WEBVTT - Part Two: Alfredo Stroessner: The Luckiest Dictator 0:00:01.920 --> 0:00:08.920 What's engaged in a conspiracy against all civilization my Catholic Church. 0:00:09.280 --> 0:00:13.480 This is Behind the Bastards, a podcast that focuses on 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:17.480 the evils of the false Pope in Rome. We are, 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:23.279 of course, devotees of the Antipope Novadianum, who carried out 0:00:23.680 --> 0:00:27.640 a righteous rebellion against the power of Pope Cornelius in 0:00:27.680 --> 0:00:30.800 the in the mid two hundreds. Um, you know, God 0:00:30.840 --> 0:00:34.680 rest his soul, James, what's the what's the chief thing 0:00:34.840 --> 0:00:39.280 you've learned from the Antipope? No, his input on on 0:00:39.440 --> 0:00:42.880 hair and skincare has been really important to me. Yeah, yeah, 0:00:42.920 --> 0:00:44.519 he had. He had a lot to say about that 0:00:44.920 --> 0:00:48.160 in the Latin language, which he was the first Roman 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:52.360 theologian to use. Um, I'm just learning about him now 0:00:52.400 --> 0:00:54.160 on Wikipedia. I don't know why I went with this 0:00:54.240 --> 0:00:57.640 as the introduction for the Abody Knows, Robert, nobody knows, 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:01.200 Nobody knows, nobody knows. But you know what this is 0:01:01.240 --> 0:01:05.520 now a podcast dedicated to the Antipope Novation, who lived 0:01:05.560 --> 0:01:10.440 from two hundred eighty to two hundred and fifty eight. Wow. Yeah, 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:12.440 well it's a big change from my last episode, which 0:01:12.520 --> 0:01:16.360 was of course dedicated to a dead groundhog. So that's right, 0:01:16.440 --> 0:01:19.720 that's right. They have a lot in common, the Antipope 0:01:19.720 --> 0:01:23.080 and that ground log hog that built Blasio. Did build 0:01:23.080 --> 0:01:29.720 a Blasio? Drop the anti incredible you gave us. Yeah, 0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:31.959 I'm gonna make one more request from the artists to 0:01:32.040 --> 0:01:35.559 our fans, which is a like a like a romance, 0:01:36.240 --> 0:01:39.320 a Roman style relief, like the ceiling of the U 0:01:40.120 --> 0:01:44.040 of the static. That's like, yeah, that's like antipope novation 0:01:44.240 --> 0:01:57.200 and that fucking groundhog holding hands in the sky. Find 0:01:57.200 --> 0:01:59.760 a building. It doesn't matter who owns it. Drawn that 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:02.640 as Amia, I know we will send you a titia. 0:02:03.040 --> 0:02:06.280 Let those two kings be the symbol of our next revolution. 0:02:07.800 --> 0:02:11.239 Hand in pull the Antipope writing into battle on the 0:02:13.400 --> 0:02:20.440 graund hook. Finally, Deblasio will get his comeuppance. So, speaking 0:02:20.440 --> 0:02:24.680 of Bill Deblasio, the first official Nazi party outside of Germany, 0:02:24.760 --> 0:02:28.240 was formed in Paraguay in nineteen twenty seven under a 0:02:28.320 --> 0:02:32.360 mango tree in the capital. While Forster, that anti Semitic 0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:35.000 philosopher we talked about last time, had been a miserable 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:37.880 failure in his goal of creating an Aryan sanctuary, his 0:02:38.000 --> 0:02:42.200 published writings traveled across the world and became kind of 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:46.520 a leading light for several generations of German anti Semites. 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:50.080 One of these anti Semites was a guy you might 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:54.079 have heard of named Adolf Hitler. He comes across Forrester's 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:57.200 readings as a young man, and he reveres them so 0:02:57.280 --> 0:03:00.400 much that when he comes to power, he sends a 0:03:00.400 --> 0:03:03.760 bunch of German soil over to Paraguay so that local 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:07.840 Nazis can cover Forster's grave. He also allegedly sends along 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.920 a tombstone plaque with the words the place where the 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:16.639 Father of Nazism lies inscribed upon it. Um. Now there's Yeah, 0:03:16.760 --> 0:03:19.399 we have any lists in Paraguay. That's a great thing 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:23.160 to tag. Yeah that that would be a nice thing 0:03:23.200 --> 0:03:28.120 to destroy. Yeah, yeah there is, Yeah, groundhog, that fucker 0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:31.120 do that. Give it the old build a Blasio treatment 0:03:31.120 --> 0:03:37.920 and drop it. M Now there's There is debate over 0:03:37.920 --> 0:03:40.360 whether or not Hitler is the person who sent this plaque, 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:43.960 but the plaque does exist. British historian Ben McIntyre is 0:03:44.000 --> 0:03:46.000 one of the people who considers it it likely that 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:48.560 Hitler would have said this. Obviously, that doesn't mean that 0:03:48.600 --> 0:03:51.760 he was like the only ideological father of Nazism Hitler. 