1 00:00:01,360 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, home of the 2 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:10,639 Speaker 1: modern white tail hunter and now your host Mark Kenyon. 3 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,319 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. I'm your host, 4 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:18,520 Speaker 1: Mark Kenyan, and today in the show, I'm joined by 5 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 1: Jared air Dottie to discuss how he analyzes, breaks downs, 6 00:00:23,079 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 1: and solves the white tail puzzle. All right, welcome to 7 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 1: the Wired Dunt podcast, brought to you by First Light. 8 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: As I just mentioned, we've got Jared air Dottie today 9 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: on the show. Jared is most known from two different places. 10 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: I would guess you maybe have seen him on the 11 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: white Tail Addictions TV show. That's the Lone Wolf Show 12 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: with Andre de Quisto and that whole group of incredible 13 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:01,800 Speaker 1: deer hunters. Jared is part of that crew and he 14 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:06,120 Speaker 1: is equally incredible at targeting big, mature white tailed deer 15 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: with his bow. He also was one of the founders 16 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:12,720 Speaker 1: and creators of the Blood Brothers and then now known 17 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:17,479 Speaker 1: as Next Buck DVD series. UH. If you've seen marsh 18 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: Country Bucks or hill country Bucks or farm country Bucks, 19 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: these DVDs involving Jared, his buddy Lee and Dan Infalt, Uh, 20 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: they have been kind of foundational pieces of education for 21 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:34,320 Speaker 1: a lot of us serious deer hunters. Uh, that came 22 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: out in the early two thousand's. I think ish in 23 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: that timeframe I picked him up. I think in two 24 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:44,720 Speaker 1: thousand nine maybe tals and ten and Uh. You can 25 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: just see from those DVDs the immense well of knowledge 26 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: that Jared is pulling from. And in the years since, 27 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: he's continued to have tremendous success targeting deer while also 28 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 1: raising a family and balancing all that. He's got a 29 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: really great analytical approach to deer hunting. Ah. He he 30 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: embraces this h scouting and mobile centric approach that a 31 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: lot of people are finding success with today, but he 32 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 1: brings to it his own unique set of kind of 33 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 1: mental thought processes. And so today on the show, what 34 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:18,640 Speaker 1: I want to do is walk through with him what 35 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: those thought processes are. How he goes about scouting and 36 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,959 Speaker 1: identifying buckbetting areas, how he goes through and thinks about 37 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 1: setting up and hunting these areas. How he considers finding 38 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 1: the spot within the spot. How do you put all 39 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:35,920 Speaker 1: these pieces together? Right? We're solving this puzzle every season, 40 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 1: even every day we go out to hunt. It's a 41 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 1: new puzzle. And what Jared shares this today is how 42 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 1: he personally thinks about that puzzle and how he figures 43 00:02:45,520 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 1: out how all of these different layers of information go together. 44 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 1: It's a fascinating conversation. I really enjoyed it. Jared has 45 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 1: a lot to share, and I know you're going to 46 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: enjoy this one. So without further ado, I'm gonna let 47 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 1: you get right in to this episode. The only thing 48 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: I will mention just as a heads up on the 49 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,079 Speaker 1: first Light front right. First Light is part of our 50 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:10,959 Speaker 1: mediator team. They have launched and now have available their 51 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: full white tail catalyst system and the new Solitude jacket, 52 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: all unavailable in the new Specter white tail camouflage pattern. 53 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 1: So if you want to fill out the rest of 54 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 1: your set up for the upcoming hunting season and utilizing 55 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 1: that new camera pattern, which which I've been loving use 56 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 1: last year. It works like a charm, you can check 57 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 1: it out at first Light dot com. The only other 58 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 1: news I'll mention is make sure you are checking out 59 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: all the new content we have from Wired to Hunt. 60 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 1: As we mentioned last week, it's not just a podcast anymore. 61 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 1: We've got a website, we've got new video series, we 62 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: have the New Foundations podcast, from Tony. You can find 63 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: it all at the meat eater dot com slash wired. 64 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: We've got everything there for you to find. If you 65 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: want to take your white tail know how to the 66 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: next level, this is how to do it. So check 67 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 1: it out and without further ado. I know I said 68 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 1: that once before. Now I'm gonna say it for the 69 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 1: last time. Let's get into my conversation with Jared Enjoy 70 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: all right with me. Now on the line is Jared ERDDI. Jared, 71 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: thank you for being here in the show. M very welcome. Mark. 72 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:22,360 Speaker 1: I'm excited for this conversation. You are. You're someone who 73 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 1: I've I've kind of followed from Afar and and kind 74 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:29,160 Speaker 1: of just sucked in all the information from I could 75 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 1: for a long time, as many people I'm sure did 76 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 1: with your really influential DVD series that came out many 77 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:40,240 Speaker 1: years ago. Um, and it's it's just great to get 78 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 1: to finally get to pick your brain in person and 79 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 1: dive into things that I've kind of been curious about 80 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: for years and have went out in the field and 81 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 1: tested and tried and thought about and then oftentimes wonder man. 82 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 1: I'd like to ask you know, I'd like to ask 83 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:56,160 Speaker 1: Jared about this. I wonder what Lee would think about that. Uh, so, 84 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 1: so this is great. I'm looking forward to it and 85 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 1: uh there's lots to come or so if you're if 86 00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 1: you're up for if you had enough coffee this morning, 87 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 1: I'm thinking we should just get right into the meat 88 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 1: and potatoes and things. Yeah, yeah, I'm good with that. Mark. 89 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: I appreciate you having me. Yeah. What I was hoping 90 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:17,480 Speaker 1: to do was was dissect your approach to deer hunting. 91 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 1: And it seems like you had a somewhat similar beginning 92 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:26,039 Speaker 1: to your deer hunting journey to me. Um, given that 93 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 1: you were hunting up in northern Michigan and your family 94 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: was kind of put the bait out there and sit 95 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: over it and wait on things, right, Um, remember right 96 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,799 Speaker 1: on that? Yeah, spot on, as as most of us 97 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 1: Michiganders exactly. So I lived the same life and uh 98 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: it never worked very well for us. And from what 99 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,800 Speaker 1: I get from what I hear, it seems like you 100 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 1: did that for a long time and then you had 101 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 1: an aha moment, You had some kind of shift in 102 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 1: your perspective and then things started changing for you. Can 103 00:05:56,480 --> 00:06:00,320 Speaker 1: you describe what that ah ha moment or series of moments. 104 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 1: Was that took you from you know, hunting the way 105 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:05,560 Speaker 1: you always used to and having the same old, same 106 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 1: old results to all of a sudden changing and seeing 107 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:14,680 Speaker 1: a different set of results. What was that for you? Yeah, 108 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:17,480 Speaker 1: I would say if if there was a I wouldn't 109 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 1: say it was one particular hunt, but it was probably 110 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: a particular season and or seasons, you know, kind of 111 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:28,600 Speaker 1: when I was I would say, thirteen, fourteen years old. 112 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:31,320 Speaker 1: We moved to the Upper Peninsula when I was thirteen. 113 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: When I was twelve actually um, but the fall by 114 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 1: the time I was fall of eighty eight, I was 115 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:42,799 Speaker 1: thirteen that fall, and so that was my first experience, 116 00:06:42,839 --> 00:06:47,840 Speaker 1: my second year bow hunting. UM. And we we met 117 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 1: some neighbors up in the in the up there that 118 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's just kind of took us under their 119 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 1: wing and said, you know, this is how we do it. 120 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 1: You know. So we were truck and baited in to 121 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 1: our spots, you know, almost on a daily basis. Fourth 122 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 1: season and then uh, you start hunting these spots come 123 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 1: season and in hindsight, you know, you look back and 124 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 1: you're like, the first one or two sits was really it, 125 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: and then it was done. You know they were onto you, 126 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 1: onto us. We weren't looking at wind, wind direction or 127 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 1: whether you know, really at all. It was just go 128 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 1: hunt your bait. You know, here's your tree standard or 129 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 1: your ground blind and just hunt it. So in that season, 130 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: I don't think I had any opportunities that first year, 131 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:33,239 Speaker 1: but the second year I wounded. Um. I wounded three 132 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 1: different bucks when I was fourteen. That was part of 133 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: an AHA moment as far as equipment and preparation, and 134 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:43,000 Speaker 1: we all go through that stuff, and I think that's 135 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: part of the learning phase of things. And then when 136 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 1: I was fifteen, I ended up killing four bucks. I 137 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 1: shot my first buck ever out in Colorado. I wanted 138 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: a mule there hunt with my dad. But then I 139 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:58,119 Speaker 1: got back to Michigan and I killed my first buck 140 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:00,040 Speaker 1: with a bow, and then I killed two bucks with 141 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 1: a gun back when you could kill four in Michigan. Um. 142 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: But as as those those couple of seasons were really 143 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: where things transitioned from hunting over bait all the time 144 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:16,240 Speaker 1: and gradually seeing less and less and less two then 145 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 1: UM kind of realizing that okay, my first few chances 146 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: are it, you know, and then I blew them, and 147 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: then starting to actually have some success and and score. 148 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 1: But then those spots didn't keep working out, you know, 149 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: things changed, and so um, part of part of what 150 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: I was realizing is and I think it was, uh, 151 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: my dad had a theater stand. Um, he had a 152 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,559 Speaker 1: tree stand in a clump of theaters, and and he 153 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:49,480 Speaker 1: baited it all the time. And first again, first few sets, 154 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 1: you know, one of us would have some action. I 155 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,760 Speaker 1: think my brother, Um, I think he wounded a spike 156 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 1: corn out of that stand. Um that season might have 157 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 1: my timing off. But I sat it a week or 158 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 1: so later and I just wasn't seeing Dear, But I 159 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 1: was seeing them coming out of this other side of 160 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 1: this field. Um, you know, there's it was an egg 161 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:13,280 Speaker 1: or anything. It was just an opening in the in 162 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,440 Speaker 1: the swamp basically. But I was watching him come out 163 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:19,440 Speaker 1: of this other side. And so you know, I'm I'm 164 00:09:19,480 --> 00:09:21,680 Speaker 1: sick of not seeing Dear. I just started. I went 165 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 1: for a walk and I got over there and I 166 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 1: found two or three fresh rubs and in a kind 167 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 1: of runway, and I was like, well, I might as 168 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: well try it, you know, so and and I actually 169 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: found an old it was an old ladder stand that gosh, 170 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 1: I probably hadn't been used in twenty years. So I 171 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:42,040 Speaker 1: kind of secured them some things up and I sat 172 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:45,319 Speaker 1: that in the first evening, I sat that I had 173 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: a small nine pointer, which it was a three year 174 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,839 Speaker 1: old buck in the ups, you know, about as old 175 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: as they get some sometime as you would think. Um, 176 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: but I had a three year old buck. It was October, 177 00:09:56,960 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 1: I believe, um walking just kind of shadowing Adulla that evening. 178 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: She walked right past me and then he walked by 179 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: me at fifteen yards And that was my first buck. 180 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,360 Speaker 1: And it wasn't over bait. It was just a natural 181 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: movement thing in the swamps up there, and and I 182 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: was hooked. It was like, get me away from these 183 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,160 Speaker 1: bait piles. And so that that was kind of what 184 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:22,600 Speaker 1: it became. Is um, just that realization of number one 185 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:25,719 Speaker 1: getting off of bait, and but more more still than 186 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: the bait, because I do believe baiting can be very effective, 187 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:32,080 Speaker 1: and I've done it since then. Um, But it's that 188 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:36,640 Speaker 1: realization of educating the deer and they be an onto 189 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 1: your presence and uh and just avoiding you. And it's 190 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 1: not that they leave the country or the county. Um, 191 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 1: it's not that they even go nocturnal, and in many 192 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 1: cases it's that they just know that, hey, there's hunters 193 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:52,040 Speaker 1: there and I'm not going to go there. So so 194 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: the next couple of years in high school, like I 195 00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:59,320 Speaker 1: usually killed um, three year old bucks are better just 196 00:10:59,400 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: by doing UH. And that was really cool. I mean 197 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:06,760 Speaker 1: that independence number one of breaking away and just not 198 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:11,200 Speaker 1: hunting dad's stands anymore, but picking my own spots UM 199 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:14,680 Speaker 1: usually away from bait and then UH and and having 200 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:19,679 Speaker 1: more success. So once I got to Southern Michigan, UM, 201 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 1: I was playing college baseball, so we didn't have much 202 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:24,440 Speaker 1: time to to hunt, but usually by the end of 203 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 1: October we were done. We had one of our our 204 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 1: friends or friends of the team I should say, one 205 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: of the boosters that had some land and he let 206 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:37,079 Speaker 1: me in another teammate hunt there. I got down there 207 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:38,920 Speaker 1: and I thought I was in heaven. I mean I 208 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 1: was seeing like one or two year old bucks every set. 209 00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: And I had never hunted out of a portable tree 210 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,839 Speaker 1: stand and I didn't have one yet, I didn't own one. 211 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: So we're sitting on the ground every night, and we 212 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 1: were you know, they were approaching us from the wrong 213 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:56,440 Speaker 1: side or we didn't have shooting lanes cut. It was 214 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 1: just like Willie Nilly, you know, it was so only 215 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: mobile hunting, but not with the kind of equipment that 216 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:06,040 Speaker 1: would have made me much