Speaker 1: What up, bright Side besties, Hello Sunshine. Today on the
Speaker 1: bright Side, we're closing out National Poetry Months with poet
Speaker 1: Laureate Ada Lemon, and we're talking all about awe and wonder.
Speaker 1: It's Friday, April twenty sixth. I'm Danielle Robe.
Speaker 2: And it's a girl simone. Boys, this is the bright
Speaker 2: Side from Hello Sunshine.
Speaker 1: Okay, Simone. We always save our chit chat for on air,
Speaker 1: So I don't even know what's going on in your life?
Speaker 1: What's going on?
Speaker 2: So? I was hanging out with my mom yesterday and
Speaker 2: she was like, so I listened to a few of
Speaker 2: the recently.
Speaker 3: Oh no, oh no, no, no, no, it was all good.
Speaker 3: She's like, it's really good.
Speaker 2: She was like, so you and Danielle have like a
Speaker 2: really great rapport and I was like yeah, and she's like,
Speaker 2: is that real?
Speaker 3: This is one of our most asked questions.
Speaker 1: Everybody asked me that too. All my friends are like,
Speaker 1: you guys sound like you really like each other?
Speaker 3: Do you really like her? I know, I'm like, should
Speaker 3: I not like her? At this point?
Speaker 2: I don't get it. Yes, it's real, Yes we are
Speaker 2: really friends.
Speaker 1: Should we stage a fake fight?
Speaker 2: I honestly think maybe we should just for publicity.
Speaker 1: I think so too. Let's get into the drums. Okay,
Speaker 1: I actually need your advice on something before we jump in.
Speaker 3: Yes, I'm honored that you're asking me for advice.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm gonna put myself on blast.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: I got a text from my ex boyfriend like two
Speaker 1: days ago.
Speaker 3: Is this the one that I know about?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 3: The one before?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Okay, Okay, I have less context on him, but go ahead.
Speaker 1: He was a bad man and he texted me and said, hey,
Speaker 1: do you want to grab a coffee or a meal?
Speaker 1: And I've told him in the past to please stop
Speaker 1: contacting me. Do I block him now?
Speaker 3: Number one? Do you want to meet with him?
Speaker 1: Nah? Actually, I'm gonna say, hell nah?
Speaker 2: Do you want to have any contact with him whatsoever?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 3: No, I don't. Then yeah, block, just block blocked?
Speaker 1: You know that?
Speaker 2: Black.
Speaker 1: I wish I could have like a voice note of
Speaker 1: you saying that if he texted.
Speaker 2: Me, I'll just text it to him from my random
Speaker 2: three oh five number.
Speaker 1: I like that.
Speaker 2: I feel like you could just give him a line
Speaker 2: that's like, hey, I don't really want to be in touch, but.
Speaker 1: I already did that.
Speaker 3: You already did that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, black, I think maybe we should get into the show.
Speaker 3: Maybe we should move on.
Speaker 2: Okay, So when I say the term gorpcore, what does
Speaker 2: that mean to you, Danielle, what comes to mind?
Speaker 1: I think, uh, gore texts, So I think like lots
Speaker 1: of police strings and crisscross stuff.
Speaker 2: Hot hot, You're very hot, nor face. Yes, yes, that
Speaker 2: is exactly what gorpcore is. I'm super into gorpcore, always
Speaker 2: have been. I've been doing it before it was cool,
Speaker 2: before it was gorpcore. But it's basically the next evolution
Speaker 2: of ath leisure where what Yeah, it's it's the outdoors
Speaker 2: y aesthetic like you said the Arii, the north Face,
Speaker 2: the Patagucci, but people are wearing it as street wear.
Speaker 1: So did you just say Padagucci?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Padagucci, like the.
Speaker 1: Gucci, Patagonias or collab.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 2: No, it's just like, in like our world, in like
Speaker 2: the outdoorsy girl world, we say Padagucci.
Speaker 3: I don't know why. It's like when people.
Speaker 2: Say tarje Oh, oh gotcha. You know, it's just a
Speaker 2: fun little thing that we do.
Speaker 1: I'm so on the outside of this world.
Speaker 2: So, actually, uh, Belahedide, Kendall Jenner have been wearing this
Speaker 2: style lately, but of course it's been around forever.
Speaker 3: It's all over TikTok. That's really where it's blowing up.
Speaker 2: You know why I love this trend because it's not
Speaker 2: about putting on this artificial layer of beauty, right, It's
Speaker 2: about stripping it all away. It's not about wearing a
Speaker 2: ton of makeup. It's about coming as you are in comfortable,
Speaker 2: functional clothing.
Speaker 1: You're wearing cargo capris today, are those gorp Core?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I leaned into the gorp cord today. I also
Speaker 2: have this really crinkly jacket.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's yellow puffer by the way.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Okay, so do you already own this stuff and you
Speaker 1: used to wear it camping and now you're just wearing
Speaker 1: it on the outside world? Or do people buy gorpcore
Speaker 1: to walk around in the world.
Speaker 2: It's like, okay, you know how people were wearing Lululemon
Speaker 2: pants everywhere.
Speaker 3: I think Danielle is wearing Lululemon.
Speaker 2: See, this is just like this is this is ath
Speaker 2: leisure adjacent, you know, so choogee, we're all chewgy girl.
Speaker 2: But the other layer to this for me is that
Speaker 2: gorpcore is more than just like a silly fashion trend.