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:53.840 Hitler could be a flatterer when he wanted to be. 0:03:53.880 --> 0:03:55.840 But it does there is like it is kind of 0:03:55.840 --> 0:03:59.080 beyond arguing that Hitler was a fan of this guy 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:02.680 and that Forster influenced his attitudes. Um. As a result 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:05.320 of all this, it is perhaps not surprising that Nazism 0:04:05.320 --> 0:04:08.560 held an a lure to some segments of the Paraguayan populace. 0:04:08.840 --> 0:04:13.040 The nation's first National Police Director named his son Adolpho, 0:04:13.360 --> 0:04:21.840 and demanded police cadets where swastikas on their uniforms. This 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:25.640 is this is a post nineteen five swastica right, No, no, no, 0:04:25.680 --> 0:04:30.080 these are pre forty five. Okay, still still probably a 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:34.240 poor decision. Yeah, Um did he then say it's just 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:43.880 a Buddhist symbol, bro or yeah, yeah, it means peace time. Yeah. Now. Paraguay, also, 0:04:44.000 --> 0:04:47.159 speaking of bad decisions, sided with the Nazis in World 0:04:47.160 --> 0:04:51.600 War Two initially, Um, so they kind of switched their 0:04:51.640 --> 0:04:56.359 allegiances midway through the war when it's like, you know what, look, 0:04:56.600 --> 0:04:59.000 Paraguay's got a history of being on the wrong side 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:01.080 of wars. We don't want to risked at this time. 0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:05.760 And obviously also like it doesn't really matter what side 0:05:05.760 --> 0:05:07.560 of World War two Paraguay was on. They are a 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:10.400 landlocked country in South America. They're not going to play 0:05:10.400 --> 0:05:15.760 a role in the fighting the government. Though the Paraguayan 0:05:15.760 --> 0:05:18.479 government does switch their allegiances right before the end. It 0:05:18.560 --> 0:05:21.840 is worth noting that the Paraguayan Nazi Party refuses to 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:25.400 give up the ghost until nineteen forty six, So Paraguay's 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:28.400 Nazi Party lasts longer than the original one. That's a 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:34.880 great at least later. Yeah, well well done. Then after 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:37.799 the war, this tiny landlocked nation seemed like an enticing 0:05:37.880 --> 0:05:40.720 new home to dozens of former ssmen and other fascist 0:05:40.720 --> 0:05:45.240 war criminals. Paraguay already had a modest German speaking population 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:48.960 based around Mennonite colonists, but it was also full of 0:05:49.080 --> 0:05:51.120 and this kind of made it less desirable. It was 0:05:51.160 --> 0:05:53.400 also a place where a lot of white Russian officers 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:56.120 had fled, some of whom had helped out in the 0:05:56.160 --> 0:05:59.839 Chaco War. These guys, some of them didn't like the 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:03.440 ass some of them were always were also very sympathetic 0:06:03.480 --> 0:06:06.920 to the Nazis because, like you know, Stalin and the 0:06:06.960 --> 0:06:10.200 white Russians not a not a not a great mix um. 0:06:10.480 --> 0:06:14.000 So on the whole this huh fucking white Russians end 0:06:14.080 --> 0:06:16.520 up everywhere. I've recently been on a kick about reading 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:19.600 about white Russians in the Spanish Civil War who end 0:06:19.640 --> 0:06:24.760 up yeah, all over the international brigades. Yeah, and a 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:27.440 lot of these guys are Czarists. A lot of these 0:06:27.480 --> 0:06:29.440 guys are fascists. A lot of these guys are the 0:06:29.520 --> 0:06:32.840 kinds of Czarists that are basically fascists. In any case, 0:06:33.160 --> 0:06:35.640 it's a nice place to be a Nazi. After World 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:39.320 War Two, Paraguay, so Nazis start filtering in there. A 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:42.280 lot of them settle with Mennonites. At least one Mennonite 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:45.720 community adopts a pro Nazi school curricula for its children 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:49.479 as a result of this. God, yeah, don't speak that 0:06:49.520 --> 0:06:52.760 shit into reality because understantists will be all over it. Yeah, 0:06:52.839 --> 0:06:57.280 fucking Mennonazis, Jesus, others simply took Nazis. Be fair if 0:06:57.320 --> 0:06:59.960 they if they'd all been Mennonites, and we probably would 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:02.559 have had quite so many issues with them. No, No, 0:07:02.880 --> 0:07:07.520 although speaking yeah, they they I mean they already mostly 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:12.960 did shit on horseback anyway. As as illustrated and probably 0:07:12.960 --> 0:07:16.080 the best scene of a Band of Brothers, God, that 0:07:16.160 --> 0:07:20.200 show did a lot, right, there's this great scene where 0:07:20.240 --> 0:07:22.920 like a bunch of American soldiers are like riding in 0:07:23.320 --> 0:07:25.760 after kind of the Nazi regime collapses, and they see 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:29.160 all these like German po doubles hauling shit on horses 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:30.920 while they're on the back of a jeep, and they're 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:33.560 like fucking horses. Like, you thought you could win this 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:36.160 war and you've got fucking horses. What's wrong with you people? 0:07:36.760 --> 0:07:41.400 It's very funny. So yeah, these Nazis start winding up 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:43.920 all over the fucking place, and they decide, like, you 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:46.600 know what Paraguay would be great for is a smuggling 0:07:46.640 --> 0:07:50.240 base for Odessa, the organization of former ss men who 0:07:50.320 --> 0:07:53.280 helped each other smuggle themselves into other countries in order 0:07:53.320 --> 0:07:56.880 to avoid prosecution for doing a holocaust. Now, some of 0:07:56.920 --> 0:08:00.560 my sources will argue that like Stressner, the kind of 0:08:00.600 --> 0:08:03.760 guy who wasn't really logically committed to much of anything 0:08:03.800 --> 0:08:07.200 other than being in power. But that's also essentially the 0:08:07.320 --> 0:08:11.120 ideology of a lot of surviving Nazi officials. So Stressner 0:08:11.160 --> 0:08:14.080 and the Nazis got along pretty well. And there are 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:17.960 some allegations, most notably from Alex Schumtov, that Stressner was 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:22.080 at least Nazi curious Schumatov basically claims that in his 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:25.320 early life Stressner had little contact with Germans in Paraguay, 0:08:25.320 --> 0:08:27.720 but that this changed in his thirties and he kind 0:08:27.720 --> 0:08:29.920 of became a Germanophile, you know, getting in touch with 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:32.880 his dad's people. I'm gonna quote from Vanity Fair again here. 0:08:33.880 --> 0:08:36.960 One of Stressner's German buddies was Hans Rudel, a flying 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:39.520 ace in the Luftwava who flew more missions than anyone, 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:43.360 destroyed a cruiser, a battleship five hundred nineteen Russian tanks, 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:46.319 was shot down twice, lost his right leg below the calf, 0:08:46.480 --> 0:08:49.440 but continued to excel at tennis and water skiing. Was 0:08:49.440 --> 0:08:52.200 the idol of the post war German right, the embodiment 0:08:52.240 --> 0:08:55.439 of Aryan perfection. Hitler created a special metal with him, 0:08:55.440 --> 0:08:58.000 the Knight's crossed with golden oak leaves. After the war, 0:08:58.040 --> 0:09:00.640 he tried out planes for the Argentinian government, and when 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:03.480 Perone fell in nineteen fifty five, was given asylum by 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:06.280 his friend Stressner. When Argentina was no longer safe for 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:09.160 x Nazis, Rudel went to Paraguay as well and worked 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:13.079 in the Ferretta Paraguaya and on Suncon selling BMW's telephone, 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:17.440 cement and iron. He also worked for Odessa, So he's like, 0:09:17.760 --> 0:09:22.240 he's like a BMWU dealer who's smuggling lavafa SS out 0:09:22.280 --> 0:09:26.080 of Europe and into Argentina. It's like the forest gump 0:09:26.080 --> 0:09:32.360 of Nazis here here, all the high points fucking Argentina. Mm. Yeah, 0:09:32.360 --> 0:09:35.720 he's all over the fucking place. In addition to selling 0:09:35.840 --> 0:09:38.440 used cars. Yeah, so I gotta have a side hustle. 