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Speaker 1: M last time on ear witness.

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Speaker 2: My mind, sir, for cross to you.

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Speaker 3: I have a pit what appears to be a jumped.

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Speaker 2: The county police officer shot in the back of our building.

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Speaker 2: That movie he hasked been shot looks it looks too bad.

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Speaker 4: And then I just heard one say that's it. That's all.

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Speaker 4: We can't do anymore. It's so we can't save it.

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Speaker 4: He's gone.

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Speaker 5: Tavaris Johnson.

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Speaker 6: I remember he was pushing a Drinka's forward in a wheelchair.

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Speaker 2: They came together.

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Speaker 7: I had saw too far.

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Speaker 1: I was pushing a Drinka's in the club.

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Speaker 4: I just thwo signs up and I left.

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Speaker 1: And and he was still there.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, he'll stay there.

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Speaker 3: When I left, a deputy Shaer working another deputy shares murder.

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Speaker 4: Do you think that was emotional?

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Speaker 3: Yes, it was very and had it been my decision

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Speaker 3: the day we caught the people that did it, let's

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Speaker 3: put them on death throat.

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Speaker 1: The murder of Deputy Bill Hardy behind the Crown Sterling

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Speaker 1: Sweets Hotel was the top news story in Birmingham on

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Speaker 1: July nineteenth, nineteen ninety five.

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Speaker 5: And plays are looking for a cop killer.

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Speaker 1: Someone shot forty nine year old William Hardy several times.

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Speaker 6: In the slow start, but investigators are throwing everything they

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Speaker 6: have behind the case.

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Speaker 1: The TV news footage shows deputies wearing the traditional black

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Speaker 1: band over their badges, a gesture that r us is

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Speaker 1: grief for a fellow officer.

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Speaker 3: We're somber, we'll say it, but we know we have

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Speaker 3: a job to do, and we're determined to do that job.

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Speaker 8: This is a very difficult night for William Hardy's family.

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Speaker 6: The Hardy home is full of sorrow and.

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Speaker 5: Pain as they search for asss to a cesseless crime.

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Speaker 1: A week after the murder, hundreds of people turn out

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Speaker 1: for Deputy Hardy's funeral.

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Speaker 4: Thank you, my brothers, Thank you, my brothers.

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Speaker 1: Video footage of the funeral shows women in dresses fanning themselves.

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Speaker 1: It's summer in Alabama, a swampy ninety seven degrees. Someone

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Speaker 1: actually faints in the heat.

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Speaker 7: We are still for that.

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Speaker 9: We all have to do what Bill has already done.

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Speaker 1: The church is packed, but at least one longtime colleague

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Speaker 1: of Hardy's isn't at the service.

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Speaker 4: I didn't make the family.

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Speaker 3: We weren't this case so hard and we were so

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Speaker 3: determined to get a resolution.

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Speaker 4: I was working, I didn't make his feel.

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Speaker 1: Tony Richardson is the lead detective on the case. A

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Speaker 1: prosecutor who used to work with Richardson tells me he's

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Speaker 1: a thorough investigator, a man who gets the job done.

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Speaker 1: But this case is different from any other he's worked before.

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Speaker 1: He's investigating the murder of someone he knows, someone he likes,

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Speaker 1: someone he worked with for almost two decades.

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Speaker 3: When you got a different shriff killed over here, it's

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Speaker 3: high profile and people are expecting things out here, not

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Speaker 3: only you.

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Speaker 4: You know, you emotional. You want to find the people

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Speaker 4: who did this. You want somebody in custom.

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Speaker 1: In the immediate hours after Deputy Hardy's murder, Detective Tony

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Speaker 1: Richardson and his investigators interviewed Marshal Kelly Cummings, the Keebler

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Speaker 1: cookie guy who heard the shots and saw someone drive away.

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Speaker 1: They also interview the front desk clerk at the hotel,

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Speaker 1: Barry Rushikov, and other people staying at the Crown Sterling

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Speaker 1: Suites who heard voices in the parking lot followed by gunshots.

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Speaker 1: No one they talked to says they actually saw the murder.

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Speaker 1: Just a few witnesses heard the gunshots and then saw

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Speaker 1: a car pull away. The lead evidence technician, who's actually

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Speaker 1: Tony Richardson's brother, Deputy Charlie Richardson, finds two nine millimeters

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Speaker 1: shell casings at the scene. A ballistics expert will later

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Speaker 1: say that both casings came from the same gun, and

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Speaker 1: that's pretty much all they have to go on. Police

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Speaker 1: sweep the surrounding area and pull over any vehicle's loosely

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Speaker 1: matching descriptions from hotel guest guests, but it doesn't get

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Speaker 1: them very far.

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Speaker 3: Not only do you want somebody in custody. The lieutenant

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Speaker 3: is telling me, we need to get this done. The

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Speaker 3: captain is telling the lieutenant, we need to get this done.

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Speaker 3: The sheriff, you're telling the captain, we need to get

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Speaker 3: this done.

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Speaker 1: Nine hours after Hardy is killed, the Sheriff's department announces

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Speaker 1: a reward for information. The reward amount would eventually grow

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Speaker 1: to twenty thousand dollars adjusted for inflation, that's about forty

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Speaker 1: grand today. And once a tip line is announced, the

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Speaker 1: phone start ringing. One caller says a guy known as

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Speaker 1: Big Man told him his cousin was involved. Another says

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Speaker 1: a member of the Disciples gang carried out the murder.

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Speaker 1: Officers sift through this information, trying to decipher what's worth

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Speaker 1: pursuing and which callers might be pranks or people just

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Speaker 1: interest did in the reward money. Days go by and

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Speaker 1: they still don't have a suspect. And then Detective Richardson

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Speaker 1: speaks to a woman named Rosa Hardy, and what she

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Speaker 1: tells him eclipses every other lead he has.

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Speaker 5: And she told me, she says, my daughter knows who

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Speaker 5: killed Bill?

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Speaker 3: Do you he?

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Speaker 1: My man?

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Speaker 7: Love hads my be.

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Speaker 10: Sorrowst rely in this bad.

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Speaker 1: Tears.

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Speaker 10: I want to see remblation.

