WEBVTT - Desperately Devoted to Executive Producer, Michael Edelstein 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:05.200 Welcome to desperately devoted Think of us as your favorite 0:00:05.200 --> 0:00:08.520 neighbors as we chat about life and relationships, all. 0:00:08.440 --> 0:00:11.719 While we revisit the iconic show Desperate Housewives together. 0:00:11.880 --> 0:00:15.080 I'm Terry Hatcher, I'm Andrea Bowen, and I'm Emerson Tenny. 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:19.639 You know how when you connect with an old friend 0:00:19.680 --> 0:00:21.479 that you haven't seen in a long time, and you 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:23.480 have that feeling of where you just pick up right 0:00:23.480 --> 0:00:26.080 where you left off and the best, it's the best feeling. 0:00:26.239 --> 0:00:30.840 So today I have that feeling because and you super 0:00:30.880 --> 0:00:33.519 Desperate Housewives fans, you are going to be so excited 0:00:33.560 --> 0:00:36.680 for this. We have a guest here, a very special guest, 0:00:37.320 --> 0:00:40.159 somebody who you might not immediately recognize their name, but 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:44.279 you will recognize the influence that this person had on 0:00:44.320 --> 0:00:48.879 the show because it was everywhere from the cast to 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:52.400 the music, from the way it looked on screen, I mean, 0:00:52.880 --> 0:00:56.080 from dealing with the network stuff that went on behind 0:00:56.200 --> 0:00:59.800 the scenes that nobody's ever heard of. This person was 0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:02.920 one of two people that helped it get there and 0:01:03.040 --> 0:01:06.319 keep it there, and he was one of the two 0:01:06.400 --> 0:01:09.280 executive producers that had everything to do with getting this 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:13.080 show made. Of course, everyone's familiar with Mark Cherry, right, 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:15.959 So it's about time that you get to meet the 0:01:16.000 --> 0:01:19.360 man behind so much else that happened on this show. 0:01:19.800 --> 0:01:22.160 He has been my friend from the beginning, and I've 0:01:22.200 --> 0:01:26.480 missed him desperately. He went off after the first season 0:01:26.840 --> 0:01:30.679 to be the president of NBC Universal International Studios, which, 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:33.640 by the way, produced a little show called Downton Abbey, 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:38.360 among other great shows. So we are so very desperately 0:01:38.400 --> 0:01:41.400 devoted to him for being here with us today bringing 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:47.000 his unique and encompassing perspective. Everyone please go crazy and welcome. 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:49.280 Executive producer Michael Etelstein. 0:01:49.520 --> 0:01:53.800 Yeah, it's so great to see all of you. I mean, 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:57.000 it's been twenty years. Basically until a couple weeks ago, 0:01:57.520 --> 0:02:01.200 I hadn't seen Emerson since what you were seven? Yeah, 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:04.800 you were thirteen. Andrea, Yeah, and you look amazing. And 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:06.840 then Terry it's it's I can't believe it. 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:09.280 It's it's been so great to reconnect. It just it 0:02:09.400 --> 0:02:11.680 really and we're going to get into all the stuff 0:02:11.680 --> 0:02:14.120 that's come up for us. But I'm it's crazy kind 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.400 of the timing of us reconnecting and us doing this podcast, 0:02:17.480 --> 0:02:19.600 and it makes so much sense for you to be 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:22.200 here because by the way, Andrew and I don't remember anything. 0:02:22.520 --> 0:02:26.000 And not only that, Like, I think people have these 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:31.000 assumptions that we know more than we know, just because 0:02:31.040 --> 0:02:34.320 we were on the show and we really were such 0:02:34.360 --> 0:02:37.400 a little part of it and really only in front 0:02:37.440 --> 0:02:39.960 of the camera, Like I wasn't even ever in a 0:02:40.000 --> 0:02:41.880 writer's room, do you know what I mean? Like, I 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:45.240 think there's assumptions that I know much more than I know. 0:02:45.320 --> 0:02:48.920 So I'm glad you're here to help reveal stuff that 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:51.760 I know our fans are going to want to know about. 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:54.200 It's like, the first season was centered around a mystery 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:56.520 on the story of the story on the street. But 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:59.280 this is kind of like our first season one mystery. 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:01.639 We can't wait here everything you have to show. 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:03.880 To surprise us. So let's just can we just start 0:03:03.919 --> 0:03:05.600 at the beginning, which is, how the hell did you 0:03:05.639 --> 0:03:06.600 get involved with this thing? 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:09.960 So at the time, I was producing a show for Touchstone, 0:03:09.960 --> 0:03:15.400 which is Disney's television armor. It was then and my show, 0:03:15.400 --> 0:03:18.079 which was called Threat Matrix, was coming to an end. 0:03:18.120 --> 0:03:20.880 It didn't get picked up for another season, and the 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:25.160 studio Josh Berry, who was amazing, sent me the script. 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:28.320 I was so busy producing another show. I didn't read 0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:30.440 it for six weeks. Oh wow, and it sat on 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:32.800 my desk and Josh finally is like, dude, are you're 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:34.360 going to read the script? And so I read it 0:03:34.720 --> 0:03:37.800 then and I immediately thought, this is the most amazing 0:03:37.880 --> 0:03:38.920 pilot script i'd read. 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:42.480 That's my recollection of I'm a little vague on where 0:03:42.520 --> 0:03:45.200 I was. I somehow picture that I was poolside. I 0:03:45.240 --> 0:03:47.280 think it was in Tucson. I was at a hotel. 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:49.680 I don't know why that comes to my mind, but 0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:53.440 I do remember saying to my manager at the time, 0:03:54.040 --> 0:03:56.119 this is like the best script I've ever read. I'd 0:03:56.240 --> 0:03:59.280 do anything to be any of these women in this show. 0:03:59.800 --> 0:04:05.160 Well, it's interesting because that script was so popular and 0:04:05.240 --> 0:04:08.280 as you know, in Hollywood explain to your listeners. So 0:04:08.320 --> 0:04:12.880 in Hollywood, you know, most times with big actresses like yourself, 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:15.440 it was offer only. And what that means is the 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:18.360 actor won't come in and read, and the only thing 0:04:18.440 --> 0:04:20.120 you can do is make them an offer, and you 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:22.880 have to hope that you cast the show properly. We 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:27.240 had decided Mark myself and the director had decided that 0:04:27.360 --> 0:04:30.640 everybody had to come in and read, which was highly unusual. 0:04:30.720 --> 0:04:34.240 Can I tell you something. I actually love reading, I 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:37.640 love auditioning. I've never been one of the actresses that 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:41.080 had even for the smallest parts. And my reasoning is 0:04:41.600 --> 0:04:43.800 because I don't want to show up this on the 0:04:43.880 --> 0:04:47.479 set and have the director whose vision I'm trying to 0:04:47.520 --> 0:04:51.440 execute go, that's not how I see it like that's 0:04:51.560 --> 0:04:54.000 I didn't see it like that, right. I want to 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.719 have the exchange of bringing my creativity and my talent 0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:00.640 to a producer and a director's so that we can 0:05:00.680 --> 0:05:02.760 be like, oh, yeah, she's going to be able to 0:05:02.800 --> 0:05:05.320 deliver what it is that you want. 0:05:05.480 --> 0:05:07.479 Well, and you were absolutely fearless because I think we 0:05:07.520 --> 0:05:09.040 made you auditions seven times. 0:05:09.160 --> 0:05:13.120 Wait yeahs wait why so many times? 0:05:13.240 --> 0:05:15.560 You know? It was interesting some of the some of 0:05:15.600 --> 0:05:20.200 the decisions were instantaneous some of them. So you know, 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:22.160 we saw Eva and I know you guys have talked 0:05:22.160 --> 0:05:24.880 about this. Eva was cast first. She came in. She 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:27.599 was supposed to be a supermodel. She's obviously not tall, 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.320 and we just decided, okay, aside from that, she's it. 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:36.480 And she really, you know, wasn't famous at that point. Marca. 0:05:36.480 --> 0:05:37.880 She gives tall though. 