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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Smansa and welcome to stuff

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Speaker 1: I've never told you a prediction of iHeartRadio. And welcome

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Speaker 1: to another edition a Feminist around the World. And yes,

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Speaker 1: I'm taking over your segment again, Samantha.

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Speaker 2: I dare you, Yes, so I dare I.

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Speaker 1: Dare I do want to put a timestamp on this

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Speaker 1: one because it's changing a lot. Today is January tenth,

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. Happy belated birthday to my friend Marissa.

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Speaker 3: If you're listening, Happy belated birthday Marissa.

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Speaker 2: Yeap yesterday yesterday.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, this one is a bit of a follow

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Speaker 1: up I mentioned recently. It's a bit of a follow

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Speaker 1: up on the episode we did my last takeover of

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Speaker 1: the segment on Nia da Costa and the Marvels. So

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Speaker 1: today we are talking about the director of the next

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Speaker 1: Star Wars movie that is going to focus on Daisy

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Speaker 1: Ridley's character Ray and her Jedi Order. It's supposed to

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Speaker 1: take place fifteen years after the Rise of Skywalker. It's

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Speaker 1: set to come out sometime in twenty twenty six. But

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Speaker 1: this director is Charmine Obeyed Hinoi. She has said she

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Speaker 1: loves heroes, she loves the lived in esthetic, of the

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Speaker 1: original trilogy and things like Andora. That's part of why

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Speaker 1: she was hired. She is the first woman and Pakistani

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Speaker 1: American to direct a Star Wars movie. So quickly, there's

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Speaker 1: a reason this story came into my lap, and it

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Speaker 1: was kind of comical and infuriating. So I was hanging

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Speaker 1: out with a friend of mine recently and she was

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Speaker 1: talking about how she works with this guy who is

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Speaker 1: liberal in some ways but very conservative in other ways,

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Speaker 1: and she can't quite figure him out. And one of

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Speaker 1: the examples she brought up was she said he was

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Speaker 1: talking he didn't understand her point. She was making about

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Speaker 1: like toxic fandom, women and people of color off of

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Speaker 1: social media, like all of this, and he didn't know

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Speaker 1: what she was talking about. But of course he had

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Speaker 1: a comeback and it was, well, did you hear what

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Speaker 1: this new director has said? She has said that this

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Speaker 1: new movie she's making is going to make men uncomfortable,

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Speaker 1: And I was like, huh, that doesn't sound right. I

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Speaker 1: feel like I would know about this if that was true.

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Speaker 1: And sure enough, so I have quite a story for you.

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Speaker 1: But first let us break down Charmino Bai Chanoi. She

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Speaker 1: is a Canadian Pakistani activist, journalist, documentarian, and filmmaker, perhaps

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Speaker 1: best known for her work around honor killings and asset

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Speaker 1: attacks against girls and women in her home country. She

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Speaker 1: was born in Karachi, Pakistan, in nineteen seventy eight, and

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Speaker 1: she later moved to the US, where she received a

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Speaker 1: bachelor's in economics and government from Smith College and then

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Speaker 1: two master's degrees from Stanford University and Communication and International

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Speaker 1: Policy Studies. After she graduated, she moved to Canada with

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Speaker 1: her husband, where she became a Canadian citizen, But in

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Speaker 1: two thousand and two she returned to Pakistan to make documentaries.

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Speaker 1: Her twenty twelve documentary Saving Face traced the harsh history

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Speaker 1: of acid attacks against women in Pakistan, highlighting the stories

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Speaker 1: of two survivors of these attacks and bringing to light

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Speaker 1: how prevalent they were at the time, and as part

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Speaker 1: of her work, she helped push for changes to address

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Speaker 1: these attacks. Here's the quote from screen rant. Her works

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Speaker 1: have been hugely influential, resulting in actual changes of the

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Speaker 1: law pertaining to honor killings in Pakistan. In twenty twelve,

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Speaker 1: the government of Pakistan awarded Obeyed Chenoi one of its

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Speaker 1: highest civilian honors, and time magazine recognized her as one

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Speaker 1: of its top one hundred most influential people in the world.