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Speaker 5: I want to know who you are. I'm reation.

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Speaker 10: In this inspiration to the who's holding studs, to the.

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Speaker 7: Who's holding the start?

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Speaker 1: I'm Beth Shelburne. This is ear witness, Chapter two.

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Speaker 3: Don't know Diddley, anybody that was not there when I

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Speaker 3: was there, anybody that was not there when Harry was shot.

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Speaker 5: Don't know deadly.

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Speaker 4: About this case.

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Speaker 1: When I first got the enormous trove of records in

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Speaker 1: the investigative file, I spent hours and hours just staring

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Speaker 1: at my computer, overwhelmed by thousands of pages of documents.

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Speaker 1: Right away, I knew I wanted to talk to Tony Richardson,

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Speaker 1: the lead investigator in Hardy's murder. His name is on

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Speaker 1: most of the police reports, and it's his voice we

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Speaker 1: hear on a lot of the interrogation tapes.

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Speaker 11: Short of tolevision, Jeff, we got a shurance service today.

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Speaker 1: When I first call him for an interview, he says

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Speaker 1: it would be best not to talk with me, but

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Speaker 1: Richardson keeps talking for twenty five minutes. It seems like

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Speaker 1: he's got a lot on his mind. Two weeks later,

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Speaker 1: he agrees to go on the record.

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Speaker 3: Listen, I've decided I'm going to speak with you concerning

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Speaker 3: your podcast.

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Speaker 1: Great, I'm really glad to hear that. My producer Mara,

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Speaker 1: and I meet him in a conference room of a

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Speaker 1: local library. Hey, how are you. I'm Beth Tony MAA

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Speaker 1: nice to be a too. He's dressed casually, jeans, a

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Speaker 1: black sweatshirt, a US Marines ball cap, and a toothpick

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Speaker 1: he keeps in his mouth the entire interview.

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Speaker 3: Somebody when they hear this, they're gonna be questioning.

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Speaker 4: My integrity.

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Speaker 3: You know, is this guy telling the truth for his

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Speaker 3: He just telling her story. So I'll talk to the day.

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Speaker 3: Let'sty started.

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Speaker 1: When Detective Tony Richardson first gets that tip from Rosa Hardy.

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Speaker 1: He goes over to the Ford dealership where she works

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Speaker 1: as a receptionist.

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Speaker 4: I was always pretty thorough.

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Speaker 1: I wrote everything down, He writes in a report that

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Speaker 1: Rosa Hardy told an officer that her daughter had information

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Speaker 1: concerning the crime. The police report reads, miss Hardy told

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Speaker 1: us that after she arrived for work at twelve noon

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Speaker 1: of seven nineteen, she heard a police officer had been killed.

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Speaker 1: She bought a newspaper and learned the victim was someone

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Speaker 1: she and her family knew personally. Rosa knew Deputy Hardy

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Speaker 1: and his wife. They have the same last name, but

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Speaker 1: they're not related. They were good friends. The report goes

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Speaker 1: on to say that Rosa's daughter, Yolanda Chambers, called her

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Speaker 1: at work. Rosa told her that the officer that had

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Speaker 1: been killed was Bill Hardy. According to Rosa, her daughter

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Speaker 1: Yolanda responded, Mama, I didn't know it was him, and

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Speaker 1: then Yolanda went on to say she knew who killed him.

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Speaker 5: She says, my daughter knows who killed Bill.

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Speaker 4: Well, great will. She talked to me.

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Speaker 5: I don't know.

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Speaker 4: She kind of reluctant.

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Speaker 5: She don't want to do it.

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Speaker 3: I'm trying to get her to do it, and I

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Speaker 3: was just begging her, you know, let's figure out a

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Speaker 3: way to get her in.

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Speaker 4: We need her.

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Speaker 1: But Rosa isn't sure where Yolanda is.

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Speaker 3: I think at the time Yolanda was a semi runaway

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Speaker 3: or whatever, but she wasn't there, okay, So we worked

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Speaker 3: very hard with Mom to get Yolanda in.

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Speaker 1: Later that evening, Rosa calls the Sheriff's office and says,

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Speaker 1: Yolanda is at her apartment, and that's where Richardson picks

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Speaker 1: her up. He brings Yolanda to Sheriff's headquarters for questioning.

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Speaker 11: Charlotan, Tony rich and Jeffer Kind of Shriff's office. Today's

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Speaker 11: date is July twenty fourth, nineteen ninety five. The time

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Speaker 11: it's eleven twenty pm. I'm at the Sheriff's Office headquarters

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Speaker 11: along with Officer James Branton at the Birmingham Police Department

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Speaker 11: and Yolanda Michelle Chambers. Yolanda is a black female, she's

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Speaker 11: fifteen years of age.

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Speaker 12: Again, what I want to talk to you about.

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Speaker 1: Is Yolanda is by herself in a room with detectives

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Speaker 1: and a tape recorder.

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Speaker 13: So I guess the best way for us to forceed

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Speaker 13: is for you to tell me, first of all, when

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Speaker 13: you learned that w Hardy had been killed?

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Speaker 7: All right, if I'm not mistaken, it was a Friday.

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Speaker 7: Me and one of my girlfriends fan named Latanya. Me

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Speaker 7: and her and two guys are supposed to hook cup

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Speaker 7: that night. Yeah, you know they're older than us. One

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Speaker 7: is twenty one.

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Speaker 2: They called him Dre. He's in a wheelchair.

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Speaker 1: Dre is ar Dregas Ford's nickname, and for some reason

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Speaker 1: in this interview, Yolanda refers to to Forrest as Carlos.

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Speaker 7: He has a brother named Carlos, so we you know,

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Speaker 7: we was supposed to hook up, you know, after they

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Speaker 7: left Teeve.

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Speaker 1: To Forest and Ardregas are not related, and to Forest's

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Speaker 1: nickname has never been Carlos. It's unclear why Yolanda refers

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Speaker 1: to him this way, but she tells police that ar

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Speaker 1: Dregas called her around two am. He and to Forrest

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Speaker 1: had left Tea's place and we're on their way to

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Speaker 1: pick her up.

