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Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's Josh and for this week's s Y

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Speaker 1: s K Selects episode, I picked How Magic Mushrooms Work,

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Speaker 1: which came out in two thousand and twelve. I think

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Speaker 1: we're just kind of starting to dip our toe into

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Speaker 1: um controversial topics maybe who knows. And I think I

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Speaker 1: remember us being worried we were going to get in

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Speaker 1: trouble for it. Well we didn't. So here it is again,

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Speaker 1: enjoy Welcome to Stuff you should Know from house Stuff

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Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast on

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Speaker 1: Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant with me. Uh

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Speaker 1: and this is the far out podcast Stuff you should know.

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Speaker 1: That's right. We were kicking off. This is our first

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Speaker 1: show we're recording in and uh, Josh thought let's kick

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Speaker 1: it off with the Little Almond Brothers and get psychedelic exactly.

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Speaker 1: That's how you think of when you think psychedelia. Well,

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Speaker 1: they were known for having mushrooms on their album covers

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Speaker 1: and t shirts and it was a very common thing.

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Speaker 1: Those are peaches, dead mushrooms all over the place. Okay, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but generally now, of course, you think of like, you know,

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Speaker 1: the grateful Dead. Jefferson airplane, Yeah, the floor elevators, Yeah, Quicksilver,

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Speaker 1: messenger service, Moby Grape strawberry, alarm clock, chocolate watchman, Jimi

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Speaker 1: Hendricks of course. Who yeah, so Chuck Uh, you're familiar

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Speaker 1: with psychedelia rock and roll? Of course? Are you familiar

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Speaker 1: with psychedelia as far as psychedelics are concerned. I know

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Speaker 1: you are, and you want to know how I know

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Speaker 1: you are because we podcasted on it. That's exactly right,

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Speaker 1: LSD and Cia. What else? It seems like we've been

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Speaker 1: psychedelics treatmental illness, that's right. That was a big one

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Speaker 1: that kind of overlaps with some of this. Um. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna lay a lot of the blame of all the

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Speaker 1: lost research, decades of it at the feet of Timothy Leary,

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Speaker 1: the man who ruined everything, um and what we're talking about.

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Speaker 1: Pardon my sniffles. By the way, I'm not sick mentally.

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Speaker 1: I'm not allowing myself to think of me as sick.

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Speaker 1: I have sniffles. That's that's what I did. I was like, now,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sick. I'm just not gonna let it happen.

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Speaker 1: And you look at you. You look fantastic. It was

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Speaker 1: just a few days I think if I would have

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Speaker 1: wallowed in it, it would have been more than a week.

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Speaker 1: I'm not yeah, I'm not letting myself. I hit it hard, man,

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Speaker 1: like tons of fluids and emergency and airborne and fruits,

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Speaker 1: and that was fine. Okay, you'll be great airborne. You know.

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Speaker 1: That's like Holly discredited. It's the same thing as an

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Speaker 1: emergency pretty much. It's just like vitamins and stuff. Okay,

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Speaker 1: all right, but it doesn't keep you from getting sick.

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Speaker 1: I think that's how it's discredited. But it'll it'll help

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Speaker 1: you out, like in a vitamin any way. Right, alright,

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Speaker 1: some college, because there's like get to the most room exactly.

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Speaker 1: So let's get to the mushroom. Chuck, Um, chuck. I've

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Speaker 1: got no real intro other than I think we should

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Speaker 1: talk about the history of mushrooms first. What do you think?

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Speaker 1: I think it sounds great. Um. Apparently there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of um debate over how long people have been using

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Speaker 1: magic mushrooms. UM. As far as religious rituals recreationally, who knows,

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Speaker 1: but the supposition is that it goes back thousands and

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Speaker 1: thousands of years. For example, there's a cave painting in

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Speaker 1: Um Algeria that it's nine thousand years old. Um, that

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Speaker 1: supposedly depicts mushrooms. There's another one in Spain that's six

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Speaker 1: thousand years old that depicts mushrooms. Um. And I mean

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Speaker 1: it makes a lot of sense that when you think

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Speaker 1: of Native American tribes, Amerindian tribes, Mesoamerican tribes. Um, these

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Speaker 1: people have customarily eaten magic mushrooms all this time. Right. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's what one camp says is, hey, they've been used

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Speaker 1: in religious rites for thousands of years and Central American

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Speaker 1: Northern Africa, Like you said, so, uh, what's the rub?

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Speaker 1: But then there's another camp that says, hey, you can't

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Speaker 1: prove that you're just seeing what you want to see

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Speaker 1: when you look at that ca painting or that Allmond

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Speaker 1: Brothers cover and uh, just because there's a mushroom on

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Speaker 1: the wall doesn't mean that they ate magic mushrooms. What

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Speaker 1: did the Aztecs have? How do you pronounce that? I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I've never been good at pronouncing Aztec, but

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Speaker 1: I can take a stab at it if you'd like

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Speaker 1: me to. Tan un knocked tal right. They called it

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Speaker 1: the flesh of the gods, and they use the substance

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Speaker 1: we know that we just don't know what it was,

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Speaker 1: but a lot of people think that it might have

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Speaker 1: been quote unquote magic mushrooms. Right. They also made statues

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Speaker 1: of it, that kind of thing, um, And you generally

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Speaker 1: only do that back in the day, if you if

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Speaker 1: it's a very revered sub instance, they're gonna make a

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Speaker 1: statue of just like whatever. If we can speak in likelihoods,

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Speaker 1: there were we know there were mushrooms where we assume

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Speaker 1: that there were these mushrooms growing wild like they are

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Speaker 1: today in these areas that these people were hunters and

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Speaker 1: gatherers and foragers so likely tried these mushrooms. If they

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Speaker 1: did try these mushrooms, they probably wigged out, right, isn't

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Speaker 1: that the clinical term? I think they call it a trip?

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Speaker 1: Okay man, Uh, they tripped and um probably started incorporating

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Speaker 1: it into their cave art you know teas today and

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Speaker 1: there on their book cover from their notebooks. Uh. It

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Speaker 1: has been confirmed in contemporary tribes in Central America, including

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Speaker 1: the mass at Tech, the Mixed Tech, the Nagua, and

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Speaker 1: the Zappa Tech. So all the texts are way into

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Speaker 1: it at least these days. Right, So if they eat

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Speaker 1: it these days, I would say, chances are they probably

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Speaker 1: ate it back in the day as well. Okay, so um,

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Speaker 1: as far as the West is concerned. Um, well, I'm

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Speaker 1: sorry it wasn't. Also, it's not just Middle America, Mesoamerica,

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Speaker 1: Northern African Spain, you mean like a Middle America like

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Speaker 1: Ohio and America. It's not just Kansas that's on mushrooms. Um,

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Speaker 1: the Sammi. Have you heard of the Sami people? So

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Speaker 1: they're finished. They're like indigenous Finish tribes like be York

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Speaker 1: clearly has Sami in her. Like her look, it's very Sami. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well you'd like the Sammies. Cool looking. Um. They love