Speaker 2: It's a lifestyle. It means you're always dressed for adventure
Speaker 2: or nature therapy. And you know what's really cool. Since
Speaker 2: the pandemic, there have been a rise in communities focused
Speaker 2: on bringing women and women of color together outdoors. So
Speaker 2: one that comes to mind is called Hike Clerb. They
Speaker 2: host hike group hikes and activities. Another one clurb It's
Speaker 2: Cute Right Outdoor Afro, which is all about reconnecting black
Speaker 2: folks to the land through fishing kayaking. So I think
Speaker 2: that's beautiful, and I also think about my own community.
Speaker 2: I mean, I have a gaggle of GORP girls that
Speaker 2: I go camping with. Some of my best memories are
Speaker 2: with them in the wilderness in Canada or the Pacific Northwest.
Speaker 1: The ggg's the GGG Gaggle of GORP Girls.
Speaker 3: It's the triple G. Hmmm, I'm all about the GORP
Speaker 3: core lifestyle.
Speaker 1: You are really bringing something new to my life. I
Speaker 1: had no idea that gorpecore existed. I don't know if
Speaker 1: I'm interested.
Speaker 3: To be quite.
Speaker 2: Honest, don't speak too soon, because I have brought you
Speaker 2: actually my favorite GORP recipe. So GORP stands for good
Speaker 2: old raisins and peanuts. It's essentially trail mix. But I
Speaker 2: have what I think is the best recipe for gorp.
Speaker 1: You've given me so many gifts this week, it's not
Speaker 1: really a good Wait. Is there Captain Crunch in there? Yes?
Speaker 3: Okay, so here I love Captain Crunch.
Speaker 2: Here is the recipe for the best gorp in the world.
Speaker 2: It is Captain Crunch, almonds, crasins, and reci's pieces.
Speaker 1: Can I have some?
Speaker 3: Yeah, but make sure that you get one of the bite.
Speaker 1: This is freaking delicious. I want to curse, right, God,
Speaker 1: it's it's This is better than puppy chow.
Speaker 3: It was amazing.
Speaker 1: I think we have to end the show because we're
Speaker 1: eating I know, right, Okay, So you are a gorpe
Speaker 1: girl living your most authentic life. Yes, This article from
Speaker 1: Glamour by Sophia Bush really had me feeling away because
Speaker 1: she's truly living her authentic life now. One year after
Speaker 1: a picture perfect wedding turned very public divorce, Sophia Bush
Speaker 1: found herself in a new relationship with a woman, and
Speaker 1: it was with famed soccer star Ashlyn Harris, and the
Speaker 1: internet went wild. Of course, there were rumors because Ashland
Speaker 1: was married and had kids with her ex wife, who
Speaker 1: was also a famous soccer player, and Sophia Bush has
Speaker 1: not spoken out about it until now. She wrote an
Speaker 1: essay for Glas in her own words, addressing everything for
Speaker 1: the first time. And the reason I'm bringing this up
Speaker 1: is I thought it was really moving. She mentions joy
Speaker 1: four times in the article. She said she's been chasing
Speaker 1: joy and has made a few decisions like doing a
Speaker 1: play in London last year, thinking it would jumpstart this joy.
Speaker 1: You know how we do that when we're not happy.
Speaker 1: We try all these things to jumpstart the joy, and
Speaker 1: unfortunately it's just an inside job. And she wrote, I
Speaker 1: have real joy. It took me forty one years to
Speaker 1: get here. I feel like I can finally breathe.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 1: I think women just want to exhale. We hold so
Speaker 1: much in We hold guilt, shame, past hurts, betrayals, lost, divorce,
Speaker 1: like feelings of all of our family, our parents, our kids,
Speaker 1: and we just want to feel like we can breathe.
Speaker 1: There's been so much judgment around her relationship and how
Speaker 1: she chose to live her life. That just made me
Speaker 1: happy to read that she was exhaling. I think we
Speaker 1: all want permission to exhale.
Speaker 2: I know a lot of people are going through this
Speaker 2: internally or in a quiet way, right like getting to
Speaker 2: their true self and living out their truest life and identity.
Speaker 2: But she had to do it in such a public forum,
Speaker 2: and from the outside looking in, it got messy, and
Speaker 2: so I can only imagine how hard that was to
Speaker 2: both be feeling like you're living alive for so long
Speaker 2: and then have to get into this new relationship and
Speaker 2: have everyone comment on it and weigh in. So does
Speaker 2: feel like she's exhaling right now.
Speaker 1: I like that you use the word messy because I
Speaker 1: think we all look at the mess in life and
Speaker 1: it scares us. But when we think about books or
Speaker 1: films or things that we gravitate towards, a lot of
Speaker 1: it oftentimes is the mess of life because we're all
Speaker 1: looking for that permission to live in our mess too.
Speaker 1: And so I like that she threw away the rules.
Speaker 1: She's just living in the mess.
Speaker 3: We got to live in the mess. It's the only
Speaker 3: way to live.
Speaker 1: Okay, we are not going to stage a fake fight
Speaker 1: at least right now, but there is a celebrity that
Speaker 1: did stage of fake scenario that we have to get
Speaker 1: into before break because last spring, when there were rumors
Speaker 1: that Sidney Sweeney was secretly dating her anyone but you
Speaker 1: co star Glenn Powell. Oh, I remember this, You remember this?
