1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm ebonymone and I'm Rick Schwartz, and we're here 2 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:10,120 Speaker 1: from the San Diego Zoo Wildlife Alliance, the global conservation 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: organization behind the world chame of San Diego Zoo and 4 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: Safari Park, and together we're excited to announce the podcast 5 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 1: Amazing Wildlife. Here incredible stories about wildlife and the global 6 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,320 Speaker 1: efforts to save it as we explore the connection between humans, wildlife, 7 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: and the environment. Listen to Amazing Wildlife on the I 8 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. 9 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: Advertising is online and delivered where you are. 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The more we 19 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 1: learn about COVID nineteen, the more questions we have the 20 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 1: biggest question, now, what's next? What will COVID bring in 21 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:22,600 Speaker 1: six months a year. If you're feeling anxious about the future, 22 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: You're not alone. Cal Hope offers free COVID nineteen emotional 23 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 1: support call eight three three four six seven three or 24 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:39,400 Speaker 1: live chat at cal hope dot org. Today, Cathy guys 25 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 1: White gave the commencement speech at her alma mater, the 26 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: University of Michigan, talking about what she talks about best, 27 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: the insecurities of working American women. The world expects so 28 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 1: much of you right now. You'll be expected to be 29 00:01:55,920 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 1: a dynamic businessperson, financial wizard, nurturing homemaker and lightened involved parent, 30 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 1: environmental activist, physical fitness expert, a sexy and alluring yet 31 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: responsible partner, champion of human rights, independent thinker, community activists, 32 00:02:11,400 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 1: and if you're a woman, a size five, all at once. Today, 33 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: when the message is that anyone can do anything, it's 34 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 1: going to be very hard for you not to feel 35 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 1: that everyone else is doing something and that you personally 36 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: are stuck in your same old ruts. And just in 37 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: case normal humans insecurity doesn't nail you, you'll be bombarded 38 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,799 Speaker 1: by images that will try look at how women are bombarded. 39 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: Look at the commercials. Look at how they picture men 40 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 1: and women in the commercials. Men and commercials are always 41 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 1: doing one thing. The women are doing six things at once. Now, 42 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: the man in the commercial will be mowing the lawn 43 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 1: one job. The woman in the commercial is giving herself 44 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 1: a beauty treatment for her hands while she does the dishes. 45 00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: The man in the commercial is grilling a steak one job. 46 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 1: The woman in the commercial is simultaneously cleaningly of and 47 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: disinfecting the floor, popping a five course meal in the microwave, 48 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: and faxing the office while explaining the miracle of feminine 49 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 1: hygiene products to her daughter. And if you think that 50 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: doesn't translate into real life expectations, head for Detroit during 51 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: rush hours some morning and look around you on the freeway. 52 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: If you've been listening to this show, you won't be 53 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: surprised to hear the creator of Cathy Comics talking about 54 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: the unreasonable expectations often pushed on women, the sorts of 55 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 1: expectations that make one say acc speaking hypothetically. Of course, 56 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:56,480 Speaker 1: Cathy Comics certainly changed in tone and mission as the 57 00:03:56,480 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: strip went on, but it serves as a document of 58 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 1: a woman's insecure rities and concerns for thirty four consecutive 59 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:06,360 Speaker 1: years between nineteen seventy six ten, and the issues mentioned 60 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: and not mentioned aligned pretty closely with mainstream liberal views 61 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 1: on women of this time. There's also plenty to say 62 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 1: about what this commentary does not reference, a reflection of 63 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:22,600 Speaker 1: how American feminism has historically either ignored or been actively 64 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: hostile to the interests of women of color, queer women, 65 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,200 Speaker 1: and working class women. So in this episode, I'm gonna 66 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 1: let Kathy lead us through American feminist issues according to 67 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: the funny pages, and I'll fill in some blanks of 68 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 1: what does not appear. So she passed into the world 69 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy six, she's at what, she's out on dates, 70 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: and she don't lack politics. From Mama and urban to 71 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:52,039 Speaker 1: feminist friends. She's fighting all the stands it with chocolate 72 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 1: and hair. Kathy. She's fighting back to stress with success. 73 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:23,840 Speaker 1: Let's snack Cathy pan She's got luck going all. So 74 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 1: not to be patronizing, but Kathy cartoons did not invent feminism, 75 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: So we do require a little bit of set up 76 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: here in order for all of the expectations that eventually 77 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: stress our heroine out. During the second wave of feminism 78 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:40,920 Speaker 1: to exist in the first place, a lot of social 79 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:45,240 Speaker 1: gains had to be made beforehand. And quick disclaimer here, 80 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: I will be the first to say that this episode 81 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: will in no way be comprehensive, and so I want 82 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: to see at the top. I don't have the purview 83 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 1: to give a full overview of the history of American feminism. 84 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 1: You could be in school for years on that topic. 85 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: But I will be including further re sources in the 86 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 1: show notes to help bridge those gaps. So to begin, 87 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 1: we have to take a look at the first wave 88 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:09,719 Speaker 1: of American feminism, which leads us to where Kathy alternatively 89 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:13,840 Speaker 1: thrives and fails in the second wave. So let's go 90 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: back to the year eighteen forty eight. Okay, I can 91 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 1: already hear you growning. That's so long ago. Sit down 92 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: and listen. This is going somewhere, I repeat. Was popularly 93 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 1: considered to be the launch of the first wave of 94 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 1: American feminism with the first formal women's rights convention in 95 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,760 Speaker 1: Seneca Falls, New York. This wave, while containing many steps 96 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:45,720 Speaker 1: forward and eventually steps backward, is considered to have continued 97 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:49,360 Speaker 1: through when women got the vote in the US victories 98 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 1: along the way included increased educational opportunities, wives being granted 99 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:57,160 Speaker 1: custody of their own children, women being able to own 100 00:06:57,240 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 1: property in their own name, and of course the vote. 101 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 1: In the first wave of feminism and in every wave since, 102 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:07,240 Speaker 1: middle class white women have been disproportionately centered in how 103 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 1: the activism is discussed and treated in pop culture. This 104 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: was well on display during this first wave. The majority 105 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:18,240 Speaker 1: of commonly discussed women of this era and American feminism 106 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 1: are white. Your Susan B. Anthony's your Elizabeth, Katie Stanton's 107 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 1: your Lucretia Motts, You're Lucy Stones. While American feminists had 108 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:29,119 Speaker 1: certainly existed for some time, it's in the mid eighteen 109 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 1: hundreds that they began to organize in large numbers. Much 110 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:36,920 Speaker 1: of this early organization drew inspiration from prior experiences with 111 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 1: the temperance and abolition movements. Here's what historian Manisha Sinha 112 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,760 Speaker 1: in The Slaves Cause, A History of Abolition said of 113 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 1: first wave American feminism. If not all female abolitionists became 114 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:55,400 Speaker 1: women's rights activists, pioneering feminists owed their public careers to abolition, 115 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 1: while women of color spoke not just about the oppression 116 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: of their gender, but race and class. The white middle 117 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:04,760 Speaker 1: class figureheads of the first wave often ignored or made 118 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 1: their insights unwelcome. There were divides among white feminists as well. 119 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 1: Working class women were concerned with factory conditions and labor exploitation, 120 00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:15,920 Speaker 1: while white women of the middle class and above were 121 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:20,080 Speaker 1: primarily concerned with gaining rights as individuals outside of marriage, 122 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 1: including the ability to own property, have child custody, and vote. 123 00:08:24,480 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: Feminist scholar and general legend Angela Davis explains why upper 124 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: class white women gained an interest in seeking suffrage for 125 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:36,360 Speaker 1: women around this time in her classic book Women, Race 126 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 1: and Class. An ideological consequence of industrial capitalism was the 127 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 1: shaping of a more rigorous notion of female inferiority. It seemed, 128 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 1: in fact, that the more women's domestic duty shrank under 129 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: the impact of industrialization, the more ridge became the assertation 130 00:08:51,559 --> 00:08:54,840 Speaker 1: that women's place was in the home. Have been productive 131 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:56,960 Speaker 1: workers within the home economy, and their labor have been 132 00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:00,200 Speaker 1: no less respected than their men's. The many back tring 133 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:02,319 Speaker 1: moved out of the home and into the factory. The 134 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:04,599 Speaker 1: ideology of women who begin to raise the wife and 135 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: mother is ideal. As workers. Women had at least enjoyed 136 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: the economic quality, but as wives there were destined to 137 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:16,600 Speaker 1: become appendagous to their men, servants to their husband's As mothers, 138 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 1: they would be defined as passive vehicles for the replenishment 139 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:23,640 Speaker 1: of human life. The situation for that white housewife was 140 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:29,199 Speaker 1: full of contradictions, and it bears much repeating that black feminists, 141 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:32,959 Speaker 1: many of them born into slavery prior to abolition, were 142 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 1: instrumental in this movement, although their contributions are frequently and 143 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 1: unfairly deemphasized by white feminists even today. So journal Truth 144 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:43,439 Speaker 1: was one of the most prominent Black women in the 145 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 1: movement at this time, speaking about her experiences intersectionally as 146 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:51,280 Speaker 1: both a formerly enslaved Black person and as a woman. 147 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 1: Here's a quote from her famous speech Ain't I a Woman? 148 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 1: From an Akrons Women Convention in eighteen fifty one, read 149 00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:03,679 Speaker 1: by performer st for the Sojourner True Project. In I 150 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: am a woman's right. I have as much muscle as 151 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 1: any man, and I can do as much work as 152 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 1: any man. I have plot and reaped and husked and 153 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 1: chopped and mode, and can any man do better than that? 154 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:31,480 Speaker 1: I have heard much about the sexiest being equal. I 155 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:34,319 Speaker 1: can carry as much as any man, and I can 156 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 1: eat as much too. If I can get it, I 157 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: am as strong as any man. That is today the 158 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: poor man seemed to be all in confusion. They don't 159 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:52,679 Speaker 1: know what to do. Why children, If you have woman's rights, 160 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,760 Speaker 1: give it to her and you will feel better. You 161 00:10:57,320 --> 00:11:01,000 Speaker 1: have your own rights, and they will be so much trouble. 