Speaker 1: Hey. You know, if you follow me on social media,
Speaker 1: you know that I live on a farm. I got
Speaker 1: a lot of animals. Go it's pigs, horses, miniature horses,
Speaker 1: pack because chicken. What am I forgetting? I think we're
Speaker 1: about to get a couple of tiny little sheet I
Speaker 1: got this place in the eighties, and you know, a
Speaker 1: kid growing up in the city, I just really started
Speaker 1: to connect a lot with animals and with nature, and
Speaker 1: I for some reason, developed this love of horses, and
Speaker 1: that was really what brought me to buy this piece
Speaker 1: of property back in nineteen eighty three. But I find
Speaker 1: that when I start caring for another creature, it really
Speaker 1: helps me to kind of recenter my days. And I
Speaker 1: think that spending time, certainly in lockdown, around living, breathing
Speaker 1: animals and connecting with them was incredibly helpful. And to
Speaker 1: this day, my wife and I will just say, oh, wow,
Speaker 1: you know, we haven't been down to hang out with
Speaker 1: the animals today, and we'll just go and sit there
Speaker 1: and just I don't know, do little it up and
Speaker 1: you know, hang out with them, and it can be
Speaker 1: a very very therapeutic moment. The Fabulous Amanda sayfer It
Speaker 1: is our guest today on the podcast, and she also
Speaker 1: lives on a farm. And I really love this person
Speaker 1: and I love that she is so compassionate for all creatures.
Speaker 1: Apparently not male ducks, however, But a little bit more
Speaker 1: on that later. So if you love animals, lean in
Speaker 1: and listen up. I'm glad you're here, Amanda. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much for being here. It's so good to see you.
Speaker 1: As I've told you multiple times, I admire are you
Speaker 1: so much for your chameleon like work. A lot of
Speaker 1: us are pretty good at doing maybe one thing and
Speaker 1: maybe two, and I'm talking about some of our greatest,
Speaker 1: greatest performers. But you are someone who really, really truly
Speaker 1: does disappear into all sorts of different kinds of parts,
Speaker 1: as well as all sorts of different kinds of genres
Speaker 1: of movie. I mean, you really, your your career has
Speaker 1: been completely unclassified. And I just wondered if when when
Speaker 1: you start out, you're really young, right, and you start
Speaker 1: to do this thing where you're gonna, you know, become
Speaker 1: somebody else, was it in your mind to try to
Speaker 1: have the kind of career, to try to explore the
Speaker 1: different kinds of uh variety of parts that you have
Speaker 1: been able.
Speaker 2: No, it was here. Listen, here's the thing you said.
Speaker 2: Amazing things. I really appreciate all everything that your perspective
Speaker 2: on my acting is really meaningful because you have continued
Speaker 2: to bring any kind of refreshing angle or take to
Speaker 2: any new character. You always find something different to do.
Speaker 2: It's never boring, You're never one saying it's that kind
Speaker 2: of career that like most people want. You're able to
Speaker 2: bend yourself in ways that you know people wish they could,
Speaker 2: and I try to do. And I think the answer
Speaker 2: to that question is that I was. I very deliberately
Speaker 2: wanted to bend myself as much as possible when I
Speaker 2: was younger, so I didn't fit into any mold, or
Speaker 2: I didn't let the industry put me in any mold
Speaker 2: because it was super easy to do to a young
Speaker 2: blonde girl next door. Sure, and then I was like
Speaker 2: and then, but it was totally this movie Chloe that
Speaker 2: I think got people within the industry, producers and actors
Speaker 2: and casting directors to see that I was kind of
Speaker 2: pushing my own boundaries and they were like, okay, And
Speaker 2: that creates trust, maybe not with everybody, but with enough
Speaker 2: people so they can start seeing me in other ways.
Speaker 2: You know, it's a little harder for women, it seems,
Speaker 2: to get out of that box.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think everything is harder for in
Speaker 1: our industry for women. But I also think that you
Speaker 1: make a very good point which a lot of people
Speaker 1: don't really necessarily get unless they happen to choose this life,
Speaker 1: and that is that people really would rather have you
Speaker 1: do the same thing, especially if that thing that you've
Speaker 1: done has been successful. You know, the first time I
Speaker 1: was in a successful movie, they just wanted to find
Speaker 1: pretty much the same movie for me to do again.
Speaker 1: But they weren't sequels. They were just in that same
Speaker 1: sort of pocket and pushing back against that. Sometimes it's
Speaker 1: a couple of things. Number One, it is without even
Speaker 1: knowing it, it's pretty risky, you know, because you're not
Speaker 1: leaning towards the money, really, you know, you're leaning towards
Speaker 1: something that satisfies you creatively. But you know, I think
Speaker 1: that you've really been able to do that. And also,
Speaker 1: as I pointed out, across all kinds of genres, I
Speaker 1: make comedy and musicals and horror and dramas and and
Speaker 1: you know real you know, what do they call rep
Speaker 1: from the headlines type characters and and and all this stuff.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's it really is amazing. Now, is
Speaker 1: there We've probably discussed this before, but is there one
Speaker 1: thing that's at the top of the list when you
Speaker 1: look through that giant pile of scripts that come up,
Speaker 1: uh via email to you just just you don't even
Speaker 1: have enough room in the hard drive for all those PDFs.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just mountains men.
Speaker 1: I mean, is is there one? Is there one? Is it?
Speaker 1: You know, direct, director or star whatever.
Speaker 2: It's director, it's totally director. And if it and if
Speaker 2: it's not, if it's somebody who's very new to the
Speaker 2: industry or new to directing, or at least somebody that
Speaker 2: we've we haven't seen before, it's it's descript. It just
Speaker 2: has to happen. There's got to be something incredibly interesting
Speaker 2: about the character and what the character goes through, even
Speaker 2: if it's just me on my own in a short film.
Speaker 2: Just if if this person has a true vision and
Speaker 2: and not an incredible and incredibly like fascinating story or
Speaker 2: at least grounded or at least realistic story, then I'm in.
Speaker 1: But you do so many other things besides uh, this
Speaker 1: acting stuff. What have you been busy with since we've
Speaker 1: been on strike.
