacy and how also they are entering more 0:37:18.880 --> 0:37:22.160 and more into contracts with third parties, providers that come 0:37:22.200 --> 0:37:26.240 from like tech industry, and they're becoming extremely relevant also 0:37:26.280 --> 0:37:29.960 for the kind of concentration you know, in the European market. 0:37:30.160 --> 0:37:31.480 But do you think your colleagues and do you think 0:37:31.520 --> 0:37:33.840 regulators in Italy are doing the right thing when it 0:37:33.880 --> 0:37:36.080 comes to embracing this technology. 0:37:36.680 --> 0:37:37.000 I think. 0:37:37.080 --> 0:37:39.839 So we have had a lot of changes, you know, 0:37:39.920 --> 0:37:42.520 within our own institution in order to cope with this, 0:37:42.680 --> 0:37:45.400 you know, and created a way to talk to the 0:37:45.480 --> 0:37:49.800 market and understanding of what kind of regulation is needed. 0:37:51.160 --> 0:37:54.160 The European Commission has issued a number of vertical and 0:37:54.200 --> 0:37:58.719 horizontal regulation that are extremely interesting and that we are 0:37:58.760 --> 0:38:03.120 now implementing their and trying to organize sort of innovation 0:38:03.239 --> 0:38:07.040 in a way which does not create instability at the market. 0:38:07.040 --> 0:38:08.880 But at the same time, we don't want to stiffle it. 0:38:09.200 --> 0:38:12.439 We want newcomers, we want innovation, we want to create 0:38:12.520 --> 0:38:13.200 new industry. 0:38:13.719 --> 0:38:16.239 We're talking about fintech and an issue that comes up 0:38:16.239 --> 0:38:20.520 a lot is cybersecurity, and I'm wondering how the ECB 0:38:20.719 --> 0:38:25.960 plays a role in protecting both consumers and corporations, including banks, 0:38:25.960 --> 0:38:27.480 from this emerging threat. 0:38:28.040 --> 0:38:32.320 Well, there are now a couple of peace of legislation 0:38:32.440 --> 0:38:36.200 that have been put together in the EU that look 0:38:36.280 --> 0:38:41.560 after explicity, after a security of infrastructure, and that is 0:38:41.640 --> 0:38:44.160 of course, you know, an issue that concerns banks, but 0:38:44.200 --> 0:38:48.840 concerns also utilities and other important networks of the country. 0:38:49.160 --> 0:38:51.840 The one thing that you know, it's very important. The 0:38:51.960 --> 0:38:54.919 kind of risk that we're looking at is how interconnected 0:38:54.960 --> 0:38:58.439 the platforms are becoming and how this role of third 0:38:58.480 --> 0:39:03.359 party providers are are is you know, increasingly important when 0:39:03.400 --> 0:39:09.320 it comes to create you know, new ability for companies, 0:39:09.320 --> 0:39:12.480 for banks to provide these services. So I think this 0:39:12.600 --> 0:39:17.160 is main top issue on the U legislator agenda and 0:39:17.200 --> 0:39:17.840 on ours. 0:39:18.160 --> 0:39:20.760 We have a story by our team here at Bloomberg 0:39:20.800 --> 0:39:24.360 News about central makers losing sleep over europe souring economies. 0:39:24.400 --> 0:39:28.359 Have another worry looming large, how much more damage Donald 0:39:28.360 --> 0:39:29.920 Trump could cause if he returns to. 0:39:29.840 --> 0:39:30.439 The White House. 0:39:30.680 --> 0:39:32.520 We're two weeks away from the election here in the US. 0:39:32.520 --> 0:39:33.319 How are you watching it? 0:39:33.719 --> 0:39:37.480 Well, you know, we concern like everybody else. And I 0:39:37.520 --> 0:39:40.239 think that you know, one of the issues for US 0:39:40.280 --> 0:39:44.440 regulators is that you know, deregulation will see what happened 0:39:44.440 --> 0:39:46.640 with the US regional banks. You know, there are huge 0:39:46.640 --> 0:39:50.640 banks compared to European size, and you know, the the 0:39:50.719 --> 0:39:54.279 lack of application of Basil three, the sort of like 0:39:54.360 --> 0:40:00.560 the light touch supervision. I think it's something that worries 0:40:00.920 --> 0:40:04.480 the international markets. You know, the you don't need to 0:40:04.520 --> 0:40:09.400 be a non internationally active bank in order to create 0:40:09.400 --> 0:40:13.160 a wave that touches and other countries and other industries. 0:40:13.520 --> 0:40:15.919 So your concern is mostly about regulation when it comes 0:40:15.960 --> 0:40:17.239 to smaller banks in in. 0:40:18.040 --> 0:40:21.880 You know, I would say so, yes, definitely, that is 0:40:21.920 --> 0:40:26.040 an area that has been clearly, you know, something that 0:40:26.200 --> 0:40:30.560 has created concern in last year when you know, Silicon 0:40:30.640 --> 0:40:35.200 Valley Bank and the other regional banks that didn't hit 0:40:35.560 --> 0:40:38.279 the press too much, but we knew about it, and 0:40:38.360 --> 0:40:41.080 this is of course something that we don't know whether 0:40:41.160 --> 0:40:44.439 there can be a contagent, you know, and how that's 0:40:44.480 --> 0:40:47.160 going to work. Also going towards Europe. 0:40:47.400 --> 0:40:50.480 Alessandro Petzzlli, Wuty Governor of the Bank of Italy, the 0:40:50.520 --> 0:40:54.560 Italian Central Bank, Joining us here in the Bloomberg BusinessWeek Studio. 0:41:00.080 --> 0:41:03.600 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us 0:41:03.640 --> 0:41:06.880 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen 0:41:06.920 --> 0:41:09.080 on Apple car Play and then brought auto with a 0:41:09.080 --> 0:41:14.880 Bloomberg Business act or watch us live on YouTube. 0:41:13.840 --> 0:41:15.719 Plenty ahead in our second hour of the weekend edition 0:41:15.760 --> 0:41:19.080 of Bloomberg Business Week, including the high schooler who kind 0:41:19.120 --> 0:41:22.040 of schooled us. He created a method to detect pesticide 0:41:22.040 --> 0:41:26.560 residue on produce using a handheld detector with some AI 0:41:26.640 --> 0:41:29.480 thrown in. We're just kind of liked Tim and I like, wait. 0:41:29.360 --> 0:41:31.279 What how old are you and what did you do? 0:41:32.080 --> 0:41:34.360 I truly every time I wash fruit or eat fruit, 0:41:34.400 --> 0:41:35.959 I think about his device and I want one. 0:41:36.000 --> 0:41:36.280 Plus. 0:41:36.320 --> 0:41:39.080 The CEO of Lifewave Foods on tapping into the dairy 0:41:39.120 --> 0:41:42.760 resurgence among American consumers Kafir anyone. 0:41:43.400 --> 0:41:44.920 I know, we're still trying to figure it out, right, it. 0:41:44.880 --> 0:41:46.319 Doesn't matter how you say it, it tastes good. 0:41:46.400 --> 0:41:47.239 Ah, nice to know. 0:41:47.520 --> 0:41:50.000 First up this hour, what started as a battery company 0:41:50.000 --> 0:41:53.320 in the nineteen nineties in Shenzhen, China has now become 0:41:53.360 --> 0:41:55.520 one of the best selling EV brands in the world. 0:41:55.800 --> 0:41:58.040 And now the company's startling growth has made it a 0:41:58.120 --> 0:42:01.640 global player, and that has sparked tariffs from the United 0:42:01.640 --> 0:42:03.000 States and the EU. 0:42:03.280 --> 0:42:06.640 We're talking about Chinese automaker BYD it stands for build 0:42:06.719 --> 0:42:09.520 your Dreams. They've seem to figure out something that the 0:42:09.560 --> 0:42:11.400 rest of the auto industry has not, and that is 0:42:11.600 --> 0:42:14.160 build an affordable EV for the masses. 0:42:14.239 --> 0:42:14.399 Yeah. 0:42:14.440 --> 0:42:16.600 I feel like that's the holy grail in the EV world. 0:42:16.840 --> 0:42:17.160 All right. 0:42:17.200 --> 0:42:19.319 This story is the cover of the upcoming new issue 0:42:19.320 --> 0:42:22.280 of Bloomberg Business Week and is by Bloomberg News auto 0:42:22.360 --> 0:42:25.760 reporter Gabby Coppola, who joined us to talk about China's 0:42:25.880 --> 0:42:26.759 EV offensive. 