1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,160 Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: today's best minds, and an implan analysis report says Trump's 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:17,960 Speaker 1: policies could cost America twenty three billion in GDP if 5 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,439 Speaker 1: Taurus continue to stay away. We have such a great 6 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:24,799 Speaker 1: show for you today. The New Yorkers Evan Osno stops 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 1: by to talk to us about the tech brolocar key 8 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: and what can be done about their assault on democracy. 9 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 1: Then we'll talk to Randy Weingarten, president of the American 10 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:39,720 Speaker 1: Federation of Teachers, who will spell out the cruel attacks 11 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: against working people and Trump's big beautiful bill. But first 12 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: the news, SAMII. 13 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:49,159 Speaker 2: We were doing an interview the listeners will hear in 14 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:53,159 Speaker 2: a week or two about bitcoin. And as you were 15 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 2: doing that, the headlines started to rise that Trump media 16 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,560 Speaker 2: plans to buy two point five billion of bitcoin. And 17 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,680 Speaker 2: I look Robinhood and it was just soaring through the 18 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 2: roof that bitcoin price. What are you see in here? 19 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 1: So again Jesse's obsessed with bitcoin. Now, now this is 20 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 1: Trump World one oh one, right, you know, buy sketchy things, 21 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 1: make you know, say you're going to buy more stuff, 22 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: Buy the dip. Remember Trump's tweet He's doing the same 23 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: thing with tariffs that he's doing with bitcoin. I mean again, Okay, 24 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: I'm going to read you the statement. First of all, 25 00:01:26,800 --> 00:01:30,680 Speaker 1: Trump Media and Technology Group said on Tuesday, it's raising 26 00:01:30,720 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: two point five billion two by bitcoin. I want to 27 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: emphasize the word said here, okay, because maybe but maybe 28 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: they just said it. Okay, this is not a group 29 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,399 Speaker 1: of people for whom their word is something you can 30 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: take to the bank. Now that said, I'm not even 31 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 1: going to mention the name of the person who had 32 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: a quote about this, because he's very litigious. But I 33 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 1: am going to read the quote because it's very hilarious. 34 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 1: We view bitcoin as an apex instrument of financial freedom, 35 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,960 Speaker 1: and now Trump Media will hold cryptocurrency as a crucial 36 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:10,959 Speaker 1: part of our assets. Trump Media CEO, whose name cannot 37 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 1: be said because of his litigious nature. The investment will 38 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 1: help defend our company against harassment and discrimination by financial institutions, 39 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 1: which plague many American and US firms. Okay, first of 40 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: all Americans and US firms. All right, okay, we're not 41 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: going to parse that, but we are going to say 42 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 1: that pretty interesting. Maybe they have two point five billion 43 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 1: dollars to buy bitcoin. Maybe they don't. I would not 44 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 1: take any one of these people at their words zoom in, 45 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:47,200 Speaker 1: because there's an axiom we're getting this is from axios. 46 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 1: We're going to zoom in. Nunez says the strategy would 47 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 1: provide opportunities for Trump media and areas like subscription payments 48 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: and a utility token. Really, who could have seen that 49 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: Trump World would get so excited about a very sketchy cryptocurrency, which, 50 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,959 Speaker 1: by the way, cryptos sort of redundant cryptocurrency is sketchy. 51 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: But it's nice to see that Trump World has continued 52 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: its march to do what is possibly not what it's 53 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:20,639 Speaker 1: saying it's doing. Who knows, who can say? Who can say? 54 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:25,080 Speaker 3: Speaking of lawsuits, yeah, well, basically each day, as I 55 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 3: try to select some subjects that you may want to 56 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 3: talk about, all I do is I just go, hmm, 57 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 3: blizzard of lawsuits? 58 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,640 Speaker 2: Which what should we discuss? And so today's one is 59 00:03:33,680 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 2: that NPR is suing the Trump administration over their funding 60 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 2: cuts from President Trump's stupid executive order. 61 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:44,520 Speaker 1: Yes, so NPR National Public Radio doesn't even get that 62 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 1: much money from the government. Probably could make up the shortfall, 63 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:51,200 Speaker 1: but I think it's really important to remember here you 64 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 1: win in court. You win in court when you sue 65 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 1: trump World, you win in court. You know why you 66 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: win in court because what Trump World is doing is 67 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: almost entirely illegal. There are occasionally times when they get 68 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 1: away with it because it's a trumpy judge or because 69 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 1: it ends up in front of Samuel Alito, but largely 70 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 1: all of this is completely an utterly sketch. So you 71 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 1: should sue. And that's what's happening here NPR and these 72 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:23,279 Speaker 1: are local affiliates. It's suing the Trump administration. I want 73 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: to point out this is a guy record low approval rating. 74 00:04:27,080 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 1: People don't like this. He is crushing norms left and right, 75 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 1: and so the Corporation for Public Broadcasting is going to 76 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 1: sue back, and good for them. Republicans have been targeting 77 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 1: the portion of NPRS and PBS funding that is congressionally 78 00:04:43,240 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 1: approved by the way it's approved by Congress, not by Trump. 79 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,480 Speaker 1: You know, this is another thing like Trump's executive orders 80 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 1: tend to undermine the power of the purse right one 81 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 1: of Congress is very few powers tend to be undermined 82 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:01,279 Speaker 1: by trump Ism. Now, publicans just go along with it 83 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 1: because they don't care and because you know they'll do 84 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 1: anything Trump wants. But it's worth realizing that a lot 85 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: of this stuff is actually not within Trump's powers. 86 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:13,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, that sounds right. So the Trump administration has canceled 87 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 2: Harvard's remaining federal contracts. One of the things we used 88 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 2: to discuss a lot in this podcast back when this 89 00:05:19,560 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 2: guy Ron DeSantis was really making a lot of headlines 90 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 2: was the concept of performative moronics. Yes, I can't think 91 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 2: of anything that fits that title more than this. 92 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: Ooh, performative moronics. That's a throwback to the first Trump administration. 93 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 2: I think I think that was more of our Biden 94 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:42,159 Speaker 2: era analysis a lot of the time, if I'm being honest. 