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Speaker 2: You know i'd be on time.

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Speaker 7: They call it around about two or three, you know,

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Speaker 7: be like, come.

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Speaker 1: On, Ardregas asks Yolanda to bring along a friend for

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Speaker 1: to Forest, So after they pick up Yolanda, they all

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Speaker 1: drive to pick up her friend, Latanya Henderson, who lives

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Speaker 1: a few minutes away. I want to take a moment

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Speaker 1: to address the age gap between to Forest, Ardregas and

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Speaker 1: the girls they're picking up. To Forest is twenty two,

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Speaker 1: Ardregas is twenty one, Latania is sixteen, and Yolanda is fifteen.

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Speaker 1: To Forest and Ardregas met Yolanda and Latania at a

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Speaker 1: night club two nights prior to picking them up after teas.

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Speaker 1: It's likely that the girls lied about their age to

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Speaker 1: get into the club where they met. But I don't

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Speaker 1: know if to Forest and Ardregas knew how old they were.

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Speaker 1: I don't even know if it came up. The age

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Speaker 1: of consent in Alabama is sixteen. But regardless, guys in

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Speaker 1: their early twenties picking up teenage girls, it's just problematic.

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Speaker 7: Him and Carlos came down me and we went all

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Speaker 7: hand to waste in Deer Park.

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Speaker 2: People tell you.

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Speaker 1: Yolanda says that once they get to Latanya's house, it

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Speaker 1: takes a while for Latanya to get ready.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, going out and try about it.

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Speaker 7: Forty minutes to get ready take our bathroostuf because she

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Speaker 7: didn't have on no clothes.

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Speaker 1: Latanya finally sneaks out of her bedroom window to meet them.

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Speaker 1: Once the girls are in the car, Yolanda says that

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Speaker 1: something is off and our Dregas seems nervous.

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Speaker 7: You know, and all like what's wronging around? Why we

231
00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:44,040
Speaker 7: either got to get for the wrong we either, you know,

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Speaker 7: it goes on in chill out, so you know we're

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Speaker 7: runing around. You know, we'll tell me hill I mean,

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Speaker 7: and it is molded cough.

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Speaker 1: According to Yolanda or Dragas says, the other guy in

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Speaker 1: the car with them, to Forrest had smoked a cop.

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Speaker 2: For me, a fan a lot of hut you know

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00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,040
Speaker 2: bos We got their light playing, y'all, got.

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00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:11,440
Speaker 1: Us in the cart out y'all and did so did

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00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:16,680
Speaker 1: a crime somehow. This revelation that to Forest and Ardregis

241
00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,760
Speaker 1: were supposedly just involved in the murder of a police

242
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:23,560
Speaker 1: officer doesn't deter their plans. She says. The four of

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00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:25,800
Speaker 1: them drive off to look for a hotel room.

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Speaker 2: We rode around in Hollywood rus we went to the fact.

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00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:34,080
Speaker 1: In hand, but she says, the Fairfield End was booked

246
00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,920
Speaker 1: solid and so they head across the street to the

247
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Speaker 1: Super eight motel.

248
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Speaker 7: So when we went light across to the Suma eighth,

249
00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:45,600
Speaker 7: a whole lot of cops came from knowing sheriffs and

250
00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:50,320
Speaker 7: everything just came and I'll you know, and hated everybody

251
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:51,160
Speaker 7: can at the cop.

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Speaker 1: It's there and the Super eight parking lot. That officers

253
00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:58,640
Speaker 1: tell the group they're investigating the murder of a deputy

254
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Speaker 1: who was shot and killed earlier that night a few

255
00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:06,639
Speaker 1: miles away at the Crown Sterling Sweets Hotel. Remember, officers

256
00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:09,159
Speaker 1: were on the lookout for cars in the vicinity of

257
00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,960
Speaker 1: the crime scene, and this is why they pull in

258
00:17:12,119 --> 00:17:14,960
Speaker 1: behind the Monte Carlo in the Super eight parking lot.

259
00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,560
Speaker 1: One of the officers later testifies that he tried to

260
00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:26,040
Speaker 1: extract ar Dregis from the car before learning that he's paralyzed.

261
00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,800
Speaker 1: The officer makes to Forest get out of the car,

262
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:33,040
Speaker 1: put his hands on the trunk while he pats him down,

263
00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,720
Speaker 1: then looks inside the Monte Carlo with his flashlight. He

264
00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:42,199
Speaker 1: finds nothing suspicious and decides to let everyone go except

265
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:46,199
Speaker 1: to Forest because he has a misdemeanor warrant for driving

266
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Speaker 1: without a license. So police take to Forest to the

267
00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:55,120
Speaker 1: Birmingham City Jail and he bonds out later that afternoon. Meanwhile,

268
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:59,680
Speaker 1: Ardregas's license is expired, so police won't let him drive home,

269
00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,720
Speaker 1: and he leaves the Monte Carlo in the Super eight

270
00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:05,960
Speaker 1: parking lot. He and the girls get a cab to

271
00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,879
Speaker 1: go home, and Yolanda crashes at a friend's house. She

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00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:12,280
Speaker 1: says she calls her mom later that morning.

273
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Speaker 2: Ho, god, my mom is next morning, she say, guess

274
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,200
Speaker 2: class not as being as big.

275
00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:27,840
Speaker 1: That click, it's the sound of an officer turning the

276
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:31,760
Speaker 1: tape recorder off. We don't know what's being said between

277
00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:35,760
Speaker 1: Yolanda and investigators when the tape is stopped, but Yolanda's

278
00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,600
Speaker 1: first interview isn't over. The tape starts rolling again.

279
00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:43,399
Speaker 7: Okay, go ahead, Yeah, I'll tell my mom about it

280
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,199
Speaker 7: and she can see Yolanda, you know how the police

281
00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:47,760
Speaker 7: house that got killed last night.

282
00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:49,200
Speaker 2: I'm right here.

283
00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:51,159
Speaker 13: Okay, let me stop you again, Okay, because I want

284
00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:52,679
Speaker 13: to make sure that we get it on the record.

285
00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:53,440
Speaker 4: Now.

