Speaker 1: Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of iHeartRadio and Grimm
Speaker 1: and Mild from Aaron Manky listener Discretion is advised known
Speaker 1: as the Gray Ghost, the USS Hornet is one of
Speaker 1: the most important ships in American military history. During World
Speaker 1: War II, the aircraft carrier participated in some of the
Speaker 1: most significant Pacific theater military action of the entire war,
Speaker 1: including the Battle of the Philippine Sea, during which the
Speaker 1: Hornet shot down seventy two enemy planes in a single day,
Speaker 1: and the Battle of Leyte Gulf, the largest naval battle
Speaker 1: in modern history. But with that history comes a heavy legacy.
Speaker 1: The ship, known today as the USS Hornet, is actually
Speaker 1: the eighth US naval ship to hold the name Hornet,
Speaker 1: and the history of what came before is a lot
Speaker 1: to bear. The previous iteration of the USS Hornet sank
Speaker 1: in battle, taking one hundred and forty men down to
Speaker 1: the bottom of the ocean with her. Today, the USS
Speaker 1: Hornet is permanently docked in Alameda, California, and is a land,
Speaker 1: sea and air museum. It's also widely believed to be
Speaker 1: the most haunted ship in the Navy, full of both
Speaker 1: friendly sailors taking care of the boat they loved and
Speaker 1: restless spirits of those who died of horrific injuries doing
Speaker 1: some of the most dangerous work in the world. More
Speaker 1: than three hundred lives were lost aboard while she was
Speaker 1: commissioned as an active ship, including according to some, the
Speaker 1: highest rate of suicide in the Navy. Who is staying
Speaker 1: behind on the USS Hornet? Why do they choose to
Speaker 1: stay and do those lives lost on her namesake contribute
Speaker 1: to the paranormal activity people report experiencing all over the ship.
Speaker 1: The answer is, well, it's a long story. I'm Amy Bruney,
Speaker 1: and this is haunted road. The USS Hornet was built
Speaker 1: as a World War II Essex class aircraft carrier, constructed
Speaker 1: in nineteen forty two and nineteen forty three, one of
Speaker 1: the twenty four Essex class carriers built during and after
Speaker 1: the war, she was nicknamed the Great Ghost, and, according
Speaker 1: to the USS Hornet Sea Air and Space Museum's history
Speaker 1: of the ship, was one of the most decorated ships
Speaker 1: in the US Navy. She's eighth in a line of
Speaker 1: American warships named Hornet dating all the way back to
Speaker 1: the Revolutionary War, The Hornet and the Wasp for the
Speaker 1: first ever ships in the Continental Navy started in seventeen
Speaker 1: seventy five. She was intended to be named the USS Cuarsage,
Speaker 1: but during construction the USS Hornet CV eight sank in
Speaker 1: the nineteen forty two Battle of Santa Cruz Islands. One
Speaker 1: hundred forty men went down with the ship. Its wreckage
Speaker 1: was found off the Solomon Islands in twenty nineteen, when
Speaker 1: that tragedy occurred, the Kuresarge was renamed the USS Hornet
Speaker 1: in her honor. Commissioned on November twenty ninth, nineteen forty three,
Speaker 1: the Hornet is massive in scope, eighteen hundred seventy two
Speaker 1: feet long and one hundred forty seven feet wide, with
Speaker 1: a draft of twenty eight feet and a displacement of
Speaker 1: over thirty six thousand tons when fully loaded. Her height
Speaker 1: above the waterline to the top of her mast is
Speaker 1: one hundred ninety feet. During World War II, this enormous
Speaker 1: ship could carry anywhere from ninety two to one hundred
Speaker 1: and one aircraft and from thirty six hundred to four
Speaker 1: thousand men. The main deck of the USS Hornet is
Speaker 1: the hangar deck, where the aircraft were stored and maintained.
Speaker 1: Above the hangar deck. The flight deck is where aircraft
Speaker 1: would take off in land. The Hornet's airstrip is roughly
Speaker 1: two hundred feet long. As the Hornet Museum describes, landing
Speaker 1: an aircraft on the flight deck of an aircraft carrier
Speaker 1: at sea is a dayangerous task reserved only for experienced pilots.
Speaker 1: All aircraft built for carrier use were equipped with tail hooks,
Speaker 1: hooks that lower from the back end of the aircraft,
Speaker 1: designed to catch an arresting cable. Hornet's flight deck had
Speaker 1: four arresting cables stretching across the landing area of her deck,
Speaker 1: each one able to trap and stop an aircraft in
Speaker 1: its tracks if the hook caught it. If the aircraft's
Speaker 1: tailhooks were damaged, a barricade net would be set up
Speaker 1: on the flight deck and the pilot would fly directly
Speaker 1: into it, allowing it to drag the plane to a stop.
Speaker 1: Above the flight deck rises the ship's island, which served
Speaker 1: as the command center and held the captain's Bridge, pilot house, navigation,
Speaker 1: primary flight control, and at its base, combat information center.
Speaker 1: The captain's bridge was where the captain was based when
Speaker 1: the USS Hornet was on the move. He could see
Speaker 1: twenty five miles in every direction from this vantage point,
Speaker 1: and gave orders on steering the ship from there. Below deck,
Speaker 1: there was a mix of living and working spaces, including
Speaker 1: a library, a chapel, lounges, a barber shop, and the
Speaker 1: ship's post office. The sick bay could hold up to
Speaker 1: fifty injured men. The mess hall had a bakery that
Speaker 1: could bake cakes as large as a table. The sleeping
Speaker 1: quarters weren't quite that luxurious. The men slept on thin
Speaker 1: cots hanging from chains and stacked three deep bunk bed style.
Speaker 1: I've actually slept on those bunks, although I wouldn't call
Speaker 1: it sleep. In the deepest parts of the ship were
Speaker 1: the machine rooms in the brig, which could hold up
Speaker 1: to thirteen men who posed a threat to the ship's safety.
Speaker 1: According to the ship's history, prisoners in the brig were
Speaker 1: expected to wake up at four thirty am and do
Speaker 1: hard labor during the day. When out of their cells,
Speaker 1: they were chained together and led through the passageways by
Speaker 1: a marine. Others in the area would have to turn
Speaker 1: away to socially isolate them as part of the punishment.
