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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for

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Speaker 2: the future of this show.

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Speaker 3: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 3: perspectives from the left and the right that simply does

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Speaker 3: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and

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Speaker 2: you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free,

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Speaker 2: and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

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Speaker 3: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: dot com.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, everybody, Happy Tuesday.

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Speaker 3: We have an amazing show for everybody today. What do

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Speaker 3: we have, Crystal, indeed we do so.

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Speaker 2: We've got confirmation hearing set to start today. Pete Hegseth

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Speaker 2: is up first, the nominee for Secretary of Defense. We're

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Speaker 2: also taking a look at the way that some of

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Speaker 2: Trump's nominees have changed their tune on key issues in

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Speaker 2: an attempt to get across the finish lines. This very

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Speaker 2: interesting stuff. There got a bunch of media news for you.

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Speaker 2: Jen Rubin is leaving the Washington Post and starting a

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Speaker 2: new venture with the very interesting launch video, so I'll

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Speaker 2: show you that.

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Speaker 4: The big news though.

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Speaker 2: Is MSNBC Rachel Maddow is being put back in on

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Speaker 2: a nightly basis, at least for the first hundred days

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Speaker 2: of the Trump administration. I think an indication of how

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Speaker 2: much MSNBC is struggling in the ratings and sort of

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Speaker 2: trying to find regain their identity and planned for the future, etc.

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Speaker 2: So really interesting development. There, huge potential news in the

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Speaker 2: least maybe inching close to a Gaza ceasefire deal. The

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Speaker 2: details on how that was all achieved. Obviously, the timing

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Speaker 2: is Trump is set to re enter office. All of

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Speaker 2: this very significant, very interesting, so we'll dig into that.

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Speaker 2: Also have some updates for you on a potential TikTok sale.

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Speaker 2: So there was a report that they might be looking

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Speaker 2: at selling to Elon who knows, they're denying it, I

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Speaker 2: don't know.

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Speaker 4: It's interesting.

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Speaker 2: We've also got the leadst back and forth with Steve

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Speaker 2: Bannon just absolutely torching Elon Musk in this continued sort

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Speaker 2: of intra mega war. We are going to once again

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Speaker 2: attempt to have Matt Stoller on today. We had some

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Speaker 2: kind of technical issue. Yesterday, we wanted to get him

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Speaker 2: to weigh in on Mark Zuckerberg's appearance on the Joe

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Speaker 2: Rogan podcast and what he had to say there, in

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Speaker 2: particular about the CFPP.

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Speaker 4: So we're going to try for that again.

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Speaker 2: I think we've got all the tech issues resolves, so

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Speaker 2: it should be good to go this time. And James

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Speaker 2: Fox has a new documentary out about the UFO program,

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Speaker 2: so Soccer's going to talk to him about that.

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Speaker 4: I'm sure that would be quite interesting.

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Speaker 1: It will be interesting. Indeed. James one of my favorite

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Speaker 1: UFO filmmakers.

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Speaker 3: He's made some phenomenal films and documentaries in the past.

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Speaker 3: Highly recommend you guys watch them and we will show

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Speaker 3: you where you can, as well as talk to him

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Speaker 3: a little bit about what we learned. But as Christal said,

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Speaker 3: the hearings are off, we are off to the races.

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Speaker 3: Pete Hegseth will be in the box today very shortly

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Speaker 3: after we finished taping this show actually on Capitol Hill.

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Speaker 3: Let's go ahead and put this up there on the screen.

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Speaker 3: Pete Hegseth will be the first of Donald Trump's nominees

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Speaker 3: to appear before the United States Senate for him confermation

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Speaker 3: hearings but quickly followed within the next week or so

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Speaker 3: that you guys should pay attention to. So after Hegseth

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Speaker 3: goes up, A Chirsty Nome is set to testify on

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Speaker 3: Wednesday at nine am for DHS Secretary. Marco Rubio will

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Speaker 3: be at ten am Wednesday before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

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Speaker 3: Pam Bondi will also be up before the Senate Judiciary

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Speaker 3: Committee this week on Thursday. You also have some hearings

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Speaker 3: that have yet to be scheduled, which is kind of interesting.

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Speaker 3: Those include RFK Junior for Health and Human Services, Cash

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Speaker 3: Patel for FBI Director, Linda McMahon for the Secretary of Education,

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Speaker 3: and Tulsey Gabbert. Now, the reason why those in particular

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Speaker 3: have been held up is that you have some of

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Speaker 3: these nominees who are going through the vetting process and

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Speaker 3: the ones who appear to be a little bit more precarious.

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Speaker 3: Although we'll talk about this, I think we both generally

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Speaker 3: where they're probably all going to make it, it just

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Speaker 3: could be more of a rocky road. One in particular

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Speaker 3: has been Tulsa Gabbert, who has not been able to

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Speaker 3: get a confirmation hearing scheduled and has herself come under

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Speaker 3: a lot of pressure to change some of her past

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Speaker 3: positions on FIZA, So let's go ahead and put this

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Speaker 3: up there on the screen. This was a key signal

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Speaker 3: from Tulsa Gabbert she was willing to play ball with

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Speaker 3: the Republicans by completely reversing her past posisue a past

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Speaker 3: position on section seven oh two of the Foreign Intelligence

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Speaker 3: Surveillance Act. You guys have probably heard us talk about

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Speaker 3: it in the past, but if what it all comes

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Speaker 3: down to is it's section Section seven oh two. Reauthorization

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Speaker 3: has been a key issue actually since the beginning of PISA,

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Speaker 3: but in particular became a bipartisan issue after it was

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Speaker 3: used to spy on Carter Page, the Donald Trump associate

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Speaker 3: twenty seventeen is his key part of Russiagate lore. So Ever,

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Speaker 3: since that happened, there's been kind of a maga push

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Speaker 3: to try and to end section seven oh two.

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Speaker 1: The deep State has fought tooth and nailed to keep.

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Speaker 3: It and they've succeeded, And frankly, this is just more

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Speaker 3: evidence of why they succeed Jenator James Langford of Oklahoma

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Speaker 3: literally said he's like, I will not vote for her

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Speaker 3: unless she reverses a position on seven oh two.

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Speaker 1: And she was like, Okay, the only one and he

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Speaker 1: was not the only one. He's the only one who

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Speaker 1: said it out loud.

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Speaker 3: We'll recall in the House of Representatives Mike Johnson who

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Speaker 3: previously had said some interesting things on seven oh two,

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Speaker 3: Mike Turner who's in the Intelligence Committee chair, and others

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Speaker 3: significantly pushed and all of a sudden, miraculously seven oh

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Speaker 3: two just sails through the House GOP. And I'm talking

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Speaker 3: about hundreds of people in the House GOP have spoken

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Speaker 3: against section seven oh two. Here again with Tulsia I,

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Speaker 3: I don't think you can find a figure who is

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Speaker 3: more emblematic of the at least bipartisan push. Originally she

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Speaker 3: went from literally Democratic Republican. But I think we could

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Speaker 3: say she's generally been skeptical of the deep state, etc.

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Speaker 3: In the past, and for her to switch her position

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Speaker 3: on this is really disheartening. I mean, it just means

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Speaker 3: that even here, when you have people who have had

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Speaker 3: this long time position and who want to get through

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Speaker 3: the confirmation process, that is un you know, it's basically

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Speaker 3: it's just not possible to be confirmed. And then also

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Speaker 3: it just shows if you're willing to play ball on this,

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Speaker 3: what are you going to play ball on next time?

