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Speaker 1: On this episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly, the new season

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Speaker 1: of Netflix is surprising. Smash hit Drive to Survive drops

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Speaker 1: this weekend. British Formula one presenter Will Buxton joins us

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Speaker 1: to explain how the show's unexpected success in America has

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Speaker 1: created countless new fans and helped grow the sport and

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Speaker 1: later NFL network. Reporter Mike Garret follow fills us in

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Speaker 1: on the fallout over Calvin Ridley's season long suspension for gambling.

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Speaker 1: But first, with March Madness set to begin this weekend,

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Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated senior writer Pat Porty tells us about a

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Speaker 1: former Sneaker executive who claims some of the biggest recruits

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Speaker 1: to the biggest programs are all getting paid. We take

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Speaker 1: you inside the scandal that rocked college basketball. It's March nine.

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Speaker 1: I'm your host, John Gonzalez from Sports Illustrated and I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio. This is Sports Illustrated Weekly, straight away off

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Speaker 1: the mark Rebound's time expires, Not Hawk Survive at Home.

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Speaker 1: We are getting guys from New York and Philadelphia and

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Speaker 1: Los Angeles to come to Lawrence, Kansas. Is it because

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Speaker 1: they like the wheat fields or is it because they're

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Speaker 1: getting something whether or not college athletes should be paid.

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Speaker 1: It's already happening. Merle Code was once an employee for

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Speaker 1: both Adidas and Nike, and part of his job was

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Speaker 1: helping ensure star prospects and their families were financially compensated.

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Speaker 1: And on that point, Code has no regrets because while

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Speaker 1: some consider those methods on ethical, Code maintains it's simply

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Speaker 1: a part of the business. I do not have to

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Speaker 1: abide by the pitch because I'm arms linked away. I'm

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Speaker 1: not a part of n C double a system. I

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Speaker 1: don't have to bother for his actions. Code is looking

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Speaker 1: at nine months in prison. I discussed his situation with

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Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated senior writer Pat Forty, who interviewed Code at

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Speaker 1: length for his podcast yahoo's College Football Inquirer. Al Right, Pat,

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Speaker 1: let's start with how Code ended up getting arrested. Tell

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Speaker 1: us what happens to Code On the morning of September Yeah, so,

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Speaker 1: like six thirty in the morning, he hears the front

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Speaker 1: door being knocked or doorbell rang. I think he said

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Speaker 1: that his wife was in the shower getting ready for work.

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Speaker 1: He goes downstairs, opens the door, and there's he set

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Speaker 1: up to twenty federal agents on his lawn or you know,

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Speaker 1: right there at the doorway, guns drawn, facing him, and

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Speaker 1: he's wondering what the heck just happened, and they're saying

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Speaker 1: they're putting him under arrest for bribery, for odd money laundering,

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Speaker 1: and he had no idea what they're talking about. And

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Speaker 1: then they played him the audio excerpts of some of

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Speaker 1: the wire tapped phone conversations he had had with some

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Speaker 1: of the other co conspirators in this deal, and he

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Speaker 1: began to figure out all. He still thought it was

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Speaker 1: just a complete mistake, like how could I possibly being

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Speaker 1: charged here? But it became very real when they put

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Speaker 1: the handcuffs on him and put him in a car

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Speaker 1: and took him and booked him that morning. According to code,

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Speaker 1: he was merely one part of a larger system. But

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Speaker 1: Pat he told you the compensating kids is considered standard

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Speaker 1: practice and that basically all the big programs do it.

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Speaker 1: Do you believe him? Sure? I believe him? Yeah, I mean, look,

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Speaker 1: this had been an open secret for a long time.

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Speaker 1: This was just the most detail and acknowledgement of somebody like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I paid guys, But I think everybody knew certainly that

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Speaker 1: the best players were getting paid, they were being taken

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Speaker 1: care of. Almost all of them by the time they

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Speaker 1: even got to college had agents already. Maybe they hadn't

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Speaker 1: signed anything formally, but they were receiving kickbacks from agents.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I think that this was the way basketball

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Speaker 1: had gotten things done, and now we just got to

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Speaker 1: find out a little bit more of the nitty gritty

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Speaker 1: of how it happened. So, I mean, I would say,

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Speaker 1: if if your school was signing blue chip players in

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Speaker 1: the last twenty years, they were probably all getting paid.

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Speaker 1: So Code said to you that the Feds weren't really

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Speaker 1: after him so much as they were after these big,

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Speaker 1: high profile names like Sean Miller and Rick Pettino, and

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Speaker 1: to make that happen, they wanted him to wear a wire.

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Speaker 1: They wanted whoever else they thought I was lotting to

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Speaker 1: be able to provide. And I was like, listen, man,

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Speaker 1: I'm not doing that. This is not who I And

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Speaker 1: we know that Rick Pettino ended up getting moved out

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Speaker 1: at Louisville, but no criminal charges against him. Pettina recently

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Speaker 1: tweeted about this. He said, for the tenth time, I

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Speaker 1: have no idea who Merle Code is and why he's

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Speaker 1: using me and others to be relevant. What do you

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Speaker 1: make a Pettino's denial. It's strategic as much as anything,

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Speaker 1: because he doesn't have to know who Meral Code is

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Speaker 1: from Rural Code to still be telling the truth. So

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Speaker 1: what Rick says about Okay, I don't know Merle Code

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean that he didn't know that there was a

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Speaker 1: deal going on. It's just a a well worded statement

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Speaker 1: from Rick. Yeah, there are degrees of separation here where

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Speaker 1: there's quote unquote plausible deniability, but everybody understands what's happening

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Speaker 1: behind the scenes. And and Code in his book, there's

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Speaker 1: so many revelations like that, and also in the conversation

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Speaker 1: with you on your podcast where he said he doesn't

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Speaker 1: really believe there's such a thing as a clean program,

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Speaker 1: and he outlines a conversation between a Kansas assistant coach

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Speaker 1: talking about trying to recruit Zion Williamson that the family

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Speaker 1: wanted money and housing. Williamson ended up going to Duke,

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Speaker 1: but Bill self like Patino, denies any knowledge of an

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Speaker 1: off books deal for Zion, and Code writes in his

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Speaker 1: book not only that he knew about this whole thing,

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Speaker 1: but that the higher ups at Kansas who gave self

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Speaker 1: a lifetime contract. News. So this really goes bey on

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Speaker 1: just the coaching level, right, I mean a whole bunch

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Speaker 1: of administrators are complicit in this. Yeah, I mean in

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Speaker 1: a larger sense, everybody knew, what knows what's going on.

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Speaker 1: You guys have got to help us get the top guys.

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Speaker 1: You guys do your thing. We're fine with it. I

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Speaker 1: have to pretend I don't know what's going on, but

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Speaker 1: they all know. And then of course Self's bosses certainly No. Okay,

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Speaker 1: if you're getting the top classes at Kentucky, if you're

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Speaker 1: getting the top classes at Duke and so on and

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Speaker 1: so forth, you should probably have a pretty good idea

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Speaker 1: how those guys are coming. When he says that there's

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Speaker 1: no such thing as a clean program, some people go, well,

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Speaker 1: wait a minute, Duke and Coach K have this reputation.

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Speaker 1: Are we to believe that Duke in Coach K are

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Speaker 1: just like everybody else? Yes, we are, We absolutely are.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure the program was built that way in

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Speaker 1: the eighties when Coach K first got it going, but

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Speaker 1: they were getting the top players, and we as stay

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Speaker 1: that the top players were by and large not going

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Speaker 1: anywhere for free for a long time, for decades really.