Speaker 1: Everyone believed it. It was super scandalous because she was
Speaker 1: and still is very much engaged and he had recently
Speaker 1: broken up with his long term girlfriend. And despite all that,
Speaker 1: they were spotted going to the zoo with his family,
Speaker 1: holding hands, lovingly looking into each other's eyes on the
Speaker 1: red carpet Internet. Sluice also noticed that Sidney wasn't wearing
Speaker 1: her engagement ring at the time, and we all fell
Speaker 1: for it. We thought it was real. But in an
Speaker 1: interview with The New York Times, Sidney Sweeney admitted that
Speaker 1: she and Glenn leaned into the affairs and the rumors
Speaker 1: to promote the film. Sidney and her fiance were producers
Speaker 1: on the film, and so they were like financially invested
Speaker 1: in its success, and they were like, let's do what
Speaker 1: we gotta do.
Speaker 2: That is a supportive fiance, right there, someone who is
Speaker 2: going to let their partner lean into the chemistry with
Speaker 2: their costar on the Today Show, on all these public outings.
Speaker 2: I mean, both of them are very comfortable in their relationship.
Speaker 2: But this makes me think about all the times when
Speaker 2: celebrities have been in relationships that were actually pr stunts.
Speaker 1: Here's the thing about twenty twenty four. I feel like
Speaker 1: the veil is being lifted. We used to believe all
Speaker 1: of this, like growing up with tabloids and you know,
Speaker 1: I used to work in entertainment news, and I was like,
Speaker 1: I saw the behind the scenes where there's smoke, there's
Speaker 1: usually fire like et and extra and either not making
Speaker 1: things up. They have multiple sources. So I used to
Speaker 1: believe all this stuff. But now celebrities are in on it.
Speaker 1: They know how to work the system also in terms
Speaker 1: of fake relationships. So I did a little deep dive.
Speaker 1: Nick Lache went on one date with Kim Kardashian back
Speaker 1: in two thousand and six, and then later on he
Speaker 1: went on Watch What Happens Live and he said that
Speaker 1: he thinks now looking back, that she leveraged that whole
Speaker 1: thing publicity. Duh, She's masterful.
Speaker 3: Uh huh.
Speaker 2: And then also Rachel Bilson and that guy Nick Faiel
Speaker 2: from The Bachelor. Okay, so they apparently went on a
Speaker 2: date too, back in twenty nineteen, and then Rachel admitted
Speaker 2: on his podcast that they just did it for the
Speaker 2: internet for attention. She said, we were messing around, not
Speaker 2: with each other, but with the Internet. So this happens
Speaker 2: way more than we think.
Speaker 1: I think we forget it's the entertainment business. Yeah, that business, and.
Speaker 2: A lot of times both of these people are profiting
Speaker 2: off of the attention in some way. Yeah, Danielle, Any
Speaker 2: any gorp tastic plans for the weekend? What's the opposite
Speaker 2: of GORP? What happens if you stay in your apartment
Speaker 2: all wee get bed rot? No, I'm interviewing Chaz Ebert,
Speaker 2: who was Roger Ebert's wife, and I'm from Chicago, so
Speaker 2: I'm excited for that.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And I turned down a bachelorette party classic, so won't
Speaker 1: be going to that.
Speaker 3: Were they offended?
Speaker 1: I know they love me and I love them, and
Speaker 1: they know I'm just gonna take them to dinner instead.
Speaker 1: And I really need new workout clothes. I am committed
Speaker 1: on Sunday to trying to find some new workout clothes.
Speaker 1: I feel like all of mine are from twenty twenty
Speaker 1: one and it's just not looking good at the gym.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree, Oh mine are ratty af.
Speaker 1: What are you doing. Who cares about my pants, my expandex.
Speaker 2: This is a weekend where I think I have no plans,
Speaker 2: which is very exciting, But.
Speaker 1: I want to make a prediction. I think you're going
Speaker 1: to end up being really busy.
Speaker 2: I hope not. No, I don't have any plans. The
Speaker 2: books are clear for this weekend.
Speaker 1: Awesome, you're gonna jump in the pool?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Not cuddle with Michael? What you don't do that?
Speaker 2: I cuddle, but I I need to clear up some misinformation.
Speaker 2: I do cuddle, but I don't what you said something
Speaker 2: you were like, I want to like be next to
Speaker 2: you every moment of the day.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: My definition of love is like you don't want to
Speaker 1: go to the grocery store because you don't want to
Speaker 1: get up off the couch as you love that person
Speaker 1: so much. Simone's looking at me with terror in her eyes?
Speaker 1: Is that codependency?
Speaker 2: I think that sounds unhealthy to me. I'm not an expert,
Speaker 2: but you do you you know, if anyone out there
Speaker 2: agrees with.
Speaker 1: Me, let me know.
Speaker 2: After the break, we're bringing poetry off the shelf and
Speaker 2: into the wild with poet Laureate Ada Lemone. We'll be
Speaker 2: right back.
Speaker 3: And we're back.
Speaker 2: April is National Poetry Month, and our next guest has
Speaker 2: been lighting up the literary world with her poetry for
Speaker 2: nearly two decades.
Speaker 1: Ada Le Moon is the twenty fourth Poet Laureate of
Speaker 1: the United States, the recipient of a MacArthur Fellowship, and
Speaker 1: one of Time's twenty twenty four Women of the Year.