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:42.760 Stressner and Rudel become fast friends and working with Rudel, 0:09:42.800 --> 0:09:46.320 Stressner sets up a system whereby new passports and visas 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:48.839 can be sold for an exorbitant price, of which he 0:09:48.920 --> 0:09:51.720 got to cut two old Nazis. And one of the 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:55.800 Nazis who takes advantage of this very forgiving Paraguayan government 0:09:55.840 --> 0:09:59.280 policy is another fella you might have heard of, doctor 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:06.280 Joseph Angola. So, oh good, it's good. That's yeah, so 0:10:06.360 --> 0:10:09.520 I was looking forward to that. It's Friday afternoon. Yeah, 0:10:09.559 --> 0:10:11.680 so if you if you're not up on your Mangola. 0:10:11.760 --> 0:10:13.840 The kind of cliffs notes of this guy is that 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:17.160 he's a doctor at Auschwitz superform's fatal experiments on fifteen 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:20.160 hundred sets of twin children. Um, he did shit like 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:24.319 inject colored eye into like the eyes of toddler's color 0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:26.640 die into the eyes of toddlers who were twins, to 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:29.240 like see if it affected the other twin. It was 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:32.439 like nonsense, it was, it was crazy nonsense. That's doctor 0:10:32.520 --> 0:10:35.920 Joseph Mangola. He's a terrible person. We will cover him 0:10:35.960 --> 0:10:38.120 at some point. He's one of those guys like Durrel Wanger, 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:41.160 who he's not like. Mangola himself is not the most 0:10:41.200 --> 0:10:43.520 fascinating individual. So a lot of it's just kind of 0:10:43.520 --> 0:10:47.439 a list of horrible war crimes. Um, but we'll get 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:49.080 him one of these days. I know, I know the 0:10:49.120 --> 0:10:53.040 subreddits crying out from Mangola, and eventually I Am going 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:55.560 to show them why they don't want what they think 0:10:55.600 --> 0:10:59.319 they want. No one's going to have a good time 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:03.160 with this episod so um it is. It is weird. 0:11:03.760 --> 0:11:06.680 The people are demanding Mangola. Got a lot of Mangola 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:09.160 stands in the audience who can't wait to get their 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:15.600 mangelicque out. Um got a Mangola pill. Nope, nope, no, 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:19.120 that was not a mistake. No, that was a mistake. Ah, 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:21.800 let's move it on, Let's move it on so Mangola. 0:11:22.160 --> 0:11:24.679 One report from a German Paraguay and who was in 0:11:24.760 --> 0:11:27.240 country at the time says that Mangola in nineteen fifty 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:29.840 nine made us say a living in Paraguay as a 0:11:29.880 --> 0:11:36.960 salesman for a manure spreading business. Post war Nazi careers 0:11:36.960 --> 0:11:40.920 are always like what weird? Why did they make them 0:11:41.000 --> 0:11:44.439 do shit? Like if you're just fucking like put them 0:11:44.440 --> 0:11:48.640 in a hotel or something like these comedy fucking jobs. Yeah, no, 0:11:48.720 --> 0:11:52.199 they're making money. The guy who claimed this told Alex Schumatov, 0:11:52.440 --> 0:11:55.199 I didn't know he was a doctor, and we talked 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:57.920 about business and never the war. I figured he didn't 0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:01.960 want to talk about it. Probably probably did, I see 0:12:02.040 --> 0:12:06.640 from Probably didn't want to talk about the war. Yeah. Whatever. 