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Speaker 1: mushrooms so much that they are known to drink the

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Speaker 1: urine of reindeer that have just recently ingested mushrooms. And

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Speaker 1: there's yeah, there's an art installation and I think Berlin

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Speaker 1: recently of this guy who had a bunch of magic

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Speaker 1: mushrooms in this pin, a bunch of reindeer in them,

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Speaker 1: and he was having the reindeer eat the mushrooms and

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Speaker 1: then collect him their urine and storing it. Well, my

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Speaker 1: question to him is why would he go about it

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Speaker 1: that way? If he has some magic mushrooms. Did it

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Speaker 1: like increase the potency or something like that. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: You'd probably be better off asking a sami person than him. Sure,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. If like, um, it's like that coffee

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Speaker 1: we failed to mention that's like ferrets and they poop

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Speaker 1: it out the coffee being and then they roast that

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Speaker 1: into coffee. Exact it's status. Um. So anyway, people have

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Speaker 1: probably been eating magic mushrooms for a long time, but

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Speaker 1: among Westerners it was totally unthought of, unheard of, unknown

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Speaker 1: until the fifties. Right, yeah. Uh. In nineteen five, a

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Speaker 1: writer while he's a mycologist who studies mushrooms. His name

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Speaker 1: was our Gordon Wesson, and he traveled to Mexico a

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Speaker 1: lot back in the fifties searching out mushrooms. Not for

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Speaker 1: magic mushroom purposes, but he was just into mushrooms and

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Speaker 1: he participated in a ritual he and his wife did together, well,

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Speaker 1: not not at first. Actually, did you read the article? No, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's really good. You should read it sometime. He he

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Speaker 1: took a colleague down there first. Later on he took

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Speaker 1: his wife and daughter and she was like eighteen, so

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Speaker 1: he was like, sure, she's old enough, and they all

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Speaker 1: tripped on these mushrooms. But I'd like to read a

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Speaker 1: selection if I may Alan as his friend. By the way,

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Speaker 1: is that allen him? Um? Yeah, I think so. Um.

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Speaker 1: Alan and I were determined to resist any effects that

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Speaker 1: they might have to observe better the events of the night,

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Speaker 1: But her resolve soon melted before the onslaught of the mushrooms.

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Speaker 1: Alan felt cold and wrapped himself in a blanket. A

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Speaker 1: few minutes later, he leaned over and whispered, Gordon, I'm

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Speaker 1: seeing things. I told him not to worry. I was too.

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Speaker 1: We were never more wide awake, and the visions came,

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Speaker 1: whether our eyes were open or closed. They emerged from

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Speaker 1: the center of our field of vision, opening up as

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Speaker 1: they came, now rushing, now slowly, at the pace that

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Speaker 1: our will chose. They began with art motifs. Motifs fractals

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Speaker 1: is another word angling, such as might decorate carpets or

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Speaker 1: textiles or wallpaper, or the drawing board of an architect.

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Speaker 1: Then I saw a mythological beast drawing a regal chariot.

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Speaker 1: And then he goes on to describe all sorts of things,

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Speaker 1: including seeing not an imperfect view of ordinary life, but

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Speaker 1: the archetypes, the platonic ideas that underlie the imperfect images

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Speaker 1: of everyday life. So he was tripping hard. It sounds

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Speaker 1: like a yeah, And that's unusual that he says that

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Speaker 1: he saw something in a chariot, because mushrooms and lst

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Speaker 1: are Although they're hallucinogens, they don't cause actual hallucinations. They

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Speaker 1: tend to just mess with, distort things that are already there. Exactly.

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Speaker 1: I have an answer for that because I thought the

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Speaker 1: same thing. He did it in darkness, So I mean,

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Speaker 1: on drugs or not. If you go and sit in

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Speaker 1: a dark room long enough, you're gonna start seeing things

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Speaker 1: in your mind's eye. And I think that's what's going on.

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Speaker 1: You're just imagining. It's such an our. Gordon Wasson, apologist, Chuck.

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Speaker 1: He was pretty moved though, and he wrote this article

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Speaker 1: in Life, and uh, the editor picked out the title

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Speaker 1: Seeking the Magic Mushroom. Yeah, that's where the name came from.

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Speaker 1: A Life magazine editor in nineteen fifty seven coined the

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Speaker 1: term magic mushroom. Um. After that little trip um, Wasson

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Speaker 1: and Heim recruited Albert Hoffman, who was the chemist who

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Speaker 1: created LSD isolated LSD and said, hey, man, we know

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Speaker 1: it's you're into. Take these mushrooms and figure out what's

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Speaker 1: going on with them. And he did, and he isolated

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Speaker 1: the active ingredient. A um, what is it a trip

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Speaker 1: to It's a trip to mine, which is an alkaloid.

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Speaker 1: Thank you. That's actually related trip to fan. Okay, the

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Speaker 1: Turkey stuff. Yeah, well you know it happens to in Turkey.

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Speaker 1: But the trip of mine is the two are psilocybin

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Speaker 1: and silison. So siloson is uh, that's the metabolite of psilocybin.

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Speaker 1: Psilocybin is the active ingredient the trip to mind found

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Speaker 1: in mushrooms. And then when you're when you ingested, your

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Speaker 1: body breaks down the psilocybin into psilocine. And they're starting

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Speaker 1: to come to realize that psilocine is probably the culprit

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Speaker 1: behind everything. Yeah. Um, before we move on, I want

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Speaker 1: to point out in the article he uh, he did

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Speaker 1: it quite a few times in Mexico, and then he

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Speaker 1: said later on, just to test to see if it

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Speaker 1: was part of just the communal experience of being there,

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Speaker 1: he went back to New York City and uh and

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Speaker 1: took some and he said it was even better in

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Speaker 1: New York City. Also, he disproved that he's like I

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Speaker 1: love New York UM, so okay. Albert Hoffman isolates psilocybin

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Speaker 1: UH and Sandoz who he worked for, who also started

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Speaker 1: mass producing LSD, started mass producing psilocybin as well, and

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Speaker 1: UM the psychological psychiatry community got his hands on it

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Speaker 1: and started studying it. We'll talk about some of the

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Speaker 1: studies later, but as early as the sixth ease they

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Speaker 1: realized that UM obsessive disorders UM could be treated with

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Speaker 1: psilocybin until they shut it down. They totally shut it down.

