WEBVTT - Ken West 0:00:08.600 --> 0:00:12.320 This watt me up ken breast, Kevin, this partner did 0:00:12.320 --> 0:00:15.680 you started to pick out? And this is doctor typical 0:00:15.800 --> 0:00:20.280 contect promoter who references Christo. He's really an artist underneath. 0:00:20.440 --> 0:00:22.799 It's really intrigued. It's like, Kevin, how did you become 0:00:22.840 --> 0:00:30.280 up from contract propos um? I don't know if he 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:35.240 ever became a concert promoter. The probably the simple answer 0:00:35.360 --> 0:00:44.479 that is that in the round eighteen made seven, Uh 0:00:44.800 --> 0:00:49.080 went to art school where all the dysfunctional people. So 0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:54.400 it's just like uk t um and I soon discovered 0:00:54.440 --> 0:00:57.760 that I didn't like the idea of producing art and 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:02.120 hoping somebody bought it. Didn't feel very good about selling myself. 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:06.240 But then I did notice a lot of music came 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:09.240 out of art school in those time. That's just generally 0:01:09.319 --> 0:01:13.280 how most of the modern movement kind of happened. And 0:01:13.319 --> 0:01:15.800 I did notice straight away there were some people with 0:01:15.920 --> 0:01:21.240 incredible talent that couldn't tie their shoelaces, probably because they 0:01:21.240 --> 0:01:25.840 were so tunnel visioned about what they were producing. Um. 0:01:26.000 --> 0:01:28.319 Probably the earliest one to come along really was was 0:01:28.440 --> 0:01:34.120 Nick Cave when We're both one Um and that Gravitator 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:38.679 and Ed Cooper from the Saints how did you know 0:01:38.920 --> 0:01:44.240 Nick Cave? Uh? I got involved with Ed Cooper, who 0:01:44.319 --> 0:01:48.400 was the songwriter guitarist for the Saints, because I got 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:50.640 invited down by a friend to hear them rehearse, because 0:01:50.640 --> 0:01:53.000 they were rehearsing for six months for their first shows, 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:56.760 the Laughing Clowns, And they had a very strong connection 0:01:56.920 --> 0:02:01.600 with Nick Cave, so that when they went down to Melbourne, 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:05.640 they supported what was then the Boys next Door, and 0:02:05.720 --> 0:02:08.400 when Poison next Door came up to Sydney, they'd support 0:02:09.120 --> 0:02:13.600 the Laughing Clowns Mutual Appreciation Society. Okay, we rassed a 0:02:13.680 --> 0:02:17.200 chapter there. You would going to art school? Yeah, you said, Okay, 0:02:17.240 --> 0:02:19.040 I don't want to promote myself. I don't want to 0:02:19.040 --> 0:02:24.040 be victimized by the public. Was Nick Kieve a friend 0:02:24.080 --> 0:02:28.360 then became a friend pretty quick because when you're that young, 0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:32.240 you're working together, there's no real structure anything, no real 0:02:32.280 --> 0:02:38.360 management structure around the place. Uh. It just very quickly 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:42.600 snowball party to do with amazing person called Keith Glasses 0:02:42.639 --> 0:02:45.480 started missing link records and started signing all these acts 0:02:45.520 --> 0:02:48.680 and so as he's running an independent record store and roster. 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:52.160 Then I started to move into the factor that I 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:55.320 knew how to. I was originally enlightening and then went 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:59.160 into producing shows, and then was booking the shows bearing 0:02:59.160 --> 0:03:01.200 a mind. In those days, there was no such thing 0:03:01.320 --> 0:03:05.000 as somebody purchasing the show of this sorts of things. 