1 00:00:01,360 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, home of the 2 00:00:05,320 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: modern white tail hunter, and now your host Mark Kenyon. Hey, everybody, 3 00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 1: welcome to Wire to Hunt episode. I'm your guest host 4 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 1: Tony Peterson, and today I'm talking to Jeremy more about 5 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:22,200 Speaker 1: tracking deer with dogs and all of the cool ways 6 00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:38,519 Speaker 1: that dogs can help you become a better hunter. Hey, everybody, 7 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: welcome to the Wire to Hunt podcast, which is brought 8 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 1: to you by First Light. You might notice that this 9 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 1: voice does not sound like Mark Kenyon. That's because I 10 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 1: am guest hosting this week, and my name is Tony Peterson. 11 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 1: I also do the Wire to Hunt Foundations podcast if 12 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 1: you want to check that out. But Mark is I believe, 13 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: he said down at a Yo Yo convention in Akron, 14 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: Ohio this week, so he needed somebody to fill in. 15 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: He called me up said can you do it? I 16 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 1: said I would be happy to buddy. So I am 17 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 1: doing this week's episode and I am interviewing a guy 18 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:11,920 Speaker 1: named Jeremy Moore. Jeremy's been on here a few times. 19 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:16,040 Speaker 1: Marks interviewed him, I've interviewed him on my podcast. He's 20 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,679 Speaker 1: he's a really knowledgeable dog trainer who also happens to 21 00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: be a really passionate bow hunter, and so Jeremy trained 22 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: shed dogs, game recovery dogs, and he bow hunts all fall, 23 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:30,000 Speaker 1: and I wanted to have him on because I have 24 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,479 Speaker 1: a little puppy at home that I'm I'm gonna train 25 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:38,520 Speaker 1: to find, hopefully find wounded deer for my family and 26 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: my friends, anybody who needs it, because now more and 27 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 1: more states are opening up, uh, the legal option to 28 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 1: go find you know, go recovery deer, recover deer with 29 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:52,520 Speaker 1: with blood trailing dogs or I should say game recovery dogs. 30 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: You'll hear why we we shouldn't say the blood tracking 31 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: thing during this episode. But Jeremy is such a good, 32 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 1: good source of information. Uh, he knows so much about this. 33 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:03,320 Speaker 1: He knows how to train them, he knows how to 34 00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:07,279 Speaker 1: tie in all of these different aspects of of deer 35 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 1: hunting and the relationship or the at least the parallels 36 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 1: between sporting dogs and deer. So we go down a 37 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: couple of rabbit holes on this one. But it's a 38 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: lot of fun. So I think you're really going to 39 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:21,359 Speaker 1: enjoy it. Are you doing, buddy? I'm doing really well. 40 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 1: How are you doing? It's good man? It seems like 41 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: every podcast I get to host, I get to see 42 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:28,680 Speaker 1: your face. So I'm loving the podcast game. Yeah, and 43 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 1: congratulations too. It's exciting to see you, you and these 44 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: guys working together, so I'm looking forward to it. It's fun, 45 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:35,880 Speaker 1: you know, other than having to work with Mark and Spencer, 46 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:38,839 Speaker 1: it's a blast. So well, I'm not going to say 47 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: that I've always had a nice relationship. Everything's one very 48 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 1: well with me and Mark, so I've always enjoyed them. 49 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 1: Now they're they're great. Uh You When when Mark said 50 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: I need some help with a couple of these episodes, yeah, 51 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,280 Speaker 1: I just thought, I'm like, I gotta I gotta see 52 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:55,919 Speaker 1: if Jeremy wants to do this, because you're you're tied 53 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:58,480 Speaker 1: into these two worlds that I love personally, which is 54 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:01,519 Speaker 1: sporting dogs and and you know, you're a hardcore white 55 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: table bow hunter. You get your family out there, you 56 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: you you hunt a lot of deer, and you've kind 57 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:09,639 Speaker 1: of mixed these worlds better than just about anyone out there. 58 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:11,839 Speaker 1: And you you do the shed dog thing that the 59 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: game recovery thing, and you're a bow hunter. And I'm like, 60 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:16,480 Speaker 1: I want to talk to Jeremy because I have a 61 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:19,680 Speaker 1: nine week old puppy at home who I fully intend 62 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: to train to find all the deer that we do 63 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 1: not hit well. And and so I want to I 64 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: want to ask you about that. There there's a lot 65 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:29,120 Speaker 1: of way, there's a lot of places I want to 66 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 1: go in this podcast, but let's start with that. Because 67 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: this this dog of mine, and you know me, this 68 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 1: this dog is a bird dog. First, right, it's a 69 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 1: family dog. It's a bird dog. I've never done I've 70 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 1: done the shed antler thing, but I've never done the 71 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: game recovery thing. What should I be doing? Well? I 72 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: think you know I I You're right, like for us 73 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 1: out of necessity, I love I love working with the 74 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 1: dogs so much, But you're right, I do so much 75 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: deer hunting stuff, and deer hunting is really like my 76 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: if I had to pick one thing to do, it's 77 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: I'm not going to give up deer hunting. So by 78 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: me figuring out ways to include the dogs, it's that's 79 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 1: been a real benefit. But I think that there's the 80 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 1: dogs enhance it, like the dogs make it better. Um. 81 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 1: You know, when you start talking about tracking dogs, game 82 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: recovery dogs, there's a clear um. You know, there's a 83 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: it's really it's not hard to understand how they can 84 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 1: improve our experience and um, you know, finding one finding 85 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:28,240 Speaker 1: one deer that otherwise would not have been found is 86 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:30,840 Speaker 1: We're worth everything that you're gonna put into it. From 87 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:34,600 Speaker 1: a work why work? From a work standpoint, training standpoint, 88 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: that satisfaction is is you know, it's hard to beat. 89 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 1: It's it's so much that I know, I do know, 90 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:43,159 Speaker 1: and we'll probably talk about this a little bit. But 91 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:47,279 Speaker 1: like some guys are really hardcore into tracking, and almost 92 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 1: all of them that I know, at one time we're 93 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: very avid hunters, and then they started tracking with their 94 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: dogs and this was so much more enjoyable to them. 95 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 1: They enjoyed that that they got a bigger rush out 96 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:03,640 Speaker 1: of it. They everything that was more desirable for them 97 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,480 Speaker 1: to do the dog stuff that they end up they 98 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: don't hunt because there is a fine line and balance 99 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 1: of time and and everything when people really get into it. 100 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 1: Obviously takes a lot of time and the time of 101 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:19,559 Speaker 1: the year for a tracking dog, it's hard to hunt 102 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 1: because there's a relatively short wind of time that that's 103 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 1: when the tracking dogs are needed. So, um, yeah, I 104 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: I with you. With a young dog, what what do 105 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,720 Speaker 1: you need to get started. I and you had sent 106 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:34,960 Speaker 1: me a message early here by the way, you see 107 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 1: an email come through shortly, but I sent you a message. 108 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:39,440 Speaker 1: It was some questions that you had sent me for 109 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 1: something another project you're working on, and kind of a 110 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 1: similar question, you know, what are you gonna get started 111 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:46,280 Speaker 1: with a pup? And I hate to be that guy 112 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: that's beating the dead horse over and over and over, 113 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:53,120 Speaker 1: but I always say, when it comes to dogs, regardless 114 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 1: of what we're doing with them, the foundation has to 115 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:59,280 Speaker 1: be there first. So I don't care if it's tracking dog, bird, dog, 116 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 1: shed dog, name it, whatever you want to do with 117 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 1: it in the field without a foundation. And and when 118 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 1: I say foundation, I mean obedience like heel sits, stay, come, 119 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 1: and I call you. Those are the big four. If 120 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 1: you don't have that, First off, you won't enjoy the 121 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 1: dog while whether it's in the field or not. And 122 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: second off, you can't really do this training that I 123 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:29,479 Speaker 1: think is necessary to develop those skills without those foundational things. 124 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,119 Speaker 1: Because it's like a basketball team can't play a game 125 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 1: if they don't know how to dribble, and and they 126 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: can't if they don't know how to shoot. So there's 127 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:39,919 Speaker 1: these real basic things that and that all has to 128 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 1: be there first. So the Foundation Foundation Foundation and I 129 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 1: spend literally months and months and months on it. At 130 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: the same time, I do think there's little things that 131 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,479 Speaker 1: you can start doing with that pup. Howld your pup 132 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 1: right now? So she's nine weeks and we're doing I mean, 133 00:06:56,200 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 1: she's already sit down place. Come, I'm working on heel there. 134 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: So I'm working on you know, it's all tree training stuff, 135 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,479 Speaker 1: but um, working on all that. I just didn't know 136 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 1: if there was anything any any little things on this 137 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:10,760 Speaker 1: this blood tracking side of things that I should start 138 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:14,240 Speaker 1: thinking about for the near future. Yeah, you can, And 139 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:17,600 Speaker 1: it's just the thing is is you don't have to, 140 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: but you certainly can. And I think what what the 141 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:23,200 Speaker 1: slippery slope is is when we start giving a list 142 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,679 Speaker 1: of here's what you should do type stuff, everybody takes 143 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:32,480 Speaker 1: it so so literally that they focus on that. And 144 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 1: what I what I emphasize with young dogs is let 145 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 1: them develop as they developed, like we don't we can help. 146 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:42,800 Speaker 1: We can help them along the way, but I don't 147 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:45,559 Speaker 1: think we should be steering them too hard when they're little, 148 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: because I think that the thing that will make a 149 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: lot of people maybe relax a little bit. A bit 150 00:07:52,840 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 1: about the idea of developing dogs for the field is 151 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: that the hard work has been done by people for 152 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 1: hundreds of years before us, so we we don't have 153 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 1: to worry about like fitting the round peg into the 154 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: square hole like these these dogs, and it's and it 155 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:11,760 Speaker 1: doesn't matter what breed like we can we'll probably talk 156 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:15,440 Speaker 1: some breed stuff too, but the the these dogs have 157 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 1: the ability to find game in them and we don't 158 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: have to put it in so we don't train them 159 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 1: to track. It's just like I don't train retrievers to retrieve, 160 00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 1: and we don't train pointing dogs the point like they 161 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,480 Speaker 1: have it in them. And but not all of them 162 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: come out at the same time either. So yes, there's 163 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:37,079 Speaker 1: stuff I wanted like expose it to to give it 164 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: an opportunity to develop, maybe come out a little quicker. 165 00:08:40,360 --> 00:08:42,599 Speaker 1: You know. He brought up treat training, and I have 166 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: to go off on a tangent, but like treat training 167 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,080 Speaker 1: to me is makes trainers feel really good. I don't 168 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: treat training, and I'm not against treat training. I also 169 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,040 Speaker 1: don't use shot collars, and I'm not against shot collars. 