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Speaker 1: And there are other trappings along the way that would

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Speaker 1: not pass the smell test, one of the first being that.

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Speaker 1: And it's mentioned in in Merle's book that Zion's dad

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Speaker 1: is asking Merle for a hundred dollars to buy groceries

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Speaker 1: because he doesn't have enough money to feed the family.

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Speaker 1: I literally came home until my wife he went at

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Speaker 1: a t. M Lee was asking for some grocery money

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Speaker 1: because he was out of work, and I gave my

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Speaker 1: hundred hundred dollars of my money, no problem. But Vita

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Speaker 1: supposed to give a key in his family a hundred

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars. A couple of years later, when Zion goes

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Speaker 1: to Duke, they move into a half million dollar house

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Speaker 1: in a luxury subdivision. I've driven by the house. I've

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Speaker 1: seen it's a nice place. When families are suddenly getting

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Speaker 1: up and moving across the country with their child who's

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Speaker 1: going to be in school for one year, there's probably

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Speaker 1: a deal going on. Mike's Evsky's had a great career.

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Speaker 1: But if anybody out there thinks that he is Ivory Tower, Mike,

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Speaker 1: you're probably wrong. I found it really interesting that the

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Speaker 1: pushback wasn't so much about this happening at all, It

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Speaker 1: was that, hey, we wanted to happen for us too.

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Speaker 1: There's a conversation about Billy Donovan when he was at Florida,

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Speaker 1: and he was mad about this whole thing, but mostly

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Speaker 1: he was mad that Nike was catering to Kentucky and

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Speaker 1: that they weren't spreading the wealth around. And Code said

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Speaker 1: that Donovan threatened to call Nike president Phil Knight personally

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Speaker 1: because he said, this stuff is getting out of hand.

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Speaker 1: So it wasn't so much that Billy Donovan was mad

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Speaker 1: that kids were getting paid. It was that, hey, we're

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Speaker 1: not getting our share of these big recruits. Absolutely, yeah, no.

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Speaker 1: And that's one thing, you know. Code goes into some

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Speaker 1: pretty good detail on that of it being a little

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Speaker 1: bit exhausting trying to maintain good relations with all these

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Speaker 1: people but having a distinct pecking order. Nike has a

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Speaker 1: lot of schools that it outfits, Adidas has a lot

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Speaker 1: of schools that they outfit, But somebody's got to come first,

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Speaker 1: and if not the school that's coming first, then you

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Speaker 1: you do get a little bit angry. And I think

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Speaker 1: there was definitely a shift. I mean, Billy Donovan went

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Speaker 1: through a period where he was getting all the big

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Speaker 1: time recruits, you know, late Joineese, early two thousand's, and

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Speaker 1: then Kentucky re established itself rather dramatically with John Calipari.

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Speaker 1: It was just an ungodly haul of big time players

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Speaker 1: right away as soon as he got there. And I'm

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Speaker 1: sure Nike was integraty involved in a lot of that.

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Speaker 1: I find it really interesting how Code sees himself fitting

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Speaker 1: into this underground economy and the morality attendant to that,

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Speaker 1: where he says, you know, there was a five figure

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Speaker 1: payment to Anthony Davis and Kentucky and he didn't see

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Speaker 1: that as a bad thing because he said a d

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Speaker 1: was generating tens of millions of dollars for everybody but himself.

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Speaker 1: Here's Davis, what can you do? And on your pod

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Speaker 1: he told you that he's not going to apologize for

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Speaker 1: doing his job and challenging a corrupt system. So Code

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Speaker 1: isn't very apologetic about this, right. He He sees himself

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Speaker 1: as part of a system that functions the way it functions,

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Speaker 1: and that it's a capital of society and there shouldn't

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Speaker 1: be anything wrong with that. This is about me trying

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Speaker 1: to help and assist families didn't need, for the most part,

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Speaker 1: to try to change their station in life, because the

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Speaker 1: system didn't treat him fairly. So let's create a system

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Speaker 1: where it does. Code I mean, makes it very clear

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Speaker 1: that he thinks that the n C double A rules

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Speaker 1: are outdated, unfair, and he's pro players getting whatever they

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Speaker 1: can however they can. And yeah, the the Anthony Davis anecdote,

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Speaker 1: which is really interesting when he goes in a great

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Speaker 1: detail on that this was one where he had gotten

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Speaker 1: to know Anthony Davis when he was younger coming up

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Speaker 1: in Chicago and got to know the family, and so

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Speaker 1: Codes there on the ground floor with him. He goes

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Speaker 1: to Kentucky and then that during his freshman year around Thanksgiving,

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Speaker 1: he said that Anthony Davis's dad lost his job, and

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Speaker 1: he got word from somebody else at Nike that that

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Speaker 1: they were in a bit of a pinch and could

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Speaker 1: they help him out until he goes pro. And so

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Speaker 1: Code went to a former assistant athletic director of Kentucky

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Speaker 1: and says, hey, is there anything we can do here?

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Speaker 1: And they're like yeah. They put together the scheme to

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Speaker 1: market a T shirt with the famed unibrow of Anthony Davis,

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Speaker 1: and it sells like wildfire, as you would expect in

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Speaker 1: Kentucky with the most rapid fan base in the country

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Speaker 1: and a team that is you know, has a chance

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Speaker 1: to win a national championship, and so they the immediate

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Speaker 1: proceeds become ten thousand dollars cash that has passed along

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Speaker 1: to Merle, and Merle hands it to Anthony Davis's mother

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Speaker 1: before Kentucky plays Indiana December tenth, two thousand and eleven

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Speaker 1: in Bloomington's I mean, that's how the deal got done

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Speaker 1: in extreme detail. So he didn't end up cooperating with

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Speaker 1: the fetes. He didn't wear a wire. Why is he

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Speaker 1: talking now? He's talking now. It's interesting because I think

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Speaker 1: he he wants to say, well, how the system works,

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Speaker 1: but he's also really wants to say that this is

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Speaker 1: this is the unjust way that the federal crime and

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Speaker 1: punishment system works and works, and how I got ensnared

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Speaker 1: in it, and that what I was doing could not

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Speaker 1: possibly be construed as defrauding these schools. And so I

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Speaker 1: think he's taking issue with the schools, and he's taking

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Speaker 1: issue with the Feds while also pulling back the curtain on.

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Speaker 1: This is how the underground economy works. And yes it's

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Speaker 1: against n C double A rules or was really still is,

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Speaker 1: even with the name, image and likeness evolution that we've had,

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Speaker 1: but it shouldn't be against the law. And how did

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Speaker 1: this happen, you know? And why were the the everybody

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Speaker 1: that was punished in this but one person, all black

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Speaker 1: men and one white guy. I've grown up a black

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Speaker 1: man in my whole life, whole ship that just love

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Speaker 1: about GM is a good game. And he won his

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Speaker 1: job and he got thrown into so that we couldn't

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Speaker 1: come back and say it was anything racial. He was

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Speaker 1: a low white man headed pone. And they stated intent

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Speaker 1: by the FEDS is that they wanted to They wanted

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Speaker 1: but to bust big names of this. They wanted to

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Speaker 1: bust Rick Pettino, They wanted to bust Bill self at Kansas.

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Speaker 1: They wanted to bust Sean Miller at Arizona. But then

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Speaker 1: they didn't go get him. Whether they just got scared

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Speaker 1: they couldn't pin enough on them or what, but they

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Speaker 1: curtailed the investigation, went after the low hanging fruit they

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Speaker 1: knew they could get, and that's who it turned out

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Speaker 1: to be. Guys like Moral Code, who nobody had really

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Speaker 1: heard of. People in basketball certainly knew him outside of that,

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Speaker 1: and nobody knew who he was. But he was a

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Speaker 1: guy that helped make the underground economy work. Eight of

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Speaker 1: the nine men charged and convicted in the scandal are

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Speaker 1: black men and the high profile white coaches. While some

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Speaker 1: of them lost their jobs, they're not going to prison.