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:10.000 So it was renting halls, it was taking door deals 0:03:10.040 --> 0:03:12.040 at venues. But I want to go back to the 0:03:12.040 --> 0:03:16.320 beginning or at school. Yeah, how do you say I'm 0:03:16.320 --> 0:03:18.280 going to promote a show? I'm gonna how how do 0:03:18.320 --> 0:03:19.480 you just say I'm gonna go to the jump to 0:03:19.560 --> 0:03:22.800 the other side and be a business person. Okay, I'll 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:26.200 take it back to the simple thing. UM. At the 0:03:26.280 --> 0:03:33.120 round at the age of nineteen, the artist Christo came out, 0:03:33.320 --> 0:03:35.040 you mean the Christal of the guy who does you 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:40.440 know umbrellas? And he had wrapped Shelly Beach for years earlier, 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:47.680 had just completed running fence UM and similar situation. I 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:51.000 suppose he did a talk at what was to become 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:55.240 COVID wasn't called co for at the time. UM. Only 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:59.040 four people turned up. There's only two of us were interested. 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:04.640 I just kind of had him for two hours and 0:04:04.760 --> 0:04:09.080 just talked through everything, and he talked in terms of 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:12.360 what I needed to do running fence it was going 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:15.360 to cost six million dollars and it took me five 0:04:15.440 --> 0:04:18.720 months to get that money together. You also mentioned that 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:21.560 he never used volunteers. He tried to use volunteers, but 0:04:21.600 --> 0:04:24.359 they were hopeless, so it was easier for him to 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:28.680 find more money than use volunteers. Talked about the tribalism 0:04:28.680 --> 0:04:31.400 of say, running fence, where you'd end up with ten 0:04:31.520 --> 0:04:35.520 teams that were kind of competing against each other, all 0:04:35.560 --> 0:04:39.960 again pre mobile phone, and running in isolation like isolated tribes, 0:04:40.800 --> 0:04:43.440 and he'd be holding that thing together. And then I 0:04:43.880 --> 0:04:49.640 pretty much became the cornerstone of understanding of the concept 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:57.280 of being about humanity more than making something to hang 0:04:57.320 --> 0:05:03.200 in the gallery. That impermanence can be more permanent, uh, 0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:11.240 And that the the real point of it comes down 0:05:11.279 --> 0:05:17.240 to is that you can amplify something great a lot 0:05:17.279 --> 0:05:22.839 easier than something that's not great. And you don't need 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:27.680 to be the most aware person to notice that there's 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:30.240 something special going on with Nick Cave and he's twenty 0:05:30.279 --> 0:05:32.840 one when he's producing very very angry. But I mean, 0:05:32.839 --> 0:05:37.480 we got to see Kristi and you're very inspired, Okay, yeah, 0:05:37.560 --> 0:05:40.520 inspired in a way that there's another way of doing 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:44.480 things okay, and then does it What what's your thought 0:05:44.520 --> 0:05:47.400 process to say, Hey, I might want to have a 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:49.960 music event which would be kind of like an evanescent 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:52.960 event like running fans of the umbrellas or you know, 0:05:53.279 --> 0:05:58.480 surrounding the lakes the islands in Miami, et cetera. Yeah, 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:02.800 that was already done. So Uh. The point of it was, 0:06:02.880 --> 0:06:07.120 as I found that if there was a great subculture 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:13.200 that was going on, that could be um pulled together 0:06:13.240 --> 0:06:19.480 to make a bigger statement. Also found that the performances 0:06:19.520 --> 0:06:23.320 when say, the group Laughing Clowns played with a normal 0:06:23.360 --> 0:06:27.240 support were pretty shabby. When the Boys next Door played 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:30.479 become the birthday party later when they performed with an 0:06:30.520 --> 0:06:33.880 average kind of opening act, didn't really give it everything 0:06:33.920 --> 0:06:37.080 they had. But when you put two competing bands on 0:06:37.160 --> 0:06:40.400 the one show on an equal bill, the their sets 0:06:40.400 --> 0:06:44.520 are on fire. Okay, that's something great. But you are 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:48.440 an artist, Yeah, how do you literally become a businessman 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:52.479 because they had to be a business Okay, but you 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:57.480 woke up one day and say the answer is contro promotion. No, no, 0:06:57.960 --> 0:07:00.640 it was just a natural progression. That line of it is. 