170 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: I just don't use them, and I don't use them 171 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,040 Speaker 1: because they don't feel like I need them, and I 172 00:08:58,080 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 1: don't think they helped me, and I think they put 173 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:01,080 Speaker 1: me in a I think they put a lot of 174 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 1: people in situations that aren't the best for themselves and 175 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 1: the dogs. The idea of treat training, I think is 176 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 1: really an accelerated way of getting little dogs to shape 177 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:16,440 Speaker 1: into things behavior wise that we like to see. I'm 178 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 1: not against that, like, I don't have a problem with it. 179 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:23,160 Speaker 1: What I think is what I think. Like, I look 180 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,400 Speaker 1: at it and I go, I like to shape dogs 181 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,440 Speaker 1: and good into desirable behaviors as well, But I feel 182 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 1: like that happens if you if you're consistent and you 183 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: lead them down a good path, it will happen. What 184 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:39,800 Speaker 1: I don't like is trying to speed stuff up to 185 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:43,040 Speaker 1: get ahead, because there's no I just don't think you 186 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:45,000 Speaker 1: get ahead with dogs. I think you get ahead and 187 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 1: then you find yourself in a bad position. And I 188 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: think that a lot of times the treat training. I've 189 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,560 Speaker 1: seen some incredible tree training videos where people are having 190 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:56,880 Speaker 1: these nine week old puppies like gears healing off lead 191 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: and I go, everybody goes man, they he taught that 192 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: dog to heal off lead already, and I said, yeah, 193 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,439 Speaker 1: but no, they're not healing them off lead. They're guiding 194 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 1: them with a piece of kibble in the in their 195 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:12,520 Speaker 1: hands and that kind of But what I look at 196 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 1: it is is at the end when you take the kid, 197 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:18,040 Speaker 1: if you took the kibble away, does the behavior stay? 198 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:21,880 Speaker 1: And I don't think it does as well. I like 199 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:24,559 Speaker 1: to look at it as I take a different approach 200 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 1: to shaping. It takes a little more time, admittedly, but 201 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:32,680 Speaker 1: I don't care what the score is at the end 202 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 1: of the first quarter. It's the end of the game 203 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:37,199 Speaker 1: that matters. So like to be six weeks ahead of 204 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: where I am today. It looks good. But let's talk 205 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:45,040 Speaker 1: in six months or six years and see how how 206 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 1: did that time How how did things go along that 207 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:50,439 Speaker 1: time frame, Because it's in the end that really matters. 208 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: So when it comes to these little dogs, you know, 209 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:58,120 Speaker 1: kibble is great. I like food, especially with food driven dogs. 210 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: So for track or for birds, or for sheds, or 211 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 1: for anything that uses nosework. I like to use. I 212 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 1: like to use food. I think you can use it 213 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: to your advantage. And so I would take, you know, grass, 214 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:13,679 Speaker 1: go outside and get your front lawn and cut a 215 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 1: cut a circle. Maybe he'll do in the backyard, but 216 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: moa mowitz so that there's a little bit taller grass 217 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 1: in a relatively small area. And take that bowl of 218 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:25,440 Speaker 1: food that you normally we're gonna feed that pup. You know, 219 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,320 Speaker 1: by nine weeks you're on your solid like I've got 220 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: puppies in the back right now there four weeks they 221 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,199 Speaker 1: got their first solid meal. Today it's mush. It's not 222 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 1: not hard kibble, but eventually within a couple of weeks 223 00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 1: they're gonna be eating dry kibble. And so you could 224 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: take that kibble and you could put it in the grass. 225 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 1: So you motor circle. Let's say you motor circle about 226 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: six or seven feet in diameter, not real big, but 227 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 1: for that dog, it's pretty pretty good sized distance. And 228 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:52,480 Speaker 1: that the height doesn't have to be real tall grass. 229 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 1: It just needs to be, you know, two or three 230 00:11:54,559 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 1: inches taller than everything around it. And so it's a 231 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:01,679 Speaker 1: clear like island of taller grass. And sprinkle some food 232 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,280 Speaker 1: in there, kibble a handful of it, and then take 233 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,719 Speaker 1: the dog and let it go down wind. And then 234 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 1: don't I don't have to say anything, just just be 235 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:11,760 Speaker 1: down wind of it, and watch that puppy use its 236 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 1: nose and work into that cover, and then watch its 237 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:17,920 Speaker 1: body language to watch its tail, watch its watch how 238 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:21,160 Speaker 1: it breathes. It goes from maybe panting through its mouth, 239 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:22,679 Speaker 1: doll of a sudden its mouth was closed, and you 240 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:26,440 Speaker 1: start to hear that little hoover vacuum. And now all 241 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: of a sudden, they're working that nose and that tail 242 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,840 Speaker 1: starts to change the cadence. And I like using that 243 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 1: to a get the puppy to understand if I use 244 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:38,560 Speaker 1: my nose, there's really good things that happen. It's the 245 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 1: exact same thing that happened the day the puppy was born. 246 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 1: When I watched these puffs behind me, there are four 247 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 1: weeks old right now. When they were born, within four 248 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 1: or five hours, they were literally scooching themselves across the 249 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:54,000 Speaker 1: welping pen to get over by mom if she had adjusted. 250 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:58,000 Speaker 1: They can't see and they can't hear, but they could smell, 251 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 1: and so they literally made their way up cross this 252 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 1: gigantic welping box to them and got there. And why 253 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: did they get there Because they were hungry and they 254 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:08,080 Speaker 1: wanted to get warm, and they curled up my mom 255 00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 1: and the nurse. So they've been doing it since literally 256 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: the hours that first hours they were alive. Now we're 257 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 1: just like adding distractions, were adding some things. Their dogs 258 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 1: have become mobile, so now they can run around a 259 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 1: little bit and cover some ground. But those are things 260 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: that I think you can do that enhance that dogs 261 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:27,760 Speaker 1: understanding of use my noise get some reward. But I 262 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:31,319 Speaker 1: think also you're gonna gain You're gonna start to feel 263 00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: just as good about watching your dog do that. I 264 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: think a lot of this early stuff on is like 265 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,440 Speaker 1: keeping us and excited about it and making us feel good. 266 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: You'll be able to start reading the dog's body language 267 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: and go on, Man, my dog really says a lot 268 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: by just physically making changes with its body and how 269 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,440 Speaker 1: it works. So you could configure different you know, you 270 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,800 Speaker 1: could configure I use that. I call that a hunt command. 271 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 1: So like I put that food in there and I 272 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 1: let him find it. And in the background a lot 273 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 1: of times with my dogs, I give them a verbal cue. 274 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 1: You know, you can stay lost, you can say find it, 275 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: you can say whatever you want to say. But I 276 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:09,200 Speaker 1: stand in the back after the first day or two 277 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 1: and I start to read that language just just watching 278 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,680 Speaker 1: them do what they do naturally, and then I start 279 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:16,719 Speaker 1: layering in some verbal over the top of it, so 280 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 1: you can start find it, find it, find it, find it, 281 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 1: find it. And that doesn't mean anything to them at 282 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,200 Speaker 1: that point, but they hear it because they can hear. 283 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: And there you're in the background, just saying it over 284 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:30,360 Speaker 1: and over and over again, and they every time you 285 00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 1: say it there in that area, there in that tall grass, 286 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:36,800 Speaker 1: their noses are working, their tails are going, and they're 287 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 1: getting rewards. And that reward is that cable. And so 288 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 1: you do that enough and it's it's it's classic conditioning 289 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 1: and it's path blow. So you do it enough, and 290 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, i can sit here in the 291 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: living room and I've got a couple of dogs laying 292 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: on the beds right now, and if I go find it, 293 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,040 Speaker 1: find it, find it, find it, I'll look in their noses, 294 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 1: even in their sleep. Their noses will start to move, 295 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 1: their noses will start to get driplets of water on 296 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 1: it because they hear that, and their body tells them 297 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:04,440 Speaker 1: I have to use my nose and something good will 298 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 1: come from it. So so hold on a second. Is 299 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:09,760 Speaker 1: that is that find it command? Or is that like 300 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: a generic thing like like fetch would be for some 301 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,120 Speaker 1: people or are you are you tying that specifically to 302 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:18,760 Speaker 1: later blood trailing efforts. Try so, so this is early 303 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:21,240 Speaker 1: on just to develop what I call hunt command. I 304 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:23,840 Speaker 1: wouldn't use find it, find it, find it, find it 305 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:27,200 Speaker 1: the whole time while we're tracking, because it's too much 306 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: verbal and there's really no reason. So what I would 307 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 1: do is I might use find it to start, like 308 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 1: I might use find it to engage the dog and 309 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 1: the idea of there's something here for me to find, 310 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 1: and then when they as soon as they're on it, 311 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:45,400 Speaker 1: I shut up, Like I I think one of the 312 00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:48,120 Speaker 1: biggest things that we do and I'm guilty of it, 313 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:51,800 Speaker 1: and I can be accused of very easily, and I 314 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: will and I will agree with it is what you're 315 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 1: talking awful lot when you're trained on video. Yes, but 316 00:15:58,080 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 1: I'm not talking to the dog. I'm talking to camp. 317 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,280 Speaker 1: And so I make a point of like our YouTube 318 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: channel is filled with all sorts of different videos, and 319 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:11,840 Speaker 1: I oftentimes remind people of, hey, I I'm gonna talk. 320 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: It's going to actually make my training a lot harder 321 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,440 Speaker 1: and we're gonna get a lot less done that. I 322 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 1: then I think we could if we weren't so verbal, 323 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: because I think it becomes white noise to the dog. 324 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 1: So when I actually do have to give them something verbally, 325 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 1: they it doesn't have the impact because I'm so constantly talking. 326 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 1: So that's that's like that's a given take where you 327 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 1: I could go and just film it, and you could 328 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 1: and and the guys could follow me around with the 329 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 1: camera and I could say nothing, and then the viewer 330 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 1: would have to guess, like, I wonder why you did that. 331 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: I don't think that that's as valuable for YouTube as 332 00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 1: it is for me. With a session with the dogs, 333 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: so those they look a little bit different. UM. I 334 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 1: had a guy that we had a workshop this weekend 335 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 1: and we had people from across the country here and 336 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 1: one of the one of the biggest things that stood 337 00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 1: out to me one guy in a little German, short 338 00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: haired pointer. UM. I encourage people to be encouraging to 339 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 1: their dogs. I think we get in a rut. This 340 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 1: is a general dog or anything, but I think we 341 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 1: get in a rut where we pick apart all the 342 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 1: bad things. We we correct, we correct, we get really 343 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:20,639 Speaker 1: good at correcting, and that's fine. You need to correct things. 344 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:22,720 Speaker 1: It's pressure in praise. I think that's how they learned. 345 00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:25,320 Speaker 1: But you have to make me really good at the corrections, 346 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: sharp timing, you have to you have to acknowledge and 347 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: have reflexes. Well, this guy. Most people are really good 348 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:35,600 Speaker 1: at the corrections, they're not so good at reminding the 349 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:37,800 Speaker 1: dog when they do it well. So I always am 350 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: talking to people and saying, how many goods did you 351 00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:42,280 Speaker 1: say there? How many times did you tell the dog good? 352 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 1: Because you corrected it four times, but ten times it 353 00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:48,640 Speaker 1: was in perfect position and I didn't hear anything. Oh yeah, yeah, 354 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: So I gotta remember say good. Well, this guy he talked. 355 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 1: He just talked and talked and talked constantly, good good, good, 356 00:17:55,640 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 1: good good constantly, and he never left any silence. And 357 00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:02,800 Speaker 1: I told him, I said, man, I love your enthusiasm. 