more effective back then. But 217 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 1: UM really cool, UM, really cool history to to look 218 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: back on those memories of stumbling my way through, um 219 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: figuring things out. And then once I remember the first 220 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: lock on stand. I got a lock on limb tree 221 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:25,360 Speaker 1: stand UM from d n R Sports Center in Kilna Zoo. 222 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: And that was you know, that was it. I was. 223 00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: I was like, oh my gosh, I've got it made. 224 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: Now I can get up in a tree and you know, 225 00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:37,400 Speaker 1: use these screw in steps and stuff, and UM, so 226 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 1: I started having some more success. And then I met 227 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: a guy when I was going to grad school at 228 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 1: you have Them, UM, I met a guy that also 229 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:49,400 Speaker 1: kind of took me under his wing. I was door 230 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,000 Speaker 1: knocking all day on a Saturday Sunday in the ann 231 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 1: Arbor area and uh, I met a good friend to 232 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: this day that um let me hunt with him and 233 00:12:59,800 --> 00:13:01,760 Speaker 1: he was the first one that put me on the 234 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: lone wolf stands UM. And so I remember sitting in 235 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 1: this stand one morning. He had he had a stand 236 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 1: and he's like, well, just you know, just choose this one. 237 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,640 Speaker 1: And and I was sitting in it that morning. It 238 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:18,440 Speaker 1: was frosty and cold, and I'm sitting there like this 239 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 1: stand isn't squeaking, and what's going on? I started trying 240 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:27,720 Speaker 1: to make it squeak. I'll be done. I mean, I 241 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:30,199 Speaker 1: got to talk to him about this, and and that 242 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:38,320 Speaker 1: was I think it was like, um seven and and 243 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 1: he told me about him and how much they cost 244 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 1: you because they were always been a lot more than 245 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 1: the rest of them out there. But I'm like, oh 246 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:48,679 Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm in college. I can't get those yet. Um. 247 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 1: But then fast forward a couple of years once I 248 00:13:51,320 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 1: finished graduate school. UM, my stepbrother had started a knife company, 249 00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 1: and um, I was helping him out with trade show 250 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,520 Speaker 1: see runs. He owns Rapid River Knife Works up in 251 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:08,000 Speaker 1: Rapid River, Michigan. And when when I was at those shows, 252 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:11,360 Speaker 1: that was when I first met Andre and and and 253 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 1: Dan Infalt. And with my background and art and design 254 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: and photography and video and in my previous few years 255 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 1: of hunting out alone wolves and getting more mobile and 256 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 1: having more success and always being a fan of videos 257 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: and watching you know, probably yourself. You know Dan Fitzgerald 258 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: and and all the video guys that you know, the 259 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 1: real true Monster Buck series, and watching every hunting video, 260 00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:42,280 Speaker 1: I could nobody's talking about how to how to kill 261 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 1: these bucks, you know, in a pressured situation or um 262 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 1: on a you know, non outfitted basis. Um, they're just 263 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 1: they're just all about um plugging, plugging their products or 264 00:14:56,040 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 1: or the outfitter that they're with. And at those shows 265 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: was when I started talking to those guys about you know, 266 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:05,520 Speaker 1: what if what if we made a video that taught 267 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:09,000 Speaker 1: people how to do it? And that was kind of 268 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: the birth of things. Yeah, and and that that's a 269 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 1: great segue because those videos, because I think I mentioned 270 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: at the top, really were foundational for a lot of people. 271 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 1: I mean a lot of people that are today super 272 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,320 Speaker 1: successful in the white tail woods, uh can point back 273 00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: to those as as being a great, great start for them. 274 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: I mean it helped me a ton and a bunch 275 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:37,400 Speaker 1: of my hunting buddies. I know, probably twelve thirteen years 276 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: ago maybe is when I picked him up and all 277 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: my friends are, yeah, you gotta watch this, you gotta 278 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 1: watch this, And I did, and it helped just click 279 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:49,040 Speaker 1: help click things together. Um, and if anyone hasn't watched 280 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:51,840 Speaker 1: those videos, they should. But what I'm really curious about, 281 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:53,800 Speaker 1: I want to go through a bunch of other things 282 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 1: that you did discuss in there, But at a high level, 283 00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:01,320 Speaker 1: I'm wondering you did your has your general roach? Maybe 284 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 1: let me take one step back. You kind of talked 285 00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 1: us through where you came from as far as how 286 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:11,160 Speaker 1: you start hunting and how that evolved, and you you 287 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:13,640 Speaker 1: you kind of fell into the idea that being mobile 288 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 1: helps etcetera, etcetera. But now, can you tell me if 289 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: you were in a elevator and you had thirty seconds 290 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: before you got to the fifth floor that you're gonna 291 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:26,720 Speaker 1: get off, and there's one of the persons that elevator 292 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: with you, and you need to explain like this is 293 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:32,600 Speaker 1: this is my hunting philosophy, this is the key to 294 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 1: my hunting success, and thirty seconds that that generalizes your 295 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 1: approach to targeting mature white tail box. How would you 296 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: how would you sum that up quickly as like the 297 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:49,440 Speaker 1: Jared already approach today? Yeah, it's it's probably gonna sound 298 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: like others you've talked to um, But if I had 299 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,960 Speaker 1: thirty seconds, I would tell them figure out where a 300 00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: buck bets where the buck you want to kill his betting, 301 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 1: and don't let him know you're hunting him. And and 302 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:05,760 Speaker 1: that's that's really what it comes down to. When I 303 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 1: started learning where deer we're living and learning how to 304 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 1: figure out if you had one around. You know, obviously 305 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:16,919 Speaker 1: trail cameras have helped that immensely, but if you have 306 00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:20,399 Speaker 1: one around, that's worth hunting, figuring out where he's living, 307 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:25,200 Speaker 1: where he's spending his time. Um. Then and and then 308 00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:30,480 Speaker 1: the general observation that don't let them know you're hunting him. 309 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 1: That that kind of sums it up for me. You 310 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: it comes to, like Andre coined the phrase virgin sits. 311 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 1: You know, you just you gotta have that element of surprise. Um. 312 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,320 Speaker 1: But that that's really what it's about to me too. 313 00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: You just can't over hunt stuff to the point where 314 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 1: they are educated. Um. There there several times now where 315 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:54,919 Speaker 1: you guys think I don't ever hunt the same spot 316 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:58,159 Speaker 1: twice in a season, and that's not true. Um. I 317 00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:01,360 Speaker 1: may hunt him a few times times, especially during the rut, 318 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,160 Speaker 1: you know, when things are different, but in general it's 319 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 1: not to the point where they're educated. You know, we 320 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,960 Speaker 1: can keep things fresh by moving around. Yeah, well, let's 321 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 1: let's start the first part of that, then the whole 322 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 1: aspect of betting knowing where they live. Um, it's pretty 323 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:20,800 Speaker 1: intuitive in a lot of ways, but if you had 324 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:26,159 Speaker 1: to describe for yourself, why do you view understanding betting 325 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: as the number one first you know, first priority when 326 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:30,640 Speaker 1: you're trying to figure out a new place or trying 327 00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 1: to put together hunting strategy in your thoughts? Why is 328 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 1: that so important? Why is that the crux to everything else? Well, 329 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:43,479 Speaker 1: the main reason is because that's what dear do their 330 00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:46,199 Speaker 1: day is they bed, they're they're in their bed a 331 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:48,439 Speaker 1: mature buck. I'm not going to talk about does or 332 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 1: young bucks, but um, that mature buck is most most 333 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:56,160 Speaker 1: of the time going to be betted. Um. And so 334 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:59,120 Speaker 1: when you look at the big picture of whether it's 335 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 1: a morning hunt or an evening hunt, you have to 336 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 1: be x amount of yards from that deer's bed in 337 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 1: order to have any chance of seeing him in daylight 338 00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 1: that day. And in some states that might be a 339 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:14,720 Speaker 1: few hundred yards or more um. In other states and 340 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 1: areas it may be fifty or a hundred yards UM. 341 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:22,160 Speaker 1: So that's that's really why it's so important because that's 342 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: where they spend the daylight hours, and that's all we 343 00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 1: have to hunt them. Um. And and then you you know, 344 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 1: so from there you figure out where's the chink in 345 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,880 Speaker 1: his armor that's gonna allow me to see him when 346 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: he's on his feet. Yeah, let's let's talk about then, 347 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: how you identify those spots. Um. You guys did a 348 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 1: great job covering this in the in the DVDs in 349 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: the past. I'm curious. I want to walk through each 350 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,480 Speaker 1: of the different major terrain types and how you look 351 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 1: about how you think about identifying those betting ears. But 352 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 1: in particular, I'm really interested in also if your views 353 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 1: have evolved at all on any of these things since 354 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 1: those original videos. So, for example, when it comes to 355 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:07,639 Speaker 1: like swamps and marshes and you're thinking about betting, um, 356 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,639 Speaker 1: can you walk me through, you know, where some somebody 357 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 1: should start looking for that, what kinds of features will 358 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: help them keen on what where those buck betting areas 359 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:18,360 Speaker 1: might be. And then is there anything different now than 360 00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 1: you know fifteen or however many years ago it was 361 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,399 Speaker 1: when you guys put this information out to the public 362 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:26,240 Speaker 1: on those videos. Yeah. The cool thing about it, and 363 00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:29,880 Speaker 1: this was a big reason I I saw a value 364 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,119 Speaker 1: in making those videos is because I think it's timeless information. 365 00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 1: I mean, unless the terrain changes and the topography changes, 366 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 1: I really don't see a big difference or a shift 367 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: in in how they bed now versus twenty years ago. 368 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:48,200 Speaker 1: If things are the same. Obviously, foliage and you know, um, 369 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 1: trees and brush will grow and and change, and the 370 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 1: canopy and those kind of things can change. Pressure can 371 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:57,879 Speaker 1: change what they're doing, but all else be an equal. 372 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,880 Speaker 1: I don't see a big difference in and what they're doing, 373 00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 1: especially with hill country and thermals. Um, they still will 374 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 1: bed too to those advantages. You know where they want 375 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 1: to look, you know, look to where they can't see, 376 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 1: and smell what's behind them and smell thermals coming up. 377 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:21,119 Speaker 1: In the general sense bed and betting on lee sides 378 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: of hills. I mean, to this day, I still use 379 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: that for success hunting elk out west honey, mule deer 380 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 1: out West Um. Last year I killed an elk and 381 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: a mule deer, and it was largely because of those 382 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: those concepts in those videos. When I when I look 383 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:41,119 Speaker 1: at a new spot or a historical spot that I 384 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 1: may have known for a long time, those are still 385 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 1: the concepts that will ring true. So if you learn 386 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:51,200 Speaker 1: those in and you know, really keep those in mind 387 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 1: with any spot you're hunting, they're gonna stay pretty true 388 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:58,439 Speaker 1: to form. Yeah. So so let's do a little more 389 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:01,800 Speaker 1: detail then into that that hill country example you describe. 390 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: You mentioned a bunch of things. They're kind of rapid 391 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 1: fire least out of the hill, you know, catching wind 392 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:09,960 Speaker 1: over their back. But can you can you maybe paint 393 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: the picture in a little bit more detail of exactly 394 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 1: the type of spots you're going to key in on 395 00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 1: and and why you think those bucks prefer those places. Yeah, 396 00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's all about a deer having an advantage, um, 397 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: the best advantage he can to survive, you know. And 398 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,520 Speaker 1: it's not just humans, but it's against predators and andre 399 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 1: and I talked about this many many years ago, but um, 400 00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: humans are a small percentage of the threats that a 401 00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:44,760 Speaker 1: buck or any deer has out in the wild. Um 402 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:49,679 Speaker 1: so when you I guess, uh, trying to think of 403 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,600 Speaker 1: a better analogy offhand, but um, it's it's like anything, 404 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,480 Speaker 1: you know, the dominant animal is going to get the 405 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,960 Speaker 1: best spot, right, and the best spots seem to be. 406 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:04,119 Speaker 1: You know, where those mature bucks are betting. It typically 407 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:10,320 Speaker 1: is in those types of scenarios. So if it's hill country, um, 408 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: they want to have the wind to their advantage, of 409 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:18,720 Speaker 1: visual visual to their advantage. And so what what we've seen, 410 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:21,240 Speaker 1: and this is what this was in the early two 411 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 1: thousand's when when I first started hunting the steeper stuff 412 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 1: out west, you know, along the Mississippi and stuff. I'd 413 00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:31,119 Speaker 1: sit there in the bottom of the valley, I'd get winded. Um. 414 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,320 Speaker 1: I don't know how many times it took me, but 415 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:38,679 Speaker 1: I'm watching these deer just regularly about a third of 416 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 1: the way down from the top of the hill. And 417 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 1: so over those years, as as I started scouting more 418 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:49,000 Speaker 1: and walking those hills and just seeing really observing what's 419 00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:53,280 Speaker 1: going on. Um, you've got a collision of air currents 420 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 1: um just over the edge. It's not necessarily a third, 421 00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: it's not always right over the top or or halfway 422 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,240 Speaker 1: up or anything. But there's a collision of air currents 423 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,720 Speaker 1: when you have a prevailing wind coming over a ridge 424 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 1: and you have thermals from the bottom coming up. And 425 00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: again this is during the daytime, not you know, usually 426 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,720 Speaker 1: it's depend on the temperature shift that day, it's an 427 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,440 Speaker 1: hour or two after daylight. But as those thermals come 428 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: up and a prevailing wind comes over, there's we kind 429 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,919 Speaker 1: of we coined at this thermal tunnel or a mixing 430 00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 1: zone where those air currents collide. And that's really where 431 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 1: those deer like to bed because they've got the best 432 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 1: of both worlds. They've got wind in their face coming 433 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:40,560 Speaker 1: up and a prevailing wind coming over the top. So 434 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:45,600 Speaker 1: they feel pretty invincible there. And and it's it rings 435 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: true to this day. I mean, if I go anywhere 436 00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 1: almost anywhere, but in hill country where you've got systems 437 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: of ridges and fingers and points going off of ridges, 438 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: and you walk those ridges, that's tip quickly where you're 439 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: going to find your beds. And the best buck bedding 440 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:09,959 Speaker 1: um is typically on points um given prevailing winds. You know. 441 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: So it's gonna shift based on where prevailing wind is, 442 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:16,640 Speaker 1: but they're going to typically be on those on those 443 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:21,200 Speaker 1: points um where they have that advantage to themselves. So 444 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:24,480 Speaker 1: and it may or may not be with a tree 445 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 1: to their back or a blowdown to their back or something. 