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Speaker 1: You and Me Both is a production of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: I'm Hillary Clinton and this is You and Me Both.

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Speaker 1: You know, we've heard from a lot of amazing people

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Speaker 1: on this podcast, like Pamala Harris and Demanda Gorman and

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Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi and Stacy Abrahams and Maria Ressa, Tan France,

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Speaker 1: Jose Andreas, and that's just to name a few. But

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Speaker 1: I know all of these people would be quick to

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Speaker 1: tell you that no one does great things alone. We

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Speaker 1: need friends, spouses, partners, siblings, colleagues, and others we can

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Speaker 1: turn to for support who will keep us motivated and

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Speaker 1: hold us accountable. So on today's episode, we're celebrating partnerships.

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Speaker 1: I'll be talking to Lieutenant Governor and Second Lady of

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Speaker 1: Pennsylvania John and Giselle Fetterman about their shared commitment to

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Speaker 1: public service. And I'll be talking to Jorge and Ilana Valdez,

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Speaker 1: a brother sister team who found a creative new way

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Speaker 1: to help thousands of college students find friendships and more

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Speaker 1: while campuses are shut down. But first I'm talking to

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Speaker 1: Amy not Too So and and Friedman, hosts of the

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Speaker 1: beloved podcast Call Your Girlfriend, and now best selling authors

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Speaker 1: about friendship Amy Not Too So, and and Friedman are

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Speaker 1: each extraordinary women in their own right. Last July, they

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Speaker 1: released their book Big Friendship, How We Keep each Other Close,

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Speaker 1: which is really a love letter to friendship and a

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Speaker 1: guide for people who want to be better friends in

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Speaker 1: a time when we've been isolated from our friends. This

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Speaker 1: book sure resonated with me, and I was delighted to

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Speaker 1: welcome them to the podcast. I'm just so excited to

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Speaker 1: talk to both of you. And it's particularly poignant to

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Speaker 1: me because in the last year I've lost two really,

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Speaker 1: really good friends, and I missed them all the time.

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Speaker 1: I mean every day I want to talk to one

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Speaker 1: or the other about what's going on or you know,

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Speaker 1: what they're thinking or how they're managing. And I almost

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Speaker 1: have to catch myself because you know, I can't talk

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Speaker 1: to them. But when you think about friendship, and the

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Speaker 1: two of you just really have delved into it. What

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Speaker 1: are some of your favorite examples of friendship and popular culture? First,

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Speaker 1: I just want to say I'm so sorry for your loss,

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Speaker 1: Like hearing that is, it's so big and it's so profound,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think the reason and and I are

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Speaker 1: so invested in our friendship and in friendship in general.

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Speaker 1: I think it is because culturally, we haven't made space

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Speaker 1: to to tell people that, you know, when your friend,

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Speaker 1: I said, is a significant loss in your life, and

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Speaker 1: that we should treat it that way, you know, and

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Speaker 1: you should have time for bereavement, and you should have

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Speaker 1: people check in on you. So that is you know,

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Speaker 1: that's a lot to hear. And I'm so sorry you're

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Speaker 1: dealing with that. To your question about friendship and popular culture,

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Speaker 1: I think that pop culture for me has always been

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Speaker 1: where the idealized version of friendship was. I was an

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Speaker 1: obsessive Mary Tyler Moore show watcher as a kid, and

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Speaker 1: when and when I was learning English, it was a

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Speaker 1: show that meant so much to me, and so like that,

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Speaker 1: friendship is iconic to me. I think, Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: in the book, we write a lot about Oprah and Gail,

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Speaker 1: and while that is not a fictional account of friendship,

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Speaker 1: I think that too very real women sharing how invested

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Speaker 1: they are in each other. That is something that had

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Speaker 1: it has left a lasting impression on my life. How

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Speaker 1: about you, an well, and when we talk about complex

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Speaker 1: portrayals of friendship that you know, don't just show the

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Speaker 1: idealized good stuff, but show everything that it can mean

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Speaker 1: to be in someone's life this way. I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of those examples come from fiction. We both love

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Speaker 1: Tony Morrison Sula and speaking of a lifelong, powerful, profound entanglement,

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Speaker 1: so to speak. That book really gets at some of

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Speaker 1: the things I think we were hoping to write about,

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Speaker 1: in the sense that a friendship can be lots of things,

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Speaker 1: not just always affirming and joyful, but complex and difficult.

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Speaker 1: You know, when you make friends as an adult, that's

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Speaker 1: a different kind of entry into friendship. I think about

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Speaker 1: how YouTube met watching what the premiere of Gossip Girl,

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Speaker 1: right the prom episode. Let me tell you it was

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Speaker 1: riveting stuff. I just I love the the image of it.

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Speaker 1: But you became friends as adults, and I think that's

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Speaker 1: a really significant event because for so many people, you know,

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Speaker 1: that's hard for them, you know. I think that and

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Speaker 1: and I were both people that we were so aware

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Speaker 1: that so much of our social life when we were

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Speaker 1: young was really organized around our parents. That is just

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Speaker 1: the truth of any young person. You meet people because

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Speaker 1: you're in the same boat as them, and to some

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Speaker 1: extent that is also true in college. And I think

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Speaker 1: that you know once you step out into the real world.

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Speaker 1: You have this opportunity to just be yourself and tell

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Speaker 1: your story to people who you know don't have like

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Speaker 1: a preconceived notion of who you are, and you get

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Speaker 1: to try out almost like a new identity. We're like,

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Speaker 1: this is who I am when the world is not

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Speaker 1: negotiating me through my mom and dad or my academic

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Speaker 1: achievements or whatever. And so I think that, like when

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Speaker 1: we met, it was very much a phase of life

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Speaker 1: where you know, we lived in d C, such a

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Speaker 1: transient kind of city, but we had a lot of

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Speaker 1: room in our life to make a new friend because

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Speaker 1: we were trying to figure out who am I going

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Speaker 1: to be in the world, Like who do I want

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Speaker 1: to be when I like an older, more established person.

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Speaker 1: And so when I think about people who don't want to,

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Speaker 1: you know, they think that they don't have the capacity

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Speaker 1: to make friends as adults, it makes me really sad

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Speaker 1: because I think that the opportunity you have every time

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Speaker 1: you make a friend as an adult, particularly like every

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Speaker 1: decade of adulthood, is that you get to be a

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Speaker 1: new person in someone's life, and you get to learn

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Speaker 1: about yourself in a new context. And so I just

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Speaker 1: really hope that we are people who are open to

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Speaker 1: that in every season of life. It's so true that

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Speaker 1: part of our story is about meeting at this point

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Speaker 1: where we were trying to figure out what the next

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Speaker 1: phase looked like for both of us individually. And when

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Speaker 1: we look back on our admittedly kind of limited experience

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Speaker 1: in adulthood making friends, like hopefully we're both around a

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Speaker 1: long time to make a lot more, we really see

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Speaker 1: that we both have made friends and periods of transition

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Speaker 1: and periods where something is shifting in our lives and

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Speaker 1: we maybe require are a new kind of relationship or

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Speaker 1: support to see us into the next phase. And you know,

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Speaker 1: we're all always changing, and I think friends are a

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Speaker 1: great reminder of that and a great inspiration to change more.