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Speaker 1: In twenty fifteen, she debuted documentary following the story of

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Speaker 1: Pakistani musicians on their journey to perform at Lincoln's Center

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Speaker 1: in New York called Song of Lahore, and her twenty

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Speaker 1: sixteen documentary A Girl in the River The Price of

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Speaker 1: Forgiveness followed the story of a woman who survived an

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Speaker 1: attempted honor killing, and in doing so, it shedded light

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Speaker 1: on the history of this practice in that country. All

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Speaker 1: of these were acclaimed, and she did a bunch of

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Speaker 1: other projects too. These are just a taste. Her other

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Speaker 1: works have looked into issues such as child abuse, gun violence, police,

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Speaker 1: women's soldiers, education, the trans experience in Pakistan, and scarcity.

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Speaker 1: And she has done children's series one including one that's

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Speaker 1: sort of like Our Female First but in Pakistan, in

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Speaker 1: an animated film called Satara Let Girls Dream That sounds

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Speaker 1: really really interesting. She also directed the twenty eighteen documentary

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Speaker 1: Student Athlete alongside Trish Dawton that was on HBO. She is,

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Speaker 1: as of January twenty twenty four, the first and only

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Speaker 1: woman director to win two Academy Awards by thirty seven

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Speaker 1: years old, and the first Pakistani winner and only one

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Speaker 1: of eleven women to win an Oscar for a non

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Speaker 1: fiction film. She's won six Emmy Awards, both at the

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Speaker 1: International Emmy Awards and News and Documentaries Awards. And that's

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Speaker 1: really just a handful of what she's won. So here's

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Speaker 1: a quick run through, but again this is not at

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Speaker 1: all complete. She was the first non US American person

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Speaker 1: to win a Livingstone Award for Young Journalist. Twenty fifteen,

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Speaker 1: she became the first Pakistani person to make a full

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Speaker 1: length computer animated movie. She was the first artist named

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Speaker 1: to co chair of the World Economic Forum in twenty seventeen.

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Speaker 1: That same year, she was awarded the Knight International Journalism

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Speaker 1: Award by the International Center for Journalist. She's also been

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Speaker 1: involved in charities. No surprise, she was key in founding

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Speaker 1: the Citizens' Archive of Pakistan in two thousand and seven,

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Speaker 1: which is an organization focused on preserving the culture and

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Speaker 1: heritage of Pakistan. Though a bulk of her work has

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Speaker 1: been in documentaries, this is not her first foray. Star

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Speaker 1: Wars will not be her first foray into Hollywood by

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Speaker 1: any means. In twenty twenty two, She directed two episodes

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Speaker 1: of the Disney Plus show Miss Marvel before seeing read

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Speaker 1: in episode five, time and time again. She was the

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Speaker 1: first Pakistani director to work with Marvel, and this did

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Speaker 1: give her a really valuable experience working with visual effects

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Speaker 1: teams who reported enjoying working with her. Cinematographer Jules Olafwin

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Speaker 1: told screen Rant, the last thing was the director. Sharmino

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Speaker 1: baie Chenoi is on paper a pretty amazing person. She's

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Speaker 1: a two time Oscar winning, seven time Any winning documentary director.

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Speaker 1: Not only that, she's very much involved in a lot

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Speaker 1: of social programs in Pakistan, highly regarded there. I did

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Speaker 1: my research, I started delving into her. I was blown away.

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Speaker 1: She sounded pretty amazing. Then I met her on a

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Speaker 1: Zoom call and we hit it off immediately. I just

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Speaker 1: thought I had to work with this woman. She just

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Speaker 1: sounds so amazing. The rest is history. I've worked with

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Speaker 1: her and I love her. She is amazing. She's everything

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Speaker 1: the Google search said she is, but so much more.

