Speaker 1: Welcome to Checking In with Michelle Williams, a production of
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and The Black Effect. Y'all, I've got to show
Speaker 1: some hometown love. I'm so excited to have Kimberla Laws
Speaker 1: and Robie as our special guest today. She is a
Speaker 1: New York Times bestselling author and she is currently giving
Speaker 1: back in this space of also mentorship with her writers
Speaker 1: Masterclass and her podcast. She's so amazing, super quiet, but
Speaker 1: such a force. And to know that she is still
Speaker 1: living in Rockford, Illinois, author of thirty books. Y'all get
Speaker 1: into this, Get into it, Come on in, get some coffee.
Speaker 1: This is going to be a beautiful conversation. We are
Speaker 1: here for another amazing episode of Checking In. Of course,
Speaker 1: there can be no Checking In without y'all that keep
Speaker 1: downloading these episodes and being so engaging and checking in Today,
Speaker 1: I've got someone who is a hometown trailblazer, hometown hero
Speaker 1: has done so much in the world of books. I'm
Speaker 1: humble today to have a New York Times best selling
Speaker 1: author also USA today helms her as a best selling author.
Speaker 1: Because she is a best selling author of twenty nine books.
Speaker 1: She got like eighty more of her sleeves I'm sure
Speaker 1: of it. Inspirational speaker and writing and publishing mentor, please
Speaker 1: welcome to checking in Kimberla Lawson Roby.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Michelle, it's wonderful to be here.
Speaker 1: Twenty nine books, ma'am. How do you keep writing? It's
Speaker 1: so much more in you as well?
Speaker 2: I you know, I think so. And of course that
Speaker 2: always takes me back though, when I'm thinking about the
Speaker 2: twenty nine books, what it was like, first of all,
Speaker 2: to never have a dream of writing books. I had
Speaker 2: a dream of writing, and I always loved writing. But
Speaker 2: did I think I would write books? Definitely not. And
Speaker 2: so I didn't even write the first one until I
Speaker 2: was thirty years old. And you know, fast forwarding to
Speaker 2: today sometimes doing not just one book a year, but
Speaker 2: two books every single year. And so it's just been
Speaker 2: an amazing journey.
Speaker 1: It has, yes, yes, and you guys, I sprinkled in
Speaker 1: the intro hometown because she is from Rockford, Illinois, where
Speaker 1: I was born and raised, and you're still in Rockford.
Speaker 1: Knowing that you could move anywhere and be anywhere. What
Speaker 1: keeps you in Rockford?
Speaker 2: That question comes up a lot, and I think you
Speaker 2: know sometimes too, I will see people that I've known
Speaker 2: most of my life, but I haven't seen in a
Speaker 2: number of years, and they'll say, so, how long are
Speaker 2: you going to be here? You know, can we get together?
Speaker 2: And so I thought, wow, I must not be out
Speaker 2: very much. And about you know, the.
Speaker 1: Times that I've lived in Rockford, I haven't seen you, no,
Speaker 1: And about a lot of places, you know, unless it
Speaker 1: was some ticketity bents, I think I've seen you at
Speaker 1: one event or something, yet not knowing that you have
Speaker 1: still lived in Rockford, Illinois. Best selling author.
Speaker 2: Yes, but it is it's home to me, you know,
Speaker 2: on my mom's side of the family, with the exception
Speaker 2: of two brothers, there were eleven of them. All the
Speaker 2: rest of my aunts and uncles and their children live
Speaker 2: in the Rockford area. So I think that's part of it.
Speaker 2: But it's absolutely home. And so I think once I
Speaker 2: started writing and the national tour started and we were
Speaker 2: traveling around city to city, then it became more of
Speaker 2: a joy for me to be at home, you know,
Speaker 2: in a smaller area. And you know, this is a
Speaker 2: lot of a lot of the times. This is where
Speaker 2: I truly find my peace.
Speaker 1: So what I love it. Yeah, And and y'all just
Speaker 1: give me a minute. These are two hometown girls talking now,
Speaker 1: your last name lost in Roby. Those are two huge
Speaker 1: families in the Rockford area. Yeah, so I'm assudent assuming
Speaker 1: maiden name Lawson, the very named Roby. Yes, and I
Speaker 1: know a lot of Lawson and I know a lot
Speaker 1: of Roby's, and I just think that is absolutely absolutely cool.
Speaker 2: It is. It is a big big families. And it's
Speaker 2: interesting too in Rockford, you know, as you know, and
Speaker 2: as you were just saying, we know just about everybody here.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like we know the names of you know,
Speaker 2: if you attend certain churches here, it was certain families
Speaker 2: tended to gravitate toward the same churches, you know, as
Speaker 2: as some of their other family members. And so that's
Speaker 2: that's a little interesting when you're when you're living in
Speaker 2: a town that was under two hundred thousand.
Speaker 1: So yes, yes, and y'all she's got this signature amazing
Speaker 1: skin hair like we we're going to get into. But
Speaker 1: I think when you live in a place where it's peaceful,
Speaker 1: that I'm sure that helps you being centered, looking good,
Speaker 1: feeling good. You know. Now you have been on a
Speaker 1: must read authorless that includes Maya Angelo, like, did you
Speaker 1: ever get that feeling that you knew that what you
Speaker 1: were right would be best selling?
Speaker 2: Nope, I never did. And you know, I think sometimes
Speaker 2: it's it's fear. It's sometimes doing what you love, what
Speaker 2: you enjoy and living out your dreams, but still somewhere
Speaker 2: on the inside thinking maybe it won't be good enough.
