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Speaker 3: Slash audio. All right, welcome to Hoops tonight. You're at
Speaker 3: the ball.
Speaker 2: You have you Tuesday, buddy, hopeball. You guys are having
Speaker 2: a great start for your week. Got a jam packed
Speaker 2: show tonight. We had a four game night on a weekday.
Speaker 2: Absolutely insane, all sorts of crazy drama, all sorts of
Speaker 2: crazy results. We had a game winner. We have a
Speaker 2: bunch of stuff we're going to be getting into today.
Speaker 2: You guys are the joke before we get started. Subscribe
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Speaker 3: To them in our mail bags. Moving forward.
Speaker 2: At the tail end of the show tonight, we're gonna
Speaker 2: take more questions from the chat, so make sure you
Speaker 2: guys drop your questions there in the chat. All right,
Speaker 2: let's talk some basketball quickly before I get to Clippers Nuggets.
Speaker 2: The Celtics game is the game I didn't get to
Speaker 2: watch tonight, so we're not gonna get around to that one.
Speaker 2: But I saw Jason Tatum thirty five, eight and ten
Speaker 2: on just sixteen shots to close out the Magic, his
Speaker 2: third consecutive thirty five point game in the entire playoff run.
Speaker 2: Last year, he had two thirty five point games total,
Speaker 2: and that is the biggest difference between this year's Celtics
Speaker 2: and last year's Celtics. Last year, Celtics did not have,
Speaker 2: in my opinion, a player that can reach that top tier,
Speaker 2: superstar level. Jason Tatum was incredibly versatile in that playoff run.
Speaker 2: He did a ton to make that team championship caliber.
Speaker 2: But now he's bringing that extra level of shot making
Speaker 2: and half court surgery that makes him one of the
Speaker 2: very best players in the entire NBA and it just
Speaker 2: makes that Celtics team that much more difficult to deal
Speaker 2: with in this sort of setting. Again, no more thoughts
Speaker 2: on that game, Beau, I didn't get to watch it.
Speaker 2: When I saw that number. Again, he already has more
Speaker 2: thirty five point games in the first round that he
Speaker 2: did in the entire playoff run last year. Great sign
Speaker 2: for Celtics fans. We're gonna start with Clippers Nuggets, and
Speaker 2: for two games in a row now it has felt
Speaker 2: like the Nuggets have had the Clippers. They're bringing late
Speaker 2: help on Kawhi when he gets into the mid range
Speaker 2: and preventing him from really getting into a good scoring
Speaker 2: rhythm as a shot maker there in that short to
Speaker 2: mid range where he.
Speaker 3: Loves to work.
Speaker 2: Although Kawhi did have one of his better passing playoff
Speaker 2: games that I've ever seen from him tonight, But Kawhi
Speaker 2: has managed to score over twenty five points just once
Speaker 2: in this entire series. They're putting a ton of pressure
Speaker 2: on Harden. Christian Brown is applying a lot of full
Speaker 2: court ball pressure, like just attacking the basketball and making
Speaker 2: him uncomfortable. They're bringing Jokic aggressively out to the level
Speaker 2: on him, and as the intensity of the series is
Speaker 2: picked up, James Harden has looked completely caught off guard
Speaker 2: by it. I was joking with my buddy Jason Maples
Speaker 2: on Twitter earlier, like, it's still shocking to me even
Speaker 2: with James Harden's playoff history, and when you're watching it happen,
Speaker 2: it's still jarring to see because like the game has
Speaker 2: this level of intensity and you can see it in
Speaker 2: all these different ways. Right, it's two to two, game
Speaker 2: five of a series, basically a must win for both
Speaker 2: team games for obvious reason, it's just very difficult to
Speaker 2: put yourself in a situation where you have to win
Speaker 2: two games in a row just to survive, right, And
Speaker 2: you're seeing like the yelling and screaming of Russell Westbrook,
Speaker 2: the yelling and screaming of Christian Brown, even the intensity
Speaker 2: from like Nicole Jokicic just like barking at his teammates,
Speaker 2: barking at officials, getting super excited every time one of
Speaker 2: his teammates makes a play. There's like this emotional momentum
Speaker 2: with the team as they're bringing the requisite intensity to
Speaker 2: meet the moment. The transition pushes from jokis just his
Speaker 2: eyes light up every time he sees an opportunity to
Speaker 2: make the defense pay for something. There's a level of
Speaker 2: like mental and physical intensity that is president in all
Speaker 2: of these series. But you can see in the game tonight,
Speaker 2: and then you're watching James Harden and it looks like
Speaker 2: he'd much rather be playing in like kind of a
Speaker 2: chill pickup game, Like he's operating at a level of
Speaker 2: intensity that is just several levels below what the team
Speaker 2: needs from him in that moment. And it always again,
Speaker 2: this has happened a lot over the course of his career,
Speaker 2: and it often comes in this phase of the series,
Speaker 2: towards the end of the series, when the team has
Speaker 2: been scouted out really well and the defender guarding James
Speaker 2: Harden has started to pick up on some of his
Speaker 2: cues and some of his little tips that he uses
Speaker 2: to tip off the moves that he's going to use,
Speaker 2: and the physical intensity and the overall urgency of the
Speaker 2: moment picks up, and as it gets crazier and crazier,
Speaker 2: he struggles back to back very important games for the Clippers.
Speaker 2: James Harden had twenty six points total in the two games.
Speaker 2: I do want to credit the Nuggets defense, though, with
Speaker 2: exception of the fourth quarter in Game four when they
Speaker 2: kind of lost control of things in transition, and then
Speaker 2: you could tell just in general the Nuggets got out
Speaker 2: of their defensive groove. The Nuggets have looked like the
Speaker 2: more intense team. They look like they want to win
Speaker 2: the series more. They have pretty quickly recaptured a level
Speaker 2: of defensive intensity much closer to what they had in
Speaker 2: the playoffs in twenty twenty three. It all starts with
Speaker 2: the bracket and the ball screens, the ball pressure that
Speaker 2: Christian Brown is applying on James Harden and Jokic getting
Speaker 2: out and making sure that Harden is not having an
Speaker 2: easy time getting the pass out from those situations. And
Speaker 2: you could see James Harden get flummixed that he's like
Speaker 2: trying to force a pass to the role man when
Speaker 2: the skip passes open. But the guy Garden the skip
Speaker 2: pass is like on the role man and it's a
Speaker 2: turnover because he's getting sped up and he's struggling to
Speaker 2: deal with the physicality and he's not making the same
Speaker 2: reads that James Harden can make when things are just
Speaker 2: a little less intense or when he is more intense
Speaker 2: and ready and engaged in the moment. But it all
Speaker 2: starts with those two at the level, Christian Brown and
Speaker 2: Nicola Jokic, the two of them are the guys that
Speaker 2: have stabilized this defense with what they've done in pick
Speaker 2: and roll and then the backside rotations. That's the third
Speaker 2: piece of it that they've managed to recapture. Again, the
Speaker 2: goal of your defense in the playoffs is to make
Speaker 2: opposing stars uncomfortable. Have they done that with Kawhi, Yes,
Speaker 2: they've kept him from volume scoring. Have they done that
Speaker 2: with James Harden. Yes, they've kept him from picking them
Speaker 2: apart in pick and roll. And for as much as
Speaker 2: we've talked about the Nuggets defense down the stretch of
Speaker 2: the season, which was a major storyline, it was the
Speaker 2: main reason so many people, including most of the Nuggets
Speaker 2: fans that I follow, picked the Clippers to win the
Speaker 2: series was because their defense was in such a bad place.
Speaker 2: But they've been operating at an insanely high level on
Speaker 2: offense for months. I thought Jokic was so much better
Speaker 2: than his box score looked tonight like he's four for
Speaker 2: thirteen from the field, But I thought he had complete
Speaker 2: command of the pace and flow of the game. He
Speaker 2: generated countless advantages. His transition pushes kept everybody out of
Speaker 2: position throughout the game. The team was playing out of those.