Speaker 1: On March fifteenth, nineteen forty four, the ship left Pearl
Speaker 1: Harbor and steamed toward the conflict in the Pacific. As
Speaker 1: James Martin wrote for CNET, the USS Hornet played a
Speaker 1: pivotal role in virtually all of the assault landings in
Speaker 1: the Pacific from March nineteen forty four until the end
Speaker 1: of World War II. Her aircraft destroyed more than fourteen
Speaker 1: hundred Japanese aircraft and destroyed or damaged over a million
Speaker 1: tons of enemy shipping. During that eighteen months of combat,
Speaker 1: the USS Hornet traveled extensively, sailing one hundred and fifty
Speaker 1: five thousand miles or about six trips around the world.
Speaker 1: On June nineteenth, nineteen forty four, the USS Hornet participated
Speaker 1: in the Battle of the Philippine Sea, which would become
Speaker 1: known as the Great Marianna's Turkey Choote. During this battle,
Speaker 1: the Hornet shot down seventy two enemy planes in a
Speaker 1: single day. From October twenty third to October twenty sixth,
Speaker 1: nineteen forty four, she took part in the Battle of
Speaker 1: Leyte Gulf, described by the Naval Surface Force as the
Speaker 1: largest naval battle in modern history and the last of
Speaker 1: the Great Sea Battles. It was also the first time
Speaker 1: that the Japanese deployed Kamikazi fighters On February nineteenth and twentieth,
Speaker 1: nineteen forty five, the Hornet supported the amphibious landing assault
Speaker 1: on Ewo Jima. According to Sea Forces dot Org. On
Speaker 1: March eighteenth, nineteen forty five, the USS Hornet's complement of
Speaker 1: eighteen black cooks, the highest position of black American could
Speaker 1: hold in the Navy at the time, was completing gunnery
Speaker 1: practice in case of emergency when one of them spotted
Speaker 1: a Kamikazi plane streaking toward the ship. As Mark Hansen
Speaker 1: wrote for the US Naval Institute, in the final five
Speaker 1: hundred yards of the suicide bombers dive on the Hornet,
Speaker 1: the ship's cooks, furious and ready. Gun fighters now found
Speaker 1: their mark, blasting off the Kamikazi's right wing, igniting the
Speaker 1: bomber in to a fireball that veered left and toward
Speaker 1: the Hornet's flight deck, Passing just thirty feet from the
Speaker 1: battle station. The Kamikaze pilot's visage was clearly discernible through
Speaker 1: cockpit smoke. The Kamakazi continued its plunge, barely missing the
Speaker 1: gasoline bomb and rocket laiden flight deck before splashing into
Speaker 1: an ocean grave. All eighteen of the men were quickly promoted.
Speaker 1: The Hornet was decommissioned in nineteen forty seven and became
Speaker 1: an attack aircraft carrier and then an anti submarine warfare
Speaker 1: support ship. During her military career, the USS Hornet endured
Speaker 1: fifty nine air attacks but was never seriously hit. As
Speaker 1: Seenet reported, the Hornet also has the distinction of being
Speaker 1: hit by a torpedo, which bounced off of the Hornet's
Speaker 1: hull and failed to detonate. However, though the ship was
Speaker 1: never seriously damaged in battle, more than three hundred people
Speaker 1: lost their lives aboard. Riding for Wired, Betsy Mason said
Speaker 1: that the flight deck of an aircraft carrier is considered
Speaker 1: one of the most dangerous places in the world to
Speaker 1: work on board. Accidents included sailors walking into spinning aircraft props,
Speaker 1: being sucked into air intakes, and being blown off the
Speaker 1: deck by exhaust from aircraft. At least three men were
Speaker 1: decapitated by snapping flight arrest cables, which fly at five
Speaker 1: hundred miles per hour when snapped. Sailors were also burned
Speaker 1: and maimed by the explosion of dropped munitions. On February sixteenth,
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty four, a plane crashed on the flight deck
Speaker 1: before the crew was ready to receive it, killing the
Speaker 1: pilot and injuring two crew Many other pilots serving aboard
Speaker 1: the Hornet never returned from their missions, having been shot
Speaker 1: down by enemy planes. According to some, the ship also
Speaker 1: had the highest rate of suicide in the Navy. In
Speaker 1: the years after World War II, she participated in several
Speaker 1: unique relief missions, including aiding in the search for survivors
Speaker 1: of an airplace attack when a British commercial flight was
Speaker 1: shot down by Chinese fighter jets in nineteen fifty four.
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty one, when wildfires destroyed much of the
Speaker 1: Tony Bellair neighborhood of Los Angeles, the Hornet helped with
Speaker 1: clean up efforts, using her generators to feed electricity into
Speaker 1: the Southern California power grid. In nineteen sixty six, the
Speaker 1: USS Hornet recovered the unmanned Apollo AS two two capsule
Speaker 1: when it returned from its suborbital spaceflight, and she became
Speaker 1: the prime recovery ship for the Apollo space program. On
Speaker 1: July twenty fourth, nineteen sixty nine, she was part of
Speaker 1: history again. After the lunar command module of the Apollo
Speaker 1: eleven space missions splashed down in the Pacific Ocean, the
Speaker 1: Hornet recovered the module with astronauts Buzz Aldred, Neil Armstrong,
Speaker 1: and Michael Collins inside. Aldred and Armstrong. Having just been
Speaker 1: the first humans to walk on the Moon, the astronauts
Speaker 1: took their first steps back on Earth on the hangar
Speaker 1: deck of the U. S USS Hornet, and those footsteps
Speaker 1: are immortalized on the floor of the ship. Richard Nixon,
Speaker 1: John McCain, and other dignitaries were aboard for this historic moment.
Speaker 1: According to the Kennedy Space Center, due to fear of
Speaker 1: moon germs, the astronauts were immediately quarantined aboard the Hornet
Speaker 1: in a custom Airstream trailer along with a flight surgeon
Speaker 1: while the ship steamed a port in Hawaii for five days.