Speaker 2: And and so then I remember when I was starting
Speaker 2: out writing the first book. You know, I am thinking
Speaker 2: about the Maya Angelous of the Worlds and the Tony
Speaker 2: Morrisons and Terry McMillan and Walter Mosley, you know, all
Speaker 2: of the names you knew back then in the nineties
Speaker 2: when I started out, And so, yeah, there was fear
Speaker 2: of that. And did I think that I would make
Speaker 2: the New York Times bestseller list? Nope, didn't even think
Speaker 2: so much about that. Didn't even really know that I
Speaker 2: would write more than two or three books. So yeah,
Speaker 2: it has it's been a dream come true. And what
Speaker 2: I share all the time is that you know, here,
Speaker 2: I didn't want to become a writer. And I don't
Speaker 2: know if you knew this, but I share this as
Speaker 2: much as I can because I'm hoping people don't make
Speaker 2: the mistake that I made. I did not go into
Speaker 2: writing right away out of high school and right out
Speaker 2: of college because I looked at the salaries of writers
Speaker 2: and they weren't earning very much, and so I thought,
Speaker 2: I love writing, but I'm definitely not going to be that,
Speaker 2: you know, So let me figure out a career. Let
Speaker 2: me figure out a major in college that will allow
Speaker 2: me to end up in a job and working for
Speaker 2: someone who's going to pay me an above average income.
Speaker 2: So that was really my thinking, and I ended up miserable.
Speaker 2: You know, was moving from one job to the next.
Speaker 2: Sometimes as early as nine months. I would start a
Speaker 2: position and think, oh, this isn't going to work. I
Speaker 2: can see where I'm not going to move up the
Speaker 2: corporate ladder. It's time to move on to the next one.
Speaker 2: And I would be on what I call this resume
Speaker 2: submitting campaign. And so from one job to the next
Speaker 2: to the next, work for all of the companies here
Speaker 2: just about that the names that anybody would know. Then
Speaker 2: worked for the state of Illinois, and then I worked
Speaker 2: for the city of Rockford. So the list just went
Speaker 2: on and on. And that made me take a step
Speaker 2: back to say, okay, lord, now you know, I've got
Speaker 2: to go into prayer because I'm not just miserable. I'm
Speaker 2: feeling depressed every day when I get up and in tears.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm to the point where, no, I don't
Speaker 2: want to put the suit on. I'm pulling out of
Speaker 2: my closet the first thing I see to get dressed
Speaker 2: and go to work. And so my husband will he's
Speaker 2: watching this and thinking, you know this shouldn't be you.
Speaker 2: You do have to do something else. And I started
Speaker 2: thinking back to all of those teachers who said, you
Speaker 2: have a gift when it comes to writing, you have
Speaker 2: a gift when it comes to storytelling. And so that
Speaker 2: led me into saying, you know what, I'm going to
Speaker 2: keep working for the City of Rockford, but every evening
Speaker 2: and weekend, I'm going to start writing. And I kept
Speaker 2: doing that for some months in nineteen ninety five until
Speaker 2: it was complete.
Speaker 1: Wow, Now when you said you loved writing helped me,
Speaker 1: maybe even for those of us who might even be innur.
Speaker 1: So when you say I loved writing, did you know
Speaker 1: it was writing books or was it just going to
Speaker 1: be writing articles for people writing? What?
Speaker 2: Yes, articles? I thought that I would either work for
Speaker 2: our local newspaper or write articles for magazines, and if
Speaker 2: it was fiction, maybe some short stories for magazines. But yeah,
Speaker 2: I never thought that it would be books.
Speaker 1: So when you say for the paper, so is writing
Speaker 1: and journalism. It wasn't journalism though, was it that?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I was thinking along the lines of journalism. And
Speaker 2: in fact, I wrote for the school newspaper when I
Speaker 2: was at Eisenhower Middle School here, so I loved loved
Speaker 2: writing in that respect. And so yeah, no, I never thought, Okay,
Speaker 2: I'm going to write fiction, I'm going to write a
Speaker 2: novel and I'm going to write a book, and you know,
Speaker 2: so it just ended up being that. But that was
Speaker 2: definitely not my lifelong dream.
Speaker 1: So since nineteen ninety five, is that correct? You? Yes,
Speaker 1: published your first book thirty books later. That requires discipline.
Speaker 1: It's almost like if somebody started recording music in nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety five and they've got thirty albums out right. That
Speaker 1: means there is a not only a love and passion,
Speaker 1: but you can have passion and love for something but
Speaker 1: no discipline. Yes, Now, in order for you to have
Speaker 1: the results that you have the fruit of that is discipline.
Speaker 1: Where do you find your discipline to write? Is it
Speaker 1: something you had to work at.
Speaker 2: It is something that I have to work at, I
Speaker 2: would say more now than when I first started out,
Speaker 2: which is interesting. You know, you would think it would
Speaker 2: maybe be the other way around, but I think in
Speaker 2: the beginning, and sometimes I think this happens with no
Speaker 2: matter what industry you're in, you I want it really badly,
Speaker 2: and it's such a goal that you're trying to meet,
Speaker 2: and you have this dream that you want to see
Speaker 2: come to pass. And so nothing could have stopped me
Speaker 2: from saying, this is what I'm going to do every
Speaker 2: single evening, every night, every weekend, every holiday until the
Speaker 2: book is complete. And so then when the next book
Speaker 2: came around, it was time to write that. So of
Speaker 2: course I ended up self publishing the first book because
Speaker 2: I couldn't find a literary agent. I was rejected by
Speaker 2: every single one that I submitted to, and the same
Speaker 2: thing when I went directly to publishers.
