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Speaker 1: Of course Love Supreme. It's a production of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora

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Speaker 1: Sweet On QLs. We're really excited to bring you a

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Speaker 1: second part of our exclusive benefew with Kenneth's baby Face epodes.

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Speaker 1: Let's start in the show. How do you determine? Because

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Speaker 1: looking at your solo career from you know, tender Lover

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Speaker 1: was eighty nine, was eighty nine and then uh, don't

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Speaker 1: forget about lovers, your lovers, and but from that to

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Speaker 1: then you know, for the cooling you like, which is

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Speaker 1: my favorite, Like, how did you do video man? How

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Speaker 1: did you determine? Okay, this is for me and this

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Speaker 1: is for my artists or or other people I'm producing

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Speaker 1: for how did you balance that workload? Um? Songs first

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Speaker 1: and whatever I would write it. I get asked that

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Speaker 1: question many sense. Why didn't you keep in the road?

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Speaker 1: Why didn't you keep every little step? Because listen to

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Speaker 1: who sung it and and listen to the songs so

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Speaker 1: as became you know, so UM, I think the song

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Speaker 1: is ultimately find their right homes. And UM, for me,

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Speaker 1: there are certain songs that I could do and that

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Speaker 1: I could do well in certain songs I wish I

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Speaker 1: could have done better, but I couldn't, So I was

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Speaker 1: honest with myself and gave him away for that reason.

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Speaker 1: What's an example of a song that you gave away

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Speaker 1: that you enter the road once? Once I finished and said,

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Speaker 1: oh man, was it your vocal that just didn't work out?

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Speaker 1: Or yeah, I just didn't Well, I specifically wrote it

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Speaker 1: for boys the man, so I was going for that

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Speaker 1: whole old Philly sound, you know. And uh. And then

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Speaker 1: when I and then when they started singing it, I was,

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Speaker 1: you know, because I really almost kept it. But when

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Speaker 1: they those boys walked in there and started saying, I said,

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Speaker 1: damn home, it was like, you know, it was clear

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Speaker 1: that Wow, that moment was clear they they were a

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Speaker 1: better group than I thought they were. And uh, and

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Speaker 1: I knew that I would want to work with him again. Question.

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Speaker 1: How many songs did you work on for the Dangerous

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Speaker 1: Project for Michael Jackson. I'm here in no. Ten. We

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Speaker 1: we got called to work with Michael right. We had

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Speaker 1: just signed Jermaine Jackson on the face and then Michael

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Speaker 1: heard a little song called word to the Bad and yeah,

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Speaker 1: R and B distrack. You wrote that Jermaine with Jermaine

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Speaker 1: Jermine like left ife was on it. Okay, so so

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Speaker 1: we got called. We got totally forgotten this story. We

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Speaker 1: when we signed him up. Then we got a call

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Speaker 1: from the gloved One and wanted to meet us. And

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Speaker 1: I'm like, I had met I had met Michael, you know,

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Speaker 1: younger days, but he didn't know that. But so, um

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Speaker 1: we got the call that, you know, I'd like to

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Speaker 1: meet with you guys. So he sent a helicopter and

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Speaker 1: we we we went out to Neverland and uh, we

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Speaker 1: were like, all right, we gotta go. We can't not go.

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Speaker 1: I know, we just signed Jermaine, but we can't not go.

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Speaker 1: This is Michael. And Jermaine was like, this is crazy. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he knew we No, this is no. This is my brother.

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Speaker 1: He's trying to he's purposely whatever. So and uh so

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Speaker 1: we got to Neverland and uh sat in the living

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Speaker 1: room waiting for a little bit from Michael. Come out.

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Speaker 1: Then Michael finally came out. Please meet you guys. How

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Speaker 1: are you doing? I said great? He says, um, So

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Speaker 1: I wanted to bring you guys here because I really

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Speaker 1: wanted to know, you know, if you wanted to do

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Speaker 1: some work with me and stuff. So I said that's great. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, obviously we've been banned for years. Um so Michael,

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Speaker 1: so what we want to know is that what do

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Speaker 1: you want from us? Right, because like, you know, what

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Speaker 1: have you heard from us? What do you want to

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Speaker 1: what kind of music are you looking for? And he goes, well,

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Speaker 1: so I really love that thing that um what's that

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Speaker 1: song that Janit does um rhythm rhythm, so like so ago,

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Speaker 1: so you know that Jimmy Terry right. I said, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know, I know, but I like it. And then

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Speaker 1: we said so, I said, so what is it of

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Speaker 1: ours that you like? And he goes, well, I particularly

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Speaker 1: love that song? Uh a crime, it's no crime. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I love the beat. I don't like the beat. I

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Speaker 1: don't like the words. God. It's like, okay, all right,

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Speaker 1: all right, but you know me, Mr Positive and you

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Speaker 1: know you can. I was like, okay, all right. So

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Speaker 1: that gives us a direction. At least, we no kind

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Speaker 1: of where to go because it didn't matter. He could

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Speaker 1: have said our stuff was crap and we would have said,

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Speaker 1: well we'll make it well uncraffic and uh so we

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Speaker 1: got the you know, he said, let's go go to

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Speaker 1: the studio and work. Let's let's put some work together

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Speaker 1: and and do some studio, put some studio time together.

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Speaker 1: And so we went out and work. I forget what

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Speaker 1: the studios we went out to work at. But prior

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Speaker 1: to that, right after that meeting, we had a we

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Speaker 1: went up to Lionel Richie's house. Perhaps have to be

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Speaker 1: friends with Brenda. Ritchie was very good friends with Brendi

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Speaker 1: Richie and we went over to the house and the

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Speaker 1: Linel was there and Lionel said, and I'm gonna tell

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Speaker 1: you something about Michael. He said, he's a nice guy.

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Speaker 1: But don't get caught. Don't get caught in the web

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Speaker 1: of you know, all the you know, the charm and

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Speaker 1: the magic stuff, because you you will be working forever

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Speaker 1: and never come out with nothing. So just be careful

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Speaker 1: to not get caught up in that way, because you know,

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Speaker 1: he's so magical that you be magic out and you

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Speaker 1: won't even know. So we went in there kind of

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Speaker 1: with a different attitude when we went to work with them,

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Speaker 1: because I would see the guys that could be so

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Speaker 1: hard and stuff like that, and you get in front

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Speaker 1: of Michael Jackson, maybe suddenly they become little lambs. No

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Speaker 1: matter how hard you are, you talking to Michael Jackson.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a whole another story. Michael just he's magical.

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Speaker 1: So um so we kind of like stay strong because

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Speaker 1: of that. And so we went in and we started

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Speaker 1: working on tracks. I think we probably went through three

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Speaker 1: or four tracks, and he'd come in. He listened to

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Speaker 1: him nice, love love it, love it. Okay, now you

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Speaker 1: see that right there? Take this now and want you

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Speaker 1: to it's beautiful. But now I want you to go

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Speaker 1: to a place that you've never gone before. Reach inside

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Speaker 1: and go to a place that you've never gone. We

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Speaker 1: were like, oh yeah, now' right, we haven't gone far enough.

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Speaker 1: So we went back and start going further and further.

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Speaker 1: And then he'd come back and we we fixed up

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Speaker 1: the track. We like, we know we're there now. We

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Speaker 1: just playing the track. We hadn't even done the top

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Speaker 1: lines yet, but we're going for the tracks and stuff like.

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Speaker 1: So he'd come in and listen, and it's like probably

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Speaker 1: about the fourth day he was supposed to come by.

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Speaker 1: Each day he didn't. What't he didn't come back to

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Speaker 1: the fourth day and then he came in and he

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Speaker 1: listened to it. I love it. It's great. No, you

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Speaker 1: can figure out his steps right, beautiful. No, I love this,

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Speaker 1: I love now. No, this is perfect. But now what

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Speaker 1: I want you to do is go even deeper, go

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Speaker 1: to a place that you never go. He's right, What

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Speaker 1: does that? What does that entail? Is that more patches

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Speaker 1: in the song? Is it more percussion? You know? It's like,

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Speaker 1: give me something different, give me something unique, give me

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Speaker 1: something that you know we haven't heard before, pushing naws,

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Speaker 1: even the rhythms, that could be anything. So he just

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Speaker 1: he wasn't completely pulled in yet, and so we we

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Speaker 1: ultimately did this song called Slave to the Rhythm, and

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Speaker 1: that's the song that we ended up with it that

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Speaker 1: we But then he was he was supposed to come

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Speaker 1: by the studio, wouldn't come by. And then me and

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Speaker 1: Eli sat down one day we said, you know what,

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Speaker 1: we've been here a week, he came down. He came

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Speaker 1: here twice. Out of seven days he came here twice.

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Speaker 1: We out of here. So we left. We went back

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Speaker 1: over to another studio for getting he was d We

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Speaker 1: went to Michael, called l A and said what happened? When?

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Speaker 1: Where where did you guys go? Eli said, nope, we

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Speaker 1: got us stuff to do. We can't do it. This this,

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Speaker 1: this is our song, this is it and uh and

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Speaker 1: we were done and we pulled out of the project.

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Speaker 1: So and you were flying with that. We were fine

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Speaker 1: with it because what we didn't want to be is

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Speaker 1: those producers that would get caught with one artists and

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Speaker 1: only have one artists. Our career was built on a

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Speaker 1: number of artists and had we stopped at one and

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Speaker 1: just stopped there, then you just hang your flagship on

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Speaker 1: one and and that's what your Yeah, so we wanted

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Speaker 1: to always be able to and at that point we

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Speaker 1: started the label and then you know, Jermaine was pretty

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Speaker 1: pissed at that particular point. Really you think that's what

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Speaker 1: was asked, how do you do all this? And then yeah,

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Speaker 1: well that was I mean that was the thing. Look,

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Speaker 1: we were we had la face and we were supposed

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Speaker 1: to be working on our arts at that particular point.