0:42:26.920 --> 0:42:30.360 BYD was founded in nineteen ninety five by a Chinese 0:42:30.360 --> 0:42:33.719 battery scientist named Wan Chuanfu. And he was basically a 0:42:33.719 --> 0:42:37.200 government researcher who saw that, you know, the Chinese economy 0:42:37.239 --> 0:42:39.400 was opening up, and he decided to move to Shenzen 0:42:39.520 --> 0:42:41.640 in the south of China, which is today kind of 0:42:41.719 --> 0:42:44.640 one of the like a Silicon valley of China. And 0:42:44.760 --> 0:42:48.520 he started out making batteries for mobile phones, but his 0:42:48.640 --> 0:42:49.520 dream was to. 0:42:49.960 --> 0:42:51.400 Electrify the auto industry. 0:42:51.440 --> 0:42:53.640 He always thought that you could make you know, battery 0:42:53.680 --> 0:42:57.480 powered vehicles, and it took a really long time from 0:42:57.560 --> 0:43:00.200 nineteen ninety five to up until about twenty twenty for 0:43:00.320 --> 0:43:03.080 him to make that a reality. But the story is 0:43:03.120 --> 0:43:05.760 really about how he did that. And you know buid 0:43:06.000 --> 0:43:09.200 because they are kind of the poster child for China's 0:43:09.200 --> 0:43:11.160 EV offensive around the world. I mean, they're not the 0:43:11.200 --> 0:43:13.960 only one by any means. There's lots of Chinese EV 0:43:14.080 --> 0:43:16.440 companies that are now trying to export around the world. 0:43:16.560 --> 0:43:18.840 You know, we see a lot in Europe but also 0:43:18.920 --> 0:43:22.440 in Southeast Asia, the BID is kind of the strongest 0:43:22.480 --> 0:43:24.640 and the biggest, and you know, they're the biggest EV 0:43:24.840 --> 0:43:28.160 seller in China. And I think because we're in this 0:43:28.239 --> 0:43:31.360 moment of trade war and talking about tariffs and tension 0:43:31.400 --> 0:43:33.880 with China, there's a tendency by people in the West 0:43:33.880 --> 0:43:36.040 to kind of think that, oh, this is all because 0:43:36.080 --> 0:43:38.360 of Chinese subsidies. And I'm not at all saying that 0:43:38.400 --> 0:43:41.280 there aren't Chinese subsidies involved. I mean, the Chinese economy 0:43:41.360 --> 0:43:43.919 is not a free market economy. There's a lot of protectionism, 0:43:44.239 --> 0:43:46.359 and the scale of subsidies that they use is much 0:43:46.400 --> 0:43:49.799 higher than what other, you know, free market democratic countries do. 0:43:50.320 --> 0:43:52.799 But if they were just subsidies, there would be twenty 0:43:52.840 --> 0:43:56.040 byds and there's really just one. And you know that 0:43:56.200 --> 0:43:58.840 is the due to the innovation and the sort of 0:43:58.960 --> 0:44:01.319 long term vision of Tuan Fu and the other key 0:44:01.360 --> 0:44:02.320 people in the company. 0:44:02.400 --> 0:44:04.480 Well, Gabby, get to it, because it does feel like 0:44:04.920 --> 0:44:07.040 the thing, the nut that they figured out how to crack, 0:44:07.080 --> 0:44:10.080 the holy grail, if you will, is to build an 0:44:10.080 --> 0:44:14.200 affordable EV for the masses, which we keep getting promises 0:44:14.239 --> 0:44:17.279 from the likes of Elon Musk and others, and yet 0:44:17.320 --> 0:44:20.839 it hasn't happened. BYD though figured it out. 0:44:21.080 --> 0:44:22.880 How is that? Is it just getting the cost of 0:44:22.920 --> 0:44:24.319 batteries down? What was it? 0:44:24.960 --> 0:44:27.040 You know, it's not just one things. I think it's 0:44:27.040 --> 0:44:29.040 a confluence of things. But you know, one thing I 0:44:29.120 --> 0:44:32.040 learned in researching this story, Carol, is that you know, 0:44:32.120 --> 0:44:34.040 we look at the US now and we say, oh, 0:44:34.160 --> 0:44:36.719 evs aren't taking off. Look at this, sales are down. 0:44:37.200 --> 0:44:39.640 China went through that too for like ten years. Like 0:44:39.840 --> 0:44:43.280 China also was engineering incentives. But the thing is BYD 0:44:43.440 --> 0:44:45.440 never stopped. I mean they had a vision to do 0:44:45.480 --> 0:44:47.440 this and they kept doing it when it was not popular, 0:44:47.480 --> 0:44:50.920 when they weren't selling. One thing that's really key is 0:44:51.000 --> 0:44:53.520 they also sell hybrids, so they're not like Tesla, where 0:44:53.560 --> 0:44:56.279 if EV demand drops, that's all they got. You know, 0:44:56.680 --> 0:44:58.880 if you got range anxiety, BYD's got to plug in 0:44:58.960 --> 0:45:01.600 hybrid for you. But I think the key, the key 0:45:01.640 --> 0:45:03.440 to what they've achieved is a lot of it has 0:45:03.480 --> 0:45:06.840 to do with vertical integration. You know, UBS did a 0:45:06.920 --> 0:45:09.640 report that their vehicles are twenty five percent cheaper to 0:45:09.719 --> 0:45:12.279 make than basically the rest of the auto industry, and 0:45:12.320 --> 0:45:13.799 a lot of that is because they make so many 0:45:13.800 --> 0:45:16.200 things themselves in the house. This is not just a battery, 0:45:16.239 --> 0:45:19.120 This is not just a car company. They make semiconductor chips, 0:45:19.120 --> 0:45:23.080 they make solar panels, they make components for consumer electronics 0:45:23.080 --> 0:45:27.040 for companies like Apple. I mean, they're manufacturing Titan really 0:45:27.080 --> 0:45:29.480 in China. But the other part of it is they 0:45:29.520 --> 0:45:31.640 had a battery breakthrough. Like I said, Wan Chuanfu is 0:45:31.640 --> 0:45:34.600 a battery scientist. And I think China gives a lot 0:45:34.680 --> 0:45:37.920 of subsidies for research and investment, you know, R and 0:45:38.000 --> 0:45:40.520 D and investment. That's a big part of their economy. 0:45:40.560 --> 0:45:43.279 And so I mean he I visited. I did visit 0:45:43.360 --> 0:45:45.560 their headquarters in chen Jin, and I felt like I 0:45:45.600 --> 0:45:48.879 was at an academic campus or like a national lab, 0:45:48.960 --> 0:45:51.319 because there was just the museum of what all the 0:45:51.360 --> 0:45:53.040 things they've invented and researched is. 0:45:53.400 --> 0:45:54.279 There's a lot there. 0:45:54.880 --> 0:45:57.080 What's the give us an idea of what's there apart 0:45:57.120 --> 0:45:59.440 from vehicles that we've seen pictures of because we know 0:45:59.480 --> 0:46:01.279 we're not driving these things here in the US. We'll 0:46:01.280 --> 0:46:02.840 get to that in just a minute. 0:46:02.760 --> 0:46:05.440 Right well, And keep in mind, like they're not letting 0:46:05.440 --> 0:46:08.200 an American journalist in to see behind the wall and 0:46:08.239 --> 0:46:10.520 see all their secrets. But I mean, one thing that 0:46:10.560 --> 0:46:12.520 Wan Chuanfu is very proud of is they always do 0:46:12.560 --> 0:46:15.239 this nail test where they have you go in the 0:46:15.360 --> 0:46:18.680 museum lobby area and there's this glass wall, and there's 0:46:18.920 --> 0:46:22.520 a lithium ion battery with nickel, and then there's the 0:46:22.520 --> 0:46:26.000 BID battery, which uses LFP or lithium iron phosphate. That's 0:46:26.040 --> 0:46:28.440 kind of a key part of their success is they 0:46:28.680 --> 0:46:31.960 decided early on to work with this battery chemistry LFP, 0:46:32.040 --> 0:46:35.120 which is more stable and less fire prone than the 0:46:35.239 --> 0:46:37.719 nickel based batteries we've seen the Koreans and everybody in 0:46:37.719 --> 0:46:40.240 the West using. So when you go into this museum, 0:46:40.640 --> 0:46:42.719 they have this like robot arm that comes down and 0:46:42.719 --> 