1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:05,000 Speaker 1: The man decided that he would buy cheap meet in France, 2 00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: smuggle it across the border, and sell it for a 3 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:11,559 Speaker 1: higher price in Switzerland. Now, how did the police get 4 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: onto this guy? I mean, was there blood running down 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: his fender? Welcome to Bloomberg Benchmark, a podcast about the 6 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 1: global economy. I'm Dan Moss, Executive editor for Economics. Joining 7 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:35,239 Speaker 1: me this week in a special one off is Joe Wisenthal, 8 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:38,560 Speaker 1: whom you may recognize as the co host of Odd Lots. 9 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 1: Thanks for having me down. Really excited to our beer, 10 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: and we're excited to well, you know, Joe. As you 11 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,879 Speaker 1: and I have often discussed, too often, the study of 12 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 1: economics and exchange rates can become very arcane. We find 13 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 1: ourselves asking, well, what does this mean in real life? 14 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:58,800 Speaker 1: What does it mean for the person in the street, 15 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: Whereas we find out today the person in the car right? 16 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: I mean, often there are some obvious ways that economics 17 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,680 Speaker 1: can affect us, whether we have a job or not, 18 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: or mortgage. These are sort of the go to examples 19 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 1: that people would site all the time for real world examples, 20 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: but there's tons of other ones, and as we'll discuss today, 21 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:25,559 Speaker 1: some very interesting, surprising ramifications that happen due to things 22 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:28,920 Speaker 1: like exchange rates. Right, So this is as much a 23 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 1: story about meat smuggling and about packing all that steak 24 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: and chicken and pork into the trunk of your car 25 00:01:36,959 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 1: and driving across the border as it is about exchange 26 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: rates smuggling. That's what modern day smuggling is like in 27 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 1: this era of free floating currencies. It's not a couple 28 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: of guys in the basement of the House of Commons 29 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 1: in London with a keg of gunpowder, right. I think 30 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 1: typically want to imagine smuggling. Maybe they think of drug smuggling, 31 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: some sort of subterfuge to take in a lead goal 32 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: good across a border, or get something out of a 33 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: country that's not supposed to leave. But sometimes it's essentially 34 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 1: a form of arbitrage. But this meat smuggling, uh, you know, 35 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,360 Speaker 1: is an economic Crimes like it are on the rise, 36 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: particularly in Switzerland, and that's a function of monetary policy 37 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: and the strength of the Swiss franc I knew it 38 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 1: was strong, but I didn't realize how strong. In the 39 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: last ten years it's appreciated against the Euro, which is 40 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:30,679 Speaker 1: a currency that it's neighbors that Switzerland's neighbors share by 41 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 1: more than fifty more than any other major currency, right, 42 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 1: and that that that huge swing is kind of twofold. 43 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,800 Speaker 1: I mean, one, the Euro has been exposed to be 44 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 1: deeply flawed over the last several years. The economy really 45 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: hasn't gotten going their fundamental questions about its existence. And 46 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: then not only that, but Switzerland is this pocket of stability, 47 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: not just by European standards, but by global and historical standards. 48 00:02:55,280 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 1: So at a time when there's so much uncertainty in 49 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,639 Speaker 1: the world, people pile into this was Frank when they're nervous, 50 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:03,960 Speaker 1: when they are looking for something to do with their 51 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 1: money that's saved. So you have this extreme divergence between 52 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 1: the strength of the Swiss currency, the frank, and all 53 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 1: of its direct neighbors, and it's rapidly becoming a pocket 54 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:18,800 Speaker 1: of retail economic crime, as our guest colleague, Katherine Boseley, 55 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: an economics reporter for Bloomberg and Zurich, is about to 56 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:25,920 Speaker 1: explain to us. So, Katherine, this is a story about 57 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 1: a car the border, a trunk full of mate, and 58 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:32,919 Speaker 1: a confession that this has been going on for fifteen years. 