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Speaker 1: You know, when you think about the friends from different

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Speaker 1: phases of your life, it does reflect who you are,

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Speaker 1: but it also, as you both said, reflect who you

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Speaker 1: want to become. Because there is a way in which

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Speaker 1: your friendship, especially a close friendship, can be such a

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Speaker 1: stimulant for you having to take steps it might be

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Speaker 1: a little scary or break off a different relationship because

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Speaker 1: you've got the support of a friend when you should

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Speaker 1: have done it even before. So there's just a lot

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Speaker 1: of learning that goes on through friendship. And you know,

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Speaker 1: when you talk about friendship, you know, you came up

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Speaker 1: with a couple of terms that really resonated with me.

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Speaker 1: One is big friendship. What sets big friendship apart? Is

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Speaker 1: there such a thing as a little friendship? I love

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Speaker 1: the idea of a little friendship. You're like a little

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Speaker 1: friendship as a treat for you. Little friendships everywhere our

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Speaker 1: next book, right exactly, that's right. You know, I think

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Speaker 1: that what we were really trying to get at is

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Speaker 1: that the word friend is so nebulous. Friend is anyone

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Speaker 1: from that person that you met one time who did

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Speaker 1: that really nice thing for you, to someone that's you know,

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Speaker 1: they're just in your Facebook feed and you don't remember

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Speaker 1: when you met them. And then you know, there's the

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Speaker 1: friend like Anne is my friend, someone who I want

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Speaker 1: her to be there on my last day in the world.

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Speaker 1: I want to know that I have a strong, solid

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Speaker 1: relationship with her. And in the Golden Girls version of this,

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Speaker 1: you know she's there at the nursing home with me.

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Speaker 1: That's the that's the fantasy. Please, you mean, on our

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Speaker 1: Hawaiian compound, we are not in the nursing home. But

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Speaker 1: let's let's construct a better fantasy for this. Okay, thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you, thank you. But you know, I think that

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Speaker 1: they're so much of the unexpressed feelings a friendship or

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Speaker 1: that is that we don't we're not even precise about

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Speaker 1: what we're talking about here, and so in um, you know,

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Speaker 1: coining Big Friendship and talking about it, we are so

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Speaker 1: laser focused on the kind of friendship that you want

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Speaker 1: to be so deeply rooted in that this person is

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Speaker 1: a huge part of your life. You want the worlds

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Speaker 1: to know and to recognize that they're a big part

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Speaker 1: of your life. It is a relationship that is mature,

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Speaker 1: It's a relationship that is rooted in the future, and

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Speaker 1: that is um you know, I think really upends the

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Speaker 1: social scripts for um, the role that your friends are

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Speaker 1: supposed to have in your life. Like we are, we

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Speaker 1: are so deeply invested, you know, in creating a world

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Speaker 1: where romantic love or you know, like parents and children

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Speaker 1: bonds are not the only ones that people think make

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Speaker 1: you a whole adult, you know, And we think that

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Speaker 1: with Big Friendship, we're getting a little closer to that world.

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Speaker 1: But I have to point out that you two have

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Speaker 1: been very honest about the trials and tribulations of your

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Speaker 1: big friendship. This is the exact reason we wanted to

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Speaker 1: write a book, in fact, that something that encompasses the

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Speaker 1: complexity of friendship as opposed to just the joyful, up

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Speaker 1: on the shelf parts of it. And you know, for us,

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Speaker 1: I think the hardest moments were things that started small,

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Speaker 1: you know, moments of disconnect or miscommunication where one of

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Speaker 1: us felt you know, maybe dismissed or hurt, but didn't

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Speaker 1: say anything in real time. And then some more time

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Speaker 1: passed and something else happened, and the disconnect kind of

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Speaker 1: compounded until it got to this place where we were

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Speaker 1: really just completely missing each other and also didn't feel

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Speaker 1: safe or comfortable talking about the hard things in our

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Speaker 1: lives individually. And it was complex because we on the outside,

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Speaker 1: we're still hosting a podcast together, we were still extremely

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Speaker 1: functional colleagues, we still had this really deep well of

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Speaker 1: love and respect for each other, but in the kind

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Speaker 1: of emotional day to day our relationship was not great.

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Speaker 1: And I also have to say that friendship is unique

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Speaker 1: among intimate relationships. You know, it can kind of fall

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Speaker 1: into the same traps you know, the same ebbs and

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Speaker 1: flows that any other relationship has. Conflict is just part

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Speaker 1: of intimately knowing people, and that's something we wanted to

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Speaker 1: really bring to the conversation about friendship. We're taking a

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Speaker 1: quick break. Stay with us. You know, I love this

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Speaker 1: poem that you have in the book. You share a

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Speaker 1: few lines of a Pat Parker poem for the white

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Speaker 1: person who wants to know how to be my friend,

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Speaker 1: and then you go on to sort of pick that

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Speaker 1: apart two because for people who might not know who

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Speaker 1: you are, which I can't believe anybody actually doesn't. You know,

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Speaker 1: we have a black friend and a white friend, and

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Speaker 1: the two have had to not only navigate business and friendship,

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Speaker 1: and there were relationship but also race. Let's you know,

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Speaker 1: let's be clear. And in this poem, I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: so fascinating because you know, the poem begins with the

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Speaker 1: first thing you do is to forget that I'm black. Second,

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Speaker 1: you must never forget that I'm black. So how do

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Speaker 1: you to navigate this dynamic in your friendship? And you know,

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Speaker 1: as somebody who's been blessed with really strong friendships with

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Speaker 1: black women for many years, I'm often amazed at the

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Speaker 1: obstacles that they face in their everyday life, which are

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Speaker 1: you know, just stomach churning and so how have you

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Speaker 1: to navigate this dynamic? And and and have you ever

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Speaker 1: had to stop and think or or worried that you're

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Speaker 1: getting it wrong in you know, trying to be as

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Speaker 1: honest as you possibly can have I ever, you know,

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Speaker 1: one reason we love that poem so much is because

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Speaker 1: it really does speak to this duality of like what

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Speaker 1: makes friendship powerful is that two people feel connected, right,

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Speaker 1: they feel a sense of affinity. And at the same time,

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Speaker 1: if it's an interracial friendship, particularly one like hours involving

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Speaker 1: a white friend and a black friend, we do not

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Speaker 1: have parallel experiences in this world. And you know, that

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Speaker 1: dynamic that you're talking about of, you know, really coming

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Speaker 1: to a deeper understanding of what it means to be

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Speaker 1: a black woman in the United States of America through

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Speaker 1: your friendship with black women is something that I fully

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Speaker 1: relate to. You know. It's one thing to kind of

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Speaker 1: read statistics or read the news, and it's another when

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Speaker 1: a person you love says like this is what's going

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Speaker 1: on with me, and like this is how this plays

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Speaker 1: out in my day to day life, and so that

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Speaker 1: is something that we really write about as not an

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Speaker 1: equal experience for both people in the friendship, you know.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I can tell you that I feel deeply

