1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece. We just read the headlines 2 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:21,320 Speaker 1: about a brutal beating, kidnap, and murder of a young 3 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:27,120 Speaker 1: Memphis mother of two, Eliza Fletcher. But now we are 4 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:34,840 Speaker 1: learning the whole thing could have been avoided. Eliza could 5 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 1: very well be alive today, teaching at her church school 6 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 1: where she taught, taking care of her two little boys. 7 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: I'm so mad I could chow a nail in half 8 00:00:51,120 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 1: because I firmly believe her murder could have been avoided. 9 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,639 Speaker 1: I'mancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being 10 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 1: with us here at Fox Nation and Sirius XM one eleven. 11 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:09,360 Speaker 1: Where did it all start? Listen? It's been just over 12 00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 1: twelve hours since Elijah Fletcher disappeared and multiple agencies have 13 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: joined forces, and I can tell you there's a lot 14 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: of concern in the community as time passes by. Where 15 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 1: is the lines of Fletcher? That's the question many are 16 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: asking across the Mid South after investigators say the avid 17 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: jogger was abducted. It's very important that if anybody knows 18 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: the whereabouts of miss Fletcher to contact the police immediately. 19 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:36,800 Speaker 1: Fletcher was jogging down Central Avenue around four thirty this 20 00:01:36,959 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 1: morning when investigators say she was approached by someone who 21 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:44,119 Speaker 1: forced her into a dark colored suv and drove off. 22 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: You don't want to hear that that's going on. We 23 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 1: want to find her. We don't know, we don't know 24 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:53,600 Speaker 1: what's going on. Hart Robinson is a friend of Fletcher 25 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 1: and got the news this morning and immediately came to 26 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: the area of Central Avenue and Zach Curling Street where 27 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,960 Speaker 1: he was last seen. Where everybody's just really looking forward. 28 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: The search was on for the missing mom up to 29 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:11,919 Speaker 1: Eliza Fletcher. You were just hearing our friends at WRG 30 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:17,400 Speaker 1: Channel three. There were only two clues left behind listen. 31 00:02:17,680 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 1: Fletcher cell phone and a water bottle were found in 32 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 1: front of a home owned by the University of Memphis 33 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:25,520 Speaker 1: and a safety alert sent to students. They say she 34 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:29,160 Speaker 1: was reported missing after not returning home from her run. 35 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:33,080 Speaker 1: The suv that she was last seen and was spotted 36 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: driving westbound down Central Avenue. Multiple agencies, including the FBI 37 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,359 Speaker 1: or assisting with the case with one goal in mind, 38 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: find Eliza Fletcher. Our concern is to locate miss Fletcher. 39 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,400 Speaker 1: So if anybody knows where she's at, call the police immediately. 40 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: Really just think her life could have been spared. I 41 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:58,240 Speaker 1: firmly believe it. And then the frantic search. Listen to 42 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: our friends at NBC around seven to fifty am, roughly 43 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 1: three hours after the abduction, the suspect's brother and another 44 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 1: witness telling investigators they saw him wash his clothes in 45 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 1: a sink and clean the inside of the car with 46 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,960 Speaker 1: floor cleaner, according to an affidavit, the brother also saying 47 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 1: he was acting very strange that bizarre scene allegedly unfolding 48 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 1: less than a mile from where police discovered the unidentified 49 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: body late Monday. The affidavit also says Abstin left sandals behind, 50 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 1: Authorities using DNA from those shoes to zero in on him. So, 51 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:34,640 Speaker 1: while the frantic search throughout the Memphis area is ongoing 52 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: for the missing mom, you see Cleota Abstin frantically cleaning 53 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: the back of his GMC, washing his clothes, and his 54 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 1: brother's sing Wow, isn't that quite the coincidence? And then 55 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 1: the gruesome discovery our friends w RG A good wrenching 56 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 1: discovery south Memphis, as detectives confirm a body was located 57 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,560 Speaker 1: a few yards away from where Eliza Fletcher's alleged abductor 58 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 1: came hours after her kidnapping. Monday, Memphis police swarmed this 59 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 1: area after finding a body in an overgrown lot near 60 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 1: a vacant home on Victor Street. The scene just a 61 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: stone's throw away from where Memphis police say thirty eight 62 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: year old Cleota Absent came hours after abducting Fletcher. They 63 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 1: believe he cleaned blood from the interior of the suv 64 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:32,440 Speaker 1: used in the abduction and washed his clothes in his 65 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: brother's sink in the past ten minutes. Memphis police confirming 66 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: those new details, saying that the body they found yesterday 67 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:44,159 Speaker 1: is that of missing mother Eliza Fletcher, and now the 68 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 1: man they