162 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,679 Speaker 1: While truth speech was a huge hit in eighteen fifty one, 163 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:08,560 Speaker 1: Angela Davis explains that a number of white women at 164 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:11,680 Speaker 1: the conference did not want truth the only black woman 165 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 1: at the convention to speak at all. The racism displayed 166 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: by white feminists of this time is worthy of more 167 00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:21,440 Speaker 1: discussion and has been chronicled in seminal text like White Tears, 168 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: Brown Scars by Ruby hammad On, Intersectionality by Kimberly Crenshaw, 169 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:29,240 Speaker 1: and Davis's Women, Race and Class, among many many others. 170 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:31,800 Speaker 1: I will link to these books in the description of 171 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:34,320 Speaker 1: this episode. What needs to be said is this white 172 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:37,560 Speaker 1: feminist leaders like Susan B. Anthony and Elizabeth Katie Stanton, 173 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,839 Speaker 1: who had supported the abolition of slavery and even worked 174 00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: with Frederick Douglas to win the vote quote for both 175 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 1: women and African Americans unquote, would later actively work against 176 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:52,439 Speaker 1: the black vote and the interests of black women in particular, 177 00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 1: over and over in an attempt to get white women 178 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 1: the vote ahead of black men. The message being sent 179 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 1: by these leaders is clear. The white woman's vote took 180 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 1: precedence over all women's votes for Anthony and Stanton. Following 181 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 1: the dissolution of their alliance with Douglas, who had previously 182 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 1: stood up for the woman's vote at the Seneca Falls 183 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:15,559 Speaker 1: Convention in eighteen forty eight, Stanton and Anthony created the 184 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 1: National American Woman's Suffrage Association in eighteen sixty nine, specifically 185 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: to oppose the fifteenth Amendment, which granted black men the vote. 186 00:12:24,800 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: Anthony famously said she would cut off her right arm 187 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:31,439 Speaker 1: before demanding voting rights for black men instead of women. 188 00:12:31,640 --> 00:12:34,679 Speaker 1: With the significant biases of white leaders in mind, one 189 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:37,439 Speaker 1: of the strengths of the first wave of feminism was 190 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: its clear goal and focus, which was suffrage, and after 191 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,319 Speaker 1: seventy years, that was achieved in nineteen twenty. In these years, 192 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:48,120 Speaker 1: even the most liberal wings of the movement were met 193 00:12:48,200 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 1: with vitriol from American patriarchy. A best selling book in 194 00:12:51,559 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 1: eighteen seventy three stated that women could not last in 195 00:12:54,400 --> 00:12:58,000 Speaker 1: careers and would suffer quote exhaustion of the feminine nervous 196 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:01,599 Speaker 1: system unquote, and President Theodore Roosevelt once said that a 197 00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: white woman who postponed childbirth to do literally anything else 198 00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 1: was a race trader. So in the years of this movement, 199 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,560 Speaker 1: steps were made in the right direction. Women gained access 200 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 1: to higher education to keeping their wages, as well as 201 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 1: early whisperings of widespread birth control access. Following the success 202 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,079 Speaker 1: of the women Suffrage movement in securing the vote, the 203 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:26,719 Speaker 1: nearly seventy five years of consistent feminist activism began to 204 00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: slow down, in part due to active antagonism from American 205 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:35,040 Speaker 1: patriarchal structures who blacklisted feminists from publishing their work in 206 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:39,840 Speaker 1: major publications and labeled many communists and a quote serious 207 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:42,559 Speaker 1: threat to the country. This led to one of the 208 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: most notable backlashes against the gains of feminists in American history. 209 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: But keep in mind that even with this passing, black 210 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:54,040 Speaker 1: women's votes were still not treated equally. Martha S. Jones, 211 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:57,959 Speaker 1: author of Vanguard, How Black women broke barriers, won the 212 00:13:58,080 --> 00:14:01,520 Speaker 1: vote and insisted on equality, were all told time in 213 00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 1: the following quote, the nineteenth Amendment did not eliminate the 214 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 1: state laws that operated to keep Black Americans from the 215 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:13,199 Speaker 1: polls via poll taxes and literacy tests, nor did the 216 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: nineteenth Amendment address violence or lynching. Some African American women 217 00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: will vote with the Nineteenth Amendment unquote. This backlash is 218 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 1: carefully documented by writer Susan Kaluti in her book Backlash, 219 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 1: which documents both the major American feminist movements and the 220 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: near certainty that periods of women's gains would be followed 221 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: by a period of severe backlash, backlash that extends to 222 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: the political, to the cultural, and within the feminist movement itself. 223 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:47,200 Speaker 1: Valuti describes the first twentieth century backlash as happening in 224 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:50,520 Speaker 1: the nineteen twenties, with a wave of anti feminist media 225 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 1: demonization of women who wanted to get divorces or abortions, 226 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: and an increased emphasis on looks and consumptions, exemplified by 227 00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 1: the rise of the Miss America agent that started in 228 00:15:02,120 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: the same year that women got the vote. And the 229 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:07,920 Speaker 1: thing about backlashes is they tend to erase a lot 230 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 1: of progress. According to Fluti, by nine there were fewer 231 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 1: women doctors than there had been in nineteen. Fast forward 232 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: a bit to the late thirties early forties, women surged 233 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 1: back into the workplace in America. During World War Two, 234 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:24,360 Speaker 1: with men leaving the country to fight in the war, 235 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 1: five to six million women entered the workforce, two million 236 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: of which entered heavy industry jobs. The government began to 237 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 1: provide wild stuff like daycare assistants, Working class women fought 238 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 1: for unions, and young girls grew up wanting their own careers. 239 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,000 Speaker 1: And keep in mind that this is the era that 240 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 1: Kathy guiss Wide's mother, as well as the comic character 241 00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:47,040 Speaker 1: of Mom, would have been growing up in. But when 242 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 1: the war ended, backlash again, where the Rosie the riveter 243 00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: messaging of women's roles in war efforts led some to 244 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 1: believe that their place in the workplace was here to stay. 245 00:15:57,440 --> 00:16:00,840 Speaker 1: In came the nineteen fifties, those a million women in 246 00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: heavy industry laid off and forced out of their job 247 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: to make room for veterans returning for war. As ever, 248 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:11,080 Speaker 1: working class and women of color often remained in the workplace, 249 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 1: but not with the same status or pay as in 250 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 1: the wartime. Women were denied unemployment pay flat out, and 251 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 1: middle class white women were generally pushed into the Donna 252 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: Reed nineteen fifties era cult of domesticity. Just ten years later, 253 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,920 Speaker 1: the culture dictated that jobs and education were very unfeminine, 254 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: and calling yourself a feminist was once again and athema. Anathema, 255 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 1: and calling yourself a feminist was once again an athema. 256 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 1: Never said that word out loud before, Good job, Jamie, Okay. 257 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:46,240 Speaker 1: Integral to this and all periods of backlash is an 258 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 1: emphasis on consumerism and on improving the individual. The economy 259 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,080 Speaker 1: is flourishing in the nineties and fifties in the US 260 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 1: made women a larger consumer block than ever, and defining 261 00:16:57,760 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 1: oneself through consumption was a great way to distract from, 262 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:05,440 Speaker 1: you know, being mad about not having rights. Kathy Guys White, 263 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: born in nineteen fifty spent her formative years within a 264 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: period of backlash that predated the second wave feminist movement, 265 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 1: which most people consider to have been started in nineteen 266 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: sixty eight, when a New York Times magazine article by 267 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:22,199 Speaker 1: Martha Lear coining the term was released. So where were 268 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 1: women's rights by the sixties? Hey everyone, it's dramas from 269 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 1: Life as a Gringo podcast. I Heart Radio. Sounds of 270 00:17:36,760 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 1: My Culture is brought to you by Stay Farm. As 271 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 1: Stay Farm, we know how important it is to celebrate 272 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 1: Hispanic heritage every day. That's why we support Michael and 273 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:50,320 Speaker 1: invite you to continue enjoying all its great podcasts. We 274 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 1: also know what it takes to manage money, no matter 275 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:55,439 Speaker 1: the budget. That's why it's a good idea to consider 276 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 1: State Farm and the surprisingly great rates. Like a good neighbor, 277 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:04,720 Speaker 1: Stay Farm is all right, Prince Royce, my guy, thank 278 00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,880 Speaker 1: you for hanging out, and I gotta say listen. I'm 279 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: I'm curious when you look back on growing up in 280 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,920 Speaker 1: a Latino community, what comes to mind for you. I 281 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:16,840 Speaker 1: think growing up in New York and being surrounded by 282 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 1: so much Latin culture was a blessing for me. I 283 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: think I was able to listen to so many different 284 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 1: genres of music, from hip hop to salsa to medding, 285 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 1: get to rock, go to and I think that that's 286 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: what I loved about New York. There was such a 287 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: big present community of of everything. Support TUA all year 288 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,960 Speaker 1: long by listening to the MICA podcast network available on 289 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 1: the I Heart radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you 290 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:48,200 Speaker 1: listen to podcasts. Do you own or rent your home? 291 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:50,440 Speaker 1: Sure you do, And I bet it can be hard work. 292 00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:55,120 Speaker 1: You know, it's easy bundling policies with ga Geico makes 293 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 1: it easy to bundle your homeowners or renters insurance along 294 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:01,240 Speaker 1: with your auto policy. 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Like a good neighbor. 305 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:36,360 Speaker 1: State Farm is there, call or go to state Farm 306 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 1: dot com for a quote today. If you could talk 307 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 1: to me a little bit about the process you went through. 308 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:46,440 Speaker 1: And I think it's good to not pat yourself on 309 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: the back, but to put it out there so other 310 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 1: people can kind of hear what it takes. Like I 311 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 1: don't know. I always look at like this, like what 312 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: do I want? I wanted to be at w w 313 00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:56,440 Speaker 1: WE Superstar all right, what does it take to be 314 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 1: a WW superstar? What are the tools I will need 315 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,680 Speaker 1: to give me every possible opportunity I can get? And 316 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 1: so I took the tools of acting classes, improv classes, 317 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:09,720 Speaker 1: wrestling school, everything I possibly can to knock on the 318 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 1: door of w W. The people of the everyone on 319 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:14,160 Speaker 1: that Real World Show would wear my T shirts, would 320 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: always ask me like they were so supportive, like you 321 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 1: don't give it that very often? Really don't listen to 322 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,440 Speaker 1: the Michael Doua podcast network available on the I Heart 323 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. 