1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,080 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You missed in History Class from how 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:14,040 Speaker 1: Stuff Works dot Com. Hello, and welcomed to the podcast. 3 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:17,159 Speaker 1: I'm Tracy B. Wilson and I'm probably from So. I 4 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: did not intend for today to be a Halloween episode. 5 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,800 Speaker 1: Is scary. Yeah, due to some quirks in our publishing schedule, 6 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: it happens to be coming out right before Halloween. It 7 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 1: is a listener request from listener Ellen or perhaps Ellen, 8 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: And in researching it, I realized it was the most 9 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:42,040 Speaker 1: frightening thing I had ever learned about. So, so buckle up. 10 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,559 Speaker 1: History has scared Tracy. History has scared Meat. So. From 11 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 1: nineteen sixteen to about nine seven, this really bizarre epidemic 12 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:53,120 Speaker 1: spread around the world. It came to be known as 13 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: sleepy sickness, and it is not to be confused with 14 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: sleeping sickness, which is a tropical disease found in sub 15 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 1: Saharan Africa. This is another name for a disease called 16 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:08,959 Speaker 1: encephalitis lethargica, and it caused this really weird variety of symptoms, 17 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 1: from drastic behavior changes to unusual eye movements. Especially in 18 00:01:14,959 --> 00:01:18,640 Speaker 1: the beginning years of it. Uh, the really common element 19 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 1: was this deep, prolonged sleep that went on and on 20 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: from days two months, and people just couldn't wake up. 21 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:31,399 Speaker 1: Between twenty and of the people who got this disease died, 22 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:35,240 Speaker 1: and of the ones who survived, only about a third 23 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: really fully recovered. The rest developed what came to be 24 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:42,960 Speaker 1: known as post and syphilitic parkinson ism, and some of 25 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:47,560 Speaker 1: these patients persisted in a semi comatose state for decades. 26 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:52,639 Speaker 1: It's extra terrifying. The next part is even more terrifying. Yeah, 27 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: As if all of this were not enough to scare 28 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: the pants off of you. While in this extremely deep sleeps, 29 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 1: it was part of many of the aces. People appeared 30 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 1: to be unconscious, but in reality they were actually alert. 31 00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 1: They were completely aware of what was going on, but 32 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: they were unable to move or speak, so it was 33 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 1: a sort of paralysis. Really. Yeah, So people today may 34 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: have heard about this whole disease from the movie Awakenings 35 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 1: starring Robin Williams, or maybe from the first pages of 36 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:27,480 Speaker 1: Neil Gaiman's amazing comic book series Sandman, which starts off 37 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:31,079 Speaker 1: when a ritual that was meant to capture death instead 38 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 1: captures dream and causes people to sleep endlessly. Otherwise, it's 39 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:39,519 Speaker 1: pretty far in the background of medical history most of 40 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: the time. It's not something that people remember all that 41 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 1: well today, but from its onset until about ten years 42 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: after it faded away, there were more than nine thousand 43 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: papers and books published on it, So at the time 44 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: it was a big deal, even though people don't necessarily 45 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:02,119 Speaker 1: come up with it immediately when thinking about huge epidemic today. Yeah, 46 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: and I wonder why that is ull talk about some 47 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 1: of that. Yeah, Prolonged sleep as an illness has been 48 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 1: reported really really way back into history. There are written 49 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 1: records as early as Hippocrates of this kind of incident happening. 50 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: And then there are also, of course in our cultural 51 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:23,920 Speaker 1: consciousness tales like sleeping beauty and these stories like ripped 52 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 1: van Winkle uh, and some people along the line have 53 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 1: theorized that these were actually rooted to some degree in 54 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 1: some kind of sleeping illness. In the real world, there 55 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: had also been an outbreak of a similar condition in 56 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: Italy in eighteen eighty nine and eighteen ninety, which came 57 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:43,160 Speaker 1: to be known as Landona, and it was thought at 58 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 1: the time to be a complication of the flu. And 59 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: around the world other outbreaks of