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Speaker 1: A media.

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Speaker 2: Oh here, ye, hear ye. The Court of Bastards is

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Speaker 2: now in session, the Honorable Judge Robert Evans presiding. And

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Speaker 2: that's not a bit. I'm making an announcement here. Well,

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Speaker 2: I don't think I told you this yet. I have

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Speaker 2: been sworn in as a judge. I am legally a

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Speaker 2: United States municipal judge for the state of New Mexico.

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Speaker 3: This is not this is it's not a bit, and

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Speaker 3: he's brought it up.

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Speaker 1: I think he's told me this same same piece of

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Speaker 1: information five pounds.

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Speaker 2: I have the paperwork. I am now legally the Honorable

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Speaker 2: Robert Evans. For the rest of my life. I can

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Speaker 2: marry people, not just officiate like some of you folks.

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Speaker 2: I can witness documents, I could hear cases. I don't

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Speaker 2: think anyone's gonna give me any but I am a

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Speaker 2: judge now in New Mexico. And uh, you know.

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Speaker 3: How how does one become a judge in New Mexico?

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Speaker 2: You get sworn in by another judge. It works. Actually,

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Speaker 2: I'm just like.

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Speaker 3: How did you do you? Just you had to like

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Speaker 3: call them and was there an online app.

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Speaker 2: Let's let's call them a fan. I mean, definitely they

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Speaker 2: are a fan, a wonderful person whose name and.

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Speaker 3: They were like, hey, bro, did you know that it's

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Speaker 3: no work to become a judge?

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Speaker 2: You know it's incredibly easy. Well, it's apparently I didn't

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Speaker 2: know this either. Becoming a judge works exactly like being

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Speaker 2: a vampire and interview with a vampire.

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Speaker 3: Come in.

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Speaker 2: If somebody invite you more than you get, you can

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Speaker 2: get made a judge by like a bigger judge. But

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Speaker 2: you cannot necessarily make other people judges.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 2: You have to see you have to drink a certain

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Speaker 2: amount of blood.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you got to keep the pyramid at a

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Speaker 3: you know, a certain angle or else it gets too wide.

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Speaker 2: Again, if if I'm remembering interview with a vampire, right,

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Speaker 2: I am now going to live in France and then

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Speaker 2: burn down a theater.

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Speaker 3: Take on an eight year old child as you.

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Speaker 2: Take on an eight year old Ye?

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Speaker 3: Do the whole reare with that was? I'm very confused

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Speaker 3: still about what she was in that movie.

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Speaker 2: You gotta try the new TV show will It's It's wonderful?

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Speaker 3: Oh is it? I? I kind of I saw that

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Speaker 3: it existed, but I kind of put it in the

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Speaker 3: same like, you know, when they made the Archie comic

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Speaker 3: into it. Yeah, Drama Dale. I kind of so, I

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Speaker 3: kind of assumed it was something like that where they

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Speaker 3: just like or like The Fresh Prince, they turned that

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Speaker 3: into a fucking drama or whatever. It was like something

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Speaker 3: like that where it was just like real teeny like

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Speaker 3: as a Buffy the Vampire type show.

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Speaker 2: No, I can confidently say as a United States judge

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Speaker 2: that show is good. I do that power. I'm gonna

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Speaker 2: go do a Blood Meridian after this. Call me the

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Speaker 2: Judge used my own urine to make gunpowder. It's gonna

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Speaker 2: be incredible, folks, amazing. But my first act as judge

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Speaker 2: is to sit down with my buddy, the Grammy Award

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Speaker 2: winning Greasy Will and Judge P Diddy, and this will

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Speaker 2: be legally binding whatever I say, the courts have to do.

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Speaker 2: If I understand being a judge right, and I don't

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Speaker 2: think I do.

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Speaker 3: Can I be the middle of the defense and the prosecutor,

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Speaker 3: Like I don't know, I want to be both? Can

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Speaker 3: I be both?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? You could absolutely be both?

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, whatever's fun A kind of a moment.

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Speaker 3: A guest of behind the Bastard's like primary responsibility is

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Speaker 3: to be a bit of both of these things like

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Speaker 3: cheering you on for your incredible journalistic integrity and also

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Speaker 3: correcting your pronunciation.

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Speaker 2: Words Jeordia ash I honestly forget what we were saying.

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Speaker 3: See, I have no idea.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, not my job as a judge to know how

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Speaker 2: to pronounce R and B Duo Jordia Cage, Jordia Jeordia Jordan.

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Speaker 2: You know what, I sentence you to come up with

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Speaker 2: a different fucking name. I'm glad this intro was fun

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Speaker 2: because what we're going to talk about after this cold

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Speaker 2: open not fun at all. We're back and things are

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Speaker 2: about to get horrible. So nineteen ninety one, the same

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Speaker 2: year that he got all of those fucking people killed,

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Speaker 2: is the year in which Joy j o I Dickerson Neil,

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Speaker 2: one of those hyphenated last names, claims that Sean drugged

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Speaker 2: and raped her. Yes, yeah, I know, sorry, there was

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Speaker 2: there was no way to learn out swing. That's why

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Speaker 2: I opened something fun. Yeah, because it's gonna get It's

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Speaker 2: just it's I mean, this is gonna be horrible, folks.

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Speaker 3: Sorry, what year was this?

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Speaker 2: Ninety one, same year he got nine people killed in

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Speaker 2: a crush, So this is the earliest. I don't know

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Speaker 2: that This is the first person that John drugs and

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Speaker 2: assaults or assault period. But this is the earliest allegation

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Speaker 2: so far against Diddy that may have changed by the

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Speaker 2: time these episodes dropped. It is coming out rapidly every day.

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Speaker 2: It is one of the most serious. She was a

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Speaker 2: college student at the time. Sean was an up and

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Speaker 2: coming music producer who hosted legendary parties. He put her

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Speaker 2: in one of his music videos and then while they

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Speaker 2: were doing that, he asked her out on a date,

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Speaker 2: which is you know, classic story.

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Speaker 3: Classic story. Yeah, this is why the yeah prototype exists.

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Speaker 3: This is why people know that this is a thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's just the classic producers story.

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Speaker 2: And it's it's fucked up because like obviously this is

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Speaker 2: the way a lot of people get assaulted. It is

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Speaker 2: also legitimately how a lot of people's careers begin. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, like and honestly, sometimes both happen, right, Like

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Speaker 2: that's yes, which is why it's going to keep happening.

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Speaker 3: The story is exactly that. It's literally, let me assault

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Speaker 3: you and you get a career.

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Speaker 2: You can get in this fucking you know, I.

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Speaker 3: Mean, it's you know, and as this progresses on, we're

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Speaker 3: going to see a lot of that where it's like

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Speaker 3: people who go along with it make it, and when

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Speaker 3: they stop going along with it, they disappear.

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Speaker 2: Right right, yes, yes, you know. So after dinner, Sean

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Speaker 2: pushes Joy to stay out with him. She wants to

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Speaker 2: go home, and he's like, no, no, no, let's go, and

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Speaker 2: he takes you to a recording studio. She has a

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Speaker 2: drink at some point, I think, on the drive over,

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Speaker 2: and she like can't get out of the car because

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Speaker 2: she's so fucked up by the time they get there,

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Speaker 2: not from the drink, but from the fact that the

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Speaker 2: drink has been drug. Obviously drug, I'm guessing just from

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Speaker 2: her description, sounds like GHB, but could have been a

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Speaker 2: couple of things.

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Speaker 3: Pretty fast acting. Yes, yes, in a car drive across

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Speaker 3: the Yeah, that's that's not.

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Speaker 2: A long Nope, nope, nope. Combs takes her to a

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Speaker 2: separate location and he sexually assaults her. He films the rape.

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Speaker 3: Naturally, because why not keep evidence.

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Speaker 2: Why not keep that? Well, he films that he uses

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Speaker 2: like revenge porn against her, right.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, so this is like this is where he

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Speaker 3: starts to get into this.

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Speaker 2: The black man is doing this from the jump, Yeah, yeah, Epstein,

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Speaker 2: if you will, Yeah, exactly, And Dickerson actually finds out

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Speaker 2: that he's videotaped it because a male friend of hers

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Speaker 2: comes to her and is like, hey, man, I was

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Speaker 2: just hanging out with Sean and he showed us a

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Speaker 2: video of himself having sex with you and like you

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Speaker 2: don't really look like you're conscious, right, So that's how

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Speaker 2: she finds out about it. Like he shares he shows

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Speaker 2: this to a number of people.

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Speaker 3: That is just fucking awful.

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Speaker 2: It's hideous and it's one of those things.

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Speaker 3: Wait, so wait, so this is ninety one, right, ninety one?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what what do you have?

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Speaker 1: It?

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Speaker 3: Was it a camp quarder?

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Speaker 2: He had like a camp It must have been like

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Speaker 2: a camp quorder Yeah, like that, it was.

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Speaker 3: Not like it was it hidden situation or because there's

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Speaker 3: like there's like an element of like decisions that he

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Speaker 3: had to make, like he had to set this up

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Speaker 3: and plan this, like this wasn't you know, Yeah.

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Speaker 2: He had to set this up. He played the plan this.

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Speaker 2: He spent a lot of money, like it's not cheap

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Speaker 2: dead right Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, camera in ninety one was very expective. You weren't

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Speaker 3: just buying one cheese.

