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Speaker 1: This is me eat podcast coming at you shirtless, severely

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Speaker 1: bog bitten, and in my case, underwear listening podcast. You

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Speaker 1: can't predict anything presented by on X. Hunt creators are

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Speaker 1: the most comprehensive digital mapping system for hunters. Download the

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Speaker 1: Hunt app from the iTunes or Google play store. Nor

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Speaker 1: where you stand with on X. All right, folks, we're

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Speaker 1: here in Southern Colorado? Are you entroing the show? Yohnnie?

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Speaker 1: I just messing around starting I could though. That's all

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna say about it. Southern Colorado. Yeah, that's enough. Um.

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Speaker 1: You know what I was thinking about recently, uh, that

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Speaker 1: I wanted to I think I kind of told you

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Speaker 1: about it already, but I thought you'd like it. As

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Speaker 1: I saw a dude he had a shirt. You know,

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Speaker 1: people will go to a um like the Super Bowl whatever,

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Speaker 1: or someone will win the Super Bowl, yes, and people

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Speaker 1: have a shirt they'll say, like the Bears, yeah, super

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Speaker 1: Bowl champions. I saw a guy recently that had a

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Speaker 1: shirt commemorating the fact that he watched that big Solary clips.

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Speaker 1: It was like Solary Clips two eighteen or whatever. You know,

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Speaker 1: I thought you'd appreciate you like that. I like it well,

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Speaker 1: I thought you'd like it. I didn't give a shift.

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Speaker 1: I thought you'd like it. Oh you didn't your ship.

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Speaker 1: I mean I liked it, but like it as much

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Speaker 1: as I thought you'd like it. Yeah, we should make

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Speaker 1: something that just say, like Elk Season twenty nineteen. I

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Speaker 1: would be a good idea. Um, Remember we're talking about

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Speaker 1: me saying that you'll appreciate this seth the flip flop flasher,

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Speaker 1: me saying that I gave up on flip flops because

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Speaker 1: of someone saying, like, how are you going to rescue

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Speaker 1: your family? Yeah, or defend your wife? Or defend your

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Speaker 1: wife if you're wearing flip flops. I'd be curious to

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Speaker 1: get your take on this, Rock Denver, I have mixed feelings.

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Speaker 1: I definitely appreciate both sides of it. I lived in

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Speaker 1: Hawaii for about a year before I joined the Navy,

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Speaker 1: and flip flops is like general attire. I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: that's what you wear, whether it's a formal event or

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Speaker 1: you're on the beach or head of the beach, and

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Speaker 1: your feet become like belt radial. So I'd say, because

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Speaker 1: you get so much barefoot time over there as well,

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Speaker 1: So if you had to rescue your family over there,

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Speaker 1: They're probably prepped to go barefoot if need be. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I felt like at a time I probably had

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Speaker 1: that capacity for work, but now I live somewhere in between.

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Speaker 1: I do like having the kit if things go wrong,

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Speaker 1: I'm off the races, grabbing one kid, my brides grabbing

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Speaker 1: the other kid, and we're surviving the zombie apocalypse. But

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Speaker 1: I like a flip flop man, still flip flop. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm real torn on it. Man. Like I said, I

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Speaker 1: quit for a while, but I'm thinking about getting back

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Speaker 1: into it now because it's a wintertime now. Well, getting

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Speaker 1: back into it weather improves. But I took a little

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Speaker 1: break because my buddy Dave, um, my buddy Dave was

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Speaker 1: telling I think I told the story right. My buddy

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Speaker 1: Dave was telling a story where he was in He's

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Speaker 1: from Montana, but he was in New York and he

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Speaker 1: comes into a comedy club with his wife and he's

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Speaker 1: got his flip flops on, and the comedian on stage

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Speaker 1: brates him. It's like, where the hell are you from

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Speaker 1: because he was like surprised to see a guy wearing

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Speaker 1: flip flops in in the city. Yeah, I think I

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Speaker 1: don't think you should wear flip flops in New York

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Speaker 1: City because you're not prepared. We're not prepared. It's also dirty. Well,

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Speaker 1: he didn't like it, and that made my buddy Dave's

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Speaker 1: really questioned. And then I showed up and flip flops

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Speaker 1: and Dave was like, you are the last guy that

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Speaker 1: planet I thought would wear flip flops. What is going on?

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Speaker 1: Then I quit. So after talking about his flipop thing,

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Speaker 1: we got two pieces of feedback from people UM, one

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Speaker 1: pro flip flop and one UH con flip flopper against

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Speaker 1: flip flop against flip flop guys talking about how last

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Speaker 1: December he UH comes home on his lunch break and

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Speaker 1: sees that there's a car park in his driveway and

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Speaker 1: his side gates open and the French doors in the

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Speaker 1: back of his house are open. And he credits his

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Speaker 1: leather boots with the fact that he had was emboldened

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Speaker 1: to run into his house and confront the intruder. And

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Speaker 1: he says that if he'd been wearing his flip flops,

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Speaker 1: he would have been stuck out front calling nine on one.

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Speaker 1: But he goes in. He's sure someone's in his house

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Speaker 1: robbing his house. He barrels into the house yelling, who's

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Speaker 1: at my house? And has met there by a dude

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Speaker 1: who burglar who is brandishing the guy's own seven like

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Speaker 1: the burglar ran in found his three fifty seven and

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Speaker 1: is holding his three seven. They get into a scuffle

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Speaker 1: and he knocks the glasses off of the guy and

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Speaker 1: then Hall's ass out of his house and runs away,

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Speaker 1: leaving the burglar in the house with the pistol. Later,

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Speaker 1: when the cops come over, they find that that the

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Speaker 1: glasses that the I knocked off during the scuffle, and

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Speaker 1: they're able to pull a DNA sample off the glasses

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Speaker 1: and catch a career burglar, and he credits his having

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Speaker 1: not had his flip flops on. But another guy is

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Speaker 1: talking about he takes his wife. This guy's in North Carolina.

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Speaker 1: He takes his wife to some fancy resort and his

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Speaker 1: wife goes into the bathroom and he's sitting there eating

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Speaker 1: and sees that there's this rat scurring around and she's

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Speaker 1: not happy about the rat. He tells the waitress about

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Speaker 1: the situation. Eventually, the rat comes by and comes within

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Speaker 1: seven feet and he's got those big you know, those

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Speaker 1: big keen flip flops, like super heavy duty flip flops.

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Speaker 1: He says he took that flip flop and Joe Joe

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Speaker 1: killed the rat hucking a flip flop at it. So

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Speaker 1: he said, in that case, it was his flip flops

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Speaker 1: that enabled him to defend his wife from the rat

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Speaker 1: from the big scary and they gave him a hunter

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Speaker 1: daughter credit. Oh there you go at the resort. So

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Speaker 1: you think he's gonna go back to that rat field resort.

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Speaker 1: So point being it's inconclusive weather. Flip flops, Um, you

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Speaker 1: know our appropriate attire. If we're making arguments on the

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Speaker 1: toughness of flip flops, I will say when stationed on

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Speaker 1: both coasts in the seal teams, the west coast of

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Speaker 1: the seal teams in mass wears flip flops at a high,

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Speaker 1: high level. So if you're just trying to like evaluate

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Speaker 1: the the raw toughness of those people that wear flip flops,

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Speaker 1: there's at least one subgroup that will live a large

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Speaker 1: portion of their life in flip flops whose toughness is

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Speaker 1: probably unquestioned, who are probably capable of defending their wives. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you read that book black Hawk Down, you might be

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Speaker 1: able to get some perspective on this. I know people

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Speaker 1: that were there. Yeah. I read the book Black Hawk Down,

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Speaker 1: and in it, the author Mark bowden Um talks about

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Speaker 1: some developing tensions within the ranks of people in Somalia,

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Speaker 1: and one point of contention was that certain guys on

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Speaker 1: this base were allowed to wear flip flops while on

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Speaker 1: guard duty military that they would maybe not allowed, but

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Speaker 1: they were taking the liberty to stand there with a

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Speaker 1: flak vest. What do you call a flag vest? Yeah, flat,

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Speaker 1: flat jacket. I mean that's old altar body arm. They

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Speaker 1: would have shorts, flip flops, a flak jacket while standing guard,

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Speaker 1: and other people from other units weren't allowed to do this,

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Speaker 1: and it was creating some tension. There would be some

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Speaker 1: aesthetic of seeing somebody in that gear that would appeal

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Speaker 1: to me, and I would probably be equally piste that

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Speaker 1: they were in that outfit standing. So you'd look at

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Speaker 1: it and be like, yeah, yeah, like I like what

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Speaker 1: this guy believes in, and I would probably holler at

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Speaker 1: him to go put some combat books. That's some pants

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Speaker 1: um on the on the subject, on on the ongoing

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Speaker 1: subject of what to do with your dead body when

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Speaker 1: you die. This guy, he this guy writes in he

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Speaker 1: was talking about this with his wife, and his wife

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Speaker 1: proposed to him that she could take his ashes and

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Speaker 1: integrate him into a salt mineral lick and then put

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Speaker 1: like stir him into a mineral lick and put it

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Speaker 1: out so that that, uh, that's how his ashes could

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Speaker 1: go consumed by dear so that he could give something

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Speaker 1: back after all that they had given to him. That

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Speaker 1: I like it. Yeah, I like that too. Uh. Notthing

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Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about is, yeah, like I was

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Speaker 1: observing the air day an emerging trend. And this might

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Speaker 1: not even resonate with people who don't live in sort

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Speaker 1: of like posh mountain towns, But in posh mountain towns

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Speaker 1: there's an emerging mom being one of yeah, but I

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Speaker 1: mean catch them. Like all the posh mountain towns. There's

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Speaker 1: an emerging trend of of having your pickup truck and

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Speaker 1: and and instead of keeping your ship in your truck,

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Speaker 1: you strap it to the outside of your truck. And

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Speaker 1: I was observing this to you, and it seemed to

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Speaker 1: agitate your honest that I even had the audacity to

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Speaker 1: make the observation. You got pretty hot. You got pretty hot,

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Speaker 1: just like and just that's that's the part that got

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Speaker 1: me is that I couldn't believe that over such a thing,

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Speaker 1: that you were affected so much personally on the inside,

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Speaker 1: Like I don't really care if you like it or

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Speaker 1: don't like it, but the fact that it sort of

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Speaker 1: affected you and that you were like really worked up,

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Speaker 1: that these people choose to do this, whether it's fashion

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Speaker 1: or for whatever reason. Fashion, yeah, it's fashion, but it's

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Speaker 1: just interesting to me to find that you like it

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Speaker 1: affects you so much. Yeah, you like, there's no way that,

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Speaker 1: Like where I grew up, where everybody, like you know,

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Speaker 1: all the people hunt for ride up drive pickup trucks,

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Speaker 1: there's no way that what you do if you like

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Speaker 1: to hunt fish, you get a truck and you put

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Speaker 1: a top around it and then you put your your

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Speaker 1: stuff in there. But wasn't there a subset of that

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Speaker 1: group that would have some ksey lights even though they

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Speaker 1: really never really needed them, but they had freaking lights

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Speaker 1: on their truck with some lights would not be out

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Speaker 1: of the question, even though they really cruised around in

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Speaker 1: fashion doing whatever you do with and we would weld up, uh,

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Speaker 1: we would weld up uh bumper guards that were excessive,

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Speaker 1: Like you'd start with aid inch sea channel and weld

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Speaker 1: that to the frame, not like you start with aid

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Speaker 1: inch sea channel, raft around and then just build from

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Speaker 1: there and looking and at the time I didn't recognize

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Speaker 1: it as such, but to be totally honest, looking back

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Speaker 1: on it, there was a fashion element to who could

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Speaker 1: have the craziest brush guard? Yeah, now it's just that

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Speaker 1: who couldn't have the most overlake? What is it? It's

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Speaker 1: it called overland. I don't know. Yeah, I mean I

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Speaker 1: think it seems like yeah, yeah. The ear day, I

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Speaker 1: was sitting there and the guy pulls up. I was

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Speaker 1: looking out our office wind when the guy pulls up

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Speaker 1: and he's yeah. He looked like you're Samity sam Um,

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Speaker 1: like all this ship, gas cans, water cans, shovels, pick axes,

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Speaker 1: but Jack all hooked it out and then like, what's

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Speaker 1: the inside the truck? I don't know, room for the

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Speaker 1: kayak or the stand up paddle. I just feel like

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Speaker 1: at my like like, I don't know, man, at forty

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Speaker 1: five years of age, I'm just hitting the age where

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Speaker 1: I look at stuff and I don't like it. But

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Speaker 1: I just look at the age where I just get

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Speaker 1: like like things will catch my eye and irritate me

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Speaker 1: a little bit that they shouldn't. And you're not there

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Speaker 1: yet because you're less, you're younger. Yeah, Seth was saying

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Speaker 1: for his rig. You know he's got a n f J,

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Speaker 1: so it's a little bit. It is all your ship

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Speaker 1: strapped to the outside of your truck. No, nobody wants

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Speaker 1: you wish. I wish some ship was strapped to the

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Speaker 1: outside though. How old are you look? Sweet? We had

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Speaker 1: this conversation the other day in the car um and

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Speaker 1: there was two things that I would put on the outside,

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Speaker 1: one being fuel canisters because it smells. It smells, and

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Speaker 1: the FJ has such a small tank that I'm always hauling,

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Speaker 1: Like if I go hunting, I throw my hitch carrier

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Speaker 1: in with a tank of gas on who makes that?

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Speaker 1: Who makes the your I know your rig? But what

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Speaker 1: what kind of rig is that? It's a Toyota f

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Speaker 1: Jake cruiser. You think it's a hunting rig? Oh it is.

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Speaker 1: It's just a little small That's why I need ships

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Speaker 1: trapped on the outside. And you think it looks sweet?

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I like it. Yeah, it's a badass, a

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Speaker 1: little rake. No, I mean you think it'd be sweeter

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Speaker 1: if you had like pots and pans and ship hanging

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Speaker 1: off it. No, no, I don't need that ship. But

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Speaker 1: it's older, what what years? It's two seven, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's not like the old. It's not the old. Yeah. Um,

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Speaker 1: I could use fuel canisters and I wouldn't I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: mind having a pooie tent. Oh really, dude, tell me

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Speaker 1: about the tent. Why do you Why do you want it?

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Speaker 1: Because because he thinks it looks sweet. No, it's like

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Speaker 1: you get one of those like, oh my god, No,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna head down now. I'm already to go down

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Speaker 1: to the brew pub. No, dude. Most most of the

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Speaker 1: time when I'm going hunting on the weekends, like I'll

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Speaker 1: I like to hunt out in eastern Montana, bunch, So

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Speaker 1: we go out there. We'll roll up at like you know,

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Speaker 1: ten eleven o'clock at night. You sleep under your vehicle.

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Speaker 1: When I was your age, we slept under our trucks.

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Speaker 1: Now we do that sometimes or in them. But it

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Speaker 1: would be nice for you if you slouch in the

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Speaker 1: front seat and sleep. It would be nice. When you

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Speaker 1: show up you're tired, You last thing you want to

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Speaker 1: do is put up a tent. You just pop up

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Speaker 1: the tapui and go to bed. You get under the

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Speaker 1: vehicle and sleep down there. You know, we're coming from

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Speaker 1: coming from a guy that's been looking at buying a

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Speaker 1: camper young children. Okay, well camper though, scamp I'm signed

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Speaker 1: yet maybe you look at had put it on from

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Speaker 1: in the middle of this crazy But I have young

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Speaker 1: children too, but I haven't gotten so soft as to

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Speaker 1: consider the idea of a camper yet, taking putting it

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Speaker 1: out there that, like, you know, there's just sort of

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Speaker 1: different levels. You can't say just because you have kids

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden, now it's like okay to have

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Speaker 1: a camper. And because he's eight and wants a tapui

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Speaker 1: tent makes him soft? Didn't sleep under his Okay, here's okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna put it the breath. Now I'm gonna put

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Speaker 1: the rest. But here's the thing say about it's like this,

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Speaker 1: Why and I bring this up. I brought us up

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Speaker 1: a number of time, so we get some things. Why

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Speaker 1: is it that that that, uh, left wing people tend

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Speaker 1: to have more food allergies than right wing people, Like

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Speaker 1: I don't know, gluten intolerance is a left wing ailment? Okay?

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Speaker 1: Why do old people not like to puoi tense to

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Speaker 1: tense appeal to people to to They appeal to people

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Speaker 1: of a certain age bracket who live in a certain

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Speaker 1: kind of town. Yeah, but I think I'm gonna argue

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Speaker 1: that because because a guy that owns part of our

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Speaker 1: where our office is, is an overlander and is at

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Speaker 1: least ten years our senior, maybe fifteen, and he rocks

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Speaker 1: it to Pouie. I mean, but you gotta have money

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Speaker 1: to have one of these, and like that is that

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Speaker 1: that's your hobby. You gotta have money, man, and you that, like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you can do it on the chief. Also,

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Speaker 1: I think it's like the Instagram sort of thing, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean, And that's where the young people's

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Speaker 1: element of it comes in. It's like it's an Instagram thing. Dude.

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Speaker 1: I'm an instagram man too. I love Instagram at Steve Ronella,

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Speaker 1: I love it. I love it. Yeah, you're right, you're right.

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Speaker 1: Let's see, yeah we saw. Yeah. You know. It's like

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Speaker 1: my wife she doesn't let me talking to waitresses and

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Speaker 1: stuff anymore because I'm just too old, you know, to

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Speaker 1: like have any kind of chit chat. She's like, at

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Speaker 1: your age, if there's an attractive waitress, just shut up,

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Speaker 1: just like, just order what you need, Just order what

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Speaker 1: you need. You can't banter anymore. You're too old to

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Speaker 1: banter with waitresses. And I think I just need to

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Speaker 1: stop talking about this kind of stuff. But real quick, um,

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Speaker 1: uh you wanna do you wanna try to sell your thing?

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Speaker 1: Your car? Right now? Oh? Yeah, I got a I

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Speaker 1: got a two thousand eighteen out back, sixteen thousand miles

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Speaker 1: on it. It's got a topper. It's got a two

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Speaker 1: leete upper. It's in Los Angeles. They're not called toppers.

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Speaker 1: What do you what do you call it? Cargo toppers?

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Speaker 1: Like bad car talk called topper. I used to call

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Speaker 1: it a pot. It's I got the pod pot on top. Dude,

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Speaker 1: you got a cargo carrier? Cargo carrier? Whatever is rocket box? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a rocket box. Uh yeah, it's in What do

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Speaker 1: you need for it? It's in Los Angeles. Lazy jumpers,

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Speaker 1: Chris gil Ridge Pounder. I'm trying to get twenty two

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Speaker 1: for it. How the context is your Instagram? Do you

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Speaker 1: have a lot of pictures of you adventuring, no overlanding.

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Speaker 1: It's got stock tired and no overlanding. So how do

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Speaker 1: they find you? They want to buy your rig at

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Speaker 1: Christopher gil on Instagram. Send me a message, M Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what else we got? Honest? I got one more? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we gotta get to No, no, I got one more,

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Speaker 1: one more. I like to now and that like to

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Speaker 1: catch up on feedback stuff. A guy wrote in this

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Speaker 1: is good because this is a segue. Honnie. A guy

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Speaker 1: wrote in he works, he's security. He's like a security

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Speaker 1: guy Yelso National Park. And he gets uh complaint, He

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Speaker 1: gets a complaint just he says, like just last night,

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Speaker 1: I had to respond to a noise complaint from a guest.

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Speaker 1: And the noise complaint was, can you please do something

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Speaker 1: about that elk bugling near my hotel room? It's driving

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Speaker 1: me crazy? Uh, And I thought that was pretty funny.

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Speaker 1: And also at one point, as someone asked the guy,

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Speaker 1: at what elevation do elk turn into moose um? But

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Speaker 1: there's this thing. I think there's this thing that keeps

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Speaker 1: happening to Yellowstone. Where it's a little bit confusing is

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Speaker 1: where people there's been a lot in the news of

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Speaker 1: people getting too close, like this year, like some guy

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Speaker 1: got his little girl like super close to a bison

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Speaker 1: in it threw up in the air and it keeps happening,

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Speaker 1: and people keep and it seems like when it happens,

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Speaker 1: there's sort of this thing where people are very quick

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Speaker 1: to condemn the individual and how stupid the individual is

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Speaker 1: for doing something so dangerous. Right, it's like the same story,

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Speaker 1: like this guy in BC has got arrested or got

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Speaker 1: a bunch of trouble because he got out I was

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Speaker 1: trying to have it. He was trying to box with

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Speaker 1: a grizzly bear. He's trying to taunt a grizzly into

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Speaker 1: a fight, you know, and he got in trouble, and

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Speaker 1: so in like Backpacker magazine is the big thing about

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Speaker 1: what an idiot this guy is and how horrible it is, right,

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Speaker 1: how dangerous it is. But then like when I think

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Speaker 1: about this, and you'll talk about people being dangerous around animals,

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Speaker 1: how can there be that? Like there's a movie about

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Speaker 1: a guy that free solos l cap. It's exceedingly dangerous,

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Speaker 1: the most dangerous thing you could do, right, But then

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Speaker 1: he's like celebrated for being dangerous. Why is it that

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Speaker 1: you can do that and be celebrated and they're going

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Speaker 1: to give you an oscar and like you're the coolest

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Speaker 1: thing on the planet and you can do all the

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Speaker 1: talk shows, but if you want to box a grizzly,

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Speaker 1: you're like any of the people. I think because the

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Speaker 1: dude that climbed that mountain prepared over a lifetime to

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Speaker 1: develop a skill set to then go do said exceptionally

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Speaker 1: dangerous thing. Do you know that the guy that wanted

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Speaker 1: the box the grizzly didn't I don't guess it wasn't

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Speaker 1: Mike Tyson. Yeah, It's just like the thing that keeps happening.

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Speaker 1: I think. I think, like, I'm like, is danger cool

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Speaker 1: or not cool? Because if you want to if you

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Speaker 1: want to go pet a buffalo, oh my fine, yeah, No,

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Speaker 1: I'm for dangerous. It's not like you're wanting to stab it.

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Speaker 1: If you want to just go up and see how

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Speaker 1: close and see if it will gore you. I feel like, like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, not with a kid that that that was egregious. No,

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Speaker 1: that was like a bad call. And I don't know

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Speaker 1: about the kid's parents, but I just don't think it's

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Speaker 1: like that bad. If you if some person, like an

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Speaker 1: adult makes a con just a decision to go and

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Speaker 1: taunt an animal and then the animal gores him, I

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Speaker 1: don't know. Man, I look at it, like, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think people just set because you're fucking with an animal,

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Speaker 1: you're not you don't pose any danger to it. Well

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Speaker 1: I know, but it's like I think there's when you

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Speaker 1: compare it to something like Alex Hanold, who's like that's

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Speaker 1: like his he's like an athlete, that's like his thing,

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Speaker 1: and there's like that acceptance of risk that he takes,

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Speaker 1: you know, and the people that typically do that. I mean, sure,

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Speaker 1: maybe the guy was preparing for his whole life to

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Speaker 1: box at grizzly bear. But will you ever watch the

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Speaker 1: movie Grizzly Project. No, but the guy that gets uh

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Speaker 1: in a skirmish with the grizzly and then designs a

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Speaker 1: suit that yeah wear and so that guy, Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: then he couldn't get a barried to attack him when

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Speaker 1: he had a suit on. That's a great movie. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: his buddy runs him over to pick up just to

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Speaker 1: test this. Yeah, yeah, I see that guy. But go on,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, man, I think that. I think people

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Speaker 1: just when they see people messing with animals, like taunting

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Speaker 1: them to get attacked or something, or getting too close,

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Speaker 1: I think they get more defensive for the animal and

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Speaker 1: get angry at the person for being for like just

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Speaker 1: leave it alone. You know this the best they could

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Speaker 1: come up with in this article condemning the guy from

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Speaker 1: wanting to box the grizzly bear. The best they could

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Speaker 1: come up with it was that it was bad because

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Speaker 1: the grizzly bear then might expect to box other individuals

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Speaker 1: who weren't willing participants in the boxing. That's the best

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Speaker 1: they could come up with, and why it's bad to

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Speaker 1: go and like do they just mean mall yeah, but

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Speaker 1: then I'm sure that he's not gonna box. It's just

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Speaker 1: like you know, I you know, and I used to

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Speaker 1: do it too, Like when someone would get injured by

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Speaker 1: an animal, I'd be like, Oh, that idiot. But then

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Speaker 1: I start thinking like, I don't know, I don't think

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Speaker 1: it's safe to I don't think it's safe to feel

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00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,719
Speaker 1: that way anymore, you know, like if you get up

404
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Speaker 1: close to if you want to go get up close

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Speaker 1: to a moose and see what happens and the moose

406
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Speaker 1: beats your ass, I think it should just be like,

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Speaker 1: you know, I just feel like I'd be like, oh,

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00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,960
Speaker 1: that's that's a decision he came to. It's your decision, man,

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00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:17,000
Speaker 1: it's like bull riders. Yeah exactly. Yeah, they hop on

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Speaker 1: a I don't know how two thousand pound bull that

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Speaker 1: wants to kick their ass every time. Yeah, I haven't

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Speaker 1: sorted it out in my head, but it just occurred

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Speaker 1: to me only yesterday when we were walking around. It

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00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 1: occurred to me only yesterday. Why does it bother me

415
00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 1: when I hear about someone doing something stupid in a park?

416
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Speaker 1: And I started questioning myself. But I don't think bull right, Yeah,

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00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:40,639
Speaker 1: I didn't think about that example. But yeah, bull riders aren't.

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Speaker 1: Um I think people could. I think there's a large

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Speaker 1: group of people that can that make the argument that

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Speaker 1: no offense any bull riders listening, that bull riders have

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Speaker 1: a they're not, you know, playing with a whole. I

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Speaker 1: don't say it's don't don't say this. I don't say this.

423
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 1: I have like a lot of respect and admiration from advocate.

424
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,359
Speaker 1: I'm just playing Devil's advocate. I don't have any problem

425
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 1: with bull riders. Yeah, I think that's like that is

426
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:12,879
Speaker 1: like what I would have liked to have done with

427
00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:20,920
Speaker 1: my life. Man, about taunting of animals, yes, I mean

428
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 1: that's some serious taunting. But I'm totally fine and I'm

429
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:25,400
Speaker 1: fine with going up if you want to go petal

430
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 1: Buffalo and gets smashed like I just I'm done acting like,

431
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,200
Speaker 1: oh those stupid people, because I get caught in that trap.