0:46:45.239 sticks and nail right through the battery, and on the 0:46:45.320 --> 0:46:48.000 nickel side you see the thing explode, and on the 0:46:48.000 --> 0:46:52.239 bid LFP battery nothing happens. So that's like probably one 0:46:52.239 --> 0:46:55.520 of Wangwan Fu's greatest achievements is who's saying, look, I 0:46:55.560 --> 0:46:57.879 made this battery that you know can actually be used 0:46:57.880 --> 0:47:00.719 for long range vehicles, but it could and I and 0:47:00.840 --> 0:47:03.400 I look, they call it. They branded as the safe 0:47:03.400 --> 0:47:07.120 Thing No batteries A hundred percent you know, zero fire risk, 0:47:07.160 --> 0:47:08.680 and I think if you were to google you'd find 0:47:08.719 --> 0:47:12.080 that's true for BID two. But you know that is 0:47:12.120 --> 0:47:13.920 a key part of it. But the you know of 0:47:14.280 --> 0:47:20.240 suspension systems, you know, research on materials, polymers, so many things, 0:47:20.280 --> 0:47:23.080 I mean, the engineering, you know, all these things. But 0:47:23.200 --> 0:47:25.480 another thing I should mention in my story. You know 0:47:25.520 --> 0:47:28.200 what a scoop that we uncovered myself and our our 0:47:28.520 --> 0:47:30.719 you know star Apple or reporter Mark German, is that 0:47:30.800 --> 0:47:35.200 actually BID and Apple worked together, uh for a battery 0:47:35.239 --> 0:47:37.840 system for the Apple car when that project was still going. 0:47:37.920 --> 0:47:40.920 And our reporting showed that that work that Apple and 0:47:40.960 --> 0:47:44.920 BYD did together did influence and you know, impact somewhat 0:47:44.920 --> 0:47:47.200 of BID's own blade development, cause at one point both 0:47:47.239 --> 0:47:50.600 companies had access to this very similar technology. Apple decided 0:47:50.600 --> 0:47:52.480 to shelve it cause who wants to get into the 0:47:52.480 --> 0:47:55.000 car business these days, I guess, and BID was all 0:47:55.080 --> 0:47:57.399 went ran with it, you know. And to be clear, 0:47:57.520 --> 0:47:59.799 you know BYD developed the blade battery by themselves. There's 0:47:59.800 --> 0:48:02.399 no Apple ip in that blade battery. But the two 0:48:02.440 --> 0:48:04.279 companies work together. You had some of the best and 0:48:04.320 --> 0:48:07.759 brightest minds in this field working together, and BYD is 0:48:07.800 --> 0:48:10.279 the one that commercialized it, and now they're, you know, 0:48:10.360 --> 0:48:13.000 the biggest carmaker in China thanks in part to that 0:48:13.560 --> 0:48:14.440 battery breakthrough. 0:48:16.000 --> 0:48:20.359 I well, listen, you know, I my husband and I've 0:48:20.960 --> 0:48:23.840 been looking at EV's for a while and they're just 0:48:24.160 --> 0:48:27.880 crazy expensive and it's just hard to get it and 0:48:27.920 --> 0:48:29.279 I kind of want to do the right thing for 0:48:29.320 --> 0:48:30.000 the environment. 0:48:30.360 --> 0:48:31.520 Well, you're not going to get a bid. 0:48:31.800 --> 0:48:33.360 I'm not going to get a byd Listen. 0:48:33.440 --> 0:48:35.680 We only have about forty five seconds left hair Gabby 0:48:35.680 --> 0:48:39.040 and I highly recommend everybody check out the magazine because 0:48:39.080 --> 0:48:41.280 there's so much detail in this and it's a company 0:48:41.280 --> 0:48:44.360 that we talk about so much. Thirty forty seconds, so 0:48:44.600 --> 0:48:46.880 take away before we have to say goodbye. 0:48:46.560 --> 0:48:50.000 If the West, if US and Europe European companies want 0:48:50.000 --> 0:48:52.080 to compete with China, they have to be honest about 0:48:52.520 --> 0:48:54.719 what they're up against. And it's not just subsidies. It's 0:48:54.760 --> 0:48:59.320 a very competitive company. You know, we're down a few points, 0:48:59.640 --> 0:49:01.200 quite a few points in the fourth quarter, but the 0:49:01.239 --> 0:49:03.520 game's not over. There's still a chance. But you know, 0:49:03.640 --> 0:49:05.640 companies need to get honest with themselves about the kind 0:49:05.680 --> 0:49:08.400 of cultural change and technological change that needs to happen 0:49:08.680 --> 0:49:09.920 for them to compete with BID. 0:49:10.200 --> 0:49:12.239 I wonder how many automakers are somehow, you. 0:49:12.200 --> 0:49:16.239 Know, seruptitiously like getting a BYD car and pulling it 0:49:16.280 --> 0:49:19.600 apart and like understanding everything that's in it and trying 0:49:19.600 --> 0:49:21.280 to figure out what they need to do right. 0:49:21.640 --> 0:49:23.400 Gab Business and do it in teardowns. 0:49:23.480 --> 0:49:24.480 Yes, that's happening. 0:49:25.760 --> 0:49:29.440 Great reporting the Apple scoop too as well. Unbelievable Bloomberg 0:49:29.440 --> 0:49:32.400 News Auto reporter Gabby Copola. She's of course got the 0:49:32.400 --> 0:49:33.839 cover story of Bloomberg Business Week. 0:49:35.360 --> 0:49:39.200 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Podcast. Listen live 0:49:39.280 --> 0:49:42.120 each weekday starting at two pm Eastern on Apple car 0:49:42.239 --> 0:49:45.200 Play and Androyd Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You 0:49:45.239 --> 0:49:48.520 can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship 0:49:48.560 --> 0:49:52.360 New York station Just Say Alexa, playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:49:54.160 --> 0:49:57.080 Sticking with the automotive space, General Motors had its best 0:49:57.160 --> 0:49:59.720 day in four years this past week after it signaled 0:50:00.000 --> 0:50:03.120 colid us demand for its highest margin vehicles. Even as 0:50:03.120 --> 0:50:05.640 a broader auto market softens. 0:50:05.360 --> 0:50:08.480 Well, some rival automakers are cutting prices and boosting incentives 0:50:08.480 --> 0:50:10.920 to reduce inventory. GM has been able to hold the 0:50:10.960 --> 0:50:14.640 line on high demand vehicles like it's old school gas 0:50:14.680 --> 0:50:18.759 powered GMC Yukon suv and the Chevy Silverado pickup. For 0:50:18.800 --> 0:50:21.840 more on GM's success, Eligrafey and I spoke to Bloomberg 0:50:21.920 --> 0:50:23.280 News auto reporter Keith Notten. 0:50:23.680 --> 0:50:26.000 Well, they're making a lot of money in the home 0:50:26.040 --> 0:50:31.480 market with their traditional vehicles, with gas fueled pickup trucks 0:50:31.520 --> 0:50:36.480 and sport utility vehicles, and that's helping to offset losses 0:50:36.520 --> 0:50:40.040 that they have in electric vehicles, and losses that they 0:50:40.120 --> 0:50:43.719 have in China, and losses that they have with their 0:50:43.920 --> 0:50:48.280 autonomous unit crews. So they're selling a lot of traditional 0:50:48.400 --> 0:50:51.560 vehicles at high prices and high margins. 0:50:51.600 --> 0:50:55.120 Who's buying these vehicles? These are these cars? I mean, 0:50:55.120 --> 0:50:57.520 they're not as expensive as the evs, but these are 0:50:57.560 --> 0:50:58.880 expensive cars now. 0:50:59.400 --> 0:51:01.800 Well for sure. I mean, you know, cars average almost 0:51:01.840 --> 0:51:06.440 fifty thousand dollars these days in price and interest rates 0:51:06.440 --> 0:51:09.279 still remain sort of stubbornly high, though the FED has 0:51:10.000 --> 0:51:13.799 begun to lower rates that will hopefully pull down car 0:51:13.880 --> 0:51:18.200 loan rates. But you know, the American consumer, at least 0:51:18.280 --> 0:51:23.319 in GM's experiences, remaining incredibly resilient and continues to buy 0:51:23.960 --> 0:51:29.400 really well outfitted cars, which is, you know, driving profits 0:51:29.520 --> 0:51:31.920 up for them. And you know they, as you said, 0:51:31.960 --> 0:51:34.479 they raised their guidance. It's the third time this year 0:51:34.800 --> 0:51:38.440 that they've raised guidance. They've beat earnings estimates for seven 0:51:38.520 --> 0:51:43.000 quarters in a row, so consumers have not stopped buying cars. 0:51:43.760 --> 0:51:47.200 So is this more a story about the resiliency of 0:51:47.239 --> 0:51:51.680 the US consumer in general or is this a GM 0:51:52.040 --> 0:51:56.040 specific kind of I guess optimism. 