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:04.120 As they spent four years in art school, primarily to 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:07.040 borrow the equipment because it was an electro media of course, 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:10.920 thing that gave us access to lighting, film, sound, very 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:12.960 low tech, a lot of it, some high tech. We 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:17.120 collaborated with many other things. Were collaborated with the Conservatory 0:07:17.120 --> 0:07:19.960 of Music with Martin Wesley Smith, who was the just 0:07:20.120 --> 0:07:25.680 pioneering the electronics division of the of the Conservatory of Music. 0:07:26.440 --> 0:07:32.760 We worked on various things outside, such as architecture review 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:36.120 and things like that, where the arts end of things, 0:07:36.480 --> 0:07:41.840 of different parts of it was on a similar path um. 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:46.880 And in that process I found that the real art 0:07:47.040 --> 0:07:49.400 was because I was saying friends at the time, you know, 0:07:49.520 --> 0:07:53.040 what's the point of art? Now? Warholes killed everything, so 0:07:53.960 --> 0:07:57.440 we're starting to repeat ourselves all over again. And I 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:00.800 just tried to follow the art, and the art was 0:08:00.840 --> 0:08:03.760 moving out of the visual arts world into the musical world, 0:08:04.560 --> 0:08:06.920 and I wanted to be more part of the future art, 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:11.520 not the past art um. And as that grew in 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:16.520 that process and the experiments worked, there was the people 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:19.760 that are around at that time didn't want to We're 0:08:19.760 --> 0:08:24.320 in seventy six, you said, seventy seventy nine when I 0:08:24.360 --> 0:08:27.640 did the first silly show that did not work out 0:08:27.680 --> 0:08:30.440 very well, and then so tell me about the two. 0:08:30.680 --> 0:08:33.600 So tell me about the first silly show. It was 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:35.679 cheaper to hire a band with a p A than 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:38.520 the p A, and the band I hired was shipped. 0:08:39.960 --> 0:08:41.840 But I actually put it on because I wanted the 0:08:41.880 --> 0:08:43.840 band that I was living with at the time to 0:08:43.920 --> 0:08:46.720 play with a good PA. But it didn't work out. 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:51.760 I learned my lesson, didn't I always stop whenever I failed, 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:56.080 and then regroup. Sometimes I've stopped for a six months. 0:08:56.080 --> 0:09:00.240 Sometimes I've stopped for a couple of years. Um stop 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:02.200 now for five. I don't have any hunger to go 0:09:02.280 --> 0:09:06.000 back to it. There's better being on the outside than 0:09:06.040 --> 0:09:08.920 the inside at the moment, and I don't have that 0:09:09.000 --> 0:09:12.400 compulsion to keep doing it because I think the arts 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:19.240 moved again now into science. Science you mean tech just 0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:26.280 science in general. Two examples what you consider science. There's 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:32.240 the scientific process of trying to solve problems in a 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:36.480 futuristic sense that is needing the imagination of the artists 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:40.160 to get it there, that it needs to have people 0:09:40.200 --> 0:09:43.760 around with the political and financial strength to make them happen. 