95 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:45,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, so this is really stupid, but it's also I 96 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: want to point out, just shows how little runway they 97 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:51,640 Speaker 1: have here. So Trump administration will eliminate the remaining one 98 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: hundred million in federal contracts with Harvard University. They are saying, Okay, 99 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: so what are they going to do. They're going to 100 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: cut a lot of use federal contracts. First of all, 101 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 1: they're not going to be able to do it. Number one, 102 00:06:07,080 --> 00:06:10,719 Speaker 1: they are not going to be able to legally This 103 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:13,280 Speaker 1: is so fucking dicey. The other thing is like, let's 104 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:16,040 Speaker 1: just think this through. Okay, So this is stuff like 105 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 1: training feople. This is stuff like science stuff right, like 106 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:23,640 Speaker 1: during cancer or stuff happening in the labs. What are 107 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 1: you gonna do. You're gonna move that lab work to 108 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: the Heritage Foundation. They don't have any labs at the 109 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 1: Heritage Foundation. You know you have these world class scientists. No, no, 110 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,360 Speaker 1: we don't want the world class scientists. We're gonna we're 111 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 1: gonna go and throw away all this research and we're 112 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 1: gonna start doing research. You know what at Hillsdale College. 113 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 1: There's no medical school at Hillsdale College. Okay, that's not 114 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 1: how it works. What Charlie Kirk is gonna take over. 115 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 1: You're gonna have Turning Point USA labs, right, you have 116 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: PhD mds like Charlie Kirk doing this is the stupidest 117 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: fucking thing ever. To reiterate how stupid this is. This 118 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:05,720 Speaker 1: is one of these things where we are literally we're 119 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: just throwing away scientific advances somebody, not somebody. A lot 120 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: of us are going to get cancer, right, and little 121 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 1: more than a third of all Americans will get cancer 122 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:18,240 Speaker 1: or some form of cancer, and we will have doctors 123 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 1: who say to us, you know, we have some great 124 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 1: studies on this, but we're still, you know, maybe four 125 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 1: or five years behind. We're four or five years from 126 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: getting to a place where we can cure this. Four 127 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 1: or five years. That's the Trump administration, that's the second 128 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: Trump administration. There will be people who die because we 129 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: have lost four or five years of scientific advancements because 130 00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:45,000 Speaker 1: of COVID and Donald Trump and RFK Junior and people 131 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 1: who don't who just literally want to throw the baby 132 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 1: out with the bathwater. So it is so painful for 133 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: me as someone who is not a scientist. It's such 134 00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: a tragedy. It's like we are burning the library at Alexandria. 135 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 1: We are cutting our noses off despite our faces. We're 136 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 1: doing our on purpose. It's not even an accident, right, 137 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,640 Speaker 1: we are literally it is fall of the Roman Empire, 138 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:11,680 Speaker 1: and we're doing it to ourselves. There are a lot 139 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: of reasons how we got here, and I just hope 140 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: that like Canada and Europe and China and all those 141 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 1: other countries are going to pick up these scientists and 142 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 1: keep the work going because you know, we are in 143 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: a climate rasis, We are in a really perilous moment 144 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:33,679 Speaker 1: in all different ways. Microplastics, cancer, you know, clusters. I mean, 145 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: just we are as sort of free apocalyptic America and 146 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 1: a lot of this end. If you don't think there 147 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:42,680 Speaker 1: are more pandemics coming, I don't know what to tell you. 148 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,320 Speaker 1: It's a very dark moment in American life. 149 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, speaking of darkness in America, there's a cloud over 150 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:54,319 Speaker 2: the Pentagon. It's shaped kind of like a buggy beer 151 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 2: that's been frozen. 152 00:08:56,000 --> 00:09:01,200 Speaker 1: No, I'm kidding. Yeah, definitely, definitely, we love it. 153 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:05,360 Speaker 2: So there's this fellow Pete hegg Sith the controversy with him. 154 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 2: You could pretty much set your watch to it at 155 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:10,040 Speaker 2: this point that there will be an article about some 156 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 2: nefarious thing happening, some serious fuckery happening in under his purview. 157 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, so let's talk about this. Look, you put a 158 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: guy like Pete Hegseth in this job, and I know 159 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: you're going to be shocked to hear, but my man 160 00:09:24,760 --> 00:09:30,520 Speaker 1: does not know how to do nearly anything, and that 161 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:34,360 Speaker 1: in itself not necessarily. No, it's bad. So he's running 162 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:36,520 Speaker 1: the dog. I was going to say it wasn't bad, 163 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 1: but it is really bad. He's running the DODA. Trump 164 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: has had many scandals now that are completely disqualifying, right, 165 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:49,640 Speaker 1: heg Seth has had just scandal after scandal, like the 166 00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 1: wife on the signal Chat. Remember when they added this 167 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:56,280 Speaker 1: signal chat, there was a bunch of stuff with the wife, 168 00:09:56,559 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 1: with the brother, anti nepotism stuff. I mean, just like 169 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: continual problems with this guy. So now he's fired three people, 170 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 1: and again Trump advisors lose confidence in Pentagon leak investigation. 171 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 1: Hegseth used to justify firing of three top aides. So 172 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 1: that sounds as if Trump advisors think Pete hegg Seth 173 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,199 Speaker 1: weekend Fox News host former, he's not doing it anymore 174 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:25,959 Speaker 1: right now, though he may be back soon. I wonder 175 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,559 Speaker 1: if he gets fired from his job, if he ends 176 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 1: up going back to the weekend, or if they like 177 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:32,440 Speaker 1: bump him up to the weekday. 178 00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:35,680 Speaker 2: Here's my guess. He takes Judge box of wines place 179 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:36,200 Speaker 2: on the five. 180 00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 4: Ooh. 181 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: From head of the DoD to panelists on the five, 182 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:44,880 Speaker 1: jess A guitarl Off. 183 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 2: Put my bet from my crypto ortings on polymarket right now. 184 00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: Yes, Jessin to Tarlaf, Pete hagg Seth coming to you 185 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 1: is certainly possible. I would never bet against you, Jesse, 186 00:10:56,120 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: but I think either way, there's something rotten in the 187 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:04,679 Speaker 1: state of Denmark. Right, We've got Trump advisors losing confidence, 188 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 1: by the way, and I want to point out these 189 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 1: guys love to leak. One of the hallmarks of Trump 190 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 1: one point zero was just continual leaking. Right, you had 191 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:16,520 Speaker 1: everyone in the world leaking to everyone. So Trump advisors 192 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,360 Speaker 1: losing confidence makes me think that they think that the 193 00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:24,680 Speaker 1: legal wire tap may not have been true. Again, there's 194 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 1: a lot to parson this thing, but I think that 195 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:33,000 Speaker 1: there's a real question about when does when does Trump 196 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:37,559 Speaker 1: world start losing confidence? In Pete hexp. So Trump's big 197 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: thing is he doesn't like firing people this time because 198 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 1: like Rachel Mattow had that whole wall people he had fired, 199 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 1: so clearly some things do in fact breakthrough. So he 200 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 1: just moves everyone around. So remember Mike Walls was a 201 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 1: National security advisor. Now he's his body man and also 202 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 1: cook at mar A Lago. I'm kidding, obviously, and that's 203 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:02,080 Speaker 1: what we're seeing here. So he Seth will probably be 204 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: running hod Or on the five. Eventually we'll see what happens. Obviously, 205 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 1: never a great Evan Osnos is a writer at The 206 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,439 Speaker 1: New Yorker and the author of Behals and Have Yachts. 