Speaker 2: A lot of the looks that Jamal Murray got were
Speaker 2: out of those transition pushes, out of those Jokic post
Speaker 2: ups and Jokic high post kind of fulcrum situations where
Speaker 2: he's just setting these guys up with great advantages. It
Speaker 2: kept everyone in rhythm. As I mentioned earlier, I thought
Speaker 2: Yokich was fantastic defensively tonight, a way better game than
Speaker 2: the box score would to lead you to believe. And
Speaker 2: then Jamal Murray the sixth forty point playoff game of
Speaker 2: his career. That's kind of a crazy stat dating back
Speaker 2: to his awesome shootout that he had with Donovan Mitchell
Speaker 2: back in the bubble. Jamal Murray looked fantastic tonight. Out
Speaker 2: of everything we saw, and we saw a ton of
Speaker 2: three point shot making. His three point shot was just
Speaker 2: dead eye tonight. He was getting separation on his moves,
Speaker 2: he was getting great lift all over the floor. But
Speaker 2: I thought the most exciting play for Denver's playoff chances
Speaker 2: was the transition Dunky had at the end of the game.
Speaker 2: He got up and he ammed that thing, and you
Speaker 2: could tell he knew it too, and he was like
Speaker 2: he was pumped, and you could tell he was feeling
Speaker 2: great physically. And that bodes extremely well for the big
Speaker 2: picture with this Nuggets team. That really was the story
Speaker 2: of the series to this point, in my opinion, the
Speaker 2: Nuggets had some other big country since tonight. Russell Westbrook
Speaker 2: was amazing in the first half. Vintage like not just
Speaker 2: knocking down spot up threes and scoring as a hutter.
Speaker 2: He was like getting buckets and causing actual problems for
Speaker 2: the Clippers on the ball. Michael Porter and Aaron Gordon
Speaker 2: were both excellent tonight. Christian Brown was great on both ends.
Speaker 2: Hit that huge three at the end of the third
Speaker 2: quarter that built that extra bit of margin going into
Speaker 2: the fourth. But at the end of the day, Jamal
Speaker 2: Murray and Nikol Jokic have badly outplayed James Harden and
Speaker 2: Kawhi Leonard. That's the series. Everything else flows down from there.
Speaker 2: That's what dictates the types of advantages the role players
Speaker 2: are getting. James Harden is the guy on the Clippers
Speaker 2: that can consistently set people up with advantages. He hasn't
Speaker 2: done a very good job of that. Nikolejokic, even in
Speaker 2: a poor shooting night, set up his team with countless
Speaker 2: advantages throughout the game. And again, when I keep talking
Speaker 2: about creating advantages, it's a very basic concept. Every basketball player,
Speaker 2: even the best basketball players in the world, are going
Speaker 2: to be more successful when they have a defender sprinting
Speaker 2: at them, versus when they have a defender set on
Speaker 2: them when the health defense is out of position and
Speaker 2: sprinting into help versus when the help is already pre loaded.
Speaker 1: Up.
Speaker 2: That's why advantage creation is so important. That's why I
Speaker 2: tend to be very predisposed, so to speak, as a fan,
Speaker 2: as a basketball fan, towards players that naturally create a
Speaker 2: ton of advantages in games. So I've always liked the
Speaker 2: big forwards, the Lebron's, the Lucas, the Nikola Jokic's.
Speaker 3: I've liked the.
Speaker 2: Deadly high pick and roll playmakers, the guys like Tyrese Halliburton,
Speaker 2: for instance. I've always liked the guys that just I mean,
Speaker 2: Steph is kind of a unicorn in this regard, but
Speaker 2: he can just create a ton of advantages just by
Speaker 2: running around the floor and everybody reacting to him Gehannest,
Speaker 2: just by being this battering ram that you have to
Speaker 2: account for by packing up the paint. Those guys that
Speaker 2: can consistently set their teammates up with advantages, they're gonna
Speaker 2: have a really high offensive floor. Everything flows down from
Speaker 2: those guys, and again the intensity, Like I don't think
Speaker 2: it's a coincidence that Nikola Jokic has looked like psychopathically
Speaker 2: competitive in these two games and his team has met
Speaker 2: the moment and been a buzzsaw versus a Clippers team
Speaker 2: that's had a lethargic James Harden and a generally quiet
Speaker 2: and like like Kawhi Leonard is not the type of
Speaker 2: personality that is going to galvanize a group with energy.
Speaker 2: He's he gets called a robot for a reason. Now, Kawhi,
Speaker 2: I thought was pretty good tonight, and Kawhi in general
Speaker 2: is going to have a certain floor because he is
Speaker 2: going to bring the requisite intensity. But Kawhi is not
Speaker 2: the kind of guy that's gonna, like legitimately galvanize a
Speaker 2: group emotionally and be like, hey, like, wake the fuck up,
Speaker 2: It's time to go. What are we doing?
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
Speaker 2: You're gonna see Kawhi do what Nikola Jokic did in
Speaker 2: the huddle after Game two, or he's screaming at his guys.
Speaker 2: This is unacceptable what we're doing right here. The Clippers
Speaker 2: just got punched in the face twice, like badly. You
Speaker 2: don't see that too often in a playoff series. Won
Speaker 2: this competitive or you the regardless of arena, regardless of
Speaker 2: where you're at, one team just looks like they're genuinely
Speaker 2: playing harder. It usually goes back and forth based on
Speaker 2: who won the previous game. Any chance for the Clippers
Speaker 2: to reverse the trend of this series is going to
Speaker 2: come down to those two flipping the script. Same thing
Speaker 2: I said about the Lakers versus the Wolves. Can the
Speaker 2: Lakers beat the Wolves? Yes, it starts with Luka doncicin
Speaker 2: Lebron James not getting completely outclassed by Anthony Edwards and
Speaker 2: naseried and Julius Randall at the end of games. Until
Speaker 2: they flip that dynamic, that nothing's gonna change. Same thing
Speaker 2: goes here. Until James Harden can bring the requisite intensity
Speaker 2: and create the advantages necessary to get this offense to
Speaker 2: hum and until Kawhi Leonard can bring that volume scoring
Speaker 2: that he brought in Game two, they're going to struggle
Speaker 2: to flip this dynamic.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 2: I picked the Clippers to win this series, as I mentioned,
Speaker 2: like most people did, given what we'd seen from the
Speaker 2: Nuggets and the time leading up to the series. But
Speaker 2: one of the things I said after Game two, and
Speaker 2: it's something that I feel very strongly at this point,
Speaker 2: is as a fan, I would like to see Denver
Speaker 2: advance because I think they have a much better chance
Speaker 2: to deal with Oklahoma City. The Denver Nuggets hung one
Speaker 2: hundred and forty points on the Thunder the last time
Speaker 2: that they played them. They have the ability to break
Speaker 2: down the Thunder defense with their aggregate playmaking. One of
Speaker 2: the specific reasons that I've not been as high on
Speaker 2: this Clippers team is their lack of playmaking. Once you
Speaker 2: get past James and James, Harden can have some issues
Speaker 2: as the intensity gets leveraged.
Speaker 3: Right, I am.
Speaker 2: Worried that the Clippers would go into the Thunder series
Speaker 2: and just really fall apart offensively, and so I'm personally
Speaker 2: hoping that the Nuggets can close this deal because I
Speaker 2: think that they present a very interesting type of challenge
Speaker 2: for OKAC even on defense. Their ability to load up
Speaker 2: against an Oklahoma City Thunder offense is something that I
Speaker 2: think is a favorable matchup for them too. I think
Speaker 2: that would be a really fun series, a Thunder Nuggets series,
Speaker 2: a series that obviously the Thunder would be rightfully favored,
Speaker 2: but I think it would be a really fun example
Speaker 2: of two very different styles, a very experienced team versus
Speaker 2: an inexperienced team. That's what I'll be rooting for moving
Speaker 2: forward in the series.