432
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:34,719
Speaker 1: And the thing is, there's like this thing going on

433
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,800
Speaker 1: where a single hour people like oh and yeah, you know,

434
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 1: and Yellowstone or whatever, and National parks. They're like people

435
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,240
Speaker 1: think they're like theme parks. They don't realize that the

436
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:49,800
Speaker 1: animals are wild animals. But the but the same people

437
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:51,800
Speaker 1: who are most likely to point that out, in the

438
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:55,159
Speaker 1: same institutions that create that thing, are actually fostering and

439
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 1: developing that sense that wildlife is somehow a theme park,

440
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 1: you know, coming from the same thing. It's like you're

441
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,199
Speaker 1: creating this thing and then condemning people for sort of

442
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:07,480
Speaker 1: going along with what it is. Like you create an

443
00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 1: environment wildlife it's totally habituated, but then you get mad

444
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 1: at people who think that it's habituated. Mm hmm. It's

445
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: a good point. Yeah, it's a hard it's a hard

446
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:24,600
Speaker 1: thing to um saws out man. We used to chase moose.

447
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 1: I don't know why. That's not smart. No, we were younger.

448
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: We would chase him. Yeah, if you saw him you

449
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,679
Speaker 1: chase them. See how close you get to him. Well,

450
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:36,159
Speaker 1: if you didn't know they were danging, I mean no,

451
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 1: I knew, moose don't seem dangerous. We knew a lot

452
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:40,120
Speaker 1: of people don't know that. It was just like we'd

453
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 1: it was like bull riding. It was like bull riding. Yeah,

454
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:45,720
Speaker 1: oh yeah, he kick us off more. We're supposed to

455
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:48,359
Speaker 1: talk about sometimes the bull chases you, though, doesn't it.

456
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: Steve mhm um Colorado Conlo threw over one cut, threw

457
00:25:56,080 --> 00:26:00,199
Speaker 1: out one more. Listener feedback on last one last, This

458
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: is a good one. I was talking about my brother

459
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 1: in law hitting the blue gill when he was barefoot skiing.

460
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:06,560
Speaker 1: A guy rolled in. He was at a ski tournament

461
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: and um, he had a bad fall and broke a

462
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,760
Speaker 1: couple of vertebra and he doesn't ski anymore. But he

463
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:14,360
Speaker 1: was at a tournament on Pearl River in Louisiana one

464
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:16,439
Speaker 1: time and there was a guy doing some warm up

465
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,840
Speaker 1: runs and he ran over an alligator and it removed

466
00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:27,679
Speaker 1: the right heel of his foot. Forty hit alligator, peeled

467
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,680
Speaker 1: his heel off. That's the last bit of listener for people. Man.

468
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,439
Speaker 1: I have to add that one of the greatest like

469
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,160
Speaker 1: seeds of fear that I feel like it was ever

470
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:39,679
Speaker 1: planning to me as a kid as I grew up

471
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 1: in the Bay Area, California, and Tahoe's you know, up

472
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:43,919
Speaker 1: the hill in this SI areas. We go up there

473
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:47,760
Speaker 1: skiing and trout fishing and stuff like that. My dad

474
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 1: shared a story with me. I don't know why it

475
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 1: wouldn't be true, but that you know, the rattlesnakes up there,

476
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:55,280
Speaker 1: and the winner will find a den, you know, den

477
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: up hundred whatever, couple hundred rattlesnakes in the den they

478
00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:01,719
Speaker 1: stay warm through the winter. And that's somehow on Donner Lake.

479
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 1: But they're cold blooded. Huh do rattlesnakes? But no, I

480
00:27:05,520 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: know they Yeah, I might not, I might not have

481
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:11,120
Speaker 1: the right reason for them doing that, but they're done up.

482
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,000
Speaker 1: That's yeah, that's seen it. But I've heard enough about

483
00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:16,959
Speaker 1: it that it's like they like to ball up, ball up,

484
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 1: and that apparently Donner Lake, which is right you know,

485
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 1: before you get to Taho Lake on the way up

486
00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 1: into the Sierras, some manner of the snowfall and runoff

487
00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:33,680
Speaker 1: brought one of these balls of rattlesnakes into Donner Lake,

488
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 1: and that maybe this is one of my dad that

489
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:38,360
Speaker 1: told me this. Now as I'm saying it, I don't

490
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:39,679
Speaker 1: feel like this is on my dad was saying, but

491
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:43,119
Speaker 1: that a water skier fell into that water skiing and

492
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 1: the like fell into that and the snakes just started

493
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:47,719
Speaker 1: like lightening them up. The snakes have gone into the lake.

494
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:49,879
Speaker 1: It's definitely not my dad as I hear myself telling

495
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:53,280
Speaker 1: this story. But as a kid stuck in your mind,

496
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:56,440
Speaker 1: Oh my, I mean, I never, never when I think

497
00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:57,960
Speaker 1: the rest of my life be up on a pair

498
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:00,760
Speaker 1: of water skis or up doing something on a lake

499
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:03,520
Speaker 1: where I have not at least committed a moment's thought

500
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 1: to the idea of a ball of rattlesnakes floating out there. Horrible.

501
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 1: So let's talk about time Matt trying to catch a

502
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,639
Speaker 1: snake out of a hole. No, he my brother was

503
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: hunting and a snake. He sees a rattlesnake going into

504
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: a hole, and he's never eating a rattlesnake. Always want

505
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: to eat a rawls snakes. So he grabbed the back

506
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 1: end of the rattlesnake and tries to get it back

507
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:35,160
Speaker 1: out of the hole, but the snake breaks and outcomes

508
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: a couple of baby rattlesnakes. They attack him, Yeah, he says.

509
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,840
Speaker 1: They come out of there and instantly are coming at him,

510
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 1: trying to out of the snake that broke in half. Yes,

511
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 1: whoa trying to bite him? Wait, the snakes came out

512
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 1: of the other snake. Yeah, he was trying to jack

513
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,640
Speaker 1: the snake up out of a hole. I couldn't get

514
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: it out of the hole. Broke the snake out. Aime,

515
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 1: some snakes who are then coming at him, and then

516
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: he had the tail of the one he had the

517
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 1: you know, and then it goes on from there, some

518
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: nightmare stuff. I don't remember. He was he was reminiscent

519
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 1: about this the other day. Yeah, I was. He was

520
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 1: telling me that story the other day. Am I getting

521
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: it right? Yeah, you're saying top out and they're ready

522
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,960
Speaker 1: to attack. Yes, that is some total recall. And if

523
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 1: I'm um not mistake, I believe they say those are

524
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: the ones you gotta watch out for, right because they

525
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: can't control their their venom. I've heard that might be

526
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 1: a misnomer, that that is well, that maybe they can't

527
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,120
Speaker 1: control the venom, but that is it is genuinely just

528
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 1: builds up to the bigger the snake, the more venom

529
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 1: is coming at it is being produced inside the body,

530
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,040
Speaker 1: which makes a lot of sense to me. But I've

531
00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 1: heard that many many times. Okay, introl the show. Intro

532
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: the show. I'm here with Stephen Ronnella, No as, I'm

533
00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: dealon card. Just we like to do here Danny Schmidt's

534
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 1: honest first ever meat Eater Shoot Cameraman, cameraman, give give

535
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: us a quick run, give us quick career synatis oh man, Well,

536
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 1: do a lot of wildlife work. I do a lot

537
00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:13,960
Speaker 1: of wildlife work. I do a lot of science work,

538
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: s coom sort of science communication stuff, although science comedy.

539
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,920
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's all funny. It's kind of like rom coms,

540
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:28,960
Speaker 1: s coom, SIcom, science communications, science communication. I went to

541
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:34,040
Speaker 1: school for documentary film first Scientists, so you have a

542
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 1: lot of background in communicating about science and working outside

543
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 1: and uh yeah, First Meat Eater went pretty well. You

544
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 1: like thrashers Instagram page? Yeah? Could you like to look

545
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 1: at cool skate videos? I watched skate videos pretty much

546
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 1: all day. Um, I haven't worked in skateboarding film yet,

547
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:55,320
Speaker 1: but I think it'd be sweet. You know what. It

548
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 1: didn't get a sense from as you've You've had a

549
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 1: lot of through your work, You've had a lot of

550
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 1: intersections with wildlife politics and whatnot. But then I haven't

551
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 1: gotten a sense over the last few days of you

552
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:11,480
Speaker 1: being like outwardly opinionated about wildlife politics. Have you just

553
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 1: been biting your tongue as we're always spouting off about

554
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 1: how everything I ought to be with animals? No, I mean,

555
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,800
Speaker 1: have I said anything those deeply offensive? No? I haven't

556
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: been offended yet. Uh. Well, I mean it's not black

557
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 1: and white. I think we've talked a lot about elk

558
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: and the feed grounds in Wyoming, and I think that's

559
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,479
Speaker 1: a super gray situation. And you worked on a project

560
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 1: down here about wolf ree introduction. I did. I can't

561
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 1: talk a whole lot about it. Sorry, Uh yeah, I

562
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 1: don't like that. It doesn't matter what I think. Go ahead, Yeah,

563
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,480
Speaker 1: I worked on a project about wolf free introduction to

564
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,560
Speaker 1: the thought of wolf fore introduction in Colorado. Did you

565
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: get into the pros and cons? Oh for sure? God, yeah.

566
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 1: You do some feed out, some stuff about feeding out

567
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 1: during the winter. Did a bit. My second year project

568
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: in film school was about the elk feed grounds in Jackson,

569
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,719
Speaker 1: and I went into that like I think I had

570
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: five thousand bucks to make this film. Totally like went in.

571
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 1: I didn't know a whole lot about it except that

572
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,800
Speaker 1: they're these feed grounds existed. There's twenty five thousand elk

573
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,600
Speaker 1: being fed every year in Wyoming, and obviously that's going

574
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: to present a lot of problems. But man, once I

575
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 1: dug into it, it was there's a lot more to

576
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:30,720
Speaker 1: it than just stopping feeding elka. So well, it started

577
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 1: out as as I'm sure you're well aware, tell us

578
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 1: why it started out. Well, it started out because the

579
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: city of Jackson Hole, the town of Jacksonal was trying

580
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,360
Speaker 1: to form. It was in the early nineteen hundreds and

581
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 1: it was kind of one of the last places where

582
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 1: wildlife could live bison and elk, and they it was

583
00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 1: the era of Teddy Roosevelt, and they wanted to keep

584
00:32:57,280 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 1: these animals around. There was a conservation ethic that was developing,

585
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: and uh, but they these farmers and ranchers also needed

586
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 1: this great winter habitat to raise their cattle, and so

587
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 1: they decided they could feed the elk over here and

588
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 1: still maintain these herds and keep the elk out of

589
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 1: their out of their winter range, and out of their hey,

590
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 1: in order to decrease tensions. In order to decrease tensions,

591
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:27,960
Speaker 1: you have to keep them separate. And so a hundred

592
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 1: years later, that situation still exists and there's less and

593
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: less winter range for these elk ah And in that time,

594
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,520
Speaker 1: the people of Wyoming have gotten used to having a

595
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 1: huge elk population. But every piece of alfalfa you put

596
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 1: out there creates is essentially it's like making habitat that

597
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 1: doesn't really exist, right, So, not to mention, the hunters

598
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 1: in Wyoming love to have that massive hurt, and so

599
00:33:56,840 --> 00:34:00,840
Speaker 1: to undo this hundred year policy of feeding elk all

600
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 1: over the state is super super tough. But along the

601
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:10,000
Speaker 1: way these elk have I mean, they're they're perpetuating a

602
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: lot of disease right, brusualosis and scabies and foot rot,

603
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 1: and of course the big threat is chronic wasting disease

604
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,040
Speaker 1: makes it to one of these feed grounds, and that's

605
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 1: like a time bomb. Like nobody knows what that would do,

606
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 1: what it would look like. Is it going to kill

607
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 1: all the elk? What's the prevalence rate in a herd

608
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,359
Speaker 1: like that? But wildlife disease experts will tell you, like

609
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: concentrate any animal artificially with huge numbers in a place

610
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 1: they can't hold them, and you're gonna get diseases are

611
00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: gonna pop off. So yeah, I made this film. It's

612
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 1: on PBS. It's called Feeding the Problem. I got a

613
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: hundred DVDs in a Boxer title man. Yeah, yeah, you know,

614
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: you come right out punching with that title. So I

615
00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: tried to make a film that was that was pretty balanced.

616
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 1: Interviewed a bunch of ranchers and outfitters and scientists and

617
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 1: feed ground managers. But obviously I went into it thinking,

618
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 1: you know, I come from a science background. I thought,

619
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: this seems like a bad idea, doesn't seem natural. Obviously

620
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 1: it's a it's entrenched politically, but there's gotta be some

621
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:18,439
Speaker 1: way to sort of back out of it and find

622
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,040
Speaker 1: some middle ground. So anyway, I made this movie, premiered

623
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: it in Jackson Hall, and that premiere was such a

624
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:30,000
Speaker 1: trip because I had like the whole anti feed ground

625
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,760
Speaker 1: establishment come to this premiere. It was at the Wildlife

626
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 1: Art Museum in Jackson and then I didn't know this

627
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:39,360
Speaker 1: who's gonna happen? But I had like the whole hunting, guiding,

628
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 1: ranching community also show up there they were picked good. Yeah.

629
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:46,360
Speaker 1: I had somebody come up to me. We had a

630
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 1: reception beforehand. These guys come up to me and they're like,

631
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 1: you know, we've been talking about stringing you up for

632
00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 1: making this film. I'm like, holy shit. First of all,

633
00:35:57,480 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 1: you can make your own film that says whatever you want,

634
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 1: like everything anybody can make of film. And I wasn't

635
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:05,359
Speaker 1: throwing anybody under the bus. I gave everybody a chance

636
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:09,040
Speaker 1: to spout off about whatever they wanted, and uh man,

637
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,319
Speaker 1: it was a good lesson. It was a good like

638
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 1: my first, my first foray in the documentary about a

639
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: sticky controversial subject, and I think it moved the needle

640
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 1: forward a little bit. I think it got the conversation going.

641
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:29,359
Speaker 1: They sell the DVDs in the National Refuge gift shop. Yeah, yeah,

642
00:36:29,440 --> 00:36:32,600
Speaker 1: in the Elk Refuge gift shop. I mean because I

643
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 1: interviewed like the Elk Refuge manager and like, you know,

644
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,239
Speaker 1: it was a kind of a big deal during the

645
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 1: year that we were filming down there. So when you're

646
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 1: out filming with us, now, uh, do you feel it's

647
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,879
Speaker 1: just like rinky dink fluff bs. You can't really You're

648
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:47,320
Speaker 1: not gonna be able to answer that. Honestly, I'm just

649
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 1: throwing it out there. No, I don't think so. You know,

650
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:58,720
Speaker 1: I'm interested in any and everyone's interpretation of of experiencing nature.

651
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:02,040
Speaker 1: So or it's a burder or an elk hunter, or

652
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: a scientist tagging buffalo or whatever it might be. Like,

653
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 1: I think it's all interesting and part of the big

654
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 1: picture of how humans and nature intersect. So, yeah, you

655
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: just had a big argument about Doug Peacock Doug Pica. Right,

656
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 1: let's not recap it. Yeah, okay, as a little deal

657
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:22,279
Speaker 1: in poker, Seth Morris, Howdy folks, flip flap flasher, Flash

658
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:25,320
Speaker 1: flip flop flasher. Seth was just talking about his favorite

659
00:37:25,360 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 1: sound is the sound of a hard pulling his head

660
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:33,080
Speaker 1: out of a feed been music to my ears. Yeah,

661
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:36,719
Speaker 1: let's leave that one. If you need to know what,

662
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,960
Speaker 1: you can write him in. That's like dollars coins is

663
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:41,920
Speaker 1: dropping into if you know, if you know what, if

664
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:45,280
Speaker 1: you know what, you know it, I'll just I'll just say,

665
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 1: give people a quick recap. You've been on the show

666
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:53,440
Speaker 1: before a long time ago. That was a very party

667
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:55,520
Speaker 1: when you were on, it was a very popular show

668
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 1: for us. People liked it. I like that life is service.

669
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 1: Explain your deal. Yeah, man, Uh, I feel like even

670
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 1: though I'm not on the payroll for you know, family

671
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:08,880
Speaker 1: member of meat Eater, now I hope I'm on that ledger.

672
00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 1: I met you guys through uh some work you and I,

673
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:13,640
Speaker 1: you know, Steve and I have been doing with a

674
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 1: knife company, and then we bumped our way into a

675
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:19,400
Speaker 1: show hunting bears up up in Alaska, and then have

676
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:23,280
Speaker 1: just stayed you know, connected and built friendship and relationships

677
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,279
Speaker 1: with the whole crew. And my my last life was

678
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 1: a commander in the in the seal teams. So I

679
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 1: spent twenty years thirteen active years, twenty total years with

680
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 1: my time in the reserves, both running assault teams and

681
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 1: then kind of running the training for the basic and

682
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,359
Speaker 1: Advanced course of seals and how they how they become

683
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: seals and get to the battlefield and go do the

684
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 1: nation's work. And I'm a writer, uh thinker savage gentleman

685
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: tell the books. Damn Few is the first book making

686
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 1: the modern Seal Warrior, which talks a little bit autobio autobiographical,

687
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,759
Speaker 1: but very much unlike well, I shouldn't I shouldn't say

688
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,799
Speaker 1: that I compared to other Seal books very much trying

689
00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:02,160
Speaker 1: to hit the high points of what I learned philosophically

690
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: and what I believed in and what I think seals

691
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 1: believe in, and why they why they do do do

692
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,319
Speaker 1: what they do, what why we do what we do,

693
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:10,200
Speaker 1: how we feel about our families, how we feel about

694
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:13,279
Speaker 1: service the country, um, how we impact the world. So

695
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 1: I talked a lot about that. And then the second

696
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 1: book is called Worth Dying for a Navy Seals Called

697
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: to a Nation, and that one is a little bit

698
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:22,120
Speaker 1: more outward looking as far as you know where the

699
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:26,439
Speaker 1: country is going and security throughout the world, talk talk

700
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,440
Speaker 1: about my experiences on the battlefield, talk about I have

701
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 1: a whole chapter on killing, which is one of my

702
00:39:30,280 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 1: favorite chapters, just kind of organically came up in the

703
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:36,439
Speaker 1: writing of it, and UM, I take that pretty seriously. So, yeah,

704
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 1: those are the those are the reads. And now I

705
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 1: do a lot of speaking in the kind of corporate

706
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,560
Speaker 1: space and trying to figure out what that next ridge

707
00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:44,520
Speaker 1: line is. I I enjoy that. I'll keep doing that.

708
00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:46,719
Speaker 1: If you if you call I'm coming, uh you know,

709
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:48,360
Speaker 1: if you're the right the right people to talk to you,

710
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 1: but I'm I'm I feel like I'm at a transitional

711
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 1: points to what's uh, what's the next adventure? Yeah, you

712
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 1: know what do two things too? We talked about it

713
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:57,560
Speaker 1: before we do it again. Talk about the talk about

714
00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:00,440
Speaker 1: the movie you guys had Do, which is funny, not funny,

715
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 1: but like it's a funny story. Yeah, how it came

716
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 1: about and the repercutions of it. And then and then

717
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 1: talk about your speaking thing because people should know about that. Yeah,

718
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:11,480
Speaker 1: Active Valor was the movie two thousand twelve ish. A

719
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:13,640
Speaker 1: bunch of us were, you know, at the training compound

720
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 1: running training for the seals. So you're in about as

721
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:17,839
Speaker 1: close to a nine to five job as you can

722
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 1: get if you're a seal operator. You know, if you're

723
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 1: at the team, you're just preparing for war, at war,

724
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,279
Speaker 1: coming back, unpacking your gear, cleaning and getting ready to

725
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 1: go to war again. When you go to a training compound,

726
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: you're kind of that spot where you're raising up the

727
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:31,359
Speaker 1: young lins and evaluating them and figuring out who's gonna

728
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:33,719
Speaker 1: make it through the program and get to uh um,

729
00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: get to the assault teams and so. But that job

730
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:38,719
Speaker 1: is you know, hard pointed there in San Diego, and

731
00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:41,359
Speaker 1: you're not gonna you know, unless we go to war

732
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 1: with North Korea or something, then probably everybody's going. You're there,

733
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:46,719
Speaker 1: so you have an opportunity to do other things. I

734
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:48,439
Speaker 1: guess if if you want to do that in your life.

735
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,040
Speaker 1: And so this film company had come in to do

736
00:40:50,480 --> 00:40:52,759
Speaker 1: just help upgrade a website, you know, the Seals. This

737
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:55,680
Speaker 1: was all amongst This was pre the bin Lon raid,

738
00:40:56,560 --> 00:40:58,360
Speaker 1: right in and around the time of Captain Phillips and

739
00:40:58,360 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 1: all that stuff. So I mean, I think the Sealing

740
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 1: the Seals stock or you know kind of notoriety was

741
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: was becoming more there's more awareness of it, but still

742
00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 1: pretty much in the shadows. And then um, you know,

743
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 1: the B line rate obviously blew it wide open. But

744
00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 1: our our organization was actually losing more people, are not

745
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,439
Speaker 1: getting enough new folks coming into the training program as

746
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:22,120
Speaker 1: we're kind of getting older and trailing off. So we

747
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,000
Speaker 1: were having a recruiting problem. We we just and then

748
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,120
Speaker 1: and there really wasn't enough about what Seals do on

749
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 1: the battlefield or what we do as a community that

750
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 1: would lend to someone know and know why I want

751
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:33,920
Speaker 1: to go do that for a living, and hopefully the

752
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: right people are recruiting problem because what's the what's the

753
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,480
Speaker 1: pass rate of people who even enter the elimination about

754
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 1: make it so about attrition through training over since the

755
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 1: six you got to generate big numbers. It helps to

756
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 1: have good numbers, the right numbers is probably the better

757
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:53,359
Speaker 1: way to put it. Like, can you get the right

758
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:55,359
Speaker 1: product to the front door, hoping you get more out

759
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,480
Speaker 1: the back door. We haven't figured out a way to

760
00:41:57,520 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 1: skin that cat. It's it's kind of one of those

761
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 1: things where we've we've had scientists and sports physiologists and

762
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:04,799
Speaker 1: which doctors in that place look at it. What's gonna

763
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 1: get what's gonna get somebody through training? And nobody's I mean,

764
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:09,760
Speaker 1: everybody has their own opinion as to what it takes.

765
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:12,920
Speaker 1: And um, it's hard to kind of quantify because you

766
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,360
Speaker 1: have so many different personalities that come to that place,

767
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 1: and so many different personalities come through there. There's obvious

768
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 1: elements that you have to have grit, toughness, focus, no

769
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 1: quit kind of in your d n A. But I

770
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,200
Speaker 1: mean people come with that from a lot of different places.

771
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:28,800
Speaker 1: And I came from a very healthy kind of growth

772
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:32,759
Speaker 1: and environment and parents and family, very very competitive athletically.

773
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 1: But I mean I have buddies that you know, had

774
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:36,839
Speaker 1: parents that just beat on them and said you'd never

775
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 1: be nothing, you'll never amount to nothing. And they're pretty

776
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 1: too tough to beat in training too. So it's all over.

777
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 1: I got an acquaintance you made it through and I

778
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:45,759
Speaker 1: was asking about what he felt that it was and

779
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:47,600
Speaker 1: he said it was because he liked to surf a lot.

780
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 1: He said he just didn't mind sitting in cold water

781
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:53,919
Speaker 1: for a long time, and cold water for a long time,

782
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:56,799
Speaker 1: that's gonna give you a tremendous leg up that that's

783
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:59,520
Speaker 1: probably what gets rid of most people. But so anyway,

784
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:00,880
Speaker 1: this film come when he came in to kind of

785
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:03,359
Speaker 1: help build a website and a little bit of this

786
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: is who we are, what we do, and you know,

787
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 1: if you want to come do it, here's here's here's

788
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 1: how to call this kind of thing. And then somehow

789
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: that morphed into this idea of doing a bigger film.

790
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 1: So the film company actually interviewed about thirty of us

791
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 1: at the basic training compound, just to do background knowledge

792
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,279
Speaker 1: of of what makes seal seals. You know, where you

793
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:25,279
Speaker 1: came from, what you believe in, how you feel about

794
00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 1: your family, the country, so on and so forth. Not

795
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:30,040
Speaker 1: very much in the weeds on operational stuff, but it

796
00:43:30,040 --> 00:43:33,400
Speaker 1: it drifted into that very casual like all of us

797
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:35,160
Speaker 1: went down the beach, you know, sitting in front of

798
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 1: a camera, just like we did the past couple of days.

799
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:38,799
Speaker 1: Talked a little bit about but this is all starting.

800
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,360
Speaker 1: You're being asked to do, told to do, told told

801
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 1: to do, told to do. Yeah, that was that. There

802
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:46,879
Speaker 1: was not not an invitation to go to go out

803
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: on the beach and do that. But at that point

804
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: it was just this is just it's never gonna be

805
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:52,399
Speaker 1: used for anything. They're gonna film it so they can

806
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: kind of make sure they get it right when they

807
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 1: go to make this movie. They were going to finish

808
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:58,439
Speaker 1: those interviews, go back up to l A and start

809
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:01,120
Speaker 1: trying to find the right Hollywood person to play us

810
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 1: or play the guys. And when they got done with

811
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,279
Speaker 1: those interviews, went back to l A. L A did

812
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:10,120
Speaker 1: all the editing. The two directors like, I think it's

813
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 1: gonna be easier to teach seals to act than actors

814
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:14,520
Speaker 1: would be seals, if we want to get this right,

815
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 1: And so then they came and asked us to do it. Everybody,

816
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:20,640
Speaker 1: to a man said no, every single person that was

817
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:23,279
Speaker 1: in that film said absolutely not, it's not what we do.

