WEBVTT - Part Two: P. Diddy: A Life in Crimes

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<v Speaker 1>A media.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh here, ye, hear ye. The Court of Bastards is

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<v Speaker 2>now in session, the Honorable Judge Robert Evans presiding. And

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<v Speaker 2>that's not a bit. I'm making an announcement here. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't think I told you this yet. I have

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<v Speaker 2>been sworn in as a judge. I am legally a

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<v Speaker 2>United States municipal judge for the state of New Mexico.

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<v Speaker 3>This is not this is it's not a bit, and

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<v Speaker 3>he's brought it up.

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<v Speaker 1>I think he's told me this same same piece of

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<v Speaker 1>information five pounds.

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<v Speaker 2>I have the paperwork. I am now legally the Honorable

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<v Speaker 2>Robert Evans. For the rest of my life. I can

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<v Speaker 2>marry people, not just officiate like some of you folks.

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<v Speaker 2>I can witness documents, I could hear cases. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>think anyone's gonna give me any but I am a

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<v Speaker 2>judge now in New Mexico. And uh, you know.

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<v Speaker 3>How how does one become a judge in New Mexico?

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<v Speaker 2>You get sworn in by another judge. It works. Actually,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm just like.

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<v Speaker 3>How did you do you? Just you had to like

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<v Speaker 3>call them and was there an online app.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's let's call them a fan. I mean, definitely they

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<v Speaker 2>are a fan, a wonderful person whose name and.

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<v Speaker 3>They were like, hey, bro, did you know that it's

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<v Speaker 3>no work to become a judge?

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<v Speaker 2>You know it's incredibly easy. Well, it's apparently I didn't

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<v Speaker 2>know this either. Becoming a judge works exactly like being

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<v Speaker 2>a vampire and interview with a vampire.

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<v Speaker 3>Come in.

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<v Speaker 2>If somebody invite you more than you get, you can

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<v Speaker 2>get made a judge by like a bigger judge. But

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<v Speaker 2>you cannot necessarily make other people judges.

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<v Speaker 3>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>You have to see you have to drink a certain

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<v Speaker 2>amount of blood.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, you got to keep the pyramid at a

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<v Speaker 3>you know, a certain angle or else it gets too wide.

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<v Speaker 2>Again, if if I'm remembering interview with a vampire, right,

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<v Speaker 2>I am now going to live in France and then

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<v Speaker 2>burn down a theater.

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<v Speaker 3>Take on an eight year old child as you.

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<v Speaker 2>Take on an eight year old Ye?

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<v Speaker 3>Do the whole reare with that was? I'm very confused

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<v Speaker 3>still about what she was in that movie.

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<v Speaker 2>You gotta try the new TV show will It's It's wonderful?

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<v Speaker 3>Oh is it? I? I kind of I saw that

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<v Speaker 3>it existed, but I kind of put it in the

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<v Speaker 3>same like, you know, when they made the Archie comic

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<v Speaker 3>into it. Yeah, Drama Dale. I kind of so, I

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<v Speaker 3>kind of assumed it was something like that where they

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<v Speaker 3>just like or like The Fresh Prince, they turned that

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<v Speaker 3>into a fucking drama or whatever. It was like something

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<v Speaker 3>like that where it was just like real teeny like

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<v Speaker 3>as a Buffy the Vampire type show.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I can confidently say as a United States judge

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<v Speaker 2>that show is good. I do that power. I'm gonna

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<v Speaker 2>go do a Blood Meridian after this. Call me the

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<v Speaker 2>Judge used my own urine to make gunpowder. It's gonna

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<v Speaker 2>be incredible, folks, amazing. But my first act as judge

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<v Speaker 2>is to sit down with my buddy, the Grammy Award

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<v Speaker 2>winning Greasy Will and Judge P Diddy, and this will

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<v Speaker 2>be legally binding whatever I say, the courts have to do.

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<v Speaker 2>If I understand being a judge right, and I don't

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<v Speaker 2>think I do.

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<v Speaker 3>Can I be the middle of the defense and the prosecutor,

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<v Speaker 3>Like I don't know, I want to be both? Can

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<v Speaker 3>I be both?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? You could absolutely be both?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, whatever's fun A kind of a moment.

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<v Speaker 3>A guest of behind the Bastard's like primary responsibility is

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<v Speaker 3>to be a bit of both of these things like

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<v Speaker 3>cheering you on for your incredible journalistic integrity and also

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<v Speaker 3>correcting your pronunciation.

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<v Speaker 2>Words Jeordia ash I honestly forget what we were saying.

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<v Speaker 3>See, I have no idea.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, not my job as a judge to know how

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<v Speaker 2>to pronounce R and B Duo Jordia Cage, Jordia Jeordia Jordan.

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<v Speaker 2>You know what, I sentence you to come up with

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<v Speaker 2>a different fucking name. I'm glad this intro was fun

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<v Speaker 2>because what we're going to talk about after this cold

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<v Speaker 2>open not fun at all. We're back and things are

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<v Speaker 2>about to get horrible. So nineteen ninety one, the same

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<v Speaker 2>year that he got all of those fucking people killed,

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<v Speaker 2>is the year in which Joy j o I Dickerson Neil,

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<v Speaker 2>one of those hyphenated last names, claims that Sean drugged

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<v Speaker 2>and raped her. Yes, yeah, I know, sorry, there was

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<v Speaker 2>there was no way to learn out swing. That's why

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<v Speaker 2>I opened something fun. Yeah, because it's gonna get It's

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<v Speaker 2>just it's I mean, this is gonna be horrible, folks.

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<v Speaker 3>Sorry, what year was this?

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<v Speaker 2>Ninety one, same year he got nine people killed in

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<v Speaker 2>a crush, So this is the earliest. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>that This is the first person that John drugs and

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<v Speaker 2>assaults or assault period. But this is the earliest allegation

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<v Speaker 2>so far against Diddy that may have changed by the

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<v Speaker 2>time these episodes dropped. It is coming out rapidly every day.

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<v Speaker 2>It is one of the most serious. She was a

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<v Speaker 2>college student at the time. Sean was an up and

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<v Speaker 2>coming music producer who hosted legendary parties. He put her

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<v Speaker 2>in one of his music videos and then while they

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<v Speaker 2>were doing that, he asked her out on a date,

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<v Speaker 2>which is you know, classic story.

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<v Speaker 3>Classic story. Yeah, this is why the yeah prototype exists.

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<v Speaker 3>This is why people know that this is a thing. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>it's just the classic producers story.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's it's fucked up because like obviously this is

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<v Speaker 2>the way a lot of people get assaulted. It is

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<v Speaker 2>also legitimately how a lot of people's careers begin. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, like and honestly, sometimes both happen, right, Like

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<v Speaker 2>that's yes, which is why it's going to keep happening.

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<v Speaker 3>The story is exactly that. It's literally, let me assault

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<v Speaker 3>you and you get a career.

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<v Speaker 2>You can get in this fucking you know, I.

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<v Speaker 3>Mean, it's you know, and as this progresses on, we're

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<v Speaker 3>going to see a lot of that where it's like

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<v Speaker 3>people who go along with it make it, and when

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<v Speaker 3>they stop going along with it, they disappear.

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<v Speaker 2>Right right, yes, yes, you know. So after dinner, Sean

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<v Speaker 2>pushes Joy to stay out with him. She wants to

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<v Speaker 2>go home, and he's like, no, no, no, let's go, and

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<v Speaker 2>he takes you to a recording studio. She has a

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<v Speaker 2>drink at some point, I think, on the drive over,

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<v Speaker 2>and she like can't get out of the car because

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<v Speaker 2>she's so fucked up by the time they get there,

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<v Speaker 2>not from the drink, but from the fact that the

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<v Speaker 2>drink has been drug. Obviously drug, I'm guessing just from

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<v Speaker 2>her description, sounds like GHB, but could have been a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of things.

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<v Speaker 3>Pretty fast acting. Yes, yes, in a car drive across

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<v Speaker 3>the Yeah, that's that's not.

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<v Speaker 2>A long Nope, nope, nope. Combs takes her to a

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<v Speaker 2>separate location and he sexually assaults her. He films the rape.

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<v Speaker 3>Naturally, because why not keep evidence.

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<v Speaker 2>Why not keep that? Well, he films that he uses

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<v Speaker 2>like revenge porn against her, right.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, so this is like this is where he

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<v Speaker 3>starts to get into this.

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<v Speaker 2>The black man is doing this from the jump, Yeah, yeah, Epstein,

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<v Speaker 2>if you will, Yeah, exactly, And Dickerson actually finds out

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<v Speaker 2>that he's videotaped it because a male friend of hers

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<v Speaker 2>comes to her and is like, hey, man, I was

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<v Speaker 2>just hanging out with Sean and he showed us a

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<v Speaker 2>video of himself having sex with you and like you

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<v Speaker 2>don't really look like you're conscious, right, So that's how

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<v Speaker 2>she finds out about it. Like he shares he shows

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<v Speaker 2>this to a number of people.

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<v Speaker 3>That is just fucking awful.

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<v Speaker 2>It's hideous and it's one of those things.

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<v Speaker 3>Wait, so wait, so this is ninety one, right, ninety one?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, what what do you have?

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<v Speaker 1>It?

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<v Speaker 3>Was it a camp quarder?

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<v Speaker 2>He had like a camp It must have been like

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<v Speaker 2>a camp quorder Yeah, like that, it was.

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<v Speaker 3>Not like it was it hidden situation or because there's

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<v Speaker 3>like there's like an element of like decisions that he

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<v Speaker 3>had to make, like he had to set this up

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<v Speaker 3>and plan this, like this wasn't you know, Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>He had to set this up. He played the plan this.

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<v Speaker 2>He spent a lot of money, like it's not cheap

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<v Speaker 2>dead right Yeah.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, camera in ninety one was very expective. You weren't

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<v Speaker 3>just buying one cheese.

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<v Speaker 2>That's probably a big part of an addition just wanted

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<v Speaker 2>to do in the first place. Why she's drugged, right,

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<v Speaker 2>is so that he can set up and do all this, you.

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<v Speaker 3>Know, right. Yeah, it's not an easy process to use.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not like now you just push a button or

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<v Speaker 3>whatever on your phone. You gotta set this, get lighting

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<v Speaker 3>and shit like. It's like camp quorders were not just like.

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<v Speaker 2>Just laying around. Yeah, and it's it's also I on

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<v Speaker 2>a note, now, if you're very familiar with this case,

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<v Speaker 2>you're going to know, Oh, he's not bringing up everyone.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't. There's not enough time to talk about every

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<v Speaker 2>single person who has made allegations. I'm going to go

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<v Speaker 2>through enough that you understand what he does.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Yeah. At this point, it's literally like dozens and

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<v Speaker 3>dozens of people, Like, there's so many people that they've

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<v Speaker 3>started filing class actions and against.

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<v Speaker 2>It's the kind of thing where I think, and we'll

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<v Speaker 2>never know how many people. It wasn't total, but I

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<v Speaker 2>would be shocked if the total number of victims one

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<v Speaker 2>way or the other aren't in the hundreds. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>there's different levels of victim. There's some people that.

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<v Speaker 3>It's astonishing, there's Genghis Khan levels of things.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's some people who are like he coerced me,

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<v Speaker 2>but like I did say Yes, there's some people who

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<v Speaker 2>were like I got drugged but he didn't rate me,

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<v Speaker 2>or like I got out. So there's like degrees of

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<v Speaker 2>difference from how this happens because there's so many people

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<v Speaker 2>he's doing this too.

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<v Speaker 3>And there's combinations of every single one of those things

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<v Speaker 3>too as well. It's like it is layers upon layers.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, you're talking this is nineteen ninety one, we're

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<v Speaker 3>in twenty twenty four. Yeah, you know, this is a

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<v Speaker 3>thirty year legacy of doing this. Yes, and this is

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<v Speaker 3>astonished and to only have allegations really because like that's

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<v Speaker 3>the one thing is like outside of like the industry,

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<v Speaker 3>his image was pretty clean, yeah, you know, like he

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<v Speaker 3>had a few little things.

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<v Speaker 2>That was like largely the Tupac stuff.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah did he kill Tupac or or did he was

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<v Speaker 3>involved in like but it wasn't really like the sexual

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<v Speaker 3>assault stuff that was like big. It was all like

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<v Speaker 3>conspiracy mogul like you know, mob type stuff, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>like before this point in history.

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<v Speaker 2>Right right, absolutely, Yeah, I.

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<v Speaker 3>Mean we knew about or the other stuff existed and

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<v Speaker 3>was out there, but it wasn't like that was what

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<v Speaker 3>he was known for. When he came to that, Yeah, people.

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<v Speaker 2>Would say, oh, that guy's definitely a piece of shit, right.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it was almost like he committed a bigger crime. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>in not being involved in Biggie and Tupacs.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like, look, if you're an overshadowed, if you've got

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<v Speaker 2>a crime you want to commit, you know, like maybe

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<v Speaker 2>maybe you're looking to do a big crypto scamera or something,

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<v Speaker 2>just kill Tupac first and you'll get away with it

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<v Speaker 2>for at least thirty years. Yeah, that's that's the Diddy story.

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<v Speaker 1>He might be a judge, but don't take legal advice

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<v Speaker 1>from Robert.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that should take advice. Do not kill Tupac. If

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<v Speaker 3>you find Tupac, let us say alone, say he he's

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<v Speaker 3>really a lie.