0:51:56.640 --> 0:52:01.880 Well, GM is definitely out gunning its Troit rivals Ford 0:52:01.920 --> 0:52:05.800 and Stilantis. Neither of them have beat estimate seven quarters 0:52:05.800 --> 0:52:10.120 in a row and are not raising guidance. So you know, 0:52:10.239 --> 0:52:14.640 GM is doing especially well. But what new car buyers 0:52:14.640 --> 0:52:19.000 are buying these days are more well outfitted cars and 0:52:19.120 --> 0:52:22.600 larger cars that have higher sticker prices, and that has 0:52:22.680 --> 0:52:26.319 driven up margins. You know, everybody is expecting pricing to 0:52:26.440 --> 0:52:30.520 soften because inventories are finally replenished after you know the 0:52:30.560 --> 0:52:35.080 shortages of the pandemic era. But still consumers are paying 0:52:35.160 --> 0:52:36.360 up for new wheels. 0:52:36.640 --> 0:52:38.799 Hey, we got thirty seconds left, Keith. You know I'm 0:52:38.800 --> 0:52:43.000 going to go there. Evs How ugly is it for GM? 0:52:43.360 --> 0:52:46.759 Well, you know it's interesting with GM, Tim because they 0:52:46.840 --> 0:52:50.080 are coming out with lower priced evs like the Equinox, 0:52:50.400 --> 0:52:52.920 and those are really resonating because you know, they're not 0:52:53.040 --> 0:52:56.800 too expensive. So GM is having some success with its evs, 0:52:56.920 --> 0:52:59.920 and Mary Barrow, the CEO, said they're going to reduce 0:53:00.120 --> 0:53:03.040 those losses on ev substantially next year. 0:53:03.400 --> 0:53:08.640 Keith Notton, Bloomberg News Auto reporter, joining us from Detroit, Michigan. Keith, 0:53:09.120 --> 0:53:11.080 thanks for joining us. Always good to see you. General 0:53:11.080 --> 0:53:15.600 Motor shares hire by ten point three percent as we speak. 0:53:16.920 --> 0:53:20.440 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us 0:53:20.480 --> 0:53:23.680 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern. Listen 0:53:23.760 --> 0:53:25.920 on Apple car Play and and Brout Auto with a 0:53:25.960 --> 0:53:30.080 Bloomberg Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 0:53:30.680 --> 0:53:32.400 Well, you can find our next guest products in the 0:53:32.480 --> 0:53:36.480 dairy section of your local supermarket LifeWay known for its kaffir. 0:53:36.880 --> 0:53:39.920 You know what it's like that yogurt like drink compikable 0:53:40.000 --> 0:53:41.160 yogurts movie. 0:53:41.239 --> 0:53:43.279 Oh okay, it's kind of yeah, drinkable gotten. 0:53:43.880 --> 0:53:47.359 Sorry, maybe because you don't have critics young critters. 0:53:47.120 --> 0:53:49.879 Right, I have older critters older. 0:53:50.840 --> 0:53:53.560 It's a bubbly traded company about Foydard million dollar market 0:53:53.600 --> 0:53:56.239 cap but Julius and Lanski is the second generation of 0:53:56.239 --> 0:53:58.960 her family to run the company after her father started 0:53:59.000 --> 0:54:01.040 it and took it pup like a couple years later 0:54:01.200 --> 0:54:04.880 on the Nasdaq. Julia is chairman, president and CEO of LifeWay. 0:54:04.920 --> 0:54:08.400 She joins us from Los Angeles. Julie, how are you welcome? 0:54:09.480 --> 0:54:09.719 Good? 0:54:09.800 --> 0:54:11.120 Thank you so much for having me. 0:54:11.280 --> 0:54:13.279 Yeah, thanks for joining us. You've got a really cool 0:54:13.320 --> 0:54:16.080 story and the company is a really interesting one because 0:54:16.080 --> 0:54:19.160 it's not often that you find publicly traded firms that 0:54:19.239 --> 0:54:24.120 have such a narrow focus in terms of products. Give 0:54:24.200 --> 0:54:27.479 us an idea of how business is right now and 0:54:27.600 --> 0:54:29.080 where areas of growth are for you. 0:54:30.120 --> 0:54:33.840 Sure, well, it's an exciting time to be at LifeWay. 0:54:35.000 --> 0:54:41.440 Our category is the probiotic dairy functional food space and 0:54:41.800 --> 0:54:46.239 we are seeing just a booming explosion of business. Just 0:54:46.320 --> 0:54:51.160 the last nineteen quarters have been year over year consecutive 0:54:52.000 --> 0:54:54.800 growth years for us, and that trend is not slowing 0:54:54.880 --> 0:54:56.080 down anytime soon. 0:54:56.680 --> 0:55:00.120 Is that because of what's happening in terms of of 0:55:00.120 --> 0:55:03.279 the way people think about products such as yours or 0:55:03.360 --> 0:55:06.520 are you doing things internally when it comes to product development, 0:55:06.760 --> 0:55:09.920 when it comes to placement, distribution and the like, what 0:55:09.960 --> 0:55:10.880 are you attributing that to. 0:55:11.840 --> 0:55:14.640 Yeah, I mean, I think it's both. I think, first 0:55:14.640 --> 0:55:16.560 of all, to just step back a little bit, I 0:55:16.560 --> 0:55:20.239 think people really want to know where their products are 0:55:20.280 --> 0:55:23.799 coming from, where the brands originate from. And I think 0:55:23.880 --> 0:55:27.959 LifeWay is really the embodiment of the American dream. It's 0:55:28.560 --> 0:55:31.520 just a remarkable story. As you mentioned, my dad came 0:55:31.560 --> 0:55:34.360 from the We all came from the former Soviet Union, 0:55:34.560 --> 0:55:36.759 and we were the first of forty eight families that 0:55:36.800 --> 0:55:41.839 were settled in Chicago. And you know, this idea of 0:55:41.920 --> 0:55:45.120 living the American dream was something my father aspired to. 0:55:45.360 --> 0:55:47.840 And when he walked the grocery stores in America, he 0:55:47.920 --> 0:55:52.720 noticed that there was no Kiffeir, which was a staple 0:55:52.800 --> 0:55:57.120 product for two thousand years, for two thousand years, something 0:55:57.120 --> 0:56:01.560 that my ancestors, my grandmother's passed down generation to generation, 0:56:02.120 --> 0:56:05.240 and it was simply non existent in the United States. 0:56:05.320 --> 0:56:08.480 And I think that, you know, and so that's how 0:56:08.520 --> 0:56:10.680 LifeWay was started, and then he took it public two 0:56:10.760 --> 0:56:14.880 years later. But I think consumers really love that heritage story. 0:56:14.920 --> 0:56:18.239 They want to know that their brand came from someplace 0:56:18.400 --> 0:56:21.800 authentic and real, not just out of an ai private 0:56:21.800 --> 0:56:24.839 equity office or something like that. And so I think 0:56:24.880 --> 0:56:28.399 that thirty eight years of legacy that LifeWay has been 0:56:28.400 --> 0:56:33.000 bringing to American consumers and consumers globally is part of 0:56:33.000 --> 0:56:39.680 the reason. Additionally, you know, with this really wonderful, storied product, 0:56:39.760 --> 0:56:45.239 past of my ancestors, knowing intuitively that kafir improved their 0:56:45.280 --> 0:56:49.600 well being, their health, they attributed their centurion you know, 0:56:49.640 --> 0:56:52.200 living to one hundred years of age based on their 0:56:52.239 --> 0:56:55.480 consumption of keyfer And it wasn't until nineteen oh eight 0:56:55.520 --> 0:56:59.920 when Elie Mechnipoff, doctor Ellie Mechnikoff, did the first round 0:57:00.080 --> 0:57:03.920 of science and research on kaffir and probiotics and fermented 0:57:04.000 --> 0:57:07.000 dairies like Kiffer, and he found that it did indeed 0:57:07.280 --> 0:57:11.040 help improve the body's health. And today modern science is 0:57:11.080 --> 0:57:16.040 only just catching up on the microbiome friendly bacteria, probiotics 0:57:16.040 --> 0:57:20.000 and kafir specifically, and so there's so much exciting medical 0:57:20.040 --> 0:57:24.040 research and we're LifeWay is a brand that meets the moment. 