286
00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,200
Speaker 12: You have already mentioned in your statement that this was

287
00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:56,760
Speaker 12: a Friday.

288
00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:59,719
Speaker 7: Yep, it was a Tuesday, because that's when they had

289
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:05,560
Speaker 7: had the hour it was going on with her Wednesday morning,

290
00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:06,360
Speaker 7: around bout.

291
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:11,040
Speaker 1: Two, Yolanda says that Carlos, remember, that's what she's calling

292
00:19:11,119 --> 00:19:14,720
Speaker 1: to Forrest told her the time that he shot Deputy Hardy.

293
00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:22,720
Speaker 2: But if they had worn bout twelve around now twelve thirty, Carlos.

294
00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:27,960
Speaker 1: And then Yolanda suggests a potential motive. She says, Deputy

295
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,440
Speaker 1: Hardy had arrested to Forrest before, and that's why he

296
00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:32,680
Speaker 1: supposedly shot him.

297
00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,119
Speaker 2: No, because I mean bare arrested him a found before.

298
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,199
Speaker 12: Carlos, M, h, you go, where are you arresting him

299
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:40,600
Speaker 12: at m.

300
00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:44,760
Speaker 2: I think it has him the way he went to parison.

301
00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:53,480
Speaker 1: An officer turns the tape recorder off for a second time.

302
00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:58,480
Speaker 1: When the tape resumes, Yolanda offers a different motive for

303
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:02,520
Speaker 1: Hardy's murder now. She says they killed him after an

304
00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:08,280
Speaker 1: attempted robbery, and since Hardy had seen their faces, it

305
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:09,800
Speaker 1: just made sense to kill him.

306
00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:13,560
Speaker 2: Cut them all things former do with kill him.

307
00:20:14,960 --> 00:20:18,480
Speaker 1: In the last minutes of the interview, detectives ask Yolanda

308
00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:22,360
Speaker 1: why Ardregis and Carlos had gone to the Crown Sterling Suites,

309
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:26,000
Speaker 1: and she says they wanted to get a room because

310
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,840
Speaker 1: they sell drugs. They ask her if she knows anybody

311
00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:34,560
Speaker 1: else these guys run with. Yolanda points to the photos

312
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,080
Speaker 1: of two other men in a stack that police show her.

313
00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:43,800
Speaker 1: You hear Richardson say she has identified Omar Berry and

314
00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:45,080
Speaker 1: Quintez Wilson.

315
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,879
Speaker 12: Quintez Wilson, this guy you look at you know him

316
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:54,439
Speaker 12: as what? Okay, that's the photograph of Omar Berry.

317
00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,919
Speaker 1: These two other young black men are added to their

318
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:04,480
Speaker 1: list of suspects. This first recorded interview lasts about thirty

319
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:08,720
Speaker 1: five minutes, and right at the end, an officer Asksyolanda

320
00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:11,000
Speaker 1: if anyone has made promises to her.

321
00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:14,560
Speaker 12: The promises to you by the stags, you're just made no.

322
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:28,480
Speaker 1: Caving it, She answers no. Then we hear her say

323
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Speaker 1: the only thing y'all gonna and then there's seven long

324
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:35,720
Speaker 1: seconds of silence.

325
00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:43,000
Speaker 13: It's Charlie Richardson and this is going to conclude this

326
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 13: interview at this time.

327
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Speaker 4: E PM.

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Speaker 1: I listened to this interview over and over again, and

329
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:58,320
Speaker 1: what stands out is that each time officers stop and

330
00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:02,480
Speaker 1: then restart the tape, there's a shift in Yolanda's story.

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00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:08,920
Speaker 1: At first, she says it was a Friday that she

332
00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:14,520
Speaker 1: heard about Hardy's murder. Then, after the tape stops and restarts,

333
00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 1: Richardson prompts her for the date, and she corrects herself

334
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:22,240
Speaker 1: and says it was a Tuesday night going into Wednesday.

335
00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:27,320
Speaker 1: With every restart of the tape, Richardson gets a story

336
00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,720
Speaker 1: that lines up more and more with the facts surrounding

337
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:35,160
Speaker 1: Hardy's murder, that he was shot on Wednesday morning behind

338
00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:40,240
Speaker 1: the Crown Sterling at twelve fifty am. And then there's

339
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:44,920
Speaker 1: the motives. Yolanda provides first that to Forest killed Hardy

340
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 1: because Hardy had arrested him previously, but we know Hardy

341
00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:53,480
Speaker 1: had not arrested to Forrest at the time of his death.

342
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:58,119
Speaker 1: Hardy worked in court services. His duties involved serving subpoenas

343
00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:03,800
Speaker 1: and directing traffic outside the courthouse. I've seen zero evidence

344
00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 1: that Deputy Hardy ever came into contact with to Forrest Johnson.

345
00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,080
Speaker 1: After the tape stops and restarts, Yolanda gives a second

346
00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:16,520
Speaker 1: motive that the crime started as an attempted robbery that

347
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:21,879
Speaker 1: ends in Hardy's murder. I asked Tony Richardson about his

348
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:23,400
Speaker 1: approach with Yolanda.

349
00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:27,479
Speaker 4: Yolanda was reluctant. She didn't want to talk. She didn't want.

350
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:29,639
Speaker 3: We had to keep at her and we had to

351
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 3: pull like polenty you know, Yolanda, we need this. And

352
00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:38,080
Speaker 3: sometimes we'd have to be stern, you know, infirm, trying

353
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,679
Speaker 3: to shake her. You know, sometime we'd have to be solved,

354
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 3: whatever work to get this information out of her.

355
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 1: There are a lot of stops and starts, and I

356
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 1: wonder what is going on then, like the tape stops

357
00:23:54,400 --> 00:24:00,200
Speaker 1: and then it restarts. I could doll you when you

358
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 1: go off the record with people. I mean, what what

359
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 1: is best practices?

360
00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 4: For best practice? If not is not to go off

361
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 4: the record, that's the best practice.

362
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 3: I mean, once you cut the tape on, unless the

363
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,200
Speaker 3: tape runs out and you changing the tape, you don't

364
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 3: cut it off until you're done. There's no way I

365
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 3: can tell you why the tape stopped, but I will

366
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:28,480
Speaker 3: tell you this. It didn't stop so something sinister could happen.