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<v Speaker 2>He deserves to hide. So in the wake of this

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<v Speaker 2>horrible sex crime, Sean got his first big opportunity. In

0:10:09.960 --> 0:10:13.480
<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety two, he scouted out and signed a rap

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<v Speaker 2>artist named Christopher Wallace, better known to posterity as Biggie

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<v Speaker 2>Small's org Notorious Big and this is I'm just I'm

0:10:21.440 --> 0:10:25.440
<v Speaker 2>not super you know, knowledgeable, about pop culture. I love Biggie.

0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:29.560
<v Speaker 2>Biggie was one of the greatest lyricists of his generation. Honestly,

0:10:29.600 --> 0:10:30.960
<v Speaker 2>part of why I love him. I think he's like

0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:35.720
<v Speaker 2>written better about depression and hating yourself than most people

0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:37.920
<v Speaker 2>in music of her heck, like, I mean, he was great.

0:10:38.000 --> 0:10:38.760
<v Speaker 3>He was Biggie.

0:10:38.800 --> 0:10:40.400
<v Speaker 2>He was He was a huge man.

0:10:40.800 --> 0:10:43.320
<v Speaker 3>He was fat as hell, and he knew he was

0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:45.200
<v Speaker 3>fat as hell, and he said it all the time.

0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:47.839
<v Speaker 3>And then at one point in his career he acknowledged

0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:49.920
<v Speaker 3>not only am I fat as hell, but I'm sexy

0:10:49.920 --> 0:10:52.080
<v Speaker 3>as hell too because I'm rich as hell. So, like,

0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:54.880
<v Speaker 3>I don't give a shit about what. Yeah, he was

0:10:54.920 --> 0:10:56.960
<v Speaker 3>so and he really leaned into it.

0:10:57.040 --> 0:10:57.200
<v Speaker 2>You know.

0:10:57.240 --> 0:10:59.080
<v Speaker 3>It's like you're talking about a dude whose biggest rival

0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:02.319
<v Speaker 3>at the time was Tupac, who was an athletic. Yeah yeah, no,

0:11:02.400 --> 0:11:07.480
<v Speaker 3>Tubac was ripped, you know, like and then Biggie's like, yeah, whatever, yeah, yeah,

0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:09.560
<v Speaker 3>I'm four hundred pounds. I don't give a shit, and

0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:16.600
<v Speaker 3>Biggie is. But he was notoriously notorious LG. Yeah yeah, yeah, legendary.

0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:17.680
<v Speaker 2>And he is. This is one of those guys we

0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:20.360
<v Speaker 2>talked about a lot of guys and especially gangster rapidly

0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:24.280
<v Speaker 2>massage their reputation. Biggie didn't have to do that. He

0:11:24.400 --> 0:11:28.400
<v Speaker 2>comes from a tough background. His dad abandons the family

0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:30.840
<v Speaker 2>when he's three, which is interesting that both he and

0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:32.440
<v Speaker 2>did he lose their dad's at age three. He might

0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:34.840
<v Speaker 2>have been part of why they like got along bonded.

0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:35.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:11:35.360 --> 0:11:39.440
<v Speaker 2>He grew up near Bedsty in Brooklyn, which at that

0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:41.440
<v Speaker 2>point in time was a very different neighborhood than it

0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:41.880
<v Speaker 2>is today.

0:11:42.080 --> 0:11:44.160
<v Speaker 3>Sure not filled with hipsters. Yeah.

0:11:44.240 --> 0:11:46.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. He was raised at Jehovah's Witness and became a

0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:49.720
<v Speaker 2>drug dealer selling weed at age twelve and moved up

0:11:49.760 --> 0:11:53.839
<v Speaker 2>to Crack once that epidemic kicked off. His mother WASH's Yeah,

0:11:53.880 --> 0:11:56.880
<v Speaker 2>he's raised a Jehovah's Witness. His mom is very strict.

0:11:56.960 --> 0:11:58.839
<v Speaker 2>He has to hide what he's doing from her.

0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:01.560
<v Speaker 3>I don't know that I've ever heard that before. That

0:12:01.679 --> 0:12:03.960
<v Speaker 3>is really interesting because I mean, like I knew that,

0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:06.920
<v Speaker 3>like he was very much. There's a lot of stories.

0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:09.079
<v Speaker 3>Even his mom told a lot of stories in the

0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:12.120
<v Speaker 3>biographies they'd done with of him and everything, of like

0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:14.840
<v Speaker 3>him always having to like hide stuff because she was watching,

0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:16.679
<v Speaker 3>she was on top of what he was doing. But

0:12:17.040 --> 0:12:17.680
<v Speaker 3>I never heard that.

0:12:17.840 --> 0:12:19.960
<v Speaker 2>It also has a big influence on the kind of

0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:22.680
<v Speaker 2>music he makes because his mom is very strict and

0:12:22.720 --> 0:12:25.920
<v Speaker 2>the morals that he's raised with conflicts in his new career,

0:12:26.000 --> 0:12:28.160
<v Speaker 2>so he always does. He has this feeling that is

0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:30.200
<v Speaker 2>I think not super common for a lot of people

0:12:30.240 --> 0:12:33.679
<v Speaker 2>in the same industry, that what he's doing is bad right,

0:12:33.800 --> 0:12:35.800
<v Speaker 2>and that influences the kind of music he makes. His

0:12:35.880 --> 0:12:39.120
<v Speaker 2>debut album is called Ready to Die, which includes the

0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:42.760
<v Speaker 2>song the great song Suicidal Thoughts, which opens with the

0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:45.080
<v Speaker 2>verse when I die, fuck it, I want to go

0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:47.120
<v Speaker 2>to hell because I'm a piece of shit. It ain't

0:12:47.160 --> 0:12:50.360
<v Speaker 2>hard to fucking tell, or getting more direct towards his

0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:53.000
<v Speaker 2>feelings about his mom. All my life, I've been considered

0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:55.480
<v Speaker 2>as the worst, lying to my mother, even stealing out

0:12:55.480 --> 0:12:58.840
<v Speaker 2>her purse. Crime after crime, from drugs to extortion. I

0:12:58.880 --> 0:13:02.560
<v Speaker 2>know my mom wished she got off fucking abortion. Like, yes,

0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:04.640
<v Speaker 2>I love Biggie, Yeah, yeah.

0:13:04.720 --> 0:13:08.520
<v Speaker 3>Biggie definitely was very pressing. He was very like knowledgeable

0:13:08.559 --> 0:13:10.560
<v Speaker 3>of himself and where he was at, you know, like

0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:13.280
<v Speaker 3>he anytime. It was Actually one of the things that

0:13:13.360 --> 0:13:16.079
<v Speaker 3>was so fascinating about Biggie's work is that he would

0:13:16.120 --> 0:13:20.800
<v Speaker 3>often talk about drug dealing as like as the darkness

0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:22.679
<v Speaker 3>that it was like a lot of times like people

0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:26.600
<v Speaker 3>were drug dealing, like especially now, it's like this glamour position, right,

0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:28.760
<v Speaker 3>and for him it was not. It was so much

0:13:28.800 --> 0:13:30.600
<v Speaker 3>more of like, this is what I had to do.

0:13:31.160 --> 0:13:34.120
<v Speaker 2>I hate myself because of what I had to do.

0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:36.959
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, I don't like that I had to do

0:13:37.040 --> 0:13:39.600
<v Speaker 3>these things. I don't like myself because I had to

0:13:39.600 --> 0:13:41.600
<v Speaker 3>do these things. And this is what it's like to

0:13:41.640 --> 0:13:44.200
<v Speaker 3>grow up in these situations and have And it was

0:13:44.200 --> 0:13:47.280
<v Speaker 3>like it took so much of the glamour out of it.

0:13:47.280 --> 0:13:49.720
<v Speaker 3>It was dark. It was twisted, and it was dark,

0:13:49.760 --> 0:13:53.200
<v Speaker 3>and it was like, damn, he's really speaking about the

0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:55.080
<v Speaker 3>truth of all this. Yeah, you know, it was not

0:13:55.320 --> 0:13:57.760
<v Speaker 3>like look at me, I'm doing this because I'm fucking

0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.640
<v Speaker 3>gonna wear gold necklaces and shit. Like. He was pretty

0:14:00.720 --> 0:14:03.960
<v Speaker 3>humble even with like the braggadocious part of it. It

0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:06.520
<v Speaker 3>was still kind of dark. Yeah, in its humilities.

0:14:06.600 --> 0:14:09.080
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely. I guess what we're getting at is we're both

0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:11.760
<v Speaker 2>fans of Bickie. Obviously, Biggie's going to be one of

0:14:11.760 --> 0:14:14.880
<v Speaker 2>the most successful rappers of all time, but initially when

0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:17.640
<v Speaker 2>he's getting started. His work is seen as too explicit

0:14:17.679 --> 0:14:21.120
<v Speaker 2>and too based in his extensive life of crimes from

0:14:21.280 --> 0:14:24.880
<v Speaker 2>MCA Records. Who is Uptown's distributor, and that's where Sean works,

0:14:25.200 --> 0:14:28.760
<v Speaker 2>and so Shawn's boss, Andre Harrol lets him go basically

0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:31.560
<v Speaker 2>fires him, although he will claim. Andre says I didn't

0:14:31.560 --> 0:14:34.200
<v Speaker 2>fire him because he was bad. Basically, I said, like, look, man,

0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:36.400
<v Speaker 2>you're right, this guy's going to be a hit. The

0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:39.440
<v Speaker 2>label that you get for it here fucking bounce. It's

0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:42.000
<v Speaker 2>time for you to succeed on your own, right, Andre

0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:44.520
<v Speaker 2>later tells Wall Street Journal. I didn't want to sit

0:14:44.560 --> 0:14:47.080
<v Speaker 2>there and be the one confining Puff because the corporation

0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:49.280
<v Speaker 2>was telling me to do that. I'm not built that way.

0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:51.200
<v Speaker 2>I told Puff he needs to go and create his

0:14:51.200 --> 0:14:54.200
<v Speaker 2>own opportunity. You're red hot right now. I'm really letting

0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:56.960
<v Speaker 2>you go so you can get rich. And that's exactly

0:14:57.040 --> 0:14:58.000
<v Speaker 2>what fucking happened.

0:14:58.040 --> 0:15:05.240
<v Speaker 3>So I mean, yeah, later and it's later, Yeah, yeah,

0:15:05.280 --> 0:15:07.160
<v Speaker 3>it really did. I mean it was the perfect time

0:15:07.200 --> 0:15:09.320
<v Speaker 3>for that. You know, like, for the most part, up

0:15:09.400 --> 0:15:13.640
<v Speaker 3>until Biggie and Pac, you know, a lot of hip

0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:17.320
<v Speaker 3>hop was more like happy type shit. It was still

0:15:17.320 --> 0:15:19.040
<v Speaker 3>like sometimes it was like had the darkness n w

0:15:19.200 --> 0:15:22.200
<v Speaker 3>A existed obviously, but like Biggie and Pac were like

0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:27.119
<v Speaker 3>really some of the originators of that like dark upbringing

0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.720
<v Speaker 3>culture of rap where it's like, look, we fucking we

0:15:29.800 --> 0:15:31.880
<v Speaker 3>hustle or survive and we're doing what we got to

0:15:31.960 --> 0:15:34.560
<v Speaker 3>do and like talking the real truth about what it

0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:36.600
<v Speaker 3>was like to be a black man in America at

0:15:36.600 --> 0:15:38.920
<v Speaker 3>the time. Yeah, So it was like there was something

0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:43.200
<v Speaker 3>really unique about that moment because it was starting to

0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:46.320
<v Speaker 3>you know, we're getting the crack epidemic, We're getting you know,

0:15:46.520 --> 0:15:53.760
<v Speaker 3>like crime Bill, that old Biden sleepy sleep Yeah, he

0:15:55.320 --> 0:15:59.520
<v Speaker 3>was awake, right, So it's like, yeah, exactly, like maybe

0:15:59.600 --> 0:16:03.680
<v Speaker 3>he should easily he commits some of the biggest crimes

0:16:03.680 --> 0:16:05.800
<v Speaker 3>against black America that you can imagine.

0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:09.000
<v Speaker 2>I have always been firmly of the stance that the

0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:12.160
<v Speaker 2>water fountains in the Capitol Building need to have XANAX

0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:14.720
<v Speaker 2>in them. We could solve a lot of problems, a lot.

0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:17.200
<v Speaker 3>Of problems that bring this down a little bit.

0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:19.760
<v Speaker 2>You know, put x X in the water everywhere.

0:16:20.280 --> 0:16:22.440
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, actually, yeah, great points.

0:16:22.200 --> 0:16:23.080
<v Speaker 2>Xan X lithium.

0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:25.400
<v Speaker 3>Let's just this is like when you're in high school

0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:27.320
<v Speaker 3>and you think you can solve all the world's problems

0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:29.440
<v Speaker 3>the first time you take mushrooms and you're like, we

0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:33.320
<v Speaker 3>need to give everyone mushroom. We would, but actually maybe

0:16:33.320 --> 0:16:33.680
<v Speaker 3>that might.

0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:35.400
<v Speaker 2>Maybe maybe we really do need to put lithium in

0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:39.480
<v Speaker 2>the water or something. So Comb started a label of

0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:43.680
<v Speaker 2>his own Bad Boy Records, and it bad bad Boy,

0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:47.480
<v Speaker 2>right clink clink clink. And this is when you're about

0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:49.720
<v Speaker 2>the East Coast, West Coast rap fude, it's bad Boy

0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.120
<v Speaker 2>and death Row over on, you know, the other side

0:16:52.120 --> 0:16:52.680
<v Speaker 2>of the country.