Speaker 1: The unit was then flown to Houston to the Johnson
Speaker 1: Space Center, with the astronauts still quarantined. As the ship's
Speaker 1: history describes, Hornet returned to Long Beach with a banner
Speaker 1: proclaiming Hornet plus three, which declared them to be the
Speaker 1: recovery vessel for Apollo eleven. On November twenty fourth, the
Speaker 1: Hornet recovered the crew of Apollo twelve, Charles Conrad Junior,
Speaker 1: Alan L. Bean and Richard F. Gordon Junior, from their
Speaker 1: splashdown in the South Pacific near American Samoa. Talking to
Speaker 1: The Mercury News, paranormal researcher Pamela Heath said she believes
Speaker 1: most of the spirits here are spirit guides. They came
Speaker 1: back to run the ship. They loved this ship, They
Speaker 1: loved their country. A lot of them, she said, they
Speaker 1: are back to serve. Many of these spirits have been
Speaker 1: seen as full bodied apparitions. One has been said to
Speaker 1: appear in dress whites, another in a khaki uniform, one
Speaker 1: in a pea coat, and one in a pilot's uniform.
Speaker 1: But not all of them are quite so genteel. Some
Speaker 1: people have reported seeing a headless ghost in the area
Speaker 1: of the ship's catapult, believing it to be the spirit
Speaker 1: of a sailor who was decapitated by the cables. Mills
Speaker 1: wrote that this apparition lurches back and forth across the
Speaker 1: catapult room. He also described a pitiable, gore soaked monster
Speaker 1: of a ghost in the engine room. As Mills wrote
Speaker 1: in Life, he was a sailor whose arm was cut
Speaker 1: off by the laserlike effluence of concentrated heat jetting forth
Speaker 1: from a broken pipe. He was found later by his shipmates,
Speaker 1: who were aghast at the realization that his blood literally
Speaker 1: had boiled, causing his skin to peel away like a
Speaker 1: scorched and lacerated fruit rind. He hovers about the master
Speaker 1: control panel to this day. A witness who saw him
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight described his uniform matted with
Speaker 1: glistening blood, his burned flesh hung in grotesque ribbons from
Speaker 1: his bones, eyeballs bulging in stark terror. When the burn
Speaker 1: victim phantom suddenly disappears, he leaves behind the acrid smell
Speaker 1: of cooked viscera. Well, that's quite colorful. The USS Hornet
Speaker 1: Sick Bay is also said to be haunted by the
Speaker 1: ghost of an injured sailor. According to Mills, he was
Speaker 1: a sailor who lost his footing on the flight deck
Speaker 1: and slipped right into the path of a landing aircraft.
Speaker 1: The propeller sheared off the top of his head and
Speaker 1: laid bare his brain, while the intense heat of the
Speaker 1: jet's engine incinerated his uniform and torched his body. Barely alive,
Speaker 1: he was rushed to the sick Bay operating table, where
Speaker 1: he died within moments, but perhaps because of the instant
Speaker 1: and traumatic exposure of his brain matter to the elements,
Speaker 1: he became locked in that vile moment and never realized
Speaker 1: he was dead. The dark events didn't end when the
Speaker 1: ship was decommissioned either. In two thousand seven, an electrician
Speaker 1: who volunteered on board Edward Vella the Third, died by
Speaker 1: suicide in one of the ship's engine rooms. In twenty twelve,
Speaker 1: a fugitive from justice named Todd Stewart was apprehended aboard
Speaker 1: the ship. He was wanted in connection to the death
Speaker 1: of his mother in law, a charge for which his
Speaker 1: wife was already in custody, and he had been living
Speaker 1: and working on the Hornet. As reported in The Mercury News,
Speaker 1: an education manager of the Unic's Hornet Museum, Heidi Shave,
Speaker 1: was alone on the ship one day when it got
Speaker 1: really cold. She says, I saw a man in a
Speaker 1: blue uniform. He was clear as day, like you or I,
Speaker 1: but he wasn't making any eye contact. He was sort
Speaker 1: of slow moving. There was a bulkhead there and he
Speaker 1: walked right through the bulkhead. Additional ghosts on board include
Speaker 1: a man who was supposedly murdered doing an argument in
Speaker 1: the crew's mess hall, and a hostile force in the
Speaker 1: brig said to be the spirit of a Japanese kamikaze
Speaker 1: pilot who took his own life there after being captured.
Speaker 1: Reports of hostile activity date all the way back to
Speaker 1: the Hornet's active service, when sailors in the brig would
Speaker 1: claim to be attacked by an unseen force. One man
Speaker 1: who submitted his experience to a Caltech website dedicated to
Speaker 1: ghost encounters aboard the Hornet recalled that he fell asleep
Speaker 1: in the brig while on an overnight tour and felt
Speaker 1: like he was being beaten to death. Bob Rogers, a
Speaker 1: veteran who was part of the effort to preserve the
Speaker 1: USS Hornet as a museum, reported an experience that he
Speaker 1: believed was due to the ship's helpful ghosts. The Mercury
Speaker 1: News reported that in attempting to lock up the ship
Speaker 1: in October nineteen ninety five, he and his crew had
Speaker 1: run out of chain. Rogers said, very shortly, I went
Speaker 1: through all the chain I'd gathered, and we still had
Speaker 1: six more engineering spaces to do. I jokingly said, Hornet,
Speaker 1: give us a chain. Then I walked down a passage
Speaker 1: and around a corner, and here's a pile of brand
Speaker 1: new chain in the corner. It wasn't corroded or aged.
Speaker 1: It was sparkly, brand new, like it was out of
Speaker 1: a store. I looked at it and kind of laughed
Speaker 1: and said to the others, look, Hornet gave us chain.
Speaker 1: Rogers and his crew made this request six times and
Speaker 1: found new chain after each one. Well, to talk more
Speaker 1: about the hauntings of the USS Hornet, we will soon
Speaker 1: be joined by Fay Navarro. Fay has been working on
Speaker 1: the Hornet for years as a tour guide and event manager,
Speaker 1: so she's seen it all, including lots and lots of ghosts.