207 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: Welcome to past politics, Evan. 208 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:22,240 Speaker 4: Osnos, Thank you, Molly junk Fast. 209 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 1: We're you know, very excited to have you. 210 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:27,200 Speaker 4: I'm very excited to be here. 211 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:32,200 Speaker 1: Have books coming out in June. Yes, yours is a memoir. No, 212 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 1: I'm just. 213 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:36,640 Speaker 4: Kidding a loop. Should we do that? Do you want 214 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:37,319 Speaker 4: to swop on? 215 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: I'll talk about your book and memoir? So, uh, the 216 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: book is called The Have and the Have Yachts? Have 217 00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:45,560 Speaker 1: I butchered the title? Or now? 218 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:50,079 Speaker 4: No, you you got it exactly right. And it's uh, 219 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 4: it is with my debt to both Hemingway, who wrote 220 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 4: to Have and Have Not, and then the other guy 221 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,679 Speaker 4: who got there first. So it is an idea that 222 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:01,960 Speaker 4: is that resigns in our consciousness. But I think it 223 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:05,240 Speaker 4: is a unique artifact of our time, the haves and aviats. 224 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 1: It's so wild to me to watch this cycle of 225 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: backlash to backlash to backlash, right like financial inequality, push back, 226 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: some degree of making right or a little bit of 227 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:22,200 Speaker 1: a change, and then a reelection of Trump. Explain what 228 00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 1: the fuck is going on? 229 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:26,319 Speaker 4: Well, you hit on the exact issue that interests me, 230 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:31,440 Speaker 4: which is that Americans have an almost uniquely complex and 231 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:35,559 Speaker 4: ambivalent relationship to big money to wealth. I mean it 232 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 4: is we are both at some moments cynical about it 233 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 4: and then fundamentally still aspirational. And I mean this is 234 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 4: not like an abstract idea. There was a Harris poll 235 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 4: last year that showed that sixty percent of Americans believe 236 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 4: that billionaires are making the country less fair, and sixty 237 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 4: percent of Americans want to become billionaires themselves. It is 238 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,120 Speaker 4: very often it's the same people who have this oscillation 239 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 4: of instincts, and I think you see that in our 240 00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,560 Speaker 4: politics where we are tugged back and forth. But I 241 00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 4: think what it obscures, frankly, and this is really the 242 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:12,199 Speaker 4: core of what interested me, was that we are living 243 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:15,520 Speaker 4: through utterly unprecedented times when it comes to the sheer 244 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 4: scale and speed with which these fortunes have accumulated. If 245 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 4: I can just give you one stat it is that 246 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 4: as recently as ten years ago, there was nobody on 247 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 4: the planet who had one hundred billion dollars. The idea 248 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 4: of a cent to billionaire was a non thing. There 249 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 4: are now at least fifteen people who do and to 250 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 4: give you, I mean take Elon Musk as an example. 251 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:41,240 Speaker 4: I mean, at the beginning of Trump's first term, he 252 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:44,280 Speaker 4: had about ten billion dollars. Today, as everybody knows, he 253 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 4: has four hundred billion dollars. And if you talk to 254 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 4: people who are scholars of not just scholars of the 255 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 4: recent period, archaeologists who look at inequality back to the 256 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 4: Neolithic period, they will tell you that it is very 257 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 4: hard to find in a period that is anything like 258 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 4: what we're living through now. As somebody said to me, 259 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 4: the people who built the pyramids, we're living in a 260 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 4: less unequal society. 261 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: So I want to get to the fall of the 262 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:16,280 Speaker 1: Roman Empire because it's my fall of the Roman Empire. 263 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 1: There's a lot of joking that goes around that this 264 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,280 Speaker 1: is a similar moment in America. You know that American 265 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 1: history that we history rhymes and we are in a 266 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: moment where the center cannot hold right, that there's just 267 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: too much inequality that we have, you know, And again 268 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:35,840 Speaker 1: maybe it's this idea of the printing press. You know, 269 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 1: the technology has catapulted us into a kind of dark ages, 270 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,520 Speaker 1: you know, a kind of brought time period. But but 271 00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 1: do you I mean, is that your take on this, 272 00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 1: I mean, what do you think, what do you think 273 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 1: about the instability? 274 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 4: Well, I think that the Roman analogy is more than 275 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,080 Speaker 4: casually important, Like it is more than just that we 276 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 4: sometimes throw up our hands and say God, it feels 277 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:01,880 Speaker 4: like the fall a Rum. The great scholar of Rome, 278 00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 4: the late scholar Ramsay McMullin at Yale, was once asked 279 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 4: he'd written acres on the subject of the fall of Rome, 280 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 4: and he said, well, if you really ask me to 281 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 4: boil this down, he says, the fall of Rum took 282 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 4: five hundred years, but it can be distilled into three words. 283 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 4: Fewer had more. The growth of radical inequality in both 284 00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 4: political and economic power is such a large and encompassing 285 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 4: fact of our lives that it's almost like climate change 286 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:36,400 Speaker 4: in the sense that you can go through the day 287 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:40,280 Speaker 4: without thinking about it, remembering periodically, oh, yeah, this is happening, 288 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 4: and it probably will change the world I live in, 289 00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 4: But you can lose sight of it. And there are 290 00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 4: these moments, these little dramatic indications, these moments when it 291 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,000 Speaker 4: comes into our lives. And I think that the Musk 292 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 4: Trump joint venture is one of those times when we 293 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 4: have been suddenly aware of what the windfall in economics 294 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 4: has meant for our politics and our political culture. 295 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 1: Elon Musk started out as pretty popular talk us through 296 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:08,680 Speaker 1: his devolution. 297 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think he would be the first person to 298 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 4: in some ways acknowledge that he was caught unaware by 299 00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:20,240 Speaker 4: the collapse of his relationship with most of the public. 300 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:22,960 Speaker 4: I mean he was until not long ago. If you 301 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:24,919 Speaker 4: lined up a group of college students, you would very 302 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:27,920 Speaker 4: often hear them say he is somebody who gives us 303 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:32,600 Speaker 4: inspiration about what this country can be. And his level 304 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 4: of seclusion from actually the public, from real live experience, 305 00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 4: as indicated by things like him saying that as many 306 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 4: of us have heard that the greatest flaw of Western 307 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:50,800 Speaker 4: civilization is empathy, or describing social Security as a Ponzi scheme. 