1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: Whole Zone Media. 2 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 2: This episode gets a content warning. This episode it deals 3 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:10,959 Speaker 2: with some themes that might be not what you're trying 4 00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:13,240 Speaker 2: to listen to and in which case catch us next week. 5 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:17,760 Speaker 2: I believe that the author handles these themes respectfully. However, 6 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 2: this episode does describe sexual assault and self harm. Book 7 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 2: Club Club Club is back. Book Club is back. Everyone, 8 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:40,600 Speaker 2: thanks for allowing me and unannounced three weeks I didn't 9 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 2: do book club or two weeks, I don't remember how 10 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 2: long it was, but book Club is back. I'm your USB, 11 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:49,279 Speaker 2: Margaret Kilroy, and with me is Sharen Hi. 12 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:53,720 Speaker 3: Seren Hi. You you're purposely going out of sync for 13 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 3: that chant in the beginning. You you set us up 14 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:56,720 Speaker 3: for failure. 15 00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 2: I did. I did set us up for folks, We're 16 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 2: really I set you up for failure. Oh yes, yeah, 17 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 2: you knew what you were doing. Yeah yeah, yeah. The 18 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 2: book club is your science fiction and fantasy and probably 19 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 2: non those things, your fiction thing that happens once a 20 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,679 Speaker 2: week in your ears on two different podcast feeds, on 21 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 2: Sharen's podcast feed and on my podcast feed. It could 22 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 2: happen here and cool people who do cool stuff. It's 23 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:27,760 Speaker 2: a story. I'm going to read it to Sharen and 24 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 2: you can you can listen to listener. Y's the advantage 25 00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 2: of podcasting as a format. This week, I have a 26 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:39,000 Speaker 2: story I'm really excited about. This is a story that 27 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 2: has been on my mind since it was written probably 28 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 2: about five years ago or so. 29 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 3: It's quite a compliment. 30 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's it's a it's a neat. It's an 31 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:51,559 Speaker 2: interesting idea and I'm excited to talk to you about 32 00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:56,320 Speaker 2: it at the end. It is a story that reimagines 33 00:01:56,400 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 2: prison and an anarchist society. Beautiful okay, And it was 34 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 2: written for us, well, it wasn't written for us, but 35 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 2: it was written by Lori Penny. Lori Penny is a journalist, 36 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 2: author and screenwriter. They can be found on Twitter at 37 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 2: Penny Read, Instagram at Lori Penny, and substack at Lori Penny. 38 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 2: This story is called The House of Surrender and it 39 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 2: was first published by a German magazine. Actually in German 40 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 2: was published in translation before I was published in English 41 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 2: by dear Freytag, which I don't know anything about. I 42 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:31,959 Speaker 2: don't even know what that means. 43 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 3: Sounds badass though, just by nature, sounding like having the 44 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 3: word die. 45 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:42,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it's dr it's yeah. I don't even know 46 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 2: the difference between die and der I. And if you 47 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 2: do know the difference, don't write me up. 48 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 3: Tell us. 49 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:50,600 Speaker 2: I could look it up if I wanted to know. 50 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 2: But the story is really good. The House of Surrender 51 00:02:56,639 --> 00:03:00,880 Speaker 2: by Lori Penny. Not far from here and many lifetimes 52 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 2: journey away, there is a place called Sanctuary, where they 53 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 2: grow almonds and avocados, and the weather is a perpetual 54 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 2: late spring. The town and its hundred thousand happy folk 55 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 2: are watered by a wide, gray, treacherous river. And in 56 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 2: that river is an island where no trees grow. And 57 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 2: on that island is a house unlike any other. It 58 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:24,279 Speaker 2: has many names, but the people of Sanctuary have forgotten them. 59 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 2: They call it the House of Surrender. To get to 60 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:31,119 Speaker 2: the House of Surrender, you must cross the gray River, 61 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,760 Speaker 2: although there are few boat captains brave enough to make 62 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 2: the crossing, not for all the gold and silver in 63 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 2: your purse. The river is full of hidden currents and 64 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 2: sudden whirlpools that appear to suck down on seasoned swimmers 65 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 2: and sailors to an icy grave in the grimy water. 66 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 2: And besides, nobody has to used money in Sanctuary for 67 00:03:49,720 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 2: a century and more the people of this town take 68 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:55,960 Speaker 2: what they need and give what they can, and answer 69 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 2: to no ruler but the common good. So there is 70 00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:00,640 Speaker 2: no law to compel any sailor to take you to 71 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:03,839 Speaker 2: the island in the river where no trees grow. If 72 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 2: one of them takes pity, you may pay your passage 73 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 2: with a promise, a gift, or a secret, although those 74 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 2: who travel to the House of Surrender have too many 75 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 2: of those, and precious few worth sharing. Pull yourself up 76 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 2: to the jetty and climb the steps into the cliffs. 77 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:22,040 Speaker 2: Walk half a mile over the rocks, and you'll find 78 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 2: the house. Its walls are thick stone. Whether that's to 79 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:29,160 Speaker 2: protect those inside from the outside world or whether it 80 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 2: might be the other way round is a question nobody 81 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:35,479 Speaker 2: here cares to answer. The heavy doors are not locked. 