Speaker 1: That is coming up after the break. So I am
Speaker 1: now joined by Fay Navarro, who is the private events
Speaker 1: manager at the USS Hornet and has been there for
Speaker 1: many years and has had a lot of experiences and
Speaker 1: has heard of a lot of experiences. So I thought
Speaker 1: she'd be the perfect person to chat with about the
Speaker 1: hauntings on board. So welcome, Faie, Thank you. I have
Speaker 1: to say the Hornet holds a special place at my
Speaker 1: heart because it was actually my first episode of ghost Hunters,
Speaker 1: so that I think was when people were like first
Speaker 1: introduced to me so many years ago, like publicly, it
Speaker 1: wasn't technically my first episode. I had already done an episode,
Speaker 1: but they aired it first, so that's when the world
Speaker 1: met amy. Apparently. I also investigated there before that, just
Speaker 1: because I was based out of Sacramento and I was
Speaker 1: part of a team there that we actually stayed the
Speaker 1: night on the Hornet and investigated, which was really exciting.
Speaker 1: So that's why just kind of an important place to me.
Speaker 1: Very haunted, very historic, always an experience. How long have
Speaker 1: you been working there.
Speaker 2: I've been working here for five years now.
Speaker 1: And when you joined the staff there were aware of
Speaker 1: the haunted reputation.
Speaker 2: Yes. I actually came on board this ship probably about
Speaker 2: eight nine years ago for a paranormal conference. So yeah,
Speaker 2: so people always ask why what brought me on the ship?
Speaker 2: I said, the spirits.
Speaker 1: Did like the ghosts actually, so which just perfect. We
Speaker 1: investigate a lot of former like naval ships, and a
Speaker 1: lot of them do tend to have activity, but they're
Speaker 1: also they kind of pose an interesting investigation because there's
Speaker 1: a lot that you have to kind of figure out
Speaker 1: because of all the different noises and equipment. Uh, and
Speaker 1: so you're there on the day to day basis. So
Speaker 1: are there certain things that when you first came on
Speaker 1: board seemed a little suspicious or could be paranormal, but
Speaker 1: you've since learned are perfectly natural.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's there's definitely one sound that people tend to
Speaker 2: chase after a lot, and it's like what we call
Speaker 2: the commings or the square things that keep the ship
Speaker 2: away from the pier. And it's worn down so it's
Speaker 2: metal and metal so when it scratches, it kind of
Speaker 2: sounds like an injured animal, like a dog or something.
Speaker 2: People will go hunting for this dog and I'm like, no,
Speaker 2: it's the camel. So that's one of the things definitely
Speaker 2: I found out that was an actual sound, nothing paranormal
Speaker 2: associated with it.
Speaker 1: And I always ask people those questions, Uh, do work
Speaker 1: on ships or any anything on water basically that we investigate,
Speaker 1: because you do become familiar with those sounds over time,
Speaker 1: and that can be really helpful during an investigation, just
Speaker 1: to know that ahead of time, so you're not wasting
Speaker 1: your time for pole looking for something like that. So
Speaker 1: that's good to know, but now, what about the actual activity, Like,
Speaker 1: was there a time that you had, you know, your
Speaker 1: first experience there where you were like, Okay, this place
Speaker 1: is definitely haunted.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Actually, the first time I came on board went
Speaker 2: during a paramal conference. We went down into the laundry room.
Speaker 2: In the overhead, which those don't know is the ceiling.
Speaker 2: Basically was told to watch it because it's rather low.
Speaker 2: And I went back between the leshers and the dryers,
Speaker 2: and I was standing there with the teammate in front
Speaker 2: of me, probably about like four feet in front of me,
Speaker 2: and it's just a chibus back there, and everybody else
Speaker 2: was on the other side, and I'm just standing there
Speaker 2: in the middle of this aisle basically, and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, I felt, because my hair is short, I
Speaker 2: felt like a hand from the base of my head
Speaker 2: move upward in my hair, just flipped my hair, and so,
Speaker 2: of course I turn on my flashlight. I'm trying to
Speaker 2: see about logic. There's no cobwebs, there's no breeze, we're
Speaker 2: on fourth deck. There was no logical explanation, but it
Speaker 2: definitely was like a hand motion. I'm like, wow, that's
Speaker 2: really interesting. It was really cool. From my very first
Speaker 2: experience on the ship, I didn't expect that to happen,
Speaker 2: but it was amazing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I see a lot of people would have been like, Okay, this,
Speaker 1: he's been nice. I'm leaving now.
Speaker 2: That's true.
Speaker 1: I find that whenever I get touched on an investigation,
Speaker 1: it's just it's something that I have never quite come
Speaker 1: to terms with, and I think it's just to me.
Speaker 1: It would be like if a live person just came
Speaker 1: up to me randomly grabbed me or something, if you know,
Speaker 1: I can't but like get startled and go like what
Speaker 1: is the motivation here? But sometimes the spirits are just
Speaker 1: really trying to get your attention and so exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and what is the vibe on the ship? Like is
Speaker 1: does it seem like it's mostly people trying to get
Speaker 1: your attention? Is there anything that seems a little more
Speaker 1: intense or is it mostly just kind of some people
Speaker 1: trying to communicate in some way.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of it is communication or just
Speaker 2: for me because I'm here so much and a lot
Speaker 2: of times I do stay on board overnight. I feel
Speaker 2: a lot of ways it's also let me know, like
Speaker 2: they're there to protect me, let me know, hey, I'm
Speaker 2: watching out for you kind of thing. Never never have
Speaker 2: I really been like scared or styleled, but I do
Speaker 2: at times go to different locations and the energy is
Speaker 2: like yep, nope, don't go in there. So I respect
Speaker 2: their space when I feel that, like I expect them
Speaker 2: to expect my space when I turn into my stateroom.
Speaker 2: So it's like kind of common you know, ground there.
Speaker 1: So you get an actual stateroom. Because I slept on
Speaker 1: a bunk and it was not the best night sleep
Speaker 1: I've ever had.
Speaker 2: I slept on those two when I first started coming here.
Speaker 2: But yeah, now I have my own stateroom. It comes
Speaker 2: in handy for those late night events. You know, you
Speaker 2: love driving out.