Speaker 3: It's not over.
Speaker 2: The Clippers absolutely can win Game six, and they absolutely
Speaker 2: have the talent to come back to Denver and win
Speaker 2: Game seven, but they put themselves in a buying and
Speaker 2: it's really hard for me to imagine something different happening
Speaker 2: when their leaders haven't seemed to bring the requisite intensity
Speaker 2: and to be able to meet them, to meet the
Speaker 2: competition that Jamal Murray and NICOLEA yok Which are bringing
Speaker 2: straight to them. Before we move on to Pistons Nicks,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna do a very short version of the announcement
Speaker 2: we made last night. We did just start a new
Speaker 2: partnership with Playback. It's a app that I feel very
Speaker 2: passionate about. It's an opportunity for you guys to be
Speaker 2: more interacted, interactive with us on the show. And so
Speaker 2: starting tomorrow tomorrow, after the final buzzer of the Lakers
Speaker 2: Wolves game, right after we do our YouTube show, we're
Speaker 2: gonna do our normal YouTube show here. When we're done,
Speaker 2: we're gonna go immediately after to what we're calling the
Speaker 2: Hoops tonight after show, and at the Hoops the night
Speaker 2: after show over on Playback, We're gonna take questions from
Speaker 2: you guys. We're gonna be able to actually bring you
Speaker 2: up on the stage. We're gonna be able to actually
Speaker 2: go through film live, so we'll be able to do
Speaker 2: a lot of like the actual visual examples of the
Speaker 2: stuff that we talked about on the show. It's gonna
Speaker 2: be super interactive, a little bit more informal, something I'm
Speaker 2: really excited about. It's gonna be with the after show
Speaker 2: in this playoff run, and then we have some big
Speaker 2: picture goals for next year to start doing some live
Speaker 2: watch alongs where like we can watch big NBA League
Speaker 2: Pass games together and actually go through the games as
Speaker 2: they're happening live together, something I'm really excited about. But
Speaker 2: for this season, we're just doing these after shows after
Speaker 2: our live YouTube shows. So when you guys have an opportunity,
Speaker 2: hit the link in the description, head over to the
Speaker 2: Hoops Tonight playback feed. Get set up so that you
Speaker 2: guys are ready to go tomorrow night again after the final,
Speaker 2: after we finished the live show tomorrow night on YouTube,
Speaker 2: we're all gonna head over to playback to start that
Speaker 2: new venture I'm super excited about. I hope to see
Speaker 2: you guys over there. All right, let's talk Pistons Nicks.
Speaker 2: So the Nicks had a chance to close out the
Speaker 2: Pistons in the same fashion that they took a three
Speaker 2: to one lead with keep things close until you can
Speaker 2: out execute them down the stretch, but instead it ended
Speaker 2: up being Kate Cunningham and the Pistons that played better
Speaker 2: down the stretch and sent the series back to Detroit
Speaker 2: for Game six by quickly capitalizing on a late injury
Speaker 2: to Jalen Brunson. So it was a crazy seat. Pistons
Speaker 2: are up ninety five ninety two, Jalen Brunson tweaks his
Speaker 2: ankle on a close out along the left wing. Kat
Speaker 2: literally goes down in a four on five and drops
Speaker 2: a bomb like a forty foot three from almost the
Speaker 2: logo that ties the game at one oh five. Just
Speaker 2: a huge shot, but Kate, very smartly, while Brunson is
Speaker 2: still on the floor limping around, immediately looks to attack him. Now,
Speaker 2: Kid had been attacking Brunson throughout the series, and in
Speaker 2: that fourth quarter stretch already he had just hit a
Speaker 2: three against a hedge gap on like two or three
Speaker 2: possessions earlier. And again, a hedge gap is like when
Speaker 2: Caid's coming off the screen and Jalen Brunson tries to
Speaker 2: hedge or throw his body out to force Kaid to
Speaker 2: retweet retreat. Ojananobi's going underneath the screen to try to
Speaker 2: meet him on the other side, and so there's a
Speaker 2: gap when right when Brunson's pulling back and OG's coming up.
Speaker 2: It's very similar to his switch interchange gap, which we've
Speaker 2: talked about a lot on this show. And Kate was
Speaker 2: able to hit a three in that situation against the hedge,
Speaker 2: but after Jalen Brunson sprained his ankle, he didn't want
Speaker 2: to hedge anymore because he didn't want to, like have
Speaker 2: to throw his body into a lateral quickness situation, so
Speaker 2: instead he just hugged up on the screener. That put
Speaker 2: Kate in a situation where he had no hedge. And
Speaker 2: what happens if you set a good screen and there's
Speaker 2: no hedge, You're gonna get downhill. He goes flying downhill,
Speaker 2: challenges the rim protector and misses a layup, but in
Speaker 2: the process occupies the rim protector, which allows Jalen Duran
Speaker 2: to fill the gap from behind and get the dunk
Speaker 2: right under the basket. There's a lot of that down
Speaker 2: the stretch. Jalen Brunson had a very similar play that
Speaker 2: led to Mitchell Robinson and one where he like when
Speaker 2: you get to the basket, even if you miss a layup,
Speaker 2: if you engage the rim protector, if you force the
Speaker 2: rim protector to leave his feet and get out of position,
Speaker 2: you're gonna have your center rolling down the lane with
Speaker 2: nobody who's even remotely physical capable, physically capable of hanging
Speaker 2: with him on the offensive glass. That's the lenge with
Speaker 2: the drop coverage big and that's why you'll see drop
Speaker 2: coverage bigs do so much stunting at the ball because
Speaker 2: they don't want to leave their feet because if they do,
Speaker 2: their out of position to box out and deal with
Speaker 2: the big man rolling down the lane, or to even
Speaker 2: deal with a lob right and we saw a bunch
Speaker 2: of that Jalen Brunson got. Mitchell Robinson opened that way
Speaker 2: had on the first possession. After Jalen Brunson's injury, takes
Speaker 2: advantage of the lack of a hedge, gets downhill ends
Speaker 2: up getting the miss that Jalen Duran cleans up. On
Speaker 2: the other end of the floor, Tobias Harris gets a
Speaker 2: massive stop against Karl Anthony town So after Jalen Brunson
Speaker 2: gets hurt, they have to sub induce McBride right, and
Speaker 2: Josh Hart ended up getting hurt as well, and so
Speaker 2: we saw we saw a campaign end up coming in
Speaker 2: the game as well at one point, but it was
Speaker 2: definitely an unfortunate set of circumstances for the Knicks. But Kat,
Speaker 2: as we saw it in many points in this series,
Speaker 2: has been able to create his own offense when needed.
Speaker 2: He's hit a couple of big left shoulder fades in
Speaker 2: crunch time, he had that crazy step back three against
Speaker 2: Jalen durn in game four or so. In theory, well
Speaker 2: we just go to Kat here he can create offense.
Speaker 2: Tobias Hairs excellent individual defense against Kat forces him into
Speaker 2: a tough fade away, nearly blocks it and actually forces
Speaker 2: him into a really tough like a really bad miss,
Speaker 2: like a bad bad miss. Kid goes down the other end,
Speaker 2: the Knicks are all scrambled and transition defense. Jalen Duran
Speaker 2: ends up setting like a little brush screen for Kate
Speaker 2: at the top of the key, same exact thing. Kid
Speaker 2: goes flying downhill misses but occupies all the help defenders,
Speaker 2: and there's Jalen Duran just standing under the basket ready
Speaker 2: for another finish. So more value in the form of
Speaker 2: rim pressure from Kate, and his rim pressure was fantastic
Speaker 2: down the stretch of this game. He got a transition
Speaker 2: push for a scoop shot. He was downhill non stop
Speaker 2: down the stretch, none of this tough mid range fade
Speaker 2: away shit that he was settling for in Game four.