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Speaker 1: grateful for having my world expanded and having more knowledge

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Speaker 1: of what it's like for people who are not you know,

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Speaker 1: of my race in this country. But I also recognize

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Speaker 1: that that comes at a really painful cost for friends

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Speaker 1: like I mean not to um and that conversation and

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Speaker 1: that kind of labor to explain her experience of the

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Speaker 1: world in a way that you know, I get to

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Speaker 1: have a learning experience just has a different toll. And

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Speaker 1: being able to hold those things as joint truths is

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Speaker 1: not all that different from holding the joint truths of

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Speaker 1: you must forget I'm black, and you must never forget

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Speaker 1: I'm black, and and you know, and to your point

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Speaker 1: about UM, are these things I think about? You know,

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Speaker 1: I think I have been a lot better at the

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Speaker 1: first part of that than the second part of it,

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Speaker 1: you know. I think a sort of constant vigilance and

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Speaker 1: work and conversation is required for me, a white person

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Speaker 1: who is raised and steeped in white culture, to be

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Speaker 1: more actionable and accountable when it comes to not forgetting

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Speaker 1: that people I love are black and have this experience

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Speaker 1: in the world, and from your perspective, I mean not

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Speaker 1: to as one half of this very powerful, big friendship.

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Speaker 1: How have you navigated race or has it been just

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Speaker 1: the continuity of your life having to Navy? Well, you know,

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Speaker 1: as you know, I'm black, so I you know, for me,

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Speaker 1: it's not having conversations about race is not something that

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Speaker 1: I am more attuned to when you know, something terribly

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Speaker 1: racist happens on the news, and so you know, even

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Speaker 1: just that experience, I think was was something that I

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Speaker 1: was just like not fully aware of that I was like, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I talked about race all the time because I'm black

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Speaker 1: and I don't have the choice to not. But realizing that,

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Speaker 1: you know, for a lot of my white friends, this

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Speaker 1: is like they're tuning in now because the news sets

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Speaker 1: they should tune in, or because there has been an incident,

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Speaker 1: you know. And and even in my friendship with and

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Speaker 1: where we are two people who are very justice minded,

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Speaker 1: and we are people who care a lot about living

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Speaker 1: in a world that is fair and equitable, we've been

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Speaker 1: great about talking about you know, racism as it happens

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Speaker 1: in the world. But understanding that, um, we also needed

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Speaker 1: to talk about how it was affecting our own friendship.

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Speaker 1: You know, that required a different kind of work. And

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Speaker 1: Anna is correct that the toll is the toll is

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Speaker 1: so very different you know when usually in intimate relationships

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Speaker 1: with white people. I have noticed and um, you know,

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Speaker 1: the critic Wesley Morris told us this, um for the

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Speaker 1: book that usually if a conversation about race is happening,

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Speaker 1: it's not because the white person is bringing it up.

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Speaker 1: And that is just like one tiny example of you know,

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Speaker 1: the kind of repetitive work that you have to do

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Speaker 1: all the time. And I think you know, Anna and

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Speaker 1: I are also not naive, like racism is bigger than

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Speaker 1: our friendship. We love each other a lot and we

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Speaker 1: we want to be there for each other. But this

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Speaker 1: is what we mean when we talk about systems that

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Speaker 1: oppress people, and so um, you know, she is right.

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Speaker 1: It requires a nimbleness and it requires constant vigilance, you know,

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Speaker 1: for for us, and I have to say that, you know,

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Speaker 1: for people who say that they struggle with this, I

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Speaker 1: would really like push them to think about all of

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Speaker 1: the other ways that they can be different in their

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Speaker 1: relationships you know, for white women, I'm like, if you

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Speaker 1: are married to a man. I'm not saying that it's

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Speaker 1: apples to oranges, but I think that you you can

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Speaker 1: understand how you can deeply love someone who also gets

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Speaker 1: on your last nerve about having that deeply affects your life,

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Speaker 1: you know, when that is true for straight people who

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Speaker 1: are friends with not straight people, and it's true, it's

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Speaker 1: true in in all of these ways. And I think

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Speaker 1: that having a compassion for people who are different and

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Speaker 1: having the ability to be the one that says, hey,

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Speaker 1: I understand that my experience is very different than yours,

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Speaker 1: and I want to keep checking in on that, and

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Speaker 1: I want to keep bringing that up because the world

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Speaker 1: is very cruel to a lot of different kinds of people.

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Speaker 1: And I think that if you are saying that you

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Speaker 1: are friends with people, that is something that you need

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Speaker 1: to acknowledge from the jump, and it's something that you

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Speaker 1: really have to be invested in, um, you know, in

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Speaker 1: being part of a conversation. Otherwise your relationship will never

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Speaker 1: go deeper than them, you know. I started by talking

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Speaker 1: about two friends that I lost this past year. One

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Speaker 1: a friend since sixth grade, someone who uh I was

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Speaker 1: in her wedding, she was in my wedding. You know,

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Speaker 1: we we were in constant touch with each other. We

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Speaker 1: just had, you know, one of those incredible friendships where

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Speaker 1: we knew what each other was thinking at the same

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Speaker 1: time and could kind of do the old side eye

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Speaker 1: about what we're hearing or seeing. It was one of

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Speaker 1: the great joys of my life. And my other friend

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Speaker 1: was an adult made friend who I met in the nineties,

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Speaker 1: had a chance to work with in a number of capacities.

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Speaker 1: Was somebody whose opinion I valued so much, who literally

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Speaker 1: could and would tell me anything. One of those friends

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Speaker 1: that everybody needs. Uh So I thought a lot about

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Speaker 1: friendship and knowing what real friendships have been in my life,

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Speaker 1: and knowing how difficult it is sometimes for people to

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Speaker 1: form them to maintain them, especially with everything else going

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Speaker 1: on in their lives and in the world around them.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to the two of you because

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Speaker 1: you've been, you know, so important in modeling what it

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Speaker 1: means to be a friend. You have fought for your friendship,

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Speaker 1: you have committed to your friendship, and I find that

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Speaker 1: really inspiring. I'm getting so emotional, and I'm really going

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Speaker 1: to try not to cry. But I think that hearing

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Speaker 1: you articulate everything that you said about your friends who

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Speaker 1: are gone like that is why it matters. You know,

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Speaker 1: this idea that, um, you can love people so deeply

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Speaker 1: and they can mean so much to you. Know, I

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Speaker 1: think that as a society we are not great at

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Speaker 1: reinforcing that those people can be your friends. And when

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Speaker 1: I hear you say that, I I'm just remind it

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Speaker 1: again and again that we we need people need to

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Speaker 1: know that the greatest loves of your life can be

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Speaker 1: your friends. And the reason that it's worth fighting for

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Speaker 1: your relationships, particularly your friendships, is because you know we

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Speaker 1: are not all going to be here, and if you

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Speaker 1: are lucky, you will pass on in the same season

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Speaker 1: of life. But that is not a reality for everyone.