Speaker 1: I'll never forget that. So when we investigated it was
Speaker 1: kind of this. I feel like it may have been
Speaker 1: a few different teams together, Like I think we might
Speaker 1: have kind of gotten together to do this. I don't
Speaker 1: remember the specifics of how it happened, but I do
Speaker 1: remember that I was made to serve food to everyone
Speaker 1: in the cafeteria, Like a part of part of my
Speaker 1: job for the night was you know, in the mess
Speaker 1: hall or whatever, Like we actually made food and served it,
Speaker 1: which was really interesting and I feel like I was
Speaker 1: on like corn duty. I'm pretty sure I was eating
Speaker 1: people corn if I right. So, but it was interesting
Speaker 1: because it actually really put us in a cool mindset
Speaker 1: because we were experiencing, you know, what it's like to
Speaker 1: live in that kind of a situation. We were actually
Speaker 1: sleeping there, and I don't know what the tours are
Speaker 1: like now, but it was just they were really generous
Speaker 1: with kind of where we could go. I mean, there
Speaker 1: were definitely like off limit places, but we pretty much
Speaker 1: had free rain within reason to kind of go wherever.
Speaker 1: And I, like I said, I really didn't sleep. I
Speaker 1: think I finally went to sleep at like three or
Speaker 1: four in the morning, and it was not the greatest
Speaker 1: night's sleep, but I had a lot of experiences. Now
Speaker 1: do you guys still do things like that or how
Speaker 1: how do your tours work?
Speaker 2: Now?
Speaker 1: We we do.
Speaker 2: I mean, we offer like the three hour tour, which
Speaker 2: I just call it a teaser trailer. There is very long.
Speaker 2: Then we once a quarter do it overnight and teams
Speaker 2: can come in and book a night and and do that.
Speaker 2: We've had the YouTubers come in and do their paranormal
Speaker 2: tours through the night, and we do. We take them
Speaker 2: to locations they can't go back through the night, and
Speaker 2: they get to you know, investigate areas. You know, we'll
Speaker 2: take them to us myke okay, let's know when you're
Speaker 2: ready to move on, and we'll take you to another.
Speaker 2: And then after that they're able to do Sick Bay
Speaker 2: all the way aft, which is about basically a third
Speaker 2: of the ship on second deck U guide it. They
Speaker 2: could do that all day long.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, do you remember that? It was really great?
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: Now, with these tours and just even tours in general,
Speaker 1: do you have people who just like, Okay, I've had enough,
Speaker 1: I need to get off, and I don't want to
Speaker 1: be here anymore.
Speaker 2: I think, like with my groups, because I love touring,
Speaker 2: it's about teaching them and that's what I enjoy about
Speaker 2: doing it is I've always explaining that it is scary
Speaker 2: anywhere you go in the dark, stay when you're not familiar.
Speaker 1: But I've had.
Speaker 2: People that are interested but they are scared, but throughout
Speaker 2: the night I reassure them, you know, and they feel comfortable,
Speaker 2: and so by the time they leave there, they've learned
Speaker 2: a lot and they're excited and thinking about actually coming
Speaker 2: and do it and over night. So I feel like
Speaker 2: I at least have done. My job is to help
Speaker 2: teach them and you know, to communicate with the spirits
Speaker 2: that they're willing to. But yeah, I mean I've heard
Speaker 2: people through over them. I with security, we've done overnights. Oh,
Speaker 2: you have less people to wake up because some people
Speaker 2: left through the night. It's hard to say they could
Speaker 2: lived close enough and figure their own beds are nicer
Speaker 2: just like but but yeah, it's hard to say. But
Speaker 2: the people I've worked with, they tend to be a
Speaker 2: little bit more at ease with the explaining of what's
Speaker 2: going on.
Speaker 1: Well that's great, No, I know, you know people they
Speaker 1: do do daytime tours obviously, and now I'm just have
Speaker 1: experiences during the day, right, like what can what have
Speaker 1: people reported touring the ship during the day.
Speaker 2: I've had people say they felt they've been touched or
Speaker 2: they're hair massed with. That's just like a common thing
Speaker 2: is their hair.
Speaker 1: Being messed with.
Speaker 2: Sometimes somebody will see like it thought they saw somebody
Speaker 2: walk into a room and they're going in there's nobody there.
Speaker 2: They'll swear up and down, I know I saw this
Speaker 2: person and go, well, this is the only way in
Speaker 2: this space. So you know, I go, maybe you saw
Speaker 2: an apparition. That's great, but not everybody gets to witness that.
Speaker 1: So what kinds of apparitions do people see?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: Are people seeing like full you know, apportions of people
Speaker 1: in uniform, or do they see shadow figures or both
Speaker 1: kind of both?
Speaker 2: I mean, I even, I mean, I see a lot
Speaker 2: of the shadow figures here. They've never actually fully, you know,
Speaker 2: manifest in front of me, but I had. I was
Speaker 2: in a space with my friend and we were touring
Speaker 2: his daughter around and I was sensing this gentleman by
Speaker 2: the door and I kept looking over the bed. I know,
Speaker 2: you're standing there, and we audibly heard I'm right here
Speaker 2: because I was doing a me VP session and they
Speaker 2: thought it was on the recorder when I was playing back,
Speaker 2: and we go, no, he's right there. They look, they
Speaker 2: saw him, you know, they saw him in the blue
Speaker 2: dungarease and the blue button up shirt. But I didn't
Speaker 2: see him. So I was like, still fair, But.
Speaker 1: That's so straight out. And you were looking in the
Speaker 1: same direction. Yeah, you they saw him, but you did not.
Speaker 1: He did not manifest you, no, no. Yeah, So that
Speaker 1: brings up an interesting observation that me and a few
Speaker 1: of my you know, fellow parramal researchers have kind of
Speaker 1: noticed is that sometimes we wonder if certain apparitions are
Speaker 1: being seen psychically, even by groups of people, like maybe
Speaker 1: we're not seeing it with our actual eyes. Maybe somehow
Speaker 1: we're seeing it in our minds but manifesting it in
Speaker 1: front of us. And maybe that explains why, you know,
Speaker 1: we don't always get things on camera even though we're
Speaker 1: staring straight at it with our camera pointed in that direction.
Speaker 1: So but you're saying, you guys all heard the voice.