Speaker 1: And you kept writing, So there's a word in there.
Speaker 1: Even though you were rejected by every literary publishing house,
Speaker 1: you kept writing.
Speaker 2: Yes, I kept going, kept going, and even when I
Speaker 2: was ready to give up because it was disappointing and
Speaker 2: it was discouraging, and of course that rude awakening happens
Speaker 2: when you realize it's not going to be as easy
Speaker 2: as you thought. And so I thought, oh, you know what,
Speaker 2: this was a nice idea and I thought it might
Speaker 2: work out, but it's not, so maybe it's time to
Speaker 2: move on. And my mom, you know, I always say
Speaker 2: God rest her soul. When she realized I was really
Speaker 2: ready to give up, she said, you know, I don't
Speaker 2: know anything about publishing writing books, but what I do
Speaker 2: know is we've passed around copies of your manuscript to
Speaker 2: a lot of women here locally, and many of them
Speaker 2: said they couldn't put it down until they finished it.
Speaker 2: And she said, I just think that means something, and
Speaker 2: you shouldn't give up. And so then it was my
Speaker 2: husband Will who said, well, why can't you take your
Speaker 2: business background, start your own company and publish the book yourself.
Speaker 2: So that's how the whole idea of self publishing came about.
Speaker 2: It was not my plan, wasn't something I even considered.
Speaker 2: And then he offered to withdraw money borrow from his
Speaker 2: fuh one K account, so he believed in me at
Speaker 2: that time. I always say, you know, I have to
Speaker 2: give credit where credit is due he and my mom.
Speaker 2: They believed a whole lot more in me than I
Speaker 2: believe in myself back in that period of time.
Speaker 1: So you have the discipline and resilience, but it's also
Speaker 1: good to have one or two people like you beside you. Yes,
Speaker 1: you know, because a lot of us, I'm guilty of
Speaker 1: feeling like I can do this by myself. I can
Speaker 1: work quicker on my own, but it does get lonely
Speaker 1: when you feel like you are doing stuff by yourself
Speaker 1: where you're not supported. So two closest people to you
Speaker 1: who can be the most critical or supportive, which is
Speaker 1: your mom and your husband. Mom could be like, you know, girl,
Speaker 1: if you don't go back and get your job, because
Speaker 1: we also have to tell people when you're working for corporations,
Speaker 1: you are obviously getting health insurance, yes, other benefits regarding
Speaker 1: retirement when you mentioned four on one case, So when
Speaker 1: you quit that quit your job there, you're also quitting security.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, and so with Will, that was my question
Speaker 2: to him, we're going to go from two incomes to one.
Speaker 2: You know, have you thought about that, because I thought,
Speaker 2: you know what, he's kind of lost it here. You know,
Speaker 2: that's nice. It's great to have the support, and it's
Speaker 2: great to have him believe in me. But I was
Speaker 2: thinking ahead, and it's like, Okay, you know, we're not
Speaker 2: rich and wealthy by any stretch of the imagination, but
Speaker 2: we can pay our bills on time, we can save
Speaker 2: for a rainy day, we can save for retirement, and
Speaker 2: that was a good life as far as I was concerned.
Speaker 2: And so his response was, you know, I hear you
Speaker 2: and know we won't have money to do a lot
Speaker 2: of extra things. We won't be able to just waste
Speaker 2: money on things that we don't need, you know, but
Speaker 2: we'll be able to pay our bills with my income.
Speaker 2: But I think that if you don't quit your job,
Speaker 2: and if you don't give this one hundred percent of
Speaker 2: your time, you're not going to be successful with it.
Speaker 2: And so I thought about it, prayed about it, talk
Speaker 2: to my moms more about it. Now. What I learned
Speaker 2: later is from my mom's twin brother, my dear uncle Ben, was,
Speaker 2: you know, after she had passed away and gone, he said, now,
Speaker 2: when you did give your two week notice and you
Speaker 2: ended that, He's like, she supported everything you did, but
Speaker 2: that made her nervous. She just didn't tell you that
Speaker 2: he was like, just so you know, yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: that's it, he said, But I told her it's like,
Speaker 2: you know, let her do what she's going to do.
Speaker 2: Because I did say to Will, I said, okay, but
Speaker 2: what if it doesn't work? So I still need you
Speaker 2: to answer that question. And he said, well, you know what,
Speaker 2: if it doesn't work, then you'll just move on to
Speaker 2: something else, you know, And but do you want to
Speaker 2: keep going years and years down the road wondering if
Speaker 2: you could have had some success with it? And so
Speaker 2: I moved forward with it and it started selling very well.
Speaker 2: At that time, we had probably three hundred plus, if
Speaker 2: not more, independent black bookstores in the country, and so
Speaker 2: they really supported me and really just helped make my career,
Speaker 2: you know, much bigger than it would have been. They
Speaker 2: helped me in ways that I just wasn't counting on,
Speaker 2: and so it was just a blessing all around. Took
Speaker 2: those numbers, went back to agents, found one who said yes,
Speaker 2: she sold the second book to a publisher, and from
Speaker 2: there my traditional publishing career began.
Speaker 1: Amazing. There's been so many stories about how you kept
Speaker 1: going even though you were rejected before then you said,
Speaker 1: I've got to follow my dream. But the other nugget
Speaker 1: is I want to go back to when your brother
Speaker 1: was telling you, yeah, mom was nervous, but she didn't
Speaker 1: project that onto you.