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Speaker 3: You have a lot of talk about Epstein files, JFK files.

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Speaker 3: People often they're like, why are you so pessimistic? Or

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Speaker 3: whenever you know, I meet a lot of people, people

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Speaker 3: are very excited. They're like, Oh, we're really going to

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Speaker 3: get the files this time. Like, yeah, maybe you know,

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Speaker 3: I would love to listen. Nobody would love it more

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Speaker 3: than me. But you know, I've seen too much of

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Speaker 3: this game here in Washington, and this is perhaps the

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Speaker 3: most high profile example.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean Telsea has changed her political stripes in any

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Speaker 2: number of ways and shifted her positions on any number

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Speaker 2: of issues, but this is like the core of what

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Speaker 2: she has like consistently stood for. And just as a

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Speaker 2: reminder for people, I'm sure you have heard US and

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Speaker 2: other programs talking about Section seven zero two. Effectively, this

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Speaker 2: was you know, passed alongside the Patriot Act. The idea

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Speaker 2: was that they could target foreign individual for surveillance.

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Speaker 4: But in the context of.

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Speaker 2: That, if that foreign individual happened to be talking to

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Speaker 2: a US citizen, guess what, you're scooping up all their

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Speaker 2: communications as well? Then not only does that occur, and

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Speaker 2: we're talking a mass amount of US citizen communications getting

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Speaker 2: swept up in this, then not only does that occur,

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Speaker 2: but US agencies that are able to do these backdoor

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Speaker 2: searches of that valance data that they have pulled without

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Speaker 2: having to obtain a warrant. So this is effectively an

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Speaker 2: end round around, an end run around.

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Speaker 4: The Fourth Amendment.

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Speaker 2: Allows what I view as a legal, unconstitutional searches and

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Speaker 2: surveillance of Americans, again without a warrant. There was a

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Speaker 2: huge fight during the Biden administration about the reauthorization. It

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Speaker 2: ends up being reauthorized. There were claims that there were

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Speaker 2: some reforms put into this reauthorization, which was set to

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Speaker 2: last for only two years, so time to just sort

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Speaker 2: of last out the Biden administration.

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Speaker 4: Part of those reforms.

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Speaker 2: Actually, what privacy advocates, civil liberties advocates, people like Tolzi Gabbertt.

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Speaker 4: Herself said is that in reality, they.

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Speaker 2: Actually because the wording on these quote unquote reforms was

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Speaker 2: so loose, they actually expanded the capabilities under Section seven

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Speaker 2: oh two. They opened it up, for example, to you know,

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Speaker 2: requiring the collection of data coming through data service centers,

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Speaker 2: and even the language is so loose that it could

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Speaker 2: require someone who's like a janitor at a data center

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Speaker 2: to pull data and spy on their fellow Americans.

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Speaker 4: So that was the quote unquote reform.

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Speaker 2: So anyway, Section seven zero two, it has not been

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Speaker 2: dealt with, It has not been improved. There are no

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Speaker 2: reforms that have made this any less damaging and any

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Speaker 2: less concerning if you are a civil liberty's advocate. And

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Speaker 2: yet that's exactly what Tulsi pointed to in this statement

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Speaker 2: where she completely reversed this course announceays, now.

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Speaker 4: I'm good with that.

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Speaker 2: I don't really care, think that it's all fine and

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Speaker 2: good now. She says that she was My prior concerns

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Speaker 2: about FISA were based on insufficient protections for civil liberties,

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Speaker 2: particularly regarding the FBI's misuse warrantless search powers on American citizens.

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Speaker 2: Significant PISA reforms have been enacted since my time in Congress.

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Speaker 4: To address these issues.

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Speaker 2: So she says, reforms are passed, We're good to go now,

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Speaker 2: don't need to worry about it. And our producer Griffin

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Speaker 2: pulled a SoundBite of Tulsi just eight months ago. We're

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Speaker 2: not talking years and years, we're talking just eight months

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Speaker 2: ago after these supposed quote unquote reforms passed, saying that

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Speaker 2: the reforms actually made everything worse. She decried the very

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Speaker 2: reforms that she's now saying have alleviated all of her concerns.

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Speaker 4: Let's take a listen to that.

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Speaker 5: The bill that would reinstate or extend the PISA authorities,

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Speaker 5: the Foreign Intelligence Security Act authorities for another two years.

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Speaker 5: Section seven ZHO two of FAIZA gives our government the

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Speaker 5: authority to surveil foreign actors, essentially to try to identify

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Speaker 5: terrorist threats. But part of that is they have the

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Speaker 5: ability to capture all of the conversations if you talk

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Speaker 5: to somebody in another country that they're interested in, they

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Speaker 5: can then go in and capture all of your information

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Speaker 5: as an American citizen, and they can do this without

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Speaker 5: a warrant. This has been in place for quite some time,

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Speaker 5: but this legislation that was just passed recently expanded those

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Speaker 5: authorities so they can go and actually look at like

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Speaker 5: your your WiFi history, if you're connected to Wi Fi,

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Speaker 5: they can look at everything that you did connected to

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Speaker 5: that Wi Fi signal, and in some other ways, it's

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Speaker 5: it took an already bad problem and made it many

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Speaker 5: many times worse. And again they're just saying, well, it's

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Speaker 5: for national security. The problem here is that's the thing

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Speaker 5: they ow, That's the thing they always say. And it's like,

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Speaker 5: you know, the I think it was Benjamin Franklin who said,

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Speaker 5: if you know, if you are choosing security over liberty,

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Speaker 5: you will neither be secure nor will you have liberty.

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Speaker 2: So there she is saying those reforms that she's now saying, oh,

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Speaker 2: they alleviated my concerns. She says that those reforms took

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Speaker 2: an already bad problem and made it many many times worse.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I like, obviously Tulsi completely flipping on

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Speaker 2: this to get through the confirmation process. The cope on

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Speaker 2: seeing is like, oh, she's saying what she needs to

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Speaker 2: and then when she gets in there, she's gonna go

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Speaker 2: return to form. Just tell me when that you've ever

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Speaker 2: seen that happen before in Washington. Well, and I don't

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Speaker 2: want to let Trump off the hook here either, because

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Speaker 2: he has also said that Section seven zero two was

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Speaker 2: a key priority. And you know, perhaps if Tulci is

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Speaker 2: left there out on her own, as she kind of

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Speaker 2: has been to get through the confirmation process, she's got

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Speaker 2: to bend and twist to these senator's whims. If Donald

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Speaker 2: Trump came in and said, no, this is a priority

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Speaker 2: and this is happening, You're going to confirm Tulsi Gabbard,

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Speaker 2: Tulsi Gabbard would get confirmed holding onto her previous principled

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Speaker 2: position with regard to sections.

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Speaker 4: That's always my opinion.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's always the issue, and this is part of

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Speaker 3: the problem that president cannot unilaterally just stop the seven

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Speaker 3: oh two authority. And you can try in terms of

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Speaker 3: how it works with the intelligence community, but as you

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Speaker 3: see with congressional reauthorization specifically, that's why they always hang

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Speaker 3: their hat on it, and it's the one thing they

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Speaker 3: have always gone to war for. I remember reading like

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Speaker 3: in the past former I think it's former NSA director

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Speaker 3: being like, this greatest single threat to the US intelligence

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Speaker 3: community is to not renew Section seven oh two.

