1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:01,800 Speaker 1: Now did you have any lunch? 2 00:00:01,960 --> 00:00:02,480 Speaker 2: I have eaten? 3 00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:03,400 Speaker 3: What did you have? 4 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Had? 5 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 2: Some passion fruit? Is that on the menu at the moment? 6 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: Not passion fruit? That's worry. 7 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, I saw you like very nice. 8 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 5: He doesn't know a red pepper from the passion Better 9 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:32,960 Speaker 5: get another m hm. A beautiful autumnal day. The sun 10 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 5: is out, that's slightly crisp in the air, and the 11 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 5: leaves are falling. 12 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 3: The river is high, and the living is easy. So 13 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:43,159 Speaker 3: I'm sitting here with Zad Rogers and William Lensky, who 14 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 3: produced the podcast, through these table four and we're just 15 00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 3: so excited to announce season three with an amazing lineup 16 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 3: of new guests, including Guy Ritchie s Devlin, Chad Apatow, 17 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 3: Wes Anderson, Ray Fines, and many many more. Until then, though, 18 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 3: we don't want to leave you, so we're going to 19 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:06,279 Speaker 3: be sharing some of our favorite episodes of the past 20 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:12,959 Speaker 3: two seasons, beginning with edvar Sha. 21 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 4: It's very busy as ever in the River Cafe, but 22 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:22,000 Speaker 4: today there's a special date because of the wedding going 23 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 4: on downstairs. So if you hear some background noise, that's 24 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:29,040 Speaker 4: what it's much much more importantly the week. 25 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 3: My week I was in New York. 26 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 5: I went because Edvarsha has a retrospective, which I would 27 00:01:34,520 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 5: say to anybody, including you, because you're going to run, 28 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 5: don't walk. It's a spectacular show. It's a retrospective of 29 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 5: his work over the last I guess maybe fifty years, 30 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 5: and it was very, very moving. I took Austin Butler, 31 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 5: who also was on a podcast with us, and Austin 32 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 5: had met Ed because we were in LA at the 33 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 5: same time in July, and I took Austin to ed 34 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 5: studio when I went, and they were kind of two 35 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 5: peers in the park. 36 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 4: But for our listeners, this is the same whose podcast 37 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 4: can be found on the table for podcast series. And 38 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 4: also actually I remember being with you in LA maybe 39 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:11,640 Speaker 4: this time last year recording it. 40 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:13,079 Speaker 2: And it was a dog. 41 00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:15,080 Speaker 4: We were in the Gozing Gallery in l A and 42 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 4: he brought his stray dog and he just he just 43 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:19,239 Speaker 4: looked like he just came out of the desert. He 44 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 4: was this sort of tall, dusty lean person. But Ed 45 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:25,639 Speaker 4: is famous in the podcast series. He's the only person 46 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 4: that read his own recipe, which was what it was. 47 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 5: I'm sitting here in LA with Dexter and Edwards Sha Edwards. 48 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 5: Sha is the artist and Dexter is the dog, and 49 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 5: I hope we're going to hear from them both in 50 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 5: the next half hour. 51 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 1: Did you bring the cactus armor? 52 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:05,360 Speaker 5: Yeah, there's a small work of art by my bed 53 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:07,839 Speaker 5: that I say hello to every morning and say good 54 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 5: night to every night. I think of the day it 55 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 5: arrived in the River Cafe from Los Angeles, wrapped in 56 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 5: layers of bubble wrap. I knew then unwrapping it that 57 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 5: this was one I would never let out of my sight. 58 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 5: The artist was ed Rushee, and the word in bright 59 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,640 Speaker 5: red says yum. I've known ed Richet's work since the 60 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:32,520 Speaker 5: early seventies. I followed admired his work through his career, 61 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 5: and in twenty nineteen. In twenty twenty he shows at 62 00:03:37,200 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 5: the National Gallery and Tate Modern And it was then 63 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 5: that we got to know each other well. Dinners at 64 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 5: the River Cafe, breakfast at Clarages, and we became friends. 