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:10.160 So some reports do allege that Stressner and Mangola were 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:13.200 close friends also and knew each other well. I have 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:15.719 not come across any convincing evidence of this, but he's 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:18.520 certainly it's almost certain that Mangola traveled through and spent 0:12:18.600 --> 0:12:22.720 time in Paraguay. He gets citizenship at one point in time. Um, 0:12:22.760 --> 0:12:25.080 so it's certainly possible that he and Stressner had a 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:30.000 degree of social interactions together. Now, that's all pretty bad, James. 0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:33.559 When you are smuggling, doctor Joseph Mengel at a safety, 0:12:33.920 --> 0:12:36.800 that's a bad thing to do. That's that's high up 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.000 on the list of least forgivable things. And I'm I'm 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:44.040 very pro smuggling, but not if you're smuggling Nazis. You know, 0:12:44.720 --> 0:12:49.960 Finnyl totally fine, old electronics that you stole from people's cars, 0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:55.520 great catalytic converters, excellent. Yeah, some chop today. I was 0:12:55.520 --> 0:12:58.600 really proud of him. M Exactly. We need, we need, 0:12:58.840 --> 0:13:02.280 we need the smuggling community to come together against smuggling, 0:13:02.360 --> 0:13:08.640 Joseph Mangela. Places. Look, not even once, folks, not even once. Anyway, 0:13:08.960 --> 0:13:12.480 the government's tolerance of Nazis led the fairly small Paraguay 0:13:12.480 --> 0:13:16.880 and Jewish population to have some awkward experiences after World 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:20.439 War Two. And this is where things get very weird. James. 0:13:20.440 --> 0:13:22.880 This is a really odd little story I've got for you. 0:13:23.320 --> 0:13:26.520 I found a peculiar but unique account of life in 0:13:26.559 --> 0:13:29.720 Stressner's Paraguay written by a person who at the time 0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:34.400 was a young boy named Michael Caine. Now, not that 0:13:34.600 --> 0:13:41.720 Michael Kine o. This Michael kine is basically a fascist. Yeah, 0:13:41.800 --> 0:13:45.000 and he grew up in This is so weird. The 0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:47.120 guy I found this in like this guy's blog. He's 0:13:47.160 --> 0:13:49.120 just like writing about his time as a little boy 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:52.840 in Stressner's Paraguay. He grew up in the UK in 0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:56.000 a peace church called the bruder Hof, which was part 0:13:56.040 --> 0:13:59.880 of a network of Pacifist Anabaptist religious communities that had 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:03.720 started spreading out from Germany in nineteen twenty. Now Michael's 0:14:03.720 --> 0:14:06.240 like three, I think in nineteen forty one when his 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:08.840 family has to flee the UK when the war breaks out. 0:14:08.880 --> 0:14:12.880 The UK puts Germans in concentration camps, now nicer ones 0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:16.240 than the German concentration camps, it must be said, But 0:14:16.760 --> 0:14:19.000 that's why his family leaves. They're like, this is not 0:14:19.480 --> 0:14:21.840 It seems like maybe being German in the UK in 0:14:21.960 --> 0:14:25.280 nineteen forty one is an ideal we might want to bounce. Yes, 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:28.600 so well, unless you're unless you're the monarch of cause, 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:30.960 in which grace, unless you yeah, unless you are the monarch. 0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:33.840 So his family flees the UK for the only country 0:14:33.840 --> 0:14:36.440 that will accept their peace church during the war years, 0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:40.160 which is Paraguay. Michael's recollections are on his website, and 0:14:40.520 --> 0:14:42.760 I have not looked into the Bruderhof a lot. It 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:46.080 is again, it's like a Pacifist Anabaptist network of religious communities. 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:49.680 Michael claims that he suffered terrible sexual abuse and paints 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:51.920 a picture of the Bruderhof in Paraguay as a cult 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:54.600 entirely possible. This is true, It would not be out 0:14:54.600 --> 0:14:56.800 of line with a lot of similar movements. I have 0:14:56.840 --> 0:14:59.000 no particular reason to doubt him on this. We will 0:14:59.040 --> 0:15:02.119 be using Michael's count today because it provides some contexts 0:15:02.160 --> 0:15:06.160 on how German Jewish and the German Nazi diaspora communicated. 