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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: dot com. Joining us now is Scott Horten's, the director

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Speaker 3: of the Libertarian Institute and the author of Provokes.

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Speaker 1: Scott, it's good to see you, thanks for joining us.

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Speaker 4: Thank you both very much for having me well.

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Speaker 1: Obviously, you know we have so much to talk about.

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Speaker 3: You are, of course an expert really on the history

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Speaker 3: of a lot of the claims here, but you're also

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Speaker 3: an expert on NATO. We were actually very curious for

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Speaker 3: your take here as we watch the next frontier of

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Speaker 3: this war evolves. So we've got the US and Israel

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Speaker 3: at war with Iran. You've got Iran attacking much of

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Speaker 3: the golf, but now you have Israel also trying to

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Speaker 3: step terms for the potential destruction of NATO, saying that

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Speaker 3: they may even attack Turkey. Let's take a listen here,

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Speaker 3: toe F. Tlly Bennett, the former Prime Minister of Israel,

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Speaker 3: get your reaction.

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Speaker 4: Turkish threat is emerging.

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Speaker 5: I want to be very clear. Turkey and Qatar have

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Speaker 5: gained influence in Syria, are seeking influence elsewhere and everywhere

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Speaker 5: throughout the region, and from here I warn Turkey is

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Speaker 5: the new Iran. Erdowon is sophisticated, dangerous, and he seeks

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Speaker 5: thin circle Israel. We can't close our eyes again. And

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Speaker 5: while some senior Israelis we're on Qatar's payroll. Qatar and

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Speaker 5: Turkey are nourishing the Islamic brotherhood monster that is growing

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Speaker 5: and eventually might become as dangerous as the one created

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Speaker 5: by Iran. Turkey and Katar gaining influence not only in

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Speaker 5: Syria but also in Gaza through the front door and everyone,

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Speaker 5: and trying to create a new choke cream. Turkey is

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Speaker 5: trying to flip Saudi Arabia against US and establish a

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Speaker 5: hostile Sunni access.

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Speaker 4: With nuclear Pakistan.

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Speaker 3: So Scott, if this war continues to drag on, they're

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Speaker 3: potentially maybe attacking Turkey, which would probably be the dissolution

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Speaker 3: of NATO itself. Your reaction is both to that clip

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Speaker 3: into the entire situation.

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Speaker 6: Well, first of all, I have to say that enough

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Speaker 6: Tally Bennett is the cause of September eleventh, for.

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Speaker 4: People who don't know.

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Speaker 6: In nineteen ninety six, now Tally Bennett called in an

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Speaker 6: artillery strike on a UN shelter in khan E Lebanon

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Speaker 6: and killed one hundred and eight women and children, and

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Speaker 6: bin Laden went off all about that in his first

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Speaker 6: declaration of war.

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Speaker 4: In nineteen ninety six.

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Speaker 6: And when Mohammad Atta and his best friend Ramsay bin

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Speaker 6: al she red bin Laden's declaration of war and his

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Speaker 6: you know, declaration they need to get revenge for the

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Speaker 6: kanamsacre and Operation Grapes of Wrath. That was what made

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Speaker 6: Mohammed Attah, the lead hijacker of September eleventh, decide to

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Speaker 6: join al Keda. And so literally it was that man's

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Speaker 6: murder of innocent women and children that caused those two

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Speaker 6: towers full of three thousand innocent men and women to

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Speaker 6: be brought down on September eleventh, So don't anyone ever

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Speaker 6: forget that about enough Tally Bennett and then and he

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Speaker 6: will be Prime Minister of Israel again, almost certainly. And

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Speaker 6: then as far as NATO goes, we should leave NATO.

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Speaker 6: We should abandon Israel faster than we should abandon Turkey.

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Speaker 6: Just so there's no confusion there. But it's understandable that

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Speaker 6: the Israelis are upset with the Turks after they helped

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Speaker 6: the Turks help al Qaeda take over Syria. Well, now

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Speaker 6: they don't have the bothis to balance against Turkey anymore.

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Speaker 6: Who could have thought that there would have been repercussions

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Speaker 6: from helping al Qaeda the botheists? And is it true

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Speaker 6: that Turkey and cutter back the Muslim brotherhood throughout the region?

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Speaker 4: Yes?

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Speaker 6: Absolutely, It was a tradition started by the British and

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Speaker 6: the Americans through the Saudis. They created the Muslim brotherhood

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Speaker 6: in the first place. Everybody read Devil's Game by Robert

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Speaker 6: Dreyfus is an excellent book on the background all of that.

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Speaker 6: But is that the kind of thing that could be

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Speaker 6: solved with diplomacy by the Americans super duper power.

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Speaker 4: Yes, obviously if that's what we were trying to do.

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Speaker 6: But if the Israelis have a strategy that says let's

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Speaker 6: go ahead and pick a fight with the Turks, well,

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Speaker 6: then common sense and reason and diplomatic possibility are basically irrelevant.

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Speaker 4: They get what they want. Evidently.

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Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you, Scott about the role that

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Speaker 2: religious rhetoric and fanaticism plays in stoking these conflicts. In

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Speaker 2: advance or just after Trump started this war, there was

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Speaker 2: this bizarre CNN piece where they were talking about how

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Speaker 2: the date was chosen because of its connection to the

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Speaker 2: Poorum holiday and something to do with Amlak bb out

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Speaker 2: talking about Amlek again, you know, similar rhetoric to what

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Speaker 2: we heard in connection with the genocide in Gaza. And

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Speaker 2: then there's this report from independent journalist Jonathan Larson this morning.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if you've seen this yet, where he's

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Speaker 2: found that US troops were told the Iran war is

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Speaker 2: for armageddon and the return of Jesus. I'll read you

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Speaker 2: a little bit from this piece. A combat unit commander

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Speaker 2: told non commissioned officers at a briefing Monday that the

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Speaker 2: Iran war is part of God's plan, that President Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump was anointed by Jesus to light the signal fire

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Speaker 2: in Iran to cause Armageddon and mark his return to Earth.

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Speaker 2: According to a complaint by a non commissioned officer, from

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Speaker 2: Saturday morning through Monday night, more than one hundred and

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Speaker 2: ten similar complaints about commanders in every branch of the

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Speaker 2: military had been logged by the Military Religious Freedom Foundation.

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Speaker 2: And just as one more example, of course, we all

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Speaker 2: listen to that interview between my Kakabie Christian Zionist and

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Speaker 2: Tucker Carlson where he said, yeah, I'm good with the

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Speaker 2: Greater Israel project because he sees that as fulfillment of

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Speaker 2: a Biblical prophecy.

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Speaker 4: Crazy.

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Speaker 6: I mean, I don't know, makes you wish that the

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Speaker 6: skull and bones Episcopalians would come back?

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Speaker 4: You know these Look, you know what can I say?

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Speaker 6: I can't really argue religious doctrine with people because I

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Speaker 6: don't really have one. But I think there in my

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Speaker 6: lifetime there's been a broad spectrum of people who believe

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Speaker 6: in the Bible and religion but who don't take, you know,

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Speaker 6: biblical prophecy as their mandate to implement. As American foreign

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Speaker 6: policy is completely nuts that you would have not just

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Speaker 6: you know, Republican voters whipped into line with this kind

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Speaker 6: of crap, but that you would have actual policies based

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Speaker 6: on this, that you would have leaders of the military

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Speaker 6: who are actually caught up in this stuff.

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Speaker 4: And you know, it's people's religion.

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Speaker 6: It's not like you can just convince them that, oh,

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Speaker 6: that's just superstition or that's one part of the Bible

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Speaker 6: where you shouldn't be guessing at or whatever. So the

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Speaker 6: most important thing in the world to them, and everybody

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Speaker 6: believes their own interpretation of it with whatever degree of

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Speaker 6: blind faith. Pretty hard to shake anyone out of that

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Speaker 6: belief that like, actually, you know, maybe this is just

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Speaker 6: a line of crap, and your particular beliefs about what's

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Speaker 6: happening now and the near future in biblical prophecy is

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Speaker 6: really no more credible than David Koresh or any other

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Speaker 6: end times prophecy going on. But this is a big

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Speaker 6: deal inside the military, and I know, especially in the

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Speaker 6: US Air Force. There's an activist named Mikey Weinstein, obviously

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Speaker 6: a Jewish activist going back to the w Bush years,

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Speaker 6: who complained very heavily about this kind of end times

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Speaker 6: apocalyptic belief systems at the very height of the leadership

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Speaker 6: of the US Air Force, where these are the guys

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Speaker 6: in charge of delivering the h bombs, and they are

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Speaker 6: really caught up in like biblical prophecy that yeah, maybe

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Speaker 6: this is meant to be. This is how we forced

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Speaker 6: Jesus to come back as we start a world war,

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Speaker 6: maybe even a nuclear war the end of the world,

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Speaker 6: because that's what's supposed to happen. That's God's plan, is

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Speaker 6: for us to cause this terrible chaos. When you know

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Speaker 6: anyone could tell you. I mean, I just happen to

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Speaker 6: grow up around Christians, and I know it says in

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Speaker 6: there that nobody knows the day or the time and.

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Speaker 4: All of this.

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Speaker 6: You're just supposed to wait around for the second Coming.

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Speaker 6: You're not supposed to try to make it happen. But

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Speaker 6: I've known people like this in my life too. You know,

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Speaker 6: I'm from Texas. There's a lot of Baptists around here,

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Speaker 6: in various strains of evangelicals, and I have known people

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Speaker 6: who are just absolutely convicted beyond any certainty that you

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Speaker 6: see right here where it says one day, well, one

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Speaker 6: day means five hundred years, and five hundred years means

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Speaker 6: I'm going to get raptured up in the thing and whatever,

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Speaker 6: and there are people who are they're so into it

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Speaker 6: and there's no way to reason with them. The idea

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Speaker 6: that they would be really having this much influence on

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Speaker 6: how policy is carried out is absolutely terrifying. I mean,

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Speaker 6: I don't know what's say.

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Speaker 3: I grew up around the very same people, Scott, not

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Speaker 3: that far from where you live. We also wanted to

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Speaker 3: take advantage of your expertise on the nuclear issue.

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Speaker 1: The Vice President JD.

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Speaker 3: Vance took to the airwaves yesterday he said, this is

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Speaker 3: all about Iran getting a nuclear weapon. All they want

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Speaker 3: is for this military campaign for Iran not to get

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Speaker 3: a nuclear weapon. Now, remember the Secretary of State and

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Speaker 3: the Secretary of Defense have said, actually, this is about

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Speaker 3: a missile shield for that nuclear weapon. This Vivintnya who

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Speaker 3: said this is about immunity from strike. Aka, we have

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Speaker 3: to take out their immunity from the ability to build

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Speaker 3: a nuclear weapon. By the way, meanwhile, let's put this

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Speaker 3: D three up here on the screen. Satellite imagery currently

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Speaker 3: indicates that there has been an apparent attack on the

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Speaker 3: Iranian nuclear site, but only a limited in terms of

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Speaker 3: the amount of attack.

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Speaker 1: How credulous.

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Speaker 3: Do you take this credulous, this explanation, this is all

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Speaker 3: about nuclear weapons.

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Speaker 4: Oh, they're simply lying. It's a completely bogus pretext for war.

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Speaker 6: I mean, in fact, last summer they really did essentially

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Speaker 6: obliterate Iran's nuclear program. They took the Fourdohntons and Isfahan

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Speaker 6: facilities completely offline. And Fodah and atonsas where they're enriching

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Speaker 6: uranium hexafluora gas to a higher percent U two thirty five,

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Speaker 6: and Isfahan is the facility, the conversion facility where you

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Speaker 6: can take metal to gas and back to metal again.

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Speaker 6: Well without that, I mean, they're essentially just shut down.

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Speaker 6: And there's a new report by a group called ISIS online.

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Speaker 6: There's just David Albright. He's a little bit sketchy, but

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Speaker 6: this seemed credible enough. Where they have their satellite pictures

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Speaker 6: show there's absolutely nothing going on at Foidah and Ntans

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Speaker 6: or Isfahan at all. They've sealed all the entrances with

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Speaker 6: dirt and the rest. There's a place called Pickax Mountain

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Speaker 6: where supposedly they're doing some preliminary tunnel digging or whatever.

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Speaker 6: They have essentially zero operating cascades anywhere in the country.

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Speaker 6: So Trump and net Yahoo, they really did call the

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Speaker 6: Ayatolas buff last June and essentially decimate his program. And

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Speaker 6: then we know from the negotiations in Oman that they

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Speaker 6: were the Iranians were essentially negotiating from that position.

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Speaker 4: Of weakness and knew it.