Speaker 2: My uncle yep, her brother.
Speaker 1: Oh yes, her brother told you, yeah, mama was nervous.
Speaker 1: Your mom was nervous, so she didn't project that onto you.
Speaker 1: And a lot of people my grandmother used to say, mean, well,
Speaker 1: but they it's best to have a concern maybe, but
Speaker 1: when you see somebody really want to go after something,
Speaker 1: maybe keep certain concerns to yourself. Yes, nine times out
Speaker 1: of ten, from what I'm seeing, it always works out. Yes,
Speaker 1: it always works out. Yes, always works out. After all
Speaker 1: of these books, continuing to find inspiration, is it through conversations,
Speaker 1: something you ate, something you smell in the wind, like.
Speaker 2: How so it a lot of times for me, And
Speaker 2: this really started in the very beginning without my intentionally
Speaker 2: doing this, But I started writing about very early on
Speaker 2: with the first book about real life social issues. So
Speaker 2: even though I was writing in a fictional format, I
Speaker 2: was writing about real life issues, sometimes controversial issues, sometimes
Speaker 2: taboo issues, but issues that I believed we should be
Speaker 2: talking about that maybe we weren't talking about enough. And
Speaker 2: so I began with the first book, and then after
Speaker 2: that book was out and readers started reading it and
Speaker 2: I was getting feedback, I started specifically asking readers what
Speaker 2: kept you reading, what was interesting about the book to you,
Speaker 2: what did you enjoy the most about it? And what
Speaker 2: I heard more often than that was that they could
Speaker 2: relate their own lives to the lives of the characters
Speaker 2: and the social issues and the problems and the obstacles
Speaker 2: that they were trying to overcome, or if they could
Speaker 2: not relate directly, they knew family members or friends who
Speaker 2: had experienced some of what those characters were dealing with.
Speaker 2: And so I decided from that point on that that's
Speaker 2: what I would do, that I would write fiction, but
Speaker 2: I would base it on real life social issues. And so,
Speaker 2: of course, you know, my third book, which took my
Speaker 2: career to a whole other level, was Casting the First Stone.
Speaker 2: You know, it was the first book in my Reverend
Speaker 2: Curtis Black series about problems and scandal in the church,
Speaker 2: and so, you know, talk about controversial. That that's when
Speaker 2: I really moved into the area of writing about, you know,
Speaker 2: stories that people were certainly talking about and they knew about,
Speaker 2: but maybe not talking about as publicly as you might
Speaker 2: see today. So and so, of course, then the question
Speaker 2: comes up, which kind of relates to your question, is
Speaker 2: you know where did where did you get him from?
Speaker 2: How did you create him? You know what inspired you?
Speaker 2: And so I've always said I think Reverend Curtis Black
Speaker 2: was awful and flawed, and he was as terrible as
Speaker 2: he was because he is a mixture of a number
Speaker 2: of different pastors that I have known or heard about
Speaker 2: throughout many years.
Speaker 1: Now. Has anybody ever thought the book was about them
Speaker 1: and they felt a way.
Speaker 2: Well, I won't say whether they have or not, but
Speaker 2: what has happened is I have had pastors wives contact
Speaker 2: me either by email and in a couple of cases
Speaker 2: on the road at events to just lean in while
Speaker 2: I'm signing their book to say thank you so much
Speaker 2: for writing my story, thank you for saying what I'm
Speaker 2: not able to say because so many times are members
Speaker 2: of our congregation they see us in the nice suit
Speaker 2: or the nice hat on Sunday morning, they have no
Speaker 2: clue what we're dealing with the other six days in
Speaker 2: the week.
Speaker 1: Wow. So that there has to give you ample inspiration
Speaker 1: to keep going and to keep writing, like you said
Speaker 1: stories for people who may feel like, yeah, I can't
Speaker 1: tell this, but Kim can tell yes, Kimberla can tell yes.
Speaker 1: The story one of your most recent book, Sister Friends Forever.
Speaker 1: It's very very, very very emotional story and it follows
Speaker 1: four lifelong friends facing crisis and family and love. How
Speaker 1: much of these kinds of stories are based on Well,
Speaker 1: I guess you just you answer the question previously, But
Speaker 1: in this book, I'm assuming anything based on stories you know,
Speaker 1: people you follow, because I'm like, we can get off
Speaker 1: this podcast and I'm going to tell you a bunch of stories,
Speaker 1: and but like Kim can write it, I want, Well,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: That's the thing with Sister Friends Forever. I have two girlfriends,
Speaker 2: my best friends. One it's been you know, fifty two,
Speaker 2: fifty three years because we met in first grade and
Speaker 2: so we've been friends since we were six years old,
Speaker 2: and so we have moved beyond really being friends and
Speaker 2: best friends. We're no different than sisters. I mean, that's
Speaker 2: how close we are, that's how much we love each other,
Speaker 2: and we have each other back and we're there for
Speaker 2: each other. And then she Kelly introduced me to a
Speaker 2: friend of hers, Laurie and she became my best friend.