0:16:52.760 --> 0:16:56.040
<v Speaker 3>Sug Night and Death Row sug Knight, And yeah, are

0:16:56.040 --> 0:16:57.920
<v Speaker 3>we gonna shug We're gonna talk a little bit of

0:16:57.920 --> 0:16:58.440
<v Speaker 3>sug Knight.

0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:03.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because basically, Biggie becomes a massive star pretty much overnight,

0:17:03.520 --> 0:17:05.879
<v Speaker 2>and that makes bad Boy a name, and that causes

0:17:05.920 --> 0:17:08.960
<v Speaker 2>immediate friction with the West Coast premiere gangster wrap enclave,

0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:11.280
<v Speaker 2>sug Night's Death Row Records. If you want to know

0:17:11.359 --> 0:17:13.919
<v Speaker 2>the kind of man we're talking about, Biggie being a

0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:17.080
<v Speaker 2>fucking real gangster. Sug is a real gangster.

0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:18.920
<v Speaker 3>Sugar, the realist of gangsters.

0:17:19.000 --> 0:17:23.159
<v Speaker 2>Later in life will be shot at two consecutive vm

0:17:23.200 --> 0:17:24.600
<v Speaker 2>A after parties.

0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:28.679
<v Speaker 3>Yes, oh my god, one of my favorite Sugar Night

0:17:29.160 --> 0:17:31.480
<v Speaker 3>things is the is the Vanilla Ice story?

0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:33.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, held him off the roof of.

0:17:33.880 --> 0:17:37.400
<v Speaker 3>A building by his ankles, by his ankles. He held

0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:39.520
<v Speaker 3>it because just over some dispute, you know. It's like

0:17:39.760 --> 0:17:42.720
<v Speaker 3>it was like Sug was the real suddn't.

0:17:42.200 --> 0:17:44.359
<v Speaker 2>Want to give him the rights or sell the rights

0:17:44.359 --> 0:17:46.200
<v Speaker 2>to an ice ice baby or something.

0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:48.919
<v Speaker 3>Right, Yeah, he held him off the roof of a

0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:51.320
<v Speaker 3>bill It's like, this is the type of dude he was.

0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:53.119
<v Speaker 3>Is a little side tangent. I don't want to go

0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:55.520
<v Speaker 3>too far into it, but recently there was this TikTok

0:17:55.560 --> 0:17:57.679
<v Speaker 3>thing that happened where a guy found a bunch of

0:17:57.720 --> 0:18:02.080
<v Speaker 3>old death Row tapes two inch tape in a storage lock, right,

0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:05.720
<v Speaker 3>And because I'm in the TikTok zone, I saw this

0:18:05.760 --> 0:18:07.359
<v Speaker 3>happen and I was like, oh, this is good. Hey,

0:18:07.359 --> 0:18:08.960
<v Speaker 3>if you need any help with this, hit me up.

0:18:09.119 --> 0:18:10.439
<v Speaker 3>And it turned out to be a bunch of like

0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:14.879
<v Speaker 3>mc hammer death Row era stuff, right, And it was

0:18:14.920 --> 0:18:22.000
<v Speaker 3>like almost immediately once that started coming out, all all

0:18:22.040 --> 0:18:26.399
<v Speaker 3>the comments were like, hey man, just be careful. And

0:18:26.480 --> 0:18:28.600
<v Speaker 3>it ended up going that I found the guy, the

0:18:28.680 --> 0:18:31.440
<v Speaker 3>engineer that was responsible for that stuff, and I was like, hey, man,

0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:33.639
<v Speaker 3>I was like, this guy found all this stuff. Your

0:18:33.760 --> 0:18:36.480
<v Speaker 3>name's on the tapes, and he was like, I don't

0:18:36.520 --> 0:18:40.439
<v Speaker 3>really want to be involved in that because of that

0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:43.000
<v Speaker 3>era of my life was one of the most I've

0:18:43.000 --> 0:18:48.000
<v Speaker 3>ever felt like in danger. Yeah, He's like that was

0:18:48.359 --> 0:18:51.240
<v Speaker 3>the most I was ever worried about, like making it

0:18:51.359 --> 0:18:53.960
<v Speaker 3>through the day was when I worked as an engineer

0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:54.560
<v Speaker 3>for death Row.

0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.160
<v Speaker 2>There's a lot of things you can say about Suge

0:18:58.200 --> 0:19:01.080
<v Speaker 2>Knight that are, you know, bastardy, but also sh Night's

0:19:01.160 --> 0:19:03.920
<v Speaker 2>not really even when he's behind bars, not someone I

0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:05.240
<v Speaker 2>want to talk too much ship on.

0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:11.560
<v Speaker 3>I'm close enough, man, I don't know's We'll say he's

0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 3>he's a big guys formidable. He's a formidable person. Yeah,

0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:19.560
<v Speaker 3>he's a large person and I would not know want

0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:21.480
<v Speaker 3>to ever have my tiny skull crush.

0:19:21.560 --> 0:19:23.160
<v Speaker 2>We have lots of respect for you, Shood.

0:19:24.040 --> 0:19:24.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:26.640
<v Speaker 2>Do you think don't dangles, don't.

0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:28.639
<v Speaker 3>Run me over at a burger stand? You know.

0:19:29.720 --> 0:19:32.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So this is primarily a story of the evil

0:19:32.080 --> 0:19:33.880
<v Speaker 2>that Sean is going to do later in his life

0:19:33.920 --> 0:19:35.840
<v Speaker 2>and his involvement in the East Coast West Coast rap

0:19:35.960 --> 0:19:39.400
<v Speaker 2>rivalry is like we know, but also it's murky right,

0:19:39.480 --> 0:19:41.679
<v Speaker 2>like there's a green murk of to like exactly what

0:19:41.760 --> 0:19:42.440
<v Speaker 2>he was doing.

0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:47.600
<v Speaker 3>It's unreliable narrative, as you would write a lot of

0:19:47.960 --> 0:19:49.479
<v Speaker 3>unreliable narrative.

0:19:49.760 --> 0:19:53.600
<v Speaker 2>Most of the narrators are like talking through wire taps

0:19:53.600 --> 0:19:56.720
<v Speaker 2>that the police have, or like interviews the police are conducting.

0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:00.600
<v Speaker 3>So yeah, and literally anything you get in all of

0:20:00.640 --> 0:20:04.119
<v Speaker 3>this stuff is it's unreliable. And because there's a level

0:20:04.160 --> 0:20:06.680
<v Speaker 3>of ego that's involved in this stuff, there's a level

0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:11.480
<v Speaker 3>of self importance and there's a level of also, we

0:20:11.480 --> 0:20:14.199
<v Speaker 3>were really fucked up doing drugs and alcohol and I

0:20:14.200 --> 0:20:18.000
<v Speaker 3>don't actually remember what was going on. Yeah, It's like

0:20:18.040 --> 0:20:21.840
<v Speaker 3>there's a joke in the audio industry about like literally

0:20:21.880 --> 0:20:25.080
<v Speaker 3>almost everybody has a I forgot, like like the Fleetwood

0:20:25.119 --> 0:20:28.280
<v Speaker 3>Mac like I forgot I made that song story, Like

0:20:28.359 --> 0:20:31.520
<v Speaker 3>I don't remember even being there and doing that. Yeah.

0:20:31.680 --> 0:20:34.280
<v Speaker 2>I was watching a fucking uh an old video of

0:20:34.320 --> 0:20:36.480
<v Speaker 2>them during like the Rumors tour, and it's just clear

0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:39.520
<v Speaker 2>like not a one of you. You're all playing perfectly,

0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:41.879
<v Speaker 2>but not one of you could walk ten feet without

0:20:41.920 --> 0:20:46.960
<v Speaker 2>falling down like you are you are bru walk on

0:20:47.200 --> 0:20:48.400
<v Speaker 2>that stage.

0:20:49.000 --> 0:20:52.640
<v Speaker 3>And and although it has changed in its direction. There

0:20:52.720 --> 0:20:55.000
<v Speaker 3>is still a large amount of that in the music

0:20:55.040 --> 0:20:58.160
<v Speaker 3>industry where it's just like even on the like the

0:20:58.200 --> 0:21:00.639
<v Speaker 3>professional side of things, like the engineers side of things.

0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:03.080
<v Speaker 3>I once cleaned a console that had been like a

0:21:03.119 --> 0:21:06.119
<v Speaker 3>soundboard that had been in use since like the early

0:21:06.160 --> 0:21:09.919
<v Speaker 3>seventies of like the the Oh Metallica recorded here, like

0:21:10.000 --> 0:21:12.000
<v Speaker 3>you know that type of thing. Like every band ever

0:21:12.080 --> 0:21:15.080
<v Speaker 3>had used this console, And we took off the plates

0:21:15.080 --> 0:21:17.800
<v Speaker 3>for the faders to clean it, and there was actually

0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:22.600
<v Speaker 3>cocaine and like and like weed and like shit under

0:21:22.640 --> 0:21:26.240
<v Speaker 3>the faders, like that much had accumulated over time that

0:21:26.400 --> 0:21:28.240
<v Speaker 3>it was just like under and it was like oh my,

0:21:28.440 --> 0:21:30.320
<v Speaker 3>and you're like you're like still, like why am I?

0:21:30.400 --> 0:21:32.639
<v Speaker 3>Why am I hands? Like why do I feel numb

0:21:32.800 --> 0:21:33.240
<v Speaker 3>right now?

0:21:34.280 --> 0:21:36.560
<v Speaker 2>Just cocaine?

0:21:36.840 --> 0:21:39.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, it's like that seventies.

0:21:40.440 --> 0:21:44.880
<v Speaker 2>This himself before putting it on the back of the truck. Yeah.

0:21:44.920 --> 0:21:49.199
<v Speaker 3>So there's a lot of like unreliable narration that happens

0:21:49.240 --> 0:21:51.879
<v Speaker 3>in the music industry all the time. It's there's a

0:21:51.920 --> 0:21:53.760
<v Speaker 3>lot of drugs, there's a lot of alcohol, and there's

0:21:53.760 --> 0:21:56.840
<v Speaker 3>a lot of like man, sometimes people tell me my

0:21:56.880 --> 0:21:57.560
<v Speaker 3>own stories.

0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:00.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, like a lot of when you're talking about

0:22:00.320 --> 0:22:02.960
<v Speaker 2>the guys who are also literally fighting each other a

0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:06.600
<v Speaker 2>lot a head injuries, you know, yes, yeah, But the

0:22:06.640 --> 0:22:09.040
<v Speaker 2>gist of it is, there's this huge conflict that comes

0:22:09.040 --> 0:22:11.560
<v Speaker 2>to central around Tupac who's the big West Coast star,

0:22:11.640 --> 0:22:14.439
<v Speaker 2>and Biggie who is the East Coast star. And you know,

0:22:14.520 --> 0:22:18.879
<v Speaker 2>Tupac's you know, with Shug and Biggie is with Sean Diddy.

0:22:19.480 --> 0:22:22.119
<v Speaker 2>So things come to a head on November thirtieth, nineteen

0:22:22.240 --> 0:22:25.320
<v Speaker 2>ninety four, when Tupac Shakur is shot five times in

0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:27.959
<v Speaker 2>the lobby of Quad Studios in Times Square. This is

0:22:28.040 --> 0:22:30.040
<v Speaker 2>not when he dies. Tupaca was a tough.

0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:33.439
<v Speaker 3>Suy real quick. Just to rewind in this story of

0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:36.760
<v Speaker 3>what happened. So the East Coast West Coast thing, one

0:22:36.760 --> 0:22:40.880
<v Speaker 3>of the big inciting factors were the Source Awards in

0:22:40.880 --> 0:22:44.040
<v Speaker 3>New York probably I think a year before Tupac died,

0:22:44.600 --> 0:22:49.080
<v Speaker 3>Suge Knight was on stage directly insulting did it like

0:22:49.160 --> 0:22:50.800
<v Speaker 3>that was like that was his thing. He stood up

0:22:50.840 --> 0:22:53.399
<v Speaker 3>on stage and he said, Hey, if any of y'all

0:22:53.640 --> 0:22:56.120
<v Speaker 3>want to be out there and not have a producer

0:22:56.160 --> 0:22:58.920
<v Speaker 3>that is singing and dancing all up in your videos

0:22:58.960 --> 0:23:01.800
<v Speaker 3>and being like all in trying to make himself part

0:23:01.840 --> 0:23:05.920
<v Speaker 3>of the show. Right, then come over to death row, right,

0:23:06.000 --> 0:23:08.040
<v Speaker 3>and this was like a big This was when Snoop

0:23:08.080 --> 0:23:10.520
<v Speaker 3>got involved. There was also a moment just before that,

0:23:10.560 --> 0:23:12.479
<v Speaker 3>maybe it was right after I forget where Diddy and

0:23:12.520 --> 0:23:16.640
<v Speaker 3>Shug were in a strip club in Atlanta and Shug's

0:23:16.640 --> 0:23:18.199
<v Speaker 3>best friend. That was one of the times you were

0:23:18.200 --> 0:23:21.439
<v Speaker 3>talking about Shugar's best friend got shot and killed in

0:23:21.480 --> 0:23:24.560
<v Speaker 3>the parking lot or whatever after that alternate. So up

0:23:24.680 --> 0:23:28.800
<v Speaker 3>until Tupac getting shot, there's multiple deaths that have already happened. Like,

0:23:28.840 --> 0:23:31.439
<v Speaker 3>this is a back and forth thing that's kind of

0:23:31.480 --> 0:23:35.320
<v Speaker 3>been going on, and they've been antagonizing. But it is

0:23:35.600 --> 0:23:40.480
<v Speaker 3>Tupac and Biggie verbally in the public, right, But this

0:23:40.560 --> 0:23:45.240
<v Speaker 3>is a sug Diddy situation. Yeah, this is their egos

0:23:45.440 --> 0:23:49.920
<v Speaker 3>that are bleeding down into their artists, that are fighting

0:23:49.960 --> 0:23:53.280
<v Speaker 3>against each other. Because Biggie and Tupac are best friends

0:23:53.320 --> 0:23:55.600
<v Speaker 3>at one point, well not best friends, but they are

0:23:55.640 --> 0:23:57.600
<v Speaker 3>good friends at one point in time. This is like

0:23:57.640 --> 0:24:00.760
<v Speaker 3>an important like part to understand. Yeah, Biggie used to

0:24:00.840 --> 0:24:04.520
<v Speaker 3>sleep on Tupac's couch. Tupac's acting and like starting out

0:24:04.560 --> 0:24:07.600
<v Speaker 3>his career he's getting like his first records and everything.