324 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:41,560 Speaker 1: The nineteen President's Commission on the Status of Women Report, 325 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:46,360 Speaker 1: which was initially commissioned by a preassassinated President Kennedy Remember him. 326 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 1: People love that guy? But would they have if he 327 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: had We'll never know. This commission was led by Eleanor Roosevelt, 328 00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:55,480 Speaker 1: and while it was still very you better be a mommy, 329 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:58,960 Speaker 1: eventually in its tone, this report acknowledged a lot of 330 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 1: commonly recognized discriminations against women, using hard federal data to 331 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:08,960 Speaker 1: back it up. These acknowledgements included recognition of the wage gap, 332 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 1: of employment inequality, of low support for working class women, 333 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: and women of color, of a dearth of child care services, 334 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:18,640 Speaker 1: and on and on, and just like with the first wave, 335 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,480 Speaker 1: this feminist movement came on the heels of a major 336 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: racial reckoning in the United States via the Civil Rights Movement, 337 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: where again black women in leadership positions spoke on their 338 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: role in American society, intersectionally with leaders like Marianne Weathers, 339 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 1: Ella Baker, who founded the Student Non Violent Coordinating Committee 340 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,280 Speaker 1: and more. During the Civil Rights Movement, black women worked 341 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 1: from the radical and liberal wings and were instrumental in 342 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:46,640 Speaker 1: community organizing that led to wins like the Civil Rights 343 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:49,200 Speaker 1: Act of nineteen sixty four and the Voting Rights Act 344 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,240 Speaker 1: of nineteen sixty five, and by the late nineteen sixties, 345 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:55,399 Speaker 1: a new wave of the women's movement had certainly been building. 346 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:59,880 Speaker 1: Challenging American white patriarchal structures were moved along by both 347 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,119 Speaker 1: the Civil Rights Movement and the energy from the protests 348 00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 1: surrounding the Vietnam War, as well as the growing number 349 00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:11,080 Speaker 1: of options in American feminist literature and organizations. Which brings 350 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 1: me to Betty for Dan. Oh, you thought we weren't 351 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:17,440 Speaker 1: going to get to Betty for Dan while buckling. She 352 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 1: is best known as the author of nineteen sixty three, 353 00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:25,440 Speaker 1: is the feminine mystique a gospel for dissatisfied housewives that 354 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,920 Speaker 1: bucked and rejected the idea that a woman naturally derives 355 00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: purpose from marriage, children, and housework. We'll get to its 356 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,880 Speaker 1: shortcomings in a bit, but this mystique was, as free 357 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: Dan put it, quote the problem that has no name, unquote, 358 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:43,640 Speaker 1: and this clearly spoke to a young Kathy Guy's wife. 359 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:47,160 Speaker 1: She references the feminine mystique in her work constantly, both 360 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:50,360 Speaker 1: through her character and through herself. Here she is describing 361 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,200 Speaker 1: her teen in college years in a PBS News Hour 362 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 1: clip promoting her essay collection Fifty Things That Aren't My Fault. 363 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:04,000 Speaker 1: Generation was right in between the two Betties, Betty Crocker 364 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,360 Speaker 1: and Betty for Dan, and I wanted to be both 365 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 1: of them, and a lot of women did at that time. 366 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 1: It was and I literally gained forty pounds on one 367 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:17,920 Speaker 1: Betty's chocolate funge layer cake mix while rating the other 368 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: Betty's feminine mistake. And a lot of women I think 369 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:26,240 Speaker 1: found themselves like the place I was him. But she's 370 00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:29,240 Speaker 1: not wrong. Betty for Dan is a Betty of note, 371 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: for better and for worse for Dan was one of 372 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 1: the figureheads of the liberal wing of the second Wave, 373 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 1: going on to found the NW the National Organization for 374 00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:42,920 Speaker 1: Women in n with forty eight others. Like Anthony and 375 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:48,119 Speaker 1: Stanton before them, the organization was extremely polarizing throughout the 376 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 1: second Wave due to it say it with me over 377 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 1: emphasis on the issues of straight, middle class white women 378 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 1: above everyone else. Also, like the first movement, the liberal 379 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 1: wing of the second Wave came with a pretty clearly 380 00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 1: defined goal. It was all about passing the e R, 381 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 1: a equal Rights Amendment, a proposed constitutional amendment that had 382 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:12,440 Speaker 1: been unsuccessful in making progress since ninety three. The amendment 383 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:16,280 Speaker 1: sought to and get ready for some controversial stuff, guarantee 384 00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:19,880 Speaker 1: legal rights regardless of gender. To this day, it's never 385 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:23,119 Speaker 1: been signed into law. Isn't that nice. This area of 386 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 1: the movement was popularly referred to as women's liberation, and 387 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,400 Speaker 1: there was a part of it women's libbers. The struggle 388 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:34,440 Speaker 1: to apply women's lib to everyday life is thoroughly explored 389 00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 1: in the first few years of the Kathy comics. But 390 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:41,320 Speaker 1: women of color, while again being sidelined and actively disregarded 391 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 1: by liberal, white centered organizations such as the now were 392 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,440 Speaker 1: extremely active during the Second Wave years. Some organizations of 393 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,240 Speaker 1: note membership in the Black Panther Party was over sixty women. 394 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 1: Kathleen Cleaver, who was a communication secretary with the Panthers, 395 00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: was once asked what a woman's role in the revolution was, 396 00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,680 Speaker 1: and he replied, quote no one ever asks what a 397 00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: man's place in the revolution is unquote. The National Black 398 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: Feminist Organization, founded in nineteen seventy three, was one of 399 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:11,880 Speaker 1: the first to include a lesbian agenda as a part 400 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 1: of their mission statement. Asian feminists were extremely active organizers 401 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,879 Speaker 1: as well, with projects like Asian Sisters in l A 402 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 1: drug Abuse Center founded in nineteen seventy one, and the 403 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 1: l A Asian Women's Center was an organizing hub until 404 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: it closed in seventy six. In nineteen seventy four, Indigenous 405 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:33,159 Speaker 1: American women formed the Women of All Read Nations or WARREN, 406 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,480 Speaker 1: based on concepts of tribal women's traditions and with the 407 00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:42,000 Speaker 1: key distinction that patriarchy and colonialism were inseparable concepts. And 408 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,280 Speaker 1: because of the hostility that these organizations were sometimes met 409 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 1: with by the white feminist main stream, the label of 410 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:52,639 Speaker 1: feminists sometimes be resisted. Here's Angela Davis speaking on this 411 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: ATEN talk at the Center of Contemporary Culture in Barcelona. 412 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 1: Everybody started referring to me as a feminists and my 413 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:05,159 Speaker 1: response was, I'm not a feminist, you know, I'm a 414 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 1: black revolutionary because I didn't see how the two had 415 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: anything to do with each other. But I realized that 416 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: I was talking about a certain kind of feminism, a 417 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 1: bourgeois feminism, a feminism that is still white, white bourgeois feminism, 418 00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: which is unfortunately the the most represented feminism today, and 419 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 1: most people think of that as feminism, but that ignores 420 00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:42,600 Speaker 1: the fact that huge numbers of organic and academic intellectuals 421 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 1: who are women of color have transform the very nature 422 00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:53,680 Speaker 1: of feminism. And the hallmark of feminism today is what 423 00:26:53,840 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 1: we call intersectionality, a recognition of the and not only 424 00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:08,240 Speaker 1: not only the inter relating um uh character of identities, 425 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:13,359 Speaker 1: but as I frequently say, I think intersectionality is is 426 00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 1: most helpful when we think about the intersectionality of social 427 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:23,160 Speaker 1: justice struggles. Queer women experienced active hostility from the mainstream 428 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 1: movement as well. Activists Mercia Johnson and Sylvia Rivera organized 429 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: for trans rights with Star after Johnson had been a 430 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 1: key figure at the Stonewall Riots, and both worked with 431 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 1: the Gay Liberation Front during these years. Betty free Dan 432 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: was actively homophobic, referring to lesbians as the quote unquote 433 00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:46,719 Speaker 1: lavender menace in nineteen sixty nine and did not welcome 434 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: queer women into the n o W, and of course 435 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,240 Speaker 1: people were pissed. Rita May Brown, who was a lesbian activist, 436 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 1: broke off from the New York branch of the n 437 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 1: OW and began radical lesbians who wore t shirts that 438 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,000 Speaker 1: said lavender men us and staged an action at the 439 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:05,639 Speaker 1: Second Congress to Unite Women in nineteen seventy, an action 440 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,920 Speaker 1: that forced a discussion about homophobia and the exclusion that 441 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:14,199 Speaker 1: lesbians experienced in society as well as within the feminist movement. 442 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 1: While some straight feminists with the liberal mainstream movement, including 443 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: Gloria Steinham, wanted to be more inclusive, Betty for Dan 444 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:27,000 Speaker 1: purged lesbians and lesbian sympathizers, as she put it, from 445 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 1: the n OW before in nineteen seventy one, change was 446 00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:33,720 Speaker 1: made to once again allow queer people into the organization. 