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Speaker 6: They said, you know what, We'll give you Obama deal

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Speaker 6: times one hundred. We'll have a full moratorium in Richmond

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Speaker 6: for up to three to five years, for between three

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Speaker 6: to five years, and even then, we'll enrich only up

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Speaker 6: to one point five percent. Will take any stockpile of

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Speaker 6: uranium that we have and will send that to the

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Speaker 6: United States, not even to Russia or France, but to

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Speaker 6: the United States to hold onto the stockpile and transform

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Speaker 6: any enriched uranium that they do enrich to fuel rods

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Speaker 6: and send back. And they promised no sunset provisions so

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Speaker 6: anything that That was one of the big complaints about

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Speaker 6: the JCPOA was all the sunsets, that these things expire

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Speaker 6: in five or ten years. So they were climbing way

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Speaker 6: down the ladder as far as they were. Only the

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Speaker 6: barest face saving on the ability to continue to maintain

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Speaker 6: a civilian nuclear energy program at all.

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Speaker 4: And then I think that's probably why they launched the war.

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Speaker 6: Right is this is the reporting that Netanyahu came to

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Speaker 6: town and said, don't let these negotiations get in the

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Speaker 6: way of starting the war.

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Speaker 4: We're doing this.

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Speaker 6: The negotiations are only a pretext, and this seems likely

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Speaker 6: that they decided to launch the war when they did

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Speaker 6: because the Iranians were too willing to compromise and Wikkoff

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Speaker 6: was about to come home with an acceptable deal and

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Speaker 6: they couldn't have that.

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Speaker 2: And let me ask you my last question for you

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Speaker 2: on that. We've been talking about the extraordinary comments from

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Speaker 2: Secretary of State Mark Rubio saying, hey, there was an

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Speaker 2: imminent threat because Israel was going to attack Ron with

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Speaker 2: us or without US, and that was going to create

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Speaker 2: a risk of Iran attacking our bases and service members

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Speaker 2: in the region. So rather than saying that Israel, hey,

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Speaker 2: don't do that, and you know here are going to

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Speaker 2: be the repercussions if you do a client state vasal

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Speaker 2: state of ours, instead they said, I guess we're going

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Speaker 2: to get roped into this war with a run. I mean,

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Speaker 2: how do you make sense of this? Why is the

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Speaker 2: option of constraining Israel just seemingly completely off the table

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Speaker 2: and out of sight for these people.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm not sure how much I buy that.

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Speaker 6: I mean, clearly net Nyahu's roped Donald Trump into doing

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Speaker 6: this by hook or krook one way or the other.

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Speaker 6: I'm not so sure I buy the narrative that he said, look,

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Speaker 6: I'm going to do it without you, and I'm I

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Speaker 6: use nukes and I'm going to provoke attacks against American bases,

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Speaker 6: so you might as well come with me, and gave

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Speaker 6: Trump no choice. That sounds to me like public relations

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Speaker 6: from the White House. I appreciate them blaming Israel because

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Speaker 6: they do deserve a lot of the blame, but Trump

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Speaker 6: is the man in that chair as them.

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Speaker 2: Trying to wash their hands of the consequences and say

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Speaker 2: they made us do it effectively.

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Speaker 6: And remember there was that story in Politico just what

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Speaker 6: one or two days before the war launched.

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Speaker 4: I guess it came out on.

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Speaker 6: What Thursday before the war that they were talking with

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Speaker 6: the Israelis about maybe having the Israelis start the war

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Speaker 6: in order to provoke Iran into hitting US bases so

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Speaker 6: that they could tell the American people, well, see they

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Speaker 6: hit our bases.

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Speaker 4: We have to do this.

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Speaker 6: So if they were floating that as a way as

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Speaker 6: a sort of end run around the American people and

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Speaker 6: a backdoor way into getting into the war on Thursday,

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Speaker 6: from the White House's side, they were floating that, and

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Speaker 6: it sounds to me like they were perfectly in coordination

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Speaker 6: and they decided to do this together.

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Speaker 2: So if that rationale is out the window, and I

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Speaker 2: also am a little bit skeptical of it, to be

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Speaker 2: honest with you, then what is the motivation for Trump?

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Speaker 3: Who?

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Speaker 2: You know, we have a whole compilation of Trump and

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Speaker 2: our kid Junior and Tulsea Gabbard and Steven Miller and

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Speaker 2: Jade Vance all, Oh, we'd never go.

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Speaker 7: To war with Iron, blah blah blah.

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Speaker 2: What is the rationale for this large now regional war?

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Speaker 2: What is the rationale for the timing? You know, what

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Speaker 2: do you think did lead to this? If it wasn't

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Speaker 2: you know, some combination of Donald Trump being compromised in

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Speaker 2: Israeli threats?

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Speaker 4: Right, and then funny that that's even a question.

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Speaker 6: We don't know why the President launched this completely unnecessary, unprovoked,

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Speaker 6: aggressive war and we got to like sit here and

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Speaker 6: sell it out through the team leads.

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Speaker 4: Did they have video of him raping a child.

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Speaker 6: Is that what it is that beneath all those Epstein redactions?

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Speaker 6: Is Donald Trump actually committing felonies? Or do they maybe

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Speaker 6: nothing to do with Epstein. Maybe they've just been tapping

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Speaker 6: his phone like they did Bill Clinton. Remember they tried

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Speaker 6: to blackmail Bill Clinton with Monica Lewinsky before that story

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Speaker 6: ever leaked, that we want you to.

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Speaker 4: Release Jonathan Pollard.

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Speaker 6: And he almost did it, except that the top branks

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Speaker 6: of the CIA, we're all going to resign over it

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Speaker 6: and cause a huge controversy. But they went to Bill

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Speaker 6: Clinton said we got proof you're cheating on your wife.

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Speaker 4: Pal. They had no problem trying to blackmail the president then.

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Speaker 4: So it could be that.

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Speaker 6: It also could be that just Donald Trump is good

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Speaker 6: friends with Netanyahu. He's always you know, his son in law,

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Speaker 6: Jered Kushner obviously always speaks from the lecud point of view.

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Speaker 6: He didn't know anything else about it. He didn't know

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Speaker 6: any Palestinians or any Iranians. If he knows any Iranians,

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Speaker 6: they're monarchist xpat types, right. He doesn't know anyone to

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Speaker 6: tell him a real contrary point of view on these things.

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Speaker 4: I think is a big part of it.

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Speaker 6: And then you know, people would always say, oh, Donald Trump,

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Speaker 6: he's so uncouth. You know, he's not from Manhattan, he's

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Speaker 6: from Queens and he's kind of like, don't get me wrong,

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Speaker 6: he's obviously born, very rich, but he has that sort

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Speaker 6: of uncouth, working class way of talking or whatever.

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Speaker 4: And they were afraid.

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Speaker 6: Remember, they'd say, I think he's an anti Semite, like

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Speaker 6: he one time used the word Jew outside of a

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Speaker 6: reverential tone or whatever.

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Speaker 4: We you know, we're afraid.

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Speaker 6: Like, okay, if there really is any of that kind

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Speaker 6: of like Donald Trump a sort of racism that he

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Speaker 6: grew up in as a New Yorker in that time

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Speaker 6: or whatever, there potentially could be a little bit of that.

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Speaker 6: I don't see that certainly as far as Jews go.

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Speaker 6: But even if that was true, well, how much lower

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Speaker 6: must he consider Arabs? Then if that's what a kind

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Speaker 6: of men or racist he is, if he thinks, you know,

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Speaker 6: he looks down on Jews or other minorities at all,

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Speaker 6: the Palestinians they're a Rabs. They're camel jockeys and sand

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Speaker 6: and words and whatever. You just do with them what

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Speaker 6: you want. It's the same way they created Israel in

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Speaker 6: the first place. Yeah, a bunch of Arabs have to

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Speaker 6: be removed. But so what it's like talking about removing

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Speaker 6: livestock or something like that doesn't it doesn't affect them

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Speaker 6: morally or whatever. So if Netnahu says to Trump, man,

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Speaker 6: this could be big and fun and you'll go down

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Speaker 6: in history. Bill Crystal will compare you to Theodore Roosevelt

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Speaker 6: and you'll be great and whatever, then that could be

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Speaker 6: very tempting to Donald Trump.

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Speaker 1: You know, it could be all of the above, right.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, something big, something that you know, he wants to

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Speaker 6: build giant arch in Washington, so he's remembered as the

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Speaker 6: guy who built the giant arch, you know, like he

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Speaker 6: wants to do something.

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Speaker 4: Wow.

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Speaker 1: Scott as always man, thank you for joining us.

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Speaker 4: Appreciate you, absolutely, thank you both.

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Speaker 2: All right, guys, we wanted carbon O little space to

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Speaker 2: take a look at the overwhelming pro war media propaganda

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Speaker 2: diet that the American people are being force fed. Right now,

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Speaker 2: Let's start with CNN Dana Bash with some interesting guests here.

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Speaker 7: Let's take a listen. This is a Berlin Wall moment.

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Speaker 7: Let's tear this wall down.

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Speaker 8: Then America will be safe without Islamic Republic.

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Speaker 7: I love America. I love I wrong, no Sacker.

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Speaker 2: Many people are saying that CNN is said to get

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Speaker 2: worse under the Ellison control, and I do have confidence

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Speaker 2: that Barry will figure out how. But it's going to

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Speaker 2: take some creativity based on what I've seen on that

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Speaker 2: network in the you know, after this war was launched.

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Speaker 1: Look, no disrespect to this.

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Speaker 3: Maybe actually I always say that before. Actually, no disrespect. Like,

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Speaker 3: here's the deal. You know this woman, I get, it's

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Speaker 3: Iranian expat she wants freedom for our country. I'm like,

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Speaker 3: very limited, somewhat sympathetic. My country is not a vessel

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Speaker 3: for you to achieve your ambitions, you know, I forget.

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Speaker 3: I think Bronco said this, America is the only country

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Speaker 3: on Earth which has immigrants that come to it to

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Speaker 3: get it to bomb their own country.

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Speaker 1: It's the only place.

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Speaker 3: I've also said this generally about diaspora, and I really

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Speaker 3: mean this. The diaspora are often some of the least

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Speaker 3: informed people, most biased and out of touch about what's

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Speaker 3: going on back home. I said that about myself. Do

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Speaker 3: not ask me about what's going on in India.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm from Brian, Texas, Okay.

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Speaker 3: I barely know what's going on in my own country,

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Speaker 3: let alone to reflect the beliefs of one billion people

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Speaker 3: who live across the world.

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Speaker 1: It's ridiculous.

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Speaker 3: And yet Treta Parsi was telling us this morning that

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Speaker 3: BBC ran an article with three people in Iran or

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Speaker 3: a SoundBite or whatever, three people in Iran, where they're like,

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Speaker 3: we're so happy to be bombed, as if that's the

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Speaker 3: only view inside of the country. CNN is trying to

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Speaker 3: project the same thing Berlin Wall moment.

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Speaker 1: No, it's not. You know, it's a catastrophe for the

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Speaker 1: people in Iran.

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Speaker 3: Maybe it'll end up good, but in the immediate term,

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Speaker 3: there's at least over a thousand people who are confirmed

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Speaker 3: to be killed, including much little school children, not to

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Speaker 3: mention all of the other people killed across the region

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Speaker 3: as a result of this embroiling conflict. We don't sit

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Speaker 3: here good cheer up and down. We don't even know

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Speaker 3: what's going to come next. You're probably cheering on your

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Speaker 3: own civil war and destruction of your own country.

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Speaker 7: It's discuss you know, the people to talk to.

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Speaker 2: You really would Hey, let's talk to the iraqis about Yeah, No,

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Speaker 2: you're right, but let's talk to the Afghanis. Let's talk

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Speaker 2: to the you know, the people of Libya. Let's talk

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Speaker 2: to them about you know, probably some of them had

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Speaker 2: some hopes and aspirations when yeah, so I'm cheering, yeah,

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Speaker 2: when we came in, et cetera. How did that go

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Speaker 2: for you? I think that would be an you know,

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Speaker 2: interesting and revelatory to see from our news networks. Let

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Speaker 2: me go ahead and skip over to now with Rachel Maddow.

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Speaker 2: And this was a very interesting segment here because she

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Speaker 2: goes out of her way and look, I think that

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Speaker 2: is true that some of the golf country, Saudi Arabia

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Speaker 2: in particular, I mean, there is a rivalry there with Iran, right,

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Speaker 2: And there was reporting that Saudi Arabia was also pushing

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Speaker 2: Trump alongside Israel to get into this war with Iran.

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Speaker 7: But let's be very clear.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's very clear who the primary mover is here, right,

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Speaker 2: It's Israel. I mean, you could listen to the Secretary

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Speaker 2: of State. You can listen to Nat Yale, who talking

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Speaker 2: about how he's tried and president after president to get

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Speaker 2: someone to do this and finally got Donald Trump to

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Speaker 2: You can listen to him talk about how this is

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Speaker 2: a fulfillment of a forty year fantasy that he has held.

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Speaker 2: And so Rachel kind of cleverly decides to all but

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Speaker 2: erase that aspect and instead focus in on these golf

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Speaker 2: countries which are now in flames and being attacked and

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Speaker 2: running out of interceptors and being stonewalled by the United

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Speaker 2: States for any sort of replacements.

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Speaker 7: Let's take a listen to a little bit of that.