818
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:26,200
Speaker 1: But then senior leadership put a little more pressure on,

819
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:28,279
Speaker 1: like it's gonna happen. And so one of my one

820
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: of my teams that was in the movie, he made

821
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: a really good comment. One more and we're getting coffee,

822
00:44:31,520 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 1: he said, you know, he said, one of the problems

823
00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 1: I see that is gonna happen is I know who

824
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 1: you are, sir, Like I know your background, I know

825
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:41,239
Speaker 1: the way the boys feel about you, I know the

826
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 1: way I feel about you. I know your combat record,

827
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 1: and and you know the teams you've been with, which

828
00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:49,399
Speaker 1: you know are are pretty serious teams that have done

829
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,680
Speaker 1: good things on the battlefield. And everybody that they've asked

830
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:57,319
Speaker 1: are those guys. If we say no, like if if,

831
00:44:57,360 --> 00:45:00,000
Speaker 1: if we don't do it, they're gonna get six seven

832
00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,240
Speaker 1: guys to do it. It will be the worst people

833
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:04,719
Speaker 1: in the community that say yes, Like for sure, it'll

834
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 1: be the guys that already have the Facebook page and

835
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:09,359
Speaker 1: an agent and want to go to Hollywood, and we'll

836
00:45:09,480 --> 00:45:10,960
Speaker 1: use that as a launch pat And he's like, and

837
00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:12,759
Speaker 1: that is going to be a train wreck. We'll have

838
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:15,600
Speaker 1: the worst people in our community representing the community and

839
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 1: that that actually resonated. I had already gone back to

840
00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 1: grad school. I knew at that point I was kind

841
00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:21,560
Speaker 1: of ready to go make my way. I want to

842
00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:23,319
Speaker 1: be around my bride, my kids, and it was time

843
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:25,680
Speaker 1: for something new. I've done. I turned over every stone

844
00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 1: I wanted to turn over in my my my seal experience,

845
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 1: you know, everything beyond that, which is not to say

846
00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:31,520
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have learned a lot more and it would

847
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 1: have been purposeful, good work. Beyond that, it was just

848
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 1: time I didn't. I was ready to go, and so

849
00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:38,640
Speaker 1: I didn't really think, oh, this movie will kick over

850
00:45:38,680 --> 00:45:40,800
Speaker 1: tons of kick open tons of doors. I mean, we

851
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:42,320
Speaker 1: thought they were gonna make that movie and it was

852
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 1: gonna go straight to like the bottom bin of a

853
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 1: DVD like two buck you know, Walmart. I mean we're like,

854
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:50,400
Speaker 1: there's no way this thing. It ends up being the

855
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:53,839
Speaker 1: number one movie in America, you know, Major theatrical lease

856
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:57,359
Speaker 1: and whatever. So um so, yeah, we we participate in that.

857
00:45:57,400 --> 00:45:59,920
Speaker 1: We tried to get you guys, did we talked about sports,

858
00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:01,759
Speaker 1: But I think it's the funniest part of the things

859
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 1: you didn't is all military pay. Oh yeah, man, we

860
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:12,000
Speaker 1: got we got military pay and three square meals a day. Man,

861
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:14,279
Speaker 1: you feel like this big movie, all these theaters, the

862
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:17,839
Speaker 1: lower place. Oh my god, man, your little not your

863
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:20,640
Speaker 1: little check. But there's no like, no, no, I mean

864
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 1: I think, uh, I think, all well, I shouldn't speak

865
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:25,279
Speaker 1: for anybody else. I felt good about it because it

866
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 1: felt like since we were put on orders, it felt

867
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:29,759
Speaker 1: like any other job that somebody would have adked that

868
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:31,760
Speaker 1: that they would have asked us to do in the military,

869
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:34,279
Speaker 1: and being based on you know, my job, like, hey,

870
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 1: go do that. That's what we get paid to do,

871
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:37,319
Speaker 1: so we're gonna go do that. It happened to be

872
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:40,560
Speaker 1: making a movie, made a lot of other people a

873
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 1: lot of money, and anyway, it was in that movie

874
00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:47,239
Speaker 1: launch an acting career. Um. You know, I got a

875
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:50,319
Speaker 1: lot of I guess offers afterwards, our opportunity to go

876
00:46:50,400 --> 00:46:51,759
Speaker 1: do it. It just didn't appeal to me. I mean,

877
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:55,279
Speaker 1: it wasn't something I like. Um, I mean, I like

878
00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:58,320
Speaker 1: you're doing stuff like this, I like, you know, speaking

879
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,839
Speaker 1: and talking and um, you know, I've done a TV

880
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:02,960
Speaker 1: show since and if the right project came up, I'd

881
00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 1: do it again, acting like actual just acting as a

882
00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:08,920
Speaker 1: as a UM, you know, character actor had no appeal

883
00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,000
Speaker 1: to me whatsoever. I think, you know, a bunch of

884
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 1: the bunch of the guys were extras and transformers, movies

885
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,879
Speaker 1: and all that kind of stuff, operators, not major roles,

886
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 1: but in that stuff. But I don't think anybody parlayed

887
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:22,319
Speaker 1: it into an actual um career. I mean a bunch

888
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:24,320
Speaker 1: of the guys stayed, you know, I mean I stayed

889
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:27,359
Speaker 1: for I stayed for two years. After that. I thought

890
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:28,879
Speaker 1: I was gonna get out right away. I actually stayed

891
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 1: two years longer. The people dog on you for doing

892
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,279
Speaker 1: it it, you know, the thing that was good about

893
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 1: it is yes, of course, of course. The nice thing

894
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:41,560
Speaker 1: was in general, after the initial busting of balls and

895
00:47:41,640 --> 00:47:44,080
Speaker 1: giving you a hard time, it kind of came back

896
00:47:44,080 --> 00:47:46,359
Speaker 1: to what that buddy mine who's a mass chief now said,

897
00:47:46,560 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 1: And they're like, well, I'll tell you what, man, if

898
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:49,759
Speaker 1: somebody's gonna do it, I'm glad you were rapping us

899
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:55,520
Speaker 1: as opposed to you know, somebody else. Um. I had

900
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 1: some other question about that. Now I can't here what

901
00:47:57,080 --> 00:47:59,839
Speaker 1: the hell it was about the fallout, not to fall

902
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 1: up with just the repercussions of doing it. You know,

903
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:05,880
Speaker 1: they're they're they're they're good arguments across the board on

904
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:08,399
Speaker 1: both you know, doing it not doing it. I mean

905
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 1: the back end of how many good young Lions now

906
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 1: came to the program, because that's ask what was it

907
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: regarded as a successful move for recruitment, Like overwhelmingly so

908
00:48:23,080 --> 00:48:24,839
Speaker 1: I got a bunch of people into the door. Yeah,

909
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:26,719
Speaker 1: Like we had to start at the door. We had

910
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:29,120
Speaker 1: to start creating. Well, what it allowed us to do

911
00:48:29,160 --> 00:48:30,960
Speaker 1: is instead of having a pool of candidates that we

912
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:33,439
Speaker 1: didn't really know who they were before once they entered

913
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 1: the program as best we could evaluate them, we actually

914
00:48:36,160 --> 00:48:40,160
Speaker 1: had to almost establish another program to weed and kind

915
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,799
Speaker 1: of pick the best hundred fifty or some odd guys

916
00:48:42,840 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: to go to each class. And there's only seven classes

917
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 1: I go through a year, and so we were able

918
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:50,319
Speaker 1: to actually select now what we thought would be the

919
00:48:50,360 --> 00:48:53,120
Speaker 1: best candidates, so to try and get better people to

920
00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:54,600
Speaker 1: the front board to get more to the back door.

921
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:58,479
Speaker 1: It moved the needle a little bit on graduation rates.

922
00:48:58,560 --> 00:49:01,560
Speaker 1: But um, yeah, it worked. I mean it definitely works.

923
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:07,160
Speaker 1: That's interesting. Yea, as the deal in Poker Rich, I'm

924
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:09,320
Speaker 1: sulposed to introduce myself. Yeah, and you're kind of like

925
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: done working for us now, man, come on, I'm glad

926
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:16,680
Speaker 1: I got the last one. Chris. Uh, he's got something.

927
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: You can't tell us what he's going to do because

928
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 1: he's got some endia. That's all right, there's like an

929
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: India and disclosure agreement. Yeah, I can't talk about it,

930
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:25,800
Speaker 1: kind of like Danny can't talk about his Wolf project.

931
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:31,400
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, signed it get in trouble if I start talking.

932
00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:33,560
Speaker 1: So listeners that have grown accustomed to your presence are

933
00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:36,360
Speaker 1: just gonna be deprived of you know. Yeah, they're just

934
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:40,920
Speaker 1: gonna have to try to buy my subar. All right,

935
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:46,720
Speaker 1: kick it off because it's got your project down here, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

936
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 1: it was my project. We've been trying to get his

937
00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:55,359
Speaker 1: hunt done for a few years at least three right, yeah. Um,

938
00:49:55,360 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: And we messed up because we didn't know. We didn't

939
00:49:58,360 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 1: understand the Colorado dross is the well enough um because

940
00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:06,719
Speaker 1: you're a nonresident Rooks, a resident of Colorado, and you

941
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:10,040
Speaker 1: guys are applying as a group, which what was happening

942
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,439
Speaker 1: in Colorado. There's a preference point system when you try

943
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:18,080
Speaker 1: to draw a tag that is, um a, uh, what's

944
00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:22,120
Speaker 1: what I'm looking for? Limited? Yeah? Limited? Tag, right, So

945
00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:29,320
Speaker 1: it was just more it's more demand than opportunity. And uh,

946
00:50:29,640 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 1: there's preference points. So once you get preference points, if

947
00:50:32,160 --> 00:50:34,080
Speaker 1: you have to and your buddy only has one, you're

948
00:50:34,120 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 1: gonna draw it before they do. And so however many

949
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:38,040
Speaker 1: people put in with the most points, they're gonna get

950
00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:41,080
Speaker 1: all the tags before the lower numbers. Well, when you

951
00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: guys put in as a group, um, you guys are

952
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:47,719
Speaker 1: taking like a double hit because Rourke was being put

953
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 1: in as a nonresident, because you go sort of go

954
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:52,840
Speaker 1: to the lowest common denominator, so you were going he

955
00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:54,799
Speaker 1: was getting put in as a nonresident because he was

956
00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:56,640
Speaker 1: thrown in with a non resident and they didn't want

957
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:59,840
Speaker 1: to elevate. Conversely, you'd have to elevate the non residents

958
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:02,799
Speaker 1: resident status. Was just gonna piss people off totally. And

959
00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:05,640
Speaker 1: you had like two or three or maybe four more

960
00:51:05,719 --> 00:51:08,440
Speaker 1: points than Rourke to draw the tag. But because you

961
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:10,719
Speaker 1: guys were getting put in together, you guys are put

962
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 1: getting put into the lowest amount of points. So whatever

963
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:17,280
Speaker 1: roor CAD is what you guys were putting the lowest lowest, Yeah, lowest,

964
00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:22,319
Speaker 1: the lowest status and apply the lowest points. Yes, yeah,

965
00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:24,280
Speaker 1: it was just the same same thing that was happening

966
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:28,520
Speaker 1: at Um. I didn't realize that, yeah, paralleling this, it

967
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 1: was happening to me and my buddy Ethan, who now

968
00:51:30,520 --> 00:51:34,120
Speaker 1: I'm going hunting with next month in Colorado, because we

969
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:36,240
Speaker 1: were doing the same thing, putting in as a group

970
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 1: and every year, like man, we should be drawing, what

971
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:40,840
Speaker 1: is the problem. And then as soon as we didn't

972
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 1: do it as a group, we drew, as did you

973
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:46,960
Speaker 1: and Rourke, So we weren't in as a team. And

974
00:51:47,000 --> 00:51:50,239
Speaker 1: how many uh, how many? I can't remember how many points?

975
00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:58,439
Speaker 1: I had? Four or five? Man, that's depressive to think about.

976
00:51:58,760 --> 00:52:02,320
Speaker 1: You burned that many points. Man, The thing is in Colorado.

977
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:04,440
Speaker 1: I don't know if you would have gotten much better.

978
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:07,719
Speaker 1: There might have been an archery hunt that we could

979
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:09,279
Speaker 1: have done that would have been limited entry, and that

980
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:13,040
Speaker 1: would have actually limited people. But I think where I

981
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:15,439
Speaker 1: messed up and picking out this. I had a lookal

982
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,279
Speaker 1: a buddy that lives here. I wish he could have

983
00:52:18,320 --> 00:52:19,480
Speaker 1: joined us today, but we had to head back to

984
00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 1: denver Um. But he hunts rifle seasons here, right, and

985
00:52:24,080 --> 00:52:27,839
Speaker 1: he's had very good experiences hunting during the first rifle here,

986
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:29,960
Speaker 1: and so we just very well, heck, muzzleloaders should be

987
00:52:29,960 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 1: even better basically to hunt with the rifles during the rut. Well,

988
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:36,160
Speaker 1: what we didn't factor in at all, and he couldn't

989
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 1: really speak to it because he hasn't been in the

990
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:41,719
Speaker 1: woods that much this time of years in Colorado. We

991
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 1: should point out it's it's not but you can't put

992
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:48,600
Speaker 1: a scope on your Muzzloder's your muzzleloader has to be

993
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:52,840
Speaker 1: true to caliber project out, which means you have a

994
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:58,759
Speaker 1: pretty you know, slower traveling slug and you got these

995
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:02,600
Speaker 1: open sites. Yeah, so you're not like licking ticks with

996
00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:05,880
Speaker 1: the thing you're You're not um, but compared to the

997
00:53:05,920 --> 00:53:10,160
Speaker 1: average archery hunter, you should be at least doubling your range,

998
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:12,799
Speaker 1: maybe tripling your range, and you don't need to draw

999
00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:17,080
Speaker 1: your damn ball back is kind of thing standing there

1000
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:19,520
Speaker 1: on high alert. You don't need to do a big

1001
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 1: elaborate movement. You can just get already. Yeah, it is

1002
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:29,320
Speaker 1: a factor in is the archery pressure, because in Colorado

1003
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:32,960
Speaker 1: it's over the counter archery in most units. I al

1004
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,040
Speaker 1: would say that's gotta it's gonna change that. It has

1005
00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:38,920
Speaker 1: a change. It already did in some units, um like

1006
00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 1: where I used to live up there in Eagle County. Um,

1007
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:43,959
Speaker 1: some of the units, they're like if you I think

1008
00:53:44,120 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 1: you're gonna draw it, Like this year, if you applied,

1009
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:49,040
Speaker 1: you probably drew it, but you couldn't hunt anywhere else.

1010
00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:51,879
Speaker 1: Like once you drew that tag, that like that's where

1011
00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:54,480
Speaker 1: it was good for you couldn't hunt the whole state anymore.

1012
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:56,880
Speaker 1: So I think they're gonna start doing that more and more.

1013
00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:01,080
Speaker 1: Um So, yeah, it's gonna have to be limited opportunity.

1014
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:04,960
Speaker 1: I feel like they gotta. Yeah, I think that they're

1015
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:09,719
Speaker 1: gonna have to reckon with um they're curious about like

1016
00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 1: hunter satisfaction. Yes, I think they're gonna have to. I

1017
00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:19,280
Speaker 1: would imagine if you were to pull people who hunted

1018
00:54:19,320 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 1: over the last week around this unit about hunter satisfaction,

1019
00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:27,440
Speaker 1: I think that you would find um, yeah, when you listen.

1020
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:30,160
Speaker 1: I posted a picture of us and just said said

1021
00:54:30,200 --> 00:54:33,400
Speaker 1: that we were hunting in the uh San Juan Mountains

1022
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:36,360
Speaker 1: on Instagram. And while we've been here, I got to

1023
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: um emails from friends of ours that were here earlier

1024
00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:43,080
Speaker 1: in the season, just archery, l cunning that had the

1025
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:48,279
Speaker 1: exact same experience, just like tons of dudes everywhere and

1026
00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:51,080
Speaker 1: guys that were on mules ten miles into the back

1027
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 1: country and we're just like, holy sh it, can't believe

1028
00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:57,719
Speaker 1: how many people were running into I've never um, I've

1029
00:54:57,760 --> 00:55:00,200
Speaker 1: never seen anything like it. Now we've hunted some high

1030
00:55:00,200 --> 00:55:04,080
Speaker 1: pressure stuff. Um and again you know, not having me,

1031
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 1: although we did have some local knowledge, not having personal

1032
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 1: local knowledge of a spot, it's, uh, it's a huge advantage.

1033
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:13,000
Speaker 1: You know, we all know that, you know. I mean

1034
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:17,560
Speaker 1: I hunted heavily pressured Colorado stuff for fifteen years and

1035
00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:19,839
Speaker 1: had pretty high success. Yeah, once you get the known

1036
00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:22,399
Speaker 1: area is super good. You just make the pressure work

1037
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:28,239
Speaker 1: for you. No. Um, but yeah, this was yeah, because

1038
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:30,359
Speaker 1: I think we should sort of explain the like sort

1039
00:55:30,360 --> 00:55:32,120
Speaker 1: of paint the picture of the amount of pressure. But

1040
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:35,040
Speaker 1: we're going to trailheads or not even trail heads, but

1041
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:39,279
Speaker 1: but parking areas, the end of logging roads, four or

1042
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:46,239
Speaker 1: five six vehicles, camps with multiple r VS, tents, um.

1043
00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:49,160
Speaker 1: Not only roads too, not like just like a normal

1044
00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:53,480
Speaker 1: force service road like rutted out. Yeah, and if it

1045
00:55:53,600 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 1: was like a better like an improved force service road.

1046
00:55:57,120 --> 00:55:59,800
Speaker 1: I mean seriously, we did one Like it was a

1047
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:01,560
Speaker 1: first night that we were out and I mean, it

1048
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:04,319
Speaker 1: was every possible turn off to where you're like, it's

1049
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:06,439
Speaker 1: almost like going down a river where you're like looking,

1050
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:08,520
Speaker 1: you can kind of see the next truck and you're like, yeah,

1051
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:11,080
Speaker 1: that gives me like enough space to jump in the river,

1052
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:12,960
Speaker 1: and I'm not gonna be like crowding this guy. That's

1053
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:16,040
Speaker 1: how it was. It was like every half mile there'd

1054
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,640
Speaker 1: be another truck, you know. The founder observed that when

1055
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:24,080
Speaker 1: you're in Colorado always feels like you're in someone's backyard. Yeah, yeah, no,

1056
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:27,760
Speaker 1: we've talked about it before. Man, it's ground zero, ground

1057
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:33,279
Speaker 1: zero here for loving it to death. Mm hmmm um.

1058
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:35,359
Speaker 1: And everybody, hopefully all the other Western states are gonna

1059
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:37,719
Speaker 1: be able to see how color handles it and be

1060
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:41,719
Speaker 1: able to you know, adjust and figure things out. It's

1061
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,240
Speaker 1: a conunder man, because you got like the funding problem

1062
00:56:44,320 --> 00:56:49,600
Speaker 1: where the state they need to like hunters fund Colorado's

1063
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:53,280
Speaker 1: wildlife program. Hunter's fund a lot of like public land stuff,

1064
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:57,479
Speaker 1: habitat provement, disease research, enforcement, like all that stuff comes

1065
00:56:57,480 --> 00:57:00,399
Speaker 1: from a hunter funding. And the more hunters got coming

1066
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:02,239
Speaker 1: through the door, the more funny you got, especially non

1067
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:05,319
Speaker 1: resident hunters. And so you need the money and I'm

1068
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:07,520
Speaker 1: sure there's this thing that like, man, we can open

1069
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:09,839
Speaker 1: it up and have it be over the counter and

1070
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:14,400
Speaker 1: have like and hit revenue objectives. Yeah, but at that

1071
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:16,280
Speaker 1: point they can do it here too, because they still

1072
00:57:16,320 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 1: have you know, twice as many elk as the next state,

1073
00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:23,680
Speaker 1: closest state as far as elk population goes, Right, But

1074
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 1: they're good at hiding, yeah, And I think in rifle

1075
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:29,320
Speaker 1: seasons it's worked. I mean, second season would be interesting

1076
00:57:29,360 --> 00:57:32,240
Speaker 1: to see this year because I think back in the day,

1077
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:37,919
Speaker 1: like out of the two and sixty tho, I can't

1078
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:39,520
Speaker 1: remember the number now, I think it was that we

1079
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 1: get a quarter million nonresident hunters or hunters in total

1080
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:46,080
Speaker 1: here in Colorado for big game, and like sixty of

1081
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:49,800
Speaker 1: them would all come during second rifle season. It's like

1082
00:57:49,840 --> 00:57:52,640
Speaker 1: a major chunk of that whole number all came for

1083
00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:55,680
Speaker 1: the same week, right. Really interesting to see this year

1084
00:57:55,760 --> 00:57:57,800
Speaker 1: if like that's got spread out a little bit over

1085
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 1: the archery season because we heard anecdotally that neighboring unit

1086
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:04,800
Speaker 1: a guy from a tax jurmy shop or a license

1087
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 1: sales shop. Where was that story they got to this?

1088
00:58:07,520 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 1: My buddy the other day killed a bear and took

1089
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:12,920
Speaker 1: his bear and to get checked. Yeah, it got the

1090
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:16,240
Speaker 1: yak and with the the guy that checked the warden

1091
00:58:16,240 --> 00:58:21,320
Speaker 1: that checked his bear, and the warden told him. But

1092
00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:23,680
Speaker 1: I don't know what the point, what the baseline point

1093
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:26,840
Speaker 1: was that the warden told him that archery tag sales

1094
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:29,720
Speaker 1: were up seven X. But I don't know seven x

1095
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:33,520
Speaker 1: from when. I don't. I don't even know what that means.

1096
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:35,720
Speaker 1: There's no way they're up like seven x from last year.

1097
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 1: You know what I make, I'd have a hard time

1098
00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 1: believe in it. I remember seven times more people from

1099
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:42,680
Speaker 1: a year before. I don't know what that means. Remember

1100
00:58:42,720 --> 00:58:45,920
Speaker 1: what happened when Colorado dropped there? I mean, this is

1101
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,919
Speaker 1: again just applications, right, but when they dropped the nonresident

1102
00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 1: um requirement to send in a two thousand dollar check

1103
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:55,880
Speaker 1: to apply for moose, goat and sheep, they did that

1104
00:58:55,960 --> 00:58:59,000
Speaker 1: for one year and it went like it wasn't seven x,

1105
00:58:59,040 --> 00:59:01,720
Speaker 1: it was like three hundred X. Do a better job

1106
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:07,520
Speaker 1: explaining that. Do a better job explaining. So y'all needs

1107
00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,880
Speaker 1: a tag consultant. Not really, I'll do my best, though.

1108
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 1: You're tearing it up. Man, you had that one little

1109
00:59:13,240 --> 00:59:17,360
Speaker 1: thing you missed. You couldn't think of remember what could man,

1110
00:59:21,000 --> 00:59:26,040
Speaker 1: he's already getting d M s about that super He's like,

1111
00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:36,160
Speaker 1: you gotta got um. When I first started applying for

1112
00:59:36,240 --> 00:59:38,400
Speaker 1: Moose Sheep and got in Colorado, and and I was

1113
00:59:38,400 --> 00:59:41,080
Speaker 1: a resident, but non residents would have to send in

1114
00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:45,720
Speaker 1: a check for I think is roughly if you wanted

1115
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:47,920
Speaker 1: to participate in the draw. And most of the time

1116
00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:51,200
Speaker 1: you just participating to get a preference point until you

1117
00:59:51,280 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 1: build up a certain amount of points, and then maybe

1118
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:54,880
Speaker 1: when you send in the check, you're actually hoping that

1119
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:56,800
Speaker 1: how many points you're sitting on right now might draw.

1120
00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:00,240
Speaker 1: The two I've kept up with I've got kind of

1121
01:00:00,280 --> 01:00:03,120
Speaker 1: quit doing go um the two have kept up with

1122
01:00:03,240 --> 01:00:07,200
Speaker 1: Moose and Sheep. I bet you I'm at close to ten.

1123
01:00:07,600 --> 01:00:11,640
Speaker 1: We're in there, so there's a chance at least with

1124
01:00:12,440 --> 01:00:14,760
Speaker 1: we won't get into that. But so anyways, you used

1125
01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:16,800
Speaker 1: to have to send in so if you wanted to

1126
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:19,600
Speaker 1: do so. When I moved away to participate in Moose

1127
01:00:19,640 --> 01:00:23,560
Speaker 1: and Sheep, I had to yank out thirty for a

1128
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:25,640
Speaker 1: couple of months, you know, And when that hits the

1129
01:00:25,640 --> 01:00:29,480
Speaker 1: bank account, your gals like, hi, what You're like, Oh, no,

1130
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:31,520
Speaker 1: it's it's it's coming back, don't worry about it. But

1131
01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:32,720
Speaker 1: it's not like you could just stick it on a

1132
01:00:32,760 --> 01:00:34,720
Speaker 1: credit card. They didn't accept credit cards. You had to

1133
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 1: send in the money so that if you drew they

1134
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:39,320
Speaker 1: had your money, they give you the tag because then

1135
01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:41,200
Speaker 1: they don't got to be like, hey, you won, and

1136
01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,200
Speaker 1: then the dudes like, oh, I actually have no possible

1137
01:00:44,240 --> 01:00:46,800
Speaker 1: means by which that's hold on. It's like I gotta

1138
01:00:46,800 --> 01:00:52,480
Speaker 1: sell my super and then um yeah. So that limited

1139
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 1: a lot of people from applying, especially non residents from

1140
01:00:55,240 --> 01:00:59,280
Speaker 1: applying and gaining points. So for whatever reason, I think

1141
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:01,680
Speaker 1: that all probab it felt like they were limiting the

1142
01:01:01,680 --> 01:01:04,960
Speaker 1: amount and they wanted more people to be participating, and

1143
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:07,280
Speaker 1: so they know you want to end up actually happening.

1144
01:01:07,760 --> 01:01:12,320
Speaker 1: Is that what it was costing Carr Parks and Wildlife

1145
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:15,560
Speaker 1: to do the processing and then mail out all the

1146
01:01:15,600 --> 01:01:17,920
Speaker 1: refund checks with such a large sum of money that

1147
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:23,520
Speaker 1: they're like, the system isn't working. There was their conspiracy theory. Rightly.