367
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 4: I can tell you that.

368
00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:36,880
Speaker 1: What would do you do off the record though?

369
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 3: I mean somebody could have wanted to go to the bathroom,

370
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:46,560
Speaker 3: or could have just motioned for a break, or or.

371
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 4: Could have even motioned to say, cut that thing off,

372
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:52,399
Speaker 4: you know.

373
00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 2: It.

374
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 3: There's no way I can tell you why it was

375
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:02,399
Speaker 3: cut off. I I can tell you there's nothing sinister here.

376
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 3: There's I mean, there's no smoking gun here. As far as.

377
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 4: Doing anything that was not above board. Never o never occurred,

378
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 4: never happened, never happened.

379
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 6: It was early in the morning and I was just

380
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,520
Speaker 6: lounging around in my apartment, you know, and I had

381
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 6: my front door was open, and where I was sitting,

382
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:46,560
Speaker 6: I could see out the door, and here I see

383
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 6: just cars.

384
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 5: One mark.

385
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 1: In July of nineteen ninety five, to Forrest and his

386
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 1: cousin Antonio Green were living together. But on the morning

387
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 1: of the twenty fifth, Antonio is alone in their apartment

388
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: when police cars over there.

389
00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 6: So I see him pulling up in the front lot

390
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 6: in the back and I'm like, oh, what's going on

391
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 6: over here?

392
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 2: You know.

393
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,719
Speaker 6: Next thing I know, they're in my door and they

394
00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,399
Speaker 6: acts was to far As Johnson there. I said no,

395
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:14,639
Speaker 6: I said, no, he's been staying here. But while he

396
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 6: asking me this, they've already came in bought both doors,

397
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 6: so they're already in my house. They're going down the hallway.

398
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 6: So I'm thinking, Nah, this must be something serious, you know,

399
00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:24,440
Speaker 6: whatever it is.

400
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 1: So this guy's telling me what officers say they're looking

401
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 1: for the Forest because they think he might know something

402
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:31,520
Speaker 1: about a.

403
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:35,119
Speaker 6: Murder something or when they said murder, that really just

404
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 6: threw me all the way to the left because of violent.

405
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 6: He wasn't never violent, you know, Rambunks his teenager, young

406
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 6: kid doing what all of us were doing and far

407
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 6: as partying and having a good time and all this,

408
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 6: but violence never, he was never violent person.

409
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:57,160
Speaker 1: As officers walk through Antonio's house, his phone rings. It's

410
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 1: his grandfather and he says police are at his house too.

411
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: Antonio hangs up and the phone rings again.

412
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,160
Speaker 4: The phone ring again. I answered it, and it's him.

413
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:08,959
Speaker 4: It's the Forest.

414
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,400
Speaker 6: I said, hey, man, way you head? He said, I'm

415
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:15,120
Speaker 6: headed up there now. I said, yeah, it's folks looking

416
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 6: for you. Anyways, Yeah, that's what I heard. I don't

417
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 6: know what they want, but I'm finna go and see now.

418
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 6: I'm going up dead house now and see what they want.

419
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 1: So he did to Forest tells his cousin he has

420
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 1: no idea why police want to talk to him, but

421
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: he goes to meet with them at his grandfather's house.

422
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 6: Father's house and I heard him over the radio say

423
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,760
Speaker 6: we got him in custody, and only then would they lead.

424
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: House police take to Forest to Sheriff's Office headquarters for questioning.

425
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,440
Speaker 1: On the morning of July twenty fifth, the day after

426
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 1: they first talked to Yolanda Chambers, Detective Tony Richardson and

427
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:55,640
Speaker 1: his partner Tom Salter asked to Forrest to walk them

428
00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: through the evening of July eighteenth, the hours leading up

429
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:00,640
Speaker 1: to Deputy Party's murder.

430
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 4: Suppose you doing at five o'clock and even proud little

431
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,399
Speaker 4: by Gaswell, who who you to?

432
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 1: Forrest says that around five pm, he was getting his

433
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:17,880
Speaker 1: haircut at a neighborhood spot called gas World Park, gas

434
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 1: Station Park, barbershop and nail salon part convenience store. Afterwards,

435
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:25,800
Speaker 1: he met up with his little brother at his mom's

436
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 1: apartment complex.

437
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 12: He was hanging out outside of the Yeah, we'd be

438
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 12: outside of them in the little park or around walking.

439
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 4: Is something to do? Any him to do?

440
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: Just try to fire something to do, trying to find

441
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: something to do when there's nothing to do. As to

442
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 1: Forrest tells this to police, he has no way of

443
00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 1: knowing that he's describing one of his last few days

444
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:54,760
Speaker 1: of freedom.

445
00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 4: So you guys might take you home because you're hungry.

446
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 4: Fish blown the sandwich.

447
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 1: Yes, he fries himself a Bolognian cheese sandwich, plays Sega

448
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 1: and listens to the radio.

449
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:15,240
Speaker 5: See, I think I stayed at home the Draga's game.

450
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,280
Speaker 12: I think I stayed there till he came feed me.

451
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:23,560
Speaker 1: He stays there and tell his friend ardregas Ford picks

452
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 1: him up in his nineteen seventy one black Monte Carlo

453
00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 1: to go to Teas place. While police asked to forrest

454
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: about the night party was killed. Others are out looking

455
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 1: for ardregas Ford. They knock on the door of his

456
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 1: mom's house. Here's Joyce Ford.

457
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 14: Three o'clock that morning, I'll stayed at Central Park. Somebody

458
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 14: knocked on the door and I said, and who is it?

459
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 14: And they said Jefferson kund of sheriff Man. So I

460
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 14: looked out the window. They were everywhere. I opened the

461
00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:59,040
Speaker 14: door and I was kind of nervous, and they said,

462
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 14: Dregul's fulld home.

463
00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 5: I said no.

464
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 14: Then they said, well can we come in? I said

465
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 14: I don't have anything to have. You welcome to come in,

466
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 14: but do you have a search one? And they said no.