0:05:39.480 --> 0:05:41.480 Great energy, and we shot her. If you look at 0:05:41.480 --> 0:05:44.159 the runway sequence. We shot her from below to make 0:05:44.200 --> 0:05:48.240 her look taller, but again, it really doesn't matter. Once 0:05:48.320 --> 0:05:51.040 once the audience connects with a character, they do they 0:05:51.040 --> 0:05:55.840 don't really care. So Eva was cast first. Marcia came 0:05:56.000 --> 0:06:00.440 in for Mary Alice because Marcia was studying psychology if 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:04.039 I remember, and really wasn't interested in being a full 0:06:04.120 --> 0:06:07.400 time actress again. And we convinced her as a group 0:06:07.480 --> 0:06:11.159 to you know, audition for for Bree and thank god 0:06:11.200 --> 0:06:14.840 we did it. It's unbelievab. Yes, we'll come back to 0:06:14.880 --> 0:06:19.320 the finale because there's a great moment for her, and 0:06:19.360 --> 0:06:22.960 then you know, let's see. We we cast Felicity. Felicity 0:06:23.200 --> 0:06:25.880 was the network actually said to us they didn't need 0:06:25.920 --> 0:06:28.560 to audition her. She was so hot coming off of 0:06:28.839 --> 0:06:32.599 an Aaron An Aaron Sorkin show. ABC was desperate for her, 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:35.000 and we basically said, right, we're not going to cast 0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:38.159 anybody who doesn't read. So Felicity came into our little 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:41.760 office in Burbank and she came in covered in like 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:44.880 baby food, and literally I don't think she actually dressed 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:47.440 for the part. I think she just came in as 0:06:47.480 --> 0:06:50.640 being a mom or a young mom walked in did 0:06:50.680 --> 0:06:53.920 the scene was like, oh my god, yes that's Lynette, 0:06:53.960 --> 0:06:55.760 and I literally ran out of the room, called the 0:06:55.760 --> 0:06:57.160 network and we started making her deal. 0:06:57.480 --> 0:06:59.400 Wow that quickly, Yes it was and. 0:06:59.760 --> 0:07:03.040 We we didn't have to take her to network. And 0:07:03.080 --> 0:07:05.840 then you know, there was there was one other person 0:07:05.920 --> 0:07:10.560 we were considering for you know, the role and for Susan. Yeah. 0:07:10.800 --> 0:07:14.760 My memory of my last audition, which I feel like, 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:17.760 is accurate. And I don't know if I went up 0:07:17.800 --> 0:07:21.640 the elevator at ABC with the other person that was 0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:25.240 trying to do my role, or if like we we 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:28.320 traded off, like she went up as I came down 0:07:28.560 --> 0:07:33.680 or whatever. But I do remember my my last audition 0:07:34.040 --> 0:07:39.000 being so good that when I left, I was like, well, 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:41.560 at least I didn't screw that up. Like if they 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:44.160 don't cast me, then they don't cast me. But it's 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:47.600 not because you like I forgot my lines or I 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.400 didn't do a good job, or I was having a 0:07:49.440 --> 0:07:52.680 bad day, or like I recall it being a kind 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:55.520 of a knocked it out of the park audition and 0:07:55.640 --> 0:07:57.960 just the kind where you can be like if I 0:07:58.000 --> 0:07:59.640 don't get it, I don't get it. 0:07:59.640 --> 0:08:01.720 I remember you telling me that story, and I think 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:03.680 about that. Sometimes when I pitch a movie, like the 0:08:03.720 --> 0:08:07.000 two times I've been hired, the two movies that I've 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:09.760 really been hired, I guess it's been hired to write. 0:08:10.480 --> 0:08:12.480 I have had that feeling where I've left the pitch 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:14.400 and I've thought of that moment because you've told me 0:08:14.400 --> 0:08:16.600 about it, and I've been like, well, I kind of 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:19.560 already know that this like exists in the world in 0:08:19.600 --> 0:08:21.480 front of me, and now the pieces are coming into place, 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:23.000 and if I don't get it has nothing to do 0:08:23.040 --> 0:08:24.040 with anything that I did. 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:27.440 Are we named that way? Are we naming the other actors? 0:08:27.960 --> 0:08:30.880 I will say this in fairness to her. She was brilliant. 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:35.600 She was not American, and when she did when she 0:08:35.760 --> 0:08:42.120 did comedy with an American accent, she lost that twinkle. 0:08:42.720 --> 0:08:47.199 And she was really good and really surprising because you 0:08:47.200 --> 0:08:49.520 wouldn't have thought of her for that role. But at 0:08:49.559 --> 0:08:51.560 the end of the day, so I don't even remember 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:55.560 us bringing somebody else to ABC, and I remember you 0:08:55.559 --> 0:08:58.080 know you you had canceled. We actually had an ABC 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:01.320 audition set up for you and you canceled it, which 0:09:01.400 --> 0:09:05.360 was unheard of, Like actors never canceled network read throughs 0:09:05.960 --> 0:09:09.240 or auditions and you weren't whatever. I don't know if 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:11.600 you weren't feeling well or whatever, but we wanted you 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:14.559 enough that we rescheduled, I think for the next day 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:16.440 or the day after, and you came in and the 0:09:16.480 --> 0:09:17.440 rest was history. 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:19.200 Oh so grateful and. 0:09:19.280 --> 0:09:21.880 Well, listen, I mean we are. I've been rewatching episodes 0:09:21.880 --> 0:09:25.440 which I haven't looked at in twenty years. And the nuance, 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:30.760 the subtlety, the vulnerability, the ability to be just hilariously 0:09:30.880 --> 0:09:33.000 hilariously funny. And I know you guys have talked about 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:35.480 what it's like the naked scene, which was still one 0:09:35.480 --> 0:09:38.520 of the greatest moments I think in TV to pull 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:41.640 that off in the complexity of it and also be 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:44.840 completely charming and vulnerable and sweet and. 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:48.160 So tell us about you were saying like that. There 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:50.160 was a lot to the timing of it that I 0:09:50.200 --> 0:09:53.640 think I've totally forgotten that we You had the script 0:09:53.640 --> 0:09:54.360 in January, so. 0:09:54.400 --> 0:09:56.400 I got the script. So here's what happened. So, so 0:09:56.760 --> 0:09:59.520 you know, Mark Cherry had been a sitcom producer and 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:02.920 had never produced a scripted drama, which is a very 0:10:02.920 --> 0:10:04.960 different way of filming. So you know, when you shoot 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:08.280 a sitcom, it's multi camera, you shoot everything is sort 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:11.640 of on a proscenium and you're done. As you guys know, 0:10:11.679 --> 0:10:14.240 scripted television, there's a whole other thing. You shoot in 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:17.080 one direction, you turn around, you shoot the other way, 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:19.080 Because you have to deal with all the lighting, etc. 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:23.840 And it's technically just very, very challenging to make a drama. 0:10:23.960 --> 0:10:27.560 So the studio felt like Mark needed a partner, and 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:31.280 the person who was supposed to be his partner got 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:35.400 a job executive producing General Hospital because Chuck Pratt was 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:39.199 a longtime soap opera guy, and because Chuck wasn't available, 0:10:39.240 --> 0:10:43.280 it created an opening. Mark met a few producers and 0:10:43.880 --> 0:10:45.559 I think to this day that I was probably the 0:10:45.679 --> 0:10:49.920 least offensive or the one And to be candid with you, 0:10:50.040 --> 0:10:53.800 the studio was very concerned about Mark being a gay 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:56.440 man and me being a gay man, and I had 0:10:56.480 --> 0:10:58.320 to go have a meeting and kind of pitch my 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:01.200 take on the show because they were honestly afraid at 0:11:01.240 --> 0:11:02.920 the time the show would become campy. 0:11:03.600 --> 0:11:06.160 Oh that's so interesting, yeah. 0:11:05.840 --> 0:11:07.680 And so it was like that was the elephant in 0:11:07.679 --> 0:11:09.760 the room that I addressed in my meeting, And to me, 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:12.280 when I read the script, I had two images in 0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:16.080 my head it was American Beauty meets Edward Scissorhand. 0:11:17.040 --> 0:11:18.240 Love the references. 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:18.679 Wow. 0:11:18.760 --> 0:11:21.080 And so when you see the show, because American Beauty 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.120 kind of showed us what was lurking behind our neighbors doors, 0:11:24.160 --> 0:11:26.480 and it won the Oscar and it was such a presence. 