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Speaker 8: Who benefits who wants Iran bombed off the map and

439
00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:04,280
Speaker 8: for their own reasons. Who are Iran's rivals and enemies

440
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:10,120
Speaker 8: perennially it's the Gulf Arab States, countries like Saudi Arabia

441
00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,199
Speaker 8: and United Arab Emirates and cutter and of course you

442
00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:17,480
Speaker 8: remember the Saudis who stuffed another two billion dollars into

443
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:20,720
Speaker 8: the pockets of Trump's son in law, Jared Kushner. They said,

444
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:24,400
Speaker 8: don't worry, Jared will never again work for the US government.

445
00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:27,679
Speaker 8: He's never coming back to Washington. So it's okay that

446
00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:30,119
Speaker 8: he's taken all this money from the Saudis. Now we

447
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,919
Speaker 8: will never have to worry about having somebody involved in

448
00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 8: US policy who has also just been given billions of

449
00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 8: dollars by Saudi Arabia apparently for no reason. Well that

450
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:42,960
Speaker 8: was the explanation when he took all that money from

451
00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,199
Speaker 8: the Saudis at the end of Trump's first term. And

452
00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:48,440
Speaker 8: now today, who has been leading the negotiations on behalf

453
00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:51,760
Speaker 8: of the United States government with Iran before we just

454
00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:56,200
Speaker 8: started this war with them today? I mean Secretary of

455
00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,240
Speaker 8: State Mark Rubio was in Saint Kitts this week. Wasn't him, No,

456
00:21:59,359 --> 00:21:59,640
Speaker 8: it was.

457
00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,959
Speaker 2: Jared Sure And I think this will be the you know,

458
00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:05,679
Speaker 2: the the MSNBC line from a lot of the hosts,

459
00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:09,320
Speaker 2: because this allows them to be anti war and it's

460
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 2: much easier to pick on like the politics of picking

461
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,679
Speaker 2: on Saudi Arabia, and look they deserve it, like critical

462
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:16,960
Speaker 2: of Saudi Arabia as well, the politics of that are

463
00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:19,200
Speaker 2: much easier than focusing your eyr.

464
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:23,159
Speaker 1: What about the word Israel? Israel? Can we all say it?

465
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 1: The Secretary of State zad it. Can we say it?

466
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:28,720
Speaker 1: Israel is the primary mover of this conflict?

467
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:29,080
Speaker 4: Why am I?

468
00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 1: This makes me feel crazy?

469
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,479
Speaker 3: And look, we expect bullshit from Fox, but in a

470
00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 3: time of opposition, the way that you channel that opposition,

471
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:38,960
Speaker 3: like with CNN.

472
00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:40,479
Speaker 1: Where like it's like that Mark Warner.

473
00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:42,520
Speaker 3: Initial they're like, well, but we need to hear a

474
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:45,560
Speaker 3: case from the president in the war, and he needs

475
00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:47,720
Speaker 3: a strategy. It's like, no, there's no strategy. This whole

476
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 3: thing is bullshit.

477
00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:48,840
Speaker 1: It's over.

478
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 4: This is bad.

479
00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:52,560
Speaker 3: They can't just like, look, we saw this during Iraq,

480
00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,639
Speaker 3: you know, with the MSNBC and all that light in

481
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 3: the initial years of the war before eventually discovering the

482
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:01,160
Speaker 3: Keith Olberman opposite position. But we don't want to get

483
00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 3: to that point. Let's just not get there in the

484
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,720
Speaker 3: first place. I will at least give the politicians credit.

485
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,200
Speaker 3: They're ahead of like the media in this case, Mark

486
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,200
Speaker 3: Warner and Reuben Diego, you know, these are like centrist

487
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 3: as they come.

488
00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:15,560
Speaker 2: Givo guy is definitely trying to make a pivot.

489
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:17,639
Speaker 7: He's just endorse gram Platner as well. But yeah, I

490
00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:18,159
Speaker 7: mean they.

491
00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:20,640
Speaker 3: Even they though, are like, this is Israel's war. They're

492
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:21,080
Speaker 3: calling him.

493
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,160
Speaker 1: They're like, we're being walked around on a leash.

494
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:26,160
Speaker 3: I mean, this is like four Chans, you know zog

495
00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 3: posting from like five years ago, you know what I mean.

496
00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 2: I know it is crazy to hear Mark Warner, in particular,

497
00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,399
Speaker 2: when I heard him talking about like Israel dragon his

498
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:37,399
Speaker 2: war was like, wow, I could never have imagined, you know,

499
00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:39,440
Speaker 2: to your point, let's actually play a Fox News clip,

500
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:44,560
Speaker 2: because just rest assured. Fox News has been embarrassingly slavishly

501
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 2: pro war building up to the war, in the war now,

502
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 2: whitewashing everything that's going on, I mean, just absolute shameful cheerleaders.

503
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 2: And this moment from Brit Hume, this is the seven

504
00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 2: Guys that I'm queuing up here. It's particularly extraordinary because

505
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:00,879
Speaker 2: he's like, oh, I think the Democrats are caught in

506
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 2: a buying because this worth so popular.

507
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,119
Speaker 7: Meanwhile, look at literally every.

508
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:06,560
Speaker 2: Poll and you will see the way that people are

509
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,920
Speaker 2: completely disgusted with what is being done in their name.

510
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 2: This is the seven Lets take a listen to that.

511
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 9: The public reaction is likely to be favorable. And I

512
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 9: think these Democrats are kind of trapped because they exist

513
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:25,560
Speaker 9: in a party whose membership overwhelmingly despises Donald Trump. It's

514
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,400
Speaker 9: been called Trump derangement syndrome, and there's something to that,

515
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 9: and the result is that these Democrats, with rare exceptions

516
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:34,399
Speaker 9: John Fetterman today, of course was the one we just

517
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 9: heard from, are opposed to this because they feel they

518
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 9: must be that they feel their job in life is

519
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 9: to resistant oppose Donald Trump in every way, almost no

520
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 9: matter what he does. So I think that accounts for

521
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,159
Speaker 9: the political reaction on the Democratic side here now. Over time,

522
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,160
Speaker 9: those who are critical may feel vindicated if things start

523
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 9: to go bailey, but if they don't, they're going to

524
00:24:57,320 --> 00:24:57,879
Speaker 9: be stuck with this.

525
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,720
Speaker 7: Jesus is gonna public is going to react very favorably.

526
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,920
Speaker 1: This is the same guy who sold the rocket. Why

527
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:06,400
Speaker 1: should we be so surprised.

528
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:07,879
Speaker 3: I literally used to watch this guy when I was

529
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 3: a bit like a child in like grade school, doing

530
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:15,919
Speaker 3: the exact same stuff. Nothing's changed, Absolutely nothing has changed.

531
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,560
Speaker 3: And look, if anything, I want to give America credit

532
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 3: because despite all this BS.

533
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 1: They're still against the war.

534
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 3: Imagine that this is like a boomer trap, but the

535
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 3: rest of the country is living in a totally different reality.

536
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm not just fluffing us, but yesterday was

537
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 3: literally the biggest day in the history of our show.

538
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 3: I think this is why I am always Look, you know,

539
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 3: you don't want to be too self referential. I'm like,

540
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 3: it's very nice if the show is popular, but you'll

541
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 3: watch cable news like I was yesterday, waiting for Trump.

542
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 1: To speak, and I was like, oh, this is why, right,

543
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:47,360
Speaker 1: because it's just Bret McGirk.

544
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:52,239
Speaker 3: Brett McGirk was on Stephen Colbert yesterday Lives. Give him up,

545
00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 3: all right, Colbert is bad sorry, un ironically like that

546
00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:58,800
Speaker 3: was Stephen Colbert's special guest. If you don't know who

547
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,520
Speaker 3: that is, a former he worked for multiple administrations.

548
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 1: He's pro war, you know, he's anti.

549
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:05,920
Speaker 2: He was driving the pro genocide tree.

550
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:11,680
Speaker 3: Israel, like you know, one of these typical blob politicians

551
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:13,400
Speaker 3: who's just been around the block, one of the most

552
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:17,160
Speaker 3: failed politicians, like one of the most failed US policymakers

553
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 3: probably in decades.

554
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,479
Speaker 7: But continues to fail up rev exactly.

555
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 3: And he's the one who's on CNN all the time.

556
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:24,959
Speaker 3: Now he's on Stephen Colbert. I mean, this is this

557
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 3: is the level of propaganda that we're all dealing with.

558
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 3: It's craziness.

559
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:29,440
Speaker 7: Let's put E six up on the screen.

560
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:32,720
Speaker 2: This is Scott Jennings, who's, of course the resident Republican

561
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:33,640
Speaker 2: over at CNN.

562
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 7: So he's got.

563
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 2: Two sirens here, he says, senior Trump administration officials tell

564
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:43,400
Speaker 2: me the credible intelligence indicated Iran planned preemptive missile strikes

565
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:46,760
Speaker 2: against US military targets in the region and against civilian

566
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 2: targets as well, failure to act what have resulted in

567
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 2: mass US casualties. So you know, you know, this is

568
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 2: really credible information when senior officials, rather than like you know,

569
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:00,440
Speaker 2: brief in Congress or like planning this with a credible

570
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,119
Speaker 2: media source, leak it to Scott Jennings so that he

571
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 2: can tweet it out. And sure enough, immediately you had

572
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 2: everyone from Ted Cruz, you know, the military, the people

573
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,880
Speaker 2: themselves who went and briefed Congress saying yeah, no, this

574
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 2: is this is not true.

575
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:14,879
Speaker 7: There were no preemptive attacks.

576
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,920
Speaker 2: And now, of course we've got Marco Rubio laying out

577
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:21,359
Speaker 2: this new tale about how well, technically there's sort of

578
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 2: were preemptive attacks if Israel struck them first, which we

579
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 2: thought they were going to strike them first, and.

580
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:27,160
Speaker 7: That put us at risk.

581
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:30,679
Speaker 2: I guess that's their definition of you know, preemptive, That

582
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,639
Speaker 2: we're preempting Israel putting our troops in danger is the

583
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 2: new story.

584
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:36,919
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna have this guy on again. I mean,

585
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 1: you know, look at this.

586
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:40,640
Speaker 7: Lies all all the time.

587
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 2: On their airwaves, and they just keep having them back,

588
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:43,400
Speaker 2: having them back.

589
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 1: It's all that theater. It's all game, you know, to

590
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:46,800
Speaker 1: all of these people.

591
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:48,160
Speaker 3: If you get a story, it like here's the thing,

592
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,560
Speaker 3: you're going to have any opinion that you want, literally

593
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:51,440
Speaker 3: any I don't care.

594
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,640
Speaker 1: I'll never say that you shouldn't be allowed on the air.

595
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:57,120
Speaker 3: But that is literally bullshit whenever it comes and it's

596
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:02,040
Speaker 3: laundered propaganda from the government. Does CNN have any standards

597
00:28:02,040 --> 00:28:04,679
Speaker 3: to allow this up on their air because he is

598
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:08,399
Speaker 3: doing this under their auspices, repeating these types of talking points.

599
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,400
Speaker 3: And again, it's not an opinion. This is a literal

600
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 3: fact that he's trying to presuppose onto the minds of

601
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 3: the American public, which is a complete lie.

602
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:21,200
Speaker 2: I can complete lie if someone came on our program

603
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,440
Speaker 2: and just like routinely, like we would not have that

604
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:25,679
Speaker 2: someone on the air who's just trying to lie to

605
00:28:25,720 --> 00:28:26,720
Speaker 2: our audience all the time.

606
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 1: Why what is the purpose of that, Like it's not.

607
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:31,160
Speaker 2: The blame, it's yeah, they like the you know, they

608
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 2: like the fights, they like the debates, they like that

609
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 2: that circus, and so.

610
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 1: We'll fight a debate if we think there's a purpose

611
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 1: to it.

612
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,600
Speaker 3: But this is literally a purpose for the actual like

613
00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 3: you know, suppose it to be entertainment value. But this

614
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 3: is the ultimate reduction of the mainstream media, where even

615
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 3: war and peace lives, where lives lives are at stake,

616
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 3: the lives of American service members, Iranians, Israelis, Americans are

617
00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: living in the entire golf. Even that is reduced to entertainment.

618
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 3: This is this is why I hate these people so

619
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 3: so much. It's, by the way, speaking of hate Van Jones,

620
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 3: mister reasonable, here's mister reasonable Van Jones singing the praises

621
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 3: of Rais Apolovi, the fail son who will be the

622
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 3: next monarch of Iran.

623
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 1: Take a listener.

624
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,400
Speaker 10: Recently you saw millions of people come out of their

625
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 10: homes protesting, demanding a new regime. They were chanting the

626
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,200
Speaker 10: name of Reza Paulivi. Who is Reza Polavi. He is

627
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 10: actually the son of someone who's known as the Shaw

628
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 10: of Iran. He doesn't want to come home as a

629
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 10: ruler like his father. He wants to come home as

630
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 10: a healer. He wants to come home. It's what's called

631
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 10: a transitional figure to give the people of Iran a

632
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,880
Speaker 10: fair chance to come up with a new government for

633
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 10: themselves that is based not on theocracy like they have

634
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 10: right now, or a monarchy like they had under his father,

635
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 10: but a true democra. But why should you care about rezipolity.