encephalitis had also followed 60 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 1: behind other epidemics, particularly the flu. This particular one started 61 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: just a couple of years before the nineteen eighteen Spanish 62 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: flu epidemic, which killed between twenty and forty million people, 63 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 1: and when it came to the encephalitis lethargica epidemic, the 64 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:11,280 Speaker 1: first reports came at about the same time in different 65 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 1: two different places, which were France in Austria. In nineteen 66 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,719 Speaker 1: six in France, a doctor named Genrene Cruche started to 67 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:23,280 Speaker 1: see six soldiers with this weird assortment of seemingly unrelated 68 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 1: neurological symptoms, and the one common element was that the 69 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 1: patients just slept, apparently peacefully and deeply, and that they 70 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: could not be woken up, and he started to wonder 71 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:37,559 Speaker 1: whether there was some kind of new chemical weapon at work. 72 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 1: At about the same time, a British doctor named A. J. 73 00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:45,120 Speaker 1: Hall also reported similar symptoms, and other troops who were 74 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,919 Speaker 1: stationed in France. In Vienna, it came to the attention 75 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: of Romanian Austrian psychiatrists Constantine von Economo after a sleepy, 76 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:58,680 Speaker 1: disoriented civilian wandered into the Wagner Jarre clinic where he worked. 77 00:04:59,400 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: The doctor's there had mostly been treating soldiers who were 78 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,919 Speaker 1: wounded in the war, so they really weren't prepared for 79 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: this apparently uninjured civilian with nothing physically wrong that they 80 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 1: could really point to. And then more and more patients 81 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: with similar symptoms arrived at the clinic, and there you know, 82 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:23,600 Speaker 1: they had the similar part of this uncontrollable sleepiness and sleep, 83 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,000 Speaker 1: but the rest of their symptoms were so strange and 84 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: diverse that the doctors were really at a loss to 85 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 1: figure out a cause or a treatment. These patients had fevers, malaise, 86 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 1: double vision, they became lethargic. Sometimes they had sore throats. 87 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,520 Speaker 1: Their eye muscles would start working and their eyes would 88 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,880 Speaker 1: dart around or roll back in their heads. Some of 89 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: them developed very strange eye and tongue movement movements, and 90 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: this variety of other neurological and psychiatric symptoms. A few 91 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 1: of them even had uncontrollable hiccups and one died of that. 92 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:03,599 Speaker 1: How that work. Well, if you can't stop pickuping, you 93 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:08,800 Speaker 1: can't really eat or sleep, and then it can cause 94 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:14,159 Speaker 1: all kinds of other Yeah. Once again, throughout all of this, 95 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 1: the common element was this strange deep sleep from which 96 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: they could not be woken. Vanni Conomos saw this common 97 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: element and said, we're dealing with a sleeping sickness. Yeah, 98 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:26,280 Speaker 1: he was really the one that just laid that out there, 99 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,640 Speaker 1: and he's a character on his own. He was also 100 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:33,120 Speaker 1: a pilot who had been serving in the war, but 101 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:35,839 Speaker 1: he came back home to Vienna after his brother was 102 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 1: killed and he really wanted to be flying, but reluctantly 103 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:42,840 Speaker 1: transferred to doing medical work instead to try to keep 104 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 1: himself more out of danger and spare his family from 105 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 1: further grief. On top of all that, he was also 106 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,479 Speaker 1: a baron, having been born to a family of Greek 107 00:06:51,520 --> 00:06:54,160 Speaker 1: aristocrats and then married the daughter of an Austrian prince. 108 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 1: As the patient started to die from sleep, Vonni Konomos 109 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 1: started an intense research effort to find a cause and 110 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 1: a cure. He studied autopsies of patients who had died 111 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,560 Speaker 1: of the disease, and he found common areas of damage 112 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: to their brains, specifically in the hypothalamus, and he suspected 113 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 1: that the differences and how much people slept was related 114 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 1: to just how their hypothalamus was damaged. He also found 115 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: that brain tissue could transmit the disease to monkeys, so 116 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: he concluded that they were looking at something that was contagious. 