Speaker 2: Well, when the pandemic hit, we were all kind of
Speaker 2: at a standstill in every industry of course, everywhere. So
Speaker 2: my creative brain was still churning out, like fiber art
Speaker 2: as it does because I can't stop. But with fiber art,
Speaker 2: you can only do so much and you're always stuck
Speaker 2: in your little bubble on the couch.
Speaker 1: Or wherever you are, and explain to explain that those
Speaker 1: people that might not know what fiberart is, oh, just.
Speaker 2: Anything you can make with yarn really, yeah, yeah, because
Speaker 2: I've seen you fiberarting on on a step before and
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 1: I didn't even know that there was that debt, that
Speaker 1: that was the thing, anything that could be done with
Speaker 1: y art.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was, I know, I was in a I
Speaker 2: was very deep into weaving while we were working together.
Speaker 2: It's just uh an a knitting, of course, but but
Speaker 2: I needed I my friends and I my friends who
Speaker 2: don't aren't actors, aren't in this business at all. We
Speaker 2: grew up together and so we started this business. That God,
Speaker 2: starting a business is hard, and also doing something to
Speaker 2: create to generate money also feels weird because when you
Speaker 2: I'm usually working with organizations, charities working to generate money
Speaker 2: from investors to donate to a certain cause. And this
Speaker 2: felt different because I'm the cause is our product, and
Speaker 2: so it's very different, and I'm used to using myself
Speaker 2: as a marketing tool to get people to donate to
Speaker 2: these very specific organized war child best friends Inada, and
Speaker 2: I think with starting a business, I was so I mean,
Speaker 2: it was all mine. We started it together, the three
Speaker 2: of us, so we were all founders and we are
Speaker 2: all what we say goes. We're all so inc control
Speaker 2: of what we were building and we really believed in it,
Speaker 2: and so that was just weird. It's kind of a
Speaker 2: new path because you.
Speaker 1: Were out there looking for investors, looking for seed money
Speaker 1: to get going.
Speaker 2: We never did that. We actually kept it all in
Speaker 2: house between us. That was really great. But it's still
Speaker 2: weird to try to get people to buy your product.
Speaker 2: But I do believe in it and it is amazing.
Speaker 2: But it is like I did, I started a business.
Speaker 2: I started a business, and that's what it is.
Speaker 1: And this is make it cute, Make it cute.
Speaker 2: And we have a charitable like fact factor too, like
Speaker 2: it's it's you know, we're trying to we are in
Speaker 2: a sustainable business, and it's really great to network and
Speaker 2: connect with other people that are like minded. And in
Speaker 2: this generation where we're trying to buy less for our kids,
Speaker 2: and when we do buy things, we want to buy
Speaker 2: things that are recycled, and we want to we want
Speaker 2: to be responsible with as consumers because we are, you know,
Speaker 2: we're always going to be in this capitalists sect, so
Speaker 2: why not create something that does less damage to the world.
Speaker 2: And we're doing that, But at the at the core
Speaker 2: of it, I really like designing playhouses.
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, tell us about the product though, because I
Speaker 1: I just I just saw it and it looks really
Speaker 1: super You want one? Sure, I don't have. I don't
Speaker 1: don't need little.
Speaker 2: Kids, I don't think so actually we are going to
Speaker 2: do it. We are going to make a smaller version
Speaker 2: for animals because people are people have been asking us
Speaker 2: and it was always my design and my friends are like, yeah, maybe,
Speaker 2: and I was like, we must because I've got my fin,
Speaker 2: I've got my dog and yeah, it's uh, it's made
Speaker 2: out of cardboard and you can call it corrogate, but
Speaker 2: the layperson says cardboard and people are like, well, our
Speaker 2: kids make stuff out of cardboard. All the time, and
Speaker 2: unfortunately we've got these massive like boats that look like
Speaker 2: crap and don't they don't want to throw them away?
Speaker 2: So why not make something that's incredibly easy to use.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's it folds up so mm hmm. It's
Speaker 2: made from recycled well, cardboard is recycled, has to be
Speaker 2: fifty percent at least.
Speaker 1: And their playhouses, right, and their playhouse.
Speaker 2: You just it's three little pieces. There's no assembly, you
Speaker 2: just I mean you do have to assemble it, but
Speaker 2: it's just three pieces and you just pop it open
Speaker 2: and you put it in and the roof on and
Speaker 2: it you're done.
Speaker 1: So what was the genesis of that idea? I mean, well,
Speaker 1: how did that? What made you even think.
Speaker 2: About in the market place?
Speaker 1: A hole in the marketplace? Do your partners have kids too?
Speaker 2: Yeah, we all have kids.
Speaker 1: It's the same because you have two kids. How old
Speaker 1: are the kids?
Speaker 2: Know, six and a half and three and there's our
Speaker 2: six and a half and four, And we were all
Speaker 2: pregnant with our first the same time, and we all
Speaker 2: like went on vacations together. We've been best friend since
Speaker 2: we were five.
Speaker 1: Oh wow.
Speaker 2: And they all have different experiences like what Maureen was
Speaker 2: a physician's assistant. She still is and quit her job
Speaker 2: when she had kids. She has a very good business
Speaker 2: sales mind and she's also incredibly designed forward and just
Speaker 2: we have similar tastes and we just were like we
Speaker 2: need to we don't, there's no ear and was building
Speaker 2: these playhouses out of all these these refrigerator box and
Speaker 2: there were double wall, which is a box is normally
Speaker 2: like Amazon box. It's like one wall m h. And
Speaker 2: it breaks down easily and it's great. But she was
Speaker 2: building them with extra shingles, and she was painting them
Speaker 2: with ferowe ball colors and everything that we love to
Speaker 2: see in our own homes. And she's like, this is
Speaker 2: where I throw all the toys in at night, and
Speaker 2: this is how I have my zen back with all
Speaker 2: these kids crappy toys. Sorry, it's chunk. A lot of
Speaker 2: it's junk. And and then we were like, this is
Speaker 2: there's nothing like this. There's nothing cute. All the toy
Speaker 2: all the playhouses. If they're cardboard, they're a pain to
Speaker 2: put together and they're not nice looking at all.