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Speaker 2: That's probably a big part of an addition just wanted

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Speaker 2: to do in the first place. Why she's drugged, right,

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Speaker 2: is so that he can set up and do all this, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, right. Yeah, it's not an easy process to use.

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Speaker 3: It's not like now you just push a button or

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Speaker 3: whatever on your phone. You gotta set this, get lighting

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Speaker 3: and shit like. It's like camp quorders were not just like.

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Speaker 2: Just laying around. Yeah, and it's it's also I on

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Speaker 2: a note, now, if you're very familiar with this case,

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Speaker 2: you're going to know, Oh, he's not bringing up everyone.

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Speaker 2: I can't. There's not enough time to talk about every

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Speaker 2: single person who has made allegations. I'm going to go

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Speaker 2: through enough that you understand what he does.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. At this point, it's literally like dozens and

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Speaker 3: dozens of people, Like, there's so many people that they've

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Speaker 3: started filing class actions and against.

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Speaker 2: It's the kind of thing where I think, and we'll

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Speaker 2: never know how many people. It wasn't total, but I

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Speaker 2: would be shocked if the total number of victims one

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Speaker 2: way or the other aren't in the hundreds. You know,

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Speaker 2: there's different levels of victim. There's some people that.

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Speaker 3: It's astonishing, there's Genghis Khan levels of things.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's some people who are like he coerced me,

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Speaker 2: but like I did say Yes, there's some people who

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Speaker 2: were like I got drugged but he didn't rate me,

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Speaker 2: or like I got out. So there's like degrees of

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Speaker 2: difference from how this happens because there's so many people

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Speaker 2: he's doing this too.

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Speaker 3: And there's combinations of every single one of those things

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Speaker 3: too as well. It's like it is layers upon layers.

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Speaker 3: You know, you're talking this is nineteen ninety one, we're

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty four. Yeah, you know, this is a

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Speaker 3: thirty year legacy of doing this. Yes, and this is

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Speaker 3: astonished and to only have allegations really because like that's

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Speaker 3: the one thing is like outside of like the industry,

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Speaker 3: his image was pretty clean, yeah, you know, like he

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Speaker 3: had a few little things.

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Speaker 2: That was like largely the Tupac stuff.

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Speaker 3: Yeah did he kill Tupac or or did he was

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Speaker 3: involved in like but it wasn't really like the sexual

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Speaker 3: assault stuff that was like big. It was all like

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Speaker 3: conspiracy mogul like you know, mob type stuff, you know,

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Speaker 3: like before this point in history.

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Speaker 2: Right right, absolutely, Yeah, I.

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Speaker 3: Mean we knew about or the other stuff existed and

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Speaker 3: was out there, but it wasn't like that was what

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Speaker 3: he was known for. When he came to that, Yeah, people.

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Speaker 2: Would say, oh, that guy's definitely a piece of shit, right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it was almost like he committed a bigger crime. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: in not being involved in Biggie and Tupacs.

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Speaker 2: It's like, look, if you're an overshadowed, if you've got

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Speaker 2: a crime you want to commit, you know, like maybe

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Speaker 2: maybe you're looking to do a big crypto scamera or something,

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Speaker 2: just kill Tupac first and you'll get away with it

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Speaker 2: for at least thirty years. Yeah, that's that's the Diddy story.

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Speaker 1: He might be a judge, but don't take legal advice

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Speaker 1: from Robert.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that should take advice. Do not kill Tupac. If

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Speaker 3: you find Tupac, let us say alone, say he he's

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Speaker 3: really a lie.

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Speaker 2: He deserves to hide. So in the wake of this

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Speaker 2: horrible sex crime, Sean got his first big opportunity. In

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Speaker 2: nineteen ninety two, he scouted out and signed a rap

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Speaker 2: artist named Christopher Wallace, better known to posterity as Biggie

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Speaker 2: Small's org Notorious Big and this is I'm just I'm

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Speaker 2: not super you know, knowledgeable, about pop culture. I love Biggie.

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Speaker 2: Biggie was one of the greatest lyricists of his generation. Honestly,

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Speaker 2: part of why I love him. I think he's like

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Speaker 2: written better about depression and hating yourself than most people

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Speaker 2: in music of her heck, like, I mean, he was great.

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Speaker 3: He was Biggie.

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Speaker 2: He was He was a huge man.

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Speaker 3: He was fat as hell, and he knew he was

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Speaker 3: fat as hell, and he said it all the time.

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Speaker 3: And then at one point in his career he acknowledged

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Speaker 3: not only am I fat as hell, but I'm sexy

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Speaker 3: as hell too because I'm rich as hell. So, like,

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Speaker 3: I don't give a shit about what. Yeah, he was

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Speaker 3: so and he really leaned into it.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: It's like you're talking about a dude whose biggest rival

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Speaker 3: at the time was Tupac, who was an athletic. Yeah yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: Tubac was ripped, you know, like and then Biggie's like, yeah, whatever, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'm four hundred pounds. I don't give a shit, and

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Speaker 3: Biggie is. But he was notoriously notorious LG. Yeah yeah, yeah, legendary.

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Speaker 2: And he is. This is one of those guys we

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Speaker 2: talked about a lot of guys and especially gangster rapidly

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Speaker 2: massage their reputation. Biggie didn't have to do that. He

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Speaker 2: comes from a tough background. His dad abandons the family

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Speaker 2: when he's three, which is interesting that both he and

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Speaker 2: did he lose their dad's at age three. He might

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Speaker 2: have been part of why they like got along bonded.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: He grew up near Bedsty in Brooklyn, which at that

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Speaker 2: point in time was a very different neighborhood than it

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Speaker 2: is today.

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Speaker 3: Sure not filled with hipsters. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. He was raised at Jehovah's Witness and became a

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Speaker 2: drug dealer selling weed at age twelve and moved up

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Speaker 2: to Crack once that epidemic kicked off. His mother WASH's Yeah,

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Speaker 2: he's raised a Jehovah's Witness. His mom is very strict.

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Speaker 2: He has to hide what he's doing from her.

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Speaker 3: I don't know that I've ever heard that before. That

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Speaker 3: is really interesting because I mean, like I knew that,

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Speaker 3: like he was very much. There's a lot of stories.

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Speaker 3: Even his mom told a lot of stories in the

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Speaker 3: biographies they'd done with of him and everything, of like

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Speaker 3: him always having to like hide stuff because she was watching,

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Speaker 3: she was on top of what he was doing. But

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Speaker 3: I never heard that.

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Speaker 2: It also has a big influence on the kind of

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Speaker 2: music he makes because his mom is very strict and

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Speaker 2: the morals that he's raised with conflicts in his new career,

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Speaker 2: so he always does. He has this feeling that is

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Speaker 2: I think not super common for a lot of people

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Speaker 2: in the same industry, that what he's doing is bad right,

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Speaker 2: and that influences the kind of music he makes. His

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Speaker 2: debut album is called Ready to Die, which includes the

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Speaker 2: song the great song Suicidal Thoughts, which opens with the

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Speaker 2: verse when I die, fuck it, I want to go

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Speaker 2: to hell because I'm a piece of shit. It ain't

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Speaker 2: hard to fucking tell, or getting more direct towards his

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Speaker 2: feelings about his mom. All my life, I've been considered

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Speaker 2: as the worst, lying to my mother, even stealing out

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Speaker 2: her purse. Crime after crime, from drugs to extortion. I

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Speaker 2: know my mom wished she got off fucking abortion. Like, yes,

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Speaker 2: I love Biggie, Yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 3: Biggie definitely was very pressing. He was very like knowledgeable

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Speaker 3: of himself and where he was at, you know, like

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Speaker 3: he anytime. It was Actually one of the things that

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Speaker 3: was so fascinating about Biggie's work is that he would

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Speaker 3: often talk about drug dealing as like as the darkness

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Speaker 3: that it was like a lot of times like people

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Speaker 3: were drug dealing, like especially now, it's like this glamour position, right,

300
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Speaker 3: and for him it was not. It was so much

301
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Speaker 3: more of like, this is what I had to do.

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Speaker 2: I hate myself because of what I had to do.

303
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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I don't like that I had to do

304
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Speaker 3: these things. I don't like myself because I had to

305
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Speaker 3: do these things. And this is what it's like to

306
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Speaker 3: grow up in these situations and have And it was

307
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Speaker 3: like it took so much of the glamour out of it.

308
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Speaker 3: It was dark. It was twisted, and it was dark,

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Speaker 3: and it was like, damn, he's really speaking about the

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Speaker 3: truth of all this. Yeah, you know, it was not

311
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Speaker 3: like look at me, I'm doing this because I'm fucking

312
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Speaker 3: gonna wear gold necklaces and shit. Like. He was pretty

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Speaker 3: humble even with like the braggadocious part of it. It

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Speaker 3: was still kind of dark. Yeah, in its humilities.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely. I guess what we're getting at is we're both

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00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:11,760
Speaker 2: fans of Bickie. Obviously, Biggie's going to be one of

317
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Speaker 2: the most successful rappers of all time, but initially when

318
00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:17,640
Speaker 2: he's getting started. His work is seen as too explicit

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Speaker 2: and too based in his extensive life of crimes from

320
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Speaker 2: MCA Records. Who is Uptown's distributor, and that's where Sean works,

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Speaker 2: and so Shawn's boss, Andre Harrol lets him go basically

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Speaker 2: fires him, although he will claim. Andre says I didn't

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Speaker 2: fire him because he was bad. Basically, I said, like, look, man,

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Speaker 2: you're right, this guy's going to be a hit. The

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Speaker 2: label that you get for it here fucking bounce. It's

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Speaker 2: time for you to succeed on your own, right, Andre

327
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Speaker 2: later tells Wall Street Journal. I didn't want to sit

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Speaker 2: there and be the one confining Puff because the corporation

329
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Speaker 2: was telling me to do that. I'm not built that way.