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Speaker 1: And I think feeling that you really gave it your

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Speaker 1: all and that you feel not unresolved about how you

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Speaker 1: expressed your love to someone that meant so much to you,

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Speaker 1: you know, I keep coming back to that over and

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Speaker 1: over again. It's why this is so important. It's true,

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Speaker 1: and we also owe a great debt to you in

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Speaker 1: terms of feeling like we can be honest and open

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Speaker 1: about these kinds of things, and um, We're very aware

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Speaker 1: that we did not like spring from nothing, you know,

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Speaker 1: we come from uh, you know, amazing examples in you know,

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Speaker 1: lgbt Q scholarship and in you know, feminist movement, and

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Speaker 1: you know, examples of women in politics and business and

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Speaker 1: in all these other areas that really enable us to

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Speaker 1: have the conversations that we want to have now. And

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Speaker 1: so that's one reason why it's so powerful to hear

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Speaker 1: you say that, because we are also very grateful. Thank you,

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Speaker 1: my friends. I am so delighted to talk to you both.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Thank you, I mean not to.

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Speaker 1: And Ann's book is called Big Friendship How we keep

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Speaker 1: each other close, and you can hear them every week

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Speaker 1: on their podcast, Call Your Girlfriend. I first met John

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Speaker 1: and Giselle Fetterman when I was on the campaign trail

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Speaker 1: in two thousand sixteen. I was struck by their shared

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Speaker 1: commitment to public service and by how much fun they

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Speaker 1: have together. As Lieutenant Governor and second Lady of Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 1: They've spurred each other on when it comes to getting

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Speaker 1: things done for their community and advocating for people who

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Speaker 1: really needs somebody in their corner. They live in Braddock, Pennsylvania,

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Speaker 1: where John was mayor for thirteen years, and if working

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Speaker 1: at homeschooling their three children wasn't enough, recently, their lives

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Speaker 1: got even busier when John announced that he's running to

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Speaker 1: be the next U. S. Senator from Pennsylvania. I really

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Speaker 1: was looking forward to talking to them together for this podcast. Well,

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Speaker 1: let me just welcome you to this show. I'm so

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Speaker 1: excited to talk with both John and Giselle. And we

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Speaker 1: know everybody's been you know, kind of COVID isolated. Just

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Speaker 1: give our listeners a little insight into managing three kids

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Speaker 1: while you both stay so busy and watching political campaigns

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Speaker 1: and fulfilling your duties as lieutenant governor of Pennsylvania. You know,

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Speaker 1: we have a six year old, a nine year old,

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Speaker 1: and eleven year old boy. It's fun, it's overwhelming. I

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00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,760
Speaker 1: know that you know, we're gonna look back and be

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00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,000
Speaker 1: grateful for all this time that we had together. I

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00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:14,399
Speaker 1: mean at times I hide in the closet for a

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Speaker 1: little bit. Yeah, well, how did the two of you meet.

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00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,200
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna say this that she's gonna tell the

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00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,720
Speaker 1: story to embarrass me. It's a very romantic story. I

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00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:28,000
Speaker 1: hope everyone has tissues. Uh So at the time, I

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Speaker 1: was working out of Newark, New Jersey and Food Justice

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Speaker 1: and food Access. I nutritionist by trade, and I was

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Speaker 1: at a retreat and I read this article about this

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Speaker 1: community of Braddick and they talked about the history of

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Speaker 1: this incredibly rich community, Andrew Carnegie's for steel mill, big

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00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: contributions to this country, and then it was kind of

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Speaker 1: left behind, and that was really upsetting to me. It

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Speaker 1: just felt wrong. And I loved the Brooklyn Bridge when

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Speaker 1: I lived in New York. I just love this bridge.

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Speaker 1: I thought it was magnificent. And I learned that the

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00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:06,280
Speaker 1: steal that built the Brooklyn Bridge came from Braddick. Brazilians.

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Speaker 1: We believe in signs, and I said, this is a sign.

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Speaker 1: So I wrote a letter to the borough and I

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Speaker 1: shared the work that I was doing with Food Justice

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to visit and learn more and understand

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Speaker 1: how this could happen to a city like this. And

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Speaker 1: the letter ended up with John and he called me.

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Speaker 1: I came to visit, I think like two months later,

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Speaker 1: and then I arrived and he felt madly, just madly

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Speaker 1: in love with me. So yeah, so that's how she

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00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 1: tells it, and that's obviously not true. But she enjoys

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Speaker 1: shutting that out there, and then when people see what

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Speaker 1: an ogre I look like and which she looks like,

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00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 1: they assumed that it's like, well, that's got to be true.

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Speaker 1: But it is true that that but for her reaching

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Speaker 1: out to that letter, I don't know if our paths

433
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,080
Speaker 1: would have ever crossed. You know. One of the reasons

434
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 1: that I wanted to talk with both of you is

435
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: because you both are known for your public service and

436
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,639
Speaker 1: for you know, really trying to help people, and you

437
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:06,399
Speaker 1: have a partnership, and the partnership is really key to

438
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,040
Speaker 1: what both of you have been able to accomplish. And

439
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 1: so Giselle, I want to start with you first. How

440
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:17,159
Speaker 1: did you get involved in public service? And really what

441
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 1: I view and reading about everything you're doing a really

442
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 1: creative approach to you know, service and empowerment of people.

443
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,399
Speaker 1: Thank you. I think my stems from gratitude. You know.

444
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,199
Speaker 1: I came to this country as a young immigrant. My

445
00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 1: family essentially live in the shadows for almost fifteen years.

446
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:38,960
Speaker 1: We were undocumented, and we found ourselves in this whole

447
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,080
Speaker 1: new world and kind of navigating our way around it.

448
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 1: And I saw things that I knew weren't the best

449
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: way for something to be done, and I was never

450
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:51,919
Speaker 1: in a position to be able to do something about it.

451
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 1: So I collected these kind of pains and these stories

452
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: and these experiences for when one day I was in

453
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,320
Speaker 1: the position to do something about it. And so I

454
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:04,879
Speaker 1: think it comes from I'm grateful that I get to

455
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,439
Speaker 1: live in this country and I get to do the

456
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 1: work that I do, and that's what keeps me going.

457
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:16,080
Speaker 1: That really resonates with me. You know, John, your story

458
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,440
Speaker 1: is also fascinating to me. How did you originally get

459
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 1: into public service? It's it's your family that that did.

460
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 1: I was in year two of AmeriCorps, which you know

461
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:32,880
Speaker 1: very well. You know the history there. Um. I went

462
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 1: to the Hill House, which was an organization in Pittsburgh's

463
00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,960
Speaker 1: historic Hill District, which is the Great Black Jazz It's

464
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 1: kind of like the you know, the Second Harlem, if

465
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:46,640
Speaker 1: you will, of America, to teach g D classes and

466
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,959
Speaker 1: set up computer labs there, and that was made possible

467
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 1: by AmeriCorps. I was at twenty four year old and

468
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,200
Speaker 1: I wanted to get into public service, but I wasn't

469
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 1: sure how, but AmeriCorps made that possible. So so thank

470
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: you well. I think in a list of accomplishments that

471
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,880
Speaker 1: my husband's most proud of AmeriCorps way up at the top.