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Speaker 1: So what does Code have to say about all that? Oh,

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Speaker 1: coach mad you know about that? He understood first of all,

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Speaker 1: the curdity of them being charged with trying to defraud

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Speaker 1: the schools, and secondly some of the actions from those

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Speaker 1: schools and those coaches. I mean, like Jim Ghetto was

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Speaker 1: sued by Kansas for like a million dollars. Jim Ghetto

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Speaker 1: makes a good living, but like a low six figure living,

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Speaker 1: maybe a hundred miles and hundred twenty five thousand dollars.

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Speaker 1: You're getting suited for a million dollars for my school.

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Speaker 1: You were trying to help, but all of a sudden

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Speaker 1: they turn around and frame you as the bad guy

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Speaker 1: because the Feds did it. I think that sort of

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Speaker 1: mentality really made Code angry, and seeing these coaches just

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Speaker 1: completely lie about what their involvement was, according to Code,

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Speaker 1: to distance themselves from these people who had been working

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Speaker 1: with them hand in hand, you know, and something. They're like,

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Speaker 1: oh no, no, we didn't have anything to do with

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Speaker 1: those guys. This system is set up so black kid,

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Speaker 1: black assistant coaches going to black neighborhoods, the black kids

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Speaker 1: and bringing to the white coaches and white the wild folks.

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Speaker 1: That's how the some work. They criminalized latinly because if

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Speaker 1: that's not the case, they meets see Sean Miller or

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Speaker 1: Will Wade or ripetin on anybody else involved in this

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Speaker 1: going to jail like me, because they have money, you know,

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Speaker 1: they're they're they're financially stable and able to fight this

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Speaker 1: and strict this thing out. And we we don't have

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Speaker 1: their financial backing. Yeah, we're the ones that trun the

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Speaker 1: government's way. So Code is mad. He's going to prison

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Speaker 1: for something that he finds, as you mentioned, to be

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Speaker 1: completely hypocritical and unjust. And he writes in his book

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Speaker 1: that he could create a real problem for college coaches

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Speaker 1: and athletic directors and recruits in power conferences. And he

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Speaker 1: says he has a massive amount of evidence that was

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Speaker 1: never presented to the jury, but that bringing that out

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Speaker 1: now would serve no purpose. Do you believe him that

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Speaker 1: he has all this evidence? And if he does, why

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Speaker 1: is he setting on it? Well? Yeah, and that's my

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Speaker 1: one place where I have a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: problem with code in his book, because I think you

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Speaker 1: should bring forth that, Evans. Let's tell the truth. You

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Speaker 1: you know the truth. Tell the truth. And yes, I

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Speaker 1: believe he absolutely has the evidence. I mean, I know

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Speaker 1: that there was a great deal of frustration from him

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Speaker 1: and the other defendants about the hours of wire taps

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Speaker 1: and the mountain of text messages and other documentation that

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Speaker 1: was not allowed into court. That was going to be

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Speaker 1: their whole argument for like, Hey, I promise you we

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Speaker 1: weren't defrauding these schools. They wanted us to do this.

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Speaker 1: In many instances, these coaches are actually asking for the

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Speaker 1: asking for the help. So how can I then defraud

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Speaker 1: the same people that are asking for the help in

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Speaker 1: turn having a hundred and ninety million or a hundred

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Speaker 1: and sixty million or eighty million dollar relationships that they did.

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Speaker 1: We negotiate after we're conveetued the prosecutors were blocking that

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Speaker 1: didn't want the evidence admitted. The judge upheld it for

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Speaker 1: whatever reason, and so it was never heard. But my point, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was like, moral, if you're in if you're in

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Speaker 1: possession of those things, I'd sure like to see it.

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Speaker 1: I'd sure like to hear it. And I think it

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Speaker 1: would then paint the full picture of what everyone knew

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Speaker 1: and what was going on. So why he's not coming

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Speaker 1: out with that, I asked him on our podcast. A

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Speaker 1: lot of these black assist coaches will be to gas

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Speaker 1: who take the brunt of the heat or whatever it is.

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Speaker 1: I've got to set it. And I realized that, and

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Speaker 1: he didn't want to see that. But you know, in

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Speaker 1: my mind, I just wonder if he's holding that, it

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Speaker 1: still is a potential hammer over some people's heads, some

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Speaker 1: some very rich people's heads who have a lot to

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Speaker 1: lose in this. Yeah, in the interim, as he's weighing

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Speaker 1: what to do with the evidence that he may or

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Speaker 1: may not have, how much prison time is he looking at?

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Speaker 1: Nine months? Although you know, I think that could be

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Speaker 1: reduced for good behavior. He's in a prison in South Carolina.

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Speaker 1: And you know, on one hand, you said, oh, nine months,

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Speaker 1: but hey, that's nine months of your life. You're in prison. Man,

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Speaker 1: I don't think anybody would want to spend those nine

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Speaker 1: months or even if it ends up being eight or

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Speaker 1: seven and a half. And then you come out and

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Speaker 1: he said, this is a guy I like. He's the

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Speaker 1: son of a former judge in South Carolina. He was

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Speaker 1: successful college player, he played professionally, he had a good

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Speaker 1: professional reputation, and now he's he's got a felony on

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Speaker 1: his record for life that he has to deal with.

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Speaker 1: There's so much going on here, just an incredible job

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Speaker 1: by you on the reporting. We'll keep an eye on it.

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Speaker 1: If there's further developments, hopefully we'll have you back. Pat Forty,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for this my pleasure. John, thank you.

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Speaker 1: You can read Pat Forty's piece about Merle Code on

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Speaker 1: si dot com. We'll link to it in our show notes.

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Speaker 1: Special thanks to Sean Sullivan at Yahoo for providing Merle

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Speaker 1: Code's original audio from the College Choir podcast After a Break.

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Speaker 1: Will Buxton on the explosion in popularity for f one

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Speaker 1: thanks to the hit Netflix show Drive to Survive. Well

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Speaker 1: are we gonna talk about these here? It's not just

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Speaker 1: about what's going on on the track, it's everything that

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Speaker 1: happens off the track. As recently as three years ago,

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Speaker 1: when American motorsport fans thought about racing, they pretty much

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Speaker 1: only thought about NASCAR. But all of that changed in

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Speaker 1: twenty nineteen when the show Drive to Survive dropped on Netflix.

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Speaker 1: Seemingly overnight, a legion of new Formula One racing fans

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Speaker 1: were created. Suddenly, friends of mine who previously had no

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Speaker 1: interest in racing were hawked. With the fourth season of

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Speaker 1: Drive to Survive premiering this weekend, and with F one

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Speaker 1: back on the track for a new season beginning March twenty,

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Speaker 1: we wanted to talk to somebody about the explosion in

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Speaker 1: popularity for both the sport and the show Drive to Survive.

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Speaker 1: Success in season one was born out of the issues

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Speaker 1: that the production team experienced in making it. This is

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Speaker 1: Wild Buxton. He's a reporter and digital presenter for Formula

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Speaker 1: One and the de facto narrator for Drive to Survive.

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Speaker 1: Do your will tell it that first season of the

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Speaker 1: show was a happy accident that created the phenomenon the

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Speaker 1: fact that Mercedes and Ferrari wanted nothing to do with it.