117 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: He publicly announced his conclusion that they were dealing with 118 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: a new disease, probably a virus, before the Psychiatric Society 119 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: in Vienna, on April seventeenth of nineteen seventeen. UH. Consequently, 120 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:42,679 Speaker 1: sometimes the disease has been referred to as von Economo's disease. 121 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: His announcement was not at all well received. At a 122 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: time the prevailing view with that mental illnesses were all 123 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: products of things like trauma and buried memories. Freud was 124 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 1: really at the forefront of psychology at this point, so 125 00:07:57,440 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 1: a lot of people just scoffed at the idea that 126 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 1: there could be a virus or other disease process causing 127 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 1: the kinds of behavior changes in psychological problems that some 128 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: of the patients were exhibiting. The ongoing debate and this 129 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: mystery of the whole thing kept much progress from being 130 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 1: made in terms of treatment and prevention. But then UH, 131 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 1: the illness mostly disappeared from continental Europe. It really just 132 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: fell off suddenly, and Spanish flu on the rise took 133 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 1: its place and it became a much more pressing priority. 134 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: Not long after that, though, the disease appeared in London 135 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,439 Speaker 1: and it followed much the same pattern as it had 136 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 1: on the continent. There were, you know, all these patients 137 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: who were suddenly having this strange collective collection of symptoms 138 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 1: and sleeping constantly. The government in Britain quickly made it 139 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 1: a reportable disease. The Ministry of Help had to be 140 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 1: notified of all new cases, and its appearance and spread 141 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: uh in London was much like it had been in 142 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: France and Austria. Strange symptoms and unending sleep uh, you know, 143 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,680 Speaker 1: baffling the doctors. But in England the symptoms became even 144 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:04,839 Speaker 1: more alarming, with patients who could never sleep, or who 145 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: couldn't stop laughing, or had other strange physical or emotional presentations. 146 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:14,479 Speaker 1: It also seemed like fewer and fewer people were truly recovering. 147 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: In Austria and France, there had been people that had 148 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:22,800 Speaker 1: gotten better, but as it's spread around England, a lot 149 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: of people were becoming comatose or developing. As we mentioned 150 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 1: at the beginning, what later came to be known as 151 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:32,600 Speaker 1: post en syphilitic parkinson is um or PEP. Sometimes the 152 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:36,520 Speaker 1: onset of parkinson is um happened years after people recovered, 153 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 1: after they had apparently been healthy all that time. During 154 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:44,719 Speaker 1: the epidemic, the average age for the onset of Parkinson's 155 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,959 Speaker 1: dropped to thirty six years old. Today, while there are 156 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 1: people who have early onset, the average age for people 157 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: to start exhibiting Parkinson's is sixties. So this was really 158 00:09:56,520 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: a significant and strange happening. Uh following the epidemic, two 159 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:06,520 Speaker 1: thirds of Parkinson's patients had previously had encephalitis, so it 160 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: clearly was causing it right, This disease was causing a 161 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: drastic shift in who developed Parkinson's and when. So, to 162 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:21,480 Speaker 1: return to the story of encephalitis Letharctica from England, the 163 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 1: disease spread all over the globe, and the same story 164 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 1: just played out over and over and over. People would 165 00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: start showing up with these strange symptoms that prevent that 166 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:35,000 Speaker 1: presented themselves in such different ways that it would take 167 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 1: a while for doctors to realize what was happening. It 168 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: really didn't help that the epidemic had started just at 169 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: the end of World War One and just before the 170 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,400 Speaker 1: start of the nineteen eighteen Spanish flu epidemic, and so 171 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: resources were just scarce and there were definitely bigger priorities 172 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 1: going on, and this crazy although terrifying disease, and as 173 00:10:56,440 --> 00:10:59,560 Speaker 1: it spread it started to prompt a variety of different 174 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 1: sleep disorders, so while some patients would sleep for months 175 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 1: at a time, others couldn't sleep at all, and they 176 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 1: would actually die of exhaustion. The disease came to be 177 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 1: known in some places as epidemic encephalitis rather than encephalitis lethargica, 178 00:11:13,880 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: since not everyone could really be called lethargic anymore. As 179 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:20,560 Speaker 1: it spread, it also started to affect more and more 180 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:24,960 Speaker 1: children and young people. Children who contracted the disease developed 181 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: impulse control issues that led to them having violent behavior 182 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: in their adolescence. Some of them injured themselves or other people. 183 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 1: One even removed her own eyes and several of her 184 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 1: own teeth okay after I unclenched after that um, this 185 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: behavior often would continue for the rest of these patients 186 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: lives after they progressed out of childhood, unless post and 187 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 1: cephalitic parkinson is M made them physically unable to continue. 188 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 1: For children with the disease, outbursts were so severe that 189 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:00,840 Speaker 1: many had to be institutionalized. Hospitals and asylums that were 190 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,920 Speaker 1: accustomed to providing care for adults suddenly had to develop 191 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: new practices to care for children because there were so 192 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:12,160 Speaker 1: many suddenly having a movement institutions. Researchers theorized that the 193 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 1: reason this encephalitis was causing behavior changes like this and 194 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:19,280 Speaker 1: young people was because their brains hadn't yet developed the 195 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: capacity for self control that adults typically had by the 196 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: time they were infected, and this tendency towards violent behavior 197 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:31,360 Speaker 1: and other erratic behavior even led to encephalitis lethargica being 198 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 1: blamed for gangster behavior and lawlessness during the nineteen twenties. 199 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 1: Once this disease spread to the United States, neurologist Frederick Tilney, 200 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 1: who was known as Fred and had also been Helen 201 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: Keller's neurologist, became the country's foremost authority on sleepy sickness. 202 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:50,960 Speaker 1: One of his most famous encephalitis patients was Jesse Morgan, 203 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:53,959 Speaker 1: who was the wife of Jack p Morgan, who himself 204 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:57,400 Speaker 1: was the son of banker and philanthropist John Pierpoint Morgan. 205 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:02,079 Speaker 1: She got the disease in ninety five. Five. After Jesse's death, 206 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: Jack donated two hundred thousand dollars to the Neurological Institute 207 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 1: the fund research into this disease. The Neurological Institute was 208 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: behind most of the research into encephalitis authargica that came 209 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:18,040 Speaker 1: from that point. Later on, William Matheson, who was the 210 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: wealthy founder of a chemical company and an encephalitis patient, 211 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:26,079 Speaker 1: started the Matheson Commission to fund research at the Neurological Institute, 212 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 1: with Dr Josephine B. Neil, who was an encephalitis expert, 213 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: helming the project, and the commission's aim was to study 214 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:37,959 Speaker 1: the disease and eventually find a vaccine. Since nobody knew 215 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 1: exactly what was causing the disease, they worked on three 216 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 1: theories simultaneously. One was that it was being caused by 217 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: an unknown virus, the next was that it was being 218 00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 1: caused by bacteria, possibly strap uh, and the third was 219 00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:55,960 Speaker 1: that it was being caused by herpes. This was a 220 00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:00,240 Speaker 1: long shot to begin with because no causative agent had 221 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 1: been found for this disease. They were basically operating in 222 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 1: the dark based on best guesses. On top of that, 223 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 1: there was a ton of infighting among the researchers. A 224 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: lot of them were extremely prominent neurologists and scientists. Each 225 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 1: of them really wanted to be the one to crack 226 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: this case and figure out what's going on um that 227 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: they were not working together very well. They were each 228 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 1: trying to get the glory for themselves. And then there 229 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:31,920 Speaker 1: was another huge setback when Matheson himself died in nineteen thirty. 