446 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:30,400 Speaker 1: Typically though, they like to butt up to some cover 447 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:33,600 Speaker 1: behind them um where they can see in front of 448 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 1: them and not be approached from behind. Um. But yeah, 449 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: that's that's what we're observing. Yeah, So what about a 450 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: scenario like this. I've encountered this myself, where I've gone 451 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,400 Speaker 1: and been scouting that kind of area looking for these 452 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,119 Speaker 1: places where you think bucks of bed and there's sometimes 453 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:53,680 Speaker 1: these ridge systems where there's points coming off frequently, many 454 00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: of these points that seem pretty similar, all poking off 455 00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,920 Speaker 1: the main ridge out into the larger drainage. And every 456 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,400 Speaker 1: one of those points, we'll have a handful of beds 457 00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: on it. A couple here, the next one, we'll have 458 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,879 Speaker 1: a couple to three here, next one, we'll have the 459 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 1: same kind of thing. And when you go down a 460 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,480 Speaker 1: ridge and there's nine points like that over the course 461 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:13,199 Speaker 1: of I don't know, a half mile or something, and 462 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,479 Speaker 1: they all have beds on them, and they all have 463 00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,760 Speaker 1: some rubs coming up off the top. How do you like? 464 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: What are the things you think about when trying to 465 00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,359 Speaker 1: prioritize or trying to figure out, Okay, this is where 466 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 1: the mature bucks actually spending most of the time, or 467 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 1: these few are where the mature buck is spending the 468 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:32,119 Speaker 1: most time. Um, have you ever encountered situation like that, 469 00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: where there seems like there's so many potential great spots 470 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 1: for a for a group of bucks or a buck 471 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 1: to bed. Yeah, I guess maybe not exactly like that, 472 00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:44,440 Speaker 1: but I know what you mean. I mean, we're sometimes 473 00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: the sign can just look so similar that it's hard 474 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:52,920 Speaker 1: to point out anyone particular spot to start, right. And 475 00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: and that's that's quite awesome the case. I mean, it's 476 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:59,359 Speaker 1: it's rare, um that you go out and you find 477 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 1: just the or fixed scenario of oh my gosh, this 478 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:06,480 Speaker 1: point at this point only has giant rubs and big 479 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 1: beds and nothing else does. Um, that's kind of rare, right, 480 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,840 Speaker 1: I've done. Like when I hunted the big woods in Ohio. Um, 481 00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 1: this is probably about six or eight years ago, when 482 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,399 Speaker 1: I probably longer than eight or ten years ago, when 483 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 1: I first started hunting down there, um, and I kind 484 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:28,160 Speaker 1: of saw that scenario. And I spent basically two full 485 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 1: days walking nothing but big woods and ridges and stuff. 486 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,359 Speaker 1: And in those two full days, I found about three 487 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:38,280 Speaker 1: points that just kind of stuck out more than others 488 00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 1: where those ones did have the big rubs and the 489 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,359 Speaker 1: rest were pretty similar, you know. And so part of 490 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:48,680 Speaker 1: it for me is Um, you know there's always that balance. Okay, 491 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:50,280 Speaker 1: how much time do you have? You know, I don't 492 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 1: have a full week to scout this or to hunt it. Maybe, UM, 493 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:57,360 Speaker 1: you go down with a certain plan that I've got 494 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,919 Speaker 1: three days, I'm gonna scout for two days and or 495 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:02,800 Speaker 1: one day, or I'm gonna scout all day and I'm 496 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 1: gonna hunt the evening. It all depends on your individual plan, right, 497 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 1: and so if you walk all day and you you 498 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:14,840 Speaker 1: see nothing but similar sign then you're gonna end up 499 00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: taking a flyer, right, taking your best guess. Um, you 500 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 1: may put out cameras and try to hone in on 501 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: what the difference is. UM. Typically too, if you're if 502 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: it's a time of year, like I guess, if it's 503 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,240 Speaker 1: early season, you're probably not just blowing through and scouting 504 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 1: ridges like that are super thick and really hard to 505 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:40,960 Speaker 1: walk through. Um, it's probably opening up and it's late October. 506 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 1: So I'm I'm more so keying in on some primary 507 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 1: scrapes along those ridges because, um, especially Ohio or Wisconsin, 508 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: they're a little more apt than Michigan to be on 509 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:57,520 Speaker 1: their feet, you know. But um, primary scrapes on ridges 510 00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 1: tend to be something that will pop up. If you 511 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:05,239 Speaker 1: walk enough, you're going to find areas that okay, this 512 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 1: is where the bucks in the area are are moving towards, 513 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 1: even though the points may look similar. Um, then then 514 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: that that tends to be your focus. But yeah, I mean, 515 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: if if you've got pretty generic sign, then uh, you 516 00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: gotta start somewhere right, and then you start that's we're 517 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 1: bopping around tends to help, but you're also trying to 518 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:32,720 Speaker 1: factor in lots of things, you know, whether you're shining 519 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: the area and what you're seeing, or you're running trail cameras, 520 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 1: or you're talking to somebody, or you've got pictures or visuals, um, 521 00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,680 Speaker 1: something is going to indicate Okay, I've seen a big 522 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:47,280 Speaker 1: one in this area or somebody else has, and then 523 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,600 Speaker 1: you start scouting and trying to hone in on it, 524 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 1: you know, and putting those puzzle pieces together so and 525 00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 1: and knowing that, Okay, if a buck was seen in daylight, 526 00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 1: he was you know, and unless it's peak or something 527 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: where he may have traveled a long ways, if he 528 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:07,480 Speaker 1: was seen in daylight somewhere, he's probably not moved real 529 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 1: far from his bed. So now you've got something you 530 00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:14,720 Speaker 1: can hone in on. Um, like just that natural assumption 531 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,760 Speaker 1: that if a buck's on his feet in the evening, 532 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 1: whether it's a field edge or anywhere, Um, yeah, he 533 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 1: probably hasn't moved real far from where he's betted. So 534 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:29,040 Speaker 1: now you've got somewhere to start. Yeah, I want to 535 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 1: dive just a little more into something you just mentioned 536 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:35,440 Speaker 1: that being you know, you just described this example as 537 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,160 Speaker 1: being it would work if it was outside the rut. 538 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 1: But what about inside the rut? How do your views 539 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 1: on these buck beds and bedding areas? Does that just 540 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:47,400 Speaker 1: go all out out the window during the rut and 541 00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: you're just going to focus on you know, travel corridors 542 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,200 Speaker 1: and does or do you still in the back of 543 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 1: your mind keeping keep where those buckbeds worthy you discovered 544 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 1: earlier in the year. How does all this factor in 545 00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 1: in November? Yeah, in the peak of the rut, I'm 546 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: more so focused on the dope doe betting areas and 547 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 1: the travel corridors between those buck areas and the buck 548 00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: pending betting points and the doe betting areas. So if 549 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: it's too late now for scrapes and and that primary 550 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:23,400 Speaker 1: scrape hunting um, then I'm more keyed in on those 551 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:28,600 Speaker 1: travel zones around dough betting areas because that's that that 552 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 1: to me, is the ticket. Um. And it can also 553 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:34,280 Speaker 1: be food. You know, it depends if you're hunting private 554 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 1: and you've got food plots and doughs are coming in, 555 00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:41,080 Speaker 1: and yeah, that that becomes an easier scenario. But I 556 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:45,520 Speaker 1: mean if you're hunting big woods, Um, I'm keying in 557 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,720 Speaker 1: on doe betting areas and I've I've watched it, you 558 00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 1: know where, especially in Iowa. Um, I've seen bucks just 559 00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,280 Speaker 1: sent check doe betting areas one after another after another. 560 00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:58,640 Speaker 1: And and even if they're younger bucks, you just see that. Okay, 561 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,880 Speaker 1: that's the pattern, that's what they're doing. Um. So yeah, 562 00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 1: that's that's that's the tactic I shift towards. Is hunting 563 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: the dough betting areas makes sense? Now you mentioned the 564 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:14,600 Speaker 1: fact that if it's too late for primary scrapes, what's 565 00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: the time frame that you think is right for hunting 566 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:19,640 Speaker 1: those primary scrapes and for people that don't know and 567 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 1: and honestly, I guess everyone kind of has a slightly 568 00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:24,480 Speaker 1: different definition of what they're talking about. When they mentioned 569 00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 1: primary scrapes can you define for you what that looks like, 570 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:29,880 Speaker 1: and then what's the sweet spot when you're keying in 571 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:34,000 Speaker 1: on those kinds of spots. Yeah, So the primary scrapes 572 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:36,240 Speaker 1: are not those big scrapes you typically see on a 573 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 1: field edge, or you know when you see a field 574 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 1: edge littered with ten of them and there's one big 575 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: one there. Those aren't typically the primary scrapes. The primary 576 00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:48,680 Speaker 1: scrapes are are more so in thicker cover. Um. They're 577 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 1: closer to where that buck is betting or where those 578 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:56,400 Speaker 1: doughs are betting, and they're more frequently checked. Um, and 579 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: they're they're very killable over those scrapes. And late October 580 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,560 Speaker 1: the best generality I can give you With late October, 581 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 1: it can be very early November. It can be third 582 00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:11,160 Speaker 1: week of October. Um, depending on what area of the 583 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:15,400 Speaker 1: Midwest that we're in. I'm not going to get into Canada. 584 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 1: I've never white tail hunted in Canada, but um yeah 585 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: around here. I mean, what's really keyed I've keyed in 586 00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: on is from basically October through um November two November three. 587 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 1: To give you an example of what I've learned in 588 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: the last few years, I've hunted um a particular farm. 589 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:44,320 Speaker 1: And one of the things I've I've taken pride in 590 00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,000 Speaker 1: over the last twenty plus years and the deer I've 591 00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,360 Speaker 1: killed is I can't think of any of them that 592 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: have come out of the same tree, and most of 593 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 1: them have been on different farms because I don't own 594 00:33:55,840 --> 00:33:59,560 Speaker 1: farms or don't own land besides my small acreage I've 595 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:03,080 Speaker 1: got behind my house. I don't on land to be 596 00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: able to, you know, have something locked up forever. And 597 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:08,799 Speaker 1: I've had success on a lot of different fimers, in 598 00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:12,720 Speaker 1: a lot of different places, in different trees. Um, because 599 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 1: I know the elements that I'm looking forward to have success. 600 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,880 Speaker 1: It's not it's not about just finding one spot and 601 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 1: then scoring every year in that spot. Um. But a 602 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:28,399 Speaker 1: spot that Lee and I hunt together, um man. It's 603 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 1: what's really cool is when you do get a couple 604 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,759 Speaker 1: of three seasons to hunt the same spot. Um. My 605 00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:38,239 Speaker 1: trail cameras have shown me daylight activity of bucks on 606 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:46,120 Speaker 1: scrapes from probably October ish until November two, and then 607 00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 1: it just almost shuts right off and you know the 608 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,160 Speaker 1: dose have come in to heat. The bucks are locked 609 00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 1: on does and they're not on the scrapes and that's 610 00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:57,560 Speaker 1: just the way it is there. It's uh, it's really 611 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 1: almost cut and dry. We've had really good action in 612 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:04,080 Speaker 1: that late October area up until about November two, and 613 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:05,680 Speaker 1: then it just shuts right off and then it will 614 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,439 Speaker 1: kick back in around November twelve. And that's uh, that's 615 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,960 Speaker 1: that's pretty consistent to a lot of things that that 616 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,479 Speaker 1: I've seen to it's and the research bears out too. 617 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:20,920 Speaker 1: I think that they've shown peak peak scraping activity is 618 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:23,240 Speaker 1: right right in that same pocket, in that same window. 