Speaker 2: Caid was going to the bucket down the stretch in
Speaker 2: this game and had a lot of success that way.
Speaker 2: So Kate goes down the hill, gets the miss that
Speaker 2: leads to the Jalen dura and put back. Now the
Speaker 2: pissons are up for Tim Hart, but the way Junior's
Speaker 2: turn to get a big stop. This time they go
Speaker 2: to McHale, bridges Tim hardaway, forces him into like a
Speaker 2: tough leaning fade away along the right lane line, ends
Speaker 2: up missing, and then Cad closes the deal with a
Speaker 2: textbook drop coverage attack where he gets Juce McBride trapped
Speaker 2: on his side, puts him in jail, hits a little floater,
Speaker 2: and then on the very next possession a post fade
Speaker 2: where he turns over the double team and Asar Thompson
Speaker 2: just slips along the baseline right behind Karl Anthony Towns
Speaker 2: and Cad rifles a perfect pass right to him underneath
Speaker 2: the basket for the easy layup. Cade was brilliant down
Speaker 2: the stretch of this game. And by the way, during
Speaker 2: that whole run, Tom Tibodau was never able to get
Speaker 2: Jalen Brunson back into the game. Now I understood the
Speaker 2: idea from Tim's He had one time out left, and
Speaker 2: the ability to advance the ball is it could make
Speaker 2: a huge difference in a comeback, right. So, like, first
Speaker 2: of all, you gotta remember Brunson was stepped out because
Speaker 2: he was.
Speaker 3: Having an ankle in jo injury. He needed a minute, right.
Speaker 2: Cad scores or generates bucket on three straight possessions, so
Speaker 2: it gets to six quickly, all right. So it's already
Speaker 2: in a situation where the Knicks basically need to go
Speaker 2: like like perfect basketball down the stretch, right, And in
Speaker 2: that scenario, it's very possible that you do hit a
Speaker 2: shot that forces you to call a timeout after fouling
Speaker 2: to advance the ball so that you can get another
Speaker 2: shot up with like two seconds left on the game
Speaker 2: clock if you run into that scenario. So I think
Speaker 2: what Tibbs was thinking is someone's gonna get fouled. Something's
Speaker 2: gonna go out of Bound's worst case scenario. This is
Speaker 2: why we have Kat, This is why we have Mikhale Bridges,
Speaker 2: so that they can run offense if we need to
Speaker 2: need them to in a situation. In theory, we have
Speaker 2: a better defensive lineup out there, maybe we can buy
Speaker 2: Jalen Brunson a few possessions. So I understood, But then
Speaker 2: it just by the time you got a chance to
Speaker 2: use the timeout, it was too late. But like at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, the damage was done in
Speaker 2: those first couple of possessions after Jalen Brunson got hurt.
Speaker 2: And so I don't want to hyper focus on that
Speaker 2: decision there. From Tibbs, I could see what he was thinking.
Speaker 2: He just wanted to save that time out for a
Speaker 2: final passe ession should they need it. But the story
Speaker 2: of the game, and easily the most interesting storyline for
Speaker 2: the rest of the series, was Aasar Thompson's individual defense
Speaker 2: on Jalen Brunson. Pistons fans had been clamoring for this
Speaker 2: adjustment for the entire series. There was some pretty strong
Speaker 2: lineup data that the Pistons were about the same on
Speaker 2: offense and considerably better on defense. When Aasar Thompson was
Speaker 2: on the floor. I was a little bit more on
Speaker 2: the fence down the stretch. In Game four, a SAR
Speaker 2: made a couple of classic young guy mistakes on offense,
Speaker 2: so I thought it was at least defensible to at
Speaker 2: least in crunch time for excuse me, for the Pistons
Speaker 2: to go with like a more experienced and more polished
Speaker 2: offensive player. But down three to one, JB. Bickerstaff finally
Speaker 2: leans fully into a SAR. He plays a series high
Speaker 2: twenty nine minutes. He was plus nine in those minutes.
Speaker 2: Jalen Brunson finishes the game four for sixteen from the field.
Speaker 2: Now as a team effort, several guys got big stops
Speaker 2: on Brunson on an island, Heyde got stops. Dennis Schroeder
Speaker 2: got stops. Guys did It was a team effort on Brunson.
Speaker 2: But Asar applied constant ball pressure. Was closing off driving
Speaker 2: angles by beating him to spots, was bumping him off
Speaker 2: his base on his fade away, got great contests on
Speaker 2: his mid range, was pursuing him over the top of
Speaker 2: ball screens and getting contests from behind those rear view contests.
Speaker 2: And I thought his ball pressure in particular caused Brunson
Speaker 2: to play faster than usual. It sped him up throughout
Speaker 2: the entire game. He missed a couple of shots that
Speaker 2: he usually makes, like easy shots right at the rim.
Speaker 2: He took some unusual shots, like there was one where
Speaker 2: he had a catch in the left corner and Aasar
Speaker 2: Thompson closed out on him textbook closed out, closes out
Speaker 2: on the high side shoulder to funnel him towards the baseline.
Speaker 2: Brunson rips baseline and ends up taking kind of like
Speaker 2: a eurostep floater. But Tobias Harris was like right there,
Speaker 2: like right there, and Brunson just shot the floater directly
Speaker 2: into Tobias's hands, like it barely got out of his
Speaker 2: hands before he got before he got blocked, and like
Speaker 2: Brunson usually sees that sort of thing, but I thought
Speaker 2: he was just a little bit rushed, just a little
Speaker 2: bit uncomfortable compared to what he looked like at other
Speaker 2: points in the series. And so, I mean, especially with
Speaker 2: where the situation is gone to this point in the series,
Speaker 2: I think it was a worthwhile gamble from Jav Bickersoft
Speaker 2: to lean into a sar and more and it paid off.
Speaker 2: And that will be the biggest key in game six.
Speaker 2: Back in Detroit, Canon Brunson solved the SR. Thompson problem
Speaker 2: and get more comfortable throughout the game. I think the
Speaker 2: Knicks are going to go into Detroit in Game six
Speaker 2: and play like a veteran team that knows they need
Speaker 2: to win. They had a similar game last year where
Speaker 2: they went into Philly, I think, and beat them in
Speaker 2: game six, where they kind of like looked a little sketchy,
Speaker 2: but then they were able to rise up on the
Speaker 2: road and get the job done. My guess is it'll
Speaker 2: look a little bit like that, but it'll probably still
Speaker 2: be a close game because this Pistons team has had
Speaker 2: a lot of success with them again against them with
Speaker 2: their physicality, So I think it'll be a close game
Speaker 2: and it'll come down to a late game execution and
Speaker 2: if the Knicks can be what the Knicks are capable
Speaker 2: of beating and Jalen Brunson can stay on the floor,
Speaker 2: they should be able to close out the deal there.