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Speaker 1: Psilocybin magic mushrooms UM. Any of the silocide mushrooms are

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Speaker 1: a Schedule one drug, which is kind of unusual because UM,

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Speaker 1: study after study has shown that mushrooms aren't habit forming

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Speaker 1: or addictive and that, you know, they kind of do

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Speaker 1: have a lot of medical uses, which again we'll talk

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Speaker 1: about in a little bit. But let's talk about the

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Speaker 1: mushrooms and cells. Chuck. They are a plant, a mineral, fungus,

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Speaker 1: or an animal. They're an animal. Uh, there are a

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Speaker 1: fungus and it means it grows from a score and UH,

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Speaker 1: each little mushroom in the case of psilocybin mushrooms has

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Speaker 1: anywhere from point two to point four percent psilocybins a

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Speaker 1: very small amount. Yeah, it sounds like it. And uh,

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Speaker 1: the National Survey on Drug Use and Health in two

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Speaker 1: thousand three did a survey and they found that about

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Speaker 1: eight percent of adults over twenty six, which to me

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Speaker 1: makes us an invalid study already if they didn't include, um,

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Speaker 1: eight percent have have tried it at some point. I

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Speaker 1: saw like teenagers, UM, something like around eight percent, but

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Speaker 1: it was hallucinogens um other than LSD, which includes like

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Speaker 1: PCP and stuff like that. Really, it seems kind of

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Speaker 1: weird to lump those together. Um. But in Europe the

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Speaker 1: prevalence is probably higher, um between point three percent in

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Speaker 1: fourteen point one percent of use at least once in

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Speaker 1: the person's lifetime between point three and fourteen. Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: pretty pretty wild. And let's just call it fourteen, okay,

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Speaker 1: you know. And then for some reason, um, the Czech

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Speaker 1: Republic in Slovakia report the highest use among teenagers of

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Speaker 1: magic mushrooms. Not sure why. Interesting, Yeah, it's a nice

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Speaker 1: place to be. It was about to bag on it

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Speaker 1: and say you'd do it too, but it's lovely. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: or maybe that's why they're doing it because it is lovely,

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Speaker 1: because New York City it's the best. Uh So Timothy Leary,

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Speaker 1: we failed to mention. But of course obviously he sunk

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Speaker 1: his teeth into it literally, and like you said earlier,

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Speaker 1: like all things, he kind of killed the psychedelic movement

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Speaker 1: in a way as he was actually creating it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: by making it, you know, a hippie burnout thing. Well,

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Speaker 1: he definitely delegitimized it. I mean, there are a lot

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Speaker 1: of people who were studying um LSD and psilocybin and

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Speaker 1: um I would gain all those to see how they

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Speaker 1: can help people with mental illness. And Leary was like, no, man,

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Speaker 1: let's just completely screw the establishment with this stuff. Well,

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Speaker 1: and he's the one who established the whole set and

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Speaker 1: setting thing right which is still in use today, including

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Speaker 1: in this article from how Stuff Works dot com. Set

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Speaker 1: and setting are defined in here. Um, do you want

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Speaker 1: to talk about it, Well, this is the trip as

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Speaker 1: they call it, The mushroom trip is very dependent on

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Speaker 1: set and setting, the frame of mind that you have

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Speaker 1: going into it. Where you are the setting obviously, if

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Speaker 1: it's you know, some kind of stressful, highly organized thing.

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Speaker 1: Like if you're in school or you're like in a

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Speaker 1: train station and somebody's like, you're gonna miss your train.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna miss your train is probably not a good idea.

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Speaker 1: Um Or if you're hanging out with friends and you're

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Speaker 1: camping or you're doing something there where you have no

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Speaker 1: stress involved and you have the right outlook going in,

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Speaker 1: Timothy Leary says, that's what you want as far as

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Speaker 1: going into this whole thing. Right set is mindset and

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Speaker 1: setting is your environment. Um Also, studies have found that

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Speaker 1: even um what are called drug naive people can have

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Speaker 1: a positive experience on psilocybin mushrooms if there is if

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Speaker 1: what's about to happen to them is explained to them

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Speaker 1: ahead of time. That that's a big part of it too,

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Speaker 1: is knowing what you're getting into going into it well.

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Speaker 1: And that's a big part of these studies we're going

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Speaker 1: to talk about later on was these people are all

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Speaker 1: coached ahead of time by people you know, they call

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Speaker 1: them their guides is what they are now. They're reach

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Speaker 1: research assistants who have had previous experience with psychotropics, but

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Speaker 1: they would explain to them what they're about to get

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Speaker 1: into and that would obviously help them along as they're

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Speaker 1: going in. But they do mention the guide thing in

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Speaker 1: here in this article. Uh, they say that a lot

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Speaker 1: of people, um, because you know, you can have a

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Speaker 1: bad trip, which the only thing you can do there

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Speaker 1: is to write it out. Obviously you can't turn off

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Speaker 1: the effects, which is a very important thing to note.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't go away, No, it doesn't. Although supposedly, um,

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Speaker 1: in the emergency room they usually prescribed sedatives and suppose

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Speaker 1: really helps a bad trip. Yeah, I'm sure it does, um,

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Speaker 1: But they say in the article here, new users are

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Speaker 1: often advised to have an experienced friend h guide them

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Speaker 1: through the experience, Like did you see Flirting with Disaster? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Lily Tomlin, Well yeah, they accidentally dosed the cop and

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Speaker 1: she was like Alan and it's like she's a great guy,

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Speaker 1: He'll be fine, and that she just kind of coaches

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Speaker 1: him through the thing. I was looking up movies, um

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Speaker 1: that have mushrooms in him, and I was having a

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Speaker 1: lot of job. I found like Altered States. Well this

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Speaker 1: was LSD, but oh yeah, okay, but I guess that's

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Speaker 1: a good time to mention that LSD and psilocybin. Mushrooms

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Speaker 1: are very similar in the effect. Although they say that

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Speaker 1: mushrooms are generally milder and don't last as long, their

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Speaker 1: chemical composition is very very similar. Do you know how similar?

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Speaker 1: I think there's like one um hydroxy really that's different,

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Speaker 1: but they're pretty close, very close. Would when they made

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Speaker 1: LSD did they try to synthesize psilocybin? Was that the

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Speaker 1: way they were after? No, because they didn't know that

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Speaker 1: psilocybin existed until after LST had been synicide. Interesting because

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Speaker 1: you know he did LST in and do psilocybin until

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Speaker 1: like quite a coincidence, isn't it? Yeah? Um, so do

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Speaker 1: you know what's going on in the brain? Do you

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Speaker 1: know what the whole secret is behind magic mushrooms? Uh?

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Speaker 1: Central nervous system. There's some kind of inhibits and inhibits

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Speaker 1: something right. Uh. No, it does the opposite. It's an agonist,

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Speaker 1: which I came to realize that agony means that you

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Speaker 1: feel everything. I'm in. Agony means you're feeling everything. And

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Speaker 1: agonists UM binds to a receptor like in your brain

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Speaker 1: that releases a neurotransmitter, and in this case, UM psilocybin

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Speaker 1: or psil Lowson binds to serotonin receptors. It says, relieve

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Speaker 1: the serotonin, right, and your synapses are flooded with serotonin

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Speaker 1: and that's what gives what clinical researchers basically call the

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Speaker 1: sensation of just being overwhelmed by sensation. Interesting. Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: all serotonin, man, although there is evidence that it affects

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Speaker 1: your dopamine receptors, but not directly, like indirectly, which would

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Speaker 1: kind of give you a sense of view for you right,

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Speaker 1: uh so, josh. Some of the side effects when someone

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Speaker 1: is taking mushrooms include dizziness and nausea UM, muscle weakness,

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Speaker 1: loss of appetite, and numbness um. Sometimes uh, there could

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Speaker 1: be vomiting sometimes anecdotally. Experts have said that inducing vomiting

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Speaker 1: is a way to cease the nausea when you're experiencing

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Speaker 1: nausea in a mushroom trip, and said they're not considered

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Speaker 1: to be addictive and you can build up a toleran

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Speaker 1: it's really quick. Yeah. Um. It says here in the

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Speaker 1: article that like, for exam ample, taking mushrooms two days

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Speaker 1: in a row um is going to make the effects

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Speaker 1: of them on the second day far less pronounced I guess.