had in custody already charged with her kidnapping, 69 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,919 Speaker 1: faces murder charges. And this is coming just about sixteen 70 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 1: hours after they discovered a body here not far, they said, 71 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: within walking distance to an apartment complex where the thirty 72 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 1: eight year old Cleota Absen was seen cleaning his suv 73 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,679 Speaker 1: shortly after the abduction. Our friends at Fox thirteen joining 74 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 1: w RG when Eliza went missing, the search ensued. You 75 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 1: see the defendant, the suspect caught on video just cleaning, cleaning, scrubbing, scrubbing, 76 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: trying to get rid of blood. He would need some 77 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: sort of hydrochloric acid to do that trick. It didn't work, 78 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: blood throughout his suv, and then a couple of hundred 79 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 1: yards away, the body of Eliza Fletcher found just discarded 80 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:53,479 Speaker 1: in tall grass. Her Lululemon running shorts found in a 81 00:05:53,600 --> 00:06:01,240 Speaker 1: garbage bag not far away, also discarded. And now today 82 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 1: we find out her abduction, her likely rape, her murder 83 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:20,280 Speaker 1: could have all been avoided. How taking listen to our 84 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: friends at wat N. The man accused of kidnapping and 85 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:28,920 Speaker 1: killing Eliza Fletcher is facing three new criminal charges tonight. 86 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:32,919 Speaker 1: The charges are from another case in twenty twenty one. 87 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:37,040 Speaker 1: In this case, he's facing charges for aggravated rape, kidnapping, 88 00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 1: and unlawful possession of a gun. Memphis Police confirm a 89 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:45,039 Speaker 1: sexual assault report was taken on September twenty one of 90 00:06:45,160 --> 00:06:48,359 Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. The sexual assault kit was submitted to 91 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 1: the Tennessee Bureau of Investigations two days later on September 92 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,320 Speaker 1: twenty third of last year, but that kit was not 93 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 1: tested until he was connected to Eliza Fletcher's disappearance. Did 94 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:05,039 Speaker 1: you hear that? Another aggravated kidnap and rape? All the 95 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: way back almost a year ago? Twenty twenty one, a 96 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 1: rape kit was taken. It was sent to the Tennessee 97 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: Bureau of Investigations the TBI, and not a thing was done. 98 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 1: It sat on a shelf and in that Manila evidence 99 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 1: bag sealed shut with the investigators initials over it to 100 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:44,120 Speaker 1: maintain the chain of custody. Was the evidence that would 101 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: have put Cleotha Abstin behind bars at the time Eliza 102 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: was kidnapped and murdered. Joining me right now in All 103 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 1: Star panel to make sense of what we know right now. 104 00:07:57,520 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: But first I want to go to Dave Matt Crime 105 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 1: online dot Com investigative reporter, Dave, what went wrong? Nancy? 106 00:08:05,480 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: You know, we talked about how quickly they were able 107 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 1: to identify the DNA of Cleota Abstin on the slides 108 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 1: that they found at the kidnapping scene Proliza fledgerd. They 109 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 1: turned that around in less than eighteen hours from the 110 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: moment they found the slides to the moment they identified 111 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: the DNA clumbing from Cleotha Abstin in the case from 112 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 1: September twenty first, twenty twenty one, a woman reported the rape, 113 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 1: They did a rape kit, and forty eight hours later, 114 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:39,440 Speaker 1: on September twenty third of last year. The rape kit 115 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:45,680 Speaker 1: was submitted to the TBI DNA case files. The problem 116 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 1: is unless they order a rush on the DNA, it 117 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:55,360 Speaker 1: goes into the regular file. Just stop, no affairs, Dave Matt. 118 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:58,840 Speaker 1: But I really don't want to hear that because that 119 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: is all by I know you're reporting whether TBI wants 120 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: me to hear. But when it comes to a life 121 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:14,800 Speaker 1: threatening violent crime, why is there a weight? I pay 122 00:09:14,880 --> 00:09:19,240 Speaker 1: half my paycheck every year. I have ben since I 123 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 1: was a lowly assistant in the District Attorney's office, since 124 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 1: before that, when I worked at the library at Mercy University. 125 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:33,760 Speaker 1: Why do I pay taxes so Cleota Absent can walk 126 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 1: free and murder Eliza Fletcher leaving her two children with 127 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:44,199 Speaker 1: no mother. You know how much that screws a kid 128 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: up forever. And you're telling me it sounds like, with 129 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 1: a straight face, that it was in line to get analyzed. 