0:15:06.480 --> 0:15:09.600 Which is an interesting thing, right that you have these 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:12.800 Jewish people who have fled to Paraguay and these Nazis 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:15.280 who have fled to Paraguay, and because they're all German, 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:18.600 they wind up like involved with each other sometimes and 0:15:20.200 --> 0:15:27.120 word that would be and again Michael, he is writing 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:29.840 as an adult about his experience as a child in 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:33.560 this like expat community. This same bar he's talking about 0:15:33.600 --> 0:15:35.120 like a bar that he was brought to as a 0:15:35.200 --> 0:15:38.520 kid for like a business deal. The same bar used 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:40.600 to be owned by Schortzel. His real name was a 0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:43.040 meal Wolf, a German jew and his place was used 0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:45.640 for years by Nazis and Jews, who were all involved 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:48.520 in business and all of them good friends. As a 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:51.160 fourteen year old, the Bruderhoff put me to work in Asuncion, 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:54.600 where they bought a new house in Vulgiicio Marino. They 0:15:54.640 --> 0:15:58.120 rented a large house in Indepensia Naciona, two doors down 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:01.200 from Wolf. I went to Shorze Bar with Alfred, a 0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:03.400 brother from the Bruderhoff, who wanted to drink of beer 0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:05.560 but had no money, but I did so we went together. 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:08.720 Soon Schortzel approached me for some business in wood turn 0:16:08.720 --> 0:16:11.080 to products that the Bruderhoff was selling. That's how he 0:16:11.120 --> 0:16:13.600 became a good friend of Schortzel with Jews. The key 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:16.120 to a good friendship is money. When I came roun 0:16:18.600 --> 0:16:23.000 oh boy, oh no? Do we want to keep reading room? It? Yeah, 0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:25.920 one last sentence. When I came round to Shortzel's with 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:30.480 wooden articles, he called me Nachmann and I called him saujud. 0:16:30.840 --> 0:16:33.400 Now I looked these nicknames up because I was like, 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:38.680 what kind of nicknames do basically and a Jewish boy 0:16:38.760 --> 0:16:43.560 come up with for each other. Vainachman basically means Santa Claus. Uh, 0:16:44.240 --> 0:16:46.760 So that's the Jewish guy is calling him Santa Clause 0:16:46.960 --> 0:16:49.440 right because he's buy I think, because he's buying him 0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:53.880 a beer. And Saud that nickname which is this kid's 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.640 nickname for his this his Jewish friend, comes from the 0:16:56.760 --> 0:17:00.320 term judensau, which is a medieval racial caricature sure that 0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:02.760 depicts Jewish children suckling at the teats of the pig. 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:06.399 It is a racial slur. Um. So like his friend 0:17:06.520 --> 0:17:09.639 is like, hey, Santa Claus, and he's like, hey slur, 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:15.920 Like hey racial slur buddy, um awkward look. Yeah, I 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:18.160 would love to find I haven't found really any other 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:22.760 accounts of like the complicated interactions of the Jewish striass 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:26.080 for a German community in Paraguay and the Nazi. I 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:29.560 assume this happened in places like Argentina too. Um. It's 0:17:29.560 --> 0:17:31.480 a fascinating topic. I would love to read more on 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:34.080 the matter. Hopefully I'll find something else at some point. 