65 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 5: First I fell in love with the art, and. 66 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: Then I fell in love with the artist. Would you 67 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: like to read a recipe? 68 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 2: Shall I read your recipe? 69 00:03:58,600 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 1: But I'd like to hear yours. 70 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 5: You'll be the first person to read a recipe that 71 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 5: is not a river cafe recipe, and I think that's good. 72 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:10,200 Speaker 6: What is that cactus omelet which I make occasionally? You 73 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 6: have to get nopolytos little cactus pads that they slice 74 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:20,160 Speaker 6: into little bits, and so says utensils omelet pan are 75 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 6: similar type pan with rounded bottom, mixing bowl, wire, whisk 76 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 6: or fork. Instructions. Break two eggs in bowls slightly under 77 00:04:29,000 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 6: mix with whisk or fork. Heat butter in pan until 78 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 6: it bubbles and begins to turn brown. Add the eggs 79 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 6: and let them sit in the pan until the bottom 80 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 6: begins to harden. As soon as this sets, but while 81 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 6: the top is still moist, add salt and pepper, cottage cheese, 82 00:04:48,839 --> 00:04:53,919 Speaker 6: sprinkle celery on top, followed by the nopoulitos. Let the 83 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:57,360 Speaker 6: omelet set for about one minute over a low fire 84 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 6: roll omelet out of pan and onto plate. 85 00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:08,119 Speaker 1: Where does this recipe come from? 86 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:10,039 Speaker 2: I sort of made it up. 87 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:14,680 Speaker 6: Yeah, And I always liked the taste of They're kind 88 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 6: of slimy of cactus, you know, nopolitos and uh, but 89 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 6: they have a flavor all their own, and I've always 90 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 6: liked them. 91 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:27,839 Speaker 5: Yeah, because you know, where we live, we don't get 92 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:29,160 Speaker 5: cactus cacti. 93 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: So was it when you came out here to l 94 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 1: you had it? 95 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 2: Yeah? 96 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 1: Did you go in the desert? 97 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 2: Uh? Well, Los Angeles. 98 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: I've talked to artists. 99 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 5: I've interviewed Damian and Tracy, but I haven't had an 100 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 5: artist or painted about We talk about food and have 101 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 5: food in their life and food in there are But 102 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 5: you actually painted with food. 103 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:54,400 Speaker 1: You use egg yolk and you used didn't you. 104 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 5: Was that a certain period that you started painting with 105 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 5: with actually food? 106 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:05,680 Speaker 6: I was maybe I was frustrated with art materials or 107 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:10,719 Speaker 6: it felt like I had reached a apex or a 108 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 6: stopping off point. And then I thought about why you 109 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:19,080 Speaker 6: can make marks on paper or on canvas with any 110 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 6: number of things. 111 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:21,720 Speaker 2: Why does it have to be pigments? 112 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 6: And so then I started using these things like axle, grease. 113 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 2: And caviar, and. 114 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 6: Well, it's of course egg, and it's pretty stable and 115 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:41,080 Speaker 6: it hardens and it's proven to be pretty pretty stable 116 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:41,680 Speaker 6: over the years. 117 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 5: Also, the paintings that you did with caviar still ye, 118 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 5: still still there. 119 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 6: They've yellowed a little bit, but yeah, that's what do 120 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:56,360 Speaker 6: we call that entropy or something? But you don't do anymore, No, 121 00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 6: I haven't done that for a while, But don't give 122 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 6: me any idea. 123 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 5: I think I'm going to give you an idea. When 124 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 5: I came to a studio, you have an orchard in 125 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:12,600 Speaker 5: the bat and I was wondering, you know, what what 126 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 5: does that mean to you to have fruit growing in 127 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:16,239 Speaker 5: behind your studio. 