130 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 1: You know what, I don't want to hear it. She's 131 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: dead and she endured a horrible death. That Stuving was 132 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:07,560 Speaker 1: covered in blood. I put money on it. She was 133 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 1: forcibly raped, likely sodomized as well. Why because of align 134 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:31,560 Speaker 1: a queue for evidence time stories with Nancy Grace with 135 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 1: me now. Lisa Daddy, I a former police lieutenant, New Haven, 136 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:40,840 Speaker 1: PD and she is the director of the Center for 137 00:10:40,880 --> 00:10:46,680 Speaker 1: Advanced Policing and Graduate program coordinator, University New Haven. Lisa, 138 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 1: could you please interpret what Dave Matt was just trying 139 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:54,439 Speaker 1: to say? Honestly, Nancy, the police department messed up on 140 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: that one, and you know, I really don't wait, wait, wait, 141 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:03,200 Speaker 1: messed up. Let's just analyze what you just said. Messed up. 142 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:08,320 Speaker 1: This is more than just messing up that didn't fall 143 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:14,720 Speaker 1: through the cracks. They screwed up horribly and Eliza is 144 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:20,960 Speaker 1: dead because they couldn't analyze a rape kit to Rachel 145 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:25,880 Speaker 1: Dfish are joining me special guest, registered nurse, sex assault 146 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:30,680 Speaker 1: nurse examiner. She's an expert witness. She's offered author of 147 00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:33,920 Speaker 1: Taking Back the Pen and you can find her at 148 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 1: Legal are In Consult dot org. Rachel, do you ever 149 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 1: get tired of hearing about one fell after the next. 150 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 1: You deal with rape victims every day, and I keep 151 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: screaming from the rooftops. A rape victim is never the 152 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:58,960 Speaker 1: same like a child molestation victims. Yes, they can go 153 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: on about life same light. They're having a normal life, 154 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:07,320 Speaker 1: but they're never the same after a rape. Maybe you 155 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:09,880 Speaker 1: can say it better than me, right, Yeah, the impact 156 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: that a victim has after being assaulted, it's lifelong. It 157 00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:18,800 Speaker 1: never goes away. A murder is one thing that's the 158 00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:21,319 Speaker 1: end result. But there are people living with the effects 159 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:23,960 Speaker 1: of this for the rest of their lives. And it 160 00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:27,720 Speaker 1: comes down to the fact that jurisdictions, communities don't put 161 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 1: an emphasis on crimes of violence against women are the vulnerable. 162 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,559 Speaker 1: These sex crimes are just tossed the side. There's not 163 00:12:34,679 --> 00:12:39,079 Speaker 1: proper funding, we don't adequately staff or law enforcement agency 164 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,240 Speaker 1: their crime labs. And then the statutes. I mean Tennessee, 165 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 1: you don't even have to the law enforcement agency does 166 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:47,560 Speaker 1: not even have to turn over the kit until sixty 167 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 1: days to the crime lab. So the statutes are showing, okay, 168 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: there's not a priority. What can happen in sixty days. 169 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:58,719 Speaker 1: A lot can happen. Other rapes can happen. Yeah, like 170 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 1: a Lis of Fletcher get murdered. And you know another thing, 171 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: Rachel D. Fisher, who is a rape sex assault nurse examiner. 172 00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 1: It's a very very specialized area. I wonder what that 173 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:17,679 Speaker 1: says to the rape victim like Cleotha Abstin's other rape victim. 174 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:20,520 Speaker 1: I mean, we already know of one when he was 175 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:25,560 Speaker 1: nearing adulthood, this one in September twenty twenty one. I 176 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 1: wonder how that rape victim felt when she would call 177 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 1: and say, um, what the status of my brutal rape case? 178 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: And she said oh, and she hears, oh, yeah, well 179 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:41,440 Speaker 1: it's in the queue. It's like you're at Target and 180 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: there's a long line, or you're at Kroger and the 181 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:48,960 Speaker 1: line wraps around the cash register. H No, she's not 182 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:53,040 Speaker 1: buying a dozen apples. She's trying to find out about 183 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:57,439 Speaker 1: her rape case that forever altered her life. And she 184 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:02,400 Speaker 1: gets told, yeah, you're in the line. Still analyze it. Meanwhile, 185 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:06,079 Speaker 1: this guy is walking free. But am I talking gibberish? 186 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:09,760 Speaker 1: Karen Start, because I feel like I'm not getting through. 187 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 1: I don't think I can scream any louder in a studio. 188 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:16,200 Speaker 1: Karen starting joining me now a psychologists at a New 189 00:14:16,280 --> 00:14:18,480 Speaker 1: York at karen Start dot com. That's Karen with a 190 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 1: se Karen, help me, please, Nancy, You're not talking gibberish. 191 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,680 Speaker 1: This is how it happens. I feel like crying and 192 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 1: fighting and hitting someone all at the same time, people 193 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 1: don't take it seriously enough. Here's something that will damage 194 00:14:37,080 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: someone's life forever. And I don't understand because police are 195 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 1: supposed to be trained, they're supposed to know that they 196 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: need to do something right away. And it is outraged, 197 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: just outrageous that they did not make sure that that 198 00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 1: came back as soon as possible. And who knows whatever 199 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:03,080 Speaker 1: he was up to. Nancy, Oh oh, this is the 200 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:08,400 Speaker 1: tip of the iceberg. Karen, Karen, Karen Stark. This guy, CLARITHA. 