467
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 14: I said, well you can't come in. They said, well,

468
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 14: we have some questions to asks and can you bring

469
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 14: him in when he get home? And I told him.

470
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:23,720
Speaker 14: When he got home, I told him what happened and

471
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 14: he said, yeah, Ma, I'd be glad to go.

472
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 1: So Joyce drives our Dragas to the Sheriff's office headquarters

473
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 1: on the morning of July twenty sixth. Detectives Richardson and

474
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 1: Salter asked him what he was up to on the

475
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 1: night of the murder. Richardson asks him what time he

476
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 1: picked up to Forrest first time.

477
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 12: You saw him, tubes it was about ten o'clock and

478
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 12: night but.

479
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 1: Tea, how about Tom Once they get to Tease or

480
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: Dragas says, his beeper is going off all night. It's

481
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 1: Yolanda Chambers shouldn't been paid, but I won't call him.

482
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 1: But so he had just met her the previous Sunday

483
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 1: at another nightclub called the Jaguar. In separate interviews, both

484
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: to Forrest and Ardregas tell detectives they hung out at

485
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,960
Speaker 1: Teas until past one am, catching up with old friends

486
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: like Mama Cat and Queasy.

487
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 4: Right there we were fucking with that girl Mama kidd

488
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:22,560
Speaker 4: whore out telling you about Mamma Cad.

489
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 1: And Queasy, but after they strike out at the club,

490
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 1: Ardregas says he finally calls Yolanda around two thirty am.

491
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 4: So I called her till I will come and get.

492
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,080
Speaker 1: Ardregas says, he and too Forrest pick up Yolanda and

493
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,320
Speaker 1: then head to her friend Latanya's house, and just like

494
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,479
Speaker 1: Yolanda told police, he also says that Latanya doesn't come

495
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,960
Speaker 1: out to meet them right away. He remembers this clearly

496
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 1: because it was kind of annoying to go long wow,

497
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: to come out up.

498
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 12: At day time or night. You know, we ain't got

499
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 12: time to be waiting on nobody.

500
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: Dectives also bring Latania Henderson in for questioning. She talks

501
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: to a female officer without a parent or lawyer present,

502
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 1: and she says the same thing.

503
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 2: So Yolanda and them.

504
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 7: Pick up around per o'clock my time, Aganical run free

505
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 7: and very o'clock am and a moment market.

506
00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: All four of them say. They leave Latanya's house and

507
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:23,600
Speaker 1: try to get a room.

508
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 12: I see when we pulled up at a fair via Nam.

509
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 12: We went to Fairfield first to put them in a

510
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 12: fair Field.

511
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,560
Speaker 1: Just like Yolanda says. They tell police that the Fairfield

512
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 1: Inn is booked, so they head to the Super eight Motel.

513
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 1: This is where officers stopped them as part of their

514
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 1: sweep of cars across Homewood. At this point, Ar dregis

515
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 1: to Forrest. Latania, and Yolanda have all independently described similar

516
00:32:56,520 --> 00:33:00,960
Speaker 1: versions of the night to detectives, with one huge, huge exception.

517
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 1: No one in the car says they know anything about

518
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:09,760
Speaker 1: Deputy Hardy's murder except Yolanda.

519
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 8: Today day is July twenty sixth, nineteen ninety five. At

520
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 8: the time is twelve thirty seven.

521
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 1: Two days after her first recorded interview with police, Yolanda

522
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 1: Chambers is back in for questioning. At first, Yolanda tells

523
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 1: a similar story to her first interview that she heard

524
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 1: Ar Dregas say that to Forrest killed a cop.

525
00:33:56,640 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 12: Did you say anything?

526
00:33:57,600 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 5: Is now.

527
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:06,959
Speaker 1: The tape recorder is turned off. Forty minutes later, they

528
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 1: start recording again.

529
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 5: Ris Shardon Richard, I'm restarting the tape.

530
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,719
Speaker 8: The time is twenty minutes to two. We took a

531
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:24,479
Speaker 8: short brake. We're gonna get started again. You Lona doing

532
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 8: our break time. We talked something about the incident of.

533
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:32,319
Speaker 4: The for the case.

534
00:34:33,600 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 8: Now I'm want to ask you, now what you have

535
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 8: already told me during the times that I have interviewed you.

536
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:40,200
Speaker 13: Is that the truth?

537
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 12: No, it's not the truth.

538
00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 8: No, did any that you told me?

539
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 12: Did any of that occur?

540
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:51,760
Speaker 2: Can occur?

541
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 7: But it was not nothing bad at her?

542
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:56,880
Speaker 4: Okay.

543
00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 8: So are you telling me that you didn't get to

544
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,399
Speaker 8: his second hand, that when this deputy was shot and killed,

545
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:04,080
Speaker 8: that you were there?

546
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 2: No, I didn't get it taking hand, how of that

547
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 2: you were there?

548
00:35:09,600 --> 00:35:15,440
Speaker 1: I'm feeling well, She says she was actually there when

549
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:18,560
Speaker 1: Hardy was shot, and she's about to tell detectives a

550
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 1: completely different version of what happened that night.

551
00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:23,960
Speaker 12: Okay, tell me about that.

552
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,239
Speaker 7: Well, when I told you that they were supposed to

553
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 7: come get me where I'm back, We're getting me by

554
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 7: eleven thirty, they did come and give me.

555
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:36,120
Speaker 2: As the actual crime.

556
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: Yolanda now says that to Forrest and Rodregaz came to

557
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:45,640
Speaker 1: pick her up around eleven thirty pm instead of two am.

558
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,759
Speaker 2: You know, after they came and got me, women gat

559
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:49,320
Speaker 2: for crying.

560
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 3: You were you were ready?

561
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 2: Uh huh?

562
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 12: Women?

563
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:56,279
Speaker 2: You mean brought right out right on now?

564
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 4: Okay.

565
00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:02,080
Speaker 1: Yolanda says that Latanya hops right into the car instead

566
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 1: of taking a long time to get ready.

567
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 12: Did you know it's the time where y'all were going?

568
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:08,839
Speaker 7: Yeah?

569
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 2: Where were you going?

570
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 12: Okay? So did y'all go to the crowdstairs?