1148
01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:25,360
Speaker 1: It was funny because people would say, like, oh, the

1149
01:01:25,400 --> 01:01:27,720
Speaker 1: reason they do that is how much money they make

1150
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:31,760
Speaker 1: an interest where for some two months or whatever, they're

1151
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:34,880
Speaker 1: sitting on all these millions of dollars and then it

1152
01:01:35,040 --> 01:01:37,200
Speaker 1: comes out that it costs them an enormous amount of

1153
01:01:37,200 --> 01:01:40,800
Speaker 1: money to process all this stuff issue paper checks, like

1154
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:43,200
Speaker 1: there's no money making going on, yeah, just the postage

1155
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:47,320
Speaker 1: to you know, send everything back. So one year they

1156
01:01:47,440 --> 01:01:50,560
Speaker 1: drop it to like where it's just wide open. Everybody

1157
01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,600
Speaker 1: can apply for like and put it on their credit card.

1158
01:01:54,560 --> 01:01:56,520
Speaker 1: You saw to uh, you know, put up the money,

1159
01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:57,960
Speaker 1: but you can put on a credit card. And I

1160
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:00,480
Speaker 1: think that, you know, the fee was only a few dollars,

1161
01:02:01,200 --> 01:02:03,840
Speaker 1: and it went up something like three the amount of

1162
01:02:03,880 --> 01:02:07,160
Speaker 1: applicants like it just like everybody just got in were like, sure,

1163
01:02:07,280 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 1: we can apply now and it won't cost me but

1164
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:11,160
Speaker 1: a couple of bucks and and you know a little

1165
01:02:11,160 --> 01:02:13,120
Speaker 1: bit of interest on my credit card for a few months.

1166
01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: And so I just fluttered him. So then the next

1167
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:18,840
Speaker 1: year then they changed it again. And so I can't

1168
01:02:18,840 --> 01:02:20,600
Speaker 1: remember because now it's only been a year or two

1169
01:02:20,640 --> 01:02:22,600
Speaker 1: with the new system. But now I think that as

1170
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:26,480
Speaker 1: a non resident, I'm paying I think maybe a hundred

1171
01:02:26,560 --> 01:02:30,440
Speaker 1: dollars per species, per year per to get a point

1172
01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:34,040
Speaker 1: to participate. And so they you know, they try to

1173
01:02:34,040 --> 01:02:36,440
Speaker 1: find a middle ground, like they're still getting money coming

1174
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:40,040
Speaker 1: in but now as hope not as many people swamping

1175
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:43,160
Speaker 1: the system. Like I said, I'm doing my best here.

1176
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:46,000
Speaker 1: I'm sure that there's some dude a car Parks and Wildlife,

1177
01:02:46,680 --> 01:02:49,600
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know what I think people in Colorado

1178
01:02:49,640 --> 01:02:51,920
Speaker 1: Parks and Wildlife are thinking when they listen to this

1179
01:02:52,600 --> 01:02:55,400
Speaker 1: and and a bunch of them do. I think they're

1180
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 1: thinking like, yeah, man, it's like there's like something that

1181
01:02:57,840 --> 01:03:01,880
Speaker 1: needs to be sorted out. Yeah, yeah, yeah there's and

1182
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:04,120
Speaker 1: there's and again it's just the amount of people and

1183
01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:06,560
Speaker 1: it's a great place to hunt, and you know, people

1184
01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:09,480
Speaker 1: want to come hunt here, but there's a whole thing

1185
01:03:09,520 --> 01:03:12,560
Speaker 1: that's called preference point creep here in the state where

1186
01:03:13,600 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 1: like and that's why we by saving too many points

1187
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:19,000
Speaker 1: if you're starting out now in Colorado, doesn't do you

1188
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 1: much good because again, the amount of demand that's that's

1189
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:27,080
Speaker 1: that's there every single year. If this unit this year

1190
01:03:27,240 --> 01:03:29,720
Speaker 1: was five points, let's just say for the muzzleloader hunt,

1191
01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:32,320
Speaker 1: next year it might jump up to six point minimum

1192
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:34,439
Speaker 1: and then seven point minimum. So if you have three

1193
01:03:34,520 --> 01:03:37,440
Speaker 1: this year and next year you have four, but the

1194
01:03:37,520 --> 01:03:40,520
Speaker 1: cap is at seven, it just moves along ahead of

1195
01:03:40,560 --> 01:03:42,560
Speaker 1: you and you're never gonna catch up. And there's a

1196
01:03:42,600 --> 01:03:45,680
Speaker 1: lot of units in Colorado that that's happening in and

1197
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:50,560
Speaker 1: it pushes people to the open units. Well sure, but

1198
01:03:50,680 --> 01:03:53,600
Speaker 1: they're just people are just like they're upset and they're

1199
01:03:53,600 --> 01:03:55,840
Speaker 1: frustrated because they're like, man, I have you know, some

1200
01:03:55,880 --> 01:03:59,160
Speaker 1: people have twenty years of applying and money put into it,

1201
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:01,720
Speaker 1: and they're seeing the point creep happening, and they're like,

1202
01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:04,040
Speaker 1: there's no end in sight, and I'm never gonna draw

1203
01:04:04,040 --> 01:04:06,560
Speaker 1: a tag because there's and you can look at all

1204
01:04:06,600 --> 01:04:09,280
Speaker 1: the numbers and you have twenty one points. You can

1205
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: see that in whatever fancy unit you're applying for, how

1206
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:14,760
Speaker 1: many people applied with more points ahead of you, and

1207
01:04:14,800 --> 01:04:17,120
Speaker 1: how many people how big that pool is. So there

1208
01:04:17,160 --> 01:04:19,520
Speaker 1: might have been five thousand people that apply with twenty

1209
01:04:19,560 --> 01:04:22,240
Speaker 1: three points. If those five thousand people keep applying for

1210
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:25,000
Speaker 1: that same unit and there's only ten tags issue the year,

1211
01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:28,920
Speaker 1: it takes a lot of years until that that pool

1212
01:04:29,160 --> 01:04:32,080
Speaker 1: falls out, and you know, people are gonna die with

1213
01:04:32,520 --> 01:04:34,840
Speaker 1: thirty points in Colorado. You know, what do you think

1214
01:04:34,880 --> 01:04:36,680
Speaker 1: about that rich pounder you ever put in for a

1215
01:04:36,680 --> 01:04:38,280
Speaker 1: tag in your life? No, but you know what I

1216
01:04:38,320 --> 01:04:41,800
Speaker 1: do think about it? It sounds a lot like airline

1217
01:04:41,920 --> 01:04:46,360
Speaker 1: status and playing that game, man, and I play that

1218
01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:50,080
Speaker 1: game hard. Yeah, Like when you get like I could

1219
01:04:50,080 --> 01:04:53,640
Speaker 1: go into the Delta, the most crowded place in the

1220
01:04:53,640 --> 01:05:01,800
Speaker 1: Air Force. Delta allows dude, it's like, how's everybody? Everybody? Well,

1221
01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:04,760
Speaker 1: I got some fancy lounge now to through am X though,

1222
01:05:04,840 --> 01:05:08,600
Speaker 1: but Steve not always flying a priority pass or something. Yeah,

1223
01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:11,560
Speaker 1: but it's like, what are we gonna do, like landing

1224
01:05:11,600 --> 01:05:13,160
Speaker 1: the airport and he's gonna go to the delta a

1225
01:05:13,200 --> 01:05:16,000
Speaker 1: lounge and go to a different one. Usually if one

1226
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:17,720
Speaker 1: of you has access to allounge and let you have

1227
01:05:17,760 --> 01:05:21,400
Speaker 1: a buddy, tyne bucks. What the delta. So if you're

1228
01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:22,680
Speaker 1: gonna go in there, if you know you're gonna go

1229
01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:26,440
Speaker 1: in there and have a meal and have a couple, wait,

1230
01:05:26,480 --> 01:05:28,880
Speaker 1: Delta charges you twenty nine bucks to bring a buddy,

1231
01:05:28,920 --> 01:05:32,760
Speaker 1: to bring your partner or your wife or your kids. Dude,

1232
01:05:32,760 --> 01:05:39,640
Speaker 1: I'm sticking like an alien. Probably it's ridiculous. That's a

1233
01:05:39,640 --> 01:05:42,840
Speaker 1: little off topic. So, yeah, a lot of pressure here,

1234
01:05:43,080 --> 01:05:48,600
Speaker 1: and uh that I was not expecting it. Man, we

1235
01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:50,280
Speaker 1: thought we were going to be into some because man,

1236
01:05:50,640 --> 01:05:52,840
Speaker 1: we thought we're gonna be in some rip roaring bugle

1237
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 1: fest man. Yeah, with muzzleloaders in hand. Nonetheless, um burned

1238
01:05:59,120 --> 01:06:08,320
Speaker 1: all my points. How many bugles? What's that? Yeah? Watched

1239
01:06:08,360 --> 01:06:12,520
Speaker 1: the bowl silently bugle. Yeah, that's cool to see. I

1240
01:06:12,560 --> 01:06:15,320
Speaker 1: think that that happens. It's been I mean, first time

1241
01:06:15,360 --> 01:06:17,600
Speaker 1: I saw it was probably close to twenty years ago.

1242
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:20,520
Speaker 1: Do everything but make the noise. Yeah, And then we

1243
01:06:20,600 --> 01:06:23,000
Speaker 1: were the way I could tell because I couldn't figure

1244
01:06:23,000 --> 01:06:24,840
Speaker 1: out what I was looking at. And it was the

1245
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:26,800
Speaker 1: night before season. I was just out with the client

1246
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:28,760
Speaker 1: or two for just a walk, and we decided to

1247
01:06:28,800 --> 01:06:33,080
Speaker 1: sit in this place called the the Cafe. Everybody used

1248
01:06:33,120 --> 01:06:35,640
Speaker 1: to meet there for lunch midday, that's how it got

1249
01:06:35,680 --> 01:06:38,560
Speaker 1: that name. And uh, we're sitting there and of course,

1250
01:06:38,640 --> 01:06:42,040
Speaker 1: night before season, just the whole herd pops in the winds,

1251
01:06:42,040 --> 01:06:44,520
Speaker 1: swirl in every direction and they're like, yeah, we don't care,

1252
01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:46,800
Speaker 1: you know, just out in the middle for like an hour,

1253
01:06:47,640 --> 01:06:51,120
Speaker 1: and the temperature dropped just enough to where when he

1254
01:06:51,160 --> 01:06:54,480
Speaker 1: would make that posture, you could see the steam coming

1255
01:06:54,520 --> 01:06:56,960
Speaker 1: out of his mouth like he should be bugling that.

1256
01:06:57,000 --> 01:06:59,120
Speaker 1: You can see his pushing air out of his mouth,

1257
01:06:59,600 --> 01:07:02,480
Speaker 1: yet there was no sound. I think eventually He did

1258
01:07:02,520 --> 01:07:04,240
Speaker 1: that three or four, maybe a half dozen times, and

1259
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:09,200
Speaker 1: eventually I could just hear like, yeah, there was some

1260
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:13,080
Speaker 1: sound coming out. Because again, they have to bugle at

1261
01:07:13,080 --> 01:07:16,040
Speaker 1: those cows right as they're trying to accord them here

1262
01:07:16,120 --> 01:07:19,080
Speaker 1: him whatever they're doing, you know, push them around, trying

1263
01:07:19,080 --> 01:07:21,720
Speaker 1: to breed them. I think that if there's a certain

1264
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,240
Speaker 1: without trying to anthropomorphize too much, but there's trying to

1265
01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:27,800
Speaker 1: show some respect to keep them around, to not run

1266
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:32,200
Speaker 1: them off, you know. But really, yeah, but if you

1267
01:07:32,240 --> 01:07:36,560
Speaker 1: bugle real loud every other bull in the zone, it's like, oh,

1268
01:07:36,760 --> 01:07:38,680
Speaker 1: you got a bunch of ladies down there. I'll come

1269
01:07:38,760 --> 01:07:41,160
Speaker 1: check that out and try to steal them and mess

1270
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:43,680
Speaker 1: with you. And you know, yeah, like if you're like

1271
01:07:43,760 --> 01:07:46,920
Speaker 1: a you know, if you're a young single guy and

1272
01:07:47,000 --> 01:07:48,960
Speaker 1: you go, like you just stumble into the bar at

1273
01:07:49,040 --> 01:07:53,720
Speaker 1: night and it's you and like twenty women, right, you

1274
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:55,960
Speaker 1: could have then called your buddies and be like, hey,

1275
01:07:56,640 --> 01:08:03,160
Speaker 1: guess what, guess what's happening. If it was one, I

1276
01:08:03,280 --> 01:08:06,880
Speaker 1: might call one or two my best friends, but you'd

1277
01:08:06,920 --> 01:08:14,080
Speaker 1: be like, turn my phone off. Uh. Two interesting things

1278
01:08:14,120 --> 01:08:16,720
Speaker 1: about sand. Uh. We we can speak generally about the

1279
01:08:16,720 --> 01:08:20,400
Speaker 1: sand Juan's two good stories about the sand. Juan's um

1280
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:24,439
Speaker 1: one is the and the grizzly bear story down here

1281
01:08:25,320 --> 01:08:30,679
Speaker 1: where um you know, grizzlies once upon a time, hundred

1282
01:08:30,720 --> 01:08:36,160
Speaker 1: fifty years ago, uh could be found all the way

1283
01:08:36,200 --> 01:08:40,559
Speaker 1: down into Sonora, Mexico. Right. They ran from northern Mexico

1284
01:08:41,360 --> 01:08:46,000
Speaker 1: all the way up through the western the Western States

1285
01:08:46,040 --> 01:08:49,240
Speaker 1: basically from the hundredth meridian and on the Great Plains

1286
01:08:49,640 --> 01:08:51,960
Speaker 1: around from the hundredth meridian west all the way to

1287
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:56,400
Speaker 1: the Pacific coast up through the western Canadian provinces, all

1288
01:08:56,479 --> 01:08:59,840
Speaker 1: of Alaska. UM. And then they kind of got gradually

1289
01:09:00,120 --> 01:09:02,000
Speaker 1: in the lower forty eight whittled away to just a

1290
01:09:02,000 --> 01:09:07,200
Speaker 1: couple of little enclaves and and uh Idaho, Montana, Wyoming,

1291
01:09:07,920 --> 01:09:10,360
Speaker 1: Colorado had him until you know, they had him into

1292
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:13,360
Speaker 1: the forties. And then starting in the fifties like wanted

1293
01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:16,040
Speaker 1: pop up now and then like like out of nowhere

1294
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:18,759
Speaker 1: of grizzly to kill a sheep, and some old trapper

1295
01:09:18,880 --> 01:09:20,960
Speaker 1: go out and kill the grizzly. And it got to

1296
01:09:21,000 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 1: be nineteen fifty was it fifty three? I think in

1297
01:09:25,400 --> 01:09:32,880
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty three the state declared grizzlies extinct, gone and

1298
01:09:32,920 --> 01:09:36,280
Speaker 1: then in nineteen seventy nine does the dude by the

1299
01:09:36,360 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 1: last name of Wiseman oh bow hunting in the San

1300
01:09:40,320 --> 01:09:45,839
Speaker 1: Juans with a recurve. I think he had a recurve. Uh,

1301
01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:50,479
Speaker 1: some bitch doesn't. He gets most dudes probably gets mauled

1302
01:09:50,479 --> 01:09:54,040
Speaker 1: by a grizzly. There's always been rumors of some around

1303
01:09:54,520 --> 01:09:59,880
Speaker 1: gets mauled by a grizzly. Uh. There's some controversy around

1304
01:10:00,120 --> 01:10:03,240
Speaker 1: what exactly happened. But the bear winds up dead. His

1305
01:10:03,360 --> 01:10:08,160
Speaker 1: story is that he kind of accidentally cornered it on

1306
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:15,280
Speaker 1: a ridgeline somehow, and it was a sow and she

1307
01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:17,679
Speaker 1: starts mauling him on the leg and then starts mauling

1308
01:10:17,720 --> 01:10:19,960
Speaker 1: him on the shoulder, and he sees his quiver laying

1309
01:10:19,960 --> 01:10:22,040
Speaker 1: there and like his arrows spilled out of his quiver,

1310
01:10:22,120 --> 01:10:26,240
Speaker 1: And according to his story, he takes an arrow and

1311
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:30,960
Speaker 1: starts jabbing her with it, and she eventually stops mauling

1312
01:10:31,000 --> 01:10:35,439
Speaker 1: and walks off a few yards and lays down, bleeds

1313
01:10:35,439 --> 01:10:39,080
Speaker 1: out and dies. They don't keep the body. Somehow, like

1314
01:10:39,200 --> 01:10:43,040
Speaker 1: winds up that they skin it. Biologists were able to

1315
01:10:43,040 --> 01:10:45,599
Speaker 1: look and not only is like here's his female grizzly

1316
01:10:45,680 --> 01:10:48,599
Speaker 1: that suppose he's been like the species supposed been extinct

1317
01:10:48,640 --> 01:10:51,760
Speaker 1: from the state for twenty six years. But here she is,

1318
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:55,920
Speaker 1: and she had like the color of her, the color

1319
01:10:56,040 --> 01:10:58,479
Speaker 1: of her that that she had like stretched out teats,

1320
01:10:58,520 --> 01:11:01,040
Speaker 1: and the coloration on him suggests that she had reproduced

1321
01:11:01,439 --> 01:11:05,080
Speaker 1: in her life. And that brought on this big search

1322
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:07,920
Speaker 1: that ran all the way into the early nineties of

1323
01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:16,439
Speaker 1: people coming down. Um, the writer and uh, the writer

1324
01:11:17,439 --> 01:11:20,719
Speaker 1: and environmentalist David Peterson was involved with it. The writer

1325
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:23,200
Speaker 1: Rick somehow it became like a literary thing. I guess

1326
01:11:23,439 --> 01:11:28,560
Speaker 1: the writer Rick Bass got involved with it. The contrarian

1327
01:11:29,120 --> 01:11:32,320
Speaker 1: Doug Peacock got involved with it, coming down and trying

1328
01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:37,880
Speaker 1: to establish the presence of grizzlies here, and kept added

1329
01:11:37,880 --> 01:11:41,519
Speaker 1: till the nineties. And I think now there are still

1330
01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:44,920
Speaker 1: a lot of believers that there are grizzlies in Colorado. Um,

1331
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:48,920
Speaker 1: I know some of them personally, but they're new grizzlies,

1332
01:11:48,960 --> 01:11:51,559
Speaker 1: different grizzlies. Yeah, because that's the new resting point out

1333
01:11:51,560 --> 01:11:55,080
Speaker 1: because this is the Southern We're in the south of

1334
01:11:55,280 --> 01:11:57,240
Speaker 1: the States, so people are trying to establish this idea

1335
01:11:57,240 --> 01:11:59,360
Speaker 1: that there had always been something. Now there's a new

1336
01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:01,680
Speaker 1: idea that some and it's not unreasonable at all, and

1337
01:12:01,680 --> 01:12:03,960
Speaker 1: it will happen that some are gonna drift down from

1338
01:12:03,960 --> 01:12:07,479
Speaker 1: Wyoming and absolutely like in twenty years, if I had

1339
01:12:07,479 --> 01:12:11,559
Speaker 1: to make you know in twenty years there, I'll just come. Yeah,

1340
01:12:11,560 --> 01:12:15,000
Speaker 1: I'll just say in twenty years, if if trends continue,

1341
01:12:15,080 --> 01:12:17,759
Speaker 1: you will have grizzlies in Colorado in twenty years, wolves

1342
01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:21,040
Speaker 1: are shown up. It's just gonna happen. But the idea

1343
01:12:21,040 --> 01:12:23,439
Speaker 1: that they've been here and surviving this mountain range now

1344
01:12:23,520 --> 01:12:25,679
Speaker 1: despite some people that still believe because then some kid

1345
01:12:26,760 --> 01:12:29,519
Speaker 1: claims that have had one come out and falls charge

1346
01:12:29,600 --> 01:12:31,879
Speaker 1: him and basically like a dance around him and stomped

1347
01:12:31,880 --> 01:12:33,919
Speaker 1: the ground around him, and he got this whole elaborate

1348
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:36,960
Speaker 1: story that happened to him in the san juans Um

1349
01:12:37,040 --> 01:12:38,479
Speaker 1: and so but it's kind of like a thing that

1350
01:12:38,520 --> 01:12:41,080
Speaker 1: people like to believe it. But back to this Wiseman

1351
01:12:41,160 --> 01:12:44,920
Speaker 1: dude story is that a lot of people felt that

1352
01:12:45,160 --> 01:12:49,960
Speaker 1: a more reasonable explanation would be the he stumbles upon

1353
01:12:50,080 --> 01:12:52,880
Speaker 1: the bear, sinks an arrow into it and then gets mauled,

1354
01:12:54,560 --> 01:12:56,920
Speaker 1: and then it mauls him and then dies from the wound.

1355
01:12:57,080 --> 01:13:00,960
Speaker 1: But the dude took a polygraph right, took a polygraph

1356
01:13:00,960 --> 01:13:04,519
Speaker 1: and passed the polygraph that he got mauled first, then

1357
01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:08,320
Speaker 1: jabbed it was an arrow and killed it. There was

1358
01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:10,720
Speaker 1: only one jab mark. I don't know how. No. I

1359
01:13:10,760 --> 01:13:12,599
Speaker 1: think he jabbed it a handful of times around its

1360
01:13:12,680 --> 01:13:18,080
Speaker 1: neck got you. I could see if there was one hole,

1361
01:13:18,320 --> 01:13:20,240
Speaker 1: it would be like, oh, maybe he did shoot it.

1362
01:13:22,240 --> 01:13:27,800
Speaker 1: I man again, like if someone said, uh, someone said, hey,

1363
01:13:27,840 --> 01:13:30,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask you a question. If you get the

1364
01:13:30,000 --> 01:13:33,519
Speaker 1: answer right, you live. If you get the answer wrong,

1365
01:13:33,680 --> 01:13:37,160
Speaker 1: I'm gonna shoot you and kill you right, And he

1366
01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:39,560
Speaker 1: said did he shoot it and then get mauled or

1367
01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:42,679
Speaker 1: mauled it then get then stabbed it. If I had

1368
01:13:42,720 --> 01:13:48,360
Speaker 1: to like do that, I would probably go with I

1369
01:13:48,400 --> 01:13:54,400
Speaker 1: think he shot it then got mold mm hmm. I've

1370
01:13:54,439 --> 01:13:58,519
Speaker 1: never met the guy. It's a tough story to believe. Man. Well,

1371
01:13:59,000 --> 01:14:01,439
Speaker 1: the book talks about out they did an autopsy on

1372
01:14:01,479 --> 01:14:04,840
Speaker 1: this bear and one of the wounds they think the

1373
01:14:04,880 --> 01:14:09,519
Speaker 1: wound that probably did the most damage. The it showed

1374
01:14:09,560 --> 01:14:11,880
Speaker 1: the entry of an arrow is like creating a really

1375
01:14:12,120 --> 01:14:16,519
Speaker 1: round hole and puncture mark in the body was opposed

1376
01:14:16,560 --> 01:14:21,840
Speaker 1: to some jagged stabbing motion. Interesting, like it's just the

1377
01:14:21,960 --> 01:14:27,160
Speaker 1: last grizzly in Colorado happens too. But what does he

1378
01:14:27,240 --> 01:14:29,960
Speaker 1: think he's gonna do if he should? Like, I think

1379
01:14:29,960 --> 01:14:32,280
Speaker 1: he's creeping along with the woods. I mean again, someone's

1380
01:14:32,280 --> 01:14:33,439
Speaker 1: got a gun to my head. I gotta get right

1381
01:14:33,479 --> 01:14:37,519
Speaker 1: or else I die. Have he steaks right? I got children? Um,

1382
01:14:37,560 --> 01:14:39,280
Speaker 1: I don't know. He's creeping along and alvious. It's like

1383
01:14:39,360 --> 01:14:42,600
Speaker 1: holy shit, but his first inclination is to shoot it

1384
01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:44,320
Speaker 1: and then have to deal with the maybe thals a

1385
01:14:44,320 --> 01:14:49,160
Speaker 1: black bear? Like maybe? Yeah? What season? Was he hunting? Beart?

1386
01:14:49,200 --> 01:14:53,160
Speaker 1: Was he like walking around? Is that also black bear? Probably?

1387
01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:55,479
Speaker 1: I'm sure interesting? Well, if he felt it was a

1388
01:14:55,479 --> 01:14:57,080
Speaker 1: black bear, why wouldn't he just be like, I don't

1389
01:14:57,120 --> 01:15:01,040
Speaker 1: know a black bear? That's why? Because that because there

1390
01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:04,200
Speaker 1: haven't been any grizzlies in your state. For there haven't

1391
01:15:04,240 --> 01:15:08,439
Speaker 1: been any. They were declared extinct six years ago. It's

1392
01:15:08,439 --> 01:15:10,400
Speaker 1: not even on your mind. Look, if I knew some

1393
01:15:10,400 --> 01:15:11,880
Speaker 1: guy in Michigan that had a bear tag and he

1394
01:15:11,960 --> 01:15:14,720
Speaker 1: stumbled through the up no not, let's say not say

1395
01:15:14,720 --> 01:15:18,960
Speaker 1: mission because historically didn't have a guy in South Dakota. Okay,

1396
01:15:19,800 --> 01:15:21,800
Speaker 1: do they get a lot of black beards and help me,

1397
01:15:21,800 --> 01:15:25,080
Speaker 1: help me with a good state, Johnny, help me with bears.

1398
01:15:25,200 --> 01:15:29,160
Speaker 1: And there's a guy still creeping through the woods in California, California,

1399
01:15:29,200 --> 01:15:31,679
Speaker 1: creeping through the woods of California, got a bear tag,

1400
01:15:31,720 --> 01:15:34,280
Speaker 1: burn a hole in his pocket, and lo and behold

1401
01:15:34,280 --> 01:15:38,200
Speaker 1: there through the brushes a bear? Yeah? Is he is

1402
01:15:38,479 --> 01:15:42,880
Speaker 1: his responsibility to be Like, I wonder if somehow there's

1403
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:46,240
Speaker 1: a remnant, surviving population of these bears that no one's

1404
01:15:46,280 --> 01:15:49,000
Speaker 1: known about for twenty six years, and maybe I better

1405
01:15:49,040 --> 01:15:52,400
Speaker 1: investigate quickly before loosing my arrow. Or is he gonna

1406
01:15:52,400 --> 01:15:55,599
Speaker 1: be like, holy shit, a bear. Shoot? No, he's gonna shoot.