Speaker 1: And plus I love that you're not using plastic, because
Speaker 1: you know that's that's one of the tough that's a
Speaker 1: whole other conversation about, you know, our overuse of play
Speaker 1: classic and what's more single use than a playhouse once
Speaker 1: your kid, you know, grows out of it. And that's
Speaker 1: just a lot. That's a lot of that's a lot
Speaker 1: of stuff that's good going to.
Speaker 2: Never break down and it doesn't break down. There's a
Speaker 2: lot of like different materials that aren't plastic, you know
Speaker 2: those those there's canvas tents and stuff it takes at
Speaker 2: least an hour to put together there. Some of them
Speaker 2: are insanely expensive. The kid craft stuff is great for outside.
Speaker 2: Our product is not outside. But it's just like it
Speaker 2: was a giant hole in the market. We're like, I
Speaker 2: don't want to build. I don't want to build that.
Speaker 2: I want that. I don't want to build. I want
Speaker 2: someone to do it for me. And I don't want
Speaker 2: to have any butt clenching when I'm at the checkout
Speaker 2: in online. I just because we were doing market research too.
Speaker 2: When we started our business. We had to buy all
Speaker 2: of them, and I mean it was it was stressful
Speaker 2: because we knew we needed to do we but we
Speaker 2: needed help making it. We needed engineers, we needed hard
Speaker 2: woork companies, people that work with this material. We did
Speaker 2: it all our own and then we met somebody who
Speaker 2: this Robert, who actually created Green Toys. Him and his
Speaker 2: partner created Green Toys, which is all those really cool
Speaker 2: trucks made out of plastic milk jugs. But so it
Speaker 2: looks like plastic, it's durable like plastic, but it's not.
Speaker 2: It's made out of recycled material and it blew up.
Speaker 2: He sold his company. Now he's an employee of he's
Speaker 2: a consult and he helps with our finances. But I'm
Speaker 2: telling you, Kevin, business is hard. We're finally finally starting
Speaker 2: to talk to investors, like I can't do it anymore.
Speaker 2: We have a lot of people interested. We've sent it
Speaker 2: out to so many people. We you know, we did
Speaker 2: quality control, We've met everybody. We work within the facilities
Speaker 2: and on the East Coast. It's expensive to build things
Speaker 2: in the US. It's just keeping things sustainable is expensive.
Speaker 2: So it's like, I don't know if this business is
Speaker 2: you know, to make money as much as it is
Speaker 2: to create something that we love. Hopefully one day that's great.
Speaker 1: Tell me how's your music?
Speaker 2: Thank God, I'm working.
Speaker 1: Have you been are you doing anything?
Speaker 2: Are you doing any.
Speaker 1: No, I'm out with the band. We're playing a lot
Speaker 1: of shows.
Speaker 2: This fall around the country or like everywhere, all.
Speaker 1: Around the country. Yeah, we're on our way. What's our
Speaker 1: next run? I think our next roun is maybe Texas
Speaker 1: and then we're going down south and we were just
Speaker 1: up in Maine a couple of days ago. So yeah,
Speaker 1: we're actually playing a lot. And the weird thing about
Speaker 1: being in a band is that the gigs get booked,
Speaker 1: Like oftentimes weigh in advance of when my acting gigs
Speaker 1: get booked. So I'm always a little bit stressed out
Speaker 1: because I say, well, if something's going to come through,
Speaker 1: then we're going to have to you know, cancel a
Speaker 1: show or or you know, or or or boot it
Speaker 1: down the road. And it's or I'll have to be
Speaker 1: flying from some place to another place to another place
Speaker 1: in a place ranged all bills. And because of the strike, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's been We've been just able to
Speaker 1: play all these shows and it's been great. I feel
Speaker 1: very grateful to have that. I think both of us,
Speaker 1: Kier and I have kind of realized during this strike
Speaker 1: that we we're for better or for worse, we're kind
Speaker 1: of workaholics. You know, we really do like to work,
Speaker 1: and so it's been a it's been a whole.
Speaker 2: That's the thing. We create all these other worlds for
Speaker 2: ourselves on purpose or not on purpose, and because we're
Speaker 2: we want to be creating. And I mean, yes, we're
Speaker 2: artists and we're actors, but we're artists. So it's like
Speaker 2: that's many things, like you have you traveling with your
Speaker 2: band and being able to finally say yes, are you availble, yes,
Speaker 2: can you do yes? Instead of trying to to fit in,
Speaker 2: try to do it all because there's only enough time
Speaker 2: in the day. And so right now, yeah, I feel
Speaker 2: privileged too that we're on strike for a great reason.
Speaker 2: We got to keep negotiating. We got to sort this
Speaker 2: out sooner than later because people need to work.
Speaker 1: They definitely did. What's the thing on the stage?
Speaker 2: Speaking for fillings, it's Ashlma Louise the musical, and I've
Speaker 2: been working on its almost.
Speaker 1: I mean, oh, that is so exciting.
Speaker 2: But am I ready for that? Am I really? Is
Speaker 2: my body really ready to do to the show?
Speaker 1: Of course it is?
Speaker 2: Is it though? Because I did that and it was
Speaker 2: really great and it was hard, and I didn't have
Speaker 2: any kids and I didn't live here on a farm
Speaker 2: full time.
Speaker 1: You were with Tommy with your husband, right, were you
Speaker 1: guys in the play?
Speaker 2: Yeah, but this is music and this is Broadway, so
Speaker 2: there was no pressure to do off Broadway and no music.
Speaker 2: This is music, him singing. If I lose my voice,
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna be able to drink as much as
Speaker 2: I like to drink. There is that, And the kids
Speaker 2: don't go to school in the city. So it's just
Speaker 2: am I ready for it? But I keep thinking it's
Speaker 2: a dream come true. Every challenge has a rainbow at
Speaker 2: the end of it, and it's gonna be amazing. I'm god,
Speaker 2: I'm so sicking.