636
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 10: If Iran were suddenly to be ruled by someone who

637
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 10: believes in democracy, believes in the rule of law, believes

638
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 10: in women's rights, believes in fairness to everyone, suddenly the

639
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 10: entire region of the Middle East changes overnight and the

640
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 10: Iranian people get a chance to step forward as partners

641
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 10: to the world again.

642
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is what counts now for good analysis. They

643
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 3: were chanting his name, maybe some people more, maybe few

644
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 3: masad people in the crowd were for sure, this guy

645
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,240
Speaker 3: has no support out of Los Angeles and here in

646
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:41,240
Speaker 3: Georgetown and Potomac, Marian.

647
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:42,479
Speaker 7: Trump says something about him.

648
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, even he was like, yeah, he doesn't have that

649
00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 3: much support, except you know, it's true, it's true. And

650
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:48,920
Speaker 3: then that lady with the Afro who's on TV, that's it.

651
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 3: Those are the only people y right who have It's ridiculous.

652
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,360
Speaker 3: And this is like, honestly, Akmed Talabi had more of

653
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,760
Speaker 3: a chance of leading Iraq than this guy does of

654
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 3: leading Iran a democratic transition. It's I mean, you know,

655
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 3: this guy has not even said one word about any

656
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 3: of the people he supposedly wants to lead who are dead.

657
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: Not one word. So he's going to lead them. Oh yeah, okay,

658
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:11,120
Speaker 1: I'm sure that's going to work out.

659
00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:15,239
Speaker 2: One thing that really all yours leaders to their you know,

660
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 2: potential subjects, is when they cheer for their country to

661
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 2: get bombed and their people to get killed and don't

662
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:22,600
Speaker 2: even express regret.

663
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 7: About it when it happens.

664
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 2: That's something that I find really endears a potential leader

665
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:27,880
Speaker 2: to their people.

666
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:30,600
Speaker 7: And yeah, I mean, you know, and you love the propaganda, la.

667
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 2: He fails to mention how the Shaw came into power

668
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 2: and why it was a monarchy, the fact that we

669
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 2: overthrew their actual democratically elected leader Mosadic and installed the

670
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,480
Speaker 2: Shawns to the Shaw. So, I mean, there is no

671
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 2: legitimacy here whatsoever. And you know, apparently the Trump regime

672
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 2: knows that. But somehow Van Jones, who used to somehow

673
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 2: be a mouse, I mean, this man's transition to whatever

674
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 2: this is is just crazy, total sell out.

675
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 3: And at this point and yeah, well you can still

676
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 3: take a little something called Bezo Prize Google be.

677
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 7: What do you get? One hundred millions?

678
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 4: Yeah?

679
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:04,800
Speaker 1: Okay, interesting.

680
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 2: All right, guys, So this morning we are talking to

681
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 2: Illinois congressional candidate for the ninth Congressional district, kat Abu Gozela.

682
00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 2: She is running in a Democratic primary right now, and

683
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:19,240
Speaker 2: we wanted to talk to her specifically about foreign policy.

684
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 2: Kat welcome, great to see you.

685
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 7: Great to see you too, yeah, of course.

686
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 2: So just to give people a little bit of sort

687
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 2: of context and backstory here, Ryan was able to get

688
00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 2: his hands on an email that had been sent from

689
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 2: a campaign advisor to you, who I understand is no

690
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 2: longer with the team that represented a number of your

691
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 2: views that people had questions about because they found some

692
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 2: of those views relatively surprising. So we figured, rather than

693
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 2: trying to parse secondhand from an advisor who's no longer

694
00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 2: with the team anymore, we would just speak to you

695
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:46,840
Speaker 2: directly about these things.

696
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 7: So glad to have you today, Thanks so much. Yeah,

697
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:49,600
Speaker 7: of course.

698
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:51,560
Speaker 2: So I actually wanted to start with an issue that

699
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 2: wasn't in that letter. We'll get to the letter in

700
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: a minute, but that is top of mind for people,

701
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 2: which is the Iran War. So the first question is just,

702
00:32:58,080 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 2: you know, what do you think about the Iran War?

703
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:03,120
Speaker 2: Do you support or oppose it and why I absolutely

704
00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 2: oppose it.

705
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 7: This was completely unprovoked, and as we saw on reporting

706
00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 7: this morning, Pete Hexseth is trying to paint this as

707
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 7: a Christian war, with one commander even telling his squad

708
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 7: that this is to bring Jesus back through the armageddon.

709
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 7: This is a violation of international law. It's disgusting, and

710
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,800
Speaker 7: it's on Congress to pass a war powers resolution. This

711
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 7: is also another impeachable offense for Trump. Absolutely oppose it,

712
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 7: and I'm just couldn't be more disgusted.

713
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 11: So Kat, let's go through some of the some of

714
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 11: the email to get your to get your sense on

715
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:45,480
Speaker 11: you know, where you agreed with Ben Mermel, the National

716
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 11: Security advisor, and where you disagreed with him. But first

717
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 11: of all, is it true that he's no longer with

718
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 11: the campaign? And was it? Was it this email? Was

719
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 11: it something else? Like, what's the if he's no longer

720
00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 11: with the campaign, what was the decision there?

721
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 7: Yeah, let's start with Ben. So Ben was helping us

722
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 7: write some policy on everything from animal rights to our

723
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:11,480
Speaker 7: Free and Sovereign Palestine page. He actually offered to resign

724
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:13,479
Speaker 7: the second the story broke, Because we have two weeks

725
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:15,680
Speaker 7: to election day, and he didn't want the story to

726
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 7: be about him. He wanted to support the campaign, and

727
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 7: it was a mutual decision, mainly because this was communication

728
00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:24,400
Speaker 7: that was not passed by the campaign. It was not

729
00:34:24,440 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 7: approved by the campaign. I would not have used such

730
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,400
Speaker 7: aggressive language, and there were some characterizations in there that

731
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 7: I actively disagree with. But I also take umbrage with

732
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:35,719
Speaker 7: some of the characterizations I've seen of Ben, and I

733
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:40,280
Speaker 7: do want to clear this up right now. First off,

734
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,839
Speaker 7: I've seen people try to pay him as anti Palestine,

735
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,760
Speaker 7: and that couldn't be further from the truth. Ben actually

736
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,920
Speaker 7: grew up in an Orthodox Jewish family and has lost

737
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,239
Speaker 7: many of his personal relationships, his family, his friends, his

738
00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 7: community for standing up for Palestinian dignity. He and I

739
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 7: have spent hours articulating our right to return policy, which

740
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:02,360
Speaker 7: of course is very personal to myself and my family

741
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 7: because you know, we're Palestinian. He has consistently Actually, when

742
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,359
Speaker 7: he was at the GW encampment, I was also at

743
00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:12,240
Speaker 7: the GW encampment. He was characterized as attending a pro

744
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 7: Israel counter protest there. Both the encampment and the counter

745
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 7: protesters were extremely close together. I know he spoke to

746
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,359
Speaker 7: some of the hostages family. But I think that it's

747
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 7: very disingenuous and also unfair to characterize him as anti

748
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 7: Palestine considering what he has risked in his own personal

749
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 7: life to stand up for Palestinian human rights. The main

750
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 7: issue for his departure is the lack of communication with

751
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:40,160
Speaker 7: the campaign. We also were made aware of him inviting HSI,

752
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:42,080
Speaker 7: which is a part of ICE, to speak to a

753
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:45,799
Speaker 7: group that he was in. I very much disagree with that.

754
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 7: I know that his perspective at that time was like, well,

755
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 7: it's not like the bad part of ICE, it's an

756
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 7: investigation wing. And I think that he now realizes that

757
00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:58,360
Speaker 7: ICE has been bad since it's been created, and hopefully

758
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 7: he wouldn't make that decision again. But I do have

759
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:02,080
Speaker 7: a problem with it, gotcha.

760
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 2: So let's to get into the letter then a little bit.

761
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 2: You said you disagreed with some of the framing or

762
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 2: some of the language in the letter. Could you just

763
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:10,920
Speaker 2: be a little bit specific about that, and we can

764
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 2: just put as an example, put g one up on

765
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 2: the screen as an example of some of the language

766
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:20,000
Speaker 2: in the letter. It described you as firmly an interventionist,

767
00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 2: and it also said you won't stop until Russia's made

768
00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 2: to pay for its crimes, among other policy characterizations. But

769
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 2: what was some of the language in there that you

770
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 2: felt was not reflective of the views that you hold well.

771
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 7: Those two quotes specifically are probably where I'd start. While

772
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 7: it's stop until Ussia is made to pay for its

773
00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 7: crimes seems vague and aggressive, but firmly an interventionist, I

774
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 7: would very much disagree with. First off, I would not

775
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,799
Speaker 7: describe myself and I have never described myself as an

776
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:53,799
Speaker 7: interventionist when it comes to Ukraine and when it comes

777
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:57,239
Speaker 7: to anywhere in the world, including the United States own actions.

778
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:00,720
Speaker 7: I am anti war of aggression, anti invasion, anti crimes

779
00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:03,440
Speaker 7: against humanity, and I think one thing that email didn't

780
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:06,840
Speaker 7: capture is how we need to exhaust all diplomatic options

781
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:10,040
Speaker 7: for humane foreign policy and that any sort of military

782
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:14,200
Speaker 7: aid would be an absolute last resort. Also not captured

783
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 7: there is talking about how paying for arms to Ukraine

784
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,960
Speaker 7: to protect itself from invasion should be paid for through

785
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 7: seizing Russian oligarch assets, which has been a proposed solution

786
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:27,239
Speaker 7: in countries in Europe and is one I believe that

787
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 7: we should act here. But what I really want to

788
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 7: lead with is humane foreign policy. I'm endorsed by Peace Action,

789
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:38,080
Speaker 7: which is the world's largest grassroots piece network. I firmly

790
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:41,920
Speaker 7: believe that in my ideal United States, we are leading

791
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:47,320
Speaker 7: with public diplomacy. We are ensuring the reinstitution also expansion

792
00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:51,240
Speaker 7: of USAID and issuing reparations to the global South, especially

793
00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 7: in the focus of infrastructure and renewable energy. These are

794
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 7: things that I think we should be focusing on, and

795
00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:02,320
Speaker 7: deterrence is it's own subjects. But I do not describe

796
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 7: myself as an interventionist.

797
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 11: The two main things that people picked up on here

798
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 11: were the Russia Ukraine policy and then kind of China Taiwan.

799
00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 11: So I mean, let's do Let's do Russia Ukraine first.

800
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 11: So rather than get into what the email says, is

801
00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:22,759
Speaker 11: your policy, tell us what your policy is. Do you

802
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:28,480
Speaker 11: believe that, as the memo says, that the US should

803
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 11: arm Ukraine until basically every square foot of Ukrainian land

804
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:37,720
Speaker 11: is taken back from Russia. How do you see this ending?

805
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean I want to be realistic here. I'm

806
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:42,440
Speaker 7: not sure that there is a world right now where

807
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 7: Ukraine gets every square foot of land that Russia has

808
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 7: illegally seized, but there is a way that we can

809
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:53,240
Speaker 7: get Ukraine to a position where they have equal footing

810
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:55,719
Speaker 7: or an advantage at the bargaining table. I mean, part

811
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 7: of the reason that this has been so costly for

812
00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:00,840
Speaker 7: both states and for every state that is is siding

813
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:03,920
Speaker 7: with either one, is that there wasn't firm enough policy

814
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 7: to demonstrate that this would be a costly affair, both

815
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:12,960
Speaker 7: in human life and in dollars. So the effort of

816
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 7: arming Ukraine needs to be rooted in the idea of

817
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:18,400
Speaker 7: getting to a negotiating table where they are able to

818
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 7: fight for their own self determination, and then also politically

819
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 7: recognizing illegally Sea's Land as still part of Ukraine. So

820
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 7: one specific question there.

821
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 2: Early in the war, there's reports that Ukraine and Russia

822
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,240
Speaker 2: were actually pretty close to a deal, and that deal

823
00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 2: would have involved, you know, Russia taking some land, you know, Crimea,

824
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:40,799
Speaker 2: probably parts of eastern Ukraine, and the US and the

825
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 2: UK intervened to stop that diplomacy and to continue the war.

826
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,200
Speaker 2: So do you think that was the right move for

827
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 2: the US to intervene at that point and continue arming

828
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:55,440
Speaker 2: Ukraine and sort of block that potential diplomatic solution do

829
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:56,960
Speaker 2: you think that was the right decision or do you

830
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:59,040
Speaker 2: think that that was the wrong call at that point.