0:24:07.840 --> 0:24:10.960
<v Speaker 3>He's starting to have success. Before Biggie Biggi's sleeping on

0:24:11.000 --> 0:24:14.159
<v Speaker 3>his couch. Biggie is his friend. So Tupac comes to

0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:16.600
<v Speaker 3>New York to record at Quad Studios. This is like

0:24:16.800 --> 0:24:21.200
<v Speaker 3>the big inciting incident before the Source Awards thing. Tupac

0:24:21.200 --> 0:24:24.080
<v Speaker 3>comes to New York. He's recording in Quad Studios. He

0:24:24.160 --> 0:24:26.440
<v Speaker 3>comes down to the lobby. Biggie and Diddy are there

0:24:26.480 --> 0:24:29.400
<v Speaker 3>as well. That same night he comes down to the lobby,

0:24:29.520 --> 0:24:31.720
<v Speaker 3>he gets shot and robbed in the lobby.

0:24:31.800 --> 0:24:32.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:24:32.080 --> 0:24:34.800
<v Speaker 3>Right, and this is New York lobby. It's it's ten

0:24:34.840 --> 0:24:37.199
<v Speaker 3>feet there's a security guy there. It's like, you know,

0:24:37.240 --> 0:24:41.040
<v Speaker 3>it's a So he gets shot in that lobby and

0:24:41.080 --> 0:24:43.640
<v Speaker 3>he immediately blames Biggie.

0:24:43.640 --> 0:24:45.720
<v Speaker 2>Well, and there's for selling him out, and there's I

0:24:45.760 --> 0:24:48.200
<v Speaker 2>mean yeah, and there's also like it's it's worth Biggie

0:24:48.240 --> 0:24:51.200
<v Speaker 2>and Puffy are in the studio right at this at

0:24:51.240 --> 0:24:53.680
<v Speaker 2>the top, like, and he is the only it's a

0:24:53.720 --> 0:24:55.840
<v Speaker 2>quote unquote robbery, but he is the only one who

0:24:55.920 --> 0:24:56.439
<v Speaker 2>gets shot.

0:24:56.640 --> 0:24:58.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yes, he's the only one that gets shot. And

0:24:58.880 --> 0:25:01.320
<v Speaker 3>like it's been dramatized in a lot of like you know,

0:25:01.480 --> 0:25:04.240
<v Speaker 3>biopics and everything, but it's a non descript place. Like

0:25:04.280 --> 0:25:06.400
<v Speaker 3>I've been to Quad Studios before I recorded there. It's

0:25:06.400 --> 0:25:09.760
<v Speaker 3>a pretty non descript place. It's not like a flashy

0:25:09.800 --> 0:25:13.280
<v Speaker 3>studio like in La You can see that a lot

0:25:13.280 --> 0:25:14.639
<v Speaker 3>of the studios, you know, a lot of them are

0:25:14.720 --> 0:25:16.959
<v Speaker 3>kind of like nonscript but but you can like they

0:25:17.000 --> 0:25:20.000
<v Speaker 3>have signs or whatever. Quad Studios has no sign. Quad

0:25:20.000 --> 0:25:22.680
<v Speaker 3>Studios is not like an accident where you just stumble

0:25:22.760 --> 0:25:25.639
<v Speaker 3>in and shoot somebody. Yeah, yeah, no, you have to

0:25:25.760 --> 0:25:28.720
<v Speaker 3>know somebody is there. It's on like the thirteenth floor

0:25:28.760 --> 0:25:29.200
<v Speaker 3>or some shit.

0:25:29.320 --> 0:25:31.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he wasn't like on the street, and it was

0:25:31.520 --> 0:25:34.560
<v Speaker 2>a crime of opportunity, right, Like the fact that he's like,

0:25:34.600 --> 0:25:37.359
<v Speaker 2>what this pad do have been them? Is not not

0:25:37.800 --> 0:25:41.439
<v Speaker 2>paranoia or whatever? Ruling yes, yeah, And so that builds

0:25:41.520 --> 0:25:42.120
<v Speaker 2>up Tupac.

0:25:42.119 --> 0:25:44.600
<v Speaker 3>Actually, right after that shooting, he goes to jail for

0:25:44.760 --> 0:25:48.000
<v Speaker 3>sexual assault, spend some time in jail, and that's when

0:25:48.040 --> 0:25:51.120
<v Speaker 3>Biggie's career grows gets all big, and he comes out

0:25:51.119 --> 0:25:55.440
<v Speaker 3>of jail to see Biggie now succeeding like fully and

0:25:56.560 --> 0:25:59.920
<v Speaker 3>also feeling that hatred and that that you know, like

0:26:00.200 --> 0:26:02.760
<v Speaker 3>they were involved in this somehow of me getting shot

0:26:03.119 --> 0:26:06.800
<v Speaker 3>becomes incredibly paranoid. This is when the Tupac switch really

0:26:06.880 --> 0:26:08.880
<v Speaker 3>goes to the gangster shit.

0:26:08.920 --> 0:26:11.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you know, and he starts and putting out songs

0:26:11.400 --> 0:26:14.440
<v Speaker 2>insulting Biggie and bad boy rap exactly exists.

0:26:14.520 --> 0:26:18.359
<v Speaker 3>And again, while he's in jail, Biggie puts out who's shots.

0:26:18.480 --> 0:26:19.919
<v Speaker 3>I think he was in jail away. I might be

0:26:19.960 --> 0:26:22.560
<v Speaker 3>missing some of this up because also I am an

0:26:22.640 --> 0:26:28.679
<v Speaker 3>unreliable But while he's in jail, Biggie puts out who

0:26:28.720 --> 0:26:33.880
<v Speaker 3>shot you? Which seems like a direct attack on Tupac.

0:26:33.920 --> 0:26:36.120
<v Speaker 3>Who's shot YOUA is like a pretty.

0:26:36.240 --> 0:26:37.840
<v Speaker 2>It's a pretty funny thing to do.

0:26:38.720 --> 0:26:41.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, when you're wondering who's shot and.

0:26:41.240 --> 0:26:43.480
<v Speaker 2>Somebody puts out a song, it's the if I did

0:26:43.480 --> 0:26:44.680
<v Speaker 2>it of gangster rap.

0:26:44.880 --> 0:26:48.280
<v Speaker 3>Yes, it really is, and like and so Tupac's like, okay,

0:26:48.359 --> 0:26:51.680
<v Speaker 3>well then he no, and this escalates to a massive,

0:26:52.080 --> 0:26:54.720
<v Speaker 3>massive battle between East Coast and West and.

0:26:54.680 --> 0:26:56.879
<v Speaker 2>We are going to talk more about that. But you

0:26:57.000 --> 0:27:00.240
<v Speaker 2>know what, never shot Tupac. The best of my knowledge,

0:27:00.320 --> 0:27:02.360
<v Speaker 2>I can't really prove this, but it's unlikely.

0:27:03.280 --> 0:27:06.400
<v Speaker 3>Our products and sponsor yea and and sponsors, Yeah, products

0:27:06.400 --> 0:27:08.920
<v Speaker 3>are the guys, the guys that give us the money.

0:27:09.040 --> 0:27:11.400
<v Speaker 3>It's doing stuff very unlikely that they did.

0:27:11.920 --> 0:27:14.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, although although unless it's.

0:27:14.440 --> 0:27:18.520
<v Speaker 3>An yeah, you might get it.

0:27:18.600 --> 0:27:27.679
<v Speaker 2>Yeah starts buying podcast space and we're back. So in

0:27:27.720 --> 0:27:31.479
<v Speaker 2>September of nineteen ninety five, there's another you know chapter

0:27:31.640 --> 0:27:35.720
<v Speaker 2>in this escalating battle. Witnesses say that they see Diddy's

0:27:35.760 --> 0:27:38.679
<v Speaker 2>bodyguard get into an argument at an Atlantic club with

0:27:38.720 --> 0:27:41.960
<v Speaker 2>a guy named Jai Hassan Jamal Roblez, a member of

0:27:42.040 --> 0:27:44.679
<v Speaker 2>Death Rows who's like a death Row guy, right, and

0:27:44.720 --> 0:27:48.199
<v Speaker 2>then after that argument, Roblez is shot and killed. And

0:27:48.240 --> 0:27:50.119
<v Speaker 2>it's one of those like, well, he was having an

0:27:50.200 --> 0:27:53.159
<v Speaker 2>argument with Combs's bodyguard who's a shooter, and then he

0:27:53.240 --> 0:27:54.320
<v Speaker 2>gets shot, right.

0:27:54.480 --> 0:27:56.680
<v Speaker 3>Turns out people with guns are willing to use this.

0:27:57.320 --> 0:28:00.920
<v Speaker 2>And by the way, Combs's bodyguard, who probably Roblez, gets

0:28:00.960 --> 0:28:04.119
<v Speaker 2>shot himself years later in Atlanta. You know, not a

0:28:04.160 --> 0:28:04.720
<v Speaker 2>long life.

0:28:05.119 --> 0:28:07.520
<v Speaker 3>Like I said, this is this is a back and

0:28:07.560 --> 0:28:10.199
<v Speaker 3>forth kind of situation for a long time. It's like

0:28:11.040 --> 0:28:13.760
<v Speaker 3>it mirrors what is going on because these are people

0:28:13.760 --> 0:28:16.320
<v Speaker 3>who are also gang relating in all these situations. It's

0:28:16.359 --> 0:28:18.879
<v Speaker 3>a lot of bloods versus crypt situation. This is the

0:28:18.880 --> 0:28:21.480
<v Speaker 3>early nineties. This is actually a thing that's going on

0:28:21.520 --> 0:28:21.800
<v Speaker 3>in the.

0:28:21.720 --> 0:28:24.639
<v Speaker 2>World is tightened, the organized crime part of it and.

0:28:24.880 --> 0:28:28.439
<v Speaker 3>The mob pirus in California and the and the crypts

0:28:28.280 --> 0:28:32.520
<v Speaker 3>in Los Angeles and Crenshaw. It's like this is all

0:28:32.600 --> 0:28:33.879
<v Speaker 3>happening at the same time.

0:28:34.080 --> 0:28:36.640
<v Speaker 2>Diddy is not a guy who comes out of gang life,

0:28:36.640 --> 0:28:39.320
<v Speaker 2>but he is now involved in organized crime, right, because

0:28:39.320 --> 0:28:39.920
<v Speaker 2>that's just.

0:28:39.880 --> 0:28:42.960
<v Speaker 3>One of the big implications for Diddy being involved in

0:28:43.000 --> 0:28:45.280
<v Speaker 3>Tupac's death is that he was hiring.

0:28:45.440 --> 0:28:48.560
<v Speaker 2>Keep Yeah, we'll be talking about that, right.

0:28:48.600 --> 0:28:51.560
<v Speaker 3>So it's like we get into this he is associated

0:28:51.600 --> 0:28:54.080
<v Speaker 3>heavily with other gang members. It's a bit like the

0:28:54.520 --> 0:28:57.280
<v Speaker 3>Rolling Stones Hell's angel Ship where it's like, who do

0:28:57.320 --> 0:29:00.560
<v Speaker 3>you hire to protect you in your territory? Don't hire

0:29:00.600 --> 0:29:03.120
<v Speaker 3>the people who are strong there, You don't.

0:29:03.000 --> 0:29:05.320
<v Speaker 2>You're not saying have that, yeah, yeah, yeah.