Speaker 2: And so that's been nearly forty years of friendship. And
Speaker 2: so just the idea of me thinking about my sisterhood
Speaker 2: that I have with them and the relationship that I
Speaker 2: have with them, and I started thinking, you know what
Speaker 2: happens when women do meet. It might be in school
Speaker 2: at a young age. And in this case, these four women,
Speaker 2: none of them go to the same elementary school. They
Speaker 2: meet because their parents are all members of the same church,
Speaker 2: and they build this relationship and they remain friends, and
Speaker 2: they go to four separate colleges when they graduate from
Speaker 2: high school, but they still come home and they spend
Speaker 2: their time together every summer. And then they eventually graduate
Speaker 2: and make the decision to make their home back in
Speaker 2: their hometown together. And so now as the story opens,
Speaker 2: they're all forty years old, and they are as close
Speaker 2: as sisters can be. That has not changed, but they're
Speaker 2: living four different lives as it relates to their relationship statuses.
Speaker 2: And I had always wanted to write about the four
Speaker 2: of them. So Serena is still single, really wants to
Speaker 2: be married more than anything, and is wondering why she's not.
Speaker 2: Michelle is finally engaged for the very first time, about
Speaker 2: to be married in three months, but now the true
Speaker 2: first love of her life is now back on the scene,
Speaker 2: so she's kind of got some issues with that. Kenya
Speaker 2: is married, has a husband and two beautiful children, but
Speaker 2: her husband's first wife, Well you'll kind of have to
Speaker 2: read the story to read what's going out with that.
Speaker 2: And then Lynette, sadly is already divorced, is trying to
Speaker 2: navigate what it's like now to be a single mother
Speaker 2: and to get back out on the dating scene after
Speaker 2: not having done so for nearly twenty years.
Speaker 1: Now, you just told four very real scenario circumstances that
Speaker 1: someone even listening to this podcast can relate to. You
Speaker 1: got to read the book because I want to know that,
Speaker 1: Michelle get back with the you know what happened there.
Speaker 1: But you know, now, there's one book of yours that
Speaker 1: I do have. The woman Got created you to be
Speaker 1: you guys, I've always known Kimberlad to be poised, seemingly centered,
Speaker 1: ground and anchored right. But in this book, you admit
Speaker 1: that for years you weren't being the real woman God
Speaker 1: created you to be. You had an epiphany that brought
Speaker 1: that into focus. Can you share that because now you're
Speaker 1: writing about other people's stories. Now you're writing the woman
Speaker 1: God created you to be in your more autobiographical book.
Speaker 2: Yes, and that's it. And you know, it's been interesting
Speaker 2: when I finished writing The Woman Got Created You to
Speaker 2: be and was sharing the manuscript with some of my
Speaker 2: beta readers, and then when the book was released, I started,
Speaker 2: you know, of course, right away receiving feedback from readers,
Speaker 2: and I was shocked, I guess to some degree, to
Speaker 2: hear readers say I thought that I knew you. You know,
Speaker 2: I've loved your writing and I've enjoyed your storytelling, but
Speaker 2: now I feel like I have a connection with you
Speaker 2: on a whole other level.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's almost like, I think you can have a certain
Speaker 2: amount of success and people just assume you don't have issues,
Speaker 2: you don't have problems, and that life is just great,
Speaker 2: and that's just not true. And so that was one
Speaker 2: of the reasons too. I think that of all the
Speaker 2: books that I've written, I was really terrified to write it.
Speaker 2: I wasn't sure, first of all, that I could write
Speaker 2: nonfiction because I had only written fiction. When it came
Speaker 2: to the books that I had written for so many years.
Speaker 2: But I also knew that in order for me to
Speaker 2: write this book in the way I knew God was
Speaker 2: calling me to write it, I was going to have
Speaker 2: to be very transparent. And that did mean that I
Speaker 2: couldn't just talk about the happy times and the success
Speaker 2: and all of these great times and the blessings that
Speaker 2: God has you know, favored me with. I was going
Speaker 2: to have to talk about the flaws and fears and
Speaker 2: how it you know, has sometimes consumed me, and failures,
Speaker 2: you know, where maybe I said some things that I
Speaker 2: absolutely should not have said to someone, and maybe I
Speaker 2: treated someone in a way that I'm not proud of
Speaker 2: but really wanted to write about. You know, this is
Speaker 2: what I did. This is how I made changes, This
Speaker 2: is how I worked on my relationship with God. And
Speaker 2: this is how you know you can do the same thing.
Speaker 2: Or I'm hoping that it prevents you from making some
Speaker 2: of the mistakes that I've made throughout the years.
Speaker 1: Now, y'all, you got to read that book The Woman
Speaker 1: God Created You to Be, because you've heard the saying
Speaker 1: this is just how I am. Yes, I think that's
Speaker 1: an easy way out or to wait for you to
Speaker 1: stay comfortable in who you are versus. No, we can
Speaker 1: all grow, we can all get better. Yes, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't think we were created to stay the same.
Speaker 1: I told someone the other day, as long as you
Speaker 1: are growing, you will be changing. But you've got to grow,
Speaker 1: You've got to grow. But I think that this is
Speaker 1: just how I am. It's rooted in a lot of
Speaker 1: fear and pride.
Speaker 2: It is definitely both of those. And you're right, it's
Speaker 2: like any of us. If we're doing some of the
Speaker 2: same not so nice things at forty fifty sixty years
Speaker 2: old that we were doing in our teens and in
Speaker 2: our twenties, you know what, shame on us? You know,
Speaker 2: you know, shame on us, because as you said, we
Speaker 2: can grow. And you know that old cliche. When you
Speaker 2: know better, you do better, you know, and I think
Speaker 2: we should so well.
Speaker 1: The book helps break cycles because by the time you
Speaker 1: get forty and you're having some of the same results,
Speaker 1: some of the same relationship problems, whether it's business or
Speaker 1: work or with you can't keep you can't see them,
Speaker 1: maybe quite keep just regular friends. You gotta is this cyclical?