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Speaker 2: I told Puff he needs to go and create his

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Speaker 2: own opportunity. You're red hot right now. I'm really letting

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Speaker 2: you go so you can get rich. And that's exactly

333
00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:58,000
Speaker 2: what fucking happened.

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Speaker 3: So I mean, yeah, later and it's later, Yeah, yeah,

335
00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:07,160
Speaker 3: it really did. I mean it was the perfect time

336
00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:09,320
Speaker 3: for that. You know, like, for the most part, up

337
00:15:09,400 --> 00:15:13,640
Speaker 3: until Biggie and Pac, you know, a lot of hip

338
00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:17,320
Speaker 3: hop was more like happy type shit. It was still

339
00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,040
Speaker 3: like sometimes it was like had the darkness n w

340
00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,200
Speaker 3: A existed obviously, but like Biggie and Pac were like

341
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Speaker 3: really some of the originators of that like dark upbringing

342
00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:29,720
Speaker 3: culture of rap where it's like, look, we fucking we

343
00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:31,880
Speaker 3: hustle or survive and we're doing what we got to

344
00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:34,560
Speaker 3: do and like talking the real truth about what it

345
00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:36,600
Speaker 3: was like to be a black man in America at

346
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Speaker 3: the time. Yeah, So it was like there was something

347
00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:43,200
Speaker 3: really unique about that moment because it was starting to

348
00:15:43,480 --> 00:15:46,320
Speaker 3: you know, we're getting the crack epidemic, We're getting you know,

349
00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:53,760
Speaker 3: like crime Bill, that old Biden sleepy sleep Yeah, he

350
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:59,520
Speaker 3: was awake, right, So it's like, yeah, exactly, like maybe

351
00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:03,680
Speaker 3: he should easily he commits some of the biggest crimes

352
00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:05,800
Speaker 3: against black America that you can imagine.

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Speaker 2: I have always been firmly of the stance that the

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00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:12,160
Speaker 2: water fountains in the Capitol Building need to have XANAX

355
00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:14,720
Speaker 2: in them. We could solve a lot of problems, a lot.

356
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Speaker 3: Of problems that bring this down a little bit.

357
00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:19,760
Speaker 2: You know, put x X in the water everywhere.

358
00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:22,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, actually, yeah, great points.

359
00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:23,080
Speaker 2: Xan X lithium.

360
00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:25,400
Speaker 3: Let's just this is like when you're in high school

361
00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:27,320
Speaker 3: and you think you can solve all the world's problems

362
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,440
Speaker 3: the first time you take mushrooms and you're like, we

363
00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:33,320
Speaker 3: need to give everyone mushroom. We would, but actually maybe

364
00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:33,680
Speaker 3: that might.

365
00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:35,400
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe we really do need to put lithium in

366
00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:39,480
Speaker 2: the water or something. So Comb started a label of

367
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,680
Speaker 2: his own Bad Boy Records, and it bad bad Boy,

368
00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:47,480
Speaker 2: right clink clink clink. And this is when you're about

369
00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,720
Speaker 2: the East Coast, West Coast rap fude, it's bad Boy

370
00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,120
Speaker 2: and death Row over on, you know, the other side

371
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Speaker 2: of the country.

372
00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:56,040
Speaker 3: Sug Night and Death Row sug Knight, And yeah, are

373
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Speaker 3: we gonna shug We're gonna talk a little bit of

374
00:16:57,920 --> 00:16:58,440
Speaker 3: sug Knight.

375
00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:03,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, because basically, Biggie becomes a massive star pretty much overnight,

376
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Speaker 2: and that makes bad Boy a name, and that causes

377
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:08,960
Speaker 2: immediate friction with the West Coast premiere gangster wrap enclave,

378
00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:11,280
Speaker 2: sug Night's Death Row Records. If you want to know

379
00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:13,919
Speaker 2: the kind of man we're talking about, Biggie being a

380
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,080
Speaker 2: fucking real gangster. Sug is a real gangster.

381
00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:18,920
Speaker 3: Sugar, the realist of gangsters.

382
00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:23,159
Speaker 2: Later in life will be shot at two consecutive vm

383
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:24,600
Speaker 2: A after parties.

384
00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:28,679
Speaker 3: Yes, oh my god, one of my favorite Sugar Night

385
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:31,480
Speaker 3: things is the is the Vanilla Ice story?

386
00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:33,840
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, held him off the roof of.

387
00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:37,400
Speaker 3: A building by his ankles, by his ankles. He held

388
00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:39,520
Speaker 3: it because just over some dispute, you know. It's like

389
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,720
Speaker 3: it was like Sug was the real suddn't.

390
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:44,359
Speaker 2: Want to give him the rights or sell the rights

391
00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:46,200
Speaker 2: to an ice ice baby or something.

392
00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:48,919
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, he held him off the roof of a

393
00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,320
Speaker 3: bill It's like, this is the type of dude he was.

394
00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:53,119
Speaker 3: Is a little side tangent. I don't want to go

395
00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,520
Speaker 3: too far into it, but recently there was this TikTok

396
00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:57,679
Speaker 3: thing that happened where a guy found a bunch of

397
00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:02,080
Speaker 3: old death Row tapes two inch tape in a storage lock, right,

398
00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,720
Speaker 3: And because I'm in the TikTok zone, I saw this

399
00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:07,359
Speaker 3: happen and I was like, oh, this is good. Hey,

400
00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:08,960
Speaker 3: if you need any help with this, hit me up.

401
00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:10,439
Speaker 3: And it turned out to be a bunch of like

402
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:14,879
Speaker 3: mc hammer death Row era stuff, right, And it was

403
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:22,000
Speaker 3: like almost immediately once that started coming out, all all

404
00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:26,399
Speaker 3: the comments were like, hey man, just be careful. And

405
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:28,600
Speaker 3: it ended up going that I found the guy, the

406
00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:31,440
Speaker 3: engineer that was responsible for that stuff, and I was like, hey, man,

407
00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,639
Speaker 3: I was like, this guy found all this stuff. Your

408
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,480
Speaker 3: name's on the tapes, and he was like, I don't

409
00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,439
Speaker 3: really want to be involved in that because of that

410
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,000
Speaker 3: era of my life was one of the most I've

411
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:48,000
Speaker 3: ever felt like in danger. Yeah, He's like that was

412
00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:51,240
Speaker 3: the most I was ever worried about, like making it

413
00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:53,960
Speaker 3: through the day was when I worked as an engineer

414
00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:54,560
Speaker 3: for death Row.

415
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,160
Speaker 2: There's a lot of things you can say about Suge

416
00:18:58,200 --> 00:19:01,080
Speaker 2: Knight that are, you know, bastardy, but also sh Night's

417
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:03,920
Speaker 2: not really even when he's behind bars, not someone I

418
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:05,240
Speaker 2: want to talk too much ship on.

419
00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:11,560
Speaker 3: I'm close enough, man, I don't know's We'll say he's

420
00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:16,840
Speaker 3: he's a big guys formidable. He's a formidable person. Yeah,

421
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,560
Speaker 3: he's a large person and I would not know want

422
00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:21,480
Speaker 3: to ever have my tiny skull crush.

423
00:19:21,560 --> 00:19:23,160
Speaker 2: We have lots of respect for you, Shood.

424
00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:24,840
Speaker 3: Yeah.

425
00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:26,640
Speaker 2: Do you think don't dangles, don't.

426
00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:28,639
Speaker 3: Run me over at a burger stand? You know.

427
00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,080
Speaker 2: Yeah. So this is primarily a story of the evil

428
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:33,880
Speaker 2: that Sean is going to do later in his life

429
00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:35,840
Speaker 2: and his involvement in the East Coast West Coast rap

430
00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:39,400
Speaker 2: rivalry is like we know, but also it's murky right,

431
00:19:39,480 --> 00:19:41,679
Speaker 2: like there's a green murk of to like exactly what

432
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:42,440
Speaker 2: he was doing.

433
00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:47,600
Speaker 3: It's unreliable narrative, as you would write a lot of

434
00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:49,479
Speaker 3: unreliable narrative.

435
00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 2: Most of the narrators are like talking through wire taps

436
00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,720
Speaker 2: that the police have, or like interviews the police are conducting.

437
00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,600
Speaker 3: So yeah, and literally anything you get in all of

438
00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:04,119
Speaker 3: this stuff is it's unreliable. And because there's a level

439
00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:06,680
Speaker 3: of ego that's involved in this stuff, there's a level

440
00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:11,480
Speaker 3: of self importance and there's a level of also, we

441
00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:14,199
Speaker 3: were really fucked up doing drugs and alcohol and I

442
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:18,000
Speaker 3: don't actually remember what was going on. Yeah, It's like

443
00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:21,840
Speaker 3: there's a joke in the audio industry about like literally

444
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:25,080
Speaker 3: almost everybody has a I forgot, like like the Fleetwood

445
00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,280
Speaker 3: Mac like I forgot I made that song story, Like

446
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:31,520
Speaker 3: I don't remember even being there and doing that. Yeah.