571
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 2: Yeah?

572
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:15,759
Speaker 7: We went, we went.

573
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,720
Speaker 1: She now says they left Latanya's house and went straight

574
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: to the Crown Sterling Suitets Hotel.

575
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 7: And what time do you think you got there, Little Asia,

576
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 7: because Draco's drive pad.

577
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 1: So, Yolanda names an arrival time that fits neatly with

578
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:39,360
Speaker 1: Hardy's murder, which was around twelve to fifty am. And

579
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:42,279
Speaker 1: then she says that our dregas and to Forrest. We're

580
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: meeting up with some guys at the hotel to do

581
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: a drug deal.

582
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 8: Okay. And where did y'all park.

583
00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:53,320
Speaker 7: On the sad not on the sack for the south

584
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 7: right cross from where the bank is.

585
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 1: She says they pull up on the side of the hotel,

586
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:02,759
Speaker 1: across from another car that flashes its lights at them.

587
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: Inside that car, Yolanda says she sees three people and

588
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 1: two of them are the guy she previously identified in

589
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 1: photos that police showed her, Omar Barry and Quintez Wilson.

590
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 1: Yolanda says that Omar and Quintez walk over to Ardregas's

591
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 1: car and to Forrest gets out to join them. Yolanda, Latanya,

592
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:30,120
Speaker 1: and Ardregis stay in the car, and Yolanda says this

593
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 1: is when she sees Deputy Bill Hardy walk around the

594
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: side of the building. In the final six minutes of

595
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 1: this recording, Yolanda tells a disjointed version of events. She says,

596
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: Deputy Hardy meets up with this group of men in

597
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,000
Speaker 1: the parking lot and they huddle up, then all walk

598
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,319
Speaker 1: toward the front entrance of the hotel. She says they're

599
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 1: gone for thirty to forty minutes, when to Forrest, who

600
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 1: she calls Carlos, jogs back to the cars.

601
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 2: Carlo jumping for the man who wants this gold is cold.

602
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 2: It's old.

603
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:05,839
Speaker 8: Let me stop you there now.

604
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:11,040
Speaker 1: Up until this point, Yolanda has not mentioned Hardy's murder.

605
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,080
Speaker 12: Okay, now, you mentioned to me that you heard what

606
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:15,440
Speaker 12: you thought was three shots.

607
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,279
Speaker 2: But when we heard it, we were like, we know

608
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:18,840
Speaker 2: what it was.

609
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:20,960
Speaker 7: We didn't know what was going on.

610
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 1: This is the first time there's any mention on tape

611
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 1: that Yolanda heard gunshots. She confirms it after Tony Richardson

612
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 1: brings it up.

613
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 8: So you heard those shots before he ever ran back

614
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:35,479
Speaker 8: to the school when they will call in the long

615
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:36,279
Speaker 8: period of time.

616
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:37,360
Speaker 4: Okay.

617
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: This version of events does not line up with what

618
00:38:41,520 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: Richardson knows about the crime. Hardy was murdered at the

619
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 1: back entrance of the hotel, not the side near the

620
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:53,759
Speaker 1: bank where Yolanda says they were parked, and definitely not

621
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 1: the front of the hotel where she claims this group

622
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:58,320
Speaker 1: of men disappeared with Hardy.

623
00:38:59,080 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 12: This is what you're telling me.

624
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 2: This is the honest for guy truth.

625
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:07,400
Speaker 12: Okay. Why didn't you tell me from the start that

626
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:09,120
Speaker 12: you were late because I was scared.

627
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 2: I didn't know what was gonna have.

628
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:15,879
Speaker 7: I just think so it is, okay. I just want

629
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 7: to since I had since I knew of about it,

630
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:21,600
Speaker 7: you know, I just wanted to let you know that

631
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 7: I have some information about it, but I don't want

632
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:27,920
Speaker 7: you out to know how they're the actual paths.

633
00:39:31,280 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 1: The recorder is turned off yet again for almost an hour.

634
00:39:36,480 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 1: When the tape starts up again, Sergeant Salter asks the questions.

635
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 12: Ms.

636
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 9: Chambers, we need to clarify something about where y'all were

637
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:50,080
Speaker 9: parked at at the Crown Stirling Suite, and it's my

638
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 9: understanding that y'all drove in to the parking lot to

639
00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:54,359
Speaker 9: the back door.

640
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 4: Is that correct?

641
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 7: Correct?

642
00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:00,520
Speaker 1: Yolanda now agrees that they were parked at the back

643
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:04,400
Speaker 1: of the hotel where Hardy was shot. There's no discussion

644
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 1: on tape about why this detail changed, and then her

645
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 1: story changes again. She says she didn't just hear the shots.

646
00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 1: She says she sees Deputy Hardy falling to the ground

647
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:19,440
Speaker 1: right after he shot.

648
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 2: I heard the first shot, and then I looked over.

649
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 7: He had already fail.

650
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:26,880
Speaker 2: You were falling.

651
00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:28,399
Speaker 9: He was falling when you saw him.

652
00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:29,880
Speaker 5: Who was standing in front of him?

653
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 4: When you saw him falling?

654
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:32,959
Speaker 2: A little?

655
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 7: Carlo?

656
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 4: Did you see a gun.

657
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:37,319
Speaker 5: The bad time?

658
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 10: You did?

659
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 2: Did you hear another shot? I heard? I heard three shots?

660
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 2: You heard three shots? Okay?

661
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:51,000
Speaker 8: Then what happened?

662
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:52,960
Speaker 3: And then.

663
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:56,320
Speaker 7: A thigh running?

664
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 2: Who started running all over him?

665
00:40:58,360 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 8: Okay?

666
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 1: Sergeants Alter then prompts her to talk about what she

667
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,839
Speaker 1: sees when to Forest gets back into Ardregas's money.

668
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,319
Speaker 5: Carlo, did he have anything on his hand?

669
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:10,000
Speaker 3: You told me?

670
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 9: Did you think he was hurt?

671
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's some Did you see how he got.

672
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:17,080
Speaker 9: The blood on his hands?

673
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:17,320
Speaker 7: No?

674
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 2: I just seen the blow. I don't put it on me.