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Speaker 1: This is a season where Mercedes and Ferrari are ultimately

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Speaker 1: fighting for the world championships, so the two protagonists for

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Speaker 1: the title weren't in the show. There's no access to

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Speaker 1: their garage, their personnel, their drivers, nothing, so they had

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Speaker 1: to look for stories beyond the traditional oh, here's her

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Speaker 1: World Championships one and from that I think they inadvertently

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Speaker 1: stumbled on what the success of the show has been,

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Speaker 1: which is the human stories and the things that we

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Speaker 1: can all relate to all of the characters, the politics,

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Speaker 1: the really interesting things that went on behind the scenes

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Speaker 1: and not necessarily at the top teams, and making them human.

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Speaker 1: I was surprised with how successful it was, but I

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Speaker 1: wasn't massive surprised that it found a fan base in

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Speaker 1: the US. We knew there was a fan base just

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Speaker 1: waiting for Formula one. They just had to be engaged

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Speaker 1: in the right way. The show clearly needed a big

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Speaker 1: personality to start season one, and as you mentioned, you know,

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Speaker 1: some of the top teams weren't really on board yet.

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Speaker 1: So would it be fair to say that Daniel Ricardo

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Speaker 1: was really a big beneficiary of the Netflix effect. I'd

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Speaker 1: say Netflix was a big beneficiary of Daniel Ricardo. You know,

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Speaker 1: can I get you to tell me who you are

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Speaker 1: and what you do for a job, I'm Dania Ricardo

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Speaker 1: and I'm a car mechanic. Alrighty, I got this. I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna nail at three to one. I am Daniel Ricardo,

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Speaker 1: I was born in Perth, Australia, and I'm a Formula

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Speaker 1: one driver. Sounds pretty good when I say that he

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Speaker 1: was manner from heaven. He's such an open, friendly, naturally,

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Speaker 1: very very funny guy, great looking, his own style, just

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Speaker 1: really fun. But then he pulls the helmet on and

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Speaker 1: completely switches from being this carefree, jokey character to one

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Speaker 1: of the best races that Formula one has in its field.

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Speaker 1: He's just superb as a person and as a racing driver.

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Speaker 1: Because of the show, how do you think it's affected

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Speaker 1: Formula One as an actual racing product. Do you notice

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Speaker 1: more excitement and more fan investment? Have you been recognized more? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've been recognized loads. The real noticeable difference was in

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Speaker 1: in Austin, Texas last year, because there's one way in

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Speaker 1: and one way out through a tunnel and you exit

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Speaker 1: out of this tunnel up the hill and there's a

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Speaker 1: little pathway on either side, and you know, normally you

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Speaker 1: you'd walk out or you drive out. If you were

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Speaker 1: a driver or a team bus every night and there's

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Speaker 1: you know, there's no one there in you couldn't move.

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Speaker 1: It was rammed with people wanting photographs, wanting autographs with everyone,

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Speaker 1: with engineers and mechanics, with journalists, with you know, with

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Speaker 1: the drivers, with team bosses. It's like being at a

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Speaker 1: rock concert now that that never existed before, so that

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Speaker 1: that's very, very noticeable for a lot of people. It's

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Speaker 1: made them perhaps slightly more wary about the conversations they

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Speaker 1: have in the paddock when there's a boom miclooming um,

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Speaker 1: because mic exactly every Mike's life. So yeah, a couple

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Speaker 1: of the things that got caught. It's a bit of

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Speaker 1: a soap opera. There are obviously elements of it which

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Speaker 1: are slightly stretched, but I think that that just helps

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Speaker 1: to draw people in and to create that real kind

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Speaker 1: of passion for the for the characters as well. And

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Speaker 1: you know, part of that is creating heroes and villains.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought up the heroes and the villains

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Speaker 1: component for listeners who haven't yet caught on. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to discuss Lewis Hamilton's who's a seven time Formula one

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Speaker 1: World champ, he's a celebrity as a philanthropist. I believe

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Speaker 1: he was did he was the fourth driver to be knighted.

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Speaker 1: Where he is now, Sir Lewis Hamilton's Sir Lewis Hamilton's

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Speaker 1: I love when people are united. It's fascinating to me.

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Speaker 1: He's also the only black driver on the circuit. Explain

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Speaker 1: to people how important he's been in growing the sport.

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Speaker 1: Lewis's influence on Formula one's global recognition but also the

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Speaker 1: way in which the sport conducts itself. It can't be overstated.

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Speaker 1: He's changed everything. Part of that is through the way

429
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 1: in which he races. He is one of the single

430
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:35,280
Speaker 1: most gifted athletes of sport has ever seen. He only

431
00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 1: needs to get that eighth World championship to be one

432
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: higher than Michael Schumacher and then inarguably from a statistical perspective,

433
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,520
Speaker 1: of the greatest of all time. But as you say,

434
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:46,600
Speaker 1: he's become so much more than that over the last

435
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:51,280
Speaker 1: few years, pushing the causes that he believes in, whether

436
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:55,200
Speaker 1: it's to do with race relations and inequality. When you

437
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: do have their success, what are you gonna do with it?

438
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:01,479
Speaker 1: I'll be down if I'm going to win all these

439
00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 1: championships and have all the success and not use it

440
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,440
Speaker 1: to make change. It's an odd world, it's an odd sport.

441
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 1: It's it's very elitist, it's very white European sport. And

442
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 1: I think Lewis had always felt slightly on the periphery

443
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: and never quite accepted because he doesn't fit that traditional

444
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,600
Speaker 1: Formula one mold. And here he was not trying to

445
00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 1: fit that mold anymore but actually changing the sport, changing

446
00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 1: the conversation within the sport to the things that really

447
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 1: mattered to him. And I think it's huge. Alright, So

448
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 1: we have Sir Lewis Hamilton's but he's not the only

449
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: outsize character here, right, tell us about Max for stabbing?

450
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: Oh boy, where do you start? Maxah? So, Max, for

451
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,640
Speaker 1: those that don't know, is one of the youngest Formula

452
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,920
Speaker 1: one World champions in history. He's in his early twenties,

453
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:59,720
Speaker 1: twenty four years of age, just crowned World champion. We

454
00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:02,400
Speaker 1: have Chip can only be one by one and it's

455
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:06,679
Speaker 1: goting toutch It's twenty twenty one. Max must happen for

456
00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:17,919
Speaker 1: the first time ever. It's Champion of the World. Broke

457
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:22,360
Speaker 1: Lewis Hamilton and Mercedes run of consecutive drivers world championships

458
00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:24,640
Speaker 1: in the turbo hybrid era, which has been in place

459
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,440
Speaker 1: for the last five six seasons. The only driver other

460
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:31,399
Speaker 1: than a Mercedes driver to win that world championship. Oh

461
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:38,959
Speaker 1: my good God, would be so like a champion all

462
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 1: the year. You deserve that. He absolutely love you. He

463
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 1: was a carting prodigy, born to a father who was

464
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:52,960
Speaker 1: an ex F one driver, a mother who was a

465
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 1: carting champion. You know, motor racing was in his blood.

466
00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:59,119
Speaker 1: He was always going to gravitate towards it, or at

467
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 1: least ask to try it out. And it turned out

468
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 1: he was pretty good, so good that when he graduated

469
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 1: from go karts into open wheel racing, this puny, little

470
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:13,680
Speaker 1: sort of fifteen year old teenage kid, he just turned

471
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,960
Speaker 1: up and obliterated everybody. He became the youngest driver to

472
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: win a race in history, and now in one he's

473
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 1: a world champion. He is an aggressive, elbows out, take

474
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:28,400
Speaker 1: no prisoners kind of racing driver, and some people love

475
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 1: him for that, some people hate him for that. But

476
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: he has energized an entire generation of Formula One fans

477
00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:42,120
Speaker 1: well specifically with Lewis and Max, and that rivalry. How

478
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,120
Speaker 1: is that elevating the sport? We all love a rivalry.