59 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 1: We'll get to the cash in the sunglasses case. Later, Hi, Well, 60 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: we've got the case of a man who was arrested 61 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: in the French speaking part of Switzerland carrying a kilo 62 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 1: grams of fresh meat a few months ago. Um. And 63 00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: he was then interrogated by the border officials, and it 64 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: turned out that he'd been spiriting meat across the border 65 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 1: for fifteen years, including twenty seven tons of lamb, eighteen 66 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 1: tons of beef and twelve tons of chicken. He now 67 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 1: owes back customs duty of about a million francs, which 68 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 1: is almost a million dollars, and also of course faces 69 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: criminal proceedings. Now, Joe, you actually had some barbeca for 70 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 1: breakfast that you've prepared for yourself. What goes through your 71 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,560 Speaker 1: mind when you hear this? That's exactly right. I I 72 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: had made some barbacoa in my slow cooker, so I've 73 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 1: been eating it for the last three days. So you know, 74 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: in France and Switzerland, meat is plenty, plentiful. It's available. 75 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 1: It's not like it's not as cows rising on the hillside. 76 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:45,560 Speaker 1: It's not like there's a shortage of meat in either country. 77 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:51,359 Speaker 1: So what fundamentally makes this an attractive smuggle? Well, and 78 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 1: the prices in Switzerland's are considerably higher even than in France, 79 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 1: and of course, in addition you've got the currency effect. 80 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 1: So obvious, least a man decided that he would buy 81 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 1: cheap meat in France, smuggle it across the border, and 82 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 1: sell it for a higher price in Switzerland. Now, how 83 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:13,600 Speaker 1: did the police get onto this guy? I mean, was 84 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: there blood running down his fender? No? There are there 85 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 1: are quite uh strict imports restrictions to Switzerland. You may 86 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: bring in three hundred francs worth of items a day, 87 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 1: and for certain food stuff there are additional rules. For example, 88 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 1: I believe for meat it's one kilogram per person per day. 89 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 1: Anything above that has to be declared and you have 90 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:42,680 Speaker 1: to pay customs duty. So there are inspections, snap inspections 91 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 1: all over the place. And it was such an inspection 92 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,039 Speaker 1: that nabbed this guy. So it was just pure bad 93 00:05:49,120 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 1: luck probably, yes, Yeah, And so you mentioned that you 94 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 1: can move one kilogram of meat per day across the 95 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,720 Speaker 1: border for personal, non commercial reasons. I actually lived in 96 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: Geneva for one semester when I was in college studying abroad, 97 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:07,919 Speaker 1: and I remember I was studying French and I was 98 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:10,880 Speaker 1: with my French teacher and we actually briefly crossed the 99 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:12,960 Speaker 1: border into France and I didn't then my passport with 100 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: me that day, but they didn't even bother to check. 101 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 1: So these are pretty loose porous borders typically, right. Indeed, 102 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:25,039 Speaker 1: that's the case, especially in the Geneva area. It's very 103 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: one road just continues and suddenly you're in the other country. 104 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:33,599 Speaker 1: So how often do you, meaning is an average representative 105 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:36,479 Speaker 1: of the Swiss population, Not that you're really averaging anything, 106 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: but how often does the typical Swiss person go to France, 107 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:47,440 Speaker 1: Germany or Italy to do their shopping? Well, according to 108 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 1: a study by Credit Swiss M, one in ten francs 109 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 1: in retail spending is spent abroad. So that's a pretty 110 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 1: big chunk of people's budgets. So here's my question. You know, theoretically, 111 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:07,920 Speaker 1: from a macro economic standpoint, exchange rates are supposed to adjust, uh, 112 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:11,240 Speaker 1: you know, in a pure sort of free trade uh 113 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: sort of framework. The that that shouldn't really happen, that 114 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: the price of meat is so different that it's worth 115 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 1: smuggling risking prosecution by the law. It should be the 116 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: balancing out effects. So what prevents a balancing out of 117 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 1: the Swiss Franc and the Euros, such as to render 118 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:34,120 Speaker 1: this an uncompelling