Speaker 2: But really impressive moment of growth there from Cad Cunningham
Speaker 2: and the Detroit Pistons. All Right, we'll talk quickly on
Speaker 2: Pacers Bucks and then we'll do a mail bag and
Speaker 2: then we'll get out of here Milwaukee through a hell
Speaker 2: of a punch. Tonight, Giannis played another amazing game in
Speaker 2: that like kind of point center role where he's next
Speaker 2: to Bobby Portis and he just kind of determines everything
Speaker 2: as the half court shot creator. Thirty points, twenty rebounds,
Speaker 2: and thirteen assists with two steals and two blocks and
Speaker 2: absolutely insane stat line. I tweeted this earlier, like I
Speaker 2: was obviously wrong to pick the Bucks to beat the
Speaker 2: Pacers for a myriad of reasons, and obviously the Dame
Speaker 2: injury was a psychological punch to the gut for the
Speaker 2: Bucks in the middle of the series. But I don't
Speaker 2: have any regrets for believing in Giannis and his ability
Speaker 2: to potentially win this series, like he is just he
Speaker 2: is amazing, and he's gonna go play somewhere else this summer,
Speaker 2: and some team is going to become frightening when they
Speaker 2: add Giannis to the mix, And there are a couple
Speaker 2: teams out there that have the assets to make a
Speaker 2: move for him, that are already really fucking good, and
Speaker 2: it could get incredibly scary. But Giannis played amazing. Gary
Speaker 2: Trent Junior and AJ Green go nuclear from three. They
Speaker 2: hit fourteen of them, including Gary Trent hitting five of
Speaker 2: his eight threes in crunch time. But Tyre's Halliburton was
Speaker 2: even better. Think about how good you thought Gary Trent
Speaker 2: Junior was down the stretch, Like did it feel like
Speaker 2: when you were watching the game that Gary Trent was
Speaker 2: scoring every single time? He had fifteen points in crunch time.
Speaker 2: Tyres Haliburton had fourteen of his own in crunch time
Speaker 2: to go with two assists. The Pacers overcame a seven
Speaker 2: point deficit no tee. With a little over a half
Speaker 2: minute left, Andrew Nemhard hits a ball bomb coming off
Speaker 2: of ball screen like a deep like thirty foot three
Speaker 2: off the dribble at the top, and then Tyre's Halliburton
Speaker 2: beats his man off the dribble twice, once against aj
Speaker 2: Green on the right wing, once against Giannis on Tanakoompo
Speaker 2: on the left wing for the win, and on both
Speaker 2: of them like Aj Green physicality bumping up on Halliburton,
Speaker 2: He's Shiel turns the corner, he bumps him at the
Speaker 2: rim and he still gets enough lift to power through
Speaker 2: the contact for a soft left handed finish off the
Speaker 2: glass and one and then attacking Giannis in a switch
Speaker 2: the nasty left to right crossover turns the corner and
Speaker 2: for the second time in crunch time, he elevates and
Speaker 2: actually gets an up and under to avoid rim protection
Speaker 2: and cleanly lay it down off the glass like that
Speaker 2: is the most athletic Tyrese has looked on his dribble
Speaker 2: drive and rim finishing attacks, especially out of one one
Speaker 2: on ones, since the beginning of last year when he
Speaker 2: was kicking everybody's ass before he pulled his hamstring like.
Speaker 2: There has been a consistent theme with Tyre's Halliburton in
Speaker 2: his range of potential outcomes, and it pretty much comes
Speaker 2: down to he can make all the reads, but in
Speaker 2: order to beat switches, he's got to be able to
Speaker 2: beat people off the dribble and hit stuff at the
Speaker 2: rim in traffic, and in order to dick take the
Speaker 2: type of coverage necessary to generate all the kinds of
Speaker 2: openings that he can kill teams with, he's got to
Speaker 2: be able to hit his three. If he can hit
Speaker 2: his three off the dribble, that's the other ceiling raising
Speaker 2: piece that unlocks everything that he does, because if he
Speaker 2: can score effectively enough and drop coverage and he can
Speaker 2: score effectively enough and switches that unlocks his his peak trait,
Speaker 2: which is that he sees every he sees every read
Speaker 2: as it's happening, and he makes those reads on time,
Speaker 2: on target. The pass is always in the right place.
Speaker 2: That's the ceiling raising piece. But it depends on his
Speaker 2: ability to be explosive in one on one situations and
Speaker 2: to knock down shots and drop coverage and so like, honestly,
Speaker 2: we're recording a Pacers Calves preview tomorrow morning, so keep
Speaker 2: an eye on the feeds early ish in the day
Speaker 2: tomorrow for that. But the main thing that I want
Speaker 2: to focus on is that they're going to need Tyrese
Speaker 2: Halliburton to be amazing to be able to win that series.
Speaker 2: And this is the best that he's looked since the
Speaker 2: time that he came onto the scene early last year
Speaker 2: and everyone was like, oh my god, what are we watching?
Speaker 2: Like evolutionary Steve Nash here, Like he's showing that upside again.
Speaker 2: The first step on the move on Giannis was crazy,
Speaker 2: Everyone's slaying Giannis, and I mean, the dude had to
Speaker 2: do everything for his team, So like, I'm just not
Speaker 2: going to be super critical of him in that situation.
Speaker 2: This is not like the Luka Doncic situation where he's
Speaker 2: being anchored by Lebron James and Austin Reeves and and
Speaker 2: somehow still running out of gas at the end of games.
Speaker 2: Like Giannis is the engine for everything this team does.
Speaker 2: Like who's the second best player on Gianni's team tonight.
Speaker 2: It's scary Trent Junior. It's Kevin Porter Junior. You know,
Speaker 2: like like he took a bunch of league, like a
Speaker 2: replacement level players in the NBA and went in Indiana,
Speaker 2: very good Indiana Pacers team and nearly got the job done.
Speaker 2: But like in that last iso, Tyree's he toasted him
Speaker 2: on that move. He looked expl on that move and
Speaker 2: it wasn't like a high hesitation, just shoot the gap.
Speaker 2: He changed direction with a sweeping left to right crossover
Speaker 2: and then hit the jet moving forward. They're gonna need
Speaker 2: him to be incredible to beat the Calves, and I
Speaker 2: thought that was a really good sign, how explosive he
Speaker 2: looked down the stretch. We had a really weird altercation
Speaker 2: at the end of the game with Tyres Alberton's dad,
Speaker 2: like walking onto the court to just shit Takianus on
Speaker 2: the floor. That was super bizarre, But I thought both
Speaker 2: Tyrese and Jannis handled it really well in their postgame pressers,
Speaker 2: and that kind of took some of the uh, the
Speaker 2: weirdness away because you could see, like, I'm so glad
Speaker 2: that we've seen this from Tyrese. Like shit talk can
Speaker 2: get nasty sometimes, but there is something to be said
Speaker 2: about high level competition and the ability to separate what
Speaker 2: is high level competition from what things are like off
Speaker 2: the court. And there are a lot of people out
Speaker 2: there that, like I mean, we were talking about this
Speaker 2: last night, Like I I like to think I'm a
Speaker 2: reasonably nice guy. I have been awful to people in
Speaker 2: the basketball court before, Like awful to the point where,
Speaker 2: like I think about it all week until I see
Speaker 2: that person and I can apologize to them. Like there
Speaker 2: is a when you get out there and the competitive
Speaker 2: juice to start flowing, Like there is it is important
Speaker 2: to separate the competition from what things are like off
Speaker 2: the court. And like Giannis had a chance to go
Speaker 2: into that press conference and just rip Tyrese and talk
Speaker 2: all sorts of shit about who he thinks he is
Speaker 2: as a person. Nope, tyres is a competitor, wish him
Speaker 2: all the best, but then calling attention to the obvious
Speaker 2: behavior from his dad, and same thing with Tyres Halliburn.
Speaker 2: He could have gone into the presser and been like,
Speaker 2: those boys talk shit the entire series and we busted
Speaker 2: their ass. Nope, he went up there and he was like, look,
Speaker 2: we're outside of the lines now, time to be a
Speaker 2: grown up.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: I respect the hell out of Giannis, I respect the
Speaker 2: hell out of Dame. This is just what we do
Speaker 2: when we compete, and and I just I just want
Speaker 2: to applaud those those guys for handling that really sticky
Speaker 2: situation with class. All Right, let's hit a couple. Let's
Speaker 2: do about ten minutes of mail back questions and then
Speaker 2: we'll get out of here for them.
Speaker 3: Let's do it.
Speaker 1: First question. Uh, you allude to this a little bit
Speaker 1: in the Nuggets Clipper supports for the show, but Jokic
Speaker 1: seems to have really stepped up on the defensive end.