447
00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:34,280
Speaker 2: I was watching a fucking uh an old video of

448
00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:36,480
Speaker 2: them during like the Rumors tour, and it's just clear

449
00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:39,520
Speaker 2: like not a one of you. You're all playing perfectly,

450
00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:41,879
Speaker 2: but not one of you could walk ten feet without

451
00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:46,960
Speaker 2: falling down like you are you are bru walk on

452
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:48,400
Speaker 2: that stage.

453
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,640
Speaker 3: And and although it has changed in its direction. There

454
00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,000
Speaker 3: is still a large amount of that in the music

455
00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:58,160
Speaker 3: industry where it's just like even on the like the

456
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,639
Speaker 3: professional side of things, like the engineers side of things.

457
00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:03,080
Speaker 3: I once cleaned a console that had been like a

458
00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:06,119
Speaker 3: soundboard that had been in use since like the early

459
00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:09,919
Speaker 3: seventies of like the the Oh Metallica recorded here, like

460
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,000
Speaker 3: you know that type of thing. Like every band ever

461
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,080
Speaker 3: had used this console, And we took off the plates

462
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:17,800
Speaker 3: for the faders to clean it, and there was actually

463
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:22,600
Speaker 3: cocaine and like and like weed and like shit under

464
00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:26,240
Speaker 3: the faders, like that much had accumulated over time that

465
00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:28,240
Speaker 3: it was just like under and it was like oh my,

466
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:30,320
Speaker 3: and you're like you're like still, like why am I?

467
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,639
Speaker 3: Why am I hands? Like why do I feel numb

468
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:33,240
Speaker 3: right now?

469
00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:36,560
Speaker 2: Just cocaine?

470
00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:39,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like that seventies.

471
00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:44,880
Speaker 2: This himself before putting it on the back of the truck. Yeah.

472
00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:49,199
Speaker 3: So there's a lot of like unreliable narration that happens

473
00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:51,879
Speaker 3: in the music industry all the time. It's there's a

474
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:53,760
Speaker 3: lot of drugs, there's a lot of alcohol, and there's

475
00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,840
Speaker 3: a lot of like man, sometimes people tell me my

476
00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:57,560
Speaker 3: own stories.

477
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, like a lot of when you're talking about

478
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,960
Speaker 2: the guys who are also literally fighting each other a

479
00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,600
Speaker 2: lot a head injuries, you know, yes, yeah, But the

480
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:09,040
Speaker 2: gist of it is, there's this huge conflict that comes

481
00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 2: to central around Tupac who's the big West Coast star,

482
00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:14,439
Speaker 2: and Biggie who is the East Coast star. And you know,

483
00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:18,879
Speaker 2: Tupac's you know, with Shug and Biggie is with Sean Diddy.

484
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,119
Speaker 2: So things come to a head on November thirtieth, nineteen

485
00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 2: ninety four, when Tupac Shakur is shot five times in

486
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,959
Speaker 2: the lobby of Quad Studios in Times Square. This is

487
00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 2: not when he dies. Tupaca was a tough.

488
00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,439
Speaker 3: Suy real quick. Just to rewind in this story of

489
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 3: what happened. So the East Coast West Coast thing, one

490
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,880
Speaker 3: of the big inciting factors were the Source Awards in

491
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,040
Speaker 3: New York probably I think a year before Tupac died,

492
00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:49,080
Speaker 3: Suge Knight was on stage directly insulting did it like

493
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:50,800
Speaker 3: that was like that was his thing. He stood up

494
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:53,399
Speaker 3: on stage and he said, Hey, if any of y'all

495
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,120
Speaker 3: want to be out there and not have a producer

496
00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:58,920
Speaker 3: that is singing and dancing all up in your videos

497
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,800
Speaker 3: and being like all in trying to make himself part

498
00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:05,920
Speaker 3: of the show. Right, then come over to death row, right,

499
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:08,040
Speaker 3: and this was like a big This was when Snoop

500
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,520
Speaker 3: got involved. There was also a moment just before that,

501
00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:12,479
Speaker 3: maybe it was right after I forget where Diddy and

502
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:16,640
Speaker 3: Shug were in a strip club in Atlanta and Shug's

503
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:18,199
Speaker 3: best friend. That was one of the times you were

504
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:21,439
Speaker 3: talking about Shugar's best friend got shot and killed in

505
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,560
Speaker 3: the parking lot or whatever after that alternate. So up

506
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 3: until Tupac getting shot, there's multiple deaths that have already happened. Like,

507
00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:31,439
Speaker 3: this is a back and forth thing that's kind of

508
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:35,320
Speaker 3: been going on, and they've been antagonizing. But it is

509
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:40,480
Speaker 3: Tupac and Biggie verbally in the public, right, But this

510
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:45,240
Speaker 3: is a sug Diddy situation. Yeah, this is their egos

511
00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:49,920
Speaker 3: that are bleeding down into their artists, that are fighting

512
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:53,280
Speaker 3: against each other. Because Biggie and Tupac are best friends

513
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,600
Speaker 3: at one point, well not best friends, but they are

514
00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 3: good friends at one point in time. This is like

515
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 3: an important like part to understand. Yeah, Biggie used to

516
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 3: sleep on Tupac's couch. Tupac's acting and like starting out

517
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 3: his career he's getting like his first records and everything.

518
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 3: He's starting to have success. Before Biggie Biggi's sleeping on

519
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,159
Speaker 3: his couch. Biggie is his friend. So Tupac comes to

520
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,600
Speaker 3: New York to record at Quad Studios. This is like

521
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:21,200
Speaker 3: the big inciting incident before the Source Awards thing. Tupac

522
00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:24,080
Speaker 3: comes to New York. He's recording in Quad Studios. He

523
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 3: comes down to the lobby. Biggie and Diddy are there

524
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,400
Speaker 3: as well. That same night he comes down to the lobby,

525
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 3: he gets shot and robbed in the lobby.

526
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

527
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 3: Right, and this is New York lobby. It's it's ten

528
00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:37,199
Speaker 3: feet there's a security guy there. It's like, you know,

529
00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 3: it's a So he gets shot in that lobby and

530
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,640
Speaker 3: he immediately blames Biggie.

531
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 2: Well, and there's for selling him out, and there's I

532
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,200
Speaker 2: mean yeah, and there's also like it's it's worth Biggie

533
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 2: and Puffy are in the studio right at this at

534
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 2: the top, like, and he is the only it's a

535
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 2: quote unquote robbery, but he is the only one who

536
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 2: gets shot.

537
00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, he's the only one that gets shot. And

538
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 3: like it's been dramatized in a lot of like you know,

539
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,240
Speaker 3: biopics and everything, but it's a non descript place. Like

540
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:06,400
Speaker 3: I've been to Quad Studios before I recorded there. It's

541
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,760
Speaker 3: a pretty non descript place. It's not like a flashy

542
00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 3: studio like in La You can see that a lot

543
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 3: of the studios, you know, a lot of them are

544
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:16,959
Speaker 3: kind of like nonscript but but you can like they

545
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 3: have signs or whatever. Quad Studios has no sign. Quad

546
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,680
Speaker 3: Studios is not like an accident where you just stumble

547
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,639
Speaker 3: in and shoot somebody. Yeah, yeah, no, you have to

548
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:28,720
Speaker 3: know somebody is there. It's on like the thirteenth floor

549
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 3: or some shit.

550
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, he wasn't like on the street, and it was

551
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 2: a crime of opportunity, right, Like the fact that he's like,

552
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:37,359
Speaker 2: what this pad do have been them? Is not not

553
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:41,439
Speaker 2: paranoia or whatever? Ruling yes, yeah, And so that builds

554
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:42,120
Speaker 2: up Tupac.

555
00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 3: Actually, right after that shooting, he goes to jail for

556
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:48,000
Speaker 3: sexual assault, spend some time in jail, and that's when

557
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,120
Speaker 3: Biggie's career grows gets all big, and he comes out

558
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 3: of jail to see Biggie now succeeding like fully and

559
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,920
Speaker 3: also feeling that hatred and that that you know, like

560
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 3: they were involved in this somehow of me getting shot

561
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,800
Speaker 3: becomes incredibly paranoid. This is when the Tupac switch really

562
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:08,880
Speaker 3: goes to the gangster shit.

563
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and he starts and putting out songs

564
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,440
Speaker 2: insulting Biggie and bad boy rap exactly exists.

565
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:18,359
Speaker 3: And again, while he's in jail, Biggie puts out who's shots.

566
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:19,919
Speaker 3: I think he was in jail away. I might be

567
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 3: missing some of this up because also I am an

568
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:28,679
Speaker 3: unreliable But while he's in jail, Biggie puts out who

569
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:33,880
Speaker 3: shot you? Which seems like a direct attack on Tupac.

570
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,120
Speaker 3: Who's shot YOUA is like a pretty.

571
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 2: It's a pretty funny thing to do.

572
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, when you're wondering who's shot and.

573
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 2: Somebody puts out a song, it's the if I did

574
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 2: it of gangster rap.

575
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,280
Speaker 3: Yes, it really is, and like and so Tupac's like, okay,

576
00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 3: well then he no, and this escalates to a massive,

577
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 3: massive battle between East Coast and West and.

578
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:56,879
Speaker 2: We are going to talk more about that. But you

579
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:00,240
Speaker 2: know what, never shot Tupac. The best of my knowledge,

580
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,360
Speaker 2: I can't really prove this, but it's unlikely.