201 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 1: Abstin started committing violent felonies at age eleven that we 202 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 1: know of. And you know, Matthew Mangino, I'm not asking 203 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 1: you to speak. I'm just referring to you former prosecutor, 204 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:31,800 Speaker 1: now civil and defense attorney and author. He would argue, Oh, 205 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:35,280 Speaker 1: he was just eleven, the sweet little boy. You know. 206 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: I might buy that at eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen, but 207 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:45,600 Speaker 1: then at sixteen, seventeen eighteen, I'm not buying it anymore. So, Karen, 208 00:15:45,680 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: start when people say he started his one man crime 209 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 1: wave at age eleven, how many rapes has this guy committed, 210 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: culminating in the murder of Eliza Flasher and Mangino, don't 211 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: even by they're jumping in and say he's innocent until 212 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 1: proving guilty. I know that we all know that, and 213 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 1: I believe there is a snowball's chance in hell that 214 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 1: he may not be guilty. Okay, So that said, what Karen, 215 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 1: start say something so I can quit feeling like I 216 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:20,640 Speaker 1: want to kill somebody. You're not going to clift of 217 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: the sorry fancy, but this is outrageous and people, do 218 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: you know that psychochasts start at an early age, so 219 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:32,920 Speaker 1: it doesn't surprise me that this began at eleven. The 220 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 1: outrageous part of this is that he is not already 221 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 1: under lock and kids walking free to grab a line. Okay, 222 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:45,520 Speaker 1: so what is the excuse? Take a listen to our 223 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: friend Marcus Hunter. Scientists pulled the recently tested kids matching 224 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:56,160 Speaker 1: Gapson Henderson for analysis nine months after it was received 225 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,840 Speaker 1: on to June twenty fourth of this year, and completed 226 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:03,560 Speaker 1: and initial report of the results on August twenty ninth. 227 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:07,800 Speaker 1: The sample was then entered into coodas, which returned a 228 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:11,720 Speaker 1: match on a September fifth, which was within hours of 229 00:17:11,840 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: Memphis police finding Fletcher's body on Victor Street and forty 230 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:20,400 Speaker 1: nine weeks after MPD submitted the rape kit to TBI, 231 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 1: the match of the September twenty one assault came back 232 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: to Cleiota Abston Henderson. The results were then reported to 233 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:32,879 Speaker 1: Memphis police. According to court documents, Thursday, he was indicted 234 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 1: all the charges of aggravated rape, especially aggravated kidnapping, and 235 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:41,120 Speaker 1: gun charges in connection to the crime from a year ago. 236 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:45,480 Speaker 1: You know, it's just all blah blah blah words. Now 237 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:50,159 Speaker 1: am I supposed to believe Matthew Mengino. I'm coming to 238 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 1: you just as a legal expert. Don't put on your 239 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: defense hat yet, okay, because we all know you're a 240 00:17:57,240 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 1: former prosecutor or former parole board member, author of the 241 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 1: Executioner's Toll, So please don't start telling me he was 242 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,159 Speaker 1: only eleven years old when he committed his first balloting. 243 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 1: I lets just say that for the shrink what you know, 244 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:15,359 Speaker 1: all this is bs right, because they're saying that it 245 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:19,679 Speaker 1: was just a coincidence that when Eliza Fletcher goes missing 246 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 1: and they go, oh, you know what, you're at the 247 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: front of the line. Now, let's do that DNA kit. No, 248 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:30,640 Speaker 1: that's not a coincidence. There's no such thing in criminal law. 249 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:34,520 Speaker 1: So they're trying to tell me that Eliza goes missing, 250 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 1: and then they go, wow, I think it's time that 251 00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:41,920 Speaker 1: we do the DNA on that file way back there 252 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 1: on the shelf. What really happened, Mangino? Well, I think 253 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:50,600 Speaker 1: what really happened is they were able to find DNA 254 00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:54,719 Speaker 1: on the sandals that were found at the crime scene, 255 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:59,120 Speaker 1: and they immediately did an analysis. I'm not talking about that, 256 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: Matthew claith Austin DNA as on a September twenty twenty 257 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:12,199 Speaker 1: one rape victim. Okay, right, So why when Eliza gets 258 00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: kidnapped and there's a search going on, did they go wow, 259 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 1: I think I'll sir, oh think I'll run that DNA test. 260 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 1: Let's total b S. Why did they suddenly decide to 261 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:27,159 Speaker 1: run it then, you know, to cover their butts? I 262 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:32,760 Speaker 1: mean they failed. This was a systemic failure to test 263 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 1: DNA that was found at a crime scene and as 264 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:42,000 Speaker 1: simple as just running a code combined DNA index system 265 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:49,440 Speaker 1: exactly know. It was cover your ass, That's what it was. Yeah, 266 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: And I'm just wondering, Matthew Mangino, why did they select 267 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:59,760 Speaker 1: that particular rape kit to suddenly test. I'm guessing that 268 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 1: the rape occurred in the same m O modus operandi 269 00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: method of operation as