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Speaker 1: And one of the guys in these studies to um,

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Speaker 1: I believe, takes them for cluster headaches, and he's taken

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Speaker 1: them so much that they don't have psycho hallucinogenic properties anymore.

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Speaker 1: It's just like medicine for him, really gross fungal medicine. No,

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Speaker 1: I think you might take a pill. Okay, I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure though. UM all the tolerance also, UM, you can

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Speaker 1: build up across tolerance. So like if you took a

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Speaker 1: bunch of mushrooms one day and then the next day

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Speaker 1: took mescalin or LSD, those effects would be dampened as well.

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Speaker 1: And I think it has to do with the fact

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Speaker 1: that it's all it's your serotonin. But if you do that,

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Speaker 1: that means a lot of other things as well about you.

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Speaker 1: It does you know, yes, I don't know what, but

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Speaker 1: oh you know what, you have a T shirt that

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Speaker 1: has an Almond Brothers album cover, it means you're hippie,

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Speaker 1: a dirty, dirty, melly hippie. So um chuck. Some of

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Speaker 1: the other effects of tripping on shrooms is um euphoria

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Speaker 1: or dysphoria, and also sometimes a very rapid shift between

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Speaker 1: the two. UM basically being really happy and then being

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Speaker 1: terrified UM and then deep personalization, which is a sense

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Speaker 1: that you are not yourself, or you belong to somebody

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Speaker 1: else or there's you, you lose your sense of self,

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Speaker 1: and then de realization, which is the sense that you

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Speaker 1: are in a dream or that man, this isn't real,

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Speaker 1: nothing is real, that kind of thing. The passage of

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Speaker 1: time is often distorted, whether it's like have we been

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Speaker 1: talking about this for five hours or five minutes or

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Speaker 1: the other way around. I think it can go either way.

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Speaker 1: I found a study that UM showed it basically tested

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Speaker 1: that it gave people psilocybin and then did like time

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Speaker 1: interval tests and found two to three seconds is about

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Speaker 1: the most that a person can it's successfully achieve as

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Speaker 1: these tests, like beyond three seconds they start to get

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Speaker 1: really bad at it. And they also found the person's

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Speaker 1: tapping preference, which I guess is like if you're just

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Speaker 1: sitting there tapping, you know your fingers, what your preferences,

364
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:23,959
Speaker 1: and it's slower when you're on mushroom really so uh

365
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Speaker 1: and like you said that, you don't actually hallucinate, like

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Speaker 1: you're not going to be sitting there and see pink

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Speaker 1: elephants dancing across the room. But if there's a painting

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Speaker 1: of a pink elephant, uh, it might appear as if

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Speaker 1: the elephant were breathing or moving or shifting. Or if

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Speaker 1: you hear something like a song or running water or

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Speaker 1: you know, a creek or something like that, you might

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Speaker 1: hear other things within that sound, but not completely imagine them. Right. So,

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Speaker 1: one of the things we were talking about was that, sure,

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Speaker 1: mushrooms have been around for thousands of years, growing wild

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Speaker 1: like they do today, and um, that's where a lot

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Speaker 1: of people get their mushrooms. Apparently is just foraging it

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Speaker 1: for him. One of the big problems is that, Um,

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Speaker 1: while there are a lot of mushrooms in the genus Silocybe,

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Speaker 1: which we probably should have mentioned earlier, that's there's the

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Speaker 1: big spoiler. All the mushrooms are in the same genus. Um,

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00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:26,399
Speaker 1: there's a lot that look like them two and that

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Speaker 1: might grow in similar places that will shut down your kidneys. Yeah,

383
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Speaker 1: so you have to be very careful when you're foraging

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Speaker 1: for fresh wild mushrooms if you're into that kind of thing,

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00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:42,040
Speaker 1: which neither Chuck nor i Um suggests should be done. Yeah,

386
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Speaker 1: we're not endorsing this, No, I'm just saying like this

387
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Speaker 1: is in the article. Yeah, I thought that was implicit,

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00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,360
Speaker 1: but it's probably a good time to c o a yeah. Um.

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Speaker 1: In the article, they also point out that even experienced

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Speaker 1: mushroom hunters have made mistakes out there in the dark

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Speaker 1: in the field among the cows. So yeah, it can

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Speaker 1: be toxic. It's not a good idea to just go

393
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Speaker 1: picking mushrooms growing in it pie. And that holds true

394
00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:14,000
Speaker 1: for if you're looking for truffles or you know edible mushrooms. Um. Yeah,

395
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:15,840
Speaker 1: you want to kind of know what you're doing. Um.

396
00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,280
Speaker 1: One way to tell what kind of mushroom you're looking

397
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: at is to create a spore print, which apparently you

398
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,200
Speaker 1: take a piece of paper and you take the cap

399
00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,960
Speaker 1: of the mushroom. There's a stem in a cap um

400
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,960
Speaker 1: and in the genocilicide. Most of them are fairly small,

401
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,479
Speaker 1: so the cap is about one inch tall, the stems

402
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 1: about three inches tall. Um. But you take the cap

403
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:39,880
Speaker 1: and you place a gill side down. If you've ever

404
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,800
Speaker 1: looked at the underside of a mushroom, there's the gills.

405
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 1: They're just so weird looking, little powdery, powdery gills. Powder

406
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: is the spores you press the gills down on the

407
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 1: paper and it should leave an imprint of the spores.

408
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,200
Speaker 1: And if you know what you're doing, you can identify

409
00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 1: more easily or more um closely. They kind of mush him.

410
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: You're dealing with um. So we said that there's like

411
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,920
Speaker 1: dozens of species I think of Psilocybe mushrooms. Yeah, there's

412
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,200
Speaker 1: tons of them. A couple of really popular ones though

413
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Speaker 1: as far as ingestion goes, are the Psilocybe cubensis. It's

414
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: one of the most common ones. It's a little larger

415
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,160
Speaker 1: as far as magic mushrooms go. It's got a golden cap.

416
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, it's called the Golden cap or Mexican mushroom,

417
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,120
Speaker 1: the street name that that's the one that um our

418
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 1: Gordon Wasser probably was probably in Mexico um And it's

419
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,720
Speaker 1: got usually a reddish brown cap, white or yellowish stem.