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Speaker 1: So when you get a call from Michael, we was like,

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Speaker 1: we're not going to not you know, we gotta do Michael,

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Speaker 1: and so we we we tried it. We went there,

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Speaker 1: but we knew we couldn't stay there forever to keep

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Speaker 1: doing it, and we felt like we were going to

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Speaker 1: run into that. Um it was it was more of

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Speaker 1: a thing of thinking Michael, well, maybe we don't, maybe

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Speaker 1: we don't see the same things, and maybe we're not

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Speaker 1: the guys for you, so we don't want to go

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Speaker 1: with this whole process. Did you feel in your heart

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Speaker 1: of hearts that you had a good song What's Lave? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I thought it was pretty good, but I think I

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Speaker 1: didn't think we got a chance to work it too

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Speaker 1: to make it the best. You know. Um, I think

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Speaker 1: that with any artists that you start to work with,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna go through some songs that aren't great. But

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Speaker 1: if you get more time with them, then you will

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Speaker 1: get to that greatness. But you gotta have that time.

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Speaker 1: You gotta have the time to have the bad songs

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Speaker 1: in order to have the great songs. So when you

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Speaker 1: started let face, uh, I mean, I guess it's impossible

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Speaker 1: for any black entrepreneur to not have thoughts of Motown

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Speaker 1: in their heads. As an lake course, what's my label

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Speaker 1: gonna be the new Motown? Um? What were your Well?

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Speaker 1: I mean, by this point, at least like you Ellie's,

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Speaker 1: you and l A are are about to separate and

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Speaker 1: you're about to produce on your own, and he runs

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Speaker 1: the label like, how did you guys come into an

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Speaker 1: amicable Um. It was the label became the thing for that.

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Speaker 1: He had to run run the label. Um we were

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Speaker 1: Um it was a little little card for him to

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Speaker 1: keep producing and be a writer and all that and

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Speaker 1: and actually run the label business. Couldn't really do that.

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Speaker 1: You have to you have to make a choice. You're

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Speaker 1: neither gonna be a businessman or you gonna be an artist. Um.

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Speaker 1: And the truth is is l A was always kind

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Speaker 1: of the businessman. He was always that was his role,

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Speaker 1: you know, going way back to the deal. He was

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Speaker 1: like the guy that made sure everybody everybody got to eat,

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Speaker 1: going back to his days, you know, like too you

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Speaker 1: know essence and the deal, living in Indianapolis and making

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Speaker 1: sure he made some deals with some people at Church's

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Speaker 1: chicken to make sure they could eat every night. So

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Speaker 1: it was that was his gig. And uh and he

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Speaker 1: basically became, you know, the manager of you know, Leface Records. Um,

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Speaker 1: it was he had to be. He had to make

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Speaker 1: sure everybody got chicken. But how does that work from

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Speaker 1: an artists Like when y'all decided which artists would be

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Speaker 1: that did it? Ever? Did at least say okay, so

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Speaker 1: this is this group good? In mob? I just want

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Speaker 1: you to hear. So you know, we were always on

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Speaker 1: the same page in terms of we never fought in

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Speaker 1: terms of artists and uh whether something was good or not.

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Speaker 1: That's where we were always good together, is that, you know,

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Speaker 1: our taste are very simular, so we kind of would

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Speaker 1: support eachaln what was your relationship like with without casts?

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Speaker 1: Because I wasn't around as much without casts, and so

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Speaker 1: I would kind of see the guys because at that

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Speaker 1: point I was kind of like doing a lot of

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Speaker 1: producing out this way and kind of making the l

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Speaker 1: A connection, so to say. And so you were working

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Speaker 1: in Los Angeles while he stayed in Atlanta. Yeah, what

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Speaker 1: was it about Atlanta that attracted or made that the official?

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Speaker 1: We we were living here in l A. And we

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Speaker 1: felt like we needed to get out of here in

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Speaker 1: order to like, you know, be a big fish in

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Speaker 1: a little see. We tried to start a label here.

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Speaker 1: Then we would they never know we were here, and

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Speaker 1: uh Stlanta as Minneapolis or yeah, okay, And so in

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Speaker 1: going down there, we you know, we we were right

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Speaker 1: to go there, and uh we got we got very lucky.

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Speaker 1: You know that the talent came to find us there's

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Speaker 1: some talent that we lost doubt on. You know, um

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Speaker 1: who almost didn't get signed to the label or who didn't?

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Speaker 1: Who did you miss out on? We had an A

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Speaker 1: and R person that um had got something that we did.

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Speaker 1: We found out after the fact. I got to make

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Speaker 1: sure that's true, that the story in fact is true,

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Speaker 1: because it's sad if it is um but R Kelly

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Speaker 1: what and they this is bull stuff? So this bull

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Speaker 1: craps are on So we never got it. We never

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Speaker 1: got to even hear it. But he did. He did?

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Speaker 1: You guys do the music together to he you wouldn't

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Speaker 1: have told you y'all missed out on me. You know

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Speaker 1: that right in the midday, in the middle of Canbrie.

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Speaker 1: That's crazy. So okay, one one of your clients that

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Speaker 1: were particularly curious about, uh who who's done our show before?

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Speaker 1: H Usher? Raymond Oh Yeah, says one of his career

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Speaker 1: regrets was the fact that he did not get a

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Speaker 1: freshly pinned baby faced classic when he first signed to

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Speaker 1: the label. When when and went so far as to

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Speaker 1: tell us that can We Talk was initially his song.

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Speaker 1: To this day, he believes that he believes that um

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Speaker 1: U Usher came when Usher came. He came out of

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Speaker 1: time when me and l A were going through this

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Speaker 1: like Cam and jay Z and Usher came in and

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Speaker 1: Usher came, He's this bad little kid came and sang

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Speaker 1: into the road and it's demo and he was bad

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Speaker 1: its little kids bad um. Bad isn't good or bad

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Speaker 1: like badass? And uh, I certainly, you know, I thought

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Speaker 1: he was an amazing kid. He came out of time

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Speaker 1: with me in l A were like kind of like

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Speaker 1: had our issues and uh so I kind of like

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Speaker 1: ended up being out here in l A a a lot um.

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Speaker 1: I got a call from Quincy Jones two write a

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Speaker 1: song for Devin Campbell and it's Quincy Jones. I was like,

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Speaker 1: it's Quincy Jones. So I wrote can we Talk Um?

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Speaker 1: And did a demo of it. And Eli had heard

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Speaker 1: the record of thinking Um and he wanted it for

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Speaker 1: us your but I had already given it two uh

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Speaker 1: to Tevin. And it was a question, will you know

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Speaker 1: us just us you can sing better and and you

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Speaker 1: know the thing is good, And I said, well, but

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Speaker 1: I can already did this deal with with Quincy, and

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Speaker 1: I ain't gonna like tell Quincy no at this particular point,

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Speaker 1: so the song ultimately went to and so the song

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Speaker 1: was never really four Usher. But but from the way

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Speaker 1: that probably l A talking, because I'm sure l A

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Speaker 1: said it differently, that's supposed to be your song went

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Speaker 1: that way. That's I'm sure that's kind of how it went.

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Speaker 1: And so Usher is not wrong in terms of how

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Speaker 1: he how it came to him. He just don't know

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Speaker 1: the real story behind it. Do you. Okay, you don't know.

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Speaker 1: But between nine four and ninety nine, did you personally

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Speaker 1: get tired of hearing you on the radio? No, because

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't listen how I would if if something came

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Speaker 1: on that I did, then I turned the RADI off,

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Speaker 1: I listen then you obviously Yeah, So like because during

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Speaker 1: that time, because it's like, wait, next hill is ninety five?

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Speaker 1: And then producing you produced everything on the way into Excel.

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Speaker 1: How hard was that too? It was it a good

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Speaker 1: idea at the time versus getting to the end point

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Speaker 1: it was? It was it was a huge undertaking, only

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Speaker 1: because it wasn't about it when I did the project. Uh,

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Speaker 1: Forest Whittaker came to me and asked me to do

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Speaker 1: it when he um and then not only did he

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Speaker 1: ask me just to do that. But he also asked

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Speaker 1: me to score the film m and I said, well,

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Speaker 1: I've never done that, and he said that's it. And

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Speaker 1: I told him I can't do that because I don't

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Speaker 1: that's not what I do. And he said, you can

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Speaker 1: do it, and I'll get you some help to make

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Speaker 1: sure you can do it. But initially, I want you

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Speaker 1: to come and I want you to write the songs

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Speaker 1: for this film, and I want you to watch the

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Speaker 1: movie as I'm doing it and and write the song.

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Speaker 1: So I ultimately kind of took all my gear over

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Speaker 1: to a studio with him as he was editing the film,

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Speaker 1: and and I also watched him film of it film

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Speaker 1: it as well, and then he gave me a kind

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Speaker 1: of sense of where he wanted to go, and as

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Speaker 1: he sent me scenes, I'd write songs to it. And

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Speaker 1: and the truth is, I think every time I wrote

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Speaker 1: a song, he liked it. And uh, and so I

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Speaker 1: didn't really go through a bunch of different songs and

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Speaker 1: that was just kind of like hitting hitting the scenes,

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Speaker 1: and and then we had to figure out who was

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Speaker 1: going to sing it. And Uh, initially when we were

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Speaker 1: doing the um doing the music, it wasn't even we

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Speaker 1: wanted for sure that Whitney was going to sing anything

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Speaker 1: at all. Um, she wasn't necessary. She she might sing something,

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Speaker 1: she might not. We didn't know. And then because it

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Speaker 1: wasn't it wasn't gonna be a Whitney project. They just

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Speaker 1: wanted me to do the do the music for it.