Speaker 1: If that's not cool enough, later this year, NASA is
Speaker 1: sending one of her poems all the way to Jupiter.
Speaker 2: Danielle, you know it's fitting because AIDA's poetry explores the
Speaker 2: awe inspiring beauty and power of nature and our complex
Speaker 2: relationship with it in today's world. We often talk about
Speaker 2: on this show how simply going outside, getting your photosynthesis on,
Speaker 2: and even touching grass just helps us find joy.
Speaker 1: Yep, And we asked Ada on the show to talk
Speaker 1: about finding meaning and purpose in the wilderness and about
Speaker 1: her signature project bringing poetry to national parks across the country. Ada,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us on the bright side.
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1: Ada, You have achieved the highest honors in your field.
Speaker 1: One of your poems is actually going to space.
Speaker 3: So cool.
Speaker 1: It's very cool. But also I don't think very many
Speaker 1: people grow up thinking, yeah, I'm going to be a
Speaker 1: poet and think that it's a viable career path. How
Speaker 1: did you get into this field?
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for that question.
Speaker 5: I will say that I knew I always wanted to
Speaker 5: be in a creative field.
Speaker 4: In some way.
Speaker 5: In fact, I think it was a joke in my
Speaker 5: family that Ada was going to be a dancing, singing.
Speaker 4: Doctor, lawyer, writer.
Speaker 5: It wasn't really until I was in high school that
Speaker 5: I discovered poetry in earnest and really fell in love
Speaker 5: with it. And then I had a moment when I
Speaker 5: was in undergraduate at the University of Washington and I
Speaker 5: thought I was going to be an actor. And I
Speaker 5: loved being on the stage. I loved the collaboration of
Speaker 5: the theater group, all of those things that you know
Speaker 5: made theater so beautiful. And in my junior year, I
Speaker 5: took a poetry class and I thought, oh no, I
Speaker 5: love this so much. And one of the things I
Speaker 5: loved about it as much as I love collaboration, is
Speaker 5: that you can do poetry whenever you want to do it.
Speaker 5: No one can say, oh, you know, you're not right
Speaker 5: for this, or you were you know, you get to
Speaker 5: do it whenever you want. And when I was writing,
Speaker 5: it felt like the truest form of creative freedom for me,
Speaker 5: and everything just clicked into place, and I thought, this
Speaker 5: is what I want to dedicate my life to.
Speaker 1: That's such an incredible feeling to lock in like that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you mentioned writing. I'm curious about who you read. Who
Speaker 1: were the poets that you grew up reading that made
Speaker 1: you want to become a poet.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I still remember where I was in I worked
Speaker 5: at the local bookstore, Readers Books and Sonoma, which is
Speaker 5: still there. It's an amazing independent bookstore. And at fifteen
Speaker 5: they opened and I was their first employee.
Speaker 4: And I still.
Speaker 5: Remember where I was when I was reading Lucill Clifton,
Speaker 5: Elizabeth Bishop. Those were two really you know, seminal poets
Speaker 5: for me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Ada, you live in Kentucky now, but before that,
Speaker 2: you spent twelve years working in magazines in New York City,
Speaker 2: And I lived in New York City for a while too,
Speaker 2: also working in media, and I can remember feeling so
Speaker 2: claustrophobic as a nature lover, just itching to get out
Speaker 2: into a wide open expanse. How did you find inspiration
Speaker 2: as a writer in New York City.
Speaker 5: Yeah. You know, it's funny because I am such a
Speaker 5: nature lover. I'm born and raised in California and a
Speaker 5: small town Sonoma and Glenellen and I really it was
Speaker 5: difficult for me at first to find a way to
Speaker 5: exist in the sheer buzz and chaos that is New
Speaker 5: York City. And I really would double down on naming
Speaker 5: and looking at trees and thinking, Okay, there are three
Speaker 5: trees on my block. This is what kind of trees
Speaker 5: they are, And I think they became so precious. And
Speaker 5: I still remember this moment when I was walking I
Speaker 5: was tempting for a magazine very early on, and there
Speaker 5: was all of these pots that were set out with
Speaker 5: greenery in them, and I remember looking at them grow
Speaker 5: and thinking, Okay.
Speaker 4: We got this.
Speaker 5: You know, you and me, You and me, plants, we
Speaker 5: got this. But I will say that when I moved
Speaker 5: out of New York City, I found myself feeling a
Speaker 5: little more grounded in terms of belonging to the natural world.
Speaker 5: And I felt like it was definitely a little bit
Speaker 5: more of a more fraught relationship when I was living
Speaker 5: in the city. Even though New York City is still
Speaker 5: my all time favorite city.
Speaker 1: I mean it's so literary, it is.
Speaker 5: And really growing up in that poetry scene in my
Speaker 5: twenties and just finding so many inspirational poets to go
Speaker 5: and listen to, and around every corner was someone talking
Speaker 5: about making art of some sort.
Speaker 2: Creative juices there are just infectious in New York City.
Speaker 2: But as we were talking about the trees I realize
Speaker 2: the way you feel about trees is the way I'm
Speaker 2: starting to feel about birds. You guys, I think I'm
Speaker 2: entering my bird watching era. Yes, I feel like it's
Speaker 2: part of just growing up. Eventually, bird watching just becomes
Speaker 2: something that you want to do.
Speaker 3: Ada is nodding.