358 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 1: I but you're the opposite of everybody else. You need 359 00:18:06,840 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 1: to just throttle back and save it for when it 360 00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: comes thrown. It really matters because when you really need 361 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: to give. And this dog is really literally had like 362 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 1: a twelve week pup. So I said, when your dog 363 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:20,800 Speaker 1: really does something well, you need that dog to understand it. 364 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 1: And if you're constantly talking to it, and then the 365 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:26,119 Speaker 1: verbal is the way you praise it. They're not going 366 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 1: to know the difference between that and the rest of 367 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:29,720 Speaker 1: the gibber jabber that they hear from you, So you 368 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: gotta you have to balance that a little bit. But 369 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:36,160 Speaker 1: when we're tracking, I shut up. I'll see. My job 370 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,240 Speaker 1: is to focus on that dog and understand, based on 371 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:43,159 Speaker 1: its body language, how are we doing. And you know, 372 00:18:43,280 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 1: if the dog gets off and and you can tell 373 00:18:46,480 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 1: that the dog is off of the line, I might 374 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: I might help the dog because this isn't a test, 375 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:54,840 Speaker 1: this is a training thing. We're working together. I might 376 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 1: help the dog by re engaging them with that find 377 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 1: a command, find it, find it good, good, and then 378 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,720 Speaker 1: shut up. And when I say good, envision that dog 379 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:07,919 Speaker 1: going changing. Body language got the same. Now I'm quiet 380 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 1: and I let the dog work. Is this Are you 381 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 1: seeing more interest here? Now? You know? I mean people 382 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 1: who know the history of the European game recovery dogs. 383 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 1: I mean that's like just ensconced in that dog culture 384 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: over there, like there's there's no you know, we think 385 00:19:24,080 --> 00:19:26,959 Speaker 1: about dogs and in different categories like house dogs and 386 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: you know, hunting dogs, and this kind of new category 387 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:33,919 Speaker 1: of game recovery dogs. But really over there, there's they 388 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 1: don't differentiate. And now more and more states are legalizing 389 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:40,159 Speaker 1: you know, blood trailing on a leash or off leash 390 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 1: or thirty ft check ard or whatever. Are you seeing 391 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:44,560 Speaker 1: more interests come up with that. Are you having more 392 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:48,200 Speaker 1: just like general sporting dog owners that are interested in it. Yeah, 393 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:50,440 Speaker 1: for sure, I think it. I think it. It's great 394 00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:53,800 Speaker 1: that they are because I think it's it saves more game. 395 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 1: I think more game gets found now than it ever 396 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 1: has before because of the dogs, and that that really 397 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:05,840 Speaker 1: is the reasoning and the objective is get find find 398 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:08,680 Speaker 1: game that otherwise won't be found. And but but when 399 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,879 Speaker 1: you when I think about that question, I think, yes, 400 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 1: in big when it comes to big game. But I 401 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:17,520 Speaker 1: will remind like there's a lot of people that are 402 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 1: intimidated by the idea of you know, dabbling in tracking 403 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,120 Speaker 1: or you know, big game recovery with a dog. Any 404 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:27,040 Speaker 1: dog doesn't. I don't care the breed, I don't care 405 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:30,080 Speaker 1: if it's a crossover, like you're gonna do multiple things 406 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 1: with the dog. But I want to remind anyone who's 407 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:36,159 Speaker 1: got that that dealt in their mind, or that second 408 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:41,439 Speaker 1: guessing game recovery. Yeah, you're right, you're the Europeans look 409 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:43,919 Speaker 1: at it completely different than we do over here, but 410 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:49,159 Speaker 1: not really because we all understand over here in the States, 411 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 1: we all understand the value of a dog to recover game. 412 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: It's just not big game like a pheasant dog has. 413 00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:03,000 Speaker 1: The most value of pheasant dog brings to me is 414 00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: get cripples. Like if I wing a burden, it sails 415 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: and it hits the ground and it's running, I will 416 00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: never get it by myself. And very rarely are you 417 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 1: gonna be able to catch back up to it not 418 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 1: and cover and be able to find it and and 419 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:20,400 Speaker 1: get the game recovered it where that's what the dog does. 420 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:25,920 Speaker 1: The greatest retreat of of my memory with any dog 421 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 1: my whole life was my first laboratory retriever. And it 422 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 1: was a duck that we shot and it sailed way. 423 00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 1: It was in the Dakotas it sailed way across this 424 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 1: pothole we're hunting over water, it hit the water, it 425 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,280 Speaker 1: swam to the shore, it went up. We saw it 426 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 1: across the road and we're like, I mean it was 427 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,480 Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of yards away. We're like, 428 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:48,640 Speaker 1: there's no way we're never going to find that duck. 429 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 1: So we got done, we picked up and I said, 430 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:54,760 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna take Remy over there, and I brought 431 00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 1: We walked way over there. She got on that line. 432 00:21:57,600 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: This is hours later, and she went up and she 433 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:02,240 Speaker 1: crossed that road and we literally just sat there and 434 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: waited so long that the trucks came around and we're 435 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 1: sitting there. We're sitting there. We watched her work at Chisfield. 436 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,240 Speaker 1: Chose a paul Field, She went into a c RP 437 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, she came back a long 438 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: time later, in ten fifteen minutes later with a live 439 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: drake mallard in her mouth, and she brought it back 440 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:21,840 Speaker 1: to us. And so I look at that, and they go, 441 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:23,720 Speaker 1: that's a tracking job. That's all that was was a 442 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,880 Speaker 1: tracking job. And so there's not a lot of difference 443 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: between tracking a bird or tracking a rabbit or tracking 444 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:37,240 Speaker 1: a deer. It's just our our perception of it as 445 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: hunters over here is well, that's that's so much different. 446 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:43,720 Speaker 1: It's not you know, look at hounds, look at what hounds. 447 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,040 Speaker 1: What we think with hounds over here, Yeah, it's it's 448 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:50,199 Speaker 1: more of a it's a skilly. You kind of alluded 449 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 1: to this earlier that that they have and this is 450 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,439 Speaker 1: sort of a bolt on task like this is you know, 451 00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:57,679 Speaker 1: for a while there and you saw this, people were 452 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,680 Speaker 1: getting like dedicated shed dogs, you know, or or dedicate 453 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 1: you know. And and the guys you're talking about who 454 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,520 Speaker 1: are who are just blood tracking now they're not doing 455 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: they're not hunting anymore. That's just their thing. They're looking 456 00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:09,320 Speaker 1: for a specific kind of dog. But this is something 457 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 1: that you can take. You know, all kinds of different 458 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 1: working dogs out there, probably dogs that we don't even 459 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:19,119 Speaker 1: think of as working dogs, and they have thousands and 460 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 1: thousands of years of evolution of of this. This is 461 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 1: already built into them. We just need to give them 462 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 1: the opportunity to develop it a little bit and have 463 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 1: that framework of control around it, like you talked about earlier. Yeah, 464 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 1: I think when you think about like the original tracking dogs, 465 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,720 Speaker 1: the best tracking dogs, uh, you think of like the 466 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:40,560 Speaker 1: ones that depend on it to survive wolves, coyotes, Like 467 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: they're they're really good tracking dogs and they they they 468 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: become it because if they aren't, they'll die. Like they don't, 469 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: they don't survive. And you know, the the idea and 470 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,159 Speaker 1: the understanding. Like I truly believe that one of the 471 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 1: biggest values that tracking dog brings to me is a 472 00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: much clearer understanding of what actually happened when it comes 473 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 1: to let's let's say a scenario as somebody hits a deer. 474 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,960 Speaker 1: Um archery is the biggest one that I see. But 475 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: let's say it's it's archery hunt. Somebody hits the deer, 476 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 1: knew they hit it well, they always know they hit 477 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 1: it well. And then you go to the scene, well 478 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:20,560 Speaker 1: you start to look at it. I've seen it so 479 00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 1: many times. Now this this is only after a lot 480 00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 1: of experience, but with dogs, like an experienced dog, I 481 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 1: can't tell you how many countless times that I've seen 482 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:33,120 Speaker 1: these really well trained dogs that have seen and been 483 00:24:33,119 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 1: on lots of tracks literally within a hundred yards of it. 484 00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:41,240 Speaker 1: I can look and I don't. I don't think this 485 00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 1: deer is dead. And it's always discouraging to the hunter 486 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: and they're always no, no, no, you know they know, 487 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,720 Speaker 1: they know. Well how many times I can't tell you 488 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 1: how many times that the hunter knew where the deer 489 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 1: went and the dogs said it went somewhere else, and no, no, 490 00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:59,280 Speaker 1: it's this way the dog says this way. No, it's 491 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:02,320 Speaker 1: this way. Dogs says that all of a sudden, here's 492 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 1: the deer. How did it get over there? You know, well, 493 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:07,199 Speaker 1: I don't know how. And I'm not saying that the 494 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 1: people are lying about it. I don't think it's intentional. 495 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:12,240 Speaker 1: But a lot of things happen in the woods and 496 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,600 Speaker 1: you get confused and you get excited and you see 497 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: something that you thought you saw. And the dogs are 498 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:20,879 Speaker 1: the honest part in this puzzle, you know, like they 499 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:23,920 Speaker 1: really tell us the truth all the time. And and 500 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,880 Speaker 1: you know, I've been on tracks where I know it's 501 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,560 Speaker 1: very very unlikely that we're going to recover this deer, 502 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: and they can tell us that pretty quickly. And I 503 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:36,840 Speaker 1: think it's because and it's through body language, But I 504 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: think that it has a lot to do with the 505 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:43,200 Speaker 1: idea of when you think back to like as these 506 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 1: animals evolved, if they're bad trackers as far as they track, 507 00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,159 Speaker 1: and they're they're not tracking the deer that's going to 508 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,680 Speaker 1: eventually expire, or it's hurt so bad that they could 509 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:59,399 Speaker 1: catch up to it. If they just chase the you know, 510 00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:03,040 Speaker 1: chase to chase, they burn more calories than they ever 511 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 1: take in and if you do that, you don't make 512 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: it so they're they're just the depth of them is 513 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,520 Speaker 1: is amazing and and and that all takes a lot 514 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 1: of um, you know, that takes a lot of experience 515 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:20,359 Speaker 1: for the dog. It takes a lot of experience for 516 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 1: the handler to be able to read the dog uh 517 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,280 Speaker 1: and the and the other sign Like I don't think. 