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Speaker 1: So then Whitney decided that she was going to sing something.

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Speaker 1: And then then Whitney decided that if I'm to be

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Speaker 1: a part of it, then I get to have sakes.

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Speaker 1: So who gets to sing? Who? Who don't get to sing? So?

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Speaker 1: So what someone kicked off the album that we don't

335
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Speaker 1: know about? There were some people that she didn't they

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Speaker 1: want to sing? Um there we ask who? I just

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00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:32,560
Speaker 1: WV made it now? She liked that and uh so,

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Speaker 1: so the list came up of of the of the girls.

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Speaker 1: I wrote out a list and and then she I

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Speaker 1: just wrote out the Listen. She just kind of said nope, nope, nope, yep, yep,

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Speaker 1: And uh because I know she loves everybody, well everybody

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Speaker 1: was everybody was who in black music? Was? Was it

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Speaker 1: a black artist that got rejected? One of them? Oh?

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00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:06,080
Speaker 1: Some pop artists got rejected? M hmm. Nor Madonna. I'm

345
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,960
Speaker 1: sure it couldn't be the bus. Did you go for

346
00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:13,160
Speaker 1: a big non black names on the black movie about

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00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:14,680
Speaker 1: the black This is fun for us to guess this.

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00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,919
Speaker 1: You don't have to name anything. You don't name anything. Uh,

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00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:29,560
Speaker 1: there was another huge artist that Jackson. You're not confirming,

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Speaker 1: you're not confirming or denying den that's no way. Okay,

351
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Speaker 1: she wasn't there, she wasn't on there. Okay, that's all right.

352
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Speaker 1: But I feel like a mount like I feel like

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Speaker 1: the that's two major people. I feel like I'm Mount Fiji.

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00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,800
Speaker 1: That could have that could have been on my Hello.

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Speaker 1: I'm not confirming or denying that makes sense. Yeah, that

356
00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,800
Speaker 1: makes lessense. Mariah was not on that soundtrack, but would

357
00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 1: Tommy led her on a client project problem? Probably not? Okay,

358
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 1: So obviously Mariah was one. Although I'm certain in my

359
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:12,760
Speaker 1: in my I to believe that before the Prince of

360
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,480
Speaker 1: Egypt project that maybe perhaps there was an idea thrown

361
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Speaker 1: around that Mariah and Whitney do something together on their

362
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Speaker 1: Waiting to Excel soundtrack. Yeah, I'm gonna give myself right,

363
00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:31,520
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give myself up. I told you we were

364
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:38,520
Speaker 1: spen spent too many times reading album credits. We would

365
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,680
Speaker 1: have this conversation if you weren't here. That wasn't a

366
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Speaker 1: big conversation, big piece, But there were other people that

367
00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:48,560
Speaker 1: were kind of mentioning um. But so the people that

368
00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,000
Speaker 1: she did pick were the people that she actually she

369
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 1: liked their voices um and more. And and we were

370
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Speaker 1: we were just kind of in searching me saying no, total,

371
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Speaker 1: y'all never gonna let me live that down. I'm sorry,

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I love you, total. What about

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Speaker 1: us as a damn look soul food soundtracks that time?

374
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Speaker 1: How long how long did it take working on that?

375
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,760
Speaker 1: Because that's I mean, that's a lot of songs, you know, Um,

376
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:27,359
Speaker 1: I can't even remember. It was a couple of months probably,

377
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,200
Speaker 1: you know how long did it take to do Arethas? So?

378
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 1: I love that. That's one of my favorites. Really. Yeah,

379
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:38,320
Speaker 1: I figured she would be the hardest client. She came

380
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Speaker 1: in and sank that in three takes, damn. So the

381
00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:44,960
Speaker 1: Mavericks just knock it out. Let me find like Faith

382
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:51,920
Speaker 1: Evans took twelve weeks to she I just meant like

383
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Speaker 1: just Aretha basically, we'll come in you got three times

384
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Speaker 1: and then out of here. You know, it's like so

385
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: all the Mavericks are just like yo back man w

386
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:10,159
Speaker 1: went no pro tools and and that was saying I

387
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,479
Speaker 1: actually went to England and recorded her there in England. UM.

388
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: So that was fun um And that was it was um.

389
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:23,200
Speaker 1: As you're putting the project together, you feel like it's special,

390
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:28,600
Speaker 1: but you don't you don't completely know. Um. And when

391
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 1: it was all when it was all put together, it

392
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,359
Speaker 1: was the first time I handed something in the clive

393
00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,879
Speaker 1: and he had no comments. Was that a good or

394
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:41,000
Speaker 1: bad fan? It's amazing thing has like really sure you

395
00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:44,280
Speaker 1: don't want me try to do something? And so there

396
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:47,359
Speaker 1: was there was questions about you know, from a lot

397
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:49,399
Speaker 1: of different people. There was questions. I remember I had

398
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 1: a say this, had a big debate with Andre Herrell

399
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: about you know Mary song, UM not gonna cry because

400
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,680
Speaker 1: he he felt like that was Mary was too young

401
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:06,239
Speaker 1: to sing that song? Well, because you know it, did

402
00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:10,880
Speaker 1: you hear them? That was the beginning of I guess

403
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:12,719
Speaker 1: some of the years of my life. I gave all

404
00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:17,720
Speaker 1: years and it's kind of a married divorce. It was

405
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: like that's but she was the vessel for that, like

406
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,000
Speaker 1: that's she still kills that I was gonna say, like,

407
00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:27,520
Speaker 1: I think that really took her from your next door

408
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,480
Speaker 1: to sister girl. Mary made her grow up and maybe

409
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,399
Speaker 1: they weren't ready. It was her first Yeah, it was

410
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 1: wow wow, but it was it was about I mean

411
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 1: I explained to him, I said, you know, the look,

412
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 1: the thing about Mary is that she has all this

413
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Speaker 1: pain and and has the voice to tell the story.

414
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: And so she is as you say, she was a

415
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:58,440
Speaker 1: vessel for uh, for Angela where Angela's rolling that in

416
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:02,520
Speaker 1: the movie. And and because of that, it sold and

417
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 1: it worked. Um, and so there's something about all the

418
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:09,880
Speaker 1: women that were involved with that movie at this particularly

419
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 1: more as more time goes by, how special it seems.

420
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 1: You know that, Um, the work that they did, that

421
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 1: everybody did as part of that movie musically as well

422
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: as the actual you know filming it so ful soundtrack.

423
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 1: How close did you guys ever get to a milestone

424
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:32,439
Speaker 1: project or was it just that one song recording? Uh?

425
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,680
Speaker 1: I want to know what that. I want to know

426
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 1: that session was, like, it was a great It was

427
00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:44,959
Speaker 1: a great session. That was um so much fun. I mean,

428
00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 1: I wanted the great thing about doing soundtracks is you

429
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,560
Speaker 1: got to work with artists that you hadn't hadn't had

430
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 1: a chance to work with yet, so and to create

431
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: a reason to work together in the whole milestone thing

432
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: that was It was perfect. Um. I purposely just kind

433
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 1: of you know, took a back step and was letting

434
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,719
Speaker 1: it be the guys, you know, between Kevin and Melbourne

435
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 1: and Casey and Jojo and just to hear their voices.

436
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 1: And they always talked about a mile stone thing, but

437
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,480
Speaker 1: it never really I think it was a record company

438
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 1: issues or whatever like that, And it's always something that

439
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:23,920
Speaker 1: I've always played around with, you know, thinking about trying

440
00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:25,680
Speaker 1: to do it at one point, but just we just

441
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 1: never got there. What was the advantage of producing that

442
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,479
Speaker 1: movie and that soundtrack though, because that was like your

443
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:35,359
Speaker 1: first that was Was that the first time you did entertainment? Um?

444
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 1: It was first? Sorry I was I was just saying

445
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 1: that what I was thinking it was the first time,

446
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 1: but I couldn't remember I had plenty was okay producing

447
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: the movie? Yeah, the movie that was great, Like freaking

448
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:58,360
Speaker 1: half plenty. I've watched Love forty. That's my life. Yeah,

449
00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:02,040
Speaker 1: like I thought that with somebody I loved that, Well,

450
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 1: yeah that's his life too. Trying to explain, d' angelo,

451
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: this is movie about your life that you don't know about.

452
00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: He still, yeah, I heard about this. So how did

453
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 1: that project wind up in your lap? Um? The Uh,

454
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 1: it was kind of we ran into the I'm losing

455
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 1: his name right now, Chris Um, Chris Scott or Chris

456
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:34,200
Speaker 1: yer Row. Do you know I have the DVD Little

457
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 1: Chris Fisher. We round from Sundance and we were able

458
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 1: to kind of take that film, take that film when

459
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 1: we took it to Sundance and was able to get

460
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: it made through you know, and that way. But we

461
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 1: had we had saw the film and loved it, thought

462
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 1: he was great. That whole Love forty thing was amazing.

463
00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 1: By the way, Steve, do you know the story of

464
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 1: honest Steve engineered Uh, de' angelo's voodoo, so not the

465
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:10,160
Speaker 1: lead engineer. So you were there like we were there.