128 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 2: Well, fortunately I. 129 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 6: Got this building that had a large backyard I had 130 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:27,320 Speaker 6: no real use for, so I sort of divided the 131 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 6: backyard in half and thought, well, I'll just put an 132 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:33,600 Speaker 6: orchard in here. And I've always wanted to grow citrus 133 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 6: and other things too, figs, pomegranates, cherries, and then I've 134 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 6: got some raised beds there that that I grow. I 135 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 6: was growing the world's hottest pepper the boot you Lochia. 136 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 6: It's like an Indian called ghost pepper. It measures out 137 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 6: to be the hottest pepper in the world. 138 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:01,120 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, how do you eat it? That's a 139 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 2: nobody ever has the answer to that. 140 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 6: Make it that's too powerful, I guess so, and make 141 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 6: it so fine, grind it so fine. And I think 142 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 6: there are people that are still working on it to 143 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 6: get the. 144 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 2: Get the Blue Ribbon for the hottest pepper. 145 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 1: That so that it judges that competition. But you cook 146 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: a lot, don't you. 147 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 5: That recipe for an omelet is a really interesting recipe 148 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 5: because it's using. 149 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,239 Speaker 1: An ingredient that is so local. 150 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 5: You know, you go into great depth to tell how 151 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,080 Speaker 5: you fry the eggs, you season it, the heat of 152 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 5: the pan. 153 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: That's a chef's recipe. 154 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 6: Well it's sort of hit and miss, you know, And 155 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,240 Speaker 6: so that's fine. Since I'm usually cooking for myself, it 156 00:08:45,240 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 6: doesn't matter. But only other thing I really cook is chili, 157 00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 6: and I like. I like to make chili. I make 158 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:58,640 Speaker 6: it without onions, without beans, and without tomatoes. That's fun 159 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 6: to make, and that takes a few hours to do that, 160 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:02,480 Speaker 6: but it's worth it. 161 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: When you're painting, how do you eat and paint generally? 162 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 2: And I don't even eat lunch. 163 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:12,120 Speaker 6: I mean I will maybe have a banana or a 164 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 6: piece of fruit, and that's my lunch. I don't eat 165 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 6: three meals a day like I used to. But I 166 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 6: know it's in our artistic tradition. It's always been a 167 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 6: ceremony with artists to stop working at eleven forty five. 168 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 2: And sit down. And I don't drink wine. 169 00:09:36,280 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 6: Yeah, so and then you know, it's also a tradition 170 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 6: to have wine with lunch. 171 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 5: But in New York in the kind of sixties seventies, 172 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 5: wasn't there the whole thing where artists would be in 173 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 5: their studios all day, very solitary, and then go to 174 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 5: Max's or to you know, to the culture of kind 175 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:55,679 Speaker 5: of being alone and then going out every night. And 176 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 5: were you ever part of that culture or was it. 177 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 6: Lle Well, yeah, it's the pnemonium of crowds of people 178 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 6: in a place like Maxis, Kansas City or any of 179 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 6: those kind of places, and. 180 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: It was almost ceremonial. 181 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 6: You know, you'd go and have great fun and drink 182 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 6: and uh, that was part of life. 183 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: I guess you live in New York? 184 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:20,520 Speaker 2: Did You never did live in New York. 185 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:20,679 Speaker 1: No. 186 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 6: It was always too complicated or too expensive. 187 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 2: For me to live there. 188 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 6: And uh, just the idea of trying to take a 189 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 6: two by four across town was such an issue that 190 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 6: made California impossibly convenient. 191 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 5: Yeah, we saw Frank Gary yesterday and we talked about 192 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:46,479 Speaker 5: the camaraderie between for him many more artists and architects. 