619 00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: So makes makes all the sense in the world. Um. 620 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 1: You know something that just a random analogy that popped 621 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:31,959 Speaker 1: in my mind as we were talking a second ago, 622 00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,440 Speaker 1: when you mentioned how you have to take this scouting 623 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 1: information and then layer it with something like a trail 624 00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:43,759 Speaker 1: camera picture over a scrape or siting or you know, 625 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,960 Speaker 1: whatever other information you have. You can't just rely on 626 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:50,359 Speaker 1: that scouted point. And you know, knowing that it's kind 627 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:54,439 Speaker 1: of like layering pieces of Swiss cheese, Like you've got 628 00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,720 Speaker 1: that first layer of Swiss cheese that tells you, Okay, 629 00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:00,280 Speaker 1: I scouted this area and I saw six different points 630 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,799 Speaker 1: that all could have a buck betting on them. That's 631 00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:05,400 Speaker 1: one layer but there's still holes in it, right, And 632 00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,479 Speaker 1: then you need to take another slice of Swiss cheese, 633 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 1: and maybe that's your trail camera information, or maybe that's 634 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:14,279 Speaker 1: glassing from a field edge and seeing where these deer 635 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:16,320 Speaker 1: popping out, and that's going to give you another level 636 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 1: of information. You layer that on top and that covers 637 00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 1: some of the holes, but maybe you still have a 638 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:24,520 Speaker 1: couple more. So then you've got to take another slice 639 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: and maybe this is uh, you know, historical information. You've 640 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,920 Speaker 1: hunted it two years prior, so you've been able to 641 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:31,839 Speaker 1: deserve some things over the years. You take that and 642 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 1: if you stack enough layers like that, all of a 643 00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,719 Speaker 1: sudden you cover all the holes and you've got stuff 644 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:40,400 Speaker 1: figured out. But you can't depend on any one single piece, 645 00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:43,920 Speaker 1: or you narrow it down to the one hole that's 646 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,479 Speaker 1: still showing, and you know that's that's it again. And yeah, 647 00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,480 Speaker 1: I think of it as putting a puzzle puzzle together 648 00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,440 Speaker 1: and you're getting more and more pieces, and the Swiss 649 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: cheese is a good one too. I mean, that's a 650 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,680 Speaker 1: good a good picture. People can think in their head 651 00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:02,120 Speaker 1: of the data that you're gathering and how you're honing 652 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:06,799 Speaker 1: in on what's ultimately gonna give you success because we 653 00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:08,600 Speaker 1: only have to do it once. You know, you don't 654 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: have to be right once true true, sometimes easier said 655 00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:17,759 Speaker 1: than done, but you get those pieces together, it's a 656 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 1: pretty nice thing. Now, what about what about this set 657 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 1: of scenarios we're talking about trying to understand betting, trying 658 00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:26,360 Speaker 1: to understand how these bucks are gonna, you know, relate 659 00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:29,839 Speaker 1: to terrain. But let's shift the area from a health 660 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 1: country scenario to a marshy, swampy kind of situation. Um. 661 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:38,680 Speaker 1: Can you can you walk me through the habitat types 662 00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:41,000 Speaker 1: and features and behavior as you're seeing in that kind 663 00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:48,399 Speaker 1: of scenario. Yeah, So the best analogy I can give 664 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:52,680 Speaker 1: you relates more to rivers and in a swamp scenario 665 00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:56,560 Speaker 1: around along rivers that that I'm more familiar with, um, 666 00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:59,439 Speaker 1: because you know, when I've I don't hunt as many 667 00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:04,399 Speaker 1: swamps and more in Wisconsin. UM, but around me, UM, 668 00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:09,239 Speaker 1: the typical scenarios are relating to rivers and river activity 669 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 1: and it's swampy, cattails, marsh and stuff in public areas. Um. 670 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:20,719 Speaker 1: What what you generally see and and I outlined this 671 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,799 Speaker 1: in in my farm country video as well, is they 672 00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:27,680 Speaker 1: bed relating to the rivers UM and the air currents 673 00:38:27,719 --> 00:38:31,160 Speaker 1: that flow along those river systems UM. So you have 674 00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: a prevailing wind, of course, but you also have your 675 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: UM here on shore offshore breezes. I'll describe them as 676 00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,759 Speaker 1: where the cooling of the air or just that settling 677 00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:46,600 Speaker 1: of the of the air currents UM changes you know, 678 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:50,120 Speaker 1: with air temperature and just in relation to the also 679 00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:54,480 Speaker 1: in relation to the topography. But what what we typically 680 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,680 Speaker 1: see are are them betting on ox bows UM or 681 00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,080 Speaker 1: some sort of hump or point that the go is 682 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:03,880 Speaker 1: out along the river. And and that's that's what I 683 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,640 Speaker 1: like to target. So you know we've I've seen this 684 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,480 Speaker 1: in Iowa, but it's it's the same in Michigan too. 685 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: If you scout river systems UM, you typically your thickest 686 00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:18,720 Speaker 1: cover is right up along those rivers and you've get 687 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,839 Speaker 1: you get cut banks to where they're those deer are 688 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:25,720 Speaker 1: less approachable from the river, so they'll bed on those 689 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:30,359 Speaker 1: humps or or those ox bows and they're not as 690 00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:32,279 Speaker 1: approachable there. You know, you've got to go through a 691 00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,000 Speaker 1: bunch of cover to get back into the oxbow or 692 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:39,000 Speaker 1: if you're on the river, UM they you know, you 693 00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:41,120 Speaker 1: may have a high bank that they'd have to approach, 694 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,919 Speaker 1: or they can they can see you, so they'll bed 695 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:48,760 Speaker 1: with that prevailing wind um coming from the field or something, 696 00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:52,160 Speaker 1: and then you know they're facing the river. They can 697 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:55,400 Speaker 1: just watch anything coming in the river or you know, 698 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,480 Speaker 1: by way of the river and escape back out through 699 00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 1: the cover, or if somebody comes crashing through there, they 700 00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:04,160 Speaker 1: can just drop down the river, drop across the river 701 00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:08,239 Speaker 1: and they're safe. So those those are the scenarios that UM, 702 00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:14,239 Speaker 1: I see the most and what relates to me around here. Um, 703 00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,840 Speaker 1: you don't have the quite the thermal activity and and 704 00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:21,319 Speaker 1: that kind of stuff because it's flatter ground. Um, but 705 00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 1: you do have that those breezes that go up and 706 00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,560 Speaker 1: down the river and that you can play to your advantage, 707 00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:34,239 Speaker 1: you know. So so that's that's the UM and that's 708 00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:37,200 Speaker 1: the scenario most relevant to what I'm I'm familiar with, 709 00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:40,560 Speaker 1: what I'm experienced with. Yeah, that's interesting. Do you find 710 00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:43,200 Speaker 1: that they will flip flop which side of the river 711 00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:45,719 Speaker 1: they're betting on based on if it's you know, let's 712 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:49,600 Speaker 1: say you've got a north south river and you're gonna 713 00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:52,120 Speaker 1: have a westerly wind more often. But then ever, once 714 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:55,360 Speaker 1: when I get that east. Would you see them flip flopping, 715 00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,440 Speaker 1: just like a buck might flip flop either side of 716 00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:02,640 Speaker 1: a ridge based on what direction the winds coming. Yeah, 717 00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:06,239 Speaker 1: I'm trying to I mean, the theory of that absolutely, 718 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:09,200 Speaker 1: um whether I've seen that directly, I'm trying to think 719 00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:12,000 Speaker 1: because in most cases you don't have the exact same 720 00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:14,839 Speaker 1: terrain on both sides of the river. There's reasons that 721 00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:17,440 Speaker 1: you know, if you've got a high cut bank on 722 00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,520 Speaker 1: one side, it's not high cut on the other side, 723 00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:22,000 Speaker 1: because that's not where the current is flowing. That's not 724 00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:25,000 Speaker 1: how it's bending. Will they bed further down on the 725 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:27,960 Speaker 1: other side. Yeah, absolutely, I mean I don't see why 726 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:35,000 Speaker 1: they wouldn't, um it. It also depends on it just 727 00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:38,359 Speaker 1: all depends on that particular farm or that land. Um, 728 00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:41,080 Speaker 1: how it lays out, you know. So if if your 729 00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:44,120 Speaker 1: spot is is good for a west wind, and then 730 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:46,759 Speaker 1: you've got an east wind that day, it might be 731 00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:48,680 Speaker 1: as simple as them bedding on the other side of 732 00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,160 Speaker 1: the river, or they may be on the other side 733 00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:52,879 Speaker 1: of the field, on the other side of the road, 734 00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:56,000 Speaker 1: in a different part of that property, or on a 735 00:41:56,040 --> 00:42:00,600 Speaker 1: different property. So yeah, it's it's completely dependent on on 736 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:04,880 Speaker 1: the elements of that particular land, but the theory in 737 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,520 Speaker 1: the in the principle absolutely I've seen. I've seen both 738 00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:11,520 Speaker 1: scenarios where yeah, they just flip, they flip to the 739 00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:13,319 Speaker 1: other side of the ridge or to the other side 740 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:16,440 Speaker 1: of the river, or they may be on a different 741 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:20,040 Speaker 1: property on the other side of the road. Yeah you mentioned, 742 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,879 Speaker 1: you know how this kind of scenario river winding through 743 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:26,840 Speaker 1: might might be applicable to some farmland type stuff. And 744 00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:30,000 Speaker 1: I've always thought that the hill country bedding is something 745 00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,600 Speaker 1: that that seems pretty easy to identify in a map 746 00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:34,520 Speaker 1: and they go there on foot and like, oh, yeah, 747 00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:36,600 Speaker 1: there's a bed right where they're supposed to be. And 748 00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:39,480 Speaker 1: you can look at a map of a swamp or 749 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,520 Speaker 1: something and and look for high ground islands in the 750 00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:44,560 Speaker 1: middle of it or point extending out of it, and 751 00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:46,160 Speaker 1: think to yourself, how there should be a bed there, 752 00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:47,480 Speaker 1: and you go and you take a look at Yep, 753 00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:52,440 Speaker 1: there's a bed. But general kind of generic farm country 754 00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,200 Speaker 1: where I hunt a lot of the time in southern Michigan, 755 00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 1: where there's no topography, there's no hills, where sometimes there's 756 00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,600 Speaker 1: no wet lands or swamp. It's just mixed egg and 757 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:05,719 Speaker 1: timber and little brush here and there, and it's that 758 00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:08,799 Speaker 1: sometimes is the hardest stuff, at least for me to 759 00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:12,080 Speaker 1: figure out, like where's the very best? Not right? How 760 00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,160 Speaker 1: do you think? I mean? I'm glad you mentioned that, 761 00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 1: because that's part of the reason I made that farm 762 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:20,239 Speaker 1: country video, because you think about, Okay, well there's swamps 763 00:43:20,280 --> 00:43:23,239 Speaker 1: and then there's hill country, and then farm country is 764 00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,080 Speaker 1: kind of like, whoa, what do you mean by that? 765 00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:28,680 Speaker 1: And it's exactly what you just described because you see 766 00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:32,160 Speaker 1: elements of everything in there, and you've got in most 767 00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:34,919 Speaker 1: cases a lot more of a people element to it. 768 00:43:35,400 --> 00:43:40,839 Speaker 1: So um, and and that's why I described that's kind 769 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:42,520 Speaker 1: of why I did them in that order as well, 770 00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:48,320 Speaker 1: because you've got flatter ground, let's just say, flatter ground 771 00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:54,040 Speaker 1: betting habits or or swamp swampland versus hill country. But 772 00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:58,000 Speaker 1: then farm farmland kind of incorporates a lot of things, 773 00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:00,200 Speaker 1: and so you kind of need to be experience it's 774 00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:04,960 Speaker 1: in all those elements in order to recognize what's going 775 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:11,560 Speaker 1: on in farmland. So um, it really just takes paying attention. 776 00:44:11,800 --> 00:44:13,800 Speaker 1: You know, the deer will tell you where they're betting 777 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:16,280 Speaker 1: if you just pay attention to where you're seeing them, 778 00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:19,720 Speaker 1: and where the sign is at, and where your friends 779 00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:23,080 Speaker 1: are seeing them, or where the landowners seeing them, and 780 00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:26,600 Speaker 1: and not being closed minded, you know, so I'm making it. 781 00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,040 Speaker 1: I made an specific point in that farm Country video 782 00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:35,799 Speaker 1: to talk about betting near the barns um and near 783 00:44:35,840 --> 00:44:39,200 Speaker 1: the people, because in so many cases and so many 784 00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:42,399 Speaker 1: stories I've heard of of bucks that lay down right 785 00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:45,920 Speaker 1: behind the barn or right by you know, the farm 786 00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:50,640 Speaker 1: equipment or whatever. They will bet wherever they need to 787 00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:54,200 Speaker 1: to stay safe, and in in a lot of cases 788 00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:58,160 Speaker 1: it's um, it's where they can keep an eye on 789 00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:01,040 Speaker 1: the people. So the mistake I see a lot of 790 00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:05,360 Speaker 1: hunters make is that assumption that they're just in the 791 00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:10,200 Speaker 1: thickest cover furthest away from people, and and I usually 792 00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:13,680 Speaker 1: see it's the opposite. I mean, it's it's usually where 793 00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:17,680 Speaker 1: they can keep tabs on people. So they're especially in 794 00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:22,759 Speaker 1: urban settings, um, but even in the more remote farmland, 795 00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:26,000 Speaker 1: they still tend to like to bed near the people 796 00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:28,560 Speaker 1: so that they can keep an eye on them. And 797 00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:30,440 Speaker 1: then when you know they get a little too close, 798 00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:32,799 Speaker 1: then no, then they go bounding back into the cover 799 00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:38,160 Speaker 1: where they're safer. UM. But as far as UM the 800 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:43,120 Speaker 1: terrain and specific elements to look for. Yeah, I can't 801 00:45:43,120 --> 00:45:47,319 Speaker 1: tell you anyone particular one because you'll see elements of 802 00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:49,720 Speaker 1: all of that. You know, you may have a swampy 803 00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:53,440 Speaker 1: element or a hill country element, um, but generally you 804 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,640 Speaker 1: know they're still going to keep that wind in mind. 805 00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:58,080 Speaker 1: You know, like my house, for example, I look out 806 00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,000 Speaker 1: at my field right now, and to the left or 807 00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:07,040 Speaker 1: the right, I've got um uh small hill on both sides, 808 00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:09,560 Speaker 1: and those deer will bed you know, whether it's a 809 00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:13,440 Speaker 1: northwest or southwest wind, they'll be betted on that particular 810 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:16,279 Speaker 1: spot in a given day because that's where the scent 811 00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:18,839 Speaker 1: from my house goes, so they can keep tabs on me. 812 00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,640 Speaker 1: And it's yeah, it's of course it's Michigan. There's those 813 00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: in small bucks. Um. But they have that same survival 814 00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:30,120 Speaker 1: instinct that they want to know where they're their threat 815 00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,600 Speaker 1: is at. And I've I've thought of it before, whether 816 00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:37,160 Speaker 1: you're playing paintball or um. If you were in an 817 00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:40,600 Speaker 1: actual like a movie where people are hunting people, the 818 00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:42,720 Speaker 1: last thing I would want to do is go bury 819 00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:46,960 Speaker 1: myself in some thick cover where I can get snuck 820 00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:49,719 Speaker 1: up on and not know where people are coming. From 821 00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:52,280 Speaker 1: or anything. I would. I would more so want to 822 00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:57,120 Speaker 1: stay uh in sight of of my threat, you know, 823 00:46:57,440 --> 00:46:59,319 Speaker 1: keep tabs on where they're at so I can keep 824 00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,239 Speaker 1: moving around them. Yeah, that's that's the way I try 825 00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:20,400 Speaker 1: to approach it. Are there any personal examples where you 826 00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:23,359 Speaker 1: found something like that and figured out how to kill 827 