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Speaker 1: This is Kelly Henderson and you're listening to the Velvet

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Speaker 1: Edge podcast. This week, my guest is singer songwriter Kelly Bannon,

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Speaker 1: who I have known for years in Nashville. We've also

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Speaker 1: just kind of grown up in the music industry here together.

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Speaker 1: I personally love hearing people's stories, and especially the imperfect,

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Speaker 1: behind the scenes stories of what it truly takes to

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Speaker 1: make it in this industry. Kelly talks about her journey

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Speaker 1: from growing up in Nashville and getting a record deal

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Speaker 1: to having songs on the radio and then now making

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Speaker 1: music completely on her own. She also has a really

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Speaker 1: great podcast called This Nashville Life that breaks down the

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Speaker 1: behind the scenes of the Nashville music industry. Even more so,

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Speaker 1: we talk about all of that, and also her new

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Speaker 1: music and just being a woman in the country music

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Speaker 1: world and how that's changed or maybe not changed in

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Speaker 1: the last year. Here's our conversation. Carry ready, I'm ready,

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, Kelly Bannon, singer songwriter Kelly Bannon is here. Hi.

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Speaker 1: I can't believe I haven't had you on before, because

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Speaker 1: I feel like that not a week goes by where

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Speaker 1: someone does not say to me if if they start

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Speaker 1: talking me and they're like Kelly, and I answer and

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Speaker 1: they think they're talking to you, or they tell me,

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Speaker 1: has anyone ever said to you you look just like

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Speaker 1: Kelly Bannon? That is I think that is a massive compliment.

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Speaker 1: I would love one. I would love your thighs. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: that's such Whenever anyone says that, I'm like, that's such

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Speaker 1: a compliment. That's like me seven years ago when I

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Speaker 1: was sitting balance. Later, but and I'm not as tall

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Speaker 1: as you, but you know, I will say, and I

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Speaker 1: think when I'm looking at you, it's not like we're

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Speaker 1: mere images of each other, but we do look a

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Speaker 1: lot like I. I don't love how long and over

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Speaker 1: my face is, but when I look at your face

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Speaker 1: and her face is amazing, that's really you know. I

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Speaker 1: have to do some shading to like same. Especially in pictures,

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Speaker 1: the contour is needed. We definitely have the same coloring

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Speaker 1: to you. And I think the same name situation even

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Speaker 1: more other level because my old my manager, I used

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Speaker 1: to be managed by a woman named Carrie Edwards. Do

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Speaker 1: you ever get confused for me? Sometimes? Yeah, so less

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Speaker 1: than the two of us, but when we were working together,

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Speaker 1: I think that confused people so much, so I would

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Speaker 1: know because they would call me Carrie. It's a little

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Speaker 1: tricky with us. Someone will just start talking about something

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, wait, they think I'm I think that

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Speaker 1: you think I'm Kelly Henderson. I've had full blown conversations

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Speaker 1: with people and they're talking to me so assertively that

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Speaker 1: I'm like, wait, we must have had this conversation was

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Speaker 1: I drunk, Like I don't know what it is, And

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Speaker 1: then once they say something about music or like me

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Speaker 1: playing guitar, I'm like, oh, that is so funny. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I was half of this conversation earlier in the

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Speaker 1: week with Ashley Iger, but we were trying to figure out,

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Speaker 1: like where do we know each other from? Because Nashville

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Speaker 1: is just such that city that you've just known people

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Speaker 1: forever and you don't run brow and I feel that

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Speaker 1: way with you. Do you remember I actually remember the

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Speaker 1: first time that I ever worked with you, which I

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Speaker 1: don't know if it was the first time we met,

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Speaker 1: but it was UM because I was already a fan

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Speaker 1: of your work and I knew of you. It was

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Speaker 1: that Um we were doing a corporate shoot for a

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Speaker 1: brand had a sponsorship with. When I was doing here,

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Speaker 1: and you were doing hair and makeup, but the phone

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Speaker 1: was if they wanted like natural natural, They're like every day,

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Speaker 1: we've got Kelly Henderson here. That would be so fun.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, we need to do another. I went

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Speaker 1: just to do that. That was the first time I

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Speaker 1: remember actually getting to be with you for any now.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if we had met casually before then.

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Speaker 1: I feel like, probably in a green room somewhere. I

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Speaker 1: don't award shop or some situate. We're always in the

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Speaker 1: same circle. So you grown up here though, right from Nashville.

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Speaker 1: My family moved here in the early eighties, and um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: so I'm not born but raised. I don't remember. We

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Speaker 1: were from Michigan originally. I don't remember anything else. Has

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Speaker 1: it changed so much for you? Because I feel like

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Speaker 1: it's changed so much for me. When did you get here?

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Speaker 1: Got here in two thousand four? Okay, so yeah, it

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Speaker 1: has changed a ton since then. Too. Um. I would

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Speaker 1: say I think of Nashville like it's grown up a

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Speaker 1: little bit. Um. I think there is still a lot

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Speaker 1: of the really charming parts that are maybe the southern

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Speaker 1: hospitality or overall like a warmth to people friendliness. Um,

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Speaker 1: I mean we can talk about some of the gender

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Speaker 1: stereotypes around, like expecting people to be friendly. I do

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Speaker 1: think Nashville, like when we moved here, my mom used

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Speaker 1: to say, people honk their horn to say hey, like

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Speaker 1: at the light you're a blogging traffic, So I think

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Speaker 1: that's changed. Obviously, traffic has changed. I think, um, the

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Speaker 1: restaurant scene is a really positive change. That's a huge

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Speaker 1: positive change. I agree with our city overall. Yes, setting

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Speaker 1: a lot better. Yes, what are some of the changes

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Speaker 1: you don't like? You know? I sometimes am torn when

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Speaker 1: people say when I hear people say the new Nashville, oh,

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Speaker 1: because I think one as not to sound like an asshole,

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Speaker 1: but as somebody who grew up here and was part

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Speaker 1: of the culture here. There's always been some really appealing

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Speaker 1: parts of the like what the community is, and I

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Speaker 1: think that's always been the most attractive thing about Nashville,

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Speaker 1: Like you can be a part of a community here.

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Speaker 1: You're going to find whether you're a creative or a

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Speaker 1: business person or like looking for a great family life,

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Speaker 1: you will find that here because community is so important.

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Speaker 1: And so there's a way where I sort of feel

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Speaker 1: like people want to take credit for the new Nashville,

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Speaker 1: and it's like, well, actually, I think you kind of

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Speaker 1: need to credit nashvillions, like because I was always here.

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Speaker 1: It was always here. But I do think that having

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Speaker 1: more business, having honestly more people that are our generation,

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Speaker 1: I think have really changed like adults, but still like

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Speaker 1: youthful minded adults that are forward thinking and you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe not kind of the blue blood culture. Right. That

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Speaker 1: was what's different about the Nashville that I grew up

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Speaker 1: in was in some ways very different than country. Um.

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Speaker 1: It was more southern. Um. I mean I'm a debutante.