581
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:06,400
Speaker 3: Our products and sponsor yea and and sponsors, Yeah, products

582
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 3: are the guys, the guys that give us the money.

583
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,400
Speaker 3: It's doing stuff very unlikely that they did.

584
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, although although unless it's.

585
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:18,520
Speaker 3: An yeah, you might get it.

586
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:27,679
Speaker 2: Yeah starts buying podcast space and we're back. So in

587
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,479
Speaker 2: September of nineteen ninety five, there's another you know chapter

588
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:35,720
Speaker 2: in this escalating battle. Witnesses say that they see Diddy's

589
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,679
Speaker 2: bodyguard get into an argument at an Atlantic club with

590
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 2: a guy named Jai Hassan Jamal Roblez, a member of

591
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,679
Speaker 2: Death Rows who's like a death Row guy, right, and

592
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 2: then after that argument, Roblez is shot and killed. And

593
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,119
Speaker 2: it's one of those like, well, he was having an

594
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:53,159
Speaker 2: argument with Combs's bodyguard who's a shooter, and then he

595
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 2: gets shot, right.

596
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,680
Speaker 3: Turns out people with guns are willing to use this.

597
00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:00,920
Speaker 2: And by the way, Combs's bodyguard, who probably Roblez, gets

598
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,119
Speaker 2: shot himself years later in Atlanta. You know, not a

599
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:04,720
Speaker 2: long life.

600
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 3: Like I said, this is this is a back and

601
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,199
Speaker 3: forth kind of situation for a long time. It's like

602
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 3: it mirrors what is going on because these are people

603
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 3: who are also gang relating in all these situations. It's

604
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:18,879
Speaker 3: a lot of bloods versus crypt situation. This is the

605
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 3: early nineties. This is actually a thing that's going on

606
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 3: in the.

607
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 2: World is tightened, the organized crime part of it and.

608
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,439
Speaker 3: The mob pirus in California and the and the crypts

609
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:32,520
Speaker 3: in Los Angeles and Crenshaw. It's like this is all

610
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:33,879
Speaker 3: happening at the same time.

611
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,640
Speaker 2: Diddy is not a guy who comes out of gang life,

612
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 2: but he is now involved in organized crime, right, because

613
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 2: that's just.

614
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 3: One of the big implications for Diddy being involved in

615
00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,280
Speaker 3: Tupac's death is that he was hiring.

616
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 2: Keep Yeah, we'll be talking about that, right.

617
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 3: So it's like we get into this he is associated

618
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 3: heavily with other gang members. It's a bit like the

619
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 3: Rolling Stones Hell's angel Ship where it's like, who do

620
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,560
Speaker 3: you hire to protect you in your territory? Don't hire

621
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 3: the people who are strong there, You don't.

622
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,320
Speaker 2: You're not saying have that, yeah, yeah, yeah.

623
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 3: And even to this day, you know, I've toured with

624
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 3: some big acts. I've toured with, you know, jay Z

625
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 3: and pusha T. I've toured with a lot of like

626
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:15,360
Speaker 3: mid level like rappers, VIC Mensa and id K, like

627
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 3: all sorts of stuff like that. Even to this day,

628
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 3: when you go to a town, a city, you check

629
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 3: in with the guy there on the rap tours, you

630
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:29,479
Speaker 3: check in with the j princes, you check in with

631
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,960
Speaker 3: the people that are the guy in that town out

632
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 3: of respect, out of whatever, but like you make sure

633
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,080
Speaker 3: that you are talking to those people. So this is

634
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:43,120
Speaker 3: happening now, make no mistake that was there are people

635
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 3: that were in charge in those cities that were heavily

636
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 3: like involved in the responsibility around protecting those incidences from happening. Yeah.

637
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,280
Speaker 2: Well, podcasting works the same way. You know when the

638
00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:56,040
Speaker 2: Last podcast on the Last Guys when they tour in Portland,

639
00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 2: you know, they give Sophie and I down, you know,

640
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 2: the pod Save Guys. When I go to d C.

641
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 2: You know, fucking they'll uh the Last the last if

642
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:07,640
Speaker 2: you don't call them.

643
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, you know, and I understand that.

644
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:14,760
Speaker 3: You know, It's like it's the hard business. Similar. Yeah,

645
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 3: the knitting circles are actually very similar as well.

646
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, Sophie just put out a hit on

647
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:22,640
Speaker 2: I'm really bad at actually knowing other people in the

648
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 2: podcast business. I was gonna say, Sarah Marshall that y'all

649
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 2: are real life from No, absolutely not. I'm going I'm

650
00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 2: going to Chicago. I gotta call the knowledge fight guys.

651
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,239
Speaker 2: Make sure they don't fucking put one in me at

652
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:44,440
Speaker 2: the airport. Oh man. So, and it's also worth noting,

653
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 2: as we say people are dying, Combs is ordering hits, right.

654
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 2: I can't say that to a point of legal certainty.

655
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:52,719
Speaker 2: The ordering hits.

656
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 3: The implication is strong that people are being directed to

657
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 3: execute other people on this. You know. Yeah, bye Sean. First.

658
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 2: I might not have said that a few months ago,

659
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 2: but now that he's in jail, I feel confident he's

660
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 2: not going to assume me for defamation. Yeah, he's definitely

661
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 2: had people killed. Yeah. Yeah. So it is also and

662
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 2: I should you know, we're talking about this feud, and

663
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 2: we will get back to this East coast West coast feud.

664
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 2: I should note here it is around this time in

665
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:25,400
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety three or nineteen ninety four. I think the

666
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 2: timeline's a little bit murky. The person may not remember precisely,

667
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 2: because that's the way trauma works. That Sean Combs is

668
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 2: accused of committing his second rape that we know of,

669
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 2: Lisa Gardner, who was sixteen years old at the time.

670
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 2: He is in his twenties. She is a child says

671
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 2: that she met Colmebs and Aaron Hall at an album

672
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 2: release in New York. She alleges that Colmes coerced her

673
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 2: into having sex, and then Hall assaulted her, and then

674
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:55,960
Speaker 2: Diddy rapes her, and then Diddy and Hall rape her

675
00:31:56,080 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 2: fifteen year old friend Monica Chase. So he and his

676
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 2: friend Aaron Hall coerce and rape two underage people, one

677
00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,480
Speaker 2: of whom is fifteen, one of whom is sixteen. The

678
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 2: day after the assault, Combs comes to her house, she says,

679
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 2: and chokes her until she passes out, and then sexually

680
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:20,080
Speaker 2: assaults her again. This is bad stuff. This is bad,

681
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 2: very bad stuff. Yeah, and it's one of those like, yeah,

682
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,120
Speaker 2: ordering hits is bad too, But to an extent, everyone

683
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,280
Speaker 2: who's in this East Coast West Coast thing is agreeing,

684
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 2: we're going to do some dangerous shit, right.

685
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 3: Yes, oh yeah. Like so outside of the sex assault stuff,

686
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 3: that's just.

687
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: Oh no, I'm.

688
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 3: Just like I can't.

689
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,120
Speaker 2: Oh my god, you gotta use this. It's the only

690
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 2: thing that you can do after talking about something that horrible.

691
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 2: It's necessary.

692
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 3: Oh no. But it's like it's like that's willing participants stuff,

693
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 3: not the sex assaults of the gang stuff. This is

694
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 3: willing participant stuff. So it's like it's a lot easier

695
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 3: to sit back and be But like the sex assault

696
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 3: stuff happening co currently, it's like, it's that what we

697
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 3: were talking about. It is like it's covering up almost

698
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 3: or being covered up by the gang stuff. It's like

699
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,480
Speaker 3: we're over here thinking about East Coast West Coast war.

700
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 3: He's raping girls. Like it's like that's that's the thing

701
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 3: that likes.

702
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

703
00:33:25,400 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, It's like it's like there's one side where it's like, well,

704
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 3: this is like a willing participant situation. I mean, obviously

705
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 3: I'm not trying to say everybody that's hurt by gang

706
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 3: violence is a willing but the yeah, yes, it's like

707
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 3: between these two guys, they are fighting each other. They

708
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 3: are fighting each other, They're causing the country to fight

709
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,320
Speaker 3: each other. Like there this is a thing that's like

710
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 3: escalating violence amongst people in gangs. You know. It's like,

711
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:53,719
Speaker 3: but yeah, willing participants. Again, it's like there's obviously collateral

712
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 3: damage is obviously bad shit. But but the other side

713
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 3: of this, where it's like sexual assault stuff, it's like, damn, dude,

714
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 3: like you don't even get that shit. To the surface

715
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:03,440
Speaker 3: because there's people dying.

716
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 2: Right, and everyone's paying attention to the glamorous gang fight stuff, right,

717
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,040
Speaker 2: and this is happening the whole time that's going down.

718
00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 2: Also in nineteen ninety four, the same year, probably Comb's

719
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,960
Speaker 2: allegedly met and raped a woman named April Lampros. She

720
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 2: claims that he started it by telling her he wanted

721
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 2: to be her mentor, he love bombed her, and once

722
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,800
Speaker 2: they were dating, he ordered to keep the relationship secret

723
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,480
Speaker 2: and started beating her. Lampros later alleged that Combs forced

724
00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 2: her and his partner at the time is romantic partner

725
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 2: kim Porter, to take MDMA and then force them to

726
00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 2: have sex while he watched. She attempted to cut off

727
00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 2: contact with him, but he threatened her, including with revenge porn,

728
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,640
Speaker 2: so she keeps going for a while. This would have

729
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 2: been a thing that would have looked like they were

730
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:48,319
Speaker 2: dating from the outside, but a big part of it

731
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 2: is that he is violent and if she leaves, he's

732
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:54,239
Speaker 2: going to post videos of them having you know of yeah,

733
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 2: you know so.