00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:26,520 Speaker 1: that buck that was set up to know what you 828 00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:28,400 Speaker 1: were doing? Like he he thought he was ahead of 829 00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:29,759 Speaker 1: the game. It was setting up us about where he 830 00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:33,840 Speaker 1: could keep tabs on people, but you figured that out. Um, 831 00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:36,080 Speaker 1: do you have any example kind of like that that 832 00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:38,400 Speaker 1: you could kind of illustrate for us or or know 833 00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:40,799 Speaker 1: of someone who did that. I just imagine a lot 834 00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:44,319 Speaker 1: of people, a lot of people are in situations like 835 00:47:44,360 --> 00:47:46,480 Speaker 1: that probably and don't realize it or don't know how 836 00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:49,160 Speaker 1: to deal with that, and it's something that probably would 837 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:59,200 Speaker 1: be helpful to address. Yeah, I gotta think here, um, 838 00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:03,040 Speaker 1: or even just you examples of just specific places you 839 00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:08,040 Speaker 1: found betting in this more generic farm country, just describing 840 00:48:08,080 --> 00:48:11,399 Speaker 1: specific examples of what those spots look like. Just it's 841 00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:14,799 Speaker 1: just so easy to identify the gay hill country bed 842 00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:16,680 Speaker 1: should be in here and you can see it, But 843 00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:19,240 Speaker 1: like you mentioned, it's much harder to paint that picture 844 00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:26,839 Speaker 1: for generic farmland. Yeah, well there's one. Um. The one 845 00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:29,400 Speaker 1: that first comes to mind is a property I didn't 846 00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:31,480 Speaker 1: never even get to hunt, but I scouted it with 847 00:48:31,520 --> 00:48:33,000 Speaker 1: a friend of mine that I used to hunt with 848 00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:35,480 Speaker 1: in Iowa, and he told me about, you know, his 849 00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:39,719 Speaker 1: farm over in Illinois and they had this and they 850 00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:43,319 Speaker 1: couldn't figure him out. Um, they didn't, you know, know 851 00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:46,799 Speaker 1: what he was doing or or what was going on. 852 00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:51,239 Speaker 1: And I spent a while, but I chuckled because he 853 00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:54,279 Speaker 1: told me just a couple of things where they had 854 00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:59,440 Speaker 1: seen it. And we walked over there and within within 855 00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:02,040 Speaker 1: ten it might have even been five minutes, I said, well, 856 00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:04,680 Speaker 1: here's where he's living. This is right where he's betting man. 857 00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:10,760 Speaker 1: Because we walked in off of this it was pretty exposed. Um, 858 00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:16,319 Speaker 1: it was ffty yards within some cover, um, and we 859 00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:20,759 Speaker 1: were maybe a hundred yards off the road and it 860 00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:23,120 Speaker 1: was the last spot. He like looked. He was like, 861 00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:26,000 Speaker 1: are you kidding me? I'm like, yeah, I mean look 862 00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:30,840 Speaker 1: at this. They were five size rubs and giant beds 863 00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:35,719 Speaker 1: in this little spot of cover that I mean, if 864 00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:37,279 Speaker 1: you if you got in there and just sat in 865 00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:41,080 Speaker 1: those beds and looked around you like, well, absolutely he's living. 866 00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,840 Speaker 1: This is exactly where he's living. And then if you 867 00:49:43,880 --> 00:49:46,040 Speaker 1: back up from there and think, well, how would you 868 00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:49,440 Speaker 1: kill him? I told him this would be really challenging, 869 00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,919 Speaker 1: and this is why he's living here and surviving here 870 00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:54,960 Speaker 1: because he can see anything from this road. And I 871 00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:57,080 Speaker 1: mean as soon as you pull in and park, you know, 872 00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:59,600 Speaker 1: he knows right where you're at, you know. And so 873 00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:04,040 Speaker 1: that was that was mostly farmland. It was pretty flat, 874 00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:06,600 Speaker 1: but it had hill country element to it because it 875 00:50:06,680 --> 00:50:10,879 Speaker 1: had some rolling topography to it where I'm like, well, 876 00:50:11,200 --> 00:50:12,920 Speaker 1: if you want to get this buck on trail camera 877 00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:15,600 Speaker 1: and know whether he's in here or not, you know, 878 00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:18,160 Speaker 1: this is how you do it, you know. So you 879 00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:21,400 Speaker 1: had really just a couple of main trails coming in 880 00:50:21,480 --> 00:50:23,600 Speaker 1: and out of the beds because it was so thick. 881 00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,200 Speaker 1: So I would have backed off a little bit more 882 00:50:26,280 --> 00:50:30,239 Speaker 1: by this particular crick bottom. Um I would. I would 883 00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:32,760 Speaker 1: have loved the chance to have hunted that spot because 884 00:50:33,200 --> 00:50:35,000 Speaker 1: because of what I saw there, it would have been 885 00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:38,400 Speaker 1: very challenging. It's and it's something that you know it 886 00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:40,080 Speaker 1: doesn't you know. You look at that and you think 887 00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:43,440 Speaker 1: you found it, and okay, but that's just one piece 888 00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:45,439 Speaker 1: of that puzzle right now. You've got to figure out 889 00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:50,200 Speaker 1: when when you can get him in daylight coming back 890 00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:52,520 Speaker 1: in there or coming out of there with you know, 891 00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:56,560 Speaker 1: and get in and out not being seen and stuff. So, um, 892 00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:58,600 Speaker 1: that that that's that's the first one that comes to 893 00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:00,960 Speaker 1: mind that I didn't didn't get to hunt it, but um, 894 00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:06,080 Speaker 1: it was it was completely overlooked by the guy. Um 895 00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:09,479 Speaker 1: he had hunted that property for for years and never 896 00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:12,440 Speaker 1: thought to just hundred yards from the road, this is 897 00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:15,480 Speaker 1: where the biggest one they'd ever seen was living. So 898 00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:18,799 Speaker 1: he was walking right past that area every time, right, Yeah, Yeah, 899 00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:20,759 Speaker 1: I mean that deer probably saw him every time he 900 00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:23,440 Speaker 1: was in and out, and they would see him on occasion. 901 00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:25,600 Speaker 1: You know he was because when he told me that, 902 00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:28,120 Speaker 1: well this is the side. You know, we've seen him 903 00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:30,839 Speaker 1: over here, and I don't know where he's coming from, 904 00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:35,160 Speaker 1: and said, well again back to like they're betted most 905 00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,839 Speaker 1: of the day and outside a peak of the rud, 906 00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:42,279 Speaker 1: he's probably not moving far from where he's betted. So yeah, 907 00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:44,880 Speaker 1: I went in there and looked around and within five minutes, 908 00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:48,439 Speaker 1: I mean, it was just super obvious that that buck 909 00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:53,520 Speaker 1: was living there. Why don't we explore what you would 910 00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:57,840 Speaker 1: do next in that scenario. So so in vision, you've 911 00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,800 Speaker 1: got a property, maybe you haven't hunted before, new property, 912 00:52:01,440 --> 00:52:05,320 Speaker 1: and or even this property. And let's say for some reason, 913 00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:07,359 Speaker 1: instead of what ended up happening, your body said, hey, 914 00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:09,879 Speaker 1: you know what you found where he's living, get after him. 915 00:52:09,920 --> 00:52:14,319 Speaker 1: You can hunt him, and um yeah, um. What I'm 916 00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:16,040 Speaker 1: curious about is what do you do next? Like you 917 00:52:16,160 --> 00:52:19,440 Speaker 1: found the bedroom, I'd like to hear like your your 918 00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:22,200 Speaker 1: thought process on what you're gonna do next? Are you 919 00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:24,160 Speaker 1: gonna like how are you going to think about where 920 00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:26,160 Speaker 1: you would set up? When would you come in and 921 00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:28,040 Speaker 1: bring a stand? Would it be the day you hunt, 922 00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:32,920 Speaker 1: or would be you know, a month beforehand? Uh? And 923 00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:34,840 Speaker 1: and then I want to keep on going all the 924 00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:37,319 Speaker 1: way through. Let's talk through that. Let's talk through the 925 00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:39,680 Speaker 1: day you're putting the stand up, and we'll kind of 926 00:52:40,200 --> 00:52:43,960 Speaker 1: flesh out an example from this starting point. Does that 927 00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:50,480 Speaker 1: make sense? Yeah? Um m hmm. I almost say trail 928 00:52:50,560 --> 00:52:54,200 Speaker 1: cameras don't make it fair anymore, especially with cell cameras. 929 00:52:54,200 --> 00:52:56,600 Speaker 1: But you know, we all have different scenarios, whether this 930 00:52:57,040 --> 00:52:59,759 Speaker 1: was let's say it's Illinois or whatever, And I don't 931 00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:02,680 Speaker 1: live there, it's a different scenario of how I approach 932 00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:05,719 Speaker 1: it versus if I lived there. So if I lived there, 933 00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:10,719 Speaker 1: I would, um, I would just be I'd start observing. 934 00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:13,720 Speaker 1: I would literally, whether it's from a from my truck 935 00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:16,880 Speaker 1: with a spotting scope half mile down the road, or 936 00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:19,320 Speaker 1: if I had to climb a tree across the field, 937 00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,279 Speaker 1: I would figure out a way to start observing that 938 00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:26,520 Speaker 1: spot without intruding on it. So that would be step 939 00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:29,120 Speaker 1: one if I'm living there locally, if I'm If I'm not, 940 00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:34,640 Speaker 1: I'm starting to pepper perimeters with trail cameras and and 941 00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:37,200 Speaker 1: I'm probably doing that anyways if I if I do 942 00:53:37,280 --> 00:53:43,600 Speaker 1: live there. Um, But it's all about again not educating them, 943 00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:46,760 Speaker 1: not letting them know you're hunting them. So you're sitting 944 00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:49,440 Speaker 1: back and observing and and seeing if you can get 945 00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,719 Speaker 1: eyes on him, and and crops will play a big 946 00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:56,600 Speaker 1: factor obviously, you know. So if that field is beans 947 00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:59,960 Speaker 1: that year or whether it's corn that year, um, you've 948 00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,040 Speaker 1: got to figure out what he's doing. He may be 949 00:54:02,160 --> 00:54:04,560 Speaker 1: at a at a farm two miles over in the 950 00:54:04,600 --> 00:54:06,799 Speaker 1: beans all summer and then come back, or he might 951 00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:08,640 Speaker 1: not not not even be on the farm that year. 952 00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:13,000 Speaker 1: Because of the crop rotation. So that's all stuff you 953 00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:15,520 Speaker 1: have to start learning and figuring out. And it can 954 00:54:15,560 --> 00:54:18,839 Speaker 1: you can learn that and as quick as a conversation 955 00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:21,680 Speaker 1: with somebody that can tell you that because you know 956 00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:26,160 Speaker 1: they have a history of knowing, or it's observations or 957 00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:28,960 Speaker 1: or trail cameras that tell you that. But that's the 958 00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:32,440 Speaker 1: kind of stuff you need to start figuring out. Is Okay, 959 00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,160 Speaker 1: he's living there, but is he living there all the time, 960 00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:37,719 Speaker 1: or is he living there every other year or on 961 00:54:37,880 --> 00:54:41,040 Speaker 1: certain winds or on certain crop rotations. So those are 962 00:54:41,080 --> 00:54:45,640 Speaker 1: the thoughts in my head. And if if i'm let's say, 963 00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:50,200 Speaker 1: you know, this perfect scenario exists of this buck is 964 00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:55,040 Speaker 1: living there all summer and it's beans, and you watch 965 00:54:55,120 --> 00:54:58,239 Speaker 1: him doing a certain thing, and then you know whether 966 00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:01,760 Speaker 1: it's September fifteen or October first, or whenever the opener 967 00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:06,320 Speaker 1: comes in, then yeah, it might be. You know, again, 968 00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:10,040 Speaker 1: the perfect scenario of go in and hang a stand 969 00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:12,040 Speaker 1: based on a chink in his armor and you know 970 00:55:12,080 --> 00:55:14,800 Speaker 1: he's coming right out here, and and I can flip 971 00:55:14,840 --> 00:55:18,759 Speaker 1: in here along this creek bed or or something. And 972 00:55:18,880 --> 00:55:22,120 Speaker 1: if it's private, I'm certainly thinking about pre hanging a 973 00:55:22,200 --> 00:55:25,839 Speaker 1: stand in in the springtime or the early season. I'm 974 00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:29,200 Speaker 1: prepping a spot that you know, Okay, if it's this bed, 975 00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:32,960 Speaker 1: then you generally don't have a bunch of options. You 976 00:55:33,040 --> 00:55:35,200 Speaker 1: generally have Okay, this is going to be the tree. 977 00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:37,200 Speaker 1: It's either going to be this one or this one 978 00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:41,200 Speaker 1: based on this scenario. And so I might pre hang 979 00:55:41,239 --> 00:55:43,439 Speaker 1: a stand or at least prep it so that all 980 00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:46,279 Speaker 1: I've got to do is hang the stand or or 981 00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:51,240 Speaker 1: hang a few sticks or something. But yeah, it's every 982 00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:55,880 Speaker 1: you know, the thing I guess. I I also pride 983 00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:58,360 Speaker 1: myself in as I I can't tell you that I 984 00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:03,279 Speaker 1: just do any one thing. I always look at the 985 00:56:03,360 --> 00:56:07,480 Speaker 1: elements in the given scenario, because it's like the thing 986 00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:10,480 Speaker 1: I I know a lot of For whatever reason, I've 987 00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:12,759 Speaker 1: met a lot of professional fishermen in my life, and 988 00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:15,640 Speaker 1: I've friends with a lot of guys that fish professional 989 00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:19,840 Speaker 1: walleye circuits and stuff, and and you I was chuckled 990 00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:22,239 Speaker 1: because at the end of a tournament, the interview in 991 00:56:22,280 --> 00:56:26,080 Speaker 1: the winter and he says, oh, yeah, it was it 992 00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:30,240 Speaker 1: was pink. You know, we're trolling pink in fifteen foot 993 00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:32,759 Speaker 1: of water off of this, you know, and wam wam wham, 994 00:56:32,800 --> 00:56:35,520 Speaker 1: you know, and they well, if if you just told 995 00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:37,759 Speaker 1: everybody else to do that, you know, then they could 996 00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:41,960 Speaker 1: have slammed them too. But they knew, um, they were 997 00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:44,640 Speaker 1: able to figure it out quicker, sooner or better than 998 00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:47,560 Speaker 1: anyone else on that particular weekend, that that was the 999 00:56:47,600 --> 00:56:51,080 Speaker 1: thing that worked. And it wasn't because they didn't know 1000 00:56:51,160 --> 00:56:56,680 Speaker 1: how to um two jig crawlers or troll crawlers or 1001 00:56:56,840 --> 00:57:01,520 Speaker 1: or um fish swim baits or or whatever. They know 1002 00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,479 Speaker 1: all the techniques. They just have an open and enough 1003 00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:08,400 Speaker 1: mind to take in the given conditions and then apply 1004 00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:10,280 Speaker 1: what they think is going to work at that time. 1005 00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:13,840 Speaker 1: And that's the way I approach hunting, is whether I 1006 00:57:13,880 --> 00:57:16,560 Speaker 1: need to pre hang a spot in the spring or 1007 00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,640 Speaker 1: have a stand on my back and hunt something right 1008 00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:23,120 Speaker 1: at the minute, Um, I just try to keep an 1009 00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:26,640 Speaker 1: open enough mind to what I know that you know, 1010 00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:29,480 Speaker 1: the deer being so different everywhere that you just have 1011 00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:33,480 Speaker 1: to be willing to observe what's going on and then 1012 00:57:33,560 --> 00:57:36,320 Speaker 1: be be able to take advantage of it. Be willing 1013 00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:38,960 Speaker 1: and able and have the knowledge of knowing when to 1014 00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:42,520 Speaker 1: take advantage of it. Yeah, that's that kind of example 1015 00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:47,439 Speaker 1: you laid out there. Um, speaks to something that I'm 1016 00:57:47,480 --> 00:57:51,720 Speaker 1: constantly internally debating, which is, you know, this wall example, 1017 00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,040 Speaker 1: the fact that he was able to figure out that 1018 00:57:54,080 --> 00:57:58,480 Speaker 1: specific combination more quickly than anybody else, but that probably 1019 00:57:58,480 --> 00:58:00,280 Speaker 1: took some trial and error, like he had to try 1020 00:58:00,360 --> 00:58:05,160 Speaker 1: something realized that wasn't just try something adjust In the 1021 00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:09,200 Speaker 1: dear world, we we put together an idea of what 1022 00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:11,720 Speaker 1: we think is happening based on all the different factors 1023 00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,960 Speaker 1: we and then we we throw a dart at the wall. 1024 00:58:15,040 --> 00:58:17,400 Speaker 1: We think this is the tree, this is the behavior 1025 00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:19,880 Speaker 1: where we think he's gonna do. We're gonna try this, 1026 00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:22,480 Speaker 1: but then you hunt it and it doesn't pan out. 1027 00:58:23,120 --> 00:58:27,919 Speaker 1: And the question that I'm always thinking through is this 1028 00:58:28,120 --> 00:58:30,680 Speaker 1: fine line that we seem to have to walk between, 1029 00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:36,880 Speaker 1: you know, giving our idea time versus moving to the 1030 00:58:36,920 --> 00:58:39,800 Speaker 1: next idea or the next Okay, No, that wasn't it. 1031 00:58:39,840 --> 00:58:41,960 Speaker 1: He must be doing this or this set of conditions 1032 00:58:42,040 --> 00:58:45,120 Speaker 1: actually must mean this. Uh, this is a very very 1033 00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:49,280 Speaker 1: generic question, I realized, Um, but can you like how 1034 00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:53,040 Speaker 1: what's your mindset? How do you think through this dilemma 1035 00:58:53,160 --> 00:58:57,480 Speaker 1: which is giving my idea time or this specific spot 1036 00:58:57,520 --> 00:59:00,800 Speaker 1: time or another sit versus Okay, I gotta pivot, Like 1037 00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:03,400 Speaker 1: when when do you pull the plug and say, no, 1038 00:59:03,640 --> 00:59:06,040 Speaker 1: this is wrong. I gotta adjust. Is it immediately? Do 1039 00:59:06,080 --> 00:59:08,360 Speaker 1: you never give an idea two days or a spot 1040 00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:13,520 Speaker 1: two days? Or is it? I realized this is so specific, 1041 00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:18,000 Speaker 1: situation specific, But I guess walk me through your thoughts 1042 00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:23,560 Speaker 1: on this general idea. Yeah, I mean that's it's definitely 1043 00:59:24,680 --> 00:59:27,480 Speaker 1: an answer that comes with experience, and everybody's going to 1044 00:59:27,600 --> 00:59:31,160 Speaker 1: be a little bit different. You're you're always gonna second 1045 00:59:31,160 --> 00:59:33,360 Speaker 1: guess yourself a little bit. But I know I second 1046 00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:35,840 Speaker 1: guessed myself a lot less now than I did twenty 1047 00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,520 Speaker 1: years ago. You know, I'd go into a spot twenty 1048 00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:42,480 Speaker 1: years ago and I'd be like, what did I do wrong? Okay? 1049 00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:45,280 Speaker 1: Did I? Did I make too much noise? Did I? 1050 00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:48,080 Speaker 1: Was it? This? Was it? That? And I've had enough 1051 00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:53,440 Speaker 1: success now where I know, um, I usually know, okay, 1052 00:59:53,960 --> 00:59:56,600 Speaker 1: well it wasn't because of me or because of the 1053 00:59:56,640 --> 00:59:59,120 Speaker 1: noise I made, or this or that. I can rule 1054 00:59:59,160 --> 01:00:03,120 Speaker 1: out certain things based on experience, so that leaves you know, 1055 01:00:03,680 --> 01:00:09,600 Speaker 1: the deer or the weather or factors out of my control. Um, 1056 01:00:09,680 --> 01:00:12,520 Speaker 1: so that I have that confidence on my side now, 1057 01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:18,520 Speaker 1: But to to what extent you're always confident that you 1058 01:00:18,680 --> 01:00:20,760 Speaker 1: did the right thing. Now it's I mean, that just 1059 01:00:20,800 --> 01:00:23,240 Speaker 1: doesn't exist. You're always you know, because until you do 1060 01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:26,680 Speaker 1: have that success, you don't know for sure. Um, but 1061 01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:33,960 Speaker 1: your experience tells you okay, um, And usually it relates 1062 01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:37,520 Speaker 1: to time of year. Okay. So I give you an example, 1063 01:00:37,560 --> 01:00:40,760 Speaker 1: like last year, the big one I killed in Wisconsin. 1064 01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:44,640 Speaker 1: That was the second time I hunted that spot in 1065 01:00:44,720 --> 01:00:49,000 Speaker 1: two days. It was a primary scrape scenario in this 1066 01:00:49,360 --> 01:00:53,240 Speaker 1: old thick bedding area. It was an old orchard area 1067 01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:55,440 Speaker 1: where there were some apple trees in there that you 1068 01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:59,160 Speaker 1: could almost not see because there's just so much brush. 1069 01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:01,960 Speaker 1: Um That I had hung a camera there a week 1070 01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:04,760 Speaker 1: and a half prior. I went there for a weekend 1071 01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:08,800 Speaker 1: and I scouted this new section of farm and I 1072 01:01:08,880 --> 01:01:11,120 Speaker 1: found this primary scrape in there. I'm like, oh my gosh, 1073 01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:14,080 Speaker 1: this is just gonna light up. This should light up 1074 01:01:14,080 --> 01:01:16,920 Speaker 1: in the next week to two weeks. And so I 1075 01:01:17,000 --> 01:01:19,240 Speaker 1: put a camera on it. And when I showed up 1076 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:23,479 Speaker 1: a week and a half later, there were um two 1077 01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,680 Speaker 1: different bucks I would have shot that were there in 1078 01:01:26,800 --> 01:01:31,720 Speaker 1: daylight probably six days out of the previous ten days. 1079 01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:37,040 Speaker 1: They were there pretty regularly. At various hours of the day, 1080 01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:41,680 Speaker 1: and that's the intel you need to know that they're like, Okay, 1081 01:01:41,840 --> 01:01:45,120 Speaker 1: he's not in there every day. So if I just 1082 01:01:45,600 --> 01:01:48,760 Speaker 1: pick this day and he doesn't show, that doesn't mean 1083 01:01:48,800 --> 01:01:52,520 Speaker 1: I screwed something up. It means that you know, you 1084 01:01:52,520 --> 01:01:55,080 Speaker 1: should give it another tribe, right, But you have to 1085 01:01:55,120 --> 01:01:57,120 Speaker 1: be smart about how you're getting in and out of it. 1086 01:01:57,760 --> 01:02:01,480 Speaker 1: So in that particular scenario I hunted last year, UM, 1087 01:02:01,520 --> 01:02:03,840 Speaker 1: I had a northwest wind the first evening. I went 1088 01:02:03,880 --> 01:02:08,680 Speaker 1: in there midday and ironically the one the other buck 1089 01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:12,040 Speaker 1: that would I would have shot. Um. I'm trying to 1090 01:02:12,080 --> 01:02:14,920 Speaker 1: think of it. Yeah, twenty minutes before I went in 1091 01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:17,919 Speaker 1: there to check my camera, that buck came through there. 1092 01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:22,000 Speaker 1: It was like twelve thirty PM. And I went in 1093 01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:25,560 Speaker 1: there at one pm to pull my camera card. And 1094 01:02:25,720 --> 01:02:30,360 Speaker 1: I was back in there at oh, I don't know, 1095 01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:33,640 Speaker 1: like two thirty or something, and I hung a spot. 1096 01:02:34,160 --> 01:02:36,000 Speaker 1: It was so thick in there that I couldn't even 1097 01:02:36,000 --> 01:02:38,080 Speaker 1: see the scrape that I was hunting. I was forty 1098 01:02:38,160 --> 01:02:42,080 Speaker 1: yards down wind of it. Um, I'm looking at one 1099 01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:45,520 Speaker 1: of the trails that was coming into it from from 1100 01:02:45,560 --> 01:02:50,000 Speaker 1: that wind direction. So I hung the little point five stand. 1101 01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:54,080 Speaker 1: Those are awesome and super lightweight. So I flipped in 1102 01:02:54,120 --> 01:02:56,720 Speaker 1: there and I hung that stand, and I saw like 1103 01:02:57,080 --> 01:02:59,840 Speaker 1: eight deer that night, and one like two year old buck, 1104 01:03:00,040 --> 01:03:03,959 Speaker 1: and and uh several doughs, but not the right one. 1105 01:03:05,120 --> 01:03:08,080 Speaker 1: And they all moved on. And I even had one 1106 01:03:08,640 --> 01:03:11,440 Speaker 1: a dull blow at me late late at night. You know, 1107 01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:13,560 Speaker 1: she got out in the field and she got circled around, 1108 01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:16,120 Speaker 1: she got down wind, and she snorted and ran off. 1109 01:03:16,160 --> 01:03:20,840 Speaker 1: But it wasn't to the extent that you're like, everything's educated, 1110 01:03:20,880 --> 01:03:23,600 Speaker 1: I'm out of here, um. But I knew that that 1111 01:03:23,640 --> 01:03:25,840 Speaker 1: spot was still good, at least for the next couple 1112 01:03:25,840 --> 01:03:29,520 Speaker 1: of days because of that scrape, you know, scrape time 1113 01:03:29,520 --> 01:03:33,400 Speaker 1: of year. So the next morning, the wind shifted and 1114 01:03:33,400 --> 01:03:37,320 Speaker 1: it went to southwest, and I knew that stand. I 1115 01:03:38,040 --> 01:03:39,880 Speaker 1: left that stand up because I'm like, oh, you know, 1116 01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:42,800 Speaker 1: I'll just be right back in here tomorrow. But it 1117 01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:46,360 Speaker 1: shifted to the southwest and I couldn't hunt that and 1118 01:03:46,440 --> 01:03:48,760 Speaker 1: it was too thick to go in there and think 1119 01:03:48,800 --> 01:03:52,440 Speaker 1: about looking for my new spot. Um in the in 1120 01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:55,280 Speaker 1: the dark especially said you know what, I'm just going 1121 01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:56,760 Speaker 1: to go to the north side of the farm and 1122 01:03:56,840 --> 01:04:00,480 Speaker 1: hunt this other spot, and then about mid morning, I'll 1123 01:04:00,520 --> 01:04:03,840 Speaker 1: get down and I'll i'll go prep it for the 1124 01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:07,200 Speaker 1: southwest wind. And so I did. I went and I 1125 01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:12,600 Speaker 1: hunted uh the north side of the farm, and I 1126 01:04:12,960 --> 01:04:14,720 Speaker 1: watched a buck breed at dough that morning. It was 1127 01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:17,600 Speaker 1: actually pretty cool, but it was it was just like 1128 01:04:17,640 --> 01:04:23,120 Speaker 1: a young three year old and and so about it 1129 01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:25,240 Speaker 1: was about nine thirty or so. I got down nine 1130 01:04:25,280 --> 01:04:27,800 Speaker 1: thirty or ten, and it was kind of breezy that day, 1131 01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:31,360 Speaker 1: which was really helpful, but I went um, I got 1132 01:04:31,400 --> 01:04:34,080 Speaker 1: down and I went into that spot. It was about 1133 01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:36,760 Speaker 1: ten o'clock. It was breezy enough that I could cut 1134 01:04:37,120 --> 01:04:40,440 Speaker 1: cut limbs and stuff and and trim stuff with it. 1135 01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:43,400 Speaker 1: You know, just lots of trees blowing around. They could 1136 01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:45,760 Speaker 1: you know, you'd have to be within twenty thirty feet 1137 01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:49,080 Speaker 1: of me to to hear me. So I got a 1138 01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:53,640 Speaker 1: spot trimmed, and I left and I had to do 1139 01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:55,840 Speaker 1: some work at the computer, and I heard to go 1140 01:04:55,960 --> 01:04:57,840 Speaker 1: for a couple hours. So I got back into the 1141 01:04:57,880 --> 01:05:01,040 Speaker 1: spot about one o'clock one It was one thirty. I 1142 01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:04,760 Speaker 1: got back into the spot and I shot that buck 1143 01:05:05,000 --> 01:05:08,280 Speaker 1: at two thirty maybe two twenty. It wasn't I haven't 1144 01:05:08,320 --> 01:05:11,520 Speaker 1: even sat an hour and that buck came into the 1145 01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:14,280 Speaker 1: apple tree next to the scrape. Um. It was a 1146 01:05:14,320 --> 01:05:18,000 Speaker 1: really cool scenario. Um. And then when I checked my 1147 01:05:18,080 --> 01:05:22,520 Speaker 1: camera later that other buck had been in in that 1148 01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:26,560 Speaker 1: spot in the morning. Um, had I, you know, had 1149 01:05:26,560 --> 01:05:28,520 Speaker 1: different winds, are still been able to sit at that 1150 01:05:29,440 --> 01:05:31,880 Speaker 1: There was a buck that came in about eight thirty 1151 01:05:31,920 --> 01:05:34,440 Speaker 1: that morning that I missed because I didn't you know, 1152 01:05:35,320 --> 01:05:37,400 Speaker 1: I didn't have the right wind and I didn't feel 1153 01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:40,440 Speaker 1: good about um because you know, the winds are calmer 1154 01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:42,240 Speaker 1: at first light. I just didn't want to get in 1155 01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:43,840 Speaker 1: there and make a bunch of actor because I figured 1156 01:05:43,880 --> 01:05:47,240 Speaker 1: they would be in there. So that was experience telling 1157 01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:51,000 Speaker 1: me to not be you know, and I've done it 1158 01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:53,600 Speaker 1: plenty of times where going in the dark and hanging stands, 1159 01:05:53,640 --> 01:05:57,400 Speaker 1: but that was not a scenario worth doing that. UM. 1160 01:05:57,520 --> 01:06:02,480 Speaker 1: But yeah, your original question about when do you move on? 1161 01:06:02,560 --> 01:06:06,360 Speaker 1: When do you stick it out? Um? Some of the 1162 01:06:06,360 --> 01:06:10,640 Speaker 1: big factors for me are my again that element of surprise. 1163 01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:15,280 Speaker 1: Is my entry and exit good enough that I feel 1164 01:06:15,320 --> 01:06:18,360 Speaker 1: I can get multiple sits or is it intrusive to 1165 01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:21,560 Speaker 1: the point where, yeah, even though they didn't show they're 1166 01:06:21,560 --> 01:06:24,280 Speaker 1: going to know I was in here and it's it's 1167 01:06:24,320 --> 01:06:28,120 Speaker 1: too tough, you know, and e bikes and cell cams 1168 01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:30,240 Speaker 1: and all that stuff, you know play a role now 1169 01:06:30,320 --> 01:06:34,440 Speaker 1: and and getting extra sits or picking the exact right 1170 01:06:34,520 --> 01:06:38,440 Speaker 1: days to do it. But um, you know, experiences is 1171 01:06:38,480 --> 01:06:42,200 Speaker 1: the best teacher. And that's where you know, like that 1172 01:06:42,320 --> 01:06:45,480 Speaker 1: scenario I just described, Um, I know I had to 1173 01:06:45,520 --> 01:06:47,880 Speaker 1: win because that was November two. I shot that deer 1174 01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:49,840 Speaker 1: on and I knew I only had that day or 1175 01:06:49,880 --> 01:06:52,160 Speaker 1: maybe the next day before it was going to pretty 1176 01:06:52,240 --> 01:06:55,080 Speaker 1: much dry up. And so I was gonna hunt that 1177 01:06:55,120 --> 01:07:00,440 Speaker 1: spot like two maybe even three days in a row. Um, 1178 01:07:00,480 --> 01:07:03,560 Speaker 1: if I needed to before I did move on. And 1179 01:07:03,600 --> 01:07:06,760 Speaker 1: then I knew that was done, and whether it was 1180 01:07:06,840 --> 01:07:09,120 Speaker 1: me or not, it was going to be done, and 1181 01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:12,120 Speaker 1: you know it would have to behind it later. What 1182 01:07:12,560 --> 01:07:16,800 Speaker 1: about making adjustments based off observations. This is another one 1183 01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:18,520 Speaker 1: where a lot of folks that talked to are kind 1184 01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:21,320 Speaker 1: of split. There's some people that will see a buck 1185 01:07:21,600 --> 01:07:24,439 Speaker 1: and they're going to move immediately. An hour later, they'll 1186 01:07:24,520 --> 01:07:26,360 Speaker 1: yank down their tree standing moved to where that buck 1187 01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:28,760 Speaker 1: moved through, or the next day or whatever. And there's 1188 01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:31,360 Speaker 1: some people who will say, well, I want to see 1189 01:07:31,360 --> 01:07:34,360 Speaker 1: a buck do something twice before I think it's a 1190 01:07:34,360 --> 01:07:37,400 Speaker 1: trend and I'll move on it. Um. And of course 1191 01:07:37,400 --> 01:07:39,120 Speaker 1: there's also you know what time of year is this 1192 01:07:39,200 --> 01:07:43,560 Speaker 1: October one or November? Um? What's your what's your take 1193 01:07:43,640 --> 01:07:47,160 Speaker 1: on on that? When will you move immediately? When will 1194 01:07:47,200 --> 01:07:50,280 Speaker 1: you not move? What's your thought process there? Yeah, No, 1195 01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:53,160 Speaker 1: a good question, um, because both of those answers can 1196 01:07:53,200 --> 01:07:57,000 Speaker 1: be right. Um. And and it is those factors again. 1197 01:07:57,080 --> 01:07:59,200 Speaker 1: So you're sitting in that tree for hours and hours 1198 01:07:59,200 --> 01:08:00,960 Speaker 1: and you've got nothing to do but think. Right. So 1199 01:08:01,040 --> 01:08:04,000 Speaker 1: I'm I'm an analytical thinker, and I'm always trying to 1200 01:08:04,040 --> 01:08:06,000 Speaker 1: figure out, Okay, if I see a deer, why did 1201 01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:11,680 Speaker 1: he do that? What? What was it? And I set 1202 01:08:11,760 --> 01:08:16,720 Speaker 1: up in a spot based on hopefully an educated guess 1203 01:08:16,760 --> 01:08:20,200 Speaker 1: of what they're gonna do, And if I see something happen, 1204 01:08:20,560 --> 01:08:24,960 Speaker 1: it's either usually confirming it or or not that I 1205 01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:29,840 Speaker 1: was right. And so there's a scenario where Okay, I 1206 01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:34,240 Speaker 1: think they're betted here, and yet the first deer I 1207 01:08:34,280 --> 01:08:38,120 Speaker 1: see is down here, and I'm like, oh, shot, I 1208 01:08:38,160 --> 01:08:40,880 Speaker 1: was wrong. Um, you know they're betted over there, And 1209 01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:43,240 Speaker 1: that's you know, I knew it was one of the 1210 01:08:43,280 --> 01:08:45,400 Speaker 1: two and it's over here. You know, now I know 1211 01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:50,400 Speaker 1: where to to move to right or you know that well, 1212 01:08:50,439 --> 01:08:52,719 Speaker 1: there's multiple deer in the area, and I know there's 1213 01:08:52,720 --> 01:08:55,640 Speaker 1: probably gonna be deer over here as well, so you 1214 01:08:55,960 --> 01:09:00,000 Speaker 1: don't react, you know extreme, you know, just by one side. 1215 01:09:00,200 --> 01:09:06,200 Speaker 1: But um, if there's a so one where I might 1216 01:09:06,280 --> 01:09:09,800 Speaker 1: jump on is if I see a hot dough and 1217 01:09:10,560 --> 01:09:15,320 Speaker 1: she's you know, passed through a certain spot or you know, 1218 01:09:15,439 --> 01:09:17,720 Speaker 1: gone back and forth along you know, a spot of 1219 01:09:17,800 --> 01:09:22,240 Speaker 1: cover a couple three times, and I've seen two smaller 1220 01:09:22,280 --> 01:09:25,439 Speaker 1: bucks do the same exact thing in a in a 1221 01:09:26,240 --> 01:09:30,040 Speaker 1: you know, on her trail. It depends where I'm at 1222 01:09:30,080 --> 01:09:33,400 Speaker 1: because I don't I don't necessarily agree that, you know, 1223 01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:35,200 Speaker 1: the big Buck's going to do the same thing that 1224 01:09:35,240 --> 01:09:37,320 Speaker 1: the little bucks did, right. I may be on in 1225 01:09:37,439 --> 01:09:41,120 Speaker 1: thicker cover set up for that big buck. But there 1226 01:09:41,120 --> 01:09:44,120 Speaker 1: are scenarios like Peak rud or something where you get 1227 01:09:44,120 --> 01:09:46,479 Speaker 1: a hot dough and she's gone through and you just 1228 01:09:46,600 --> 01:09:49,000 Speaker 1: know that this is where the big one is going 1229 01:09:49,040 --> 01:09:52,760 Speaker 1: to come through. Then that's a scenario where dropped down 1230 01:09:52,760 --> 01:09:56,040 Speaker 1: and within twenty minutes you can be over there and 1231 01:09:56,080 --> 01:10:01,080 Speaker 1: be ready when when that happens, that makes sense. No, 1232 01:10:02,680 --> 01:10:06,479 Speaker 1: the next step in playing this example out now is 1233 01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:10,120 Speaker 1: you yank your stand down and now you're gonna go 1234 01:10:10,240 --> 01:10:12,960 Speaker 1: and move it to a new spot. So what I'd 1235 01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:16,160 Speaker 1: be really interested in hearing about is is your thought 1236 01:10:16,200 --> 01:10:20,160 Speaker 1: process when you're standing in this the general zone and 1237 01:10:20,200 --> 01:10:23,920 Speaker 1: you're trying to make the decision of which tree. Like, 1238 01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:26,040 Speaker 1: in my mind, this is like an art form, trying 1239 01:10:26,080 --> 01:10:28,320 Speaker 1: to balance all the different factors when you're trying to pick. 1240 01:10:28,360 --> 01:10:30,439 Speaker 1: I mean sometimes easy, Sometimes it's like there's only one 1241 01:10:30,439 --> 01:10:33,280 Speaker 1: tree that's gonna work, But then lots of other times 1242 01:10:33,320 --> 01:10:36,040 Speaker 1: there as well. I want to be within range of 1243 01:10:36,080 --> 01:10:37,800 Speaker 1: this spot I think they're gonna come through. Are these 1244 01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:39,599 Speaker 1: two spots that might come through? And then I also 1245 01:10:39,640 --> 01:10:41,200 Speaker 1: got to think about wind, And then I also need 1246 01:10:41,240 --> 01:10:44,599 Speaker 1: to find a tree that I can stay hidden in UM. 1247 01:10:44,640 --> 01:10:47,360 Speaker 1: But very rarely do you get the perfect tree for 1248 01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:49,599 Speaker 1: all three of those. You have to kind of weigh 1249 01:10:49,680 --> 01:10:51,680 Speaker 1: each one and figure out what's more important in this 1250 01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:54,280 Speaker 1: scenario or that UM, and maybe there's other things you're 1251 01:10:54,280 --> 01:10:58,519 Speaker 1: thinking about. Two, what's what's your thought process in that moment? 1252 01:10:58,520 --> 01:11:00,880 Speaker 1: What are the what's the check list you're going through? 