Eliza's kidnap, that the victim may 270 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:15,560 Speaker 1: have described the same kind of vehicle. Something about that 271 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:18,359 Speaker 1: rape kit, about that rape maybe it was in the 272 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: same area, just I don't know, but something made them 273 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: reach back on that shelf and pull out that file 274 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:31,119 Speaker 1: and perform that DNA test is submitted to CODUS, the 275 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:35,480 Speaker 1: Combined DNA Index System. Before I go to special guest 276 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:40,400 Speaker 1: doctor Kristen Middleman from authorm Labs, I want to circle 277 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:46,439 Speaker 1: back to Rachel D. Fisher, registered sex assault nurse examiner. Rachel, 278 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:51,880 Speaker 1: could you please describe what is the procedure that you 279 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:55,040 Speaker 1: go through when you examine a rape victim and what 280 00:20:55,280 --> 00:21:00,160 Speaker 1: is a rape kitnam comes to hospital, we do head 281 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 1: to assessment and the detailed general exam where we colect 282 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,639 Speaker 1: evidence from all the intimate parts of the body and 283 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: anywhere based on the history, we submit this kit to 284 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,439 Speaker 1: law enforcement and law enforcement slowdown place, as I like 285 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 1: to say, Rachel, we're not having tea at High Grown 286 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:25,000 Speaker 1: with King Charles. Okay, when you say we connect, we 287 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:28,399 Speaker 1: collect DNA from all parts of the body. That is 288 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 1: certainly putting perfume on the pig. The rape victim, who 289 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:40,640 Speaker 1: has already been brutally raped, probably beaten, terrified, then has 290 00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:44,800 Speaker 1: to go for a rape kit. Then it's basically a 291 00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: pelvic exam and it takes a long time. What do 292 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:52,240 Speaker 1: you have to do. It's a very intrusive exam. We 293 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:56,879 Speaker 1: spread their legs, we touch, we look, we examine, we 294 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: go into all the genitalia. We swab, but we insearch speculums. 295 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 1: It's re traumatizing for the victim. Essentially, it is what 296 00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 1: it is because we're going back into these places. Okay, 297 00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,720 Speaker 1: wait a minute. See, See you are an expert, and 298 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 1: when you just roll off comments like that, not everybody 299 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:20,879 Speaker 1: knows what you mean when you say a speculum, isn't 300 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:26,280 Speaker 1: that kind of like a reverse eyelash curler where you 301 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: squinch the curler together Instead, A speculum is something you 302 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 1: stick inside the ladies vagina and anus and then you 303 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 1: open up those cat female cavities and then you go 304 00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 1: in there basically with a searchlight like a flashlight, and 305 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 1: you look around with a really long Q tip and 306 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:53,120 Speaker 1: you look in there and you try and find with 307 00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:56,919 Speaker 1: a swab. Yeah, everybody in the studio is grimacing and 308 00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:01,160 Speaker 1: looking away right now for a reason. And you swab 309 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:06,640 Speaker 1: around inside the anus in the vagina and hopefully you 310 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:15,400 Speaker 1: will get naked to the human eye sperm DNA, right. 311 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: That's the intent to get any any sort of DNA 312 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,520 Speaker 1: off of the internal orifices of the patients. Yeah, and 313 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 1: that includes the anus. Correct. We do also swab the anus. Yes, 314 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:31,160 Speaker 1: And then you have the rape kit combing as if 315 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: I would comb my hair, what is that. We take 316 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 1: a comb and we go through the head hair, pubic hair, 317 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,960 Speaker 1: getting any debris that can link it back to potentially 318 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 1: the scene of where it happened, to corroborate that as well. 319 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 1: Sometimes we do plucking of the hair in order to 320 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:53,520 Speaker 1: get DNA as well. So it's a very painful, intrusive 321 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:56,199 Speaker 1: examine some in some points of it. But when the 322 00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:00,240 Speaker 1: victims are that brave enough to come eaten for that, 323 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 1: that's right there, the first step in they're healing. And 324 00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: the first victim of this case with a positive hit 325 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: was brave enough to do that. So I can only 326 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:10,040 Speaker 1: imagine her seeing this, that she was brave enough to 327 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,040 Speaker 1: go in and then nobody tested it until it was 328 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,400 Speaker 1: too late. I can only imagine what she's feeling right now. 329 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 1: She was brave enough to do that initial rape kit 330 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 1: back then, over a year ago, and here we are, 331 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:27,199 Speaker 1: and the only way her case was finally processed was 332 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 1: because Eliza was murdered. It took a murder to get 333 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 1: her rape kit done. That's the harsh truth of what 334 00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:40,159 Speaker 1: we're dealing with. Rachel day Fisher, could you plays described 335 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:47,159 Speaker 1: the spectrum of demeanors your right victor impatience have displayed. 