230 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: That was in the middle of the Great Depression, and 231 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: he had been providing the funding, so after his death 232 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:42,880 Speaker 1: there wasn't really other funding to be had, so the 233 00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: Matheson Commission ceased operations in two and so no workable 234 00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 1: vaccine had been developed, and one of the things that 235 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 1: doctors tried to treat post and cephalitis patients with was lobotomies, 236 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 1: which also did not work. There was a lot of 237 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: ending that did not work. There were a few outlying 238 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:07,160 Speaker 1: successes during this time that we kind of give people 239 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:09,400 Speaker 1: false hope that maybe they were on the right track, 240 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:14,600 Speaker 1: but nothing led to an actual treatment or cure. Most 241 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 1: of the medical care that the patients were receiving was 242 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 1: really about just caring for their bodies and keeping them alive. 243 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: The thirty or so percent who developed parkinson is um 244 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,760 Speaker 1: generally wound up in long term care for the rest 245 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: of their lives, and many of them were completely unable 246 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:33,720 Speaker 1: to move or take care of themselves in the nineteen sixties, 247 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 1: after the drug love Adopa or el dopa as it 248 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: was called, was introduced for treating Parkinson's. New York doctor 249 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 1: Oliver Sachs, who are some of our listeners may have 250 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 1: heard of, administered it to some encephalitis lethargica patients who 251 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 1: were in long term care. Some patients actually showed a 252 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: limited recovery from their post and sephalitis lethargica Parkinson symptoms. Uh. 253 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: This is the story that's actually told in the movie Awakenings, 254 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,600 Speaker 1: which is why people may have heard of all over sex. 255 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:05,240 Speaker 1: But they all apparently developed a tolerance until the dosage 256 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: was really just too much for the human body to handle, 257 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 1: and then they would return to their semi comatose state 258 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 1: in the end. This epidemic went on from nineteen sixteen 259 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 1: to nineteen twenty seven, reaching its peak in nineteen twenty four, 260 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,800 Speaker 1: after which the number of cases started to drop off. 261 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 1: The total numbers of people affected are really unclear. There 262 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: are sources who say that a million people were killed, 263 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:32,440 Speaker 1: while others say that only half a million were affected 264 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: in one way or another. Regardless, though the mortality rate 265 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:40,360 Speaker 1: was pretty serious in England, almost half of the cases 266 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: in nineteen nineteen and nineteen twenty died. Although it was 267 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:48,200 Speaker 1: roughly concurrent with the Spanish flu pandemic, and flu came 268 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: up frequently when looking at possible causes, many doctors at 269 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: the time didn't really think the disease was actually flu related. 270 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 1: Only a small percentage of the patients had also had 271 00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:02,480 Speaker 1: Spanish flu, and teen eighty two, however, doctors from the 272 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:06,120 Speaker 1: Centers for Disease Control published this list of connections between 273 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:09,280 Speaker 1: the two diseases. So for a little while. In more 274 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:14,000 Speaker 1: recent years, flu became a prime suspect for causing encephalitis lethargica. 275 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 1: Uh there is, you know, especially since there have been 276 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: other incidents of encephalitis that have followed outbreaks of the flu. Today, 277 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:25,399 Speaker 1: the idea that the flu was the culprit has pretty 278 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:28,600 Speaker 1: much been ruled out thanks to modern testing methods. They 279 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 1: haven't turned up any sign of the flu virus in 280 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 1: tissue samples from patients who died from encephalitis, Although it's 281 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:39,879 Speaker 1: never reached that same epidemic state again, isolated cases of 282 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:44,159 Speaker 1: encephalitis lethargica have continued to crop up even in recent years, 283 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 1: most recently in a twenty three year old named Becky 284 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:52,919 Speaker 1: Powell was diagnosed with the disease and it took her 285 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 1: two years to recover. Several similar cases followed. In two 286 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: thousand three, a team of doctors public a paper in 287 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,400 Speaker 1: the journal Brain that put forth a pretty good case 288 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:07,040 Speaker 1: that the cause of encephalitis lethargica is actually a massive 289 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: autoimmune reaction to an unidentified pathogen. A strain of strap 290 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 1: comes up in the discussion, but it's ultimately dismissed as unlikely. 