193 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,640 Speaker 5: You just loved the feeling of the la kind of 194 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 5: artists being together here. 195 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: Was that part of your world as well. 196 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:54,360 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah. 197 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 6: Did he tell you that his favorite restaurant was the 198 00:10:56,760 --> 00:10:57,800 Speaker 6: Pacific Dining Room. 199 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 2: Yes, he did, yeah, and they closed it, I think, and. 200 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: He loved that place. Did you ever go there? 201 00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I went there with him too, and. 202 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 1: Mister Chow. 203 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 5: Chow and yeah, oh yeah, he's a great man. 204 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 6: I went there one time and I with a friend 205 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 6: and he said, can I bring a friend along? And 206 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:23,080 Speaker 6: I said yeah, who is it? And he said Groucho 207 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:29,200 Speaker 6: Marx No. And so we met at chows here and 208 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:32,080 Speaker 6: Groucho comes in and we all sit down and have 209 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:36,319 Speaker 6: a good time. But then the food comes and Graucho 210 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:41,200 Speaker 6: has his food sent in from Nate and Al's delicatessen. 211 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 6: He didn't even have the He said, I've heard about 212 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 6: this place. I've heard about this place, And so he 213 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:53,920 Speaker 6: dined at Chow's restaurant without having its food. 214 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 5: That I've heard of people, you know, of course, people 215 00:11:57,160 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 5: bring their own wine at the River CAF. 216 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 1: People like to bring their own wine. 217 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 5: And once somebody bought their own truffle. They've been to 218 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:05,960 Speaker 5: Italy and they brought a white truffle and asked us 219 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 5: if we would grade it for them over their pasta. 220 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:12,560 Speaker 5: But I never actually have heard of anybody actually ordering 221 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 5: their own food. But I suppose if you're grudging in Marx. 222 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:18,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, did you go to chaws a lot? Who would 223 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: go there with you? Oh? 224 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:21,120 Speaker 2: Lots of different people. 225 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 6: I mean used to go there with Tim Leary and 226 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:28,079 Speaker 6: his wife and they were regulars there for a good while. 227 00:12:28,360 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 6: And it's so good and so traditional. I mean they 228 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 6: opened I think nineteen seventy five or something like that, 229 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 6: and they established a menu that they really didn't vary 230 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 6: from in London. 231 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:45,120 Speaker 5: They used to have a kind of cart that you 232 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 5: could actually make the noodles. 233 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, they do that here too. 234 00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, we should all. 235 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 5: Okay, are you going out much? Are you trying to 236 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 5: stay quiet? 237 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 2: I'm happy to you know. 238 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 6: I love loud Hollywood parties, but I don't miss them 239 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 6: one iota. 240 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 1: It's been there and done that. Why did you go 241 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:06,560 Speaker 1: to the desert? 242 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 2: Yeah? I go to the desert. 243 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:09,880 Speaker 1: What do you eat there? You hunt? 244 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 2: I used to do that, but I don't do that anymore. 245 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 6: And I have a lot of quail out there. And 246 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 6: oh it's out north of it's east of Big Bear Lake. 247 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 6: It's not the kind of desert that is like palm 248 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 6: springs with palm trees. No palm trees up there, they 249 00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:34,839 Speaker 6: have Joshua trees. If you know what those crazy things 250 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 6: look like. 251 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 2: Beautiful. 