308 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:55,679 Speaker 4: There are really a tell about how far his life 309 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:59,760 Speaker 4: had become really divorced, in a kind of lunar way 310 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:02,959 Speaker 4: from the lives of most other human beings. And I 311 00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:05,639 Speaker 4: think this is a theme that runs through my book 312 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,760 Speaker 4: because over and over again I would find myself in 313 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:12,399 Speaker 4: places that I know quite well. I mean like Greenwich, Connecticut, 314 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 4: which is where I grew up, is a place that 315 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 4: has historically been kind of in some sense connected to 316 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,200 Speaker 4: but also disconnected from the rest of the country by 317 00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 4: the forces of wealth. But in recent years, and Musk 318 00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:29,720 Speaker 4: is just the most dramatic illustration of this, that the 319 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:34,160 Speaker 4: building of walls, both literally around people's estates but also 320 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 4: psychologically and emotionally and culturally has become so profound that 321 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:42,200 Speaker 4: we are now living in an arrangement that is much 322 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 4: closer to what it was like in This is not 323 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:48,160 Speaker 4: an extravagant analogy, but like medieval Europe, there's a reason 324 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,639 Speaker 4: why people build castles. They built castles to defend themselves 325 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:56,160 Speaker 4: and their property against others. And Elon Musk is a living, 326 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 4: breathing demonstration of what happens when you think that you 327 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 4: understand how other people live and you don't. 328 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,359 Speaker 1: So interesting because I think that's completely right. And I 329 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 1: also wonder how much Elon Musk is is a function 330 00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 1: of not having anyone around you who has ever told 331 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:13,760 Speaker 1: you the truth. 332 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,760 Speaker 4: Oh, completely right. I mean, this is the great risk 333 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 4: for authoritarians, either in private business or in public office, 334 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 4: is that you become so insulated and comfortable. It's like 335 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 4: this kind of amniotic fluid of agreement around you that 336 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:35,800 Speaker 4: nobody who disagrees with you, stays very long, and as 337 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:39,680 Speaker 4: a result you make actually sometimes terrible mistakes. This is 338 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 4: what's known as authoritarian backlash, and it's where you misjudge 339 00:19:44,359 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 4: the public mood. You know, if you're the Shaw of Iran, 340 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:52,000 Speaker 4: you host a giant party to celebrate your leadership a 341 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:56,119 Speaker 4: few months before the revolution rises up and removes you. 342 00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:59,400 Speaker 4: And that's the pattern. And I think it's because there's 343 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:02,040 Speaker 4: nobody around who can say it. I'll give you one 344 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:05,760 Speaker 4: other fascinating example. I wrote a profile that's in this 345 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:09,160 Speaker 4: book of Mark Zuckerberg when he was in the period 346 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 4: of kind of coming to terms with his vast new powers, 347 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 4: and he had gone you'll remember Molly on this like 348 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:18,239 Speaker 4: kind of weird tour of the United States where he 349 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 4: was going out and wanting to meet people and people, 350 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:26,639 Speaker 4: and it was kind of it got mocked because, as 351 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 4: people put at the time, they said, this really looks 352 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 4: like a man who has landed or a person who 353 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:33,239 Speaker 4: has landed on this planet and is like, bring your 354 00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 4: humans to me. I will see them, and I will 355 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 4: meet them, and we will eat their things. And then 356 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 4: and somebody who had worked for him told me, look, 357 00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:45,239 Speaker 4: the reality was when he was on this tour. We 358 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,120 Speaker 4: could all see that this was really not going to work, 359 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 4: and it looked, it looked kind of ridiculous, but there 360 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:55,760 Speaker 4: was nobody around him who could and would tell him that, right, right, 361 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,200 Speaker 4: right right, authoritarian backlash. 362 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: So is it a question to keep going with this theory? 363 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 1: Putin's war with Ukraine is that? Is that the same? 364 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:11,160 Speaker 4: Very much so. Putin is the paradigmatic example of what 365 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:14,760 Speaker 4: the scholars call a sultanistic oligarch, which is a wonderful 366 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:21,239 Speaker 4: term actually, and a sultanistic oligarch is somebody who is 367 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 4: essentially agreed upon by the other elites or the other 368 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 4: oligarchs in a society to let one among them rule, 369 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 4: and it's because they all benefit from that. But the 370 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,919 Speaker 4: danger of becoming a sultanistic oligarch is that kind of 371 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,720 Speaker 4: seclusion and that kind of absence of any sort of 372 00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,679 Speaker 4: critical thinking and judgment around you. And so everybody begins 373 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 4: to say to you, well, it seems like invading Ukraine 374 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:49,119 Speaker 4: is a brilliant strategic move, sir. And you know, we 375 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,520 Speaker 4: all saw those images of the of the boardroom where 376 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:55,879 Speaker 4: the oligarchs and the and the leaders of the intelligence 377 00:21:55,880 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 4: community in Moscow were being briefed on this plan and 378 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:03,760 Speaker 4: there was up warrious applause, and that is a it's 379 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 4: you know, it's a lesson that I think goes beyond 380 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 4: just talking about our president or the Russian president or 381 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:15,159 Speaker 4: it is really like a deep lesson in the problem 382 00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:20,640 Speaker 4: of becoming too far ahead, too far isolated, and becoming 383 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 4: too sure. To quote Kendrick Lamar, that you deserve it all. 384 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 4: It's a risk it'll blow up on you. 385 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,679 Speaker 1: It'll blow and that's what we're saying. So what we 386 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: saw with Elon I just want to get back to 387 00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 1: Elon for a minute, because he is the most pertinent 388 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 1: right now in our American political world, is that his 389 00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:45,640 Speaker 1: polling went down. His the numbers at Tesla's prophets were 390 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: down seventy one percent. Who even knew that could happen? 391 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:52,399 Speaker 1: At a company, right they sold well? I saw reporting 392 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:57,480 Speaker 1: that they sold seven thousand cars in Europe. I mean, okay, 393 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: do you think that these kind of come to Jesus 394 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: moments where you see that the emperor really has no clothes? 395 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:08,439 Speaker 1: Do you think they influence the zeitgeist or do you 396 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:10,840 Speaker 1: think they're just sort of I mean, what, you know, 397 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:13,040 Speaker 1: the question we all have all the time is what 398 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 1: breaks through. 