82 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 2: Walk the halls. Nobody's going to stop you. Here you 83 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 2: will find the worst and the weirdest of men and women, 84 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 2: strange and dangerous creatures who cannot live among their fellow humans, 85 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 2: or else their fellow humans will not have them. This 86 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 2: one is a rapist. That one poisoned her husband and 87 00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:57,720 Speaker 2: infants in a fit of madness after the twins were born. 88 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 2: This one beat his wife until the heith flew from 89 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 2: her head. That one cheated as neighbors of all their harvest, 90 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 2: until the children sickened and starved. Had they stayed in 91 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 2: the sanctuary, these people would have had to face their 92 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 2: neighbor's justice. Instead, they come to the house of surrender, 93 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 2: where nobody will harm them, and they can reflect on 94 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 2: their transgressions and all the safety stone walls can offer, 95 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 2: which is less than you'd think, as most of them 96 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:28,520 Speaker 2: bring the terror with them across the Gray River. In 97 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 2: my two score years as warden of this place, I 98 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 2: have known them all, the wicked and the warped, the 99 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 2: tortured and the repentitant, and those too far beyond the 100 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:42,040 Speaker 2: sphere of decency to contemplate redemption. But none were as 101 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 2: strange as Robert Schmidt. And you know what else is strange, Charen. 102 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 3: It's strange that we have to beg for money. 103 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:55,960 Speaker 2: That's what's strange. It is. Yeah, but don't worry. We're 104 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 2: not begging for your money unless you want to subscribe 105 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:04,599 Speaker 2: to Cooler Zone Media. That flstead is brilliant. We're begging 106 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 2: for the money for the following advertisers, which you can 107 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:10,359 Speaker 2: press forward a bunch of times to get to the 108 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:28,840 Speaker 2: rest of the story, and we're back. He arrived one 109 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:31,720 Speaker 2: cold June morning, courtesy of a boatswain who had been 110 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 2: too shocked at his appearance and obvious distress to consider 111 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 2: turning him down when he begged passage. The coins he 112 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 2: offered her, which he also tried to press upon me, 113 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 2: were as strange as he was, different shapes and shades 114 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,320 Speaker 2: of corrosive metal, all emblazoned with the faces of stern men, 115 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 2: great buildings and motifs of war and conquest that were 116 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 2: chilling to look at, though I did not look away. 117 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:56,560 Speaker 2: I took one as a gift, a silver that he 118 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,160 Speaker 2: said was called a quarter. Although its shape was perfectly round. 119 00:07:01,640 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 2: He was a thin, frayed string of a man, this Schmidt. 120 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,679 Speaker 2: His skin pale as boiled fish, so much that anyone 121 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 2: who saw him knew that he had come from far away. 122 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 2: That was all we knew at first, as he would 123 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 2: not speak to us beyond demanding to be released, and 124 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,800 Speaker 2: no records could be found of his birth or previous life, 125 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 2: only of the report we had received from the assembly 126 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 2: of the village that sent him here. We took him 127 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 2: to Room fourteen, where he yelled for three hours. First 128 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 2: he yelled to be released, Then he yelled in his 129 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 2: strange foreign accent for his mother. Then he just yelled. 130 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 2: I could hear the screaming from down the corridor as 131 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:43,000 Speaker 2: I went over the morning's reports. I gritted my teeth 132 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:45,720 Speaker 2: at the dumb beast noise and decided to do something 133 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 2: about it. The corridors of the main asylum were light 134 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 2: and airy, even on a cold winter morning, with the 135 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 2: sun floundering in an ash gray sky below the wide 136 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 2: wooden walkways. Some of the other wardens were setting out 137 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 2: bowls and spoons in the muno area, ready for breakfast. 138 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 2: The murderer in Room thirteen put his head up to 139 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 2: the grill of his cell as I passed, Can you 140 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:13,240 Speaker 2: ask him to stop? He whispered. I'll try, I promised. 141 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 2: Do you want music? The murderer, who had strangled his 142 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 2: own brother in a rage twenty years ago, nodded hard, Yes, 143 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: he did want music. I fingered my tablet. A few 144 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 2: seconds later, a gentle rhythmic tune started spooling from the 145 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 2: speaker in the corner of his cell. He smiled and 146 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 2: closed his eyes and started to rock gently back and 147 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 2: forth on his sleeping pallet. I took a deep breath 148 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 2: in front of the door to Room fourteen. Then I 149 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 2: pounded on the grill. That's enough, I yelled. You're upsetting 150 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:48,079 Speaker 2: your block mates. If you don't control yourself, there will 151 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 2: be consequences. The screaming stopped, two blissful seconds of quiet, 152 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 2: heavy breathing. Let me the fuck out of here, Schmidt said, 153 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:01,679 Speaker 2: You people have no idea the mistake you're made. I'm 154 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:04,199 Speaker 2: sure there's been no mistake, I said, but if you've 155 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 2: got an issue to raise, why don't you talk to 156 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 2: me or one of the other wardens about it instead 157 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 2: of screaming. I heard a shuffling noise as Schmidt dragged 158 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 2: himself up to the speaking hatch. Then his face appeared. 159 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 2: I stepped back, alarm fisting through my guts. I had 160 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 2: forgotten quite how strange looking this Schmidt truly was, with 161 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:26,199 Speaker 2: his wild beard and ice blue eyes. I don't know 162 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:28,440 Speaker 2: why I'm being kept here, he said, in his languid, 163 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 2: long ago accent. But when someone works out who I am, 164 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 2: you're going to be in a world of trouble. So 165 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 2: I suggest you open this door right now. If you 166 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 2: value your job, I can't open the door I said, 167 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,960 Speaker 2: on whose authority am I kept here? It was truly confused. 168 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 2: Where did this man come from to ask such a thing? 169 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,520 Speaker 2: And nobody's authority? I said, nobody has the authority to 170 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 2: keep you here against your will. You chose to come 171 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 2: here for your own safety and others. Then why am 172 00:09:56,880 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 2: I locked in? You aren't locked in. I can't open 173 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 2: the door because it locks from the inside. If you 174 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:05,960 Speaker 2: want to get out, you have to unlock it yourself. 