466
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,160
Speaker 1: We were there in prison for six years like Michael

467
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: Jacks And yeah, so Love Love forty was supposed to

468
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 1: be like Brown Sugar, like a song about forty of love,

469
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 1: like like literally this guy. I guess the narrative is

470
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 1: that the lead protagonist was in love with um that

471
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 1: she used to work at. Her name was Heavilyn Savage. Right, no, no, no,

472
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: but you really know that movie I got if you

473
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: were well she used to date, right no, no, no,

474
00:29:56,320 --> 00:30:02,560
Speaker 1: but I'm saying that, uh, the and R that work,

475
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,640
Speaker 1: that the publishing spot that D was playing at when

476
00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 1: he got signed, he and her started dating. So the

477
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: movie is really based on a real life story of

478
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 1: this kind of triangle between this R and B singer

479
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 1: uh in the object of her affections and the guy

480
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 1: that like he just basically made a movie about it.

481
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 1: And yeah, it's it's quite up. It's really it's it's

482
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: it's a classic. All right. So you said you never

483
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 1: got tired of yourself? Uh on the radio, but I

484
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 1: mean towards I mean after Like, what do you say

485
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:58,040
Speaker 1: when Eric Clapton comes a calling, like is it? Oh yeah,

486
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 1: of course, like you you say, God himself is how

487
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 1: does he know who I am? That's what you say?

488
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 1: Whose idea was that? Kathy Nelson from m C A,

489
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 1: m c A, Yeah, how do you know that Kathy?

490
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 1: I remember I know her name because she was on

491
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: the cbfore soundtrack whatever anyway rights dot com, Oh my god, jesus.

492
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: All right, so she came up with the idea thing Nelson. Yes,

493
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,360
Speaker 1: she called and said that you know, she had this idea,

494
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 1: had to had this song. Uh with no no, Um

495
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 1: judge had had done the song and UH sent me

496
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: the song to let me here and then she said,

497
00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 1: now I have this idea for you to do it

498
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: with their Clapton. Um. I sent it to Eric Clapton

499
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 1: and actually Eric Clapton said he would do it, but

500
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: he would only do it if you produced it. And Uh,

501
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 1: I was like, well, how's even know who I am?

502
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 1: And then UM we got on the phone and he

503
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 1: told me that he was a fan of He loved

504
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,560
Speaker 1: the song when can I see you again? Um, and

505
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 1: said that you know, he was very inspired by that

506
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 1: and he thought I could do a good job with

507
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 1: the moment. So when the England recorded it with him,

508
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: that was a crying song that I just remember when

509
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 1: I came out and the video came out of it.

510
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: You just started, if I could change the world, change

511
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: the world, changed, change the world? And how come how long?

512
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: Oh lord that video? Where'd you record that song? And uh?

513
00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:37,120
Speaker 1: Which one the Clapton song? And uh in England I

514
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: forget the name of the studio that was recorded part

515
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: of it there and then part of it here and

516
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:46,640
Speaker 1: record play. Was that after trying? Was that after take

517
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 1: a ballot? I don't know, Yeah, before okay, thank you?

518
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:03,479
Speaker 1: Then was it was it easy recording her? Or yeah? Um?

519
00:33:03,800 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: Me and Macdonna got along very well, see the same

520
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 1: thing she liked for Kenna see you and and so

521
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,320
Speaker 1: she went to work together because of that and um,

522
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: and she came to my house at the time. I

523
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 1: just lived on Sidey Seed and we we wrote the

524
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 1: song there at the house. And actually I had a

525
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: little studio in the house where we recorded part of

526
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: it there. One question I always had a project, always

527
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,600
Speaker 1: had a question about was Tony Rich I was read

528
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: because I thought it was you the first time I

529
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,480
Speaker 1: heard it. Yeah, So how did that come about? When

530
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: me and l A, uh we're mad at each other? Okay,

531
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: what happened? I can't tell that never mind, But how

532
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: many artists were reflection of it? Me and l A

533
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 1: kind of had fell out and um and so Paves

534
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 1: went to find another me. So she found Tony Rich.

535
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,720
Speaker 1: You did not write nobody news, Nope, he didn't. No,

536
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 1: he didn't that That's why I thought it was I

537
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 1: had that album I need Laser Shots. You did not

538
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,399
Speaker 1: write that. You had nothing to do with that, nothing

539
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,399
Speaker 1: to do with it other than him being on my label. Yeah,

540
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,680
Speaker 1: Like he has the plaque for his Greatest Fighter on

541
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:25,920
Speaker 1: his It's like like that's a good fight, Like I'm

542
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 1: gonna fight with you. Was you gonna get paid? Don't

543
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:32,120
Speaker 1: worry about it? I thought you. So many people thought that,

544
00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 1: but no, or at least think back up on it. Nah,

545
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:37,800
Speaker 1: well not now. When I first heard John B, I

546
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:40,399
Speaker 1: thought that was because when they was like, yeah, that's

547
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: the new John B featuring baby Face, I was like, Okay,

548
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 1: when did John B? Saying? I didn't know? I didn't

549
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: know he was on that record? When I said, I

550
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 1: was afraid to ask. I mean, the thing was like,

551
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,320
Speaker 1: I was like, how do you feel about working with

552
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:55,600
Speaker 1: someone that sounds so closely to you? Like, how did

553
00:34:55,640 --> 00:35:00,600
Speaker 1: you it's the Wolf in Scott I didn't know you had?

554
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 1: That was all Tony rich Baby okay, and nobody knew

555
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: what except those two? You know, I had that album.

556
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:13,439
Speaker 1: I think I ordered like from Columbia houses some ship

557
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 1: but dollar that's yeah, uh yeah. I literally just walked on.

558
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 1: So I want to ask you, um with yeah, yum um,

559
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: what were some of the arts. One of the artists

560
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 1: that you guys had signed Lornia. You learn that he

561
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:43,480
Speaker 1: was a great artist and she had it she I mean,

562
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:46,480
Speaker 1: she had amazing voice. Um, that wasn't that but that

563
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:48,759
Speaker 1: was Tracy's label. That wasn't really my label. That was

564
00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 1: you know, so that was kind of like that thing

565
00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:54,600
Speaker 1: and I supported it, you know. Um, but Lorne was

566
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 1: one of those really great artists that you know, I'm

567
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 1: sorry it didn't work out for her, like like thinking

568
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 1: shouldn't because she's amazing voice and and also amazing um

569
00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: spirit about her as well, beautiful person. The evolution of

570
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 1: Tracy Edmands is quite amazing, Like she has become a

571
00:36:12,239 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: role model for a lot of women, especially executives that

572
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 1: how do you how does that make you feel? Like

573
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:20,319
Speaker 1: some of the things that you guys built. And I'm

574
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:22,640
Speaker 1: proud that she was able to, you know, come from

575
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:25,359
Speaker 1: where she came from beause you know, people just they

576
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:27,759
Speaker 1: you know, she was in a video so they called

577
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 1: a video girl, and and so I spent a good

578
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 1: deal of time trying to take that off of her

579
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 1: and give her the opportunity to prove that, you know

580
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:38,520
Speaker 1: that she was she's a business person business. I mean

581
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,000
Speaker 1: that so fool was just so it was so it

582
00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,680
Speaker 1: was it was a lot more about that. You know, Um,

583
00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:49,960
Speaker 1: women in business, UM, many times they will not get

584
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:52,640
Speaker 1: the same shot because they because they think that they

585
00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 1: don't know what they're doing or are are It's uh,

586
00:36:56,480 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 1: it's just this, you know, it's a chauvinistic man's game.

587
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,360
Speaker 1: And so I think when you can, when you have,

588
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: when you're in a position to help help someone, then

589
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:09,879
Speaker 1: that's what you should do. You know, a buddy of mine,

590
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:12,560
Speaker 1: new artists that you're working with, she said, you guys

591
00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 1: are working to other cat ground. Uh. She wanted me

592
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:18,279
Speaker 1: to ask you, which I thought was a great question,

593
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: what do you do when you have writer's block? But

594
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 1: is that even the thing? Do you have? Right? Does

595
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:27,400
Speaker 1: that even exist? Yeah, you just don't write, just let

596
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:29,520
Speaker 1: it go because it just stop. You just don't write.

597
00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:31,879
Speaker 1: And then I thought it was a baby face punt. Yeah,

598
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:36,640
Speaker 1: all right, let it go, let it flow. Random, random

599
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:38,080
Speaker 1: baby face question. I just wanted to ask. In the

600
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:41,440
Speaker 1: last two years solid, can you tell me how Solid

601
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: came about? And how did Todd dollarside? How did that happen? Um?

602
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:48,080
Speaker 1: SI called here and wanted to work with me and

603
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,719
Speaker 1: you and that's that's a great because I love his

604
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:55,480
Speaker 1: voice and um incredible voice. And then uh, as I

605
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 1: met him, we just did some more work together just

606
00:37:57,600 --> 00:38:00,800
Speaker 1: recently too. So um but when we when we started

607
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 1: to work together, and then I saw how much of

608
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:04,880
Speaker 1: a musician he was. That was That's what I was

609
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: impressed about. And does he play yeah, okay yeah, and

610
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 1: uh good musician and so he's very untapped in terms

611
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: of what what his real talent is I think, and

612
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: I think that will keep showing. It's more time goes by,

613
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:22,279
Speaker 1: but it was it was fun to do that. Then

614
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:24,480
Speaker 1: we just we just recently did some more work again.