831
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 7: I mean, personally, I think that historically appeasement has not

832
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 7: been shown to be an effective solution to invasion. But

833
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 7: I also firmly like when it comes to foreign policy,

834
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:13,719
Speaker 7: my leading principle is the idea of self determination, and

835
00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 7: I think in that moment it should have been up

836
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 7: to the people of Ukraine to decide where they wanted

837
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 7: to reach a peace deal. But once again, that's leading

838
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 7: in self determination. I'm not sure the exact call I

839
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:28,319
Speaker 7: would have made in that moment, because frankly, I'm not

840
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 7: under bombings right now, and it's much different when you

841
00:40:32,280 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 7: are in that position. I don't think it should be

842
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:39,960
Speaker 7: the United States and any other countries role to force

843
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 7: any country to decide what decision to make in its

844
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 7: own self determination.

845
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:47,480
Speaker 11: So the war has lasted longer than World War One

846
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:54,440
Speaker 11: at this point, it has created a generational crisis of

847
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 11: demography for Ukraine. I'm sure you've seen if you want,

848
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 11: there are countless videos going around of basically, you know,

849
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 11: gangs of Ukrainian government officials like snatching fairly elderly people

850
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 11: off the street, you know, pushing them into vans, driving

851
00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 11: them to the front. A lot of Ukrainian men have

852
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:19,200
Speaker 11: left for other parts of left for other parts of Europe.

853
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 11: If if it's that difficult for the Ukrainian government to

854
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:27,720
Speaker 11: force its own people to go to the front lines

855
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:32,960
Speaker 11: and die in this war, why do we believe that

856
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 11: we should then continue pushing them to go there? Doesn't

857
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,320
Speaker 11: that say something about their lack of interest in pursuing

858
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:43,239
Speaker 11: this war If they have to be forced at gunpoint

859
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:47,280
Speaker 11: to go die for this and so at what Russia

860
00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 11: also has suffered, you know, many tens of thousands, probably

861
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:54,839
Speaker 11: perhaps hundreds of thousands of casualties. Why does at what,

862
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:58,600
Speaker 11: at what point does it become a cost that is

863
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 11: like exceptable to the United States? What you said, you

864
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 11: want to you know, you want them to bear a

865
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 11: cost so that they don't do it again. Haven't they

866
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 11: borne that cost at this point? Or what would the

867
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 11: cost be?

868
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:10,440
Speaker 7: I'm sorry, I don't know when I said. When I

869
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 7: said that, I was mentioning that this war has been costly,

870
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 7: and that's I think the aspect of everything that you

871
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 7: said shows that war is hell. I think it should

872
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 7: be up to the Ukrainian people and whether it is

873
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 7: a referendum or whether it is negotiating from their leadership

874
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:32,399
Speaker 7: to decide what deal they want to make to end

875
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,480
Speaker 7: this war. But once again, invasion is it's not okay

876
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:38,799
Speaker 7: when the United States does the people.

877
00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:43,320
Speaker 11: Express that sense of self determination. There aren't elections, and

878
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:44,919
Speaker 11: when they are asked to go to the front lines,

879
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:45,960
Speaker 11: they resist.

880
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 7: That's part of the problem, ensuring that there are ways

881
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:52,880
Speaker 7: to have Like, I know that war is difficult, but

882
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:55,759
Speaker 7: I do think that there is more role for democracy

883
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:58,120
Speaker 7: to play here. But at the same time, I just

884
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 7: need to stress that and wars of aggression are not okay.

885
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:04,239
Speaker 7: It's not okay when the US does it, it's not

886
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 7: okay when Russia does it. And appeasement historically is not

887
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:16,560
Speaker 7: the answer or the instant salve to an invader as

888
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 7: we'd like to hope it would be.

889
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:19,759
Speaker 2: And then how do you balance this, and this will

890
00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 2: tie into your Taiwan policy, how do you balance those

891
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:28,960
Speaker 2: principles of you know, natural self determination and opposing wars

892
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,640
Speaker 2: of aggression with concern that for example, and you can

893
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:34,759
Speaker 2: tell me whether this is your policy or not, you know,

894
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:39,080
Speaker 2: by providing long range weaponry to Ukraine, allowing them to

895
00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:43,040
Speaker 2: strike within Russia, you know, increasing involvement in what you

896
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,680
Speaker 2: know is clearly like a proxy war with the US

897
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:48,680
Speaker 2: directly involved on the side of Ukraine that you're courting,

898
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:53,239
Speaker 2: this direct engagement between two nuclear powers, which obviously in

899
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 2: the nuclear age we have to take extraordinarily seriously. So

900
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:00,520
Speaker 2: how do you balance those principles that you hold with

901
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 2: a concern about you know, an escalatory spiral that could

902
00:44:06,160 --> 00:44:08,320
Speaker 2: lead into you know, chaos and disaster.

903
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think that this is one of those issues

904
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 7: that in our modern diplomatic age, it's like there's no

905
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,560
Speaker 7: black and white. But I think the main thing here

906
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:22,440
Speaker 7: is that Putin doesn't just want to stop with part

907
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:25,880
Speaker 7: of Ukraine. That is not his plan. He will continue

908
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:28,960
Speaker 7: to take more and more. We saw this after twenty fourteen.

909
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 7: The fact that he invaded Ukraine once again in a

910
00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:35,360
Speaker 7: war of aggression shows that his goal is not just

911
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:40,640
Speaker 7: for one piece of the country, or even just that country.

912
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 7: We risk even greater conflict, not just between as like

913
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:50,439
Speaker 7: a proxy war, which I in you know, my own

914
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,360
Speaker 7: values I don't want to see or I would not

915
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,319
Speaker 7: want to support Ukraine in that respect, but in a

916
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:59,680
Speaker 7: way of self determination, but it would be In that case,

917
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:02,520
Speaker 7: you would have even more countries that are directly drawn

918
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,759
Speaker 7: into this conflict, raising these stakes of possible nuclear war

919
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:11,120
Speaker 7: or possible conflict between superpowers. I also think, you know,

920
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:14,959
Speaker 7: for me, nuclear disarmament is a huge priority and something

921
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,560
Speaker 7: that I would want to champion in Congress, especially in

922
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 7: a post Trump world.

923
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:21,640
Speaker 11: On the question of twenty fourteen, do you think the

924
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:26,240
Speaker 11: US played a role in instigating by you know, pushing,

925
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:30,799
Speaker 11: pushing NATO closer and closer support for active support for

926
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:37,040
Speaker 11: the Made on Uprising role in response? Because I think

927
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:40,440
Speaker 11: that goes to the question of American intervention and its virtues.

928
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 7: I totally get what you're saying, Ryan, but personally, I

929
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:45,880
Speaker 7: think the point is moot. Once you're invading another country,

930
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:52,560
Speaker 7: once you are violating that sovereignty, there is no equivocating

931
00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:56,319
Speaker 7: on whether that's okay or not. No matter what the

932
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 7: United States or any other country is doing. Invasion is

933
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:01,000
Speaker 7: a line that we need to draw.

934
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:04,080
Speaker 2: All right, Let's talk then a little bit about your

935
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:08,160
Speaker 2: policy on Taiwan. And again, rather than you know, quoting

936
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 2: from the letter from the advisor, I'll just let you,

937
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:13,120
Speaker 2: you know, have the floor here of how you think

938
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 2: that the US should approach Taiwan and China.

939
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 7: I really appreciate that, Crystal, genuinely, and I also want

940
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 7: to stress for anyone and not just you, Ryan, if

941
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:24,319
Speaker 7: you want to reach out to us, I don't use

942
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,240
Speaker 7: Twitter anymore. The best way to contact us is through

943
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:30,080
Speaker 7: our press accounts or any of the other social media

944
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 7: accounts that we're on, So for comment, would really appreciate that.

945
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:37,600
Speaker 7: In the future regarding Taiwan, though, Look, the Republicans want

946
00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 7: to use China as some boogeyman, and I don't think

947
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:41,680
Speaker 7: it has to be that way. You know, we are

948
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,880
Speaker 7: in a globalized world. I am not an isolationist, but

949
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:46,880
Speaker 7: I want us to get to a point where China

950
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 7: can be a partner with us in trade and innovation.

951
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:53,880
Speaker 7: I also have to balance that with the commitment that

952
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:58,120
Speaker 7: I have to self determination and to promises that we

953
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:00,839
Speaker 7: have made in the past regarding to I think one

954
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:03,160
Speaker 7: thing this email didn't get clear was the fact that

955
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:06,680
Speaker 7: any sort of military aid to Taiwan is an absolute

956
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 7: last resort, not just after diplomatic options have been exhausted,

957
00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:14,840
Speaker 7: but after we exhaust the diplomatic options. After that, we

958
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 7: need to be reinvesting in diplomacy between Taiwan and China,

959
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:22,640
Speaker 7: between Taiwan and the US and the US and China. Additionally,

960
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 7: we need to be politically adhering to the One China policy.

961
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:28,919
Speaker 7: If the Taiwanese people pass referendum saying they want reunification

962
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:32,880
Speaker 7: with China, I'm absolutely supportive of that. That is their choice.

963
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:35,760
Speaker 7: But once again, invasion is where we draw the line.

964
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:38,720
Speaker 7: Even then, I don't support boots on the ground in Taiwan.

965
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:44,120
Speaker 7: I support, specifically in a defensive stance for Taiwan to

966
00:47:44,160 --> 00:47:47,080
Speaker 7: be able to protect itself from invasion, to ensure that

967
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 7: there is a cost by trying to invade this country.

968
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 7: But I also want to stress here that military aid

969
00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:57,600
Speaker 7: should be conditional, and I don't care if it's Taiwan

970
00:47:57,760 --> 00:48:02,120
Speaker 7: or Mexico. If we are providing military aid to a country,

971
00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:05,840
Speaker 7: we need to ensure it's conditional that crimes against humanity

972
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:11,440
Speaker 7: are not being systematically committed using our weapons paid for

973
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:14,880
Speaker 7: by our tax dollars. Additionally, I also want to stress

974
00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 7: that military aid is expensive. I also think we should

975
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:20,239
Speaker 7: be slashing the Pentagon's budget and that we should be

976
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:23,160
Speaker 7: closing in many of our military bases overseas. This is

977
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:25,920
Speaker 7: a massive cost and We also need to be investigating

978
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 7: companies and contractors in the military industrial complex that have

979
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:33,360
Speaker 7: essentially robbed the taxpayers of our money for their own profit.

980
00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:38,919
Speaker 11: So the current policy towards Taiwan is known as you've

981
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 11: talked about, strategic ambiguity, where you don't the US won't

982
00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:44,279
Speaker 11: say whether or not they're going to come in and

983
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 11: actively defend in the case of a Chinese assault on Taiwan.

984
00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:53,680
Speaker 11: Do you believe, as the memo says, and I believe

985
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:57,400
Speaker 11: that you've said elsewhere, but just get it directly from you,

986
00:48:57,440 --> 00:48:59,960
Speaker 11: do you believe that policy should be altered.

987
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 7: Here's the thing. If we had a president who wasn't

988
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:07,200
Speaker 7: a complete madman, like a complete psychopath, I would say,

989
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:09,080
Speaker 7: let's not even touch it. If we had a president

990
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:12,520
Speaker 7: aoc here who was able to balance these things at

991
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:15,880
Speaker 7: one time, I would say, absolutely this is the policy

992
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,239
Speaker 7: to go with. But we don't have that. We have

993
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,680
Speaker 7: a guy who's waging a Christian war with Israel against

994
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 7: Iran with zero provocation. We need to ensure that we

995
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 7: are codifying major actions that we will need to take

996
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:36,840
Speaker 7: regardless of the president under this administration, especially because no

997
00:49:36,920 --> 00:49:39,600
Speaker 7: one the United States, China, any other country in the

998
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 7: world has any idea what would happen if China does

999
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 7: invade Taiwan under this president. It could be wiping your

1000
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 7: hands clean and saying I'm good. He could try to

1001
00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 7: nuke it. We have no idea. By codifying a response,

1002
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:58,359
Speaker 7: we can ensure that there is that deterrence for more

1003
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,840
Speaker 7: diplomatic solutions, which once again is the main thing I

1004
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:05,520
Speaker 7: The last thing I want is war with China. But

1005
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 7: Trump is a madman, and we have no idea his

1006
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:13,759
Speaker 7: response to anything on the foreign or domestic stage. This

1007
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 7: is why I even I mean, it's controversial to broach

1008
00:50:16,560 --> 00:50:19,800
Speaker 7: the subject at all, but why I did so.

1009
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:23,279
Speaker 11: So the just one quick file of US so just

1010
00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:25,080
Speaker 11: to make sure I understand what you're saying. So so, because

1011
00:50:25,080 --> 00:50:27,799
Speaker 11: Trump is a mad man, you want to codify that

1012
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:33,520
Speaker 11: the US will definitely respond militarily if China moves on.

1013
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:37,240
Speaker 7: Will provide military aid to Taiwan if asked to defend

1014
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 7: itself from an invasion. That military aid, of course being conditional.

1015
00:50:41,800 --> 00:50:44,680
Speaker 11: An aid means shipping weapons, or to aid means actively

1016
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:47,719
Speaker 11: participating in shipping weapons.