0:09:44.320 --> 0:09:46.400 In the speculative world of it at the moment, there's 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:48.800 a lot of failures. And I won't say that all 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:53.959 disruptive technology is good. Disrupted good technology. But I think 0:09:54.040 --> 0:09:58.920 in terms of you're a young creative person, you're going 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:04.640 to drive more to war Woods a bigger picture, uh 0:10:04.880 --> 0:10:07.960 attitude to life than I'm going to get a band. 0:10:08.120 --> 0:10:11.079 I'm going to be an artist in paint. It's more 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:14.719 the hard end of the stick to go. I want 0:10:14.720 --> 0:10:17.760 to do something that's important. So to use the old 0:10:17.920 --> 0:10:21.520 term from the rate stuff and Chuck Yeager, you're all 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:25.120 about pushing the envelope. You're supposed to just money. I 0:10:25.160 --> 0:10:28.120 prefer to throw out the envelope. Okay, But the point 0:10:28.240 --> 0:10:30.920 is you're not. The way you're saying is money is important, 0:10:30.960 --> 0:10:33.040 but that's not the number one driver. It's more about 0:10:33.040 --> 0:10:36.720 impacting the culture. Well, money could never be important because 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:41.200 it's I've only ever seen even in in when living 0:10:41.200 --> 0:10:45.440 in a squad and not being able to basically have 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:51.000 enough money to eat um. It hasn't been about money. 0:10:51.080 --> 0:10:54.120 It's a bit the need to do it. Okay. So 0:10:54.120 --> 0:10:57.200 so I think I've said two things about it in 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:04.480 time that the money for in most situations, created process 0:11:04.760 --> 0:11:09.160 is your tools to achieve your goal. It's not the 0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:13.600 end results, and if you do a good job in 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:17.400 the simplest of terms, someone will send your check. Not nowadays, 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:20.640 of course, but that's you can't be. If you're focusing 0:11:20.679 --> 0:11:25.080 on that aspect of it, you're probably gonna fail just 0:11:25.200 --> 0:11:28.880 a little bit slower. If let's say I have an endeavor, yeah, 0:11:29.040 --> 0:11:32.120 and I certainly hope that it pays off. Should I 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:36.360 forget about the money completely. You need to get paid 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:39.040 for what you're worth. And if you can put something 0:11:39.080 --> 0:11:41.600 in structure there that you're going to get paid for 0:11:41.880 --> 0:11:46.800 what the value of you bring, then that will happen 0:11:47.240 --> 0:11:50.040 down the path. If you're wanted to get paid on 0:11:50.080 --> 0:11:54.439 a week by week basis, then you're beholding to somebody. 0:11:54.720 --> 0:11:57.839 Let's go back to the beginning. You grow up where 0:11:57.880 --> 0:12:01.319 in Sydney, Yeah, cover matters, and then what do your 0:12:01.320 --> 0:12:04.319 parents do for your living? For a living? Father was 0:12:04.360 --> 0:12:09.920 a paymaster, mother was a chronic epileptic. She worked sometimes, 0:12:09.960 --> 0:12:13.840 didn't work sometimes. So the intuitive side of it with 0:12:13.960 --> 0:12:17.120 me was that we ended up about in cabramattic was 0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:20.160 and father fought World War Two and grew up in Ramwick, 0:12:20.200 --> 0:12:23.680 went to Sydney Boys High. His brother died in World 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:29.680 War two as a Lancaster bomber navigator over France moved 0:12:29.679 --> 0:12:32.720 to Cabra matter on the basis that if Japan invades 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:37.080 next time, we're further away from the very logical at 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:39.920 the time. Okay, how many kids in the family, just 0:12:40.080 --> 0:12:43.160 my sister and your sister was older, younger, No, she's gone, 0:12:43.200 --> 0:12:47.360 she's older. She wasn't particularly healthy. And did she pursue 0:12:47.400 --> 0:12:50.240 what we would call a street life a civilian she 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:53.400 became an art teacher? Or really, so, where was the 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:55.240 influence for art? How did you know? How did you 0:12:55.280 --> 0:12:59.319 get it? Was all there is latently in there? Um. 