447 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: So again with the second wave of feminism, there were 448 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:40,720 Speaker 1: radical and liberal wings with very different interests, which created 449 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 1: significant interior conflict. The Kathy comics are really only engaging 450 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 1: with this mainstream liberal movement, in no small part because 451 00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,320 Speaker 1: the strips author was a liberal white woman in a 452 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 1: majority middle class white area, writing to some extent about 453 00:28:56,840 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: her own experiences and opinions. Cathy's ups do not feature 454 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 1: people of color or queer people, and it's radicals like 455 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: Andrea have politics that actually skew pretty liberal. This is 456 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: exemplified in the consciousness raising sessions that Andrea runs after 457 00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 1: work in the nineteen seventies, which Kathy originally finds to 458 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:19,120 Speaker 1: be kind of naval gazey and bizarre, although she does 459 00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:23,479 Speaker 1: give it a fair shake. Here's Andrea. Little boys are 460 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,880 Speaker 1: always encouraged to boast about their achievement. Well, little girls 461 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 1: are scolded for boasting because it's unfeminine. But with assertiveness 462 00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 1: training exercise number two, women can rediscover the prod we 463 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 1: have every right to express. Each one of you will 464 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,320 Speaker 1: stand up and say out loud the one thing you're 465 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 1: most proud of yourself. I am very proud of the 466 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 1: fact that I have never boasted. Andrea goes relatively hard 467 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:51,160 Speaker 1: in these early years. There's also a funny storyline from 468 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 1: the late seventies, where she gets a job as a 469 00:29:53,680 --> 00:30:00,760 Speaker 1: mall Santa to challenge the patriarchal construct of Santa. Actual 470 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,720 Speaker 1: radicalism at this time took a very different form and 471 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: often rejected consciousness raising groups on the same grounds that 472 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 1: Kathy did, and he thought they were two centered on 473 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 1: the self above the collective. Here's a quote I love 474 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,760 Speaker 1: from the nineteen seventy anthology Sisterhood Is Powerful, from radical 475 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 1: feminist Robin Morgan. This is not a movement one joined. 476 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: There are no rigid structures or membership card. The women's 477 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,400 Speaker 1: liberation movement exists where three or four friends or neighbors 478 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 1: decide to meet regularly over coffee and talk about their 479 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: personal lives. It also exists in the cells of women's 480 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 1: jails and the welfare lines, in the supermarket, the factory, 481 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 1: the convent, the farm, the maternity ward, the street corner, 482 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,120 Speaker 1: the old Ladies home, the kitchen, the steno pool, the bet. 483 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:49,920 Speaker 1: It exists in your mind and in the political and 484 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:53,800 Speaker 1: personal insights that you can contribute to change and shape 485 00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:58,480 Speaker 1: and help its growth. This interest in viewing consciousness raising 486 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,920 Speaker 1: as a wider construc was not shared by all feminists, 487 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:04,800 Speaker 1: but the emphasis that everyday lives of women should be 488 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 1: up for discussion, definitely was. New York Radical Women member 489 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:13,120 Speaker 1: Carol Hannish popularized the phrase the personal is political in 490 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 1: a nineteen sixty nine essay, That is to say that 491 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: women speaking about their problems in marriage and access to healthcare, 492 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 1: in labor issues in appearance was important and emphasizing in 493 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,480 Speaker 1: these groups that it was counterproductive to say that not 494 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: living up to this expected image was a personal instead 495 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: of a systemic failure. Sidebar. Hannish was just very cool 496 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:38,120 Speaker 1: in general. She was one of four radical feminists who 497 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:40,960 Speaker 1: hung a women's liberation banner over the balcony at a 498 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:45,280 Speaker 1: Miss America pageant in ninety eight. Good stuff. So, the 499 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,920 Speaker 1: Cathy character is at first resistant towards consciousness raising because 500 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:54,480 Speaker 1: of its, in her perspective, unwillingness to accept gradual change, 501 00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:57,600 Speaker 1: while she is open and even wants to feel better 502 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 1: about her station in life. She is an a full 503 00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 1: women's liber in the sense that she wants romantic love 504 00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,680 Speaker 1: with a man and has a tendency to not assert 505 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: herself in the relationships she cares about, as well as 506 00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,800 Speaker 1: in the workplace. The example of her screaming at a 507 00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:16,120 Speaker 1: consciousness raising session when the leader suggests that men should 508 00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: be removed from women's lives altogether, is a perfect example 509 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,360 Speaker 1: of this, and Kathy guys White has a vested interest 510 00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: in exploring how men reacted to the women's liberation movement 511 00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:29,360 Speaker 1: taking off through characters like irving Mr Pinkley and the 512 00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:33,440 Speaker 1: parade of losers that Cathy dates and rejects throughout the 513 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:37,080 Speaker 1: nineteen seventies. Also referenced in these strips is the then 514 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:41,120 Speaker 1: new term MSS, brought into the mainstream by feminist Sheila 515 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:45,120 Speaker 1: Michaels and popularized further by Glorious Dynham's magazine of the 516 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,240 Speaker 1: same name. The whole idea behind it is that women 517 00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: in the workplace and in general shouldn't be pressured to 518 00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 1: disclose their marital status when introducing themselves, and Cathy is 519 00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,440 Speaker 1: on board with this. When the Kathy character asks to 520 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,640 Speaker 1: be called MS in the late seventies, a male employee 521 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:06,600 Speaker 1: comments this Mrs MSS or miss miss. Oh you're single, 522 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,719 Speaker 1: then no, I'm miss. Women invented miss, so you wouldn't 523 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:13,600 Speaker 1: be able to label us as single or married. Well 524 00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: that may be, but the only woman I see you 525 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 1: actually use MSS are single. Miss miss. You don't know 526 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 1: that I'm a miss. Yes, I do. If you were married, 527 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: you wouldn't worry so much about being labeled single. This 528 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,080 Speaker 1: is what I think Kathy's strips do really well. Take 529 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,200 Speaker 1: this step forward for the feminist movement like a simple 530 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:35,600 Speaker 1: demand to not be defined by marital status, and reflects 531 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:39,880 Speaker 1: how the institutions that resist these changes reacted, usually in 532 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,720 Speaker 1: a way that makes our heroine feel less than This 533 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: is also reflected in Kathy's relationship with Irving, a man 534 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 1: who is clearly uncomfortable with the changing role of women 535 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 1: in the world, and unlike some popular criticism would lead 536 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:56,480 Speaker 1: you to believe, Irving's behavior was criticized within the strip, 537 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,920 Speaker 1: although some took rateful issue with the Kathy character herself 538 00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 1: absorbing a lot of toxic and abusive qualities stemming from 539 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,400 Speaker 1: his own insecurities, and people were rightfully critical of the 540 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,840 Speaker 1: fact that she married him for some reason. I digress. 541 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,520 Speaker 1: Here is a late nineteen seventies strip with Irving and Kathy. 542 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,120 Speaker 1: You want me around until you read some women's article, 543 00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:20,319 Speaker 1: and then all you care about is your career. Then 544 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:22,920 Speaker 1: you get disillusioned by your career and you search for 545 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,320 Speaker 1: some big romance to give meaning to your life. You 546 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 1: do yo yo's you beg me to come back, I 547 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,040 Speaker 1: come back, I threaten your space, you throw me out. 548 00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,200 Speaker 1: You don't even know what you want. Kathy at last, 549 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:40,480 Speaker 1: a man who really understands me. Something that's always really 550 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:45,080 Speaker 1: fun is seeing Irving's character get torn to shreds whenever 551 00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:47,520 Speaker 1: he comes into contact with Andrea, who thinks that he 552 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: is not good enough for Kathy, all the way up 553 00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,920 Speaker 1: until the two marry in two thousand five. Here's a 554 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:54,640 Speaker 1: seventies era interaction with the two of them, with Cathy 555 00:34:54,719 --> 00:35:01,520 Speaker 1: sitting silently beside Irving. Throughout history, women have been suppressed, repressed, 556 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:07,480 Speaker 1: and oppressed serving. We've had miserable jobs, hideous pay, humiliating benefits, 557 00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,640 Speaker 1: and not one shred of respect as close to equal 558 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:14,279 Speaker 1: human beings. What possible injustice is? Do you think men 559 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 1: have suffered that even come close? We never learned to cry. 560 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:22,399 Speaker 1: You never had anything to cry about. While the Equal 561 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:25,960 Speaker 1: Rights Amendment ultimately failed, the nineteen seventies proved to be 562 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,520 Speaker 1: a very productive time for American feminists. According to Fluty, 563 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,800 Speaker 1: millions more women entered the workplace, the wage gap closed 564 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:37,239 Speaker 1: to about seventy for upwardly mobile white women. Let's be clear, 565 00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 1: access to birth control increased. Title nine pass which welcomed 566 00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,320 Speaker 1: women into high school and collegiate sports. The Equal Credit 567 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,800 Speaker 1: Opportunity Act of nineteen seventy four was passed, which banned 568 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 1: discrimination in access to credit on the basis of gender, 569 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:55,800 Speaker 1: marital status, race, religion, national origin, and age. There was, 570 00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,360 Speaker 1: of course, Row View eight, the nineteen seventy three Supreme 571 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 1: Court decision and that finally, for now gave people with 572 00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:06,120 Speaker 1: uterus as the right to get an abortion for up 573 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:11,000 Speaker 1: to three months. This movement absolutely lacked in intersectionality and 574 00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:14,400 Speaker 1: solidarity with women of color and with queer women, and 575 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:18,040 Speaker 1: the Kathy character benefits from much of the progress of 576 00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:21,480 Speaker 1: this time. As a middle class white woman, she is 577 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 1: able to eventually by her own home as a single woman, 578 00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:28,320 Speaker 1: she ascends in the workplace. She struggles and fails to 579 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,239 Speaker 1: get equal pay, but at least isn't legally barred from 580 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 1: pursuing it technically, and that is how the comic plays 581 00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:37,080 Speaker 1: out in the seventies. But by the end of the 582 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 1: nineteen seventies, the second wave feminist movement was considered to 583 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:43,720 Speaker 1: have ended. And it's when we get into Kathy's strips 584 00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,680 Speaker 1: from the nineteen eighties that I think the strip really 585 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:49,880 Speaker 1: hits its stride. While Kathy comics were never designed to 586 00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:55,040 Speaker 1: communicate or promote radical feminism, the semi autobiographical format was 587 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,960 Speaker 1: well equipped to comment on the backlash to second wave 588 00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:01,600 Speaker 1: feminism that took place through the nineteen eighties. As a 589 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,000 Speaker 1: general rule, Kathy was a reactor to trends, not a 590 00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:08,640 Speaker 1: creator of trends, sort of an ancestor to the hashtag 591 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:13,640 Speaker 1: relatable content that haunts a million abandoned Instagram pages today. 592 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,520 Speaker 1: In the nineteen eighties, as Reagan came into power, the 593 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:19,800 Speaker 1: vast majority of American women saw the winds of the 594 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,040 Speaker 1: nineteen seventies, and those who had advocated for them treated punitively. 595 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 1: Here's how Susan Faludi describes the concept of backlash in 596 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:32,719 Speaker 1: a forward to a new edition of her book. The 597 00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:36,399 Speaker 1: backlash against women's rights works in much the same way. 598 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 1: Its rhetoric charges feminists with all the crimes it perpetrates. 