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:37.280 I just kind of a stumbled into this. The ship 0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:40.480 that people will put on the Internet without being forced to, Like, 0:17:40.680 --> 0:17:43.840 you cannot send me to Guantanamo Bay if I had, 0:17:44.119 --> 0:17:47.840 if I had been giving my friends slur nicknames and 0:17:47.960 --> 0:17:49.920 get it out with me. But this guy's used apparently 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:52.119 popped it out on the Internet for the world to see. 0:17:52.680 --> 0:17:55.479 I mean this, I don't entirely know what's happening with 0:17:55.800 --> 0:18:00.240 the fascist Michael Caine, but he's it's it's His blog 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:03.200 is a real one. Yeah, yeah, there was a time 0:18:03.240 --> 0:18:09.439 when yeah, humans were blogging and yeah, a powerful insight 0:18:09.520 --> 0:18:13.159 into the brain. Speaking of fascist Michael Caine, do you 0:18:13.160 --> 0:18:18.280 know what the non fascist Michael Caine loves blowing the 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:21.480 doors off things? Is? That? Is that a thing that 0:18:21.520 --> 0:18:24.600 Michael Caine did? A lot of the Michael Caine, isn't 0:18:24.600 --> 0:18:28.680 it in h what's it called? He's in a lot 0:18:28.680 --> 0:18:34.080 of stuff. He's Michael Caine. Uh yeah, I mean he 0:18:34.160 --> 0:18:37.560 was in the Batman movies. He's Alfred. So does he 0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:41.280 blow the doors off of something in the in the 0:18:41.280 --> 0:18:44.960 Italian job? Oh? Oh oh yeah, I think that is 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:48.439 my That is Michael Caine Italian j I had a 0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:50.760 moment there, always worried. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, this is 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:53.520 this is good Michael Caine content. This is an episode 0:18:53.960 --> 0:19:00.159 rich with Michael's cane. So um, anyway, that was a 0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:01.919 bit of a digression, but I just found it too 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:06.280 interesting to not include. Fascinating this must have happened in 0:19:06.320 --> 0:19:08.439 a lot of other countries too. This like the German 0:19:08.960 --> 0:19:11.480 Jewish dias for a and the German Nazi dias for 0:19:11.560 --> 0:19:14.639 a having some forms of interaction with each other. I 0:19:14.680 --> 0:19:16.840 would love to read more about that. I just don't know. 0:19:17.119 --> 0:19:19.320 I haven't I haven't run into much else. But yeah, 0:19:19.440 --> 0:19:21.359 it's a whole whole thing, and it gives you an 0:19:21.400 --> 0:19:24.160 idea of the kind of peculiar bedfellows that exist under 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:28.400 Stressner's regime. The main reason that I found Michael's story, though, 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:31.399 is that it provides a rare, direct personal account of 0:19:31.480 --> 0:19:34.639 the man that Alfredo Stressner trusted to maintain his secret 0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:38.920 torture police, who were his primary instrument of maintaining power. 0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:43.760 And this man was named Pastor Militiadez Coronelle born in 0:19:43.800 --> 0:19:47.280 August of nineteen nineteen. Coronelle worked for the Education and 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:50.000 Culture Ministry when Stressner came to power. He was like 0:19:50.320 --> 0:19:53.240 part of the Department of Education, and then Stressner's liken, no, 0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:54.920 you see my I'm more of a torture guy. To me, 0:19:55.080 --> 0:19:58.240 I'm gonna put you in charge of my torture department. 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:03.639 Coronelle was noted to be an obsessive bureaucrat. He loves paperwork. 0:20:03.840 --> 0:20:05.400 Part of all we know so much about this guy 0:20:05.560 --> 0:20:08.679 is every arrest and every torture that they do is documented. 0:20:08.760 --> 0:20:12.320 Every surveiled dissident is recorded and filed away. But he's 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:14.720 not just a paperwork guy. He likes to get down 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:17.480 there and get his hands dirty. In nineteen seventy five, 0:20:17.600 --> 0:20:20.920 when his forces arrested the secretary of the Paraguayan Communist Party, 0:20:21.119 --> 0:20:24.719 Pastor Coronell had him dismembered by chainsaw while he watched. 