0:29:05.080 --> 0:29:08.160
<v Speaker 3>And even to this day, you know, I've toured with

0:29:08.360 --> 0:29:10.320
<v Speaker 3>some big acts. I've toured with, you know, jay Z

0:29:10.440 --> 0:29:12.280
<v Speaker 3>and pusha T. I've toured with a lot of like

0:29:12.680 --> 0:29:15.360
<v Speaker 3>mid level like rappers, VIC Mensa and id K, like

0:29:15.400 --> 0:29:17.880
<v Speaker 3>all sorts of stuff like that. Even to this day,

0:29:18.760 --> 0:29:22.760
<v Speaker 3>when you go to a town, a city, you check

0:29:22.760 --> 0:29:25.600
<v Speaker 3>in with the guy there on the rap tours, you

0:29:25.720 --> 0:29:29.479
<v Speaker 3>check in with the j princes, you check in with

0:29:29.560 --> 0:29:33.960
<v Speaker 3>the people that are the guy in that town out

0:29:33.960 --> 0:29:37.640
<v Speaker 3>of respect, out of whatever, but like you make sure

0:29:37.760 --> 0:29:40.080
<v Speaker 3>that you are talking to those people. So this is

0:29:40.120 --> 0:29:43.120
<v Speaker 3>happening now, make no mistake that was there are people

0:29:43.120 --> 0:29:45.640
<v Speaker 3>that were in charge in those cities that were heavily

0:29:46.320 --> 0:29:51.120
<v Speaker 3>like involved in the responsibility around protecting those incidences from happening. Yeah.

0:29:51.120 --> 0:29:53.280
<v Speaker 2>Well, podcasting works the same way. You know when the

0:29:53.360 --> 0:29:56.040
<v Speaker 2>Last podcast on the Last Guys when they tour in Portland,

0:29:56.040 --> 0:30:00.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, they give Sophie and I down, you know,

0:30:01.160 --> 0:30:03.000
<v Speaker 2>the pod Save Guys. When I go to d C.

0:30:03.320 --> 0:30:06.600
<v Speaker 2>You know, fucking they'll uh the Last the last if

0:30:06.640 --> 0:30:07.640
<v Speaker 2>you don't call them.

0:30:07.800 --> 0:30:11.880
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, you know, and I understand that.

0:30:11.960 --> 0:30:14.760
<v Speaker 3>You know, It's like it's the hard business. Similar. Yeah,

0:30:14.800 --> 0:30:17.600
<v Speaker 3>the knitting circles are actually very similar as well.

0:30:17.680 --> 0:30:20.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, yeah, Sophie just put out a hit on

0:30:20.720 --> 0:30:22.640
<v Speaker 2>I'm really bad at actually knowing other people in the

0:30:22.720 --> 0:30:25.240
<v Speaker 2>podcast business. I was gonna say, Sarah Marshall that y'all

0:30:25.240 --> 0:30:31.320
<v Speaker 2>are real life from No, absolutely not. I'm going I'm

0:30:31.320 --> 0:30:34.200
<v Speaker 2>going to Chicago. I gotta call the knowledge fight guys.

0:30:34.240 --> 0:30:36.239
<v Speaker 2>Make sure they don't fucking put one in me at

0:30:36.240 --> 0:30:44.440
<v Speaker 2>the airport. Oh man. So, and it's also worth noting,

0:30:44.520 --> 0:30:47.800
<v Speaker 2>as we say people are dying, Combs is ordering hits, right.

0:30:48.040 --> 0:30:51.480
<v Speaker 2>I can't say that to a point of legal certainty.

0:30:50.680 --> 0:30:52.719
<v Speaker 2>The ordering hits.

0:30:53.320 --> 0:30:58.360
<v Speaker 3>The implication is strong that people are being directed to

0:30:58.400 --> 0:31:03.320
<v Speaker 3>execute other people on this. You know. Yeah, bye Sean. First.

0:31:03.440 --> 0:31:05.240
<v Speaker 2>I might not have said that a few months ago,

0:31:05.280 --> 0:31:07.480
<v Speaker 2>but now that he's in jail, I feel confident he's

0:31:07.520 --> 0:31:10.800
<v Speaker 2>not going to assume me for defamation. Yeah, he's definitely

0:31:10.840 --> 0:31:16.040
<v Speaker 2>had people killed. Yeah. Yeah. So it is also and

0:31:16.080 --> 0:31:17.960
<v Speaker 2>I should you know, we're talking about this feud, and

0:31:17.960 --> 0:31:20.280
<v Speaker 2>we will get back to this East coast West coast feud.

0:31:20.600 --> 0:31:23.160
<v Speaker 2>I should note here it is around this time in

0:31:23.240 --> 0:31:25.400
<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety three or nineteen ninety four. I think the

0:31:25.440 --> 0:31:28.720
<v Speaker 2>timeline's a little bit murky. The person may not remember precisely,

0:31:28.800 --> 0:31:31.600
<v Speaker 2>because that's the way trauma works. That Sean Combs is

0:31:31.640 --> 0:31:34.360
<v Speaker 2>accused of committing his second rape that we know of,

0:31:34.880 --> 0:31:38.240
<v Speaker 2>Lisa Gardner, who was sixteen years old at the time.

0:31:38.360 --> 0:31:42.640
<v Speaker 2>He is in his twenties. She is a child says

0:31:42.640 --> 0:31:45.600
<v Speaker 2>that she met Colmebs and Aaron Hall at an album

0:31:45.680 --> 0:31:49.520
<v Speaker 2>release in New York. She alleges that Colmes coerced her

0:31:49.560 --> 0:31:52.840
<v Speaker 2>into having sex, and then Hall assaulted her, and then

0:31:52.960 --> 0:31:55.960
<v Speaker 2>Diddy rapes her, and then Diddy and Hall rape her

0:31:56.080 --> 0:32:00.640
<v Speaker 2>fifteen year old friend Monica Chase. So he and his

0:32:00.680 --> 0:32:06.040
<v Speaker 2>friend Aaron Hall coerce and rape two underage people, one

0:32:06.040 --> 0:32:08.480
<v Speaker 2>of whom is fifteen, one of whom is sixteen. The

0:32:08.600 --> 0:32:12.560
<v Speaker 2>day after the assault, Combs comes to her house, she says,

0:32:13.080 --> 0:32:16.080
<v Speaker 2>and chokes her until she passes out, and then sexually

0:32:16.120 --> 0:32:20.080
<v Speaker 2>assaults her again. This is bad stuff. This is bad,

0:32:20.440 --> 0:32:25.400
<v Speaker 2>very bad stuff. Yeah, and it's one of those like, yeah,

0:32:25.520 --> 0:32:28.120
<v Speaker 2>ordering hits is bad too, But to an extent, everyone

0:32:28.160 --> 0:32:31.280
<v Speaker 2>who's in this East Coast West Coast thing is agreeing,

0:32:31.400 --> 0:32:34.040
<v Speaker 2>we're going to do some dangerous shit, right.

0:32:34.520 --> 0:32:38.720
<v Speaker 3>Yes, oh yeah. Like so outside of the sex assault stuff,

0:32:38.720 --> 0:32:39.200
<v Speaker 3>that's just.

0:32:41.600 --> 0:32:42.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh no, I'm.

0:32:42.720 --> 0:32:44.520
<v Speaker 3>Just like I can't.

0:32:44.600 --> 0:32:48.120
<v Speaker 2>Oh my god, you gotta use this. It's the only

0:32:48.200 --> 0:32:51.680
<v Speaker 2>thing that you can do after talking about something that horrible.

0:32:52.120 --> 0:32:54.000
<v Speaker 2>It's necessary.

0:32:55.160 --> 0:32:58.920
<v Speaker 3>Oh no. But it's like it's like that's willing participants stuff,

0:32:58.920 --> 0:33:01.000
<v Speaker 3>not the sex assaults of the gang stuff. This is

0:33:01.000 --> 0:33:04.480
<v Speaker 3>willing participant stuff. So it's like it's a lot easier

0:33:04.520 --> 0:33:06.840
<v Speaker 3>to sit back and be But like the sex assault

0:33:06.840 --> 0:33:10.560
<v Speaker 3>stuff happening co currently, it's like, it's that what we

0:33:10.560 --> 0:33:13.760
<v Speaker 3>were talking about. It is like it's covering up almost

0:33:14.160 --> 0:33:16.160
<v Speaker 3>or being covered up by the gang stuff. It's like

0:33:16.160 --> 0:33:18.480
<v Speaker 3>we're over here thinking about East Coast West Coast war.

0:33:18.840 --> 0:33:22.120
<v Speaker 3>He's raping girls. Like it's like that's that's the thing

0:33:22.160 --> 0:33:23.000
<v Speaker 3>that likes.

0:33:24.480 --> 0:33:25.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:33:25.400 --> 0:33:27.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, It's like it's like there's one side where it's like, well,

0:33:27.960 --> 0:33:31.080
<v Speaker 3>this is like a willing participant situation. I mean, obviously

0:33:31.120 --> 0:33:32.920
<v Speaker 3>I'm not trying to say everybody that's hurt by gang

0:33:33.000 --> 0:33:36.640
<v Speaker 3>violence is a willing but the yeah, yes, it's like

0:33:36.760 --> 0:33:39.040
<v Speaker 3>between these two guys, they are fighting each other. They

0:33:39.040 --> 0:33:41.640
<v Speaker 3>are fighting each other, They're causing the country to fight

0:33:41.680 --> 0:33:44.320
<v Speaker 3>each other. Like there this is a thing that's like

0:33:44.600 --> 0:33:49.400
<v Speaker 3>escalating violence amongst people in gangs. You know. It's like,

0:33:49.480 --> 0:33:53.719
<v Speaker 3>but yeah, willing participants. Again, it's like there's obviously collateral

0:33:53.800 --> 0:33:56.240
<v Speaker 3>damage is obviously bad shit. But but the other side

0:33:56.240 --> 0:33:58.800
<v Speaker 3>of this, where it's like sexual assault stuff, it's like, damn, dude,

0:33:58.840 --> 0:34:01.600
<v Speaker 3>like you don't even get that shit. To the surface

0:34:01.880 --> 0:34:03.440
<v Speaker 3>because there's people dying.

0:34:03.280 --> 0:34:07.480
<v Speaker 2>Right, and everyone's paying attention to the glamorous gang fight stuff, right,

0:34:07.600 --> 0:34:10.040
<v Speaker 2>and this is happening the whole time that's going down.

0:34:10.239 --> 0:34:13.600
<v Speaker 2>Also in nineteen ninety four, the same year, probably Comb's

0:34:13.600 --> 0:34:16.960
<v Speaker 2>allegedly met and raped a woman named April Lampros. She

0:34:17.120 --> 0:34:19.520
<v Speaker 2>claims that he started it by telling her he wanted

0:34:19.520 --> 0:34:22.120
<v Speaker 2>to be her mentor, he love bombed her, and once

0:34:22.120 --> 0:34:24.800
<v Speaker 2>they were dating, he ordered to keep the relationship secret

0:34:24.840 --> 0:34:28.480
<v Speaker 2>and started beating her. Lampros later alleged that Combs forced

0:34:28.520 --> 0:34:31.560
<v Speaker 2>her and his partner at the time is romantic partner

0:34:31.680 --> 0:34:34.640
<v Speaker 2>kim Porter, to take MDMA and then force them to

0:34:34.680 --> 0:34:37.600
<v Speaker 2>have sex while he watched. She attempted to cut off

0:34:37.600 --> 0:34:41.000
<v Speaker 2>contact with him, but he threatened her, including with revenge porn,

0:34:41.120 --> 0:34:43.640
<v Speaker 2>so she keeps going for a while. This would have

0:34:43.640 --> 0:34:46.200
<v Speaker 2>been a thing that would have looked like they were

0:34:46.280 --> 0:34:48.319
<v Speaker 2>dating from the outside, but a big part of it

0:34:48.360 --> 0:34:51.000
<v Speaker 2>is that he is violent and if she leaves, he's

0:34:51.040 --> 0:34:54.239
<v Speaker 2>going to post videos of them having you know of yeah,

0:34:54.440 --> 0:34:55.160
<v Speaker 2>you know so.

0:34:55.280 --> 0:34:58.160
<v Speaker 3>And this is all a recurring business and all the stuff.

0:34:58.160 --> 0:35:01.200
<v Speaker 3>It's like he took that that one playbook and just

0:35:01.320 --> 0:35:03.520
<v Speaker 3>ran with it, play the hits every single time. He

0:35:03.600 --> 0:35:05.880
<v Speaker 3>just kept going with it because like he knew that

0:35:06.080 --> 0:35:09.160
<v Speaker 3>there is a there and there is a very truthful

0:35:09.239 --> 0:35:12.200
<v Speaker 3>element to the power of influence like that you can

0:35:12.239 --> 0:35:14.919
<v Speaker 3>have by by just being who you are and being

0:35:14.920 --> 0:35:18.040
<v Speaker 3>a big deal. And it's scary because you think, especially

0:35:18.040 --> 0:35:20.880
<v Speaker 3>with people like Diddy, where they actively know that they

0:35:20.920 --> 0:35:24.080
<v Speaker 3>are untouchable. Yeah, they actively know that they're untouchable and

0:35:24.080 --> 0:35:25.120
<v Speaker 3>that they can do whatever they want.

0:35:25.160 --> 0:35:27.279
<v Speaker 2>And these are like, these are the two cases we

0:35:27.400 --> 0:35:30.879
<v Speaker 2>have from the fucking the war years, right, these aren't

0:35:30.880 --> 0:35:34.160
<v Speaker 2>the only two. Like, again important, that's not a singular

0:35:34.200 --> 0:35:36.920
<v Speaker 2>event type. This is a pattern that he has and

0:35:36.960 --> 0:35:40.360
<v Speaker 2>he is engaging in this pattern regularly for basically like

0:35:40.600 --> 0:35:42.480
<v Speaker 2>most of the time you and I have been alive.

0:35:42.880 --> 0:35:45.239
<v Speaker 2>That's the kind of bastard we're talking about it.