615
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:30,360
Speaker 1: And uh, I like, I like doing work everywhere, so

616
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 1: whether it's you know, whether it's hip hop or whether

617
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:37,800
Speaker 1: it's your country or are any any genre because to

618
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 1: be able to why I feel so blessed because I

619
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 1: can work with the ty Dalla side, you know ago

620
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,239
Speaker 1: our little way, and then I can also then I'm

621
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:50,239
Speaker 1: working with Johnny Mathis, I do with Barber Strikes. So

622
00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:54,040
Speaker 1: I have a question, what was it like, Um, how

623
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 1: did the Fallout Boy project work coming out? Because because

624
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 1: that's that's it seems like really random just know that's

625
00:38:59,400 --> 00:39:02,600
Speaker 1: It's the other thing where I get calls from you know,

626
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 1: these artists that you know Patrick from Fallback call and

627
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,840
Speaker 1: uh and wanted to wanted to do some work and

628
00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 1: want to figure out how to how how we could

629
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,360
Speaker 1: work together and so um I was able to, you know,

630
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 1: do a couple of things with them. And they called

631
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 1: me because of the Josie and the Pussycats and the

632
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: music I did for the Josie and the Pussycats. I

633
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 1: was gonna say, Uh, I once tried to do this, uh,

634
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:34,440
Speaker 1: like real serious symposium, like in New York, and I

635
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:36,760
Speaker 1: had their ears and then I had to give a reference,

636
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 1: and I gave a Josie and the Pussycat reference and

637
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,839
Speaker 1: the collective left there about here they were like get out.

638
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:47,280
Speaker 1: But the thing was, y'all were really trying to drop

639
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 1: some science in that movie. I mean it was beyond

640
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:53,440
Speaker 1: I watched it on it was like it was on

641
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:58,719
Speaker 1: the airplane, when you're on the airplane. Um, but it

642
00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 1: wasn't the standard popcorn fair. You guys are literally trying

643
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 1: to expose all the magician's tricks to how the industry works.

644
00:40:09,719 --> 00:40:12,840
Speaker 1: And I almost felt like when I watched it, I

645
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 1: was like, wait, are y'all allowed to do this? Like

646
00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:18,439
Speaker 1: how are they not trying to get rid of you guys?

647
00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:22,400
Speaker 1: Like what was I mean, what was the it was

648
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:29,640
Speaker 1: because because it was colored in in this comical mhm.

649
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:32,440
Speaker 1: Have you guys seen it? I haven't seen it. It's

650
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 1: a it's like they're literally exposing the industry. It's like

651
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:39,759
Speaker 1: behind what what's the behind the behind the music? That

652
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:44,920
Speaker 1: behind the music documentary I did where they where they

653
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:48,160
Speaker 1: expose how records get on clear channel and all that

654
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: stuff behind the song? I forget what it's but this

655
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 1: is like the movie version of that. It's a good

656
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: it's a it's a great movie actually, and um, and

657
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:58,840
Speaker 1: the music was funny and so though it's it's one

658
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 1: of those projects I'm proud to have been a part of. Sure,

659
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:12,240
Speaker 1: so I guess there was not necessarily silence. But before

660
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 1: you did your solo project in two Thou with the Face,

661
00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:19,680
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, with the Neptunes, Like at that point did

662
00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:22,600
Speaker 1: you just feel like, Okay, well I don't totally have

663
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 1: to have like fifteen number ones every year like I can, Like,

664
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:30,880
Speaker 1: what made you want to let someone else produce you?

665
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:38,239
Speaker 1: That was rough? Um, because the tunes well that was cool, okay, um,

666
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:43,440
Speaker 1: because I wanted to learn and I work with uh

667
00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: younger writers and younger producers that i'd like to see

668
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,560
Speaker 1: what they do. Um. There's never a point where you

669
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:53,919
Speaker 1: can't learn more and and to watch for real work

670
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:56,400
Speaker 1: and and you know, because he was doing everything on

671
00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:58,759
Speaker 1: this ensnic and it was like, wait a minute, this

672
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:04,920
Speaker 1: is all you use? That was amazing. Um. And to

673
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 1: see him at that particular point, I I told him

674
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 1: at that point, I said, I know that one day

675
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 1: he's gonna blow up because of the passion that he

676
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,840
Speaker 1: has with everything. And I kind of already kind of

677
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:18,120
Speaker 1: liked everything that he did. But at that point, what

678
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 1: was different for that project for me was that I

679
00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:24,800
Speaker 1: really kind of let go and let everybody kind of

680
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 1: produce me so heavy d he was part of that, uh,

681
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,239
Speaker 1: and he brought in a couple of songs and uh,

682
00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 1: and I was working with Andre Horael and so they

683
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,319
Speaker 1: were so I really kind of was just letting them

684
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,240
Speaker 1: guie at me. Um. Okay, So I have the story

685
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:45,640
Speaker 1: do you know the story about to tell oh Jesus Christ?

686
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:50,040
Speaker 1: All right, so uh, earlier that day, the roots are

687
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 1: at the House of Blues. Um, this is like this

688
00:42:54,640 --> 00:43:01,840
Speaker 1: might have been ninety nine, I guess um. And I

689
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:05,400
Speaker 1: got a weird phone call that I didn't trust, and

690
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:10,239
Speaker 1: my managers like, yo, um, you're gonna go to Baby

691
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:15,360
Speaker 1: Faces Studio after the show tonight, um. And I was

692
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:18,759
Speaker 1: like for what He's like, I don't know to to

693
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 1: work on stuff? I said, does he want me to

694
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 1: drum on stuff? Like see make sure my back lines there.

695
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,719
Speaker 1: I'm thinking I'm going there to drum on it. They're

696
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:28,520
Speaker 1: like to see about production and I was like, Okay,

697
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:31,360
Speaker 1: who's punking me? Like why in the world with the

698
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:37,279
Speaker 1: world's most successful songs, I want to weep with me

699
00:43:37,440 --> 00:43:40,560
Speaker 1: like one and a half hits like that? That doesn't

700
00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 1: sound right. So I instantly thought it was set up.

701
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:50,840
Speaker 1: I thought it was set up between between nineties six

702
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:55,319
Speaker 1: and two thousand and two. The kind of the kind

703
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:59,879
Speaker 1: of no no, the kind of what they do now

704
00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: was following me, and I always felt that some even

705
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,279
Speaker 1: with Biggie going like, I always felt like there was

706
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:10,080
Speaker 1: gonna be some like bad boy retaliation about to happen. Um.

707
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:14,360
Speaker 1: And it really got confirmed because when we're on stage

708
00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:16,919
Speaker 1: during the last like by this point, like Scratch Roz,

709
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 1: we're doing there so parts of the show, and you

710
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 1: know the show is about the end. I looked to

711
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:26,320
Speaker 1: the stage left and I saw these three big dudes,

712
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,320
Speaker 1: like three big monsters l a dudes at the side,

713
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: and Tina's like, these guys are gonna drive you to

714
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:38,920
Speaker 1: baby Face. I'm a I'm a die. So you know,

715
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 1: we get all stage and they're like, yeah, what's up, man,

716
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 1: how are you doing? We're going to drive you on

717
00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:45,640
Speaker 1: the face the studio. And I knew by that point

718
00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,320
Speaker 1: I was gonna die because I was like, this is

719
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:51,800
Speaker 1: how bad Boy gets me back for what they do video.

720
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: And we walked out of the dressing room. We're in

721
00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: the hallway, and I distinctly remember running back to the

722
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:05,600
Speaker 1: dressing room and I grabbed a bag of Laies Mesquite

723
00:45:05,640 --> 00:45:09,799
Speaker 1: barbecue chips because I was like, okay, well, at least

724
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:12,879
Speaker 1: wanted this is gonna be my last meal before I die.

725
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,600
Speaker 1: And we get in the car and it's just like

726
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 1: the Mafia films, like I sat in the middle. I

727
00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:22,880
Speaker 1: sat in the middle, flanked between these two guys. They

728
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 1: drive me to the studio. We go down in this

729
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:30,760
Speaker 1: sort of tunnel thing, and when we're walking in the hallway,

730
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 1: was like the Green Mild death row scene. It was dark,

731
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 1: no lights on, and I just like, oh fuck, I'm

732
00:45:39,680 --> 00:45:42,080
Speaker 1: about to get baseball bad at the death, like this

733
00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 1: is album my die and opened the door and it's

734
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 1: Heavy D. And I was like Heavy D. He's like, hey, man,

735
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:54,320
Speaker 1: come on man. And then I knew it was a

736
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:55,959
Speaker 1: set up because I was like, I didn't know Heavy

737
00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 1: D as a producer then, you know what I mean.

738
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 1: I was like, what are you doing here? Yeah? Man,

739
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:08,239
Speaker 1: you know producing baby Face And I was like, no, oh,

740
00:46:08,239 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 1: I mean you did not produced. Yeah, I get down

741
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:12,640
Speaker 1: working on Jill Scott too, and then like he plays

742
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:15,120
Speaker 1: me all these songs and you know, by that point,

743
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:21,400
Speaker 1: I was like and then he got to you like

744
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,239
Speaker 1: one you were like in another studio somewhere. You got

745
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:28,160
Speaker 1: on the phone like on another line. But yeah, I

746
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:30,800
Speaker 1: thought that I was going to die at night, and

747
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:36,200
Speaker 1: I thought, what what did you end up doing? Was joint?