399 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:19,160 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think there's no question that this leaves a 400 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,399 Speaker 4: scar on the public mood. It's not just on Elon 401 00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 4: Musk individually. I think this is really important because when 402 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 4: you try to understand essentially, like where does this lead Molly, 403 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:31,119 Speaker 4: which is you know, the question we're all trying to 404 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 4: figure out, which is what happens when you have the 405 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:34,880 Speaker 4: Musk era, Where does that go? Where does that take 406 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:40,639 Speaker 4: a country? We actually have a useful, almost hauntingly useful model, 407 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:42,840 Speaker 4: which is the end of the nineteenth century the beginning 408 00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 4: of the twentieth century in this country, which is that 409 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 4: you know, that was a time when you had these tycoons, 410 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:52,119 Speaker 4: the robber barons as they were called during the Gilded Age, 411 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 4: who were very in many ways Musk Like. I mean, 412 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,840 Speaker 4: you know Jay Gould, who was the Wall Street Titan. 413 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 4: Twain used to say, look, Americans have always have always 414 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 4: revered money, but Jay Gould made them meal down and 415 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 4: worship it. And in many ways, Musk is the modern 416 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:13,680 Speaker 4: incarnation of that. And what we saw in that period 417 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 4: in the late nineteenth century was that there were these 418 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,440 Speaker 4: acts of just cartoonish extravagance, cartoonish sort of self indulgence, 419 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 4: the equivalent of having the many things that Musk has 420 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:28,160 Speaker 4: accumulated for himself, most significantly perhaps his family arrangement, which 421 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:33,080 Speaker 4: looks sultanistic in so many ways that in the at 422 00:24:33,119 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 4: the end of the nineteenth century, you had people hosting parties, 423 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 4: for instance, in New York City in a ballroom in Manhattan, 424 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,720 Speaker 4: where they brought horses into the court into the ballroom 425 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:44,800 Speaker 4: and they ate on horseback and drank champagne out of 426 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:49,119 Speaker 4: the saddle bags. And the country, regular Americans, we're hearing 427 00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,679 Speaker 4: about this, reading about it in the newspapers, and it 428 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:55,360 Speaker 4: was accumulating to the point of a breaking point where 429 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 4: people would say, we we just we can't go on 430 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,440 Speaker 4: like this, And that's what you had that It's really 431 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:02,960 Speaker 4: what gave way to the birth of the progressive era 432 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:05,919 Speaker 4: and then ultimately to the New Deal, was this recognition 433 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,320 Speaker 4: on the part of the public and ultimately on some 434 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,280 Speaker 4: of the elites, people like Teddy Roosevelt and then later 435 00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 4: Franklin Roosevelt, that this just you can't go on this 436 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,880 Speaker 4: way or the country won't hold. I think that Musk 437 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 4: is pretty proficient at reading ultimately his role in the culture, 438 00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 4: and he'll figure out a way to kind of, you know, 439 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:26,240 Speaker 4: get himself back in I don't have any doubt about 440 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 4: that he'll find a way to rebuild some cultural cachet 441 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 4: which is now so very much in remission. But ultimately, 442 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,520 Speaker 4: I think that the bigger impact is really on that 443 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 4: constant oscillation that we started with between fascination and revulsion 444 00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 4: with giant wealth. And he has almost single handedly pushed 445 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,440 Speaker 4: the United States away from capitalism. 446 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:50,680 Speaker 1: Ooh, that's interesting. Imagine being so rich that you turn 447 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 1: Americans off of capitalism. 448 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 4: That's the pattern. That's history. It tells us, it happens, 449 00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:00,320 Speaker 4: and it takes ultimately other people to say to the 450 00:26:00,320 --> 00:26:03,640 Speaker 4: elon Musks of the world, if you carry on this way, 451 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 4: this system which has been ultimately so rewarding for them, 452 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 4: is going to be is going to lose. 453 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 1: Its public basis of support. Are you surprised that the 454 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:19,159 Speaker 1: oligarchs of this moment aren't more philanthropic. You think about 455 00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,480 Speaker 1: Bill Gates with this comment that he made about Mosque, 456 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:24,080 Speaker 1: where he said, this is a register in the world 457 00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: taking away from the poorest children in the world. Talk 458 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:28,640 Speaker 1: to me about that. 459 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:31,959 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's been quite noticeable in the philanthropy community. You 460 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 4: hear about this generational Really there's been a kind of 461 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 4: generational split, which is that the early generation of mega 462 00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 4: wealth of the latter half of the twentieth century and 463 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,080 Speaker 4: early twenty first century, principally Warren Buffett, Bill Gates, or 464 00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,200 Speaker 4: the iconic figures that they made. 465 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:50,920 Speaker 1: Larger the Waltons. 466 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,639 Speaker 4: Yeah, they and they did large. They made a point 467 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,919 Speaker 4: in a sense to make to put themselves in the 468 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:02,000 Speaker 4: tradition of Andrew Carnegie and John D. Rockefeller, who believed 469 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:05,159 Speaker 4: you had to give some of your fortune or in 470 00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,320 Speaker 4: Gates and Buffett's case, the lion's share of your fortune 471 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 4: back to the public through philanthropy. And there has been 472 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:16,000 Speaker 4: this real shift though since then. Really it's sort of 473 00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 4: started in the last ten years or so where and 474 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:22,399 Speaker 4: this is not me making up making an abstraction. The 475 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,639 Speaker 4: data is quite clear on this that the amount of 476 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,960 Speaker 4: money that people like Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk are 477 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:33,320 Speaker 4: giving to philanthropy is just simply much less than their predecessors, 478 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 4: like Buffetting Gates were. And what's the reason for this 479 00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:38,720 Speaker 4: is that there is a theory that's become popular in 480 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:43,439 Speaker 4: Silicon Valley, which is that essentially your greatest act of philanthropy, 481 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 4: putting that in quotes is your business. 482 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: You know, it's as much high on your own supply gone. 483 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:52,679 Speaker 4: I mean, that's you know, Musk's view is, as he 484 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,120 Speaker 4: said at one point, the greatest gift I can give 485 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 4: to humanity is tesla, to which others might say, but 486 00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 4: you know what about a Musk foundation? And I've watched 487 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,240 Speaker 4: it happen just over the last ten years. This is 488 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 4: a real shift. 489 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 1: I mean. The most incredible part of this is that 490 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,240 Speaker 1: The New York Times had a lot of reporting on 491 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:11,320 Speaker 1: the Musk Foundation where they were getting in trouble for 492 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:15,399 Speaker 1: not giving away what they are required by law to 493 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:15,919 Speaker 1: give away. 494 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,399 Speaker 4: Totally true, I mean, and I felt the most interesting 495 00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:23,480 Speaker 4: revealing detailing the Times reporting on Musk's philanthropies. One of 496 00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:29,879 Speaker 4: the recipients of his philanthropic foundation in the early years 497 00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:33,080 Speaker 4: was actually to a school that was located in his 498 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 4: own house, in which five of the fourteen students were 499 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 4: his own children. 