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:01.880 I could tell him the father painted the house seven 0:13:01.920 --> 0:13:06.600 different colors, that there was something going on. Um, But 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:09.080 you know it wasn't. I grew up in the concept 0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:11.000 of which is some of the things that championed along 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:15.160 the way was the skating, was the fact that hot 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:19.760 right art, um, the the idea of the of the 0:13:19.760 --> 0:13:22.960 working class artist more than the I'm going to be 0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:28.000 an artist, you know, the the when Big Daddy Roth 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:32.559 was making his start about cars for those people, I 0:13:32.640 --> 0:13:35.600 found a lot of things really and in fact, he 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:38.360 did the cover for the Birthday Party Junk Guard album, 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:43.160 of which he got really angry about because he finally 0:13:43.280 --> 0:13:47.360 listened to it and said that how dare you put 0:13:47.360 --> 0:13:49.640 my art work on this album? Because they told him 0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:53.719 it was a rockabilly band. Um, good old days. You 0:13:53.800 --> 0:13:56.840 could hide that, okay. So your parents were fine with 0:13:56.920 --> 0:13:58.959 you going to art school? No, they hated the idea. 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:02.560 They actually hid my sceptance until I quit the Commonwealth 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:05.200 Bank after three days and then I said, oh this 0:14:05.320 --> 0:14:08.920 turned up so I would have never even gone there 0:14:08.920 --> 0:14:12.160 if I had stayed another week. Okay, And how did 0:14:12.240 --> 0:14:15.720 you pay for art school? I got a twenty eight 0:14:15.840 --> 0:14:19.120 dollar a month living away from home allowance. I worked 0:14:19.120 --> 0:14:22.320 part time and I lived in a squad. Okay, so 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:25.960 now you have it. You put on a gig we'll 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:28.400 call a gig because you wanted the band to have 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:33.000 the p A. Was that for like your arts? Was there? 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:37.680 Was there a show? Did you charge admission? What was admission? 0:14:37.720 --> 0:14:41.800 I also produced a long form video for the entry 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:44.040 and tried to make it installation peace kind of thing 0:14:44.160 --> 0:14:47.840 based on Kitel products, and called it ken Talent was 0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:51.160 ken Tell's Show. I worked under alias is all the time. 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:56.080 It was much more fun. Um. The first touring company 0:14:56.120 --> 0:14:58.920 I set up was Edwards Zimblis and syndicate Briebery Limited 0:14:59.720 --> 0:15:05.320 Um because I just thought that's better to work that way, 0:15:05.440 --> 0:15:08.720 and to the point where in nine and January eighty 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:12.640 five when brought out Lou Reid and dealt with Eric Kranfeld, 0:15:13.360 --> 0:15:17.040 who was the Rolling Stones attorney as well as managing Lou, 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:21.840 he was convinced that this twenty six year old or 0:15:21.880 --> 0:15:24.240 whatever it was at the time, that I worked for 0:15:24.360 --> 0:15:28.480 Edward Zimbliss. And that was fine until he found out 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:30.680 in Australia when he was telling the head of security 0:15:30.720 --> 0:15:34.120 that he'd had a meeting with Edward and John Miller. 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:36.680 The head of security said, you know, he doesn't exist. 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:40.320 So it was a good front because I was too 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:45.280 young to be me. Okay, so you put on this concert, 0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:48.120 you made the video, you were having fun where you're 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:51.720 getting any traction? No, No, that's what I started. I 0:15:51.880 --> 0:15:54.200 had to move out of the friend's house and move 0:15:54.280 --> 0:15:57.680 home again for six months with my parents accepted de 0:15:57.720 --> 0:16:02.520 Selm carr Um. Then it just kind of went back 0:16:02.560 --> 0:16:04.880 into doing shows for people. There's more of an agent 0:16:05.800 --> 0:16:09.520 position because I knew how to do stuff, and that's 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:14.720 when I started creating one off events I didn't like 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:16.640 during much. I like one off events. What kind of 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:22.200 events were those? Uh? Um? The first birthday party shows 0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:25.440 were Birthday Party Love and Clowns Go Betweens at Paris Theater. 