Speaker 1: What is it? You know? It could be trauma you
Speaker 1: haven't unpacked and healed from and We've got to understand too,
Speaker 1: that we deserve to be healed from stuff.
Speaker 2: We we definitely do, definitely do. And you know, I
Speaker 2: talk about pretty early on in the book, you know
Speaker 2: what's probably been the most traumatic and devastating experience in
Speaker 2: my life, and it was when my mom became terminally ill.
Speaker 2: And my mom ended up passing away at the age
Speaker 2: of fifty seven. So you know, when you're in your thirties,
Speaker 2: your early thirties, you're not expecting that you're going to
Speaker 2: lose your mother. And so that became a time in
Speaker 2: my life where you know, I did what you know.
Speaker 2: I used to hear my mom and my grandmother say
Speaker 2: you know, and I say, oh, I'll never do this
Speaker 2: or that could never happen with me, and you know,
Speaker 2: they would say, honey, just keep on living. You know,
Speaker 2: you know when you say never, you know, never say never.
Speaker 2: But I did something that I thought I would never
Speaker 2: do and likely would have criticized someone else if they
Speaker 2: admitted that, And that is I became so angry with
Speaker 2: God that I literally just didn't want to hear anything
Speaker 2: about him, and because all I could see was I've
Speaker 2: been raised up to love you, to know who you
Speaker 2: are to honor you and to trust and believe in you,
Speaker 2: and now you're going to take the most important person
Speaker 2: in my life away from me. And so I just
Speaker 2: couldn't wrap my mind around that, and so I had
Speaker 2: to grow. And so my mom she realized that she
Speaker 2: had overheard me having a conversation with Kelly. Kelly. It
Speaker 2: was the day I was on the phone with her
Speaker 2: telling her that the doctors we had just come back
Speaker 2: from Madison and they had said that they had done
Speaker 2: all they could do. And so Kelly's first response was, well,
Speaker 2: we know God has the final say. And my best friend,
Speaker 2: my best friend, who I never had spoken this way
Speaker 2: too before. When she barely finished the last word, my
Speaker 2: response was, you know what, I am so tired of
Speaker 2: you and everybody else telling me what God is going
Speaker 2: to do, because the only thing I can see is
Speaker 2: that he's taking everything away from me. And so there
Speaker 2: was just silence on the phone with both of us.
Speaker 2: And so my mom was at her house and she
Speaker 2: was in the guest bedroom and she told me, you know,
Speaker 2: a day or so later, she said, I heard you
Speaker 2: when you were having that conversation on the phone with Kelly,
Speaker 2: And she said, I started praying for you right then
Speaker 2: and there in that moment, and she said, the reason
Speaker 2: I started praying for you is because when I'm gone,
Speaker 2: He's going to be the only one you have to
Speaker 2: bring you through what you're going to go through. And
Speaker 2: so I think about that now, because she was absolutely right.
Speaker 2: It is losing her. That's what helped me turn my
Speaker 2: life around and bring me closer to God than I
Speaker 2: had ever been.
Speaker 1: Listen, I could see me being even mad at my mama.
Speaker 1: Thank you for praying. Mama, Yes, you can't be on
Speaker 1: Kelly's side too. Now I need you, I need you
Speaker 1: to console me. And here she is, yes, knowing she's
Speaker 1: going to pass away, Yeah, and she still has the
Speaker 1: strength to say, I'm praying for you.
Speaker 2: That's right, That's exactly right. And because I guess in
Speaker 2: her mind she's you know, probably you think about a
Speaker 2: mom who's like, we've raised you up, and you know,
Speaker 2: you know, that's kind of a dangerous path to be
Speaker 2: sliding along saying you're angry and through with God, you know.
Speaker 2: So you know, I'm sure that mortified her. But I
Speaker 2: was just so hurt and so angry. And then I
Speaker 2: talk about I talk about this in the book, and
Speaker 2: this was something that nobody knew, not my husband, not Kelly,
Speaker 2: not Loriie, not anybody, not my brothers, even was I
Speaker 2: was so devastated that I had finally pulled myself together
Speaker 2: and decided that I would carry out my mom's arrangements
Speaker 2: the way she had told me she wanted them to
Speaker 2: be handled, that I would be strong, I would handle
Speaker 2: her business, I would do what I needed to do,
Speaker 2: and that while you know, I didn't think I had
Speaker 2: the courage to end my life, I definitely didn't think that.
Speaker 2: Somehow I decided, you know what, though, but when it's
Speaker 2: all over and I've handled everything, if I can just
Speaker 2: get in bed and if I never get up, I
Speaker 2: don't eat, drink or do anything again, then that'll be
Speaker 2: the end of it. Literally that crossed my mind. Wow, wow,
Speaker 2: because I couldn't imagine a life without her.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, what year did she pass?
Speaker 2: Two thousand and one, and so it'll be twenty two
Speaker 2: years this year, ten years. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I know that someone listening is mad grieving, and
Speaker 1: guess what, I'm not even judging someone for being mad,
Speaker 1: because guess what, Kim, that's an emotion and natural feeling
Speaker 1: that you know, comes somebody that's listening who is upset
Speaker 1: at God over the loss of someone or something. What
Speaker 1: will you tell them right now?