1407
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,400
Speaker 1: I think what I'm saying. I don't think that could

1408
01:15:59,439 --> 01:16:02,240
Speaker 1: be the story, because if that was the case, he

1409
01:16:02,280 --> 01:16:06,800
Speaker 1: would be like I thought, yeah, because you're so low,

1410
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:13,400
Speaker 1: you're like that Jonah Hills. I can't see your cowboy

1411
01:16:13,479 --> 01:16:16,639
Speaker 1: I can't see your cowboy boots and your and your

1412
01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:19,639
Speaker 1: armpits around the resting on the table. But go ahead,

1413
01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:25,240
Speaker 1: well yeah, just the current situation here around the table. Um. No,

1414
01:16:25,360 --> 01:16:26,760
Speaker 1: I think if that was the case, he would just

1415
01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:28,840
Speaker 1: be like, I thought it was a black bear. I

1416
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:30,600
Speaker 1: shot it and it mauled me. It turns out it

1417
01:16:30,600 --> 01:16:32,679
Speaker 1: was a grizzly unless he was trying to just sound

1418
01:16:32,760 --> 01:16:34,680
Speaker 1: like a badass, you know, and he wanted to have

1419
01:16:34,760 --> 01:16:38,439
Speaker 1: this story about you know, I don't. I don't know, dude.

1420
01:16:38,520 --> 01:16:43,280
Speaker 1: I know we're rehashed. We're rehashing someone that's been hashed.

1421
01:16:43,479 --> 01:16:49,280
Speaker 1: What's pretty wild about the story is the story of um,

1422
01:16:49,479 --> 01:16:55,320
Speaker 1: the surviving of like his night out. It's pretty wild.

1423
01:16:55,479 --> 01:16:58,519
Speaker 1: He was hunting with his guide, hunting with the client. Yeah,

1424
01:16:58,560 --> 01:17:01,800
Speaker 1: he was the guide. His sends his client out of

1425
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:05,000
Speaker 1: the woods to go get help. And uh, I think

1426
01:17:05,000 --> 01:17:07,040
Speaker 1: as he retold the story, he's just thinking, like, well,

1427
01:17:07,080 --> 01:17:09,439
Speaker 1: if they go like they'll probably be back by like ten.

1428
01:17:10,200 --> 01:17:13,559
Speaker 1: Well ten pm comes the guy. The guide had collected

1429
01:17:13,560 --> 01:17:15,719
Speaker 1: a bunch of firewood for him, you know, and started

1430
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:19,840
Speaker 1: the fire client the client. Yeah, wait, not to interrupt this,

1431
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:23,080
Speaker 1: but to go back if there's another witness there. No,

1432
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:28,760
Speaker 1: they were split up. Okay, what year was this? The

1433
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:33,040
Speaker 1: dudes still life? Maybe it could be a good podcast.

1434
01:17:33,040 --> 01:17:35,479
Speaker 1: I hope, I mean, I love to m on. I

1435
01:17:35,479 --> 01:17:39,240
Speaker 1: don't know. Uh, you know, we're just talking about a

1436
01:17:39,240 --> 01:17:41,160
Speaker 1: bunch of stuff we have no idea about. That's to

1437
01:17:41,160 --> 01:17:43,719
Speaker 1: remind listeners that we have we're just I know, would

1438
01:17:43,720 --> 01:17:47,040
Speaker 1: be good to talk to the dude. Yeah, But anyways,

1439
01:17:47,080 --> 01:17:50,599
Speaker 1: he survives all night fire wood runs out, but he's

1440
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:54,759
Speaker 1: incapacitated to the point where he can't go collect more wood,

1441
01:17:54,920 --> 01:17:57,519
Speaker 1: and so he basically shivers and bleeds, you know, and

1442
01:17:57,600 --> 01:18:00,559
Speaker 1: makes it to daylight until they get the ascue crew

1443
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:04,439
Speaker 1: in there to get him out. Very easily could have

1444
01:18:04,439 --> 01:18:12,600
Speaker 1: just slipped off and that was the last Grizzly. You

1445
01:18:12,600 --> 01:18:18,759
Speaker 1: know what's crazy is this happened on September. Yeah, septem

1446
01:18:19,800 --> 01:18:23,920
Speaker 1: are kidding me forty years ago today. If you didn't

1447
01:18:23,920 --> 01:18:27,800
Speaker 1: believe in like ghosts and whatnot, I don't know what

1448
01:18:27,840 --> 01:18:30,240
Speaker 1: that tells you. I can't find anything that says he's

1449
01:18:30,240 --> 01:18:32,559
Speaker 1: still alive, that he's live in two Down fourteen. Oh

1450
01:18:32,600 --> 01:18:36,920
Speaker 1: it was Um. What was the other interesting thing about

1451
01:18:37,000 --> 01:18:39,280
Speaker 1: san Juan's. Oh, there's another thing I want to talk

1452
01:18:39,320 --> 01:18:41,679
Speaker 1: about about san Juan's. It kind of pertains to some things.

1453
01:18:41,720 --> 01:18:45,759
Speaker 1: But and some of the same characters are involved, because

1454
01:18:46,040 --> 01:18:51,160
Speaker 1: again the hunter and environmentalist David Peterson, Is you alive?

1455
01:18:53,240 --> 01:18:59,360
Speaker 1: When was that article today? Yeah's eighty six years old, dude,

1456
01:18:59,400 --> 01:19:02,760
Speaker 1: cal him ups kicking still in this photo of him,

1457
01:19:02,880 --> 01:19:06,160
Speaker 1: his hands are bigger than his head. We'll put kour

1458
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:11,000
Speaker 1: In on it, you know. Yeah, I mean he's at

1459
01:19:11,040 --> 01:19:12,360
Speaker 1: that age you kind of you know, I don't know

1460
01:19:12,360 --> 01:19:15,439
Speaker 1: if you really need to. I mean, it's up to him. Yeah. Um,

1461
01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:17,320
Speaker 1: we'd love to hear we'd love to hear that story.

1462
01:19:18,840 --> 01:19:21,439
Speaker 1: And again, me talking about this whole thing about what happened,

1463
01:19:21,479 --> 01:19:24,000
Speaker 1: I have no idea what happened. I'm just talking about

1464
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:26,320
Speaker 1: there's different perspectives on it. And if just looking at

1465
01:19:26,360 --> 01:19:30,000
Speaker 1: it from outside purely like outside looking in things there

1466
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:32,680
Speaker 1: are I'm not the only guy to bring up like

1467
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:35,920
Speaker 1: what what now? Uh. The interest thing this is also

1468
01:19:35,960 --> 01:19:40,120
Speaker 1: involves David Peterson because he's he's he's promoted this idea

1469
01:19:40,560 --> 01:19:42,720
Speaker 1: is that one of the things we're seeing here is

1470
01:19:42,800 --> 01:19:47,400
Speaker 1: that one of the things that of like that there's uh,

1471
01:19:47,520 --> 01:19:50,519
Speaker 1: this Elkert here's declining. And there's a lot of contention

1472
01:19:50,560 --> 01:19:52,960
Speaker 1: about why this Elkert is declining. The thing that they're

1473
01:19:52,960 --> 01:19:58,080
Speaker 1: finding is um one of these guys that was involved,

1474
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:00,400
Speaker 1: it was very involved and wrote a lot about and

1475
01:20:00,400 --> 01:20:02,280
Speaker 1: commented about this search for the last grizzle in the

1476
01:20:02,320 --> 01:20:06,800
Speaker 1: San Juan's feels that Um. I think he makes the

1477
01:20:06,960 --> 01:20:12,680
Speaker 1: argument that increased hunting pressure in the San Juans is

1478
01:20:12,920 --> 01:20:19,080
Speaker 1: interrupting the rut and it's making that bulls don't bugle

1479
01:20:19,680 --> 01:20:23,400
Speaker 1: and cows aren't getting bread, and that there's also this

1480
01:20:23,600 --> 01:20:28,679
Speaker 1: edition of muzzle loader hunters in here, and that that

1481
01:20:28,800 --> 01:20:32,760
Speaker 1: is what's causing a decline in the elk kirts. Biologists

1482
01:20:33,280 --> 01:20:38,120
Speaker 1: don't on on whole biology don't agree with this assessment

1483
01:20:38,439 --> 01:20:44,200
Speaker 1: because pregnancy rates are not down and calving rates aren't down.

1484
01:20:44,680 --> 01:20:49,360
Speaker 1: But what's down is calf survivability, meaning calves are hitting

1485
01:20:49,400 --> 01:20:53,439
Speaker 1: the ground, but they're not reaching maturity. And some people

1486
01:20:53,520 --> 01:20:56,439
Speaker 1: look and say, you know what that means is that

1487
01:20:56,479 --> 01:20:59,719
Speaker 1: we have a predation problem, which flies in the face

1488
01:20:59,840 --> 01:21:04,120
Speaker 1: of people, which flies in the face of an individual

1489
01:21:04,120 --> 01:21:06,519
Speaker 1: like David Peterson, who would argue that we have been

1490
01:21:06,560 --> 01:21:10,040
Speaker 1: waging this hundreds year long war on predators and to

1491
01:21:10,240 --> 01:21:13,639
Speaker 1: now blame predators on declining elk numbers is to once

1492
01:21:13,680 --> 01:21:16,479
Speaker 1: again look away from the reality of our own impacts

1493
01:21:16,520 --> 01:21:22,240
Speaker 1: on the landscape. Well, just coincidentally this happens to I

1494
01:21:22,360 --> 01:21:25,960
Speaker 1: say that wrong. It just happens to coincide with the

1495
01:21:26,000 --> 01:21:31,000
Speaker 1: fact that Colorado's um fish and Wildlife has realized that

1496
01:21:31,080 --> 01:21:34,240
Speaker 1: they think that their bear population, that their numbers were

1497
01:21:34,280 --> 01:21:38,360
Speaker 1: off by it possibly as much as like, like they

1498
01:21:38,400 --> 01:21:40,120
Speaker 1: think it might be as twice as big as they

1499
01:21:40,200 --> 01:21:42,080
Speaker 1: as they thought it was just five years ago. But

1500
01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:46,880
Speaker 1: the exploding population of five bears to the point where

1501
01:21:46,920 --> 01:21:50,280
Speaker 1: there they've actually this year they dropped the non resident

1502
01:21:50,360 --> 01:21:53,599
Speaker 1: bear tag price from three fifty to a hundred dollars

1503
01:21:53,640 --> 01:21:56,839
Speaker 1: because they really want people out there hunting black bears

1504
01:21:56,960 --> 01:22:00,479
Speaker 1: and reducing the population for all sorts of sin. I mean,

1505
01:22:00,520 --> 01:22:02,719
Speaker 1: this being one of them that possibly might be affecting

1506
01:22:02,800 --> 01:22:06,800
Speaker 1: you know, elk heard size, but uh, you know, there's

1507
01:22:06,840 --> 01:22:09,760
Speaker 1: just black bears. I mean, you guys were last night

1508
01:22:09,840 --> 01:22:15,160
Speaker 1: in a small rural town here and and uh yeah,

1509
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:18,439
Speaker 1: tell them about that. Yeah, we just we rolled into

1510
01:22:18,439 --> 01:22:21,560
Speaker 1: a town to fuel up, and we went to the

1511
01:22:21,640 --> 01:22:24,360
Speaker 1: gas station, fueled up, and we're coming back and like

1512
01:22:24,520 --> 01:22:27,479
Speaker 1: you couldn't be anymore downtown and there was a black

1513
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:32,720
Speaker 1: bear stand there on the sidewalk downtown, crippled, crippled his

1514
01:22:33,160 --> 01:22:36,040
Speaker 1: his front right, Paul was he was like holding it.

1515
01:22:36,120 --> 01:22:38,120
Speaker 1: Got hit by a car or something, probably trying to

1516
01:22:38,160 --> 01:22:42,320
Speaker 1: get into a dumpster. Yep. It's one of those funny

1517
01:22:42,439 --> 01:22:44,320
Speaker 1: situations when you look at these these kind of like

1518
01:22:44,360 --> 01:22:46,679
Speaker 1: guys that have been talking about hunting for so long

1519
01:22:46,720 --> 01:22:50,160
Speaker 1: and talking about wildlife for so long. Um, like you know,

1520
01:22:50,280 --> 01:22:52,679
Speaker 1: people we keep mentioning, like David Peterson and Doug Peacock

1521
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:57,080
Speaker 1: and everything. It's like you get into people get into

1522
01:22:57,080 --> 01:22:59,160
Speaker 1: this thing where you you have this set of ideas

1523
01:22:59,200 --> 01:23:02,519
Speaker 1: that you you become very invested in, you know, and

1524
01:23:02,560 --> 01:23:07,280
Speaker 1: then time marches on and your sets of ideas don't

1525
01:23:07,280 --> 01:23:11,559
Speaker 1: evolve with the new reality and you wind up um

1526
01:23:11,640 --> 01:23:14,840
Speaker 1: having like these like somewhat antiquated notions. But it's also

1527
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:21,439
Speaker 1: this really interesting case study and how people's agenda can

1528
01:23:21,479 --> 01:23:26,840
Speaker 1: inform people's personal agenda or personal biases can inform an

1529
01:23:26,840 --> 01:23:29,880
Speaker 1: interpretation of science, which you which which we all would

1530
01:23:29,880 --> 01:23:32,880
Speaker 1: hope that science sits in this objective position where we

1531
01:23:32,880 --> 01:23:34,920
Speaker 1: can talk about like fact and not fact. But you

1532
01:23:34,960 --> 01:23:37,040
Speaker 1: could be like I've been hunting bow I've been bow

1533
01:23:37,120 --> 01:23:39,519
Speaker 1: hunting the San Juan Mountains my entire life. I used

1534
01:23:39,520 --> 01:23:42,479
Speaker 1: to have the place to myself. Elk hunting is going

1535
01:23:42,520 --> 01:23:46,600
Speaker 1: to ship. I love bears. What could be causing the problem.

1536
01:23:46,640 --> 01:23:50,760
Speaker 1: It's got to be other hunters and someone else who

1537
01:23:50,880 --> 01:23:55,439
Speaker 1: might be like invested in hunter participation or a guide

1538
01:23:55,520 --> 01:23:58,080
Speaker 1: or whatever. His things like, oh, that can't be it.

1539
01:23:58,240 --> 01:24:01,840
Speaker 1: I make my living off hunters. It's got to be

1540
01:24:01,880 --> 01:24:05,120
Speaker 1: the damn bears, you know. And and what we all

1541
01:24:05,200 --> 01:24:09,080
Speaker 1: like go out and run out and push whatever version

1542
01:24:09,200 --> 01:24:12,640
Speaker 1: sort of reinforces our reality. I share this seeing by

1543
01:24:12,640 --> 01:24:14,920
Speaker 1: brother dot long ago. I was talking about why, um

1544
01:24:16,720 --> 01:24:20,640
Speaker 1: did we talk about this, like why big scientific advancements

1545
01:24:20,640 --> 01:24:23,960
Speaker 1: have you are typically made by young people? Yeah? But

1546
01:24:24,080 --> 01:24:26,879
Speaker 1: Cameron FROMS on the podcast, so yeah, you definitely mentioned

1547
01:24:26,880 --> 01:24:30,439
Speaker 1: how better science is usually done by younger science. Yeah,

1548
01:24:30,439 --> 01:24:31,880
Speaker 1: I was just I was reading this book by the

1549
01:24:32,040 --> 01:24:34,719
Speaker 1: he's coming on the podcast. But this guy, Justin Schmidt,

1550
01:24:34,720 --> 01:24:36,639
Speaker 1: who's an entomologist, and he came up with this thing

1551
01:24:36,640 --> 01:24:39,880
Speaker 1: called the Schmidt pain Index, by which you can um

1552
01:24:39,960 --> 01:24:44,439
Speaker 1: index out how the severity of insect bites. And he

1553
01:24:44,520 --> 01:24:46,920
Speaker 1: just put like it's like one two, three, four four

1554
01:24:47,000 --> 01:24:49,680
Speaker 1: plus and he's been bit by everything. Every insight that

1555
01:24:49,760 --> 01:24:54,720
Speaker 1: constingua um and and ranks him and he studies toxins

1556
01:24:54,760 --> 01:24:58,320
Speaker 1: and insects, and as sort of an aside in his book,

1557
01:24:58,320 --> 01:25:02,800
Speaker 1: he's like talking about why young people make its scientific advancements,

1558
01:25:02,800 --> 01:25:06,160
Speaker 1: Like they make scientific advancements because they haven't yet entered

1559
01:25:06,200 --> 01:25:09,720
Speaker 1: that stage of their career where they're defending old ideas,

1560
01:25:11,080 --> 01:25:14,360
Speaker 1: where it's like, you put forth an idea and it's novel,

1561
01:25:14,439 --> 01:25:16,200
Speaker 1: and it gets a lot of attention, and then people

1562
01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:18,600
Speaker 1: start focusing on we'll look at this person's idea, and

1563
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:21,120
Speaker 1: they start adding to it and questioning it and questioning

1564
01:25:21,120 --> 01:25:24,320
Speaker 1: its assumptions and challenging it. And then you either like,

1565
01:25:24,479 --> 01:25:26,479
Speaker 1: you know what, damn it, you're right, I need to

1566
01:25:26,479 --> 01:25:31,599
Speaker 1: evolve my feeling, or you become entrenched and you spend

1567
01:25:31,680 --> 01:25:35,519
Speaker 1: your career, you know, being like, yeah, but it sure

1568
01:25:35,640 --> 01:25:38,439
Speaker 1: was a good idea, you know, you spend your career

1569
01:25:38,479 --> 01:25:40,559
Speaker 1: like loving it. It's hard for a person in this

1570
01:25:40,600 --> 01:25:43,040
Speaker 1: position to be like, oh, you know, we need to

1571
01:25:43,040 --> 01:25:46,280
Speaker 1: stop this war on predators two then later be like,

1572
01:25:47,000 --> 01:25:50,639
Speaker 1: you know what, man, we gradually sort of did stop

1573
01:25:50,680 --> 01:25:54,000
Speaker 1: the war on predators, and now we've got a shipload

1574
01:25:54,080 --> 01:26:02,439
Speaker 1: of them. You're kind of right. It's tough. Well, Johnny Man,

1575
01:26:02,560 --> 01:26:04,560
Speaker 1: I was trying to come up with a good segue

1576
01:26:04,640 --> 01:26:06,960
Speaker 1: because I think one of the things that dominated our

1577
01:26:07,000 --> 01:26:11,000
Speaker 1: conversations for at least for the last couple of days was, um,

1578
01:26:11,120 --> 01:26:13,800
Speaker 1: we did some hunting on the continental Divide Trailer off

1579
01:26:13,800 --> 01:26:17,640
Speaker 1: the Continental Divide Trail that runs through the San Juan's

1580
01:26:17,680 --> 01:26:21,200
Speaker 1: And uh, it wasn't until like the third day up

1581
01:26:21,240 --> 01:26:25,200
Speaker 1: there that we ran into our first through Hiker. This

1582
01:26:25,240 --> 01:26:28,200
Speaker 1: is the world I didn't know existed exactly, which we've

1583
01:26:28,200 --> 01:26:30,000
Speaker 1: had we've had a lot of fun chatting about it.

1584
01:26:30,000 --> 01:26:34,200
Speaker 1: And we ran into another through Hiker, um Denali and

1585
01:26:34,280 --> 01:26:39,479
Speaker 1: Soda where their two trail names which I knew about

1586
01:26:39,479 --> 01:26:41,759
Speaker 1: trailingas I didn't know where they how they came about.

1587
01:26:42,080 --> 01:26:44,880
Speaker 1: We still don't know how they come about. No, yeah,

1588
01:26:44,920 --> 01:26:47,560
Speaker 1: we have understand Yeah we got we gotta grasp you

1589
01:26:47,600 --> 01:26:51,120
Speaker 1: guys some research. Yeah really, Yeah, you're with like a

1590
01:26:51,160 --> 01:26:53,320
Speaker 1: group of people on the trail and they just like

1591
01:26:53,439 --> 01:26:56,280
Speaker 1: give you the name. But in the caveat remember the

1592
01:26:56,320 --> 01:26:57,960
Speaker 1: thing that the little blurb but I found on Google

1593
01:26:57,960 --> 01:27:00,719
Speaker 1: was like if you respond to it only one time,

1594
01:27:01,400 --> 01:27:04,960
Speaker 1: you're stuck with it forever. Oh yeah, So if somebody

1595
01:27:04,960 --> 01:27:07,479
Speaker 1: calls you something and you and you like ignore it,

1596
01:27:07,640 --> 01:27:10,000
Speaker 1: If you ignore it, it doesn't count. You just keep

1597
01:27:10,040 --> 01:27:14,200
Speaker 1: saying no, my name is Steve. Oh so that's how

1598
01:27:14,240 --> 01:27:16,320
Speaker 1: you don't get stuck with the trail and you ignore

1599
01:27:16,360 --> 01:27:20,160
Speaker 1: it because one dude We met this trail named Soda

1600
01:27:20,160 --> 01:27:23,200
Speaker 1: because he likes to drinking pop how to call them pop?

1601
01:27:24,360 --> 01:27:26,080
Speaker 1: And then another trail name yet Donal. We don't know

1602
01:27:26,120 --> 01:27:29,960
Speaker 1: how she got it. Should ask a through hikers, someone

1603
01:27:30,040 --> 01:27:33,920
Speaker 1: who will uh do the Appalachian Trail, the Pacific Crest Trail,

1604
01:27:34,320 --> 01:27:37,560
Speaker 1: the Conte Divida Trail, and they do it top to bottom,

1605
01:27:37,920 --> 01:27:42,479
Speaker 1: Canada to Mexico and they're the elite trail hiker. Or

1606
01:27:42,560 --> 01:27:44,680
Speaker 1: Mexico to Canada. You don't have to take either way,

1607
01:27:45,680 --> 01:27:48,280
Speaker 1: or you can just nickel and diamond over time. We

1608
01:27:48,360 --> 01:27:51,720
Speaker 1: met a guy yesterday who's just nickeling and diamond. You

1609
01:27:51,720 --> 01:27:55,920
Speaker 1: know what, Actually it's funny to dude. Nickelin and Diamond

1610
01:27:56,080 --> 01:27:58,479
Speaker 1: had a health flat for to say then the dudes

1611
01:27:58,520 --> 01:28:03,400
Speaker 1: they were just doing it. Certainly the dude, the dude

1612
01:28:03,439 --> 01:28:06,559
Speaker 1: I spent time with doing the through hike, was the

1613
01:28:06,640 --> 01:28:13,120
Speaker 1: least bragging, most unassuming. He's like, yeah, held, he told

1614
01:28:13,200 --> 01:28:15,519
Speaker 1: us he was he was being lazy because he didn't

1615
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:18,800
Speaker 1: have a fishing rod. I'm like, dude, you're walking the

1616
01:28:19,040 --> 01:28:23,040
Speaker 1: entire north to south of the whole United States and

1617
01:28:23,080 --> 01:28:25,960
Speaker 1: you're saying you're being lazy. A dude from a dude

1618
01:28:25,960 --> 01:28:30,439
Speaker 1: from London, the pair of Solomon sneakers, thirteen pounds of

1619
01:28:30,520 --> 01:28:33,479
Speaker 1: gear that was packed waiting with no food and waters.

1620
01:28:33,479 --> 01:28:35,400
Speaker 1: Thirteen pounds might have been less than that man. That

1621
01:28:35,439 --> 01:28:40,360
Speaker 1: thing was light. Yeah. He had like a Sawyer water

1622
01:28:40,720 --> 01:28:43,560
Speaker 1: purifying bottle, a bottle of Doctor, a half bottle of

1623
01:28:43,600 --> 01:28:46,560
Speaker 1: the like, a couple of licks of Dr Pepper, a

1624
01:28:46,720 --> 01:28:48,840
Speaker 1: zero degree bag, some kind of tent which I can't

1625
01:28:48,840 --> 01:28:52,760
Speaker 1: imagine fitting that pack, a booney hat, a pair of

1626
01:28:52,760 --> 01:28:55,400
Speaker 1: sneakers and pants, and some track and pulling. That some

1627
01:28:55,560 --> 01:28:58,360
Speaker 1: bitch was walking from Canada to Mexico. And it acted

1628
01:28:58,400 --> 01:29:00,839
Speaker 1: like he was if you'd run into him. His demeanor

1629
01:29:00,960 --> 01:29:03,080
Speaker 1: was as though he was walking down to get a beer. Yeah,

1630
01:29:04,160 --> 01:29:08,120
Speaker 1: Like it was just no fanfare whatsoever. Yeah, And I

1631
01:29:08,160 --> 01:29:11,120
Speaker 1: was like, I was expecting a bigger answer because you

1632
01:29:11,280 --> 01:29:16,120
Speaker 1: questioned his motive and he just and and and I

1633
01:29:16,160 --> 01:29:19,160
Speaker 1: liked his answer. He's from London and he's basically like,

1634
01:29:19,840 --> 01:29:24,639
Speaker 1: you guys have unbelievable wildlife and scenery and mountains here

1635
01:29:24,880 --> 01:29:27,040
Speaker 1: and I don't have anything like that where I came from,

1636
01:29:27,160 --> 01:29:30,519
Speaker 1: and it's just great to walk through it. And that

1637
01:29:30,640 --> 01:29:32,080
Speaker 1: was like kind of the that was it. And that's

1638
01:29:32,080 --> 01:29:36,639
Speaker 1: why I'm walking to Canada. Man. Yeah, and you kind

1639
01:29:36,640 --> 01:29:41,280
Speaker 1: of expect like, well, I got divorced and I'm down

1640
01:29:41,320 --> 01:29:43,640
Speaker 1: and out. I needed to clear my head to do

1641
01:29:43,760 --> 01:29:47,960
Speaker 1: something big, and here I am, you know, finding myself.

1642
01:29:48,000 --> 01:29:50,120
Speaker 1: But I just want to see the cool ship. Yeah,

1643
01:29:50,280 --> 01:29:52,599
Speaker 1: I just want to go see big mountains. He had.