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Speaker 1: Oh wow, that just shook me. I did not see that,

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Speaker 1: like just a different that part and that part of

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Speaker 1: Nashville is still exists, but I don't overlap with it

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Speaker 1: as much except it whole foods. Yeah, to somebody I

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Speaker 1: wanted to words, I don't even have words right now

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Speaker 1: that you're what was that like? You know, it was

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Speaker 1: just like one of those things that you do, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: do you do that? And I think it's very southern,

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Speaker 1: very southern. Yeah, there's a you know, huge ball Nashville.

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Speaker 1: Does it different than a lot of other stuff. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what you're Louisiana. Oh yeah, we had that,

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Speaker 1: so it would people do independent balls, like would there

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Speaker 1: be like a Kelly Henderson ball. I really didn't grow

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Speaker 1: up in that world of Louisiana where I'm from, but

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Speaker 1: they definitely had that. I'm trying to remember if it

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Speaker 1: was a specific person, but I do remember. Yeah, isn't

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Speaker 1: it like a coming out party or something? So different

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Speaker 1: cities do it differently. I think Atlanta you do like

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Speaker 1: an individual party. In Nashville there are charitable events. So

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Speaker 1: there are two big I think that's how it is

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Speaker 1: in Louisian and they essentially are charitable events and all

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Speaker 1: the girls, like, let's say it's one of them, might

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Speaker 1: be the winter of your freshman year of college, and

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Speaker 1: all the girls that are invited of that year would

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Speaker 1: all debut together. Wow do you like dance? What do

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Speaker 1: you do with you? I mean you have a massive gown,

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Speaker 1: so it's like a bridal gown. Like I bought my

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Speaker 1: gown at B Hughes, which is like the store. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you dance. I think you have to wear this

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Speaker 1: is so I didn't expect this to take this turn me.

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Speaker 1: You have to wear just curious length kid gloves, white

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Speaker 1: kid gloves. Oh, I need to see pictures of this.

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Speaker 1: We're probably going to have to find pictures of this

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Speaker 1: for me to post about after this conversation. And it's

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Speaker 1: white tie, of course, So it's tie and white tie

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Speaker 1: and tails for the guys. Yeah, okay, well that was

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Speaker 1: the fun fact of that was the last time I

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Speaker 1: was in white tie. Okay, Well, so with being busy

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Speaker 1: being a debutante. So listen, didn't you always know you

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Speaker 1: wanted to do music when you grew out? I, I

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Speaker 1: mean I always knew that I was obsessed with music,

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Speaker 1: and then it stirred something in me that almost made

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Speaker 1: me uncomfortable. Like do you remember when you did you

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Speaker 1: have like an alarm clock radio in your of course,

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Speaker 1: and I would have it set to either ninety seven

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Speaker 1: point nine, which is our country station, or one seven

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Speaker 1: point five, which is like our pop station still to

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Speaker 1: this day. And like certain songs I remember like woken

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Speaker 1: up to and feeling like it would just almost like

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Speaker 1: just stir me make me think, how do I this

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Speaker 1: is just almost really great songs are unnerving in the

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Speaker 1: way that they kind of get under your skin or

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Speaker 1: you can't get them out of your head. So I

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Speaker 1: remember feeling that I also was a huge Amy Grant fan.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I remember Amy Grant so well. And

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Speaker 1: so I would dress up like this is the middle

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Speaker 1: school days. Like I would dress up and hair brush

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Speaker 1: it in the mirror to Grant, heart and motion, Heart

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Speaker 1: and motion. Yes, that was the best. But no, I

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Speaker 1: went to college. I thought I was going to law school,

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Speaker 1: just be practical and try and make a living. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I think growing up here, one thing you

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Speaker 1: learn is everyone doesn't make it. I mean, we're going

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Speaker 1: to get into some of this. Everyone doesn't make it.

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Speaker 1: And so I had a bunch of you know, like

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Speaker 1: babysitters growing up. They'd moved to town, maybe they went

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Speaker 1: to Vandy, they were singing jingles back when that was

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Speaker 1: a thing, and then it wouldn't work out and they'd

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Speaker 1: move home. And so I think I was really aware

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Speaker 1: that not people don't like, lots of people don't make it.

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Speaker 1: So you have to be really really good. And I

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Speaker 1: think even more than that, there has to be all

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Speaker 1: this other stuff that collides, absolutely, the timing, the connections,

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Speaker 1: all of it. So you did go to college. What

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Speaker 1: do you have a degree in American politics? Oh, oh

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Speaker 1: my gosh, naturally, But no, I mean there are definitely

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Speaker 1: times I love. I went to u v A in Charlottesville, Virginia.

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Speaker 1: I loved v A. I sang in an acapella group

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Speaker 1: like some Lauren Hill and some Christine Aquilara. I don't

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Speaker 1: know that I loved my college experience, but I don't

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Speaker 1: know that it was productive for my music career. Well

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Speaker 1: except for the singing group. I mean maybe, Yeah, that

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Speaker 1: was that kind of when you started singing. That was

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Speaker 1: the first time that I was singing out like I

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Speaker 1: wasn't just in the choir or like right and people

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Speaker 1: were like, oh, you're because my family growing up, um

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Speaker 1: was not super musical. I grew up playing classical violin,

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Speaker 1: and you know, no one in my family was in

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Speaker 1: the music business. They were in business, and so it

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Speaker 1: wasn't like at home anyone was like, oh, wow, you

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Speaker 1: are like kind of a good singer. Yeah. Um. So

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Speaker 1: I think the first time I really had feedback from

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Speaker 1: the outside world like oh, you might be kind of

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Speaker 1: good at this and not just like you know, anybody

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Speaker 1: singing a lot like that was the first time I've

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Speaker 1: really had that like feedback from other people. And I think,

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Speaker 1: and I'll be curious what this moment was for you too,

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Speaker 1: because I think everyone has to have a moment where

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Speaker 1: someone else outside of themselves affirms that longing or that

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Speaker 1: thing that you have, that curiosity you have about you know,

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Speaker 1: a certain field or a passion that you have because

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Speaker 1: you very few people can do it with only their

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Speaker 1: own like their own totals. Have to have someone go,

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Speaker 1: you're looking good at that, you should do that? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Or have you ever thought about You've got to have

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Speaker 1: some other voices I think encouraging you. I think so too,

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Speaker 1: And I think it's a similar I had a similar

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Speaker 1: just path to what I do now because I didn't

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Speaker 1: think about it as a job like I always knew.

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Speaker 1: I was really interested in red carpets and what people

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Speaker 1: wore and what their hair and makeup looked like. But

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Speaker 1: I got a PR degree. You did, yes, Okay, So

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Speaker 1: when did you start or when was that first moment

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Speaker 1: when you were like, wait, maybe that's a career. So

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Speaker 1: I came to Nashville to do or it's in an

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Speaker 1: internship When I was in college in Nashville, and I

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Speaker 1: just loved the music industry and I was super drawn

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Speaker 1: to that, but I just still thought, oh, I'll just DPR.