291 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: And their research was done on twenty different patients who 292 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:23,119 Speaker 1: developed the disease between two thousand two, and those patients 293 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:26,000 Speaker 1: had a much lower mortality rate than during the epidemic. 294 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 1: Only one died, but five of them did have to 295 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 1: be placed on a ventilator. Had those five patients lived 296 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:34,640 Speaker 1: in the ninety twenties, they probably would not have made it, 297 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: but almost none of them had fully recovered a year 298 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: or so later when the paper was published. They continued 299 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 1: to have neurological and psychiatric symptoms. Yeah. If if there 300 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 1: had been if today's ventilation technology had existed in the 301 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: nineteen twenties, the mortality rate would have been Yeah, because 302 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 1: people would get into this just deep uninterrupted sleep and 303 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:01,919 Speaker 1: their respiratory functions would fail, and there wasn't really anything 304 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 1: that people could do about it. But now that we 305 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:08,639 Speaker 1: have violators UH, that there are actual there's a treatment 306 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 1: for that part of it that didn't exist back then. 307 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:15,680 Speaker 1: In paper in the journal BMC Infectious Diseases reported that 308 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 1: a team of researchers had found virus like particles in 309 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 1: the brains of both epidemic encephalitis patients and modern patients, 310 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:28,359 Speaker 1: so people who had died UH either recently or during 311 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 1: the epidemic. This supports the idea that the cause of 312 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: encephalitis lethargica is an interarovirus, but exactly what interovirus we 313 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:43,400 Speaker 1: still do not know. And on that note, so encephalitis 314 00:19:43,520 --> 00:19:46,880 Speaker 1: lethargica has a some you know, a legacy today, even 315 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: though a lot of people have not really heard of 316 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 1: it as tragic and frightening as the disease was and 317 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: is really. In the end, it helped doctors understand more 318 00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 1: about the brain. Von economist conclude Usian about the hypothalamus 319 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:04,919 Speaker 1: and its role in the patients sleep, for example, was 320 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: hugely unpopular at the time, but many years later it 321 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:12,440 Speaker 1: was proved to be true after we developed sorts of 322 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:15,200 Speaker 1: imaging technologies that we can use to look directly at 323 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:19,119 Speaker 1: the brain as it's working today. Neurologist Bernard Sacks also 324 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 1: wrote that the epidemic of encephalitis quote revolutionized the practice 325 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:27,280 Speaker 1: of neurology. So it really changed the way that, uh, 326 00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,119 Speaker 1: these things were examined from the get go. Yeah, it 327 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: helped solidifying neurology as an actual field. In the early days, 328 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:38,840 Speaker 1: there was sort of this hodgepodge of neurology ideas and 329 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:41,640 Speaker 1: psychology ideas and all these things that were kind of 330 00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: together in one big pot. And in part because of 331 00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 1: encephalitis being spread the way that it was, a group 332 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:55,360 Speaker 1: of doctors branched off to study just neurology and encephalitis. 333 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:57,919 Speaker 1: Lethargica was also one of the conditions that made it 334 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 1: clear that disease process says, can lead to mental illnesses. Uh, 335 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,880 Speaker 1: it's solidified the idea that mental illnesses were not solely 336 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: in the realm of emotions or traumatic experiences. It's not 337 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 1: always buried memories. Sometimes there can actually be a physical 338 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 1: happening that causes mental illness. There are a couple of 339 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:20,479 Speaker 1: books that are out about this epidemic. The one that 340 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: I read researching. This podcast was called Asleep, The Forgotten 341 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,200 Speaker 1: Epidemic that remains one of Medicine's greatest mysteries by Molly 342 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 1: Caldwell Crosby and her grandmother survived Sleepy Sickness. It starts 343 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: with sort of a case study of her grandmother. That's 344 