Speaker 1: Do do you love love love the music that's in
Speaker 1: the show. That's great? And so do you so you
Speaker 1: have all you have all the songs now so you
Speaker 1: can you can literally work on them all the time. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Because we did well, they're probably changing because we only
Speaker 2: did two workshops. Have you ever done a musual?
Speaker 1: Never done a musical?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 1: I did one music. We did one show where it
Speaker 1: was about the Yale Whiff and Proofs, which was a
Speaker 1: is the a cappella a cappella group at Yale? Yeah,
Speaker 1: we did a play probably in the Know the eighties
Speaker 1: or something like that in New York off Broaby and
Speaker 1: so they were singing in that, but it was definitely
Speaker 1: not a musical. So so you have the songs. Is
Speaker 1: it the world party? Are you? Are you feeling like
Speaker 1: you really want to strengthen your voice? Is that the
Speaker 1: thing to make it through the.
Speaker 2: Hos yamina and need to stand or whatever. I also
Speaker 2: need to find my middle voice again. I mean I've
Speaker 2: been training in a different way with different music for
Speaker 2: so long for fun, and then now I'm just getting
Speaker 2: back to like the OZ because there's a lot of
Speaker 2: OZ and I hate singing. You know, we sing, we
Speaker 2: go in our middle voice and head voice. It's like
Speaker 2: oohs and ease are so easy. So I work out
Speaker 2: OS's is.
Speaker 1: It? Do this? Are the songs? Do they kind of
Speaker 1: sit in the pop rock world or are they more
Speaker 1: traditional Broadway o case?
Speaker 2: So it's like all rock. I'm flok. It's it's my dream.
Speaker 2: It's like it couldn't be better.
Speaker 1: Oh that's so great.
Speaker 2: Because we had just Tommy and I had just seen
Speaker 2: Nico Case at levon Helm Studios. Have you played there before?
Speaker 1: Yeah? We played there. Yeah, we played with with Levon
Speaker 1: when he was alive the Midnight Ramble. Yeah, it was
Speaker 1: quite an experience, you know. It's yeah, it's a great
Speaker 1: place for people that don't know. Levon had this barn
Speaker 1: up up in in Woodstock and uh, yeah that he built,
Speaker 1: and you know, you got we get the opportunity to bands,
Speaker 1: We get the opportunity to go and essentially play in
Speaker 1: this in this barn to a small but great crowd,
Speaker 1: amazing sound, and then uh, you're you're kind of opening
Speaker 1: for Levon. In this case, it was Levon and and
Speaker 1: Larry Campbell and a bunch of great players and and
Speaker 1: and then at the end of it you get asked
Speaker 1: to sit in and it was such a great experience.
Speaker 1: He's one of my favorite drummers. And I got to
Speaker 1: sit sort of like on the lean against this radiator
Speaker 1: that's against the wall behind him and just and watch
Speaker 1: his amazing left hand and the stuff that his left
Speaker 1: hand was doing. And it was a it was a
Speaker 1: great night, great night for me. I actually acted with him,
Speaker 1: uh a few years ago, many many years ago, Uh,
Speaker 1: in a movie and uh so we we kind of
Speaker 1: knew each other already, but that was great anyway. So
Speaker 1: so what did you you saw? What did you see
Speaker 1: up there? At that point?
Speaker 2: We saw yeah, and it was incredible. And it was
Speaker 2: our first time at Lewand Hill Studio and we sat
Speaker 2: there and it was just it was Tommy's my husband
Speaker 2: is the biggest Ego caes fan, like of all time.
Speaker 2: For his birthday, I had his daughter to learn our daughter, sorry,
Speaker 2: his daughter, my daughter, our daughter. I had her learn
Speaker 2: I wish I was the Moon tonight and she learned
Speaker 2: the entire thing and and have and and and that's
Speaker 2: like one of her best songs. And the lyrics are
Speaker 2: crazy for six year olds to be singing amazing. But
Speaker 2: I was working. I was doing my second workshop with
Speaker 2: Nico at the time. I was teaching my daughter the
Speaker 2: song and she listened. I showed her the video of
Speaker 2: her practicing, and she was just so alown away and
Speaker 2: she was like, are you trying to kill him? And
Speaker 2: I was like, he's you know, it's her. Her voice
Speaker 2: speaks to him and me and many people. It made
Speaker 2: people feel safer in the world. Nico cases like a treasure,
Speaker 2: a national treasure, and the fact that she's composing all
Speaker 2: of the music for this show is just so kismet
Speaker 2: and it makes me feel like this was like sent
Speaker 2: to me from God because I you know, I can
Speaker 2: sing it, and I feel connected to it in a
Speaker 2: way that I don't feel for with a lot of people,
Speaker 2: a lot of musicians. And also I get to act
Speaker 2: and I get to play Thelma, and that it gets
Speaker 2: to work with friends, you know, I Trip Coleman's directing
Speaker 2: and beautiful theater director. Yeah, and so many wonderful people
Speaker 2: are part of it, and Mandy who was ran Williamstown
Speaker 2: for a long time who I'm friends with, and it's
Speaker 2: just like such a perfect little pocket of art for
Speaker 2: me to now fulfill.
Speaker 1: Okay, I wait to see that.
Speaker 2: When do you go into rehearsal, I think, well, we
Speaker 2: have our third workshop in November, which is the two
Speaker 2: week workshops. We do all the songs again and everything again,
Speaker 2: and then we have like most of our cast, and
Speaker 2: then I think we're I think we're hoping for January
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five because we need this next year to
Speaker 2: I mean, dude, putting things something new, putting new musical
Speaker 2: out on Broadways.
Speaker 1: Apparently, yes it is.
Speaker 2: I have digests.
Speaker 1: Well that's so exciting. Now I want to just talk
Speaker 1: about your you grew up in Allentown, and I know
Speaker 1: that you you just have this great, great, deep love
Speaker 1: for animals. Did you have animals or ride horses when
Speaker 1: you were younger or any of that? Now you didn't.
Speaker 1: You didn't grow up on a farm in Alaison. So
Speaker 1: what do you think it came out of?
Speaker 2: I don't. I truly don't know.
Speaker 1: You're in a barn, right, animals. Yeah, the barn.