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Speaker 1: But then you move here, and you know, kind of

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Speaker 1: like what you're saying, not everyone makes it. It's really competitive,

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Speaker 1: and there weren't that many jobs at that time. It

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Speaker 1: was a super small industry. I didn't know anybody, so

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Speaker 1: it was like all the people from Belmont or Vandy

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Speaker 1: who had the connections in the industry or whose parents

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Speaker 1: were in the industry, they were the ones who got

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Speaker 1: the first time jobs, you know. So I just had

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Speaker 1: to start hustling. And I did get a job in

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Speaker 1: pr but I hated it. And luckily during that time,

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Speaker 1: I met another makeup artist who was just like, hey,

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Speaker 1: I just need an assistant. I know you don't know

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Speaker 1: what you're doing, but you want to just come. And

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Speaker 1: I was like, yep, was it this cours doesn't even

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Speaker 1: live here anymore. Name was Alta, But yeah, okay, so

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Speaker 1: you're assisting. So I just as assisting and I just

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Speaker 1: started learning and realizing how much I loved that world.

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Speaker 1: I still was like, maybe I'll do wardrobe or maybe

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Speaker 1: I didn't know what it was specifically that I wanted

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Speaker 1: to do, and now that's I think that's why I

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Speaker 1: do a little bit of all of it. Yeah, was

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Speaker 1: that kind of what so when you finally like someone

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Speaker 1: was like, Oh, you're pretty good at this. What was

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Speaker 1: the next step would you do? I think? So I

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Speaker 1: was still in college and I was still you know,

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Speaker 1: got my degree, I was graduated. I was studying for

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Speaker 1: the l s AT, which is the entrance exam from

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Speaker 1: law school. And I was starting to write songs at

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Speaker 1: home just in my free time. And my husband, Jeff,

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Speaker 1: we got married right out of college. Jeff would make

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Speaker 1: me I had never played out really, so I never

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Speaker 1: played my guitar in front of anyone. I was. I'm

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Speaker 1: still not a great guitar player, but I was a

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Speaker 1: really shitty guitar player then. And he would every Thursday

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Speaker 1: we would have someone over for dinner and I would

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Speaker 1: have to play something I'd written that week in front

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Speaker 1: of them. Oh my god, which is honestly now, I

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Speaker 1: would be. So it's just it's so cringe worthy. And

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Speaker 1: we never We don't do that kind of stuff anymore either,

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Speaker 1: I don't. We don't sit around as much and trade

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Speaker 1: songs with friends like you do when you're just out

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Speaker 1: of college. I think, and knew it's all new, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: so our poor friends that would come over, they get

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Speaker 1: a free dinner. But they would have to endure some

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Speaker 1: really shitty songwriting. Uh, and that we were in Atlanta

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Speaker 1: at the time, and then we came back to Nashville

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Speaker 1: like two thousand five or six, and I started writing

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Speaker 1: almost full I mean as much full time. I had

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Speaker 1: a jewelry line then. Actually, if we ever talked about that,

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Speaker 1: but I have a little jewelry line. I'd fill orders

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Speaker 1: at night and then I'd write during the day. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: so what part do you like better? Do like the

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Speaker 1: singing or the songwriting or can you not pick? I

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Speaker 1: love I truly, truly, truly love singing. I also I

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Speaker 1: am a ball of nerves, so I bring a lot

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Speaker 1: of just my own ship to the table. So every

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Speaker 1: time I go on stage, and I don't know what

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Speaker 1: it's like for you, where these scenarios are. When every

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Speaker 1: time I step out on stage, I'm nervous. Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter how low like as far as the pressure

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Speaker 1: it really should be. I am nervous and I'm afraid

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Speaker 1: I'm going to completely fall on my face. So I

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Speaker 1: would say, what's tricky about that is every single day

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Speaker 1: I do my job, I have to get over this

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Speaker 1: big hurdle. Yeah, I did recently have, Like I was

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Speaker 1: working with an acting coach for a project that I'm

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Speaker 1: working on right now, and she was like, have you

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Speaker 1: heard of beta blockers? Have you heard of CBD? So,

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Speaker 1: but so that I would say, I love singing, that's

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Speaker 1: my probably my favorite thing to do ever. But also

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Speaker 1: it's it's like, did you ever see that Will Smith

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Speaker 1: video of him? Um? It was about skydiving and it

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Speaker 1: like the I wish I could remember the exact quote,

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Speaker 1: but it's on his Instagram somewhere. But essentially, they when

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Speaker 1: you go skydiving, they say, Okay, we're gonna You're gonna

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Speaker 1: jump on the count of three and they go three

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Speaker 1: or you know or whatever one. So they go one too,

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Speaker 1: and they push you out on three. You can't even

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Speaker 1: fully think about it. So you can't because if you wait,

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Speaker 1: you won't go. And so the moral of this, you know,

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Speaker 1: the story, is like the greatest joy or the greatest

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Speaker 1: accomplishment is just on the other side of your fear

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Speaker 1: um And I think about that a lot, because I

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Speaker 1: feel like I just walk around with a lot of fear,

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Speaker 1: but all the things that we want are just on

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Speaker 1: the other side of that. Year. Someone else has said

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Speaker 1: that before on this podcast, And that's one of my

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Speaker 1: favorite quotes, like, whatever it is you want is just

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Speaker 1: on the other side of fear. You just you kind

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Speaker 1: of have to jump analogy too, both. Yeah, So you

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Speaker 1: were in Atlanta singing songs for your friends. How do

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Speaker 1: you get to Nashville and get a record deal? Um?

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Speaker 1: And that was I kind of okay, So um, I

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Speaker 1: My whole journey, as far as that goes, went really

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Speaker 1: backwards to the order that it normally happens for people.

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Speaker 1: What do you mean I got a record deal before

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Speaker 1: I had a publishing deal, management, or really even any

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Speaker 1: reputation in town. I was kind of quietly doing my

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Speaker 1: thing with a handful of people that were not particularly

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Speaker 1: plugged into music row at the time, writing wise, and

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Speaker 1: I was shopped by my producer kind of co producing team,

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Speaker 1: which was a man named Paul Whorley who produced Dixie Chicks,

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Speaker 1: h Sarah Evans, Martina like all the records I grew

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Speaker 1: up listening to very famous, super famous and amazing human

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Speaker 1: and a man named Jerry's Smith. But we so they

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Speaker 1: used to do this. I don't know if this is

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Speaker 1: as much of the way that people get shopped to

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Speaker 1: record deals, but in two thousand twelve, Um, they had

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Speaker 1: we had made maybe a couple maybe we've gone in

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Speaker 1: and cut like three or four songs. They share the

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Speaker 1: music with Capital, with a couple other labels, and then

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Speaker 1: you go in and we just did like a little

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Speaker 1: like conference room, you know, performances acoustics, like a full showcase.

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Speaker 1: I feel like that's how they do it a lot now.

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Speaker 1: They do a lot of showcases now, I think, and

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Speaker 1: I honestly think they go so much more by social numbers.