0:11:26.520 --> 0:11:28.280 I mean, it's hard to remember because it's you know, 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:30.720 we're going back, you know, twenty plus years. I remember that, 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:34.560 and yeah, it was brilliant. And then the idea of 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:38.520 this suburban world that Tim Burton created with Edward Scissorhand, 0:11:39.200 --> 0:11:41.000 where it was you know, we're going to take you 0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:43.200 to some very dark places, but if we keep it 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:46.360 really bright, we can take the audience there. So that's 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:47.200 what I pitched. 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:49.520 Wo wait, I have a question. Is that why Danny 0:11:49.520 --> 0:11:51.640 Elfman did the music? 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:53.880 I mean Danny Elfman we got very lucky because at 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:56.439 that point in time, he'd only done The Simpsons for TV. 0:11:56.600 --> 0:11:59.200 So Danny did only the main title. He didn't do 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:02.760 any of the episod Yes, so he did our main title, 0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:06.040 which was you know, iconic and absolutely amazing. 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:08.319 I just associate him so much with Timberton, and because 0:12:08.320 --> 0:12:10.720 he's scored so many of his films that that's so 0:12:10.800 --> 0:12:12.240 interesting that that's a reference. 0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:14.360 And he got it and it's his first take on 0:12:14.440 --> 0:12:17.120 the theme song was a little less resolved and a 0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:20.280 little darker. And we sat with him and talked with him, 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:22.720 and he's such a genius. I had to go. I 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:25.080 was sent with the network notes to go, you know, 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:25.880 give notes. 0:12:25.600 --> 0:12:28.880 To explain to a musician that you want it subtenly changed. 0:12:28.880 --> 0:12:32.240 It's so interesting because the way he built it was 0:12:33.080 --> 0:12:37.160 it kind of built without a resolve a musical and 0:12:37.880 --> 0:12:40.760 what he did. So I had to go give Danny Elfman, 0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:44.360 like one of the greatest composers of all time, musical 0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:46.440 notes and like you go over and I went to 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:49.640 his house and in the basement and to Danny's credit, goes, oh, yeah, yeah, 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:51.080 you just want to resolve, and he just looked at me, 0:12:51.120 --> 0:12:54.600 not up and down. I watched him change one hundred 0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:59.200 lines of music, Like he literally sat there, changed one 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:03.160 hundred lines of music, you know, instrument parts right, and 0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:06.600 then push play and I'm like, yeah, that's good. Wow. 0:13:06.840 --> 0:13:08.559 He just did it right in front of my eyes 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:10.680 in like the space of a half hour. And then 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:13.160 it came back to bite me a little bit because 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:15.760 when we went to go score the sound. You know 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:18.120 that that opening. We did it on the Warner Brothers 0:13:18.160 --> 0:13:21.400 a lot on their big orchestral stage, and Danny wanted 0:13:21.440 --> 0:13:24.599 twenty more musicians or something like. His agent called me 0:13:24.600 --> 0:13:27.400 because Danny needs more musicians and Disney which week we 0:13:27.440 --> 0:13:29.440 can get into, you know, before the show had gone 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.920 on the air, Disney was very very conscious about spending. 0:13:32.640 --> 0:13:34.760 Money, right, Okay, So, which is why. 0:13:34.600 --> 0:13:35.360 You were in Flip. 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:40.000 Flops history solved? Can we also touch on how Charles 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:41.079 McDougall got involved. 0:13:41.120 --> 0:13:42.120 Sure, that's a good story. 0:13:42.240 --> 0:13:45.840 Yeah, okay, great, let's talk about Charles McDougal so much 0:13:45.840 --> 0:13:46.320 you can see. 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:49.080 Yeah, So in January I'm hired, Okay, and then you 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:51.680 know or maybe it's yeah, I guess beginning of January 0:13:51.760 --> 0:13:53.360 or late so it had to be late December. I 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:57.360 think I was hired because we started filming like the 0:13:57.400 --> 0:14:02.600 third week in January. Yeah, we delivered in March. No, No, 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:05.400 we started prep in January and then we started filming 0:14:05.400 --> 0:14:05.760 in March. 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:07.080 Okay, that sounds right. 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:10.760 So yes, So I was probably hired in January, and 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:15.600 the first job I had was to go with Mark 0:14:15.720 --> 0:14:19.760 to a director's home and talk about the script, and 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:23.600 this was a big feature film director who was who 0:14:23.680 --> 0:14:27.640 had a huge, huge romantic comedy movie that everybody knows. 0:14:28.000 --> 0:14:31.040 And we go and have a meeting and then my 0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:34.400 phone rings about five or six hours after he says, right, 0:14:34.440 --> 0:14:36.200 you seem like a lovely guy, but I can't work 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:39.480 with him. Oh okay, and so we quit. Wow, And 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:43.600 we were in that frantic And what people don't realize, 0:14:43.600 --> 0:14:46.840 and what's changed so much about TV now is that 0:14:47.560 --> 0:14:52.720 you know, pilot season. Every studio was producing pilots, every 0:14:52.760 --> 0:14:56.480 network was producing pilots. So you are chasing talent like crazy. 0:14:56.640 --> 0:15:00.200 Yeah, your case was always it was always built around this. 0:15:00.800 --> 0:15:01.840 You would January to March. 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:04.160 In January to March, you would find out if you 0:15:04.200 --> 0:15:07.320 got picked up in May. Then you would start shooting 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:11.640 your year series like August, September earlier. Yeah, and then 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:13.560 you would do that through April. You would have a 0:15:13.560 --> 0:15:14.800 little break and then you would do it again. 0:15:14.840 --> 0:15:16.080 So you're chasing your cast. 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:19.320 It's all getting shot at the same time. 0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:22.280 The hunger games of hiring people. 0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:25.480 Now, of course it isn't like that because everyone is 0:15:25.560 --> 0:15:28.360 desperate for a job. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah, anyway, started 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:29.040 to cut your no. 0:15:29.040 --> 0:15:31.920 You're not, and so it's it's so what happened was 0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:36.600 there was a vacuum and the network wanted a big 0:15:36.720 --> 0:15:40.320 film person and I'm like, you know, we make TV. 0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:43.440 We need someone who understands TV. And then we had 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:46.040 to go a little bit deeper because going back to 0:15:46.120 --> 0:15:49.320 two thousand and four, no one had mixed drama and 0:15:49.440 --> 0:15:52.160 comedy on American television. And I know we won, you know, 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:55.440 awards and comedy categories, but you know, the show was 0:15:55.560 --> 0:15:57.920 really not a comedy and it wasn't a drama. It 0:15:58.040 --> 0:16:01.480 was entirely its own thing. And so I started to 0:16:01.480 --> 0:16:04.200 think about who knows how to mix comedy and drama, 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.680 and the Brits and watching British television had been doing 0:16:07.720 --> 0:16:11.200 it for years absolutely, and Charles had directed a British 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:15.560 program called Queer as Folk, which was a really complicated mix. 0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:18.680 It was a realistic look on sort of gay life, 0:16:19.200 --> 0:16:22.080 but it was funny, it was real. He'd also done 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:24.640 Sex in the City, and so the fact that he'd 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:27.800 done sex in the City made me and I checked 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:29.720 with my friends who were producers there, and they said 0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:31.720 they were very happy with the film. They had everything 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:35.080 they needed. The challenge with Charles was at Disney. He'd 0:16:35.160 --> 0:16:38.960 done some directing for them and had gone wildly over budget, 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:41.720 and the studio didn't want to hire it, okay, and 0:16:41.840 --> 0:16:45.080 so and everybody wanted to feature film person and somehow, 0:16:45.360 --> 0:16:48.720 some way, I kind of just kept twisting arms until 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:50.160 they agreed to hire Trump. 