Speaker 1: Let's get more on the economic challenges that face Britain's
Speaker 1: next Prime Minister, can Andy Burnham, who looks set to
Speaker 1: take over from Keir Starmer, help Britain escape weak activity,
Speaker 1: high debt and elevated boring costs. Joining us now as
Speaker 1: Paul Novak, General Secretary of the Trade Trades Union Congress.
Speaker 1: The TU see the umbrella body for dozens of trade unions,
Speaker 1: many of whom are affiliated with Labour. Good to speak
Speaker 1: to you again.
Speaker 2: Paul, morning, Carolyn, good to speak to you.
Speaker 1: Been speaking to the British Chambers of Commerce this morning.
Speaker 1: Obviously they represent business. They've got a lot of the
Speaker 1: leaders that Rachel Reeves speaking to them today. They employ
Speaker 1: millions of people in Britain. The BCC boss says that
Speaker 1: increasing taxes for business is will be a road to ruin.
Speaker 1: But you do want more support for voters. What do
Speaker 1: you want to see from potentially Andy Burnham if he
Speaker 1: does become PM.
Speaker 2: Well, whoever is our next Prime minister. Andy Burnham at
Speaker 2: the moment is the only candidate. I want them to
Speaker 2: show from day one that they're on the side of
Speaker 2: working people, their families and communities, and to set out
Speaker 2: an ambitious program on that first one hundred days of
Speaker 2: a labor government about what they're going to do. So, yes,
Speaker 2: get our economy growing, but get our economy growing in
Speaker 2: a way that puts pockets in the money in the
Speaker 2: pockets of working people. So there are lots of things.
Speaker 2: I've got a long list of suggestions Karen on but
Speaker 2: just on that issue around tax I mean, so, for example,
Speaker 2: we think it's important that you know we've we've got
Speaker 2: a fully costed plan for the government to introduce a
Speaker 2: social tariff on energy bills. Now hard to think on
Speaker 2: a daylight today where the sun is cracking the flags
Speaker 2: about the cost of heating, but we know in the
Speaker 2: autumn and winter, because of that conflict in Iran, lots
Speaker 2: of people are going to see big spikes in the bills.
Speaker 2: So support for low middle income households. How can you
Speaker 2: pay for that? We think an increase in the bank
Speaker 2: seur charge to bank levy on windfall profits can help
Speaker 2: the government do that. I think that would be the
Speaker 2: right thing to do to support families. I think it
Speaker 2: would help bring down inflation, and frankly, I think Britain's
Speaker 2: banks can afford it because they've been doing very well
Speaker 2: over the course last eighteen months two years, because we've
Speaker 2: been in a relatively high interest rates environments. So they're
Speaker 2: the sort of policies I think they could make a
Speaker 2: massive difference to millions of people from down the country.
Speaker 3: We spoke to. When we spoke to the BCC, they
Speaker 3: said they wanted to have a discussion about the Employment
Speaker 3: Rights Act to make sure it works for business. Are
Speaker 3: you worried about elements of that Act being rolled back?
Speaker 2: Well, I think it would be real mistake for the
Speaker 2: government to roll back on the Employment Right Sack then,
Speaker 2: and we've seen it already. I mean, I think the
Speaker 2: new Prime Minister will have a short honey moon period
Speaker 2: and there will be a lot of vested interests making
Speaker 2: the case for, you know, change this or that, and
Speaker 2: there will be some dodgy bosses out there who don't
Speaker 2: want to see improvements and employment rights. Now, where I
Speaker 2: would agree with the British Chambers of Commerce is that
Speaker 2: there's going to be a lot of change as a
Speaker 2: result of the Employment Rights Act. I think there's a
Speaker 2: responsibility on government to work with unions and employers to
Speaker 2: help employers understand those changes. But fundamentally this is about
Speaker 2: making work pay for millions of working people. So whether
Speaker 2: that's giving a million people on zero hours contracts the
Speaker 2: right to guaranteed hours, whether that's making sure that people
Speaker 2: have access to sick pay, to flexible working, We're very
Speaker 2: clear this is a packaging measures that's good for working people.
Speaker 2: The government itself is clear that this could deliver a
Speaker 2: thirteen billion pounds boost of the UK in terms of productivity,
Speaker 2: and I would ask employers to get on board with
Speaker 2: that agenda and final point on that. Our post election
Speaker 2: polling was very clear, it doesn't matter whether you voted
Speaker 2: reform at the last election. Labor, Green, conservative people support
Speaker 2: improvements in employment rights and I would hope that employers
Speaker 2: would respect that.