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Speaker 1: Now, I mean, look, let's take.

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Speaker 3: Him at his word, and if you don't like the

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Speaker 3: intelligence community and you don't like the current methods, maybe

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Speaker 3: we should not reauthorize it. But that is certainly part

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Speaker 3: of the problem here. And just for people who see

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Speaker 3: this is how Washington works, guys, and I saw Glenn

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Speaker 3: Greenwalley did a fantastic segment about this, about the problems

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Speaker 3: with seven oh two, and exactly about how DC you know,

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Speaker 3: have shaped people to shape people. Even the people who

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Speaker 3: are outsiders, the total outsiders, who were you know, like

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Speaker 3: Tulsi Gabbard, even they can be brought to heal. But

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Speaker 3: I will say, you know, it's not just Tulsi. Let's

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Speaker 3: go ahead and put a four please up on the screen.

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Speaker 3: A lot of these people, again outsiders, are colliding with

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Speaker 3: the legitimate political system, and you guys will see that

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Speaker 3: that does not mean that they have the authority that

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Speaker 3: we may necessarily want them to have. So as you

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Speaker 3: guys saw with seven oh two, we just showed you.

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Speaker 3: But RFK Junior actually on two key positions. One is

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Speaker 3: saying that. One is saying he said, I'm quote all

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Speaker 3: for the polio vaccine. This is despite some pass advocacy

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Speaker 3: against that. I have seen some people say like he

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Speaker 3: was talking about a previous version of the polio vaccine.

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Speaker 3: I'm not one hundred percent certain on that, but what

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Speaker 3: I do know is an absolute flip flop is abortion.

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Speaker 3: Because he assured Senator James Langford that he, as the

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Speaker 3: HHS Secretary, would not use any state or taxpayer funded

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Speaker 3: resources to go towards organizations like Planned Parenthood or others,

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Speaker 3: and that if there were some movement within the Trump

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Speaker 3: bureaucracy like against the what is the abortion pill that's

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Speaker 3: currently moving through the US mail system and others that

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Speaker 3: which again the HHS, Secretary of the FDA and these

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Speaker 3: other organizations have significant regulatory authority over that, he would

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Speaker 3: not interfere. So that is one where he's previously a

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Speaker 3: pro choice Democrat. You know, I'm a pretty key litmus

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Speaker 3: test issue, I would say, but has changed. We also

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Speaker 3: have here Pete Hegsath, who has previously opposed women serving

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Speaker 3: in combat roles. By the way, today that is going

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Speaker 3: to be the number one thing you guys are all

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Speaker 3: going to hear about, So brace yourselves. I was just

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Speaker 3: reading this morning that the Senate Armed Services Committee has

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Speaker 3: seven Democratic women on it. Two of them one of

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Speaker 3: them is Elizabeth Warren, but one Kirsten Gillibrand not a

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Speaker 3: lot of people know this. Literally one of her key

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Speaker 3: issues in the Senate is women in the military, and

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Speaker 3: specifically adjudicated eating sexual assault in the military. She's previously

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Speaker 3: tried to take it out of the hands of the U.

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Speaker 3: Cmjan and make it like civilian thing. Terrible idea in

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Speaker 3: my opinion, but whatever, well, fine, it failed.

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Speaker 2: The concern was that oftentimes women were having to report

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Speaker 2: sexual assault up the chain of command to people who

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Speaker 2: you know, either may have had a close relationship with

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Speaker 2: the abuser or may even be the abuser themselves, that

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Speaker 2: there were problems with the previous system.

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Speaker 1: We'll put out saying the previous system was perfect.

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Speaker 3: But anyway, this just has all been adjudicated and it

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Speaker 3: did not work or it did not pass. My point

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Speaker 3: is is that those people, I think Maji Orono as well,

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Speaker 3: who is on the Senate Armed Services Committee, are going

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Speaker 3: to significantly press Pete hexeth on the women in combat roles.

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Speaker 3: To one of them, Tammy Duckworth. Obviously, she was wounded

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Speaker 3: in combat. I think she lost two of her legs,

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Speaker 3: so that's going to be a set piece. And they're

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Speaker 3: also going to be pressing him on previous allegations against him.

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Speaker 3: There's some talk here about the FBI reports. So if

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Speaker 3: there's anyone that's going to be explosive, spicy for media

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Speaker 3: content and anothers, I think the Pete Hegseth one certainly today.

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Speaker 3: I also think the RFK Junior one is a sleeper.

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Speaker 3: I mean, this is still not one where you're one

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Speaker 3: hundred percent on confirmation. But as I said at the top,

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Speaker 3: I have a reasonable expectation that all these people are

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Speaker 3: going to get confirmed. Trump has stuck by all of them.

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Speaker 3: He brought Joni Hearnst Jonie Ernst to heel. She previously

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Speaker 3: had been trying to, you know, stop Pete Hegseth's or

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Speaker 3: Pete Hexets nomination. She is also a major proponent of

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Speaker 3: women in combat, former veteran herself, and I believe she

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Speaker 3: didn't she say she was previously. She's a sexual assault

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Speaker 3: survivor anyway, So my point is that she had some

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Speaker 3: objections to him, but and she also wanted the job herself.

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Speaker 3: Now it seems that she's either endorsed him or she's like,

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Speaker 3: I'm willing to hear him out in confirmation. Hexeth may

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Speaker 3: have some of the biggest trouble, but you know, Tulsea

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Speaker 3: Gabbard cash Betel and Tolsey Gabbard cash Betel and RFK

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Speaker 3: Junior I think are going to have some of the

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Speaker 3: toughest confirmation hearings, especially with the way that the Democrats

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Speaker 3: are going to try and to create viral moments and

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Speaker 3: more political increy and create political conditions to make them unconfirmable.

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Speaker 3: But considering what we've seen so far, I don't see

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Speaker 3: anything other than some crazy kind of black Swan event

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Speaker 3: happening that would prevent any of them from being able

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Speaker 3: to take their position.

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Speaker 4: I think they're all likely to get through.

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Speaker 2: I think Telsa is probably the one that is the

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Speaker 2: most dicey because I don't think a single Democrat will

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Speaker 2: vote for her. I mean, you know, these things are personal.

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Speaker 2: Are a lot of these way like she used the

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Speaker 2: turncoat in terms of the Democratic Party, So they're not

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Speaker 2: going to be excited to vote for her, and then

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Speaker 2: they worry about her different foreign ties, et cetera, et cetera.

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Speaker 2: But and Republicans are going to be the hawks in

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Speaker 2: the Republican Caucus are also going to be somewhat skeptical

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Speaker 2: of her, which is why this section seven two thing

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Speaker 2: was so significant. Her changing her stripes on this one

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Speaker 2: is so significant in an attempt to get herself across

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Speaker 2: the finish line, because I think she felt that especially

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Speaker 2: without you know, again, I think if Trump came in

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Speaker 2: and said, Tulsi's my Tulsi is my pick. I wanner through.

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Speaker 2: I will punish anyone who doesn't vote for her. Section

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Speaker 2: seven oh two is a key priority for me. You

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Speaker 2: are not going to block her nomination over something that

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Speaker 2: I support and is my agenda, the will of people.

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Speaker 4: Blah blah blah.

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Speaker 2: I think he could get her over the finish line

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Speaker 2: without her having to change her stripes, but that's obviously

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Speaker 2: not the way that things are playing out. So again,

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Speaker 2: I think she'll get through. I think hers might be

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Speaker 2: the one that has the biggest question mark.