arbitrage. Well, in the case of the 119 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 1: Swiss Franc, it's also a popular investment for investors who 120 00:07:39,040 --> 00:07:42,200 Speaker 1: want a safe place to park their money, especially in 121 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: in the Euro area. During the Greek debt crisis, people 122 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: wanted to move out of Euros and into assets of 123 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: different denomination. So the frank has faced quite a bit 124 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 1: of appreciation pressure, as Dan said earlier in our talk, 125 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: and basely the central bank is using a policy of 126 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 1: negative interest rates and currency market interventions to try and 127 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:10,840 Speaker 1: weaken it. But the fact that the Swiss Franc remains 128 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: strong over valued, as a central bank says, it means 129 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:20,000 Speaker 1: that this meat arbitrage opportunity remains attractive, and there's an 130 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 1: element of price insensitivity among Frank buyers. They don't really 131 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: care that it's expensive, they don't really care that they're 132 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 1: getting negative interest rates. All these people just want to 133 00:08:30,520 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 1: be assured that their money will still exist there tomorrow, 134 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 1: will still be saved, and so this sort of inherent 135 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 1: overvaluation doesn't go away because they're not really buying it 136 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: for valuation reasons. Is that correct? Indeed, that is correct. Yes, Now, Cathy, 137 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 1: the customs official you spoke to after this trunk stake 138 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:53,440 Speaker 1: bust told you that economic crimes like this are on 139 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 1: the rise and they're anticipating more of them. What does 140 00:08:57,200 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: that say about where the Swiss populous thinks the exchange 141 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: rate is going. Well, I guess the that would tell 142 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: us that we expect the overvaluation of the frank to 143 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:15,959 Speaker 1: continue or even potentially to be exacerbated. Now, the day 144 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 1: after you informed the world of the Swiss steakhist you 145 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 1: also published a story about a missing sunglasses case that 146 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,840 Speaker 1: had the equivalent of thirty thou dollars in cash stuffed 147 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: into it. And this guy just turns up at a 148 00:09:32,320 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 1: police station says, oh, yeah, that's mine, and the cops said, well, okay, fine, 149 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:39,640 Speaker 1: it must be yours. What is going on with Switzerland 150 00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: at the moment talk to us about the sunglasses case. Well, 151 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:47,439 Speaker 1: there was a case of h year old dutch man 152 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:51,680 Speaker 1: apparently found this glasses case stuffed with twenty eight thousand 153 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: euros in a pile of snow in in in in 154 00:09:56,320 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: the city of Zurich and correctly turned it into the police. 155 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:05,280 Speaker 1: And they have a ledger at the lost and found 156 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,559 Speaker 1: office where you can also report things that are missing, 157 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:12,719 Speaker 1: and sure enough, someone had in fact reported twenty eight 158 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 1: thousand euros missing. They then contacted the claimant and he 159 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:22,800 Speaker 1: was he had to answer some additional questions and but 160 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 1: low and behold, he seems to have been the rightful owner. 161 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 1: Why that's my question too, Why why so much money? Well, 162 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 1: it says, yes, it's a lot of money to stick 163 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: into a sunglasses case. And if I read your story correctly, 164 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: the cops thought this was completely unremarkable that someone would 165 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: then turn up and say, oh, yeah, that that's mine. Okay, 166 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: here you go, sign here, sir. I don't think that 167 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,720 Speaker 1: they thought it was so very unremarkable, since they did 168 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 1: put a press release out about this UM. But there 169 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:58,320 Speaker 1: was a case a few months ago where six thousand 170 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 1: francs were also found UM and a very similar situation 171 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 1: a pension or turn them in and the rightful owner 172 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: was found. Is it just the case that people hold 173 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 1: a lot of cash in Switzerland? Is it a cultural thing? 