1644
01:29:52,680 --> 01:29:57,000
Speaker 1: No he was like one of those dudes. There's dudes

1645
01:29:57,000 --> 01:29:58,840
Speaker 1: who are bad ass. You to know about it. Well,

1646
01:29:58,840 --> 01:30:01,360
Speaker 1: those dudes that aren't bad want you to to think this badass.

1647
01:30:01,560 --> 01:30:05,040
Speaker 1: There's badasses that want you to know they're badasses. Then

1648
01:30:05,080 --> 01:30:08,760
Speaker 1: there's like badasses that that no, o, they're badasses, but

1649
01:30:08,800 --> 01:30:12,120
Speaker 1: they intentionally underplay it as sort of a move. And

1650
01:30:12,120 --> 01:30:13,880
Speaker 1: then there's a dude who's a badass. He doesn't even

1651
01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:19,519
Speaker 1: know he's a badass. He fell in the It hasn't

1652
01:30:19,520 --> 01:30:22,519
Speaker 1: even occurred to him that he's a badass. Dude, I

1653
01:30:22,560 --> 01:30:26,120
Speaker 1: wish we had that kind of podcast. Man walking some

1654
01:30:26,240 --> 01:30:28,599
Speaker 1: of bit. He said. Some days he walks thirty miles,

1655
01:30:30,120 --> 01:30:32,759
Speaker 1: just plops down wherever he is, wakes up, keeps walking.

1656
01:30:33,439 --> 01:30:35,360
Speaker 1: The only parts he doesn't like was when there's no water,

1657
01:30:36,880 --> 01:30:41,840
Speaker 1: which is yeah, he had some nasty stories drinking out

1658
01:30:41,840 --> 01:30:45,720
Speaker 1: of stockponds, drinking out of stockponds and wyoming. How sick

1659
01:30:45,760 --> 01:30:49,479
Speaker 1: you get that manure flavored water. Yeah, he said, it's

1660
01:30:49,560 --> 01:30:52,559
Speaker 1: not fun when you have to force yourself to drink

1661
01:30:52,600 --> 01:30:55,480
Speaker 1: the water because it tastes so bad. It's all so bad.

1662
01:30:55,720 --> 01:30:58,599
Speaker 1: And he talked about interesting kind of hunger as he says,

1663
01:30:58,640 --> 01:31:02,760
Speaker 1: you get hungry to a point where hunger wakes you

1664
01:31:02,880 --> 01:31:06,200
Speaker 1: up in the middle of the night, which is an

1665
01:31:06,200 --> 01:31:08,880
Speaker 1: interesting kind of hunger. Yeah, I don't know if I've

1666
01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:10,840
Speaker 1: ever I don't think I've never woke up with the

1667
01:31:11,000 --> 01:31:12,760
Speaker 1: woke up and having to be like the thing that

1668
01:31:12,840 --> 01:31:16,719
Speaker 1: woke me up was hunger. And he was packing ramen,

1669
01:31:16,760 --> 01:31:24,120
Speaker 1: noodles and rice. He says freeze drives too expensive days.

1670
01:31:24,160 --> 01:31:28,000
Speaker 1: Have you ever been out of food long enough? You know?

1671
01:31:28,000 --> 01:31:29,679
Speaker 1: When I finished field train, they sent me to ranger

1672
01:31:29,720 --> 01:31:33,720
Speaker 1: school and Range Army Ranger schools kind of system for

1673
01:31:33,920 --> 01:31:37,679
Speaker 1: making you crazy uncomfortable is doing a lot of packing

1674
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:40,000
Speaker 1: and humping through mountains and things like that, but it

1675
01:31:40,640 --> 01:31:43,400
Speaker 1: is starvation. They give you one m r E a

1676
01:31:43,479 --> 01:31:47,679
Speaker 1: day when you're operating at a very very high intensity level.

1677
01:31:47,960 --> 01:31:51,880
Speaker 1: I wouldn't say I woke up from hunger. We thought

1678
01:31:51,960 --> 01:31:56,599
Speaker 1: about food constantly the entire time you're in the field. There,

1679
01:31:57,080 --> 01:32:00,879
Speaker 1: you're probably thinking more about food than like the combat

1680
01:32:01,520 --> 01:32:03,960
Speaker 1: scenario that they're running. How many calories in an m

1681
01:32:04,040 --> 01:32:08,320
Speaker 1: R E. They're pretty calorie dens. I mean they're they're

1682
01:32:08,320 --> 01:32:11,040
Speaker 1: they're made to be, you know, rations for troops in

1683
01:32:11,040 --> 01:32:12,600
Speaker 1: the field. I I don't know what the numbers, but

1684
01:32:12,640 --> 01:32:15,120
Speaker 1: I mean one is not enough to what we're doing.

1685
01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:16,800
Speaker 1: And if you're on a patrol. You could be on

1686
01:32:16,800 --> 01:32:19,759
Speaker 1: a patrol at night, you'd have fifty people in your company,

1687
01:32:19,840 --> 01:32:25,719
Speaker 1: so spread out, you know, six yards apart. Somebody drops

1688
01:32:25,760 --> 01:32:28,240
Speaker 1: like a skittle that they'd squirreled away from their m

1689
01:32:28,360 --> 01:32:32,519
Speaker 1: R Like you could smell it from smell it, Like

1690
01:32:32,600 --> 01:32:36,759
Speaker 1: somebody is eating a skittle and somebody might have dropped

1691
01:32:37,479 --> 01:32:42,760
Speaker 1: skin and I and everybody knows. Everybody knows what's in

1692
01:32:42,800 --> 01:32:46,160
Speaker 1: the m R E. I got pneumonia during the course,

1693
01:32:46,320 --> 01:32:49,400
Speaker 1: and so they pulled me from from the block of

1694
01:32:49,439 --> 01:32:52,280
Speaker 1: trainers and they sent me the hospital. If I don't

1695
01:32:52,360 --> 01:32:55,360
Speaker 1: finish this course straight through, I won't start with my

1696
01:32:55,400 --> 01:32:58,240
Speaker 1: Advanced Seal Tactical Training Team to earn my tried and

1697
01:32:58,240 --> 01:33:02,120
Speaker 1: to like actually become a seal until like six months later. Like,

1698
01:33:02,360 --> 01:33:04,040
Speaker 1: if I got back from Rangers, go on time, I

1699
01:33:04,040 --> 01:33:06,160
Speaker 1: get to start with that class and become a Seal,

1700
01:33:06,240 --> 01:33:08,920
Speaker 1: Like real deal with the team. If I get bumped

1701
01:33:09,000 --> 01:33:11,800
Speaker 1: or rolled in this Ranger class and delayed that extra

1702
01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:14,200
Speaker 1: whatever three weeks, I would have to wait six My

1703
01:33:14,560 --> 01:33:18,400
Speaker 1: seal dream was now six eight months further away. So

1704
01:33:18,400 --> 01:33:19,960
Speaker 1: there's no way I wasn't making through this course. They

1705
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:23,320
Speaker 1: take me this hospital, doctors checking, a bunch of troops

1706
01:33:23,320 --> 01:33:25,639
Speaker 1: coming to me. He's like, yeah, pneumonia, gotta pull you.

1707
01:33:26,680 --> 01:33:31,280
Speaker 1: I was like, sir, please, what's the worst that happens

1708
01:33:31,280 --> 01:33:32,800
Speaker 1: if you don't pull me. He's like, you know, you'll

1709
01:33:32,800 --> 01:33:34,200
Speaker 1: pass out. You'd be in big trouble. I was like,

1710
01:33:35,080 --> 01:33:37,160
Speaker 1: can we make that deal. I'll come back. You see

1711
01:33:37,200 --> 01:33:38,920
Speaker 1: me again. I'm willing to run the ridge. Like now

1712
01:33:38,960 --> 01:33:41,599
Speaker 1: I gotta pull. He walks out of the room. Nurse

1713
01:33:41,640 --> 01:33:43,280
Speaker 1: comes in and was like, well, the docks I set

1714
01:33:43,320 --> 01:33:46,880
Speaker 1: up good to go. She's like yeah. I was like yep.

1715
01:33:47,720 --> 01:33:50,639
Speaker 1: So she takes me out to the waiting room where

1716
01:33:50,640 --> 01:33:53,920
Speaker 1: the Ranger you know whatever folks would bring you back

1717
01:33:53,920 --> 01:33:56,880
Speaker 1: to the class. The whole time, I'm just praying I

1718
01:33:56,920 --> 01:34:00,960
Speaker 1: don't get made. She sits me in a little lounge area,

1719
01:34:01,080 --> 01:34:03,719
Speaker 1: and there were some bags of candy, like just little

1720
01:34:03,720 --> 01:34:05,400
Speaker 1: bags of candy, and there were peanut m and m's,

1721
01:34:05,439 --> 01:34:08,000
Speaker 1: which do not come in m R. E's, So I

1722
01:34:08,040 --> 01:34:12,120
Speaker 1: pocket one of those things. Dan takes me back to

1723
01:34:12,120 --> 01:34:14,439
Speaker 1: my company. I get back out and that night I'm

1724
01:34:14,479 --> 01:34:18,080
Speaker 1: back with my team and uh my squad, like my

1725
01:34:18,200 --> 01:34:20,759
Speaker 1: four little dudes in this gun nest in this patrol

1726
01:34:20,760 --> 01:34:22,840
Speaker 1: base of this triangle patrol base where you'd set up

1727
01:34:22,840 --> 01:34:25,599
Speaker 1: like it's old school tactics, where you'd set up three

1728
01:34:26,120 --> 01:34:28,120
Speaker 1: you know, the apex of the triangle. You'd have a

1729
01:34:28,120 --> 01:34:30,160
Speaker 1: big machine gun nests and everybody spread out in a

1730
01:34:30,200 --> 01:34:32,679
Speaker 1: triangle around it with defensive positions, leaderships in the middle,

1731
01:34:32,760 --> 01:34:35,759
Speaker 1: like making plans or whatever. I break out those peanut

1732
01:34:35,840 --> 01:34:38,240
Speaker 1: m and m's, you know, pass seven eight of them

1733
01:34:38,240 --> 01:34:41,120
Speaker 1: to each guy, and like the two dudes that weren't

1734
01:34:41,120 --> 01:34:43,160
Speaker 1: in our gun nests, they're like sitting there, can like

1735
01:34:43,240 --> 01:34:45,280
Speaker 1: smell the peanut m and ms. They're like looking up

1736
01:34:45,320 --> 01:34:47,400
Speaker 1: and they know for sure peanut m and ms don't

1737
01:34:47,439 --> 01:34:50,120
Speaker 1: come in an m R. E. And I'm looking over

1738
01:34:50,200 --> 01:34:52,320
Speaker 1: doing this to them, like if you say something to

1739
01:34:52,360 --> 01:34:54,680
Speaker 1: an instructor that like I brought these peanut and m m,

1740
01:34:55,000 --> 01:34:56,920
Speaker 1: it gets over for you. So if we're don't wrap

1741
01:34:56,920 --> 01:34:58,160
Speaker 1: me out, because like if you got if you got

1742
01:34:58,200 --> 01:34:59,639
Speaker 1: caught with something you were supposed to have, you get

1743
01:34:59,680 --> 01:35:02,479
Speaker 1: kicked out the program. But I made it through and

1744
01:35:02,520 --> 01:35:04,599
Speaker 1: got back to my team. But I was hungry, man.

1745
01:35:04,720 --> 01:35:06,080
Speaker 1: And the thing you want, the thing you want when

1746
01:35:06,080 --> 01:35:08,000
Speaker 1: you're that hungry as sugar. Sugar is the thing you

1747
01:35:08,040 --> 01:35:10,040
Speaker 1: want more, you know, you know what I what I

1748
01:35:10,040 --> 01:35:11,840
Speaker 1: want when I get super hungry is the ship that

1749
01:35:12,080 --> 01:35:15,280
Speaker 1: uh you're only going like a big gas station off

1750
01:35:15,320 --> 01:35:19,120
Speaker 1: the highway. You got those glass cases full of like

1751
01:35:19,200 --> 01:35:24,479
Speaker 1: all that brown food. When I get like hungry, I

1752
01:35:24,560 --> 01:35:29,479
Speaker 1: think about going in and smashing going over to the

1753
01:35:29,479 --> 01:35:31,200
Speaker 1: side of my truck where I keep my pick axe

1754
01:35:31,240 --> 01:35:33,760
Speaker 1: mounted to the outside of my truck, and coming in

1755
01:35:33,840 --> 01:35:37,519
Speaker 1: and smashing that glass case open and eating all that

1756
01:35:37,560 --> 01:35:39,280
Speaker 1: brown food out of the inside of that thing. Why

1757
01:35:39,280 --> 01:35:41,320
Speaker 1: don't you just open the door to the case. It's

1758
01:35:41,320 --> 01:35:43,400
Speaker 1: gotta be just I'm just that hungry. The drama. Yeah,

1759
01:35:43,520 --> 01:35:45,720
Speaker 1: you don't have time. I don't want shattered glass all

1760
01:35:45,720 --> 01:35:48,320
Speaker 1: over all over the food. Yeah, to get into one

1761
01:35:48,320 --> 01:35:51,599
Speaker 1: of them brown food cases, because sometimes they take those things.

1762
01:35:51,640 --> 01:35:53,519
Speaker 1: It's like that you make like a breedo and fill

1763
01:35:53,560 --> 01:35:56,519
Speaker 1: it full of a real low grade barbecue meat and

1764
01:35:56,520 --> 01:35:58,439
Speaker 1: then deep fry that thing and then put it in

1765
01:35:58,439 --> 01:36:00,719
Speaker 1: that case under that red glue lamp for a few days.

1766
01:36:00,800 --> 01:36:05,320
Speaker 1: Oh my god, those things look good. Maybe this is

1767
01:36:05,400 --> 01:36:08,120
Speaker 1: just for a personal deal with me, but I feel

1768
01:36:08,120 --> 01:36:09,840
Speaker 1: like it for me, it was much worse when I

1769
01:36:09,880 --> 01:36:12,880
Speaker 1: was younger, Like we went and did our honeymoon in

1770
01:36:12,920 --> 01:36:15,840
Speaker 1: New Zealand and backpacked around for like five or six weeks,

1771
01:36:16,200 --> 01:36:17,840
Speaker 1: and I feel like that's all I could think about

1772
01:36:17,840 --> 01:36:19,240
Speaker 1: as soon as I get on the trail, and we'd

1773
01:36:19,240 --> 01:36:21,120
Speaker 1: be out there just long enough to be away from,

1774
01:36:21,160 --> 01:36:23,639
Speaker 1: you know, restaurant food. I just be like, next meal,

1775
01:36:23,800 --> 01:36:25,640
Speaker 1: next meal, what's in the pack? I can't wait to

1776
01:36:25,640 --> 01:36:27,599
Speaker 1: eat that, this, that and the other. Now I feel

1777
01:36:27,600 --> 01:36:31,280
Speaker 1: like I haven't had those thoughts on the trail for

1778
01:36:31,680 --> 01:36:33,599
Speaker 1: I don't get on the trail. I get as soon

1779
01:36:33,600 --> 01:36:37,919
Speaker 1: as I stop hiking, you start thinking about food, smashing

1780
01:36:37,960 --> 01:36:41,639
Speaker 1: the gas station glass case and raiding the brown fisture. Well,

1781
01:36:41,760 --> 01:36:43,880
Speaker 1: I'm just saying in general, when you're out in the woods,

1782
01:36:43,880 --> 01:36:46,200
Speaker 1: like I just don't And maybe I'm just better at

1783
01:36:46,200 --> 01:36:49,799
Speaker 1: feeding myself. I don't know. The sugar thing is interesting

1784
01:36:49,840 --> 01:36:53,200
Speaker 1: because we got done with a pretty big hike the

1785
01:36:53,240 --> 01:36:54,720
Speaker 1: other morning. When we were sitting there, when we met

1786
01:36:54,720 --> 01:36:59,080
Speaker 1: Soda Pop and I think his name was Soda. Referred

1787
01:36:59,120 --> 01:37:04,760
Speaker 1: to him to his face has has old, but his

1788
01:37:05,680 --> 01:37:09,679
Speaker 1: real name was Soda Trail. His trail name Soda. Yeah,

1789
01:37:09,720 --> 01:37:12,040
Speaker 1: we met Soda. We had a giant bag of gummy

1790
01:37:12,080 --> 01:37:13,960
Speaker 1: bears and we bought when we went grocery shopping like

1791
01:37:14,000 --> 01:37:16,960
Speaker 1: we do before all these trips and those went fast. Man,

1792
01:37:17,760 --> 01:37:21,320
Speaker 1: like you notice this sort of uh you hand He

1793
01:37:21,360 --> 01:37:22,880
Speaker 1: tried to hand him a handful of pro bars and

1794
01:37:22,920 --> 01:37:25,080
Speaker 1: he wouldn't take him. Yeah, he didn't. He refused. I

1795
01:37:25,080 --> 01:37:27,600
Speaker 1: just saw offered him any just a snack because the

1796
01:37:27,640 --> 01:37:30,080
Speaker 1: restaurants were sitting around eating and I figured this guy

1797
01:37:30,160 --> 01:37:35,000
Speaker 1: hes been felt like he wanted it, but I wouldn't

1798
01:37:35,000 --> 01:37:37,639
Speaker 1: take it. He was wasn't he going into town? Yeah,

1799
01:37:37,840 --> 01:37:39,800
Speaker 1: he felt like he wanted he didn't take it. He

1800
01:37:39,880 --> 01:37:42,799
Speaker 1: was fixing to have a good meal in town. Dude,

1801
01:37:42,920 --> 01:37:46,439
Speaker 1: all we had to offer bars man for four months.

1802
01:37:46,479 --> 01:37:48,200
Speaker 1: I don't think he wants to look at another bar

1803
01:37:48,360 --> 01:37:54,639
Speaker 1: when he knows that there's want a bowl rice? Uh yeah,

1804
01:37:54,760 --> 01:38:00,960
Speaker 1: so we've been dogging on that. There's there's expectations. Oh,

1805
01:38:01,120 --> 01:38:04,519
Speaker 1: that's almost your day with this ecological principle. My brother

1806
01:38:04,600 --> 01:38:11,360
Speaker 1: just introduced me to um opt the optimal niche did.

1807
01:38:11,360 --> 01:38:16,240
Speaker 1: They teach about this in forestry optimal optimal niche and

1808
01:38:16,400 --> 01:38:23,040
Speaker 1: realized niche. As some people might say, where do you

1809
01:38:23,080 --> 01:38:25,240
Speaker 1: go with rour? You're good at Yeah, you're very good.

1810
01:38:25,600 --> 01:38:29,680
Speaker 1: One of the things. You're very very good at pronunciation

1811
01:38:29,760 --> 01:38:32,080
Speaker 1: and annunciation. I like that stuff is important to me.

1812
01:38:32,120 --> 01:38:35,200
Speaker 1: But I have a little bit of a like. I

1813
01:38:35,240 --> 01:38:38,080
Speaker 1: don't like when people use it's like the one word

1814
01:38:38,080 --> 01:38:41,280
Speaker 1: out of character that they use that whatever the standard

1815
01:38:41,960 --> 01:38:45,160
Speaker 1: variant of, they pick the one that's a little bit cooler,

1816
01:38:46,560 --> 01:38:50,360
Speaker 1: you know, Like, what's a good example our last president

1817
01:38:50,400 --> 01:38:52,720
Speaker 1: being like Pakistan. You know what you'd say it like,

1818
01:38:52,720 --> 01:38:55,800
Speaker 1: it's Pakistan man. We all say Pakistan. I know they

1819
01:38:55,880 --> 01:38:57,400
Speaker 1: might say it, that's not the way we say it.

1820
01:38:57,760 --> 01:39:00,439
Speaker 1: I got you, So for me, I say niche. My

1821
01:39:00,479 --> 01:39:03,879
Speaker 1: wife is leaning on me very heavily to stop saying Iran.

1822
01:39:06,600 --> 01:39:09,599
Speaker 1: She has a friend from there. She's like, please, it's

1823
01:39:09,640 --> 01:39:11,720
Speaker 1: not Iran. I'm like, I just think it is. Now,

1824
01:39:12,479 --> 01:39:16,120
Speaker 1: how do you pronounce it? You're wrong, I can't do it.

1825
01:39:16,640 --> 01:39:21,240
Speaker 1: You can't say chile. Yeah exactly, I feel the same chili. Sorry.

1826
01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:25,960
Speaker 1: Uh yeah. I don't walk around saying you guys should

1827
01:39:25,960 --> 01:39:34,360
Speaker 1: all call it a latvia. Uh. This has not to

1828
01:39:34,360 --> 01:39:36,200
Speaker 1: do with anybody. I think it's a really interesting idea.

1829
01:39:36,439 --> 01:39:41,479
Speaker 1: Is Um, we're hiking up elk Hunton back home, and

1830
01:39:42,200 --> 01:39:45,120
Speaker 1: we're looking at there's a lot of just shiploads of raspberries,

1831
01:39:46,000 --> 01:39:47,840
Speaker 1: and it just so happens that I've been clearing a

1832
01:39:47,880 --> 01:39:50,120
Speaker 1: place in my yard to start my own raspberry patch,

1833
01:39:50,160 --> 01:39:52,679
Speaker 1: and there's all these wild raspberries. And I was saying

1834
01:39:52,680 --> 01:39:55,679
Speaker 1: to my brother, who deals in plants, he's an a cologist. Um,

1835
01:39:55,840 --> 01:39:58,360
Speaker 1: I was saying, Hey, what do you think if I

1836
01:39:58,400 --> 01:40:02,760
Speaker 1: took this little ship in raspberries and brought them home?

1837
01:40:03,640 --> 01:40:05,360
Speaker 1: Would they be like, this is the greatest place on

1838
01:40:05,439 --> 01:40:08,639
Speaker 1: earth and grow into the giant raspberries that you grow

1839
01:40:08,680 --> 01:40:11,280
Speaker 1: in your yard where they always be little ship in

1840
01:40:11,840 --> 01:40:15,040
Speaker 1: mountain raspberries. And he said, I don't know the answer

1841
01:40:15,080 --> 01:40:17,000
Speaker 1: to that. I could see it going both ways. And

1842
01:40:17,000 --> 01:40:21,040
Speaker 1: he said, but there's this thing, there's uh optimal niche

1843
01:40:21,400 --> 01:40:25,360
Speaker 1: I think the optimal niche and realize niche, meaning there

1844
01:40:25,400 --> 01:40:29,680
Speaker 1: are probably many plant species that would like to be

1845
01:40:30,760 --> 01:40:36,000
Speaker 1: in a certain place, like ideally they would occupy this niche.

1846
01:40:36,720 --> 01:40:39,200
Speaker 1: But because it's suitable for a lot of plant species

1847
01:40:39,200 --> 01:40:41,840
Speaker 1: and it's very perfect for plants, there's a lot of

1848
01:40:41,880 --> 01:40:46,639
Speaker 1: pressure there, and plants have varying degrees of being able

1849
01:40:46,680 --> 01:40:49,559
Speaker 1: to deal with stress, and they have varying degrees of

1850
01:40:49,600 --> 01:40:53,040
Speaker 1: being able to combat other plants through the production of

1851
01:40:53,120 --> 01:40:56,639
Speaker 1: toxins and aggressive rhizome structures, and they don't do well

1852
01:40:56,680 --> 01:41:01,360
Speaker 1: in battles, so they wind up grow owing not where

1853
01:41:01,360 --> 01:41:04,679
Speaker 1: they should grow, but they grow where they can grow.

1854
01:41:06,400 --> 01:41:09,600
Speaker 1: And he was saying it maybe that this plant's stature

1855
01:41:10,400 --> 01:41:13,360
Speaker 1: is the result of it's not where it really I

1856
01:41:13,400 --> 01:41:15,439
Speaker 1: would love to be, it's just where it can be.

1857
01:41:15,560 --> 01:41:18,320
Speaker 1: It's a low pressure, low stress environment for to be.

1858
01:41:18,760 --> 01:41:20,600
Speaker 1: And if you had some little plot of ground and

1859
01:41:20,600 --> 01:41:23,200
Speaker 1: you plucked every freaking weed out of there and made

1860
01:41:23,200 --> 01:41:25,840
Speaker 1: it perfect and put him there, he might then realize

1861
01:41:25,880 --> 01:41:28,840
Speaker 1: his full potential of what he, like quote should look like,

1862
01:41:29,840 --> 01:41:33,240
Speaker 1: which is a thought was an interesting idea. Um I

1863
01:41:33,320 --> 01:41:36,280
Speaker 1: bring it up because we had come into this with

1864
01:41:36,760 --> 01:41:40,840
Speaker 1: high expectations you'll see that this is a horrible segment

1865
01:41:40,840 --> 01:41:42,320
Speaker 1: because its not the same ship, but it has to

1866
01:41:42,320 --> 01:41:44,880
Speaker 1: do with like the realized thing and you had observation

1867
01:41:45,000 --> 01:41:47,880
Speaker 1: last night. We're like, once I got over the of

1868
01:41:47,880 --> 01:41:50,160
Speaker 1: being in this unit L County, once I got over

1869
01:41:50,200 --> 01:41:53,280
Speaker 1: the disappointment of it not being what I realized what

1870
01:41:53,360 --> 01:41:58,120
Speaker 1: I wanted and aligned my expectations that wanted being okay,

1871
01:41:58,360 --> 01:41:59,640
Speaker 1: Like I want to be in an okay place to

1872
01:41:59,680 --> 01:42:03,360
Speaker 1: run run around. It just took five days to get

1873
01:42:03,360 --> 01:42:10,600
Speaker 1: over the man. Yeah, another truck, another guy. In the end,

1874
01:42:10,640 --> 01:42:12,600
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, it's pretty fun and I gotta be

1875
01:42:12,600 --> 01:42:15,240
Speaker 1: totally honest. Man. On day one, on day one of

1876
01:42:15,280 --> 01:42:21,240
Speaker 1: the hunt, we heard a bugle. Um wrote it off

1877
01:42:21,240 --> 01:42:23,280
Speaker 1: as being a mug. Kind of wrote it off as

1878
01:42:23,280 --> 01:42:27,160
Speaker 1: being a mug. Had to be a person got in there. Well,

1879
01:42:27,240 --> 01:42:30,200
Speaker 1: we might have heard the person. Oh it could be

1880
01:42:30,200 --> 01:42:32,360
Speaker 1: because we only heard one. The rest of the crew

1881
01:42:32,880 --> 01:42:36,160
Speaker 1: was listening to was sounding like a bugle. Battle. Day one,

1882
01:42:36,760 --> 01:42:39,080
Speaker 1: we do get into three young bulls and they were

1883
01:42:39,120 --> 01:42:41,879
Speaker 1: half spoot and so we're calling at three young bulls

1884
01:42:42,520 --> 01:42:45,040
Speaker 1: and then kind of see this other bull which want

1885
01:42:45,040 --> 01:42:46,799
Speaker 1: to be in one of the three young bulls. But anyways,

1886
01:42:46,960 --> 01:42:50,800
Speaker 1: moved and then bumped an elk that was like under

1887
01:42:50,840 --> 01:42:56,360
Speaker 1: our feet, and that could have been the high likelihood

1888
01:42:56,360 --> 01:42:58,920
Speaker 1: that was another bull. For sure there was coming up

1889
01:42:58,960 --> 01:43:00,960
Speaker 1: to check out, because we'd be year old and whatnot.