1017
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:49,920
Speaker 7: I know in the past I have said aid and

1018
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 7: intercepting missiles at the beginning of an invasion. I think

1019
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:55,440
Speaker 7: that is on the table, but we should not have

1020
00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 7: US troops deployed on Taiwanese soil.

1021
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:04,719
Speaker 2: Obviously, the concern is that if you move away from

1022
00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:07,520
Speaker 2: strategic ambiguity, which is meant to I don't know what

1023
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 2: we'd do to enforcing this hard line and saying you know,

1024
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:15,759
Speaker 2: we will respond, we will defund Taiwan, that that would

1025
00:51:15,840 --> 00:51:19,719
Speaker 2: in fact provoke a direct conflict with China, and again

1026
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:21,799
Speaker 2: gets to the you know, the same concern about a

1027
00:51:21,840 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 2: direct conflict with Russia. Obviously, nuclear armed superpower, incredibly capable

1028
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:30,640
Speaker 2: at this point in terms of their military and technology.

1029
00:51:31,120 --> 00:51:34,520
Speaker 2: So what gives you the confidence that drawing that harder

1030
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 2: line is not going to actually escalate the conflict with China?

1031
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 7: I mean, frankly, Biden did this in his last administration.

1032
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 7: He mentioned that we need to be questioning where we

1033
00:51:47,080 --> 00:51:49,799
Speaker 7: stand on strategic ambiguity, and the response that China had

1034
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,520
Speaker 7: was some angry op eds on the mainland, but did

1035
00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:56,040
Speaker 7: not spirek full invasion into Taiwan.

1036
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,399
Speaker 11: So on a more kind of philosophical level, to get

1037
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 11: to the heart of a foreign policy approach, you do

1038
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:08,800
Speaker 11: have a very deep and intuitive understanding of the problems

1039
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,480
Speaker 11: with the military industrial complex and also its willingness to

1040
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:15,880
Speaker 11: assist in a genocide in Gaza. I'm just curious, how

1041
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:20,200
Speaker 11: did you develop this comfort with using, you know, US

1042
00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:27,400
Speaker 11: military support, intervention and US sanctions around the world, Like

1043
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:31,840
Speaker 11: what one would expect, Like for somebody who has seen

1044
00:52:32,600 --> 00:52:35,319
Speaker 11: what the US is capable of when it intervenes, either

1045
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 11: through sanctions policy or militarily, it'd say, you know what

1046
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:41,719
Speaker 11: this is like, we just need to roll We just

1047
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:44,600
Speaker 11: need to roll this back. Yeah, So where does the

1048
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:45,520
Speaker 11: comfort come from.

1049
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:49,000
Speaker 7: I wouldn't describe it as comfort at all. I mean,

1050
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:54,879
Speaker 7: my own family was expelled from Palestine in nineteen forty eight,

1051
00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:57,120
Speaker 7: and there are still many of my family members that

1052
00:52:57,160 --> 00:53:01,080
Speaker 7: don't have full civil or legal rights that have been

1053
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:06,360
Speaker 7: killed as a result of this genocide. It's not something

1054
00:53:06,400 --> 00:53:08,680
Speaker 7: that I take any comfort in. But I also think

1055
00:53:08,719 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 7: we need to be realistic in the right to self determination,

1056
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:13,720
Speaker 7: which I think is something that I hope you all understand.

1057
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:19,919
Speaker 7: I'm very personally invested and passionate about, but I want

1058
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,880
Speaker 7: to do everything we possibly can to lead with humane

1059
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:29,359
Speaker 7: foreign policy under Trump. These are safeguards against him and

1060
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:33,520
Speaker 7: not knowing what his response would be, but I ideally

1061
00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:35,919
Speaker 7: would like to not have to use them at all.

1062
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:39,800
Speaker 7: One of the you know, I studied international affairs, I

1063
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:43,840
Speaker 7: actually focused on security policy, like I really focused on atrocity, genocide,

1064
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:47,160
Speaker 7: and extremism in school. And one of my biggest passions,

1065
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:49,000
Speaker 7: one of my favorite courses and one of the things

1066
00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 7: that I've studied the most, is the value of public diplomacy,

1067
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:56,920
Speaker 7: of cultural exchange, of investing in infrastructure, of the need

1068
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,160
Speaker 7: to have trade between all of these countries in the

1069
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:02,600
Speaker 7: globalized world we have now, that is what I want

1070
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 7: our foreign policy to be. I want to be rolling

1071
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:08,600
Speaker 7: back military bases abroad. I want to be cutting the

1072
00:54:08,600 --> 00:54:12,000
Speaker 7: Pentagon's budget. We need to be investing it in housing, groceries,

1073
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:14,799
Speaker 7: and healthcare. Here we need not just a Marshall Plan,

1074
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:18,080
Speaker 7: but a new new deal for our federal government that

1075
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 7: includes mass employment, that includes building more housing, that focuses

1076
00:54:21,960 --> 00:54:26,239
Speaker 7: instead of bombs on actually helping folks here. But we

1077
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:30,480
Speaker 7: also will have to deal with the fact that we

1078
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:34,160
Speaker 7: are pariahs on the global stage. We need to recognize.

1079
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,680
Speaker 7: I think one of the issues here when we're talking

1080
00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:40,960
Speaker 7: about this is I mean what I say, and that's

1081
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:44,439
Speaker 7: not something you see a lot in politics, especially when

1082
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:49,160
Speaker 7: it comes to military aid. I feel very passionate about

1083
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:53,160
Speaker 7: sovereignty and I feel very passionate about human rights, and

1084
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 7: that is part of why I am running for Congress

1085
00:54:56,200 --> 00:54:58,879
Speaker 7: in the first place. I want to not just end

1086
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 7: the genocide in Gaza and in the West Bank, but

1087
00:55:02,880 --> 00:55:07,680
Speaker 7: also be working towards establishing Palestinian statehood and also ensuring

1088
00:55:07,719 --> 00:55:11,120
Speaker 7: that any solution there is negotiated by the people actually

1089
00:55:11,120 --> 00:55:15,720
Speaker 7: living there and not dictated by the United States. These

1090
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:19,759
Speaker 7: are all principles that can when it comes to military aid,

1091
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:21,960
Speaker 7: when it comes to public diplomacy, when it comes to

1092
00:55:22,040 --> 00:55:24,719
Speaker 7: reparations for the Global South. It can be difficult to

1093
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:28,200
Speaker 7: hold them in, especially with the United States history of

1094
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:33,600
Speaker 7: intervention and imperialism, to hold them together and to understand

1095
00:55:33,640 --> 00:55:36,960
Speaker 7: how they contradict and also understand how they're more complicated

1096
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:39,640
Speaker 7: than we would like to portray them. But that is

1097
00:55:39,680 --> 00:55:41,719
Speaker 7: also part of the reason that I want to help

1098
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:44,719
Speaker 7: elect more progressives across the country, so we don't have

1099
00:55:45,000 --> 00:55:48,160
Speaker 7: representatives that are behold into the military industrial complex, and

1100
00:55:48,200 --> 00:55:50,600
Speaker 7: we can look at these issues with clear eyes and

1101
00:55:50,800 --> 00:55:53,920
Speaker 7: also express disagreements and try to find the best path forward.

1102
00:55:54,280 --> 00:55:56,800
Speaker 2: It just seems that the two values are somewhat in conflict.

1103
00:55:56,920 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 2: The value of rolling back the bases over ease and

1104
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:04,160
Speaker 2: checking the military industrial complex and reclaiming some of that

1105
00:56:04,239 --> 00:56:07,400
Speaker 2: funding so that instead of having austerity for social programs

1106
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:10,040
Speaker 2: we have austerity for the Pentagon seems to be in

1107
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:14,520
Speaker 2: conflict with the instinct to intervene in all of these

1108
00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 2: border disputes. And one other thing that I'll put there

1109
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 2: too is, obviously we talggle about Ukraine and Taiwan a

1110
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:24,439
Speaker 2: lot because those are the places where the Empire has

1111
00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:27,120
Speaker 2: the most interest and you know, is interested in checking

1112
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:31,399
Speaker 2: these geopolitical rivals in particular. But there are dozens of

1113
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:36,200
Speaker 2: border disputes around the world right now. So also, what

1114
00:56:36,360 --> 00:56:39,640
Speaker 2: is the limiting principle for where you would want the

1115
00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:43,600
Speaker 2: military engage, where you would want us intervening potentially covertly?

1116
00:56:44,040 --> 00:56:47,000
Speaker 2: You know, how do you reel that in if that's

1117
00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:48,120
Speaker 2: the underlying principle.

1118
00:56:48,800 --> 00:56:53,200
Speaker 7: First off, I don't support like covert CIA coups, and

1119
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:54,880
Speaker 7: I think this is something that we also need to

1120
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 7: ensure that we are holding people accountable for that we

1121
00:56:57,800 --> 00:57:00,680
Speaker 7: are investigating these types of interventions that we have made.

1122
00:57:01,280 --> 00:57:03,000
Speaker 7: These are things that I think we should be saying

1123
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:06,560
Speaker 7: publicly and above board, or at least discussing publicly and

1124
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:09,959
Speaker 7: above board, because that lack of transparency when it comes

1125
00:57:10,040 --> 00:57:15,160
Speaker 7: to any sort of intervention has been limited in the past.

1126
00:57:15,320 --> 00:57:18,000
Speaker 7: And when it comes to these two issues in particular,

1127
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:23,200
Speaker 7: not only have we made a commitment, actually full stop,

1128
00:57:23,240 --> 00:57:26,760
Speaker 7: we have made a commitment, and I also want to

1129
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:31,200
Speaker 7: stress that any sort of aid to these two states

1130
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:34,880
Speaker 7: has to come with consent from those states. You are

1131
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:38,200
Speaker 7: absolutely right, crystal of like, these are geopolitical rivals, but

1132
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 7: it also means that when they are doing an imperialism,

1133
00:57:42,600 --> 00:57:45,480
Speaker 7: when they are invading another country, they aren't necessarily in

1134
00:57:45,560 --> 00:57:49,560
Speaker 7: the right just because they're not the United States. Yes,

1135
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:52,760
Speaker 7: these are two very hot button topics that involve two

1136
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:56,960
Speaker 7: of our biggest geopolitical rivals, but there are also two

1137
00:57:57,040 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 7: commitments that we have made, and when it comes to invasion,

1138
00:58:01,840 --> 00:58:04,680
Speaker 7: if we have made that commitment, we should absolutely stand

1139
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:07,600
Speaker 7: by it with the consent of those countries and not

1140
00:58:07,640 --> 00:58:11,160
Speaker 7: putting our troops on the ground. But first off, exhausting

1141
00:58:11,320 --> 00:58:13,560
Speaker 7: every diplomatic option beforehand.

1142
00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:18,880
Speaker 11: Are there any models for intervention, either diplomatic or military

1143
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:23,040
Speaker 11: that you would uplift as like this is how, this

1144
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:24,600
Speaker 11: is how it should be done, and this was actually

1145
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:28,600
Speaker 11: effective at producing self determination in the country where it

1146
00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:30,440
Speaker 11: was brought to.

1147
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:34,160
Speaker 7: I'm actually going to go a little bit aside from

1148
00:58:34,400 --> 00:58:37,120
Speaker 7: that question to one of my favorite examples of public

1149
00:58:37,120 --> 00:58:40,919
Speaker 7: diplomacy that when I first heard like the first half

1150
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,320
Speaker 7: of this, I was like, I don't know about that,

1151
00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:46,120
Speaker 7: and then by the end of it was on board

1152
00:58:46,120 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 7: with So bear with me here. One of my professors

1153
00:58:50,840 --> 00:58:54,880
Speaker 7: was Apao in a Middle Eastern country, a public affairs officer,

1154
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 7: and during Ramadan this was I believe in like twenty

1155
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:04,600
Speaker 7: fourteen early twenty ten, they worked with a local film

1156
00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:07,640
Speaker 7: group to create a TV series about the realities of

1157
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:11,840
Speaker 7: being an ISIS bride, of being a woman recruited to ISIS,

1158
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:14,280
Speaker 7: and the horror of I think all of us can

1159
00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:17,400
Speaker 7: agree that women undergo when they are recruited by ISIS.

1160
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:23,400
Speaker 7: It was largely paid for with a coalition of dollars,

1161
00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:28,720
Speaker 7: but also pushed by the American by the American government,

1162
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:32,280
Speaker 7: but it was had complete control by the filmmakers who

1163
00:59:32,320 --> 00:59:36,320
Speaker 7: were local that wrote it, distributed it, and it was

1164
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:40,760
Speaker 7: aired during Rabadon the next year, ISIS recruitment of women

1165
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:45,120
Speaker 7: went down by like seventy five percent. That is I

1166
00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:48,400
Speaker 7: think a yes, it is a small example, but an

1167
00:59:48,400 --> 00:59:54,920
Speaker 7: example of actually beneficial US involvement in diplomacy, but also

1168
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,439
Speaker 7: actively working towards a goal. Of course that is much

1169
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:06,640
Speaker 7: smaller than providing military aid or trying to negotiate border disputes.