0:57:24.240 --> 0:57:27.880 We are on every grocerysource shelf across the United States, 0:57:27.880 --> 0:57:34.120 from Whole foods and ultra premium markets to Walmart and Costco. 0:57:34.240 --> 0:57:35.840 Yeah, that's what I wanted to talk about because I 0:57:35.840 --> 0:57:41.160 was talking to somebody recently who has a startup ish 0:57:41.240 --> 0:57:43.040 food company. They've raised quite a bit of money and 0:57:43.040 --> 0:57:46.080 they're pretty prominent, but she was telling me how difficult 0:57:46.120 --> 0:57:48.000 it is to get shelf space at some of these 0:57:48.040 --> 0:57:51.120 prominent retailers. How do you do it? As you know, 0:57:51.440 --> 0:57:53.680 you're not independent in the sense of a startup, You're 0:57:53.920 --> 0:57:56.720 far from it. You're a publicly traded company, but you're 0:57:56.880 --> 0:57:59.800 you know, you're not Danin by any means. You know, 0:57:59.840 --> 0:58:02.520 you're not like Talless. So so how do you do it? 0:58:02.560 --> 0:58:03.960 How do you compete with the big players? 0:58:04.920 --> 0:58:07.400 Well, I think they compete with us. I think they 0:58:07.480 --> 0:58:11.160 aspire to be relevant like LifeWay is. You know, we 0:58:11.360 --> 0:58:16.280 have been very passionate and trend setting from day one, 0:58:16.320 --> 0:58:21.440 and we still operate very nimble, and we are trend setting. 0:58:21.520 --> 0:58:24.800 We aren't just following trends, but we're creating the trends. 0:58:25.680 --> 0:58:30.520 We have been, you know, dedicated to putting a bottle 0:58:30.560 --> 0:58:34.040 of LifeWay Keeper in everybody's hand, every consumer's hand, from 0:58:34.320 --> 0:58:39.080 cradle to grave, generation to generation, and you know, building trial, 0:58:39.240 --> 0:58:43.040 showing up at culturally relevant events, yoga. You know, we 0:58:43.040 --> 0:58:46.040 were one of the first brands to partner with yoga 0:58:46.080 --> 0:58:50.720 studios across the country. You can try our samples, our 0:58:50.720 --> 0:58:56.000 products at Lallapalooza at Austin City Limits, all different, you know, 0:58:56.080 --> 0:59:00.440 really amazing cultural moments that are relevant for concers. And 0:59:00.480 --> 0:59:03.640 the way that we show up to our consumers, educating 0:59:03.680 --> 0:59:06.080 them on the importance of gut health is one of 0:59:06.120 --> 0:59:08.960 the reasons why we have had such tremendous success. 0:59:10.400 --> 0:59:16.520 So so okay, so really interesting story, family story. Publicly 0:59:16.520 --> 0:59:19.400 held company, small market cap about three hundred and ninety 0:59:19.440 --> 0:59:24.760 million dollars. Stocks almost doubled year to date, Julia, I 0:59:24.800 --> 0:59:27.240 am curious, so tuck us through some of the metrics, 0:59:27.240 --> 0:59:30.440 the type of growth that you're seeing, revenue, top line growth, 0:59:30.920 --> 0:59:35.160 earnings growth, cash coming in. What do you do to 0:59:35.240 --> 0:59:37.360 kind of keep growing the company? 0:59:37.880 --> 0:59:42.680 Yeah, I mean, you know, we have had the most 0:59:43.240 --> 0:59:49.000 incredible historic quarters. The last five quarters were record breaking quarters. 0:59:49.280 --> 0:59:52.280 Like I mentioned, nineteenth consecutive quarters of year over year 0:59:52.320 --> 0:59:57.080 top line growth. We just hit our the second quarter 0:59:57.240 --> 1:00:01.160 this year, we almost hit fifty million dollars, which has 1:00:01.480 --> 1:00:06.040 been a number we've had long circled in our aspirations. 1:00:06.800 --> 1:00:11.240 Up more than twenty five percent this year. Our twenty 1:00:11.720 --> 1:00:15.040 twenty nineteen, revenue went from about ninety three million to 1:00:15.120 --> 1:00:18.880 almost two hundred million right now two hundred million run rates, 1:00:18.920 --> 1:00:22.280 So we've doubled our revenue. While I don't obsess about 1:00:22.280 --> 1:00:25.560 the share price at all, I am very proud of 1:00:25.600 --> 1:00:28.040 the fact that in the last five years our share 1:00:28.080 --> 1:00:32.520 price is up over almost over twelve hundred percent. So 1:00:33.720 --> 1:00:36.200 you know, these are some remarkable numbers. Our gross profit 1:00:36.400 --> 1:00:41.480 improved to a ninety two percent increase. You know, our 1:00:41.560 --> 1:00:44.440 gross margin was up two hundred and ninety basis points. 1:00:44.840 --> 1:00:49.120 So the metrics that prove that, you know, consumers are 1:00:49.160 --> 1:00:53.680 looking for Lifewaykeeper. We are taking market share away from 1:00:53.720 --> 1:00:57.919 other brands of other types of functional beverages or other 1:00:58.080 --> 1:01:00.439 kind of old stale products like yoga. 1:01:00.520 --> 1:01:01.200 I think we're the. 1:01:01.320 --> 1:01:05.520 More trendier, fashionable, healthier cousin of yogurt. 1:01:05.800 --> 1:01:08.840 Hey, one thing we wanted to ask you is you 1:01:08.880 --> 1:01:11.000 know nifty function on the Bloomberg where you can look 1:01:11.040 --> 1:01:14.040 at you know, your top shareholders and denote North America 1:01:15.320 --> 1:01:19.280 has about what about a twenty twenty three twenty I 1:01:19.320 --> 1:01:25.240 guess yeah reported that back in September, and they, you guys, 1:01:25.280 --> 1:01:29.600 confirmed a receipt of a proposal from denote they offered twenty. 1:01:29.280 --> 1:01:30.480 Five dollars a share. 1:01:30.640 --> 1:01:33.480 You guys right now change trade at twenty six dollars 1:01:33.520 --> 1:01:34.440 forty cents a share. 1:01:35.000 --> 1:01:36.120 Is there an offer? 1:01:36.240 --> 1:01:36.520 Is like? 1:01:36.720 --> 1:01:40.120 Is there is that the future that you ultimately will 1:01:40.160 --> 1:01:43.400 maybe connect with this company danone will own you? 1:01:43.600 --> 1:01:46.200 Or is the plan to kind of keep going alone? 1:01:46.680 --> 1:01:49.040 Well, while I can't comment on that, I would like 1:01:49.120 --> 1:01:52.400 to point to the incredible success that we're having at LifeWay. 1:01:52.640 --> 1:01:55.600 We're on a really strong growth trajectory with a really 1:01:55.640 --> 1:01:59.120 long runway, and in terms of growing both our flagship 1:01:59.120 --> 1:02:04.240 product of but also an incredible exciting emerging category which 1:02:04.280 --> 1:02:06.600 is not new for us, but new for the American people, 1:02:06.640 --> 1:02:09.600 which is farmers cheese and farmer sheees. Is so exciting 1:02:09.600 --> 1:02:12.520 because maybe you've noticed that last year cottage She's went 1:02:12.640 --> 1:02:17.720 viral on TikTok and it's all over everyone's making blended cottage. 