Speaker 2: You know, I would tell them to stay prayerful, to
Speaker 2: know that God truly is who he says he is,
Speaker 2: and that you know the scripture and it says, you know,
Speaker 2: weeping mate, endure for a night. As many times as
Speaker 2: we have heard that joy truly does come in the morning,
Speaker 2: and that had I not allowed my faith to return,
Speaker 2: and had I not gotten myself back on track and
Speaker 2: just reconnected with God and worked on my relationship with him,
Speaker 2: I would not have gotten through the grief. I'm not
Speaker 2: sure how I would have made it through the morning
Speaker 2: process had it not been for him. I mean, he
Speaker 2: carried me completely through and I went from having a
Speaker 2: relationship to him to having a relationship with him on
Speaker 2: a level that I had not even known before.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing. I can imagine that
Speaker 1: experience alone inspired so many other portions of books. When
Speaker 1: you were saying that, I even just saw cinematography on
Speaker 1: your mother overhearing that conversation, like I could see that
Speaker 1: I see that I've been seeing the past few months
Speaker 1: or so this year about a master class, Yes, that
Speaker 1: you have. There is a waiting list though, apparently kimber
Speaker 1: La Laws and Roby Writing and Publishing master Class. Why
Speaker 1: have you decided to do that?
Speaker 2: I finally decided to do it because, well, for a
Speaker 2: number of years, I've been asked by readers, will you
Speaker 2: ever do workshops? Will you ever do some sort of
Speaker 2: class on writing? Sometimes it's you know, I've already finished
Speaker 2: writing my book, but now I need to know what
Speaker 2: to do next. So can you talk about the different
Speaker 2: versions of publishing? How do I get a literary agent,
Speaker 2: and how do I go about promoting my work once
Speaker 2: it is published? And so a lot of times I
Speaker 2: will talk to folks on the phone, you know, just
Speaker 2: depending on how much time I have, I'll talk to
Speaker 2: people in person at events. I'll respond with lengthy email
Speaker 2: messages if I have time. And so that was sort
Speaker 2: of it. But now fast forwarding to this year, I
Speaker 2: started receiving more questions than usual, And I think it
Speaker 2: kind of has something to do. Even with the pandemic,
Speaker 2: I would say, I think so many people now things
Speaker 2: that they've wanted to do or had dreams about doing,
Speaker 2: They're moving forward with it much more frequently than we've
Speaker 2: probably seen in the past, and so I thought, you know, now,
Speaker 2: in this day of zoom and doing everything online, you know,
Speaker 2: maybe I should create something that I can offer in
Speaker 2: that particular platform. And so from there both of the
Speaker 2: master classes were born, one for writing and then one
Speaker 2: for publishing and promoting your work.
Speaker 1: And I think so many people have discovered purpose. And
Speaker 1: like you said during the pandemic, matter of fact, there's
Speaker 1: something you say in your book, so much of what
Speaker 1: you loved doing as a child has everything to do
Speaker 1: with your assigned purpose. Then you ask the question do
Speaker 1: you know your purpose? And you're so right? What were
Speaker 1: you passionate about? And that still even something that grinds
Speaker 1: your gears right now that you feel like if I
Speaker 1: could just get my hands in there, I could fix
Speaker 1: this and some of the most life changing. A lot
Speaker 1: of people have found wealth, all types of wealth, emotional
Speaker 1: of course, financial wealth by being the solution to a
Speaker 1: problem that they felt. You know, And so I love
Speaker 1: that you pose that question and you have the answer. Well,
Speaker 1: so much of what you love doing as a child
Speaker 1: has everything to do with your assigned purpose. Now, Women
Speaker 1: who writes Books dot Com is where you can redister
Speaker 1: Sture for the online Writing or Publishing Masterclass. There is
Speaker 1: still a waiting list. When will it go live again?
Speaker 2: Well, either the first part of September. And actually I'm
Speaker 2: working on something now because I've had so many folks
Speaker 2: contact me over these last three months. I did it
Speaker 2: in May, and then June and then July, you know, saying,
Speaker 2: you know, is it possible that you could just create
Speaker 2: a recording that I could have access to because they've
Speaker 2: just not been able to work things out scheduling wise
Speaker 2: so that they can attend. I've done weekdays, I've done
Speaker 2: the weekend, and so I'm thinking about doing that. But
Speaker 2: whether I make the recorded one available for registration or
Speaker 2: I do the live the next one will be in September.
Speaker 1: Okay, amazing. All right, So y'all women who write books
Speaker 1: dot com. If you are a writer, y'all register now.
Speaker 1: Do have a question, and I know that's what the
Speaker 1: mass classes for. What is a common mistake that maybe
Speaker 1: self published authors do? Well?
Speaker 2: That's like the easy one. I could almost barely wait
Speaker 2: for you to finish asking the question because I always
Speaker 2: tell this like, okay, please take this through you know
Speaker 2: the right way. Don't take it the wrong way to
Speaker 2: writers when I'm talking to them, but I'm trying to
Speaker 2: be honest because I want them to be the best
Speaker 2: that they can be. Sometimes I will read manuscripts or
Speaker 2: books that have already been self published, and the writing
Speaker 2: is better than I would ever be able to do.
Speaker 2: That's how great the writing or the story is. But
Speaker 2: the editing is a whole other story. And so many
Speaker 2: times writers will finish writing their book, they will maybe
Speaker 2: have a proofreader take a quick look at it, looking
Speaker 2: for typos and spacing errors, and then that's where it ends.
Speaker 2: But you definitely want to hire three sets of editors.