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Speaker 1: Like I don't think there was Instagram in two thou

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Speaker 1: twelve or was brand new, like it wasn't. There was

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Speaker 1: maybe Facebook, yeah, definitely Facebook, Twitter, but I don't think

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Speaker 1: Instagram definitely wasn't a big thing. Yeah, So you we

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Speaker 1: went in. I played like one two thousand and twelve.

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Speaker 1: Kelly didn't know was literally wearing only mascara and that

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Speaker 1: was a big day. And I would think I was

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Speaker 1: wearing flats, but now I wouldn't. I mean, I didn't know,

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Speaker 1: And I think in some ways they found that charming,

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Speaker 1: like I didn't look like an artist, and that kind

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Speaker 1: of came back to bite me too, because I had

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Speaker 1: a lot of learning to do about I hate even

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Speaker 1: saying it because I think you don't have to buy in.

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Speaker 1: I think you can do it your own way. But

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Speaker 1: I think there are just generally expectations that even if

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Speaker 1: it's not a glamy like super pretty, you know, fashiony look,

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Speaker 1: you have to have an identifiable look as an artist.

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Speaker 1: Especially then, it was more like, yeah, you needed to look,

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Speaker 1: you need to do your makeup, you need to do

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Speaker 1: your hair. I mean I was told on radio tour

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Speaker 1: that I was expected to not wear pants, like I

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Speaker 1: needed to wear shorts or sc hurts. Oh wow, that's

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Speaker 1: amazing moment, right jeez. But I think that it's changed.

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Speaker 1: Just like I was hosting an event with Ashley McBride

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Speaker 1: over the weekend, and I love Ashley has such an

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Speaker 1: identifiable look, incredible gray streak, you know, right like on

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Speaker 1: her bangs, which is so gorgeous, and then these like

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Speaker 1: really tight curls and she's in she's in jeans and

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Speaker 1: she's in a t and it's not she's not going

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Speaker 1: to be like in some short outfits some and she's

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Speaker 1: but she has a very brandable like, she has an identity.

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Speaker 1: So I think I don't think you have to wear

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Speaker 1: the short skirt and tons of makeup necessarily, but you

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Speaker 1: have to have an identity. You have to kind of

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Speaker 1: own your look, whatever that may be. As stumb as

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Speaker 1: it sounds. I mean even back then, they would be like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: so Lindsay is the girl with a guitar and Janna

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Speaker 1: Kramer is the girl from the TV show, Like what

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Speaker 1: are you? I'm like, I'm the girl I just want

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Speaker 1: to sing, like really wants to write great songs and like,

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Speaker 1: you know, but but I think you know now I

392
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Speaker 1: probably would have better answers, of course, but it's so

393
00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 1: much easier to figure out. I think this goes with

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Speaker 1: any sort of business because I struggle with this brand

395
00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,280
Speaker 1: wise too. It's like what is your thing? Because it's

396
00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:18,200
Speaker 1: so oversaturated, which obviously in music there's a million girls

397
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Speaker 1: who want to be singers and who are beautiful and

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Speaker 1: who can do it. So what does make you stick out?

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Speaker 1: I do think it's helpful, though, to have people in

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Speaker 1: your life that can be an accurate mirror. What do

401
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,359
Speaker 1: you means? You need an outside perspective because you're thinking

402
00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:35,800
Speaker 1: about all every single little part of Kelly Henderson where

403
00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:38,600
Speaker 1: I as an outsider, right, go oh no, you're like

404
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:43,600
Speaker 1: sleeking a little edgy, cheeky, witty humor, straight talking you know,

405
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:50,439
Speaker 1: boss bitch, but like still, yeah, sometimes you need people

406
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,800
Speaker 1: around you that go You're all like, we're all a

407
00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:56,280
Speaker 1: lot of things, so we got to distill it down

408
00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:59,000
Speaker 1: to a handful of things that are the most I

409
00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:01,560
Speaker 1: think I'm a story to color. UM. I bring a

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Speaker 1: lot of heart and UM just I've had a ton

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Speaker 1: of therapy, So I think that's one of the things

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00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 1: that I don't know, hopefully, is UM connective about me?

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Speaker 1: Is I can Yeah? I mean we all have days

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Speaker 1: where we're just like I can't, you know, don't don't

415
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,320
Speaker 1: want to go there, have to be more guarded. But

416
00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:21,800
Speaker 1: I try and really connect with people I really care

417
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:28,399
Speaker 1: about relationships. UM. Also, I feel uh that, uh, supporting

418
00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:32,800
Speaker 1: empowered female voices and an empowered female perspective is really important.

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Speaker 1: So I have I feel like a lot of my songs,

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Speaker 1: even if they're more playful, like this last song that

421
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:39,399
Speaker 1: we you Know you were a part of UM is

422
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 1: a more playful it's probably a younger song, but it's

423
00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 1: still an empowered perspective. UM. So that's important to me.

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00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:49,479
Speaker 1: I don't know, it's it's ever changing to write You're

425
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:52,159
Speaker 1: like refining, but as it should be. I think it

426
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:53,879
Speaker 1: should evolve, you know, as long as you have your

427
00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:57,240
Speaker 1: foundation figured out. So did you figure out who you

428
00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 1: were to get the deal or was that a part

429
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 1: of like the process us. I think what happened there

430
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: more than anything. So I entered the business at a

431
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,080
Speaker 1: time of turmoil for that company, in that there was

432
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:13,840
Speaker 1: this huge merger happening. So the man who's signing me,

433
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,159
Speaker 1: Mike Dungan, who is still, I mean, one of my

434
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: idols in the industry. I love him and his passion

435
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 1: for music, and then he immediately signs me, and then

436
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:26,640
Speaker 1: almost immediately he moves over to Universal, the ultimate goal

437
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:28,720
Speaker 1: being that he's going to unite these two companies. But

438
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: for about eight months, we don't know what's going to happen,

439
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 1: and we're not kind of not supposed to be talking

440
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:35,040
Speaker 1: with him, but we know we think we're ultimately going

441
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:38,280
Speaker 1: to be working with him again. UM as far as

442
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:42,520
Speaker 1: like what what worked and what didn't, I think I

443
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:47,560
Speaker 1: had to take a I had to take more control

444
00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:51,719
Speaker 1: over my sound. I think I had really well written

445
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:54,360
Speaker 1: songs as I was first getting signed, and they were

446
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:56,399
Speaker 1: they did the same thing that I still think is

447
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,159
Speaker 1: like one of my big signatures for songwriting, which is

448
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:01,840
Speaker 1: there's a smart element to it. And I don't mean

449
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,720
Speaker 1: that in you know, I can be a little heavy,

450
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,200
Speaker 1: but it's not one of my favorite parts of my personality. Um,

451
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 1: but it's like playing with words in like kind of

452
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 1: a way that has a bit of a wink to it.

453
00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:15,919
Speaker 1: So the first single was called Sorry on the Rocks,

454
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 1: Like I got this guy that always just like calls

455
00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:19,879
Speaker 1: when he's to say sorry when he's drunk. That's the

456
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:23,879
Speaker 1: only time he's like remorseful for his shitty behavior. Um.