500 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:41,640 Speaker 1: Yes, many people are saying doing things for your kids 501 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: is not actually philanthropy, or when you are the richest 502 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 1: man in the world, we're laughing about this, but really 503 00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 1: we are laughing to keep from crying because it's so dark. 504 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,280 Speaker 1: I wonder if you could talk about are there any 505 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 1: I have to talk about this, because otherwise I'll go insane. 506 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:03,360 Speaker 1: There anything you're seeing when you in this store of 507 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 1: the haves and the have yat about some kind of 508 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 1: positive move towards So let's talk about that. 509 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:16,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned that, because there are some 510 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 4: good news things that should be recognized and cultivated and celebrated, 511 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:23,720 Speaker 4: which is that there are some people who have really 512 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 4: gone through a bit of a process over the last 513 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 4: ten or fifteen years with the rise of Trump in 514 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 4: our politics, that has made them say that they recognize 515 00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:36,200 Speaker 4: that the country is, on some level on an unsustainable 516 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:40,320 Speaker 4: cour There is this organization called the Patriotic Millionaires, which 517 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:43,959 Speaker 4: I write about in this new piece in the New Yorker, 518 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 4: in which these are folks who have thrived in the 519 00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,320 Speaker 4: current disposition of power, the meaning that the tax code 520 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,959 Speaker 4: that benefits them they have benefited from. But they are 521 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:54,880 Speaker 4: in fact some of the people who are standing up 522 00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,080 Speaker 4: and saying, really, this is about taxes and wages. It's 523 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 4: not complicated. They say, look, if you if wages had 524 00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 4: kept up with gains in productivity, if wages had kept 525 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:06,360 Speaker 4: up with the growth in the economy, wages today would 526 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 4: be much higher than they were before. And you know, 527 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 4: there's one guy in particular who I'm thinking of named 528 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 4: John Driscoll, who was the CEO of a big healthcare 529 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 4: company who realized that, look, there is no way in 530 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 4: which I can expect to have a successful business if 531 00:30:19,200 --> 00:30:21,080 Speaker 4: the people who work for me are sleeping in their 532 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 4: cars at night. And so, and what's the encouraging thing 533 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 4: here too, is Molly that this is like any kind 534 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:32,240 Speaker 4: of culture. Culture moves, and sometimes it moves even faster 535 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 4: than we expect. And so right now it feels as 536 00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:38,320 Speaker 4: if we're in the season of plunder. We're in the 537 00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 4: season of the oligarchs who are exploiting this president to 538 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:45,760 Speaker 4: benefit themselves as much as they can. But it also 539 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,280 Speaker 4: can move fast, and we've seen it once before. We 540 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 4: saw it in nineteen thirteen when you had the rise 541 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:56,160 Speaker 4: of elites in this country who recognized that to protect 542 00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:00,080 Speaker 4: the country's future, you had to reign in excesses and abuses. 543 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:01,760 Speaker 4: And we're beginning to see some of that. And I 544 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:04,360 Speaker 4: think that the size of the I'll just mention one 545 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:06,400 Speaker 4: other thing, which is that the size of the protests 546 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:10,080 Speaker 4: that Bernie Sanders has been getting this summer. Are really 547 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 4: remarkable because I interviewed a bunch of people at protests 548 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:17,280 Speaker 4: at the Bernie Sanders rallies, and to a person, they 549 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,760 Speaker 4: had never been to one before. These are not diehard 550 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 4: Bernie bros. These are people in some cases, in a 551 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 4: few cases actually people who are quite sympathetic to Republican 552 00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 4: arguments who said, I didn't vote for this, I didn't 553 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 4: vote for what Trump is doing and what we know 554 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:33,200 Speaker 4: from history. If there's one thing that listeners can take 555 00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 4: away who are trying to figure out, what do we 556 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 4: do as a people now to protect this country, the 557 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:43,880 Speaker 4: answer is it is sustained public pressure. Sustained public pressure 558 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 4: that it matters to use your voice and to get 559 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:49,520 Speaker 4: up and say no, this is not right, this is 560 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 4: not fair, and this is not sustainable. 561 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 1: Randy Weiningarden is the president of the American Federation of 562 00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,960 Speaker 1: Teachers and the author of the upcoming book Why Fascist 563 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 1: Spear Teachers. Welcome back to Fast Politics, Randy Winingarten. So 564 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:08,440 Speaker 1: we're in this insane moment in American life. The houses out, 565 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,280 Speaker 1: the senators out there is the big beautiful bill. It 566 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 1: both grows the deficit and cuts, food stamps for children. 567 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 1: Trump administration is at war with poor kids in every 568 00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 1: which way. You are the head of the American Teachers Federation, 569 00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:25,640 Speaker 1: you are in it. Talk to us. 570 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 5: So you know, a budget is your priorities. And what 571 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:33,640 Speaker 5: you can see in that big, ugly bill is that 572 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 5: it is big, but it is pretty ugly. Is the 573 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 5: Trump administration's priorities, which is to keep the tax cuts 574 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:49,480 Speaker 5: that they did in twenty seventeen, including most particularly, to 575 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:53,400 Speaker 5: prefer the millionaires and the billionaires in this country and 576 00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:57,280 Speaker 5: let them keep all the wealth that they grew over 577 00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:01,800 Speaker 5: all this time, and to as actually give everybody else 578 00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:06,920 Speaker 5: trinkets or a trickle down effect. So they've given everybody 579 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:10,640 Speaker 5: something little except for people who make under fifty thousand 580 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:14,040 Speaker 5: dollars who may actually have to pay more taxes. And 581 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:16,640 Speaker 5: that's the second point I want to do. So one, 582 00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:20,760 Speaker 5: they really really prefer the billionaires and the millionaires. But 583 00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:25,600 Speaker 5: the second thing they do is really really really cruel 584 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 5: because they're taking out, especially everything that created innovation in 585 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:34,640 Speaker 5: the country, everything that helped in terms of climate control. 586 00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 5: They're using education funding as a piggy bank for the rich, 587 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:43,120 Speaker 5: a new tax shelter for vouchers, and then they take 588 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:48,280 Speaker 5: a hatchet to student loans, to nutrition aid, and to 589 00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 5: healthcare for the middle class and the poor. And now 590 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 5: they're lying about it like Johnson is saying, oh, no, 591 00:33:55,880 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 5: this is just about waste and abuse, when it essentially 592 00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 5: we'll take fourteen million people off of healthcare and make 593 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:10,319 Speaker 5: it impossible for families under the poverty line to feed 594 00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:14,000 Speaker 5: their kids. So if you hear my anger, and then 595 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,360 Speaker 5: they sneak in things like stopping the courts from enforcing 596 00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:19,399 Speaker 5: their orders. 