479
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:50,000
Speaker 1: Formula One was built on great rivalries, and I think,

480
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: you know, we we we've got a fantastic one for

481
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 1: the ages right now because it's two generations and it's

482
00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,640
Speaker 1: not so much the bat on being handed over as

483
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 1: the next generation trying to wrench ship out of Lewis

484
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:06,600
Speaker 1: Hamilton's grip. And that's been wonderful. You know, you have

485
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: these periods of domination by a certain team. We had

486
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 1: it in the two thousands with Ferrari, where you know,

487
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: Schumacher couldn't be beaten. We've had it over the last

488
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 1: few years with Mercedes that couldn't be beaten. And now

489
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,359
Speaker 1: were one. We had a situation where Red Bullet delivered

490
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,159
Speaker 1: a car, Mercedes have delivered a car which was pretty equal.

491
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,480
Speaker 1: Max and Lewis going wheel to wheel and for the

492
00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:34,359
Speaker 1: first time really Lewis having to fight for a world championship,

493
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: not against a teammate, but against somebody in different equipment.

494
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:44,360
Speaker 1: And what was wonderful, I think in was seeing them

495
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 1: both try to work each other out. Silverston is a

496
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: prime example where they famously came together and Max Verstappen

497
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 1: ended up in the barriers. How much it's gonna try again,

498
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: this time on the inside. The best out of the

499
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: race of that bag crash, its cost Louis Hamilton and

500
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 1: Max for Staven coming together. Hamilton continues on for the

501
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 1: second time this season, Hamilton's and for Stappen clash and

502
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:13,920
Speaker 1: tangle on the opening lab, but this time it is

503
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: ending in dramatic consequences from the championship leader. For me,

504
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: in that moment, Lewis knew precisely what he was doing.

505
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 1: He could have taken the corner normally, but he didn't.

506
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: He pretty much left his car in the middle of

507
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:30,280
Speaker 1: the track and he gave the Stepping a choice which

508
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: was you can either back out of this or we're

509
00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: going to touch. And Max didn't back out, and at

510
00:29:37,040 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 1: that point Lewis knew here was a guy that isn't

511
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 1: going to back out. It happened again in Italy again

512
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: it's will to will Hambilton at this time for Steppord

513
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 1: and Hamilton that crash chant and they are both out.

514
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: It happened in Brazil, but he is false wife father

515
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:58,560
Speaker 1: Stepping have a step in himself, has to go off

516
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: the track for Stappord fast and so wide he had

517
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 1: to leave the track itself. And watching these two guys

518
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: wheel to wheel at two D kind of play chicken

519
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 1: with one another and try to work each other out

520
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 1: and be the last one to blink was just it

521
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 1: was exhilarating. Is so thrilling, and so as we come

522
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 1: to they'll both be so much more aware of one

523
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 1: another and the levels that each one is willing to

524
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 1: push in order to win. I wanted to talk to

525
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:40,040
Speaker 1: you about something that's omnipresent in the sport and the

526
00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:43,600
Speaker 1: show and as universal for everybody, and it's always sort

527
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 1: of lingering there in the background, and that is the danger. Yeah,

528
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 1: when they get into a two D mile, now I

529
00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: can't this and almost fighter pilot mentality, I can think

530
00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:03,479
Speaker 1: it happen. I thing on my family. All I do

531
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 1: is pry for a sci Fi rice. You need to

532
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,560
Speaker 1: respect to speed, but the second the driver has fear,

533
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 1: you need to retire. And you obviously have to have

534
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: nerves of steel to drive Formula one. And I am

535
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,080
Speaker 1: quite certain they have considered their own mortality, and yet

536
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: they have to put that in the back of their

537
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:25,959
Speaker 1: minds every time they climb into the car. There's a

538
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 1: well worn phrase that you will never find a more

539
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,160
Speaker 1: singularly unimaginative human being on earth and a racing driver,

540
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:36,440
Speaker 1: because if they if they spend all their time imagining

541
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 1: the myriads of implications of what could go wrong, they

542
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 1: would never get into a racing car. That's why sensible

543
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,560
Speaker 1: people don't. Yeah, of course they're aware of it. You know,

544
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 1: they've all been in big smashes. Some will have been injured,

545
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 1: others won't have been, but they will all have had

546
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: friends that have been and many of them raced alongside,

547
00:31:55,800 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 1: and many of them knew very well jul Biyankee, who

548
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: was the last form of the one driver to be

549
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 1: to be killed in a race, and that really wasn't

550
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 1: so long ago, who was a lovely kid and and

551
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:11,640
Speaker 1: really was seen as the shining staff of Ferrari, their

552
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:16,600
Speaker 1: future world champion. Charlett Clerk, who now leads Ferrari's charge,

553
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: was his godson. Well here he is now race winner,

554
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 1: you know, the number one guy at Ferrari. And yeah,

555
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: it's it's it's it's a lovely but ultimately very tragic

556
00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: kind of full circle story. Yeah, it really is. We

557
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 1: saw with Romane Grosjean in in Bahrain, and I'm sure everybody,

558
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:35,120
Speaker 1: whether you whether you like Formula one or not, will

559
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 1: have seen the footage from Bahrain and that fireball and

560
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 1: Roman climbing out of it. Not only has he survived

561
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:46,760
Speaker 1: going through a barrier a hundred and sixty miles an

562
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: hour with within a ball of fire, that the heat

563
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 1: must have been so extreme it was a miracle. It

564
00:32:54,360 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 1: was absolutely a miracle. I want to talk to you

565
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: about that because Season three, episode nine is literally called

566
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 1: Man on Fire and you bring up Romain Grosjean and

567
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 1: it's just the spectacular crash will and you're in that episode.

568
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 1: There are certain moments where silence falls on a racing

569
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:26,160
Speaker 1: track and you know what that means. It's funny. I

570
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:28,400
Speaker 1: caught a lot of flak on social media for that line.

571
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:32,800
Speaker 1: Why they thought it was overly emotional or like a

572
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: planted line or something like that. It was. It just

573
00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 1: came out of the interview that we were doing. It

574
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 1: is a truism. There are only a few times where silent, well,

575
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,280
Speaker 1: pretty much one time when when silence does fall on

576
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,719
Speaker 1: a racetrack, and that's when something absolutely horrible has happened.

577
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,440
Speaker 1: And if you've ever been at a racetrack where something

578
00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 1: truly ghastly happens, you will know what that silence sounds

579
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 1: like and what it feels like, and it's it's just

580
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,120
Speaker 1: it's just gut wrenching because at the time where you

581
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 1: should be hearing the you know, the screaming of the

582
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 1: cars and the engine, note, there's nothing. It's just a

583
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:12,880
Speaker 1: complete void of emptiness. And Roman admitted that he he

584
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 1: did I think that was it. He didn't think that

585
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:19,320
Speaker 1: his his number had been called, but then somehow found

586
00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 1: the strength to pull himself out and saying, you know, no,

587
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,279
Speaker 1: not not today. And the big scary thing with that

588
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:28,600
Speaker 1: was it was fire. And you you don't see fire,

589
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: certainly not in Formula one because there's no refueling anymore.