457
00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:27,159
Speaker 1: And then, uh so I think that was there. But

458
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,880
Speaker 1: I think production wise, I had this incredible producer, Paul Whorley,

459
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:33,040
Speaker 1: who had made you know, had all these Grammys and

460
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: had made all these famous albums, but I didn't know

461
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:39,679
Speaker 1: how to help him do me. So I think the

462
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 1: music was not as original, not as edgy. Um I

463
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:47,800
Speaker 1: would sing, I'd sing, you know, a couple takes on something,

464
00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:49,240
Speaker 1: and I'd start to get a little texture on my

465
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:50,960
Speaker 1: voice and you'd be like, yeah, you're done for the day,

466
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 1: because that's a style like you not everybody wants a

467
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:56,680
Speaker 1: ton of, you know, Like one of my favorite things

468
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: about I mean that was where as I started working

469
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 1: with my next producer, Jason Lenning, He'd be like, Okay,

470
00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: go get another glass of bourbon. You know, when I

471
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 1: started to get a little texture. And so I think

472
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 1: figuring that out and and finding people that help you

473
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:15,920
Speaker 1: be you and set you up to be a really

474
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 1: great version of yourself. Um, So that I think was important.

475
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 1: Finding a stylist, I mean, and that was one of

476
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 1: those things too, Like there was this kind of chat

477
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: going around the building when I was first signed. I

478
00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 1: had done a little private event for the team. It

479
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 1: was in the basement of Maggianos, which is just like

480
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 1: a terrible location to like co introduce someone to you know,

481
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 1: their new team. And I'm wearing this little free people

482
00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 1: sun dress and I'm probably in a little wedge and

483
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 1: don't have a ton of you know, hair and makeup happening.

484
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,560
Speaker 1: And it got back to me that people in the

485
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:55,560
Speaker 1: building were saying, she's not sparkly, she doesn't sparkle um

486
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 1: And then I had then, I you know, did the

487
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:02,400
Speaker 1: thing that in to cure you know, person in their

488
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 1: twenties that doesn't really know any better. I just was like,

489
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,440
Speaker 1: fuck that, I'm going to be sparkly, and I spent

490
00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 1: a lot of time. I probably lost a lot of

491
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 1: time unto that altar of like I'm going to look

492
00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 1: sucking sparkly, like to make everybody happy. Absolutely yes, well

493
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: maybe because it was like, oh normal me isn't enough,

494
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 1: isn't good enough, or it doesn't look like that would

495
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:29,880
Speaker 1: be a that's a big one for me to just

496
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,119
Speaker 1: like body image and beauty issues like not I was

497
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 1: not super cute, Like growing up, I wasn't. No one

498
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,280
Speaker 1: was like, oh that Kelly Bannon is really cute, you know,

499
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,280
Speaker 1: Like I was nerdy and I didn't know how to

500
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 1: do my hair makeup. I probably didn't know how to

501
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 1: dress for myself, and like just also when you don't

502
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 1: know yourself, I agree with that. I was just about hard.

503
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 1: You're never more I think you're never more attractive and

504
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 1: powerful than when you just own yourself, know who you

505
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,760
Speaker 1: are and have a really strong sense of self. So

506
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 1: there was a lot of kind of looking around and

507
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: trying to make other people happy before I finally came

508
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,400
Speaker 1: to the end of that and was like, I think

509
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: I need the more I know myself, the more I'm

510
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,159
Speaker 1: going to be able to make the music that I

511
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: want and play the part. I mean, because you do

512
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,120
Speaker 1: you when you're on stage, you are a version of yourself.

513
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 1: It's a performance exactly entertainment. Yes, And I think you

514
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:30,200
Speaker 1: don't want me to wear the same thing that I'm

515
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 1: like rolling around town popping over to target in right,

516
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,640
Speaker 1: that's part you know. But so I think that just

517
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 1: I'm a I think I'm a late bloomer and on

518
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 1: a lot of fronts. And it took me a long

519
00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 1: long time, yeah, to really probably know know what I

520
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: wanted and not believe that I just would find the

521
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:55,160
Speaker 1: right answer asking other people and then do that. So

522
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,239
Speaker 1: how did you get back in touch with yourself then?

523
00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,159
Speaker 1: Because this deal went away? Right? So that too? So

524
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: I actually think I was learning a lot about myself

525
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:05,359
Speaker 1: and stepping out into it as we were still having

526
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,920
Speaker 1: some really cool moments with Universal, Like a real moment,

527
00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 1: really great, powerful moment for me was famous coming out

528
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,320
Speaker 1: and that I just we disappeared and I went and

529
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 1: made music with a new producer, Jason Lenning, and I

530
00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,160
Speaker 1: was like, the only chance I have now that we've

531
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 1: already had one field single, now there's a merger, The

532
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 1: only chance I have is if I go away and

533
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: I come back with something really different and fresh and

534
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: it worked. I mean, I think what was sad about

535
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,439
Speaker 1: that song is it was about I don't know, twelve

536
00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 1: or fourteen months before Kelsey's first hit me. Yeah, I

537
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 1: mean like you mean it, And I think we got

538
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 1: a lot We got pretty beat up over that song

539
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: at country radio because it was progressive and pop leaning

540
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 1: and kind of before that was acceptable. So we knew

541
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 1: there were like huge sales numbers with that song and

542
00:28:55,920 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 1: huge streaming numbers. Uh, but we didn't have time for

543
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: a lot of that to really kick in and convinced

544
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 1: country radio that. But I think for me, that's the

545
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:10,959
Speaker 1: one that got away. Yeah. And then, um, you know,

546
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: out of when something doesn't work, it can really you

547
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 1: can get in a bit of a tailspin about it,

548
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: like what if I wasn't broken but the system was broken,

549
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 1: But instead you internalize it and go, oh that I'm

550
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 1: still broken and I don't have my ship together, and

551
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 1: like so you kind of go into So I think

552
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 1: that was I was like learning, oh wait, when I

553
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: step out and try something that feels like me, it

554
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: can work. But and then when it doesn't work, what

555
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,200
Speaker 1: do I do? Isn't that the hardest thing when you

556
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,000
Speaker 1: feel like you're being authentic to you and you feel

557
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 1: so good about it and it feels just so true,

558
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 1: and then it doesn't work, like not getting that validation back.

559
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: It's crushing. But I you know what a friend of mine,

560
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,480
Speaker 1: I think, Ruthie Collins told me this last summer, we

561
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 1: put out three songs at the same time. They were

562
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 1: all getting they were all getting a lot of play

563
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: on Sirius xm um, all part of what they call

564
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 1: um their Highway Fine program. But it was also for

565
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 1: people that had never heard of me. They're like, holy shit,

566
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 1: why are their three brand new songs from this person

567
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: I've never heard of? They're like all in my radio

568
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: station right now. So there were kind of equal. There

569
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 1: was a lot of love and there was also a

570
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 1: lot of dislike because it was a lot oversaturated, which

571
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 1: you're being exposed to a bunch of people. And Ruthie said,

572
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 1: it's great because you're like the sooner. Like the sooner

573
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: you do something, Okay, let's say you've got a casual fan.