Speaker 1: Okay, a bank tax would be an absolute bombshell. But
Speaker 1: you know Jamie Darmond, if you look at him JP
Speaker 1: Morgan chief. He has directly told Bloomberg recently that if
Speaker 1: there were to be an increase in terms of taxes
Speaker 1: on banks that JP Morgan would scrap plans to invest
Speaker 1: billions in a new London headquarters in Canary Wharf. He
Speaker 1: said specifically that JP Morgan, in his words, we paid
Speaker 1: probably ten billion dollars in extra taxes by now I
Speaker 1: don't think that's right or fair. What would that mean
Speaker 1: an extra bank tax if a major global bank were,
Speaker 1: you know, not to progress with you know, investment in
Speaker 1: London in the UK.
Speaker 2: Well, I'll be honest with you, Krol and I take
Speaker 2: those comments with the pinchers of salt. I mean the
Speaker 2: toy has reduced the bank SAT charged by three percent
Speaker 2: three years ago it is now. I think, at the
Speaker 2: very least, considering those windfall profits of the banks and
Speaker 2: making the government should reverse that. But I think they
Speaker 2: can go further. I mean the Tories themselves putty thirty
Speaker 2: five percent levy on the win for profits of the
Speaker 2: energy companies, and we're in a similar situation now with banks.
Speaker 2: And I would say to JP Morgan and everybody else,
Speaker 2: reflect on the fact that last year was a record
Speaker 2: year for bonuses in the City of London, twenty four
Speaker 2: billion pounds handed out. At the same time, one in
Speaker 2: three people were worried about taking on the heating because
Speaker 2: they're heating bills. One in five was skipping meals because
Speaker 2: they can't make ends meet. We need an economy that
Speaker 2: works for everybody, not just those at the very top.
Speaker 2: And I think that those at the very top have
Speaker 2: done well over the last few years. They haven't been
Speaker 2: through a cost of living crisis. Millions of families have,
Speaker 2: so I think and incoming prime minister has got to
Speaker 2: be prepared to take on those vested interests and show
Speaker 2: who side they'rerong.
Speaker 1: Okay, but is Bernham really going to deliver that? Has
Speaker 1: he not lost the supportive unions? United Sharon Graham, for example,
Speaker 1: doesn't want the Energy secretary you know, Edmitt Abound to
Speaker 1: become chance that has Burnham actually lost union support? Is
Speaker 1: he in danger of losing your union support if he doesn't,
Speaker 1: you know, come up with those all of those measures
Speaker 1: that you want to see delivered quickly.
Speaker 2: No, No, I mean as I say, I mean, were
Speaker 2: we yet to say if any other candidates declare, I'm
Speaker 2: very clear if it's Andy Burnham or anybody else, we
Speaker 2: want to work with the new prime minister to deliver
Speaker 2: the change that people voted for back in July twenty
Speaker 2: twenty four. I think we've got an opportunity now to
Speaker 2: really reset things and really show working people that they're
Speaker 2: on the government is on their side. You know, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of disillusionment with politics. I mean that same
Speaker 2: post election. Pollar talked about before when you ask people
Speaker 2: who which party is best at sorting the fundamental problems
Speaker 2: like getting the economy back on track, that don't know's
Speaker 2: beat to any particular party at the moment. There's a
Speaker 2: lot of lack of faith in the political process and
Speaker 2: that's why I think any Petian just needs to nail
Speaker 2: coldorus to the mast. Who side of you're on, and
Speaker 2: my answer very clearly and unequivocally should be on the
Speaker 2: side of working people.
Speaker 3: Are you then concerned or what's your view on the
Speaker 3: people who are advising Andy Brown on as economic policies.
Speaker 3: There's a whole list of them that have been reported,
Speaker 3: the likes of Andy hal Dane Jim and Neil Karis Roberts.
Speaker 2: Yeah. No, Well, I think a lot of those people
Speaker 2: who have got really good qualities and we've done a
Speaker 2: lot of work with them, and I'm not going to
Speaker 2: advise Andy on who he appoints as economic advisors, or
Speaker 2: Andy or any future prime minister or indeed their cabinet members.
Speaker 2: I mean, that sort of fantasy politics isn't isn't my job.
Speaker 2: Whoever's doing those key jobs, whether it's Prime minister, Chancellor, secretary,
Speaker 2: of State for Business and Trade. We want them sort
Speaker 2: of setting out an agenda where where people can see
Speaker 2: this is going to make a difference to me and
Speaker 2: my family, This is going to put more money in
Speaker 2: my pocket, and that that's absolute essentially, because if you
Speaker 2: want a growing, sustainable economy, where can people need money
Speaker 2: in their pockets? And for far too many people household
Speaker 2: budgets are squeezed, work is insecure. I think the government's
Speaker 2: got an opportunity to do something about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, not the vested interest that you're concerned about, No.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. It's no surprise, Carol, that social media billionaires
Speaker 2: will rail against any efforts to raise wealth taxes and
Speaker 2: dodgy bosses will oppose any improvements in employment rights because
Speaker 2: that's what they did with the minimum wage, and that's
Speaker 2: what they've done with every single progressive change in employment law.
Speaker 2: The new Prime Minister just has to be clear who
Speaker 2: side they're on and nail the colors to the mass
Speaker 2: on day one.