590
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 1: And to see the fire was something you don't you

591
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: haven't seen since the nies seventies. So it was it

592
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:43,520
Speaker 1: was very, very scary, but a testament. A lot of

593
00:34:43,560 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 1: people say it was lucky. Yes, luck played a part

594
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:47,799
Speaker 1: in it in terms of, you know, the angle that

595
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 1: he went in and the speed and everything else. But

596
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:53,920
Speaker 1: it's also the testament to the incredible amount of work

597
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: that's been done on safety in the sport that his

598
00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 1: overalls allowed him to be in those flames for as

599
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: long as he was. That the halo, which had been

600
00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,200
Speaker 1: fitted to the car, which is that sort of appendage

601
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 1: that goes around the driver's head, meant that when he

602
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:15,279
Speaker 1: went through that metal barrier, he wasn't decapitated, because you know,

603
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 1: four years ago he would have been. That's the simplicity

604
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 1: of it, and that just shows how far we've come

605
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: even in this short space of time. Roman got out

606
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,839
Speaker 1: of that crash and then went to the States where

607
00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:31,640
Speaker 1: he's had the most incredible season in Indy Car on

608
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 1: the podium, a huge success. The fans of door him.

609
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: He's sort of taken on this the Phoenix Monica, and

610
00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 1: you know, he's really embraced the fact that he that

611
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 1: he came through that fire. Roman is the toast of

612
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 1: Indy Car and doing so so phenomenally well. The new

613
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:50,400
Speaker 1: season is coming up. You're preparing to give your passport

614
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 1: to work out. What are you excited about? What kind

615
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 1: of things should we expect, which drivers should we be

616
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:01,359
Speaker 1: focused on? Give us a little provod Man, Honestly, I'm

617
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 1: excited about so much. It's me. I'm usually excited about

618
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 1: pretty much everything. I first, first, of all, the new

619
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:08,879
Speaker 1: season of Drives to Survive coming out is gonna be great.

620
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:11,000
Speaker 1: I think it's March the eleventh that it hits Netflix.

621
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:13,240
Speaker 1: I've not seen it yet, so I have no idea.

622
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,840
Speaker 1: What on earth I said. Over the last year, you

623
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 1: have all these wonderful stories and all these incredible drivers.

624
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 1: It's that wonderful period and we haven't had it for

625
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:26,279
Speaker 1: a long time where I can sit here, hand on

626
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 1: heart and say I have no idea what this future

627
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:33,919
Speaker 1: holds because everything's new. So it's it's a really great

628
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 1: place to be. Well, so there are two races in

629
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,720
Speaker 1: the States this year, Austin and Miami. And you mentioned

630
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: the celebrity and the pup and the pageantry that happened

631
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,320
Speaker 1: in Austin, But what do you expect from the races

632
00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 1: in the States. Miami I think is going to be spectacular.

633
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 1: I've seen some of the plans that they have for

634
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 1: the race, and genuinely and not kind of overblowing this,

635
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,200
Speaker 1: I think it could change the game in terms of

636
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 1: what people expect from a a fan experience at a

637
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: Grand Prix. It looks, honestly, it's gonna blow people away.

638
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 1: It just looks sensational, um, So, I'm really excited, really

639
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:15,520
Speaker 1: really excited about Miami, and it just shows that, you know,

640
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,399
Speaker 1: the further growth of the sport in the States. There's

641
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:20,359
Speaker 1: so much talk already about there being a third race

642
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 1: in the States. You know that it's been talked for

643
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 1: years about about getting a race back to Vegas, which

644
00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,520
Speaker 1: would just be cool. So, you know, and honestly, I

645
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 1: think Miami is going to be I think it's going

646
00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 1: to be sensational, and I think it's going to really

647
00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 1: take a lot of people by surprise how big an

648
00:37:34,920 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: event it is. You are clearly excited. You have now

649
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 1: gotten me excited about it. It is an exciting time

650
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:44,719
Speaker 1: for the sport and for the show. We started at

651
00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:47,200
Speaker 1: the beginning, now we have reached the end. Well, Buxton,

652
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:51,160
Speaker 1: this was a podium worthy interview. Thank you, thank you.

653
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 1: After a break, NFL Network reporter Mike garret Follow explains

654
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 1: the fallout after Falcon's wide receiver Calvin Ridley got suspended

655
00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:18,640
Speaker 1: for gambling on football. He's a breaking news reporter for

656
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 1: the NFL Network who has been all over one of

657
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 1: the biggest stories in the league. Mike garret Follow, Welcome

658
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:27,399
Speaker 1: to Sports Illustrated Weekly. Thank you, buddy, appreciate you having

659
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: me ready to go. Thank you for doing this. Um

660
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:32,120
Speaker 1: So Falcon's wide receiver Calvin Ridley was suspended by the

661
00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:35,279
Speaker 1: league for the entire upcoming season. At least he can

662
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:39,080
Speaker 1: apply for reinstatement after the Super Bowl. In three he

663
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 1: got dollars on parlays, which relative to what he lost,

664
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 1: does not sound like a lot, but the league found

665
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,479
Speaker 1: out and suspended him. Mike put in perspective how big

666
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 1: a story this is and how big a deal it

667
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,799
Speaker 1: is for the league. Well, it's huge because you know,

668
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 1: I know people were quick to say, Oh, it's the

669
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,839
Speaker 1: league that's partnered with all these gambling companies, and it's

670
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,359
Speaker 1: okay to promote gambling and for them to make money

671
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: off of but the it's not okay for the players,

672
00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 1: which I get to a certain degree, But I also

673
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 1: signed the same contract with the same language and the

674
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 1: same I mean, we're not allowed, as reporters who are

675
00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:16,840
Speaker 1: employed by the NFL network and thereby employed by the NFL,

676
00:39:16,920 --> 00:39:21,080
Speaker 1: to gamble on more than just the NFL. So it's

677
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 1: a what you signed up for. And I understand the

678
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:26,279
Speaker 1: integrity of the game. I mean, I understand why it

679
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 1: goes to a time before many of us were even

680
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:33,840
Speaker 1: watching the league or even alive, and something that they

681
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:35,880
Speaker 1: wanted to maintain the whole way, and something that they

682
00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 1: made clear when they made these partnerships said they're going

683
00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:42,360
Speaker 1: to have the resources of those partners at their disposal

684
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:45,320
Speaker 1: to make sure that the integrity of the game is

685
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:48,960
Speaker 1: upheld and that nobody is, whether it's player or coach,

686
00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:54,239
Speaker 1: or executive or reporter, is gambling on league stuff. So, yeah,

687
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:58,120
Speaker 1: it's huge for the league. It's huge for everything that

688
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 1: they've stood for for a number of years. I do

689
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:03,920
Speaker 1: understand where people are coming from defending Calvin Ridley and saying, hey,

690
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:05,759
Speaker 1: what's the big deal? But I also understand where the

691
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:08,520
Speaker 1: league is coming from saying that they've got to uphold

692
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:10,800
Speaker 1: what is very important to them, and that's the integrity

693
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:13,840
Speaker 1: of the game. Yeah, there's a fine line here for sure, because,

694
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:17,200
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, not just the NFL leagues, all kinds

695
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 1: of sports leagues are partnering with gambling concerns now. But

696
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 1: on the other hand, having players, coaches, executives gambling on

697
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 1: sports or in your case, reporters, that's something that's a

698
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: little bit different. You reported that Calvin Ridley bet on

699
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 1: his team, and for people of our age or older. Immediately,

700
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 1: my first thought was Pete Rose, who was banned from

701
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:38,960
Speaker 1: baseball for life for betting on the Reds. And I

702
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:41,839
Speaker 1: know it's a different time and a different era now,

703
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 1: but it seems like a really fine line for the NFL,

704
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:47,359
Speaker 1: right because on the one hand, you have, Hey, we

705
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:49,839
Speaker 1: want fans or at least you're free to gamble if

706
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:53,280
Speaker 1: you're a fan on these games. But for us personally,

707
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:57,240
Speaker 1: anybody who's even tangentially or officially associated with the NFL,

708
00:40:57,560 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 1: we've got to make sure that that's separate. Yeah, I mean,

709
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,719
Speaker 1: it's it goes beyond that, right, Like if I'm on

710
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:06,480
Speaker 1: business with the NFL. If I'm sent somewhere on business

711
00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:09,720
Speaker 1: pertaining to the NFL network, I can't even set foot

712
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 1: in a casino to play, right. Yeah, yeah, no, that's

713
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 1: part of the deal, because if you're on business, this

714
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:18,640
Speaker 1: is the logic. If you're own business and you lose.