518 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:28,439 Speaker 1: I think great trackers like tracking dogs. Really good tracking 519 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 1: dogs are not just independent units. They're always teamed up 520 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: with a really good tracker. Trackers, trackers and tracking dogs. 521 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:42,359 Speaker 1: It's not coincidental that they're always together. Um, there's there's 522 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 1: a there's a lot of input from the handler, and 523 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:49,800 Speaker 1: there's a lot of understanding that you've got to trust 524 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,320 Speaker 1: the dog at times and and it's a it's very 525 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 1: much a team um and that in and the more 526 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,159 Speaker 1: they do, the better they get. There's it's just like 527 00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,639 Speaker 1: anything else. But I also think, you know, so I 528 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,359 Speaker 1: say all that stuff and I go and I know 529 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,160 Speaker 1: that will intimidate people, and go, I don't. I can't 530 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,480 Speaker 1: do that. I'm not that guy the whole. One of 531 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,119 Speaker 1: the first stories I heard about tracking success was I 532 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,159 Speaker 1: was in college and a roommate of mine had a 533 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:19,240 Speaker 1: Golden Retriever that his buddy shot a deer and they 534 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:22,840 Speaker 1: couldn't find it. My buddy took his dog with to 535 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:24,800 Speaker 1: go look for it. They weren't taking it to track, 536 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:29,879 Speaker 1: and no training, I mean, zero training, and they brought 537 00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,160 Speaker 1: the dog with and they went to look for where 538 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: the deer was. And the dog ran off like I 539 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 1: mean with conviction, like he went. He looked like he 540 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: was going somewhere for a reason. And so my buddy 541 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,520 Speaker 1: followed his dog, and the guy that shot the deer 542 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:49,840 Speaker 1: kept looking for some type of signs, some type of 543 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,720 Speaker 1: visual clue, and it didn't go very far. And here 544 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 1: that here he follows this dog, and here's the dog 545 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: is right next to that dead deer. And so he's 546 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,120 Speaker 1: like I couldn't believe it. But so no training, no experience, 547 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:08,119 Speaker 1: no extra effort put in, and that dog did it 548 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:11,240 Speaker 1: like an old pro. So I don't think I don't 549 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 1: share that story with everyone to be like, don't work 550 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,439 Speaker 1: at it, just take your dog. It will happen. But 551 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,720 Speaker 1: I also think there's it's for most of us, it's somewhere. 552 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: We're somewhere in the middle. Yeah, Well that's that's just 553 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,159 Speaker 1: an example, you know we should we should comment on 554 00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: this or or talk about this a little bit. But 555 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 1: you know, we say blood tracking dogs, but they're they're 556 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,320 Speaker 1: following the scent of a wounded animal. Like there. There's 557 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:34,720 Speaker 1: a lot more to it than that, and so people 558 00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:36,880 Speaker 1: kind of think like, oh, they're they're finding a spot 559 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:38,520 Speaker 1: of blood and then they're sniffing for the next one. 560 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:40,040 Speaker 1: That's not how it works there. You know, when you 561 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,120 Speaker 1: think about what you talk about that rooster you knocked 562 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 1: down that goes running or the you know, the that 563 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,200 Speaker 1: that might be the best scenario because you think about 564 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: being in a place with tons of pheasant sign you 565 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: knock a rooster down, that dog knows which sent to 566 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: follow to track that sucker down, And it's not because 567 00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:58,240 Speaker 1: he's blood trailing a rooster going four, you know, I mean, 568 00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,719 Speaker 1: they know the smell of a So this is like 569 00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: inherent in them and so it's about us just giving 570 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 1: them those opportunities and then having the ability to reset 571 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: them and control them in these situations until they just go, oh, 572 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 1: this is this is what I'm doing, Like okay, I 573 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:17,640 Speaker 1: can do this. Yeah, yeah, for sure. The the you know, 574 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: you're right, the blood tracking part of it. I say, 575 00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: for a long time, I got away from staying blood 576 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,480 Speaker 1: tracking because I was trying to make a point of like, 577 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,920 Speaker 1: they're not tracking blood like that, if there was blood, 578 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 1: we wouldn't need It's the idea that there isn't blood 579 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 1: and and there's it's it's usually not that there isn't 580 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:38,240 Speaker 1: any blood, because oftentimes there is some type of a clue. 581 00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 1: But there's so much more than just blood. And and yes, 582 00:29:42,320 --> 00:29:45,040 Speaker 1: it's specific to following, you know that. I think one 583 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:48,120 Speaker 1: of the biggest asked questions, the biggest fear that people 584 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 1: have is if I trained my dog to track dear, 585 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: they'll they'll run dear. And it couldn't be further from 586 00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 1: the truth. The the idea of a dog that runs dear. Now, 587 00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:03,280 Speaker 1: will dogs run deer? For sure? Untrained dogs run deer 588 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 1: like it's a contribute. I I always say to people, like, 589 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 1: if your pheasant dog jumps a deer while you're pheasant hunting, 590 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,480 Speaker 1: it chases it, do you have a bad pheasant dog. No, 591 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 1: you don't have a problem with it. It's not a 592 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:17,120 Speaker 1: pheasant problem. It's a control problem with a pheasant dog. 593 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 1: So if the deer, if the dog is chasing deer. 594 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 1: It's an issue with control, and so tracking dogs don't 595 00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: just follow deer, they follow a specific deer. And that's 596 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: made up of all sorts of different clues. Um. You know, 597 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 1: there's we can go down and there's a ton of it. 598 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,120 Speaker 1: There's there's adrenaline that comes off of a wounded deer 599 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: that has a very you know. I take my dog 600 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 1: to the vet and have black black Labradors to bring 601 00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:46,680 Speaker 1: to the vet. And I get there and I'm always 602 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,280 Speaker 1: embarrassed because God do not take care of these dogs. 603 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 1: They got all this dan dreff, you know, like they flake. 604 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,480 Speaker 1: I get him up on the table to get inspected, 605 00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 1: and black dog with all this white dander, and I go, geez, man, 606 00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 1: he's never never like that at home. He's got a 607 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:01,480 Speaker 1: nice colde, I thought, And the in the that says, no, 608 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,920 Speaker 1: he's nervous. What do you mean he's nervous. Oh, he's nervous. 609 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 1: So when he's nervous, exfoliates. And so when you exfoliate, 610 00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 1: skin cells come up, dander comes off. Well, I learned 611 00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:17,479 Speaker 1: from a canine trainer um that I've probably picked up 612 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: more like understanding of how dogs process sent that from 613 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 1: than anyone else, and he was in New York City. 614 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,800 Speaker 1: I met him at a t a show, our tree 615 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,440 Speaker 1: trade show. But so we we were talking and he 616 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 1: was training dogs to track criminals or people, individual people 617 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,200 Speaker 1: through the streets of New York and where I'm He's 618 00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:39,680 Speaker 1: explained to mean this process and he goes, yeah, a 619 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:43,520 Speaker 1: criminal has an adrenaline rush when that when they're being chased. You, 620 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: I mean you ever you ever get afraid of something 621 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: and run like it's a weird feeling that overcomes your 622 00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 1: entire body, and that creates scent. When you're nervous, you 623 00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: start to exfoliate, dander happens. Well, that's sent. Those are 624 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 1: all sent clues, and that you're leaving this mist down 625 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,920 Speaker 1: the road and through the building and wherever you're going, 626 00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:09,760 Speaker 1: which are settling down, and then the dog utilizes that 627 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 1: as a scent clue. So you know, you you step 628 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:15,320 Speaker 1: in something and then you run for a distance, you're 629 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,200 Speaker 1: going to carry that scent. That's a scent clue for 630 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:20,280 Speaker 1: that dog. And it's associated with a specific person, not 631 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 1: just people. So a deer is the same way. A 632 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,640 Speaker 1: deer has an interdigital gland in between their their hoof. 633 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,440 Speaker 1: It's unique to them. It's a lot. It literally is 634 00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,120 Speaker 1: like a fingerprint, and so that has a unique scent 635 00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 1: and that specific interdigital gland combined with all these other 636 00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:41,400 Speaker 1: scent clues. That dog puts all that in its memory 637 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:46,400 Speaker 1: and goes, if I smell one of these different scent clues, 638 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 1: it's this deer and oh I crossed another deer, but 639 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 1: that does not have this one, and it needs to 640 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 1: have this in order for it to be that, so 641 00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,120 Speaker 1: I have to follow. So I leave that one alone 642 00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: and I follow this one. And the thing is is, 643 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 1: as we talk about it, we're kind of like trying, 644 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 1: I'm trying to draw this picture of how this dog 645 00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: is processing it. Well, it happened like that, Like I mean, 646 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 1: it's the fastest computer in the world. Is the way 647 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:12,320 Speaker 1: your nose works. So it's really amazing, it is. I 648 00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: I interviewed a canine researcher from Texas Tech one time 649 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:20,440 Speaker 1: for Sporting Dog Talk, and he he focuses on their 650 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,719 Speaker 1: old factory abilities and he's studying how good are their 651 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 1: noses really, And he described it to me as them 652 00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:28,800 Speaker 1: being able to smell three drops of something in an 653 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: Olympic sized pool. That's how And I always think about 654 00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: this with deer when people are like, oh, I put 655 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:35,840 Speaker 1: on this suit and I beat the deer's nose, and 656 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,440 Speaker 1: I'm like, you know when you I can't remember, I 657 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,280 Speaker 1: think a dog is like million cent receptors and a 658 00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:45,000 Speaker 1: deer's three seventy or something that it's wild, wild numbers. 659 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:48,800 Speaker 1: And then you think about how they can They can 660 00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 1: key in on those biochemical little little clues on somebody 661 00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 1: running through New York or you know that deer that 662 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:58,600 Speaker 1: has a certain kind of wound or something like that, 663 00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:02,640 Speaker 1: and they can follow that through a billion different other 664 00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 1: sense and they can filter that through while running. It's 665 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 1: it's like amazing. I mean, it's so incredible that they 666 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:10,799 Speaker 1: can do that. It's hard to and it is hard 667 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,520 Speaker 1: to wrap wrap your mind around it. I think sometimes 668 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:17,520 Speaker 1: the belief comes in witnessing that you know, like you 669 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 1: you watch, you know, there's all these examples, but like 670 00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:25,120 Speaker 1: there's at the Border that I've heard about that where 671 00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:28,840 Speaker 1: this this drug dog picked up dope that was coming 672 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,400 Speaker 1: through and it was encased in concrete like it was 673 00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 1: a it was drugs inside of a concrete pillar and 674 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:37,719 Speaker 1: the dog was able to pick that up. So when 675 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,120 Speaker 1: you hear I mean if that's the case. We're not 676 00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: fooling these dogs noses with with our you know, we're not. 677 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:46,200 Speaker 1: I don't have to be too worried about like, you know, 678 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 1: the big one for shed hunting is where rubber gloves. 679 00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:50,520 Speaker 1: And I laugh at it, and I go, are you 680 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 1: kidding me? That's the thing you think is holding your 681 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 1: dog up and training because you're not wearing a pair 682 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 1: of rubber gloves like it's insulting to the dogs. So 683 00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 1: their noses are just we I don't think we will 684 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:06,760 Speaker 1: understand exactly how to be able to put it into measure, 685 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,040 Speaker 1: but I mean when you bring up deer stuff and 686 00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:12,840 Speaker 1: in scent suits and all that stuff. Here's one that 687 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 1: I here's one that I did give a bit of 688 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:19,759 Speaker 1: credibility to is I read a article about they had 689 00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 1: a drug dog or a canine unit dog. It was 690 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: I think it was a man tracker. But they had 691 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:26,479 Speaker 1: a test where they had I think it was nine 692 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:30,399 Speaker 1: boxes in a room, um box big enough to cover 693 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:34,520 Speaker 1: up a person, and they put people in the box 694 00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:36,319 Speaker 1: and they let the dog in the room and the 695 00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:38,400 Speaker 1: dog has to find the box that the person is 696 00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 1: in and indicate. So they did it with nothing like 697 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:43,920 Speaker 1: just put a person in the room and it happened 698 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 1: in like it happened in a matter of like less 699 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:49,400 Speaker 1: than a few seconds. Dog went right to the box. Boom, 700 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 1: got it. So they then they put the dog. They 701 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,919 Speaker 1: sprayed the person down with like a sent killer type thing, 702 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:58,560 Speaker 1: and dog went right to the box. You know, it 703 00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 1: maybe was like a split second longer, but it went 704 00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: right to the box. They put a carbon suit on 705 00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,439 Speaker 1: the person or some type of one of those suits 706 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:09,640 Speaker 1: and just a hint more just to touch, more um 707 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 1: longer to find. And then they put an ozone unit in. 708 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 1: And when they put the ozone unit