1:02:17.720 --> 1:02:21.000 She's in various recipes like that on social media. And 1:02:21.480 --> 1:02:24.360 our farmer sheeese is one of our legacy products that 1:02:24.400 --> 1:02:26.720 we've been making for over thirty eight years. It's something 1:02:26.760 --> 1:02:32.720 my grandmother's made. Like I mentioned footwog in my language, 1:02:32.760 --> 1:02:38.919 it's called footwog and Farmers Cheese is exploding and we're 1:02:38.960 --> 1:02:41.800 really excited to be growing that category where the largest 1:02:41.800 --> 1:02:45.040 manufacturer of Farmers She's today and it's going to be 1:02:45.080 --> 1:02:47.720 really exciting to scale that into all of our locations 1:02:47.760 --> 1:02:50.959 where our Kifer is currently sold and bring this new 1:02:51.080 --> 1:02:54.760 new category in the dairy space. You know, bioavailable, high 1:02:54.880 --> 1:02:59.240 quality protein is something that consumers are really looking for 1:02:59.280 --> 1:03:03.120 in their craving and that's something that Lifeboys really has 1:03:03.160 --> 1:03:06.840 been pioneering and paving for a long time in the 1:03:06.960 --> 1:03:10.080 natural food space, organic food space, which is now mas market. 1:03:10.160 --> 1:03:12.040 So that's a really exciting time for us. 1:03:12.120 --> 1:03:14.000 We only have about a minute left, but what's your 1:03:14.000 --> 1:03:19.240 product pipeline look like expansion beyond Farmer Cheese and Keifer. 1:03:20.320 --> 1:03:23.240 Yeah, well, we are scaling our pro Bugs, which is 1:03:23.440 --> 1:03:27.760 a pouched product for kids, Pouchkifer product for kids that 1:03:27.800 --> 1:03:31.840 we innovated over ten years ago, and we've really invested 1:03:31.840 --> 1:03:35.440 in some equipment and machinery to really scale that. You know, 1:03:35.440 --> 1:03:39.960 we disrupted the entire baby food packaging space by launching 1:03:40.000 --> 1:03:42.720 the first ever pouch in the United States for kids, 1:03:43.400 --> 1:03:46.480 so we're excited to scale that into mass market right now. 1:03:46.480 --> 1:03:49.920 It's a whole foods nationwide. We also just announced the 1:03:50.400 --> 1:03:55.000 expansion of ten exciting new trendy flavors lactose free. That's 1:03:55.040 --> 1:03:57.400 another big concern in the dairy space. People are looking 1:03:57.400 --> 1:04:00.800 for lactose free products, which Lifewi offers, but they're really 1:04:00.840 --> 1:04:07.520 exciting flavors like taro ube, Macha, latte, leachy, you know, 1:04:07.600 --> 1:04:13.240 really on trend, snackaball easy, instagrammable types of new products 1:04:13.240 --> 1:04:16.440 that we're exciting to scale. Excited to scale that nationwide 1:04:16.480 --> 1:04:19.479 as well. And then we have just like a long 1:04:19.880 --> 1:04:22.640 long trajectory of new products in the pipeline which I 1:04:22.680 --> 1:04:25.880 can't discuss us yet, but look for more things connected 1:04:25.920 --> 1:04:30.360 to skin gut access. We know that abiotics work really 1:04:30.440 --> 1:04:34.640 well on the skin or inside out, so some kind 1:04:34.680 --> 1:04:40.120 of skin and friendly products good Brain's okay. 1:04:39.880 --> 1:04:42.360 We'll come back and tell us more when you can 1:04:42.960 --> 1:04:45.640 give us some of the specifics, because that's super interesting. 1:04:46.000 --> 1:04:49.720 Julie Smolanski, CEO at LifeWay Foods, joining us from LA. 1:04:52.040 --> 1:04:55.520 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week Podcast. Catch us 1:04:55.600 --> 1:04:58.840 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen 1:04:58.880 --> 1:05:01.560 on Apple car Play the Android auto with a Bloomberg 1:05:01.600 --> 1:05:05.200 Business app or want us live on YouTube. 1:05:06.240 --> 1:05:08.320 It is Bloomberg Business Week, And I want to know, 1:05:08.400 --> 1:05:10.800 Carrol Masser, Yes, what you were doing when you were 1:05:10.840 --> 1:05:11.520 in ninth grade? 1:05:13.160 --> 1:05:13.520 For sure? 1:05:13.600 --> 1:05:14.120 High school? 1:05:14.200 --> 1:05:15.440 Yeah, I don't know. 1:05:15.600 --> 1:05:19.640 Just trying to gymnastics, gymnastics, cheerleading, trying to get a's, 1:05:19.880 --> 1:05:20.439 getting a's. 1:05:20.760 --> 1:05:22.840 You were you anywhere close to creating an AI based 1:05:22.880 --> 1:05:24.600 handheld pesticide detector? 1:05:24.720 --> 1:05:26.320 That would be a no, okay. 1:05:26.480 --> 1:05:29.440 That's what sirrich Subash has been up to. He's in 1:05:29.560 --> 1:05:32.280 ninth grade and that creation helped crown him the winner 1:05:32.680 --> 1:05:35.360 of the twenty twenty four to three M Young Scientists Challenge. 1:05:35.760 --> 1:05:39.080 Also includes a nice twenty five thousand dollars cash prize, 1:05:39.080 --> 1:05:40.960 a trip here to New York, YEP to Ring the 1:05:40.960 --> 1:05:44.360 Belt in New York Stock Exchange, and yes, gets to 1:05:44.400 --> 1:05:47.280 hang out with us, which I think is just the 1:05:47.280 --> 1:05:48.240 biggest prize. 1:05:48.480 --> 1:05:49.280 That's their round. 1:05:49.280 --> 1:05:51.600 Siries Shabash is the winner of the twenty twenty fourth 1:05:51.680 --> 1:05:55.960 REEM Young Scientists Challenge and Aditya Banerjee is Senior Research 1:05:56.080 --> 1:05:59.120 Energy of the Corporate Research Process Lab. Over at three am, 1:05:59.200 --> 1:06:02.320 they both join us in our Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. 1:06:02.720 --> 1:06:07.320 Very cool to have you both here. Congratulations Soris. First, 1:06:07.320 --> 1:06:11.440 I want to ask you aditya tell us about this challenge, 1:06:11.800 --> 1:06:14.120 how long you've been doing it, how it came about, 1:06:14.280 --> 1:06:15.240 and why you're doing it. 1:06:15.600 --> 1:06:18.240 So the Three and Young Scientist Challenge has been around 1:06:18.280 --> 1:06:22.960 for seventeen years. This is my first year doing this mentorship. 1:06:23.040 --> 1:06:28.440 So I'm just awfully lucky to be paired with Series 1:06:28.560 --> 1:06:31.680 and it has been an awesome experience. Our goal as 1:06:31.720 --> 1:06:33.640 part of the Three and Young Scientist Challenge is to 1:06:34.720 --> 1:06:39.880 nurture and just work with such young, bright, young minds 1:06:40.360 --> 1:06:45.960 and just help them bring their imagination their creations to life. 1:06:46.240 --> 1:06:49.040 So I mean we live by science applied to life, 1:06:49.120 --> 1:06:51.520 so they have all the science innovations in their mind. 1:06:51.960 --> 1:06:57.840 We have some experience in getting the science to people's hands, 1:06:58.000 --> 1:07:00.840 so we hope that we can breach the gap for 1:07:00.920 --> 1:07:05.160 them to take his concepts to hands off consumers and 1:07:05.240 --> 1:07:08.440 help them in any way possible to make that journey smooth. 1:07:08.640 --> 1:07:10.920 Well, Series, tell us about what you have sitting in 1:07:10.920 --> 1:07:14.440 front of you, because it looks like an iPhone attached 1:07:14.480 --> 1:07:16.240 to some sort of gizmo. Here, what's going on? 1:07:17.400 --> 1:07:21.360 So my device, my project, it's called PESTI scanned and 1:07:21.400 --> 1:07:24.520 so what it is is at home people can scan 1:07:24.840 --> 1:07:28.320 for pesticide residues on their produce items. That's the real 1:07:28.360 --> 1:07:31.480 core concept here because there's a lot of contaminants like 1:07:31.520 --> 1:07:34.360 pest side residues they can stick around on produce after 1:07:34.560 --> 1:07:37.880 washing where they've been linked to health issues like certain 1:07:37.920 --> 1:07:43.360 cancers and Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, near degenerative diseases along those lines. 1:07:43.520 --> 1:07:45.240 You can pick that up and you can there's a 1:07:45.280 --> 1:07:47.440 camera right there in front of you for those watching 1:07:47.440 --> 1:07:49.560 on YouTube, Elizabeth's going to get a shot of this thing. 