Speaker 2: This is the like really this was an old stable
Speaker 2: obviously we made into these two rooms are guests room.
Speaker 2: This is like the middle barn, the barn barn that's
Speaker 2: actually over there. You can kind of see it right
Speaker 2: over right over there. That's like the barn, and that's
Speaker 2: you know, where where all the good stuff happens, where
Speaker 2: all the sick animals come in when they need help.
Speaker 1: So you take animals in. I didn't. I didn't realize that.
Speaker 2: You take for instance, we're getting two new horses, and
Speaker 2: the fencing guys are here right now to fix the
Speaker 2: third paddock, and we only have three, and we'll only
Speaker 2: ever have three and we always will always you know,
Speaker 2: be a capacity. But everybody in the town kind of
Speaker 2: knows what our deal is. We'll take it animals who
Speaker 2: are very old and they all pretty much pass away
Speaker 2: here m so it's a sanctuary essentially, okay, and we
Speaker 2: get retire So this retire he's coming. He's thirty years old.
Speaker 2: He's coming on this week this weekend, once the fencing's done,
Speaker 2: and he's coming with a friend.
Speaker 1: Of horse, a horse. Sorry, yeah, okay, because you have
Speaker 1: you have some other stuff too, you have got goats.
Speaker 2: We mainly it's like we can have as many many
Speaker 2: horses as anyone can have because we have room. We
Speaker 2: have a retiree, a trail horse who's who's thirty and
Speaker 2: he's he was going to go off to auctions, so
Speaker 2: we were just like I'm here and then his friend.
Speaker 2: But his friend is not retired. He's ten years old
Speaker 2: and he's in great health. Oh good, So that's not
Speaker 2: that's not normal. We don't normally take in people who
Speaker 2: are in great health.
Speaker 1: Do you get up on him ever? I mean, they
Speaker 1: sound like they're not they're they're they're not sound.
Speaker 2: But but no, this guy is going to be the
Speaker 2: first sound. Oh it's thirty year olds of the thirty
Speaker 2: year old the ten year old. I wouldn't read on
Speaker 2: because I'm not experienced enough. But she can be broken,
Speaker 2: and he will be one day, hopefully. But the thirty
Speaker 2: year old is the one that I'm gonna put my
Speaker 2: kids on.
Speaker 1: Oh nice, that's awesome. That's very exciting. And you have
Speaker 1: and you have goats and your beloved dog.
Speaker 2: I love a dog. And ducks. We've just taken in
Speaker 2: two more ducks. Ducks are real pain. I don't recommend it.
Speaker 2: Do anybody do you have ducks?
Speaker 1: No chickens, but no ducks.
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: No, ducks.
Speaker 2: Don't do it. Don't do it. It's hard, it's there.
Speaker 2: They're very very vicious to each other.
Speaker 1: Wow, okay, I didn't know that about ducks. Well, I
Speaker 1: think that's a good segue. Is Julie available to hop
Speaker 1: on with us?
Speaker 2: Hey?
Speaker 1: Why Julie? You guys know each other?
Speaker 4: Yes we do.
Speaker 1: There's Julie Castle from Best Friends Animal Society. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much for joining Amanda and me.
Speaker 3: It's an honor to be here, big big fans of
Speaker 3: both of your work.
Speaker 1: Thanks you too. You know I was I was reading
Speaker 1: up about you and have just what I find to
Speaker 1: be pretty fascinating journey into what it is that you do.
Speaker 1: So maybe just explain that it's almost like you got
Speaker 1: You're on your way to law school and got a
Speaker 1: flat tire or something and ended up going into animal rescue.
Speaker 2: But UH, talk to me about how it happens, you know.
Speaker 3: I think it's a measure of really, I don't want
Speaker 3: to sound too wu, but it's a measure of really
Speaker 3: being up into the universe, you know. And I was
Speaker 3: I just graduated from college, and my friends and I
Speaker 3: knew it was our last hurrah before graduate school.
Speaker 4: So we decided to take a trip to Mexico.
Speaker 3: And at the time, I drove this really old nineteen
Speaker 3: seventy nine Dodge Colt and it had a different color panel.
Speaker 3: Every panel was a different color because I'd been in
Speaker 3: so many accidents. And we stay down there until we
Speaker 3: ran out of money, and we realized that we had
Speaker 3: just enough for a candy bar each and gas to
Speaker 3: drive eighteen hundred miles back home, and we decided to
Speaker 3: drive straight through. And my friend who was with us,
Speaker 3: she was a huge animal fan, and she'd been donating
Speaker 3: to this small sanctuary in southern Utah. She begged us
Speaker 3: to stay, to stop at this sanctuary. None of us
Speaker 3: wanted to. We hadn't showered, we retired. We were fighting.
Speaker 3: Finally we agreed to stop, just to kind of shut
Speaker 3: her up, and we pulled into the magnificent canyon, Red
Speaker 3: Rock Canyon, that in any other state would be a
Speaker 3: National park. And I was so taken by the spiritual nature.
Speaker 4: Of the place.
Speaker 3: I was taken by the founders, and I was taken
Speaker 3: by the the ethic of no kill.
Speaker 4: I'd never heard of it before.
Speaker 1: And well, maybe you could just explain to us what
Speaker 1: that means.
Speaker 3: No yeah, no kill is really it's a philosophy. It's
Speaker 3: that every life has intrinsic value, and every life that
Speaker 3: can be saved should be saved. In pure data terms,
Speaker 3: it means we know that about ninety percent of all
Speaker 3: the animals that in our America's shelter system are savable,
Speaker 3: and that ten percent sometimes they need to be humanely euthanized,
Speaker 3: either they they're too sick or injured, or maybe their
Speaker 3: behavior issues are too severe. And so that that's the
Speaker 3: pure definition of no kill. But for us, it really
Speaker 3: is a philosophy.
Speaker 1: And so you you walked, you saw this animal sanctuary,
Speaker 1: and you decided to just that your life would take
Speaker 1: a different path.