715
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:20,799
Speaker 1: Let's say I lose a ton of money and now

716
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:22,600
Speaker 1: I gotta get myself out of this hole. What's the

717
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 1: quickest and easiest way for you to do that. Hey,

718
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:26,960
Speaker 1: I've got some information on this event that I'm covering,

719
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 1: whether it's a game or one of their what they

720
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,279
Speaker 1: call tent pole events. This is the way I can

721
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 1: pay my debt back, whether you give me money straight

722
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 1: for this, or you forgive my gambling debt whoever it is.

723
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,240
Speaker 1: You know, specifically, if you borrow money off of somebody

724
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:41,920
Speaker 1: or the casino itself, whatever, that's their logic. And for

725
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 1: a guy to be betting on his own team, certainly

726
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:48,759
Speaker 1: betting against them, I think would be worse to bet

727
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 1: on his own team. It's the use of that information,

728
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 1: which they did say in this case, there was no

729
00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:56,839
Speaker 1: indication there was any inside information, which I will say

730
00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: this backing up a second, he was kind of on

731
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:02,399
Speaker 1: his own. He was going through his own stuff. There

732
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,719
Speaker 1: were legit mental issues at play. I do know that

733
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,439
Speaker 1: a lot of his teammates at some point in time

734
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 1: were like, we have no idea what's going on with

735
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:12,320
Speaker 1: this guy. So the notion that he could have been

736
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 1: out of communication with his teammates for at least a

737
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 1: couple of days is not that far fetched. But certainly

738
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 1: he had a beat for what was going on there.

739
00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 1: But uh, their thing was no inside information and no influence,

740
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:27,279
Speaker 1: no like hey, and again influences more. I would think

741
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:29,840
Speaker 1: betting against the team, like, hey, do me a favorite

742
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 1: drop a couple of passes because I bet on the

743
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 1: other team here. And listen the fact that his defense

744
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:37,160
Speaker 1: was I only bet hundred, which he could have bet

745
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:39,080
Speaker 1: one dollar and it would have been enough. But I

746
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 1: do understand what his defense was about, which was, hey,

747
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,200
Speaker 1: I bet It's not like it was life or death

748
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 1: for me. And I like, hey, you absolutely got to

749
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:49,920
Speaker 1: take a dive here. So I get where he was

750
00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:51,920
Speaker 1: coming from. And again, he bet on them, not against him.

751
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,879
Speaker 1: But it's just something that they clearly want to stay

752
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:59,919
Speaker 1: away from, particularly now because because they have those partnerships. Yes,

753
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 1: So about that, How the NFL found out here is key,

754
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: and you did some really excellent reporting on this. Explained

755
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: to listeners how it is that the NFL discovered that

756
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 1: Ridley bet on football, because, as you said, they're monitoring

757
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 1: to make sure exact coaches and players and broadcasters aren't gambling. Yeah,

758
00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:22,360
Speaker 1: I mean it's the hard Rock is the app because

759
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 1: he was in Florida and the hard Rock I think

760
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,840
Speaker 1: noticed some activity and I guess that's basically just traced

761
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:33,040
Speaker 1: back to his name was Calvin Ridley I mean, sounds

762
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:35,040
Speaker 1: like he had it under his name on his phone.

763
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:39,319
Speaker 1: At that point, they notified the NFL's partner in this one,

764
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: which is Genius Sports Group. Now, Genius Sports Group is

765
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,360
Speaker 1: not a gambling site. It is a service that the

766
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 1: NFL has used to be its official data distributor when

767
00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 1: it comes to media companies and sports gambling sites. So

768
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: the hard Rock notified Genius Sports Group, which was able

769
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 1: to corroborate the information and let the NFL know. At

770
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: that point they begun an investigation. Sounds like Ridley just

771
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,359
Speaker 1: flat out cop to making the bets, which he did

772
00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:08,839
Speaker 1: again on Twitter after after the story broke, and then

773
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:12,319
Speaker 1: uh Levy this suspension, which again I mean, I saw

774
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 1: some folks, including Joe Banner say that he's surprised it

775
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,359
Speaker 1: was only a year that it could have and should

776
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 1: have been worse. Again, that's a lot of the traditionalist

777
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:24,240
Speaker 1: because I know a lot of the modern thinking folks.

778
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:26,200
Speaker 1: I mean, when I tweeted out that he placed bets

779
00:44:26,239 --> 00:44:28,359
Speaker 1: on his phone, I got a bunch of people saying, Hey,

780
00:44:28,360 --> 00:44:30,040
Speaker 1: he's just like us, you know. I get I get

781
00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:33,680
Speaker 1: that I do, but I also know that there are

782
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:35,920
Speaker 1: certain things that you agree to when you sign a

783
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:41,160
Speaker 1: contract and there are conflicts of interests in many areas

784
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 1: of life. Lawyers will talk to you about conflicts of

785
00:44:44,200 --> 00:44:48,320
Speaker 1: interests and agents in the business and team types sometimes

786
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 1: conflicts of interest. You know, there there are conflicts of

787
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:53,359
Speaker 1: interest that you agree to. You might sit there and say, well,

788
00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:54,960
Speaker 1: it's silly that Joe Blow can make a bet, but

789
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: Calvin Ridley camp. But that's kind of what you sign

790
00:44:57,200 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 1: up for and that's what you agree to. Uh. And

791
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 1: the NFL wanted to make sure that it was clear

792
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 1: to everybody. And I do remember this because I was

793
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,000
Speaker 1: on the day that the NFL announced I think was

794
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 1: Caesar's or one of their partners that they really announced,

795
00:45:08,560 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: and it was a topic on Total Access and I

796
00:45:10,719 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 1: remember talking about it on the air. I said, they're

797
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 1: making these partnerships, but they made it clear they're also

798
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,839
Speaker 1: gonna work with these companies to ensure that the integrity

799
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:22,200
Speaker 1: of the game is of the utmost importance and they

800
00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:25,839
Speaker 1: will have cooperation and information at their disposal. And that's

801
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:27,840
Speaker 1: how it happened, and that's how Calvin Ridley was pinched

802
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 1: on this one. Yeah, And so the integrity of the

803
00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:33,000
Speaker 1: game thing, I get Mike But on the other hand,

804
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:36,160
Speaker 1: if I'm Calvin Ridley and you mentioned his his Twitter reaction,

805
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 1: he said, you know, I don't have a gambling problem.