472
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:09,119
Speaker 1: So I will pass that on. We need more of

473
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:12,239
Speaker 1: that in America right now. I hope that part of

474
00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:17,639
Speaker 1: the change in our politics and our society is trying

475
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 1: to intentionally create more and more opportunities for service, which

476
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,200
Speaker 1: then has the benefits that you just described. John, when

477
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: you came to do that g e D program, what

478
00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:33,880
Speaker 1: was your transition into decigning to run for mayor and Braddock?

479
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 1: How did that happen? Yeah, just to put that in context,

480
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: Braddock had lost its population. It was as vibrant and

481
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 1: robust as Silicon Valley is because Pittsburgh and the steel

482
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 1: industry was that industry that was driving American innovation. Fast

483
00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: forward to when I showed up twenty years ago, you know,

484
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 1: affiliated with AmeriCorps. We lost the population and the community

485
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,840
Speaker 1: was around black and it was one of the port is,

486
00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 1: one of the porst communities in Pennsylvania. So I started

487
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:08,119
Speaker 1: setting up programming to help young people get their g

488
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 1: d s, get their jobs. There's driver's license. And then

489
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 1: after a couple of years it was going beautifully and

490
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,800
Speaker 1: I was feeling really enriched, but two of my students

491
00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 1: were killed with guns, and it really hit me with

492
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:23,880
Speaker 1: a realization that it's great that I can get someone

493
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 1: a g D or a job, but that's not much

494
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 1: help if they're not around to to do that. So

495
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: I I ran for mayor, wanting to be the change

496
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 1: I hoped to impose or create in my community, and

497
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: that would be that you don't lose anybody through gun violence.

498
00:28:40,720 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 1: And that first race, the young people that I worked with,

499
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:48,760
Speaker 1: you know, my former students, all registered to vote and

500
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 1: went and knocked on door to door for me. And

501
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 1: long story short, I won that first race by one vote,

502
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 1: one vote, one vote. So I have the ultimate every

503
00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,600
Speaker 1: vote counts story because I would never have been mayor,

504
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 1: lieutenant governor, or you know, having the esteem, privilege, and

505
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: honor to be talking to you this morning, but for

506
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,600
Speaker 1: that one vote back in two thousand and five. Well,

507
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 1: what I like, though, is that you are willing to

508
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 1: speak out and invite people to come into the conversation.

509
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:25,800
Speaker 1: You've been an outspoken advocate on everything from lgbt Q rights,

510
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 1: immigration reform obviously, to marijuana legalization. One of the subjects

511
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 1: you've really run with as lieutenant governor. But in following

512
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: your career and just on that marijuana legalization issue, what

513
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,360
Speaker 1: you did was very much in keeping with how I

514
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 1: think of politics. You traveled the whole state, the whole

515
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. You went to you know, every corner,

516
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: engaging people. You had people who agreed with you, people

517
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 1: who disagreed, and people who just wanted to know what

518
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:58,200
Speaker 1: the debate was all about. And that led you then

519
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 1: to be able to make a recommendation and based on

520
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: real conversations, how do we get back to that, John,

521
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:09,920
Speaker 1: how do we try to reinstate the sense of um,

522
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: you know, not only civility, um, but you know, a

523
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,080
Speaker 1: real conversation about the direction of our country going forward.

524
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,800
Speaker 1: Well that that what a great question because like it

525
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: just brought me back to Pennsylvania has sixty seven counties,

526
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,280
Speaker 1: and I insisted to go every single one of them,

527
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:27,560
Speaker 1: and just to give you an idea of the diversity

528
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 1: of Pennsylvania, Like our our smallest county has five thousand

529
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: people in it. And it's hard to remember that we're

530
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:37,840
Speaker 1: all Pennsylvanians because our life experiences could be so drastically different.

531
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: But you just mentioned the words civility and and my gosh,

532
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 1: like those meetings were all civil, it was such a

533
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,920
Speaker 1: great conversation, like going to the reddest communities, the reddest

534
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 1: counties in Pennsylvania, Like it's it's nostalgic, but it's crazy,

535
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 1: is that wasn't even that long ago, and you know

536
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:58,640
Speaker 1: how much things have changed and how toxic things have gotten.

537
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 1: But I also learned that people really want to talk

538
00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: and people want to be engaged. You really get to

539
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: see a person's experience through his or her own eyes

540
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 1: when you're in their own community. Absolutely, and social media

541
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 1: has has weaponized cruelty and given it a velocity that

542
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: is unprecedented where if you're in a room and personal,

543
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: it's a lot harder to do and say some of

544
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 1: the things that get flown around online and never once

545
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 1: you know, in the reddest county. So your question really

546
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 1: made me nostalgic back to a time where we could

547
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 1: have a conversation. And I also discovered that around Pennsylvanians

548
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: are for this. It's not a hard left kind of

549
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: niche issue. It is a populist like let's just do

550
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: it already thing. You know, of course, more Democrats than

551
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: Republicans but a majority of Republicans too. But what has happened,

552
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:53,959
Speaker 1: you know, as has been well documented and as we

553
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 1: have all experienced the fore president's campaign and presidency in bold,

554
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: did a lot of people to be more vocal in

555
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:09,040
Speaker 1: expressing racists and xenophobic and other very negative, hateful points

556
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:13,360
Speaker 1: of view. And that's something that your family has experienced firsthand.

557
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:17,360
Speaker 1: And Giselle, you had a particularly unfortunate experience at the

558
00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 1: grocery store this past fall. What happened there? So I

559
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:24,239
Speaker 1: do usually have the protection of stay troopers with me

560
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:26,840
Speaker 1: because of my husband's role in this time. I just

561
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,320
Speaker 1: was running to the grocery store, which is just three

562
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: minutes from my house. I just sometimes like to go

563
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 1: by myself because it's you want to feel normal, right,

564
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:39,320
Speaker 1: And the golden Quewis were on sale, and they those

565
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 1: are my favorite. And I ran to get some golden

566
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:45,080
Speaker 1: Quwi's and I was in line to pay, and this

567
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: woman passed and recognized me, you know, she stopped and

568
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 1: it just began from there. She you know, yelled some slurs.

569
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 1: She said that I don't belong here, that I'm a

570
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 1: thief and I'm belonging in this country. And I was paralyzed.

571
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm I think I'm really good at standing

572
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 1: up for someone else, but it's when it's for me,

573
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:07,719
Speaker 1: I just kind of freeze and just start crying. And

574
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,479
Speaker 1: that's what I did. And I paid quickly, and I

575
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 1: ran off to my car and I was leaving. She

576
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 1: followed me to the car and continued again yelling slurs

577
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 1: at me. And it was it was a pretty terrible

578
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: harbor experience of many people face UM in this country unfortunately. UM.

579
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 1: But I you know, when it happens to you and

580
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 1: it's so close, that hate is so close to your face,

581
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: it was a lot to process. Wow, I'm so sorry

582
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 1: that happened. How do you try to deal with that?

583
00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:40,720
Speaker 1: How do you understand that? What can we all learn

584
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 1: from that? So I cry a lot. I think that's

585
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 1: my first thing. But you know, I tried to understand

586
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: that that woman, for example, she wasn't born that way.