1253 01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,680 Speaker 1: And all the different details you're considering to pick the 1254 01:11:03,680 --> 01:11:09,120 Speaker 1: perfect spot within the spot. Yeah, that's that is I mean, 1255 01:11:09,160 --> 01:11:11,360 Speaker 1: that's the stuff you run through your mind when you're 1256 01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:13,840 Speaker 1: standing there on the ground and you're looking around. Um, 1257 01:11:14,240 --> 01:11:18,800 Speaker 1: for me, the number one scenario is where do I 1258 01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:22,599 Speaker 1: think that buck's gonna come through? Where? You know? And 1259 01:11:22,640 --> 01:11:26,559 Speaker 1: where are the alternate scenarios and where's my best chance 1260 01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:33,200 Speaker 1: to stay undetected and and kill that buck? You know. Um, 1261 01:11:33,320 --> 01:11:36,320 Speaker 1: the tree really doesn't factor into me until the very 1262 01:11:36,439 --> 01:11:39,880 Speaker 1: end because I almost try to eliminate all the trees 1263 01:11:39,920 --> 01:11:44,320 Speaker 1: and try not to look at the trees until I've decided, Okay, 1264 01:11:44,360 --> 01:11:47,680 Speaker 1: where where do I need to be? And once you 1265 01:11:47,720 --> 01:11:50,960 Speaker 1: decide where you need to be, then you find the 1266 01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:53,960 Speaker 1: nearest tree that works, and then you start looking at 1267 01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:57,080 Speaker 1: the trees. So that's that's my thought process. I really 1268 01:11:57,120 --> 01:11:59,360 Speaker 1: don't try to look at the trees at all until 1269 01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:02,120 Speaker 1: I figure out, Okay, well here's the trail, this is 1270 01:12:02,120 --> 01:12:04,000 Speaker 1: the other trail, this is what the wind is doing. 1271 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:06,840 Speaker 1: So if I had any choice in the world and 1272 01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:09,920 Speaker 1: where to put a tree, where would it be? And 1273 01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:14,760 Speaker 1: then I then I base my decision on that um 1274 01:12:14,760 --> 01:12:17,800 Speaker 1: because and this goes back to equipment now, I mean, 1275 01:12:17,840 --> 01:12:20,240 Speaker 1: whether it's the point five or guys that are saddle 1276 01:12:20,320 --> 01:12:25,240 Speaker 1: hunters or sticks or whatever you're using. My setup lets 1277 01:12:25,240 --> 01:12:28,519 Speaker 1: me get into basically almost any tree I want to, 1278 01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:31,160 Speaker 1: or I go back to the truck and pick my 1279 01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:33,840 Speaker 1: other setup that that does let me, you know, but 1280 01:12:34,600 --> 01:12:37,759 Speaker 1: I try to make sure my equipment isn't a limiting factor, 1281 01:12:38,040 --> 01:12:40,680 Speaker 1: and then I can get into about any set up. 1282 01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:44,479 Speaker 1: Some of them may require more trimming than others, and 1283 01:12:44,520 --> 01:12:46,599 Speaker 1: so that's a factor. And I'm like, well, gosh, man, 1284 01:12:46,640 --> 01:12:50,200 Speaker 1: I could get here, but it's quiet today, and I 1285 01:12:50,320 --> 01:12:53,240 Speaker 1: know that the deer bedded close and I really can't 1286 01:12:53,360 --> 01:12:56,120 Speaker 1: cut the crap out of stuff, you know, So that 1287 01:12:56,160 --> 01:13:00,599 Speaker 1: can become a factor. But yeah, I'm mean it's it's 1288 01:13:00,640 --> 01:13:03,720 Speaker 1: usually the last factor. I'm figuring where where do I 1289 01:13:03,760 --> 01:13:07,840 Speaker 1: have to be, and then then I decided, you know, 1290 01:13:08,080 --> 01:13:11,800 Speaker 1: how to how to make it happen? So, um, you 1291 01:13:11,840 --> 01:13:14,759 Speaker 1: know it could be I was, I was. I wounded 1292 01:13:14,800 --> 01:13:16,840 Speaker 1: this one. This was one of the few I probably 1293 01:13:16,920 --> 01:13:19,519 Speaker 1: myself and not wounding them. But about fifteen years ago 1294 01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:24,080 Speaker 1: I wounded a big one. I was in a tree. Um, 1295 01:13:24,160 --> 01:13:26,639 Speaker 1: I mean it was like a six inch popal tree 1296 01:13:26,800 --> 01:13:29,880 Speaker 1: on the tip of a point that but I had 1297 01:13:29,880 --> 01:13:32,800 Speaker 1: observed these deer going through the end of this point 1298 01:13:32,920 --> 01:13:35,640 Speaker 1: the previous evening and there was a big one in 1299 01:13:35,680 --> 01:13:39,799 Speaker 1: that area and I sat there. It was like fifteen 1300 01:13:39,840 --> 01:13:41,960 Speaker 1: degrees at night, and I sat there in this tree, 1301 01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:46,599 Speaker 1: not moving a muscle for like two and a half hours, 1302 01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:50,040 Speaker 1: just you know, totally sticking out. But I knew it 1303 01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:52,439 Speaker 1: was probably gonna be last light when it happened anyway, 1304 01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:56,280 Speaker 1: so I had a better chance. Um, but I caught 1305 01:13:56,280 --> 01:13:58,639 Speaker 1: a deflection on a on a limb when it when 1306 01:13:58,680 --> 01:14:01,040 Speaker 1: I did get a shot, and that it didn't work 1307 01:14:01,080 --> 01:14:05,280 Speaker 1: out that time. But um, I just I try to 1308 01:14:05,360 --> 01:14:08,120 Speaker 1: not let you know I hunt the deer, not the tree. 1309 01:14:08,160 --> 01:14:10,360 Speaker 1: That's what I said. You know, just don't be hunting 1310 01:14:10,400 --> 01:14:12,280 Speaker 1: trees when you're out in the woods. You know, hunt 1311 01:14:12,360 --> 01:14:15,920 Speaker 1: the deer and the sign and then figure out where 1312 01:14:15,920 --> 01:14:19,880 Speaker 1: you need to be. Under had said something to me like, man, 1313 01:14:19,960 --> 01:14:25,680 Speaker 1: this is like twenty years ago. UM about his His 1314 01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:28,360 Speaker 1: example was, you know, you look at a deer if 1315 01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:30,800 Speaker 1: you if you're lucky enough to watch a mature buck 1316 01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:35,160 Speaker 1: on his feet for any amount of time, UM, think 1317 01:14:35,160 --> 01:14:38,360 Speaker 1: about how many trees that deer walks by that you 1318 01:14:38,360 --> 01:14:42,200 Speaker 1: could have killed him from right. And if you had 1319 01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:45,280 Speaker 1: just known right, if you had an hour glad crystal ball, 1320 01:14:45,320 --> 01:14:47,400 Speaker 1: and you could say, well, you know this buck's going 1321 01:14:47,439 --> 01:14:49,280 Speaker 1: to come out here and walk along here and go 1322 01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:52,320 Speaker 1: back over here. There's there's a ton of trees you 1323 01:14:52,320 --> 01:14:55,960 Speaker 1: could kill him from. Um, But we don't have that 1324 01:14:56,040 --> 01:15:01,559 Speaker 1: crystal ball. And and so to me, it's a little 1325 01:15:01,600 --> 01:15:04,760 Speaker 1: bit less about the perfect tree, but it's about the 1326 01:15:04,880 --> 01:15:08,760 Speaker 1: um what gives you your best chance, you know too, 1327 01:15:10,680 --> 01:15:14,639 Speaker 1: to have that scenario work out. You know, Okay, here's 1328 01:15:14,720 --> 01:15:16,920 Speaker 1: here's the wind. That's good for me, that's good for 1329 01:15:16,960 --> 01:15:21,080 Speaker 1: the deer. This is where I need to be. Um. 1330 01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:23,320 Speaker 1: And then yeah, it might mean that I'm in a 1331 01:15:23,360 --> 01:15:25,000 Speaker 1: skinning or tree that I want to be, or I'm 1332 01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:27,040 Speaker 1: on the back side of it in a saddle, or 1333 01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:31,599 Speaker 1: I'm in a climber thirty feet up, or I'm I'm 1334 01:15:31,640 --> 01:15:35,719 Speaker 1: just in my sticks and lightweight stand and and uh, 1335 01:15:35,920 --> 01:15:38,519 Speaker 1: it's is usually the case, you know. So so it 1336 01:15:38,520 --> 01:15:44,160 Speaker 1: sounds like you're you're always going to prioritize the location, 1337 01:15:44,200 --> 01:15:49,000 Speaker 1: the best location over the best cover, right, Um, yeah, 1338 01:15:49,080 --> 01:15:52,400 Speaker 1: not necessarily always, because like I guess, the exception to 1339 01:15:52,439 --> 01:15:56,599 Speaker 1: that too, is how much time you have, UM, how 1340 01:15:56,640 --> 01:15:59,320 Speaker 1: intrusive that spot is or how aggressive it is. If 1341 01:15:59,360 --> 01:16:01,040 Speaker 1: you like, I gotta get this done, and if I 1342 01:16:01,120 --> 01:16:04,040 Speaker 1: go in here, it's a one and done situation. You 1343 01:16:04,040 --> 01:16:07,160 Speaker 1: know I've I've stunk it all up and this is 1344 01:16:07,200 --> 01:16:12,800 Speaker 1: it versus UM more conservative approach, and you're like, you know, 1345 01:16:13,080 --> 01:16:15,720 Speaker 1: I might get a shot here or I might just 1346 01:16:15,760 --> 01:16:19,160 Speaker 1: be observing tonight, but I'm not very intrusive, so I'm 1347 01:16:19,160 --> 01:16:23,440 Speaker 1: gonna see what's going on. So you've got those scenarios too. Okay, 1348 01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:26,840 Speaker 1: what about that situation and you you you dropped a 1349 01:16:26,840 --> 01:16:29,839 Speaker 1: couple of examples in there, but maybe you can expand 1350 01:16:29,840 --> 01:16:33,240 Speaker 1: on this. In this scenario where you know you've got 1351 01:16:33,360 --> 01:16:36,400 Speaker 1: the perfect location, but it's a crap tree, it's a 1352 01:16:36,439 --> 01:16:39,479 Speaker 1: six inch poplar or whatever with almost no branches or 1353 01:16:39,520 --> 01:16:42,080 Speaker 1: something like that, what are the things you do to 1354 01:16:42,160 --> 01:16:47,519 Speaker 1: make that work still for you? So the things you 1355 01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:51,639 Speaker 1: the things you do is is you just number one, 1356 01:16:51,680 --> 01:16:56,879 Speaker 1: you mentally prepare yourself for being ready. Um, you generally 1357 01:16:56,880 --> 01:16:59,280 Speaker 1: have Okay, if if it's that type of scenario, you 1358 01:16:59,320 --> 01:17:02,800 Speaker 1: know that I can't get away with excess movement. I 1359 01:17:02,880 --> 01:17:05,000 Speaker 1: have to be ready and whether that means holding your 1360 01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:08,120 Speaker 1: bow the whole time or having it on a hangar 1361 01:17:08,200 --> 01:17:11,000 Speaker 1: right in front of your face where you just minimize 1362 01:17:11,439 --> 01:17:14,800 Speaker 1: absolutely every movement. It might mean standing the whole time 1363 01:17:14,800 --> 01:17:20,240 Speaker 1: instead of sitting. Um, but it it's something to that 1364 01:17:20,360 --> 01:17:23,200 Speaker 1: extent that you know, Okay, this is what I sacrificed. 1365 01:17:23,320 --> 01:17:26,160 Speaker 1: I'm giving up this in order to have this. And 1366 01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:29,840 Speaker 1: so if that's the tree, and it means you're really exposed, 1367 01:17:30,520 --> 01:17:34,120 Speaker 1: it means you have to minimize your movement. Um. So 1368 01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:36,880 Speaker 1: the only way to get get the job done is 1369 01:17:37,200 --> 01:17:41,120 Speaker 1: and you tell yourself, okay, well it's it's raining, I'm 1370 01:17:41,120 --> 01:17:43,640 Speaker 1: not going to hear him coming, or it's windy, I'm 1371 01:17:43,680 --> 01:17:46,719 Speaker 1: not gonna hear him coming. Um, they could be right there. 1372 01:17:47,160 --> 01:17:50,120 Speaker 1: You give yourself. You know, it's like I always call 1373 01:17:50,200 --> 01:17:53,160 Speaker 1: that pre pitching your outfielders when we're in baseball. You know, 1374 01:17:53,240 --> 01:17:55,880 Speaker 1: you're a base runner and you've got to see where 1375 01:17:55,920 --> 01:17:58,040 Speaker 1: the defense is playing to know whether you can go 1376 01:17:58,080 --> 01:18:01,200 Speaker 1: to third on a base hit to such and such spot. 1377 01:18:01,920 --> 01:18:03,840 Speaker 1: You know you're getting your tree stand and I pre 1378 01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:08,000 Speaker 1: pitch my my dear, you know, I'm I'm analyzing, Okay, 1379 01:18:08,040 --> 01:18:09,960 Speaker 1: if he comes from here, this is what I have 1380 01:18:10,040 --> 01:18:11,519 Speaker 1: to do if he comes from here, This is what 1381 01:18:11,600 --> 01:18:13,839 Speaker 1: I have to do. And you figure out your worst 1382 01:18:13,880 --> 01:18:16,519 Speaker 1: case scenario. It's like, all right, if there's one over here, 1383 01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:20,280 Speaker 1: how can I get my bow and get turned around 1384 01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:23,360 Speaker 1: and stuff? So you you you prepare yourself for that 1385 01:18:23,439 --> 01:18:28,120 Speaker 1: worst scenario and sit or stand or set up to 1386 01:18:28,200 --> 01:18:31,559 Speaker 1: accommodate that. And and that's how you can close the 1387 01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:34,960 Speaker 1: deal on more dear um. But too many guys, And 1388 01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:36,840 Speaker 1: this was what drives me nuts. I mean, guys are 1389 01:18:36,960 --> 01:18:40,720 Speaker 1: ranging deer right before they shoot him, and I just 1390 01:18:40,760 --> 01:18:43,599 Speaker 1: don't get that. You know, we've got range finders, and 1391 01:18:43,640 --> 01:18:48,800 Speaker 1: we've got brains to remember things. You should be you know, 1392 01:18:49,280 --> 01:18:52,240 Speaker 1: ranging things ahead of time and then just sit there 1393 01:18:52,240 --> 01:18:54,760 Speaker 1: and repeat it to yourself in the tree. You know, 1394 01:18:55,360 --> 01:18:59,719 Speaker 1: that's thirty yards, that's thirty five, that's you know, normally 1395 01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:03,320 Speaker 1: I have three or four yardages that I keep repeating 1396 01:19:03,360 --> 01:19:06,519 Speaker 1: to myself. Okay, I know that one's one, I know 1397 01:19:06,640 --> 01:19:09,760 Speaker 1: that one's thirty. I know that's twenty two. And that's 1398 01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:11,439 Speaker 1: all you need to know, you know, because if you 1399 01:19:11,479 --> 01:19:15,440 Speaker 1: can't do the math in between those, then you're struggling. 1400 01:19:16,160 --> 01:19:19,920 Speaker 1: So that's the kind of stuff that you mentally prepare 1401 01:19:19,960 --> 01:19:22,040 Speaker 1: yourself for and that you do while you're in a tree, 1402 01:19:22,840 --> 01:19:25,439 Speaker 1: um to help you close the deal. Yeah, that's a 1403 01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:29,280 Speaker 1: great point. You know. Another part of this whole scenario 1404 01:19:29,400 --> 01:19:33,040 Speaker 1: of of of picking the spot and finding the tree 1405 01:19:33,200 --> 01:19:35,760 Speaker 1: and getting set up all that kind of stuff is 1406 01:19:35,880 --> 01:19:39,439 Speaker 1: of course factoring wind. You mentioned that as being one 1407 01:19:39,439 --> 01:19:41,280 Speaker 1: of the first things going to think about, but I 1408 01:19:41,320 --> 01:19:44,519 Speaker 1: also know that you think about wind not in the 1409 01:19:44,640 --> 01:19:46,720 Speaker 1: obvious way all the time, which is just making sure 1410 01:19:46,760 --> 01:19:49,880 Speaker 1: that deer won't smell me, but also thinking about how 1411 01:19:49,920 --> 01:19:52,040 Speaker 1: deer will use the wind, and then trying to find 1412 01:19:52,120 --> 01:19:56,439 Speaker 1: up an off wind angle or somewhere where you both 1413 01:19:56,520 --> 01:20:01,000 Speaker 1: kind of feel like you're in in an advantageous position. Um. 1414 01:20:01,040 --> 01:20:03,479 Speaker 1: And this is this concept is something that a lot 1415 01:20:03,520 --> 01:20:08,080 Speaker 1: of great deer hunters talk about. It's also a concept 1416 01:20:08,080 --> 01:20:10,599 Speaker 1: that I think a lot of new to average hunters 1417 01:20:10,600 --> 01:20:14,360 Speaker 1: have a hard time putting into action. It's it's one 1418 01:20:14,360 --> 01:20:16,160 Speaker 1: thing to hear, it's a harder thing to figure out 1419 01:20:16,200 --> 01:20:19,000 Speaker 1: how to pull it off. Um. And I've even had 1420 01:20:19,080 --> 01:20:22,439 Speaker 1: struggles sometimes with it in like high deer density areas 1421 01:20:22,439 --> 01:20:24,800 Speaker 1: where you know you might be able to play it 1422 01:20:24,840 --> 01:20:28,040 Speaker 1: on the buck, but if there's twenty does that can 1423 01:20:28,080 --> 01:20:30,360 Speaker 1: come through from every different direction in the world, and 1424 01:20:30,400 --> 01:20:35,720 Speaker 1: they start spooking your nights. Done to um, So I'm 1425 01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:39,479 Speaker 1: just kind of curious if you can speak to how 1426 01:20:39,640 --> 01:20:44,559 Speaker 1: you think about finding those situations and and then maybe 1427 01:20:44,560 --> 01:20:47,480 Speaker 1: there's an example you can share to kind of illustrate 1428 01:20:47,520 --> 01:20:50,160 Speaker 1: how to take this idea that makes a lot of sense, 1429 01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:55,760 Speaker 1: but it's often a lot harder to execute on. Yeah, 1430 01:20:55,800 --> 01:20:59,840 Speaker 1: I mean to me, it's it's um, it's just getting 1431 01:20:59,840 --> 01:21:02,759 Speaker 1: over that initial hump of learning what the heck people 1432 01:21:02,800 --> 01:21:06,360 Speaker 1: mean when they say play the wind, and there was 1433 01:21:06,479 --> 01:21:10,439 Speaker 1: bad information given for years about that, because playing the 1434 01:21:10,479 --> 01:21:14,400 Speaker 1: wind does not just mean walking into the wind. Um, 1435 01:21:14,800 --> 01:21:18,040 Speaker 1: it might mean that, but it doesn't just mean that. 1436 01:21:18,120 --> 01:21:24,280 Speaker 1: It means, you know, hunting to the point where the 1437 01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:27,639 Speaker 1: deer don't detect you, you know, before you shoot him, right, 1438 01:21:27,720 --> 01:21:31,479 Speaker 1: so and using the wind to that advantage. And so 1439 01:21:31,640 --> 01:21:34,720 Speaker 1: you've got to not just think about what wind is 1440 01:21:34,760 --> 01:21:37,200 Speaker 1: good for you, but what wind is good for the deer, 1441 01:21:37,280 --> 01:21:40,080 Speaker 1: because if the wind is bad for the deer, they're 1442 01:21:40,120 --> 01:21:42,840 Speaker 1: not going to do what you want them to. And 1443 01:21:42,920 --> 01:21:45,479 Speaker 1: if if if you can think through a scenario, is 1444 01:21:45,520 --> 01:21:48,280 Speaker 1: if you're not there Okay, if this buck is bettered 1445 01:21:48,280 --> 01:21:50,240 Speaker 1: where I think he is, what is he probably going 1446 01:21:50,320 --> 01:21:55,240 Speaker 1: to do based on this wind? Okay? And then where 1447 01:21:55,320 --> 01:21:59,240 Speaker 1: could I be sitting that he would still do that 1448 01:21:59,320 --> 01:22:02,000 Speaker 1: and not hecked me? You know. And and so when 1449 01:22:02,040 --> 01:22:06,160 Speaker 1: you especially you know, nowadays with ONYX and and the 1450 01:22:06,240 --> 01:22:10,160 Speaker 1: aerial stuff we've got access to, um, you can just 1451 01:22:10,240 --> 01:22:14,920 Speaker 1: literally scrub your finger or draw lines and and and 1452 01:22:15,400 --> 01:22:18,160 Speaker 1: figured out pretty quickly. But the problem a lot of 1453 01:22:18,160 --> 01:22:22,960 Speaker 1: guys have is is they said, well, okay, I you know, 1454 01:22:23,040 --> 01:22:25,280 Speaker 1: I've got a I've got a west wind tonight. That 1455 01:22:25,400 --> 01:22:28,640 Speaker 1: means I can I can hunt over here and they 1456 01:22:28,640 --> 01:22:31,600 Speaker 1: won't smell me. Okay, but will they be there in 1457 01:22:31,640 --> 01:22:34,559 Speaker 1: a west wind? And if the answer is yes, then 1458 01:22:34,920 --> 01:22:37,800 Speaker 1: then you're good. But if it's not, then you've got 1459 01:22:37,800 --> 01:22:42,519 Speaker 1: to rethink your strategy. So for me, it's, um, yeah, 1460 01:22:42,560 --> 01:22:45,439 Speaker 1: it's it's it becomes pretty obvious, you know, when you 1461 01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:50,120 Speaker 1: and you said, okay, well, especially in hill country for example, 1462 01:22:50,200 --> 01:22:52,680 Speaker 1: all right, we've got let's say we've got a northwest 1463 01:22:52,760 --> 01:22:58,800 Speaker 1: running ridge and you've got a um, a north south 1464 01:22:58,880 --> 01:23:00,920 Speaker 1: running ridge, I should say. And let's say you've got 1465 01:23:00,960 --> 01:23:05,160 Speaker 1: a west wind. So people say, well, I'm gonna hunt 1466 01:23:05,280 --> 01:23:10,240 Speaker 1: my h east side of the property because that's ah, 1467 01:23:10,560 --> 01:23:14,719 Speaker 1: you know, that's gonna be down wind. Well, what happens 1468 01:23:14,760 --> 01:23:16,599 Speaker 1: when the deer, you know, they're bedded on the east 1469 01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:19,240 Speaker 1: side of that slope because you know they got a 1470 01:23:19,280 --> 01:23:23,439 Speaker 1: west wind that day, And what happens when they want 1471 01:23:23,439 --> 01:23:25,559 Speaker 1: to head west, you know, into the wind, out to 1472 01:23:25,600 --> 01:23:28,559 Speaker 1: the farm field or the food plot or whatever it does, 1473 01:23:28,640 --> 01:23:32,400 Speaker 1: you know, good to be east of them. So that's 1474 01:23:32,439 --> 01:23:37,800 Speaker 1: where you look at terrain and natural um differences with 1475 01:23:37,880 --> 01:23:43,799 Speaker 1: thermals um and cover and obstacles like blowdowns and stuff. 1476 01:23:44,080 --> 01:23:48,360 Speaker 1: And you're scouting will show you that. It's like, okay, um, 1477 01:23:48,439 --> 01:23:52,759 Speaker 1: how can I still sit on west of that deer 1478 01:23:53,520 --> 01:23:57,040 Speaker 1: with the west wind without being able you know, him 1479 01:23:57,080 --> 01:24:01,840 Speaker 1: to be able to detect me? So you know, and 1480 01:24:01,880 --> 01:24:03,760 Speaker 1: it's and it's obvious. Well, yeah, you know you're not 1481 01:24:03,800 --> 01:24:06,839 Speaker 1: gonna sit directly up wind of him where he's betted, 1482 01:24:07,400 --> 01:24:11,040 Speaker 1: maybe north or south of him. Right. Well, now you're 1483 01:24:11,040 --> 01:24:15,120 Speaker 1: scouting is is you're you're asking yourself, okay, well, what's 1484 01:24:15,160 --> 01:24:17,360 Speaker 1: going to make him go north a little bit or 1485 01:24:17,479 --> 01:24:21,120 Speaker 1: south a little bit. Sometimes it's a little bit of 1486 01:24:21,120 --> 01:24:23,760 Speaker 1: a shift in the contour of the land, you know, 1487 01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:26,599 Speaker 1: where that ridge turns just a little bit before it 1488 01:24:26,640 --> 01:24:30,600 Speaker 1: goes out to the field. And sometimes it's a blowdown 1489 01:24:30,920 --> 01:24:33,439 Speaker 1: or a thicket or something that they want they walk 1490 01:24:33,520 --> 01:24:36,280 Speaker 1: on the edge of that gives you that little bit 1491 01:24:36,320 --> 01:24:39,479 Speaker 1: of advantage. And so those are the things you're looking for. 1492 01:24:40,560 --> 01:24:45,520 Speaker 1: So I like an example of that would be um. Oh, 1493 01:24:45,560 --> 01:24:48,400 Speaker 1: I shot a big, big eight point down in Ohio 1494 01:24:48,520 --> 01:24:51,760 Speaker 1: in late January a couple of years ago. It was 1495 01:24:54,520 --> 01:24:59,000 Speaker 1: January I shot it, and that was a spot EYED 1496 01:24:59,040 --> 01:25:03,400 Speaker 1: hunted two times prior to that. So you're thinking, generally 1497 01:25:03,439 --> 01:25:06,479 Speaker 1: you don't hunt the same spot, you know, late season 1498 01:25:06,600 --> 01:25:09,200 Speaker 1: like that. But I was. I was getting in and out. 1499 01:25:09,240 --> 01:25:11,479 Speaker 1: We had snow and I was getting in and out. Um. 1500 01:25:11,760 --> 01:25:14,840 Speaker 1: It was lower deer density too, so I wasn't spooking him. 1501 01:25:15,720 --> 01:25:20,120 Speaker 1: But I went in um and scouted in the snow 1502 01:25:20,360 --> 01:25:22,160 Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh my gosh, this is these deer 1503 01:25:22,280 --> 01:25:26,640 Speaker 1: coming right up this ridge, um out of this valley. 