175 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 2: You're lying. There's a bolt underneath the door and another 176 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 2: one up top. They're a little stiff sometimes, but I 177 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 2: promise you you're free to leave. I must warn you, though, 178 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:18,960 Speaker 2: I said a little louder, that if you try to 179 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 2: harm me or anyone else in this building, I'm going 180 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 2: to have to use my shock stick on you, and 181 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:27,400 Speaker 2: I don't want to do that. Silence. Then the slow, 182 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:32,319 Speaker 2: resentful funk of two bolts drawing back. Can I come in? 183 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 2: I said, Silence. My name is Gorman Rain, I said, 184 00:10:38,640 --> 00:10:40,079 Speaker 2: I'd like to come in and talk with you, but 185 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 2: I need to know you're not going to attack me, 186 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 2: because I don't want to have to hurt you. It 187 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 2: has been a pleasant morning so far, and I don't 188 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 2: want to end it with your vital fluids on my shoes. 189 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 2: Come in if you want. I came in and sucked 190 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,959 Speaker 2: in a breath through my teeth. The man in the 191 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,760 Speaker 2: room fourteen had overturned all his furniture and thrown his 192 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,680 Speaker 2: food tray across the room. There were dabs of blood 193 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 2: on the wall where he'd been pounding. He sat, curled 194 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 2: like a question mark in one bare corner. Is there 195 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 2: any way I can help? I asked. I need you 196 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 2: to tell them. He said that I haven't done anything wrong. 197 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 2: If there's been a misunderstanding, I'm sure you can explain yourself, 198 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:23,319 Speaker 2: I said, but there's rarely misunderstanding in cases like yours. 199 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:27,280 Speaker 2: What reason, after all, would the girl have had to lie? 200 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 2: I could see that Schmidt was going to be difficult 201 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 2: to reach. Do you even know who I am? Only 202 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaker 2: what you told us and what you told the people 203 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 2: of the village you came from. Your name is Robert Schmidt. 204 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 2: You say you are a scientist, but there are no 205 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 2: records of where you practiced or where you were born. 206 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 2: I'm from here, Schmidt said, I'm from here three hundred 207 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 2: and thirty years ago. I took a deep breath so 208 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:52,239 Speaker 2: how did you come to be here now, I asked 209 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:56,640 Speaker 2: in a time machine. I am a scientist, well, a researcher. 210 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,440 Speaker 2: It's one of the first multi century journeys. My lab 211 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:01,120 Speaker 2: is made, and I need to be allowed back to 212 00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:05,360 Speaker 2: the place I came through why, so I can tell 213 00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 2: them it worked. I asked a junior warden to keep 214 00:12:10,880 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 2: a subtle eye on Schmidt for the next few days, 215 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 2: to check that he wasn't hurting himself. Inside, I was 216 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 2: cursing my own foolishness. I clearly made a mistake in 217 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 2: my initial diagnosis. I had assumed that Schmidt was merely 218 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:26,040 Speaker 2: uneducated and lacking an empathy. He appeared instead to be 219 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:29,480 Speaker 2: quite mad. I wanted to help him, this young man. 220 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:31,560 Speaker 2: I wanted to know the ghosts that haunted him, so 221 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 2: that together we might banish them and find him some 222 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 2: measure of peace. I am old, and in forty years 223 00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 2: I attended to so many lost creatures on this substemious rock, 224 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 2: and most I have been able to stretch out a 225 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 2: hand to. Though not all come here hoping for peace. 226 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 2: MY place is not to judge them, but to help them, 227 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 2: to protect them whatever harm they have done in the 228 00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 2: lives they left behind. This is my work, has been 229 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:55,839 Speaker 2: the work of my life, since I came here on 230 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 2: my own rickety midnight boat so long ago, to reach 231 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,200 Speaker 2: the unreached with soft words and offer them a bridge 232 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:05,520 Speaker 2: back to the world. I felt certain that, however, Schmidt 233 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 2: had transgressed, however mangled his mind by suffering. I could 234 00:13:08,640 --> 00:13:12,720 Speaker 2: not guess at I could help him. Perhaps I was arrogant, 235 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 2: I see that now, But there was more. What I 236 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 2: did not could not admit to myself was that Schmidt 237 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,280 Speaker 2: frightened me. And the most frightening prospect was the idea 238 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:25,200 Speaker 2: remote but impossible not to consider when you looked at 239 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:28,640 Speaker 2: that strange white face, heard that odd high voice, that 240 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:33,800 Speaker 2: he might be telling the truth. The next day I 241 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 2: returned to speak to Schmidt. I brought fresh rolls and coffee, 242 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 2: and we took breakfast together. He had restored order to 243 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,720 Speaker 2: his room during the night, and perhaps it was in 244 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 2: repentance for his previous rudeness that he answered almost immediately 245 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:48,080 Speaker 2: when I asked if he was feeling better, I'm not crazy, 246 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 2: he said. You must see that it's not my place 247 00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 2: to pass judgment on how you see the world. I said, 248 00:13:54,559 --> 00:13:57,600 Speaker 2: which was quite true. I'm merely anxious that you caused 249 00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 2: no further harm to yourself, for or any other citizen. 250 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 2: I'm not like the lunatics in here, he said. I 251 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 2: didn't even hurt that girl. It was a misunderstanding. They 252 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 2: say you violated her autonomy. I said, they sent a report. 253 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 2: It wasn't like that, he said. He was looking away 254 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 2: from me and eviscerating his role with his hands. Besides, 255 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:20,800 Speaker 2: it seems so primitive here, I assumed. I don't know 256 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 2: what I assumed. He started in on a second roll. 257 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:26,520 Speaker 2: I suppose I was excited to be in a new place. 258 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 2: That night, I reread the report that had arrived as 259 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:34,400 Speaker 2: Schmidt on the solar tablet I reserved for official communications. 