0:20:25.240 --> 0:20:29.879 That is, yeah, we don't come into enough chainsaw killings 0:20:29.920 --> 0:20:34.200 in this show, but there we go. That's it's always 0:20:34.240 --> 0:20:36.639 good to break new ground when yeah he's an e 0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:39.600 state minns. Yeah, no, it's nice. He's like a Robert 0:20:39.680 --> 0:20:43.560 Rodriguez ville in this guy. So Coronell is a dedicated 0:20:43.680 --> 0:20:46.200 student of torture. He practiced it himself, but he was 0:20:46.240 --> 0:20:49.159 also a keen amer of the world's greatest torture experts 0:20:49.200 --> 0:20:52.480 at the time, which was the US Police. Now we 0:20:52.680 --> 0:20:55.239 know that the FBI sent him friendly letters as well 0:20:55.280 --> 0:20:57.560 as books on law enforcement. Like the director of the 0:20:57.640 --> 0:21:00.240 FBI is like sending this guy like textbooks to be 0:21:00.280 --> 0:21:01.879 like here you go, this will help you make your 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:05.080 torture police. Don't worry, we know all about it. We 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:08.840 also know that, through Operation Condor, the FBI kept abreast 0:21:08.880 --> 0:21:11.639 of whenever Paraguay and dissidents would pop up in surrounding 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:14.600 countries that had right wing dictatorships allied with the US, 0:21:15.119 --> 0:21:17.560 which at this point was all of Paraguay's neighbors. This 0:21:17.680 --> 0:21:20.080 brings me to the nineteen fifty eighth story of Gladys 0:21:20.160 --> 0:21:23.920 Sanomon and Augustine Guibero. They were physicians in the capital 0:21:23.960 --> 0:21:26.680 who refused to falsify an autopsy report to claim a 0:21:26.800 --> 0:21:30.520 victim of Coronel's police had died of natural causes. Instead, 0:21:30.640 --> 0:21:33.040 doctor Santomon took the corpse to a class in her 0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:36.480 medical school and performed the autopsy in front of her students, 0:21:36.520 --> 0:21:38.159 so that there would be people who knew what had 0:21:38.200 --> 0:21:40.040 happened to this man. It was just the only thing 0:21:40.119 --> 0:21:41.680 she could think of to do to make sure that 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.480 the truth got out. Like if I write anything about this, 0:21:44.640 --> 0:21:47.000 they will purge it. So I am going to autopsy 0:21:47.119 --> 0:21:49.840 this murder victim in front of my students so they 0:21:49.920 --> 0:21:53.800 see what our government's doing. Very sensibly, she and her 0:21:53.920 --> 0:21:58.840 husband fled the country for Brazil. Now they're in Brazil 0:21:58.960 --> 0:22:01.920 for a little while before the Brazilian military caesar's power, 0:22:02.480 --> 0:22:04.240 and so then they have to flee Brazil, and the 0:22:04.320 --> 0:22:07.760 next place they move, Argentina, falls to a US backed 0:22:07.840 --> 0:22:10.439 military dictatorship in nineteen seventy six. This gives you an 0:22:10.440 --> 0:22:12.360 idea of like how tough it is to be any 0:22:12.440 --> 0:22:14.879 kind of dissident in South America at this time. Right, 0:22:15.119 --> 0:22:17.200 they are like running as fast as they can, always 0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:20.440 just ahead of the next US backed military coup. And 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:22.280 I'm going to quote from the New York Times here. 0:22:22.880 --> 0:22:26.240 Hours after the coup, the Argentine police abducted doctor Sanomon 0:22:26.280 --> 0:22:29.800 and tortured her at the Esquela Mechanisa in Buenos Aires. 0:22:30.160 --> 0:22:32.440 Doctor Sandomon said she was bound and plunged into a 0:22:32.480 --> 0:22:35.440 bathtub of vomit and excrement. They accused me of killing 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:38.240 a patient in my office, doctor Sanomon said, calling the 0:22:38.359 --> 0:22:41.040 charge a total lie. Then the police falsely accused her 0:22:41.080 --> 0:22:43.879 of selling drugs, she said. A week later, doctor Sanomon's 0:22:43.920 --> 0:22:47.439 husband was abducted and tortured as well. Doctor Sanomon landed 0:22:47.520 --> 0:22:50.680 at the Imboscata camp for political prisoners in Paraguay, where 0:22:50.720 --> 0:22:53.200 she treated more than four hundred fellow prisoners from several 0:22:53.280 --> 0:22:56.600 South American countries, including women whose husbands had been executed 0:22:56.640 --> 0:22:58.760 and their children. The women she said had been in 0:22:58.840 --> 0:23:01.760 prison to silence them. Doctor Sanoman and her husband were 0:23:01.800 --> 0:23:04.760 eventually given asylum in Germany in nineteen ninety seven after 0:23:04.800 --> 0:23:07.560 the German government pressed Argentina to bring about their release. 0:23:08.080 --> 0:23:10.560