in, it took 709 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,959 Speaker 1: about four or five times as long for the dog. 710 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:23,320 Speaker 1: It was like fifteen to twenty seconds versus three to five. 711 00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 1: And the dog went to it and found him. But 712 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,279 Speaker 1: it took a while. And I thought, and and and 713 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:32,000 Speaker 1: so a lot of people will read that, go, yeah, 714 00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,319 Speaker 1: it doesn't work. The dog found him. Of course they 715 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:39,080 Speaker 1: found him. It's not the dog is well, it's in 716 00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:42,560 Speaker 1: that test. They shut the ozone unit off two. So 717 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 1: when I've I've messed around with with trying to fool 718 00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,279 Speaker 1: dogs a million different ways. That was That was a 719 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:52,239 Speaker 1: field and stream test they did and if you know 720 00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:57,279 Speaker 1: about ozone, like it's it's a bleaching agent, It's an 721 00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:02,319 Speaker 1: unstable molecule that binds to biological molecules. And it was 722 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:04,400 Speaker 1: the only thing I found when I was training Luna 723 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,279 Speaker 1: and my older lab now for shed antlers, where I 724 00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:11,640 Speaker 1: could treat an antler and treat my gloves and then 725 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 1: I could throw that antler out there and leave it, 726 00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:15,960 Speaker 1: and I could see that that dog would run down 727 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:17,520 Speaker 1: wind of it and not pick it up right away. 728 00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: I tried spraining it down every other way, because you 729 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,520 Speaker 1: know how it is, like if you handle it with 730 00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 1: your hand, they're gonna smell. There's all kinds of scent 731 00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,080 Speaker 1: on it, right, So you throw that antler out, they 732 00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:27,960 Speaker 1: get down wind of it in the grass. They know 733 00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:31,000 Speaker 1: they're just on it. Turn on a dime, And I thought, 734 00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:32,799 Speaker 1: is there you know, there has to be a way 735 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,160 Speaker 1: to try to do this where there's not I'm not 736 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,359 Speaker 1: introducing all these extra smells in this hand smell. The 737 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,440 Speaker 1: only thing I found that worked was ozone. Sure, and 738 00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:45,520 Speaker 1: I I with that study. I look at it and 739 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:48,640 Speaker 1: I go for a deer hunter, like, if it gives 740 00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:50,360 Speaker 1: me a couple of extra seconds, if it gives me 741 00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:54,239 Speaker 1: fifteen seconds versus three. There's value there because if it's 742 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: the right deer, I can kill him, you know, and 743 00:37:55,960 --> 00:38:00,520 Speaker 1: so I. But I just I think that under standing 744 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:05,400 Speaker 1: the the power of that nose it's hard for us 745 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:09,359 Speaker 1: probably to wrap our mind around. But when you when 746 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:11,960 Speaker 1: so and and so, we get we get off on 747 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:16,440 Speaker 1: these in these directions talking about this. But what it 748 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:18,359 Speaker 1: comes down to is think about a gut shot deer 749 00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:22,000 Speaker 1: runs through the woods, like, is that that challenging for 750 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:25,719 Speaker 1: our dog? Probably not what And it's not so much 751 00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: the It's not so much the tracking itself of the deer. 752 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:31,759 Speaker 1: I think what really creates the biggest issues are conditions 753 00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:36,120 Speaker 1: and conditions, and I think it's overlooked because the easiest 754 00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:40,600 Speaker 1: track job in the world is very challenging if the 755 00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:46,360 Speaker 1: dogs not capable of processing the scent because of outside influence, 756 00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:49,560 Speaker 1: which can be temperature, can be very mutric pressure, it 757 00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 1: can be moisture, it can be it can be the heat, 758 00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,120 Speaker 1: But not so much the heat on the scent, but 759 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:57,440 Speaker 1: how it affects the dog and how it affects the 760 00:38:57,480 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 1: dog's ability to breathe because the dog has to be 761 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,400 Speaker 1: you through it snows in order process sent So we 762 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:06,200 Speaker 1: worked this weekend at this workshop and it was terribly warm, 763 00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:08,920 Speaker 1: I mean it was in the nineties, and we did 764 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,560 Speaker 1: a hunt command drill, and I said, you know, we 765 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,600 Speaker 1: got to be realistic with these dogs, not only because 766 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:19,360 Speaker 1: from a safety factor, but also from a like, let's 767 00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 1: let's recognize some of the things we do are going 768 00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,080 Speaker 1: to be maybe not that challenging on a normal day, 769 00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,440 Speaker 1: they're extremely challenging today because not only are we asking 770 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:33,320 Speaker 1: the dog to process sent with its nose and fine stuff, 771 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 1: we're asking them to be comfortable in degree weather, in 772 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,240 Speaker 1: the sun when they're when it's June and they're probably 773 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 1: not in their best shape for the year. And so 774 00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 1: if you if you're having a hard time, and I 775 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,880 Speaker 1: and I I think it's a real good thing to 776 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,279 Speaker 1: put yourself in the dog's shoes occasionally, because I said 777 00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:53,919 Speaker 1: that a few people you know that get frustrated. I've 778 00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:55,680 Speaker 1: said this over the years. When people get frustrated with 779 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:59,520 Speaker 1: their dogs not doing well in tough conditions, I tell them, well, 780 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:02,040 Speaker 1: why don't you run a couple of laps down and back, 781 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:03,879 Speaker 1: and then I'm gonna see if you can talk carry 782 00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:06,399 Speaker 1: on a good conversation with me, because they can't even 783 00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,000 Speaker 1: they can't even say their name because they're just huffing 784 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,200 Speaker 1: and puffing. I say, now you know what it feels 785 00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:13,799 Speaker 1: like to be your dog to have to go try 786 00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,879 Speaker 1: to do something that completely relies on using your nose 787 00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:19,360 Speaker 1: when you're having a hard time catching your breath to 788 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,400 Speaker 1: begin with. I think we have to keep all that 789 00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:25,040 Speaker 1: stuff in in, you know, in the back of our minds. Well, yeah, 790 00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:27,640 Speaker 1: and you have to. You have to look at when 791 00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:31,320 Speaker 1: you get certain challenging conditions, like the extreme heat that 792 00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:33,160 Speaker 1: we've had lately. A lot of times you don't get 793 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,840 Speaker 1: any wind either, you know, you get those just dead days. 794 00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:38,160 Speaker 1: And you know, Mark and I just did did some 795 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:41,320 Speaker 1: stuff on this as far as like deer studies with 796 00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,480 Speaker 1: with you know, a lot of hunters think that the 797 00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:46,840 Speaker 1: deer movement, you know, really really falls off the cliff 798 00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:49,640 Speaker 1: when the wind is blowing hard, and they've studied that, 799 00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:51,680 Speaker 1: and it's just not true. It's the opposite, you know, 800 00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,240 Speaker 1: and it the worst times to hunt for buck movement 801 00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:58,279 Speaker 1: are when there's no there's no wind whatsoever. And if 802 00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:00,600 Speaker 1: you like it's it's making a But I don't think 803 00:41:00,600 --> 00:41:02,719 Speaker 1: it's a big one to say it's probably because you're 804 00:41:02,719 --> 00:41:04,319 Speaker 1: taking their nose out of the game and they don't 805 00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:07,600 Speaker 1: like that, sure, and so I mean, it's so much 806 00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:10,880 Speaker 1: of that stuff. I think, you know, this is why 807 00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:12,560 Speaker 1: I want to have you on here. I think it's 808 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:17,080 Speaker 1: so cool how many how much dogs can teach you 809 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,040 Speaker 1: about deer, you know, even if even if you have 810 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,640 Speaker 1: to do make those little leaps. It's just like there's 811 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,520 Speaker 1: so many things that are similar about them. Yeah, and 812 00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,960 Speaker 1: when you start thinking about, you know, the the beauty 813 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,719 Speaker 1: of the dog for tracking purposes is it's there's a 814 00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,840 Speaker 1: lot of levels to it. One of them is a 815 00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:39,000 Speaker 1: completeness to it, like if you want if you wounded deer. 816 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:41,560 Speaker 1: First of all, deer don't die when you shoot them. 817 00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:44,560 Speaker 1: I mean, I I think some people have a hard 818 00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:48,680 Speaker 1: time believing that, you know, they don't. They're they're the toughest, 819 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:51,120 Speaker 1: the toughest damn animals out. I mean, they're just so 820 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,520 Speaker 1: they're will to live and and they're they're just sheer 821 00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:58,960 Speaker 1: toughness is is hard to wrap around our you know, 822 00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:02,919 Speaker 1: our little brains. And I I think it's funny when 823 00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:04,719 Speaker 1: you think about, like God, some of the some of 824 00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:06,839 Speaker 1: the injuries I see bucks come out of during the rug, 825 00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:10,560 Speaker 1: and I go, if if that happened to me, I'd 826 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,239 Speaker 1: lay down and hope I wish I died, you know, 827 00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 1: like I don't know that. And then you think, now, 828 00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:18,360 Speaker 1: then they're gonna go run up and down hills and 829 00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:21,440 Speaker 1: and continue to chase and not eat not. I mean 830 00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:23,680 Speaker 1: that the stuff that their bodies are capable of doing 831 00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:28,560 Speaker 1: is really remarkable, and we we don't. We have to 832 00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: understand that just because we put a hit on the 833 00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:37,680 Speaker 1: deer there there are there are percentage chances that it's 834 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,279 Speaker 1: not dead. It's not it's not going to be a 835 00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:42,960 Speaker 1: mortal world. And so the best tracking dog in the 836 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:47,000 Speaker 1: world I won't find a deer that doesn't die. And 837 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:50,840 Speaker 1: and we have to accept that, which which sometimes is 838 00:42:50,840 --> 00:42:53,839 Speaker 1: a struggle. But the beauty of the tracking dog is 839 00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:57,879 Speaker 1: for me, it's a peace of mind. It's an understanding 840 00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:02,399 Speaker 1: that look, I probably did. If you, if you brought 841 00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:04,839 Speaker 1: in any tracking dog from somewhere else, or you used 842 00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:07,600 Speaker 1: your own tracking dog, I think there's a sense of 843 00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:11,960 Speaker 1: comfort in knowing. I think you did just about everything 844 00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:16,279 Speaker 1: you could from a moral standpoint, from an ethical standpoint, 845 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:20,880 Speaker 1: to do to recover that, to recover that animal, And 846 00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:26,040 Speaker 1: I I know how deer hunters are. I'm like that 847 00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:28,880 Speaker 1: I've lost sleep at night. I've lost sleep at night, 848 00:43:28,920 --> 00:43:31,320 Speaker 1: dear with dear that I haven't shot as much less 849 00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:34,440 Speaker 1: those that I have shot and and and I've lost 850 00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:38,120 Speaker 1: here over the years. And if you haven't, God bless you. 851 00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:43,759 Speaker 1: Uh it, don't criticize, Yeah, don't criticize that. And I 852 00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:45,560 Speaker 1: you know, I just I think that's easy for us 853 00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: to do in it and I think you hunt long enough, 854 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:52,239 Speaker 1: you go through it. It's it's it's the hardest part. 855 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:54,760 Speaker 1: It's one of the hardest parts of being a hunger um. 856 00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:57,759 Speaker 1: But it happens, and in the dog allowing me to 857 00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:02,719 Speaker 1: understand a I don't think it's dead. If it is, 858 00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:06,160 Speaker 1: I did everything I could to try to find it. 859 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:09,200 Speaker 1: And there is a sense I think of satisfaction when 860 00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:11,120 Speaker 1: it comes to that. Yeah, well you bring up a 861 00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:14,600 Speaker 1: good point there that I think you can't talk about enough, 862 00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:16,360 Speaker 1: which when it when it comes to deer hunting and 863 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:21,000 Speaker 1: specifically shooting deer, like, the thing that's most dangerous is 864 00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:23,799 Speaker 1: what you think, you know, Like, I know, I hit 865 00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:25,880 Speaker 1: him right here. Ask any guide out there right like 866 00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:29,040 Speaker 1: I him right behind the shoulder, perfect shot. And then 867 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:30,480 Speaker 1: all of a sudden you can't find him, and it's 868 00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:34,120 Speaker 1: like it didn't work that way. And that's why that 869 00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:38,759 Speaker 1: those situations when you're like, man, I know that I 870 00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:41,600 Speaker 1: saw that arrow hit here and he reacted this way, 871 00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: when you find them and get to actually see what happened, 872 00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:46,799 Speaker 1: or like you said, you get that dog on that 873 00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:49,359 Speaker 1: track and that dog is just not interested and it's 874 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:51,399 Speaker 1: a season seven year old dog has done and been there, 875 00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:56,080 Speaker 1: done that. You go, Okay, something different happened that. That 876 00:44:56,320 --> 00:44:59,360 Speaker 1: is kind of one of those weird experiential things that 877 00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:02,520 Speaker 1: over time makes you a way better hunter because you 878 00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:05,319 Speaker 1: just realize, like, man, I get this stuff wrong a 879 00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:10,640 Speaker 1: lot for sure, and and and accepting it, realizing that 880 00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,600 Speaker 1: and being okay with that, it's a big it's a 881 00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:16,799 Speaker 1: big step, um and and it's a life step, you know, 882 00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:19,600 Speaker 1: accepting the fact that you're not always right and and 883 00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:22,280 Speaker 1: being okay with it and learning from it is really important. 