Speaker 3: I saw this animal sanctuary, We pulled out of the sanctuary,
Speaker 3: and I stopped the car at a gas station and
Speaker 3: put a couple of quarters in the pay phone and
Speaker 3: called my dad and said, Hey, I'm not going to
Speaker 3: the University of Virginia law school.
Speaker 4: I'm a canab Utah.
Speaker 1: And I how did how did that? How did that?
Speaker 4: Oh? He was so happy for me. No, he was.
Speaker 3: Okay, okay, I you know, honestly, I don't think he
Speaker 3: got over it for a decade. Wow. We were really
Speaker 3: it was really hard scrabble stuff in those early days.
Speaker 3: You know. It was I was making one hundred and
Speaker 3: eighty three dollars every two weeks. You know, we didn't
Speaker 3: really have an h R department.
Speaker 1: And that was in canep.
Speaker 3: That was in cannap And you were expected to do
Speaker 3: whatever it took just to keep the lights on and
Speaker 3: keep the animals fed.
Speaker 4: And so it was tough. It was really. I mean
Speaker 4: it's still tough in its own way.
Speaker 1: But back then, were the majority of the animals horses.
Speaker 3: No, we had about seven hundred dogs, seven hundred dogs,
Speaker 3: five hundred cats.
Speaker 1: How do you keep I can't imagine seven hundred dogs.
Speaker 4: Oh, it was crazy.
Speaker 3: So I was employee number seventeen, so there were seventeen
Speaker 3: employees and then the founders. There were about twenty founders,
Speaker 3: so all told, are about forty people taking care of
Speaker 3: this massive sanctuary. You know, the acreage back then was
Speaker 3: about three thousand acres.
Speaker 1: God, So I've been to caneb and I'm I'm we're here.
Speaker 1: You have a pizza joint? Oh yeah, yeah, that I
Speaker 1: want to go to. But it's hard for me to
Speaker 1: imagine that there's that many animals even around there. It's
Speaker 1: it's it's not a very heavily populated part of the world.
Speaker 4: No, it's not.
Speaker 3: A cannab is one of the most sparsely populated places
Speaker 3: in America. So we knew social distancing before it became
Speaker 3: a thing.
Speaker 1: A We are so thrilled to share that. Best Friends
Speaker 1: Animal Society is partnering with Warner Brothers Discovery for the
Speaker 1: twentieth anniversary Puppy Bowl to help animals find the loving
Speaker 1: home and match donations to cover adoption fees for their
Speaker 1: pet life saving centers nationwide. From February seventh to the fourteenth,
Speaker 1: All you gotta do is text puppy, that's puppy to
Speaker 1: seven zero seven zero seven zero or head to puppybowl
Speaker 1: dot com to donate to double your impact, or find
Speaker 1: a shelter near you. Watch Puppy Bowl on Animal Planet
Speaker 1: at Sunday, February eleventh, at two pm Eastern time eleven
Speaker 1: am Pacific time.
Speaker 3: We've got parrots and bunnies and pigs and horses, and
Speaker 3: we have a whole wildlife department where we see golden
Speaker 3: eagles and bald eagles and hawks and deer and bob
Speaker 3: cad and all sorts of things.
Speaker 1: And what do you think about men and I were
Speaker 1: speaking about her desire. I don't know how this works
Speaker 1: to to actually kind of take her own property and
Speaker 1: try to make it and try to use it as Obviously,
Speaker 1: I don't think you're going to be able to fit
Speaker 1: that many dogs at your place, will you, But just
Speaker 1: try to use it as a you know, a sanctuary
Speaker 1: is is that something that you can that people can
Speaker 1: actually look into doing and that you can help them
Speaker 1: with or or you know, navigating you were talking about
Speaker 1: navigating the governmental rules around that and I'm curious about that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have a whole course on that how to
Speaker 3: start Wow amazing sanctuary where we go through all that
Speaker 3: for people, you know, how to get your how to
Speaker 3: register for a five LLO and C three status, what
Speaker 3: legal support you need, what you're operating budget should look like,
Speaker 3: basic animal care. We go through the whole thing and
Speaker 3: we get a lot of people that have come through
Speaker 3: that course over the years. We've been doing it for
Speaker 3: about thirty years, and our whole premise is just to
Speaker 3: be generous, generous with our experience, with our knowledge, with.
Speaker 4: The success that we've had.
Speaker 3: We really really believe that passing that along to other
Speaker 3: organizations and people, it just makes this community stronger as.
Speaker 2: Environing people to like, if they want to, if they
Speaker 2: really want to do this, take animals in or at
Speaker 2: least advocating for animals at any at any cost, like
Speaker 2: just to get people just to get it on their
Speaker 2: minds to know that they can do that because everybody
Speaker 2: can advocate for what they believe in, and especially animals
Speaker 2: because they don't have voices. It's just like, I love
Speaker 2: that you're teaching people how to how to save animals,
Speaker 2: like physically saved them too, and bring them into their homes.
Speaker 2: It's like fostering is Fostering is like one of the
Speaker 2: most incredible things that I've I can that humans can
Speaker 2: do because they take them in until they can find homes.
Speaker 2: And I think that's amazing too, Like you get people
Speaker 2: to really foster if they can't commit to these animals,
Speaker 2: they foster them, but then they also have to get
Speaker 2: rid of them and send them away to their forever home.
Speaker 2: And that's it's like the most selfless thing to me
Speaker 2: that I feel like that you can do. And you
Speaker 2: guys are so good at advocating for that too.
Speaker 1: Do people come to actually come to you and adopt
Speaker 1: off off of the best friends, Yeah.
Speaker 3: They do. And our sanctuary holds a really special place
Speaker 3: because it really is the place where most animals that
Speaker 3: come here and need that extra lover or attention, extra
Speaker 3: medical care, extra special needs. But we've got life saving
Speaker 3: centers all over the country.
Speaker 4: Because okay, I see broader goal is.
Speaker 3: To end killing of shelter pets five and so the
Speaker 3: bulk of our adoptions take place in one of those
Speaker 3: centers or through our network partners, about forty four hundred now.