1170
01:00:06,960 --> 01:00:09,160
Speaker 7: But this is the type of public diplomacy and humane

1171
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:11,280
Speaker 7: foreign policy that I think we should be leading with

1172
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:13,280
Speaker 7: by putting it in the hands of the people that

1173
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:16,200
Speaker 7: actually live there, of the leaders who are actually there,

1174
01:00:16,640 --> 01:00:19,960
Speaker 7: of addressing the issues that they actually want to address,

1175
01:00:20,600 --> 01:00:23,360
Speaker 7: and not saying we are the cops that are dictating

1176
01:00:23,360 --> 01:00:26,840
Speaker 7: what you have to do, but instead asking, look, especially

1177
01:00:26,880 --> 01:00:29,080
Speaker 7: as we're going to have to make a lot of

1178
01:00:29,640 --> 01:00:31,080
Speaker 7: we're going to have to be on like a twenty

1179
01:00:31,120 --> 01:00:33,920
Speaker 7: year apology tour after this presidency and after you know,

1180
01:00:33,960 --> 01:00:40,000
Speaker 7: the last hundred years of American foreign policy, of we

1181
01:00:40,160 --> 01:00:43,760
Speaker 7: have immense resources and these are actual issues on the ground,

1182
01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:46,360
Speaker 7: and if we are going to be involved in this

1183
01:00:46,400 --> 01:00:51,280
Speaker 7: globalized world, how do you want us to be involved?

1184
01:00:51,640 --> 01:00:55,360
Speaker 2: And in terms of a military intervention or action, is

1185
01:00:55,400 --> 01:00:58,000
Speaker 2: there a model that you know that you would point

1186
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,200
Speaker 2: to that is sort of reflective of the value that

1187
01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:01,280
Speaker 2: you support.

1188
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:05,880
Speaker 7: I mean, unfortunately, the war that I can think that

1189
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:09,200
Speaker 7: the United States was on the right of is World

1190
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:10,920
Speaker 7: War Two. And I can point to the fact that

1191
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:15,840
Speaker 7: appeasement didn't work, but that working with and arming countries

1192
01:01:15,840 --> 01:01:19,240
Speaker 7: that did fight against invasion was successful. But it did

1193
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:21,720
Speaker 7: have a massive toll, which is why we need to

1194
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:26,120
Speaker 7: have firmer commitment to international law, international laws that didn't

1195
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:30,880
Speaker 7: exist until after that war, and ensuring that we are

1196
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:34,439
Speaker 7: truly trying to follow those principles, laws that, by the way,

1197
01:01:34,440 --> 01:01:37,800
Speaker 7: were created by both the United States and the Soviet Union.

1198
01:01:39,200 --> 01:01:41,840
Speaker 7: But the truth is, over the last hundred years, the

1199
01:01:41,840 --> 01:01:46,920
Speaker 7: only consistency we've really seen is across the board the

1200
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:49,880
Speaker 7: effects of imperialism and the model for fascism on the

1201
01:01:49,880 --> 01:01:55,640
Speaker 7: global scale, targeting visible minorities, queer people, educational institutions, and

1202
01:01:55,720 --> 01:02:01,680
Speaker 7: trying to silo a population in its within its borders

1203
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:06,080
Speaker 7: while targeting another population. So we are kind of on

1204
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 7: uncharted territory here, and I think it's on us, not

1205
01:02:09,960 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 7: just as the United States, but as a planet to

1206
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:15,960
Speaker 7: be committing to the values that we believe in trying

1207
01:02:15,960 --> 01:02:16,480
Speaker 7: something new.

1208
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:19,080
Speaker 11: There's an argument. I'm curious for you. I'm sure you've

1209
01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:20,600
Speaker 11: seen it. I'm curious for your take on it. That

1210
01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:25,960
Speaker 11: kind of hawkish wing of the US security establishment overlearned

1211
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:29,560
Speaker 11: the lesson of World War Two and now tries to

1212
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:35,200
Speaker 11: frame all diplomacy as appeasement. That any any diplomacy with

1213
01:02:35,720 --> 01:02:38,200
Speaker 11: somebody that you considered to be adversarial is by then

1214
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:41,080
Speaker 11: definition appeasement and will lead to them worse things. So

1215
01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:44,400
Speaker 11: we actually have to you actually have to confront Confrontation

1216
01:02:44,480 --> 01:02:46,920
Speaker 11: has to be the lead. What's your I'm sure you've

1217
01:02:46,920 --> 01:02:49,080
Speaker 11: heard that argument. What's your counter to it?

1218
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:53,919
Speaker 7: I think it's a dumb argument. Frankly, like I said,

1219
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:57,439
Speaker 7: you know a lot of American politicians on both sides

1220
01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:59,320
Speaker 7: want to paint China as a boogeyman. I think that

1221
01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:02,400
Speaker 7: we can be using deterrence not just as a way

1222
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:04,720
Speaker 7: to stop an invasion of Taiwan, but also as a

1223
01:03:04,760 --> 01:03:08,040
Speaker 7: stopgap to build diplomatic relations between the US and China.

1224
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:09,960
Speaker 7: We live in a globalized world and we have to

1225
01:03:10,040 --> 01:03:14,080
Speaker 7: act like it. We have to be encouraging more trade relationships.

1226
01:03:14,080 --> 01:03:17,520
Speaker 7: We have to be encouraging investment infrastructure and renewable energy.

1227
01:03:18,120 --> 01:03:22,200
Speaker 7: We have to be collaborating on innovation, and you know,

1228
01:03:22,240 --> 01:03:25,120
Speaker 7: maybe that sounds pollyanna ish, but I don't care. I

1229
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:29,480
Speaker 7: think that this is the future of our world. If

1230
01:03:29,520 --> 01:03:32,600
Speaker 7: we want to have any chance of surviving climate change,

1231
01:03:32,640 --> 01:03:34,920
Speaker 7: we want to have any chance of surviving we're not

1232
01:03:35,200 --> 01:03:40,360
Speaker 7: enduring a thermonuclear war. That collaboration and diplomacy is essential,

1233
01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:41,800
Speaker 7: and you will have to do it with countries you

1234
01:03:41,880 --> 01:03:44,200
Speaker 7: like and countries you don't like. And I think that

1235
01:03:44,400 --> 01:03:49,600
Speaker 7: specific argument that you mentioned, especially by warhawks, is frankly

1236
01:03:49,960 --> 01:03:53,680
Speaker 7: kind of idiotic. I would just go back.

1237
01:03:53,520 --> 01:03:56,360
Speaker 2: To the example of Ukraine, because I think it illustrates

1238
01:03:56,360 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 2: some of the difficult choices here where you know, very

1239
01:03:59,760 --> 01:04:03,800
Speaker 2: early there was a diplomatic effort, and we know kind

1240
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:06,400
Speaker 2: of the contours of what that deal would have looked like,

1241
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 2: and it is a much better deal than what would

1242
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:12,600
Speaker 2: likely be on the table for Ukraine today. And it

1243
01:04:12,680 --> 01:04:17,280
Speaker 2: obviously comes four years before we've had this mass you know,

1244
01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:21,160
Speaker 2: death and destruction and the loss effectively of an entire generation,

1245
01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:26,200
Speaker 2: if not two generations of Ukrainian men, and heavy battlefield losses.

1246
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:29,640
Speaker 7: So, you know, how do you think.

1247
01:04:29,480 --> 01:04:32,840
Speaker 2: About weighing and balancing the fact that there's no doubt

1248
01:04:32,920 --> 01:04:34,440
Speaker 2: right in a lot of ways, it would have been

1249
01:04:34,440 --> 01:04:38,240
Speaker 2: an unjust outcome at that point in time because Russia

1250
01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:42,440
Speaker 2: would have taken some territory based on that invasion. Nevertheless,

1251
01:04:42,440 --> 01:04:45,320
Speaker 2: it would be a superior outcome to what is likely

1252
01:04:45,400 --> 01:04:46,840
Speaker 2: to be achievable at this point.

1253
01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:50,120
Speaker 7: Once again, I think that in that instance it should

1254
01:04:50,120 --> 01:04:52,960
Speaker 7: have been up to Ukraine and not pressure by other

1255
01:04:53,040 --> 01:04:55,120
Speaker 7: countries outside of Ukraine.

1256
01:04:55,680 --> 01:04:56,320
Speaker 1: This is.

1257
01:04:58,560 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 7: This is an argument of sovereignty in my opinion, and

1258
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:03,000
Speaker 7: if that is what the country of Ukraine chooses to

1259
01:05:03,040 --> 01:05:06,840
Speaker 7: do and what they have negotiated, that should be their prerogative.

1260
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:11,160
Speaker 7: And the United States is not Ukraine. I'm not sure

1261
01:05:11,160 --> 01:05:13,240
Speaker 7: if y'all have heard this. We are not Ukraine and

1262
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:16,120
Speaker 7: it should be up to that country to be able

1263
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:17,080
Speaker 7: to decide its future.

1264
01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:21,720
Speaker 2: So APAC has apparently been coming after you, kat Ryan,

1265
01:05:21,720 --> 01:05:23,240
Speaker 2: maybe you should set this up because you know the

1266
01:05:23,280 --> 01:05:26,880
Speaker 2: details of who exactly this a PAC affiliated super pack

1267
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 2: Chicago Progressive Partnership is.

1268
01:05:29,720 --> 01:05:32,040
Speaker 11: Yeah, this seems like a new one. Originally they were

1269
01:05:32,040 --> 01:05:34,959
Speaker 11: doing well. They had two in their Affordable Chicago now

1270
01:05:35,880 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 11: ironically a pack biting Mom Donnie's kind of affordability message.

1271
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:42,000
Speaker 11: And then they had one elect Chicago Women.

1272
01:05:43,640 --> 01:05:46,400
Speaker 7: Now they call it ECW because it's already so toxic.

1273
01:05:47,120 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 11: So immediately their their bake pack had took on a

1274
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:53,000
Speaker 11: level of toxility that they had to ultate.

1275
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:53,480
Speaker 1: Docs.

1276
01:05:54,160 --> 01:05:57,920
Speaker 11: Yeah, so they're coming after you for with positions you

1277
01:05:57,920 --> 01:05:59,160
Speaker 11: held in high school, am I?

1278
01:06:00,040 --> 01:06:00,320
Speaker 6: Yeah?

1279
01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:04,520
Speaker 7: Yeah, hold on, let me describe this ad to y'all.

1280
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:09,120
Speaker 7: So I grew up like Reagan Republican because my mom

1281
01:06:09,520 --> 01:06:11,920
Speaker 7: was a white Texan and my dad was like, yeah,

1282
01:06:11,920 --> 01:06:16,440
Speaker 7: assimilation's great. And so when I was about fifteen, I

1283
01:06:16,440 --> 01:06:20,080
Speaker 7: started questioning whether Ronald Reagan was right about everything. He

1284
01:06:20,200 --> 01:06:23,240
Speaker 7: was wrong pretty much about everything, and Trump had just

1285
01:06:23,280 --> 01:06:25,400
Speaker 7: announced his presidency around then, and so I was like,

1286
01:06:25,440 --> 01:06:30,880
Speaker 7: maybe Marco Rubio is the answer. Which anyways, I wrote

1287
01:06:30,920 --> 01:06:33,000
Speaker 7: an op ed in my high school paper, which is

1288
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:35,200
Speaker 7: now defunct. By the way, I got it shut down

1289
01:06:35,240 --> 01:06:38,880
Speaker 7: for writing a story on students cheating and the alumni

1290
01:06:38,920 --> 01:06:43,400
Speaker 7: association didn't like that. But they quoted this paper twice

1291
01:06:43,480 --> 01:06:46,080
Speaker 7: in an AD to try to paint me as a

1292
01:06:46,160 --> 01:06:53,440
Speaker 7: secret Republican literally my high school paper. Additionally, have they

1293
01:06:53,560 --> 01:06:56,480
Speaker 7: used AI to like give me Mara a loco face

1294
01:06:56,560 --> 01:07:00,360
Speaker 7: on a pin next to Marco Rubio's face. It's really

1295
01:07:00,400 --> 01:07:03,960
Speaker 7: incredible stuff. Also, the entire thing is like, who is

1296
01:07:04,080 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 7: kat Aba Gazale? We don't know, as if there aren't

1297
01:07:07,680 --> 01:07:12,400
Speaker 7: thousands of pages of my own reporting and federal indictments

1298
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:16,680
Speaker 7: to let people know. But genuinely made me laugh out loud.

1299
01:07:17,360 --> 01:07:21,400
Speaker 11: So you've been on a journey since then, So talk

1300
01:07:21,480 --> 01:07:23,720
Speaker 11: about how you wound up where you are now, because

1301
01:07:23,840 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 11: I think we have g six here. I think along

1302
01:07:26,760 --> 01:07:31,120
Speaker 11: the way on this journey you were a bit enamored

1303
01:07:31,160 --> 01:07:32,680
Speaker 11: of Pete Boy.