Speaker 1: So not great by any means, but it does feel
Speaker 1: like a massive improvement from the regular season. Is that
Speaker 1: what you're saying?
Speaker 2: Yes, part of it is like the juxtaposition, and what
Speaker 2: I mean by that is like they were so bad
Speaker 2: on defense to end of the season, they were so
Speaker 2: so bad, like everybody was bad, and so like there's
Speaker 2: a certain amount of like they're just kind of like
Speaker 2: competing now and that's making the world of difference and
Speaker 2: they just weren't competing earlier. But I mean, like everything
Speaker 2: comes down to because of the way that Denver guards,
Speaker 2: Everything comes down to just the three parts of their
Speaker 2: pick and roll coverage, the ball pressure of Christian Brown,
Speaker 2: Nicole Jokic, at the level in their backside rotations, and
Speaker 2: they're just substantially sharper on all three fronts than they
Speaker 2: were in the regular season.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I feel like they're a lot sharper
Speaker 1: in the regular season. That feels obvious. It feels like
Speaker 1: he's been sharper just since Game one and two. I mean,
Speaker 1: the the at the the intensity and I was about
Speaker 1: to say foot speed and that felt like the wrong
Speaker 1: word to use for yokch but uh in the the
Speaker 1: intensity and sort of purpose with Wick at least he's
Speaker 1: guarding out there feels notable. It certainly feels a lot
Speaker 1: more like their championship run than it did last season.
Speaker 2: You know, by comparison, he's big and he's smart, so
Speaker 2: like if he does, like think of it like this,
Speaker 2: he his speed is more useful because he's usually early,
Speaker 2: but he's gotta be bringing the requisite intensity. But like, dude,
Speaker 2: I thought Jokic's intensity was like palpable, palpable on the
Speaker 2: screen tonight, Like you could tell he was like I'm
Speaker 2: winning this fucking game, Like like I'm winning this fucking game.
Speaker 2: And it just was like the exact opposite of the
Speaker 2: energy we were seeing from James Harden, and it was crazy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is funny when people like to do the
Speaker 1: whole does Yokuchi even care about basketball? Thing? Like when
Speaker 1: you watch the dude in the playoffs, I mean he
Speaker 1: is as an tens of the competitors anybody.
Speaker 3: Dude, it's such bullshit.
Speaker 2: But I was like when I was like when I
Speaker 2: heard it was like, oh, Yokich like did this like
Speaker 2: you know, four hour coaching class back when he was
Speaker 2: in Europe this summer. I'm literally sitting there thinking like
Speaker 2: this dude's a basketball nutshob. This dude loves basketball. Let's yeah. Uh.
Speaker 1: On the hardened question, are Harden's late series struggles more
Speaker 1: about a lack of intensity or being overly scouted by
Speaker 1: that point, sort of familiarity with the opponent at that point.
Speaker 2: You know, I've been thinking a lot about this tonight
Speaker 2: over the course of the game, like what what is
Speaker 2: it that's causing him to do this? And I think
Speaker 2: there's a couple of different things. I think there are
Speaker 2: some obvious skill things like James Harden has always had
Speaker 2: a little bit a little bit of a like a
Speaker 2: his bag, has several very reliable moves, but he doesn't
Speaker 2: necessarily have like a gigantic variety of shot making. It's
Speaker 2: a lot of like the same three or four types
Speaker 2: of moves, And so I think there's a certain amount
Speaker 2: of like guys pick up on his cues.
Speaker 3: But also, like.
Speaker 2: I genuinely think that part of the NBA playoff process
Speaker 2: is like overcoming the adversity of a defense kind of
Speaker 2: figuring you out throughout NBA history, even the greatest basketball
Speaker 2: players that I've watched, Because in the playoffs, you have
Speaker 2: to beat four teams over the course of two months,
Speaker 2: generally at progressively more difficult levels, right and once you
Speaker 2: get into like second third round, you're consistently running into
Speaker 2: great defenses. I think what ends up happening is like
Speaker 2: over the course of a series, you get tons of tape,
Speaker 2: and teams are pretty good at taking away what you
Speaker 2: like to do, and like you will find yourself in
Speaker 2: a basketball game where you're like, shit, the thing I
Speaker 2: like to do is not working.
Speaker 3: What am I gonna do now?
Speaker 2: And like there's it's like a intensity, like confronting the
Speaker 2: problem with intensity, which is like, well, if I just
Speaker 2: play really fucking hard, I can make these things happen
Speaker 2: that are positives for me and my team, and I
Speaker 2: can build momentum in the form of confidence that comes
Speaker 2: from that, and and I can try to turn this
Speaker 2: thing around. And then there's the it's just not my night,
Speaker 2: you know, Like I know it does it almost like
Speaker 2: feels like that kind of energy from him where he
Speaker 2: almost like succumbs to it, and it's like, dude, James,
Speaker 2: this happens to everybody. This happens literally everybody in these games.
Speaker 2: It gets really fucking hard, Like you just have to
Speaker 2: find a way to contribute, Just find a way, you know,
Speaker 2: And like for him, it could have literally just been
Speaker 2: creating advantages in ball screens by like getting downhill with
Speaker 2: the same verve that he brought in the fourth quarter
Speaker 2: a game.
Speaker 1: Fo Yeah, it's this is probably a bit of an
Speaker 1: unfair comparison because it's, you know, one of the best
Speaker 1: players of all time. But you think Steph Curry likes
Speaker 1: being top locked, he likes being fucking face guarded like.
Speaker 3: He hates it. He hates it, but he at least
Speaker 3: puts in.
Speaker 1: The requisit effort required to try to beat it other
Speaker 1: ways and create advantage for his team when defenses are
Speaker 1: playing gimmicky defenses or trying to do everything they can
Speaker 1: to take away your best option, right, Like, that's part
Speaker 1: of the equation that you're describing.
Speaker 2: No, you're absolutely right to put it simply like Steph
Speaker 2: had a poor shooting night relative to what he's capable
Speaker 2: of in Game four, but his impact came in the
Speaker 2: form of his intensity throughout the game.
Speaker 1: Right, And you can say the exact same for Yokic tonight.
Speaker 1: And on that Jokic point, James Harden was tasked with
Speaker 1: the at least point of attack defense on Jokic a
Speaker 1: lot in the second half. It did seem to have
Speaker 1: some success at least, you know, he wasn't yok wasn't
Speaker 1: as much of a scorer certainly tonight. Is that something
Speaker 1: that you think the Clippers can use next game. Is
Speaker 1: a reasonable thing that could affect Jokic and change the series,
Speaker 1: or is it's sort of like a gimmicky thing they
Speaker 1: tried to do tonight.
Speaker 2: It's gimmicky in the sense that, like Jokich was doing
Speaker 2: a lot of work at the top of the key,
Speaker 2: and it gave them some flexibility in terms of the
Speaker 2: ability to switch. And there's also the reality that like
Speaker 2: this is teams have been trying this forever, which is basically,
Speaker 2: let's put our bigger forward that's not very good on
Speaker 2: the perimeter, Let's put him on Jokic, and then let's
Speaker 2: put our center on the back line. And it's just
Speaker 2: really as you look through the Clippers roster, they don't
Speaker 2: really have like Kawhi effectively is that big forward, but
Speaker 2: he's better deployed on the perimeter. So basically, James Harden
Speaker 2: is playing the same role that you see so many
Speaker 2: teams use against Denver, which is he's basically their defensive four.
Speaker 2: I mean, who was this primary matchup earlier in the series.
Speaker 2: It was literally Aaron Gordon or Michael Porter Junior for
Speaker 2: the most part. So like the idea there though, is
Speaker 2: like what James Harden is doing. Getting super aggressive up
Speaker 2: underneath Jokic is one part of the team defensive scheme
Speaker 2: of handling him, which really involves packing things on the
Speaker 2: back line and like making difficult passing reads as you
Speaker 2: have some non shooters on the floor.