0:35:45.280 --> 0:35:51.560
<v Speaker 3>I was five when he started, Yeah, right, that was three. Yeah.

0:35:51.760 --> 0:35:55.080
<v Speaker 2>In September of nineteen ninety six, Tupac was gunned down

0:35:55.080 --> 0:35:58.439
<v Speaker 2>in a drive by shooting in Las Vegas. Six months

0:35:58.480 --> 0:36:01.920
<v Speaker 2>after that, Biggie is killed they drive by in Los Angeles.

0:36:02.160 --> 0:36:04.880
<v Speaker 2>No one was officially convicted by their murder, but we

0:36:04.960 --> 0:36:07.000
<v Speaker 2>at this point also pretty much know who did both.

0:36:07.280 --> 0:36:09.960
<v Speaker 2>Biggie was very likely gunned down by a guy named Pouci,

0:36:11.400 --> 0:36:13.960
<v Speaker 2>So you can imagine is the character from the Simpsons

0:36:13.960 --> 0:36:14.560
<v Speaker 2>if you like.

0:36:15.760 --> 0:36:17.080
<v Speaker 3>And he's gonna at the end of it.

0:36:17.120 --> 0:36:19.160
<v Speaker 2>He is.

0:36:20.080 --> 0:36:23.919
<v Speaker 3>Here's the toughest part. Again, again, unreliable narrators, right. Also,

0:36:24.560 --> 0:36:26.640
<v Speaker 3>every single one of these people die, every single one

0:36:26.680 --> 0:36:29.440
<v Speaker 3>of them gets shot in an early death, or Leido Anderson,

0:36:29.480 --> 0:36:33.640
<v Speaker 3>who was the likely killer of Tupac, also ended early.

0:36:33.840 --> 0:36:36.839
<v Speaker 3>Keithy D is the only one that's stuck around.

0:36:36.480 --> 0:36:42.560
<v Speaker 2>For amazing makes it You never think it's gonna be,

0:36:43.160 --> 0:36:43.560
<v Speaker 2>but it is.

0:36:43.680 --> 0:36:46.680
<v Speaker 3>Keithy D sticks around and he is as unreliable as

0:36:46.680 --> 0:36:49.160
<v Speaker 3>they come, just because of who he is as a person.

0:36:49.239 --> 0:36:52.319
<v Speaker 3>It is all it's braggadocious shit. It's all about like

0:36:52.440 --> 0:36:55.400
<v Speaker 3>talking about I who was involved in this thing? It

0:36:55.520 --> 0:36:58.719
<v Speaker 3>is definitely he was involved. Yeah he was in the

0:36:58.800 --> 0:37:00.879
<v Speaker 3>right places. But there's a lot of like you know,

0:37:01.239 --> 0:37:03.160
<v Speaker 3>it's even that way with Suge Knight, where it's like

0:37:03.200 --> 0:37:05.400
<v Speaker 3>Suge Knight is bragging about a lot of this stuff

0:37:05.600 --> 0:37:07.920
<v Speaker 3>and trying to like elevate and you don't get a

0:37:08.360 --> 0:37:12.279
<v Speaker 3>complete narrative because nobody is ever gonna tell the truth.

0:37:12.360 --> 0:37:17.240
<v Speaker 3>Right right, and as far as the evidence points yeah, Poochie.

0:37:17.040 --> 0:37:21.400
<v Speaker 2>And also clarify here you will find other theories. There

0:37:21.400 --> 0:37:23.040
<v Speaker 2>are people who say, no, it wasn't Poochi, it was

0:37:23.120 --> 0:37:25.040
<v Speaker 2>this other person that killed Biggie, and the same is

0:37:25.080 --> 0:37:27.680
<v Speaker 2>true with Tupac. I'm going with like the likeliest version

0:37:27.680 --> 0:37:32.120
<v Speaker 2>of the story. This is not a litigate who killed Tupac?

0:37:32.200 --> 0:37:41.360
<v Speaker 2>Podcast right, there's literally podcasts, strong opinions, nine biographies, there's bios,

0:37:41.360 --> 0:37:43.160
<v Speaker 2>there's there's so many things. I've got to work in

0:37:43.320 --> 0:37:45.920
<v Speaker 2>theory that it was in fact Bernie Sanders who dropped

0:37:45.960 --> 0:37:47.480
<v Speaker 2>to damnit, I.

0:37:47.480 --> 0:37:49.279
<v Speaker 3>Was gonna make that joke. I was gonna say this.

0:37:51.480 --> 0:37:52.680
<v Speaker 2>Sanders.

0:37:53.239 --> 0:37:57.879
<v Speaker 3>I was ready, damn it. I was gonna make that

0:37:57.960 --> 0:37:59.400
<v Speaker 3>joke because I knew it was going to be a

0:37:59.400 --> 0:38:02.040
<v Speaker 3>deep cut that like the real lovers of the pot,

0:38:02.160 --> 0:38:03.960
<v Speaker 3>he'd be like, oh shit, he's one of us.

0:38:04.040 --> 0:38:10.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So, as you noted, Tupac was almost certainly killed

0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:13.839
<v Speaker 2>by Dwayne Keefey d Davis, who was finally arrested last

0:38:13.880 --> 0:38:16.080
<v Speaker 2>year for the murder. He had been made a police

0:38:16.080 --> 0:38:18.239
<v Speaker 2>informant in two thousand and nine after an arrest for

0:38:18.320 --> 0:38:21.560
<v Speaker 2>drug trafficking. This is like a lot of people. He

0:38:21.680 --> 0:38:25.320
<v Speaker 2>is not super well informed about how the legal system works,

0:38:25.360 --> 0:38:28.279
<v Speaker 2>and he believed himself immune to prosecution and admitted to

0:38:28.360 --> 0:38:30.919
<v Speaker 2>killing Tupac in a drive by in nineteen ninety six.

0:38:31.440 --> 0:38:34.239
<v Speaker 3>And all right, so heavily believe So the breakdown of

0:38:34.280 --> 0:38:36.719
<v Speaker 3>this story, I'll try and get through really quick. But basically,

0:38:36.920 --> 0:38:39.800
<v Speaker 3>it was a Tyson fight in Las Vegas. Tupac is

0:38:39.840 --> 0:38:43.240
<v Speaker 3>there with his girlfriend and Suge Knight. He goes because

0:38:43.239 --> 0:38:47.319
<v Speaker 3>he actually wrote a song for Mike Tyson's walking. He

0:38:47.360 --> 0:38:49.799
<v Speaker 3>wrote like a rap song from Mike Tyson and it's like,

0:38:49.840 --> 0:38:51.880
<v Speaker 3>it's funny, you should listen to it, but it's, you know,

0:38:52.280 --> 0:38:55.239
<v Speaker 3>a Tupac. So he's there and he's watching the fight.

0:38:55.320 --> 0:38:59.040
<v Speaker 3>And then after the fight he sees a guy, Orlando Anderson,

0:38:59.080 --> 0:39:04.280
<v Speaker 3>who just weeks prior had taken somebody down and stolen

0:39:04.320 --> 0:39:06.080
<v Speaker 3>their chain. This is a big deal at this time.

0:39:06.120 --> 0:39:08.680
<v Speaker 3>You have a chain that says death row on it.

0:39:09.080 --> 0:39:12.960
<v Speaker 3>Suge Knight only gives those to the closest of associate cinema.

0:39:13.040 --> 0:39:17.360
<v Speaker 2>Again, podcasting works the same way. Exactly, I'm gonna come

0:39:17.400 --> 0:39:18.040
<v Speaker 2>out blast it.

0:39:18.320 --> 0:39:21.799
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Orlando Anderson was involved in that. Tupac sees him

0:39:21.880 --> 0:39:24.920
<v Speaker 3>right after the Tyson fight, he beats the shit out

0:39:24.920 --> 0:39:27.560
<v Speaker 3>of him in a lobby and then goes back to

0:39:27.640 --> 0:39:30.239
<v Speaker 3>his place. And then Sugar and Tupac are gonna go

0:39:30.320 --> 0:39:33.200
<v Speaker 3>to an after party. They start driving down the street.

0:39:33.440 --> 0:39:37.719
<v Speaker 3>Orlando Anderson happens to be Keithy D's nephew, right, and

0:39:37.800 --> 0:39:40.400
<v Speaker 3>they are in a car together driving down the street,

0:39:40.880 --> 0:39:45.600
<v Speaker 3>and Orlando and keify. Depending on which narrator you believe

0:39:45.719 --> 0:39:49.600
<v Speaker 3>one of them definitely plug Tupac. Now in one of

0:39:49.600 --> 0:39:55.920
<v Speaker 3>the greatest moments in Tupac history, in all history, fuck it.

0:39:56.360 --> 0:39:58.759
<v Speaker 3>The cop comes up to Tupac and he says, who

0:39:58.840 --> 0:40:06.040
<v Speaker 3>shot you? Two bucks is fuck you? Because even in

0:40:06.200 --> 0:40:11.279
<v Speaker 3>death he kept it real. It is one of my

0:40:11.320 --> 0:40:14.080
<v Speaker 3>favorite Those were like his last words. That was his

0:40:14.200 --> 0:40:15.960
<v Speaker 3>last words, was saying fuck you to him.

0:40:15.960 --> 0:40:20.839
<v Speaker 2>He's a literal Johnny tight lips character. Yeah you shut

0:40:20.920 --> 0:40:21.640
<v Speaker 2>I ain't saying nothing.

0:40:21.680 --> 0:40:24.359
<v Speaker 3>I say yeah.

0:40:24.520 --> 0:40:31.200
<v Speaker 2>Would tell the doctor tell him to a second exactly, literally,

0:40:31.320 --> 0:40:32.080
<v Speaker 2>like who shot you?

0:40:32.239 --> 0:40:34.279
<v Speaker 3>He knows who shot him. He just beat that guy

0:40:34.400 --> 0:40:38.560
<v Speaker 3>up ten fucking minutes ago. You know. He's like, no, man,

0:40:38.880 --> 0:40:40.200
<v Speaker 3>fuck yourselves.

0:40:41.360 --> 0:40:46.840
<v Speaker 2>Speaking of shooting people. Don't do that. Listen to these ads.

0:40:50.600 --> 0:40:52.160
<v Speaker 2>We are.

0:40:53.480 --> 0:41:07.000
<v Speaker 1>Bah no now man, Shane so much Shane.

0:41:06.760 --> 0:41:10.920
<v Speaker 2>Fuck so Tupac. We're talking about Tupac who was almost

0:41:10.920 --> 0:41:14.560
<v Speaker 2>certainly killed by Dwayne Keefe D Davis. So Davis, while

0:41:14.560 --> 0:41:18.120
<v Speaker 2>believing himself immune to prosecution, admits to killing Tupac in

0:41:18.200 --> 0:41:20.520
<v Speaker 2>nineteen ninety six. This is much more recently. He just

0:41:20.560 --> 0:41:24.120
<v Speaker 2>got arrested, I think last year. And he also claims,

0:41:24.160 --> 0:41:27.000
<v Speaker 2>while he again believed himself immune, that did he offered

0:41:27.040 --> 0:41:30.400
<v Speaker 2>him a million dollars to kill Tupac and paid that

0:41:30.640 --> 0:41:33.680
<v Speaker 2>fee to a different South Side Crips member to do

0:41:33.719 --> 0:41:34.480
<v Speaker 2>the job.

0:41:34.560 --> 0:41:36.680
<v Speaker 3>And he did not get that money ever.

0:41:36.800 --> 0:41:44.520
<v Speaker 2>No, Wow, he got fucked over by a fucking did.

0:41:44.560 --> 0:41:46.720
<v Speaker 2>He's not a man of his word, man.

0:41:46.600 --> 0:41:49.400
<v Speaker 3>This guy. No. So. One of the things, so Keithy

0:41:49.440 --> 0:41:52.160
<v Speaker 3>D had actually been a security guard for Puffy for

0:41:52.200 --> 0:41:54.480
<v Speaker 3>a while and like and that's how that link had

0:41:54.480 --> 0:41:56.880
<v Speaker 3>been established, you know. One of the things that's like

0:41:57.160 --> 0:41:59.040
<v Speaker 3>there's parts of this whole story that you have to

0:41:59.120 --> 0:42:01.719
<v Speaker 3>kind of take with like a bit of like I

0:42:01.760 --> 0:42:06.240
<v Speaker 3>don't think Keithy D was actively like seeking out Tupac

0:42:06.320 --> 0:42:09.400
<v Speaker 3>or anything. I think there's a situation where if Puffy

0:42:09.520 --> 0:42:11.520
<v Speaker 3>was involved in this whole situation the way that it

0:42:11.560 --> 0:42:14.200
<v Speaker 3>has been accused. I think he did what they say

0:42:14.239 --> 0:42:16.319
<v Speaker 3>he did, which is he put a word out. The

0:42:16.360 --> 0:42:18.880
<v Speaker 3>word is, if you kill Tupac, I give you a

0:42:18.880 --> 0:42:23.279
<v Speaker 3>million dollars. Right. And then I think keify D and

0:42:23.480 --> 0:42:27.600
<v Speaker 3>Orlando Anderson happened to be in the right place at

0:42:27.640 --> 0:42:30.160
<v Speaker 3>the right time, right. They they were at the right

0:42:30.160 --> 0:42:32.799
<v Speaker 3>place at the right time, they were connected in the

0:42:32.880 --> 0:42:35.080
<v Speaker 3>right situation that it happened that they were like, we

0:42:35.160 --> 0:42:38.560
<v Speaker 3>know where this motherfucker is. We are here right now,

0:42:39.080 --> 0:42:41.719
<v Speaker 3>Let's do this shit and we'll try and collect on

0:42:41.800 --> 0:42:45.759
<v Speaker 3>this later. And I think probably, although I don't think

0:42:45.760 --> 0:42:47.440
<v Speaker 3>it was a million dollars right this. I could be

0:42:47.480 --> 0:42:49.040
<v Speaker 3>wrong about this, but I think what it was actually

0:42:49.080 --> 0:42:51.480
<v Speaker 3>transferred was like two hundred thousand or something like that.