574
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: It was like kind of listening passive fan of kind

575
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,840
Speaker 1: of listening if I do something that's really me, but

576
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 1: they don't like it and they're like, oh, that's not

577
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: for me. She's like, great, because you're finding your actual people.

578
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 1: That is so true. The more you're doing like kind

579
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: of the in the middle thing where like, yeah, I

580
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 1: kind of like that, Like you don't want lukewarm. Really

581
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,600
Speaker 1: it's far from a business perspective of like from an

582
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 1: artist perspective, but you can kind of lukewarm can feel

583
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 1: okay because no one's saying I don't like that, and

584
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 1: because it's numbers a lot of times quantity totally. So

585
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,120
Speaker 1: I think learning that it's okay that people are like

586
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 1: I hate that because other people are saying I love that,

587
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:20,080
Speaker 1: and then you're finding your real people. Someone told me

588
00:31:20,160 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 1: one time that I think it was Bobby Bones actually,

589
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:25,760
Speaker 1: because he's pretty polarizing as a person, you know, but

590
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: he's found so much success in that because either people

591
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,600
Speaker 1: are super interested or they don't know what to expect,

592
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: and that's interesting, you know, and he's found his audience

593
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 1: that way, which to me was a huge it was

594
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:42,239
Speaker 1: a huge aha moment to just be like, right, you

595
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 1: can't live in that middle ground. Really, you have to

596
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 1: really find your voice. Well, I really see that on

597
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 1: your stuff, and I think there are in my moments

598
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 1: where maybe I don't have as much courage. That's where

599
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 1: I want to be living because I think, Okay, this

600
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,480
Speaker 1: is a really silly example, but I was in Chicago

601
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: over the weekend and I bought like some really gorgeous lingerie,

602
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:07,920
Speaker 1: like like like just like a really beautiful bra underwear situation,

603
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 1: a little boutique in wicker Park, and I was like,

604
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 1: I would love to put this on my stories because

605
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:15,360
Speaker 1: it's gorgeous, and I'd love to shut out the brands,

606
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 1: but I feel like I would get like some backlash

607
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 1: from some of the more conservative people that follow me

608
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: or some of the parents of my friends. And I

609
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:31,320
Speaker 1: literally didn't post something all my stories, which is so dumb,

610
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:34,080
Speaker 1: because I was like, I feel like somebody I'm going

611
00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 1: to get some backlash for this. It wouldn't have even

612
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 1: been me in the underwear, like I was like doing

613
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 1: some blat way and I'm like, girl, we would have

614
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 1: been asking exactly. And I think back to your point

615
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 1: about Bobby. Even I think most people that tune in

616
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:56,520
Speaker 1: tune in because they fucking love him, right, But even

617
00:32:56,560 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: the people that tune in because they don't, they're still listening.

618
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: So he's still got their number person, and people tune

619
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,040
Speaker 1: into hate as much as they tune into I agree,

620
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 1: he's a smart, smart man, So you find your voice

621
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 1: a little bit more. What's so, what's the next step though?

622
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:16,120
Speaker 1: Because I know you? Then I leave and then I

623
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:19,960
Speaker 1: left mydea, which was hard because I one, it's really

624
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: expensive to make music by yourself. You need the backing

625
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,479
Speaker 1: of a label or something about I mean, you know, okay,

626
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 1: what I mean, are you comfortable? What is an average

627
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: hair and makeup cost for a shoot? Oh? You want

628
00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:37,120
Speaker 1: me to say what we may or like arrange? I

629
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 1: think you can go anywhere between you know, twelve to

630
00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: two thousand for just one and then you usually have

631
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 1: two people and rageous like that's not that's a standard

632
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 1: right there. So then you can assume like stylist just

633
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:54,360
Speaker 1: going to be somewhere in there too, photographer is going

634
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: to be you know, way more than that. So just

635
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: think about those kinds of numbers you're when you you know,

636
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 1: And so I had to really learn to piece things

637
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 1: together and uh and not hopefully not, I mean hustle

638
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:10,799
Speaker 1: to an extent. I like the word hustle, and I

639
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:15,040
Speaker 1: also don't like it because I like the word hustle

640
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: from a work ethic perspective, totally embrace it from a

641
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 1: work ethic perspective. For me, just because I've done so

642
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,759
Speaker 1: much therapy, I'm like, I don't want to embrace a

643
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,160
Speaker 1: thing where I have to like be grabbing and chasing,

644
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 1: because I'm like, I don't do that. I don't want

645
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 1: to do that anymore. Like, and it kind of sounds

646
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: grimy or like you would use people or just be

647
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 1: out for your own goals and all of that thing,

648
00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:37,719
Speaker 1: and I don't mean it that way either. So more

649
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: about like really really work hard, really really try and

650
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:43,479
Speaker 1: come up with opportunities where maybe I can't offer someone

651
00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 1: that rate, but I would say, instead, I can offer

652
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:47,920
Speaker 1: you this, and you know, I'm going to be really

653
00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:50,120
Speaker 1: accommodat about your schedule. I'm only going to use you

654
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 1: for this short amount of time, right, So trying to

655
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,560
Speaker 1: come up with, you know, ways to be creative about

656
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 1: how you keep costs down so you can continue competing

657
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:03,279
Speaker 1: at that same high level that you were. But the

658
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,520
Speaker 1: hardest thing for me leaving the record deal was one

659
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:10,279
Speaker 1: you have a lot of credibility when you have a

660
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 1: major label deal totally and not even like you have

661
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 1: the credibility, and then you're talking about all the people

662
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,120
Speaker 1: you have to hire as like a freelancing. But there's

663
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,919
Speaker 1: at a label, there's a radio department, there's marketing, there's

664
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:26,720
Speaker 1: popular's creative direction, there are graphic designers. You're not paying

665
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:30,320
Speaker 1: all a cart for any of that, and there's visual

666
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 1: there's I mean resources just even to go make a record.

667
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,360
Speaker 1: So and I loved my team, and so for me,

668
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,400
Speaker 1: I felt we had had three singles go to country

669
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:43,919
Speaker 1: radio and we just didn't have any heat after kind

670
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: of the aftermath of Famous really, and I just didn't

671
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:52,560
Speaker 1: think I'd already reinvigorated the team once had to start over,

672
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: and I just didn't know the likelihood of being able

673
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 1: to do that a third time or a second time.

674
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,359
Speaker 1: And I wanted to make music and put it out

675
00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 1: and I wasn't going to be able to do that.

676
00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 1: And it's not because it's the big bad label. They're

677
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: they're just smart about their business and they're not going

678
00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:11,319
Speaker 1: to spend money on stuff that they can't put out

679
00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 1: or you know. So I had gone and made an

680
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: EP independently, and we just said, hey, we've we've gone

681
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 1: and made music. I think it's time to move on.