Speaker 1: For sure. I agree. All right, let's move away from
Speaker 1: the series to a couple other questions. Given the Knicks
Speaker 1: Piston series has been dead even or close to debt,
Speaker 1: even are you does that make you lower on the
Speaker 1: New York Knicks ceiling or higher on Detroit's presence last
Speaker 1: future Given the fact they're doing all this also without
Speaker 1: Isaiah Stewart and Jade and.
Speaker 2: Ivy, I think that there's I mean, you texted me
Speaker 2: during the game, Jackson, You're like, I think this is
Speaker 2: going to be a series that the Knicks will win,
Speaker 2: but that we will look back on one day and
Speaker 2: be like, hey, this is one of the series where
Speaker 2: Caid kind of like showed some of what he's capable of,
Speaker 2: like an important part of his story, so to speak.
Speaker 2: It's like the old Lebron Wizard series for instance, you know,
Speaker 2: and like it's one of those things where you know,
Speaker 2: Kate has learned some valuable lessons over the course of
Speaker 2: this series. Caid early in the series was like not
Speaker 2: being as deliberate with hunting, screening actions in crunch time.
Speaker 2: It was attacking too much one on one in the
Speaker 2: middle of the series, made some bad reads where it's
Speaker 2: like trying to like split double teams and stuff and
Speaker 2: turning the basketball over tonight. Very decisive in the actions
Speaker 2: that he was attacking and was relentlessly getting downhill, wasn't
Speaker 2: settling for some of the mid range jump shots that
Speaker 2: he was settling earlier in the series. For like, Caid
Speaker 2: has shown growth over the course of this series, He's
Speaker 2: been really good defensively for stretches in this series, Like
Speaker 2: you're seeing a lot of stuff come to the surface
Speaker 2: of sar Thompson and what he's shown you as like
Speaker 2: kind of the literally the m N Thompson role just
Speaker 2: guard the other team's best guard and then operate as
Speaker 2: a baseline vertical spacer like the there's obviously a lot
Speaker 2: of exciting stuff there. I personally was never very high
Speaker 2: on the Knicks at any point this season, Like there
Speaker 2: was not a single day from from the day they
Speaker 2: got the shit kicked out of him by the Celtics
Speaker 2: there was never a single day that I really took
Speaker 2: the Knicks that seriously as a championship contender. We'll see,
Speaker 2: we'll see if they can flip that script going against
Speaker 2: the Knicks, but like Eric going against the Celtics. But
Speaker 2: like it also is a little tricky to me with
Speaker 2: this Jalen Brunson ankle thing, Like if he's not super
Speaker 2: explosive in game six and he deals with another game
Speaker 2: of Asar Thompson all over him, I could see things
Speaker 2: going south. Like I think the Knicks are gonna win,
Speaker 2: and I think they'll probably win in six, but there's
Speaker 2: like a hefty, like twenty percent chance that the Pistons
Speaker 2: get this done. Like they are a real problem for
Speaker 2: the Knicks on a bunch of different levels.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. I mean, it's crazy watching these
Speaker 1: playoffs with this sort of extra level of scrutiny that
Speaker 1: we're watching it with. And it's crazy how much the
Speaker 1: Thompson Twins jump off the screen still as rookies to
Speaker 1: have to be the best athletes on the floor every
Speaker 1: time they're on the floor to be it's rare to
Speaker 1: see a defender have the this kind of size. Also,
Speaker 1: they're kind of huge and have the lateral quickness to
Speaker 1: constantly be beating people to the spots that they want
Speaker 1: to be getting to. All the time.
Speaker 2: I've been thinking about this a lot within the context
Speaker 2: of like, okay, so like why there was a reason
Speaker 2: why I was disagreeing with a lot of people talking
Speaker 2: about the Luka Doncicic like roster structure with the Lakers,
Speaker 2: and like there's a obvious thing where it's like you you,
Speaker 2: of course want to have Luca with a rim, like
Speaker 2: a like a vertical spacer, like obviously, and the Lakers
Speaker 2: will get one this summer, I'm sure. But outside of that,
Speaker 2: like I like the idea of Luca being surrounded with
Speaker 2: guys that don't just finish plays, but that can extend
Speaker 2: advantages and play out of like like kind of complex
Speaker 2: clothes out attacking and connective playmaking and all that kind
Speaker 2: of stuff. I you know, I've had this like vision
Speaker 2: for what the Lakers can be that has never really
Speaker 2: come to fruition yet, which involves basically Luca creating advantage
Speaker 2: and then Lebron and Austin and everyone else just playing
Speaker 2: off of that advantage and having a ton of success.
Speaker 2: But here we are the Lakers, are down three to one,
Speaker 2: and last year a team of Luca surrounded with play
Speaker 2: finishing was more successful. So then I look at why
Speaker 2: why were they more successful? And I keep coming back
Speaker 2: to Derek Jones Junior and Derek and Daniel Gafford.
Speaker 3: And the specific.
Speaker 2: Dynamic of having a legitimate guy like what Jaden's doing
Speaker 2: to Luca, which is having a legitimate on ball guy
Speaker 2: that can be a pest that you that will switch
Speaker 2: if needed, but that is really hard to get to
Speaker 2: switch because he's so nifty getting around screens that can
Speaker 2: make a guy uncomfortable all game and that can be
Speaker 2: bracketed by rim protection on the backside. I think that's
Speaker 2: how they beat the Thunder, That's how they beat Minnesota.
Speaker 2: They press up, like Derek Jones was able to press
Speaker 2: up on Ant's pull up jump shot enough that he
Speaker 2: wasn't very comfortable with it, and Ant was dealing with
Speaker 2: a ton of rim protection when he would get past
Speaker 2: that first layer. And I want to be clear, and
Speaker 2: deserves more credit. He's not just beating the Lakers because
Speaker 2: of a lack of rimp protection. He has beat them
Speaker 2: with his passing and his three point shooting, which is
Speaker 2: just a testament to his development. But I think there's
Speaker 2: something to be said about these types of guys. You're
Speaker 2: watching a Men Thompson have some success defensively, You're watching
Speaker 2: Asar Thompson have a lot of success defensively. You're like
Speaker 2: these Like, I think it's actually better to surround your
Speaker 2: supremely gifted offensive player with defense than offense. And one
Speaker 2: of the big reasons why I'm thinking that way, Jackson,
Speaker 2: is these these shooters that don't make shots. There's all
Speaker 2: these shooters that don't make shots out there, and it's like,
Speaker 2: so it's like, what good is the shooter that doesn't
Speaker 2: make shots compared to the athlete that's athletic every single night,
Speaker 2: And so like at a certain point, I almost look
Speaker 2: at it and I go, like, how much different is
Speaker 2: the average like non athletic skill guard shooting on wide
Speaker 2: open catch and shoots in this series than some of
Speaker 2: the better athletes who maybe aren't as good as shooters,
Speaker 2: but they feel fresher, they get more lift on their
Speaker 2: jump shot, and they can impact the game in all
Speaker 2: these other ways.
Speaker 1: It's really interesting shooters not making shots, because that's what
Speaker 1: I have been thinking many of the games watching the Pistons,
Speaker 1: where I'm like, can their shooters just hit a shot?
Speaker 1: What the hell is going on? And not that these
Speaker 1: two are the same caliber of player, because I think
Speaker 1: we can all agree that overall, Jaden McDaniels is, you know,
Speaker 1: a tier or two above someone like Malik Beasley. But
Speaker 1: from a just a conceptual standpoint, Jaden's gonna have some
Speaker 1: games where he hits three. It's like Malik Beasley. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's not gonna do it every game, maybe one out
Speaker 1: of every five or two out of every five or whatever,
Speaker 1: but he is going to do that on occasion. And
Speaker 1: he's every single night going to bring the athleticism in
Speaker 1: size and speed and strength that someone like you know,
Speaker 1: just for the example, Malik Beasley is not providing.