1504 01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:30,759 Speaker 1: And I had what was it. I had a southwest wind, 1505 01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:35,439 Speaker 1: west southwest wind that night, and so they were mostly 1506 01:25:35,479 --> 01:25:38,240 Speaker 1: coming into that wind with with it mostly in their 1507 01:25:38,280 --> 01:25:41,559 Speaker 1: face but not totally. And so by getting a little 1508 01:25:41,600 --> 01:25:46,080 Speaker 1: bit further east, just you know thirty yards um, you know, 1509 01:25:46,400 --> 01:25:50,200 Speaker 1: had that deer and and it almost it was really borderline. 1510 01:25:50,240 --> 01:25:52,599 Speaker 1: But that buck came out of the valley that night, 1511 01:25:52,720 --> 01:25:56,519 Speaker 1: like just twenty minutes before dark. I see him down 1512 01:25:56,520 --> 01:25:59,840 Speaker 1: in the valley and he's working his way up, but 1513 01:26:00,040 --> 01:26:02,479 Speaker 1: he's working his way towards the east to kind of 1514 01:26:02,479 --> 01:26:05,080 Speaker 1: start trying to smell what's coming down the ridge from 1515 01:26:05,080 --> 01:26:09,320 Speaker 1: the thermals and stuff. But it was just off enough 1516 01:26:10,200 --> 01:26:12,680 Speaker 1: that he didn't go far enough east to smell me. 1517 01:26:12,960 --> 01:26:14,920 Speaker 1: And he started coming up that ridge and so he 1518 01:26:15,000 --> 01:26:18,720 Speaker 1: had to win mostly in his face. And and I 1519 01:26:18,760 --> 01:26:23,040 Speaker 1: had that just that cross wind enough that it was 1520 01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:25,560 Speaker 1: it wasn't going down to him, it was going a 1521 01:26:25,600 --> 01:26:28,880 Speaker 1: little bit to his right, and it was you know, 1522 01:26:29,360 --> 01:26:31,400 Speaker 1: one of those perfect winds where you got about a 1523 01:26:31,439 --> 01:26:33,840 Speaker 1: six mile an hour wind where it's steady enough to 1524 01:26:34,600 --> 01:26:37,760 Speaker 1: to not deflect and not so calm that your scent 1525 01:26:37,880 --> 01:26:41,400 Speaker 1: is pooling. But that's the kind of scenarios that that 1526 01:26:41,479 --> 01:26:45,920 Speaker 1: are those are killing scenarios, Yam. I shot the one 1527 01:26:46,000 --> 01:26:48,960 Speaker 1: that we had on the Addictions episode years ago, that 1528 01:26:49,200 --> 01:26:51,000 Speaker 1: in that little water puddle that I put in the 1529 01:26:51,000 --> 01:26:55,160 Speaker 1: Whole Country video, and that was another perfect example of 1530 01:26:55,880 --> 01:26:59,439 Speaker 1: um kind of think. So that was a southwest wind, 1531 01:27:01,080 --> 01:27:05,640 Speaker 1: and it was more of a south southwest wind, and 1532 01:27:05,800 --> 01:27:10,519 Speaker 1: that buck would bed in there on anywhere from the 1533 01:27:10,560 --> 01:27:14,640 Speaker 1: west to south wind. And but I was I was 1534 01:27:14,720 --> 01:27:17,960 Speaker 1: far enough west of him that my wind was going 1535 01:27:18,320 --> 01:27:21,880 Speaker 1: to his north. And so he you know, he had 1536 01:27:21,920 --> 01:27:25,719 Speaker 1: to um walk the contour that point a little bit 1537 01:27:26,040 --> 01:27:28,680 Speaker 1: to swing a little bit south of me before he 1538 01:27:28,760 --> 01:27:32,519 Speaker 1: started going west. And you know, by the time he 1539 01:27:32,600 --> 01:27:39,240 Speaker 1: got to me, I'm um again, like my wind is 1540 01:27:39,360 --> 01:27:42,679 Speaker 1: quartering towards him, you know where if he'd kept coming 1541 01:27:42,680 --> 01:27:45,160 Speaker 1: and walked past that water hole, you know, he'd he'd 1542 01:27:45,160 --> 01:27:47,080 Speaker 1: have winded me. So those are the scenarios you look 1543 01:27:47,120 --> 01:27:50,439 Speaker 1: at too as well. Okay, he's eventually going to cross 1544 01:27:50,520 --> 01:27:52,439 Speaker 1: my wind, but I need to build to kill him 1545 01:27:52,439 --> 01:27:55,160 Speaker 1: before he does that. And and that's what you're looking 1546 01:27:55,160 --> 01:27:58,000 Speaker 1: forward to. So and so, you know, they don't always 1547 01:27:58,000 --> 01:28:01,520 Speaker 1: smell you, or they don't always bull you know, typically 1548 01:28:01,560 --> 01:28:03,680 Speaker 1: they will, you know, if if they get any kind 1549 01:28:03,680 --> 01:28:09,040 Speaker 1: of whiff. But um, do you ever sorry, I was 1550 01:28:09,120 --> 01:28:14,240 Speaker 1: gonna ask, do you do you ever get more conservative 1551 01:28:14,680 --> 01:28:17,040 Speaker 1: than what you're describing When you're in a high deer 1552 01:28:17,080 --> 01:28:19,800 Speaker 1: density area. I'm just thinking about, Like some of the 1553 01:28:19,800 --> 01:28:22,559 Speaker 1: southern Michigan places that I'm assuming you hunt are kind 1554 01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:26,080 Speaker 1: of similar to mine, where there's so many deer. Sometimes 1555 01:28:26,120 --> 01:28:29,360 Speaker 1: I find myself debating, do I do what you're describing 1556 01:28:29,640 --> 01:28:34,320 Speaker 1: and play that buck perfectly? Or do I do I 1557 01:28:34,360 --> 01:28:36,040 Speaker 1: think about the risk of the fact that there's so 1558 01:28:36,080 --> 01:28:38,160 Speaker 1: many damn does they're gonna be coming through here that 1559 01:28:38,280 --> 01:28:39,880 Speaker 1: there's no way I'll get away with it. But if 1560 01:28:39,880 --> 01:28:44,040 Speaker 1: I back off another twenty yards or something, I won't 1561 01:28:44,040 --> 01:28:46,320 Speaker 1: be perfectly on that buck, but at least I won't 1562 01:28:46,360 --> 01:28:49,960 Speaker 1: have fourteen Does that win me over the next two hours? 1563 01:28:50,000 --> 01:28:54,600 Speaker 1: And then if that buck comes through you do okay? Yeah, absolutely, 1564 01:28:54,680 --> 01:28:57,160 Speaker 1: especially if it's my home area, you know, where I 1565 01:28:57,160 --> 01:29:00,920 Speaker 1: know I have more seits. Um So. Again, it's like 1566 01:29:01,240 --> 01:29:04,559 Speaker 1: those hundred different criteria that you run through your mind 1567 01:29:05,400 --> 01:29:08,280 Speaker 1: all come into play in making that final decision of 1568 01:29:08,360 --> 01:29:10,599 Speaker 1: where I'm going to sit and how how many times 1569 01:29:10,640 --> 01:29:12,479 Speaker 1: I'm going to sit there and when I'm going to 1570 01:29:12,600 --> 01:29:17,240 Speaker 1: sit there. Um So, Yeah, I mean, that's that's certainly 1571 01:29:17,240 --> 01:29:19,639 Speaker 1: a factor. I'll give you an example, is that that 1572 01:29:20,400 --> 01:29:22,800 Speaker 1: great big seven point I killed a couple of years ago. 1573 01:29:23,320 --> 01:29:27,480 Speaker 1: Um I sat a more conservative spot on that farm 1574 01:29:27,560 --> 01:29:30,799 Speaker 1: because Lee already had a stand hung there. We already 1575 01:29:30,800 --> 01:29:35,120 Speaker 1: had a spot prepped and hung, and it was further 1576 01:29:35,680 --> 01:29:38,880 Speaker 1: off of the corner of the field than then you 1577 01:29:39,320 --> 01:29:41,200 Speaker 1: that you would typically sit if you were going to 1578 01:29:41,280 --> 01:29:44,439 Speaker 1: be aggressive. But it allows us to get in and 1579 01:29:44,479 --> 01:29:48,960 Speaker 1: out of there a lot easier. And especially and this 1580 01:29:49,040 --> 01:29:51,320 Speaker 1: was third week in November, getting to be into the 1581 01:29:51,360 --> 01:29:55,599 Speaker 1: third week in November, so the foliage is down, and 1582 01:29:55,680 --> 01:29:59,240 Speaker 1: you can't just be up on a ridge point, you know, 1583 01:29:59,520 --> 01:30:02,479 Speaker 1: cutting and and set things up and being super noisy 1584 01:30:02,520 --> 01:30:05,639 Speaker 1: and in that in that scenario, given where I figured 1585 01:30:05,680 --> 01:30:09,600 Speaker 1: they were betting, and um, so I sat off of 1586 01:30:09,640 --> 01:30:14,080 Speaker 1: it in that stand. Um And yeah, I mean those 1587 01:30:14,080 --> 01:30:16,240 Speaker 1: are ones where you're you're hoping to see something, you're 1588 01:30:16,240 --> 01:30:19,840 Speaker 1: hoping that um, you know, because they don't they don't 1589 01:30:19,840 --> 01:30:22,000 Speaker 1: always just come out to the corner of the field 1590 01:30:22,120 --> 01:30:24,480 Speaker 1: and then just turn around and leave. You know, they're 1591 01:30:24,479 --> 01:30:28,120 Speaker 1: probably going to come out and walk somewhere. So and 1592 01:30:28,200 --> 01:30:29,960 Speaker 1: it's the rut, you know. That was that was more 1593 01:30:30,000 --> 01:30:33,760 Speaker 1: of a later back back part of the rut. But yeah, 1594 01:30:33,800 --> 01:30:36,760 Speaker 1: he came out there after a couple of dolls came 1595 01:30:36,800 --> 01:30:41,120 Speaker 1: out into that field, and then he came out about 1596 01:30:41,160 --> 01:30:43,800 Speaker 1: ten minutes later, and he had it right over to 1597 01:30:43,840 --> 01:30:46,120 Speaker 1: where the dolls went. But then the dough ended up 1598 01:30:46,160 --> 01:30:48,439 Speaker 1: coming right over in front of me at last light, 1599 01:30:48,600 --> 01:30:52,280 Speaker 1: and then he followed her, and so that that worked out, 1600 01:30:52,320 --> 01:30:54,759 Speaker 1: you know. And that's that's why you do that, because 1601 01:30:54,880 --> 01:30:59,160 Speaker 1: I had another day, I didn't didn't have to throw 1602 01:30:59,400 --> 01:31:03,080 Speaker 1: all my chip sin right then. Um. So yeah, it's 1603 01:31:03,080 --> 01:31:07,360 Speaker 1: always it's always a factor like that. And usually I 1604 01:31:07,439 --> 01:31:11,240 Speaker 1: saved my most aggressive moves for when I really either 1605 01:31:11,320 --> 01:31:13,280 Speaker 1: I'm on a time crunch and like I got one 1606 01:31:13,360 --> 01:31:20,440 Speaker 1: day left, you know, why not? Or um, I've um, 1607 01:31:20,479 --> 01:31:24,160 Speaker 1: I've got things figured out. I know. Okay, Well I 1608 01:31:24,200 --> 01:31:26,519 Speaker 1: saw him do this. He went in here this morning 1609 01:31:26,560 --> 01:31:29,040 Speaker 1: and he betted, and this is what the winds doing. 1610 01:31:29,120 --> 01:31:32,120 Speaker 1: He's he's gonna becoming out of there one of these 1611 01:31:32,160 --> 01:31:34,800 Speaker 1: two places or something. You know. Those are those are 1612 01:31:34,840 --> 01:31:40,040 Speaker 1: scenarios where you get aggressive and and make a move. Yeah. 1613 01:31:40,080 --> 01:31:44,400 Speaker 1: I love, I love how deep you can get with 1614 01:31:44,479 --> 01:31:48,679 Speaker 1: this stuff and these this I just I geek out 1615 01:31:48,680 --> 01:31:53,080 Speaker 1: over it so hard. Um. Yeah, I tend too too. 1616 01:31:53,120 --> 01:31:56,320 Speaker 1: It's uh, the analytical side of me and the tech 1617 01:31:56,439 --> 01:32:00,520 Speaker 1: side of me that just loves to study the different scenarios. 1618 01:32:00,520 --> 01:32:03,360 Speaker 1: You know, some guys are a lot more primitive in 1619 01:32:03,400 --> 01:32:06,320 Speaker 1: their thoughts and reactions to to the way they pursue it, 1620 01:32:06,360 --> 01:32:10,439 Speaker 1: and they do well. Um, and I like studying it. Um. 1621 01:32:10,760 --> 01:32:12,559 Speaker 1: This is like I said, it's that chess game or 1622 01:32:12,560 --> 01:32:16,040 Speaker 1: that puzzle puzzle you're trying to put together. It's a 1623 01:32:16,040 --> 01:32:20,719 Speaker 1: lot of fun. Um. Well, I I feel like there's 1624 01:32:20,720 --> 01:32:22,720 Speaker 1: a million things more we could get into, but I 1625 01:32:23,080 --> 01:32:25,479 Speaker 1: don't want to take your entire day, so we should 1626 01:32:25,479 --> 01:32:29,360 Speaker 1: probably wrap it up. Um. One last kind of question, 1627 01:32:29,520 --> 01:32:32,920 Speaker 1: slash thought. I know that you've spent a lot of 1628 01:32:32,920 --> 01:32:36,479 Speaker 1: time over recent years, you know, balancing your own hunting 1629 01:32:36,479 --> 01:32:40,360 Speaker 1: time with a family and taking your son out hunting, 1630 01:32:40,640 --> 01:32:43,080 Speaker 1: and and also still trying to spend some time yourself. 1631 01:32:43,560 --> 01:32:46,439 Speaker 1: It's something that I'm starting to deal with. I've got 1632 01:32:46,439 --> 01:32:48,240 Speaker 1: a three year old and a one year old, so 1633 01:32:48,280 --> 01:32:51,479 Speaker 1: that's constantly more and more on my mind. I'm just 1634 01:32:51,560 --> 01:32:56,000 Speaker 1: kind of curious what your what your advice might be 1635 01:32:56,120 --> 01:32:59,120 Speaker 1: for folks that there's many many other folks in similar 1636 01:32:59,160 --> 01:33:01,759 Speaker 1: situations to this, with children with families, trying to balance 1637 01:33:01,760 --> 01:33:04,800 Speaker 1: our obsession with white tails and all this while also 1638 01:33:04,920 --> 01:33:08,240 Speaker 1: trying to meet all of our other obligations. Um, any 1639 01:33:08,280 --> 01:33:11,040 Speaker 1: thoughts on how you've been able to manage that and 1640 01:33:11,320 --> 01:33:14,320 Speaker 1: or how you've been able to become more efficient with 1641 01:33:14,360 --> 01:33:17,639 Speaker 1: your hunting to still reach your goals. Have a good time, 1642 01:33:17,680 --> 01:33:21,920 Speaker 1: but but have you know time for everything else too? Yeah, 1643 01:33:21,920 --> 01:33:24,200 Speaker 1: that's a good question, Mark. I'm glad to bring that up, 1644 01:33:24,240 --> 01:33:30,080 Speaker 1: because first of all, I would say, UM, make sure 1645 01:33:30,080 --> 01:33:33,280 Speaker 1: you prioritize your family. You know, they're the most important 1646 01:33:33,280 --> 01:33:38,280 Speaker 1: thing in your life there should be, and and without 1647 01:33:38,360 --> 01:33:40,000 Speaker 1: them you have nothing. You know, you can have all 1648 01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:42,400 Speaker 1: the deer heads on the on the wall in the world, 1649 01:33:42,439 --> 01:33:44,760 Speaker 1: and I just think you have nothing if you don't 1650 01:33:44,800 --> 01:33:46,760 Speaker 1: have your loved ones around you, in a family that 1651 01:33:47,439 --> 01:33:51,160 Speaker 1: loves you and supports you, and and so that needs 1652 01:33:51,160 --> 01:33:55,360 Speaker 1: to be priority one. I mean I don't think, um 1653 01:33:55,880 --> 01:33:58,080 Speaker 1: that's a that's a long rabbit hole to get down. 1654 01:33:58,200 --> 01:34:01,240 Speaker 1: But you know, people lose friendship, some marriages over deer 1655 01:34:01,280 --> 01:34:04,479 Speaker 1: and it's just not worth it. Um. So I really 1656 01:34:04,479 --> 01:34:07,800 Speaker 1: think people need to prioritize their their family. For me, 1657 01:34:07,880 --> 01:34:13,040 Speaker 1: that I mean, the good scenario UM I attribute success 1658 01:34:13,080 --> 01:34:15,920 Speaker 1: to is is, Yeah, there's there's a learning curve to 1659 01:34:16,040 --> 01:34:18,840 Speaker 1: do in this stuff, and you need that experience. Some 1660 01:34:18,920 --> 01:34:22,519 Speaker 1: guys get into hunting um later in life and they 1661 01:34:22,520 --> 01:34:25,840 Speaker 1: don't have, you know, their childhood of just exploring in 1662 01:34:25,880 --> 01:34:28,000 Speaker 1: the woods. To draw back on me, I mean, I 1663 01:34:28,040 --> 01:34:30,519 Speaker 1: was in the woods with baby guns and bone arrows 1664 01:34:30,560 --> 01:34:33,519 Speaker 1: and stuff since I was four, and I have a 1665 01:34:33,560 --> 01:34:38,120 Speaker 1: lifetime of experiences in the woods to draw on. And 1666 01:34:38,640 --> 01:34:40,920 Speaker 1: I do think you know, when you're young enough that 1667 01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:44,280 Speaker 1: you don't have a family, and if it is eating 1668 01:34:44,280 --> 01:34:46,320 Speaker 1: you up and you want to do it all the time, 1669 01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:49,559 Speaker 1: then do it. Um. That's a great time of your 1670 01:34:49,600 --> 01:34:53,080 Speaker 1: life and your teens and twenties to to figure things 1671 01:34:53,080 --> 01:34:56,519 Speaker 1: out and to learn. And if it's not not something 1672 01:34:56,520 --> 01:34:58,439 Speaker 1: you want to keep doing, that's fine. But if if 1673 01:34:58,439 --> 01:34:59,920 Speaker 1: you do love it, you're going to gain a lot 1674 01:35:00,080 --> 01:35:04,080 Speaker 1: of experience and memories, um to draw back on when 1675 01:35:04,080 --> 01:35:06,760 Speaker 1: you're older and you don't have as much time like me. 1676 01:35:07,560 --> 01:35:11,400 Speaker 1: And so nowadays I can I can be confident that, UM, 1677 01:35:11,439 --> 01:35:15,400 Speaker 1: I can sit in my my computer and we're at 1678 01:35:15,400 --> 01:35:20,439 Speaker 1: my kids soccer games and be just monitoring the weather. UM. 1679 01:35:20,479 --> 01:35:25,040 Speaker 1: Maybe I'm monitoring trail cameras or um talking to people, 1680 01:35:25,160 --> 01:35:29,000 Speaker 1: but I'm watching weather forecasts and I know and this 1681 01:35:29,080 --> 01:35:32,240 Speaker 1: is a big reason I'm self employed, because I wanted 1682 01:35:32,280 --> 01:35:35,839 Speaker 1: that flexibility in my life to be able to do that. UM. 1683 01:35:35,920 --> 01:35:40,600 Speaker 1: So if I hunt less, it's going to be quality hunts. UM. 1684 01:35:40,720 --> 01:35:45,200 Speaker 1: But you can be doing other things and still have 1685 01:35:45,360 --> 01:35:46,760 Speaker 1: that in the back of your mind, because I mean, 1686 01:35:47,000 --> 01:35:49,240 Speaker 1: my wife will tell you, I always have deer on 1687 01:35:49,240 --> 01:35:53,640 Speaker 1: my phone. I'm doing something related to deer and um 1688 01:35:53,680 --> 01:35:56,400 Speaker 1: figuring out what my next move is. And so I 1689 01:35:56,400 --> 01:36:00,880 Speaker 1: think last year, I never I never picked up a 1690 01:36:00,880 --> 01:36:03,880 Speaker 1: bow in Michigan. I just took my son out. If 1691 01:36:03,920 --> 01:36:07,120 Speaker 1: I took anybody out. Um. But I still keep tabs 1692 01:36:07,120 --> 01:36:11,160 Speaker 1: on things, and I try to run cameras and I 1693 01:36:11,240 --> 01:36:14,599 Speaker 1: go watch certain spots or I walks, you know, certain spots, 1694 01:36:14,640 --> 01:36:18,880 Speaker 1: and something appeals to me or something catches my eye. 1695 01:36:18,920 --> 01:36:24,479 Speaker 1: Then then I can shift gears really quickly. UM. But 1696 01:36:24,520 --> 01:36:27,080 Speaker 1: you know, my my mode these days tends to be 1697 01:36:27,439 --> 01:36:31,280 Speaker 1: saving my my hunting time for my kids locally. And 1698 01:36:31,320 --> 01:36:34,800 Speaker 1: then I saved some you know, my quality hunts myself, 1699 01:36:35,000 --> 01:36:38,960 Speaker 1: um in Wisconsin or or somewhere else. You know, typically 1700 01:36:39,040 --> 01:36:41,880 Speaker 1: I'll do other hunts. Like last year, I drew some 1701 01:36:41,920 --> 01:36:44,240 Speaker 1: good tags and I killed a big elk and a 1702 01:36:44,320 --> 01:36:48,120 Speaker 1: nice meal deer and um, so I enjoy the other 1703 01:36:48,160 --> 01:36:52,719 Speaker 1: stuff too, but um, yeah, I think that balance comes 1704 01:36:52,800 --> 01:36:58,320 Speaker 1: from experience of having really been into it when I 1705 01:36:58,400 --> 01:37:00,679 Speaker 1: was younger, and I can draw on uh, and I'm 1706 01:37:00,800 --> 01:37:03,439 Speaker 1: I'm a lot more comfortable not having to to grind 1707 01:37:03,479 --> 01:37:07,560 Speaker 1: it out every day, all day, everyday type of things. So, um, 1708 01:37:07,720 --> 01:37:12,479 Speaker 1: you start to see the um the sense and in 1709 01:37:12,640 --> 01:37:17,200 Speaker 1: not making certain moves anymore and just saving you're you know, 1710 01:37:17,320 --> 01:37:22,960 Speaker 1: saving your um the quality time for when we really 1711 01:37:23,000 --> 01:37:28,680 Speaker 1: need it to to happen. Yeah, yeah, that makes a 1712 01:37:28,680 --> 01:37:31,200 Speaker 1: lot of sense, Jared. And this has been great. I've 1713 01:37:31,240 --> 01:37:34,479 Speaker 1: really I've really enjoyed it. I knew I would, and uh, 1714 01:37:34,680 --> 01:37:38,599 Speaker 1: you haven't let me down. Appreciate that for for people 1715 01:37:38,640 --> 01:37:42,080 Speaker 1: that want more of of of this kind of insight, 1716 01:37:42,920 --> 01:37:45,240 Speaker 1: do you want to tell folks where they can watch 1717 01:37:45,360 --> 01:37:48,599 Speaker 1: your your white tele addictions episodes or by your DVDs 1718 01:37:48,640 --> 01:37:53,840 Speaker 1: anything else like that? Yeah? So, Lee and I still 1719 01:37:53,920 --> 01:37:58,519 Speaker 1: run Next Buck Outdoors, which is what we um changed 1720 01:37:58,680 --> 01:38:04,280 Speaker 1: Blood Brothers out Wars two years ago. And I honestly 1721 01:38:04,400 --> 01:38:09,840 Speaker 1: don't do a lot actively on social media and stuff. Um, 1722 01:38:09,920 --> 01:38:12,719 Speaker 1: it's just it's there's just not time in my life 1723 01:38:12,720 --> 01:38:14,879 Speaker 1: to to do a lot of that. I don't. I 1724 01:38:14,920 --> 01:38:18,400 Speaker 1: don't really have plans imminently of making other videos other 1725 01:38:18,439 --> 01:38:21,360 Speaker 1: than I'll still contribute to the addiction stuff that I 1726 01:38:21,840 --> 01:38:23,479 Speaker 1: that I like to do be a part of with 1727 01:38:23,560 --> 01:38:27,920 Speaker 1: Andre and them. Um. But next Buck Outdoors is where 1728 01:38:27,960 --> 01:38:31,200 Speaker 1: you can get any of my videos like that and 1729 01:38:31,400 --> 01:38:33,280 Speaker 1: just drop me a line if you have questions or 1730 01:38:33,680 --> 01:38:39,680 Speaker 1: or on some insight on something. I'm happy to help guys. Um. 1731 01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:43,719 Speaker 1: But yeah, that's you know, that's a that's a means 1732 01:38:43,760 --> 01:38:47,800 Speaker 1: of getting a hold of me there, perfect all right, Well, 1733 01:38:48,040 --> 01:38:52,040 Speaker 1: I highly recommend those Those videos have been super helpful 1734 01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:54,439 Speaker 1: to me and many other people. So for anyone listening, 1735 01:38:54,439 --> 01:38:57,400 Speaker 1: if you haven't picked up those DVDs yet, you should, 1736 01:38:57,640 --> 01:38:59,240 Speaker 1: even if it means you need to buy a DVD 1737 01:38:59,360 --> 01:39:05,960 Speaker 1: player because of people don't have those anymore. Convert them 1738 01:39:05,960 --> 01:39:11,040 Speaker 1: to online only and just haven't had time. But I 1739 01:39:11,080 --> 01:39:13,559 Speaker 1: bet if you ever had the time, Jared those things 1740 01:39:14,720 --> 01:39:17,880 Speaker 1: a virtual past to those would sell like hotcakes. They 1741 01:39:17,880 --> 01:39:22,800 Speaker 1: really would. Yeah maybe maybe, So we'll have to come 1742 01:39:22,800 --> 01:39:25,679 Speaker 1: back on plug that if I if I convert those 1743 01:39:26,600 --> 01:39:28,160 Speaker 1: you ever, if you ever do, let me know, I'd 1744 01:39:28,200 --> 01:39:32,639 Speaker 1: happily happily spread the word. All right, Jerry, Well, thank you. 1745 01:39:33,120 --> 01:39:35,080 Speaker 1: This has been a lot of fun and hoping do 1746 01:39:35,120 --> 01:39:39,479 Speaker 1: it again. Yeah, thanks part all right, and that's it. 1747 01:39:39,920 --> 01:39:44,000 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening. I'll plug once again. The new 1748 01:39:44,000 --> 01:39:46,960 Speaker 1: wire Hunt website, where you can find all our new podcasts, 1749 01:39:47,000 --> 01:39:50,080 Speaker 1: all the new articles from our team, and our new 1750 01:39:50,160 --> 01:39:54,479 Speaker 1: video series. Go to the meat eater dot com slash wired. 1751 01:39:55,160 --> 01:39:58,040 Speaker 1: Check it out. There lots to read, lots to watch, 1752 01:39:58,439 --> 01:40:00,920 Speaker 1: lots to listen to. Deer Season is gonna be here 1753 01:40:00,920 --> 01:40:04,120 Speaker 1: before you know it, so make sure you're prepping those stands, 1754 01:40:04,120 --> 01:40:08,439 Speaker 1: shooting that bow, learning everything you can, and getting ready 1755 01:40:08,520 --> 01:40:12,679 Speaker 1: because opening day it's just drong core. So thank you 1756 01:40:13,080 --> 01:40:15,960 Speaker 1: and stay wired to Hunt.