0:16:50.200 --> 0:16:53.280 You know when Desperate Housewives was at its best is 0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:57.200 when it was writing this tone of I love your 0:16:57.200 --> 0:17:01.520 examples of American beauty meets Edward Scissorhands is sort of surreal, 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:08.280 comedic but also grounded and emotional. And when I think 0:17:08.320 --> 0:17:11.560 it wasn't great is when it dipped off into sort 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:18.800 of more slapsticky, less consistent, you know, with the characters. 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:20.680 Like too much of one or the other, because that 0:17:20.760 --> 0:17:23.400 balance that that's where it's magic, really lie. 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:25.920 And Charles was just all over that. I think he's 0:17:25.960 --> 0:17:27.240 so tremendously talented. 0:17:27.320 --> 0:17:29.720 It was so brilliant. He came to set every day 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:31.560 with a shot list. He handed it out to us, 0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:34.800 he handed out to the camera team, and he was 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:36.879 wildly prepared. I mean, at one point I saw him 0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:39.480 skulking through the bushes looking at angles and things like 0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:42.440 in his suits. Because you guys talked about he always 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:44.879 wore suit. English directors wore suits. I mean the thing 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:47.000 I love about English directors. And I went over to 0:17:47.040 --> 0:17:50.639 London and you know, and built NBC's business there. English 0:17:50.720 --> 0:17:54.520 directors are trained both in camera and in acting. And 0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:58.000 a lot of times in the US TV directors either 0:17:58.119 --> 0:18:01.600 come out of the the the talent acting part and 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:04.199 then become a director, or they come out of the 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:07.879 camera world and become a director. But the English directors 0:18:08.040 --> 0:18:10.640 really have both raft and in fact, when we did 0:18:10.640 --> 0:18:15.080 the thing with Oprah where she came on our show, yeah, 0:18:15.200 --> 0:18:17.640 you know, Charles, I brought Charles back because we had 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:21.960 to cut Oprah into all these scenes from the first 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:25.760 season and it was so technically challenging that we needed 0:18:25.760 --> 0:18:29.919 a director who could actually understand the technical challenge and 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:31.959 do all that. And so remember we we had we 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:33.560 worked Oprah an eighteen hour day. 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:36.240 Oh my, I'm so excited to see this. 0:18:36.560 --> 0:18:38.800 So it's on. You could google it to Oprah Winfrey 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:41.919 with Stereia Lane, folks. So we made it. We made 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:44.040 an eight minute movie where Oprah came on. It was 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.600 for the Oprah Winfrey Show. And I took the guys 0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:49.280 and that's where the guys went on Oprah with that movie. 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:52.040 Oh Okay, and then we didn't get to have Charles back. 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:56.520 Charles, I think was a brilliant pilot director, and I 0:18:56.520 --> 0:18:59.960 don't think Charles had any desire to to kind of 0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:01.520 be an episodic director. 0:19:01.720 --> 0:19:05.359 It's a different beast like the directors of pilots, and 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:10.080 this is not unusual. They'll put their stamp all over it, 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:13.080 and because they have that bit of extra time to 0:19:13.160 --> 0:19:16.399 almost treat it like a mini movie. But then the 0:19:16.520 --> 0:19:20.679 pace of episodic television, it just doesn't offer them the 0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:23.560 room to create I think the way that they want to, right, 0:19:23.560 --> 0:19:27.240 That's why it's a different It's almost like a I 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:29.520 don't want to say cookie cutter, because I love some 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:32.359 of the really great episodic directors we had on our show, 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:36.879 but like it definitely is you get less time and 0:19:36.960 --> 0:19:38.520 less ownership of your vision. 0:19:38.600 --> 0:19:40.600 Well, the pilot, I think we shot for fourteen or 0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:44.000 fifteen days, Yeah, which was a long for a drama pilot. 0:19:44.119 --> 0:19:46.679 Then now it's nothing because the whole world has changed. 0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.359 But you know, a typical episode of Desperate was supposed 0:19:49.400 --> 0:19:52.720 to fit into eight days, and it never really did, 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:54.439 so we ended up having second units. 0:19:54.480 --> 0:19:58.359 And we you know, okay, so since we're there, and 0:19:58.440 --> 0:20:01.200 since we're not going to spend five hours on this 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:03.160 episode of the podcast, you don't know about it, even 0:20:03.160 --> 0:20:05.680 though I think there's stuff to fill it. But since 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:07.680 we're there, I know, you and I when we were 0:20:07.680 --> 0:20:11.280 having dinner, you mentioned and I had kind of forgotten 0:20:11.320 --> 0:20:17.720 about this too when the thing kicked off. So when 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:21.760 we got picked up and we re started shooting the season, 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:25.399 that was in June or right June or yeah, I. 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:26.399 Think it was probably June. 0:20:26.480 --> 0:20:30.240 And so it was, you know, it was shooting episodes 0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:35.080 of the show from June until September before we knew 0:20:35.080 --> 0:20:35.760 that it was a hit. 0:20:35.920 --> 0:20:37.720 It went on the air in October the beginning. It 0:20:37.720 --> 0:20:40.320 went on the air late, so the beginning of October. 0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:43.520 Okay, And so all that time, and you can talk 0:20:43.560 --> 0:20:46.080 to this better because you reminded me, and I think 0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:52.720 this is insane. In the beginning. You know, people think 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:55.400 that actors are like so spoiled and so like they 0:20:55.400 --> 0:20:59.680 get all the glamour things. They had the housewives sharing 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:03.959 a double trailer, like honeywagon kind of trailer, so like 0:21:04.440 --> 0:21:07.560 we just had these half room trailers that were connected. 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:11.040 But because we were so far behind because it was 0:21:11.080 --> 0:21:14.120 such a huge show to shoot. They added a second unit, 0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:18.439 and the trailer would go with whoever was on the 0:21:18.440 --> 0:21:21.720 first unit, and the second unit wouldn't have a trailer, 0:21:22.960 --> 0:21:26.560 And so there were or a hairdresser or there. 0:21:26.720 --> 0:21:28.560 You'd have a hair dresser. You wouldn't have somebody who 0:21:28.640 --> 0:21:29.840 knew how to do your hair. 0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:37.119 This is unheard of for the leads of a show 0:21:38.000 --> 0:21:41.080 to not have the hairdresser and the makeup artist and 0:21:41.160 --> 0:21:44.800 their trailer with them when they're working on a regular basis. 0:21:44.880 --> 0:21:47.280 It wasn't like a one off one day, can we 0:21:47.320 --> 0:21:50.840 get through this? It became a like and you remind 0:21:50.560 --> 0:21:53.280 I totally forgotten about this, and you reminded me of 0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:57.280 all this, and it just it brings back how from 0:21:57.320 --> 0:22:03.760 the beginning there was drama that that created that we 0:22:03.840 --> 0:22:04.800 had nothing to do with. 0:22:05.560 --> 0:22:08.520 There's no question. And I think part of what's interesting 0:22:08.640 --> 0:22:11.720 is is in retrospect, you know, the show was a 0:22:11.920 --> 0:22:15.119 massive hit once it hit the air, but if you 0:22:15.240 --> 0:22:18.080 go back and look at Disney and ABC in particular, 0:22:18.560 --> 0:22:21.639 they hadn't launched a successful show in five years. The 0:22:21.680 --> 0:22:24.320 company was losing probably hundreds of millions of dollars a 0:22:24.400 --> 0:22:27.120 year on pilots and TV shows that weren't getting picked 0:22:27.160 --> 0:22:30.240 up to future seasons. So from their point of view, 0:22:30.640 --> 0:22:34.399 you know, they they they were really struggling financially. And 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:36.320 I went on to run a studio, so I understand 0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:39.600 the pressures of making your budget work and hitting your numbers. 