336 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 1: They come in sometimes completely with no effect meeting their faces, 337 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 1: don't smile, they don't frown, they're just quiet, they don't 338 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 1: make eye contact. Sometimes they laughed to distracted themselves. Sometimes 339 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:01,920 Speaker 1: they're crying trauma sense in very different ways. And each 340 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,880 Speaker 1: victim is different. And I've seen law enforcement or even say, well, 341 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 1: she doesn't seem like anything happened. We're not even sure 342 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 1: if it's real because of her demeanor. Like I've heard 343 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 1: it all, But each victim processes their trauma differently, So 344 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:19,200 Speaker 1: regardless of how they respond to it, if they're brave 345 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: enough to come get an intrusive exam in a busy 346 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:26,720 Speaker 1: er and have an examiner stick things into their bodies, 347 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,840 Speaker 1: something happened nobody willingly does that. They're regardless of what 348 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: their demeanor is. They're there for help, and we help 349 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,000 Speaker 1: them all the same, and we prioritize it on our end, 350 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:39,760 Speaker 1: and then we do the next step in our process 351 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:42,719 Speaker 1: is handed over to law enforcement for them to do 352 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,560 Speaker 1: their due diligence, which is supposed to me to take 353 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,680 Speaker 1: it to the crime lab. But Tennessee has a statute, 354 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: but they have sixty days for it to sit on 355 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 1: their shelf before they're mandated to give it to the 356 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,879 Speaker 1: crime lab. Karen start as Rachel day fish or our 357 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: sex assault and ours exam or was speaking. I saw 358 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 1: of another unrelated case and it's the case of Ellen Greenberg. 359 00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:08,639 Speaker 1: She was stabbed over twenty times in the back, in 360 00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:10,440 Speaker 1: the back of the head, the back of the neck, 361 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:15,919 Speaker 1: and spine and it was deemed a suicide. And I 362 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:19,680 Speaker 1: flew to Harrisburg, Pennsylvania to meet with her parents and 363 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: go through the case. The mother, Ellen's mother was just 364 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 1: stone faced and just the devastation was so apparent. It 365 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: just hurt her to even talk. The father, Ellen's father, 366 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 1: and she was a daddy's girl, was cracking jokes and 367 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 1: like nothing was wrong. And then I noticed when he 368 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,800 Speaker 1: went to the cemetery, her father kept looking away. He 369 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:54,080 Speaker 1: couldn't stand to look at where she was buried. But 370 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 1: then as soon as we left, he was jovial and 371 00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:00,520 Speaker 1: cracking jokes. You know what, Karen Stark. When I got 372 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 1: on the plane to come home and the day, the night, 373 00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:08,879 Speaker 1: the whole thing was over, I cried and cried on 374 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:16,719 Speaker 1: that plane for the father, Allen's father, because it's so painful. 375 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 1: As you were just hearing Rachel Fisher describing some women 376 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 1: might giggle, it was so painful for him he couldn't 377 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:32,439 Speaker 1: even really address it, and so he muddled through. And 378 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,520 Speaker 1: I don't know why that just you know, I'm thinking 379 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: of these rape victims, and I'm thinking about him when 380 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:44,320 Speaker 1: it's so horrible, they can't even begin to grapple with it. 381 00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:49,080 Speaker 1: Karen Start. That's right, Nancy, it is it's they disassociate. 382 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: And you really can't pay attention to have someone reacts 383 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:57,879 Speaker 1: to trauma and to death because everyone, each one of 384 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: us is very very different in their people that cry. 385 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 1: Think about you know, when people sometimes get nervous and 386 00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:09,359 Speaker 1: they start laughing, and they're not laughing because it's funny, 387 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,960 Speaker 1: it's just their response that they have no choice. That's 388 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,000 Speaker 1: how they deal with that kind of a situation. And 389 00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:20,879 Speaker 1: that's what you're describing. I've been to funerals where somebody 390 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:26,399 Speaker 1: was so angry at the death of their spouse. They 391 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 1: were they were furious, and you would never know that 392 00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 1: this was happening because they're greeting and loving and in pain, 393 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 1: and it all gets mixed up when they have to 394 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: deal with this kind of a situation. Terrible. And now, 395 00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: having spoken to the rest of our panel, I'm going 396 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: to lay it all in your lap, Doctor Crystal Kristen Middleman. 397 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 1: She is this chief development officer and they highly respected 398 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 1: off for am Inc. You can find them at DNA 399 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: solves dot com. One of their specialties I have learned 400 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 1: is taking old or degraded DNA and somehow pulling a 401 00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: miracle and getting a match. I'm talking about DNA that's 402 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 1: been in mud, been underwater, been through a fire, fifty 403 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 1: sixty years old, and they have the technology to bring 404 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:53,360 Speaker 1: us justice. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Doctor Kristin Millman, 405 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:57,400 Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough for being with us here 406 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 1: on Clime Stories today. Do you have First of all, 407 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 1: I want to know how they made the match of 408 00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:09,880 Speaker 1: what likely statistical identification we have of Cliotha Abston, and 409 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:14,080 Speaker 1: any insight you can give us as to why they 410 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 1: so horribly failed the first rate victim, well, the last 411 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 1: rate victim that we know of, and Eliza, how did 412 00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 1: that happen? I mean, you deal with this kind of 413 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,960 Speaker 1: thing every day, and we are we're going to deal 414 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 1: with this kind of thing every single day, and I, 415 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 1: like you and everyone here at often believe that it's 416 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:41,040 Speaker 1: an outrage that we do not have the technology implemented 417 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:44,600 Speaker 1: that would be able to stop this from happening. You know, 418 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: we talked about this every single day, but the CODIS 419 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 1: testing system was created thirty years ago and nothing new 420 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:56,040 Speaker 1: has come to forensics since in order to help these investigators. 421 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 1: You know, you say the investigators might have failed. I 422 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 1: don't think the invested it as a failing. We work 423 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:03,760 Speaker 1: with these guys every single day. So after we work 424 00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 1: with CBI and they work day and night trying to 425 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 1: make things work, they're not given the technology that's necessary 426 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 1: to be able to clear these cases at scale. The 427 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,080 Speaker 1: government is who's failing. The government has failed to fund 428 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 1: and adopt new technologies that would allow the backlogs to 429 00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:27,200 Speaker 1: truly clear. We have backlogs everywhere because this technology is 430 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 1: the way that it's written right now, is not scalable. 431 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 1: You can't hire enough people to do run every single 432 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 1: test immediately and have a result in eight hours. It 433 00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:39,120 Speaker 1: is just not possible. And so but there is new 434 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:43,080 Speaker 1: technologies here. Are there one of the new technologies that 435 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,200 Speaker 1: could help clear a lot of the backlog that gets 436 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,960 Speaker 1: stuck when there's no DNA answer. But there are other 437 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 1: new technologies here. Could you imagine doing this podcast on 438 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,920 Speaker 1: computers from thirty years ago? No, you wouldn't. You would 439 00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: get the new computer, you would get the best mic, 440 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 1: You would do the next best thing you did just 441 00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,840 Speaker 1: for your business. Why isn't friends exchanging? Okay, hold on 442 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:12,200 Speaker 1: Dodgora Middleman, It is far far beyond me your knowledge 443 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:18,280 Speaker 1: regarding DNA and scientific testing. But I'm not asking for 444 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 1: a result in eight hours? What about eight days? What 445 00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: about eight weeks? What about eight months? This was a year. 446 00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 1: The last rape victim that we know of cloth Aston's 447 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 1: was September twenty twenty one. It is now September twenty 448 00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:41,360 Speaker 1: twenty two, and you're preaching to the choir, doctor Middleman. 449 00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: I spent a third of my time as a prosecutor 450 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: as a Georgia state crime lab. And can I tell 451 00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 1: you those people work like dogs, scientists and ballistics in 452 00:32:55,720 --> 00:33:00,640 Speaker 1: fiber analysis, hair analysis, DNA, blood, you name. They weren't 453 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:04,480 Speaker 1: like dogs. They already were over time. What more do 454 00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:08,400 Speaker 1: we want them to do? So where is the fail? 455 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 1: And I guarantee you the TB I tenn A CEBR 456 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: Investigation crime lab is the same. So how is it 457 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:21,600 Speaker 1: he's walking the street to murder Eliza because the system 458 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,680 Speaker 1: has failed to implement all the necessary tools. You know, 459 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,920 Speaker 1: let me tell you, Nancy, It's just like if I 460 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: gave you a bicycle and I told you go ahead 461 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,120 Speaker 1: and deliver mail all over the United States. Well, how 462 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:36,880 Speaker 1: can you possibly deliver mail all over the United States 463 00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 1: that bicycle. It would never happen. It's not possible. But 464 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,520 Speaker 1: if there were cars and planes and roads and everything 465 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,200 Speaker 1: else there and the infrastructure put all together, then you 466 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,600 Speaker 1: could deliver that mail all over the United States. Unfortunately, 467 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 1: we are at the bicycle states of forensic science when 468 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:57,120 Speaker 1: it comes to solving these backlogs with texicult and murders. 