260 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 2: It was long enough that the village assembly had clearly 261 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,000 Speaker 2: thought it important to inform the house of the full facts. 262 00:14:41,320 --> 00:14:43,040 Speaker 2: He came to us in the last week of May. 263 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:46,280 Speaker 2: It ran. He appeared at the door of a farmstead, 264 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 2: badly bleeding and disoriented. The people of the house, after 265 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 2: they tended his wounds, brought him to the town square, 266 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 2: where he explained that he was a traveler from another time. 267 00:14:55,360 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 2: We have heard news of such things happening, but we 268 00:14:57,680 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 2: would not have given them credit if it were not 269 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 2: for the strangeness of his behavior. Schmidt was from the 270 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:05,760 Speaker 2: start rude and unsocial, which was put down at first 271 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 2: to his evident foreignness. He insisted on being brought to 272 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 2: the head of our community, and it took some time 273 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 2: to explain to him that no such position exists. He 274 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 2: thinks in an extremely hierarchical manner, and though he claims 275 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:18,680 Speaker 2: to be a scientist, he cannot seem to credit the 276 00:15:18,680 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 2: evidence of his own senses. For this reason, many of 277 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 2: our young people remained convinced that he was playing a 278 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 2: practical joke on us. Schmidt spent a great deal of 279 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 2: time in the tavern, and also in the library as 280 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 2: his strength returned, taking notes on parchment, which he used 281 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 2: freely from the central stocks, apparently unaware of its great expense. 282 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 2: He was from the start dismissive and unsocial towards the 283 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:44,240 Speaker 2: female and non binary among us, seemingly unable to hold 284 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 2: true conversation with them. One of our young men offered 285 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:49,960 Speaker 2: to have intercourse with him, at which point he became 286 00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 2: angry and violent. The young man was injured and Schmidt 287 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 2: had to be restrained. One young woman in our research 288 00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 2: team took an interest in Schmid's work, gifting him freely 289 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 2: with her time and attention to help further his studies. 290 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 2: She reported to us that he woke to find a 291 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 2: drunken Schmidt attempting to have intercourse with her. She communicated 292 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:10,280 Speaker 2: clearly that she did not want to be part of 293 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:13,240 Speaker 2: intercourse with him, but he did not appear to understand. 294 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,280 Speaker 2: In his culture, signal of interest by a woman permits 295 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 2: the man to use her body to relieve himself of 296 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 2: his need at any time thereafter, and this is what 297 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 2: Schmidt proceeded to do, using his strength to force her submission. Thereafter, 298 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:31,920 Speaker 2: I clicked the tablet shut. I had read enough. Schmidt 299 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 2: had clearly fooled this rural assembly into accepting his wild 300 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:38,480 Speaker 2: story of time travel to avoid taking responsibility for his 301 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 2: own empathetic defects. He would not fool me. I would 302 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 2: reach him, even if I was determined not to be reached. 303 00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 2: After reading that, I don't really want to make a 304 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 2: snarky ad pivot, so I'll make a regular ad pivot 305 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:13,679 Speaker 2: and we're back. It was autumn and high harvest, the 306 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 2: time when everyone with the strength and skill to farm 307 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:20,160 Speaker 2: lends themselves to the almond groves. A fresh breeze trembled 308 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 2: from the plantations, and I longed to be among them, 309 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:25,679 Speaker 2: to drink hot cider and taste roasted almonds at the 310 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 2: evening celebrations after the gathering inn. But I have not 311 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 2: joined the harvest. Since I came here to work at 312 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 2: the House of Surrender. No one could compel me to 313 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:36,520 Speaker 2: stay away, just as no one could force people of 314 00:17:36,560 --> 00:17:38,840 Speaker 2: the town to bring in the fruit before it rots 315 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,920 Speaker 2: on the trees. There is an awkwardness, though, among those 316 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 2: who know my duties. Sanctuary is not a large community, 317 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 2: and after a while, everyone's business is the subject of 318 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:54,400 Speaker 2: common gossip. Instead, I walked about the grounds of Schmidt, 319 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 2: sometimes talking, more often in silence. We had come to 320 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 2: an agreement for the time being. He would stop demanding 321 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:04,400 Speaker 2: to be released and complaining that he did not belong here, 322 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 2: and in return I would behave as if I believed 323 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 2: his time travel story. In truth, I was not sure 324 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 2: whether he believed it himself. Still, I allowed him to 325 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 2: question me, as if you were truly from a long 326 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 2: ago world with laws and customs ailing to our own, 327 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:21,320 Speaker 2: Why do you do this? He asked me once, Why 328 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:22,800 Speaker 2: do you work here if you don't have to work 329 00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 2: at all. Most people work if they can, I said. 330 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,000 Speaker 2: We do the work we feel we're best suited to. 331 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 2: There can't be a lot of applications for this place, 332 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,040 Speaker 2: said Schmidt, Not too many, I admitted. It takes a 333 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:37,639 Speaker 2: certain mindset. Most people worry about being around antisocial, violent 334 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 2: individuals all day, don't you. I closed my eyes looked 335 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:45,400 Speaker 2: down at my broad, blunt hands, so much like my father's, 336 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:47,600 Speaker 2: though I have kept myself from using them to hurt 337 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:52,200 Speaker 2: another human being, of course, I said, But even more, 338 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:54,560 Speaker 2: I believe that those who can't live with others need 339 00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 2: a place to go. Rehabilitation if it's possible, asylum if 340 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 2: it isn't. What about justice? What about it for the 341 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:07,520 Speaker 2: real monsters here? Not like me? The murderers. They're victims, 342 