0:22:40.720 --> 0:22:44.920 The thing that was interesting was we never had enough 0:22:45.080 --> 0:22:48.359 money in those first thirteen episodes to actually make the show. 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:51.720 We finally have answered why I had my own wardrobe and. 0:22:51.640 --> 0:22:54.880 Why so there was never enough money? It was there 0:22:54.960 --> 0:22:57.760 was we were. We were George Perkins, who I know 0:22:57.800 --> 0:22:59.800 you guys have talked about who is our amazing line 0:23:00.600 --> 0:23:03.320 and who you know built the crew with Charlie Scurris. 0:23:03.320 --> 0:23:06.200 I mean there are two of like the nicest, most honest, 0:23:06.240 --> 0:23:10.000 hardworking people and super talented because they would try to 0:23:10.040 --> 0:23:12.920 figure out ways to make things work. But we were 0:23:13.000 --> 0:23:16.919 making that show with like scotch tape and holding it 0:23:16.960 --> 0:23:18.679 together any way we could. 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:20.639 I put some on my boobs for that. 0:23:22.520 --> 0:23:27.360 Small house after we went into the say yes, it was. 0:23:27.280 --> 0:23:29.480 A very small amount of tape I was allowed to use. 0:23:29.920 --> 0:23:32.440 I mean, as I understand that you were the fearless 0:23:32.480 --> 0:23:35.240 one who kind of decided how you wanted to do it. 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:38.040 I did because I mean my motivation though, and this 0:23:38.119 --> 0:23:40.680 is kind of how I look at everything was kind 0:23:40.720 --> 0:23:43.600 of in being considerate of the director of that. I 0:23:43.720 --> 0:23:46.359 wanted them to be able to shoot it from any 0:23:46.400 --> 0:23:48.720 angle that they I didn't want the steady cam guy 0:23:48.960 --> 0:23:51.400 to have to be like, oh I caught her underwear, 0:23:51.720 --> 0:23:53.600 that's not that SHOT's not going to work. You know. 0:23:53.640 --> 0:23:55.520 I just wanted to be like, let me just make 0:23:55.520 --> 0:23:56.560 this easy on everybody. 0:23:56.720 --> 0:23:59.360 I'm amazed the camera crew could even pull focus that day. 0:23:59.560 --> 0:24:05.240 I mean everybody, everybody was, you know, in awe, and 0:24:05.240 --> 0:24:07.640 and the film speaks for itself. I mean, it's got 0:24:07.640 --> 0:24:09.800 to be one of the great comedy performance, isn't you. 0:24:09.960 --> 0:24:20.080 Oh thank you? So. Circling back to there wasn't a 0:24:20.080 --> 0:24:22.240 lot of money there was, you feel like, how did that. 0:24:22.240 --> 0:24:26.040 Affect your experience, you know, in the studio and on set. 0:24:26.200 --> 0:24:29.280 I mean, you know, I was young, and I was 0:24:29.320 --> 0:24:32.040 in my mid thirties. I mean I'd produced you know, 0:24:32.200 --> 0:24:36.000 two pilots previously, and I had a show that had 0:24:36.040 --> 0:24:39.040 made sixteen episodes. But we really wanted this to work. 0:24:39.560 --> 0:24:41.879 And you do what you have to do, and you 0:24:41.960 --> 0:24:44.720 have to figure out what battles to fight, what battles 0:24:44.760 --> 0:24:47.280 not to fight, And it's like anything else in life. 0:24:47.280 --> 0:24:51.440 But we George and I were really holding the show 0:24:51.480 --> 0:24:54.240 together with the money we had. Every week was a fight. 0:24:54.520 --> 0:24:57.320 Every there was stuff with a studio breathe, you know, 0:24:57.400 --> 0:25:00.400 coming and like you know, standing there by the t rock, 0:25:00.560 --> 0:25:02.359 you know, to buy the to pull the plug you 0:25:02.400 --> 0:25:06.359 know on the generators. Wow, because we were shooting you 0:25:06.400 --> 0:25:10.000 know things next days. Yeah, And in fairness, we didn't 0:25:10.000 --> 0:25:13.760 do anything wrong. The show had a massive appetite. It 0:25:13.840 --> 0:25:17.520 was a big show, huge cast. I mean really unusual 0:25:17.760 --> 0:25:19.600 that you know, you'd be lucky to have two or 0:25:19.600 --> 0:25:22.280 three leads on a TV show. We had a bunch 0:25:22.280 --> 0:25:24.080 of leads. Then we had a bunch of co leads, 0:25:24.119 --> 0:25:27.880 and we had I think fourteen series in some capacity 0:25:27.960 --> 0:25:30.640 series regulars, whether they were a series regular in their 0:25:30.680 --> 0:25:32.960 deal or not, but we had to track them. Plus 0:25:32.960 --> 0:25:35.640 we had a bunch of young kids, which presents its 0:25:35.680 --> 0:25:38.080 own challenges because you can't shoot that. You can't work 0:25:38.119 --> 0:25:40.040 an eight hour day with a bunch of young kids, 0:25:40.320 --> 0:25:44.040 let alone a fourteen hour day. Yeah, And so at 0:25:44.040 --> 0:25:46.760 the time we were just doing everything we could to 0:25:46.840 --> 0:25:49.960 get to air because we thought that we had something 0:25:50.600 --> 0:25:53.560 unique and special and then fortunately, you know, the ratings 0:25:53.640 --> 0:25:55.920 came out and I think they were the biggest ratings 0:25:56.000 --> 0:25:57.520 in er It was enormous. 0:25:57.680 --> 0:26:01.400 Wow. So with that amount of oversight when it came 0:26:01.440 --> 0:26:03.760 to budgeting and things like that. I know we've we've 0:26:03.760 --> 0:26:05.760 talked about it from how it felt as actors on 0:26:05.800 --> 0:26:08.400 the show, and we've talked about like the little bits 0:26:08.440 --> 0:26:11.600 that we sort of surmised, Like we mentioned Terry and 0:26:11.640 --> 0:26:14.080 maybe Nicolette's nipples being a problem at one point that 0:26:14.119 --> 0:26:16.320 maybe you've got notes on Uh huh, do you have 0:26:16.400 --> 0:26:17.199 more to say on that? 0:26:17.520 --> 0:26:20.280 Well, I mean, I think they were concerned about advertisers 0:26:20.359 --> 0:26:24.040 and they and so so and I at the time 0:26:24.040 --> 0:26:26.320 pushed back and I said, we're doing a show about women, 0:26:26.400 --> 0:26:30.359 but we don't like women's bodies. And you know, I 0:26:30.400 --> 0:26:33.040 didn't win that argument. And what we ended up doing 0:26:33.240 --> 0:26:35.719 was in post production blurring them out a little bit, 0:26:35.800 --> 0:26:36.560 or painting them out. 0:26:36.720 --> 0:26:39.360 Oh my gosh, wow, you had your nipples blurret out. 0:26:39.480 --> 0:26:40.720 I wonder who had that job. 0:26:41.480 --> 0:26:41.640 Yeah. 0:26:41.760 --> 0:26:43.639 By the way, so the audience understands the women were 0:26:43.680 --> 0:26:47.800 wearing clothes, it's just you know, they wanted, you know, 0:26:47.840 --> 0:26:49.320 in scenes I guess where you didn't want to wear 0:26:49.320 --> 0:26:51.080 a bra. You didn't feel it was appropriate to. 0:26:51.040 --> 0:26:53.560 It was always wearing a bra. But I think when 0:26:53.560 --> 0:26:56.199 it's cold, your nipples get hard and then you know 0:26:56.280 --> 0:26:58.639 they poke out through the shirt. I mean what is 0:26:58.960 --> 0:27:01.639 interesting is as we were watching it, and maybe you 0:27:02.080 --> 0:27:06.080 listened to this, I did bring up like, wow, I 0:27:06.160 --> 0:27:09.720 kind of loosely remember being told can we put your 0:27:09.800 --> 0:27:12.919 nipples away somehow because they're causing a problem and it 0:27:12.960 --> 0:27:15.800 costs extra money to have to air brush them out, 0:27:16.600 --> 0:27:20.960 like and me thinking, you know, from my point of view, 0:27:21.080 --> 0:27:22.960 I'm not doing that, Like that's not a big deal. 0:27:23.200 --> 0:27:26.919 But it's because I'm in my body, like I'm wearing 0:27:26.960 --> 0:27:31.359 a bra, I'm wearing a shirt like that feels normal 0:27:31.400 --> 0:27:33.439 to me. It did like asking me to put like, 0:27:33.560 --> 0:27:36.240 you know, gauze over my nipples or something like that, 0:27:36.600 --> 0:27:37.920 it starts to feel. 0:27:37.600 --> 0:27:40.639 Like what, I just have an issue with it. And 0:27:41.080 --> 0:27:45.200 in fairness, listen, I I can't say it enough. We're 0:27:45.200 --> 0:27:49.000 doing a show about women. There's nothing wrong with the 0:27:49.000 --> 0:27:51.560 woman's body. These are dressed women. This is not a 0:27:51.640 --> 0:27:55.160 nudity issue, right, So for me, it was something that 0:27:55.240 --> 0:27:57.000 you know, I lost that fight. You don't win fights 0:27:57.040 --> 0:27:59.800 with standards and practices. I've only won one in my 0:28:00.080 --> 0:28:02.480 entire career when I was at CBS, and it came 0:28:02.520 --> 0:28:03.880 back to bite me in the bus. 0:28:03.960 --> 0:28:06.520 Well, I'm curious. So you're for the first you know, 0:28:06.640 --> 0:28:09.600 thirteen episodes. You're doing this on a shoe string scotch 0:28:09.640 --> 0:28:12.160 tape budget. You don't know if it's going to be successful. 0:28:12.440 --> 0:28:14.960 Then the ratings start coming in, then the show blows up. 0:28:15.560 --> 0:28:19.920 How did that change your working experience? 0:28:20.160 --> 0:28:24.879 It helped, and it made everything harder because suddenly the cast, 0:28:25.000 --> 0:28:28.879 in particular, there was not a free moment of time. 0:28:29.000 --> 0:28:32.520 ABC had not had a hit in so long, and 0:28:32.600 --> 0:28:34.720 that year, as you guys remember, it's been written about, 0:28:34.960 --> 0:28:38.080 Bill Carter wrote a book called Desperate Networks, and it 0:28:38.160 --> 0:28:41.400 talked about how ABC went from fourth place to first place, 0:28:41.440 --> 0:28:44.760 and on the back of Desperate and loss, and then 0:28:44.880 --> 0:28:50.200 Gray's Anatomy came mid season, and so you know, suddenly 0:28:50.400 --> 0:28:54.400 we were so in demand. So we did two Oprah show, 0:28:55.240 --> 0:28:59.240 we did every weekend. You know, the girls were being 0:28:59.280 --> 0:29:01.160 in Forgive me for calling you the girls. I hope 0:29:01.160 --> 0:29:03.760 that's OK. They were back in twenty twenty two thousand 0:29:03.760 --> 0:29:06.880 and four, so I guess, you know, you gardeners can 0:29:06.920 --> 0:29:08.720 have you know, we could have pedophilia and not talk 0:29:08.800 --> 0:29:11.360 about it because it's two thousand and four, and God 0:29:11.400 --> 0:29:13.200 did that make me uncomfortable. 