599 00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:44,200 Speaker 1: The backlash line blames the women's movement for the feminization 600 00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:48,200 Speaker 1: of poverty, while the backlash is own. Instigators in Washington 601 00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:51,439 Speaker 1: pushed through the budget cutch that helped impoverish millions of women, 602 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:56,080 Speaker 1: fought pay equity proposals, and undermined equal opportunity laws. The 603 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:59,719 Speaker 1: backlash line claims the women's movement cares nothing for children's 604 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,799 Speaker 1: right while its own representatives in the capital and state 605 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: legislatures have blocked one bill after another to improve childcare, 606 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,279 Speaker 1: slashed billions of dollars in federal aid for children, and 607 00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:14,239 Speaker 1: relaxed state licensing standards for daycare centers. The backlash line 608 00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,880 Speaker 1: accuses of the women's movement of creating a generation of unhappy, 609 00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,720 Speaker 1: single and childless women, but it's purveyors in the media 610 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:24,439 Speaker 1: are the ones guilty of making single and childless women 611 00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:28,800 Speaker 1: feel like circus freaks. To blame feminism for women's lesser 612 00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:32,480 Speaker 1: lives is to miss entirely the point of feminism, which 613 00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:35,719 Speaker 1: is to win women a wide range of experience. Feminism 614 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:40,719 Speaker 1: remains a pretty simple concept, despite repeated and enormously effective 615 00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:43,200 Speaker 1: efforts to dress it up in Greece paint and turn 616 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:49,000 Speaker 1: its proponents into gargoyles. Oh this backlash of the nineteen 617 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:54,000 Speaker 1: eighties manifested both in large, systemic and small, innocuous, everyday 618 00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:56,840 Speaker 1: ways for as close as the second Feminist had seemed 619 00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:00,279 Speaker 1: to passing the Equal Rights Amendment just years or leader, 620 00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:04,000 Speaker 1: there was significant pushback from the evangelical right and from 621 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:07,680 Speaker 1: former allies of the feminist movement. Throughout the decade. Cathy's 622 00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:11,920 Speaker 1: strips focus on the more innocuous but still clear backlash, 623 00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:14,680 Speaker 1: partially as a privilege of her race and class, and 624 00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:18,320 Speaker 1: personally because nothing too depressing was really tolerated in the 625 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,640 Speaker 1: funny Pages at that time. One of the things she 626 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:24,000 Speaker 1: addresses is a severe uptick and sexual harassment in the 627 00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 1: nineteen eighties workplace, as demonstrated by Cathy's boss, Mr Pinkley, 628 00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,000 Speaker 1: harassing and pressuring her to let him into her home. 629 00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 1: In two, Cathy, being way cooler than anyone ever gave 630 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,320 Speaker 1: her credit for, punches him in the face. He is 631 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,080 Speaker 1: not punished for this, but Charlene and Cathy then begin 632 00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 1: a whisper network in the workplace to protect others from 633 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:46,560 Speaker 1: it happening to them. In the first episode, we touched 634 00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: on Andrea's reaction in trying to motivate Cathy to advocate 635 00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 1: for herself in the aftermath. Here's a slice of that strip. 636 00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:57,920 Speaker 1: All right, then, what are you going to do about Mr? Pinkley? 637 00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:03,480 Speaker 1: I'll show him, I'll quit my Joba. Wrong. Wrong, wrong. 638 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:09,400 Speaker 1: The hopelessness of this situation is very Eighties Women who 639 00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:12,239 Speaker 1: pursued justice after being harassed at work were often met 640 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 1: with well, no job and further harassment. To this end, 641 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,920 Speaker 1: Andrea takes center stage in the comic strips commentary on 642 00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:24,800 Speaker 1: the struggle of working mothers, specifically with maternity leave. Andrea 643 00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:28,440 Speaker 1: began as almost a parody of nineteen seventies women's Livers, 644 00:40:28,560 --> 00:40:31,960 Speaker 1: originally vowing to focus on her career and ignore dating 645 00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,000 Speaker 1: in children, but she has a change of heart in 646 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 1: the nineteen eighties, she gets married and has her first child, Zenith. 647 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:40,040 Speaker 1: By the end of the decade, the comic basic clear 648 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,239 Speaker 1: that this isn't a betrayal of her values. Andrea's personality 649 00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:47,920 Speaker 1: and tireless advocacy for women continues, both in the way 650 00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,839 Speaker 1: that she ensures her marriage to husband Luke remains an 651 00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:54,240 Speaker 1: equitable one and with her attempts to retain her power 652 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:57,399 Speaker 1: in the workplace while raising her daughter. After giving birth 653 00:40:57,480 --> 00:41:01,239 Speaker 1: to Zenith, Andrea returns to work to con her maternity leave, 654 00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:05,360 Speaker 1: only to discover there is no maternity leave. Here's a 655 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:09,879 Speaker 1: strip from with Andrea talking to the secretary at her work. 656 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:13,439 Speaker 1: What do I fill out to begin my maternity leave? 657 00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:18,680 Speaker 1: We have no maternity leave here? What no leave, no pay, 658 00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:21,880 Speaker 1: no job. When you come back, I think I'm going 659 00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:25,040 Speaker 1: to be sick. Better save it. You only have three 660 00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:34,359 Speaker 1: days of paid sick time coming. This episode is brought 661 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:37,600 Speaker 1: to you by Royal Caribbean, an award winning global cruise line. 662 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:40,400 Speaker 1: A vacation is what you make it, so are you 663 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 1: ready to make the most of it. A Royal Caribbean 664 00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:46,760 Speaker 1: Adventure is the perfect opportunity to not just take a vacation, 665 00:41:47,120 --> 00:41:49,840 Speaker 1: but to take it for all it's worth. We know 666 00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:52,160 Speaker 1: you're eager to get back out there, and with Royal 667 00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:54,520 Speaker 1: Caribbean you can make the most of the moment and 668 00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:57,680 Speaker 1: rise to the vacation. 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Rise to 682 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:43,960 Speaker 1: the vacation. Come seek the Royal Caribbean. Visit Royal Caribbean 683 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:48,279 Speaker 1: dot com to learn more. Hey everyone, it's dramas from 684 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 1: Life as a Gringo podcast. I Heart Radio. Sounds of 685 00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,680 Speaker 1: My Culture is brought to you by State Farm. At 686 00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,680 Speaker 1: State Farm, we know how important it is to celebrate 687 00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,200 Speaker 1: Hispanic heritage every day. That to why we support Michael 688 00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:04,920 Speaker 1: Ta and invite you to continue enjoying all its great podcast. 689 00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:07,360 Speaker 1: We also know what it takes to manage money, no 690 00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:10,040 Speaker 1: matter the budget. 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I am 693 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:20,800 Speaker 1: here with the one and only not in Natasha, and 694 00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:23,200 Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you, you know, how do you 695 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:28,000 Speaker 1: feel like your your work has impacted your community and culture. 696 00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:32,320 Speaker 1: I feel like my work has impacted my community and 697 00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:37,759 Speaker 1: my culture in a very big way, because back in 698 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,960 Speaker 1: the day, it was not that common to see a girl, 699 00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:45,640 Speaker 1: especially from the Dominican Republic, to be having success in 700 00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:50,320 Speaker 1: the music industry, in in the urban industry, especially where 701 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:54,440 Speaker 1: it was not common. It was not accepted for a 702 00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:58,400 Speaker 1: girl to even belong there and for for like me, 703 00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:01,000 Speaker 1: my example, to be So it's blissit with the things 704 00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:04,400 Speaker 1: she says. So having that freedom of speech is definitely 705 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:10,839 Speaker 1: something that was not common. Support all year long by 706 00:44:10,920 --> 00:44:14,560 Speaker 1: listening to the mic podcast network, available on the I 707 00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,480 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to podcasts, 708 00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:24,360 Speaker 1: imagine fighting climate change. Every time you buy groceries or pizza. 709 00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:29,320 Speaker 1: Now you can with the Aspiration zero credit card. 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The Aspiration zero MasterCard is 721 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,000 Speaker 1: issued by Beneficial State Bank, pursu into license by MasterCard 722 00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:11,160 Speaker 1: International Incorporated, Beneficial State Bank Member f d i C. 723 00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:15,399 Speaker 1: Terms and conditions apply. Visit Aspiration dot com slash zero 724 00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:28,680 Speaker 1: for more information. Andrea then goes to her boss to 725 00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:32,759 Speaker 1: confirm that she was never guaranteed maternity leave and it's true. 726 00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:36,960 Speaker 1: Personnel confirms that she can either quit, be fired, go broke, 727 00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:40,960 Speaker 1: hiring childcare, or collapse from exhaustion doing it herself. She 728 00:45:41,080 --> 00:45:44,080 Speaker 1: takes some time off without pay and returns to work again, 729 00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:47,600 Speaker 1: asking to build back up to her normal workload while 730 00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:51,600 Speaker 1: keeping Zenith at work to avoid expensive childcare she can't afford. 731 00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:54,919 Speaker 1: But this time she's told her job has been given 732 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:58,840 Speaker 1: away altogether. In this trip, she's holding baby Zenith in 733 00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:02,400 Speaker 1: her arms. As someone trying to raise a young feminist herself. 734 00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:05,880 Speaker 1: She's furious here she is talking to the same secretary. 735 00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:10,800 Speaker 1: How could you give my job away? Companies aren't required 736 00:46:10,840 --> 00:46:13,080 Speaker 1: to hold jobs for women who take time off to 737 00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:17,840 Speaker 1: have babies. Andrea, well, that's ridiculous of the whole labor 738 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:21,239 Speaker 1: forces woman and of us will have children. This is 739 00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:27,280 Speaker 1: let's just say this company believes in old fashioned values. 740 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,960 Speaker 1: What they found someone who would take your job for 741 00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:35,319 Speaker 1: a nineteen fifty salary. Andrea is using real statistics from 742 00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:38,200 Speaker 1: six here. And she goes to the matt fighting for 743 00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:41,920 Speaker 1: parental leave in her workplace, but ultimately loses in spite 744 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,440 Speaker 1: of the millions of mothers in this same era that 745 00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 1: we're facing the same issue. She tries to raise Zenith 746 00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:50,239 Speaker 1: in a gender neutral environment, but she fails at this too. 747 00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,800 Speaker 1: The toys of this time are extremely binary, and she 748 00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:56,480 Speaker 1: ends up giving up due to lack of options and energy. 749 00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:03,440 Speaker 1: Is that an inspiring or motivational storyline. No, it's very bleak. 750 00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:05,880 Speaker 1: And Andrea goes on to work as a tempt for 751 00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:08,440 Speaker 1: six fifty an hour. But the thing is this was 752 00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:11,920 Speaker 1: reflective of a very real possibility for working women of 753 00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:15,680 Speaker 1: this time. Andrea comes into play again when campaigning from 754 00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:19,080 Speaker 1: Michael Ducaccus in his presidential bid against George Bush Sr. 755 00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:23,280 Speaker 1: Enlisting Cathy in the efforts as well, as I mentioned 756 00:47:23,320 --> 00:47:27,600 Speaker 1: in episode one, including an overt political endorsement, got the 757 00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:30,520 Speaker 1: Kathy strip dropped from some papers and moved to the 758 00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:34,200 Speaker 1: editorial pages by other papers. But Kathy, Guys White and 759 00:47:34,239 --> 00:47:38,000 Speaker 1: her characters held firm. As Faludi notes in Backlash, Ducaccus 760 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:41,040 Speaker 1: would later pretty severely back pedal on his promise to 761 00:47:41,120 --> 00:47:43,160 Speaker 1: working women in pearance by the end of his bid 762 00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:45,840 Speaker 1: and a failed attempt to gain wider support, and so 763 00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:50,040 Speaker 1: a decade after Andrea was dutifully raising consciousness in her community, 764 00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:52,120 Speaker 1: she was a married mother who had been all but 765 00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,320 Speaker 1: banished from the successful career she'd spent a decade building, 766 00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,759 Speaker 1: and she was understandably piste off about it. Unfortunately, she 767 00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,040 Speaker 1: starts to fade from the Mikes as the years go on, 768 00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:04,560 Speaker 1: but the storylines involving Andrea in the seventies and eighties 769 00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,960 Speaker 1: are truly some of my favorites. A lot of Cathy 770 00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:11,320 Speaker 1: and Andrea's friendship is built around the cost of cards. 