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:11,320 Speaker 2: and their families won't They want to see them punished, perhaps, 343 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 2: but would that bring their loved ones back? That's not 344 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:18,240 Speaker 2: the point, then, What is the point? Sometimes the families 345 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 2: will demand men. Sometimes, when the inmates return to their communities, 346 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 2: they work the lands of those they have wronged, or 347 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 2: find some other way to prove themselves reformed. And if 348 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 2: they don't, then they lead very lonely lives, or they 349 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:35,200 Speaker 2: come back here and you think that's acceptable. Most people 350 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 2: think being shut out of the community is punishment enough. Otherwise, 351 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 2: we're no better than me, I held as eyes. Then 352 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:47,840 Speaker 2: the world you're from, yes, Schmidt was certainly from another world, 353 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 2: if only in spirit. You think you're better than me, No, 354 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,400 Speaker 2: I said, I think you can be better than you are. 355 00:19:55,520 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 2: What if I don't want to be? Visitors, especially official ones, 356 00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 2: are an unusual event on the island. So when a 357 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,359 Speaker 2: science history councilor from Sanctuary itself arrived by a barge 358 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,280 Speaker 2: along with not one but two assistants, I knew that 359 00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 2: the matter was of the utmost importance. I'm here about Schmidt, 360 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:16,520 Speaker 2: said the councilor, whose name was Sophia. She wore well 361 00:20:16,560 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 2: cut overalls and could not have been more than thirty five, 362 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:21,359 Speaker 2: but she wore her hair in the half shaved style 363 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 2: traditionally adopted by those who have already rotated through their 364 00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:27,160 Speaker 2: senior levels of the science councils and have the authority 365 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 2: of learning. Thank you for coming all this way, I said, 366 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 2: pouring coffee for us both not at all. Robert Schmidt 367 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 2: is of great interest to the Science Council. I have 368 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 2: been hoping to make a personal visit. Is he settling 369 00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 2: in Well, we had some problems at first, I said. 370 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:45,600 Speaker 2: He claims that he is no foreigner, but is in 371 00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:49,640 Speaker 2: fact from here many centuries ago. He does not seem delusional, 372 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 2: merely troubled. It's perfectly true, said the councilor. It's been 373 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,119 Speaker 2: happening more and more, these people arriving from the first 374 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,880 Speaker 2: era of time jump technology, back when there were no guidelines. 375 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:04,640 Speaker 2: I felt a bubble of excitement expanding beneath my rib 376 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:06,879 Speaker 2: cage and buried my face and my coffee mug to 377 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 2: contain it. Schmidt is the first from his time to 378 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 2: appear on the West coast. However, said Sophia. We were 379 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 2: dismayed to learn that he has been obliged to surrender. 380 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:20,440 Speaker 2: Sophia continued, dismayed, but not surprised. The time from which 381 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 2: he comes, well, there was a great deal of savagery. 382 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:26,560 Speaker 2: It does not seem like a savage man, I said. 383 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:28,600 Speaker 2: After he learned he was free to leave, I found 384 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:33,400 Speaker 2: him courteous, if a little strange. Have you begun his therapy? Yes, 385 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 2: I said, He's very receptive, although still in deep denial 386 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:40,119 Speaker 2: of why I had to come here. That's to be expected, 387 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,040 Speaker 2: said Sophia. The moral codes of his culture were very 388 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 2: different from ours. She pursed her lips over the coffee cup. 389 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:48,879 Speaker 2: As a young man, I might have desired her greatly, 390 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 2: a woman of such wit and elegance. I reprimanded myself 391 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 2: for thinking such coarse thoughts about someone who was, however 392 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 2: briefly my superior a decade in society. She went on, 393 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,880 Speaker 2: her bright black eyes, holding my own a violent, authoritarian 394 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,560 Speaker 2: world of class, racial and sex hierarchies, a culture that 395 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 2: drove itself to destruction and pursuit of profit for the 396 00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:13,200 Speaker 2: very few. We can't just understand it through the lens 397 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 2: of our own society. I nodded. Now that I had 398 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:22,399 Speaker 2: been given permission to believe Schmidt, it all made sense that, 399 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 2: in fact, is the substance of our visit, said Sophia. 400 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:28,439 Speaker 2: Schmidt could help us a great deal in understanding the 401 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 2: culture and technology of his time. But for his safety, 402 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 2: we feel, the Council feels that would be better for 403 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 2: all concerned if Schmidt were to remain here in the 404 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:41,120 Speaker 2: House of Sprender on a permanent basis. Are you saying 405 00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 2: that Schmidt is in danger? I'm saying that Schmidt is dangerous, 406 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 2: and there are people who would, if it came to it, 407 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:49,399 Speaker 2: judge him too dangerous to live as part of this 408 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:53,399 Speaker 2: society because of what he did, because of what he is, 409 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 2: said Sophia, Through no fault of his own, he happens 410 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:59,520 Speaker 2: to come from the most frightening place imaginable. What place 411 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:05,360 Speaker 2: is that? The past? I was silent. You must insure, 412 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:07,480 Speaker 2: she said, that Schmidt does not come to any harm. 413 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 2: Break the news to him gently. Can he not be 414 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,879 Speaker 2: returned to his time? I asked. Impossible, said Sophia. We 415 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 2: cannot return a time traveler to a culture without any 416 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,800 Speaker 2: sense of the common good. His leader set the future 417 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,359 Speaker 2: on fire before the first leap engine was even in use. 418 00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 2: Who's to say he wouldn't do the same. He needs 419 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:26,760 Speaker 2: to be kept somewhere out of the way, or who 420 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:29,919 Speaker 2: knows what he'll do, or I thought what he might 421 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 2: do to himself. When I told Schmidt that he would 422 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:34,800 Speaker 2: not be allowed to return to his own time, he 423 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 2: said nothing. He did not rage or argue as I 424 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 2: would have expected. Instead, he locked his door and did 425 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 2: not emerge for three days. Eventually I had the guards 426 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,639 Speaker 2: break down the door. There was blood everywhere. He had 427 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,560 Speaker 2: tried to open his wrists with a broken spoon and failed. 