748
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:39,839
Speaker 1: I ended up breathing the side of relief and took

749
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:45,320
Speaker 1: about five pounds off of me going back to the bathroom. No, no,

750
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:48,600
Speaker 1: I listen. By that point, you know, we were like

751
00:46:48,760 --> 00:46:50,840
Speaker 1: torn like crazy, so I just didn't have time to

752
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:57,400
Speaker 1: to commit to that, But yeah, I knew that I

753
00:46:57,560 --> 00:47:00,279
Speaker 1: was being pranked because there was no way in hell

754
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:04,400
Speaker 1: that I was supposed to be working on a baby face. Right.

755
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: It sound like you the one person he hasn't worked

756
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 1: with yet. Yeah, I was about to say, you're both

757
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:14,960
Speaker 1: here right now, we are in a studio. The duet

758
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,319
Speaker 1: that you did with Raphael Sad, did you talk about

759
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:21,359
Speaker 1: letting other cats produce you? Was that instance that? Yeah?

760
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 1: It was on the It was on Um. Yeah, I

761
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 1: mean me and Raphaell we we kind of like the

762
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 1: same dude sometimes, and so like working with him was

763
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:41,440
Speaker 1: it's kind of like working with myself. Uh he is

764
00:47:41,480 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 1: that a good thing or bad? Fans? That's a good thing.

765
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:46,719
Speaker 1: I don't with him, I don't worry. But if I'm

766
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 1: behind the microphone, that the hardest part for me is

767
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:52,759
Speaker 1: being behind the microphone and and singing and then letting

768
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: somebody tell me if that was good or that wasn't good.

769
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,640
Speaker 1: And I'm like, that wasn't good and I could do it,

770
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:02,960
Speaker 1: do it again or whatever, And so I and I did.

771
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 1: I did the same thing. Actually I did. There was

772
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 1: I'd work with Jimmy and Terry that way. We did

773
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 1: some work together and standing behind that Mike and and

774
00:48:14,480 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: and being just the artist. I did it with Jimmy

775
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:19,600
Speaker 1: and Terry. I did it once with David Foster and

776
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 1: and uh, and that's a hard place for me to be.

777
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,879
Speaker 1: It's just, um, I feel like I feel like I'm

778
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: I have more than to I know kind of what

779
00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 1: to do myself. What was it like working with Terry

780
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: and Jimmy Like, was that it was super surreal for you?

781
00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 1: Or we had we had fun. We we did some

782
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:41,319
Speaker 1: records that are still nice records, I think, but they

783
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:45,320
Speaker 1: weren't exactly um, they weren't right for the record we

784
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:47,719
Speaker 1: were doing at the time that it ultimately didn't come out.

785
00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 1: And they've talked about releasing a lot of songs they

786
00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: I said, whenever they want to put it on the

787
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 1: record that they do of all the arts they work

788
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:58,880
Speaker 1: with them, fine with that. But dead Stock record where yeah, okay,

789
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:04,520
Speaker 1: that sort of thing. Um. But the actual it was

790
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 1: the first time actually kind of being in and actually

791
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:13,320
Speaker 1: working with them and we I guess everybody is different

792
00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:15,960
Speaker 1: in terms of how they do things and how they

793
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 1: approach records and um. So it's always fun to watch

794
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:23,680
Speaker 1: that and see see different musicians that they're bringing and stuffing.

795
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:28,920
Speaker 1: Um and UM, you you this, if you keep your

796
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:31,880
Speaker 1: eyes open, you can always learn something you know of

797
00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 1: a feel and learn how to play something a little

798
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 1: bit different. So one question I had about Tony, and

799
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:40,600
Speaker 1: this may have been more of an l a thing

800
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 1: now that you've kind of broken it down, when she

801
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 1: sued the Face, how did you guys get from her

802
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:50,040
Speaker 1: suing the Face to now y'all you know doing the

803
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:53,400
Speaker 1: Love managing the Voice album. Um. I've always been an

804
00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: artist friendly person, so I understood where she was coming

805
00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,600
Speaker 1: from when she sued she was selling because there was

806
00:50:01,680 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 1: nothing we could do about it. We were we had

807
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:06,719
Speaker 1: a joint venture, and so we didn't really make the

808
00:50:06,800 --> 00:50:10,800
Speaker 1: final answers on it. Everything that was. We would have

809
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:14,480
Speaker 1: gave everybody everything, but we she was under the aristood

810
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:18,120
Speaker 1: and so when we wanted to pay somebody, they wouldn't

811
00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:22,400
Speaker 1: let us. And uh, and so we were both the

812
00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:26,719
Speaker 1: TLC and the Tony Brackston situation was because when they

813
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:28,799
Speaker 1: came to us and asked for money, we'd say, yep,

814
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 1: we agree, we want to give them. They wouldn't let

815
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 1: us do it, so they sued us and then they

816
00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:37,120
Speaker 1: ultimately gave him the money. We wouldn't give people money,

817
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:39,320
Speaker 1: wouldn't they let your paper? Were you guys that labeled proper?

818
00:50:39,480 --> 00:50:41,680
Speaker 1: Or a production deal? Because usually with the production deal,

819
00:50:41,719 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 1: it's like he gotta get a he gotta get he

820
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:46,800
Speaker 1: gotta get production. There was, it was a JV. But

821
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:49,279
Speaker 1: the reality is we couldn't make the complete cause they

822
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:52,440
Speaker 1: they handled the first drink. So, um, do you have

823
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:55,680
Speaker 1: a relationship with Clide Davis? Yeah, what what is your

824
00:50:55,719 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 1: feeling with him? Um? Clive is a businessman. Yeah, he's

825
00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:04,239
Speaker 1: a businessman. I've worked with him in so many on

826
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:09,000
Speaker 1: so many different things. Um that I've had to work

827
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:13,319
Speaker 1: with them. Um, you know, because it's Windey Houston, you know, Um,

828
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:15,920
Speaker 1: there was. I'm working with him right now with Johnny

829
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:20,879
Speaker 1: Johnny Mathis. Um wait, clap still has a label. He's

830
00:51:21,040 --> 00:51:23,239
Speaker 1: at least a ring this. He's the head of this.

831
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: He came up with this whole idea about Johnny Mathis doing,

832
00:51:26,640 --> 00:51:31,160
Speaker 1: Um the song book. Um, okay, you know a new

833
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:35,400
Speaker 1: song book that, Um what is Clide Davis? Clive is

834
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:42,760
Speaker 1: maybe damn It takes a looking and then Johnny mathis,

835
00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:48,719
Speaker 1: what's this? What's his vocal prowess? Like great he still

836
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:50,640
Speaker 1: he sounds great. I saw him on he was on

837
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 1: Tavis Smiley. I think one of us watching him like

838
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:57,640
Speaker 1: a years ago. He sounds great. Okay, So before we

839
00:51:57,719 --> 00:52:02,640
Speaker 1: wind down, and I know every songwriter does thislike all

840
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:09,399
Speaker 1: my songs are my children? Gun to your head? Gun

841
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:12,960
Speaker 1: to your head? If all your songs are personified as

842
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 1: human beings on the Titanic and they're going down in

843
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 1: the ship, which three songs are you saving? What is

844
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:26,320
Speaker 1: your Yes, it doesn't have to be like your biggest

845
00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:29,359
Speaker 1: hits or whatever. But so don't say in the Road

846
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 1: or whatever, because like, oh that got me my first

847
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:35,720
Speaker 1: house in Malibu. Like, but I mean, like what songs

848
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: like give you goose bumps or best memories of recording it,

849
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:43,439
Speaker 1: or like ones that still impress you like I made that? Really?

850
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:46,440
Speaker 1: How did that come with me? That is a hard

851
00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:54,319
Speaker 1: question because he you have to you when I think

852
00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:56,600
Speaker 1: about I have to think about like, obviously I'm one

853
00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:58,799
Speaker 1: of those will be a Whitney song because she's not here,

854
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 1: so now XL and I mean baby tonight, I feel

855
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:10,520
Speaker 1: like very special because of that. Um, but not necessary

856
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:14,320
Speaker 1: because I love them more than any particular song cinema,

857
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:19,759
Speaker 1: So um, and I always give you the question, what's

858
00:53:19,800 --> 00:53:23,320
Speaker 1: the best song I've ever written? I haven't written because

859
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,879
Speaker 1: and I But the truth is I really believe that. Um.

860
00:53:27,719 --> 00:53:31,000
Speaker 1: I don't say that to to sound sound cool. I

861
00:53:31,120 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: say it because I because I look at the songs

862
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:36,000
Speaker 1: that other people write. Damn, I wish I wrote that.

863
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:41,480
Speaker 1: So what three songs of yours could you like? I

864
00:53:41,600 --> 00:53:48,160
Speaker 1: hate that, like, yeah, it could have been better, or

865
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:51,319
Speaker 1: I phone that one in well. I wish I had

866
00:53:51,360 --> 00:53:53,839
Speaker 1: another opportunity to work with Michael Jackson and who would

867
00:53:54,040 --> 00:53:55,880
Speaker 1: not have given him slave to the rhythm, but a

868
00:53:55,960 --> 00:54:01,319
Speaker 1: better song I did do? Um Uh, I got it. Yeah,

869
00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:03,760
Speaker 1: I did do that one, and it was. The funny

870
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:07,439
Speaker 1: thing is Michael Jackson has the song and get yeah

871
00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:10,640
Speaker 1: gotta put my gotta put your heart on the line

872
00:54:12,120 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 1: and uh. And I loved that I had that opportunity

873
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:18,880
Speaker 1: I was able to. I ultimately became friends with Michael

874
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:22,080
Speaker 1: and and found my places and find myself in places

875
00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:25,040
Speaker 1: with Michael like what am I doing here? Throughout my career,

876
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:29,320
Speaker 1: I've I found my place myself at places where I like,

877
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:32,759
Speaker 1: I have to pinch myself, why how am I here? Um?