Speaker 1: So and do you do it also online that people
Speaker 1: go and look look for look at animals online and
Speaker 1: come from other places, because like you said to me,
Speaker 1: there's so few people in Cannab for instance, that you
Speaker 1: know or or or do most of the animals and
Speaker 1: Cannab just kind of stay there.
Speaker 3: No, No, it's like destination location for people.
Speaker 1: So I want to go. I really will not that
Speaker 1: no I need, I don't need any more animals, but
Speaker 1: I would like to go. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's crazy how many see it online, see
Speaker 3: an animal that what they want to meet, and they
Speaker 3: travel all the way out to Canab fall in lot
Speaker 3: have a new family member.
Speaker 1: I want to ask you both something that man that
Speaker 1: we can start with you and okay, I'll give you.
Speaker 1: I'll give you example. I'm the youngest of six, and
Speaker 1: to me, this is a really this really is kind
Speaker 1: of a head scratcher for me. With all of my
Speaker 1: brothers and sisters, the desire to uh be around animals,
Speaker 1: be comfortable with animals, have animals. It goes from I
Speaker 1: don't want to ever see any animals in my life
Speaker 1: to a complete obsession with one of my sisters. You know,
Speaker 1: has Has has always had multiple dogs, sometimes for at
Speaker 1: a time, and is just you know, obsessed.
Speaker 2: With her dogs.
Speaker 1: And I'm just wondering, I mean, because both of you
Speaker 1: actually clearly care deeply about you know these creatures. What
Speaker 1: do you think it is that makes somebody feel that
Speaker 1: way about them or not? Because I can't figure it
Speaker 1: out for myself, and I can't figure it out for
Speaker 1: the people in my family.
Speaker 2: It's almost like it feels like Nature talks through animals
Speaker 2: more than they do human more than it does humans,
Speaker 2: I guess, because animals are simpler and it's easier to trust.
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe there's just that, maybe you feel closer to
Speaker 2: God with them. For me, I feel I feel closer
Speaker 2: to nature. I feel like the energy from an animal
Speaker 2: gives me a sense of belonging in the world. I don't.
Speaker 2: I'm I still can't make sense of it, so I
Speaker 2: can't really answer your question. I just know how I
Speaker 2: feel when I'm around them, and how I feel when
Speaker 2: they're hurt, And I think that they never would. They
Speaker 2: just don't they need our help. They don't deserve it.
Speaker 2: They don't to see an animal and pain. It's just
Speaker 2: like I have to interview. You have to intervene because
Speaker 2: they need they most neatly need it. It's up to them,
Speaker 2: I guess. But if, like especially if you can, you know,
Speaker 2: intervene and and help them, you should. But it's just
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know. I just feel I
Speaker 2: feel like I'm more fulfilled. Maybe it's just like a
Speaker 2: like a selfish need, but also like there's a symbiosis happening,
Speaker 2: you know, when I'm in the mornings, when I go
Speaker 2: out and feed. It's just even if the mini is
Speaker 2: trying to kick me, I can't fault them for any
Speaker 2: They're just innocent kick you. That's just the law. And
Speaker 2: the guy he's he's cut off really hard life and
Speaker 2: it's not his fault. So it's just like I have
Speaker 2: to be careful around him, you know. And it yeah,
Speaker 2: he really whips. He's very no but they couldn't walk
Speaker 2: when they got here, so they It's just like there's
Speaker 2: just something so incredible. And you know, Julie, you like
Speaker 2: the impact that you had for like millions of them.
Speaker 2: It's just like you, you know, there's a spiritual level
Speaker 2: to carry for animals and being around them, being in
Speaker 2: their presence that like really just uh, how about for you, Julian.
Speaker 3: You know, I mean I feel like it's almost some
Speaker 3: of it, I think is your approximate location to animals
Speaker 3: growing up, and I think the younger you're exposed.
Speaker 4: The younger you're exposed.
Speaker 3: The the more quickly that develops.
Speaker 4: It's almost like a sixth sense.
Speaker 3: And you know, you hear people talk about developing that
Speaker 3: sixth sense. I think with animals that bond is so
Speaker 3: powerful once you experience it, because it's almost on a
Speaker 3: different plane. To me, it's like there's no judgment, there's
Speaker 3: no These are special beings that we inhabit the earth
Speaker 3: with and for us to think that somehow.
Speaker 4: We're the.
Speaker 3: You know, we are the elevated being on this planet,
Speaker 3: I think for obvious reasons, you know, we gravitate toward that.
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, it's quite arrogant
Speaker 3: to place ourselves on this different level when the reality
Speaker 3: is we are all connected.
Speaker 1: You you have a goal in twenty twenty five. Can
Speaker 1: you talk to us about that?
Speaker 4: Ah?
Speaker 3: It's so like this is this is what gets me
Speaker 3: up in the morning. You know, when you think these
Speaker 3: founders that started this organization in this sanctuary in the
Speaker 3: middle of nowhere really smart people, and they just ask
Speaker 3: the simple question, why why is a society have we
Speaker 3: chosen to round up animals, put them in a shelter
Speaker 3: and exterminate them. It's just such a The practice was crazy,
Speaker 3: and you know, it's something that had been going on
Speaker 3: for one hundred and ten years by the time they
Speaker 3: rolled around, and so their idea was so radical and novel,
Speaker 3: but so simple and so so I can't even imagine
Speaker 3: that today. Because back then the estimation was seventeen to
Speaker 3: twenty million animals were dying every day in Americas shelters.
Speaker 3: We have gotten numbered down to three hundred and eighty
Speaker 3: five thousand.
Speaker 1: That's oh my wow, that's increasible.
Speaker 3: To think about a lot of these founders are still
Speaker 3: alive and active in the organization. And to imagine that
Speaker 3: you could bookend actually changing the world in your lifetime
Speaker 3: starting this movement and then seeing it kind of you know,
Speaker 3: get across the finish line.
Speaker 4: I just marvel at that for real.
Speaker 3: And so you think, okay, there's three hundred and eighty
Speaker 3: thousand animals that are still dying. That's a thousand a
Speaker 3: day roughly, it's a lot. It's like forty three an
Speaker 3: hour or something.
Speaker 2: And how do you decide who goes and whose days.