Speaker 4: Listen. It sneaks up on you.
Speaker 3: It reallyaks up on you.
Speaker 5: I have a bird's nest right now being built on
Speaker 5: the back door in Kentucky here, and I don't want
Speaker 5: to disturb the mama, so I keep I put a
Speaker 5: big sign on the back porch that just says birds
Speaker 5: nest with an arrow, just for myself. So my husband
Speaker 5: and I said, we can remember not to open that
Speaker 5: back door so that she can have her peace. And
Speaker 5: that's what it turns into. At first, you get a feeder,
Speaker 5: then you get a VIP feeder, and then you get
Speaker 5: another feeder, and this is how it begins.
Speaker 4: So you know you're in for a beautiful ride. My friend,
Speaker 4: Thank you.
Speaker 2: I find myself wanting to learn more about you as
Speaker 2: a child. What are the core memories that come to
Speaker 2: mind in terms of how nature impacted you as a child.
Speaker 5: You know, I grew up in a rural space, and
Speaker 5: I feel like nature was all around us. All four
Speaker 5: of my parents, both my mom and my stepdad, and
Speaker 5: my father and my stepmother were all nature lovers. They
Speaker 5: were people that could look at a tree and name
Speaker 5: it and tell you a little bit about it. The
Speaker 5: same with plants and animals. So I remember my interest,
Speaker 5: even as a very young person, feeling not just the
Speaker 5: wonder of nature, but the way that it unfolds and
Speaker 5: the mystery deepens the more you know. It just sort
Speaker 5: of evolves into more and more questions about the natural world.
Speaker 5: And that was also where I felt like I belonged
Speaker 5: the most as a young person. I'm sure that you
Speaker 5: both know that there's oftentimes where you feel like, oh,
Speaker 5: humanity is not for me. And I remember there was
Speaker 5: a creek across the street from my house, and I
Speaker 5: would go to that creek and sit there in the
Speaker 5: shade and watch the very small world of that little
Speaker 5: creek and think, this is where I feel most at home.
Speaker 5: This is where I feel a sense of belonging.
Speaker 1: Has your writing always been focused on the natural world
Speaker 1: or did that happen over time?
Speaker 5: You know, it's funny because when I lived in New
Speaker 5: York City, of course, the relationship to nature was a
Speaker 5: little more bifurcated than it is now. And yet the
Speaker 5: East River is very prevalent in my early work.
Speaker 4: When I was writing in.
Speaker 5: New York City, the feral cats in Brooklyn were very prevalent.
Speaker 5: I think perhaps it's more evident now, But I do
Speaker 5: think it's always been part of my impulse to write,
Speaker 5: and it's always been part of my fascination and curiosity
Speaker 5: as a writer.
Speaker 1: Have you always found that poetry feels like the best
Speaker 1: way to capture that for you?
Speaker 2: Yes? And no.
Speaker 5: I think that poetry is my most natural language. You know,
Speaker 5: I think that's not for everyone. It's not everyone's, you know,
Speaker 5: preferred way of communicating. But for me, it leaves room
Speaker 5: for all of the different mysteries and wonders of nature,
Speaker 5: and in some ways it becomes more of a mirror,
Speaker 5: and there's no summing up. You know, in a poem
Speaker 5: there is a lot of looking and deep attention, and
Speaker 5: that attention is a way of loving. And so I
Speaker 5: think that for me makes the most sense with poetry
Speaker 5: as the preferred form.
Speaker 1: There is no summing up. I like that so much.
Speaker 1: We're always trying to sum.
Speaker 4: Up, Yeah, to our detriment.
Speaker 1: I think, has there ever been a natural phenomenon that
Speaker 1: you've tried to write about but haven't quite been able
Speaker 1: to capture in words?
Speaker 4: What a beautiful question.
Speaker 5: I've written about the wildfires in California, but I wrote
Speaker 5: about it from a distance because even though my family
Speaker 5: was all there, I was in Kentucky. If something is
Speaker 5: firsthand and it feels very intense, I have to get
Speaker 5: more distance from it. So the wildfires were one that
Speaker 5: I could write about, but only because of the distance.
Speaker 5: And I think that one of the things that I
Speaker 5: struggle with the most in terms of the natural world is,
Speaker 5: you know, the human impact. I write about it, but
Speaker 5: I struggle with it each time I do.
Speaker 2: I want to talk about AWE for a moment. It's
Speaker 2: been really cool to witness the scientific research on this
Speaker 2: topic and how it's helping us articulate the healing properties
Speaker 2: of awe in nature. What does awe mean to you?
Speaker 3: Ada?
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I love that question because I do
Speaker 5: feel like a lot of people will talk about hope
Speaker 5: or resilience. You know, we use the word resilience a lot.
Speaker 5: We have to be so resilient and courage and bravery
Speaker 5: and all those beautiful words. But when I can't feel
Speaker 5: any of those things, I can still feel all. It's
Speaker 5: still the thing that I can turn on in myself,
Speaker 5: and I can get there simply by walking into the backyard.
Speaker 5: It doesn't even have to be the you know, huge
Speaker 5: expanse of the intentional nature of national parks. You know,
Speaker 5: it can be just a tree and just the bird's
Speaker 5: nest that's being built right now on the gutters. You know,
Speaker 5: I don't know there's I can experience it very accidentally,
Speaker 5: and that feels really.
Speaker 4: Special to me.