420
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: And here's an important thing. When it's bruised or crushed

421
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,000
Speaker 1: um it can turn blue. And a lot of people

422
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 1: will say, hey, that's how you know it's a magic

423
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,639
Speaker 1: mushrooms if it turns blue when you crush it. And

424
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 1: that's not true because there are toxic varieties that do

425
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:56,040
Speaker 1: the same thing. So that's a good way to get

426
00:25:56,040 --> 00:26:00,640
Speaker 1: yourself in trouble. Um. It's also copera philic, which means

427
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: that it grows in poop yeah, um, moist environments, very

428
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:09,120
Speaker 1: human environments, and hot yeah, like h South Georgia, let's say,

429
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 1: or Florida. Yeah, which apparently I didn't look to see.

430
00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 1: But as of February two thousand nine, at least, um

431
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 1: is the only state in the Union that where it

432
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:24,440
Speaker 1: isn't illegal to I guess pick or possess fresh pilocybe

433
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:28,120
Speaker 1: mushrooms fresh as a non dried out right. Yeah, that's true,

434
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:30,680
Speaker 1: or it was two years ago. I was gonna say,

435
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 1: is it's still you know? I don't know. And when

436
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,440
Speaker 1: they say the reasoning is that, hey, it grows in

437
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,440
Speaker 1: the wild. People pick mushrooms and might pick them by accident,

438
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,240
Speaker 1: so we don't want senior prison if something's an accident.

439
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:44,480
Speaker 1: Plus the rainbow families in Ocala, and we can't we

440
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 1: don't want to screw up their jam. One of the

441
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 1: one of the other more popular ones is the Psilocybe

442
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:57,680
Speaker 1: semi lanciata chuck or the liberty cap and um. It's

443
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 1: also is found in damp grassy fields populated by cattle,

444
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,199
Speaker 1: but it doesn't grow directly on the dung. And it's

445
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: a little pointy cap, light yellow and brown, and it's

446
00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 1: smaller than the golden cap Mexican. Right. And then I

447
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 1: guess one or the other of the big three is

448
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 1: p Bayo sistus or the bluebell or bottle cap? So chuck.

449
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:26,040
Speaker 1: If when we're disposed to, um, take mushrooms, what, according

450
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:31,959
Speaker 1: to the article, would the person do? Well? I mean,

451
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 1: what are what are the people who are taking mushrooms

452
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:37,359
Speaker 1: doing with them? We we talked about foraging. That's one

453
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 1: one way you can buy them, which is illegal and

454
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 1: we don't recommend it obviously. Um. It's illegal even to

455
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:48,680
Speaker 1: have spores, which is surprising because sports don't actually contain psilocybin,

456
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 1: which is what's outlawed. It's a weird loophole, but it's

457
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,480
Speaker 1: not a loophole. It's the what's the opposite of loophole

458
00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 1: the donut the doughnut part. Okay, that's what the donut

459
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: hole is. The munch. I know, I'm familiar with munch,

460
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:07,360
Speaker 1: can't believe me, okay, Um, And then you can grow

461
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: your own, obviously, but if you're looking to buy this

462
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,119
Speaker 1: kind of thing in the United States. You know, they

463
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,960
Speaker 1: sell it much like marijuana, and uh ounces and quarter

464
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 1: ounces and eight ounces and uh, I know the an

465
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,639
Speaker 1: eight is defined in this three point five grams in

466
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,640
Speaker 1: this article. This is the craziest article on the site,

467
00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 1: has to be. Yeah, it's pretty crazy. Uh yeah, because

468
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: at one point she talks about who wrote this, Shana Freeman.

469
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 1: Shana talks about the ones on the Gulf Coast give

470
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 1: you a mellower high, but the tie mushrooms give you

471
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,719
Speaker 1: a much more intense high. Right, it's crazy. It is. Um.

472
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 1: And when they dry out, which is when most people

473
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 1: uh have them, they're dried out, they will lose some

474
00:28:55,040 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: of their psychotropic properties in the drying process, but they

475
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: retain these properties. I don't know about them definitely but

476
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 1: for years. Yeah. Well, because you're you're not just drying.

477
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:09,600
Speaker 1: I think you have to freeze dry them or you

478
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: have to dry them. There's like a certain way to

479
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: dry them. I think that kind of locks in everything favor,

480
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: which apparently is very unfortunate. Um. Some mushrooms have a

481
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 1: reported flowery taste that sounds awful, um, sour or bitter,

482
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 1: so it's not very fun, which means that a lot

483
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 1: of people UM do crazy stuff with their mushrooms to

484
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,959
Speaker 1: make them more palatable chocolates, mushroom chocolates is one. UM

485
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 1: soaking liquor, soaking their mushrooms in liquor like tequiler rum um,

486
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 1: just basically grinding them up and putting them into capsules

487
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:51,720
Speaker 1: so like you don't taste anything at all, like a

488
00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 1: mushroom pill um. Or making mushroom tea, which supposedly if

489
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 1: you cook or um brew mushrooms, it's it's it's supposedly

490
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: doesn't have an effect on um the potency, Yeah, the

491
00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 1: experience the user has and it reportedly uh comes on

492
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 1: quicker as well. And anecdotally people have even been known

493
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: to eat the slimy remains of the tea. Gross. That's

494
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: what I think. I mean, everything about mushrooms are gross,

495
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 1: but slimy. I don't like regular mushrooms like it's. I know,

496
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 1: they supposedly don't have much of a taste and they're

497
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 1: put in foods for texture, but I don't like the texture. Yeah,

498
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: it's just the whole thing grosses me outright. So um,

499
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: about one gram of dry mushrooms is apparently a very

500
00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: small dose four grams UM is a medium dose for

501
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 1: an adult. I read um medium too large? Yeah, so, uh,

502
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: and I guess one P. Cubensis, the Mexican mushroom dried

503
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: is about a gram, a decent sized one. And when

504
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: the when the one gram or four grams or whatever

505
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 1: the dose is just taken, UM is ingested. Uh. You

506
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 1: apparently within twenty minutes if you take it orally twenty

507
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:16,400
Speaker 1: to thirty minutes, you start to experience symptoms and they

508
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: last for something like six hours, depending on like the potency.

509
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: I guess, well, yeah, that's what That's what SHANEA. Freeman

510
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:28,280
Speaker 1: says in this article is that, like the there's differences

511
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: between from mushroom to mushroom, from person to person. Um. Yeah, that.

512
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: I mean, it's not like Sandoz is making this stuff anymore. So.

513
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 1: We mentioned foraging, right, we mentioned uh, buying off the street,

514
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:43,959
Speaker 1: neither of which we recommend. No, again, this is all

515
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: highly illegal. I mean, a schedule one drug will get

516
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 1: you a severe prison sense. You might as well be

517
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:57,760
Speaker 1: caught with heroin or um cocaine or PCP like this

518
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,480
Speaker 1: is it. This isn't as bad as it's not, just

519
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: because you can go out in the cowfield and find

520
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 1: some doesn't mean you should take it lightly. You're right, No,

521
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 1: this is huge, man, that's a huge, huge prison sentence.

522
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 1: Very good. It's like a life ruining prison sentence. It

523
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: is very although I guess probably just about any prison

524
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 1: sentences fairly life ruining. But this is like double life ruining.