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Speaker 1: She's a really decent, wonderful human being and I loved

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Speaker 1: working with her every minute. Which, yes, if you haven't

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Speaker 1: seen that show, Miss Marvel, the host is a big

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Speaker 1: part of that show. Uh and Charmino Beijani had done

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Speaker 1: an installation called Home nineteen forty seven and twenty seventeen

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Speaker 1: all about the ten million Indian and Pakistani families displaced

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Speaker 1: by the partition, which is something that is part of

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Speaker 1: the show. Okay, so she's done a lot. Now she's

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Speaker 1: directing a Star Wars movie with a female lead, Daisy

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Speaker 1: Ridley with Ray and yes, a quote was circulating that

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Speaker 1: was going to quote make men uncomfortable. So let's break

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Speaker 1: this down. This quote is at least eight years old

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Speaker 1: and was about her film saving face about the.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't even no.

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Speaker 3: It was a dude because he's.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and it wasn't part actually a joke. She

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Speaker 1: kind of was like, oh, yeah, I like to make

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Speaker 1: men uncomfortable. And the moderator was Jon Stewart and she

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Speaker 1: immediately said to him, but not you like it was

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Speaker 1: kind of a joke, and she was talking about this

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Speaker 1: subject matter that she documented, which was very traumatic, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: should probably make you uncomfortable. And I just would like

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Speaker 1: to put a reminder here if you're mad about this

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Speaker 1: Star Wars thing, like, maybe take a second and think

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Speaker 1: about the documentary she's done, Like made me think about that.

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Speaker 1: But okay, it was eight years old quote, but everyone

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Speaker 1: was saying, oh, she hates men, she hates Star Wars.

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Speaker 1: There's like already a ton of articles and internet users

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Speaker 1: that appiled on claiming she doesn't have any experience to

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Speaker 1: be working on this movie. I would like to point

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Speaker 1: out there's a couple things I would like to point out.

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Speaker 1: One is the script is written by a man. I

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Speaker 1: do think that that's important to keep in mind because

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Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of the criticisms has gotten

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Speaker 1: as a character is that she's underdeveloped or superficial. She

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Speaker 1: was written and directed by a man, Like, I think

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Speaker 1: Daisy really did a great job. But if I feel like,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe just keep that in the back of

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Speaker 1: your head. I also kind of feel like I get

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Speaker 1: that critique, but I feel like she's in every person

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Speaker 1: character and a lot of male heroes are that character

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Speaker 1: and they don't get the same critique. And I don't

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Speaker 1: think this. I don't know this guy. I'm not saying

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Speaker 1: he's gonna do a bad job at all. I'm just saying, like,

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Speaker 1: that's something to keep in mind, and I want success,

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Speaker 1: so I'm not like I hope he veils and I

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Speaker 1: can point him, No, I want like something.

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Speaker 2: I want a good movie. And you can see.

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Speaker 1: Our book and the chapter I did on Mary Suis

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Speaker 1: for more about this whole thing with Ray's character and

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Speaker 1: a lot of the critiques she has already gotten, and

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Speaker 1: a lot of them very sexist in nature. Obey Chnoi

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Speaker 1: even as a quote about the importance of having male

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Speaker 1: champions in your life. But she did say this will

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Speaker 1: be a women centered in feminist movie. She said, quote,

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Speaker 1: it's about time we had a woman shaped Star Wars,

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Speaker 1: which got everybody really mad, and a lot of people

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Speaker 1: I feel like we're being disingenuous with their critique of

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Speaker 1: this because they were like, well, women, have you know

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Speaker 1: what about the Brackett or whatever, and like yeah, but

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Speaker 1: this is the first woman directing the Star Wars movie,

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Speaker 1: like ah, And if you type in her name and YouTube,

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Speaker 1: all the first results were like Star Wars hates men,

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Speaker 1: Go away, Star Wars is two woke, a Star Wars

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Speaker 1: movie by a man hating feminists. The new Star Wars

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Speaker 1: director really hates men. Star Wars director has ties to

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Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton without respect we reject.

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Speaker 3: I'm very specific. It was very Hillary Clinton.

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Speaker 2: The thumbnail was very funny. I must say, I thought.

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Speaker 3: Really find it hilarious that feminist is now coincided with

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Speaker 3: I don't know, stopping honored this. I mean, I guess,

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Speaker 3: I mean technically yes, yeah, but it's a bad thing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, question, trust me. I want to come back and

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Speaker 1: do a whole episode on this. I do not want

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Speaker 1: to because otherwise this episode is gonna be way too long.