Speaker 2: We all heard it, and I knew it was not
Speaker 2: a you know, it wasn't on the recorder and they're
Speaker 2: like no, and I played it back to show it
Speaker 2: to't approved on It was not on the recorder because
Speaker 2: I went straight to the door to make sure nobody
Speaker 2: was there, because other than the three of us on
Speaker 2: the ship, there was security, which was you know, in
Speaker 2: the security post. So you know, I had to prove
Speaker 2: that it wasn't an actual person coming up and saying
Speaker 2: I'm right here when I asked you.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it was interesting.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of times for me personally, like
Speaker 2: with that situation, I'm always telling them when I'm walking
Speaker 2: around at my and I sometimes I help turn off
Speaker 2: lights and stuff, and I'm always telling them please don't
Speaker 2: scare me because I'm by myself. So I'm like, okay,
Speaker 2: I got this. Is when you're supposed to show yourself
Speaker 2: to me. Is when I'm with other people I'm by myself.
Speaker 2: I have that.
Speaker 1: Same feeling when I'm in nice places, like I am
Speaker 1: totally willing and ready to have an experience when there's
Speaker 1: people with me. But the second I have to like
Speaker 1: go back and get a camera or you know, go
Speaker 1: check something up on like a third or fourth floor
Speaker 1: by myself, that's a time where I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: really want to see an apparition right now. That just
Speaker 1: really to And so I've said this many times, but
Speaker 1: my defense is always to whistle. I just like happy tune,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, nothing back can happen. Well I'm whistling.
Speaker 1: That's fine, so hard worked. So I'm sticking with it.
Speaker 1: But yeah, now, okay, So we've got apperations, we've got
Speaker 1: disembodied voices, we've been shina figures, people being touched. I mean,
Speaker 1: how often is activity happening at the Hornet it happens
Speaker 1: quite a bit.
Speaker 2: I don't know if it's because I'm here a lot
Speaker 2: then I witness it, you know what, I'm sensitive to it.
Speaker 2: But yeah, they definitely have their moments. Even when we
Speaker 2: were closed for COVID, I was still experiencing things. I
Speaker 2: was here helping clean and do some restoration and stuff,
Speaker 2: and I took on a project to redo the mestic tables,
Speaker 2: to stand them down and paint them, and I had
Speaker 2: to help with some groups. But during the week I
Speaker 2: was down there by myself and you know, saw like
Speaker 2: you know, a blue orb going from one one space
Speaker 2: to the other in the mass deck and you remember
Speaker 2: how big it's mass. It's huge, and then getting the
Speaker 2: phantom cigarette smell just out of the blue, really strong
Speaker 2: with a cigarette smell, like someone just started smoke. And
Speaker 2: I'm like, guys, there's no more smoking a lot on board,
Speaker 2: and then it would just be gone there.
Speaker 1: You know, you're like, no gost smoke either. We're yeah,
Speaker 1: like messmoking a lot.
Speaker 2: I don't care.
Speaker 1: No, that's funny now, just because you're there so often, Like,
Speaker 1: who do you think is haunting it? Do you have
Speaker 1: you ever gotten any names specifically or do you have
Speaker 1: any inclination like who it could be.
Speaker 2: We've gotten Sam, but no last name, So we get
Speaker 2: Sam a lot. I've gotten Bill and Bob, but I
Speaker 2: mean those are so common names for even back then.
Speaker 2: The one thing I can't seem to get an answer
Speaker 2: for because I tend to audibly hear a lot of
Speaker 2: a female's voice that tends to call my name at times,
Speaker 2: and I've had other people with me and hearing it,
Speaker 2: so sot to find out who this female is hanging out.
Speaker 2: But yeah, no real answers. I mean we've gotten you know,
Speaker 2: we've used the flashlight method and gotten some response up
Speaker 2: in the admirals quarters from Admiral Davis, you know, and
Speaker 2: it was a really interesting conversation and I got that
Speaker 2: on camera, actually, the interaction with that so and according
Speaker 2: to the flashlights, with their interaction, he just comes in
Speaker 2: visits and checks out the ship.
Speaker 1: So I love when you can get like actual you know,
Speaker 1: names or historical information that kind of matches with the
Speaker 1: activity itself. And I mean that says that whoever's there
Speaker 1: is actually intelligent in some way. And so why why
Speaker 1: do you think they're compelled to stay? Why do you
Speaker 1: think these hauntings exist there. I don't know.
Speaker 2: I think they just come and visit. Like like I
Speaker 2: said with the one conversation with Admiral Davis, I mean
Speaker 2: he says he just comes back and forth. He's not stuck.
Speaker 1: He just pops in and out.
Speaker 2: Why. I don't know, maybe just I just kept thinking,
Speaker 2: like I tell people, back in those days, I mean,
Speaker 2: anybody in military, there's such a brotherhood. Even though it
Speaker 2: was a stressful, scary time, it was still that bonding,
Speaker 2: this family, and it was home. So I can see
Speaker 2: them coming back to a place where it brought so Mitch,
Speaker 2: you know, memory or good times in a weird way.
Speaker 1: You know, yeah, it is certainly you know, there's this
Speaker 1: kind of sense of duty, and you know I could
Speaker 1: see that, and especially when you have it becomes almost
Speaker 1: kind of a living history museum because I think a
Speaker 1: lot of those locations are gone or they're moth balled,
Speaker 1: and so then you know, this is a place where
Speaker 1: these spirits can come back to and actually see almost
Speaker 1: exactly what they experienced in life. And you know, we
Speaker 1: we talk about that a lot, like wondering, you know,
Speaker 1: why are hotels haunted? Why are these you know, wy
Speaker 1: are places like this haunted, and I do think that.