174 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,280 Speaker 1: I mean, what is why I hold so much cash 175 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:20,560 Speaker 1: at all? If that were to happen here in the US, 176 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:23,360 Speaker 1: I think people would be pretty suspicious that they're up 177 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: to no good. I mean, there are certainly reasons why 178 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 1: someone might hold cash for whatever reasons, but we have 179 00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:31,080 Speaker 1: like a default assumption. I think that if you found 180 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 1: out someone had twenty eight thousand dollars in cash on 181 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,839 Speaker 1: their person, that they would probably you might suspect that 182 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:39,440 Speaker 1: they were engaged in some sort of illegal like in 183 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:43,440 Speaker 1: a sunglasses In the sunglasses case especially well, when I 184 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 1: spoke to the police about six thousand francs several months ago, 185 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 1: they did, in fact say that usually the amounts turned 186 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 1: in or much smaller. It is true that the twist 187 00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: do like to pay with cash, although of course you 188 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,440 Speaker 1: can find cards credit card readers everywhere, there is a 189 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: certain propensity to pay with cash. M The Swiss National 190 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:09,440 Speaker 1: Bank has a thousand franc note and they have been 191 00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:13,199 Speaker 1: quite quite clear that they will not scrap that because 192 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: it is part of the part of the culture to 193 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:20,199 Speaker 1: pay with cats. They weren't doing Moody no, but the 194 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 1: eight thousand euros is quite exceptional. So what does all 195 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 1: this say about Swiss society and the sentiment among Swiss 196 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:37,359 Speaker 1: consumers right now? Well, I'm the Swiss economy is um 197 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 1: has found its uh sell ponto more stable footing after 198 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 1: the exchange rate shocks that they had in early twenty 199 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: fifteen when the central Bank gave up its cap on 200 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 1: the franc um. Nevertheless, growth is still not as fast 201 00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,680 Speaker 1: as people would like to see us of course, and 202 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 1: in the pretty killer the retail sector has suffered because 203 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 1: of this, the unfavorable exchange rate, people shopping abroad. Um 204 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: all that. I just wanted to ask one question specifically 205 00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:17,600 Speaker 1: on that front. So a couple of years ago, uh 206 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: or I don't know, it's uh. First, a while Switzerland 207 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 1: had had a essentially a cap on how strong its 208 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 1: currency was going to get against the Euro. Then it 209 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: released that cap. But as this example of the meat 210 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:38,560 Speaker 1: smuggling demonstrates, there's still massive overvaluation. It's still a major 211 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 1: issue for the country. How frustrating is this for the 212 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 1: Swiss National Bank? This persistent overvaluation. There's persistent flood of 213 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 1: money into Switzerland from safe haven as safe haven seekers. Like, 214 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:55,640 Speaker 1: how big of a deal is that to the economy 215 00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 1: or do they just sort of accept that that's part 216 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 1: of the landscape. Yeah, I think it's a bit of both. Um. 217 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,360 Speaker 1: You know, people have gotten used to it and people 218 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 1: are in fact, you know, is for the banking sector. 219 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 1: It can be a positive. It's an asset for the 220 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:16,760 Speaker 1: wealth managers to have such a strong currency. On the 221 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 1: other hand, Um the central banker also says that it's uh, 222 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 1: you know, policy of negative rates is working, but you 223 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:30,840 Speaker 1: know that there are you know, and they're still prepared 224 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: to intervene in currency markets. You know. I hate to 225 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: say it, Joe and Catherine, but this is all food 226 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,840 Speaker 1: for thought. Benchmark will be back next week when we'll 227 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,480 Speaker 1: crack another terrible joke. Until then, you can find us 228 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: on the Bloomberg Term and on Bloomberg dot com, as 229 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: well as on iTunes, pocket cast, and Stitcher. Why do 230 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 1: they take a minute to rape and review the show? 231 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 1: Some more people can find us and let us know 232 00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:56,840 Speaker 1: what you thought. You can talk to and follow us 233 00:14:56,840 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: on Twitter at mass underscore Ko and you can follow 234 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:05,120 Speaker 1: me on Twitter at the Stalwart and Catherine you are 235 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: at c B Swiss Easy. Thanks for listening. To see 236 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:10,440 Speaker 1: you next time.