0:29:12.680 --> 0:29:16.200 Watching those Yeah. 0:29:14.960 --> 0:29:17.720 So we can come back to that. But but suddenly 0:29:17.840 --> 0:29:20.840 everybody is in demand. And you have to understand, ABC 0:29:21.080 --> 0:29:25.960 went from like not having any water running to being 0:29:26.240 --> 0:29:29.920 like gushing in success. And suddenly it didn't just translate 0:29:30.360 --> 0:29:33.880 to you know, for Desperate Housewives or Lost or Grays. 0:29:34.240 --> 0:29:37.560 It was also Good Morning America. So you know, Diane 0:29:37.560 --> 0:29:41.560 Sawyer did a special. They would they wanted everything they 0:29:41.640 --> 0:29:45.560 could get of the women, and and you know, I 0:29:45.680 --> 0:29:49.440 felt terrible at the time because you know, we forget 0:29:49.440 --> 0:29:52.000 that we were in a paparazzi era in two thousand 0:29:52.040 --> 0:29:55.400 and four. You guys had no privacy. You were followed 0:29:55.840 --> 0:29:58.360 off the studio lot, followed to your homes. I mean, 0:29:58.400 --> 0:30:01.080 you'd had success before, so you were aware of how 0:30:01.120 --> 0:30:01.719 to manage it. 0:30:01.800 --> 0:30:04.480 And we were followed home from the hospital when Emerson 0:30:04.600 --> 0:30:07.280 was born, like they've literally followed us in. 0:30:07.400 --> 0:30:10.120 And so you at least had like, you know, gates 0:30:10.160 --> 0:30:12.840 around you, you had a private area, you could go 0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:15.360 home to Marsha had a little picket fence, I mean, 0:30:15.400 --> 0:30:17.400 and they would just stare and shoot pictures of her 0:30:17.400 --> 0:30:21.120 through the windows. And so, you know, I don't think 0:30:21.280 --> 0:30:26.920 anybody was prepared to take care of you guys properly, 0:30:27.000 --> 0:30:29.480 to give you the rest you needed to make sure 0:30:29.480 --> 0:30:31.240 you had security. I mean, I think it would be 0:30:31.280 --> 0:30:33.200 done so differently. But we live in a world where 0:30:33.200 --> 0:30:36.040 we don't have mega hits like that anymore. There's no 0:30:36.120 --> 0:30:39.680 show that everybody watches at nine o'clock on Sunday night. 0:30:39.840 --> 0:30:43.520 Were there was conversations being had or not even I 0:30:43.640 --> 0:30:44.040 try to. 0:30:44.200 --> 0:30:47.120 I mean, I think it was a different time. And again, 0:30:47.320 --> 0:30:51.520 I you know, it's it's hard because everybody felt like, well, 0:30:51.520 --> 0:30:54.600 they're lucky, like they're lucky because they're on a hit 0:30:55.200 --> 0:30:58.680 and this is great for them, and everybody feels lucky 0:30:58.680 --> 0:31:00.920 to be on a hit. But you could be lucky 0:31:00.960 --> 0:31:04.200 on a hit, and you can also be exhausted or 0:31:04.600 --> 0:31:08.760 be you know. You know, Marcia couldn't go to the supermarket, 0:31:08.960 --> 0:31:10.480 you know, she was being followed. She had to go 0:31:10.480 --> 0:31:13.480 in full hair and makeup because Papa Razzi were dying 0:31:13.520 --> 0:31:17.360 to get a shot of the women not looking like 0:31:17.440 --> 0:31:21.400 they were perfect and it was a lot of pressure forever. 0:31:22.080 --> 0:31:24.480 Yeah, I can imagine. 0:31:24.800 --> 0:31:28.920 So you I know, you were talking about Danny Elfman 0:31:29.040 --> 0:31:34.080 and he only did the the trailer, I mean, the 0:31:34.120 --> 0:31:38.480 main title music. But I felt like, first of all 0:31:38.520 --> 0:31:43.000 Wassteria Lane itself was a character in the show as 0:31:43.120 --> 0:31:46.000 strong as any cast member, and I would love to 0:31:46.080 --> 0:31:49.800 know how Universal got chosen and how that street in 0:31:49.840 --> 0:31:53.280 particular became Wasteria Lane. But also, like I know, you 0:31:53.320 --> 0:31:55.520 were really involved with the music throughout the show, and 0:31:55.520 --> 0:31:58.520 I feel like that has such a central part in 0:31:58.560 --> 0:32:01.840 its success of it the way it looked. Can you 0:32:01.920 --> 0:32:02.840 tell us about that? 0:32:03.120 --> 0:32:05.280 Sure? So, I mean, I think going back to my 0:32:05.480 --> 0:32:09.200 initial statement about sort of American Beauty meets Edward Scissorhands, 0:32:09.320 --> 0:32:12.440 it was it created a picture or I had a 0:32:12.560 --> 0:32:15.440 vision for what the show should be. And in fairness 0:32:15.440 --> 0:32:17.640 to Mark, I mean Mark, I would say, if you 0:32:17.680 --> 0:32:20.040 look at our roles, he was the architect. He wrote 0:32:20.040 --> 0:32:23.560 this amazing script. And then, as you guys know, because 0:32:23.600 --> 0:32:26.040 you read a lot of scripts, somebody has to take 0:32:26.160 --> 0:32:30.960 that script and turn it into you know, film, and 0:32:31.080 --> 0:32:34.400 in television, you know, in a feature film, the director 0:32:34.440 --> 0:32:37.720 does that. In television the producers are much more involved. 0:32:38.160 --> 0:32:41.120 So it was we got very lucky that my previous 0:32:41.200 --> 0:32:45.160 show had gone down, because we inherited an amazing crew, 0:32:45.600 --> 0:32:48.479 and the crew stayed with the show for many, many years, 0:32:48.560 --> 0:32:50.960 and so those guys hit the ground running. So we 0:32:51.000 --> 0:32:53.640 had a brilliant art department. We already had a working 0:32:53.720 --> 0:32:57.080 relationship because I knew them well, and so we scouted 0:32:57.120 --> 0:33:00.360 a bunch of neighborhoods around LA and what quickly became 0:33:00.400 --> 0:33:02.640 a parent was we need to own a cult to 0:33:02.720 --> 0:33:06.880 sack and in success, nobody wants, you know, camera crews 0:33:07.000 --> 0:33:09.320 and people filming in their neighborhood at four o'clock in 0:33:09.320 --> 0:33:12.000 the morning. So then it really starts to narrow down. 0:33:12.040 --> 0:33:14.920 Where could we do this. We talked about building everything 0:33:14.960 --> 0:33:18.680 at Disney Range, okay, and and that wasn't going to 0:33:18.760 --> 0:33:22.160 be No, that didn't turn out to be practical. We 0:33:22.200 --> 0:33:24.160 looked at the Warner Brothers a lot, because they have 0:33:24.240 --> 0:33:27.240 that little lot of houses you know from sixties television, 0:33:27.240 --> 0:33:30.280 fifties and sixties television. And then you know, I said, 0:33:30.320 --> 0:33:32.920 why don't we go look at Universal and that street 0:33:33.000 --> 0:33:36.120 hadn't been touched. It was dilapidated. So one of the 0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:39.600 things we had to do was repaint and freshen up 0:33:39.720 --> 0:33:42.600 and dress an entire street, you know, and that's a 0:33:42.680 --> 0:33:45.440 multi acre set. I mean that again, TV shows at 0:33:45.440 --> 0:33:49.000 that time did not have the budgets they have now, right, so, 0:33:49.200 --> 0:33:51.160 you know, no one had made a Game of Thrones then, 0:33:51.680 --> 0:33:54.000 and so so the idea that we were going to 0:33:54.560 --> 0:33:57.560 dress up a whole neighborhood, paint every single house, find 0:33:57.720 --> 0:33:59.760 you know, and give it a look. And I know 0:33:59.800 --> 0:34:02.239 you as we're talking about some of the sets, some 0:34:02.320 --> 0:34:04.680 of those houses are just facades. There's nothing in them. 0:34:05.120 --> 0:34:07.160 And some of them we had to build sets and 0:34:07.200 --> 0:34:09.960 try to you know, put breeze I think dining room 0:34:10.000 --> 0:34:12.800 inside one of them, living room. And so we just 0:34:12.920 --> 0:34:15.400 kind of faked it until we got stage space. 0:34:15.920 --> 0:34:16.400 Wow. 0:34:16.719 --> 0:34:18.719 Yeah, because when did that happen? When did we get 0:34:18.800 --> 0:34:19.360 the stages? 0:34:19.520 --> 0:34:21.319 When? When when the show got picked up, we got 0:34:21.320 --> 0:34:23.759 more stages and we started building and we realized once 0:34:23.800 --> 0:34:25.960 the show became a hit, you know, the network realized 0:34:25.960 --> 0:34:27.520 it was in the studio, realized it was going to 0:34:27.560 --> 0:34:28.480 be around for a while. 0:34:29.120 --> 0:34:32.600 But you know, I mean talk about like sustaining like 0:34:32.719 --> 0:34:36.759 that with Steria, Lane is still on the Universal Tram tour. Yeah, 0:34:37.120 --> 0:34:38.600 like I mean, it's a highlight. 0:34:38.800 --> 0:34:40.160 It's a huge draw. 0:34:40.480 --> 0:34:42.799 Yeah, it's a huge draw. Isn't that crazy that you 0:34:42.880 --> 0:34:46.360 created this. I wouldn't say a neighborhood that didn't exist. 0:34:46.560 --> 0:34:48.880 I think we had an idea that, you know, and 0:34:48.960 --> 0:34:51.160 Mark and I actually did talk about the fact that 0:34:51.480 --> 0:34:54.719 we decided together that with Steria Lane, we were never 0:34:54.800 --> 0:34:57.960 going to give it a location, right, and and the 0:34:58.040 --> 0:35:02.960 sets were iconic, I mean, the network liked it. But 0:35:03.000 --> 0:35:05.359 then I would get phone calls where I get these 0:35:05.400 --> 0:35:07.759 panic phone calls where they'd see the dailies, which is 0:35:07.760 --> 0:35:09.920 the film that comes out every day. The street's too 0:35:09.960 --> 0:35:13.040 bright or it's too prettier, there's too many flowers. So 0:35:13.400 --> 0:35:15.920 I would, you know, So I would go, okay, and 0:35:15.960 --> 0:35:18.520 I would get in my golf cart and I would 0:35:18.640 --> 0:35:21.040 drive up from the production office, you know, putt putt 0:35:21.080 --> 0:35:22.960 putt up and around the hill and get into a 0:35:22.960 --> 0:35:27.840 stereo lane. I would literally remove one flower and I 0:35:27.880 --> 0:35:29.920 would and I would call the network back and I 0:35:29.960 --> 0:35:32.799 would say, listen, guys, you know totally hear you. I 0:35:32.840 --> 0:35:36.640 went up there myself. I pulled it back and you 0:35:37.200 --> 0:35:40.600 have to realize, like there's there's so much fear and 0:35:40.760 --> 0:35:44.480 anxiety that goes into a show before it goes on air, right, 0:35:44.840 --> 0:35:47.040 And this is true of every show I've ever worked on. 0:35:47.120 --> 0:35:50.520 There's just a tremendous amount of second guessing by everybody 0:35:50.560 --> 0:35:52.080 because who have you met who doesn't think they have 0:35:52.120 --> 0:35:52.760 a good opinion. 