Speaker 5: So it's one of my most favorite emotions because it
Speaker 5: gets me out of myself. It reminds me that to
Speaker 5: be in wonder is to be alive.
Speaker 2: Have you noticed whenever she opens her mouth a poem
Speaker 2: just falls out. It's crazy, It's crazy. That was so
Speaker 2: beautiful when was the last time that you experienced.
Speaker 5: Ah, It was just now. I went to take my
Speaker 5: dog out right before we all met for this interview,
Speaker 5: and as I was doing so, all of these new
Speaker 5: plants have been coming up. And I just planted them
Speaker 5: in November, so they were from bulbs, and I've never
Speaker 5: planted them before. And they are these beautiful, big purple onions,
Speaker 5: and I'm watching them grow and they're so wild and gorgeous,
Speaker 5: and I just, you know, was sitting there looking at them,
Speaker 5: and I felt this sense of like how the Earth
Speaker 5: makes something is incredible to me.
Speaker 1: And I think when I do an interview, I try
Speaker 1: to show up as present and real as possible. And
Speaker 1: when I'm going through hard things in my life, it's
Speaker 1: hard for me to show up at my job the
Speaker 1: way i'd like to. And when I heard you just
Speaker 1: talk about AH, I couldn't help but think what happens
Speaker 1: when you're numb? What happens when the words aren't flowing
Speaker 1: out of you. Have you gone through periods of your
Speaker 1: life like that?
Speaker 4: Yeah? And I think that.
Speaker 5: More dangerous for me than sadness or sorrow or anxiety
Speaker 5: or depression is the numbness, Because I can sustain it.
Speaker 5: I can sustain a numbness for much longer than I
Speaker 5: can any of those other hard things. And so what
Speaker 5: happens to me I start to notice that I haven't
Speaker 5: seen anything. I haven't witnessed anything. I don't know if
Speaker 5: you've ever had those moments when you're going through something
Speaker 5: very difficult, maybe grief rage, and you've gone through the
Speaker 5: whole day and you're like, wait, what happened today? I
Speaker 5: don't know if I could actually go through what happened.
Speaker 5: And so for me, the way that is back, the
Speaker 5: way that I guess call myself back to myself is
Speaker 5: to notice, is to pay attention, is to look outside
Speaker 5: of the brain, to look outside of the body. Even
Speaker 5: you know, meditations will often say, oh, return to the body,
Speaker 5: return to the breath.
Speaker 4: But when you're really numb, or when you're feeling rageful,
Speaker 4: or if you're feeling super sorrowful, or maybe your body
Speaker 4: is in pain, it's not the safest place to be.
Speaker 4: And so I have to find the meditations outside of
Speaker 4: the self. And those can just be looking at leaves,
Speaker 4: looking at trees, looking at the patterns that the leaves
Speaker 4: make on the ground, and then I can think Okay,
Speaker 4: I am a human animal and there are so many
Speaker 4: of us on this planet doing our thing, and I
Speaker 4: belong to something larger. And the thing I belong to
Speaker 4: is the earth. And for now that's enough, and let's
Speaker 4: not numb out to this beauty of being alive.
Speaker 1: That reminds me so much of what Cheryl Strade said
Speaker 1: in her book Wild that being in raw, untamed nature
Speaker 1: actually made her feel safer in the world. How does
Speaker 1: being alone in nature make you feel empowered?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: How do you bring the lion out or the lioness? Should?
Speaker 1: I say?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 5: I think the big part for me is that it
Speaker 5: makes me feel as if all of this has a purpose,
Speaker 5: that all of this is a way of moving forward.
Speaker 5: Right that you look and you find inspiration from what's
Speaker 5: around you. You think, oh, you know, that tree went
Speaker 5: through winter. It went through winter, it lost everything, it
Speaker 5: lost all of its leaves, it looked nearly dead, and
Speaker 5: now it's coming back again. And I think it's not
Speaker 5: just the metaphor of nature, but also the sense said, oh, right, this.
Speaker 4: Is me too.
Speaker 5: You know that I am I am nature and that
Speaker 5: as nature continues, I will also continue. And I think
Speaker 5: that's really important because I think it's very easy to
Speaker 5: think that we are only going through what we're going
Speaker 5: through and no one else has ever gone through it before.
Speaker 5: And I've been there, I've thought, oh, no one has
Speaker 5: had this kind of pain, or no one you know.
Speaker 1: Every time my heart's broken, I'm like, no one has
Speaker 1: ever felt this before.
Speaker 5: Nothing, nothing has, no one has experiences. And then of
Speaker 5: course you think, oh, wait, no everyone has. And there's
Speaker 5: power in that, even if you're not connected to others
Speaker 5: in that moment, just the recognition that others have gone
Speaker 5: through it.
Speaker 1: Talk to us about this National Parks project. It's called
Speaker 1: You Are Here. It sounds so exciting.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 5: I'm very excited about it. We're going to visit seven
Speaker 5: different National parks and we're putting in these beautiful poetic
Speaker 5: installations into these different parks, of really.
Speaker 4: Iconic, beautiful poems.
Speaker 5: And it's my way of hoping that visitors will come
Speaker 5: and look at these beautiful spaces and landscapes and then
Speaker 5: read the poem that has been paired with that place,
Speaker 5: and that that reading might deepen their experience to the
Speaker 5: natural world in that moment and might allow them to
Speaker 5: pay closer attention and be more present.