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:35.760 Um the first time two parents foolishly put five thousand 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:38.520 dollars in my bank account to so they get the 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:42.240 pension better. Which a week later I was on a 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:47.600 flight to London. UM stayed at Nick Squad, Nick Cave 0:16:47.720 --> 0:16:51.880 Squat and Paddington in London. That was pretty good. Um. 0:16:52.000 --> 0:16:54.360 The third floor was stairs with missing so we had 0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:57.360 to use the ladder up that part and the taps 0:16:57.360 --> 0:16:59.760 were leaking out the sides a bit, but but it 0:16:59.840 --> 0:17:05.159 was good. Got a train up to Manchester, stayed on 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:08.919 Marquee Smith's floor. I didn't realize he took a lot 0:17:09.000 --> 0:17:11.040 of speed. That's running away. He was talking all night. 0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:16.320 And then went to the Hassie Endo to meet UM 0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:19.840 to see a new Order plays like the sixth of 0:17:19.840 --> 0:17:23.960 a show. It was a free from members night, so 0:17:24.000 --> 0:17:28.879 a new order free for members night. UM. And the 0:17:28.920 --> 0:17:31.480 weird thing was the connection with Nick kind of opened 0:17:31.560 --> 0:17:35.560 doors because when well, you're in our you're in our world. 0:17:36.400 --> 0:17:39.880 You know that's you. He's he we respect him. If 0:17:39.880 --> 0:17:44.760 he respects you, then you get the time. Um ended 0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:48.560 up securing the New Order tour by sculling a cocktail 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:54.320 with Rob Britain because Bernard had ordered some blue cocktail 0:17:54.440 --> 0:17:57.880 backstage after the show and Rob said, here's this guy 0:17:57.880 --> 0:18:01.400 from Australia wants to come to Australia and said, Bernard said, 0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:03.360 I thought we were going to South America. He said, well, 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:05.920 you're gonna have to choose which one and burn and 0:18:06.000 --> 0:18:09.520 said we'll scull this cocktail and we'll go to Australia. 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:12.359 And I thought he was joking, but then I sculled 0:18:12.400 --> 0:18:14.760 it and he said, okay, we're going to Australia. And 0:18:15.200 --> 0:18:17.680 I said the rubbull, can I come past tomorrow we'll 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:20.160 work out the deal. He said, don't worry about the deal. 0:18:20.760 --> 0:18:23.840 That's factory records. Yeah, that's factory records all the way through, 0:18:23.880 --> 0:18:27.480 which is kind of how became the Manchester specialist of 0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:29.840 Manchester Think. So a lot of these things were event 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:33.680 driven in that. So the five thousand dollars your parents 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:36.600 gave you, you said, I'm gonna use this to put 0:18:36.600 --> 0:18:39.720 on a show. He said, I gotta live and I 0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:42.040 told me not to use it for that kind of okay. 0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:45.080 And so but when you went to the UK, you 0:18:45.280 --> 0:18:46.879 in the back of your mind said, I want to 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:49.359 do a show that the first time the UK yet Okay. 0:18:50.680 --> 0:18:52.800 I clearly went there on the basis that they were 0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:55.840 acts that I wanted to see and I thought people 0:18:55.840 --> 0:19:00.000 needed to see, and I thought the traditional music industry 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:02.760 he wasn't going to do it. Okay, So you secure 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:07.960 this deal with New Water, Yeah, and the factories legendarily untogether. 