682
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:25,839
Speaker 1: And they were really gracious and they said okay, they said,

683
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 1: we love you. Go like good, look. Let you ever

684
00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 1: think about quitting at that point? Was it scary or

685
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 1: were you just like, no, this is my dream and

686
00:36:34,120 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 1: I just I'm going to do it. I'm gonna figure

687
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: it out. Honestly, I don't remember thinking about quitting. Then.

688
00:36:42,840 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 1: Do you have any moments when you've thought about quitting? Oh?

689
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:47,319
Speaker 1: I mean all the time, but I almost think I

690
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 1: think about quitting now more because I actually have a

691
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: lot of other opportunities that I didn't have. Then that

692
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 1: makes sense. I don't really think about quitting, probably because

693
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 1: I'm just now, I'm so stubborn. I'm just like, I

694
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 1: will not it in, I will not give it. But

695
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,799
Speaker 1: there are moments like I you know, I've said this

696
00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,680
Speaker 1: probably before. I haven't said who said it, But you know,

697
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:13,200
Speaker 1: about a year ago, I was changing management and we

698
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 1: had some stuff happening, and my manager was talking with

699
00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 1: the publisher like, hey, I really want you to take

700
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,400
Speaker 1: a second look at Kelly. We believe in her songwriting

701
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:24,120
Speaker 1: so much. We really want her to be getting some

702
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 1: other cuts and not just writing for herself and this

703
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 1: person who's a major executive just slipped at him and said,

704
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 1: I mean she's really already had her shot. What. So

705
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:37,759
Speaker 1: it's kind of like when you're worst nightmare of what

706
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 1: you think people might be saying about her, like oh

707
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 1: my god, she's really gotten fat since she's been married

708
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,440
Speaker 1: for so long, or like, um, she's really looking her

709
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:46,839
Speaker 1: age right now. It's like the worst ship you think

710
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 1: in your head someone might be saying about you. Oh

711
00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:51,280
Speaker 1: he was saying actually actually said out loud to my manager.

712
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,480
Speaker 1: And that's where I got. Man, I want to I

713
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 1: want to shut down those voices in myself because yeah,

714
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: people are going to say that. People are going to

715
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 1: say something, isn't I mean, that's such a good point

716
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: your worst fear when someone else says it, and the

717
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:09,720
Speaker 1: voice in your head is so hard to keep out anyway,

718
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 1: Like I'm sure in your head you're saying these things

719
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 1: over and over over your inner monologue is I mean mine,

720
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,160
Speaker 1: you know different, It is different every day, but it's

721
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:20,719
Speaker 1: not good. So if someone else validates that, so we're

722
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:23,480
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it can send me into a huge

723
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: tails then so then that's like, okay, what do I

724
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 1: do now? Like I try and do things that make

725
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:34,160
Speaker 1: like really ground me. And that's and and also my

726
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:38,399
Speaker 1: female friendships have been really really important to me, just

727
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: from the perspective of having people I can tell you

728
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:45,520
Speaker 1: what's true about you. Hey, guess what you you did

729
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 1: this last year? Do you remember when that happened? Like

730
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 1: when that when that happened. I told my best friend Brenna,

731
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:53,160
Speaker 1: and she was like, Hey, She's like, do you remember

732
00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 1: last year when you didn't have a record deal, you

733
00:38:55,120 --> 00:38:57,840
Speaker 1: didn't have management because I just fired my manager and

734
00:38:57,960 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 1: you opened for a little big town at the Rhyman

735
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:04,280
Speaker 1: and you out of standing ovation. I was like, oh, yeah,

736
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 1: that happened. That happened. And just having people in your

737
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,919
Speaker 1: life that can help remind you. You know, we're gonna

738
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: have shitty days, and we're gonna have days when the

739
00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 1: voices in our heads wind, but if you can go

740
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 1: kind of back to center, even like take three deep breaths.

741
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: I mean, that's so cheesy. I hate meditating, like that's

742
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 1: not my thing. But even when I feel like my

743
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 1: nerves rise up, just taking three breasts or even this

744
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 1: is a weird thing that I learned in therapy. So

745
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:39,279
Speaker 1: anything that's tactile um, like even just like touching your

746
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 1: pants on your leg, anything that's tactile immediately grounds you really,

747
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 1: so just to grab hold of it, yeah, touch it,

748
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:49,920
Speaker 1: or like breathe in and smell like okay that candle,

749
00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 1: Like what do I smell? Anything that connects you with

750
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 1: your senses just grounds you and kind of give out

751
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:59,200
Speaker 1: of the spinning. Yeah. I love that about having the

752
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:01,239
Speaker 1: good friends who can remind you of who you are

753
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:04,680
Speaker 1: when I'm spinning in my head, that is the first

754
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 1: thing that goes for me is like you, who's your

755
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:10,600
Speaker 1: person for that? Mary Hilliard probably Mary Hilliard Harrington. She

756
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:14,360
Speaker 1: definitely is like what when I start going to you know,

757
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:17,440
Speaker 1: it's like I can be so defeated and she can

758
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: just rip me out of that place and be like, well,

759
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,520
Speaker 1: you don't see the person I see. You know. That's

760
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:25,439
Speaker 1: and that is when I said earlier, accurate mirrors. That's

761
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 1: what I'm talking about, Like, here's what I see, and

762
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 1: that's so powerful. I love that. I've never met Mary,

763
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: I'm aware of I've always heard about her. I mean,

764
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 1: I know she's worked with Dirks forever and she was

765
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 1: in PR before she was managing full time. And I'm

766
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,560
Speaker 1: sure we've been in a backstage room, absolutely never actually

767
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 1: had a conversation with her. That's insane to me because

768
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 1: this community is so smart. I've actually done a podcast

769
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 1: with her that if you guys have not listened to,

770
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:53,880
Speaker 1: they should definitely go listen. But she is just like

771
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 1: the biggest badass in Nashville, so awesome. I love her

772
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:58,279
Speaker 1: so much. I think I have seen like photos of

773
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:01,439
Speaker 1: her office though, because because it's probably pretty cool. Yeah,

774
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:04,800
Speaker 1: I think it must have been really beautiful or something. Anyway,

775
00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:06,960
Speaker 1: I'm not a stalker. I think what your story is

776
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 1: so interesting. I was just thinking about all of the

777
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 1: things that have to go exactly right to have a

778
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 1: hit song and to make an artist's career work. Isn't

779
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 1: that crazy to think about it? Honestly, that will send

780
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:22,800
Speaker 1: me in the freak out zone because it's and the

781
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:24,400
Speaker 1: and the other thing that and this is something we

782
00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:26,399
Speaker 1: were never we had trouble with, And I think why

783
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:30,239
Speaker 1: we couldn't, you know, make more of my time at

784
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 1: a major label is we would have like a base hit,

785
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:35,799
Speaker 1: but you couldn't, like we couldn't get three in a row.