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Speaker 4: And then you never know, you know, what could come

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Speaker 4: up in an.

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Speaker 2: FBI report that causes the problem, you know, that sort

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Speaker 2: of wild card situation. Is there something that we don't

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Speaker 2: know about these various picks that could ultimately come out.

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Speaker 2: But given the fact that number one, the Republicans have

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Speaker 2: really you know, when Trump said vote for Mike Johnson,

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Speaker 2: and they all fell in line.

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Speaker 4: They voted for Mike Johnson.

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Speaker 2: Right when he called up Jony Ernst and said you're

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Speaker 2: gonna behind Pete Haigsath, I'm assuming is what happened. She

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Speaker 2: was like, all right, fine, I'm going to be behind Pete.

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Speaker 4: Hegseth.

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Speaker 2: So I think the Republicans are going to fall in line,

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Speaker 2: and some of the Democrats are going to vote for

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Speaker 2: I think the Democrats are going to vote for more

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Speaker 2: of these picks than they voted for Trump's picks back

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Speaker 2: in twenty sixteen, because they have decided a good number

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Speaker 2: of them have decided that they're not really going to

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Speaker 2: resist the Trump administration in the way that they.

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Speaker 4: Did last time around.

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Speaker 2: There's just less of a desire to fight on some

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Speaker 2: of these things. So yeah, I think these picks are

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Speaker 2: all probably going.

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Speaker 3: To get through, Which brings us now to one of

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Speaker 3: the most hilarious parts of all of this is, as

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Speaker 3: you said, the fall apart of the resistance. That's a

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Speaker 3: good transition, so perfect example and how different this all is.

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Speaker 1: Let's put this up there on the screen.

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Speaker 3: The Washington Post editorial board has now issued endorsements for

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Speaker 3: all of the Trump cabinet nominees, and hilariously, they endorse

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Speaker 3: all but four of those nominees Pete Hegseth, are FK Junior,

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Speaker 3: Russ Vout for the Office of Management and Budget, and

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Speaker 3: the d n I Tulsey Gabbert. Now, I think why

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Speaker 3: this is ironic and kind of hilarious is just that.

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Speaker 3: It shows you how the Washington Post under Bezos is

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Speaker 3: trying to strike this balance of resistance audience with respectability

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Speaker 3: Washington institution politics. Now you can have one, you cannot

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Speaker 3: have both. And as we'll show you soon with their

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Speaker 3: traffic numbers, they're actually getting neither. But some of the

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Speaker 3: most hilarious ways that they endorse people you can just read.

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Speaker 3: For example, Marco Rubio. Here's why they endorse him. The

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Speaker 3: son of immigrants. Rubio is respected by Senate colleagues and

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Speaker 3: understands the vital importance of American leadership.

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Speaker 1: That's it. That's the that's their entire.

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Speaker 3: Jeff Bezos tune on why you should confirm him. For example,

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Speaker 3: on Pete Hegseth or RFK Junior, they just say with Hegseth,

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Speaker 3: the former Fox who's anchored, lacks the temperament and moral

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Speaker 3: fiber required to lead the Pentagon. He persuaded Trump to

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Speaker 3: pardon accuse war criminals, and as a well documented history

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Speaker 3: of womanizing and heavy drinking, though he says he'll give

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Speaker 3: up the bottle if he gets one of the most

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Speaker 3: sensitive and powerful jobs in the world. So they're switched

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Speaker 3: between like incisive things that they want to criticize others

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Speaker 3: on and for those though, like Doug Bergham, they say

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Speaker 3: the outgoing North Dakota governor and Stanford MBA built a

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Speaker 3: successful software company that he sold to Microsoft.

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Speaker 1: That's it. That's that's the only thing that they write for.

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Speaker 3: So the reason why this is funny is you have

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Speaker 3: to pair this endorsement and all of that with what

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Speaker 3: is also going on over at the Washington Post. So

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Speaker 3: let's move on to the next one, shall we. Washington

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Speaker 3: Post traffic from semaphore has gone from twenty two point

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Speaker 3: five daily active users in twenty twenty one.

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Speaker 4: Just out January sixth, that was the piece right.

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Speaker 3: Just after January sixth, to about three million, three million,

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Speaker 3: So you guys can do the math on what that

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Speaker 3: means daily active users down to two point five to

435
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,600
Speaker 3: three million, So that means that they have had a

436
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 3: sixty percent decline now currently in the overall traffic numbers,

437
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,679
Speaker 3: just month over months since they decided not to do

438
00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,640
Speaker 3: that endorsement. And then The Wall Street Journal has previously

439
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:21,359
Speaker 3: reported that the Post revenue fell from one hundred and

440
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,080
Speaker 3: ninety million in twenty twenty three to one hundred and

441
00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,040
Speaker 3: seventy four million just last year. Keep in mind, both

442
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,520
Speaker 3: the one hundred and ninety and one seventy four figure

443
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:30,960
Speaker 3: are not enough to cover.

444
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:33,040
Speaker 1: Their bills, and Bezos is still losing.

445
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:36,119
Speaker 3: Some one hundred million dollars or so per year operating

446
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 3: the paper.

447
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:38,680
Speaker 1: Now they've done significant.

448
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:40,680
Speaker 3: Layoffs and all of that, but part of the problem

449
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:43,239
Speaker 3: behind all of this is that the only time they

450
00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:46,919
Speaker 3: were ever in the green and profitable is by highlighting

451
00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:50,720
Speaker 3: the very resistance figures like Jennifer Rubin and others who

452
00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 3: were plot Twist has decided to leave. The paper will

453
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,240
Speaker 3: show you in a second, but all of their democracy

454
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:58,879
Speaker 3: dies in the darkness branding, et cetera. It might have

455
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,879
Speaker 3: made Bezos a little uncomfortable and at odds with Trump,

456
00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 3: but it was the only market based success that they

457
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,120
Speaker 3: could ever achieve. By ditching that, they both have gone

458
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,679
Speaker 3: from a paper that just, I mean breaks some news,

459
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,040
Speaker 3: not a ton great journalist. Obviously, we have Jeff Stein

460
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 3: here on the show, but it's not an institution in

461
00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:16,600
Speaker 3: the same way the New York Times is at all.

462
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 3: But also by ditching the Resistance and then trying to

463
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,879
Speaker 3: find this like almost like journal esque medium, they just

464
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 3: have no identity.

465
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:25,240
Speaker 1: So it's a good.

466
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 3: Example of whenever you're just constantly moving your principles around,

467
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 3: especially your customers and others, you're going to find yourself

468
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:34,440
Speaker 3: in a position like this.

469
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:36,720
Speaker 1: Now Bezos is filthy rich and he probably just doesn't care.

470
00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,000
Speaker 3: But you know, if you run the paper, this is

471
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:42,840
Speaker 3: still like this is a what, second largest newspaper in

472
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,920
Speaker 3: the United States, one of the most nationally known papers

473
00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 3: in the entire world, and it's basically collapsing in front

474
00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:53,120
Speaker 3: of our eyes, Like it's not inconceivable that this revenue

475
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,800
Speaker 3: drops below one hundred million this year with all of

476
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,560
Speaker 3: these crazy cuts and things they're trying to do over there,

477
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,159
Speaker 3: and that more and more of their star journalists and

478
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:02,919
Speaker 3: others who are the only ones who brought in traffic

479
00:24:02,960 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 3: are just gonna leave. So okay, I mean that seems

480
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:07,199
Speaker 3: to be the case. All the top reporters I know

481
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:08,400
Speaker 3: of then sign are gone.