734
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,160
Speaker 3: And this is all a recurring business and all the stuff.

735
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 3: It's like he took that that one playbook and just

736
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 3: ran with it, play the hits every single time. He

737
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:05,880
Speaker 3: just kept going with it because like he knew that

738
00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 3: there is a there and there is a very truthful

739
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 3: element to the power of influence like that you can

740
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 3: have by by just being who you are and being

741
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 3: a big deal. And it's scary because you think, especially

742
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 3: with people like Diddy, where they actively know that they

743
00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 3: are untouchable. Yeah, they actively know that they're untouchable and

744
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 3: that they can do whatever they want.

745
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,279
Speaker 2: And these are like, these are the two cases we

746
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:30,879
Speaker 2: have from the fucking the war years, right, these aren't

747
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 2: the only two. Like, again important, that's not a singular

748
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 2: event type. This is a pattern that he has and

749
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:40,360
Speaker 2: he is engaging in this pattern regularly for basically like

750
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 2: most of the time you and I have been alive.

751
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 2: That's the kind of bastard we're talking about it.

752
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:51,560
Speaker 3: I was five when he started, Yeah, right, that was three. Yeah.

753
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 2: In September of nineteen ninety six, Tupac was gunned down

754
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:58,439
Speaker 2: in a drive by shooting in Las Vegas. Six months

755
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 2: after that, Biggie is killed they drive by in Los Angeles.

756
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:04,880
Speaker 2: No one was officially convicted by their murder, but we

757
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 2: at this point also pretty much know who did both.

758
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 2: Biggie was very likely gunned down by a guy named Pouci,

759
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 2: So you can imagine is the character from the Simpsons

760
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 2: if you like.

761
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:17,080
Speaker 3: And he's gonna at the end of it.

762
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 2: He is.

763
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:23,919
Speaker 3: Here's the toughest part. Again, again, unreliable narrators, right. Also,

764
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 3: every single one of these people die, every single one

765
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 3: of them gets shot in an early death, or Leido Anderson,

766
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 3: who was the likely killer of Tupac, also ended early.

767
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:36,839
Speaker 3: Keithy D is the only one that's stuck around.

768
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 2: For amazing makes it You never think it's gonna be,

769
00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 2: but it is.

770
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 3: Keithy D sticks around and he is as unreliable as

771
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 3: they come, just because of who he is as a person.

772
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 3: It is all it's braggadocious shit. It's all about like

773
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,400
Speaker 3: talking about I who was involved in this thing? It

774
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 3: is definitely he was involved. Yeah he was in the

775
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:00,879
Speaker 3: right places. But there's a lot of like you know,

776
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 3: it's even that way with Suge Knight, where it's like

777
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,400
Speaker 3: Suge Knight is bragging about a lot of this stuff

778
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 3: and trying to like elevate and you don't get a

779
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:12,279
Speaker 3: complete narrative because nobody is ever gonna tell the truth.

780
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:17,240
Speaker 3: Right right, and as far as the evidence points yeah, Poochie.

781
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:21,400
Speaker 2: And also clarify here you will find other theories. There

782
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 2: are people who say, no, it wasn't Poochi, it was

783
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 2: this other person that killed Biggie, and the same is

784
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:27,680
Speaker 2: true with Tupac. I'm going with like the likeliest version

785
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 2: of the story. This is not a litigate who killed Tupac?

786
00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:41,360
Speaker 2: Podcast right, there's literally podcasts, strong opinions, nine biographies, there's bios,

787
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 2: there's there's so many things. I've got to work in

788
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 2: theory that it was in fact Bernie Sanders who dropped

789
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 2: to damnit, I.

790
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,279
Speaker 3: Was gonna make that joke. I was gonna say this.

791
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 2: Sanders.

792
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:57,879
Speaker 3: I was ready, damn it. I was gonna make that

793
00:37:57,960 --> 00:37:59,400
Speaker 3: joke because I knew it was going to be a

794
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 3: deep cut that like the real lovers of the pot,

795
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 3: he'd be like, oh shit, he's one of us.

796
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. So, as you noted, Tupac was almost certainly killed

797
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:13,839
Speaker 2: by Dwayne Keefey d Davis, who was finally arrested last

798
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 2: year for the murder. He had been made a police

799
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,239
Speaker 2: informant in two thousand and nine after an arrest for

800
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:21,560
Speaker 2: drug trafficking. This is like a lot of people. He

801
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:25,320
Speaker 2: is not super well informed about how the legal system works,

802
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 2: and he believed himself immune to prosecution and admitted to

803
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,919
Speaker 2: killing Tupac in a drive by in nineteen ninety six.

804
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 3: And all right, so heavily believe So the breakdown of

805
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 3: this story, I'll try and get through really quick. But basically,

806
00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:39,800
Speaker 3: it was a Tyson fight in Las Vegas. Tupac is

807
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:43,240
Speaker 3: there with his girlfriend and Suge Knight. He goes because

808
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:47,319
Speaker 3: he actually wrote a song for Mike Tyson's walking. He

809
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,799
Speaker 3: wrote like a rap song from Mike Tyson and it's like,

810
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 3: it's funny, you should listen to it, but it's, you know,

811
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:55,239
Speaker 3: a Tupac. So he's there and he's watching the fight.

812
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 3: And then after the fight he sees a guy, Orlando Anderson,

813
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:04,280
Speaker 3: who just weeks prior had taken somebody down and stolen

814
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 3: their chain. This is a big deal at this time.

815
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:08,680
Speaker 3: You have a chain that says death row on it.

816
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,960
Speaker 3: Suge Knight only gives those to the closest of associate cinema.

817
00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:17,360
Speaker 2: Again, podcasting works the same way. Exactly, I'm gonna come

818
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 2: out blast it.

819
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, Orlando Anderson was involved in that. Tupac sees him

820
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,920
Speaker 3: right after the Tyson fight, he beats the shit out

821
00:39:24,920 --> 00:39:27,560
Speaker 3: of him in a lobby and then goes back to

822
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:30,239
Speaker 3: his place. And then Sugar and Tupac are gonna go

823
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 3: to an after party. They start driving down the street.

824
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:37,719
Speaker 3: Orlando Anderson happens to be Keithy D's nephew, right, and

825
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:40,400
Speaker 3: they are in a car together driving down the street,

826
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 3: and Orlando and keify. Depending on which narrator you believe

827
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 3: one of them definitely plug Tupac. Now in one of

828
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:55,920
Speaker 3: the greatest moments in Tupac history, in all history, fuck it.

829
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 3: The cop comes up to Tupac and he says, who

830
00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:06,040
Speaker 3: shot you? Two bucks is fuck you? Because even in

831
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:11,279
Speaker 3: death he kept it real. It is one of my

832
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 3: favorite Those were like his last words. That was his

833
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 3: last words, was saying fuck you to him.

834
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:20,839
Speaker 2: He's a literal Johnny tight lips character. Yeah you shut

835
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:21,640
Speaker 2: I ain't saying nothing.

836
00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:24,359
Speaker 3: I say yeah.

837
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 2: Would tell the doctor tell him to a second exactly, literally,

838
00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:32,080
Speaker 2: like who shot you?

839
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:34,279
Speaker 3: He knows who shot him. He just beat that guy

840
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 3: up ten fucking minutes ago. You know. He's like, no, man,

841
00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:40,200
Speaker 3: fuck yourselves.

842
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:46,840
Speaker 2: Speaking of shooting people. Don't do that. Listen to these ads.

843
00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 2: We are.

844
00:40:53,480 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 1: Bah no now man, Shane so much Shane.

845
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:10,920
Speaker 2: Fuck so Tupac. We're talking about Tupac who was almost

846
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: certainly killed by Dwayne Keefe D Davis. So Davis, while

847
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 2: believing himself immune to prosecution, admits to killing Tupac in

848
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety six. This is much more recently. He just

849
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 2: got arrested, I think last year. And he also claims,

850
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: while he again believed himself immune, that did he offered

851
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 2: him a million dollars to kill Tupac and paid that

852
00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:33,680
Speaker 2: fee to a different South Side Crips member to do

853
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:34,480
Speaker 2: the job.

854
00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 3: And he did not get that money ever.

855
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 2: No, Wow, he got fucked over by a fucking did.

856
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:46,720
Speaker 2: He's not a man of his word, man.