0:42:51.800 --> 0:42:54.440
<v Speaker 2>This is what keify D says, right. I'm not saying

0:42:54.440 --> 0:42:57.160
<v Speaker 2>this is the literal amounts or how it actually right opened.

0:42:57.360 --> 0:42:59.640
<v Speaker 3>Right. So I think that that's exactly like I think

0:42:59.640 --> 0:43:02.080
<v Speaker 3>it got transferred. I think people didn't like the one

0:43:02.120 --> 0:43:05.440
<v Speaker 3>guy definitely pocketed that money, or according to the story,

0:43:05.800 --> 0:43:08.680
<v Speaker 3>pocketed that money. The in between guy pocketed that money

0:43:08.680 --> 0:43:13.240
<v Speaker 3>and was like okay, bitch. But I think that. You know, again,

0:43:13.800 --> 0:43:16.880
<v Speaker 3>unreliable narration in this whole story, but there's some I

0:43:16.920 --> 0:43:20.440
<v Speaker 3>don't think it was intentional, is my point, that they

0:43:20.480 --> 0:43:23.360
<v Speaker 3>were trying out at that moment to kill Tupac. They

0:43:23.400 --> 0:43:25.760
<v Speaker 3>didn't go to Vegas with the intent of killing Tupac.

0:43:25.880 --> 0:43:27.640
<v Speaker 3>I think they went to Vegas to see a fight,

0:43:28.080 --> 0:43:30.799
<v Speaker 3>and yeah, there was an incident and then it just

0:43:30.840 --> 0:43:33.120
<v Speaker 3>turned up and it was a perfect time, you know. Yeah,

0:43:33.239 --> 0:43:36.240
<v Speaker 3>it seems more like that than it was a premeditated

0:43:36.320 --> 0:43:39.640
<v Speaker 3>situation of they're out there looking to kill Tupac, like

0:43:39.640 --> 0:43:42.000
<v Speaker 3>they're on the street ready to do it, Like Biggie

0:43:42.040 --> 0:43:44.320
<v Speaker 3>saw Keithy and was like, I will give you this money,

0:43:44.400 --> 0:43:46.880
<v Speaker 3>go kill him now, and he went there directly. I

0:43:46.880 --> 0:43:48.600
<v Speaker 3>think it was a crime of convenience more.

0:43:48.680 --> 0:43:51.319
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, yeah, that seems likely to me. I don't

0:43:51.320 --> 0:43:53.839
<v Speaker 2>know what happened. And again when I was saying this

0:43:53.960 --> 0:43:55.480
<v Speaker 2>is what this guy says, I'm not saying this is

0:43:55.480 --> 0:43:58.120
<v Speaker 2>literally what happened. This is a dude bowshitting to the

0:43:58.120 --> 0:44:01.400
<v Speaker 2>cops how he thinks he's im mute. So the cops

0:44:01.440 --> 0:44:04.320
<v Speaker 2>had him reach out to the guy that he said

0:44:04.440 --> 0:44:07.520
<v Speaker 2>actually got paid for the job, and to Ditty basically

0:44:07.560 --> 0:44:09.439
<v Speaker 2>trying to get ditty on a wire, being like, yeah,

0:44:09.680 --> 0:44:13.080
<v Speaker 2>killing Tupac was rad right, I don't think that worked.

0:44:13.120 --> 0:44:15.520
<v Speaker 2>Sean is not that dumb, and he has.

0:44:14.800 --> 0:44:19.040
<v Speaker 3>He has notoriously been very good about not talking to

0:44:19.080 --> 0:44:19.880
<v Speaker 3>the wrong people.

0:44:20.120 --> 0:44:22.279
<v Speaker 2>Yes, you know, and he has not been charged with this.

0:44:22.440 --> 0:44:25.480
<v Speaker 2>I don't know that he ever will. But prosecutors, summarizing

0:44:25.520 --> 0:44:27.959
<v Speaker 2>one of the interviews with KFD and court documents wrote,

0:44:28.120 --> 0:44:30.640
<v Speaker 2>and this is from right after Tupac's death, Sean Combs

0:44:30.680 --> 0:44:33.480
<v Speaker 2>reaches out to defendant wondering if Southside crips were responsible

0:44:33.480 --> 0:44:37.160
<v Speaker 2>for Shakur's death by asking, is that us defendant beaming

0:44:37.160 --> 0:44:40.600
<v Speaker 2>with pride? Answers yes, And that is probably how it

0:44:40.640 --> 0:44:42.680
<v Speaker 2>went down, because it often these things are not like

0:44:43.040 --> 0:44:44.920
<v Speaker 2>I ordered to hit and then he was shot. It

0:44:44.960 --> 0:44:47.120
<v Speaker 2>was more I made it known and I spread some

0:44:47.200 --> 0:44:49.000
<v Speaker 2>money around that like I wanted someone to take a

0:44:49.040 --> 0:44:51.200
<v Speaker 2>shot at this guy, but like other people could have

0:44:51.280 --> 0:44:53.680
<v Speaker 2>done it, like I don't know, you know, this is

0:44:53.680 --> 0:44:54.040
<v Speaker 2>what I'm.

0:44:53.960 --> 0:44:56.799
<v Speaker 3>Talking about, the clout industry of this because it is

0:44:56.840 --> 0:45:00.400
<v Speaker 3>part entertainment industry, it's part it's part male ego, and

0:45:00.520 --> 0:45:02.759
<v Speaker 3>like especially at this time, like the way that the

0:45:02.840 --> 0:45:05.600
<v Speaker 3>rap industry was was like very like strong, like male

0:45:05.680 --> 0:45:08.800
<v Speaker 3>ego centric type stuff. You know. It was like Tupac

0:45:08.960 --> 0:45:12.160
<v Speaker 3>literally the beef between him and Biggie, like you know,

0:45:12.200 --> 0:45:15.840
<v Speaker 3>Biggie made hushatcha and he responded. Tupac responded with saying,

0:45:16.280 --> 0:45:18.360
<v Speaker 3>you claim to be a player, but I fucked your wife,

0:45:18.600 --> 0:45:20.640
<v Speaker 3>you know, like he Yeah, he came back with what

0:45:20.760 --> 0:45:23.360
<v Speaker 3>at that time was considered the most and the rumors

0:45:23.360 --> 0:45:27.560
<v Speaker 3>around him and faith Hill actually having you know, a relationship.

0:45:28.000 --> 0:45:30.920
<v Speaker 3>We're certainly like that's real shit. You know, like this

0:45:31.000 --> 0:45:34.000
<v Speaker 3>is a real like manly type fight. You know, this

0:45:34.080 --> 0:45:37.320
<v Speaker 3>is what they're fighting about, these chauvinistic type concepts.

0:45:37.400 --> 0:45:37.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:45:37.800 --> 0:45:40.400
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean it's exactly like I put two bullets

0:45:40.400 --> 0:45:42.600
<v Speaker 2>in Dan from knowledge fight, you know, not because I

0:45:42.640 --> 0:45:44.719
<v Speaker 2>didn't like him, just because you know he was on

0:45:44.760 --> 0:45:47.439
<v Speaker 2>my turf, right, you know, he was on my turf

0:45:47.480 --> 0:45:50.040
<v Speaker 2>and he didn't call me before Jordan went to Portland.

0:45:50.080 --> 0:45:52.400
<v Speaker 2>You know, this is just the way nobody likes it.

0:45:52.440 --> 0:45:54.520
<v Speaker 2>This is just the way podcasting has to be. There's

0:45:54.560 --> 0:45:56.759
<v Speaker 2>no other way to do it, you know, Sorry, man,

0:45:56.800 --> 0:45:59.319
<v Speaker 2>there's no other way to do it. Yeah. Yeah, one

0:45:59.320 --> 0:46:01.719
<v Speaker 2>of the NP are guys stabbed me. You know, that's

0:46:01.760 --> 0:46:03.640
<v Speaker 2>just the way it is. One of those radio lab guys.

0:46:03.680 --> 0:46:05.279
<v Speaker 2>I'm not going to tell you which one. I don't

0:46:05.280 --> 0:46:11.879
<v Speaker 2>talk except for snitch. I'll snitch on Joe Rogan.

0:46:11.960 --> 0:46:16.799
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, let me find out some news on him.

0:46:17.080 --> 0:46:20.160
<v Speaker 2>So anyway, not conclusive, but probably pretty safe to say.

0:46:20.239 --> 0:46:23.520
<v Speaker 2>Did he had something to do with the Tupac killing.

0:46:24.160 --> 0:46:27.160
<v Speaker 3>At the very least he influenced it by positively putting

0:46:27.239 --> 0:46:30.319
<v Speaker 3>put that word into the hood, right, if you kill him,

0:46:30.480 --> 0:46:31.480
<v Speaker 3>there's money on it for.

0:46:31.560 --> 0:46:35.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly. And you know, obviously, the greater crime in

0:46:35.880 --> 0:46:38.680
<v Speaker 2>this is the fan art that this whole tragic rivalry

0:46:38.760 --> 0:46:41.480
<v Speaker 2>has inspired it. I'm speaking specifically. I wrote this episode

0:46:41.480 --> 0:46:44.040
<v Speaker 2>listening to a bunch of Tupac and Biggie socks, and

0:46:44.440 --> 0:46:46.360
<v Speaker 2>while I was, you know, YouTube does its thing, and

0:46:46.440 --> 0:46:48.680
<v Speaker 2>it took me to a playlist some DJ had made

0:46:48.680 --> 0:46:52.160
<v Speaker 2>that was like Tupac and Biggie songs called Biggie Versus Tupac.

0:46:52.400 --> 0:46:55.320
<v Speaker 2>It has nothing to do with the story, but whoever

0:46:55.400 --> 0:46:58.560
<v Speaker 2>made it did a photo shop that Sophie's going to

0:46:58.640 --> 0:47:01.359
<v Speaker 2>show you, and it's supposed to be like split down

0:47:01.360 --> 0:47:06.040
<v Speaker 2>the middle, Tupac space and Biggie's face by side, but

0:47:06.160 --> 0:47:08.560
<v Speaker 2>the way they did it, it just looks like Tupac

0:47:08.600 --> 0:47:15.400
<v Speaker 2>had a stroke. Yeah, so to show it off.

0:47:15.880 --> 0:47:20.400
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I got it stroked down.

0:47:21.840 --> 0:47:26.000
<v Speaker 2>Like Biggie's got kind of those eyes. Not a successful

0:47:26.000 --> 0:47:28.520
<v Speaker 2>photo shop, my man. I'm sorry, Oh my god.

0:47:29.000 --> 0:47:31.480
<v Speaker 3>Here's the thing, man, just like you know, just like

0:47:31.680 --> 0:47:35.279
<v Speaker 3>nw A, you know, the largest consumers of this East Coast,

0:47:35.280 --> 0:47:38.279
<v Speaker 3>West Coast rap suburban white kids. You know. It's like,

0:47:38.600 --> 0:47:41.200
<v Speaker 3>and this is true with even today, like you get

0:47:41.200 --> 0:47:43.120
<v Speaker 3>into like the Travis Scott stuff, you get into like

0:47:43.200 --> 0:47:48.480
<v Speaker 3>any wrap that's like, you know, it is largely consumed

0:47:48.560 --> 0:47:52.960
<v Speaker 3>by suburban white kids who also I'm sorry, guys, like

0:47:53.640 --> 0:47:55.799
<v Speaker 3>you know, same team or whatever, but you guys could

0:47:55.840 --> 0:47:58.960
<v Speaker 3>be some of the dumbest corny as people that exist

0:47:59.080 --> 0:48:02.080
<v Speaker 3>on the planet. Like that is pretty brutal, man.

0:48:02.120 --> 0:48:06.319
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, the doubt, like the as a suburban white

0:48:06.400 --> 0:48:09.600
<v Speaker 2>kid who was listening to fucking Biggie when I was fifty.

0:48:09.400 --> 0:48:13.720
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, me too, Sorry, guys, Yeah, we just weren't really

0:48:13.840 --> 0:48:14.319
<v Speaker 3>nailing it.

0:48:14.360 --> 0:48:20.120
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna be a gangster one day, Plano fucking Tach. God,

0:48:20.160 --> 0:48:22.120
<v Speaker 2>that was so funny. All the kids who would pretend

0:48:22.120 --> 0:48:23.359
<v Speaker 2>to be fucking gangsters.

0:48:23.800 --> 0:48:28.799
<v Speaker 3>Oh my god, dude. It is the large consumer of yeah, yeah, yeah,

0:48:28.520 --> 0:48:31.560
<v Speaker 3>of that bee. And also even today we're still sitting

0:48:31.560 --> 0:48:33.640
<v Speaker 3>with this, the Kendrick Drake thing right now that is

0:48:33.680 --> 0:48:35.160
<v Speaker 3>going on. I don't know how plugged in you are

0:48:35.200 --> 0:48:35.400
<v Speaker 3>to this.