482
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,080
Speaker 1: They all left. Yeah, I just decided they don't want

483
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:10,760
Speaker 1: to deal with it anymore.

484
00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, so the just to go back for

485
00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 2: a second, the cabinet endorsement thing, which is not a

486
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,920
Speaker 2: thing I've ever seen any paper do before, and it's

487
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:24,120
Speaker 2: just like wo weird exactly, and that the analysis.

488
00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 1: Is so shallow, like form immigrants.

489
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:29,480
Speaker 2: For Christino dog jokes aside, she's served in Congress in

490
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 2: two terms as governor of South Dakota, so we give

491
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 2: her a thumbs up. It's like, okay, but like, what

492
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 2: does she believe and does that qualify her to be

493
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,159
Speaker 2: a homeland securities I got have to go to.

494
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,280
Speaker 1: Population is less than one million, by the way, so

495
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:41,680
Speaker 1: just so.

496
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 6: We're all aware.

497
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:44,920
Speaker 2: But the other thing that's ironic too is five seconds

498
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 2: ago they were like, we don't do indiments.

499
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 1: Yes, we had good point.

500
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:49,600
Speaker 4: People decide.

501
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 2: Oh now suddenly when you're going to endorse almost all

502
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 2: of Trump's nominees, suddenly you're back in the endorsements game.

503
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 2: Low and behold. So yeah, they've destroyed their brand. They

504
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:03,159
Speaker 2: built a brand very explicitly around Trump resistance. Unlike you know,

505
00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,879
Speaker 2: the New York Times really bought a bunch of businesses

506
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,679
Speaker 2: and tried to make it more than even just the

507
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 2: news at all. They have all these other verticals that

508
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 2: I think in many ways are more profitable even than

509
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:17,160
Speaker 2: the main news business that they engage in. Bezos really

510
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 2: went all in on Trump resistance, and by the way,

511
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: there's still a market for that a dramatically underserved market

512
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 2: at this point, given the fact that the Post is

513
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,000
Speaker 2: out of the game. You know, MSNBC has Joe and

514
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 2: Mika making their lull sojourn to mar A Lago, and

515
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 2: we'll get back to them in the second. CNN the

516
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,520
Speaker 2: Democratic Party themselves like bending the knee in many instances,

517
00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:42,920
Speaker 2: all of these tech oligarchs, et cetera. Remember, I mean, yes,

518
00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 2: Trump won the popular vote for the first time Republicans

519
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,159
Speaker 2: have a mandate, but he also only won the popular

520
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:51,640
Speaker 2: vote by one point five percentage points. There are still

521
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 2: a lot of people in this country who don't are

522
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:57,480
Speaker 2: not excited about him being president, are critical of him

523
00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 2: and want to see that reflected in their media consumption.

524
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,439
Speaker 2: So yeah, the brand is completely destroyed. As you said, Soccer, like,

525
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:06,879
Speaker 2: who is this for at this point, because it's certainly

526
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,440
Speaker 2: like MAGA is not looking to the Washington Posts for

527
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 2: their directions, And I think it's very clear that, you know,

528
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:14,879
Speaker 2: for Bezos, the Washington Post is like a little blip

529
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 2: on his bottom line. It doesn't matter whether it's profitable

530
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 2: or not. What's much more important to him is how

531
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 2: Amazon does his larger and like the cloud computing business

532
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,680
Speaker 2: that he has as well, which is a huge part

533
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:29,840
Speaker 2: of his bottom line. Under the first Trump administration, he felt,

534
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 2: I think correctly that he was blocked from a significant

535
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 2: government contract because of an adversarial posture Pisa VI Trump

536
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 2: and he is not going to repeat that mistake again.

537
00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 2: So you know, that's where his bread is buttered, and

538
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,159
Speaker 2: that's you know what he is going to shift the

539
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,919
Speaker 2: paper in the direction of you Also recently think we

540
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 2: covered this while you were away soccer. There was a

541
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 2: cartoonist who had been at the paper for years and

542
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 2: years to award winning, surprize winning whatever, who had submitted

543
00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:01,720
Speaker 2: an editorial cartoon that had Bezos and Mickey Mouse and

544
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 2: the La Times owner and some other oligarchs. Zuckerberg I

545
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 2: think was I think was one of them, basically like

546
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:12,440
Speaker 2: bending the knee to Trump, and the cartoon was blocked,

547
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 2: and so she decided like, Okay, that's it, I'm out

548
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 2: of here. And that's actually what Jen Rubin also cites

549
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,119
Speaker 2: that cartoon being blocked and that cartoonist departure for a

550
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 2: part of her justification for why she was ultimately going

551
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 2: to move on. So yeah, I think, you know, as

552
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 2: a business obviously it's already a catastrophe, and I wouldn't

553
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 2: look to them for any like really serious critical reporting

554
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 2: because Bezos is only going to let that critique go

555
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 2: so far because of his other business interests and not

556
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:44,520
Speaker 2: wanting to get crosswise with this company.

557
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, which is why it's hilarious. Let's put this up

558
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 3: there on the screen about Jennifer Rubin. She has announced

559
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,919
Speaker 3: her departure from The Washington Post and has decided to

560
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:58,639
Speaker 3: join us in the independent sphere, starting a startup publication

561
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 3: called The Control not owned by any hilarious Yeah, could,

562
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 3: it's just crazy. There is nobody less contrarians of those

563
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 3: like Perveros.

564
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 2: I don't know if people know that she was like,

565
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 2: you know, a mid Romney published a rock War supporting

566
00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 2: like neo Khon conservative and then you know, she makes

567
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 2: this transition in the Trump era, which okay, fine, but

568
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 2: you know oftentimes too she's one of these Obviously Magga

569
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 2: hates her because she doesn't support Trump, But I mean,

570
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 2: where is she even really politically is a really open question,

571
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:37,280
Speaker 2: because she seemingly has completely flipped a lot of views

572
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 2: in the Trump era, which is convenient for a Washington

573
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,000
Speaker 2: Post audience, where she is and was like very popular,

574
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 2: So it actually is kind of a blow to them

575
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 2: that she is leaving.

576
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:50,320
Speaker 3: Oh no, no, business wise, she's number one every time.

577
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 4: It's crazy.

578
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, but anyway, who are you she?

579
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, she has a big audience there.

580
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 2: So the fact that she's leaving, I mean it really

581
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 2: genuinely is a significant development for them.

582
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 4: And you know, I mean, on the one.

583
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 2: Hand, it's like, all right, you are standing by your principles.

584
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,840
Speaker 2: You don't want to be controlled by you know, Bezos

585
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 2: or bend Anita Trump or whatever.

586
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:12,560
Speaker 4: Okay, but it is funny to call it.

587
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 2: The contraryan when like, if you want to know what

588
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 2: Beltway conventional wisdom is, just go and read a Jennifer

589
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 2: Ruven post and you will be well schooled. And what

590
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,480
Speaker 2: the like conventional wisdom of this town is at this point.

591
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 3: Absolutely, That's why I'm excited for these people to get

592
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:30,160
Speaker 3: into the independent sphere, because they have no idea truly

593
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 3: what it actually means to cultivate an audience.

594
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 1: You have to build a sustainable business to.