525
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: That's huge. Uh mycology. You can actually grow these things,

526
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 1: and that's what some people do, some cultivators do. This

527
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 1: is also extremely illegal, very much illegal. Uh used to

528
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 1: and even so we're going to tell you how to

529
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: do it because this is stuff you should know, okay, okay, uh, yes,

530
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 1: well it's stuff that some people should know. Well, I

531
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 1: guess at the very least, it's part of explaining everything.

532
00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:50,959
Speaker 1: It's on our website. Yeah, Jerry's just in there, crack um.

533
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 1: You have to have a spore because that's the first

534
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:56,840
Speaker 1: thing you need for the mushroom to grow. Uh. Spore

535
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,840
Speaker 1: grows onto one mushroom, but a mushroom can have that

536
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 1: thousands and thousands of spores on the underside the little

537
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: pottery stuff that we're talking about. And remember we talked

538
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:09,719
Speaker 1: about taking spot prints for identification. The same sport prints

539
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 1: are often what you get in the mail when you

540
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:17,600
Speaker 1: mail order UM mushroom kits. Right, you can't just throw

541
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: these spores in the ground. They have to be hydrated

542
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 1: with clean water, meaning distilled water. And you can even

543
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 1: buy syringes that are filled pre filled with spores and

544
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: sterile water from suppliers if you don't want to make

545
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 1: your own. Right. So you remember in the um Earthworm

546
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 1: episode we talked about duff that that organic, light, spongy

547
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: organic material. You have to make your own version of

548
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 1: duff um using brown flower vermiculite, which is the little

549
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 1: white pebbly stuff in like potting soil, um and water.

550
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:54,719
Speaker 1: You just kind of mix it together and it creates

551
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:57,720
Speaker 1: duff a fluffy, kind of spongy layer. And I think

552
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 1: rice flower too, because I think wheat flour might uh,

553
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 1: I think it might mold easier or something. Okay, I

554
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 1: might be wrong. Um. And you create what's called the

555
00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 1: substrate cake, which is great. It's a great growing medium

556
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 1: for um mushrooms. It's like your soil, right pretty much. UM.

557
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,320
Speaker 1: And you create you put this little substrate cake in

558
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: a can like a jar, right, yeah, canning jar, and

559
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 1: then you put it You put the canning jar in

560
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 1: the canning bath or pressure cooker which sterilizes the insides.

561
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: That's right. And then I guess you inject the spores.

562
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 1: If you have like a syringe with the spores in it,

563
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,439
Speaker 1: you injected into the jar. Yeah, put poke some holes

564
00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 1: in the lid, and then that eventually will grow kind

565
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,200
Speaker 1: of a white ropey growth called um my celium. Yeah,

566
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 1: it's got to be at a very steady humid environments

567
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:57,320
Speaker 1: about seventy five degrees fahrenheit twenty three celsius. And within

568
00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: about a week, like you said, you get the mycelium.

569
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 1: And then, uh, if you get mold and stuff like that,

570
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 1: that means you know, it wasn't a good environment. But eventually,

571
00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 1: once it's covered my cilium, you're gonna put that into

572
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 1: a plastic container for fruiting. Uh, and under the right humid,

573
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:18,239
Speaker 1: warm conditions and grow mushrooms. And each little cake can

574
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 1: grow a lot of mushrooms, like a thousand or a hundred. Yeah,

575
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 1: not at once, obviously, No, they grow and waves supposedly,

576
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,720
Speaker 1: and you harvest, and then more come, and the harvest

577
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 1: and more come, and over the course of a month.

578
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:34,800
Speaker 1: Is where you get your mushrooms from the cake. Again,

579
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,680
Speaker 1: very illegal to buy any of this stuff or to

580
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 1: engage in growing any of the stuff. Um. And let's

581
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 1: talk about that, Chuck. I think it's high time we

582
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 1: got to the law part of it. Um. Like we said, mushrooms,

583
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 1: since I think are U a Schedule one drug? Um

584
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:55,799
Speaker 1: And like we said, Schedule one drugs are defined as

585
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,839
Speaker 1: drugs that are highly addictive and have no medical use um.

586
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 1: Which is kind of weird to put mushrooms in there,

587
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 1: but they are in there. I don't think you can

588
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 1: argue that with the d A that comes and bust

589
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 1: down your door to break up your mushroom growing operation

590
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,319
Speaker 1: that hey man, these things are not addictive and there's

591
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:16,880
Speaker 1: all sorts of medical uses for him. Although it probably

592
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 1: won't be the d n A with mushrooms, is d

593
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 1: A probably gonna be what I say, d n A

594
00:36:23,200 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: did I really, it's not gonna be the d e

595
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,280
Speaker 1: A either. You're freaking out. I know it is likely

596
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 1: not going to be the d e A either, because

597
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: it's probably gonna be a state Although is there state

598
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:40,439
Speaker 1: d A or there's something like that on the state level? Yeah, Yeah,

599
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 1: I think there's a. Yeah, there's Each state has a

600
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: Bureau of investigation that I think kind of acts like

601
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 1: the state d e A. But unless you have like

602
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 1: some big, large operation going on, it's probably not going

603
00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 1: to be a federal crime. It's probably gonna be a

604
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 1: state crime, right UM. And time was you could order

605
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 1: kits like the ones we describe UM on the internet

606
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,960
Speaker 1: over through the mail. If you do that, now you

607
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:07,840
Speaker 1: are going to get in a lot of trouble. The

608
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 1: d e A probably will come to your house or

609
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:14,640
Speaker 1: intercepted or both. UM. And that was. That's been the

610
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 1: case since two thousand three. For the States, it's been illegal,

611
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: but apparently they started cracking down on kits in two

612
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 1: thousand three. UM. In Great Britain UH, in two thousand

613
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:29,360
Speaker 1: and five, it was still legal to have um mushrooms

614
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 1: fresh mushrooms, but that's not the case any longer. UM.

615
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 1: And then in Amsterdam, even Amsterdam I was surprised to

616
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: learn of this. UH in two thousand one they outlawed

617
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 1: UM dried mushrooms, and then in two thousand and eight

618
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 1: they outlawed fresh mushrooms. So you can't have any mushrooms

619
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: in the Netherlands. But in Mexico they do have exceptions

620
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:57,160
Speaker 1: for indigenous people's and being used in ceremonies and such.