1:07:49.640 --> 1:07:52.600 It's pretty cool. So there's an app. 1:07:52.400 --> 1:07:54.560 That goes with it. There's also some hardware there. It 1:07:54.640 --> 1:07:58.560 uses a type of technology I practice so many times 1:07:58.560 --> 1:08:01.680 saying this type of technology say it? Can you say it. 1:08:01.560 --> 1:08:03.880 For me please? Spectro photometry. 1:08:04.000 --> 1:08:06.360 Spectro photometry, Yeah, and what does that do? 1:08:07.040 --> 1:08:10.720 So the idea is different materials reflect and absorb different 1:08:10.720 --> 1:08:14.280 wavelengths of light. So PESTA scan can look for those 1:08:14.320 --> 1:08:17.800 wavelengths that are reflected and absorbed by pest said residues. 1:08:19.400 --> 1:08:22.880 So okay, so we are very lucky that we have 1:08:22.920 --> 1:08:24.439 a lot of food here at Bloomberg and a lot 1:08:24.439 --> 1:08:26.200 of fresh fruit and we all tap into it. I've 1:08:26.240 --> 1:08:29.240 just had a banana and often tap an apple or 1:08:29.280 --> 1:08:30.000 some other things. 1:08:30.000 --> 1:08:31.280 We had some grape fruit this morning. 1:08:31.479 --> 1:08:33.960 You picked up an apple in our food court up 1:08:33.960 --> 1:08:36.840 in the link on the sixth floor, and so tell 1:08:36.920 --> 1:08:39.160 us show us how it works and what you do 1:08:39.200 --> 1:08:40.200 and then what you found out. 1:08:40.880 --> 1:08:44.760 So for using the actual device, you just connect the 1:08:44.800 --> 1:08:45.679 app to the device. 1:08:45.760 --> 1:08:46.880 You just turn both on. 1:08:48.000 --> 1:08:51.360 You point the device at the protocetem and then you 1:08:51.400 --> 1:08:54.679 tap scan and then a couple of seconds the results 1:08:54.720 --> 1:08:58.479 are back. And this apple had no pested residues on 1:08:58.520 --> 1:08:58.920 it at all. 1:08:59.080 --> 1:09:01.599 Score, which amazing because I don't know if these are 1:09:01.680 --> 1:09:02.559 organic apples. 1:09:02.880 --> 1:09:04.160 I don't know that they are either. 1:09:04.800 --> 1:09:06.880 But that's good to know it does. There is a 1:09:06.880 --> 1:09:09.360 sign upstairs that says please wash fruit before eating it. 1:09:09.400 --> 1:09:10.519 But that's what least do. 1:09:10.920 --> 1:09:13.120 Sometimes, you know, people go and like check the peaches 1:09:13.160 --> 1:09:14.479 to make sure they're soft. 1:09:15.120 --> 1:09:17.480 I check out a few things. It's really fascinating. 1:09:17.640 --> 1:09:19.920 So how did you how did you kind of come 1:09:20.000 --> 1:09:21.439 up with the idea, how did you pull it together? 1:09:21.840 --> 1:09:23.599 And how did you use your mentor to help you. 1:09:24.240 --> 1:09:26.599 So the whole concept really started when I was having 1:09:26.600 --> 1:09:29.640 a conversation with my mom so she was insisting that 1:09:29.680 --> 1:09:32.920 I washed my produce before consuming it, right, And yeah. 1:09:33.040 --> 1:09:36.240 Okay, mom, you gotta wash your produce, so go ahead. 1:09:36.240 --> 1:09:39.639 And my question was why and how effective is it? 1:09:40.520 --> 1:09:42.840 So looking into that, I saw that there were a 1:09:42.840 --> 1:09:46.839 bunch of caeminists like Pesta residues that can be on produce, 1:09:47.400 --> 1:09:51.720 but washing isn't necessarily completely effective, like the residues do 1:09:51.840 --> 1:09:55.519 stay on afterward. So the idea is if we could 1:09:55.520 --> 1:09:58.080 detect them, we could make sure that we weren't consuming them. 1:09:58.160 --> 1:10:00.840 And that's really where the idea for Pestis came from. 1:10:01.640 --> 1:10:04.280 So after I started building the device and I joined 1:10:04.280 --> 1:10:08.360 the three Mek Scientist Challenge, my mentoralitya has been really 1:10:08.400 --> 1:10:12.320 helpful with this, especially when I've gotten stuck. One big 1:10:12.360 --> 1:10:14.959 time was when I was designing my machine learning models, 1:10:15.280 --> 1:10:17.240 and these are what take the actual data from the 1:10:17.280 --> 1:10:20.320 sensor and then turn that into results. What you'd see 1:10:20.320 --> 1:10:23.360 on the screen whether the device has pest said residues, 1:10:23.479 --> 1:10:26.719 whether the predecess pest said residues or not. And he's 1:10:26.720 --> 1:10:29.920 helped me when I get stuck, He's helped me get unstuck. 1:10:30.800 --> 1:10:32.559 Did you I want to ask you, So, what's the. 1:10:34.360 --> 1:10:37.280 Balance of here's how you do it and solving the 1:10:37.320 --> 1:10:40.400 problem and helping him to say, you've got this problem, 1:10:40.800 --> 1:10:44.320 let me steer you so that you figure it out yourself. 1:10:44.479 --> 1:10:46.800 You got that exactly right. Like I said, our goal 1:10:46.880 --> 1:10:51.479 is to help nurture them. So I would pose it 1:10:51.520 --> 1:10:54.400 as le a, have you thought about this? Have you 1:10:54.439 --> 1:10:58.240 thought about that? And he, being a very meticulous and 1:10:58.360 --> 1:11:02.840 very energetic person, he would do his homework and he 1:11:02.840 --> 1:11:05.960 would make sure he follows up on that and next 1:11:06.080 --> 1:11:09.960 next week when we chat, he would inevitably come up 1:11:10.000 --> 1:11:10.599 with a solution. 1:11:10.920 --> 1:11:17.320 So, Sirish is in uh is in Georgia, Snellville, Georgia. 1:11:17.479 --> 1:11:18.720 You're in Minneapolis. 1:11:18.800 --> 1:11:18.960 Yep? 1:11:19.200 --> 1:11:20.960 Were you guys meeting like on zoom once a week? 1:11:21.000 --> 1:11:21.280 How was it? 1:11:21.320 --> 1:11:22.000 How did this work? 1:11:22.080 --> 1:11:22.320 Yep? 1:11:22.439 --> 1:11:26.639 We would meet after his school's done once a week 1:11:27.080 --> 1:11:29.720 and have a conversation about what he has been up 1:11:29.760 --> 1:11:32.960 to last week, anything he wanted to discuss with me, 1:11:33.760 --> 1:11:35.599 any next steps and stuff like that. 1:11:35.920 --> 1:11:39.080 Can you talk a little bit, Sish about how you 1:11:39.120 --> 1:11:42.320 got introduced to this program, because it's my understanding that 1:11:43.560 --> 1:11:46.920 you've known about the Young Scientists Challenge from three AM 1:11:47.640 --> 1:11:48.920 since you were in second grade. 1:11:49.720 --> 1:11:51.120 Yes, this is I had. 1:11:51.479 --> 1:11:54.479 I learned about the Third Big Scientist Challenge when gitan 1:11:54.640 --> 1:11:56.920 Lei Rau got nominated as Time Scard of the Year, 1:11:57.280 --> 1:11:59.600 and when I learned about it and what the challenge 1:11:59.760 --> 1:12:02.479 really stood for what it was doing, I thought that 1:12:02.520 --> 1:12:05.439 this would be a great place for me to submit 1:12:05.560 --> 1:12:10.120 my inventions. That was really because I wanted I've always 1:12:10.120 --> 1:12:12.559 wanted to have to leave an impact on the world 1:12:12.800 --> 1:12:16.240 nice and a good way to leave society a better place, 1:12:16.800 --> 1:12:19.080 and that was I thought three at the Cremning Science 1:12:19.120 --> 1:12:21.200 Challenge would be a great place for me to start 1:12:21.240 --> 1:12:25.040 with that. So I skipped fifth grade, so I wasn't 1:12:25.040 --> 1:12:28.439 able to put it in then sixth grade, our family 1:12:28.600 --> 1:12:30.599 was in India and we weren't able to get things 1:12:30.600 --> 1:12:33.920 figured out. Seventh grade I did apply, but it didn't 1:12:34.040 --> 1:12:38.640 quite work out. And this year I was able to 1:12:38.640 --> 1:12:41.479 get it in and everything worked out. 1:12:41.560 --> 1:12:41.960 Yeah. 1:12:42.000 --> 1:12:44.519 Did I hear you say inventions plural? 1:12:45.320 --> 1:12:47.799 Yeah? So I've worked on a couple of things before. 