Speaker 2: The first is a kind tent and developmental editor you
Speaker 2: want to go through your rewrites and your revisions. Then
Speaker 2: you want to hire a freelance copy editor that's sort
Speaker 2: of the middle ground person for further fine tuning. And
Speaker 2: then you want to hire a freelance proofreader. And so
Speaker 2: the biggest mistake is that most self published writers do
Speaker 2: not hire the three separate editing professionals.
Speaker 1: And you got to invest. Yes, you can't cut corners.
Speaker 2: No, it's like save. If it takes a year, let
Speaker 2: it be a year. You know, I've seen instances where
Speaker 2: someone has contacted me asked me what they should do.
Speaker 2: I've given recommendations on some of the best freelancers that
Speaker 2: I know of that come highly recommended by lots of
Speaker 2: writers who have used them, and two or three weeks
Speaker 2: later their book is available on Amazon, and so that
Speaker 2: means they didn't think that advice was necessary.
Speaker 1: Well, y'all, you have to take it from the best,
Speaker 1: someone that's been on the New York Times Best Selling
Speaker 1: List USA Today's List. Maya Angelou has definitely recommended her
Speaker 1: books as must read. Do you read other people's books?
Speaker 1: I do what has been what has been a read?
Speaker 1: What y'all like? Y'all of course read my books, but
Speaker 1: read this one right?
Speaker 2: Wow? You know I have a number of different ones now,
Speaker 2: I have to say, over these last you know, three
Speaker 2: to four years, it's been more nonfiction. Yeah, and so
Speaker 2: believe bigger? Is I believe that Marshan. Yeah, it's just
Speaker 2: that's a book that it's been out now for a
Speaker 2: few years. But I love that book so much that
Speaker 2: if you went into my Amazon account, you'd see where
Speaker 2: I had that ship to five different people.
Speaker 1: Isn't it amazing? It is?
Speaker 2: Yes, amazing?
Speaker 1: So funny you should she acts for my address today,
Speaker 1: Oh God, And I'm gonna make sure that I get
Speaker 1: yours and whatever she's sending me, I'm gonna tell her
Speaker 1: to send it to you please, because no matter what
Speaker 1: state you're in, like I started, what was that twenty
Speaker 1: twenty one, twenty twenty maybe, and you still have to
Speaker 1: pick that up because you'd be like, I'm believing bigger.
Speaker 1: It didn't season a change, and yes, your belief kind
Speaker 1: of waivers a little bit, and so you definitely want to, Yes,
Speaker 1: believe bigger for sure. And if I'm also not mistaken,
Speaker 1: you do you have a podcast?
Speaker 2: I do?
Speaker 1: I do?
Speaker 2: I'm in yes, you to be And so I have
Speaker 2: not started the next season. I'm planning to do that
Speaker 2: very soon. But yeah, based on the book.
Speaker 1: So amazing, that's uh. Checking in This podcast was birthed
Speaker 1: from my book, but you know, weekly wanted to make
Speaker 1: sure to check in with people from various walks of life.
Speaker 1: And I'm so glad that you took some time to
Speaker 1: check in with us today.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you and telling.
Speaker 1: Us about such an inspiring journey. I'm really glad and
Speaker 1: grateful that you've had a supportive family to help you
Speaker 1: and push you what if somebody My last question is
Speaker 1: what if somebody says, well, Kimberla, I think that's great.
Speaker 1: I'm excited and grateful. I'm not hating that you had
Speaker 1: your mom or husband to support you. But my family
Speaker 1: we hate on my dreams. What can I do?
Speaker 2: You know? And I talk about that somewhere in the
Speaker 2: book too. It's like, make sure you eliminate and ignore
Speaker 2: the naysayers. They were around. I had a few here
Speaker 2: and there who kind of looked at me crazy when
Speaker 2: I said I was writing my first book. You know,
Speaker 2: you know, some of the looks were, you know, wow,
Speaker 2: you know that's nice, you know, and they move on
Speaker 2: to another conversation. Some people looked at me like, you know,
Speaker 2: you must be absolutely out of your mind. And so
Speaker 2: I remember it. That's discouraging that that can really make
Speaker 2: you second guess yourself. And so I had to stop
Speaker 2: talking about it, you know, my dreams to those people.
Speaker 2: So you learn very quickly you need to figure out
Speaker 2: who that circle of friends and family members are, who's
Speaker 2: going to support you, who's going to make you accountable,
Speaker 2: who's going to tell you to keep going no matter what,
Speaker 2: And that's who you want to keep in your presence
Speaker 2: throughout that process.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, y'all, Chamberla, Laws and Roby, thank you
Speaker 1: for checking in.
Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2: It's an honor. I love you, and I'm just so
Speaker 2: grateful to have the opportunity.
Speaker 1: We've been trying to get together, you know, and stuff
Speaker 1: going on. You know, please please please, I would love
Speaker 1: to partner with you and what you got going on
Speaker 1: in our hometown about a ready yes, all right, y'all,
Speaker 1: weren't y'all inspired and just motivated? I am so inspired
Speaker 1: and motivated to do some things that I've been kind
Speaker 1: of holding on to out of fear. And I hope
Speaker 1: that this has given you the courage to kind of
Speaker 1: step out the boat and do what it is that
Speaker 1: you know that you are supposed to be doing and
Speaker 1: know that it's gonna work out, even if there's failure
Speaker 1: along the way, some hiccups, some frustration, but at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, you're going to be so glad.
Speaker 1: So while I encourage you, will you encourage me as well.
Speaker 1: All right, love y'all, Thank y'all so much for checking in.
Speaker 1: Checking In with Michelle Williams is a production of iHeartRadio
Speaker 1: and The Black Effect. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit
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