1890
01:43:01,000 --> 01:43:02,519
Speaker 1: Could have been in our bowl. He has never made

1891
01:43:02,560 --> 01:43:04,679
Speaker 1: any noise, and it could have been that we would

1892
01:43:04,680 --> 01:43:06,920
Speaker 1: have not moved up to see and he popped out,

1893
01:43:06,960 --> 01:43:09,360
Speaker 1: and it could have been right, we're in with a bowl.

1894
01:43:10,240 --> 01:43:12,160
Speaker 1: Then there was kind of a very like there's a

1895
01:43:12,280 --> 01:43:15,799
Speaker 1: sort of peculiarity of this place that these elk were,

1896
01:43:16,400 --> 01:43:17,800
Speaker 1: and it kind of made sense of like it was

1897
01:43:17,800 --> 01:43:19,479
Speaker 1: like like a little hidy hole. They had a lot

1898
01:43:19,479 --> 01:43:21,439
Speaker 1: of pressure blow him. It was sort of like a

1899
01:43:21,479 --> 01:43:23,120
Speaker 1: spot where you could picture they kind of found a

1900
01:43:23,160 --> 01:43:27,400
Speaker 1: little solace and watch this, watch this, uh full circle,

1901
01:43:28,760 --> 01:43:31,280
Speaker 1: not in they're optimal, not in their optimal niche, but

1902
01:43:31,320 --> 01:43:34,920
Speaker 1: they found some solace and they realized niche that was

1903
01:43:35,200 --> 01:43:37,880
Speaker 1: freaking cliff face now where he wanted to be. If

1904
01:43:37,880 --> 01:43:39,479
Speaker 1: it was out to him, he'd be laying out in

1905
01:43:39,520 --> 01:43:43,960
Speaker 1: the biggest, grassiest metal down in the valley bottom, but

1906
01:43:44,000 --> 01:43:46,800
Speaker 1: he couldn't because of pressure. He had to go to

1907
01:43:46,880 --> 01:43:50,160
Speaker 1: his realized niche, which was like a cliff face. Um,

1908
01:43:50,240 --> 01:43:53,880
Speaker 1: we went back in there and found a bowl and

1909
01:43:53,960 --> 01:43:57,680
Speaker 1: had like six days of hunting. This is this is

1910
01:43:57,720 --> 01:44:01,559
Speaker 1: in defense of this area. Six days of hunting. And

1911
01:44:01,640 --> 01:44:03,920
Speaker 1: if you said to someone you're gonna hunt out for

1912
01:44:03,960 --> 01:44:07,759
Speaker 1: six days and you're gonna have one like unbelievable encounter,

1913
01:44:08,280 --> 01:44:12,920
Speaker 1: what would most people say? I feel that they would

1914
01:44:12,920 --> 01:44:17,519
Speaker 1: say a deal, six days for one unbelievable encounter. Yeah,

1915
01:44:17,560 --> 01:44:21,120
Speaker 1: and then and then sprinkled other encounters, sprinkle, but one

1916
01:44:21,280 --> 01:44:24,479
Speaker 1: like Yes, the average hunter would say, deal, Yep, you're

1917
01:44:24,479 --> 01:44:26,400
Speaker 1: gonna hu You're gonna work your ass over six days.

1918
01:44:26,479 --> 01:44:28,120
Speaker 1: You're gonna have some days you don't see ship. You

1919
01:44:28,120 --> 01:44:30,080
Speaker 1: can have some days where you have like a half encounter,

1920
01:44:30,280 --> 01:44:32,960
Speaker 1: and then I'm gonna present you with one like great encounter.

1921
01:44:33,960 --> 01:44:36,080
Speaker 1: I feel a lot of guys be like, yeah, that's reasonable,

1922
01:44:36,080 --> 01:44:38,360
Speaker 1: I'll take it, and we have I mean, everybody knows that,

1923
01:44:38,439 --> 01:44:41,679
Speaker 1: you know, I think six sex rates with a gun.

1924
01:44:41,720 --> 01:44:43,960
Speaker 1: I don't know if the difference between rifle muzzleloader, but

1925
01:44:43,960 --> 01:44:48,240
Speaker 1: I want to say in Colorado hovers around, and so

1926
01:44:48,360 --> 01:44:49,960
Speaker 1: being that we had two hunters in camp and that

1927
01:44:50,160 --> 01:44:53,760
Speaker 1: you just almost killed one, you know, we almost beat

1928
01:44:53,840 --> 01:44:57,680
Speaker 1: the the yearly average, you know. Yeah, we went up

1929
01:44:57,720 --> 01:44:59,880
Speaker 1: with our baby stuff, our camp out stuff, and when

1930
01:45:00,040 --> 01:45:02,960
Speaker 1: up to um this little ridge stop that sits at

1931
01:45:03,240 --> 01:45:07,280
Speaker 1: the ridge stops eleven thousand, four feet mm hmye. And

1932
01:45:07,400 --> 01:45:09,519
Speaker 1: got there at four o'clock in the afternoon. Man, look

1933
01:45:09,600 --> 01:45:12,080
Speaker 1: down into this kind of like the same kind of

1934
01:45:12,320 --> 01:45:13,960
Speaker 1: there's a couple of miles away from where we ran

1935
01:45:13,960 --> 01:45:16,360
Speaker 1: into those three bulls, like the same feature, the same

1936
01:45:16,439 --> 01:45:20,360
Speaker 1: landscape feature, and same basic setup, and went down in

1937
01:45:20,360 --> 01:45:23,559
Speaker 1: there four o'clock in the afternoon. Here's a bull playing

1938
01:45:23,560 --> 01:45:26,519
Speaker 1: grab at or following a cow and a calf, and

1939
01:45:26,600 --> 01:45:28,280
Speaker 1: he might even put kicked up out of her bed,

1940
01:45:28,320 --> 01:45:32,760
Speaker 1: but he's following her along. So we gradually gradually get

1941
01:45:32,760 --> 01:45:35,200
Speaker 1: down in the zone and try calling here, and try

1942
01:45:35,240 --> 01:45:36,960
Speaker 1: calling there, and then we get to where we know,

1943
01:45:37,280 --> 01:45:40,040
Speaker 1: like the meadal we know they were in and start

1944
01:45:40,080 --> 01:45:45,320
Speaker 1: calling and right away a kyle pops up at eighty yards, looks,

1945
01:45:46,120 --> 01:45:49,400
Speaker 1: watches for a long time where the sounds coming from,

1946
01:45:49,600 --> 01:45:52,240
Speaker 1: goes back into the woods and comes up in parallels

1947
01:45:52,320 --> 01:45:56,400
Speaker 1: us very close, goes out of whatever happens to her.

1948
01:45:57,240 --> 01:45:59,240
Speaker 1: Then also there's a bull down there and he comes

1949
01:45:59,240 --> 01:46:01,280
Speaker 1: out the same gay happened, has to look around, and

1950
01:46:01,280 --> 01:46:05,400
Speaker 1: then pretty soon a bunch of appreciate another little ship

1951
01:46:05,479 --> 01:46:07,960
Speaker 1: and bull comes in alongside and sneaks in to get

1952
01:46:07,960 --> 01:46:12,000
Speaker 1: a look. Probably not legal. And then all these cows

1953
01:46:12,040 --> 01:46:14,679
Speaker 1: come out and a bull comes out, and we're calling

1954
01:46:14,720 --> 01:46:16,439
Speaker 1: at the bull. He's had a hundred I had said

1955
01:46:16,479 --> 01:46:18,040
Speaker 1: to myself, like we always talk, oh, like a hundred

1956
01:46:18,080 --> 01:46:21,599
Speaker 1: yards for a muzzleloader, which is far for open sites.

1957
01:46:22,400 --> 01:46:24,799
Speaker 1: He's hanging around a hundred twenty yards. We start bugling

1958
01:46:24,840 --> 01:46:28,120
Speaker 1: at him, and he's like raking mud up, raking hunks

1959
01:46:28,160 --> 01:46:31,640
Speaker 1: the grass up. Finally he comes over to chase a

1960
01:46:31,680 --> 01:46:34,479
Speaker 1: cow and comes into eight yards and I get my

1961
01:46:34,920 --> 01:46:40,920
Speaker 1: shot opportunity, and I pull off what everyone warned me,

1962
01:46:41,600 --> 01:46:46,519
Speaker 1: not what everyone multiple highly credentialed individuals warned me about

1963
01:46:46,600 --> 01:46:52,080
Speaker 1: with shooting muzzleloaders, meaning you honest Brody and Remy Warren

1964
01:46:53,040 --> 01:46:56,559
Speaker 1: all said, you have to hit that thing just right

1965
01:46:56,640 --> 01:47:01,120
Speaker 1: with a muzzleloader. Um, don't shoot him in the shoulders

1966
01:47:01,160 --> 01:47:05,439
Speaker 1: because if you hit them, you think Remy made a joke.

1967
01:47:05,479 --> 01:47:06,960
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, they go down to hard and get up

1968
01:47:06,960 --> 01:47:11,760
Speaker 1: and they're gone. And this thing came like I said

1969
01:47:11,760 --> 01:47:15,320
Speaker 1: it came to eight yards, turned broadside. I drew a

1970
01:47:15,320 --> 01:47:16,960
Speaker 1: beat on it, but it's not a percent. Like with

1971
01:47:17,040 --> 01:47:19,240
Speaker 1: open sites. I know the guys that shooting their whole

1972
01:47:19,280 --> 01:47:22,280
Speaker 1: life are very good with them, like they're great with them.

1973
01:47:22,320 --> 01:47:24,840
Speaker 1: But I didn't do In hindsight, I didn't do the

1974
01:47:24,840 --> 01:47:26,880
Speaker 1: practice I should have done. I mean, I grew up

1975
01:47:26,880 --> 01:47:29,680
Speaker 1: shooting open sites two open site twenty two is that

1976
01:47:29,720 --> 01:47:32,080
Speaker 1: squirrels and stuff. But as a long time ago, I've

1977
01:47:32,080 --> 01:47:33,920
Speaker 1: been like a scope dude forever. But you can't use

1978
01:47:33,920 --> 01:47:35,760
Speaker 1: the scope in Colorado. And I should have done way

1979
01:47:35,760 --> 01:47:41,080
Speaker 1: more practice. I leveled off. I felt good, pull the trigger.

1980
01:47:41,120 --> 01:47:47,040
Speaker 1: He goes down like like even down like insert favorite

1981
01:47:47,080 --> 01:47:49,200
Speaker 1: like hit by lightning, hit by a truck, hit by

1982
01:47:49,200 --> 01:47:56,160
Speaker 1: a train, sacrimotatus and back up and gone. And we

1983
01:47:56,640 --> 01:47:58,960
Speaker 1: like found some blood that night, a little bit of

1984
01:47:58,960 --> 01:48:02,920
Speaker 1: blood that night. Ran it down to like just a

1985
01:48:03,040 --> 01:48:05,400
Speaker 1: pin drop. And we'd only moved the trail. I mean,

1986
01:48:05,400 --> 01:48:08,360
Speaker 1: when we'd moved the trail hundred yards if not even

1987
01:48:08,400 --> 01:48:12,400
Speaker 1: a freaking drop. Came back early in the morning, early morning,

1988
01:48:12,439 --> 01:48:16,000
Speaker 1: came back at daybreak, after daybreak. Uh. I got down

1989
01:48:16,000 --> 01:48:18,360
Speaker 1: there seven thirty eight am maybe eight am. Come later

1990
01:48:18,439 --> 01:48:21,040
Speaker 1: I don't tell it was it's cold, got down there,

1991
01:48:21,120 --> 01:48:23,360
Speaker 1: started trailing again, and it was a cold night. So

1992
01:48:23,400 --> 01:48:24,760
Speaker 1: I was feeling like, if we could find this thing

1993
01:48:24,920 --> 01:48:26,640
Speaker 1: with the meats, gonna be fine because it's a chilly night.

1994
01:48:27,360 --> 01:48:30,240
Speaker 1: Um pick up from that last pinprick of blood and

1995
01:48:30,360 --> 01:48:34,280
Speaker 1: never find another pinprick of blood until probably a hundred

1996
01:48:34,320 --> 01:48:38,280
Speaker 1: fifty yards later, just by following every possible elk trail,

1997
01:48:38,360 --> 01:48:41,200
Speaker 1: every possible elk track, I finally find a pine branch,

1998
01:48:41,240 --> 01:48:43,840
Speaker 1: a bust it off pine branch sitting at shoulder height

1999
01:48:43,920 --> 01:48:46,400
Speaker 1: high shoulder height. They had a little blood wiped on it.

2000
01:48:47,920 --> 01:48:50,880
Speaker 1: And then we followed from there every elk track, every

2001
01:48:50,920 --> 01:48:53,120
Speaker 1: possible trail, back and forth, in and out, never no

2002
01:48:53,280 --> 01:48:58,640
Speaker 1: drop of blood. It's rough, man, It sounds like you

2003
01:48:58,720 --> 01:49:03,880
Speaker 1: hit the void. Yeah, it's crazy too, because like you

2004
01:49:05,439 --> 01:49:08,080
Speaker 1: like how hard he fell and hit the ground. It's

2005
01:49:08,120 --> 01:49:11,840
Speaker 1: like you think game over. Yeah, but Noah, if Rourke

2006
01:49:12,000 --> 01:49:15,000
Speaker 1: cocked back and punched me in the face, how hard

2007
01:49:15,000 --> 01:49:18,120
Speaker 1: do I hit the ground just like that? But would

2008
01:49:18,120 --> 01:49:22,880
Speaker 1: I be dead? It depends on depends on what kind

2009
01:49:22,880 --> 01:49:26,320
Speaker 1: of day lurks have, and I imagine it probably the

2010
01:49:26,600 --> 01:49:29,680
Speaker 1: depends on the angle that he hits yet. Do you know?

2011
01:49:29,880 --> 01:49:32,640
Speaker 1: Uh Rourke told me the story one time about you

2012
01:49:32,640 --> 01:49:35,160
Speaker 1: guys are doing something kind of raid and he sees

2013
01:49:35,160 --> 01:49:38,080
Speaker 1: a dude running out of the he catches a guy

2014
01:49:38,160 --> 01:49:41,599
Speaker 1: run and tell that story, my guy. I let my

2015
01:49:41,600 --> 01:49:44,839
Speaker 1: my junior officers run that raid. So myself and my

2016
01:49:44,840 --> 01:49:47,080
Speaker 1: my boss my task. You matter, good, buddy of mine.

2017
01:49:47,200 --> 01:49:50,559
Speaker 1: We're sitting outside the compound but inside the security blanket

2018
01:49:50,560 --> 01:49:52,160
Speaker 1: of our gun trucks were in a pretty good spot,

2019
01:49:52,240 --> 01:49:55,600
Speaker 1: but night vision on still in the tackle environment, and

2020
01:49:55,600 --> 01:49:57,599
Speaker 1: we had a squirter, which means a guy that got

2021
01:49:57,640 --> 01:49:59,200
Speaker 1: over the fence and was running. But he was on

2022
01:49:59,240 --> 01:50:02,760
Speaker 1: the target and he jumped over this fence and I

2023
01:50:02,800 --> 01:50:04,800
Speaker 1: was on night vision wash him unarmed. He didn't have

2024
01:50:04,800 --> 01:50:07,000
Speaker 1: a weapon on him, but he could have gone right,

2025
01:50:07,680 --> 01:50:09,640
Speaker 1: which would have served him well, because I do not

2026
01:50:09,760 --> 01:50:12,439
Speaker 1: believe with all my battle gear on, I would have

2027
01:50:12,479 --> 01:50:15,479
Speaker 1: ever caught him. But he hung a left and was

2028
01:50:15,560 --> 01:50:19,680
Speaker 1: not a jog running straight at me, and I stood up.

2029
01:50:19,760 --> 01:50:21,640
Speaker 1: He didn't hear me stand up, and took about a

2030
01:50:21,720 --> 01:50:26,960
Speaker 1: five to eight step Linebacker Lawrence Taylor esk run and

2031
01:50:27,000 --> 01:50:29,719
Speaker 1: put my shoulder into that dude to just knock him down.

2032
01:50:30,640 --> 01:50:34,160
Speaker 1: And his body exploded. Oh my god, I thought I

2033
01:50:34,240 --> 01:50:36,599
Speaker 1: killed him. I thought I killed him. I actually felt back.

2034
01:50:37,000 --> 01:50:38,960
Speaker 1: I didn't know, uh you know, I didn't know. He

2035
01:50:39,040 --> 01:50:41,599
Speaker 1: might might might have just been like the teenage son

2036
01:50:41,720 --> 01:50:43,800
Speaker 1: of the guy we're going after whatever. But I mean

2037
01:50:43,840 --> 01:50:46,400
Speaker 1: he I've never hit any by heart than any sport game.

2038
01:50:46,400 --> 01:50:48,519
Speaker 1: But I we know we picked him up and grabbed him,

2039
01:50:48,520 --> 01:50:51,000
Speaker 1: got him, got him off all right. But I don't

2040
01:50:51,000 --> 01:50:55,559
Speaker 1: think he'll ever forget that hit. But uh yeah, like again,

2041
01:50:55,600 --> 01:50:57,280
Speaker 1: man to go back to this thing, like someone's got

2042
01:50:57,320 --> 01:50:58,400
Speaker 1: a gun in your head and you had to get

2043
01:50:58,400 --> 01:51:01,559
Speaker 1: an answer, right and they said, is that that elk

2044
01:51:01,920 --> 01:51:05,400
Speaker 1: alive right now or dead right now? I would go along.

2045
01:51:05,439 --> 01:51:08,479
Speaker 1: I would probably like in that situation, I would I would.

2046
01:51:08,680 --> 01:51:10,000
Speaker 1: I think I said this the third day, I would

2047
01:51:10,040 --> 01:51:12,280
Speaker 1: say alive, but I would half expect to hear the

2048
01:51:12,320 --> 01:51:16,920
Speaker 1: gun go off. I just don't know. Um it was.

2049
01:51:17,160 --> 01:51:19,280
Speaker 1: It was confused enough. Where's the thing I like, I

2050
01:51:19,320 --> 01:51:22,200
Speaker 1: feel like I should start doing haven't typically done in

2051
01:51:22,240 --> 01:51:24,360
Speaker 1: the past by kind of like I'm interested in. The

2052
01:51:24,439 --> 01:51:27,360
Speaker 1: idea is if you get a wound, if you wound

2053
01:51:27,479 --> 01:51:30,559
Speaker 1: something where there's a good likelihood that you killed it,

2054
01:51:30,920 --> 01:51:33,439
Speaker 1: I'm interested in the idea and this there's some units

2055
01:51:33,439 --> 01:51:36,759
Speaker 1: where this is how it works. There's BlackBerry units in Alaska.

2056
01:51:36,840 --> 01:51:39,040
Speaker 1: Or if you if you wound an animal, you're not

2057
01:51:39,160 --> 01:51:42,880
Speaker 1: your tag. Um. So with that, I was like, you

2058
01:51:42,880 --> 01:51:45,519
Speaker 1: know what, man, I'm done. I'm done. Um. I have

2059
01:51:45,680 --> 01:51:48,920
Speaker 1: never done that in the past when I had something

2060
01:51:48,960 --> 01:51:51,479
Speaker 1: to get away. Uh, never done that past, But I'm

2061
01:51:51,560 --> 01:51:53,200
Speaker 1: and I don't know that I'll always do in the future.

2062
01:51:53,320 --> 01:51:55,519
Speaker 1: But in that moment, I was coming man because Rourke

2063
01:51:55,560 --> 01:51:57,479
Speaker 1: still had a tag. It was like, I'd rather put

2064
01:51:57,600 --> 01:52:01,880
Speaker 1: energy into having Roorke having equal opportunity rather than racking

2065
01:52:01,960 --> 01:52:04,479
Speaker 1: up to opportunite. Know what I mean. I don't know that.

2066
01:52:04,520 --> 01:52:06,240
Speaker 1: I don't know that that's like a rule for me,

2067
01:52:06,520 --> 01:52:11,559
Speaker 1: but that I just felt like, maybe some black bear

2068
01:52:11,600 --> 01:52:14,280
Speaker 1: is going to go into hibernation and extremely good shape

2069
01:52:16,720 --> 01:52:20,360
Speaker 1: because of that bear, because of that Elk carcass. I

2070
01:52:20,400 --> 01:52:23,040
Speaker 1: don't know. The thing I talked about too when we

2071
01:52:23,080 --> 01:52:24,800
Speaker 1: were making the show and I talked about this was

2072
01:52:25,080 --> 01:52:26,519
Speaker 1: I got a body. I don't wanted to say where

2073
01:52:26,560 --> 01:52:28,040
Speaker 1: it works, but I got a buddy that works for

2074
01:52:28,080 --> 01:52:31,920
Speaker 1: a big grocery store chain. One day sends me a

2075
01:52:31,960 --> 01:52:34,720
Speaker 1: picture you know those dumpsters, what do you call those

2076
01:52:34,760 --> 01:52:37,080
Speaker 1: dumpsters that you carry on a flatbed semi trailer? Like

2077
01:52:37,640 --> 01:52:39,320
Speaker 1: I don't know what a huge freaking dumpsters, you know

2078
01:52:39,320 --> 01:52:40,640
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like it's like a semi trailer, but

2079
01:52:40,640 --> 01:52:46,320
Speaker 1: it's a dumpster full of package pork because someone has

2080
01:52:46,360 --> 01:52:48,560
Speaker 1: screwed up taking a refrigerator truck and put it like

2081
01:52:48,600 --> 01:52:51,559
Speaker 1: in the wrong spot so it didn't get off loaded.

2082
01:52:53,439 --> 01:52:55,200
Speaker 1: And he was like they wouldn't even let him take

2083
01:52:55,240 --> 01:52:58,240
Speaker 1: it home, and it took all all this package pork

2084
01:52:58,320 --> 01:53:01,400
Speaker 1: was in this giant freaking dumpster going to a landfill,

2085
01:53:01,560 --> 01:53:05,920
Speaker 1: and you're like, what a waste of animal life? You know,

2086
01:53:06,080 --> 01:53:09,160
Speaker 1: Like what a waste of life to go to a

2087
01:53:09,280 --> 01:53:13,360
Speaker 1: landfill wrapped in plastic. And then this thing I always

2088
01:53:13,360 --> 01:53:15,120
Speaker 1: come to do, like if you hit something and lose

2089
01:53:15,160 --> 01:53:19,599
Speaker 1: it out in the environment, you know. My brother pointed

2090
01:53:19,640 --> 01:53:21,240
Speaker 1: out one time, it's like if you think it's wasteful,

2091
01:53:21,280 --> 01:53:24,720
Speaker 1: then you really don't believe in nutrient recycling because it's

2092
01:53:24,760 --> 01:53:26,960
Speaker 1: like they're in its place. It's sort of like eventually

2093
01:53:27,000 --> 01:53:29,960
Speaker 1: the animal is gonna die. Eventually that animal will die

2094
01:53:30,680 --> 01:53:35,519
Speaker 1: and will become food for other things. Um, and maybe

2095
01:53:35,520 --> 01:53:37,400
Speaker 1: that's what happened there and it died and it becomes

2096
01:53:37,400 --> 01:53:39,280
Speaker 1: food for other things. I'm not saying that this excuses it.

2097
01:53:39,320 --> 01:53:41,840
Speaker 1: I'm just saying like it's one of the many complicated

2098
01:53:41,840 --> 01:53:44,200
Speaker 1: things that rolls through your head where you're like, you

2099
01:53:44,280 --> 01:53:49,960
Speaker 1: feel like like one, you screwed up. You didn't aim carefully,

2100
01:53:50,120 --> 01:53:53,760
Speaker 1: you didn't prepare, you got excited, you did all this

2101
01:53:53,840 --> 01:53:57,600
Speaker 1: stupid stuff. Now you've caused this thing like pain, and

2102
01:53:57,640 --> 01:54:00,080
Speaker 1: there's no sort of human gain, like you know, you

2103
01:54:00,320 --> 01:54:03,920
Speaker 1: don't gain the resource like you screwed up. And then

2104
01:54:03,960 --> 01:54:06,160
Speaker 1: you go like, yeah, but maybe I'll feel better when

2105
01:54:06,160 --> 01:54:08,559
Speaker 1: I roll these ideas, this collection of ideas through my

2106
01:54:08,600 --> 01:54:14,840
Speaker 1: head about right, some bear is loving or not, or

2107
01:54:14,880 --> 01:54:17,880
Speaker 1: some elk or some elk is having a very very

2108
01:54:17,880 --> 01:54:24,200
Speaker 1: bad winter. Yeah, yeah, it sucks to think about the

2109
01:54:24,240 --> 01:54:29,040
Speaker 1: suffering they may or may not go through. That's a

2110
01:54:29,040 --> 01:54:31,680
Speaker 1: pretty big hole most likely because it went through I'm

2111
01:54:31,720 --> 01:54:33,920
Speaker 1: betting both sides, you know, through the top of the

2112
01:54:33,960 --> 01:54:36,200
Speaker 1: right I don't know. Yeah, how do you if it

2113
01:54:36,240 --> 01:54:38,560
Speaker 1: was a big hole? How there was like no blood, man,

2114
01:54:39,160 --> 01:54:42,320
Speaker 1: Because it's that's the void, man, that's the spot between

2115
01:54:42,320 --> 01:54:44,080
Speaker 1: the spine and the top of the bongs and it's

2116
01:54:44,120 --> 01:54:48,440
Speaker 1: just there. If I was able to just probably to

2117
01:54:48,520 --> 01:54:50,920
Speaker 1: take a knife, I think, and puncture your ribs, but

2118
01:54:51,040 --> 01:54:57,280
Speaker 1: not go into anything farther, you know, But like you're

2119
01:54:58,240 --> 01:55:00,680
Speaker 1: your ribs and your meat right there, you know, and

2120
01:55:00,800 --> 01:55:03,680
Speaker 1: unless you go inside and catch something internal, but just

2121
01:55:03,840 --> 01:55:07,040
Speaker 1: you're just your chunk or ribs. Because even made the

2122
01:55:07,080 --> 01:55:09,040
Speaker 1: comment of like you, I guess your your hand has

2123
01:55:09,080 --> 01:55:11,520
Speaker 1: a lot been a lot more blood if someone cut

2124
01:55:11,560 --> 01:55:13,680
Speaker 1: their fingers, but your hands are Yeah, you got a

2125
01:55:13,680 --> 01:55:16,160
Speaker 1: lot of stuff going on. Did my brother cut his

2126
01:55:16,160 --> 01:55:18,200
Speaker 1: finger in there day? We couldn't get it stop leaping.