252 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:42,840 Speaker 6: They're very spiky, spiky, and they look They got called 253 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:48,319 Speaker 6: Joshua trees because the pioneers thought they looked like silhouettes 254 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:52,920 Speaker 6: of biblical figures, so they call them Joshua trees. And 255 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 6: that grows out there. They're almost endangered because of the 256 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:03,839 Speaker 6: global warming. But then I get pinion pines there and 257 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:08,320 Speaker 6: I harvest some of the nuts. If you've got time 258 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,440 Speaker 6: to do that that well, just get the pine cones 259 00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:15,560 Speaker 6: off the trees and very carefully take all the little 260 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 6: seeds out of it, but usually the squirrels get them 261 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 6: before you do. In order to get a little handful 262 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 6: of pine nuts, it takes you about an hour, and 263 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 6: then you have to get the sap off your hands, 264 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 6: wash your hands in gasoline. I don't know, but they're 265 00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 6: extremely delicious. Yeah, they're far more delicious than the ones 266 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:42,720 Speaker 6: you actually buy in the market. 267 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:57,800 Speaker 5: Where you've kind of been through hell in this country 268 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 5: with our previous president and the and everything. And I 269 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 5: have a beautiful poster that you sent me, which is 270 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 5: a treasure. 271 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:05,920 Speaker 1: That was enough. 272 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 2: Oh enough? 273 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 1: Oh can you tell me the story of enough. 274 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 2: I don't know where that came from. 275 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 6: It's just well, Norman Lear asked me if I would 276 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:18,680 Speaker 6: do something, and so that was just some incentive to 277 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 6: make some statement about the condition of America and you 278 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 6: know where people sit on the subject, and so expressing 279 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 6: myself in that way in a poster was fun to do. 280 00:15:33,280 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 2: You know. 281 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 6: It was like, enough of this kind of politics. We've 282 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 6: got to move on from this to something better, and 283 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 6: luckily it moved that way. 284 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 5: Yeah, maybe it'd be nice to talk about from the beginning. 285 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: Tell me about where you grew up. 286 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 6: I was born in Omaha, Nebraska, very center of the 287 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 6: United States, and then we moved to Oklahoma when I 288 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 6: was like five years old. So then I grew up 289 00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 6: from there, and it was kind of a cultural wasteland 290 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:06,120 Speaker 6: in a lot of ways. Food especially, I mean, there 291 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:10,040 Speaker 6: was no such thing as an artichoke or an avocado, 292 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 6: barely no such thing as sushi. There is there now, 293 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 6: of course, because it's multi dimensional, but I remember growing 294 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 6: up there and having these kind of foods, Like about 295 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 6: their early nineteen fifties is when pizza came to fashion. 296 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 6: And we didn't call it just pizza. We call it 297 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 6: pizza pie, pizza pie, pizza pieza, like. 298 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:37,240 Speaker 2: A big pizza. 299 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 6: Yeah, because you originally came from Chicago or. 300 00:16:40,720 --> 00:16:42,080 Speaker 2: State New York, State New. 301 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:44,680 Speaker 1: And we had real southern Italian foods. 302 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 5: I thought Italian food was meatples and spaghetti and eggplant 303 00:16:49,280 --> 00:16:53,080 Speaker 5: parmesana and pizza pie until I went to Italy thirty 304 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:53,680 Speaker 5: years later. 305 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 2: Yeah. 306 00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:57,200 Speaker 1: But go back to the pizza pie. When did that come? 307 00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 6: Well, that started coming when around the time I was 308 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 6: in high school and it became a popular go to 309 00:17:03,920 --> 00:17:07,239 Speaker 6: type of food, kind of novel and unique. And there 310 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 6: were half a dozen places in Oklahoma City that actually 311 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:16,639 Speaker 6: served pizza pie, and one place was called Sussy's. 312 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:19,760 Speaker 2: That was the place you'd always go to. 313 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:22,760 Speaker 1: I did how who would cook in your house? Was 314 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: it your mother? 