587
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 1: She didn't come out of you know, into this world

588
00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: hating me because I was born in a different country

589
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:00,960
Speaker 1: or spoke a different language. So I have to understand

590
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: that she was taught that, and I my hope is

591
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,680
Speaker 1: that she can be the one who breaks that cycle. Right,

592
00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: we want to continue to break cycles. I I thought

593
00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 1: of that incident, thinking like, my gosh, did she have children,

594
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 1: does she have grandchildren? Is she teaching them this? So

595
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 1: I asked that she um received support to be able

596
00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 1: to find a way out of this. I wanted her

597
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,720
Speaker 1: to see herself and say, I don't really like that person,

598
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:29,840
Speaker 1: you know, I don't want to be that person anymore, UM,

599
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,800
Speaker 1: and that she can be the one who breaks that cycle.

600
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: We'll be right back. You know. One of the hard

601
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,280
Speaker 1: parts though about being in public life is your kids.

602
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 1: And I remember when Chelsea was, you know, maybe old

603
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: enough to understand the conversation we were having with her

604
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 1: five or six. We were telling her that, you know,

605
00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 1: she would hear mean things said about her daddy and mommy,

606
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,759
Speaker 1: and you know, she had to understand that that would happen.

607
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,879
Speaker 1: And she was so I could just remember a little

608
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:15,520
Speaker 1: face and her eyes getting really big. Well, why would

609
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:21,479
Speaker 1: anybody do that? Why would anybody say anything mean? And yeah,

610
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 1: we're we're there with you. Yeah, but you have to

611
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,880
Speaker 1: prepare your children. And and I know that, UM, you

612
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 1: guys have done that because I've read about how you

613
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 1: talk to your kids and tell them that you know, sadly,

614
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 1: this is part of the world. And when you're out

615
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 1: in the public as you both are, you know that's

616
00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:42,400
Speaker 1: going to happen. Do they understand that you think they do?

617
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 1: They really do. They've lived it for a long time.

618
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 1: And I don't wanna you know, I want to shield

619
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 1: as much as I can, but I also want them

620
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 1: to know that this is the world. You know, I'm

621
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 1: raising them not for us. We're raising them for this

622
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:58,759
Speaker 1: world so that they can be agents to combat the

623
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: rest that's out there. And I remember the night of

624
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: that incident. I came home and I was really upset

625
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: and crying for a few hours, and we're trying to

626
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:08,600
Speaker 1: explain what had happened to the kids because I was alone.

627
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 1: In August, who's six, He's like, Mom, you're so adorable.

628
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 1: How could anybody say anything to you? Like he was

629
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 1: out age. Well he's a very perceptive child, That's all

630
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: I could say. Well, so now you two have launched

631
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:28,320
Speaker 1: a new adventure because John, you have announced your running

632
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 1: for the Senate. How did you make that decision? Well,

633
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,239
Speaker 1: I mean I just always want to be in a

634
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,359
Speaker 1: position to serve. I mean it started things in my

635
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:40,720
Speaker 1: life worked out like you know I was the product

636
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 1: of a kind of an unplanned teenage pregnant romance, so

637
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 1: my beginnings could have turned out one way or the other.

638
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,400
Speaker 1: But I was fortunate where I ended up in a

639
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:54,319
Speaker 1: place where I'm able to and I want to contribute

640
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 1: because I just wanted to make the world a better

641
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 1: place and pay it forward. And that's a lane that

642
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 1: made the most sense, and that really crystallized after we

643
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:07,480
Speaker 1: got into a place with our former president doing and

644
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:12,560
Speaker 1: saying things that were beyond the pale of dismantling democracy.

645
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:16,239
Speaker 1: And I was so outraged that eight out of our

646
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:20,400
Speaker 1: nine Republican Congressional delegation members who were on the same

647
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:23,760
Speaker 1: ballot saying, you know, the voters loved me. No fraud

648
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 1: in my race, but man, Joe Biden, you rigged it

649
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:29,680
Speaker 1: for him. The fact that there are people willing to

650
00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 1: trade political capital and temporary popularity to damage this nation's

651
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:38,960
Speaker 1: democratic franchise appalled me at a level that I never

652
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 1: could have imagined. And I said this in jest, but

653
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,480
Speaker 1: it's also true that if I am the next Senator,

654
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 1: I promised to be on Sedition free. I love that,

655
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 1: and everyone knows I'm no fan of politics, I'm too sensitive.

656
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:56,880
Speaker 1: My heart can't handle it. Um. But for me, I

657
00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:59,800
Speaker 1: think was you know, my family in Brazil, it's everyone's

658
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,600
Speaker 1: him to come to America always, you know, every conversation

659
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,239
Speaker 1: I have with them, it's like, I'll see you soon.

660
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,680
Speaker 1: It's this this long American dream. And when all this

661
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:11,080
Speaker 1: was happening and everything felt like it was falling apart,

662
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,959
Speaker 1: my family stopped saying that, They're like, we're fine here,

663
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 1: and UM, that was a really sad moment because I

664
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,080
Speaker 1: love this country so much and I want them to

665
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 1: continue to dream of of being here. And I think

666
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:29,440
Speaker 1: that's what Um. You know, my support for him full came. John.

667
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:33,799
Speaker 1: I know that after you announced your Senate campaign, an

668
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 1: incident that happened in Braddock when you were mayor back

669
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:43,640
Speaker 1: in got some renewed attention on social media particularly, So

670
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,879
Speaker 1: I just have to ask you, John, what happened? So

671
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:51,840
Speaker 1: in is outside and experienced a really large and sharp

672
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: burst of gunfire and there was an individual, you know,

673
00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:59,360
Speaker 1: covered head to toe, couldn't tell what their race was,

674
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:03,080
Speaker 1: what there there was running from this corridor where there's

675
00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 1: been a lot of shootings over the years there and

676
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,799
Speaker 1: I made that split second decision I called nine one one,

677
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:14,000
Speaker 1: and I got my family in safely, and I made

678
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 1: the decision. This was a few weeks after Sandy Hook

679
00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:19,640
Speaker 1: as he as the individual was heading towards our elementary

680
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:22,640
Speaker 1: school to intercept him, didn't point the weapon against him.

681
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 1: It was over in less than thirty seconds because the

682
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 1: police were coming from such a short area. And the

683
00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 1: allegation was is that it was somehow racially motivated, when

684
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 1: that just couldn't be further from the truth. What I

685
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 1: can say, though, is is that Braddock served as my

686
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 1: my jury after that, and they knew it had nothing

687
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,720
Speaker 1: to do with the race. They knew it had nothing

688
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:46,400
Speaker 1: to do with anything other than somebody rising up to

689
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:50,759
Speaker 1: intervene in a situation where there was undisputed gunfire. Multiple

690
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,280
Speaker 1: residents you know, attested to that. And they re elected

691
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 1: me by a greater than three to one margin four

692
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:59,399
Speaker 1: months after this incident, and then to another term four

693
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 1: years later, and then to lieutenant governor. And I've just

694
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: said that my twenty years in Braddock, the most thing

695
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 1: I'm most proud of is we stopped gun deaths in

696
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 1: our community for five and a half years for the

697
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 1: first time ever. And it has to be said, profiling.