621
00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:59,360
Speaker 1: We do in the United States as well, um, but

622
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:05,960
Speaker 1: not necessarily for pilocide mushrooms. Um more. For I think

623
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 1: payote is the one that's got the big exception. Yeah,

624
00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:15,240
Speaker 1: the Native American Church is allowed to use payote, so, Josh,

625
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:20,959
Speaker 1: we said that for many years, about thirty five years

626
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 1: or so, it was shut down as far as research

627
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 1: goes as you know, potential medical benefits. Uh. Since I

628
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 1: don't know when they said you can again, but I

629
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 1: know in two thousand six Johns Hopkins started a long

630
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: term research study along with some other places, but Johns

631
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 1: Hopkins really has headed this up, and they found a

632
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,080
Speaker 1: lot of really interesting things like you said, O C

633
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:50,840
Speaker 1: D uh, and some eating disorders, some compulsive eating disorders,

634
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,600
Speaker 1: so basically any compulsion. Yeah, they found that. Uh. In

635
00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: the in the Journal of Clinical Psychiatry, it was written

636
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 1: that uh study proved well, not proved, indicated that for

637
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 1: a period of about four to twenty four hours they

638
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 1: remained symptom free for that period and sometimes it was

639
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:12,840
Speaker 1: even for days, and that they said that there was

640
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 1: no treatment that eases the symptoms as fast because it's

641
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:20,040
Speaker 1: pretty much immediate of the compulsive disorders. Yeah, I would

642
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:23,680
Speaker 1: imagine it's your you have a compulsion, or your compulsion

643
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: is exacerbated by a lack of serotonin. You take mushrooms

644
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:30,920
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden your brain is flooded with

645
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,320
Speaker 1: silicide or serotonin. Cluster headaches, Yeah, this one was interesting.

646
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:38,720
Speaker 1: I read about this as well. Cluster headaches are pretty

647
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:40,879
Speaker 1: much the worst pain you can have in your head.

648
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:46,360
Speaker 1: They liken it to childbirth without anesthesia and um in England.

649
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 1: This was in The Guardian that I read this. They're

650
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:53,200
Speaker 1: about six thousand people in England that suffer these attacks um,

651
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:56,920
Speaker 1: sometimes daily with no more than a couple of weeks remission.

652
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:01,279
Speaker 1: And it's called the cluster period with the remission or

653
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:06,280
Speaker 1: like these these periods where you have them, yeah, r period.

654
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 1: Apparently psilocybin helps us out a lot. And this one guy,

655
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: Richard alf says that he's tried conventional treatments in everything

656
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:16,319
Speaker 1: his whole life and the only thing that brought him

657
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: relief was the magic mushrooms and even by some longer

658
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:25,000
Speaker 1: periods of remission between attacks. So there's another treatment. Um.

659
00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:31,239
Speaker 1: There's also you know, whenever you hear of um H,

660
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 1: mushrooms or psychedelics or hallucinogens in general, like the whole

661
00:40:35,120 --> 00:40:38,839
Speaker 1: idea of religious epiphany or feeling like you're a one

662
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 1: with a universe or something a mystical experience. Right early

663
00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:47,640
Speaker 1: on in the West, the West study of um mushrooms this,

664
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,080
Speaker 1: this was kind of noted. And there is this famous

665
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:55,239
Speaker 1: study in nineteen sixty three where they gave psilocybin to

666
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:59,879
Speaker 1: a group of Divinity students and send them to church.

667
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,920
Speaker 1: Really yeah, and um, they of course reported like all

668
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 1: sorts of wonderful mystical feelings and connections with God and

669
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 1: religion and um, just every enlightenment basically is what they reported. Um,

670
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,359
Speaker 1: which is not that surprising because you know, I think

671
00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:21,440
Speaker 1: you could have called that one right. But what's very

672
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: surprising is that twenty five years later they've they've surveyed

673
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 1: the participants again, um, and the people who had received

674
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:34,600
Speaker 1: psilocybin UM reported a great greater number of positive life

675
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:38,520
Speaker 1: changes than people who hadn't been given psilocybin, like the

676
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 1: controls who've gotten placebo instead. Well that's what JOHNS. Hopkins

677
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 1: has found so far too. They did, uh a study

678
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,360
Speaker 1: on eighteen adults is just one of them, and ninety

679
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:51,439
Speaker 1: four percent said that it was one of the top

680
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,920
Speaker 1: five most meaningful experiences in their lives, said it was

681
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:59,279
Speaker 1: a single most meaningful experience. And then they interviewed them

682
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:03,720
Speaker 1: again a year later and found that they still felt

683
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 1: that way and had these changes in UH empathy, greater

684
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:12,440
Speaker 1: understanding of people, less judgment, and their family members even

685
00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 1: noticed that they were calmer, happier, and kinder. Because Griffith's

686
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:19,560
Speaker 1: Dr Griffiths is the guy leading this. He thinks that

687
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:23,759
Speaker 1: they found the sweet spot, which is just enough to

688
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:25,920
Speaker 1: get you to that place, but not so much that

689
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: it could have an adverse effect. I got one more too,

690
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:32,360
Speaker 1: if you're up for it. A web MD. This is

691
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,719
Speaker 1: just a couple of months ago we conducting philocybin stuff. No,

692
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:39,600
Speaker 1: they were just reporting on Johns Hopkins again, which is

693
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: party central. I guess um personality and humans is generally

694
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 1: pretty fixed after the age of thirty, they say, And

695
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 1: it takes something like a a job change or a

696
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 1: big move, or a death in the family or a divorce,

697
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 1: like something really big to affect your personality in any

698
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 1: meaningful way generally, unless you take mushrooms once. Really is

699
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 1: what they found. UH openness decreases across decades very slightly,

700
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:13,160
Speaker 1: and people generally become rigid and less creative. But the

701
00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: fifty two adults that volunteered to eat psilocybin um from

702
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:23,080
Speaker 1: the ages of sixty four had transcendent mystical experiences while

703
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:27,759
Speaker 1: taking the drug, and they said measurable increases in openness,

704
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,320
Speaker 1: which is one of five key parts of your personality,

705
00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 1: and it did not affect the other four parts, which

706
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:40,800
Speaker 1: is interesting, which is neuroticism, extroversion, agreeableness, and conscientiousness. But

707
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,720
Speaker 1: apparently it makes people more open and creative. What's crazy

708
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:47,520
Speaker 1: to me is looking at like the studies and what

709
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 1: they're doing in the studies like UM, they found that uh,

710
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:56,160
Speaker 1: I think, like UM, two milligrams or five milligrams, some

711
00:43:56,360 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 1: ridiculously large amount of psilocybin injected intravenously through an ivy

712
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 1: drip was UM like too much? Patients started um started

713
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:10,920
Speaker 1: reporting that the experiences were a little overwhelming and terrifying.

714
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:13,840
Speaker 1: Can't you imagine some poor sap in like a hospital

715
00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: room getting like three milligrams of psilocybin delivered intravenously UM.

716
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:22,279
Speaker 1: And then there's also, uh, there's been a lot of

717
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:30,719
Speaker 1: cats dogs, rabbits, um, monkeys, cats, I think I said rats, mice, cats, um,

718
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:34,839
Speaker 1: that have been given psilocybin over the course of time. Uh,

719
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 1: in the name of research or eating in the wild. Imagine, well,

720
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,120
Speaker 1: have you ever seen The Bear, the documentary that follows

721
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:46,520
Speaker 1: the Two Bears. The bear eats mushrooms and they have

722
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:49,840
Speaker 1: this big like scene where it's like just tripping and

723
00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:52,880
Speaker 1: flowers are blooming and the skies just moving with the

724
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 1: stars and everything. And we were looking closely, you mean,

725
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 1: I were checking it out last night, UM that it's

726
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:02,920
Speaker 1: clearly person dressed as a bear tripping. So we went

727
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 1: and did a little researcher, like this is a documentary, right,

728
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 1: And yeah, they had somebody dress up as a bear

729
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:13,440
Speaker 1: for that part, but the actual bear did actually eat mushrooms.