Speaker 2: Do you have a national park that has a special
Speaker 2: sweet spot in your heart.
Speaker 4: I'm really excited for all of them, but I'm definitely
Speaker 4: excited for Cape Cod. The National Seashore there has been
Speaker 4: really important to me. And then also, I mean the
Speaker 4: red Woods. I just you know, I can't wait. I
Speaker 4: cannot wait to see them again. And you know, the
Speaker 4: writer whose poem I chose to put in the red
Speaker 4: Woods is his name is Francisco X R. Lacon and
Speaker 4: he wrote in Spanish and in Nawa.
Speaker 5: And I remember not even knowing that there was a
Speaker 5: native language of Mexico, and now I know there's so
Speaker 5: many indigenous languages of Mexico, where my paternal grandfather's from.
Speaker 5: He's since passed away, Francisco X R. Lacon, but it's
Speaker 5: his poem that's going into the Redwoods, and it feels
Speaker 5: very it feels very moving to bring his words into
Speaker 5: one of the most sort of foundational natural spaces that
Speaker 5: I can think of.
Speaker 3: Redwoods are so majestic.
Speaker 2: I've spent a lot of time there camping out under
Speaker 2: the redwoods, and there's nothing quite like it. Just feeling small,
Speaker 2: I think that's part of awe too.
Speaker 5: I absolutely agree it's feeling like a part of something,
Speaker 5: but also feeling like, oh, I am nothing. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 5: And that seems like a strange thing to say, but
Speaker 5: we always center ourselves. Everything is all about us, even
Speaker 5: when we're being our most generous selves. And you get
Speaker 5: out into those redwoods or you see the ocean or
Speaker 5: whatever it is, and you think, oh, none of this
Speaker 5: is about me. I'm just a part of this. And
Speaker 5: there's peace in that, you know. I love being sort
Speaker 5: of swallowed whole by the natural world in some ways,
Speaker 5: and that idea of disappearing into the greatness of it all.
Speaker 2: As I've listened to you speak throughout this interview, I've
Speaker 2: been struck by your natural gift with language but also
Speaker 2: with performing. And I'm curious which came first. Was it
Speaker 2: your skill for poetry or performance.
Speaker 5: Ah, that's an interesting question. I think that I've always
Speaker 5: loved language first, because as much as I loved performing,
Speaker 5: when I was doing theater that was wonderful, it never
Speaker 5: felt fully like me. And so it wasn't until I
Speaker 5: found language that I could find, Oh, this is me.
Speaker 5: And I always think of it as the voice underneath
Speaker 5: the voice, right, And I always think my poetic self
Speaker 5: is the truest self, and so I think language first.
Speaker 2: What can we do to get in touch with our
Speaker 2: poetic selves? Can you leave us with a few practical
Speaker 2: tips for our bright sideties?
Speaker 3: That voice under the voice?
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I have a great prompt.
Speaker 3: If you want one, I would love it. Yeah.
Speaker 5: One of the things that I think about, especially if
Speaker 5: you are in tune to the natural world, is to
Speaker 5: think about something in nature that you've always been interested in,
Speaker 5: you know, just curious, like whether it's in an urban
Speaker 5: space and how maybe the ivy starts to corrode bricks,
Speaker 5: or the way the drainage ditch fills up really fast
Speaker 5: when it rains, or you know whatever. It is just
Speaker 5: something and it can be beautiful, it can be interesting,
Speaker 5: it can be harmful, but something that you've always been
Speaker 5: curious about. And then ask yourself why you curious? What
Speaker 5: does it remind you about in your own life moments
Speaker 5: that relate to that image that you have that Oh right,
Speaker 5: that is why I like a wildfire. Oh that is
Speaker 5: why I relate to the desert and it's great expanse,
Speaker 5: you know. That is why when the storm comes it
Speaker 5: feels like me. And if you can start to think
Speaker 5: of those connections. You can build a poem from that,
Speaker 5: right there.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 2: I love that we always end our show with thoughtful
Speaker 2: prompt So that's a beautiful one.
Speaker 4: Oh, I'm so glad good.
Speaker 1: I'm wondering if you can read us your poem how
Speaker 1: to Triumph Like a Girl. Yeah, of course i'd be
Speaker 1: happy to aida. We love that poem, how to Triumph
Speaker 1: Like a Girl. I like the Lady Horse's best. How
Speaker 1: they make it all look easy, like running forty miles
Speaker 1: per hour is as fun as taking a nap or grass.
Speaker 1: I like their lady horse swagger after winning. Ears up, girls,
Speaker 1: ears up. But mainly, let's be honest, I like that
Speaker 1: they're ladies, as if this big, dangerous animal is also
Speaker 1: a part of me, that's somewhere inside the delicate skin
Speaker 1: of my body. They're pumps, an eight pound female horseheart,
Speaker 1: giant with power.
Speaker 6: Heavy with blood. Don't you want to believe it? Don't
Speaker 6: you want to lift my shirt and see the huge,
Speaker 6: beating genius machine that thinks, no, it knows, it's going
Speaker 6: to come in first.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Ada, Ada, thank you, thank you you.
Speaker 1: I couldn't help it think that when you were talking
Speaker 1: about your paternal grandfather, the namely moan. You're wearing lemon.
Speaker 1: You're wearing yellow, which is our hellow sunshine color. So
Speaker 1: thank you for being so on brand.