698
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 1: You know this history in the black community. It's a

699
00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:21,239
Speaker 1: real thing, and I certainly understood that, But at no

700
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 1: point in time was I ever aware of this individual's

701
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 1: race or even gender based on how they were dressed

702
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,719
Speaker 1: and how far apart we were and how rapidly this

703
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 1: all happened. Well, I want to bring this back to

704
00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:37,799
Speaker 1: the two of you because I'm fascinated about partnership and

705
00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 1: one of my stories that I love about you, Giselle

706
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 1: is I think it was a birthday and John asked

707
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 1: you what you wanted, and you said you wanted a container.

708
00:40:46,920 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: And I'm not talking about like a little tiny container

709
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 1: for a plant. I'm talking about a container that goes

710
00:40:53,880 --> 00:41:01,360
Speaker 1: on a huge ship. And so John just kind of went, okay.

711
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 1: I had just got a nice honorarium, which I never

712
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 1: kept any honorariums, of course, they all went to charity.

713
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 1: And She's like, I need I want to start this

714
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,440
Speaker 1: thing called the Free Store, and I'm like okay. So

715
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 1: we would always drive by this place that creates a

716
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:19,040
Speaker 1: container offices, like you know, like out of like a

717
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 1: legitimate ocean cargo shipping container, and the price was X

718
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 1: and my honorarium was literally X I was like, okay, sure,

719
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,120
Speaker 1: here you go. And then that was what nine years ago,

720
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 1: nine years ago, and that has become the Free Store,

721
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 1: and she has created something that is as fine as

722
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,440
Speaker 1: anything that's ever been done to helping the really basic

723
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:46,799
Speaker 1: fundamental needs of the folks here. It was so the

724
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 1: two of you kind of have educated each other about

725
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:53,440
Speaker 1: all sorts of things during your your partnership. Yes, mostly

726
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: me educating him because I'm just I'm just the arm

727
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:04,239
Speaker 1: candy secretary, you know, like, well, it's a great partnership.

728
00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for, you know, one of

729
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 1: the best memories with Grace. You know, we were waiting

730
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:12,439
Speaker 1: for your event and everything was running late because that's

731
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:16,640
Speaker 1: what happens in campaigns. And she was starving and grumpy

732
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 1: because that's who she is, and we see you coming

733
00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:22,800
Speaker 1: and I said, look, Grace, there she is and she said, great,

734
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 1: but now I'm starving and you've got a big bag

735
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,399
Speaker 1: of chips from your husband, and I have the best

736
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 1: picture of her just so to her, you are the

737
00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:36,520
Speaker 1: one who fed her that day, and she she that's

738
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:40,120
Speaker 1: a great metaphor because you know that that's how I

739
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:43,440
Speaker 1: think about public service. You know, it is a process

740
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:46,719
Speaker 1: of meeting and yes, feeding all of the needs that

741
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 1: are out there. So I just wish that both of you,

742
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 1: you know, the very best in your you know, public

743
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 1: and professional and personal pursuits altogether. Thank you for talking

744
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 1: to me today. The Pennsylvania Senate election in is one

745
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:11,440
Speaker 1: of the most important contests in the country upcoming, So

746
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,440
Speaker 1: if you're paying close attention, as I hope you are,

747
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:17,800
Speaker 1: please come back next week. When I talked to another

748
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:24,400
Speaker 1: terrific Democrat in the race, Malcolm Kenyatta, you know, partners

749
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,160
Speaker 1: are great, but what if you don't have one? My

750
00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:30,080
Speaker 1: next guests set out to answer that question for one

751
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:35,200
Speaker 1: very specific demographic college students stuck at home during the pandemic.

752
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: Iliana Valdez is a senior majoring in computer science at

753
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 1: Yale University. Her brother Jorge graduated from college a few

754
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: years ago and now works as a software developer. This fall,

755
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 1: they found themselves sheltering in place, so along with a friend,

756
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 1: they came up with the idea for a new dating

757
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 1: site called okay Zoomer and worked together to build it.

758
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 1: I think it's safe to say it's been a resounding success. Hi,

759
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 1: Alianna and Jorgey, Welcome to the show today. Hi, thanks

760
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:17,800
Speaker 1: for having us. Well. I was so intrigued by Okay

761
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 1: Zoomer and I wanna learn all about that. But first

762
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:22,959
Speaker 1: a little bit about the two of you, your brother

763
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 1: and sister. I'd love to learn more about where your

764
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:31,319
Speaker 1: interest in programming came from. So I love to tell

765
00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 1: people that it started in the womb because my mom

766
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:36,200
Speaker 1: was at college studying for computer science when she was

767
00:44:36,239 --> 00:44:38,919
Speaker 1: pregnant with me. But after that, like my big brother

768
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:43,480
Speaker 1: did it. So of course, like I wouldn't be like, well,

769
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:47,160
Speaker 1: it's a pretty good combination, but the two of you

770
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:52,360
Speaker 1: working together have created something new. It's called Okay Zoomer,

771
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 1: a great name. What inspired you to do this, Eleana?

772
00:44:57,520 --> 00:45:00,359
Speaker 1: How how did you even think about it? So when

773
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:02,760
Speaker 1: we got sent home, UM, a lot of my friends

774
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 1: and I were on Facebook because that's all we had

775
00:45:04,680 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: to do at home UM in quarantined, and a lot

776
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:10,839
Speaker 1: of people were posting really funny memes about not being

777
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:12,799
Speaker 1: able to have a love life anymore and not being

778
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 1: able to find their partner before they graduate. So I

779
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 1: remember we were like, what if we solve that problem?

780
00:45:18,640 --> 00:45:20,799
Speaker 1: What did we help people find that partner before they

781
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:23,279
Speaker 1: graduate Yale or they graduate whatever university is that they're

782
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:25,160
Speaker 1: going to. And my brother was like, so quick to

783
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:28,160
Speaker 1: be on board and behind the mission. I love that, Jorge.

784
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 1: So here, your little sister comes home from school and

785
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:34,600
Speaker 1: she says, you know, this is really bad because my

786
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:38,239
Speaker 1: friends and I are feeling really isolated. She comes to

787
00:45:38,280 --> 00:45:41,600
Speaker 1: me with this Google form of people who are expressing

788
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:45,120
Speaker 1: their desire to find their match right, and it's got

789
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:47,440
Speaker 1: over ten tho sign ups on it, and she's like,

790
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:49,240
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how I'm going to get these people

791
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 1: their perfect match. And one night and I'm like, Okay,

792
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:57,000
Speaker 1: we can solve this together. Let's let's figure it out. Well,

793
00:45:57,040 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 1: you did a lot of the programming behind Okay, Zoom

794
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:05,240
Speaker 1: or Orge. What makes it different from other dating apps?

795
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 1: We try to not provide any means of superficial first impression,

796
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 1: so there's no pictures on the site. Really, the only

797
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:17,919
Speaker 1: thing we're doing is giving you basic demographic information and

798
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:21,239
Speaker 1: leaving it on you to reach out to that person. Um.