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Speaker 1: But yes, I have a lot of thoughts about this.

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Speaker 1: I personally don't think Adam Driver is helping. I can't

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Speaker 1: tell if he's joking or not, but he's like, Wokeness

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Speaker 1: killed Han Solo Because every apparently everybody comes up to him,

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Speaker 1: it's like, why did you kill Han Solo?

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Speaker 2: He says, Wokeness killed Oh yeah.

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Speaker 3: That doesn't help when they misquote everything. So if they're

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Speaker 3: taking a quote that was not even reference to this movie,

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Speaker 3: and then she said it may not gonna be uncomfortable

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Speaker 3: because of what she does for this movie, which is

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Speaker 3: not true. They're going to take that quote and run

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Speaker 3: with it.

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Speaker 2: Oh, they were so happy to run with it. Oh

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Speaker 2: my gosh.

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Speaker 1: But it was really funny because when my friend said

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Speaker 1: that at the story I told at the top, I

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Speaker 1: immediately looked up, looked it up, and I was like,

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Speaker 1: that's what thought, That's exactly what I thought.

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Speaker 3: So only were you really wrong, but you're really like

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Speaker 3: telling on yourself.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and they don't know.

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Speaker 1: Either they don't know or willfully are misrepresenting it right.

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Speaker 1: And today, just today I saw a headline that they

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Speaker 1: are now they announced that the Mandalorian Grogu are getting

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Speaker 1: their own movie by Jean Favreau and Dave Filoni and

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Speaker 1: all of these same people are like good damage control.

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Speaker 1: Maybe they'll never make this movie at all, which does happen,

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Speaker 1: So it could be this movie never comes out, we'll.

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Speaker 3: See or they'll do the same thing where they ruin it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true, that's true. And we did talk about

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Speaker 1: that with the Marvels about like with a huge company

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Speaker 1: like this, sometimes like the editing is out of the

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Speaker 1: director's control. Sometimes like pieces of it are out of

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Speaker 1: your control. And Star Wars notoriously like a look at

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Speaker 1: our episodes we did on the sequel trilogy with how

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Speaker 1: literally every movie changed the story completely from the last

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Speaker 1: one because of toxic fandom and the company like caving

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Speaker 1: into it. So you can have legitimate critiques on something

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Speaker 1: Lord knows. I have very I have some critiques on

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Speaker 1: Star Wars and Marvel stuff, but again, this movie hasn't

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Speaker 1: even come out yet, so can we stop. But I

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Speaker 1: hate that so much of these criticisms are tied up

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Speaker 1: in sexism and racism and what have you, and women

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Speaker 1: and people of color are punished more for a movie

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Speaker 1: that isn't perfect, which of course it won't be again,

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Speaker 1: especially if it's this huge company like Disney. Again, your

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Speaker 1: beautiful Darling film Imparta Strikes Back, which is my favorite,

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Speaker 1: was largely financed outside the studio, so it wasn't subject

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Speaker 1: to Disney, but now it is, and there's all of

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Speaker 1: these people like, well, we can't make these people.

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Speaker 2: Man, we can't do this. We can't do this, we

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Speaker 2: can do this, can't have nice things?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I know I talked about this before, but

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Speaker 1: I hate being in anywhere near the Vinn diagram of.

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Speaker 2: Of these people.

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Speaker 1: So I feel like I have to be more outspoken

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Speaker 1: about something that maybe I don't like that much either,

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Speaker 1: but I'm like, no, oh, I'm not going to be

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Speaker 1: on your side because you're gross.

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Speaker 3: You're not wrong, but I'm definitely not taking sides with

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Speaker 3: you exactly.

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Speaker 1: And I will defend things I don't like a Star

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Speaker 1: Wars universe. I absolutely will, because sometimes you just don't

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Speaker 1: like something but other people do and that's okay.