315 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 2: Yeah? Did you mom cooked? No? 316 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 6: Father didn't really cook so much. But Mom tossed everything 317 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 6: together and you know, it was a really it was 318 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:38,879 Speaker 6: all meat and potatoes. I like her pies particularly, and 319 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 6: she made a cherry pie that I always liked. Also, 320 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 6: she made rhubarb pie, which was another thing, and so 321 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:47,399 Speaker 6: that was big. 322 00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 1: Do you think the cherries were fresh or did she 323 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 1: get them from the cans. 324 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 6: She'd get them from a can, or sometimes when they 325 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 6: were there, she would get them fresh. And the effort 326 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,840 Speaker 6: was not so much into absolutely fresh food back then. No, 327 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 6: canned food was very big and exciting. Yeah, and then 328 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:10,400 Speaker 6: came frozen food after that, and there's you know, there's 329 00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 6: a big debate over those nutritional value of those foods. 330 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: Did your mom work? So she would work all day 331 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:17,760 Speaker 1: and then come home. 332 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:21,159 Speaker 6: She was a housekeeper and prepared food for us, and 333 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 6: and no, she didn't have a job. And so I 334 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 6: grew up in the Bible Belt there and we were Catholics, 335 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 6: so we were called mackerel snappers is what people would 336 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,399 Speaker 6: call us, meaning you don't eat meat on Friday, you 337 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 6: eat fish on Friday. So mackerel snappers. But the kind 338 00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:47,040 Speaker 6: of food that they served there, the only international food 339 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 6: was called Chinese food. And every Chinese restaurant would always 340 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:57,880 Speaker 6: say on the outside of the building Chinese and American food. 341 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:01,160 Speaker 5: To alleviate the fear of looking into Chinese restaurants. 342 00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 6: And so you could get Chinese, Yes, you could get 343 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:07,720 Speaker 6: chop suey things like that, and then you could also 344 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 6: get a hamburger. 345 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,040 Speaker 2: So they were gonna offer you. 346 00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 6: Chinese food, but also just in case, please come anyway 347 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 6: because we can make. 348 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:17,680 Speaker 2: A hamburger for you. Familiar. 349 00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 5: Yeah, but did you go to restaurants? I mean, would 350 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 5: your parents take you out for a. 351 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:22,640 Speaker 1: Meal and a time. 352 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 6: Occasionally we'd go to barbecue and that was popular. 353 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 2: Then. 354 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:30,679 Speaker 6: The one food that was really hit it big was 355 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:36,120 Speaker 6: okra fried okra, and they grow it, Yeah, they grow 356 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 6: it in a big way there, and so there's lots 357 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 6: of corn that you're giving almost every day. 358 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:43,959 Speaker 2: Yeah. 359 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 6: Also during the war, we had a victory garden. It 360 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 6: was sort of pick yourself up by your booststraps, by 361 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 6: growing your own food and participating in the war effort 362 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:59,560 Speaker 6: World War two. So it was an extension of that 363 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 6: sort of went to your dinner table and other people 364 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:08,680 Speaker 6: would save metal and that sort of thing to recycle 365 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 6: into the war effort. 366 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 2: And so victory garden it was a very popular thing then. 367 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:17,040 Speaker 1: I wasn't there. 368 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:25,880 Speaker 6: Just we'd grow tomatoes and corn and celery and various vegetables, 369 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,679 Speaker 6: and that was kind of a unified attitude at the 370 00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:34,000 Speaker 6: time to have victory gardens in your backyard. I had 371 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 6: a paper route in Oklahoma and I'd deliver my papers 372 00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,000 Speaker 6: at like four in the morning and then come back 373 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:43,080 Speaker 6: and drink almost a half a gallon of milk and 374 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 6: then oh, about twelve fourteen something like that. 375 00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 5: Yeah, you said that, You said once said that you 376 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:52,920 Speaker 5: thought that Oklahoma was like a black and white movie? 377 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 1: Do you think that? Do you think back on those days? 378 00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 6: I still do when I think back on it, But 379 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:01,200 Speaker 6: as I go back there occasionally I see that it's 380 00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 6: more progressive than I allow. 381 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 2: My mind to make it be. Yeah, so you know, 382 00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 2: it's caught up with the rest of the world. 383 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: What's happened to your house there? 