878
00:54:33,960 --> 00:54:36,920
Speaker 1: So many times? And whether it's just being there as

879
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 1: an artist or me presidents hanging with presidents, Uh, going

880
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:44,799
Speaker 1: to going to I went to a trip to Nice

881
00:54:44,920 --> 00:54:47,560
Speaker 1: with Michael Jackson and saw him for Farm on the

882
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,360
Speaker 1: stage and he had me standing on the in the

883
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 1: dressing room off to the side as he would go

884
00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:55,319
Speaker 1: back and forth, and I'm like, and why am I here?

885
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 1: Why am I here? When you said me Nation? I

886
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:09,279
Speaker 1: want how did that happen? Like the energy? So yeah,

887
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:11,759
Speaker 1: he did. Ultimately he said, you know, you and I

888
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:14,319
Speaker 1: we have the same sense of humor because we're both

889
00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:20,200
Speaker 1: from Indiana. Hey, that's from truth. I think there's some

890
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:26,360
Speaker 1: truth to that. Um. Well, I gotta didn't answer your questions. No,

891
00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:30,719
Speaker 1: of course you did. Uh, baby Face, I really, really,

892
00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:33,920
Speaker 1: really truly want to thank you for letting us. Yes, man,

893
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 1: pick your brain and I would say, in here, in

894
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:38,759
Speaker 1: your in your space. One of my Titanic baby Face

895
00:55:38,840 --> 00:55:42,160
Speaker 1: songs would be Lady Lady like off. I love that song.

896
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:45,879
Speaker 1: It's like, God, you're such an R and B D Yo, man,

897
00:55:46,040 --> 00:55:52,200
Speaker 1: that's if you thank that. I'm taking at the movies. Movies.

898
00:55:52,560 --> 00:55:56,879
Speaker 1: I never do the title right, but you know, still

899
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:02,920
Speaker 1: there is a there is a cover, there's been a

900
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:06,040
Speaker 1: cover of Shoot Him Up Movies done by Moby Dick

901
00:56:06,200 --> 00:56:12,680
Speaker 1: on No Limit Records. It is it is one of

902
00:56:12,760 --> 00:56:17,000
Speaker 1: the worst. Here your life. I don't know what baby

903
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:20,400
Speaker 1: faces it's heard that No no, it shoot him Up

904
00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:22,360
Speaker 1: movies done by by Moby Dick, who used to do

905
00:56:22,440 --> 00:56:24,760
Speaker 1: all the hooks for No. That sounds like a bad idea,

906
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 1: you know. I don't know if it's worse than the TJ.

907
00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:38,000
Speaker 1: Swan and Whitney. Oh my god, yes, I still think

908
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:43,160
Speaker 1: this is it. Yeah, this was ninety eight. This is

909
00:56:43,239 --> 00:56:47,439
Speaker 1: like no, no, no, you gotta do this is such

910
00:56:47,480 --> 00:56:52,879
Speaker 1: a menial yet up, No, not just cover. It's just yeah,

911
00:56:52,960 --> 00:57:09,440
Speaker 1: it's just here we go, come on ten. Okay, how

912
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:12,680
Speaker 1: do you know this? Fonte dude? Like y'all, I was

913
00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:15,360
Speaker 1: a No Limit head, like I just there was in college,

914
00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:19,240
Speaker 1: Like I just consumed too much music as a kid man. Okay,

915
00:57:19,280 --> 00:57:23,480
Speaker 1: that hurts a little to wait to the hook, the hook,

916
00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:25,320
Speaker 1: because that's what it really just gets kind of pain.

917
00:57:27,720 --> 00:57:31,040
Speaker 1: This It sounds like me in my bedroom, according myself,

918
00:57:31,080 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 1: sitting along to the radio. Keep trying right, there's a video.

919
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:43,880
Speaker 1: Oh it was a video. Oh my god, it was

920
00:57:45,840 --> 00:57:48,920
Speaker 1: at least they at the movie. I want to have

921
00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:52,720
Speaker 1: met with salons now all right, hello, here me go,

922
00:57:52,880 --> 00:58:00,320
Speaker 1: come on, come with it total listen. Dude would go

923
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:13,320
Speaker 1: through shoot up. Oh you tried it, he tried it,

924
00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:20,520
Speaker 1: he tried. All right, it's beautiful. Thank you baby, thank you,

925
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:28,600
Speaker 1: thank you for that again. We appreciate uh everything that

926
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:33,360
Speaker 1: you've done. And thank you. You are you are a

927
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:37,920
Speaker 1: black guy, and just says of my life in the hallway.

928
00:58:38,080 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: You get a chance to see a baby Face show today,

929
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,960
Speaker 1: like please do because you surprised the ship out of me.

930
00:58:43,080 --> 00:58:44,840
Speaker 1: Where you jump in the crowd and do like go

931
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:47,360
Speaker 1: to church. It was just amazing. So I tell people

932
00:58:47,640 --> 00:58:50,160
Speaker 1: that the show is amazing, and I just want to say,

933
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:53,400
Speaker 1: you're probably the last artist that everyone in my family

934
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:57,200
Speaker 1: was able to enjoy. Um. My dad bought two copies

935
00:58:57,240 --> 00:58:59,200
Speaker 1: of Waiting to Exhale and kept one in the car

936
00:58:59,360 --> 00:59:04,080
Speaker 1: one in the bed room. WHOA my mom. I called

937
00:59:04,120 --> 00:59:05,680
Speaker 1: my mom just before this to let her know that

938
00:59:05,760 --> 00:59:08,320
Speaker 1: I was interviewing you, and she like almost probably hopped

939
00:59:08,360 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 1: on a plane to come meet my sister. She's the

940
00:59:11,960 --> 00:59:14,439
Speaker 1: one that you know brought Tender Lover in the house

941
00:59:14,520 --> 00:59:17,680
Speaker 1: and you know it's thinking like you are the one

942
00:59:17,720 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 1: that brought my family together. I guess you could say, so,

943
00:59:20,480 --> 00:59:22,480
Speaker 1: is there someone that you haven't worked with yet that

944
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:34,160
Speaker 1: I haven't worked with? You? Bang bang got all right,

945
00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:37,120
Speaker 1: Well we should, we should, we should do that someday. Yeah,

946
00:59:37,200 --> 00:59:43,040
Speaker 1: we definitely worked. But in general, I think, I mean,

947
00:59:43,080 --> 00:59:47,200
Speaker 1: there's always artists that um that come up that that

948
00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:49,680
Speaker 1: I'd be honor to work with. But you know, I

949
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:52,680
Speaker 1: have been so lucky to work with so many arts

950
00:59:52,760 --> 00:59:58,360
Speaker 1: that if I don't, I'll be all right if you

951
00:59:58,520 --> 01:00:01,800
Speaker 1: never make another record, Like you're good, dude, You're good

952
01:00:01,840 --> 01:00:04,840
Speaker 1: ever forever. So it's like sugar Steve, alright, So we

953
01:00:04,960 --> 01:00:07,440
Speaker 1: do our reflections at the end. Uh, what have you

954
01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:09,640
Speaker 1: learned this episode? I'm still on one of the first

955
01:00:09,680 --> 01:00:14,920
Speaker 1: things I heard. Forty nominations. Uh, that's incredible. You're just

956
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:17,600
Speaker 1: gonna say, probably got a nomination even for the Writer's Block.

957
01:00:20,360 --> 01:00:27,520
Speaker 1: Even my Writer's Block is sponsored by nurse What did

958
01:00:27,560 --> 01:00:30,560
Speaker 1: you I think I've learned that, like all these songs,

959
01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:32,840
Speaker 1: you're such a machine that in my mind every song

960
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:35,080
Speaker 1: meant something deep and was based on something. But you're

961
01:00:35,080 --> 01:00:37,640
Speaker 1: such a machine that it doesn't always And that's all

962
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:41,600
Speaker 1: right because it does to me. That's what I take

963
01:00:41,600 --> 01:00:44,400
Speaker 1: a little man. What I learned is just really just

964
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:46,840
Speaker 1: kind of reinforce something I've always believed, just for him

965
01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:48,760
Speaker 1: saying that it's all about the song, you know what

966
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:51,800
Speaker 1: I mean, and just how it really is. Um, it's

967
01:00:51,800 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 1: easy to give stuff away just because if you feel

968
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:57,920
Speaker 1: that it can be better served for another person. It's

969
01:00:57,960 --> 01:01:00,800
Speaker 1: easy to be unselfish in that way because you just

970
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:04,320
Speaker 1: see it has a higher purpose and you know, Bobby

971
01:01:04,360 --> 01:01:06,600
Speaker 1: could take it further than I could, or Boys the

972
01:01:06,680 --> 01:01:09,960
Speaker 1: Man or whoever whoever. That's just something that's really inspiring

973
01:01:10,120 --> 01:01:16,360
Speaker 1: and very very wise. Boss Bill Kobe Yo, yeah the

974
01:01:16,440 --> 01:01:25,280
Speaker 1: slang Kobe, Yeah, should check out general hospital to hospital.