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 1: terrifying because it's about her grandmother being asleep for so long, 345 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:43,879 Speaker 1: but also being aware of what was happening around her, 346 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 1: which to me is just terrifying. The one caveat about 347 00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 1: this book is that it was written before the very 348 00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 1: most recent research about what might have caused this particular epidemic, 349 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: which is going to be the case which just about 350 00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 1: every book now since the latest research is just very new. Yeah. 351 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: Last year, as we were recording, I have read several 352 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,880 Speaker 1: papers that, uh, you know, and when the bird flew 353 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:12,439 Speaker 1: epidemic was was everybody was very frightened about bird flu. 354 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: There were several articles that that came up where doctors 355 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,240 Speaker 1: were like, actually, what you really should be afraid of 356 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 1: is a resurgence of this still unidentified encephalitis that sometimes 357 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: sometimes follows outbreaks of other diseases. I yeah, it's basically 358 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 1: my worst nightmare. I mean, I have not a good 359 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 1: relationship with sleep anyway. If I didn't have to do it, 360 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 1: I wouldn't. So the idea of not having any control 361 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,200 Speaker 1: over the situation and just being asleep but not really 362 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 1: because you're conscious of things happening around is my worst nightmare. Yeah, 363 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,360 Speaker 1: not to play on sleep jokes, but well, it's terrifying 364 00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: and the there are many things about this whole, the 365 00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 1: epidemic and the illness itself that are are frightening to me, 366 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: And one of them is that people would seem to 367 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: recover and they would be fine for a long time, 368 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 1: and then they developed, yeah, developed parkinson symptoms um and 369 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: once it had been established that that was a pattern, 370 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,120 Speaker 1: I can imagine like the people who had gotten better 371 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,440 Speaker 1: really being like I'm never going to be which I 372 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:22,679 Speaker 1: know that's the case with a lot of diseases that 373 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,199 Speaker 1: people have now, Like there are many cancer patients who 374 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: never feel like they are in the clear because you 375 00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 1: can be intermission. So yeah, it's a scary thing to 376 00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: live with that kind of over you cheerful it is. 377 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,359 Speaker 1: Do you have listener mail? The cheer aside, do have 378 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 1: listener mail? And actually the first listener mail that I 379 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,359 Speaker 1: have is very cheerful. I have two of them. One 380 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:50,080 Speaker 1: of them is short. The first one is from Vince, 381 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 1: and he says, Dear Tracy, thank you for helping me 382 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 1: through some boring work days. During your recent podcast on 383 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: Louis Alvarez, you mentioned all the Berkeley Nobel laureates from 384 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: its past. Being a proud alum, I had recently had 385 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:04,360 Speaker 1: a chance to visit Berkeley, and strolling around the campus, 386 00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 1: I noticed this cute photo op between the two physics buildings, 387 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:13,119 Speaker 1: and basically he attached a picture of this row of 388 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:16,280 Speaker 1: prime parking spaces that all are like this space is 389 00:24:16,320 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 1: for a novel, a Nobel laureate. So Nobel laureates get 390 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 1: awesome reserved parking at Berkeley. They deserve it. They've probably 391 00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 1: lost a lot of time in their lives to work 392 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 1: very hard on very difficult problems. Yeah. There there are 393 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:31,360 Speaker 1: a lot of spaces, and they are right by building. 