884 00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:26,080 Speaker 1: The biggest I think one of a tracking dog and 885 00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:30,719 Speaker 1: a tracker's best friend is a trail camera. Because the 886 00:45:31,280 --> 00:45:34,799 Speaker 1: deer that you knew, you know, are dead when they 887 00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:37,920 Speaker 1: show back up late season, when they show back up 888 00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:41,080 Speaker 1: next year, when they show back up you know, somewhere 889 00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:44,520 Speaker 1: down the road and you go, oh my god, they're 890 00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:50,280 Speaker 1: still alive. That is that? Ask any you know, serious 891 00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:52,560 Speaker 1: tracker that tracks for other people, Like I don't track. 892 00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:54,840 Speaker 1: I don't go on tracks. I don't I'm not a tracker. 893 00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:57,799 Speaker 1: I don't go on tracks for other people because they 894 00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:00,880 Speaker 1: literally don't have time to do it. I'm I'm I 895 00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:04,560 Speaker 1: checked for myself. I checked from my family, close friends, um, 896 00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:08,839 Speaker 1: just because of available time. But I have a lot 897 00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:12,279 Speaker 1: of friends that are, you know, really serious trackers, and 898 00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:15,720 Speaker 1: there is there is a even when their dog tells 899 00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:20,000 Speaker 1: them it's not dead, there's always that you know, oh man, 900 00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,000 Speaker 1: I just you know, I don't want to disappoint You 901 00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:26,359 Speaker 1: don't want to be disappointing to two people. And when 902 00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:29,480 Speaker 1: you go and you you look, you don't find it. 903 00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:33,360 Speaker 1: To get that email, to get a text message with 904 00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:37,680 Speaker 1: the picture, you know, that's a real comforting feeling. It's 905 00:46:37,719 --> 00:46:40,120 Speaker 1: a real reassuring feeling. It's a confidence builder for you 906 00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:42,680 Speaker 1: and your dog. Occasionally you're going to get that picture 907 00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:47,040 Speaker 1: that says, you know, we found it, and that that's 908 00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:52,000 Speaker 1: okay too, because at that point, the biggest question, well 909 00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,960 Speaker 1: where was it? And what what can what was the hit? 910 00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:57,400 Speaker 1: How can you start to look at it? Because you know, 911 00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:00,360 Speaker 1: the a lot of times what ends up happening as 912 00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:03,160 Speaker 1: and I'm not a numbers guy. I could care less 913 00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:06,759 Speaker 1: about recovery percentages. And there are some statisticians out there 914 00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:10,440 Speaker 1: that you know, their their trackers or there shed hunters 915 00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:13,160 Speaker 1: are there, whatever, and they measure everything by numbers, and 916 00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:16,720 Speaker 1: I just I don't like that. I'm not really interested 917 00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:23,120 Speaker 1: in stats. But um, the the idea of successful recoveries. 918 00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,960 Speaker 1: You know, sometimes we we find out that, you know, 919 00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:29,880 Speaker 1: we couldn't find it, and so now I doubt it. 920 00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:32,520 Speaker 1: Now I gotta have a track that has no recovery, 921 00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:35,800 Speaker 1: and the deer might be dead, the deer might die anyway. 922 00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:40,239 Speaker 1: But what ends up happening is deer goes off off 923 00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:42,719 Speaker 1: the property that you have the ability to look for 924 00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:45,280 Speaker 1: and crosses offense and you can't go over there and 925 00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:48,600 Speaker 1: and you can't get permission, and that a lot of 926 00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,839 Speaker 1: times that's how it happens, you know, And so all 927 00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:54,000 Speaker 1: these things can come up, and it's it's a shame, 928 00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:57,719 Speaker 1: but it's reality. And it's the part that you know, 929 00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:02,840 Speaker 1: without the dog, I feel like we would feel we 930 00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:06,840 Speaker 1: I would feel like we haven't given it everything we 931 00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:08,840 Speaker 1: need to give it to, you know, with the with 932 00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:12,279 Speaker 1: with the effort from an effort standpoint. So yeah, it's 933 00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,000 Speaker 1: the reality. Yeah, And I mean it's it's important to 934 00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:17,759 Speaker 1: say too that you know they're not foolproof either. I 935 00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,520 Speaker 1: mean there's their situations with a dog, like you said, 936 00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:25,000 Speaker 1: with the conditions, or just some some anomalies that show up. 937 00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:26,960 Speaker 1: I mean I talked to you about this, but my 938 00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:30,960 Speaker 1: daughter shot a dough in northern Wisconsin last year with 939 00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:35,440 Speaker 1: a crossbowl and it it was keyed up. You know, 940 00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:37,480 Speaker 1: those things are loud. It was a weird deal and 941 00:48:37,520 --> 00:48:39,319 Speaker 1: it it looked to me like a good hit. But 942 00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:41,759 Speaker 1: it was fast, you know. I mean like, so I 943 00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:43,520 Speaker 1: was like, I don't know, and you know, if they 944 00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:45,439 Speaker 1: don't go down in sight, then I'm like, okay, well 945 00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:50,400 Speaker 1: now we don't know. And we ended up having some 946 00:48:50,560 --> 00:48:53,560 Speaker 1: rain come in that night and we had a giant 947 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:55,680 Speaker 1: bear and I know this because I saw the deer 948 00:48:55,719 --> 00:48:57,440 Speaker 1: spook and then I checked a trail camera. We had 949 00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:00,359 Speaker 1: a bar get on that trail. And so the next 950 00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:02,680 Speaker 1: day I found a blood tracking guy to come in 951 00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:05,000 Speaker 1: and he brought his he had draw draw hars and 952 00:49:05,040 --> 00:49:09,080 Speaker 1: he came in and I couldn't find it, and it 953 00:49:09,080 --> 00:49:10,960 Speaker 1: couldn't get on it and never really get the dog 954 00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:12,959 Speaker 1: excited about it. And it was one of those things 955 00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,480 Speaker 1: that I don't know. I don't know if that was 956 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,440 Speaker 1: because that deer made it and it was just not 957 00:49:17,560 --> 00:49:19,440 Speaker 1: that great of a hit. I really, I really don't know, 958 00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:22,840 Speaker 1: or something with that bear screwed it up or bumped 959 00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,080 Speaker 1: it in a weird way. It's just it was like 960 00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,080 Speaker 1: a good reminder that you think, Okay, well this is 961 00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:30,959 Speaker 1: going to be the ticket, and like it's way better 962 00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,000 Speaker 1: than not doing that. But it's not a guarantee. Yeah, 963 00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:36,680 Speaker 1: I mean dogs have bad days too, you know, Like 964 00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,000 Speaker 1: I I've I've worked in in this. This is something 965 00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:42,560 Speaker 1: that as a trainer you'll get. You'll get it too, 966 00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:44,640 Speaker 1: and the more you do it, the more you'll understand 967 00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:47,279 Speaker 1: it because you'll see it. But you know, I've there 968 00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:49,879 Speaker 1: have been times where I go, there's no reason why 969 00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:52,720 Speaker 1: my dog couldn't find that that I just can't figure 970 00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:54,480 Speaker 1: out why, And I don't know what it is. I 971 00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:59,000 Speaker 1: don't know if maybe they have a headache, maybe they're dehydrated, 972 00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:01,360 Speaker 1: maybe there's something that's one on inside their body that 973 00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:05,000 Speaker 1: is they're struggling, but they're they're probably way more consistent 974 00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,040 Speaker 1: than I am when it comes to that kind of stuff. 975 00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:10,799 Speaker 1: But there are things that happened that we don't recognize 976 00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:14,480 Speaker 1: or realize when scenting conditions. That's why I say some 977 00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,839 Speaker 1: of the biggest overlooked things are the conditions I think, Um, 978 00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:22,200 Speaker 1: you know, there are dogs that will find that will 979 00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:27,040 Speaker 1: track no problem forty eight hours later, seventy two hours later, 980 00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,239 Speaker 1: they'll they'll get on a track and go and they'll 981 00:50:29,320 --> 00:50:31,560 Speaker 1: nail it. And then there are dogs you can put 982 00:50:31,560 --> 00:50:36,520 Speaker 1: on twelve hours later that struggle, struggle, struggle to get 983 00:50:36,600 --> 00:50:39,640 Speaker 1: on the track and it that's a clear indicator of 984 00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:43,320 Speaker 1: like the conditions. That seventy two hour day was perfect 985 00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:47,840 Speaker 1: and it made everything was in place, and you know, 986 00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:51,680 Speaker 1: the twelve hour one might have been the toughest, hardest conditions. 987 00:50:51,719 --> 00:50:55,040 Speaker 1: And it just doesn't matter that if you can't smell it, 988 00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:59,400 Speaker 1: you can't smell it, and and that it becomes, it creates, 989 00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:03,640 Speaker 1: it can create eight those conditions can create more issues 990 00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:06,520 Speaker 1: for a dog than anything you know, and the and 991 00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:08,560 Speaker 1: the and the reality is too when you start tracking 992 00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:13,120 Speaker 1: these deer, we we bump, we screwed up ourselves for 993 00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:16,799 Speaker 1: trackers more often than not by tracking too quickly. And 994 00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:19,440 Speaker 1: I think that's natural, you know, like when I was 995 00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:23,440 Speaker 1: growing up without even thinking about using dogs. My famili's 996 00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:25,960 Speaker 1: and it comes from my grandpa and my dad, and 997 00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:29,279 Speaker 1: we thought you just get after it good after that 998 00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:32,279 Speaker 1: deer and go well. A lot of times I think 999 00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:36,000 Speaker 1: that got shot, deer are gonna die, Like they're gonna die, 1000 00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:37,759 Speaker 1: but they could, they could take them a long time, 1001 00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,520 Speaker 1: like if you take a day or two, and so 1002 00:51:41,320 --> 00:51:45,040 Speaker 1: if they're not pushed, they're not in a hurry to 1003 00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:47,560 Speaker 1: go for a run like they they're they're going to 1004 00:51:47,800 --> 00:51:52,040 Speaker 1: hunker down. Every time you bump a deer, your chances 1005 00:51:52,040 --> 00:51:54,319 Speaker 1: of recovering number that much less because you just put 1006 00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:56,360 Speaker 1: a whole another boost of energy into that deer. You 1007 00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:59,799 Speaker 1: just put a whole another shot of adrenaline into them. 1008 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,360 Speaker 1: You just put all these Now, all of a sudden, 1009 00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:04,719 Speaker 1: that deer pushes a little bit further and he crosses 1010 00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:07,799 Speaker 1: some type of a barrier that makes it that much 1011 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:10,880 Speaker 1: more challenging, where if we had just it's it's really tough. 1012 00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:15,520 Speaker 1: But the hard part is sometimes deciding to say, let's 1013 00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:18,000 Speaker 1: not go after it yet, let's wait, and that that 1014 00:52:18,120 --> 00:52:22,040 Speaker 1: at times is more often it's the way to do it, 1015 00:52:22,080 --> 00:52:25,360 Speaker 1: you know, when in doubt, back out? Is that sane? 1016 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,200 Speaker 1: And I think there's a lot to it, whether you're 1017 00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:28,960 Speaker 1: a dog or whether you're going with a dog or not. 1018 00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:31,160 Speaker 1: The other thing is is he'll half the people that 1019 00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:34,000 Speaker 1: call for a dog call after they can't find it. 1020 00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:38,240 Speaker 1: And they brought every guy in camp and grid searched 1021 00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:42,400 Speaker 1: every property that they had and every neighboring property. And 1022 00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:44,959 Speaker 1: then you bring a dog in you say, here, sort 1023 00:52:45,040 --> 00:52:47,560 Speaker 1: that out. And that's really challenging. And I don't know 1024 00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:52,240 Speaker 1: that's fair to say that. You know, Um, it's mistakes 1025 00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:55,200 Speaker 1: that we make, and then we we like to well, 1026 00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:57,239 Speaker 1: that dog is not that dog is no good. Well, no, 1027 00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,920 Speaker 1: it's not that, it's we didn't handle it properly. Yeah, 1028 00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:03,640 Speaker 1: I mean you see that with dogs. You see the 1029 00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:06,280 Speaker 1: people who know dogs really well given in the dogs 1030 00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:09,480 Speaker 1: every chance to do what they do without interfering, like 1031 00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:12,759 Speaker 1: you said, without yelling, without moving too fast, with with 1032 00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:15,200 Speaker 1: you know, respect to the wind and how that's working 1033 00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:17,120 Speaker 1: and the conditions and everything. There's a there's a lot 1034 00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:32,719 Speaker 1: that's going on there. Let's switch gears a second here. 1035 00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:34,600 Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about something else. You know, 1036 00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:37,359 Speaker 1: I know you're you know, you're big, You're big into 1037 00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:40,240 Speaker 1: the shed dog world. That's that that that's been covered 1038 00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:43,160 Speaker 1: a lot that I was thinking about this um and 1039 00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:46,200 Speaker 1: and how to like tie dogs into the white tailed world. 