595
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 3: Be able to operate without Jeff Bezos cutting you w

596
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 3: two income every year, be totally insulated from what it

597
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 3: means to actually like fend for yourself so welcome, Jen.

598
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:49,680
Speaker 3: We're happy to have you here in the sphere. Let's

599
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:50,920
Speaker 3: check in in a year, shall we.

600
00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 2: Know what I actually think they might be successful. I

601
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 2: to be honest with you, I actually because this.

602
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 1: Market is a video first, take care.

603
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: But I mean this market of like Trump resistance, is

604
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 2: really underserved at this point, and she is a known

605
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 2: quantity in that space, and so I.

606
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:11,440
Speaker 4: Wouldn't write it off.

607
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:12,240
Speaker 1: I think it could be.

608
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 2: I think it could be. From a business perspective, I

609
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 2: think it could be a successful mentor.

610
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:17,880
Speaker 1: I think it's possible.

611
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 3: But I mean, look on the independent side, it's not

612
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 3: like it isn't saturated either.

613
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 1: You got the Bulwark. You got that.

614
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 3: Lady what's her name, Heathercox Richardson something like that.

615
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 1: She's huge.

616
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:28,760
Speaker 3: I mean she she is one of the top substacks

617
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 3: in the country. Yeah, these Midas touch dudes. Look, yeah,

618
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 3: my not my cup of tea, but they're big, Like

619
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 3: here's my thing. I don't like it, but I know

620
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 3: that they're at the I mean, I'm pretty sure they

621
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 3: are funded by Democratic super PACs and all that. So

622
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 3: let's it's not one hundred percent legit, but but but

623
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,440
Speaker 3: anybody who can command a million views of video. I

624
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 3: pay attention, you know, I mean, somebody's out there. I've

625
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,520
Speaker 3: actually met Boom. Actually I was in La and I

626
00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 3: was no San Diego and I was in an uber

627
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 3: and this guy was like, he's like, you look familiar,

628
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 3: you know whatever. And then he's like, it's I think

629
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 3: I've seen before on the Midas Touch, and I was like, no,

630
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 3: that's not me, no idea. But then he's just telling

631
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,160
Speaker 3: me about how much he loves the Midas Touch and

632
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 3: how they've they've really opened his mind as to how

633
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 3: Donald Trump is the next Hitler.

634
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 1: Here's what I was like, Hey, you know, here's what

635
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 1: I respect.

636
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 2: Someone is there not too like self serious to dig

637
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: into the like diaper Donna.

638
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: Oh absolutely like they will.

639
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:29,320
Speaker 4: They will chase every rabbit hole and so bad. Listen.

640
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 4: That's what's allowed them to build it on.

641
00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 2: And I think that, like, there is a lot of

642
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 2: churn in the liberal media space right now, and a

643
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,000
Speaker 2: lot of people who are very dissatisfied with the Post,

644
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 2: with the Times, and with MSNBC and CNN, and who

645
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:52,120
Speaker 2: are totally radically changing their media consumption habits right now.

646
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 2: So that's why I think there is an opening, like

647
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 2: if you're a liberal in that lane and you're starting

648
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 2: something new, I do think that they're as an audience

649
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,120
Speaker 2: there to potentially, you know, capture and become part of

650
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 2: their daily media diet.

651
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 4: Now you know, there are no.

652
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 2: Bad ideas, there's only bad execution, and they may well

653
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 2: suffer from pad executionists we're about to see in this

654
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 2: launch video, which we've now teased extensively. But but you know,

655
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 2: I'm just saying like, I do think if they do

656
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 2: a good job with it and fill that market need,

657
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:23,719
Speaker 2: I do think there is an audience out there for them.

658
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 4: It would not surprise me successful.

659
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 3: As we said as to their chops self. Though, here's

660
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 3: the launch video that they had.

661
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:32,280
Speaker 1: Take a listen, do politics.

662
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:35,760
Speaker 6: We're gonna do law, but we know that any successful

663
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:41,640
Speaker 6: pro democracy movement also has to be very vocal about culture.

664
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 6: We'll have a humor column, we'll even have a cooking column,

665
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 6: but we're gonna sprinkle in a little bit of pro

666
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:51,480
Speaker 6: democracy flavor.

667
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 1: What is energy?

668
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 2: I love that energy to see you want to find out?

669
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 2: You gotta subscribe?

670
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 4: Fine? Ounce are all right?

671
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 1: Jen? What was she the best?

672
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 2: All right, let's go ahead and move over to MSNBC

673
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,640
Speaker 2: where there are very interesting doings and put this big

674
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 2: blockbuster news up on the screen. So you guys probably

675
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 2: know Rachel Mattow had taken a step back from the network.

676
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 2: She was focusing on her own, like you know, longer

677
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 2: form productions and only hosting the show once a week plus.

678
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 2: They would bring her in for any like big breaking

679
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 2: news and she would sit at the desk with all

680
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 2: the other you know, primetime anchors whatever. Alex Wagner had

681
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: been brought back in to fill her a belief nine

682
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 2: pm slot on those other nights when she's not hosting. Well,

683
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 2: they are bringing Rachel back in to host five nights

684
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,400
Speaker 2: a week and sending Alex Wagner out into the field

685
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 2: for Trump's first at least first one hundred days, is

686
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 2: what the plan is. They say it's a broader move

687
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 2: by MSNBC to draw viewership to its coverage for.

688
00:33:58,200 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 4: That first one hundred days.

689
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,920
Speaker 2: And they talk about the numbers in this variety piece

690
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 2: and just how catastrophic they have been for MSNBC after

691
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 2: Trump's re election. They see between the election and the

692
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 2: end of twenty twenty four, their primetime audience between the

693
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:16,839
Speaker 2: age of twenty five and fifty four. That's the only

694
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 2: thing that matters. By the way, the key demographic is

695
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,359
Speaker 2: the only thing that matters, because that's what advertisers pay

696
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 2: for ads based on dropped by sixty five percent. Sixty

697
00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 2: five percent according to data from Nielsen. They're making a

698
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 2: couple other new moves. Jensaki is going to launch a

699
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,279
Speaker 2: podcast called The Blueprint with Jensaki that's going to look

700
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,880
Speaker 2: at the future for the Democratic Party, like she's the

701
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,120
Speaker 2: one to tell us what direction to go. And Chris

702
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,839
Speaker 2: Hayes is going to debut a new recurring segment called

703
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 2: here is What Is True that will scrutinize misinformation tied

704
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:51,440
Speaker 2: to news coming out of Washington and how it affects

705
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 2: political discourse. But this whole direction saga, it just smacks

706
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 2: of utter desperation because and I do, actually, I mean,

707
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 2: I do think that Rachel may be their only host

708
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 2: a laugh, who really has that kind of like trust

709
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 2: and credibility with the audience, especially after that Joe and

710
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 2: Minkavis a Tomorrow lago.

711
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:14,640
Speaker 4: It was devastating to them. It was devastating in the morning.

712
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:17,720
Speaker 2: Joe numbers immediately in that same day that they announced

713
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 2: that they did that their numbers dropped some forty percent

714
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:22,719
Speaker 2: hour over hour. That's in a morning show, and audience

715
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 2: share is supposed.

716
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:25,439
Speaker 4: To build hour over hour.

717
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 2: And I really think that that stench of Trump capitulation

718
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 2: has damaged the entire network. Not to mention just normal,

719
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,920
Speaker 2: like okay, the other team one, like this is really depressing.