Speaker 1: I think sometimes spirits, you know, like you were saying,
Speaker 1: they're just able to kind of come back to places
Speaker 1: that meant something to them. Like it doesn't mean they're
Speaker 1: necessarily tethered to it or you know, like you said,
Speaker 1: stuck in some way, but it's just it was important
Speaker 1: to them, And I feel like the Horn is definitely
Speaker 1: one of those places.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: Now, you have obviously probably a lot of school groups
Speaker 1: come on board, I'm sure especially I'm sure you do,
Speaker 1: like boy Scouts and things. Right, do these kids who
Speaker 1: have experiences I'm assuming you're not teaching the ghostly part
Speaker 1: of things. I'm wondering if they ever come to you
Speaker 1: with anything that they might have experienced, not knowing that
Speaker 1: the ship was supposedly haunted.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I used to help out a lot with the
Speaker 2: Scout groups before I took on the events manager position,
Speaker 2: and you do. We would do at the end of
Speaker 2: the night, we do ghost stories, and we would do
Speaker 2: like thirty minutes to forty minutes of just telling them
Speaker 2: our experiences on the ship. You know, nothing in the
Speaker 2: areas that they're sleeping, because I don't want to scare
Speaker 2: them any further. And I'm always telling them. They're very friendly.
Speaker 2: You know, if you see somebody and you're scared, just
Speaker 2: tell them to leave you alone. I go, they're very respectful.
Speaker 2: And in the morning, I've had a couple of them
Speaker 2: like would come like going. I kept seeing them at
Speaker 2: the foot of my bed. I go, did you tell
Speaker 2: them believe? And he goes, yeahh you know, so they
Speaker 2: are they're witnessing this. I had one parent one time
Speaker 2: where they were sleeping was right above when was the
Speaker 2: rest of the aircraft restoration area. And she told me
Speaker 2: the mort She goes, faith, why were people moving things around?
Speaker 2: I go, nothing was moved around? She because I heard
Speaker 2: airplanes moving and stuff. I go, trust me, we don't
Speaker 2: do that kind of stuff when people are on board,
Speaker 2: you know. It Just nothing moved. And she swore up
Speaker 2: and down there was just all this activity above her.
Speaker 2: She couldn't sleep.
Speaker 1: That was one of the experiences I had there. I
Speaker 1: didn't hear planes. I did hear it sounded like folding chairs,
Speaker 1: like being set up and taken down or put up,
Speaker 1: and like it was in that big open space. I
Speaker 1: was like, what is happening over here? Like why are
Speaker 1: people set Like I thought somebody was setting up for
Speaker 1: like a speech or something for the next day, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, don't they know that we're here investigating. Went
Speaker 1: in there completely dark, no one there, but it was
Speaker 1: very clearly that sound of like folding chairs like being
Speaker 1: set up and like thrown out and light up, and
Speaker 1: it was so loud until like I got up there
Speaker 1: and then it was just quiet. So I don't know
Speaker 1: what ghost is folding and unfolding cheers in the afterlife,
Speaker 1: but I feel like they could make better use of
Speaker 1: their time.
Speaker 2: If it was something where Sigil. I mean, it makes
Speaker 2: sense because they would set up chairs all the time
Speaker 2: for different speeches, different arrangements in those areas, you.
Speaker 1: Know, yeah, yeah, I'm sure there were very important speeches
Speaker 1: and moments that happened in that area, So maybe something
Speaker 1: kind of residual. But I think sometimes I'm baffled at
Speaker 1: the experiences that you have because they just don't really
Speaker 1: make a lot of sense. You Like, you know, you
Speaker 1: expect to hear a voice or see a shadow or
Speaker 1: but then you hear folding chairs. You know, you just
Speaker 1: what you're going.
Speaker 2: To get exactly, you don't. And it varies in locations
Speaker 2: because people are always asking where are the hot spots?
Speaker 1: It varies.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of it when we take groups
Speaker 2: around has to deal with the energy that we are
Speaker 2: putting off, you know, because like you're mentioning in screo groups,
Speaker 2: we even get like high schools that come through and
Speaker 2: do the paranormaltors and they're so full of energy and excited,
Speaker 2: and so we get activity everywhere we go because they're
Speaker 2: just so full of energy.
Speaker 1: Right, And I think that that I think that people
Speaker 1: don't realize that some times that like if you're putting
Speaker 1: off energy that can trigger activity and not necessarily like
Speaker 1: it's creating activity, but I think it creates an interest
Speaker 1: in the spirits there, Like they sense that hum and
Speaker 1: that buzz of excitement and it kind of draws them
Speaker 1: out and they want to interact.
Speaker 2: And so I was.
Speaker 1: Actually going to ask you that because people probably do
Speaker 1: you ask you all the time, like what are the
Speaker 1: hot spots are there? Is there any area that like
Speaker 1: you don't like to go?
Speaker 2: Me personally, when we're asked to take people to like
Speaker 2: a couple of different areas like Chapel or something, I
Speaker 2: avoid the Chapel area more so just an anybody's personal beliefs.
Speaker 2: You know, some people might just shone against that, so
Speaker 2: I avoid chapel. I've never personally experienced anything in there
Speaker 2: the times I've gone in there by myself. But but realistically,
Speaker 2: there are some areas that it tent doesn't always have
Speaker 2: a lot of hospital doesn't have a lot of activity sometimes,
Speaker 2: and I think a lot of it does. Again deal
Speaker 2: with the group, because by the time we get there,
Speaker 2: you're exhausted. Everybody's a gonno going to sleep, you know. Yeah, so,
Speaker 2: but I mean I've experienced plenty in the hospital, but
Speaker 2: sometimes it's not.
Speaker 1: As active really the grass that makes sense, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's I don't think people realize just how much ground
Speaker 1: they're covering when you get in there, and how easy
Speaker 1: it is to get lost. Like I can't remember if
Speaker 1: you have it, but like I investigate the Salem here
Speaker 1: locally a lot, and they, goodness, have this yellow stripe
Speaker 1: of freedom that goes through Like that's that's how I
Speaker 1: know my way. You follow this yellow stripe, that's that's
Speaker 1: will lead you to an exit. I don't remember if
Speaker 1: the Ford Head anything like that, but if that ship
Speaker 1: did not have that stripe, I would probably still be there,
Speaker 1: right now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's a good idea. We don't have a stripe.
Speaker 1: You need the stripe.
Speaker 2: I'm always telling people find a ladder, get to the
Speaker 2: anger bay.
Speaker 1: Are good, Yes, and that's pretty I do remember that.