1040 00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:49,359 Speaker 1: And man, one of the things that my dogs teach 1041 00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:52,040 Speaker 1: me and you know, doing this job, like you're you're 1042 00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:55,200 Speaker 1: pretty tied up in a tree stand until at least 1043 00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:57,080 Speaker 1: for me mid November, and then I switch over and 1044 00:53:57,080 --> 00:53:58,920 Speaker 1: I do a lot of late season grouse in a 1045 00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,600 Speaker 1: lot of late season pheasant thing. And I'll tell you 1046 00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:04,839 Speaker 1: what those pheasants take or those dogs take me into 1047 00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:07,560 Speaker 1: places where pheasants live right after the gun season ends 1048 00:54:07,560 --> 00:54:10,560 Speaker 1: here in Minnesota, and the amount of freaking deer that 1049 00:54:10,600 --> 00:54:15,799 Speaker 1: we jump in those places that sit so tight is incredible, 1050 00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:20,400 Speaker 1: like really quality bucks on public land in the immediate 1051 00:54:20,480 --> 00:54:23,520 Speaker 1: days after gun season. And I just it's always such 1052 00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:27,479 Speaker 1: an aha moment to me when when that happens. Yeah, 1053 00:54:27,480 --> 00:54:31,840 Speaker 1: and I think you can that for sure. But also 1054 00:54:31,880 --> 00:54:35,560 Speaker 1: when it comes to tracking, like tracking dogs give you 1055 00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:39,719 Speaker 1: a real education because when you don't know where the 1056 00:54:39,800 --> 00:54:42,000 Speaker 1: deer went and you're following it with a dog and 1057 00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,160 Speaker 1: there's no visual sign, but you're getting you're getting some 1058 00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:46,800 Speaker 1: confirmation where you're finding a wound bed, or you're finding 1059 00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:50,160 Speaker 1: a little bit of some hair, or you're finding some 1060 00:54:50,200 --> 00:54:52,799 Speaker 1: type of sign to con confirm you're on the right track. 1061 00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:55,759 Speaker 1: You start to learn really quickly that deer do some 1062 00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:59,439 Speaker 1: pretty patternable things when their wounded, and like deer will 1063 00:54:59,480 --> 00:55:01,920 Speaker 1: go to sir in areas and and you know, the 1064 00:55:02,120 --> 00:55:04,600 Speaker 1: everybody knows they go to wounded deer's gonna go to water. 1065 00:55:04,920 --> 00:55:08,600 Speaker 1: That's true in a lot of scenarios, but they'll I've 1066 00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:11,640 Speaker 1: also heard people tell me a mortally wounded deer won't 1067 00:55:11,640 --> 00:55:14,560 Speaker 1: go uphill by hunting the buff hunting the bluff country, 1068 00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:16,279 Speaker 1: and I've tracked a hell of a lot of deer 1069 00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:17,799 Speaker 1: up to the top of the hill and found him dead. 1070 00:55:18,239 --> 00:55:21,640 Speaker 1: So if we with, you know, following the dog. So 1071 00:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,359 Speaker 1: if we don't, I think the one thing about deer 1072 00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:29,800 Speaker 1: is they'll will never know everything about them and they'll 1073 00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:32,719 Speaker 1: never cease to amaze us or surprise us. And so 1074 00:55:33,360 --> 00:55:36,400 Speaker 1: you know, I've shed hunting quite a bit this spring, 1075 00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:42,439 Speaker 1: and shed hunting led me into areas that I've thought 1076 00:55:42,440 --> 00:55:44,640 Speaker 1: were great grouse covers. Because I love grouse on it, 1077 00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:46,320 Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh god, I'm in this growl. I 1078 00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:48,759 Speaker 1: mean this these popa slashings, and I'm going, man, this 1079 00:55:48,840 --> 00:55:51,080 Speaker 1: is this is good grouse cover. And I realized I 1080 00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:53,440 Speaker 1: wasn't flushing any grouse in there when I was shed hunting. 1081 00:55:53,600 --> 00:55:55,640 Speaker 1: I was flushing the grouse up on the edges and 1082 00:55:55,680 --> 00:55:57,600 Speaker 1: the prickly ash on the edges of the fields. For 1083 00:55:57,640 --> 00:55:59,560 Speaker 1: whatever reason, that's where they were when they were drumming 1084 00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:01,799 Speaker 1: in there. And I think that prickly ash serves as 1085 00:56:01,840 --> 00:56:05,120 Speaker 1: kind of like a shield from birds of prey. So 1086 00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:07,160 Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, that's kind of interesting. Well then 1087 00:56:07,160 --> 00:56:09,120 Speaker 1: I go out on that point and I find this 1088 00:56:09,239 --> 00:56:11,680 Speaker 1: little isolated bed on the end of the point and 1089 00:56:11,719 --> 00:56:14,160 Speaker 1: there's a shed from five or six years ago that's 1090 00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:16,719 Speaker 1: green and laying underneath the log. And I'm like, a 1091 00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:19,000 Speaker 1: buck lays here, you know, and this And then I 1092 00:56:19,040 --> 00:56:20,799 Speaker 1: sit there and I look and I go look at 1093 00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:23,680 Speaker 1: his view, look at that northwest wind that's in its face, 1094 00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:26,279 Speaker 1: look at all these different things. That makes sense. I 1095 00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:29,120 Speaker 1: probably don't go there ever, if I'm not shed on 1096 00:56:29,200 --> 00:56:32,319 Speaker 1: you with my dog. And so it opened my eyes 1097 00:56:32,360 --> 00:56:33,520 Speaker 1: to it. And then I going out into some of 1098 00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:35,759 Speaker 1: the slashings, and I look at and I go I 1099 00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:38,080 Speaker 1: literally stood in one spot and counted over a hundred 1100 00:56:38,120 --> 00:56:41,759 Speaker 1: rubbed popple slashings, and I went, man, this is a net. 1101 00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:43,799 Speaker 1: This is like a breeding nest in here. And I 1102 00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:45,880 Speaker 1: think what was happening was it's so thick. You know 1103 00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:48,680 Speaker 1: how those covers are. There's just such stem density. So 1104 00:56:48,719 --> 00:56:52,080 Speaker 1: I'm going, well, this is great cover. I don't think 1105 00:56:52,120 --> 00:56:54,879 Speaker 1: dear living it most time of the year, but I 1106 00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,879 Speaker 1: guarantee you. And I've watched Bucks walk out of that 1107 00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:01,799 Speaker 1: stuff and and fee while tending a doll and then 1108 00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:04,120 Speaker 1: turning and walk right back into it. And I've watched 1109 00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:07,200 Speaker 1: him from a distancing that I'm going I think, I 1110 00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:09,279 Speaker 1: don't think for a second that that Buck doesn't bring 1111 00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:13,400 Speaker 1: that dough into that complete tangled mass because it helps 1112 00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:16,000 Speaker 1: I think him keep other bucks off of her. Like 1113 00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:19,360 Speaker 1: I think it's like this nest of greeting, and I 1114 00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:22,720 Speaker 1: think all those rubs are completely a sign of his frustration, 1115 00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:25,560 Speaker 1: like he's I guarantee you he is, and and other 1116 00:57:25,640 --> 00:57:29,720 Speaker 1: Bucks probably you know, cruising around this hot dough that's 1117 00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:33,040 Speaker 1: in there, and they're so damn mad at each other 1118 00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:36,240 Speaker 1: and upset they're just shredding every tree they see. And 1119 00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:39,520 Speaker 1: so I made a mental note of a couple of 1120 00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:43,439 Speaker 1: spots and then said, our major corridor is going into 1121 00:57:43,480 --> 00:57:45,880 Speaker 1: this thing and coming out of this thing on both ends. 1122 00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:47,760 Speaker 1: And I don't know that it's not a bad idea 1123 00:57:47,800 --> 00:57:49,880 Speaker 1: for us to have a stand hung on both ends 1124 00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:51,920 Speaker 1: of it. You can't hunt inside of it, You'll never 1125 00:57:51,960 --> 00:57:53,800 Speaker 1: be able to shoot. But if I hunted on both 1126 00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:56,560 Speaker 1: ends of it, there's probably about a two week window 1127 00:57:57,360 --> 00:57:59,800 Speaker 1: that I would have value in sitting there and spending 1128 00:57:59,840 --> 00:58:03,160 Speaker 1: all day because you know, just the number of the 1129 00:58:03,240 --> 00:58:06,960 Speaker 1: amount of sign, the volume of sign that was there. Um, 1130 00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:08,600 Speaker 1: But I don't find that if I'm not shed on it, 1131 00:58:08,720 --> 00:58:10,400 Speaker 1: I don't find them if I'm not with those dogs 1132 00:58:10,400 --> 00:58:12,760 Speaker 1: in there. Well that's yeah, That's what I want to 1133 00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:17,600 Speaker 1: talk about, is the we we kind of talk in this, 1134 00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:21,040 Speaker 1: you know, in this white tail space specifically, we say, 1135 00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:23,880 Speaker 1: you know, oh, go scout this way, scout this way, 1136 00:58:23,960 --> 00:58:26,400 Speaker 1: get in there, look at this cover tons of ground. 1137 00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:28,680 Speaker 1: And I always think, like, man, how many people are 1138 00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:32,400 Speaker 1: actually doing that without like a little more motivation and 1139 00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:34,600 Speaker 1: taking the dog out? You know. It's kind of like 1140 00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:36,160 Speaker 1: I talk on here all the time about. You know, 1141 00:58:36,240 --> 00:58:38,200 Speaker 1: I go on turkey hunts and I find awesome places 1142 00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:41,800 Speaker 1: to deer hunt. I go pheasant hunting, and I get 1143 00:58:41,840 --> 00:58:46,080 Speaker 1: a just master's course on how good bucks are at 1144 00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:48,360 Speaker 1: hiding from us. And when they make the decision that 1145 00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,480 Speaker 1: they don't want to get seen, they can be They 1146 00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:54,640 Speaker 1: can do that living in a county with seven trees 1147 00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,800 Speaker 1: and very very little actual cover, and they can disappear 1148 00:58:58,880 --> 00:59:00,840 Speaker 1: on you and they will sit there. I mean, we 1149 00:59:00,920 --> 00:59:05,360 Speaker 1: have times, so many times every season where we'll be 1150 00:59:05,600 --> 00:59:07,640 Speaker 1: We'll be, you know, looking for a rooster we shot, 1151 00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:09,640 Speaker 1: or just working the dogs, and there'll be a little 1152 00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:12,560 Speaker 1: tiny willow patch or something on the edge of the cattails, 1153 00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:14,640 Speaker 1: and a buck will scare you as he gets up. 1154 00:59:14,640 --> 00:59:16,760 Speaker 1: He's so close, and that's a buck. And a lot 1155 00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,600 Speaker 1: of times it's it's behind us already. So that's a 1156 00:59:19,640 --> 00:59:22,480 Speaker 1: buck that's, let you know, two or three guys go by, 1157 00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:26,120 Speaker 1: two dogs go by, and has sat so tight that 1158 00:59:26,160 --> 00:59:29,200 Speaker 1: he's busting out the back side after you've already went through. 1159 00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:30,400 Speaker 1: And I just look at that and I go, man, 1160 00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:33,080 Speaker 1: you think about these big woods bucks that you hunt 1161 00:59:33,080 --> 00:59:35,280 Speaker 1: in northern Wisconsin or somewhere else, or you're down in 1162 00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:38,960 Speaker 1: Louisiana and the swamps, like they have the advantages they 1163 00:59:39,000 --> 00:59:42,560 Speaker 1: have we can't even hardly comprehend. Yeah, I think about 1164 00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:46,360 Speaker 1: think about when it's shed season, you know, I I 1165 00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:49,240 Speaker 1: see a lot of it and we see it too, 1166 00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:52,760 Speaker 1: But um, you think of deadheads, like how many people 1167 00:59:52,840 --> 00:59:54,960 Speaker 1: find deadheads when their shed honey? You know, it's just 1168 00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:58,920 Speaker 1: there's a lot of deadheads found. And I think, what 1169 00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:01,360 Speaker 1: what's interesting for me when I shed hound and I 1170 01:00:01,520 --> 01:00:03,720 Speaker 1: go to places that we've never been before, like we 1171 01:00:03,760 --> 01:00:06,120 Speaker 1: don't not not not ever been before, but don't go 1172 01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:08,160 Speaker 1: any other time of the year. And I think when 1173 01:00:08,160 --> 01:00:12,160 Speaker 1: we find those deadheads, it's a reminder of like make 1174 01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:15,320 Speaker 1: note of it. You know, why why do you find 1175 01:00:15,600 --> 01:00:18,800 Speaker 1: so many deadheads in the same similar chunk of woods. 1176 01:00:19,160 --> 01:00:21,280 Speaker 1: It seems like you do year in and year out, 1177 01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:24,840 Speaker 1: and they're not necessarily all shot by us, even like 1178 01:00:24,920 --> 01:00:28,640 Speaker 1: neighboring properties. Dear end up in little pockets. And I go, 1179 01:00:29,240 --> 01:00:32,440 Speaker 1: it's really something that if you don't keep it in 1180 01:00:32,440 --> 01:00:34,640 Speaker 1: the back of your mind, or if you do keep 1181 01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:36,520 Speaker 1: it in the back of your mind and it comes 1182 01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:38,800 Speaker 1: to fall and you make a shot on a deer, 1183 01:00:39,240 --> 01:00:43,040 Speaker 1: you know, like there's a chance that maybe if you're 1184 01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:46,280 Speaker 1: finding consistency with that, that's a spot you should look. 1185 01:00:46,360 --> 01:00:50,000 Speaker 1: And I just think that we don't we get so 1186 01:00:50,560 --> 01:00:53,200 Speaker 1: myself and the guys I hunt with, we get so 1187 01:00:53,720 --> 01:00:57,280 Speaker 1: touchy about pressure on our farm. And one of the 1188 01:00:57,280 --> 01:01:02,280 Speaker 1: things that that I think is a real underestimated value 1189 01:01:02,280 --> 01:01:05,680 Speaker 1: of a tracking dog is how efficient they are and 1190 01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:08,320 Speaker 1: how quickly they can get me into an area to 1191 01:01:08,440 --> 01:01:11,560 Speaker 1: find a dead deer and out. And it's even like 1192 01:01:11,600 --> 01:01:13,480 Speaker 1: I don't even I don't take dogs on just the 1193 01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:15,400 Speaker 1: tracks that I can't find the deer. I take them 1194 01:01:15,440 --> 01:01:17,720 Speaker 1: on every track, whether it's a good shot or not, 1195 01:01:17,840 --> 01:01:20,680 Speaker 1: because it's an experienced builder for him, it's confidence builder 1196 01:01:20,760 --> 01:01:23,680 Speaker 1: in me. It's an ability for me to truly read 1197 01:01:23,720 --> 01:01:26,280 Speaker 1: their body language on the real thing. And it is 1198 01:01:26,440 --> 01:01:30,120 Speaker 1: the most effective way to get in and out of 1199 01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:34,000 Speaker 1: a piece of property with the least amount of fooling around. 1200 01:01:34,400 --> 01:01:38,560 Speaker 1: So I mean, I I've shot dear that like we're 1201 01:01:38,600 --> 01:01:42,080 Speaker 1: easy recoveries did not use a dog, And it turned 1202 01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:45,840 Speaker 1: into forty five minutes to an hour of stepping on, 1203 01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:48,120 Speaker 1: stepping on, stepping on, stepping on, and all of a sudden, 1204 01:01:48,120 --> 01:01:50,600 Speaker 1: there it is, well, if I had a dog I'm 1205 01:01:50,680 --> 01:01:54,400 Speaker 1: in and where I helped a really good friend of 1206 01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:57,800 Speaker 1: mine who is an our and I trained a dog 1207 01:01:57,880 --> 01:02:00,360 Speaker 1: for him, and they bring every dog. They bring the 1208 01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:02,800 Speaker 1: dog on every track, the best hits, the worst hits, 1209 01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:04,840 Speaker 1: they bring it on every track. And I can't tell 1210 01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:07,920 Speaker 1: you how efficient we got getting deer out of the 1211 01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:11,200 Speaker 1: woods and are the clients were just amazed because they're 1212 01:02:11,240 --> 01:02:13,400 Speaker 1: just like, they don't even the clients don't even come 1213 01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:16,880 Speaker 1: with like we me and my buddy Mark, who is 1214 01:02:16,920 --> 01:02:19,000 Speaker 1: the son of the owner. We would go in with 1215 01:02:19,080 --> 01:02:21,720 Speaker 1: the dog Scout that I trained for him, and we 1216 01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:24,160 Speaker 1: would go in and we would be back to the 1217 01:02:24,200 --> 01:02:29,720 Speaker 1: truck dragging in such short time that the clients are 1218 01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:32,160 Speaker 1: just like, how did you How did you in that 1219 01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:34,400 Speaker 1: kind of woods? How did you cover it that? And 1220 01:02:34,600 --> 01:02:37,480 Speaker 1: the dog the dog did. The dog did what what 1221 01:02:37,600 --> 01:02:40,040 Speaker 1: it took me maybe forty five minutes, The dog did 1222 01:02:40,040 --> 01:02:44,480 Speaker 1: in thirty seconds. And so that to me is of value, 1223 01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,720 Speaker 1: especially as a hunter, because it it allows me to 1224 01:02:47,760 --> 01:02:51,200 Speaker 1: put that much less pressure on prime real estate during 1225 01:02:51,240 --> 01:02:53,760 Speaker 1: a relatively short window of time when we do the 1226 01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:55,920 Speaker 1: majority of our hunting. Well, yeah, and when you're talking 1227 01:02:55,960 --> 01:02:58,960 Speaker 1: about an outfit or running people through. You know, any 1228 01:02:58,960 --> 01:03:02,640 Speaker 1: way you can minimize impact is is a good thing. 