597 00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,320 Speaker 1: As that was amazing. Let's go back to Mike Johnson 598 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 1: for a minute, because one of the things that Mike 599 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:28,279 Speaker 1: Johnson actually said was that he said it was that 600 00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:33,839 Speaker 1: work requirements were actually they have a moral component. These 601 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 1: will be work requirements for snap benefits. They will mean 602 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 1: that if you have a child over seven years old, 603 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:44,319 Speaker 1: if you are not working, you cannot qualify for nutrition assistance. 604 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:48,319 Speaker 5: Talk us through what that looks like. So level of 605 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:53,879 Speaker 5: cruelty to their own voters is shocking to me. It's 606 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 5: essentially trying to find ways already the people who voted 607 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:02,440 Speaker 5: for Trump, essentially aside from the people who have always 608 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:06,040 Speaker 5: been for him. Let's say the net delta difference between 609 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 5: that decided the selection was the couch and the people 610 00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:12,400 Speaker 5: who made up their mind in the last few days. 611 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 5: They voted for a better life for themselves. Most of 612 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 5: not all of those folks are working really hard and 613 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,320 Speaker 5: are trying to make ends meet. So when you say 614 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,719 Speaker 5: to somebody who has a seven year old kid that 615 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 5: you're not going to feed them anymore because their parents 616 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:33,360 Speaker 5: are not working, or their one parent is not working 617 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:36,800 Speaker 5: exactly at the job you want them to work at. 618 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 5: Maybe they're working off the books because they can't make it. Yes, 619 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,840 Speaker 5: that's wrong. Maybe there are a thousand other reasons, like 620 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:50,360 Speaker 5: they're taking care of their elderly parents and they can't 621 00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:53,200 Speaker 5: be at work and take care of their elderly parents 622 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 5: at the same time. To actually do that and starve 623 00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:01,600 Speaker 5: children like that, it's cruel, it's inhuman. 624 00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:03,920 Speaker 1: So what are we going to do. 625 00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:08,240 Speaker 5: We're going to now take our AI surveillance and start 626 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:12,399 Speaker 5: using it for every single family in America to make 627 00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 5: that decision. How dare Mike Johnson decide what is moral 628 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,719 Speaker 5: and what isn't moral from the state that actually is 629 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:27,360 Speaker 5: now saying that no termination of pregnancy through abortion is 630 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:32,880 Speaker 5: legal or not? Yes, sorry, I am just It's like, really, 631 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,600 Speaker 5: how is all of a sudden we are our country 632 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:39,520 Speaker 5: that used to believe in freedom of religion. Now it's 633 00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:44,840 Speaker 5: getting closer and closer to a handsmade tail kind of 634 00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:49,680 Speaker 5: oation here. How dare you tell somebody that they can't 635 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:55,320 Speaker 5: get snap benefits for their kids, that a kid who 636 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 5: is older than seven is no longer dependent. It's my 637 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:02,319 Speaker 5: boggling to me how cruel it is. 638 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:04,520 Speaker 1: It is very cool. One of the things that the 639 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:08,239 Speaker 1: Republicans are trying to do is push back against medicaid expansion, right, 640 00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:13,200 Speaker 1: and Medicaid expansion is humongous and largely has benefited red 641 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:16,360 Speaker 1: states right. In fact, I mean Snap too. You know, 642 00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:19,040 Speaker 1: if they are able to get these cuts through, they 643 00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:22,320 Speaker 1: will mean that at least twenty five percent of children 644 00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:25,760 Speaker 1: will be affected in states like Louisiana and West Virginia, 645 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:30,360 Speaker 1: very red states. But with the issue with the Medicaid expansion, 646 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:32,960 Speaker 1: your grandma's in a nursing home, she's coming to go 647 00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 1: live with you, right, or she's going on the street. Right. 648 00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:38,120 Speaker 1: They're going to be closing nursing homes. They're going to 649 00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:42,719 Speaker 1: be closing rural hospitals. The Medicaid expansion question it is 650 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,680 Speaker 1: wildly unpopular. I mean, the polling shows that like eighty 651 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,759 Speaker 1: four percent of Americans want either the same or more Medicaid. 652 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:52,799 Speaker 5: So I think part of the problem and this is 653 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:57,200 Speaker 5: actually a real problem for the Democratic Party and one 654 00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:00,960 Speaker 5: that the Democrats have not solved. Frankly, it's a problem 655 00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 5: for truth, which is, yes, the Medicaid cuts in this 656 00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:09,360 Speaker 5: bill are terribly unpopular, but people actually have to see 657 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:13,720 Speaker 5: them to believe them. Unfortunately, in America right now, disinformation 658 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:19,400 Speaker 5: and misinformation reign supreme, and where people get their information 659 00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:25,440 Speaker 5: and what information people get has really become really problematic 660 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:28,799 Speaker 5: because people are getting a steady diet of propaganda and 661 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:32,760 Speaker 5: misinformation and disinformation. You can make a decision, for example, 662 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 5: about whether you want trickle down or not, whether you 663 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,080 Speaker 5: want tax cuts for the wealthy or not, or whether 664 00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:39,760 Speaker 5: you want a social service net. 665 00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:40,560 Speaker 1: That is a. 666 00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:44,520 Speaker 5: Legitimate question that you can raise in the United States 667 00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:47,239 Speaker 5: and America in terms of economic policy. But if you 668 00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,719 Speaker 5: don't actually know the truth, if you don't actually know 669 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,880 Speaker 5: what's in the bill, if somebody can get away and say, 670 00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:56,680 Speaker 5: oh no, this is really not a Medicaid cut when 671 00:38:56,680 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 5: it in fact is, that's part of the problem. And 672 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,440 Speaker 5: what the Democrats have not been able to do is 673 00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:05,480 Speaker 5: they do not have the information. You know, assume for 674 00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:08,319 Speaker 5: a second they are telling the truth. People don't know it, 675 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,200 Speaker 5: people don't hear it. So yes, the Medicaid cuts are 676 00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:17,880 Speaker 5: really unpopular. Frankly, all of the snap overhaul nutrition overhaul 677 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,840 Speaker 5: will be really unpopular too. Think about we're going to 678 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,759 Speaker 5: go back to lunch shaming in schools about who can 679 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,680 Speaker 5: get a lunch and who can't get a lunch. We 680 00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:31,600 Speaker 5: were supposed to solve that housing crisis. We're supposed to 681 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:35,880 Speaker 5: try to get the minimum wage raised to a living wage, 682 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:39,520 Speaker 5: and now what's happening is we're seeing even more cutbacks 683 00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:41,880 Speaker 5: to the safety net and it's going to hurt for 684 00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:43,520 Speaker 5: and work in class folk. 685 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:45,719 Speaker 1: It's funny because it's like we spend so much time 686 00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:50,399 Speaker 1: handwriting about Democrats losing working people, but here are Republicans 687 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:53,720 Speaker 1: having won them, now trying to hurt them. Yeah. 688 00:39:53,840 --> 00:39:56,040 Speaker 5: I mean, I give Josh Holly a lot of credit 689 00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,719 Speaker 5: when he says, no, don't make these cuts, and you 690 00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:01,960 Speaker 5: know these cuts are going to hurt people. But that's 691 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:07,040 Speaker 5: why I was astounded Johnson the Speaker wouldn't even be 692 00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:10,760 Speaker 5: honest about what they did. Yeah, but that's because they're 693 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,279 Speaker 5: trying to hide it. And our goal, our job has 694 00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:16,600 Speaker 5: to be tell the truth about what these cuts do 695 00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:17,560 Speaker 5: and the impact they'll have. 696 00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 1: So let's talk about that. Eventually these cuts are going 697 00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 1: maybe they won't be brought as broadly, but there will 698 00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:29,000 Speaker 1: be some level of cuts. And I wonder if Republicans 699 00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:33,160 Speaker 1: are just in denial, like, eventually this will hurt the 700 00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:35,920 Speaker 1: people that they just started winning, right. 