771 00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:14,160 Speaker 1: That is, the woman who has it all, someone who 772 00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:17,759 Speaker 1: is a career woman, a domestic goddess, and a doting mother, 773 00:48:18,000 --> 00:48:20,320 Speaker 1: all without breaking a sweat. As the comic goes on, 774 00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:23,719 Speaker 1: Guy's wides commentary is clear not only is this an 775 00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:27,640 Speaker 1: unrealistic expectation for anyone, but the powers that be in 776 00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:31,680 Speaker 1: the workplace, government, and often a woman's own home were 777 00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:35,360 Speaker 1: sometimes actively working against this being a possibility, and so 778 00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:37,680 Speaker 1: in the nineteen eighties we see a lot of Cathy 779 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:40,840 Speaker 1: feeling bad about herself when asked by pop culture to 780 00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,680 Speaker 1: compare herself to other women. To put that in context, 781 00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,480 Speaker 1: a huge component of backlash against social causes is an 782 00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:51,560 Speaker 1: increased focus on consumerism and self improvement through things like 783 00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:55,520 Speaker 1: observing fashion trends, investing in self help books, and joining 784 00:48:55,680 --> 00:49:00,400 Speaker 1: health clubs and gyms versus collectively organizing help. They really 785 00:49:00,680 --> 00:49:04,360 Speaker 1: star listen to earls we get you, show in the 786 00:49:04,480 --> 00:49:11,560 Speaker 1: world what you can do. Get it in shape, her feeling, 787 00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:18,640 Speaker 1: get it in shape, it's so feeling. And run let's 788 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:20,480 Speaker 1: see what just the wait if you work out? Twist 789 00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:23,320 Speaker 1: and Twirl comes in formatons and singer Pom Poms and 790 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,120 Speaker 1: run Twist. I'll be doing a whole episode on Kathy 791 00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:29,440 Speaker 1: Guys Whites commentary on food, fashion and beauty later in 792 00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:32,600 Speaker 1: the series. But even outside of the advertising blitz that 793 00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:35,759 Speaker 1: defined and distracted so many in the nineteen eighties. It's 794 00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:39,040 Speaker 1: interesting to watch the Kathy character constantly feel that she 795 00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:41,719 Speaker 1: isn't living up to the standards that she's supposed to, 796 00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:45,560 Speaker 1: standards that are basically impossible to achieve. Here's a strip 797 00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:48,799 Speaker 1: from the early eighties, Kathy sitting on her armchair at 798 00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:52,800 Speaker 1: home watching a TV show that says this, Welcome to 799 00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:57,000 Speaker 1: the Women's Hour, and now here's your host, Mr Bob Black. Hello, 800 00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:00,840 Speaker 1: we're talking to Margie Miller, married, mother of to founder 801 00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:04,000 Speaker 1: and president of a small manufacturing empire, and author of 802 00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:08,080 Speaker 1: two best selling novels and three plays. Margie at and 803 00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:10,279 Speaker 1: with all this going on, how in the world do 804 00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:13,759 Speaker 1: you have time to be on our show today? Margie says, Oh, 805 00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:16,279 Speaker 1: it's nothing, Bob. The little ones are at their Greek 806 00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:18,880 Speaker 1: literature workshop and the opera I have a small pardon 807 00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:22,279 Speaker 1: doesn't begin until seven o'clock. He replies, well, you must 808 00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:24,880 Speaker 1: have a lot of help at home. As the show continues, 809 00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:29,600 Speaker 1: Kathy begins to sink down in her chair. Margie says, actually, 810 00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:32,759 Speaker 1: I find a well organized house rends itself. Of course, 811 00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:34,560 Speaker 1: it has to be a bit cluttered because of the 812 00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:38,000 Speaker 1: addition I'm building this week. The host says, my, my, 813 00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:41,360 Speaker 1: you don't do anything the traditional way, do you. Cathy 814 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:45,880 Speaker 1: grabs her TV in anxiety. Margie says no, not unless 815 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:48,000 Speaker 1: you count the two D fifty sweater sets on it 816 00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:51,520 Speaker 1: each year for needy causes. The host says, Margie, thank 817 00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:53,880 Speaker 1: you so much for being with us today. And the 818 00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,439 Speaker 1: last panel, Kathy is sobbing in front of her TV, 819 00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,600 Speaker 1: as the host says, it's women like you who are 820 00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:04,040 Speaker 1: helping women all over the world feel better about themselves. 821 00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:08,120 Speaker 1: I love it. This came from a very personal place 822 00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:12,600 Speaker 1: for guys White, who wrote on this in saying, in theory, 823 00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:16,360 Speaker 1: we all say we've rejected the notion of being superwoman. 824 00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:20,600 Speaker 1: In practice, I don't know anyone who isn't still trying. 825 00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:23,839 Speaker 1: Kathy guys White was uniquely suited to comment on this time. 826 00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:27,680 Speaker 1: Here she is to the Detroit Free Press when asked 827 00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:32,080 Speaker 1: about her works views on feminism, Kathy puts feminism in 828 00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:34,960 Speaker 1: a light that's more acceptable to many women than the 829 00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:40,680 Speaker 1: hardline feminism that turns some women off. It's true Kathy 830 00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:45,480 Speaker 1: is vulnerable. She doesn't win all the time. She's always 831 00:51:45,520 --> 00:51:48,520 Speaker 1: trying to improve her life, and she often falls short 832 00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:51,839 Speaker 1: of her goals. Some may say that's a bad way 833 00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:55,400 Speaker 1: to portray the new woman. Well, I say it's realistic. 834 00:51:56,160 --> 00:51:59,400 Speaker 1: I know no woman who has it totally together, and 835 00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:02,279 Speaker 1: I think that okay. I think you can be a 836 00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:05,399 Speaker 1: feminist and still balance your checkbook by changing banks every 837 00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:08,080 Speaker 1: six months or so. I think you can still be 838 00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:10,719 Speaker 1: a feminist and eat frozen donuts right out of the 839 00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:14,480 Speaker 1: freezer and still say yes when you mean no, or 840 00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:18,839 Speaker 1: no when you mean yes. My goal is to keep 841 00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:23,320 Speaker 1: Kathy honest and close to real life. But declaring yourself 842 00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:27,239 Speaker 1: a feminist was not necessarily a very cool thing to 843 00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:29,880 Speaker 1: do in the eighties. It's no secret that women are 844 00:52:29,960 --> 00:52:33,360 Speaker 1: not a monolith, and many have upheld their own oppression 845 00:52:33,520 --> 00:52:38,000 Speaker 1: for power, profit, or just fun over the years. Philish 846 00:52:38,160 --> 00:52:41,000 Speaker 1: Laughlely emerged as the big bat of the feminist movement 847 00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:44,719 Speaker 1: in the nineties seventies and successfully campaigned against the Equal 848 00:52:44,840 --> 00:52:48,360 Speaker 1: Rights Amendment so hard that Kate Blanchett played her on 849 00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:51,360 Speaker 1: a TV show and women Have No Rights Awesome. The 850 00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:55,480 Speaker 1: eighties uplifted many women, mostly white, who denounced the feminist 851 00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:59,640 Speaker 1: gains of the seventies, while visibly benefiting from those same gains. 852 00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,440 Speaker 1: That is to say, the reason that many of these women, 853 00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:07,080 Speaker 1: including Phyllis Lafley were able to become such prominent anti 854 00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:10,680 Speaker 1: feminists was because they had child care and support to 855 00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:14,560 Speaker 1: focus on their careers, you know, things feminists fought for. 856 00:53:15,200 --> 00:53:18,920 Speaker 1: So while feminism wasn't trendy in the nineteen eighties, to 857 00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:21,799 Speaker 1: say the least, that doesn't mean that feminists weren't doing 858 00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:25,960 Speaker 1: great and important work during this time. In Bell Hooks 859 00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:29,600 Speaker 1: published From Margin to Center, which included a strong critique 860 00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:32,720 Speaker 1: of the feminine mystique, saying that it was solely concerned 861 00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:36,000 Speaker 1: with the interests of upwardly mobile white women. Hooks wrote 862 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:40,359 Speaker 1: this Free Dan's famous phrase the problem that has no name, 863 00:53:40,520 --> 00:53:43,400 Speaker 1: often quoted to describe the condition of women in this society, 864 00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:46,200 Speaker 1: actually refers to the plight of a select group of 865 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:51,000 Speaker 1: college educated, middle and upper class married white women. Housewives 866 00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:55,839 Speaker 1: would with leisure, with the home, the children, buying products, wood, 867 00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:58,600 Speaker 1: and more out of life. Free Dance includes her first 868 00:53:58,680 --> 00:54:02,640 Speaker 1: chapter by stating, we can no longer ignore that voice 869 00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:06,400 Speaker 1: within women that says I want something more than my 870 00:54:06,600 --> 00:54:11,200 Speaker 1: husband and my children and my home. That more she 871 00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:14,880 Speaker 1: defines as careers. She did not discuss who would be 872 00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:17,760 Speaker 1: called in to take care of the children and maintain 873 00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:20,600 Speaker 1: the home if more women like her self were freed 874 00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:22,840 Speaker 1: from their house labor and give an equal access with 875 00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:26,160 Speaker 1: white men to the professions. She did not ask of 876 00:54:26,239 --> 00:54:29,920 Speaker 1: the needs of women without men, without children, without holbmes. 877 00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:33,600 Speaker 1: She ignored the existence of all non white women and 878 00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,320 Speaker 1: poor white women. She did not tell readers whether it 879 00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,640 Speaker 1: was more fulfilling to be a maid, a babysitter, a 880 00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:43,520 Speaker 1: factory worker, a clerk, or prostitute than to be a 881 00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:48,440 Speaker 1: leisure class housewife. The closest Kathy's trips come to addressing 882 00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:52,359 Speaker 1: these concerns are through Charlene. Charlene is Cathy's best friend 883 00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:54,520 Speaker 1: at work and eventually her maid of honor, and was 884 00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:56,680 Speaker 1: a stand in for a woman who was relegated to 885 00:54:56,800 --> 00:55:01,360 Speaker 1: jobs that many feminists referred to as pink caller secretarial jobs, 886 00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:05,320 Speaker 1: grossly underpaid and undervalued in spite of their importance to 887 00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:08,080 Speaker 1: the workplace. Charlene has a story in the late eighties 888 00:55:08,120 --> 00:55:11,040 Speaker 1: about her status as the lowest paid employee in the 889 00:55:11,120 --> 00:55:15,160 Speaker 1: Product Testing Incorporated Office. She advocates for herself her lack 890 00:55:15,239 --> 00:55:19,279 Speaker 1: of pay, respect, and career mobility every Secretaries Week, and 891 00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,279 Speaker 1: it's a running joke in the comic that her circumstance 892 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:26,000 Speaker 1: never changes. Even Cathy dismisses her concerns in a very 893 00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:28,680 Speaker 1: upper management I pretend I do not see it kind 894 00:55:28,719 --> 00:55:32,680 Speaker 1: of way. Here's a strip. When I started here at 895 00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:35,399 Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars a year, they got me a three 896 00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:38,560 Speaker 1: thousand dollar typewriter to type. On the year they could 897 00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:41,160 Speaker 1: only give me a two hundred dollar raise, they bought 898 00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:44,720 Speaker 1: a two hundred thousand dollar phone system for me to operate. 