Speaker 4: You know, I try.
Speaker 1: I try the important things.
Speaker 2: Wait, speaking of fashion, I know you're an outdoor early Ada.
Speaker 2: I have to ask you about something that we talked
Speaker 2: about earlier in the show today.
Speaker 3: Have you heard of the gorpe core fashion trend?
Speaker 5: You know, I just heard that phrase the other day,
Speaker 5: but I'm not sure if I know what it is.
Speaker 3: Well, and I just heard that.
Speaker 1: I don't get it either.
Speaker 2: Okay, it's a new silly title for basically just dressing
Speaker 2: in comfortable performance clothing like you know, north Face or Patagonia.
Speaker 2: It's like what we wear hiking or you know, whenever
Speaker 2: we're outside connecting in nature. I'm a big fan of it.
Speaker 2: I wear it all the time because I like that
Speaker 2: it primes me for adventure. You know, I'm always ready
Speaker 2: for it.
Speaker 4: I love that.
Speaker 5: I love always feeling like you can do something right.
Speaker 5: I feel like anytime, I mean, I have to wear heels,
Speaker 5: you know, I move in heels, and at the same time,
Speaker 5: I'm like, could I run on these right?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 5: Could I do this, and I'm most comfortable, I think
Speaker 5: when I'm in my in my hiking boots and really
Speaker 5: able to get around and move very freely.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Yes, it's freedom. It's liberation to wear that clothing.
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
Speaker 3: And gorp.
Speaker 2: I know that term is confusing a lot of people
Speaker 2: don't know what it means, but it stands for good
Speaker 2: old raisins and peanuts. It's just another way I'm saying
Speaker 2: trail mix. So she's a gorp girl.
Speaker 5: But I will say that my disdain for reasons is
Speaker 5: so wholly deep and in my bloodstream that even when
Speaker 5: you said it, I was like, oh.
Speaker 4: I hope they're not referring to gorb with the one with.
Speaker 3: The raiss ada.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for blessing us with your presence
Speaker 2: and your poetry today.
Speaker 4: Thank you, Thank you guys so much for having me.
Speaker 4: It was the real pleasure.
Speaker 1: It was so lovely to meet you. Same same aidaly
Speaker 1: mone Is the US poet laureate. You are here poetry
Speaker 1: in the natural World. The companion poetry anthology to her
Speaker 1: National Parks Project is available.
Speaker 2: Now. We have to take a quick break, but we'll
Speaker 2: be right back. Stay with us, Danielle. I feel like,
Speaker 2: my blood pressure is so much lower after having spoken
Speaker 2: with her, my nervous system is calm.
Speaker 3: That was just really good for my vagus nerve.
Speaker 1: She has a really calming voice and calming presence. I
Speaker 1: felt calm when she said that in poetry there's no
Speaker 1: summing up, and I am constantly trying to sum up everything,
Speaker 1: and it really reminded me that it's about the questions,
Speaker 1: not the answers all the time.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 2: Something that stuck with me is when she said that
Speaker 2: we are fixated on these characteristics like resilience, bravery, and courage,
Speaker 2: but she said when I can't feel any of those things,
Speaker 2: I know I can always still feel AWE. That was
Speaker 2: such a great reminder that whenever you're struggling with something
Speaker 2: and you feel like I need to be resilient in
Speaker 2: this moment, I need to be brave in this moment.
Speaker 2: Instead of searching for those emotions if they're not coming
Speaker 2: up naturally, maybe you just seem to take yourself out
Speaker 2: of that current situation and seek out AWE.
Speaker 3: Yeah that's a cure. Great.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I really like that. Go touch grass exactly. Go
Speaker 2: touch grass is always the answer.
Speaker 1: Well, we're gonna miss you, but we'll see you on Monday.
Speaker 1: On the bright Side, we're talking with the Reese's Book
Speaker 1: Club April pick Claire Lombardo. She's sharing her stories on
Speaker 1: drafting her debut novel, The Most Fun We Ever Had.
Speaker 1: The bright Side is a production of Hello Sunshine and
Speaker 1: iHeart Podcasts and is executive produced by Reese Witherspoon.
Speaker 2: Production by Arcana Audio. Courtney Gilbert is our associate producer.
Speaker 2: Our producers are Stephanie Brown and Jessica Wank. Our engineer
Speaker 2: is PJ. Shahamat, and our senior producer is Itzy Keinthania.
Speaker 1: Arcana's executive producers are Francis Harlowe and Abby Ruska. Arcana's
Speaker 1: head of production is Matt Schultz.
Speaker 2: Natalie Tulluck and Maureen Polo are the executive producers for
Speaker 2: Hello Sunshine.
Speaker 1: Julia Weaver is the supervising producer, and Ali Perry is
Speaker 1: the executive producer for iHeart Podcasts. This week's episodes were
Speaker 1: recorded by Graham Gibson.
Speaker 3: Our theme song is by Anna Stumpf and Hamilton lighthauser.
Speaker 1: Special thanks to Connell Byrne, Will Pearson and Garrett Lang.
Speaker 2: I'm Simone Boyce. You can find me at Simone Boyce
Speaker 2: on Instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 1: And I'm Danielle Robe on Instagram and TikTok. That's r
Speaker 1: O b A.
Speaker 3: Y see you, Monday fan
Speaker 2: Mhm