701 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:39,040 Speaker 5: I think that they'll try to blame it on somebody else. 702 00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:43,479 Speaker 5: I agree with you, these cuts are unpopular. They will 703 00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:48,160 Speaker 5: hurt people, and the question is why are they doing it? 704 00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:51,200 Speaker 5: And they're doing it. I mean, look, Republicans say they 705 00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,640 Speaker 5: care about the debt, and they're raising the debt six 706 00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:57,560 Speaker 5: trillion dollars. So they're doing these cuts because they care 707 00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:05,520 Speaker 5: more about preserved having the huge maximalist wealth of the 708 00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:08,640 Speaker 5: people who were the winners from the last tax cut. 709 00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:12,719 Speaker 5: If you think about income inequality, it's you know, significantly 710 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:16,839 Speaker 5: higher today than it was in twenty seventeen. So they, 711 00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:21,160 Speaker 5: you know, they care about that. That's who their constituency is, 712 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,960 Speaker 5: and that's what they care about. And I think they probably, 713 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:31,120 Speaker 5: I mean, they probably believe that they can sell anybody anything, 714 00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:35,000 Speaker 5: so that people are not they can blame other people 715 00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:38,240 Speaker 5: on it. And that's why our job is to actually 716 00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:41,200 Speaker 5: tell the truth and say what's in it. And frankly, 717 00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 5: our job is also something else, which is we have 718 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:47,600 Speaker 5: to show a different future and a better future. So 719 00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:49,880 Speaker 5: for example, I'm very much. 720 00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:54,080 Speaker 6: Into let's actually have working class tax cut, Let's have 721 00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:59,440 Speaker 6: cost of living insulation here, let's do what the patriotic 722 00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:01,600 Speaker 6: millionaires have a really great proposal. 723 00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:06,560 Speaker 5: Let's make that front street. Let's actually then also show 724 00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:10,400 Speaker 5: like where's the money for career tech ed? Donald Trump, 725 00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:15,520 Speaker 5: you say that you are you care about creating pathways 726 00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:18,840 Speaker 5: for jobs for others. So where's the pathway for career 727 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,160 Speaker 5: tech ed? Why do you cut that money too? Why 728 00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:24,719 Speaker 5: don't you actually increase that funding. Don't tell me that 729 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,600 Speaker 5: Harvard should get rid of their funds so you can 730 00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:33,479 Speaker 5: put in trade schools. Why don't you fund career tech 731 00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:37,000 Speaker 5: ed instead of cutting Harvard and instead of cutting the 732 00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 5: Department of Education. Where's the big push for workforce pathways 733 00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 5: in other ways? So we should actually be fighting for 734 00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:51,239 Speaker 5: not just critiquing them, which we need to do, but 735 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:55,040 Speaker 5: we should be fighting for the things that working class 736 00:42:55,080 --> 00:43:00,000 Speaker 5: folks need, which is good jobs, affordable housing, affordable health, 737 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:04,080 Speaker 5: health care, and decent retirement. And this is the stuff 738 00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:05,680 Speaker 5: that Americans want. 739 00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:10,560 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you, thank you, Randy, thank you, thank you. 740 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:11,680 Speaker 5: Be welcome. 741 00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:21,800 Speaker 3: No second, Jesse Cannon, Molly, I'm going to really shock 742 00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:22,320 Speaker 3: you here. 743 00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:26,520 Speaker 2: After someone's mother attended a one million dollar dinner for 744 00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:29,920 Speaker 2: mister Trump, there was a pardon exchanged. Who would have 745 00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:30,440 Speaker 2: thunk it. 746 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:34,480 Speaker 1: No, I can't believe it. I'm shocked. It's a great 747 00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:37,680 Speaker 1: story from the New York Times. Ken Vogel unblocked me 748 00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:40,880 Speaker 1: on Twitter. Ken Vogel, this is the Ken Vogel and 749 00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:44,960 Speaker 1: block Molly john fest On x challenge. So this is 750 00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: a great story. This guy who worked for his mother. 751 00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:53,520 Speaker 1: His mother had a sort of nursing homeie thing. His 752 00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:56,319 Speaker 1: mother had been raising money for Trump for a long time. 753 00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:59,640 Speaker 1: They had been appealing for pardons for a long time. 754 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,279 Speaker 1: But you know what put him over the top. You're 755 00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,640 Speaker 1: going to be shocked, shocked to hear this. By the way, 756 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:08,719 Speaker 1: his mother was also involved in this Project Veritas thing 757 00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:13,560 Speaker 1: where they tried to buy Ashley Biden's diary. Everything is 758 00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:18,640 Speaker 1: so bad. American politics is so disgusting, right, they tried 759 00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:22,640 Speaker 1: to buy Ashley Biden's diary in order to hurt Joe 760 00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:26,680 Speaker 1: Biden by because this was publicizing her addiction, because she 761 00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:30,000 Speaker 1: was an addict. I mean, this is like, imagine, this 762 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:34,000 Speaker 1: is so bad. This is like the world's darkest Cohen 763 00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:40,320 Speaker 1: Brothers movie. So anyway, eventually they got this pardon. Because, 764 00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:42,840 Speaker 1: by the way, there's also a great story of a 765 00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: two million dollar yacht, which I'm not going to get 766 00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,960 Speaker 1: into right now. I do think it is funny though, 767 00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:51,600 Speaker 1: that between twenty sixteen and twenty nineteen, this guy withheld 768 00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,400 Speaker 1: more than ten million dollars from the paychecks of nurses, doctors, 769 00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:56,880 Speaker 1: and others who worked at his facilities, under the pretext 770 00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:59,880 Speaker 1: of using it for their Social Security, Medicare and federal 771 00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:02,360 Speaker 1: income tax. But you know what he did instead of 772 00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,759 Speaker 1: using it to pay there withholding taxes, he spent two 773 00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:09,239 Speaker 1: million dollars on a yacht he paid for travel and purchases, 774 00:45:09,239 --> 00:45:13,600 Speaker 1: and high end retailers including Broger of Goodman and Cardia 775 00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:18,080 Speaker 1: charged with thirteen counts of tax crimes. But our tax 776 00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:22,160 Speaker 1: crimes really crimes. If you support Donald Trump, many people 777 00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,279 Speaker 1: are saying they are not, So what happens. The mother 778 00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,680 Speaker 1: goes to a Trump fundraiser that is a million dollar 779 00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:33,040 Speaker 1: a plated fundraiser, and then he cuts the Barden great stuff. 780 00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:37,560 Speaker 1: That's what it is. That's it for this episode of 781 00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:44,400 Speaker 1: Fast Politics. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, and Saturday 782 00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,920 Speaker 1: to hear the best minds and politics make sense of 783 00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:52,439 Speaker 1: all this chaos. If you enjoy this podcast, please send 784 00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:56,160 Speaker 1: it to a friend and keep the conversation going. Thanks 785 00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:56,880 Speaker 1: for listening.