1:12:47.960 --> 1:12:51.240 Okay, PESTI Scan maybe the one single project that I've 1:12:51.240 --> 1:12:52.639 put my most time into. 1:12:53.360 --> 1:12:55.200 So I've built a couple things before. 1:12:55.240 --> 1:12:57.920 I made one robot to deliver books that that was 1:12:58.479 --> 1:13:01.439 probably the runner up to this and how much time 1:13:01.479 --> 1:13:04.640 I put into it that took. I've spent four or 1:13:04.640 --> 1:13:07.200 five months on that. I've spent about a year on 1:13:07.320 --> 1:13:08.360 this latest version. 1:13:08.640 --> 1:13:10.120 So what's the commercialization of this? 1:13:10.200 --> 1:13:12.720 Because I think I could see I would love to 1:13:12.760 --> 1:13:13.960 have one in my home and I'm sure. 1:13:13.920 --> 1:13:16.280 You would, or even just an app that could do 1:13:16.360 --> 1:13:19.400 this using technology that exists inside a phone already, right, Like, 1:13:19.439 --> 1:13:20.880 so you're at the grocery store, You're like, oh, this 1:13:20.960 --> 1:13:21.400 is good to. 1:13:21.320 --> 1:13:24.160 Go exactly right, Like we do barcodes of things to 1:13:24.280 --> 1:13:26.320 find out pricing or whatever or information. 1:13:26.479 --> 1:13:28.439 So did you how do you guys. 1:13:28.280 --> 1:13:31.040 Think about like just three AM, who's known for like 1:13:31.080 --> 1:13:33.840 all their different products and it's not just posted, it's 1:13:33.840 --> 1:13:36.400 a lot of different things. So I'm just curious, do 1:13:36.439 --> 1:13:39.720 you see something like this and say, okay, there's commercial applications? 1:13:39.840 --> 1:13:40.400 Well for sure. 1:13:40.439 --> 1:13:43.000 I mean part of our conversations was how do you 1:13:43.040 --> 1:13:47.519 simplify the prototype? That was one of the driving questions 1:13:47.520 --> 1:13:50.519 that he seek to answer during the summer. He started 1:13:50.560 --> 1:13:54.040 off with making the module simpler, something that you can 1:13:54.080 --> 1:13:57.040 just clip onto your phone, right so that it can 1:13:57.080 --> 1:13:59.800 be used for consumer He did a lot of work 1:13:59.840 --> 1:14:03.040 in driving down the unit cost of each of the modules, 1:14:03.040 --> 1:14:05.679 and he already has plans to drive it down even lower, 1:14:06.040 --> 1:14:07.880 so he is already on it. 1:14:08.160 --> 1:14:09.439 Well, what do you guys do next? 1:14:09.520 --> 1:14:12.360 I mean, these guys know I'm like super obsessed with 1:14:12.400 --> 1:14:14.320 shark Tank and when people pitch their ideas. 1:14:14.320 --> 1:14:16.200 But what do you do to help him? 1:14:16.240 --> 1:14:16.679 Maybe? 1:14:17.040 --> 1:14:18.840 Is it on his own or do you guys work 1:14:18.880 --> 1:14:20.719 with him to kind of get it to the next step. 1:14:21.000 --> 1:14:23.720 So he would be driving a lot on his own, 1:14:23.760 --> 1:14:26.800 but we are always there to support him whenever there's 1:14:26.840 --> 1:14:29.599 anything that we can help out. Me personally, three AM 1:14:29.640 --> 1:14:32.639 as a company, we would definitely be more than happy 1:14:32.680 --> 1:14:35.599 to help him out. And also the three and Young 1:14:35.640 --> 1:14:38.920 Scientists Challenged Alumnize. They have a grant program that has 1:14:38.920 --> 1:14:41.280 been set up, so there are a lot of alumnizs 1:14:41.280 --> 1:14:45.879 who leverage that to fund their programs in the future 1:14:45.920 --> 1:14:48.240 as well. So that is something that's all set up 1:14:48.320 --> 1:14:49.120 that can be used. 1:14:49.560 --> 1:14:51.040 So what do you want to do? 1:14:51.200 --> 1:14:53.559 Like our venture capitalist knocking on your door, You've got. 1:14:53.439 --> 1:14:55.719 A few more years, I imagine you want to continue 1:14:55.720 --> 1:14:57.479 your education? What's the plan here? 1:14:58.280 --> 1:15:01.920 So the big big next steps are I'm trying to 1:15:01.960 --> 1:15:05.040 scale shrink this quite a bit to where it would 1:15:05.080 --> 1:15:07.920 be far more portable and easier for a consumer to 1:15:07.960 --> 1:15:10.720 carry around. And then from there also just dropping the 1:15:10.760 --> 1:15:13.839 cost to where it could easily go into people's homes. 1:15:13.880 --> 1:15:17.679 That was that's those are my key plans for this device. 1:15:17.720 --> 1:15:21.680 In particular, how much what's the cost associated with this prototype? 1:15:21.840 --> 1:15:23.920 Like how much would this device cost as is now? 1:15:24.439 --> 1:15:27.160 So as of now for this setup if I were 1:15:27.160 --> 1:15:29.040 to make a hundred of them, that would be seventy 1:15:29.080 --> 1:15:29.759 five dollars? 1:15:30.080 --> 1:15:30.400 Is that that? 1:15:31.000 --> 1:15:34.879 But for I have a plan laid out to where 1:15:34.720 --> 1:15:37.240 there's there's a solution I can put this onto a 1:15:37.240 --> 1:15:41.439 printed circuit board, which would make this all one singular piece, 1:15:42.400 --> 1:15:44.719 and that would bring the price down to roughly thirty 1:15:44.720 --> 1:15:48.879 five dollars. But I'm looking forward to in the future 1:15:49.000 --> 1:15:53.960 reach your price, Stager, maybe twenty dollars. 1:15:52.240 --> 1:15:55.200 Cool, right, Like I don't yeah, I just think about, Oh, 1:15:55.240 --> 1:15:57.040 do you have it in the supermarket where people can 1:15:57.160 --> 1:15:58.880 I don't know, or does everybody have their own and 1:15:58.960 --> 1:15:59.479 check it out? 1:16:00.120 --> 1:16:00.920 Really really cool? 1:16:02.320 --> 1:16:04.479 One thing I want to ask you. We often talk 1:16:04.520 --> 1:16:07.920 with folks about the importance of STEM education and companies, 1:16:08.040 --> 1:16:10.439 whether it's they're out in Silicon Valley, or thinking about 1:16:10.439 --> 1:16:13.560 the next generation of workers that they need. Is this 1:16:13.680 --> 1:16:15.559 part of why three M is looking. 1:16:15.360 --> 1:16:15.840 To do this? 1:16:16.280 --> 1:16:19.519 Yes, yes, absolutely. I mean we have a we if 1:16:19.560 --> 1:16:25.000 we seek to educate or reach out to folks about 1:16:25.200 --> 1:16:28.400 science and how it's integral part of our life. We 1:16:28.479 --> 1:16:32.599 have a great science advocacy team if within three them 1:16:32.640 --> 1:16:35.120 as well. And that's also one of the reasons why 1:16:35.600 --> 1:16:39.640 during this program we get to meet young brilliant minds 1:16:39.720 --> 1:16:43.519 like him, and we try our best to, like I said, 1:16:43.600 --> 1:16:48.120 nurture and mold him and inspire them to do something 1:16:48.200 --> 1:16:51.000 like he said, like science is part of it. Merging 1:16:51.040 --> 1:16:54.080 with the society. That's another huge thing that we see. 1:16:54.160 --> 1:16:58.000 So what he's doing pretty close to society. Bigger, Yeah, 1:16:58.360 --> 1:17:00.000 y better, that's what we hope. 1:16:59.840 --> 1:17:00.960 For, the bigger impact. 1:17:01.479 --> 1:17:05.800 Srich congratulations, sabash Aditya Banerjee of three AM. 1:17:05.880 --> 1:17:07.720 Guys, thank you so much. This is Bloomberg. 1:17:08.520 --> 1:17:13.160 This is the Bloomberg Business Week podcast, available on Apple, Spotify, 1:17:13.280 --> 1:17:17.040 and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday 1:17:17.040 --> 1:17:20.639 afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 1:17:20.680 --> 1:17:24.000 the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business app. 1:17:24.080 --> 1:17:27.160 You can also watch US live every weekday on YouTube 1:17:27.240 --> 1:17:29.200 and always on the Bloomberg terminal