384 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:13,760 Speaker 2: Do you still happen still stands? Yeah? 385 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 1: When was the first time you went to Europe? 386 00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 6: About nineteen sixty one and I went there with my 387 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 6: mother and brother and we we bought a little Citron 388 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:32,200 Speaker 6: two CV automobile in Paris and drove it around Europe 389 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:34,120 Speaker 6: and then came. 390 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:35,120 Speaker 1: To your mother's first time. 391 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:38,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was her first time too. So what was 392 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 2: that like? 393 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: What was it like? Food wise? 394 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 6: Well, food wise, well, we we were kind of on 395 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 6: a budget, so there wasn't nothing particularly fancy, but just 396 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:57,879 Speaker 6: the idea of having, you know, stumbling onto wild strawberry, 397 00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 6: which I'd never had before those tiny little wild strawberries 398 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 6: was great. That was in France. We drove all over 399 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:10,680 Speaker 6: Europe and for about four or five months, four or 400 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:15,159 Speaker 6: five months, yeah, yeah, we went as far south. We 401 00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:23,080 Speaker 6: went to Yugoslavia, went to Spain, Portugal, Italy, Germany, France, 402 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:27,760 Speaker 6: British Isles, went to Ireland try to find my mother's 403 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,120 Speaker 6: heritage and never we struck out there. 404 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 1: We couldn't find it. Did you paint or draw? 405 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:36,400 Speaker 2: Yeah? 406 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:40,480 Speaker 6: I took a little homemade kit a package that I 407 00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 6: would carry around and you know, allow me to do 408 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:49,399 Speaker 6: something on about eight x ten format, and brought paints 409 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:53,640 Speaker 6: along with me and worked like that. And my mother 410 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 6: came back to the States after about two months, and 411 00:22:56,800 --> 00:22:59,639 Speaker 6: then I stayed over there by myself for a while. 412 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:12,760 Speaker 5: One of the things that I think is very moving 413 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 5: about your studio, part from the garden and the trees 414 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,119 Speaker 5: and of the fruit, is there seems to be a 415 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,679 Speaker 5: very strong community there and that when you come to 416 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 5: London for your shows. When we went out to dinner afterwards, 417 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 5: I think Puppy was the Tait and then there was 418 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:30,880 Speaker 5: a dinner at the National Gallery. 419 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: Because you had two shows. 420 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:36,639 Speaker 5: You were the first artists contemporary artists to show singularly 421 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 5: in the National Gallery. 422 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 2: I was told at I found it hard to believe, 423 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:41,919 Speaker 2: but it's true. 424 00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:46,440 Speaker 6: Yeah, and then I think virget Riley maybe had something 425 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 6: yeah recently there. 426 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 2: Yeah. Do you bring everybody with you pretty much? 427 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:53,160 Speaker 1: That's so nice. 428 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 2: People that work with me, Yeah, travel with me. Yeah, 429 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 2: that's good. 430 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,280 Speaker 5: You're animals. There are dogs? How many do you have 431 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:01,639 Speaker 5: any idea of how many dogs? 432 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:02,840 Speaker 2: Uh? 433 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:08,960 Speaker 6: Dana has five other dogs besides Dexter, so you know 434 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 6: she's got her handful. I mean she's got she needs 435 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:13,720 Speaker 6: a kennel license. 436 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:15,800 Speaker 1: Do you when you travel do you take a dog? 437 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:21,000 Speaker 5: He goes in the every So you have a painting 438 00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:21,719 Speaker 5: called Dexter. 439 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,280 Speaker 2: Again, don't give me any ideas. 440 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,840 Speaker 5: I am can I just tell the story about Ruby. 441 00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:32,360 Speaker 5: I've had such a kind of passion for the Ruby painting. 