730
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:16,439
Speaker 1: They just the director was taking a lot of artistic life.

731
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: But you and it's you have to imagine, like what's

732
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:23,279
Speaker 1: it like for an animal? Like how can we even tell?

733
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:28,360
Speaker 1: Apparently mice mice show that they're hallucinating through head twitches.

734
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:32,600
Speaker 1: And then monkeys who um have been taught to self

735
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 1: inject psilocybin um tend to zone out. Fixed staring is

736
00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:43,800
Speaker 1: what that's called or they'll grasp at unseen objects. You

737
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 1: imagine some poor monkey doing that. I can uh, oh,

738
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,879
Speaker 1: it would be fair to that. The UM web md

739
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:57,920
Speaker 1: report you know six said they had these transcendent mystical experiences,

740
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 1: but a lot of people also had bad trips at

741
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:05,319
Speaker 1: hiring abouts of fear and anxiety. So you know, we're

742
00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 1: not saying that it's like, take mushrooms and everything's great

743
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:10,880
Speaker 1: for your life. They found that it can go one

744
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 1: of two ways, good or bad. Yeah. I guess there's

745
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:19,320
Speaker 1: probably no such thing as a neutral mushroom experience. I

746
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: don't think so. I think it's gonna affect you profoundly

747
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:24,560
Speaker 1: in one way or the other. Um, if you want

748
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:26,879
Speaker 1: to know, you've got anything else, I got nothing else, sir.

749
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: If you want to know more about mushrooms, you can

750
00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:33,040
Speaker 1: read this article on the site this crazy article on

751
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: the site UM how magic mushrooms work. By typing that

752
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:39,480
Speaker 1: into the search bar at how stuff works dot com.

753
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: And that means that it is time for listener mail.

754
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:48,239
Speaker 1: And I think I think we proved that we can

755
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:51,759
Speaker 1: cover other stuff like this. We will find out if

756
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:53,359
Speaker 1: we get in a lot of trouble for this one,

757
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 1: whether we could cover stuff like this one, and it's

758
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 1: a big part of the world, and we're out to

759
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:03,440
Speaker 1: explain everything exactly, not just flowers and blue birds. We

760
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:06,880
Speaker 1: have to cover the dark underbelly as well. Jack all right,

761
00:47:06,880 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this um uh from Max. Okay, longtime listener,

762
00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:16,480
Speaker 1: first time emailer. I've sent email lots of times, but

763
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 1: just not to you, guys. Max is a funny guy.

764
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,239
Speaker 1: I've listened to the show religiously at work, but since

765
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:24,240
Speaker 1: I was laid off in May, I'd fallen far behind

766
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: hustling to get that dollar, left little time for length

767
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 1: lengthy dissections on cheesemaking arts or why we get zits.

768
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: I posted the details of my sad, unemployed s y

769
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 1: s k less experience on Twitter, and you, guys retweeted

770
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:44,439
Speaker 1: it to your adoring throngs. You did that. Yeah, it's nice.

771
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 1: I got many well wishers, a couple of people who

772
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:51,239
Speaker 1: asked for my CV. What does that stand for? Curriculum vite.

773
00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 1: I've never heard that. I mean, I've seen it, but yeah,

774
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 1: but I just never knew exactly what it stood for.

775
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 1: It's like the debbie you see when you walk in there,

776
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:03,880
Speaker 1: the water closet. You're gonna find a toilet because it's

777
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 1: a water close. But they even called the toilet the

778
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:08,000
Speaker 1: water closet. It's not even just the room. It refers

779
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:10,279
Speaker 1: also to the toilet for some reason, which makes no

780
00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:16,040
Speaker 1: sense to me. It's a closet, there's water. Uh where

781
00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:18,239
Speaker 1: was I? I got many well wishes, a couple asked

782
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 1: for my CV, and several new followers. H I got

783
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,560
Speaker 1: out of this retweet people actually following this back busy.

784
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,000
Speaker 1: Not much came of that alone, but it was awesome

785
00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 1: that you guys did that for me. Really cheered me

786
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:31,759
Speaker 1: up when that job search had been in vain for

787
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:34,279
Speaker 1: such a long while. So I wanted to send you

788
00:48:34,360 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 1: dudes a heads up that after four lengthy interviews with

789
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: the same company, I've been hired. I was vetted more

790
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:43,000
Speaker 1: thoroughly than Sarah Palin. It's an office gig and a

791
00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 1: nice neighborhood about ten minutes from my home, which is

792
00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 1: a real perk that's hard to come by here in

793
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:50,919
Speaker 1: the San Francisco Bay Area. I'll be making more money

794
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,880
Speaker 1: than ever before working with a friend of mine, and

795
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: and now I had plenty of time to catch up

796
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:59,800
Speaker 1: on your fine program. So huzzah to that. That is awesome.

797
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:02,480
Speaker 1: Thanks for your help, dudes. If I ever find myself

798
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:05,040
Speaker 1: in Atlanta where you find yourself by the Bay, I

799
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 1: owe you many beers. And that is Max in Martinez, California,

800
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 1: who you can follow at Wicked Machine if you're so interested.

801
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 1: That's awesome, and I guess he'll be tweeting about his

802
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:20,319
Speaker 1: great new job working with his buddy, sleeping late, making

803
00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:24,399
Speaker 1: more most of rolling. Indough, that's nice. Good for Max, Um,

804
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:27,320
Speaker 1: thanks a lot, Max for writing in. Yeah, I was

805
00:49:27,400 --> 00:49:30,320
Speaker 1: wondering actually like a week or so ago, how he

806
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 1: was doing. But yeah, like right away somebody was like, hey,

807
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 1: sa me or cbe. It's your curriculum vitae. People are

808
00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 1: gonna be every unemployeed person on the planet. Now, it's

809
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:42,360
Speaker 1: gonna see Josh help. We'll retweet them. Apparently it doesn't

810
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 1: do a whole lot, but we'll we'll give it a shot. Um,

811
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:48,960
Speaker 1: if you want to, I guess let us know that

812
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:51,239
Speaker 1: your own employee on Twitter, you can tweet to us

813
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,879
Speaker 1: at s y s K podcast. You can go hang

814
00:49:54,920 --> 00:49:58,759
Speaker 1: out with us on Facebook, uh facebook dot com, slash

815
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:01,440
Speaker 1: stuff you should Know, or you can send us a

816
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:05,880
Speaker 1: good old fashioned email at Stuff Podcast. At how stuff

817
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:13,920
Speaker 1: works dot com For more on this and thousands of

818
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 1: other topics. Is it how stuff works dot com, m