899 00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:47,759 Speaker 1: The year I got e three hundred dollar raise, they 900 00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:51,400 Speaker 1: bought an eleven thousand dollar copy or a four thousand 901 00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:55,680 Speaker 1: dollar facts machine and a one million, five hundred thousand 902 00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:58,719 Speaker 1: dollar computer system for me to use. Why do I 903 00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:00,600 Speaker 1: get the feeling I'd be more bad reuble to this 904 00:56:00,680 --> 00:56:04,120 Speaker 1: company by game with a plug. Kathy guys White is 905 00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:07,759 Speaker 1: again addressing a very real nineteen eighties trend here. While 906 00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:11,120 Speaker 1: those who wanted feminists to shut up about workplace harassment 907 00:56:11,160 --> 00:56:14,560 Speaker 1: and the pay gap cited figures indicating that women's presence 908 00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:17,359 Speaker 1: in the workplace had increased, they tended to not get 909 00:56:17,480 --> 00:56:20,560 Speaker 1: specific about where they were in the workplace, and it's 910 00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:23,920 Speaker 1: not surprising why by nine six a higher rate of 911 00:56:23,960 --> 00:56:27,320 Speaker 1: working women were receiving poverty wages than in nineteen seventy 912 00:56:27,400 --> 00:56:31,520 Speaker 1: three in areas like the secretarial pool were overwhelmed with women, 913 00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:36,720 Speaker 1: and historically, gender segregation by profession means that marginalized genders 914 00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:40,720 Speaker 1: are making much less money for equal work. Charlene remained 915 00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:43,759 Speaker 1: the secretary throughout the comic and is extremely good at 916 00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:46,719 Speaker 1: her job but never treated fairly, and by the end 917 00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:50,000 Speaker 1: of the Backlash eighties, Kathy's strips were often focused around 918 00:56:50,120 --> 00:56:53,320 Speaker 1: existing in the wreckage of the feminist backlash and the 919 00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:56,640 Speaker 1: dissonance that it created in women's lives. Here's a strip 920 00:56:56,719 --> 00:57:01,160 Speaker 1: with Kathy and Charlene from that hits on this theme exactly. 921 00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:05,960 Speaker 1: I'm going to read the captions. While their friends got engaged, 922 00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:09,640 Speaker 1: they got promoted. While their friends took Lama's class and 923 00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:12,960 Speaker 1: made dinner, they took meetings and did lunch. Some call 924 00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:15,959 Speaker 1: them the lost generation of women. Others say their time 925 00:57:16,040 --> 00:57:19,640 Speaker 1: has just now come after years of devoting themselves to 926 00:57:19,760 --> 00:57:23,520 Speaker 1: developing careers. The over thirty set emerges this march like 927 00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:28,200 Speaker 1: the first flowers of spring. Brave, confident, proud, and ready 928 00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:32,000 Speaker 1: for love. And then we see Charlene and Kathy. Their 929 00:57:32,040 --> 00:57:35,640 Speaker 1: outfits are a lot of they're holding diet cookies. Cathy's 930 00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:38,080 Speaker 1: wearing a Swhite shirt that says I heart Lean cuisine. 931 00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:42,240 Speaker 1: They're just decked out in eighties consumerism. The comic concludes 932 00:57:42,520 --> 00:57:47,440 Speaker 1: the debutante class of By the beginning of the nineties, 933 00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:50,840 Speaker 1: George Bush Sr. Was President, the third wave of feminism 934 00:57:50,960 --> 00:57:54,240 Speaker 1: was on the horizon, and Kathy guys White used Andrea's 935 00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:57,640 Speaker 1: waspy helicopter parenting to poke some fun at how many 936 00:57:57,800 --> 00:58:01,080 Speaker 1: upper class white feminists had taken to raising their kids. 937 00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:05,520 Speaker 1: Most feel the third wave of feminism began around when 938 00:58:05,560 --> 00:58:08,400 Speaker 1: Anita Hill spoke to an all white Supreme Court about 939 00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:12,480 Speaker 1: being harassed by Judge Clarence Thomas. Guy Swhite was extremely 940 00:58:12,680 --> 00:58:17,400 Speaker 1: interested in commenting on how sexual harassment affected the workplace, interestingly, 941 00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:20,600 Speaker 1: not how it affected the women in the workplace, who 942 00:58:20,640 --> 00:58:22,880 Speaker 1: are all well aware that this happened all the time, 943 00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:26,600 Speaker 1: but she focuses instead on the men's reaction to realizing 944 00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:29,680 Speaker 1: that there could be consequences for their behavior. You might 945 00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:33,120 Speaker 1: remember that Cathy had been sexually assaulted by her boss, 946 00:58:33,280 --> 00:58:36,480 Speaker 1: Mr Pinkley in her own house in two when he 947 00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:39,000 Speaker 1: forced a kiss on her, she punched his lights out, 948 00:58:39,160 --> 00:58:43,440 Speaker 1: But the Mr. Pinkley character remained this lovable, misogynous boss 949 00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:47,120 Speaker 1: in the workplace throughout the comic, and Mr Pinkley and 950 00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:51,280 Speaker 1: Cathy's other male co workers could not handle the fall 951 00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:53,800 Speaker 1: out of the Anita Hill hearing. Here's a strip from 952 00:58:55,680 --> 00:58:59,080 Speaker 1: as you know, this office has always prided itself on 953 00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:03,200 Speaker 1: its progressive attitude toward women. While most companies rushed into 954 00:59:03,240 --> 00:59:07,360 Speaker 1: discussions about sexual harassment right after the Thomas Hill incident, 955 00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:11,400 Speaker 1: I felt we all needed a few weeks for personal reflection. 956 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:16,200 Speaker 1: By waiting until today, I believe I've once again demonstrated 957 00:59:16,280 --> 00:59:19,840 Speaker 1: my profound sensitivity to the feelings of the women in 958 00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:24,560 Speaker 1: our workplace. And according to my wall calendar, the majority 959 00:59:24,640 --> 00:59:29,080 Speaker 1: of you are now safely past your p MS days. Jeez. 960 00:59:30,080 --> 00:59:33,560 Speaker 1: Later in this storyline, Pinkley uses what I am assuming 961 00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:36,200 Speaker 1: is company money to bring the men at the company 962 00:59:36,280 --> 00:59:40,320 Speaker 1: on a retreat to quote unquote reclaim their manhood. By 963 00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:43,440 Speaker 1: the time it's over, the men have learned nothing, but 964 00:59:43,560 --> 00:59:46,760 Speaker 1: they have taken a free vacation with company money. And 965 00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:49,439 Speaker 1: that might sound ridiculous, but it's based in the real 966 00:59:49,600 --> 00:59:53,000 Speaker 1: life bizarro work of Robert Bly, a poet who became 967 00:59:53,040 --> 00:59:58,760 Speaker 1: the founder of the New Age masculinist community want to 968 00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:02,880 Speaker 1: turn in into men again. He would do this by 969 01:00:03,040 --> 01:00:06,480 Speaker 1: having men pay him three hundred dollars the grift is strong, 970 01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:08,800 Speaker 1: meet him in the middle of nowhere in Minnesota, and 971 01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:12,240 Speaker 1: would then encourage them to find the deep masculine through 972 01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:15,960 Speaker 1: wearing wild animal costumes and walking around on all fours. 973 01:00:16,280 --> 01:00:19,280 Speaker 1: This was a real thing after the Anita Hill hearings. 974 01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:22,480 Speaker 1: Most of what Kathy Guy's White discusses about women's issues 975 01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:26,520 Speaker 1: are related to beauty standards, diet culture, changing fashion trends, 976 01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:30,160 Speaker 1: and the commodification of radical movements like Riot Girls by 977 01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:33,640 Speaker 1: fast fashion, but there are solid moments of workplace commentary 978 01:00:33,760 --> 01:00:36,560 Speaker 1: as well. In Guy's White's view, much of the financial 979 01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:39,840 Speaker 1: gain that women, mostly white women, had made in middle 980 01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:44,200 Speaker 1: management was squandered trying to achieve an unrealistic beauty standard 981 01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:47,560 Speaker 1: that was pretty rigidly imposed in the workplace. Here's a 982 01:00:47,600 --> 01:00:49,720 Speaker 1: strip from the late nineties to that effect, from a 983 01:00:49,800 --> 01:00:53,040 Speaker 1: collection called I Am Woman, Hear Me Snore. In it, 984 01:00:53,320 --> 01:00:57,160 Speaker 1: Kathy is attempting to write off these expenses on her taxes. 985 01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:00,880 Speaker 1: Any deduction is this year for the extra expenses women 986 01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:03,400 Speaker 1: and her trying to dress appropriately for the twenty different 987 01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:06,480 Speaker 1: images were supposed to maintain any right offs for the 988 01:01:06,600 --> 01:01:09,840 Speaker 1: unpaid time women to spend creating relationships, without which there 989 01:01:09,840 --> 01:01:12,200 Speaker 1: would be no family values because there'd be no families, 990 01:01:13,240 --> 01:01:16,080 Speaker 1: any allowances whatsoever. For the fact that our nation would 991 01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:18,400 Speaker 1: screech to a halt of it weren't for the underpaid, 992 01:01:18,760 --> 01:01:23,600 Speaker 1: overworked women cheerfully waiting through the mark. No, forget Uncle sam, 993 01:01:23,680 --> 01:01:27,280 Speaker 1: what this country needs is an aunt. Samantha Kathy would 994 01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:29,520 Speaker 1: remain in print for the remainder of the Third wave 995 01:01:29,560 --> 01:01:32,480 Speaker 1: of feminism, which ended around two thousand ten, when the 996 01:01:32,560 --> 01:01:34,960 Speaker 1: comic did and she does, comment on a fair amount 997 01:01:35,000 --> 01:01:38,680 Speaker 1: of things going on. Third wave feminism was more inclusive, 998 01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:41,840 Speaker 1: while still having a strong tendency to center white women. 999 01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:44,200 Speaker 1: There were many critiques from women of color and trans 1000 01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:48,000 Speaker 1: women in particular. As gate keeping and the feminist movement continued, 1001 01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:50,840 Speaker 1: the riot girl movement took off in the nineties, with 1002 01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:54,280 Speaker 1: bands like Bikini Kill, Free Kitten, and Bratt Mobile using 1003 01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:57,400 Speaker 1: both their music and their determination to remain d i 1004 01:01:57,680 --> 01:02:02,320 Speaker 1: y to release politicized material and communicate their ideas even 1005 01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:06,680 Speaker 1: further using zines. The Riot Girls zine created in Washington, 1006 01:02:06,800 --> 01:02:10,640 Speaker 1: d C. Were made and distributed by punk girls, for 1007 01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:14,960 Speaker 1: whom Miss Magazine had long become stale. For Kathleen Hannah, 1008 01:02:15,080 --> 01:02:17,680 Speaker 1: the front woman of Bikini Kill, had become activated as 1009 01:02:17,720 --> 01:02:21,640 Speaker 1: a feminist after reading, oddly enough, the feminine mystique, and 1010 01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:25,480 Speaker 1: she became a major advocate for including sex workers in 1011 01:02:25,520 --> 01:02:28,400 Speaker 1: the feminist movement as well, which gatekeepers of the Second 1012 01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:32,120 Speaker 1: Wave had not been enthusiastic about in the least. With 1013 01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:37,040 Speaker 1: this progressive surge also came the intense commercialism of feminist 1014 01:02:37,160 --> 01:02:40,800 Speaker 1: ideals in the nineties. This meant Spice Girls, girl Power, 1015 01:02:41,160 --> 01:02:45,280 Speaker 1: Disney princesses of the nineties having discernible personality is sure, 1016 01:02:45,560 --> 01:02:50,200 Speaker 1: but also existing in very rigid societal roles in heterosexual 1017 01:02:50,320 --> 01:02:56,520 Speaker 1: relationships still you aren't you dam distress and damsel and 1018 01:02:56,680 --> 01:03:00,120 Speaker 1: in distress, I can handle this. These moves were are 1019 01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:04,560 Speaker 1: often viewed as cynical, with male executives still the primary 1020 01:03:04,680 --> 01:03:08,720 Speaker 1: people and beneficiaries of choices like these, watered down feminist 1021 01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:12,600 Speaker 1: values often became more of a marketable tagline than an 1022 01:03:12,720 --> 01:03:18,280 Speaker 1: actual consideration in moving things forward. This still happens now 1023 01:03:19,240 --> 01:03:22,200 Speaker 1: so well an attempt. I don't think that gal Powa 1024 01:03:22,280 --> 01:03:25,800 Speaker 1: feminism really accomplished that much because as it was happening. 1025 01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:29,400 Speaker 1: A slew of nineties tabloid stars were dragged through the 1026 01:03:29,480 --> 01:03:32,080 Speaker 1: mud by the emerging twenty four hour news cycle in 1027 01:03:32,160 --> 01:03:34,720 Speaker 1: a way that many are starting to scrutinize today. I 1028 01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:37,920 Speaker 1: think you're Anita Hills, think you're Tanya Harding's your Monica 1029 01:03:38,040 --> 01:03:41,800 Speaker 1: Lewinsky's your Amy Fisher's your Janet Jackson's shout out to 1030 01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:45,400 Speaker 1: the year wrong about podcast you probably listen already. Women 1031 01:03:45,520 --> 01:03:48,400 Speaker 1: of the second and third waves of feminism were also 1032 01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:52,240 Speaker 1: very often at odds. Many Second waivers felt that third 1033 01:03:52,320 --> 01:03:55,720 Speaker 1: wave feminists, who were the first generation to grow up 1034 01:03:55,800 --> 01:03:58,480 Speaker 1: with the benefits that the movement had made, did not 1035 01:03:58,560 --> 01:04:01,880 Speaker 1: appreciate the work and sacrifice that the women of the 1036 01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:06,000 Speaker 1: sixties and seventies had made, and third wave feminists wanted 1037 01:04:06,040 --> 01:04:08,960 Speaker 1: to move in a new direction, rejecting the extent of 1038 01:04:09,080 --> 01:04:12,720 Speaker 1: gate keeping and lack of inclusivity of liberal white feminist 1039 01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:16,400 Speaker 1: figureheads from the second wave. Writer Rebecca Walker explains this 1040 01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:20,600 Speaker 1: conflict from a unique standpoint. Her mother is author Alice Walker, 1041 01:04:20,680 --> 01:04:24,040 Speaker 1: who wrote The Color Purple, and her godmother is Gloria Steinham. 1042 01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:28,080 Speaker 1: Walker says this there is a definite gap among feminists 1043 01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,520 Speaker 1: who consider themselves to be second wave and those who 1044 01:04:30,520 --> 01:04:34,280 Speaker 1: would label themselves as third wave. Although the age criteria 1045 01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:37,520 Speaker 1: for second wave feminists and third wave feminists as murky, 1046 01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:41,840 Speaker 1: younger feminists definitely have a hard time proving themselves worthy 1047 01:04:42,040 --> 01:04:46,000 Speaker 1: as feminists, scholars, and activists. And you know who else 1048 01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:50,520 Speaker 1: commented on this rift year girl Kathy. Cathy's interactions with 1049 01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:53,560 Speaker 1: younger women is very interesting to me, in part because 1050 01:04:53,600 --> 01:04:57,400 Speaker 1: they're pulled from a semi autobiographical place. Kathy guys by 1051 01:04:57,400 --> 01:04:59,840 Speaker 1: It's daughter was growing up in the third wave of 1052 01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:03,040 Speaker 1: a minism, and the Kathy character's interaction with third wave 1053 01:05:03,120 --> 01:05:06,720 Speaker 1: women are very telling. Here's a strip from where the 1054 01:05:06,800 --> 01:05:09,960 Speaker 1: Kathy character talks with a female friend of her ten 1055 01:05:10,080 --> 01:05:14,920 Speaker 1: years younger hottie boyfriend Alex. Of course, it's women my 1056 01:05:15,080 --> 01:05:17,760 Speaker 1: age who really paved the way for women your age, Shaannah, 1057 01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:19,959 Speaker 1: it must be incredible for you to face a world 1058 01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:23,800 Speaker 1: with so many options, no kidding. Now we women can 1059 01:05:23,920 --> 01:05:26,840 Speaker 1: use our college degrees to be underpaid in one hundred 1060 01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:29,480 Speaker 1: different professions. Now we can work and spend all the 1061 01:05:29,520 --> 01:05:32,800 Speaker 1: money on daycare, or not work and be homeless. Now 1062 01:05:32,920 --> 01:05:36,080 Speaker 1: women can demand more for ourselves and go bankrupt immediately. 