Speaker 2: It's just like I can't imagine being that position. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, that's what needs to happen, Like, how does
Speaker 2: it get that bad because there's just no room.
Speaker 3: It's a combination of factors. You know, some of these
Speaker 3: shelters that we work with, we worked with one in
Speaker 3: a fairly decently sized city.
Speaker 4: This was right before COVID.
Speaker 3: We we have programs all over the country.
Speaker 4: We walked into the shelter.
Speaker 3: Thirty thousand animals were coming in every year, twenty six
Speaker 3: thousand were dying. And within a year and a half
Speaker 3: we had taken that shelter from saving four thousand lives
Speaker 3: a year to completely getting them to ninety percent. And
Speaker 3: they have never gone back. And that's the beautiful thing.
Speaker 3: It's a combination of letting the public public know you're
Speaker 3: there really these animals, the public. Because seventeen million people
Speaker 3: are going to get a pet this year, we know
Speaker 3: that for a fact, YAP that del alta between seventeen
Speaker 3: million and three hundred and eighty five.
Speaker 4: This is not rocket.
Speaker 3: Science, like we're talking about putting people on Mars and
Speaker 3: we can't figure this out.
Speaker 4: There's something.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that's a that's a fascinating statistic. Is there
Speaker 1: a some place that people can go either to learn
Speaker 1: about the work you're doing or to find to find
Speaker 1: an animal. You know, it's this is this is this
Speaker 1: is the moment for the call to action.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got two years left to solve this. We're
Speaker 3: all we're all in, we're all working very hard. You
Speaker 3: can go to best Friends dot org. There's so many
Speaker 3: different ways to get involved. Amand dimension fostering which immediately
Speaker 3: saves a life. That we have an action team that
Speaker 3: helps locally. We've got a network of rescues and shelters
Speaker 3: that's forty four hundred strong that we support every single day,
Speaker 3: and that you know, we hope others support through volunteering
Speaker 3: and donating.
Speaker 4: But you can go on our website.
Speaker 3: You can see all of our adoptable animals, and there's
Speaker 3: a lot of different ways you can get involved, even
Speaker 3: if you don't have the time.
Speaker 1: That's awesome, that's awesome. I love what you're doing, you know,
Speaker 1: on behalf of let's say Doc and Norma, Jean and
Speaker 1: Jolene and Apollo and June and Johnny and Lucy and
Speaker 1: Little Ricky and Daisy Junior and Sharona and Kate, whom
Speaker 1: I forget thank you. They just they wanted me to
Speaker 1: say thank you for all all that what you're doing
Speaker 1: it's it's it's really amazing. Thank you, and both of
Speaker 1: you keep up the good work. Amanda. I hope that
Speaker 1: you can continue to to uh, you know, to work
Speaker 1: this this this angle of taking in animals that need help.
Speaker 2: I've I've so enjoyed my time with best friends. They
Speaker 2: always it's always such a celebration set of I mean,
Speaker 2: you look at the numbers and they're harrowing and it's
Speaker 2: really upsetting to know, yes, it's three hundreds, it's it's
Speaker 2: less than half are being used nice, but it's still
Speaker 2: so many. Like it's not ignoring that fact, but it's
Speaker 2: also celebrating the fact that we're you're going in the
Speaker 2: right direction and you are and nobody's stopping. So I'm
Speaker 2: I'm through. I mean, it's coming up and it's every day.
Speaker 2: I I know how how how much you love your job,
Speaker 2: and it really rubs off.
Speaker 3: Well, thank you and we're grateful for your support, and
Speaker 3: you know, it's uh, I think there's an authenticity to
Speaker 3: you that that I really gravitate toward.
Speaker 4: I know a lot of people do.
Speaker 3: There's just this, you know, really special message that you
Speaker 3: have to deliver about just about anything you talk about.
Speaker 4: So it's very.
Speaker 3: Cool too, you know, have both of you to support
Speaker 3: this cause so deeply, and I'm super grateful, and I
Speaker 3: think it's a at the end of the day, it
Speaker 3: really is a noble cause. Like it's it's it's one
Speaker 3: of those that you know, there's no there's no divide
Speaker 3: to it. Really, there's no politics around it in terms
Speaker 3: of you know, when eighty percent of Americans have a
Speaker 3: pet at home, you know, it's a it's one of
Speaker 3: those rare causes that so many different people get behind.
Speaker 4: And it's just.
Speaker 3: A true honor for me to do this, Like I
Speaker 3: feel like this work is not I didn't choose this,
Speaker 3: this is it's like what you said earlier, I kind
Speaker 3: of just walked into this and and I feel like
Speaker 3: I'm really not it's it's it's at some other hand whatever.
Speaker 4: May be.
Speaker 1: Awesome. Well, thank you guys so much for being here.
Speaker 1: I really do appreciate your time.
Speaker 2: It's so nice to your employee.
Speaker 1: That's your face and yeah, back at you, back at you.
Speaker 1: And I think it's very very fitting that you did
Speaker 1: this interview from a.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, thanks for listening to another episode Six Degrees
Speaker 1: with Kevin Bacon, and if you want to learn more
Speaker 1: about the Best Friends Animal Society and all that incredible
Speaker 1: work that they are up to, head to their website
Speaker 1: Bestfriends dot org. That's best Friends dot org. You can
Speaker 1: find all the links in our show notes, and if
Speaker 1: you like it, you're here. Make sure you subscribe to
Speaker 1: the show and tune in to the rest of our episodes.
Speaker 1: You can find six Degrees with Kevin Bacon on iHeartRadio,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. See you
Speaker 1: next time.
Speaker 3: If you are inspired by today's episode, please join us
Speaker 3: in supporting SixDegrees dot org by texting the word Bacon
Speaker 3: to seven zero seven zero seven zero.
Speaker 2: Your gift empowers us to continue to produce programs that
Speaker 2: highlight the incredible work of everyday heroes, while also enabling
Speaker 2: us to provide essential resources to those that need it
Speaker 2: the most. Once again, text b a c O N
Speaker 2: to seven zero seven zero seven zero or visit six
Speaker 2: degrees dot org to learn more.