428 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:51,879 Speaker 2: He cannot bring himself to end his life, not alone. 429 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 2: I understand now he kept saying. That was all he said, 430 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 2: poor soul. There could never be peace for him here. 431 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 2: I wrote to the Science History Council, but received no reply. 432 00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:08,920 Speaker 2: So I have made my decision. To night, I will 433 00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 2: go to Room fourteen and bring Schmidt his supper in person. 434 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 2: We will eat together and talk together. In the course 435 00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 2: of our conversation, I will mention casually the small cove 436 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:20,720 Speaker 2: hidden between the rocks on the north side of the 437 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 2: Bear Island, where I keep my own boat, the boat 438 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:26,360 Speaker 2: that took me here forty years ago, when I came 439 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 2: to this place to surrender, after I woke in the 440 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 2: night to find my hands, the thick, blunt hands I 441 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 2: had for my father, closing around my lover's neck. I 442 00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:38,480 Speaker 2: had planned to return one day when I could be 443 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 2: sure that I was old and frail enough to be 444 00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 2: of no more danger to any one I cherished. Now 445 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:47,360 Speaker 2: I know that I will never leave this place. Schmidt, though, 446 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,280 Speaker 2: will choose what he will choose. Perhaps he will go 447 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 2: down to the cove and take the boat out of 448 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,879 Speaker 2: the Gray River and cast out on its treacherous waters, 449 00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,440 Speaker 2: all alone towards the land, and perhaps the currents will 450 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,920 Speaker 2: not pull him down, and perhaps the people of Sanctuary 451 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,640 Speaker 2: will spare him. Or perhaps they will give him when 452 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 2: he could not give himself, not forgiveness, redemption. They will know, 453 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,240 Speaker 2: of course, and they will want to come for me, 454 00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,359 Speaker 2: But what can they do. I will take my bunch 455 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:18,679 Speaker 2: of keys and find a door to lock behind me. 456 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 2: There are always more rooms in the House of Surrender. 457 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:28,200 Speaker 2: That's the story. It's done now. 458 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 3: Well, I almost didn't want it to end. I feel 459 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:37,439 Speaker 3: like that's such a rich world to pun but no, 460 00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:41,399 Speaker 3: I mean, it's such a interesting world I would have 461 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 3: liked to have been in for a little longer. 462 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 2: I know. I hope Lori writes more in this world. 463 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 3: I mean, what incredible writing. I can't stop thinking about 464 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:57,160 Speaker 3: skin described as boiled fish, Like that is just so good? 465 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:01,880 Speaker 2: Right, Wow? 466 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,679 Speaker 3: No, I really I really like that. I I mean 467 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:08,439 Speaker 3: I love sci fi and I love like subtle sci fi, 468 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 3: if that makes sense. It's not like off the top, 469 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,679 Speaker 3: it's more just like, oh, this kind of sounds like 470 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 3: it can happen. Yeah, yeah, I really I really like that. 471 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:20,439 Speaker 3: A good twist at the end with the main character 472 00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 3: having like also gone him taken himself to the House 473 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 3: of surrender. 474 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:30,520 Speaker 2: I thought that was totally a good way to close. 475 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:34,919 Speaker 2: But yeah, I mean, like the story has been on 476 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,439 Speaker 2: my mind, like off and on for so long, just 477 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,879 Speaker 2: because the central concept this idea of like the prism 478 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 2: with the locks on the inside. Yeah, as like like 479 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,919 Speaker 2: I don't I'm not advocating this, but I'm not not 480 00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:53,399 Speaker 2: advocating this. It's just a really interesting concept of, like, well, 481 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 2: what do you do with people who people very justly 482 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 2: want to hurt if they choose to, they can choose 483 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 2: to be safe and away from those people who want 484 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,159 Speaker 2: to hurt them, you know, in this like sort of 485 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,760 Speaker 2: exile place. Yeah. 486 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I I'll be honest. When when that I 487 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 3: first heard the line of like the locks are in 488 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,439 Speaker 3: the inside, I had had a feeling he was going 489 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,399 Speaker 3: to be this like mental thing, like an existential like 490 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,720 Speaker 3: a like a you know what I mean, Like I 491 00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 3: thought it was going to be more like I wan 492 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,119 Speaker 3: don't know what the word is, like the metaphorical or something, 493 00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 3: but it's literal and I and I think you make 494 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 3: a good point because there is this huge question of 495 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 3: like rehabilitation versus like being ostracized, and like what hope 496 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,919 Speaker 3: do we have if like people are unable to be 497 00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,440 Speaker 3: rehabilitated back into society or if they're even Like it's 498 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,119 Speaker 3: just like there's so many questions when it comes to 499 00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 3: the proper way to execute whatever the hell justice is. 500 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 3: But no, I'm glad it was like an actual literal 501 00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:57,760 Speaker 3: way of it was like I thought that the prison 502 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 3: of your mind, it's actually just like it's an actual, no, 503 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:02,880 Speaker 3: totally prison with locks on the inside. 