0:48:35.640 --> 0:48:36.520
<v Speaker 1>I've tried to tell you.

0:48:36.560 --> 0:48:41.000
<v Speaker 3>It seems Yeah, it seems largely egged on by like

0:48:41.080 --> 0:48:42.320
<v Speaker 3>suburban white populace.

0:48:42.440 --> 0:48:46.000
<v Speaker 2>No, honestly, I'm considering taking some shots at Drake. This

0:48:46.120 --> 0:48:47.680
<v Speaker 2>seems like the time to do it.

0:48:47.840 --> 0:48:50.399
<v Speaker 3>You know. Yeah, he's low, he's low. You can really

0:48:50.480 --> 0:48:52.640
<v Speaker 3>get some in and nobody can say anything. This is

0:48:52.640 --> 0:48:58.160
<v Speaker 3>gonna be punching down, punching down on Drake with whatever

0:49:00.280 --> 0:49:01.240
<v Speaker 3>streams on spots.

0:49:01.280 --> 0:49:05.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So Sean Puffy Combs at this point has helped

0:49:05.160 --> 0:49:08.680
<v Speaker 2>it orchestraight Half a Coast's campaign of assassinations that led

0:49:08.680 --> 0:49:10.440
<v Speaker 2>to the deaths of two of the greatest rappers of

0:49:10.480 --> 0:49:12.719
<v Speaker 2>all time and also some other people. This was a

0:49:12.760 --> 0:49:16.080
<v Speaker 2>tough period for Diddy, though, because after Biggie dies, he's

0:49:16.120 --> 0:49:19.600
<v Speaker 2>successfully gotten rid of one of his major competitors at

0:49:19.600 --> 0:49:22.080
<v Speaker 2>the cost of losing his own golden goose.

0:49:22.480 --> 0:49:25.880
<v Speaker 3>Sort of, sort of, sort of. He waited a whole

0:49:26.200 --> 0:49:30.320
<v Speaker 3>two weeks to release this. That's exactly what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah,

0:49:30.360 --> 0:49:33.279
<v Speaker 3>So he releases his first hit single in January of

0:49:33.400 --> 0:49:36.680
<v Speaker 3>nineteen ninety seven. An album follows in July, which includes

0:49:36.680 --> 0:49:39.879
<v Speaker 3>a touching tribute to Biggie titled I'll Be Missing You.

0:49:40.200 --> 0:49:42.160
<v Speaker 3>That might as well be titled I'll be Cashing in

0:49:42.200 --> 0:49:44.799
<v Speaker 3>on your Death. Although the complaint that you're gonna get

0:49:44.840 --> 0:49:46.839
<v Speaker 3>from this, people are gonna be like, but he he

0:49:46.880 --> 0:49:48.759
<v Speaker 3>never cleared the sample right from Sting?

0:49:49.239 --> 0:49:52.960
<v Speaker 2>Right, yeah, he samples Stings every move you take, right something, Yeah, yeah,

0:49:53.000 --> 0:49:55.439
<v Speaker 2>the greatest crime he.

0:49:55.360 --> 0:49:58.560
<v Speaker 3>Never clears it, and he to this day, like Sting,

0:49:58.640 --> 0:50:02.120
<v Speaker 3>collects a pretty big amount of cash off of that. However,

0:50:02.920 --> 0:50:04.920
<v Speaker 3>don't also forget that this is a time in the

0:50:04.960 --> 0:50:10.120
<v Speaker 3>world where appearances pay, radio play pays, like everything pays.

0:50:10.160 --> 0:50:13.080
<v Speaker 3>This isn't Spotify era, where like, you know, the song

0:50:13.160 --> 0:50:15.600
<v Speaker 3>being everywhere in the entire world doesn't give you any

0:50:15.640 --> 0:50:19.560
<v Speaker 3>money even though you're not getting any publishing off of it, because, yeah,

0:50:19.640 --> 0:50:22.000
<v Speaker 3>when you record it yourself, you own that. That's the

0:50:22.040 --> 0:50:25.400
<v Speaker 3>master recording, You own your version of it. Yeah, for

0:50:26.040 --> 0:50:29.520
<v Speaker 3>certain things, right, publishing is one thing they can take

0:50:29.560 --> 0:50:32.400
<v Speaker 3>all the publishing, and you still make money off of

0:50:32.440 --> 0:50:35.040
<v Speaker 3>that song because it plays places.

0:50:35.360 --> 0:50:35.640
<v Speaker 2>Yep.

0:50:35.680 --> 0:50:38.040
<v Speaker 3>So it's not like it's not like he made no

0:50:38.120 --> 0:50:40.160
<v Speaker 3>money off of that. I just know, like people are

0:50:40.160 --> 0:50:43.040
<v Speaker 3>going but he didn't cash in on that because can

0:50:43.680 --> 0:50:45.799
<v Speaker 3>you know, Yeah, no, it's like there's still money to

0:50:45.840 --> 0:50:47.960
<v Speaker 3>be made, Especially in the nineties, there was still a

0:50:48.000 --> 0:50:50.520
<v Speaker 3>lot of money to be made off of having a

0:50:50.640 --> 0:50:52.040
<v Speaker 3>number one song in the country.

0:50:52.200 --> 0:50:54.719
<v Speaker 2>This is the first rap single to debut at number

0:50:54.719 --> 0:50:56.839
<v Speaker 2>one on the Billboard Top one hundred. Like, he makes

0:50:56.920 --> 0:50:58.560
<v Speaker 2>a lot of money as a result.

0:50:58.719 --> 0:51:01.680
<v Speaker 3>Everybody knows this song comes out at the VMA's dancing

0:51:01.719 --> 0:51:05.880
<v Speaker 3>in a white suit like like he it was actually iconic.

0:51:06.320 --> 0:51:09.279
<v Speaker 3>It's actually I mean yeah, yeah, the Biggie memorial in

0:51:09.320 --> 0:51:11.480
<v Speaker 3>the background, his dead.

0:51:11.360 --> 0:51:14.920
<v Speaker 2>Friend's huge face. Is he just fucking cash register sounds

0:51:14.920 --> 0:51:16.600
<v Speaker 2>going on immediately.

0:51:16.480 --> 0:51:20.360
<v Speaker 3>And there is also real quick just to backpedal a second,

0:51:20.640 --> 0:51:23.759
<v Speaker 3>there is a lot of talk about Biggie wanting to

0:51:23.920 --> 0:51:29.680
<v Speaker 3>leave Puffy's label before this happens. There is interviews with

0:51:29.760 --> 0:51:34.279
<v Speaker 3>tons of people, again unreliable narrator type stuff, but there

0:51:34.360 --> 0:51:37.360
<v Speaker 3>is a lot of interviews with people saying that Biggie

0:51:37.600 --> 0:51:40.279
<v Speaker 3>wanted out of his deal with bad Boy because he

0:51:40.320 --> 0:51:43.200
<v Speaker 3>felt like Puffy was taking advantage of him. He felt

0:51:43.200 --> 0:51:45.520
<v Speaker 3>like he wasn't getting what he should from his music,

0:51:45.880 --> 0:51:49.080
<v Speaker 3>that he wasn't getting like I think at the time,

0:51:49.880 --> 0:51:52.000
<v Speaker 3>like he was worth like maybe twenty million dollars or

0:51:52.040 --> 0:51:55.440
<v Speaker 3>something like that, you know, but he was not like

0:51:56.400 --> 0:52:01.360
<v Speaker 3>reaping what he actually should have from nine era music.

0:52:01.600 --> 0:52:03.880
<v Speaker 3>You know. It's like when you had a banger in

0:52:04.000 --> 0:52:08.759
<v Speaker 3>nineties era music, you made like fifty million dollars. It

0:52:08.840 --> 0:52:11.239
<v Speaker 3>was like an insane amount of money that you could make. Like,

0:52:11.320 --> 0:52:14.319
<v Speaker 3>if you talk about nineties bands, they were selling they

0:52:14.320 --> 0:52:16.840
<v Speaker 3>were still selling physical product. It's not like now with

0:52:16.960 --> 0:52:19.520
<v Speaker 3>streaming and stuff like that. They were selling a physical product.

0:52:19.760 --> 0:52:23.120
<v Speaker 3>So if you had a platinum album in the nineties,

0:52:23.480 --> 0:52:27.200
<v Speaker 3>you made twenty five thirty million, if you're label didn't

0:52:27.200 --> 0:52:29.479
<v Speaker 3>screw you, if there were you know, if you weren't

0:52:29.480 --> 0:52:32.960
<v Speaker 3>getting fucked over, you made like thirty or forty million dollars,

0:52:33.000 --> 0:52:35.879
<v Speaker 3>like you made in a tremendous amount of money. There's

0:52:35.920 --> 0:52:39.280
<v Speaker 3>a lot of there's a lot of conversation about Biggie

0:52:39.280 --> 0:52:42.200
<v Speaker 3>having known that prior to his death, which also leads

0:52:42.239 --> 0:52:46.200
<v Speaker 3>to the implication that he may have actually been involved

0:52:46.320 --> 0:52:47.879
<v Speaker 3>in yeah own death.

0:52:48.080 --> 0:52:50.160
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And we're largely just staying away from that because

0:52:50.160 --> 0:52:52.880
<v Speaker 2>it's it's not provable and the stuff that's provable is

0:52:53.160 --> 0:52:54.560
<v Speaker 2>for shit honestly a lot.

0:52:54.440 --> 0:52:59.040
<v Speaker 3>Worse again, very unreliable narrators everywhere. But it should at

0:52:59.080 --> 0:53:02.520
<v Speaker 3>least be known that there is the theory out there

0:53:02.520 --> 0:53:04.680
<v Speaker 3>in the world that that is something that goes on.

0:53:04.840 --> 0:53:07.239
<v Speaker 3>You know, that that happened and that was what he

0:53:07.320 --> 0:53:08.000
<v Speaker 3>was part of with that.

0:53:08.640 --> 0:53:11.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's going to do it for part two. Will

0:53:11.280 --> 0:53:13.359
<v Speaker 2>you got anything to plug before we roll out?

0:53:13.840 --> 0:53:17.080
<v Speaker 3>Man? I have podcasts if you are a nerd and

0:53:17.120 --> 0:53:20.840
<v Speaker 3>you like audio stuff but not nerdy audio stuff. I

0:53:20.880 --> 0:53:22.960
<v Speaker 3>have a podcast called that Sounds About Right with my

0:53:23.040 --> 0:53:26.000
<v Speaker 3>friend Shane Lance, who is a polar opposite of me

0:53:26.040 --> 0:53:30.040
<v Speaker 3>as a human. He's very Christian, very positive human being,

0:53:30.600 --> 0:53:34.040
<v Speaker 3>and I am divorced three times, so we make a

0:53:34.080 --> 0:53:38.600
<v Speaker 3>good pair and we talk about cool audio stuff, about

0:53:38.680 --> 0:53:41.319
<v Speaker 3>our own careers and a little inspirational. I mean, it's

0:53:41.320 --> 0:53:44.160
<v Speaker 3>called That Sounds About Right. I also am found all

0:53:44.200 --> 0:53:48.880
<v Speaker 3>over the internet on things from YouTube to TikTok under

0:53:48.960 --> 0:53:52.440
<v Speaker 3>Greasy Will, Greasywill Music, Greezy, I'm easy to find a

0:53:52.560 --> 0:53:53.920
<v Speaker 3>z and only one l on.

0:53:53.920 --> 0:53:58.239
<v Speaker 2>Will Yeah check him out and uh check me out

0:53:58.280 --> 0:54:01.320
<v Speaker 2>on Blue Sky, and I write, ok, and check out

0:54:01.320 --> 0:54:06.479
<v Speaker 2>our other podcast, Blue Sky. I am all right now, Yeah,

0:54:06.520 --> 0:54:08.839
<v Speaker 2>I'm happy you Actually you liked one of my ship

0:54:08.920 --> 0:54:10.520
<v Speaker 2>did You're a thing, and people.

0:54:10.360 --> 0:54:11.600
<v Speaker 3>Were very excited about it.

0:54:11.840 --> 0:54:12.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:54:12.360 --> 0:54:14.160
<v Speaker 3>I don't have many followers on Blue Sky, but I

0:54:14.200 --> 0:54:17.400
<v Speaker 3>share some really dark, twisted thoughts on there, so you know,

0:54:18.280 --> 0:54:19.799
<v Speaker 3>if you're into that, you can find me there too.

0:54:19.800 --> 0:54:23.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure watch will cancel himself and watch me cancel

0:54:23.560 --> 0:54:30.919
<v Speaker 2>myself all on Blue Sky. All right, Well that's it.

0:54:32.520 --> 0:54:35.440
<v Speaker 1>Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

0:54:35.560 --> 0:54:38.160
<v Speaker 1>For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool

0:54:38.239 --> 0:54:42.200
<v Speaker 1>Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

0:54:42.320 --> 0:54:45.440
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Behind the

0:54:45.480 --> 0:54:49.560
<v Speaker 1>Bastards is now available on YouTube, new episodes every Wednesday

0:54:49.640 --> 0:54:53.320
<v Speaker 1>and Friday. Subscribe to our channel YouTube dot com slash

0:54:53.480 --> 0:54:55.000
<v Speaker 1>at Behind the Bastards