442 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 5: I didn't know Ruby meant to me. It filled me 443 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:40,640 Speaker 5: with kind of imagination, and I kept thinking, who is Ruby? 444 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:43,399 Speaker 5: So I just dreamt about who Ruby could be. I 445 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 5: thought she might be a woman that you were in 446 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,080 Speaker 5: love with when you were a teenager in Alcoholma. I 447 00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,679 Speaker 5: thought she'd might be your mother's name. I thought she 448 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,560 Speaker 5: could be a disappointment somebody who left you, and I 449 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 5: thought she could be a tragedy of someone who died. 450 00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:58,680 Speaker 5: And I just kept thinking about because the way you 451 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 5: wrote the ruby on the painting just means so much 452 00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 5: to me. I've been trying to find a ruby painting. 453 00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:09,240 Speaker 5: But when we spent that time together in London, over 454 00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,680 Speaker 5: days and nights, I tried to I wanted to find 455 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:14,800 Speaker 5: a moment that was quiet where I could ask you 456 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:17,840 Speaker 5: who she was and what she meant to you. And 457 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 5: I dan and was there and I thought maybe I 458 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:22,400 Speaker 5: should wait, and we were to party, I should wait. 459 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 5: But as I was saying goodbye to you that night, 460 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 5: I said to you, Ed, can I just ask you 461 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:27,439 Speaker 5: one question? 462 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:28,880 Speaker 1: Who was she? 463 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 5: Who was this ruby? Who was the inspiration for these beautiful, 464 00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:33,560 Speaker 5: beautiful paintings? 465 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: And you said ruby was a dog. 466 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. But it was not the inspiration 467 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,639 Speaker 2: for that painting or that work. It wasn't. 468 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 6: The ruby I did came long before the dog. Actual, Yeah, 469 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:54,520 Speaker 6: And so I don't I'm not really sure where that 470 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,399 Speaker 6: that a name came from. It didn't come from a 471 00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 6: person in my life. 472 00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 2: I didn't know. But I liked ruby as. 473 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:06,000 Speaker 6: A feminine name, and It's just got a really good 474 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:08,359 Speaker 6: sound to it. And also it has a double meaning 475 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 6: too with the gem ruby, and so it just meant 476 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,280 Speaker 6: that to me and kind of was an excuse to 477 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 6: make a work. 478 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:22,439 Speaker 1: It's a beautiful work. It's a beautiful, beautiful work. Thank you. 479 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:24,080 Speaker 1: I have one last question. 480 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:29,920 Speaker 5: So you've described food as a journey across Oklahoma to California. 481 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 5: You've described it as an explosion of wild strawberries in France, 482 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:38,720 Speaker 5: you've used it in your work, used to actually paint 483 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 5: made out of food. But if you were feeling that 484 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 5: you needed food is comfort? Would you say there's a 485 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:47,600 Speaker 5: food you turned to and comfort? 486 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 6: I would say that some kind of soup might be 487 00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 6: the answer. It's kind of traditionally of healing kind of food, 488 00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 6: so almost any kind would chili could be, although chili 489 00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:11,120 Speaker 6: might make you hop up and down. Yeah, they may 490 00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:15,080 Speaker 6: not be so RESTful, but comfort food might be in 491 00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 6: the form of some kind of vegetable soup. 492 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,400 Speaker 1: Yeah. I get that good. So are you staying here 493 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:23,280 Speaker 1: for bid? You're going? 494 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 2: Uh? Actually, I am going to the desert? Yeah today? 495 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I hope I'll see you soon. 496 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:35,439 Speaker 2: Yeah. 497 00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,440 Speaker 5: The River Cafe Lookbook is now available in bookshops and online. 498 00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:44,240 Speaker 6: It has over one hundred recipes, beautifully illustrated with photographs 499 00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 6: from the renowned photographer Matthew Donaldson. 500 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,639 Speaker 5: The book has fifty delicious and easy to prepare recipes, 501 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 5: including a host of River Cafe classics that have been 502 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 5: specially adapted for new cooks. 503 00:27:56,800 --> 00:28:00,160 Speaker 2: The River Cafe Lookbook Recipes for Cooks of All. 504 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,560 Speaker 4: Ruthie's Table four is a production of iHeartRadio and Adami Studios. 505 00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:15,360 Speaker 4: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 506 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,560 Speaker 4: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.