0:35:53.800 --> 0:36:03.319 Yeah, I was just talking to my manager about this. 0:36:03.320 --> 0:36:07.640 There's so much scared filmmaking because especially you know, you 0:36:07.719 --> 0:36:08.600 only have so much money. 0:36:08.719 --> 0:36:10.560 Studios have mandates they want to meet. 0:36:10.640 --> 0:36:14.480 And everyone is like, how can we hit every box 0:36:14.520 --> 0:36:17.160 that we're supposed to hit and not offend anybody? And 0:36:17.600 --> 0:36:20.000 I mean, I think what's amazing is that you created 0:36:20.000 --> 0:36:22.719 something so distinct even with all of those factors. 0:36:22.920 --> 0:36:25.600 I think, listen, we had a vision. We had an 0:36:25.640 --> 0:36:31.000 amazing team of people, and it starts with mark script 0:36:31.120 --> 0:36:33.240 and that script to the you know, I rewatched the pilot, 0:36:33.239 --> 0:36:36.040 which I hadn't seen in twenty years. The script is 0:36:36.200 --> 0:36:39.520 so stellar. It has so many good move moments. Every 0:36:39.640 --> 0:36:42.560 single scene in that script does something for the show. 0:36:43.000 --> 0:36:47.200 And to set up four characters plus Edie plus each 0:36:47.239 --> 0:36:51.200 of the guys, and you knew who every character was, 0:36:51.239 --> 0:36:55.400 every adult character was in that pilot, and then you 0:36:55.760 --> 0:36:58.799 I mean Andrea. I mean, my god, your performances were 0:36:58.880 --> 0:37:03.040 are It's funny because now I've met the grown woman, 0:37:03.239 --> 0:37:05.600 But to think about that, you were just a kid, 0:37:05.640 --> 0:37:09.080 and you were so natural and so funny and so 0:37:09.360 --> 0:37:12.480 good and so charming, and the relationship you had with 0:37:12.520 --> 0:37:14.959 your mom where you kind of knew all her insecurities 0:37:14.960 --> 0:37:18.400 and loved her anyway and brought that. And so to 0:37:18.480 --> 0:37:22.960 Mark's credit, I mean, he wrote a masterpiece. My job 0:37:23.120 --> 0:37:25.960 then became to keep everybody from touching the script before 0:37:25.960 --> 0:37:26.800 we started shooting. 0:37:27.600 --> 0:37:30.160 Yeah, were there people at the studio that wanted it change. 0:37:30.239 --> 0:37:33.000 After the read through, which was three days before we filmed, 0:37:33.000 --> 0:37:36.920 they gave a bunch of notes, and I remember the 0:37:36.920 --> 0:37:38.960 studio had brought me in and I had to turn 0:37:39.000 --> 0:37:41.200 to my friends at the studio and say, I'm sorry, 0:37:41.200 --> 0:37:43.279 you don't get to give notes now. And they said 0:37:43.600 --> 0:37:46.960 what I said, We're locked. I mean, the director is prepped, 0:37:47.520 --> 0:37:49.680 You've had the script for nine months. Now is not 0:37:49.800 --> 0:37:51.520 the time to give notes. And I think they were 0:37:51.520 --> 0:37:56.279 initially concerned about Breeze dialogue was very heightened to a 0:37:56.360 --> 0:37:59.400 Los Angeles audience. You know, she's pleased as punch, her 0:37:59.480 --> 0:38:03.560 little her little expressions in euphemisms. I think to Los 0:38:03.640 --> 0:38:11.279 Angeles executives felt unnatural, and to Mark's credit, like he 0:38:11.400 --> 0:38:14.640 was his ear was leaning and picking up something else, 0:38:14.680 --> 0:38:17.120 which was you know, the genius of the show is 0:38:17.160 --> 0:38:19.279 that people in Blue states could watch it and think 0:38:19.320 --> 0:38:22.120 they were watching something that was satirical, and people in 0:38:22.160 --> 0:38:24.680 red states could watch the exact same show and connected 0:38:24.719 --> 0:38:27.319 the characters in a totally different way. And I think 0:38:27.400 --> 0:38:31.239 Mark's neutrality about how he wrote his characters allowed that 0:38:31.320 --> 0:38:31.760 to happen. 0:38:31.920 --> 0:38:34.960 Wow, that is really a good observation. I really agree. 0:38:35.000 --> 0:38:37.920 And I but I have to say I've said a 0:38:37.920 --> 0:38:41.480 lot of Marcia Marsham Marshall because she's so great. Yeah, 0:38:41.480 --> 0:38:44.920 but I can't think of anybody else that could have 0:38:45.040 --> 0:38:49.200 taken those, as you say, kind of strange still more 0:38:49.600 --> 0:38:56.759 stilted words and somehow ground them into a humanity that 0:38:56.880 --> 0:39:00.840 actually came out of her mouth and made you believe 0:39:00.880 --> 0:39:01.479 it now. 0:39:01.360 --> 0:39:04.600 Because on one level her character seems really heightened. Yeah, 0:39:04.600 --> 0:39:09.720 And on another, to your point, you you really connect 0:39:09.840 --> 0:39:12.520 with her and she breaks your heart. I mean, you 0:39:12.520 --> 0:39:14.680 know when Rex asked for a divorce and through the 0:39:14.719 --> 0:39:19.040 whole first season and you know, he she really really 0:39:20.520 --> 0:39:24.400 I think was approaching everything as this is this is 0:39:24.440 --> 0:39:27.480 a real person. This is somebody who who has who's 0:39:27.520 --> 0:39:30.040 done everything in her life that she thought was right 0:39:30.080 --> 0:39:32.080 and was going to make her happy and she wasn't. 0:39:32.120 --> 0:39:34.400 And again, that was the genius of the show, that 0:39:34.480 --> 0:39:37.720 each of the women had gone down a path before 0:39:37.880 --> 0:39:39.719 before the show started and thought they were going to 0:39:39.760 --> 0:39:43.080 find happiness, and that each of them we meet them 0:39:43.120 --> 0:39:46.200 in this moment in time where each of them is 0:39:46.239 --> 0:39:48.839 confronting what does happy look like? And I think that's 0:39:48.880 --> 0:39:51.760 why the show resonated not just with women in America, 0:39:51.800 --> 0:39:54.560 but also with a lot of men. And at one 0:39:54.600 --> 0:39:57.520 point we had that crazy thing where Edie did the 0:39:57.560 --> 0:39:59.879 Monday Night Football spot that caused. 0:40:00.160 --> 0:40:01.160 Oh, oh my gosh. 0:40:01.480 --> 0:40:03.360 Oh wait, no, there was a thing in a locker 0:40:03.440 --> 0:40:04.760 room right, Oh my gosh. 0:40:04.760 --> 0:40:07.040 I totally forgot about this thing and it blew up. 0:40:07.040 --> 0:40:08.840 But when they came and pitched it to us, ABC, 0:40:09.000 --> 0:40:11.319 Monday Night Football called me and said, we want to 0:40:11.360 --> 0:40:13.000 do this thing, and you know, we want to help 0:40:13.080 --> 0:40:16.280 you know your show, and we have more men watching 0:40:16.400 --> 0:40:19.239 our show than you have watching Monday Night Football, So 0:40:19.320 --> 0:40:20.960 let's just reset the conversation. 0:40:21.320 --> 0:40:21.640 Wow. 0:40:22.040 --> 0:40:24.560 Wait, well, I'm sort of loosely remembering this. She did 0:40:24.600 --> 0:40:25.840 a commercial in a. 0:40:25.760 --> 0:40:27.160 Towel in a locker room. 0:40:27.239 --> 0:40:29.280 Yes, it was a promo and I haven't I haven't 0:40:29.400 --> 0:40:32.640 watched it. I can't. But it caused it caused a scandal. 0:40:33.000 --> 0:40:35.200 It was sexual, you know. And I don't think she 0:40:35.360 --> 0:40:37.640 did what was scripted. It wasn't anything she did. It 0:40:37.719 --> 0:40:40.239 was what everybody decided that she should do. 0:40:40.360 --> 0:40:43.640 And it was because of it being on Family Night football, right, 0:40:43.719 --> 0:40:45.640 I mean, that's why it was so scandalous. 0:40:46.080 --> 0:40:48.280 I don't think it in and of itself was very offensive. 0:40:48.480 --> 0:40:51.880 Do you have like when you sit this far away 0:40:52.040 --> 0:40:54.080 and you like look at it and you go like. 0:40:56.040 --> 0:40:56.640 I did that. 0:40:57.280 --> 0:41:00.000 I was a part of that. Do you have things 0:41:00.160 --> 0:41:05.840 that you that like either scenes or moments or or 0:41:06.120 --> 0:41:09.880 or or struggles that you conquered over that like you 0:41:09.880 --> 0:41:11.560 you are proud of them? Or and do you have 0:41:11.640 --> 0:41:15.040 things that you like just want to be like, I'm 0:41:15.080 --> 0:41:18.320 so glad that I can just put that to rest 0:41:18.360 --> 0:41:19.240 and walk away. 0:41:19.680 --> 0:41:23.280 Well, I mean, you know, Desperate was was a wild 0:41:23.360 --> 0:41:25.600 time in my life because I was very young as 0:41:25.640 --> 0:41:31.719 a producer and as an executive, and it it allowed me. 0:41:31.840 --> 0:41:34.640 I'm grateful that that script came into my life and 0:41:34.719 --> 0:41:37.840 allowed me to showcase what I was capable of do it, 0:41:37.960 --> 0:41:40.840 just like the script allowed you guys as actors to 0:41:40.920 --> 0:41:43.759 showcase what you were able to do. Mark and I 0:41:43.960 --> 0:41:48.560 always had different visions of the show, and tonally, his 0:41:48.840 --> 0:41:53.480 taste was more comedic than mine. And what ended up 0:41:53.520 --> 0:41:57.160 happening over the course of the first season was, you know, 0:41:57.560 --> 0:42:00.839 my I was cutting those first thirteen upsodes because Mark 0:42:00.960 --> 0:42:04.240 was so far behind in writing that basically the editorial 0:42:04.280 --> 0:42:07.359 fell to me. And then, you know, and there were 0:42:07.400 --> 0:42:10.239 times where there'd be a gag or something that he 0:42:10.360 --> 0:42:14.120 loved that I just thought was silly, and I'd take 0:42:14.160 --> 0:42:17.960 it out, and so there was a schism forming between 0:42:18.000 --> 0:42:21.000 the two of us. Case wise, from the beginning. 