857
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:49,400
Speaker 3: This guy. No. So. One of the things, so Keithy

858
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 3: D had actually been a security guard for Puffy for

859
00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,480
Speaker 3: a while and like and that's how that link had

860
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,880
Speaker 3: been established, you know. One of the things that's like

861
00:41:57,160 --> 00:41:59,040
Speaker 3: there's parts of this whole story that you have to

862
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 3: kind of take with like a bit of like I

863
00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:06,240
Speaker 3: don't think Keithy D was actively like seeking out Tupac

864
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:09,400
Speaker 3: or anything. I think there's a situation where if Puffy

865
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 3: was involved in this whole situation the way that it

866
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 3: has been accused. I think he did what they say

867
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:16,319
Speaker 3: he did, which is he put a word out. The

868
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 3: word is, if you kill Tupac, I give you a

869
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:23,279
Speaker 3: million dollars. Right. And then I think keify D and

870
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 3: Orlando Anderson happened to be in the right place at

871
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 3: the right time, right. They they were at the right

872
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:32,799
Speaker 3: place at the right time, they were connected in the

873
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 3: right situation that it happened that they were like, we

874
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 3: know where this motherfucker is. We are here right now,

875
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 3: Let's do this shit and we'll try and collect on

876
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:45,759
Speaker 3: this later. And I think probably, although I don't think

877
00:42:45,760 --> 00:42:47,440
Speaker 3: it was a million dollars right this. I could be

878
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,040
Speaker 3: wrong about this, but I think what it was actually

879
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 3: transferred was like two hundred thousand or something like that.

880
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,440
Speaker 2: This is what keify D says, right. I'm not saying

881
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 2: this is the literal amounts or how it actually right opened.

882
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 3: Right. So I think that that's exactly like I think

883
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 3: it got transferred. I think people didn't like the one

884
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 3: guy definitely pocketed that money, or according to the story,

885
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 3: pocketed that money. The in between guy pocketed that money

886
00:43:08,680 --> 00:43:13,240
Speaker 3: and was like okay, bitch. But I think that. You know, again,

887
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:16,880
Speaker 3: unreliable narration in this whole story, but there's some I

888
00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:20,440
Speaker 3: don't think it was intentional, is my point, that they

889
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,360
Speaker 3: were trying out at that moment to kill Tupac. They

890
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,760
Speaker 3: didn't go to Vegas with the intent of killing Tupac.

891
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 3: I think they went to Vegas to see a fight,

892
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:30,799
Speaker 3: and yeah, there was an incident and then it just

893
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,120
Speaker 3: turned up and it was a perfect time, you know. Yeah,

894
00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:36,240
Speaker 3: it seems more like that than it was a premeditated

895
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 3: situation of they're out there looking to kill Tupac, like

896
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 3: they're on the street ready to do it, Like Biggie

897
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:44,320
Speaker 3: saw Keithy and was like, I will give you this money,

898
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:46,880
Speaker 3: go kill him now, and he went there directly. I

899
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:48,600
Speaker 3: think it was a crime of convenience more.

900
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that seems likely to me. I don't

901
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:53,839
Speaker 2: know what happened. And again when I was saying this

902
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 2: is what this guy says, I'm not saying this is

903
00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:58,120
Speaker 2: literally what happened. This is a dude bowshitting to the

904
00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 2: cops how he thinks he's im mute. So the cops

905
00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 2: had him reach out to the guy that he said

906
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:07,520
Speaker 2: actually got paid for the job, and to Ditty basically

907
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:09,439
Speaker 2: trying to get ditty on a wire, being like, yeah,

908
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 2: killing Tupac was rad right, I don't think that worked.

909
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 2: Sean is not that dumb, and he has.

910
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 3: He has notoriously been very good about not talking to

911
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:19,880
Speaker 3: the wrong people.

912
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,279
Speaker 2: Yes, you know, and he has not been charged with this.

913
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,480
Speaker 2: I don't know that he ever will. But prosecutors, summarizing

914
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:27,959
Speaker 2: one of the interviews with KFD and court documents wrote,

915
00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 2: and this is from right after Tupac's death, Sean Combs

916
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 2: reaches out to defendant wondering if Southside crips were responsible

917
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 2: for Shakur's death by asking, is that us defendant beaming

918
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 2: with pride? Answers yes, And that is probably how it

919
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 2: went down, because it often these things are not like

920
00:44:43,040 --> 00:44:44,920
Speaker 2: I ordered to hit and then he was shot. It

921
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:47,120
Speaker 2: was more I made it known and I spread some

922
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 2: money around that like I wanted someone to take a

923
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 2: shot at this guy, but like other people could have

924
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:53,680
Speaker 2: done it, like I don't know, you know, this is

925
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 2: what I'm.

926
00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 3: Talking about, the clout industry of this because it is

927
00:44:56,840 --> 00:45:00,400
Speaker 3: part entertainment industry, it's part it's part male ego, and

928
00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:02,759
Speaker 3: like especially at this time, like the way that the

929
00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,600
Speaker 3: rap industry was was like very like strong, like male

930
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,800
Speaker 3: ego centric type stuff. You know. It was like Tupac

931
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:12,160
Speaker 3: literally the beef between him and Biggie, like you know,

932
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:15,840
Speaker 3: Biggie made hushatcha and he responded. Tupac responded with saying,

933
00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:18,360
Speaker 3: you claim to be a player, but I fucked your wife,

934
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:20,640
Speaker 3: you know, like he Yeah, he came back with what

935
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,360
Speaker 3: at that time was considered the most and the rumors

936
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 3: around him and faith Hill actually having you know, a relationship.

937
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 3: We're certainly like that's real shit. You know, like this

938
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 3: is a real like manly type fight. You know, this

939
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 3: is what they're fighting about, these chauvinistic type concepts.

940
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 1: Yeah.

941
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:40,400
Speaker 2: No, I mean it's exactly like I put two bullets

942
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 2: in Dan from knowledge fight, you know, not because I

943
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:44,719
Speaker 2: didn't like him, just because you know he was on

944
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,439
Speaker 2: my turf, right, you know, he was on my turf

945
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:50,040
Speaker 2: and he didn't call me before Jordan went to Portland.

946
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 2: You know, this is just the way nobody likes it.

947
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 2: This is just the way podcasting has to be. There's

948
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 2: no other way to do it, you know, Sorry, man,

949
00:45:56,800 --> 00:45:59,319
Speaker 2: there's no other way to do it. Yeah. Yeah, one

950
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:01,719
Speaker 2: of the NP are guys stabbed me. You know, that's

951
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:03,640
Speaker 2: just the way it is. One of those radio lab guys.

952
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:05,279
Speaker 2: I'm not going to tell you which one. I don't

953
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:11,879
Speaker 2: talk except for snitch. I'll snitch on Joe Rogan.

954
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:16,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, let me find out some news on him.

955
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:20,160
Speaker 2: So anyway, not conclusive, but probably pretty safe to say.

956
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 2: Did he had something to do with the Tupac killing.

957
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 3: At the very least he influenced it by positively putting

958
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:30,319
Speaker 3: put that word into the hood, right, if you kill him,

959
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:31,480
Speaker 3: there's money on it for.

960
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And you know, obviously, the greater crime in

961
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:38,680
Speaker 2: this is the fan art that this whole tragic rivalry

962
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 2: has inspired it. I'm speaking specifically. I wrote this episode

963
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:44,040
Speaker 2: listening to a bunch of Tupac and Biggie socks, and

964
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:46,360
Speaker 2: while I was, you know, YouTube does its thing, and

965
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:48,680
Speaker 2: it took me to a playlist some DJ had made

966
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:52,160
Speaker 2: that was like Tupac and Biggie songs called Biggie Versus Tupac.

967
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:55,320
Speaker 2: It has nothing to do with the story, but whoever

968
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 2: made it did a photo shop that Sophie's going to

969
00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:01,359
Speaker 2: show you, and it's supposed to be like split down

970
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 2: the middle, Tupac space and Biggie's face by side, but

971
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 2: the way they did it, it just looks like Tupac

972
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 2: had a stroke. Yeah, so to show it off.

973
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:20,400
Speaker 1: Okay, I got it stroked down.

974
00:47:21,840 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 2: Like Biggie's got kind of those eyes. Not a successful

975
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:28,520
Speaker 2: photo shop, my man. I'm sorry, Oh my god.

976
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:31,480
Speaker 3: Here's the thing, man, just like you know, just like

977
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:35,279
Speaker 3: nw A, you know, the largest consumers of this East Coast,

978
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 3: West Coast rap suburban white kids. You know. It's like,

979
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 3: and this is true with even today, like you get

980
00:47:41,200 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 3: into like the Travis Scott stuff, you get into like

981
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 3: any wrap that's like, you know, it is largely consumed

982
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:52,960
Speaker 3: by suburban white kids who also I'm sorry, guys, like

983
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:55,799
Speaker 3: you know, same team or whatever, but you guys could

984
00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 3: be some of the dumbest corny as people that exist

985
00:47:59,080 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 3: on the planet. Like that is pretty brutal, man.

986
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:06,319
Speaker 2: But yeah, the doubt, like the as a suburban white

987
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 2: kid who was listening to fucking Biggie when I was fifty.

988
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:13,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, me too, Sorry, guys, Yeah, we just weren't really

989
00:48:13,840 --> 00:48:14,319
Speaker 3: nailing it.

990
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:20,120
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be a gangster one day, Plano fucking Tach. God,

991
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 2: that was so funny. All the kids who would pretend

992
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:23,359
Speaker 2: to be fucking gangsters.

993
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:28,799
Speaker 3: Oh my god, dude. It is the large consumer of yeah, yeah, yeah,

994
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:31,560
Speaker 3: of that bee. And also even today we're still sitting

995
00:48:31,560 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 3: with this, the Kendrick Drake thing right now that is

996
00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:35,160
Speaker 3: going on. I don't know how plugged in you are

997
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:35,400
Speaker 3: to this.

998
00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:36,520
Speaker 1: I've tried to tell you.

999
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:41,000
Speaker 3: It seems Yeah, it seems largely egged on by like

1000
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:42,320
Speaker 3: suburban white populace.