504 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:04,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is. 505 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 3: It's it's it's a fascinating concept because I think as 506 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 3: advanced as we think we are, we're extremely primitive in 507 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,040 Speaker 3: a lot of ways. Like when you think it's just 508 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:16,199 Speaker 3: like more shiny like we it's like we have like 509 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,040 Speaker 3: a fancier version of the guillotine, but it's still a guillotine, 510 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,520 Speaker 3: you know what I mean. It's just like a I 511 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 3: don't know, humans are really not as cover as I 512 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:25,560 Speaker 3: think they are. 513 00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 2: But and I really like that it's showing that like 514 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:31,400 Speaker 2: one of the things that has evolved in the future 515 00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 2: is specifically like social norms, right like hmm, Like you know, 516 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 2: the time travel part of the story is necessary, it's 517 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 2: like not a I mean, it's a time travel story, 518 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 2: but it's not. It's also not a time travel story. 519 00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 2: It's a way to say, like, something that is normal 520 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 2: in our society is sexual assault, and right, right, it 521 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 2: is completely normalized. And so here's someone who's doing something 522 00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 2: that like he's not from a time where that's what 523 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 2: he did was wrong. 524 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,160 Speaker 3: You know, he's probably done it a million times before. Yeah, 525 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 3: gone about his life. 526 00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:12,200 Speaker 2: And so like the ability to look at that from 527 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:15,719 Speaker 2: a you know, future perspective of being like, whoa, can 528 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:17,680 Speaker 2: you believe that this was normalized the way that like, 529 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 2: m you know, there's lots of things in the past 530 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 2: that were normalized that aren't good. 531 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, And back then it was very normal to have 532 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,959 Speaker 3: like a slave even like anything that's like now it's 533 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:32,760 Speaker 3: just like we would never It's like what at a 534 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 3: time people were not batting an eye. 535 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:38,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, but I did. 536 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 3: I did wonder about that gap the centuries in between 537 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,480 Speaker 3: Schmidt's time and with that his. 538 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,440 Speaker 2: Name, Schmidt, yeah, Schmidt. 539 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, I was wondering about the gap between like the 540 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,480 Speaker 3: centuries between his time and the time he jumped to, 541 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 3: like how society had to have changed and the processes 542 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,440 Speaker 3: had to have gone through or even the idea that 543 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 3: like time travel was like disbelieved by a lot of people, 544 00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:07,959 Speaker 3: so like maybe they stepped away from technology like all 545 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:09,719 Speaker 3: this stuff where it's just like what is the answer 546 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 3: for our actual progress and actual progression as like a species. 547 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's kind of like those like missing centuries 548 00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 2: in Star Trek, which they later go back and describe. 549 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,040 Speaker 2: But there's like the like Earth sucked and then we 550 00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:31,200 Speaker 2: figured out space communism exactly, you know. Yeah. And then 551 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:32,880 Speaker 2: one of the other things that I really like about 552 00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:35,280 Speaker 2: Lori's writing, I'll go out and there's a book that 553 00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,200 Speaker 2: Louri wrote. The novella is published by tour dot Com, 554 00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,800 Speaker 2: the same publisher who put out my novella that The 555 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 2: Beginning a Book Club opened with, and it's called Everything 556 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 2: Belongs to the Future, and it's another like anarchist sci 557 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 2: fi novella that But one of the things that Laurie 558 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:57,400 Speaker 2: does that like really impresses me but sometimes also like 559 00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 2: drives me crazy as a reader is that they like 560 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 2: protagonizing real problematic people. You know, like the protagonist of 561 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:14,040 Speaker 2: this story is a murderer, and the main character that 562 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:18,840 Speaker 2: they're talking about is a rapist, you know, and it's 563 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 2: like I'm too nervous of a writer to like touch 564 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,520 Speaker 2: that shit as like, I mean, I'll write about characters 565 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 2: who act like that, but it's like it's it's impressive 566 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 2: to write from those perspectives, and especially to do it 567 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 2: in ways that don't just do it in like shitty 568 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 2: edge lord ways where it's like ha ha haa, my 569 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:38,240 Speaker 2: hero is a bad guy, you know. 570 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:44,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, so yeah, that's a good point. It is a complex. 571 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,000 Speaker 3: Characters are always the most interesting, but that's like a 572 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 3: different level of like, oh, this person actually did a 573 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 3: terrible thing. Do you still root for them? Do you 574 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,400 Speaker 3: still think they're as interesting as they were ten pages ago? 575 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 3: I don't know, but I mean, for this story, it 576 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,960 Speaker 3: feels like it works only because it's talking about this 577 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 3: idea of rehabilitating yourself and like choosing to step away 578 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,680 Speaker 3: until you think you are ready to re enter anciety 579 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 3: and if maybe that never happens. So yeah, yeah, I 580 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 3: don't know. I mean, I feel like there are lines 581 00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 3: that are more egregious than others, at least in my mind. 582 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 3: Like for whatever reason, I like, I like, a murder 583 00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:32,040 Speaker 3: is more digestible than like like hurting a child or something, 584 00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:34,160 Speaker 3: you know what I mean. So I wonder the degrees 585 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 3: of like what someone can accept a character to be 586 00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 3: for something like this, or just like in general, when 587 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 3: you have a protagonist that's like really complicated. Yeahah, I 588 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:44,720 Speaker 3: don't know, so something to think about. 589 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, absolutely, Yeah, that's why I play it safe 590 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:52,160 Speaker 2: if not such, I mean, I don't always play it 591 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 2: safe with my writing. But I don't know. It's just 592 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 2: a piece that I mean, it's ballsy, it's really I mean, 593 00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:58,320 Speaker 2: I want to use a different word for that. 594 00:32:58,440 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 3: It's gutsy. 