720
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:39,399
Speaker 4: We don't really want to watch news right now.

721
00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:42,760
Speaker 2: Like that's a common dynamic, and potentially they could rebuild

722
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 2: from that they did last time that Trump won as well.

723
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: But also last time they had Rushi Gate, which you

724
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:54,720
Speaker 2: know was oversold and you know this elaborate conspiracy theory,

725
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,280
Speaker 2: but it made for That's part of why they indulged

726
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:00,400
Speaker 2: in it so heavily. It made for compelling viewing because

727
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 2: every night it was like, oh my god, what's what

728
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:05,840
Speaker 2: piece of the puzzle is Rachel Maddow going to unfurl

729
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 2: and explain for us and help to fill this in?

730
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 2: And what's going to be the dramatic conclusion, et cetera,

731
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:13,200
Speaker 2: et cetera, all this cast of characters, and that's really

732
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,919
Speaker 2: how they made their comeback in the Trump era. It's

733
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 2: not clear what would serve that same role this time around.

734
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:25,720
Speaker 2: Democrats in general are in disarray there's no coherent view

735
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:29,520
Speaker 2: of how to oppose Donald Trump this time around either

736
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 2: so they're not all you know, or is they're not

737
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:34,920
Speaker 2: all rowing in the same direction. So the only thing

738
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 2: they can think to do is basically bring back in

739
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:39,760
Speaker 2: the one person that they know still has the trust

740
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 2: of the audience and see if she can write the shit.

741
00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 1: But the problem is with this strategy is she already left.

742
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,239
Speaker 3: So you're I mean, they probably had to pay a

743
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,400
Speaker 3: boatload of money to come back for this one hundred days.

744
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:51,640
Speaker 1: What about after that?

745
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,680
Speaker 3: You know, are do they is the plan that, oh,

746
00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,160
Speaker 3: they'll find their footing. I mean, I'm assuming that's literally

747
00:36:57,239 --> 00:36:58,879
Speaker 3: what it is. They're like, Oh, we'll figure it out.

748
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:00,919
Speaker 3: We'll see what the peg is.

749
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 4: To rebuild those viewership habits.

750
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:07,719
Speaker 3: That's because you know, it's really important to know the

751
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 3: media was not the creator of the resistance.

752
00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 1: It was like a dual pathway where.

753
00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 3: Yes, MSNBC and all these other people invented Russia Gate

754
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:20,919
Speaker 3: to feed the resistance, But the resistance was a thing.

755
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 3: I was here in d C. There were people marching

756
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:25,759
Speaker 3: up and down the streets after Donald Trump won. The

757
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:27,960
Speaker 3: day after Trump won, I was at the Trump Hotel

758
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 3: for a work thing, and the entire place was flooded

759
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 3: with protesters. I remember the Women's March. It was impossible

760
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:36,680
Speaker 3: to even get around to this. What was it four

761
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,280
Speaker 3: million people showed up here in Washington, d C. Remember

762
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:41,520
Speaker 3: all those videos of the ladies in their hats on

763
00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:41,920
Speaker 3: the planes.

764
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:43,879
Speaker 1: It was big. It was big, all right, cringe but big.

765
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 3: But you know, it was the thing, and there was

766
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:50,239
Speaker 3: clearly like a demand for that type of content. That's

767
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 3: part of where it came from. This time, I don't

768
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 3: see it as much, not at all. I'm not saying

769
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:56,600
Speaker 3: that there aren't a lot of people out there don't

770
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 3: like Trump or they won't to see it something a

771
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,000
Speaker 3: little bit different, but they're not. It's not like an

772
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 3: nine to eleven style event to them, and they're tired

773
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,400
Speaker 3: or they have just been they've.

774
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:05,360
Speaker 1: Heard it all before.

775
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 3: So that level of engagement, the illegitimacy that they viewed

776
00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:10,880
Speaker 3: him as because he didn't win the popular vote, a

777
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:12,680
Speaker 3: lot of the arguments are just gone. And at this

778
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,320
Speaker 3: point everything they possibly could have done has been tried,

779
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:19,680
Speaker 3: you know, arrest, you know, the core cases. Michael Lavnati

780
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,680
Speaker 3: com even they are probably rolling their eyes at this point. No,

781
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:25,320
Speaker 3: they just have to say, I can't take this shit anymore.

782
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,799
Speaker 2: I think I think it is that exhaustion. It's not

783
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 2: that they are any less depressed about his victory. It's

784
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 2: like we tried everything, Like we were in the streets,

785
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 2: we marched.

786
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 4: We protested, like we didn't watch Rachel Mattow every night.

787
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:43,279
Speaker 2: You know, we tweeted about drump We did we you know,

788
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 2: he got arrested, he got charged, he did January sixth,

789
00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:48,759
Speaker 2: and you know, people saw with their own eyes the

790
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:53,840
Speaker 2: you know, the extremism, and there was this mass revulsion

791
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 2: against the actions that he took, in the actions he

792
00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,839
Speaker 2: didn't take on that day. And I think the sense

793
00:38:59,920 --> 00:39:03,600
Speaker 2: is like, yeah, we did all that and like it,

794
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 2: none of it worked. And even we you know, managed

795
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:09,319
Speaker 2: to get Joe Biden out of the way and have

796
00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:12,640
Speaker 2: a better chance at least at being able to succeed.

797
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 2: So I think this time, and there's also in twenty sixteen,

798
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,479
Speaker 2: he really felt like an aberration, especially because he didn't

799
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:22,800
Speaker 2: win the popular vote, and they're always you know, Russia

800
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 2: and Komi, and there were all these like, oh well,

801
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:27,840
Speaker 2: and Hillary runs a bad campaign and maybe she was

802
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:30,720
Speaker 2: a uniquely bad candidate and so there was this sense

803
00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 2: of this was a blip, and that's not the sense now. So, yeah,

804
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:39,959
Speaker 2: there's not the same grassroots movement against him, and there's

805
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 2: certainly not a media that's orienting itself in order to

806
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 2: you know, help to build up that grassroots energy movement

807
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:52,640
Speaker 2: of resistance, et cetera. And so yeah, and then the

808
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 2: other thing we haven't even mentioned is Comcast is selling

809
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:59,880
Speaker 2: MSNBC like they're being cut loose along with other cable

810
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:04,399
Speaker 2: news properties that are under the Comcast brand, and they're

811
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,120
Speaker 2: being like launched down into the ether as effectively a

812
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,920
Speaker 2: startup in the coming years. They're being cut loose from

813
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:13,640
Speaker 2: NBC where that you know, provided them with some news

814
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 2: gathering and some like legitimate news gathering ability.

815
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 4: So they're really at sea.

816
00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 2: And I do, like I said, at the word that

817
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 2: comes to mind for me looking at this bringing Rachel

818
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:25,320
Speaker 2: back in for the first hundred days is just desperate.

819
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,359
Speaker 2: It's the only thing they could figure to do to

820
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 2: try to rebuild something so that when that sale, when

821
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 2: that spinoff does occur, they have you know, something of viewership,

822
00:40:37,239 --> 00:40:42,360
Speaker 2: something that could even theoretically makes sense as a business possibility,

823
00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 2: because right now, given these numbers. It's not looking good

824
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 2: and they pay their remember huge overhead, I mean the

825
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:51,000
Speaker 2: amount that they pay these hosts.