2127
01:55:18,680 --> 01:55:21,080
Speaker 1: He's blood over damn. Imagine too, it's shaped, you know,

2128
01:55:21,240 --> 01:55:24,120
Speaker 1: barrel like and if it's up high, you know that

2129
01:55:24,120 --> 01:55:26,680
Speaker 1: blood has a chance to like one has to be

2130
01:55:26,720 --> 01:55:28,440
Speaker 1: pumped up and out of that all and then as

2131
01:55:28,520 --> 01:55:34,760
Speaker 1: it's coming down, you know, it's drying, coagulating. What happens. Yeah,

2132
01:55:34,840 --> 01:55:36,920
Speaker 1: and then you just didn't hit anything vital. I don't

2133
01:55:36,920 --> 01:55:39,000
Speaker 1: know anybody's ever quit hunting over it. But it's like,

2134
01:55:39,840 --> 01:55:41,440
Speaker 1: you know, if you're gonna go out in the woods,

2135
01:55:41,600 --> 01:55:43,080
Speaker 1: I guess you just gotta there's gotta be a certain

2136
01:55:43,080 --> 01:55:44,520
Speaker 1: amount of thing if you're gonna go out in the

2137
01:55:44,560 --> 01:55:46,960
Speaker 1: woods and shoot projectiles and stuff with the intent of

2138
01:55:47,120 --> 01:55:51,200
Speaker 1: killing it. You better you better be like real frank

2139
01:55:51,320 --> 01:55:56,280
Speaker 1: with yourself about the pallatability of that not working out.

2140
01:55:57,280 --> 01:55:59,880
Speaker 1: It's not binary. I was listening to this Galaza and

2141
01:56:00,000 --> 01:56:01,560
Speaker 1: a Day about his antelope punch she's been on. She

2142
01:56:01,640 --> 01:56:04,280
Speaker 1: talked about how she like, she's like, quote missed nine

2143
01:56:04,320 --> 01:56:07,720
Speaker 1: and then got one. I'm like, I I have to

2144
01:56:07,760 --> 01:56:10,920
Speaker 1: think that it wasn't binary that a couple of them

2145
01:56:10,920 --> 01:56:14,120
Speaker 1: got hit. I mean, do you really go nine misses

2146
01:56:14,200 --> 01:56:16,040
Speaker 1: but then all of a sudden you kill one? Yea?

2147
01:56:17,120 --> 01:56:20,040
Speaker 1: Or is there some gray in there? It's gotta be

2148
01:56:20,080 --> 01:56:22,840
Speaker 1: some gray. It's not binary. That's the thing. The first

2149
01:56:22,840 --> 01:56:24,600
Speaker 1: time I took my wife on, she never factored in.

2150
01:56:24,720 --> 01:56:26,400
Speaker 1: She thought I took her squirrel, and she thought either

2151
01:56:26,480 --> 01:56:27,880
Speaker 1: killed it or hit it. And she hit one in

2152
01:56:27,880 --> 01:56:30,960
Speaker 1: the ear m hmm, and it ran up a tree

2153
01:56:31,000 --> 01:56:33,080
Speaker 1: and kind of like mess with its ear for a minute,

2154
01:56:33,440 --> 01:56:34,920
Speaker 1: and it had like it looked like when a deer

2155
01:56:34,960 --> 01:56:36,920
Speaker 1: gets caught on barbed war. You can see it. I mean,

2156
01:56:36,920 --> 01:56:38,760
Speaker 1: we're in my mom's yard, I should point out, but

2157
01:56:39,600 --> 01:56:41,680
Speaker 1: you can see him up there and he's like totally fine.

2158
01:56:41,720 --> 01:56:43,320
Speaker 1: But she's like, it never occurred to me there would

2159
01:56:43,320 --> 01:56:45,920
Speaker 1: be anything other than one or the other. I thought.

2160
01:56:45,960 --> 01:56:47,720
Speaker 1: I was like, on off, I didn't know there's a

2161
01:56:47,800 --> 01:56:54,760
Speaker 1: middle switch. But what about like this is probably a

2162
01:56:54,800 --> 01:56:57,880
Speaker 1: little controversial, but please, well when you get into like

2163
01:56:58,040 --> 01:57:05,640
Speaker 1: we're gonna talk evential bid absolutely not hit me with

2164
01:57:05,680 --> 01:57:10,480
Speaker 1: the controversy. I don't know. After the after the couple

2165
01:57:10,480 --> 01:57:12,800
Speaker 1: of bow hunts we went on, which which would nothing

2166
01:57:12,840 --> 01:57:16,280
Speaker 1: bad happened, but just the hitting the elk and then

2167
01:57:16,520 --> 01:57:18,360
Speaker 1: finding it the next day. That was my first experience

2168
01:57:18,360 --> 01:57:20,200
Speaker 1: of that because every other meter I've done was rifle,

2169
01:57:20,640 --> 01:57:23,040
Speaker 1: and I mean, you're a good shot. So you hit it,

2170
01:57:23,200 --> 01:57:25,360
Speaker 1: the fucking animal drops and that's it and we go

2171
01:57:25,400 --> 01:57:27,560
Speaker 1: and clean it up and we start eating it. Yeah,

2172
01:57:27,760 --> 01:57:29,840
Speaker 1: and it's a whole. It's that's the binary thing. It's

2173
01:57:29,840 --> 01:57:33,160
Speaker 1: like that happened and now we're enjoying it, and now

2174
01:57:33,200 --> 01:57:36,320
Speaker 1: with muzzle loaders to like it happens where we shoot

2175
01:57:36,360 --> 01:57:39,840
Speaker 1: one and it goes away. So like I'm having a

2176
01:57:39,920 --> 01:57:47,800
Speaker 1: struggle accepting those as viable means of hunting, like ethically,

2177
01:57:48,160 --> 01:57:50,200
Speaker 1: like I know people can miss and you can do

2178
01:57:50,240 --> 01:57:52,920
Speaker 1: it with a rifle, but in my experience. Based on

2179
01:57:52,960 --> 01:57:55,480
Speaker 1: what I've seen, it's like if you are if you

2180
01:57:55,520 --> 01:57:57,560
Speaker 1: practice with the rife and you're a good shot, you

2181
01:57:58,320 --> 01:58:00,800
Speaker 1: like the animal is done and quick, and it just

2182
01:58:00,840 --> 01:58:04,200
Speaker 1: seems very clean and ethical and like how it should be.

2183
01:58:04,240 --> 01:58:07,120
Speaker 1: And when you introduced these like traditional things, it just

2184
01:58:07,160 --> 01:58:10,080
Speaker 1: seems more of like an ego thing that people are after, like, oh,

2185
01:58:10,120 --> 01:58:12,440
Speaker 1: I can get it with a stick. You know. It's like,

2186
01:58:13,000 --> 01:58:15,600
Speaker 1: well that's great for you, man, But now you just

2187
01:58:16,120 --> 01:58:19,080
Speaker 1: interrupted this thing, and you know, because well you know what,

2188
01:58:19,160 --> 01:58:22,600
Speaker 1: you know what helps it helps answer it? What the

2189
01:58:22,760 --> 01:58:31,600
Speaker 1: only there's more in the equation than animal suffering. There's

2190
01:58:31,720 --> 01:58:36,400
Speaker 1: efficacy because again, you're dealing with a finite resource, and

2191
01:58:36,440 --> 01:58:40,280
Speaker 1: the way to enable the way to enable a larger

2192
01:58:40,320 --> 01:58:46,920
Speaker 1: pool of people to have an opportunity to extract from

2193
01:58:46,920 --> 01:58:51,240
Speaker 1: a finite resource is to regulate efficacy. There was a

2194
01:58:51,280 --> 01:58:54,520
Speaker 1: movement some years ago, Yeahni probably, I'll remember when when

2195
01:58:54,560 --> 01:58:58,080
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, guys were discovering the efficacy of

2196
01:58:58,200 --> 01:59:02,840
Speaker 1: using fifty cal bmg ease is that the right word

2197
01:59:02,840 --> 01:59:07,960
Speaker 1: for it? And there was like YouTube channels, right, Yeah,

2198
01:59:08,080 --> 01:59:10,120
Speaker 1: I don't know if I qualified as a whole movement.

2199
01:59:11,160 --> 01:59:14,040
Speaker 1: There's like a thing, there's can can I say? Stirrings?

2200
01:59:15,160 --> 01:59:19,160
Speaker 1: There were some stirrings of guys realizing the incredible efficacy

2201
01:59:20,440 --> 01:59:26,800
Speaker 1: of the fifty cow round the elk um rigged up

2202
01:59:26,800 --> 01:59:31,480
Speaker 1: with big heavy, big heavy tag drivers with fifty cows

2203
01:59:31,720 --> 01:59:33,240
Speaker 1: and the fact that you could bowl an elk over

2204
01:59:33,360 --> 01:59:38,360
Speaker 1: nine yards or whatever. Right, so um, and some states

2205
01:59:38,360 --> 01:59:41,080
Speaker 1: came out and said, you can't do that. You can't

2206
01:59:41,200 --> 01:59:44,600
Speaker 1: use Uh, if a twelve gauge is effective on waterfall,

2207
01:59:44,680 --> 01:59:46,600
Speaker 1: imagine how effective a ten gage would be, or how

2208
01:59:46,680 --> 01:59:48,600
Speaker 1: effective an eight gauge. But you can't use eight gauges.

2209
01:59:48,640 --> 01:59:52,920
Speaker 1: You can't buy damn a gauge barely. So um, if

2210
01:59:52,960 --> 01:59:55,600
Speaker 1: it was just if if game management came down to

2211
01:59:55,680 --> 01:59:59,360
Speaker 1: what kills animals the cleanest, I think that we would

2212
01:59:59,400 --> 02:00:04,360
Speaker 1: welcome any in all technologies into the game. But the

2213
02:00:04,400 --> 02:00:07,000
Speaker 1: minute you enter any in all technologies into the game,

2214
02:00:07,600 --> 02:00:11,520
Speaker 1: efficacy goes up and participation will have to go down.

2215
02:00:11,760 --> 02:00:14,120
Speaker 1: If you have a population of let's say you got

2216
02:00:14,160 --> 02:00:19,120
Speaker 1: a population you got a hundred panda bears and someone's like, uh, no,

2217
02:00:19,280 --> 02:00:22,160
Speaker 1: koala bears. There's a hunter quala bears, And they're like,

2218
02:00:22,200 --> 02:00:25,440
Speaker 1: we can kill ten koala bears, and and then next

2219
02:00:25,520 --> 02:00:28,640
Speaker 1: year we'll have a hundred again because they'll reproduce, and

2220
02:00:28,640 --> 02:00:30,400
Speaker 1: you're only gonna really have a hunter because there's only

2221
02:00:30,400 --> 02:00:33,280
Speaker 1: so many eucalyptus trees. So we know that hunter koala

2222
02:00:33,320 --> 02:00:35,520
Speaker 1: bears is a great number. Every year we kill ten,

2223
02:00:35,640 --> 02:00:37,520
Speaker 1: next year magic we got a hundred. If we didn't

2224
02:00:37,560 --> 02:00:39,760
Speaker 1: kill any, we still have a hundred because that's just

2225
02:00:40,120 --> 02:00:43,320
Speaker 1: the carrying capacity of the landscape. And and if you

2226
02:00:43,400 --> 02:00:45,800
Speaker 1: had a way that a guy has a certainty of

2227
02:00:45,880 --> 02:00:48,080
Speaker 1: killing a koala bear, how many dudes get the hunt

2228
02:00:48,120 --> 02:00:59,280
Speaker 1: quali bears? One dude? No? Ten? Okay. Let's say let's

2229
02:00:59,320 --> 02:01:04,800
Speaker 1: say you say you can only use red riders and

2230
02:01:04,880 --> 02:01:07,600
Speaker 1: we find people shooting red riders only have about a

2231
02:01:07,640 --> 02:01:11,240
Speaker 1: ten percent success rate on koalas because they can soak

2232
02:01:11,320 --> 02:01:15,120
Speaker 1: up babies. Okay, how many dudes now get to go

2233
02:01:15,280 --> 02:01:21,200
Speaker 1: koala hunting? How many do you need? Is so that

2234
02:01:21,440 --> 02:01:27,960
Speaker 1: it's it's one right, one, They all get to go.

2235
02:01:28,320 --> 02:01:31,600
Speaker 1: But they're all out shooting red riders at koalas, and

2236
02:01:31,640 --> 02:01:34,959
Speaker 1: they're absorbing those babies and they're taking they're sucking up babies.

2237
02:01:36,480 --> 02:01:40,960
Speaker 1: That's wildlife management. That's a good point. That's a good

2238
02:01:40,960 --> 02:01:44,720
Speaker 1: note to end on. Yeah, that's good. I started doing

2239
02:01:44,760 --> 02:01:49,920
Speaker 1: everything as koala bears. I think that's what really worked

2240
02:01:50,000 --> 02:01:53,880
Speaker 1: was the koalas. Yeah you were um now you still lost, Chris.

2241
02:01:55,440 --> 02:02:02,360
Speaker 1: I was thinking about my concluding thought. In that case,

2242
02:02:02,480 --> 02:02:07,280
Speaker 1: please have you gotten through it? Yeah? In that case, please,

2243
02:02:07,920 --> 02:02:11,160
Speaker 1: Rich I would love to hear more than anything in

2244
02:02:11,200 --> 02:02:13,640
Speaker 1: the world, I would like to hear your concluding thought.

2245
02:02:15,400 --> 02:02:19,440
Speaker 1: It's not that deep, man, but I just liked I

2246
02:02:19,520 --> 02:02:22,480
Speaker 1: can't push your super again. No, No, that's that will

2247
02:02:22,480 --> 02:02:26,200
Speaker 1: get sold. I just like watching that out being out man.

2248
02:02:26,640 --> 02:02:29,400
Speaker 1: That was cool. There's a lot of people I know

2249
02:02:29,480 --> 02:02:32,720
Speaker 1: and hang out with it never ever get to see that.

2250
02:02:32,600 --> 02:02:36,800
Speaker 1: And that was cool see that thing getting all the yeah,

2251
02:02:36,960 --> 02:02:40,800
Speaker 1: kicking around, responding to the call, interacting. It was just

2252
02:02:40,840 --> 02:02:44,560
Speaker 1: really cool. Screwing it up will forever taint that. I

2253
02:02:44,560 --> 02:02:46,960
Speaker 1: almost wishing, you know now, like in hindsight, obviously, I

2254
02:02:46,960 --> 02:02:49,240
Speaker 1: wish you would just stayed at a hundred yards. Yeah,

2255
02:02:49,600 --> 02:02:52,600
Speaker 1: going about his business, caught our wind. I wish you

2256
02:02:52,640 --> 02:02:57,120
Speaker 1: had caught our wind. But the wind was in our face. Man, dude,

2257
02:02:57,160 --> 02:02:59,480
Speaker 1: it was a good wind day that whole We're going

2258
02:02:59,520 --> 02:03:04,640
Speaker 1: to run out of daylight. But yeah, Art, what's up.

2259
02:03:04,960 --> 02:03:08,920
Speaker 1: You have to come back. No, no, I have no,

2260
02:03:09,000 --> 02:03:11,560
Speaker 1: I have a I have a something to do before

2261
02:03:11,560 --> 02:03:13,680
Speaker 1: a concluder and then give you my thoughts on a concluderk.

2262
02:03:13,680 --> 02:03:15,480
Speaker 1: You a quick question, please? Why did your shirt say

2263
02:03:15,520 --> 02:03:21,840
Speaker 1: orange on it? I was a Syracuse orangeman. Huh tell

2264
02:03:21,920 --> 02:03:29,120
Speaker 1: you like the oranges? I do um first, thanks as

2265
02:03:29,160 --> 02:03:31,320
Speaker 1: always to uh take me out and get to run

2266
02:03:31,400 --> 02:03:34,160
Speaker 1: them up with you guys, I would say not to

2267
02:03:34,200 --> 02:03:37,640
Speaker 1: go into like my personal life. I have struggled a

2268
02:03:37,680 --> 02:03:41,400
Speaker 1: little bit post being in this league of extraordinary gentleman

2269
02:03:41,440 --> 02:03:44,760
Speaker 1: that was the military, to find folks not in the

2270
02:03:44,800 --> 02:03:46,720
Speaker 1: military and kind of beyond that part of my life

2271
02:03:46,720 --> 02:03:49,480
Speaker 1: that I really liked being around. And the media crew

2272
02:03:49,560 --> 02:03:52,240
Speaker 1: is that crew. You y'a need the rest of the

2273
02:03:52,280 --> 02:03:53,800
Speaker 1: rest of the gents here and everybody doing it. So

2274
02:03:53,840 --> 02:03:56,680
Speaker 1: I appreciate that greatly. Yeah. I even saw you get

2275
02:03:56,960 --> 02:04:03,240
Speaker 1: Ridge Pounder's phone number. Yeah, man, even though he's leaving correct, correct,

2276
02:04:03,840 --> 02:04:09,400
Speaker 1: So I appreciate that. The thing were the thing that

2277
02:04:09,440 --> 02:04:10,680
Speaker 1: I meant to get into, but we didn't. But we

2278
02:04:10,720 --> 02:04:12,320
Speaker 1: talked about it before and well, next time you come out,

2279
02:04:12,320 --> 02:04:15,000
Speaker 1: we'll talk about we're out of time now, is that? Uh,

2280
02:04:15,200 --> 02:04:19,360
Speaker 1: you're knowing the way you knew yourself and knowing that

2281
02:04:19,400 --> 02:04:23,080
Speaker 1: there would be a void. Yeah, being having like the

2282
02:04:23,120 --> 02:04:25,480
Speaker 1: self awareness to know that there would be less kind

2283
02:04:25,520 --> 02:04:28,000
Speaker 1: of void that was gonna get filled with something when

2284
02:04:28,040 --> 02:04:30,800
Speaker 1: you left the military, and that you sort of consciously,

2285
02:04:31,240 --> 02:04:33,840
Speaker 1: you know, and you grow outdoors and grow fishing, skiing, hiking,

2286
02:04:34,160 --> 02:04:36,160
Speaker 1: but you knew that. You're like, there's gonna be a void,

2287
02:04:36,240 --> 02:04:39,360
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna consciously fill that void with something that

2288
02:04:39,400 --> 02:04:41,760
Speaker 1: taps into some of that same stuff because I don't

2289
02:04:41,800 --> 02:04:44,360
Speaker 1: want it to be filled in the way that isn't

2290
02:04:44,440 --> 02:04:47,320
Speaker 1: under my control. And there's a whole lot of people

2291
02:04:47,360 --> 02:04:50,520
Speaker 1: filling voids with the wrong stuff from from our line

2292
02:04:50,520 --> 02:04:52,520
Speaker 1: of work. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, So it's good. So that's

2293
02:04:52,840 --> 02:04:57,040
Speaker 1: that's first. So thanks on concluders. There's almost nothing. Since

2294
02:04:57,080 --> 02:04:59,400
Speaker 1: I love literature probably more than anything. When it comes

2295
02:04:59,400 --> 02:05:03,360
Speaker 1: to stories, I love storytelling. Nothing makes me happier than

2296
02:05:03,960 --> 02:05:07,880
Speaker 1: a story well concluded, and almost nothing bothers me more

2297
02:05:08,160 --> 02:05:11,280
Speaker 1: than one that doesn't end well. You should meet our

2298
02:05:11,320 --> 02:05:16,000
Speaker 1: friend dirt myth. So it occurred to me when I've

2299
02:05:16,000 --> 02:05:18,640
Speaker 1: listened to your podcast, they get the concluders whenever next,

2300
02:05:18,720 --> 02:05:20,320
Speaker 1: I was gonna be hon it. This would be my answer,

2301
02:05:20,360 --> 02:05:22,040
Speaker 1: not like I prepped this and he made the way,

2302
02:05:22,080 --> 02:05:24,720
Speaker 1: but was that. I'm not going to give a concluder

2303
02:05:25,240 --> 02:05:28,480
Speaker 1: because I feel like this story is about these relationships,

2304
02:05:28,480 --> 02:05:31,920
Speaker 1: and I hope that story goes on for perpetuity. So

2305
02:05:31,960 --> 02:05:33,400
Speaker 1: I'm not going to close, even though I know that's

2306
02:05:33,400 --> 02:05:35,760
Speaker 1: a little esoteric, but I'm not. I'm not going to

2307
02:05:35,800 --> 02:05:37,800
Speaker 1: give a concluder because I don't want this story in.

2308
02:05:38,240 --> 02:05:41,480
Speaker 1: What makes a great concluder, is it it's well thought? Yeah, Seth,

2309
02:05:45,400 --> 02:05:47,320
Speaker 1: I love the sound of a pig ink in its head.

2310
02:05:50,040 --> 02:05:53,960
Speaker 1: That takes me back. It was. It was just cool

2311
02:05:54,000 --> 02:05:58,760
Speaker 1: hanging out with York hearing your stories. Man, that's awesome stories,

2312
02:05:59,200 --> 02:06:01,560
Speaker 1: good story the bummers, a lot of them. Can't leave

2313
02:06:01,600 --> 02:06:05,040
Speaker 1: the can't leave the woods. But I wish we had

2314
02:06:05,080 --> 02:06:11,360
Speaker 1: another week. Yep, that was fun. Yeah, this is Danny.

2315
02:06:11,360 --> 02:06:15,160
Speaker 1: I had a thoroughly entertaining, interesting week. I appreciate it.

2316
02:06:15,160 --> 02:06:18,000
Speaker 1: Thanks for bringing me onto this. If your footage turns

2317
02:06:18,000 --> 02:06:19,880
Speaker 1: out to be good, I hope you come back with us. Thanks.

2318
02:06:19,880 --> 02:06:22,280
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Yeah, it's an interesting experience for sure.

2319
02:06:22,320 --> 02:06:23,840
Speaker 1: If the footage is no good, you'll never hear from

2320
02:06:23,920 --> 02:06:29,040
Speaker 1: us again. Sounds good. Second closer, I think it's more

2321
02:06:29,040 --> 02:06:31,080
Speaker 1: of a pro tip. The first half of my week,

2322
02:06:31,120 --> 02:06:35,120
Speaker 1: I would say it was fairly miserable because I came

2323
02:06:35,120 --> 02:06:37,160
Speaker 1: out here with the wrong foot wear. And every camera

2324
02:06:37,160 --> 02:06:39,520
Speaker 1: guy has like ten pairs of shoes that he travels

2325
02:06:39,520 --> 02:06:42,720
Speaker 1: with because you never know what, never need rubber boots

2326
02:06:42,800 --> 02:06:45,320
Speaker 1: or hiking boots, and so I brought a lot for it.

2327
02:06:45,320 --> 02:06:46,920
Speaker 1: And so the first one I tried for the first

2328
02:06:46,920 --> 02:06:50,480
Speaker 1: three days, put thirty miles on these things. Man, I

2329
02:06:50,520 --> 02:06:53,200
Speaker 1: thought my foot was gonna fall off, and it was

2330
02:06:53,200 --> 02:06:56,520
Speaker 1: a blister to look like a gunshot, really saying thing

2331
02:06:56,560 --> 02:06:58,520
Speaker 1: about it, because it didn't matter. I had to keep

2332
02:06:58,560 --> 02:07:02,520
Speaker 1: on walking. That earn you a lot of credit because

2333
02:07:02,800 --> 02:07:05,320
Speaker 1: not having never heard that the problem existed, and then

2334
02:07:05,360 --> 02:07:07,080
Speaker 1: seeing the problem and I was like the fact that

2335
02:07:07,080 --> 02:07:13,920
Speaker 1: he hasn't brought that up, Yeah, yeah, and pushed on

2336
02:07:14,080 --> 02:07:15,960
Speaker 1: my big tone ail one night when we were spiked

2337
02:07:15,960 --> 02:07:18,480
Speaker 1: out in a bunch of yellow pus came out of it.

2338
02:07:18,600 --> 02:07:20,680
Speaker 1: And then and that was aside from the blister on

2339
02:07:20,680 --> 02:07:23,480
Speaker 1: the back of my foot, the gun show, and so yeah,

2340
02:07:23,560 --> 02:07:24,920
Speaker 1: I guess to kind of book in it from the

2341
02:07:24,920 --> 02:07:27,840
Speaker 1: beginning of the conversation. I would have traded anything for

2342
02:07:27,920 --> 02:07:32,440
Speaker 1: a pair of flip flops that I was done the

2343
02:07:32,480 --> 02:07:34,520
Speaker 1: rest of the shooting flip flops, but I had a

2344
02:07:34,600 --> 02:07:37,040
Speaker 1: backup hair. So pro tip, don't go on to one

2345
02:07:37,080 --> 02:07:39,680
Speaker 1: of these things with a pair of boots so you

2346
02:07:39,720 --> 02:07:47,840
Speaker 1: haven't thoroughly walked in and bring your flips. Yeah, we've

2347
02:07:47,840 --> 02:07:50,280
Speaker 1: been playing to catch, so thank you for listening very much,

2348
02:07:50,560 --> 02:08:12,040
Speaker 1: and uh, we'll catch you next week.