675
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:26,320
Speaker 1: Yolanda Chambers statement to police has gone from hearing Ardregas

676
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:30,200
Speaker 1: say his buddy smoked a cop to actually being at

677
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: the Crown Sterling suits wind shots were fired and seeing

678
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 1: blood dripping off to Forest's hands.

679
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 4: Did I believe everything Lena told me?

680
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 12: No, Helma.

681
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:47,080
Speaker 4: Hella.

682
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 3: But Yolanda told a lot of truth. Why she was

683
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 3: trying to hide it by telling lies?

684
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,320
Speaker 1: Why do you think she told a lot of truth?

685
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: Like what convinced you that some of what she was

686
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,319
Speaker 1: telling you was truth and some wasn't?

687
00:42:03,239 --> 00:42:03,440
Speaker 2: You know?

688
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:12,000
Speaker 3: Police officers through their knowledge, investigative skills, history, you know,

689
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 3: they know how to.

690
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:16,360
Speaker 4: Put things together.

691
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 3: So I started talking to you, but I already know

692
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:24,280
Speaker 3: in my mind before you ever started talking, what happened,

693
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:26,000
Speaker 3: how it happened.

694
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 1: After two days of on the record interviews with police,

695
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:04,279
Speaker 1: Yolanda now says that she to Forrest and Ardregis, her

696
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:09,439
Speaker 1: friend Latanya, along with Omar Berry and Quintess Wilson were

697
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:12,800
Speaker 1: all there at the Crown Sterling Suites when Deputy Hardy

698
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:16,440
Speaker 1: was killed, but all five people she places at the

699
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: hotel deny being there. The officer who interviews Latanya, Henderson,

700
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 1: confronts her with Yolanda's latest story.

701
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:27,560
Speaker 2: So what she's saying, she was.

702
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 5: There and I was there.

703
00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 2: That's a life. Okay, that's a that's a shame. Okay,

704
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:38,239
Speaker 2: So Yolanda's line, she surely is okay. So y'all never

705
00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:40,439
Speaker 2: went to Crown Sterling, y'all when I went to Super eight,

706
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 2: that's it.

707
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 10: I know Crown lives, Okay, if crownsturren myself eight, no,

708
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 10: well then I didn't go, and I'm telling truth.

709
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: Police also confront to Forrest with Yolanda's story.

710
00:43:58,719 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 12: Everything that I.

711
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:02,920
Speaker 4: Do, I explained it to you exactly what I am.

712
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:09,200
Speaker 5: Everything you said, the trip to the Crown, we take

713
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:09,879
Speaker 5: a trip down.

714
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:14,399
Speaker 4: Yes, you took a trip to the Crown, so he did, Yes,

715
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 4: you did.

716
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:19,760
Speaker 12: I hope so. And then you look to the ground.

717
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:20,719
Speaker 4: I hope you into the.

718
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:26,360
Speaker 11: Crown O Crownstriven sweet, No, sir, I ain't been to

719
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:28,240
Speaker 11: the groundstairs and I've been over.

720
00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 12: That none as he does, or.

721
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 1: They interrogate him for over two and a half hours,

722
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 1: No matter what to Forrest says or how many times

723
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:44,560
Speaker 1: he states plainly that he was not there and does

724
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 1: not know anything about the murder. Investigators don't believe him.

725
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:51,920
Speaker 12: Have I given me some of the information that you

726
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,840
Speaker 12: just have a hard time giving me. I'll say, I

727
00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 12: give you everything that I know about to I don't

728
00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:01,960
Speaker 12: know anything.

729
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 4: Ye I can't make myself cheating it.

730
00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:06,759
Speaker 12: And I don't know. I told you all that I

731
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 12: can tague.

732
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 5: That's all I know.

733
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:11,160
Speaker 9: I see that.

734
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:13,560
Speaker 12: All I'm gonna do is I'm just getting fucked. Is

735
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:16,319
Speaker 12: I'm getting I'm gonna get fucked. I don't know who

736
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:19,839
Speaker 12: get that, nad I ain't get that, man. I give

737
00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 12: you all that I know, Zoon, I can't give you nothing.

738
00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:24,320
Speaker 12: I don't think you give us all that you know.

739
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:26,960
Speaker 4: I'm trying to give you all the information that I know.

740
00:45:29,960 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 6: All us I'm giving you.

741
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:33,919
Speaker 12: I don't do anything. I'm just a way.

742
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:39,680
Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying, But you do You're gonna

743
00:45:39,680 --> 00:45:41,360
Speaker 2: make me said I did.

744
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 12: I did not do it. I I was not deaf.

745
00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:50,800
Speaker 1: From this point on, detectives rely on Yolanda to build

746
00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:54,320
Speaker 1: their narrative about the murder. They'll go on to interview

747
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:58,800
Speaker 1: her over and over again, at least twenty five times,

748
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:02,760
Speaker 1: and every time they talk to her, her story will change.

749
00:46:05,880 --> 00:46:09,480
Speaker 1: So why did police continue to lean on this fifteen

750
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:12,360
Speaker 1: year old girl, even though they caught her in so

751
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 1: many lives and who is Yolanda Chambers? That's next time.

752
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:29,959
Speaker 1: Ear Witness is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts

753
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 1: in association with Signal Company Number One. Executive producers are

754
00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:40,279
Speaker 1: Jason Flam, Jeff Kempler, Kevin Wardis, and me Beth Shelburne.

755
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,840
Speaker 1: The investigative reporting for this series was done by Me

756
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:49,759
Speaker 1: and MARAA. McNamara. Producers are Mara McNamara, Hannah Bial and

757
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 1: Jackie Polly Karakornhaber is our senior producer. Britt Spangler is

758
00:46:56,000 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: our sound designer. Additional story editing from Marie Sutton, fact

759
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: check help from Catherine Newhan, and special thanks to to

760
00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 1: Forrest Johnson's legal defense team. You can follow the show

761
00:47:10,800 --> 00:47:15,399
Speaker 1: on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, and Twitter at Lava for Good.

762
00:47:16,120 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 1: To see behind the scenes content from our investigation, visit

763
00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: Lava Forgood dot com slash ear Witness