Speaker 1: Like and like when we were investigating with the DVR cameras,
Speaker 1: I would just look for the wires and I'd be like,
Speaker 1: the wire leads to freedom, Like that's gonna take me
Speaker 1: to center, coming on wherever it is. Yeah, And that's
Speaker 1: actually something else is the whole idea of investigating on
Speaker 1: these you know, big vessels, they're like they're metal, they're steel,
Speaker 1: they're very thick.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 1: Cells don't work at certain points. I know radios have
Speaker 1: trouble at certain points, and like we talked about before,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of noises and things that don't necessarily
Speaker 1: make sense. It's very hard to figure out where they're
Speaker 1: coming from directionally. Is there any advice that you give
Speaker 1: to teams or groups on how to investigate in a
Speaker 1: scenario like that.
Speaker 2: If I'm with them for a little bit, I'm always
Speaker 2: trying to point out the natural sounds that people tend
Speaker 2: to think is kind of might be something per normal.
Speaker 2: But also, as you remember, all the wires through their
Speaker 2: transformers and stuff. How it does I like definitely like
Speaker 2: K two's and a lot of that stuff because of
Speaker 2: the power it gives off. And I'm always explaining that
Speaker 2: to people as well, like it's am I go, it's
Speaker 2: metal you get if you're using the camera, remember, reflective
Speaker 2: things reflect very easily with flashlight. It's amazing how it
Speaker 2: bounces out that fresh light off of every surface it can.
Speaker 1: It really does. And if you're using like an SLS
Speaker 1: camera or something like, it will make up figures all
Speaker 1: over the place. And yes, and there is that kind
Speaker 1: of constant hum because there's you know, there's transformers and
Speaker 1: power being run through the whole thing, and you could
Speaker 1: just hear it at all times. And like you were saying,
Speaker 1: AMF detectors and K two's they pick up.
Speaker 2: On all of that.
Speaker 1: Communication can be hard if you guys split up and
Speaker 1: you know you're trying to cover more than one area
Speaker 1: at once. I know we had a lot of trouble
Speaker 1: in walks, but you know, as part of being an investigator,
Speaker 1: like you're going to always have kind of different scenario
Speaker 1: that you have to be creative with and work around.
Speaker 1: And you know, ships always always bring the best out
Speaker 1: of us as far as getting creative with out to investigate. Yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: it does.
Speaker 2: It does kind of limit, but yeah, it causes I
Speaker 2: guess and ways to It also helps you open up
Speaker 2: your senses a little bit more as well. Yeah, because
Speaker 2: you can't really fully rely on a lot of the
Speaker 2: equipment that you're using.
Speaker 1: That's true. And the other thing too is it's so contained,
Speaker 1: like if you have a smaller group like you know,
Speaker 1: you know, like I security, there's usually security, but they
Speaker 1: stay in their little area. They don't go out, and
Speaker 1: so it's not like, you know, you have tons of
Speaker 1: outside contamination from like you know, living people. You know,
Speaker 1: you don't have a ton of traffic going by or
Speaker 1: anything like that. So that's that's actually helpful in that scenario.
Speaker 1: But so if people do want to investigate or visit
Speaker 1: the Hornet, what do they have to do it? Are
Speaker 1: there are there any things coming up or any interesting
Speaker 1: paranormal happenings that people can attend.
Speaker 2: Well, like I said, every month, we do our it's
Speaker 2: you know, our what we call our history Mystery Tour.
Speaker 2: We do the three hour tour every month on every
Speaker 2: quarter overnight we're actually working on doing a paranormal conference
Speaker 2: August twenty six, so we'll be advertising that soon shortly.
Speaker 2: We haven't done that since twenty seventeen, so that's going
Speaker 2: to be exciting. And everybody can always go on and
Speaker 2: they can go out of our events too if they're
Speaker 2: interested in booking, you know, and overnight for themselves as
Speaker 2: well as a team. Like I said, we get YouTubers
Speaker 2: in here all the time, so anywhere between two people
Speaker 2: to as many as they need, but it just yeah,
Speaker 2: it varies.
Speaker 1: That's awesome. Well, I'm sure people will be interested. I
Speaker 1: can vouch for it. It's very haunted. Everyone there has
Speaker 1: always been Leslie. Like I said, I grew up in
Speaker 1: Alameda and so the Hornet was just always there, and yeah,
Speaker 1: one of my favorite places to visit. So thank you
Speaker 1: so much for taking the time. I really appreciate it,
Speaker 1: and hopefully I'll be able to visit soon.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, thank you.
Speaker 1: It's interesting to me that the Hornet is in my
Speaker 1: hometown of Alameda, California, the place where I had my
Speaker 1: very first paranormal experiences as a child, in our old
Speaker 1: home just a few blocks up the street from where
Speaker 1: the Hornet is docked now. Of course, the base was
Speaker 1: very much in operation. Then the Hornet Museum did not exist.
Speaker 1: But I've gone back many times to investigate her, and
Speaker 1: seeing how I have very few family members still in Alameda,
Speaker 1: the Hornet has almost become my family, the one thing
Speaker 1: bringing me back to my childhood. For if I didn't
Speaker 1: go there to look for her ghosts, I wouldn't really
Speaker 1: have a reason to return to Alameda at all. Makes
Speaker 1: me wonder if some of the spirits on board feel
Speaker 1: the same. I need to revisit their past. Maybe not
Speaker 1: all the time, but for fleeting moments, a chance to
Speaker 1: experience and relive life events, even some that were tragic
Speaker 1: that eventually forged who you became and truly affected your soul.
Speaker 1: Strange that such a huge metal structure can act as
Speaker 1: such a beacon for the living and apparently the dead,
Speaker 1: Or maybe after everything we've learned and discussed in this episode,
Speaker 1: it doesn't seem so strange. After all. I'm Amy Bruney
Speaker 1: and this was Haunted Road. Haunted Road is hosted and
Speaker 1: written by me Amy Bruney, with additional research by Taylor
Speaker 1: Haggerdorn and Cassandra de Alba. This show is edited and
Speaker 1: produced by Rima el Kali, with supervising producer Josh Thain
Speaker 1: and executive producers Aaron Manke, Alex Williams, and Matt Frederick.
Speaker 1: Haunted Road is a production of iHeartRadio and Grim and
Speaker 1: Mild from Erin Menke. Learn more about this show over
Speaker 1: at Grimanmild dot com, and for more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.