975
01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:29,320
Speaker 1: But I gotta I was gonna say, when we when

976
01:01:29,360 --> 01:01:32,520
Speaker 1: we stop this, what are we gonna we leave like

977
01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:38,120
Speaker 1: five minutes from now? What's the what was it? We

978
01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:47,440
Speaker 1: covered everything right? One thing we may have touched on

979
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:50,760
Speaker 1: a little bit, but just I guess we covered it. Yeah,

980
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:52,920
Speaker 1: never mind, what was that? Well? I was gonna ask you,

981
01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:54,920
Speaker 1: do you prefer writing for women or men? Because you

982
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:58,439
Speaker 1: do such a great job writing for women, Like I don't.

983
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 1: I don't think there's any other males songwriter that can

984
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:02,680
Speaker 1: write for a woman the way that you do, so, like,

985
01:02:04,320 --> 01:02:07,880
Speaker 1: do you have a preference. I don't have a preference,

986
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 1: but I know that I can for women. It's a

987
01:02:14,640 --> 01:02:16,960
Speaker 1: lot of times here in recent years when I get

988
01:02:17,240 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 1: someone comes in the studio, we have a conversation and

989
01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:24,120
Speaker 1: we talk a lot, and I get into it's like

990
01:02:24,200 --> 01:02:26,960
Speaker 1: a doctor film moment by the time. So I go

991
01:02:27,120 --> 01:02:29,800
Speaker 1: for tears in our first conversation. Are you trying to

992
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:36,000
Speaker 1: Barbara Walters? Them? What kind of question? I go in

993
01:02:36,160 --> 01:02:38,840
Speaker 1: for the relationships and everything, so that we can get

994
01:02:38,880 --> 01:02:40,960
Speaker 1: to a point to where we can so I can

995
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:43,480
Speaker 1: I can know them, and I can try to write

996
01:02:43,640 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 1: from that perspective. Um and uh, because it gives you something,

997
01:02:49,600 --> 01:02:52,560
Speaker 1: you know, because at that particular point, um, you don't.

998
01:02:52,680 --> 01:02:55,360
Speaker 1: Sometimes you can guess about somebody and try to figure

999
01:02:55,360 --> 01:02:58,160
Speaker 1: out who they are before you get to them. And

1000
01:02:59,120 --> 01:03:02,320
Speaker 1: it's like when Whitney first came and heard this all miracle,

1001
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:05,960
Speaker 1: she wasn't ready for it, but when she heard it,

1002
01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:10,040
Speaker 1: she cried, um, and at least she had tears in

1003
01:03:10,120 --> 01:03:14,160
Speaker 1: her eyes. And so she said, that's not for me. Um.

1004
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:17,440
Speaker 1: But and I thought to myself, to be honest, I

1005
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:19,400
Speaker 1: thought to myself it's not for you, because it is

1006
01:03:19,520 --> 01:03:22,720
Speaker 1: for you, you know, and you don't. The truth is,

1007
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:24,800
Speaker 1: I thought, you don't want to say things that you

1008
01:03:24,960 --> 01:03:28,600
Speaker 1: can relate to. UM, so ultimately you go, you go

1009
01:03:28,760 --> 01:03:31,840
Speaker 1: after songs that they don't touch you. Is that how

1010
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:34,080
Speaker 1: you got to change your mind on the later on

1011
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:35,960
Speaker 1: she decided to do the song, and I don't know

1012
01:03:36,040 --> 01:03:39,640
Speaker 1: what made her decide to do it exactly. Maybe, so

1013
01:03:40,280 --> 01:03:42,440
Speaker 1: all right, I have one more question. Sorry, this is

1014
01:03:42,440 --> 01:03:46,040
Speaker 1: a production question. UM. When I listened to like Jimmy Jamming,

1015
01:03:46,040 --> 01:03:48,680
Speaker 1: Tylor Louise, I can usually tell who there who their

1016
01:03:48,720 --> 01:03:50,680
Speaker 1: B team was for a certain or a certain era.

1017
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:53,480
Speaker 1: I can never I don't think you've ever had like

1018
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:56,960
Speaker 1: a B team under you or have you. I'm like

1019
01:03:57,120 --> 01:03:59,640
Speaker 1: just a team that you know doesn't care. Was kind

1020
01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:01,800
Speaker 1: of a B team in terms of he might produce

1021
01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:03,560
Speaker 1: some of the vocals. Darrel was really good at produce

1022
01:04:03,600 --> 01:04:05,880
Speaker 1: some of the vocals. But in terms of tracks and

1023
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:09,200
Speaker 1: things in the early days, we didn't. We kind of

1024
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:13,240
Speaker 1: like did it ourselves and um, and and we would

1025
01:04:13,520 --> 01:04:16,280
Speaker 1: would really I don't even really remember putting our name

1026
01:04:16,320 --> 01:04:18,080
Speaker 1: on something that if we didn't do the tracks, but

1027
01:04:18,240 --> 01:04:19,800
Speaker 1: we put our name on it like it was us

1028
01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:23,080
Speaker 1: that wasn't We usually just gave the credit to like

1029
01:04:23,120 --> 01:04:25,120
Speaker 1: it was Kao and Darrel, then they got the credit

1030
01:04:25,200 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 1: for producing it. Yeah, all right, man, this baby all right,

1031
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:39,080
Speaker 1: all right, here it is. I used to work at

1032
01:04:39,080 --> 01:04:40,960
Speaker 1: def Jam a long time ago, and we went on

1033
01:04:41,040 --> 01:04:44,680
Speaker 1: this company retreat and I can't remember the entire story,

1034
01:04:44,760 --> 01:04:47,919
Speaker 1: but l A was telling the story about you guys

1035
01:04:47,960 --> 01:04:49,680
Speaker 1: took a I think it was a deal record to

1036
01:04:49,720 --> 01:04:51,720
Speaker 1: a club. You guys like pumped up. You guys thought

1037
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:53,560
Speaker 1: this was gonna be like the biggest record in the world.

1038
01:04:53,800 --> 01:04:55,320
Speaker 1: You guys took it to the club and to test

1039
01:04:55,360 --> 01:04:58,840
Speaker 1: it out and it tanked. Like what do you do then? Like,

1040
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:02,880
Speaker 1: how what was your how did you feel like knowing

1041
01:05:02,960 --> 01:05:08,160
Speaker 1: that your your intuition wasn't right on that one? What

1042
01:05:08,280 --> 01:05:13,280
Speaker 1: we learned is that that wasn't our gig. Uh. When

1043
01:05:13,320 --> 01:05:16,080
Speaker 1: Teddy came out with I wonder when we heard that

1044
01:05:16,120 --> 01:05:17,640
Speaker 1: at one and the first time I heard that, I said,

1045
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:21,120
Speaker 1: oh my god, this is this is changing the game,

1046
01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:23,760
Speaker 1: and I don't know, I don't know that we can

1047
01:05:23,960 --> 01:05:28,120
Speaker 1: compete with that um. And then when Teddy delivered my

1048
01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:30,680
Speaker 1: prerogative on the don't be cruel. I was like, uh,

1049
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:35,360
Speaker 1: so rather than trying to be that, we just kind

1050
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:38,840
Speaker 1: of went the other way. Um, And we weren't trying

1051
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:41,320
Speaker 1: to be dance music people. You know, we didn't think

1052
01:05:41,320 --> 01:05:43,640
Speaker 1: we were gonna make everybody dance or say we were

1053
01:05:43,680 --> 01:05:49,240
Speaker 1: just gonna entertain and so um, it was really when

1054
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:54,160
Speaker 1: we were going there checking these songs in the in

1055
01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:56,440
Speaker 1: the clubs. That was early on. It's like in the

1056
01:05:56,520 --> 01:05:59,440
Speaker 1: deal days, we didn't have it. We didn't have that

1057
01:06:00,120 --> 01:06:03,080
Speaker 1: wasn't that part of my thing? And so part of uh,

1058
01:06:03,720 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 1: part part of what happened is because of the ballot,

1059
01:06:06,720 --> 01:06:09,760
Speaker 1: because because I fell in love with Got Broken Hearts.

1060
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:14,120
Speaker 1: That's that's ultimately what helped, you know, shape us as

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01:06:14,240 --> 01:06:17,400
Speaker 1: producers and and and writers. And that opened up the

1062
01:06:17,440 --> 01:06:20,000
Speaker 1: door for us because even though don't be cruel, it

1063
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:23,160
Speaker 1: still was still with a love song. You know, Um

1064
01:06:24,200 --> 01:06:26,600
Speaker 1: what it was about. It wasn't let me get up

1065
01:06:26,640 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 1: in there, you know. So, Um, who was Jackie? I'm sorry,

1066
01:06:34,800 --> 01:06:38,520
Speaker 1: who was Jackie? Jackie? Don't be controuled and don't be cruel. Yeah,

1067
01:06:38,760 --> 01:06:41,360
Speaker 1: and don't be cruel. Regardless of the fact that I

1068
01:06:41,440 --> 01:06:55,640
Speaker 1: want you, Jackie, I can't compete that you want to

1069
01:06:55,680 --> 01:07:03,600
Speaker 1: be with me the same if you want creel And

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01:07:03,800 --> 01:07:12,400
Speaker 1: that's the app Bill, Boss Bill and I'm Faid Bill

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01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:20,000
Speaker 1: and sup baby Face, Thank you very much, Supreme, Goodbye.

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01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:29,400
Speaker 1: What's Love? Supreme is a production of My Heart Radio.

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01:07:29,920 --> 01:07:33,160
Speaker 1: This classic episode was produced by the team at Bendor.

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01:07:36,040 --> 01:07:38,320
Speaker 1: For more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the I

1075
01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:41,720
Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

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01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.