394 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 1: Says for me. It truly illustrates how good Berkeley research 395 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 1: really is. Thanks again, Vince, Thank you, Vince. I love 396 00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:42,439 Speaker 1: that picture. Yes, okay, the other one is from Sarah, 397 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:44,679 Speaker 1: and I'm going to just start with a confession that 398 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: I worried that when we were talking about Luis Alvarez 399 00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 1: that we were talking too much about how hard a 400 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,760 Speaker 1: lot of his discoveries are to understand if you are 401 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,720 Speaker 1: not also a physicist. So I particularly liked this letter 402 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:00,200 Speaker 1: from Sarah. Sarah says, Hi, Holly, and Tracy. I'm a 403 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 1: graduate student at m I T and i love listening 404 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: to your podcast when I set up reactions in our 405 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:08,280 Speaker 1: nitrogen filled glove box or washed my glassware. I just 406 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:10,880 Speaker 1: listened to your podcast on Luis Alvarez, and I wanted 407 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,359 Speaker 1: to thank you for all the podcasts you've done which 408 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,680 Speaker 1: touch on science, even though for the purposes of this episode, 409 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,280 Speaker 1: I'm a chemist and not a theoret radical physicist. I 410 00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,360 Speaker 1: find your descriptions clear and engaging, which is so rare 411 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 1: fined in science communication. I have a small correction to 412 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 1: make on your last episode where you mentioned that the 413 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 1: temperature of liquid hydrogen is degrees below zero celsius. I 414 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:35,120 Speaker 1: think you meant minus two fifty three degrees celsius, since 415 00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:39,920 Speaker 1: absolute zero zero kelvin is minus two seventy three degrees celsius. 416 00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:43,159 Speaker 1: At this point, molecules cease to have entropy, and it 417 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:47,640 Speaker 1: is the coldest possible temperature, so liquid hydrogen is twenty kelvin, 418 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:52,600 Speaker 1: which is still really really cold, but not as clear 419 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: as liquid helium, which is for kelvin. Also, I was 420 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 1: interested in hearing the cheek lub crater mentioned. I studied 421 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,000 Speaker 1: odd in the Yucatan Peninsula in college and visited the 422 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 1: town of chik Lube several times. But it was only 423 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:07,680 Speaker 1: after I got back to the States that I saw 424 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: that twenty ten science paper that you mentioned and realized 425 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: that I had been in the impact site probably responsible 426 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,200 Speaker 1: for the mass extinctions without knowing it. By the way, 427 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 1: you got the pronunciation pretty close, but it's actually pronounced 428 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: more like cheek salub. The x mention s h sound 429 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:28,720 Speaker 1: apparently means something like lee devil according to Wikipedia. In 430 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,919 Speaker 1: any case, it was amazing to have the chance to 431 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,639 Speaker 1: study there. So much of the Mayan culture and the 432 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:38,639 Speaker 1: language is preserved in the Yucatan. And then Sarah recommends 433 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:42,280 Speaker 1: h subject for us to talk about, which we're just 434 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:43,920 Speaker 1: going to save in case we're able to do that 435 00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 1: in a later podcast, and she says, anyway, sorry this 436 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:49,520 Speaker 1: email got so long, but I wanted to thank you 437 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 1: guys for your science recording. Keep up the good work, Sarah, 438 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: thank you so much. Sarah. Yeah, we got a few 439 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 1: corrections on the temperature thing we did. I would like 440 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,959 Speaker 1: to thank Sarah's correction for being very nice about it. 441 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 1: There were a couple of people who needed to tell 442 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 1: us that corrections are bad and that mistakes are bad, 443 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,680 Speaker 1: and we know that we try our best. So yes, 444 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,159 Speaker 1: that is totally either a typo in my notes or 445 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 1: a typo and something I was making notes from. So 446 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:20,200 Speaker 1: thank you very much for clarifying just how extremely extremely 447 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 1: cold liquid hydrogen is. Thankfully we did not work in 448 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 1: a lab where there would be actual scary implications of 449 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:30,440 Speaker 1: us making the error of that magnitude. Yes, we're safe. 450 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:37,640 Speaker 1: It's just words. It's just words, and we're edited though 451 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,199 Speaker 1: it's kind of her job. But yeah, occasionally we do 452 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,760 Speaker 1: get stuff wrong in spite of our best effort. So 453 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,240 Speaker 1: thank you so much, Sarah. I am so glad to 454 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,320 Speaker 1: hear from science people who enjoy us talking about science, 455 00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:53,040 Speaker 1: because I do love science, but because it is not yes, 456 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,920 Speaker 1: because it is not like my primary field of study. Uh, 457 00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: sometimes get stuff a little wrong. So if you would 458 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:05,160 Speaker 1: like to write us a letter about this or any 459 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 1: other subject, you can. 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