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Speaker 2: That's okay. Sometimes I like parts of it and not

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Speaker 2: all of it, and that's okay, Like, oh okay. That's

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Speaker 2: why being a fan is. Did you find the things

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Speaker 2: you like and you let people like what they like.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 1: So it's just like I feel annoyed because obviously for

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Speaker 1: a lot of reasons, but I feel annoyed because they're

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Speaker 1: already angry about something. It hasn't come out. They were

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Speaker 1: always going to say the same thing, but now I

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Speaker 1: feel like I won't even say fans because I won't

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Speaker 1: call them that, but like they'll say they have a

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Speaker 1: legitimate critique as a disguise to hide that they're actually

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Speaker 1: just being sexist, are racist, and they were never going

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Speaker 1: to like it in the first place. They were never

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Speaker 1: going to like it, and then they get angry when

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Speaker 1: they get called out on it because they point to

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Speaker 1: other people who maybe agree.

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Speaker 2: But not for the same terrible reasons.

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Speaker 1: It's just them, like they're using you for their bullshit

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Speaker 1: to justify how they are. Like that's why I hesitate.

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Speaker 1: That's why I've been so protective of some things. I

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Speaker 1: don't even like that much because.

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Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm not gonna let you be this bad man.

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Speaker 1: I will not stand for it. It is.

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Speaker 2: And look, can I recommend fan fiction to you if

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Speaker 2: you don't like it. There's a old world. There are books,

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Speaker 2: you can read, tons of comics. There's so much out there.

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Speaker 2: You're fine.

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Speaker 1: You can have a headcanon. You keep it to yourself,

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Speaker 1: but it's beautiful.

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Speaker 2: I have fun.

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Speaker 3: It's great.

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Speaker 1: A bunch of people like me are able to do

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Speaker 1: that instead of being hateful and driving people off social media.

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Speaker 1: And I promise you we have more reason to be

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Speaker 1: angry than you do. So I'm tired of it.

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Speaker 2: And they are so emotional, and you know it.

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Speaker 1: Might actually be a good movie of this thing you

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Speaker 1: say you're a fan of, So maybe just wait and

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Speaker 1: see and be open minded about it. Just calm down,

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Speaker 1: and like, I'm somebody who get I get emotional about

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Speaker 1: fan things.

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Speaker 2: But I also know when it's like, all right, I

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Speaker 2: didn't like it wasn't for me. That's my right, that's it,

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Speaker 2: and you move on.

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Speaker 3: You don't collection if I have to watch every day.

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Speaker 2: Exactly moving on.

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Speaker 1: See see all right, well I'm looking forward to it. Yes,

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Speaker 1: and this has been like I honestly, and I feel

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Speaker 1: a little shamed about this. I didn't know all of

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Speaker 1: this stuff about obeyed Chanoi and this is amazing stuff

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Speaker 1: like some of those I think we should put in

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Speaker 1: our movies and our books, like absolutely anyway, Sorry, got

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Speaker 1: a little emotional.

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Speaker 2: I like it, but get them. I'm so annoyed by this. Well, listeners, if.

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Speaker 1: You have any thoughts about this, if you have any suggestions,

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Speaker 1: clearly I do. I'm going to go back and talk

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Speaker 1: about this war excited. You can email us any suggestions

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Speaker 1: for this segment. I didn't finish my sentence.

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Speaker 2: You can email.

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Speaker 1: Us step Media mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. You

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Speaker 1: might us on Twitter at mom stuff Podcasts, or on

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Speaker 1: Instagram and TikTok and stuff. I never told you. We

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Speaker 1: do have a book you can get wherever you get

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Speaker 1: your books. We have a t paolog store you can

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Speaker 1: get some stuff there. We need to add some more

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Speaker 1: stuff to.

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Speaker 3: That st We do think it's not about some ideas

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Speaker 3: and we haven't done anything about it.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that's that's on my New Year's list.

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Speaker 1: So all right, Well, thanks it's always to our super

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Speaker 1: produced Christine or executive producer Maya and a contributor Joey.

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Speaker 1: Thank you and thanks to you for listening. Stuff on

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Speaker 1: Ever Told You inspection by heart Radio. For more podcasts

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Speaker 1: from My Heart Radio, you can check out the heart

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Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple podcast or if you listen to your

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Speaker 1: favorite shows and one who knows w