1304
01:07:32,800 --> 01:07:35,520
Speaker 2: You had high hopes for Pete, high hopes, had high

1305
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:37,000
Speaker 2: hopes for Pete's for Pete.

1306
01:07:37,200 --> 01:07:42,440
Speaker 11: What was it about the Buddha Judge campaign that like

1307
01:07:42,560 --> 01:07:45,800
Speaker 11: attracted you then? And if like, is that where you

1308
01:07:45,840 --> 01:07:49,320
Speaker 11: are politically now? Or would you if today's kat was

1309
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:52,320
Speaker 11: back in the twenty twenty presidential election, would you support

1310
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:53,080
Speaker 11: a different.

1311
01:07:53,520 --> 01:07:56,800
Speaker 7: I would be supporting Bernie Sanders. So I, uh, so,

1312
01:07:57,000 --> 01:08:01,640
Speaker 7: I grew up in this like you know, fiscally conservative household,

1313
01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:05,120
Speaker 7: and then we moved and where we moved to was

1314
01:08:05,680 --> 01:08:08,080
Speaker 7: much less segregated by income than where I had originally

1315
01:08:08,080 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 7: grown up. So I was about fifteen and one of

1316
01:08:11,000 --> 01:08:15,080
Speaker 7: my friends, who absolutely brilliant, so much smarter and more

1317
01:08:15,120 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 7: talented than me, couldn't go to college. She wanted to

1318
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:20,040
Speaker 7: be a doctor, and she couldn't go to college. She

1319
01:08:20,280 --> 01:08:22,040
Speaker 7: still hasn't because she had to help take care of

1320
01:08:22,040 --> 01:08:24,280
Speaker 7: her family. And it kind of it was like that

1321
01:08:24,360 --> 01:08:28,640
Speaker 7: puncture that I needed to break this conservative sphere I

1322
01:08:28,720 --> 01:08:30,599
Speaker 7: was in where I was like, but you did everything right,

1323
01:08:30,680 --> 01:08:32,880
Speaker 7: you did the bootstraps, you got the scholarship, Like, what

1324
01:08:32,920 --> 01:08:34,680
Speaker 7: do you mean you can't go to college. So that

1325
01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:37,840
Speaker 7: was when I started questioning things. By the end of

1326
01:08:38,040 --> 01:08:40,920
Speaker 7: the twenty sixteen election, I was canvassing for Hillargate at

1327
01:08:40,960 --> 01:08:43,120
Speaker 7: some voter registration drives and I was like, I'm a

1328
01:08:43,160 --> 01:08:47,519
Speaker 7: Democrat now. And then throughout college I started to go

1329
01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:51,200
Speaker 7: more and more to the left, specifically focusing on atrocity, genocide,

1330
01:08:51,240 --> 01:08:53,880
Speaker 7: and extremism because there was also this idea my parents

1331
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:56,599
Speaker 7: also came on this journey with me of a lot

1332
01:08:56,600 --> 01:08:58,960
Speaker 7: of our values didn't align with this party that we

1333
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:00,960
Speaker 7: said we were a part of. Like, at no point

1334
01:09:01,040 --> 01:09:02,960
Speaker 7: during my childhood did I feel like I couldn't do

1335
01:09:03,000 --> 01:09:05,280
Speaker 7: something just because I was a woman. I was very

1336
01:09:05,439 --> 01:09:08,880
Speaker 7: passionate about Palestinian sovereignty since I was a little kid.

1337
01:09:08,920 --> 01:09:11,960
Speaker 7: I actually got put in I couldn't go to recess

1338
01:09:11,960 --> 01:09:15,439
Speaker 7: one day because I corrected my fifth grade teacher on settlements.

1339
01:09:15,880 --> 01:09:18,760
Speaker 7: But in college I just started kind of I was

1340
01:09:19,200 --> 01:09:21,040
Speaker 7: coming to this idea of like, well, you know, we

1341
01:09:21,080 --> 01:09:24,200
Speaker 7: need the guy that will appeal to everyone, and I thought.

1342
01:09:24,200 --> 01:09:26,960
Speaker 7: I actually wrote a paper in my senior year where

1343
01:09:26,960 --> 01:09:29,360
Speaker 7: I was like, Pete Boodh Judge is the voud Castota candidate,

1344
01:09:29,439 --> 01:09:30,840
Speaker 7: Like you can just get it at a bar and

1345
01:09:30,880 --> 01:09:32,280
Speaker 7: it's fine.

1346
01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:33,439
Speaker 1: But yeah.

1347
01:09:33,520 --> 01:09:35,559
Speaker 7: By twenty twenty, I graduated. I had gone to school

1348
01:09:35,600 --> 01:09:38,800
Speaker 7: to either become a foreign service officer or to work

1349
01:09:38,840 --> 01:09:41,200
Speaker 7: for like a legacy media outlet, and I graduated into

1350
01:09:41,200 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 7: May twenty twenty, and I was very disenchanted with both

1351
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:46,679
Speaker 7: our government and legacy media, which is why I started

1352
01:09:46,720 --> 01:09:49,280
Speaker 7: looking for jobs that align more with my values. In

1353
01:09:50,120 --> 01:09:55,040
Speaker 7: By the time of like January twenty twenty, I was

1354
01:09:55,360 --> 01:09:59,120
Speaker 7: very much in Bernie's camp, and I wish that in

1355
01:09:59,160 --> 01:10:01,160
Speaker 7: twenty sixteen I could have been a part of that too,

1356
01:10:01,320 --> 01:10:06,080
Speaker 7: even though I was sixteen seventeen years old. But really

1357
01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:09,360
Speaker 7: covering the far right and seeing how ineffective Democrats have

1358
01:10:09,479 --> 01:10:12,360
Speaker 7: been in addressing the threat of the far right has

1359
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,360
Speaker 7: been essential in shaping my worldview. Like we told them

1360
01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:17,960
Speaker 7: about January sixth, before it happened. We told them about

1361
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:21,400
Speaker 7: where the DEI CRT anti trans panic would lead. We

1362
01:10:21,479 --> 01:10:25,320
Speaker 7: told them about how attacking encampments under the guise of

1363
01:10:25,760 --> 01:10:28,599
Speaker 7: protecting students from anti Semitism was actually aligning with people

1364
01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:31,160
Speaker 7: spreading the Great Replacement theory. And they didn't listen. And

1365
01:10:31,200 --> 01:10:33,360
Speaker 7: so that's why I decided to run for Congress, because

1366
01:10:33,479 --> 01:10:35,679
Speaker 7: I wanted someone in Congress who understood the far right,

1367
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:36,160
Speaker 7: and I do.

1368
01:10:36,760 --> 01:10:39,519
Speaker 2: And lastly, Kat, just tell people, you know, when is

1369
01:10:39,560 --> 01:10:42,640
Speaker 2: the primary, how's the campaign going, and how can they

1370
01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:44,519
Speaker 2: support you if they're so inclined down the stretch.

1371
01:10:45,360 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 7: If I've redeemed myself at all in this interview. You

1372
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:50,240
Speaker 7: can find our website Caatpreillinois dot com. That's Kat with

1373
01:10:50,280 --> 01:10:50,559
Speaker 7: a k.

1374
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:52,400
Speaker 4: Our.

1375
01:10:52,880 --> 01:10:55,920
Speaker 7: Primary day is March seventeenth. Early voting has already started

1376
01:10:55,920 --> 01:10:58,639
Speaker 7: all over the district. The ninth District of Illinois goes

1377
01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:02,360
Speaker 7: from uptown Chicago at Evanston, West Toscogie, and then all

1378
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:05,560
Speaker 7: the way to Crystal Lake in Algonquin. It is Jerrymander

1379
01:11:05,640 --> 01:11:09,000
Speaker 7: to hell. It looks like Maryland onozepic. But we would

1380
01:11:09,000 --> 01:11:11,479
Speaker 7: love your help, so you can join our discord, discord

1381
01:11:11,479 --> 01:11:14,040
Speaker 7: dot gg slash cat for Illinois. You can phone bank

1382
01:11:14,080 --> 01:11:17,040
Speaker 7: from anywhere. You can doorknock it you're local. We could

1383
01:11:17,040 --> 01:11:20,000
Speaker 7: really use your help. Of the three viable candidates in

1384
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,040
Speaker 7: this race, I am the only one who has not

1385
01:11:22,160 --> 01:11:24,559
Speaker 7: met with or submitted a position paper to Apak. I

1386
01:11:24,640 --> 01:11:27,800
Speaker 7: was the first one to call for impeachment. And we

1387
01:11:28,040 --> 01:11:31,000
Speaker 7: are the only campaign in this entire race of sixteen

1388
01:11:31,040 --> 01:11:33,800
Speaker 7: candidates that is funded by majority small dollar donations.

1389
01:11:34,439 --> 01:11:37,439
Speaker 2: Well, we really appreciate you doing the interview and just

1390
01:11:37,439 --> 01:11:39,679
Speaker 2: clarifying where you stand. I don't think you need redemption,

1391
01:11:39,800 --> 01:11:41,479
Speaker 2: but people just go to know, Okay, you know, what

1392
01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:42,080
Speaker 2: are your views?

1393
01:11:42,120 --> 01:11:44,560
Speaker 7: And no, absolutely, I mean like I'm joking when I

1394
01:11:44,600 --> 01:11:46,280
Speaker 7: say that, but like the main thing is like, look,

1395
01:11:46,320 --> 01:11:48,200
Speaker 7: we can disagree on these, but I always want to

1396
01:11:48,240 --> 01:11:49,360
Speaker 7: be clear about where I stand.

1397
01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:50,320
Speaker 4: I am.

1398
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,040
Speaker 7: Since I was a little kid, my belief has been

1399
01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:55,479
Speaker 7: you have to stick to your morals, even to your

1400
01:11:55,520 --> 01:11:58,639
Speaker 7: own detriment or even if it, you know, pisses someone off.

1401
01:11:58,680 --> 01:12:00,120
Speaker 7: So this is where I stand, and I hope, hope

1402
01:12:00,160 --> 01:12:01,160
Speaker 7: that we were able to clarify this.

1403
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:03,840
Speaker 2: Appreciate that, Kat, Thank you so much. Good luck, great

1404
01:12:03,880 --> 01:12:04,200
Speaker 2: to see you.

1405
01:12:04,600 --> 01:12:07,200
Speaker 1: Thanks so much, guys, Thank you guys so much for watching.

1406
01:12:07,200 --> 01:12:08,000
Speaker 1: We appreciate it.

1407
01:12:08,040 --> 01:12:11,160
Speaker 3: As a reminder, we do have our free month trial

1408
01:12:11,200 --> 01:12:12,880
Speaker 3: going on. Let's put that up there on the screen.

1409
01:12:13,120 --> 01:12:16,839
Speaker 3: Breaking Points dot Com promo code is BP three twenty

1410
01:12:16,880 --> 01:12:19,280
Speaker 3: six and you can try our premium service just for

1411
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:21,280
Speaker 3: one free month and see if you can use. You

1412
01:12:21,360 --> 01:12:23,360
Speaker 3: can cancel anytime if you don't want to.

1413
01:12:23,400 --> 01:12:24,920
Speaker 1: We deeply appreciate.

1414
01:12:24,479 --> 01:12:26,679
Speaker 3: All of the millions of new people who are watching

1415
01:12:26,760 --> 01:12:29,559
Speaker 3: the show. It really is incredible to see and we

1416
01:12:29,600 --> 01:12:32,120
Speaker 3: appreciate you all very very much. Sorry about some of

1417
01:12:32,160 --> 01:12:35,000
Speaker 3: the programming stuff lots going on today, as we had

1418
01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:35,920
Speaker 3: to drop a few segments.

1419
01:12:36,120 --> 01:12:38,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, but we'll pick them up. Don't worry, we're going

1420
01:12:38,040 --> 01:12:40,559
Speaker 2: to get to that hypocrisy. That one is not going

1421
01:12:40,600 --> 01:12:41,640
Speaker 2: to We're not gonna lose sight of that.

1422
01:12:41,680 --> 01:12:41,840
Speaker 1: One.

1423
01:12:41,880 --> 01:12:44,719
Speaker 2: Last point in personal privilege. Happy birthday to my daughter

1424
01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:48,439
Speaker 2: Ella Credible, who is turning eighteen today, which I'm in

1425
01:12:48,520 --> 01:12:50,960
Speaker 2: denial about. I think she's in denial about too, but

1426
01:12:51,120 --> 01:12:53,679
Speaker 2: love her very much and excited about the young woman

1427
01:12:53,760 --> 01:12:54,120
Speaker 2: she has been.

1428
01:12:54,560 --> 01:12:57,599
Speaker 1: Happy birthday Ella, as a girl. Dad, I'm already dreading.

1429
01:12:59,040 --> 01:13:01,600
Speaker 3: You can say this eyes forever, all right, thank you

1430
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:04,280
Speaker 3: guys so much for watching. We will see you all

1431
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:06,760
Speaker 3: on Thursday. Great show for everybody tomorrow though,