0:42:21.760 --> 0:42:25.840 I understand that I mean I yeah, and I understand 0:42:25.840 --> 0:42:30.600 that I mean I as as I said, like I 0:42:30.680 --> 0:42:34.920 feel like tonally it was could be very good. And 0:42:34.960 --> 0:42:37.600 then there were definitely episodes, maybe not so much in 0:42:37.640 --> 0:42:41.080 the first season, but like it you know, would dip 0:42:41.120 --> 0:42:43.520 into like this doesn't really make sense or this is 0:42:44.080 --> 0:42:44.960 too can't be well. 0:42:45.000 --> 0:42:50.960 It's hard work to maintain that specific tightrope of that 0:42:51.120 --> 0:42:55.480 balance between the comedy, the drama, the mystery, the surrealism. 0:42:56.160 --> 0:43:00.560 You know, it's not an easy thing to maintain, imagine 0:43:00.600 --> 0:43:03.040 from all different sides, but it is the thing that 0:43:03.200 --> 0:43:06.200 was so special about the show. And I think that 0:43:06.400 --> 0:43:10.320 so many people, even me at thirteen, I remember people 0:43:10.360 --> 0:43:13.040 telling me after they watched the show that the tone 0:43:13.600 --> 0:43:17.920 was so unique and people just loved that about it. 0:43:18.120 --> 0:43:20.319 And what's interesting is, so I watched the pilot again, 0:43:20.320 --> 0:43:23.360 and the pilot had a different composer than our series composer, 0:43:23.880 --> 0:43:25.920 and so one of the things that we had to 0:43:26.000 --> 0:43:29.400 do was invent a new sound because dramas on TV 0:43:29.480 --> 0:43:32.680 were scored with drama soundtracks and comedies were scored with 0:43:32.719 --> 0:43:37.719 comedy soundtracks, and Desperate had to let the audience know 0:43:37.800 --> 0:43:40.400 that things were ironic at times, or things were not 0:43:40.560 --> 0:43:44.080 what they seemed, or a character who's doing something straight 0:43:44.120 --> 0:43:46.640 down the middle, Oh, you've got to think about that. 0:43:47.080 --> 0:43:49.640 And so, you know, the composer of my previous show 0:43:49.719 --> 0:43:52.960 is a guy named Steve Jablonski. Steve was introduced to 0:43:53.000 --> 0:43:55.520 me through Hans Zimmer, who was the greatest of the 0:43:55.600 --> 0:43:59.520 great and Steve was composing our score and he had 0:43:59.600 --> 0:44:04.000 done a demo for Desperate Housewives, and I think Mark 0:44:04.080 --> 0:44:06.480 had felt at the time that I had hired too 0:44:06.480 --> 0:44:09.319 many of my production people. And by the way, in 0:44:09.360 --> 0:44:11.880 fairness to him, this was his project. He got saddled 0:44:11.880 --> 0:44:15.600 with an entire crew, he got saddled with an art department, 0:44:15.719 --> 0:44:19.960 I mean, and and so he chose a composer for 0:44:20.000 --> 0:44:23.000 the pilot, and we realized that wasn't the right composer. 0:44:23.280 --> 0:44:26.440 He chose another composer, realized it wasn't the right composer. 0:44:26.680 --> 0:44:30.040 And then what ended up happening is really funny. Steve 0:44:30.120 --> 0:44:32.960 Jablonski's music was in the Avid, which is the editing 0:44:33.000 --> 0:44:37.400 machine that we could, and some editor found these tracks 0:44:37.719 --> 0:44:40.680 and knew none of the politics. Oh wow, And so 0:44:40.719 --> 0:44:44.839 he cut the episode that begins with going into the Furnace. Yeah, 0:44:45.120 --> 0:44:50.240 you know, re insiderated. Uh, Steve had cut. The editor 0:44:50.239 --> 0:44:52.919 had cut Steve's music, and Mark and Iron and edited. 0:44:52.920 --> 0:44:55.359 Mark quen this music. This is the music. Who did this? 0:44:55.360 --> 0:44:59.160 This is perfect? Oh and and the poor editor turns 0:44:59.160 --> 0:45:01.759 and goes he looks in Steve Jablonski and Mark just 0:45:01.800 --> 0:45:05.279 looks it. Uh oh, But Steve got the job. And 0:45:05.800 --> 0:45:08.399 then Steve and I. So what happened is, you guys 0:45:08.440 --> 0:45:10.399 would shoot all day. We'd go to set. I would 0:45:10.400 --> 0:45:12.320 be there at call, which is like six in the morning, 0:45:12.360 --> 0:45:15.560 six thirty. We would wrap at six to seven to eight. 0:45:16.000 --> 0:45:19.000 I would then go into editorial to check on the scripts. 0:45:19.200 --> 0:45:22.399 Then I would drive from the Universal all the way 0:45:22.440 --> 0:45:26.560 to Steve's house in Santa Monica and we would And 0:45:26.600 --> 0:45:28.319 he liked to work late at night, so from ten 0:45:28.360 --> 0:45:30.480 or eleven at night till two or three in the morning, 0:45:30.520 --> 0:45:31.440 we'd work on the music. 0:45:31.600 --> 0:45:36.320 So did you not sleep for a year? Nine months? 0:45:37.600 --> 0:45:38.760 Wow? Wow? 0:45:38.880 --> 0:45:41.040 It is like having a baby. Then it is. 0:45:41.120 --> 0:45:45.239 It's like you're building growing something for nine months, you know. 0:45:46.239 --> 0:45:48.920 Like I said, it was magical because the work was 0:45:49.000 --> 0:45:53.360 so good. We all wanted we all wanted success. Everybody 0:45:53.400 --> 0:45:55.520 showed up. I mean I watched Terry come to work 0:45:55.840 --> 0:45:59.600 incredibly sick sometimes and like I'm looking in the truck 0:45:59.640 --> 0:46:01.120 with il I think she's good. I mean, we should 0:46:01.120 --> 0:46:03.719 send her home, and she would say she's fine. She 0:46:03.719 --> 0:46:05.960 would literally like hobble to set because she had a 0:46:06.080 --> 0:46:09.920 huge fever. And then the minute they called action, the 0:46:10.000 --> 0:46:12.759 magic showed up, the comedy showed up. It was like 0:46:12.920 --> 0:46:15.400 nothing was wrong, and they'd say cut and you'd collapse 0:46:15.440 --> 0:46:17.839 into your chair. And I don't know how you did it, 0:46:17.880 --> 0:46:22.160 but you always managed to when when the work was happening. 0:46:22.480 --> 0:46:23.360 That's what mattered. 0:46:24.680 --> 0:46:28.279 I seem to recall Felicity saying to me once like, 0:46:28.840 --> 0:46:33.160 what's wrong with you? You're always sick? And I at 0:46:33.160 --> 0:46:35.640 the time I remember sort of feeling like, kind of 0:46:35.640 --> 0:46:38.520 offended because I think of myself as a healthy person. 0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:41.080 But when I look back on it now, I go, Yeah, 0:46:41.200 --> 0:46:45.000 every mom I know that has a child between four 0:46:45.080 --> 0:46:49.640 and ten years old is constantly sick because your kid 0:46:49.880 --> 0:46:53.680 is bringing home every virus every other day from kindergarten 0:46:53.719 --> 0:46:55.920 in first grade and second grade. And so yeah, I 0:46:56.080 --> 0:46:58.520 probably was sick, and Emerson, it was your fault. 0:46:59.600 --> 0:47:01.319 Well, well I am don't. 0:47:01.640 --> 0:47:04.279 I'm so sorry, but I'm so happy that you have 0:47:04.360 --> 0:47:08.160 such deep mental and physical fortitude that you were able 0:47:08.200 --> 0:47:08.839 to rise up. 0:47:09.880 --> 0:47:12.600 Well to rise up, Okay, I wanted because we had 0:47:12.640 --> 0:47:15.879 mentioned obviously, Terry and I hadn't really rewatched the show 0:47:15.920 --> 0:47:18.280 at all basically until we started this podcast. 0:47:18.320 --> 0:47:21.040 Emerson of course is experiencing it for the first time. 0:47:20.840 --> 0:47:21.879 And what a show it's been. 0:47:22.040 --> 0:47:23.440 Yes, our finale, see. 0:47:23.320 --> 0:47:25.880 There's so far there have been some really standout moments 0:47:25.880 --> 0:47:29.120 from the first season. We've talked about obviously Terry's amazing 0:47:29.800 --> 0:47:32.359 naked locked out moment, and the dinner party scene from 0:47:32.360 --> 0:47:35.720 the same episode episode seven was a really big highlight 0:47:36.120 --> 0:47:39.680 that we really loved. There's that amazing scene with Felicity, 0:47:39.800 --> 0:47:42.600 the Lynette scene, the mental breakdown in the kitchen, that 0:47:42.680 --> 0:47:45.480 felt like a really strong moment from the show. And 0:47:45.560 --> 0:47:47.920 I know you said you haven't rewatched it really but 0:47:48.160 --> 0:47:49.480 maybe did in advance of this. 0:47:50.000 --> 0:47:51.920 You know, I didn't watch seven again, but I remember 0:47:51.960 --> 0:47:54.360 it really well because it was the first time that 0:47:54.440 --> 0:47:58.520 we actually veered from comedy into serious draw and that 0:47:58.520 --> 0:48:02.279 that adderall storyline about a mom just wanting to compete 0:48:02.320 --> 0:48:04.600 and just wanting to do good, which was I think 0:48:04.680 --> 0:48:07.960 so relatable to so many women. But you know, to 0:48:08.000 --> 0:48:10.840 the writer's credit, they took it down its natural path 0:48:11.160 --> 0:48:14.000 and she finally had a breakdown, and again the network 0:48:14.080 --> 0:48:17.120 was very concerned about this is a comedy, like what 0:48:17.120 --> 0:48:19.960 are you guys doing? And when that's and that show 0:48:20.000 --> 0:48:23.000 got a huge response from others and from women. I 0:48:23.000 --> 0:48:26.400 think people really felt like they could see something that 0:48:26.960 --> 0:48:29.200 rung true in their own life. And so from that 0:48:29.239 --> 0:48:31.600 point on, I think we knew we could go where 0:48:31.640 --> 0:48:33.239 we needed to go with the women as long as 0:48:33.400 --> 0:48:35.000 it was based in something real. 0:48:35.360 --> 0:48:39.319 Wow, that's that's amazing. And I will tell you what's 0:48:39.360 --> 0:48:43.279 real and true our love for you, Michael Edlstein. Thank 0:48:43.320 --> 0:48:46.720 you so much for being so generous with your time 0:48:46.880 --> 0:48:51.480 and stories. It's been amazing and we will all be 0:48:51.640 --> 0:48:55.000 coming back. Later this week, we will jump into episode 0:48:55.040 --> 0:48:59.640 twenty three, the finale of season one. One wonderful day, 0:49:00.239 --> 0:49:02.279 and I'm sure that it will be a wonderful day 0:49:02.480 --> 0:49:06.200 as we meet some new neighbors on Westeria Lane and 0:49:06.239 --> 0:49:09.919 we tie up loose ends. Or will we be able 0:49:09.960 --> 0:49:12.239 to tie up loose ends. You'll have to wait and 0:49:12.280 --> 0:49:16.799 see and join us next time because we are desperately 0:49:16.920 --> 0:49:17.960 devoted to you.