595 00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:02,600 Speaker 2: Yeah it is. 596 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 3: Yeah. No, I'm glad I was. I was the audience 597 00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:06,360 Speaker 3: for this one. 598 00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:06,600 Speaker 2: That was. 599 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:08,000 Speaker 3: I mean, I'm gonna think about it for a long 600 00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:11,520 Speaker 3: time now too. The prison of your mind. 601 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 2: Well okay, but then, like I mean, one of the 602 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,120 Speaker 2: things that strikes me, by the way, when you're pointing 603 00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:20,480 Speaker 2: that out, I'm under the impression I haven't done like 604 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 2: a whole research episode about this yet, because the Quakers 605 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:26,479 Speaker 2: are often like the heroes of the episodes that I do, 606 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,400 Speaker 2: because there's some of the only white people in slavery 607 00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 2: era United States that would like die to free people 608 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:37,120 Speaker 2: right from slavery. They're also who brought us the modern 609 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:43,400 Speaker 2: prison system because the concept of the penitentiary. Penitentiary is 610 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 2: a place to go be penitent, a place to go 611 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 2: like go be by yourself and learn what you did 612 00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:51,240 Speaker 2: is wrong. And so in a way, this is like 613 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,680 Speaker 2: recreating that. But it is a fundamental difference when you're 614 00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:58,240 Speaker 2: saying which side of the door of the lock is 615 00:33:58,280 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 2: on matters so much. 616 00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 3: It really does. It's like an adult time out that 617 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 3: you're in charge of your time out. Yeah, but like 618 00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:10,880 Speaker 3: it sounds like not everyone. I mean, he doesn't know 619 00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,000 Speaker 3: because he's not from that time. But like what if 620 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:14,719 Speaker 3: a lot of people don't know that they're capable of 621 00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:16,359 Speaker 3: unlocking it, you know what I mean? Like what if 622 00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 3: they're just like it's something they've forgotten or just like 623 00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 3: they've condemned themselves to just feel like, oh I can't 624 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 3: get out or I don't I don't know. I don't 625 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:30,799 Speaker 3: know if that makes sense. I just think it's like, uh, 626 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:35,960 Speaker 3: how much of it is like self condemnation versus just 627 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:40,000 Speaker 3: kind of accepting yourself from being like on the outskirts 628 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 3: of society. I don't know, I don't know, I don't 629 00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 3: know if that makes sense. I'm gonna be thinking about 630 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:45,400 Speaker 3: it for a long time. I will, I will, I 631 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:49,799 Speaker 3: will say that fair enough, But I think I think 632 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:53,920 Speaker 3: time travel is dangerous. Is a takeaway? Don't do it, folks, 633 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 3: Yeah we should, we should advance to that point. I 634 00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:58,719 Speaker 3: think we should step away when we come to a 635 00:34:58,760 --> 00:34:59,400 Speaker 3: time machine. 636 00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 2: Just yeah, you wouldn't go back? Would you go forward 637 00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:03,919 Speaker 2: or back in time? 638 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:10,440 Speaker 3: I would go forward. I'm so curious, not even just 639 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:12,400 Speaker 3: that I think it's gonna be worse if I'm being honest, 640 00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 3: but that's the pessimist of me. But I also I'm 641 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,080 Speaker 3: just so curious how it's gonna all turn out, and 642 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 3: like what happens if we make it to space, and 643 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:26,239 Speaker 3: like what if there's other like aliens or whatever it is. 644 00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,279 Speaker 3: I'm just so curious about the times that are gonna 645 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 3: happen when I'm not here. It must be I don't know, 646 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,960 Speaker 3: Like centuries ago, no one would have guessed where we 647 00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,040 Speaker 3: are now, Like they probably couldn't even dream up of 648 00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:43,600 Speaker 3: this world. So I'm sure it's something like that where 649 00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 3: you can't even dream it up. 650 00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 2: I don't know. That's actually that kind of blows my 651 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,440 Speaker 2: mind because I'm like, oh, I could be like this 652 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 2: could be like that and like, oh right, we're not 653 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,560 Speaker 2: capable of successfully imagining. You know, we're not gonna go 654 00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,319 Speaker 2: forward and it's not just going to be magically Star 655 00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:05,120 Speaker 2: Trek or Firefly or whatever. Yeah, but I don't know 656 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,760 Speaker 2: how to transition is to plugs anything, to plug. 657 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 3: Yes, let's talk about where you can find me in 658 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,200 Speaker 3: the future. Sorry, that was my attempt. 659 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:14,480 Speaker 2: I appreciate it. 660 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:18,239 Speaker 3: I'm sure. Reena shiro Hero on Instagram is shiro Hero 661 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,759 Speaker 3: six sixty six on Twitter. I'm also one of the 662 00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 3: hosts of It Could Happen Here, also on cool Zone 663 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:29,480 Speaker 3: and Yeah listen to Cool People who Do Cool Stuff, 664 00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:30,600 Speaker 3: which I also helped produce. 665 00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, also a nice one. So if you're listening to 666 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 2: this on one of the podcast feeds, go listen to 667 00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:39,040 Speaker 2: what's on the other podcast feed. Mine is history and 668 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:44,640 Speaker 2: Shreen's is current events and history because it's everything. And 669 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:48,320 Speaker 2: we'll be back next Sunday with another book club episode. 670 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,360 Speaker 2: I almost said cool person who does coople stuff, but 671 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:52,080 Speaker 2: that's not what's happening. I'm just gonna hang up now, 672 00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 2: buy done, bank up. 673 00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,879 Speaker 1: It Could Happen Here as a production of pool Zone Media. 674 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:02,440 Speaker 1: For a more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our 675 00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,120 Speaker 1: website coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the 676 00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:08,759 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts, 677 00:37:09,160 --> 00:37:11,280 Speaker 1: you can find sources for It could happen here, Updated 678 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:15,400 Speaker 1: monthly at coolzonmedia dot com slash sources. Thanks for listening.