1229 01:03:02,720 --> 01:03:06,520 Speaker 1: But but also, um, you know, if you wanna if 1230 01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:10,480 Speaker 1: you want to recovery dog to develop, you know, that's 1231 01:03:10,640 --> 01:03:13,240 Speaker 1: that's the ticket. I mean, you've seen we've all seen 1232 01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:15,560 Speaker 1: the bird dogs that are weekend warriors that get out, 1233 01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:17,920 Speaker 1: you know, on one trip or two trips a season 1234 01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:20,800 Speaker 1: and they don't really know what they're doing. And you know, 1235 01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:22,680 Speaker 1: do owners get mad because there's kind of an ego 1236 01:03:22,720 --> 01:03:25,080 Speaker 1: thing going on, but it's like, well, you don't you know, 1237 01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:27,040 Speaker 1: if if there's something you only do like six days 1238 01:03:27,040 --> 01:03:30,280 Speaker 1: a year, you're not gonna be good at it, right right, Absolutely, 1239 01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:34,160 Speaker 1: the best, the best pheasant dogs you're from a hunting 1240 01:03:34,200 --> 01:03:38,000 Speaker 1: perspective are the ones that our guys, our guide dogs, 1241 01:03:38,200 --> 01:03:42,040 Speaker 1: they see so many opportunities. Um, you know, by the 1242 01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:43,880 Speaker 1: time when you get these dogs at hunt a couple 1243 01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:46,240 Speaker 1: of weekends a year, by the time the weekends done, 1244 01:03:46,240 --> 01:03:48,080 Speaker 1: they're just starting to figure it out and then it 1245 01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:50,400 Speaker 1: might be several weeks before they do it again, and 1246 01:03:50,440 --> 01:03:52,960 Speaker 1: then that might be it for the year. And so um, 1247 01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:56,680 Speaker 1: the more the more you can do most definitely, the 1248 01:03:56,720 --> 01:03:58,520 Speaker 1: more the better they're going to get. The more they're 1249 01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:00,880 Speaker 1: gonna because we can only rep locate it so much 1250 01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:03,880 Speaker 1: in training, and I think we do it. We've we've 1251 01:04:03,920 --> 01:04:06,600 Speaker 1: come up with ways of doing it pretty effectively. And 1252 01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,360 Speaker 1: but it's it's like I said before, it's insulting to 1253 01:04:09,360 --> 01:04:12,200 Speaker 1: think that we're truly going to like challenge the dog 1254 01:04:12,240 --> 01:04:14,000 Speaker 1: when it comes to that kind of stuff. I think 1255 01:04:14,080 --> 01:04:18,640 Speaker 1: training a dog is the one who benefits the most 1256 01:04:18,760 --> 01:04:22,120 Speaker 1: is us in understanding how to figure out when and 1257 01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:25,600 Speaker 1: when and why the dog is doing certain things. And 1258 01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:30,080 Speaker 1: the real thing is where That's where real dogs, that's 1259 01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:33,880 Speaker 1: where real tracking dogs develop, is going on actual tracks 1260 01:04:34,080 --> 01:04:38,240 Speaker 1: because it takes away are subconscious to cheat for him, 1261 01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:40,440 Speaker 1: like we don't. We can't help them because we don't 1262 01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:42,280 Speaker 1: know where it is. Where If I lay the track, 1263 01:04:42,800 --> 01:04:44,800 Speaker 1: I know where the track is, and it's easy for 1264 01:04:44,840 --> 01:04:48,240 Speaker 1: me to try to make myself feel good by positioning 1265 01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:51,240 Speaker 1: them to always succeed. And and so if you're gonna 1266 01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:54,320 Speaker 1: do it that way, I am a big proponent of 1267 01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:56,680 Speaker 1: the idea of have someone else lay the track. I 1268 01:04:56,720 --> 01:04:58,960 Speaker 1: think you should. You should do it that way, make 1269 01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,400 Speaker 1: it easy and set the dog up to succeed to 1270 01:05:01,440 --> 01:05:04,440 Speaker 1: start out with. But then when it comes to challenging 1271 01:05:05,160 --> 01:05:07,400 Speaker 1: have someone else put it out and you go track 1272 01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:11,200 Speaker 1: it where you don't necessarily know all the little turns 1273 01:05:11,280 --> 01:05:13,200 Speaker 1: that you put into it. You don't know the little 1274 01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:16,320 Speaker 1: loops or the challenges of the backtracks, or the different 1275 01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:18,959 Speaker 1: things that have been thrown at that dog. And it 1276 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:22,480 Speaker 1: it really it forces you to be honest. How how 1277 01:05:22,520 --> 01:05:25,880 Speaker 1: are you laying a trail to train? So I use 1278 01:05:26,040 --> 01:05:28,440 Speaker 1: I just use a small piece of hide. Um, I 1279 01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:31,080 Speaker 1: make a sent. I call it. We call it blood trail. 1280 01:05:31,520 --> 01:05:34,400 Speaker 1: But it's a scent that I make. It's got thirteen 1281 01:05:34,480 --> 01:05:38,720 Speaker 1: different scent elements in it, um that are collected throughout 1282 01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:40,680 Speaker 1: the year. I collect of a freezer full of stuff 1283 01:05:40,720 --> 01:05:43,760 Speaker 1: that my wife doesn't go into for bread. Uh, that 1284 01:05:44,000 --> 01:05:47,280 Speaker 1: one's off limits. That one's my freezer so um. But 1285 01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:50,800 Speaker 1: she So I make a sent. I use a real 1286 01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:54,880 Speaker 1: piece of hide. Um. It's very simple. I just don't 1287 01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:56,880 Speaker 1: want to complicate it that much because I think the 1288 01:05:56,960 --> 01:05:58,760 Speaker 1: value that we get out of these, like I said, 1289 01:05:58,840 --> 01:06:02,160 Speaker 1: is is in reading the dog. So I simulate it 1290 01:06:02,200 --> 01:06:05,040 Speaker 1: with that that scent that I use, that blood trail scent, 1291 01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:07,040 Speaker 1: and I put it on the hide and the hide 1292 01:06:07,040 --> 01:06:09,040 Speaker 1: acts almost as a sponge it's a it's a piece 1293 01:06:09,040 --> 01:06:12,439 Speaker 1: of hide that we flesh and dry and then we 1294 01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:14,760 Speaker 1: offer it as a kid. So we saw like a 1295 01:06:14,800 --> 01:06:17,080 Speaker 1: little drag line and a training booklet and a bottle 1296 01:06:17,080 --> 01:06:20,440 Speaker 1: of scent in this in this hide, and the hide 1297 01:06:20,480 --> 01:06:22,680 Speaker 1: is an actual deer hide. So we buy deer hides 1298 01:06:23,000 --> 01:06:26,400 Speaker 1: every every fall and winter. And then we've got some 1299 01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:28,880 Speaker 1: guys with big forearms. The baseball players are the guys 1300 01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:30,960 Speaker 1: who always flash our hides for us. So we've got 1301 01:06:30,960 --> 01:06:32,440 Speaker 1: some kids that are in high school at work with us, 1302 01:06:32,440 --> 01:06:35,280 Speaker 1: and they flash all these hides and then we we 1303 01:06:35,360 --> 01:06:38,920 Speaker 1: cut them into squares, we dry them, and we we 1304 01:06:39,120 --> 01:06:41,880 Speaker 1: package them up no different than if you were shipping 1305 01:06:41,880 --> 01:06:44,840 Speaker 1: a hide off to be sold, um, you know, for 1306 01:06:45,720 --> 01:06:48,720 Speaker 1: as a as a fur buyer. So it will, it 1307 01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:51,680 Speaker 1: will stay, but it's not treated. It's not there's no chemicals, 1308 01:06:51,720 --> 01:06:54,800 Speaker 1: there's no canning. And then what happens is when you 1309 01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:57,640 Speaker 1: take that hide and you rehydrate it, put it in underwater, 1310 01:06:58,240 --> 01:07:01,760 Speaker 1: it'll start to take a softness back to an appliability 1311 01:07:01,800 --> 01:07:04,320 Speaker 1: to it. But then all of a sudden it's got moisture. 1312 01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:07,480 Speaker 1: And when it has moisture can create bacteria. When the 1313 01:07:07,520 --> 01:07:11,120 Speaker 1: bacteria start. That's where scent comes from. So we take 1314 01:07:11,160 --> 01:07:13,880 Speaker 1: that in conjunction with the scent that I make and 1315 01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:16,920 Speaker 1: I have had. It's about as easy of a process 1316 01:07:16,920 --> 01:07:21,360 Speaker 1: as I've seen, um. But the results are really good. 1317 01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,320 Speaker 1: And so there are some guys that are buying special 1318 01:07:24,360 --> 01:07:27,080 Speaker 1: tracking shoes. There's some people that are sold on the 1319 01:07:27,120 --> 01:07:30,400 Speaker 1: idea of interdigital glands and they're using hoofs um. That's 1320 01:07:30,440 --> 01:07:34,200 Speaker 1: a very European way, traditional way of doing it. I 1321 01:07:34,320 --> 01:07:38,160 Speaker 1: question the need for it, um. I'm not saying it's wrong, 1322 01:07:38,600 --> 01:07:41,480 Speaker 1: but I the amount of effort and work that that takes, 1323 01:07:41,840 --> 01:07:43,320 Speaker 1: I don't know that I gain that much from it. 1324 01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:46,200 Speaker 1: So I'm I'm more of a it's more practical for 1325 01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:47,720 Speaker 1: me to do it the way I'm doing it. It's 1326 01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:52,640 Speaker 1: more efficient, it's easier for me to store stuff, it's faster, um. 1327 01:07:52,680 --> 01:07:55,160 Speaker 1: So I I do think that the toughest part about 1328 01:07:55,160 --> 01:07:56,920 Speaker 1: tracking when you when you when you're setting up for 1329 01:07:56,960 --> 01:07:59,800 Speaker 1: training tracking dogs is you've got to understand that, like 1330 01:08:00,720 --> 01:08:02,920 Speaker 1: you don't just go out and do it like it's 1331 01:08:03,080 --> 01:08:05,440 Speaker 1: it's a two part process. You have to lay a trail. 1332 01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:08,320 Speaker 1: So there's there's some thought that goes into that. There's 1333 01:08:08,320 --> 01:08:12,000 Speaker 1: some understanding of the of the topography and the contours 1334 01:08:12,040 --> 01:08:14,960 Speaker 1: and the land that you're going to be using, and 1335 01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:17,080 Speaker 1: then you gotta so you gotta do that ahead of time. 1336 01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:20,240 Speaker 1: You gotta understand the impacts of the of the elements, 1337 01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:23,320 Speaker 1: and then you gotta wait because I think a lot 1338 01:08:23,320 --> 01:08:25,680 Speaker 1: of times we get people that lay a trail and 1339 01:08:25,680 --> 01:08:27,080 Speaker 1: then they go get their dog and they track and 1340 01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:30,040 Speaker 1: they track and like that's like kittie play. I mean, 1341 01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,599 Speaker 1: that's just that's fine. You can do that with young dogs. 1342 01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:36,479 Speaker 1: But at some point you have to start aging. You 1343 01:08:36,600 --> 01:08:40,320 Speaker 1: gotta start putting some age to that line. Um, you 1344 01:08:40,400 --> 01:08:42,479 Speaker 1: gotta let the line break down. You gotta let the 1345 01:08:42,479 --> 01:08:45,599 Speaker 1: scent kind of disperse, you gotta you gotta let things 1346 01:08:45,600 --> 01:08:48,360 Speaker 1: happen naturally like it would when you're actually tracking a deer. 1347 01:08:48,920 --> 01:08:51,680 Speaker 1: And so if you're going to train a dog to 1348 01:08:51,760 --> 01:08:55,040 Speaker 1: track with a with a line, it could be a 1349 01:08:55,040 --> 01:08:58,160 Speaker 1: two to three day process and you gotta remember it, 1350 01:08:58,240 --> 01:09:01,920 Speaker 1: Like I've laid trails out before and forgot about them, Like, 1351 01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:04,679 Speaker 1: oh god, yeah, I forgot about that one. So uh, 1352 01:09:04,720 --> 01:09:07,320 Speaker 1: you know, because life gets busy. So you you've got 1353 01:09:07,320 --> 01:09:10,040 Speaker 1: to understand that that that's the challenge there. But you 1354 01:09:10,080 --> 01:09:12,439 Speaker 1: can do some stuff that's real simple at night, Like 1355 01:09:12,760 --> 01:09:16,400 Speaker 1: I'll do it tonight, probably about the last fifteen minutes 1356 01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:19,639 Speaker 1: of light. And I'll take tennis balls, and I'll take 1357 01:09:19,960 --> 01:09:22,599 Speaker 1: that blood trail scent which is liquid, and I'll put 1358 01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:25,000 Speaker 1: that on a tennis ball, and then I'll go and 1359 01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:27,040 Speaker 1: I've got relatively short grass, and I've got lots of 1360 01:09:27,080 --> 01:09:30,320 Speaker 1: different different lengths of grass, and I'll take tennis rackets 1361 01:09:30,360 --> 01:09:33,559 Speaker 1: and I'll hit tennis balls down the driveway, down the 1362 01:09:33,600 --> 01:09:36,880 Speaker 1: grass runways. I've got all these mode strips. I'll hit 1363 01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:39,400 Speaker 1: tennis balls and skip them along the ground. You can 1364 01:09:39,479 --> 01:09:42,840 Speaker 1: use chuckets. I like tennis balls, but they're tennis rackets. 1365 01:09:42,880 --> 01:09:45,519 Speaker 1: But you just skip that tennis ball along and then 1366 01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:47,479 Speaker 1: you can you cover and you can cover the dog's eyes. 1367 01:09:47,520 --> 01:09:49,559 Speaker 1: You can do all sorts of stuff. And then you 1368 01:09:49,560 --> 01:09:51,160 Speaker 1: can get that dog with the start of the line 1369 01:09:51,200 --> 01:09:52,960 Speaker 1: and tell him find it, find it, find it, and 1370 01:09:53,000 --> 01:09:55,040 Speaker 1: then shut up and then just let them watch them work. 1371 01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,519 Speaker 1: And and now all of a sudden, I get ten 1372 01:09:58,680 --> 01:10:01,080 Speaker 1: fifteen minutes right before you know the reason I do 1373 01:10:01,120 --> 01:10:03,360 Speaker 1: it so latest because it's so hot, but I get 1374 01:10:03,400 --> 01:10:07,640 Speaker 1: I get some nice um cardio work in forcing the 1375 01:10:07,680 --> 01:10:10,240 Speaker 1: dog to use its nose, real big reward at the end. 1376 01:10:10,280 --> 01:10:13,639 Speaker 1: Tennis balls are like like the big drug for a dog. 1377 01:10:13,720 --> 01:10:15,320 Speaker 1: I'd be careful, you know, not to use it too 1378 01:10:15,400 --> 01:10:18,240 Speaker 1: much before they just they love them. It's just a 1379 01:10:18,280 --> 01:10:23,040 Speaker 1: huge reward. So a very simple little track made very fun. 1380 01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:26,840 Speaker 1: And I often I tell people, don't set just trail 1381 01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:28,599 Speaker 1: after trail, aft your trail after the trail for your dog. 1382 01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:31,920 Speaker 1: You'll burn them out. Like that's the that's the final exam. 1383 01:10:32,160 --> 01:10:34,240 Speaker 1: Like that if you're a kid, that's the big test. 1384 01:10:34,680 --> 01:10:37,240 Speaker 1: Where if all we did was send kids to school 1385 01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:39,920 Speaker 1: and teachers gave them final exams every day, the kids 1386 01:10:39,920 --> 01:10:42,679 Speaker 1: would burn right out. So how do you get prepared 1387 01:10:42,720 --> 01:10:45,000 Speaker 1: for a final exam? With lots of little quizzes and 1388 01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:47,559 Speaker 1: lots of little lessons and lots of little things, You 1389 01:10:47,640 --> 01:10:49,800 Speaker 1: work your way up and then at the end you 1390 01:10:49,840 --> 01:10:52,600 Speaker 1: get a test. And I think from a tracking standpoint, 1391 01:10:52,920 --> 01:10:55,840 Speaker 1: there's lots of little creative ways to to to do 1392 01:10:55,960 --> 01:10:58,360 Speaker 1: lessons and to have quizzes and to do that stuff. 1393 01:10:58,560 --> 01:11:00,960 Speaker 1: And then eventually at the end of the semester you 1394 01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:03,439 Speaker 1: give them the test and they you see how they did. 1395 01:11:04,640 --> 01:11:08,639 Speaker 1: I love it, buddy, Um where can everybody find all 1396 01:11:08,720 --> 01:11:12,040 Speaker 1: your YouTube videos if they're interested in training dogs and uh, 1397 01:11:12,560 --> 01:11:17,400 Speaker 1: your blood trailing, blood tracking, game recovery products, but dog 1398 01:11:17,439 --> 01:11:20,200 Speaker 1: bone Hunter for everything. So dog bone Hunter is our 1399 01:11:20,240 --> 01:11:25,240 Speaker 1: YouTube or Instagram, Facebook, our podcast, every everything is just 1400 01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:30,280 Speaker 1: at dog bone Hunter. So um, it's relatively easy. Everybody's 1401 01:11:30,400 --> 01:11:33,400 Speaker 1: using those obviously those channels, and we are making a 1402 01:11:33,439 --> 01:11:37,160 Speaker 1: real big effort to try to I love I love 1403 01:11:37,200 --> 01:11:40,920 Speaker 1: it because it's such a such an easy effective way 1404 01:11:40,920 --> 01:11:44,000 Speaker 1: for us to share information. And I just so we're 1405 01:11:44,040 --> 01:11:47,479 Speaker 1: putting a ton of effort into it, um and and 1406 01:11:47,520 --> 01:11:51,040 Speaker 1: hopefully we're really designed or we we do things to 1407 01:11:51,080 --> 01:11:53,799 Speaker 1: try to help those are interested in training their own dogs. 1408 01:11:54,080 --> 01:11:57,200 Speaker 1: And if that's you know, that's that's where I feel 1409 01:11:57,200 --> 01:12:00,200 Speaker 1: like our value comes. Awesome. Man, Well, thank you so 1410 01:12:00,280 --> 01:12:03,080 Speaker 1: much for coming on, buddy. I appreciate it. As always, 1411 01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:10,040 Speaker 1: that's it for this episode of Where to Hunt. I'm 1412 01:12:10,040 --> 01:12:12,519 Speaker 1: your host, Tony Peterson. I should say I'm your guest 1413 01:12:12,520 --> 01:12:14,400 Speaker 1: host Tony Peterson. I think you'll hear me around here 1414 01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:17,040 Speaker 1: a little bit more. As always, thank you so much 1415 01:12:17,120 --> 01:12:20,160 Speaker 1: for listening. If you're not subscribe, please subscribe. If you're 1416 01:12:20,160 --> 01:12:23,880 Speaker 1: not listening to my foundations podcast listen to that as well. 1417 01:12:24,240 --> 01:12:26,240 Speaker 1: But thank you so much for checking in. We really 1418 01:12:26,240 --> 01:12:28,360 Speaker 1: appreciate it, and we will see you here next week.