Speaker 2: And when they do make shots, it makes them like
Speaker 2: kind of unbeatable, kind of like they looked in Game one,
Speaker 2: and then they can have a game like Jayden didn't
Speaker 2: shoot particularly well in Game four, but was like super
Speaker 2: super impactful defensively. It's just, you know, every single year
Speaker 2: I cover the league, I feel like I learned a
Speaker 2: little bit more, and you always are everything's also about
Speaker 2: the context, Like you you also, we've seen teams like
Speaker 2: Denver pull it off to where they can win without
Speaker 2: a ton of supreme athleticism on the floor just by
Speaker 2: overwhelming skill and size, or Golden State, where it's like
Speaker 2: Golden State has continued to win without much physical size
Speaker 2: on the floor repeatedly over the course of the last decade,
Speaker 2: and so like there I there is no harder fast rule,
Speaker 2: to be clear, But as I'm looking specifically, like as
Speaker 2: a fan of the Lakers, for instance, as I look
Speaker 2: at that team I've been, all I can think about
Speaker 2: for the summer is getting more athletic.
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's all I can think about.
Speaker 1: And just thinking about it more really just in real time,
Speaker 1: as in the playoffs, specifically, when defenses are so you know,
Speaker 1: focused on the guys who are the best players obviously,
Speaker 1: but then they're also very focused on the elite, the
Speaker 1: elite level play finishers like a Malik Beasley. They are
Speaker 1: on that dude's hip, right, Milik Beasley is not getting
Speaker 1: many half court remotely open three pointers, while Jaden McDaniels,
Speaker 1: someone of that sort of ILK is getting open three
Speaker 1: pointers because defense are like, we will live with that,
Speaker 1: we will live with him shooting threes, and so then
Speaker 1: the equation changes even further where it's like, what would
Speaker 1: you prefer a contested in Malik Beasley three or a
Speaker 1: wide open Jayden McDaniels three, And the numbers probably I
Speaker 1: don't even know what the numbers say. They would probably
Speaker 1: still land in Malik Beasley. But it's a lot closer.
Speaker 1: You're not actually comparing contested three for contested three. You're
Speaker 1: comparing contest for much of the game. You're comparing contested
Speaker 1: three from shooter versus open three from quote unquote non shooter.
Speaker 2: It's a little more complicated than that, because I think
Speaker 2: there's value in being guarded a certain type of way.
Speaker 2: But I think, like I think Malik Beasley is a
Speaker 2: class of shooter that get that that gets guarded that
Speaker 2: type of I'll give you an example like bogged In Agdanovich,
Speaker 2: you know, or like when you're looking at like like
Speaker 2: Tim Hardaway Junior is a great example. Tim Hardaway Junior
Speaker 2: at stretches in this series has not been able to
Speaker 2: make shots. Like to me, it's that's that tier below
Speaker 2: Malik Beasley where it's like that where the other team
Speaker 2: just puts a decent lock and trail defender on them
Speaker 2: that takes away the easy ones. And then like all
Speaker 2: of a sudden he becomes a useless player. Like but
Speaker 2: there's it's just it's just the volatility, because like I
Speaker 2: feel like Buddy Healed was this guy, and Buddy.
Speaker 3: Heeld's had a couple of good games in a row,
Speaker 3: so like it.
Speaker 2: But my point is, though, is like like Buddy Healed,
Speaker 2: when he's got the shot going the way he did
Speaker 2: in the last two games, looks like a good player.
Speaker 2: But like Buddy's looked really bad in the games when
Speaker 2: he hasn't been hitting shots. And so that that's where
Speaker 2: it just gets stricky. And I think that there's something
Speaker 2: to be said about the dependability of athleticism and like
Speaker 2: ideally that guy can hit a catch and shoot three.
Speaker 2: But like to me, it'd be like a guy like
Speaker 2: Chris Dunn, like how much value is there and a
Speaker 2: guy like Chris Dunn versus a guy like a Tim
Speaker 2: Hardaway junior, you know, And it's a complicated discussion, and like,
Speaker 2: you know, there are other times. There are other times
Speaker 2: I watch a game and I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: shot making is the only thing that matters, Like it's
Speaker 2: all I feel like it all depends on like having
Speaker 2: the perfect mixture of things. It's just I tend to
Speaker 2: think of it like like having Luka Doncic as like
Speaker 2: this supremely gifted offensive player that can create advantages.
Speaker 3: I just want to put him in.
Speaker 2: A situation where his athletic job is really easy, so
Speaker 2: that over the course of games, he can just focus
Speaker 2: on creating shots. There's something to be said about being
Speaker 2: problematic how much they switch with him. And this is
Speaker 2: why his conditioning is so important, because it would be
Speaker 2: good for him to be able to add a hedge
Speaker 2: and recover look to what he can do, but he
Speaker 2: just needs to get faster and he needs to be
Speaker 2: able to cover ground more over the course of games.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I've just been I've been very keyed in
Speaker 2: on the athletes, and we've just seen a lot of
Speaker 2: examples of the athletes kind of having big impact at
Speaker 2: this point.
Speaker 1: For sure, Let's do one more question in a caz
Speaker 1: Verus Celtics potential Eastern Conference matchup, assuming that that does happen,
Speaker 1: does Donovan Mitchell need to reach the level of a
Speaker 1: top five player and do you think he's capable of
Speaker 1: reaching that type of ceiling.
Speaker 2: I think where Donovan Mitchell is going to become incredibly
Speaker 2: important for the Caves Celtics matchup is crunch time when
Speaker 2: it turns into the matchup hunting, slow down type of thing,
Speaker 2: because the Calves, I think, are gonna have a lot
Speaker 2: of success in that series just with their blender and
Speaker 2: what I mean by that is just the incessant transition pushes,
Speaker 2: the quick, decisive attacks, the diversity in the way that
Speaker 2: they attack. But at the end of games, the Celtics
Speaker 2: will be able to strangle the pace and it's going
Speaker 2: to become about picking on matchups and there's no doubt
Speaker 2: that Donovan Mitchell is gonna have to go toe to toe.
Speaker 3: With those guys.
Speaker 2: The key there is, though, is like hand the Calves
Speaker 2: get so for instance, I'm one of the reasons why
Speaker 2: I view in that series is more of a coin flip,
Speaker 2: is like the home court advantage piece, Like what if
Speaker 2: if the Calves win Game one or Game two by
Speaker 2: fifteen eighteen points and it doesn't come down to crunch time,
Speaker 2: they could put themselves themselves in a situation where like
Speaker 2: if they win two games like that in a series,
Speaker 2: then Donovan Mitchell might only need to out execute the
Speaker 2: Celtics and crunch time you know twice, you know, Like
Speaker 2: that's really the key to me is like I think
Speaker 2: if the I think if the Calves are going to
Speaker 2: beat the Celtics, they need like a couple of those
Speaker 2: games to be like run like between game one, two
Speaker 2: and five, they would need to win two of those
Speaker 2: games by like ten fifteen points, because I think it'd
Speaker 2: be I think it would be really difficult to ask
Speaker 2: Mitchell to out execute Tatum four times in a series
Speaker 2: in a crunch time, you know, slow down type of game.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm with you.
Speaker 3: All right, guys.
Speaker 2: That's all we have for tonight is always be sincerely
Speaker 2: appreciate you guys for supporting us and supporting the show.
Speaker 2: As mentioned tomorrow, we are going to be doing our
Speaker 2: series preview on Pacers Calves with Carter Rodriguez tomorrow night
Speaker 2: Live after the final buzzer of Lakers Timberwolves. Don't forget,
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Speaker 2: Jampack Day for the show tomorrow. We'll see you guys
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