799
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:23,960
Speaker 1: And another thing that's different is that we only give

800
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 1: you a match every Friday. You know, It's not like Tinder,

801
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:28,920
Speaker 1: where you're getting an endless stream of people that you

802
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:32,040
Speaker 1: might be interested in. So really it's focusing on like

803
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:37,040
Speaker 1: making core personal relationships that are built to withstand and Iliana,

804
00:46:37,120 --> 00:46:41,120
Speaker 1: You're not just making potential romantic matches, as I understand it,

805
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:46,160
Speaker 1: You're helping your fellow college students replicate the kind of

806
00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:49,400
Speaker 1: random encounters they might have if they were, you know,

807
00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:52,920
Speaker 1: in the dining hall or the library or walking out

808
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 1: of a class, so that they could have a more

809
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:58,960
Speaker 1: normal life right now. Yeah, that was a big driving

810
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: force behind it. I'm also a freshman counselor and a

811
00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 1: lot of our first years like have not been able

812
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 1: to meet other people. Um, so this is definitely like

813
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:07,480
Speaker 1: something we want to apply it to. We want to

814
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 1: make sure that, you know, students who are completely remote

815
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:12,839
Speaker 1: still get that experience of networking, because that's a huge

816
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,920
Speaker 1: important part of being at college. Aleana, Why do you

817
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 1: think Okay zoomer has struck such a chord and and

818
00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:21,680
Speaker 1: how many people have actually ended up using it so far?

819
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 1: I think a huge part of what it struck such

820
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: a chord is because our current apps like Tinder and

821
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,799
Speaker 1: stuff like that are very driven on hookups and like

822
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:32,400
Speaker 1: short term interactions, which did not survive the pandemic because

823
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,720
Speaker 1: we were gone and separated from each other for eight months,

824
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:37,360
Speaker 1: and so people realize, wow, maybe there needs to be

825
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:39,480
Speaker 1: a different method for me to build these like meaningful

826
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:42,319
Speaker 1: conversations before I start a relationship with someone to make

827
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: sure that it's going to last. Um So that's been

828
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 1: a huge like part of why I think it worked.

829
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:49,799
Speaker 1: And we've had over twenty thou people use it so far,

830
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:54,080
Speaker 1: and that number keeps growing. Have you gotten any testimonials

831
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 1: that show that you're doing the right thing, You're you're

832
00:47:56,600 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 1: really helping people during such a difficult time. Yeah. So

833
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:04,400
Speaker 1: one of my best friends actually is currently in rural Wyoming.

834
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:08,279
Speaker 1: In rural Wyoming, his tender options are like zero to none.

835
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:12,040
Speaker 1: Um So, it's definitely been a huge factor for people

836
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 1: that they still want to date people they have things

837
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:15,480
Speaker 1: in common with, so that means they still want to

838
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:18,399
Speaker 1: date people at their respective universities. But the dating apps

839
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:20,600
Speaker 1: they're out there just aren't cutting it anymore, especially in

840
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 1: our new globalized community that we have. It's just we

841
00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:25,680
Speaker 1: know that we're going in the right direction just because

842
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 1: we've been able to serve a lot of people who

843
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: haven't been served by the current dating apps anymore. Okay,

844
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 1: before we close, I have to ask have either of

845
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 1: you gone on any Okay Zoomer dates. I've gone in

846
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,399
Speaker 1: an Okay Seemer friend date and it was awesome. Met

847
00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 1: a nice person from Princeton and check in every now

848
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:48,759
Speaker 1: and then. How about you or Unfortunately I'm out of

849
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,880
Speaker 1: the age demographic at this point. Well, I'm sort of

850
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:55,440
Speaker 1: hoping that as you grow and develop this new site

851
00:48:55,800 --> 00:48:58,880
Speaker 1: that you expand it for ages, because it's not only

852
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 1: college kids who need to have, you know, positive connections

853
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:08,960
Speaker 1: without the pressure of appearance being front and center and

854
00:49:09,160 --> 00:49:13,720
Speaker 1: all the ideas of dating and the pressures that that brings.

855
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:16,879
Speaker 1: So I'll put it a plug for you know, expanding

856
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:21,760
Speaker 1: Okay Zoomer. I want to thank both Iliana and Jorge

857
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:25,440
Speaker 1: and really congratulate you on making such good use of

858
00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:29,600
Speaker 1: the time you had during COVID to create something that

859
00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:33,240
Speaker 1: can bring people together in some really good and positive ways.

860
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 1: Thank you both very much. Thank you to check out

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Speaker 1: Okay Zoomer go to Zoomer dot Love. Speaking of partners,

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00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 1: we could not make this podcast without you our listeners,

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00:49:55,360 --> 00:50:01,400
Speaker 1: and I love hearing your stories and ideas for upcoming oos. Recently,

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00:50:01,640 --> 00:50:06,399
Speaker 1: after our episode on doing hard Things, I asked you

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Speaker 1: to share some of the hard things you've had to do,

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Speaker 1: and boy, I got so many wonderful responses. Anna wrote

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Speaker 1: to me about how hard her parents have been working

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Speaker 1: as they try to keep their small business and employees

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Speaker 1: afloat during this pandemic. Sharon and so many others wrote

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Speaker 1: in about dealing with loss and grief, the death of

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Speaker 1: a loved one, the difficulty conceiving, caring for aging parents,

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Speaker 1: and so much more. Thank you to everyone who has

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Speaker 1: written in, and on a related note, for a future episode,

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00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:47,920
Speaker 1: I'll be answering questions from listeners. So if you have

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00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:52,520
Speaker 1: a question about the podcast about public service, about the

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00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:56,799
Speaker 1: skills that I have or haven't mastered during this pandemic,

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00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,040
Speaker 1: for example, leave us a message at mine one four

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00:51:01,560 --> 00:51:06,600
Speaker 1: four five eight one four four one. Again that's nine

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00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:11,680
Speaker 1: one four four five eight one four four one. We

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00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:14,480
Speaker 1: just asked that you try to keep it to you know,

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00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:17,800
Speaker 1: a minute or so, or if you prefer, you can

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00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:22,680
Speaker 1: email us at You and Me Both pod at gmail

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00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:26,840
Speaker 1: dot com. I really look forward to hearing from you.

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Speaker 1: You and Me Both is brought to you by I

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00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:37,799
Speaker 1: Heart Radio. We're produced by Julie Subran, Kathleen Russo and

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00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:43,000
Speaker 1: Lauren Peterson, with help from Huma Aberdeen, Nikki E Tour,

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00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:50,400
Speaker 1: Oscar Flores, Lindsay Hoffman, Brianna Johnson, Nick Merrill, Rob Russo,

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Speaker 1: and Lona Valmiro. Our engineer is Zack McNeice and the

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00:51:56,239 --> 00:52:00,600
Speaker 1: original music is by Forest Gray. If you like you

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Speaker 1: and me both, please help spread the word, tell your

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Speaker 1: friends about it, post about it on social media, and

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Speaker 1: make sure to hit the subscribe buttons so you never

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Speaker 1: miss an episode. You can do that on the I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening and see you next week