0:19:08.320 --> 0:19:12.320 How long thereafter they actually show up in Australia Not 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:16.280 that long after. It was November toward the fall before that, 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:22.600 and that did really well. Turned up. It was the 0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:25.080 sound guy didn't get through because he filled out his 0:19:25.160 --> 0:19:28.600 visa form wrong and the studio engineer was there, not 0:19:28.680 --> 0:19:31.720 Martin had the other studio engineer was there, did a 0:19:31.840 --> 0:19:35.560 terrible show at the Capital Theater because he kept saying 0:19:35.560 --> 0:19:38.160 I was looking for the rewind button. Is he never 0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:42.520 mixed live great help, totally top end sliced it, but 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:48.720 his heads off. UM And then ten shows, so I 0:19:48.720 --> 0:19:54.520 got from like nine to of the first shows of 0:19:54.560 --> 0:20:00.359 New Order in the world. Um came friends that created 0:20:00.400 --> 0:20:05.199 the process of trying to create the goal for me 0:20:05.359 --> 0:20:07.719 was to go, if they're in safe hands, if they 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:10.120 feel her in safe hand, the money doesn't matter that much. 0:20:11.400 --> 0:20:14.000 And that was the foundation of what I wanted to go. 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:18.000 You're in safe hands. I will back you up on anything. 0:20:18.000 --> 0:20:19.959 I need to back you up. I can't guarantee you're 0:20:19.960 --> 0:20:22.199 going to make a lot of money. Okay. So they 0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:24.960 came to Australia, they did ten gigs. Yeah, you make 0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:32.040 money or lose money. Lost thirty dollars. Who's money kind 0:20:32.080 --> 0:20:36.600 of ours but it was borrowed. Um, So I stopped 0:20:36.640 --> 0:20:40.200 for a year, moved out of Sydney, moved down to Melbourne, 0:20:40.320 --> 0:20:44.600 shared a house with business partner of that time, Vivian Lee's. 0:20:46.400 --> 0:20:51.280 Eventually did the final convince the birthday party to come 0:20:51.359 --> 0:20:53.520 back to do a show. It's a series of shows 0:20:55.359 --> 0:20:59.240 that didn't do much more than break even. That was 0:20:59.280 --> 0:21:05.040 the end of the Birthday Party. Um, it was just 0:21:05.160 --> 0:21:08.159 hand to mouth. Did other things, but not class things. 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:11.920 Whose money was it? Oh, it's a friend of Vivian's 0:21:11.920 --> 0:21:14.440 who was a dope dealer environ. Okay, so we didn't 0:21:14.440 --> 0:21:17.000 want to lose You don't want to lose the money. 0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:20.480 But he had the money. It didn't really care that much? Okay, 0:21:20.640 --> 0:21:22.680 so now you're living hand to mouth. He got paid 0:21:22.720 --> 0:21:27.600 back how much later? Okay? So what happened in that year? 0:21:27.640 --> 0:21:30.879 How do you end up making the money back? Brought 0:21:30.920 --> 0:21:34.919 back John Cooper Clark through all the weirdest things to 0:21:34.960 --> 0:21:38.880 pay a lot of money. They just cleaned up um 0:21:39.160 --> 0:21:42.440 single person again a heroin addict but kind of everything. 0:21:43.119 --> 0:21:45.199 Just to go back to New Order because at this 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:50.280 point they're legendary when you bring necessarily, but when you 0:21:50.359 --> 0:21:53.600 when you bring them to Australia with the advent of 0:21:53.600 --> 0:21:56.520 their career, anybody, how do you why would people go 0:21:56.560 --> 0:21:58.679 to see him? Were they playing on the radio? What 0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:04.520 would drive tickets? Sale? Us stuy division? And the music 0:22:04.600 --> 0:22:07.399 is great, the first album was sensational, right so, but 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:09.440 they would have to be word of mouth for people 0:22:09.480 --> 0:22:11.359 to know to go oh yeah. But I had a 0:22:11.400 --> 0:22:13.480 lot of ways of promoting things as well, Like I 0:22:13.520 --> 0:22:17.119 did a Hunters and Collectors show at Sydney University Refectory 0:22:17.160 --> 0:22:21.280 that's sold out at tickets. Instead of announcing the tour 0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:23.399 of the usual way, I got a stamp made that 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:30.720 said New Order on sale date and stamped everybody coming 0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:34.800 in with that. So everybody at the event was stamped 0:22:35.640 --> 0:22:40.280 with the on sale announcement, which meant that the Capital 0:22:40.320 --> 0:22:44.560 Theater sold out in an hour when it happened, and 0:22:44.640 --> 0:22:46.439 we added extra days. But because the sound was so 0:22:46.520 --> 0:22:48.199 bad at the first one I returned, it didn't do 0:22:48.280 --> 0:22:50.719 very well. I wanted to do two shows, but then 0:22:50.760 --> 0:22:53.479 they said, we don't like playing the same venue twice. 0:22:53.520 --> 0:22:56.440 They just make things up. Okay, remember how much ticket 0:22:56.440 --> 0:22:59.880 prices were on that first show fifteen dollars ninety Okay, 0:23:00.280 --> 0:23:02.840 so now you end up, Meggi, you moved to Melbourne, 0:23:03.080 --> 0:23:05.159 you end up making the money back. You do those shows. 0:23:05.200 --> 0:23:09.760 What happens after that? Just slowly picked myself up and 0:23:09.800 --> 0:23:14.679 started doing it again with it. No, you just go 0:23:14.840 --> 0:23:19.240 through a series of the violent fems. I was. We're 0:23:19.240 --> 0:23:23.200 going to basis that the it was much more mathematical 0:23:23.240 --> 0:23:27.240 than what it sounds. The independent seen and the important 0:23:27.320 --> 0:23:30.800 record model where you're paying more for an imported vinyl 0:23:30.840 --> 0:23:33.480 album and a local president on the theory that it's 0:23:33.480 --> 0:23:36.919 a better quality. You've got to go if they're selling 0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:40.080 three thousand copies of an album through the independent stores, 0:23:40.119 --> 0:23:42.840 because I can ask them and they say, we've sold 0:23:42.880 --> 0:23:47.200 five copies of this Violent Fem's album here on impoard 0:23:47.920 --> 0:23:50.200 and you go. Most of them are in share houses. 0:23:51.560 --> 0:23:54.639 That means it's got a much bigger reach. It's not 0:23:54.720 --> 0:23:57.919 in the charts, it's not there, but you know that 0:23:57.960 --> 0:23:59.639 the people are buying that are going to come to 0:23:59.680 --> 0:24:02.560 the show, and not only just them, but they will 0:24:02.640 --> 0:24:06.240 drag friends along. Um. If they're a social act that 0:24:06.920 --> 0:24:09.080 that you want to show off to your friends that 0:24:09.160 --> 0:24:13.440 they're great, then they will be your spokesperson as well. 0:24:13.520 --> 0:24:17.440 Plus a good relationship with Double J Radio before it 0:24:17.480 --> 0:24:21.440 went to Triple J and became national. Um, there was 0:24:21.480 --> 0:24:23.680 the beginning of the street press movement that was really 0:24:24.440 --> 0:24:28.080 championing a lot of these things. That was the beginning 0:24:28.119 --> 0:24:33.240 of the hunger for information tree Internet that they wanted 0:24:33.280 --> 0:24:38.679 to consume more and so they consumed everything that was available. Okay, 0:24:38.720 --> 0:24:40.840 so that was your next big The Violent Fams were 0:24:40.840 --> 0:24:43.920 your next big thing. Yeah, okay, so the Violent Fams came. 0:24:43.960 --> 0:24:46.560 How many deeds did you do with them? About and 0:24:46.640 --> 0:24:54.160 how they do solid at every date? Um? No few 0:24:54.240 --> 0:24:57.680 of a thousand people out front. So you meet Bummy 0:24:57.720 --> 0:25:00.760 Maw and then I took a manic to in America 0:25:01.960 --> 0:25:06.320 for four months and that's when things ramped up a 0:25:06.359 --> 0:25:08.360 little bit. Wait, wait, so you went as the tour 0:25:08.440 --> 0:25:10.920 manager in the States. I wanted somebody with an accent, 0:25:12.840 --> 0:25:15.840 makes some sound more international. This was when blister in 0:25:15.840 --> 0:25:19.600 the sun, when it's happening for the violent thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. 0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:22.280 So it was like a one thousand to two thousand 0:25:23.520 --> 0:25:26.520 see you know, okay, I guess one of post being 0:25:26.520 --> 0:25:32.840 Salt Lake City because I swear, okay, a little bit slower, 0:25:33.520 --> 0:25:35.480 the biggest shower of the American tour at that point 0:25:35.520 --> 0:25:40.359