826
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I was just like absolutely, he sets financial disclosure.

827
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:57,879
Speaker 3: This guy only works weekends. He's getting paid two point

828
00:40:57,920 --> 00:40:59,360
Speaker 3: two million a year to only.

829
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:03,040
Speaker 1: Work two days, two days a week. Nice, jag must

830
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:03,439
Speaker 1: be nice.

831
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 6: Nice.

832
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: You know that's the word Fox News.

833
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 3: Obviously it's probably a little bit higher over there, but

834
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 3: I mean, what cut it in half a million?

835
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:12,120
Speaker 1: I mean, Rachel's pulling.

836
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 2: A million unt of money and Joe Amica make that

837
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 2: kind of money. They make a million easy, Yeah, huge

838
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:20,759
Speaker 2: dollar figures. I mean every every primetime host is making

839
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 2: at least a million a year. Rachel's making way more

840
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 2: than that. Joe Amica make way more than that. I

841
00:41:26,719 --> 00:41:30,280
Speaker 2: mean that's if you're if you're a startup, like even

842
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:33,239
Speaker 2: they said they'd be a well funded startup, Well, even

843
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:37,239
Speaker 2: a well funded startup can't handle that kind of overhead

844
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 2: when you're not bringing in the viewers. So yeah, the

845
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 2: future not looking great over there. Another this is not

846
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,040
Speaker 2: totally unexpected, but some of four broke the news and

847
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:49,439
Speaker 2: can put this up on the screen. Chuck Todd has

848
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 2: been meeting with Washington media organizations. He is going to

849
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:56,760
Speaker 2: leave NBC at the end of his contract, you'd already

850
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:58,880
Speaker 2: been take it off meet the press, So not all

851
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 2: that surprising.

852
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 4: That he is looking to move on.

853
00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:03,919
Speaker 2: Wouldn't surprise me, Sager if he also tries to get

854
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:08,160
Speaker 2: into the like independent media game because of the yeah,

855
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:10,720
Speaker 2: the hot hot spots to be and these people all.

856
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 4: Think that they can make it in our world.

857
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:16,040
Speaker 2: And I don't know, some of the ways that he's

858
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 2: been talking recently have seemed to me to be an

859
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:24,400
Speaker 2: attempt to transition into more of like an independent media space,

860
00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 2: giving some creedence to Bernie Sanders, that kind of stuff,

861
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:30,480
Speaker 2: where you know, it's very different from the way that

862
00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 2: he used to approach these topics.

863
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 3: Also fancies himself into intellectual like big history takes, so

864
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:40,439
Speaker 3: I could also see him trying to write some Bill

865
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:44,279
Speaker 3: O'Reilly style history books. That is, by the way, is

866
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,439
Speaker 3: a book guy so depressing. Whenever you check the top

867
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 3: ten books in the United States, number eight is always

868
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 3: some fucking.

869
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 1: Killing so and so by Bill O'Ryan.

870
00:42:57,520 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 3: Who are you buying this?

871
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: I just don't understand it.

872
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,240
Speaker 3: I think it's like grandma's who buy them as gifts

873
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:05,200
Speaker 3: for their grandsons.

874
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:06,760
Speaker 4: They've got ripped.

875
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: Like, oh no, no, look, put the accurate there.

876
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 3: It's mostly the killing books are just like aggregators. It's

877
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:19,759
Speaker 3: like reading a BuzzFeed article about an event like killing Lincoln, right,

878
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 3: and it's like narrative style, basically narrative style aggregation. I

879
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:26,479
Speaker 3: actually tried to read Killing Lincoln once because I was like, Okay,

880
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:27,680
Speaker 3: what's all the fuss about. It was one of the

881
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:31,399
Speaker 3: top selling books in the country. It's incomprehensible and bad.

882
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 1: I just don't get it.

883
00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:36,360
Speaker 3: But you know, for for Chuck, there's a well trotten

884
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 3: path out there, there's a well trotten path.

885
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 2: He doesn't have to juice the estill a riots. Obviously

886
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:44,439
Speaker 2: I don't share his politics, right. He really is kind

887
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:46,720
Speaker 2: of the goat of like the cable news format.

888
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,120
Speaker 4: That man really made, you know.

889
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,879
Speaker 2: Cable news, what it is like the format and his

890
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:56,160
Speaker 2: style and you know, his command of the audience and

891
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 2: all that stuff, Like he really was you have to

892
00:43:58,640 --> 00:43:59,799
Speaker 2: I have to respect the game.

893
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 3: I have to resct absolutely ice to watch growing up

894
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:04,399
Speaker 3: what was you know, the debate segments and that these

895
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:06,839
Speaker 3: have I mean, listen, it was at one point I

896
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 3: think O'Reilly was commanding like ten million viewers a night

897
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 3: whenever there, whenever we were in the lead up to

898
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:16,040
Speaker 3: the Iraq war. I mean, honestly has a lot of

899
00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 3: responsibility for that. For a lot of the problems with

900
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 3: the Bush administration. It was a different moment in time.

901
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 3: It was almost twenty years ago, it feels like forever,

902
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,359
Speaker 3: but at one point in time like these people were

903
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 3: the kings of American politics. So at the very least,

904
00:44:28,640 --> 00:44:30,719
Speaker 3: thank god that that time is over.

905
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:34,799
Speaker 2: Yes, indeed, we've got one last piece here, which is

906
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,520
Speaker 2: more on the dismal television ratings and a new poll.

907
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:40,719
Speaker 2: It can put B three up on the screen here.

908
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:43,759
Speaker 2: Americans exhausted by political news TV ratings and a new

909
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:48,320
Speaker 2: poll show they are tuning out. So about two thirds

910
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 2: of American adults say they have recently felt the need

911
00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 2: to limit media consumption about politics and government because of overload.

912
00:44:55,120 --> 00:44:57,200
Speaker 4: You should probably do that. It's probably good for your health.

913
00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:00,399
Speaker 2: Smaller percentages of Americans are limiting their intake of about

914
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 2: overseas conflicts, economy, or climate change. Seven and ten Democrats

915
00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:07,359
Speaker 2: say they're stepping back from political news. Percentage isn't quite

916
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,240
Speaker 2: as high for Republicans who have reason to celebrate Trump's victory,

917
00:45:10,239 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 2: but still about six and ten republicans say they felt

918
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:14,719
Speaker 2: the need to take some time off too, and the

919
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 2: share for independence is similar.

920
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:18,880
Speaker 4: Maybe I don't know.

921
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:21,680
Speaker 2: People are bad at really describing like what they should

922
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:25,280
Speaker 2: do versus what they are doing, et cetera. The fact

923
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,799
Speaker 2: that cable news ratings are at CNN and MSNBC in

924
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:33,000
Speaker 2: particular are massively down doesn't necessarily mean that news conception

925
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:36,920
Speaker 2: overall is massively down, because, as we've discussed before, you know,

926
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,839
Speaker 2: a bunch of like left independent channels are actually seeing

927
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 2: a huge surge right now, Kyle's obviously being one of them.

928
00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:48,480
Speaker 2: So yeah, I think there's a real I'm sure there's

929
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:51,560
Speaker 2: some fatigue after an election, there already is, but it

930
00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 2: also seems to me like what we're seeing is more

931
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 2: of a reshuffling of media habits than a desire to

932
00:45:58,080 --> 00:45:59,359
Speaker 2: completely step away.

933
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: Yeahquestion, I totally agree with that.