469 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 1: We are DNA testing. Is that it's see still and 470 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 1: there are so many ways. I mean, our technology, we 471 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,240 Speaker 1: don't need a code of database to identify someone. You 472 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 1: don't have to have raped someone else in order for 473 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: us to identify you. That's the biggest key. You can 474 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 1: rate one person and get identified the very very first time. 475 00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:21,280 Speaker 1: Yet our technology isn't widely used everywhere because people scream 476 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,319 Speaker 1: all sorts of stuff. Oh well, it's new, we don't 477 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,080 Speaker 1: know if the worst Oh my god, privacy, Oh so well, 478 00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:29,560 Speaker 1: the government's slow and funding it. I want to perpetrator 479 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 1: in jail the first time they commit a crime. I 480 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: don't want to have to wait till the second victim, 481 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:35,560 Speaker 1: in the third victim, or the eleventh or twelveth victim. 482 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:38,719 Speaker 1: And trust me, we've identified those as well. They're in 483 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,480 Speaker 1: codeed so many many times then no one's ever identified them. 484 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:44,680 Speaker 1: They come to us finally, and now they're identified and 485 00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: all these crimes are solved. That's devastating. You're hearing the 486 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:52,839 Speaker 1: voice of doctor Kristen Middleman, chief development officer at all 487 00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:56,960 Speaker 1: Ram Lab. You can find her at dnasolves dot com 488 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:03,360 Speaker 1: explaining how we don't even need another rate or murder 489 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:09,320 Speaker 1: to identify CLEOTHA. Abston from his last rate last September, 490 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:13,520 Speaker 1: but it was never done. Take a listen to Marcus 491 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:19,879 Speaker 1: Hunter WRG. The TBI accepts rush DNA cases when requested 492 00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:23,480 Speaker 1: by a local investigative agency, as we did in the 493 00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:26,839 Speaker 1: recent Eliza Fletcher case. It went on to say, our 494 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:31,760 Speaker 1: scientists identified Cliota Abston as a suspect less than eighteen 495 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,719 Speaker 1: hours after receiving a key evidence. The agency said at 496 00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:39,560 Speaker 1: the soundfool they received in September of last year was 497 00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:43,799 Speaker 1: not submitted as a rushcase. Therefore, it was placed with 498 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:48,080 Speaker 1: the standard casework, which can have an average turnaround of 499 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 1: thirty three to forty nine weeks. So, Lucia Daddy, Oh, 500 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,919 Speaker 1: what does it take to be a rush case? I mean, 501 00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:00,719 Speaker 1: Cleiota Abston in court today, our new charges of a 502 00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:05,799 Speaker 1: violent rape and as they say, especially dangerous kidnap. Why 503 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,040 Speaker 1: was that not a rush case back in September twenty 504 00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:11,239 Speaker 1: twenty one? It should have been when you have a 505 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:15,799 Speaker 1: stranger rape and given the circumstances of what we know, 506 00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 1: that should have been a rush because we know they're 507 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: gonna hit again. It's not just one and done. So 508 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 1: I don't understand how a year ago that case was 509 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:31,080 Speaker 1: not rush To try to identify the who a violent 510 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:34,879 Speaker 1: rate of brutal kidnapping is not a rush? Then what 511 00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:39,400 Speaker 1: is it? Took this before we knew the truth. It 512 00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:43,080 Speaker 1: took this before that rape kit was tested. Listen to 513 00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:46,320 Speaker 1: our friends at Fox thirteen and after David released Tuesday 514 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:51,239 Speaker 1: reveals new details about Fletcher's final moments. Investigators say data 515 00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 1: from the FBI Cast team, which is used to track 516 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: cell phones, led them to East Person Avenue and Victor Street. 517 00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 1: While searching that area Monday, just after five, they say 518 00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: officers noticed high grass at a vacant home, as well 519 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:10,800 Speaker 1: as vehicle tracks in the high grass. Officers also smelled 520 00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:14,760 Speaker 1: an older of decay. We're told the officers fanned out 521 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:18,440 Speaker 1: and walked to the back of the property. Immediately to 522 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,200 Speaker 1: the right of the steps, they say they found a 523 00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 1: woman's body. To give you an ideal why it was 524 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,719 Speaker 1: so hard for officials to find her is because even 525 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,120 Speaker 1: though they're in the middle of a neighborhood, you can 526 00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:35,040 Speaker 1: see the very tall grass shielding the view from the street. 527 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 1: I'm five five. Take a look at this grass, It's 528 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: towering over me. Then there's this abandoned home, and we're 529 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 1: told Fletcher's remains were found behind this housewalk with me 530 00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:50,080 Speaker 1: so you can see beside these steps here and you 531 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:54,120 Speaker 1: can even see an imprint in the dirt right here. 532 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:59,400 Speaker 1: Why did it have to take the murder I'll Eliza 533 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:04,880 Speaker 1: Fletcher for there to be justice and a rate that 534 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:11,800 Speaker 1: occurred one year ago. A lot of hard questions today, 535 00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:19,239 Speaker 1: But will we ever get answers? Nancy Grace Clands story 536 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: siding off, Keep my friend