1063 01:05:36,440 --> 01:05:39,080 Speaker 1: Or charge at all and be slowly strangled by eighteen 1064 01:05:39,160 --> 01:05:42,960 Speaker 1: percent interest. Alex says, how's it going in there, Kathy, 1065 01:05:43,920 --> 01:05:47,720 Speaker 1: I've just been soaked by the fountain of youth. Another 1066 01:05:47,800 --> 01:05:51,600 Speaker 1: issue Cathy addressed was the anxiety around fertility and age, 1067 01:05:51,840 --> 01:05:55,120 Speaker 1: yet another issue that was frequently misrepresented in the media 1068 01:05:55,280 --> 01:05:59,000 Speaker 1: in order to viewed cynically discourage people with uteruses from 1069 01:05:59,040 --> 01:06:01,600 Speaker 1: remaining in the work place for too long or aiming 1070 01:06:01,680 --> 01:06:05,840 Speaker 1: their goals too high for fear of the almighty biological clock. 1071 01:06:06,200 --> 01:06:09,280 Speaker 1: Even in the comics Last Days After Kathy gets married 1072 01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:12,280 Speaker 1: in two thousand five, another comment on boomer women who 1073 01:06:12,400 --> 01:06:16,400 Speaker 1: delayed marriage and children to help develop their careers and themselves, 1074 01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,960 Speaker 1: Kathy guys White explored the frustrations and pressures that came 1075 01:06:20,000 --> 01:06:23,320 Speaker 1: with aging. Long after Andrea and her children have disappeared 1076 01:06:23,320 --> 01:06:26,000 Speaker 1: from the comic, after Charlene has gotten married and had 1077 01:06:26,080 --> 01:06:29,560 Speaker 1: two children, Kathy continues to pursue the idea of being 1078 01:06:29,720 --> 01:06:33,000 Speaker 1: an optimized woman, and it's just as impossible as it 1079 01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,880 Speaker 1: ever was. Third wave feminism sought to address a lot 1080 01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:40,520 Speaker 1: issues like rape and domestic violence, the fight to preserve 1081 01:06:40,600 --> 01:06:44,520 Speaker 1: reproductive rights when conservative after conservative tried to remove them 1082 01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:47,480 Speaker 1: and included race, class, and trans rights in a more 1083 01:06:47,560 --> 01:06:52,360 Speaker 1: meaningful way in their platform, they ultimately lacked a clear goal. 1084 01:06:52,680 --> 01:06:54,880 Speaker 1: I would argue that one of the greatest accomplishments of 1085 01:06:54,920 --> 01:06:59,240 Speaker 1: third wave feminism was moving organizational efforts across mediums. In 1086 01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:02,760 Speaker 1: the nineties, Riot Girls pioneered zines, and by the two 1087 01:07:02,840 --> 01:07:06,600 Speaker 1: dozen tens the movement had been brought online. Many say 1088 01:07:06,680 --> 01:07:09,320 Speaker 1: fourth wave feminism is what's happening right now. I kind 1089 01:07:09,360 --> 01:07:11,480 Speaker 1: of reject the whole wave thing anyhow, but it's a 1090 01:07:11,560 --> 01:07:17,480 Speaker 1: clean way to organize a podcast. Here's my question. Why 1091 01:07:17,640 --> 01:07:22,440 Speaker 1: have feminists not embraced or even engaged with Kathy at 1092 01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,840 Speaker 1: any point. It's very possible that there's just a million 1093 01:07:25,960 --> 01:07:28,840 Speaker 1: bigger fish to fry, but different areas of different movements 1094 01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:31,720 Speaker 1: have found the time and energy to rally around other 1095 01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:35,800 Speaker 1: fictional women of different movements. Think you're Mary Tyler, Moore's 1096 01:07:35,840 --> 01:07:39,520 Speaker 1: your Joe March is your Lisa Simpsons. Come on, Stacy, 1097 01:07:39,840 --> 01:07:42,560 Speaker 1: have waited my whole life to hear you speak. Don't 1098 01:07:42,600 --> 01:07:46,320 Speaker 1: you have anything relevant to say? Don't ask me. I'm 1099 01:07:46,440 --> 01:07:51,840 Speaker 1: just a girl in on hating Kathy essay in the 1100 01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:55,600 Speaker 1: comics journal writer Juliette Cohn takes a guess, but what 1101 01:07:55,760 --> 01:07:58,919 Speaker 1: of the feminists? Why is there no defense from them? 1102 01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:03,560 Speaker 1: How has Kathy managed to fail them so utterly? She is, 1103 01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:06,720 Speaker 1: as they state, not a role model, And though the 1104 01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:09,720 Speaker 1: need for female role models is real, so too is 1105 01:08:09,760 --> 01:08:14,320 Speaker 1: the use of this argument towards patriarchal aims. But beyond this, 1106 01:08:14,920 --> 01:08:17,799 Speaker 1: there is a certain reproach in the tones of Cathy's 1107 01:08:17,880 --> 01:08:22,160 Speaker 1: female critics of frustration. Why couldn't you do better? How 1108 01:08:22,240 --> 01:08:25,400 Speaker 1: could you fail so visibly? It is an anger at 1109 01:08:25,400 --> 01:08:29,640 Speaker 1: her imperfection that reveals an implicit understanding that Cathy's circumstances 1110 01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:33,160 Speaker 1: are not fair, that her stumbling weighs more than a man's. 1111 01:08:33,680 --> 01:08:36,960 Speaker 1: It is a criticism born from fear of censure. What 1112 01:08:37,200 --> 01:08:41,280 Speaker 1: might Cathy's weakness bring upon us? Con continues later in 1113 01:08:41,360 --> 01:08:44,800 Speaker 1: the same essay. Womanhood is mundane, is what it comes 1114 01:08:44,840 --> 01:08:48,640 Speaker 1: down to, and Kathy operates squarely within what we understand 1115 01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:53,600 Speaker 1: womanhood to be. Women's work is diapers, typing, cooking, and 1116 01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:58,240 Speaker 1: data entry. Cathy dwarfed by stacks of anonymous paperwork, celebrated 1117 01:08:58,280 --> 01:09:03,480 Speaker 1: for her diligence but never in ovation. Woman's play is frivolous, superficial, 1118 01:09:03,680 --> 01:09:08,320 Speaker 1: distracting and materialistic Kathy enjoying a chick flick, acute stiletto, 1119 01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:10,960 Speaker 1: and evening in with a friend and some ice cream. 1120 01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:14,640 Speaker 1: Women's sorrow is only poetic if it can become a 1121 01:09:14,720 --> 01:09:18,200 Speaker 1: symbol that means something to a man. Cathy cries most 1122 01:09:18,240 --> 01:09:22,680 Speaker 1: regularly over her inability to become that symbol. Her frustrations 1123 01:09:22,720 --> 01:09:26,080 Speaker 1: at work, including an episode of sexual harassment from her boss, 1124 01:09:26,479 --> 01:09:29,120 Speaker 1: could never be considered powerful in the manner of the 1125 01:09:29,240 --> 01:09:32,040 Speaker 1: man in the gray flannel suit or death of a salesman. 1126 01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:35,840 Speaker 1: Her play is goofy, and the strip itself is, of 1127 01:09:36,000 --> 01:09:39,760 Speaker 1: course an artifact of woman's play. Her sorrow is to 1128 01:09:39,880 --> 01:09:43,200 Speaker 1: be mocked. No one remarks, going on a decade since 1129 01:09:43,280 --> 01:09:46,400 Speaker 1: the strip's end, about the expressiveness of Guys White's line. 1130 01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:50,280 Speaker 1: No one discusses the artfulness of the interplay between Kathy, 1131 01:09:50,640 --> 01:09:53,960 Speaker 1: largely ambivalent to feminism with a capital F, and her 1132 01:09:54,040 --> 01:09:58,080 Speaker 1: more openly political friend Andrea, the consciousness of this choice, 1133 01:09:58,240 --> 01:10:01,479 Speaker 1: as Guys White once remarked, embodying the position of women. 1134 01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:04,679 Speaker 1: Quote launched into adulthood with a foot in both worlds, 1135 01:10:04,800 --> 01:10:08,040 Speaker 1: and quote will not be lauded. I really like watching 1136 01:10:08,160 --> 01:10:11,720 Speaker 1: characters funk up and adjust and grow over time, even 1137 01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:13,920 Speaker 1: if they don't grow as quickly as people would like. 1138 01:10:14,520 --> 01:10:19,520 Speaker 1: And again, Kathy is commenting pretty much exclusively on feminisms 1139 01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:23,200 Speaker 1: traditional beneficiaries. That's important to note, and I think it 1140 01:10:23,280 --> 01:10:26,000 Speaker 1: made her work a kind of safe choice to feature 1141 01:10:26,040 --> 01:10:29,240 Speaker 1: in the funny pages at first. The absence of black, brown, 1142 01:10:29,439 --> 01:10:32,840 Speaker 1: queer Asian Native women from the pages of the newspapers 1143 01:10:32,960 --> 01:10:36,240 Speaker 1: during this era is absolutely a failure, and I believe 1144 01:10:36,280 --> 01:10:40,200 Speaker 1: primarily an editorial and systemic one. So no, Kathy is 1145 01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:43,519 Speaker 1: not an ambassador of perfect feminism and certainly does not 1146 01:10:43,720 --> 01:10:46,920 Speaker 1: speak for all women, and she never claimed to by guys. 1147 01:10:46,960 --> 01:10:49,680 Speaker 1: By its own admission, the Kathy character was created as 1148 01:10:49,760 --> 01:10:52,960 Speaker 1: comfort food for those who felt slower to apply the 1149 01:10:53,080 --> 01:10:56,559 Speaker 1: tenets of feminism to their daily lives, who were making 1150 01:10:56,680 --> 01:10:59,920 Speaker 1: an active effort to unlearned behaviors and instincts they've grown 1151 01:11:00,040 --> 01:11:03,120 Speaker 1: up with but maybe weren't quite there yet. If anything, 1152 01:11:03,240 --> 01:11:05,960 Speaker 1: I think the Kathy character reflects some of the games 1153 01:11:06,040 --> 01:11:09,679 Speaker 1: made by American feminists between the seventies and the two thousand's, 1154 01:11:09,880 --> 01:11:13,000 Speaker 1: as well as the frustrating, stopped and start nature of 1155 01:11:13,080 --> 01:11:17,200 Speaker 1: progress and the exclusionary measures taken when ending the comic 1156 01:11:17,320 --> 01:11:20,760 Speaker 1: in two thousand ten, Kathy guys White said this, I 1157 01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:23,760 Speaker 1: am not stopping the strip because I think anything has 1158 01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:27,000 Speaker 1: been resolved. When I see my daughter and her generation, 1159 01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:29,800 Speaker 1: I see that a lot of the games between men 1160 01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:33,600 Speaker 1: and women fixation on fashion. I'll die if my hair 1161 01:11:33,720 --> 01:11:35,920 Speaker 1: doesn't look right, And I really thought we could have 1162 01:11:36,200 --> 01:11:39,280 Speaker 1: lost that in the last thirty years, but I guess 1163 01:11:39,320 --> 01:11:42,800 Speaker 1: we haven't. She continues a bit later, I feel like 1164 01:11:43,120 --> 01:11:45,760 Speaker 1: a lot of the time my strip made sort of 1165 01:11:45,840 --> 01:11:49,960 Speaker 1: political comments about the state of women, their expectations, state 1166 01:11:50,000 --> 01:11:53,320 Speaker 1: of women in the office, being harassed, being held back, 1167 01:11:53,760 --> 01:11:57,200 Speaker 1: being utterly confused by the mixed messages we get from 1168 01:11:57,280 --> 01:12:00,759 Speaker 1: everything from what size to be had, a few about ourselves, 1169 01:12:00,800 --> 01:12:04,559 Speaker 1: how to look to me, that's all sort of political. 1170 01:12:04,880 --> 01:12:07,559 Speaker 1: A lot of what I wrote about was the woman's 1171 01:12:07,600 --> 01:12:09,920 Speaker 1: place in the world and the pressure we're under to 1172 01:12:10,080 --> 01:12:13,360 Speaker 1: be a certain way, to think certain things, to have 1173 01:12:13,840 --> 01:12:19,479 Speaker 1: or not have certain opportunities. And that's where Kathy and 1174 01:12:19,680 --> 01:12:23,240 Speaker 1: American feminism stands. Her work does not represent the experience 1175 01:12:23,280 --> 01:12:26,599 Speaker 1: of all American women, because American women are not a monolith. 1176 01:12:26,840 --> 01:12:28,960 Speaker 1: There are a lot of perspectives that we don't see 1177 01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:31,200 Speaker 1: in her work. What we do see is how an 1178 01:12:31,240 --> 01:12:35,120 Speaker 1: average woman received the gains and stepped back around feminism. 1179 01:12:35,280 --> 01:12:37,800 Speaker 1: Whether you agree with her takes or not, I'm going 1180 01:12:37,880 --> 01:12:40,960 Speaker 1: to close this episode with some words from Roxanne Gay 1181 01:12:41,160 --> 01:12:46,640 Speaker 1: and her essay collection Bad Feminist. Gay says this, feminisms 1182 01:12:46,680 --> 01:12:50,240 Speaker 1: failings do not mean we should hue feminism entirely. People 1183 01:12:50,320 --> 01:12:52,720 Speaker 1: do terrible things all the time, but we don't regularly 1184 01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:56,519 Speaker 1: disown our humanity. We disavow the terrible things. We should 1185 01:12:56,560 --> 01:12:59,959 Speaker 1: disavow the failures of feminism without disavowing its many successes 1186 01:13:00,160 --> 01:13:03,479 Speaker 1: and how far we have come. American feminism has been 1187 01:13:03,640 --> 01:13:07,840 Speaker 1: fractured and laud as hell from the jump, and understanding 1188 01:13:07,920 --> 01:13:11,240 Speaker 1: that history feels important in order to move forward, though 1189 01:13:11,280 --> 01:13:13,800 Speaker 1: a small one, I think Cathy Strips are a part 1190 01:13:13,880 --> 01:13:15,840 Speaker 1: of that, and as the only woman in the Funny 1191 01:13:15,880 --> 01:13:19,960 Speaker 1: Pages at the beginning of her career, those contributions are significant. 1192 01:13:20,280 --> 01:13:25,080 Speaker 1: And speaking of those Funny Pages, what was going on there? 1193 01:13:25,760 --> 01:13:28,559 Speaker 1: Next week we take a look at the women who 1194 01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:31,320 Speaker 1: came before Kathy in this media, at the men she 1195 01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:34,280 Speaker 1: was sharing the pages of, and how newspaper comics grew 1196 01:13:34,400 --> 01:13:37,559 Speaker 1: and changed during her thirty four year tenure. There will 1197 01:13:37,640 --> 01:13:41,320 Speaker 1: be boondocks, there will be Dilbert's, and with deepest regrets, 1198 01:13:41,640 --> 01:13:45,519 Speaker 1: there might be even a family circus next week on 1199 01:13:46,040 --> 01:13:50,080 Speaker 1: ac Cast. Act Cast is an I Heart radio production. 1200 01:13:50,320 --> 01:13:54,000 Speaker 1: It is written, researched, and hosted by me Jamie Loftus, 1201 01:13:54,240 --> 01:13:57,880 Speaker 1: Sophie Lichtaman is the World's Greatest producer, Isaac Taylor is 1202 01:13:57,920 --> 01:14:01,320 Speaker 1: the world's greatest editor. Zoe played It's the World's Greatest music, 1203 01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:05,400 Speaker 1: and Brandon Dickard wrote the world greatest theme song for 1204 01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:08,280 Speaker 1: this show. In today's episode, you heard the vocal talent 1205 01:14:08,400 --> 01:14:13,439 Speaker 1: of Jackie Michelle Johnson as Cathy, Melissa Lozada Oliva as Andrea, 1206 01:14:13,720 --> 01:14:17,439 Speaker 1: Maggie Mayfish as Charlene, Miles Gray as Mr. Pinkley, and 1207 01:14:17,760 --> 01:14:22,040 Speaker 1: Irving with additional performances might be wonderful Joel Smith, Sharene 1208 01:14:22,120 --> 01:14:28,280 Speaker 1: Lanny Unist, Caitlin Derante, Julia Claire, and Isaac Taylor. Oh Boy, 1209 01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:36,360 Speaker 1: see you next week. Teething can be a real nightmare 1210 01:14:36,400 --> 01:14:39,400 Speaker 1: for your little ones. Highlands Naturals baby oral pain relief 1211 01:14:39,439 --> 01:14:42,439 Speaker 1: tablets can help ease the pain. 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The 1220 01:15:07,360 --> 01:15:10,680 Speaker 1: more we learn about COVID nineteen, the more questions we have. 1221 01:15:11,280 --> 01:15:16,240 Speaker 1: The biggest question now, what's next? What will COVID bring 1222 01:15:16,400 --> 01:15:20,519 Speaker 1: in six months a year? If you're feeling anxious about 1223 01:15:20,520 --> 01:15:24,360 Speaker 1: the future, you're not alone. Cal Hope offers free COVID 1224 01:15:24,479 --> 01:15:30,479 Speaker 1: nineteen emotional support. Call eight three three four six seven 1225 01:15:30,560 --> 01:15:34,439 Speaker 1: three or live chat at cal Hope dot org today. 1226 01:15:35,960 --> 01:15:37,639 Speaker 1: If you work in I T, you'll want to check 1227 01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:41,599 Speaker 1: out change Makers, a podcast profiling I T industry leaders. 1228 01:15:41,760 --> 01:15:44,160 Speaker 1: We dive deep into I T profiles and learn what 1229 01:15:44,320 --> 01:15:47,000 Speaker 1: it takes to drive large scale I T transformations for 1230 01:15:47,160 --> 01:15:50,880 Speaker 1: successful businesses. Visit change Makers dot fresh works dot com