806
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,560
Speaker 1: I've got a total of fifteen hundred dollars. And as

807
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 1: a result of that one hundred dollars, he lost what

808
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,080
Speaker 1: north of ten million dollars, almost eleven million dollars, right,

809
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,480
Speaker 1: And so that's a big thing to exchange. And as

810
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 1: you mentioned, the NFL statement says in their investigation quote

811
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: uncovered no evidence indicating any inside information was used or

812
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 1: that any game was compromised in any way. So if

813
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 1: that is the case that he wasn't you know, some

814
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:06,080
Speaker 1: inside sharp gambling a ton of money with with all this,

815
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 1: you know, inside or knowledge. If it wasn't that, if

816
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:10,479
Speaker 1: it was just a couple of one off bets here,

817
00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 1: is it just that the league is making an example

818
00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 1: of him? Is that what this is? No? Well, yeah,

819
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 1: I mean in certain ways, yeah, I do know that

820
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,600
Speaker 1: they don't want to go an inch in that direction,

821
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:24,400
Speaker 1: because what happens when somebody tries to take a yard.

822
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:27,840
Speaker 1: I will say this, I mean, if it was inside

823
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 1: information betting against this team, or some kind of influence,

824
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 1: it's probably a lifetime ban. So for folks to say

825
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 1: it probably should have been worse, it could have been

826
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:41,520
Speaker 1: worse had the circumstances been worse. So now to explain

827
00:46:41,600 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 1: folks how it works, his contract tolls basically, so the

828
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: eleven million dollars he was supposed to make this upcoming

829
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: season gets pushed back one more year, and so when

830
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:52,760
Speaker 1: he comes back, his contract resumes where it left off. Now,

831
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,239
Speaker 1: in the end, that's a year off his career that

832
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 1: he's not going to get back. So in a sense, yeah,

833
00:46:57,719 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 1: he sort of lost a million. I mean, you could

834
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: slice he lost money. There's no question he lost a

835
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,719
Speaker 1: significant amount of money. There's no doubt about that. And

836
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 1: this is a guy who and this cannot be ignored,

837
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: came into this offseason with questions, came into this offseason

838
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 1: as a guy that we were looking at that was

839
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 1: going to potentially relocate because he's going through mental health issues,

840
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 1: which are legit. I mean, that was a part of

841
00:47:19,160 --> 00:47:21,680
Speaker 1: this thing. But I've heard so many things. And one

842
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:23,840
Speaker 1: of the things that I was told when I was reporting,

843
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:26,080
Speaker 1: like Calvin Ridley back in January, and I said, this

844
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 1: guy could be up for a fresh start somewhere is

845
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:31,960
Speaker 1: somebody said to me, look, this guy's got vices. And

846
00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:34,439
Speaker 1: I didn't mention that on the air because I thought

847
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,080
Speaker 1: that that was kind of you needed a little more there,

848
00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:38,960
Speaker 1: and you need you needed to definitely have that all

849
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 1: the way. But now that we've put one on display,

850
00:47:41,640 --> 00:47:43,320
Speaker 1: and I know he said he doesn't have a gambling problem.

851
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 1: But this is a guy who, hey, I was away

852
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 1: from football and felt like in some form or fashion

853
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:49,359
Speaker 1: he needed to be back in it, and that's why

854
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 1: he placed the bets. I mean, I don't know have

855
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 1: the full psychological breakdown, but I'm sure that that was

856
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,640
Speaker 1: part of it. It's a guy who had questions and

857
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,879
Speaker 1: had red flags and had situations that even the foul

858
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,040
Speaker 1: and acknowledged publicly. Coming into this offseason, you had this

859
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 1: on top of that. I had somebody say to you know,

860
00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:08,879
Speaker 1: he's never gonna play again. I don't believe that at all.

861
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:11,399
Speaker 1: I really don't. He's got too much talent. He's gonna

862
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:13,800
Speaker 1: have some time away to maybe deal with whatever issues

863
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:16,399
Speaker 1: he's got going on beyond this gambling thing. I think

864
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:18,040
Speaker 1: he can come back, and he can come back strong.

865
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:19,440
Speaker 1: I think he could be a good player. He has

866
00:48:19,440 --> 00:48:21,480
Speaker 1: been in this league. For quite some time. So I'm

867
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:23,480
Speaker 1: not gonna say he's never gonna play again, but certainly

868
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 1: his future has been affected here. I mean, it's such

869
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,360
Speaker 1: a bombshell story, Mike, Like, even for a league like

870
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 1: the NFL, where there's always a bombshell story one after

871
00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:36,280
Speaker 1: the next, you're just plugged in as anybody, Like, what's

872
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:39,239
Speaker 1: the feeling behind the scenes across the league? I mean,

873
00:48:39,239 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 1: I'm sure that you were talking to a lot of

874
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:43,800
Speaker 1: people today like what's the overarching takeaway here from people

875
00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 1: behind the scenes. Yeah, it's um. I do know that

876
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 1: I've spoken to agents who said they made sure they

877
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,400
Speaker 1: rounded up all their clients and said, don't be stupid,

878
00:48:53,400 --> 00:48:56,880
Speaker 1: basically like you know, it's it's not worth it. Even

879
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:59,480
Speaker 1: Calvin was laying, like you said, the first guy in

880
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:02,840
Speaker 1: history and lose eleven million. So I know there's a

881
00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:04,960
Speaker 1: lot of that going on. I'm sure there's gonna be

882
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:07,200
Speaker 1: a lot of that with teams towards the players right now.

883
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 1: They're really not supposed to be in communications, so maybe

884
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:12,680
Speaker 1: this is more of a training camp or spring excuse me,

885
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:14,560
Speaker 1: O t A S. When they get back to work,

886
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 1: Hey guys, f y I. And it doesn't even have

887
00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:19,800
Speaker 1: to be just NFL. I mean, you could be gambling

888
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:22,200
Speaker 1: on anything. Now. Listen. They can go to the Kentucky

889
00:49:22,239 --> 00:49:24,800
Speaker 1: Derby in the offseason, they can go to the casino

890
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:27,120
Speaker 1: in the off season. They're allowed to do all that stuff.

891
00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:30,160
Speaker 1: But if they catch you gambling on sports or or

892
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 1: football in particularly, let's say some guys want to lay

893
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: some bets in the NFL draft coming up, that's not

894
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:39,319
Speaker 1: gonna fly. So um, there'll be some reminders as we

895
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:42,080
Speaker 1: go on here from the NFL, or excuse me, from

896
00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:44,839
Speaker 1: teams towards the players, and from agents certainly toward their

897
00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:48,240
Speaker 1: own clients. Man, what a wild story you did. Excellent

898
00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 1: work on it. You can find him breaking news all

899
00:49:50,640 --> 00:49:52,920
Speaker 1: the time. Really, he's doing something right now, probably on

900
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:55,360
Speaker 1: the NFL network. Mike Gara follow Thank you for this,

901
00:49:55,880 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 1: Thank you, brother, I appreciate it. Sports Illustrated Weekly is

902
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:09,640
Speaker 1: a production of Sports Illustrated and I Heart Radio. For

903
00:50:09,760 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 1: more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart

904
00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:16,720
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.

905
00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 1: And for more of Sports Illustrated It's best stories and podcasts,

906
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:24,520
Speaker 1: visit SI dot com. This episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly

907
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:28,399
Speaker 1: was produced by Cooper McKim, Jessica your Moski and Isaac Lee,

908
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:32,040
Speaker 1: who was also our sound engineer. Our senior producer is

909
00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 1: Dan Bloom. Our executive producers are Scott Brody and me

910
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:40,439
Speaker 1: John Gonzalez. Our theme song is by Nolan Schneider. Thanks

911
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:43,160
Speaker 1: for listening and if you've stuck around this song, we

912
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 1: leave you with this. Remember Seulan wiking around the office

913
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 1: is in London, being hugely excited and he was just like, well,

914
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:56,400
Speaker 1: my man, you gotta be in it, and I was

915
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:57,680
Speaker 1: just like, okay, cool,