1001
00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 2: No, honestly, I'm considering taking some shots at Drake. This

1002
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:47,680
Speaker 2: seems like the time to do it.

1003
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,399
Speaker 3: You know. Yeah, he's low, he's low. You can really

1004
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:52,640
Speaker 3: get some in and nobody can say anything. This is

1005
00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:58,160
Speaker 3: gonna be punching down, punching down on Drake with whatever

1006
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:01,240
Speaker 3: streams on spots.

1007
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:05,160
Speaker 2: Yeah. So Sean Puffy Combs at this point has helped

1008
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:08,680
Speaker 2: it orchestraight Half a Coast's campaign of assassinations that led

1009
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:10,440
Speaker 2: to the deaths of two of the greatest rappers of

1010
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:12,719
Speaker 2: all time and also some other people. This was a

1011
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 2: tough period for Diddy, though, because after Biggie dies, he's

1012
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:19,600
Speaker 2: successfully gotten rid of one of his major competitors at

1013
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 2: the cost of losing his own golden goose.

1014
00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:25,880
Speaker 3: Sort of, sort of, sort of. He waited a whole

1015
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:30,320
Speaker 3: two weeks to release this. That's exactly what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah,

1016
00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:33,279
Speaker 3: So he releases his first hit single in January of

1017
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 3: nineteen ninety seven. An album follows in July, which includes

1018
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:39,879
Speaker 3: a touching tribute to Biggie titled I'll Be Missing You.

1019
00:49:40,200 --> 00:49:42,160
Speaker 3: That might as well be titled I'll be Cashing in

1020
00:49:42,200 --> 00:49:44,799
Speaker 3: on your Death. Although the complaint that you're gonna get

1021
00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:46,839
Speaker 3: from this, people are gonna be like, but he he

1022
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:48,759
Speaker 3: never cleared the sample right from Sting?

1023
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:52,960
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, he samples Stings every move you take, right something, Yeah, yeah,

1024
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:55,439
Speaker 2: the greatest crime he.

1025
00:49:55,360 --> 00:49:58,560
Speaker 3: Never clears it, and he to this day, like Sting,

1026
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:02,120
Speaker 3: collects a pretty big amount of cash off of that. However,

1027
00:50:02,920 --> 00:50:04,920
Speaker 3: don't also forget that this is a time in the

1028
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:10,120
Speaker 3: world where appearances pay, radio play pays, like everything pays.

1029
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 3: This isn't Spotify era, where like, you know, the song

1030
00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:15,600
Speaker 3: being everywhere in the entire world doesn't give you any

1031
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 3: money even though you're not getting any publishing off of it, because, yeah,

1032
00:50:19,640 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 3: when you record it yourself, you own that. That's the

1033
00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 3: master recording, You own your version of it. Yeah, for

1034
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:29,520
Speaker 3: certain things, right, publishing is one thing they can take

1035
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 3: all the publishing, and you still make money off of

1036
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:35,040
Speaker 3: that song because it plays places.

1037
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:35,640
Speaker 2: Yep.

1038
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:38,040
Speaker 3: So it's not like it's not like he made no

1039
00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 3: money off of that. I just know, like people are

1040
00:50:40,160 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 3: going but he didn't cash in on that because can

1041
00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:45,799
Speaker 3: you know, Yeah, no, it's like there's still money to

1042
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:47,960
Speaker 3: be made, Especially in the nineties, there was still a

1043
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 3: lot of money to be made off of having a

1044
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:52,040
Speaker 3: number one song in the country.

1045
00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:54,719
Speaker 2: This is the first rap single to debut at number

1046
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:56,839
Speaker 2: one on the Billboard Top one hundred. Like, he makes

1047
00:50:56,920 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 2: a lot of money as a result.

1048
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 3: Everybody knows this song comes out at the VMA's dancing

1049
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:05,880
Speaker 3: in a white suit like like he it was actually iconic.

1050
00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:09,279
Speaker 3: It's actually I mean yeah, yeah, the Biggie memorial in

1051
00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 3: the background, his dead.

1052
00:51:11,360 --> 00:51:14,920
Speaker 2: Friend's huge face. Is he just fucking cash register sounds

1053
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:16,600
Speaker 2: going on immediately.

1054
00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:20,360
Speaker 3: And there is also real quick just to backpedal a second,

1055
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:23,759
Speaker 3: there is a lot of talk about Biggie wanting to

1056
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 3: leave Puffy's label before this happens. There is interviews with

1057
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 3: tons of people, again unreliable narrator type stuff, but there

1058
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:37,360
Speaker 3: is a lot of interviews with people saying that Biggie

1059
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 3: wanted out of his deal with bad Boy because he

1060
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:43,200
Speaker 3: felt like Puffy was taking advantage of him. He felt

1061
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:45,520
Speaker 3: like he wasn't getting what he should from his music,

1062
00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 3: that he wasn't getting like I think at the time,

1063
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:52,000
Speaker 3: like he was worth like maybe twenty million dollars or

1064
00:51:52,040 --> 00:51:55,440
Speaker 3: something like that, you know, but he was not like

1065
00:51:56,400 --> 00:52:01,360
Speaker 3: reaping what he actually should have from nine era music.

1066
00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:03,880
Speaker 3: You know. It's like when you had a banger in

1067
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:08,759
Speaker 3: nineties era music, you made like fifty million dollars. It

1068
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:11,239
Speaker 3: was like an insane amount of money that you could make. Like,

1069
00:52:11,320 --> 00:52:14,319
Speaker 3: if you talk about nineties bands, they were selling they

1070
00:52:14,320 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 3: were still selling physical product. It's not like now with

1071
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:19,520
Speaker 3: streaming and stuff like that. They were selling a physical product.

1072
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:23,120
Speaker 3: So if you had a platinum album in the nineties,

1073
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 3: you made twenty five thirty million, if you're label didn't

1074
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:29,479
Speaker 3: screw you, if there were you know, if you weren't

1075
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:32,960
Speaker 3: getting fucked over, you made like thirty or forty million dollars,

1076
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,879
Speaker 3: like you made in a tremendous amount of money. There's

1077
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:39,280
Speaker 3: a lot of there's a lot of conversation about Biggie

1078
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:42,200
Speaker 3: having known that prior to his death, which also leads

1079
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 3: to the implication that he may have actually been involved

1080
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:47,879
Speaker 3: in yeah own death.

1081
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:50,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, And we're largely just staying away from that because

1082
00:52:50,160 --> 00:52:52,880
Speaker 2: it's it's not provable and the stuff that's provable is

1083
00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:54,560
Speaker 2: for shit honestly a lot.

1084
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 3: Worse again, very unreliable narrators everywhere. But it should at

1085
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:02,520
Speaker 3: least be known that there is the theory out there

1086
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:04,680
Speaker 3: in the world that that is something that goes on.

1087
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 3: You know, that that happened and that was what he

1088
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:08,000
Speaker 3: was part of with that.

1089
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 2: Well, that's going to do it for part two. Will

1090
00:53:11,280 --> 00:53:13,359
Speaker 2: you got anything to plug before we roll out?

1091
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:17,080
Speaker 3: Man? I have podcasts if you are a nerd and

1092
00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:20,840
Speaker 3: you like audio stuff but not nerdy audio stuff. I

1093
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 3: have a podcast called that Sounds About Right with my

1094
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 3: friend Shane Lance, who is a polar opposite of me

1095
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:30,040
Speaker 3: as a human. He's very Christian, very positive human being,

1096
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:34,040
Speaker 3: and I am divorced three times, so we make a

1097
00:53:34,080 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 3: good pair and we talk about cool audio stuff, about

1098
00:53:38,680 --> 00:53:41,319
Speaker 3: our own careers and a little inspirational. I mean, it's

1099
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 3: called That Sounds About Right. I also am found all

1100
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:48,880
Speaker 3: over the internet on things from YouTube to TikTok under

1101
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:52,440
Speaker 3: Greasy Will, Greasywill Music, Greezy, I'm easy to find a

1102
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:53,920
Speaker 3: z and only one l on.

1103
00:53:53,920 --> 00:53:58,239
Speaker 2: Will Yeah check him out and uh check me out

1104
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:01,320
Speaker 2: on Blue Sky, and I write, ok, and check out

1105
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:06,479
Speaker 2: our other podcast, Blue Sky. I am all right now, Yeah,

1106
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:08,839
Speaker 2: I'm happy you Actually you liked one of my ship

1107
00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:10,520
Speaker 2: did You're a thing, and people.

1108
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:11,600
Speaker 3: Were very excited about it.

1109
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:12,240
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1110
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 3: I don't have many followers on Blue Sky, but I

1111
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:17,400
Speaker 3: share some really dark, twisted thoughts on there, so you know,

1112
00:54:18,280 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 3: if you're into that, you can find me there too.

1113
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:23,480
Speaker 2: I'm sure watch will cancel himself and watch me cancel

1114
00:54:23,560 --> 00:54:30,919
Speaker 2: myself all on Blue Sky. All right, Well that's it.

1115
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:35,440
Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1116
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:38,160
Speaker 1: For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool

1117
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:42,200
Speaker 1: Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1118
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:45,440
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Behind the

1119
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:49,560
Speaker 1: Bastards is now available on YouTube, new episodes every Wednesday

1120
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:53,320
Speaker 1: and Friday. Subscribe to our channel YouTube dot com slash

1121
00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:55,000
Speaker 1: at Behind the Bastards