786
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:39,440
Speaker 1: You'd have one little blip up and then when that

787
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 1: momentum is happening, you have to be able to come

788
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 1: right behind it with more stuff to keep the story going,

789
00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 1: to get kind of established. So is that what it's

790
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 1: like the three hits? People say yeah, well or not

791
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: even like songs, It's like, okay, so you have this

792
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 1: story around, this song is happening and it's growing, and

793
00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: then you need to make a tour announcement and then

794
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,799
Speaker 1: and you need or some other big pr story and

795
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: then you need so you need like it is this,

796
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:07,040
Speaker 1: I mean we were talking about it. I don't know

797
00:42:07,040 --> 00:42:10,359
Speaker 1: if we had pushed record, but about how literally their

798
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 1: work is never over and if you don't close your

799
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 1: computer and like shut it down, you it's it's feeding

800
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:22,520
Speaker 1: that feeding the story is constant. So interesting. So do

801
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:25,960
Speaker 1: you feel like the because there's a huge movement right

802
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: now with women and country music making the argument that

803
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 1: they have just been shafted for years, which is true,

804
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:37,360
Speaker 1: and you were kind of thrown into that time period,

805
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 1: wasn't for sure for sure? Did that affect things? Yes?

806
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: And what's amazing? So we had a top forty on

807
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,759
Speaker 1: my first single, um even though you know, and then

808
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 1: so that was actually they did a pretty good job

809
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:54,560
Speaker 1: as sad as that sounds to have like barely have

810
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 1: a top forty. But I think what I've learned, and

811
00:42:57,680 --> 00:43:00,360
Speaker 1: maybe it's just because I'm older now, I think then

812
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:03,160
Speaker 1: it was okay for everyone was talking about, oh, it's

813
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 1: so hard to get on the radio for a woman,

814
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: and I was like, I'm going to be the exception,

815
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 1: and I was satisfied with the idea of being the exception.

816
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:17,479
Speaker 1: And now I'm like, that is not fucking good enough.

817
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 1: That is not good enough for our girls, that's not

818
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,120
Speaker 1: good enough for our like women that are entering college.

819
00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 1: That isn't good enough for me. That's not good enough

820
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 1: for Marin or for Kelsey Vallerine or for any like

821
00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:32,240
Speaker 1: being the exception. That is bullshit. So I think that's

822
00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 1: maybe where my thinking has changed a little bit. Is

823
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:37,600
Speaker 1: maybe just when I was younger, I was a little

824
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: more self focused in it was I just believed it

825
00:43:41,560 --> 00:43:43,839
Speaker 1: would work for me, and so it I wasn't as

826
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: concerned with the overall, like the greater picture. And now

827
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 1: I'm as a whole, like really legitimately concerned that a

828
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 1: little girl that's riding in her car that here's I

829
00:43:56,040 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 1: don't know, the one, what is it like their average

830
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:04,600
Speaker 1: radio station is maybe between ten and at best female.

831
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,200
Speaker 1: So she hears that one female voice and she's like,

832
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 1: I want to be a singer when I grew up,

833
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:14,839
Speaker 1: And Nope, that's not actually a viable possibility. So that

834
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,839
Speaker 1: is where I feel that we have to step in

835
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 1: and and it's not Radio is not the bad the

836
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:26,240
Speaker 1: bad guy, Like radio is part of this whole system

837
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 1: that has happened and it's changed because this town is

838
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 1: so interconnected that you can't look at anyone thing and

839
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,760
Speaker 1: say that's the problem. Because you know, the average publisher

840
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,600
Speaker 1: can't justify signing a bunch of women writers because they're

841
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 1: probably gonna write female songs and there's only a handful

842
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:46,399
Speaker 1: of women they could pitch that too, so they can't

843
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 1: pay for that person's draw because they aren't going to

844
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 1: see the royalties that they need. And because there aren't

845
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: a ton of female songs being written, there are less

846
00:44:56,600 --> 00:45:01,840
Speaker 1: great female songs floating around, probably just from a sheer

847
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:05,840
Speaker 1: volume perspective, so artists are pretty much have to write

848
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,799
Speaker 1: all of their songs like female artists, you just are

849
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 1: not going to have that many, like incredible outside songs

850
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: to pick from. When I really think those are the

851
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: songs that build this town, the house that built me,

852
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:21,799
Speaker 1: Girl Crush, those were outside songs and so and then

853
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:26,440
Speaker 1: you've got labels signing less people, less women, um, because

854
00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:30,160
Speaker 1: they can't get on the radio, and because there's probably

855
00:45:30,239 --> 00:45:33,520
Speaker 1: just just so. But this cycle, it's a weird cycle.

856
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 1: And I mean, you have tons of people in your

857
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:37,840
Speaker 1: life that has spoken probably about the main Bobby speaks

858
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 1: about it a lot. There's a lot of different perspectives.

859
00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 1: I'm not the only perspective. I just think we're out

860
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,279
Speaker 1: of place where we have had so few women on

861
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:50,319
Speaker 1: the radio for so long that it's actually changed are

862
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 1: the way that we listen so that I may not

863
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:57,799
Speaker 1: be able to even listen to other female voices with

864
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:02,319
Speaker 1: the same objectivity because we've now we've like trained our

865
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:05,880
Speaker 1: ears to hear certain things. So I think even my

866
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:09,680
Speaker 1: bar for women is higher. Do you think it's getting

867
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 1: any better? I don't know. I think that, um. I

868
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:17,080
Speaker 1: think that there's the potential for streaming to really really change,

869
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 1: uh the playing field. But country is sort of the

870
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 1: last to adopt streaming, so we are you know, our

871
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 1: genre consumes a lot less music in the streaming world

872
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:33,160
Speaker 1: than other genres. I don't know. I mean, I think

873
00:46:33,239 --> 00:46:37,840
Speaker 1: it's I think the we're doing right now, we're educating.

874
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 1: We're still educating. We've probably been educating for five years,

875
00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:46,040
Speaker 1: four years. And then when we've when everyone knows it's

876
00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 1: a problem, then probably it will start. But I still

877
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 1: sometimes feel like we're in education where like you'll get

878
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:53,279
Speaker 1: I'll get a tweet that's like, well, isn't it just

879
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:57,200
Speaker 1: that like women aren't making as good music as guys like,

880
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 1: oh sir, I'm like, this is going to be a

881
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:07,480
Speaker 1: long tweet conversation. But and it's like the other thing

882
00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:09,239
Speaker 1: is and I think Marin has said this, the most

883
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:11,440
Speaker 1: interesting thing about me is not that I'm a woman.

884
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,040
Speaker 1: That's such a good point. It's not the most interesting

885
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:17,720
Speaker 1: thing about you, but because becomes the most interesting thing. Yeah,

886
00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:20,319
Speaker 1: so it becomes the thing you talk about, and I'm

887
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:22,200
Speaker 1: happy to talk about it. Yes we have to talk

888
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:24,560
Speaker 1: about it, but it's the thing that you talk about

889
00:47:24,560 --> 00:47:29,960
Speaker 1: instead of like your music or you know, so speaking

890
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,919
Speaker 1: of music, let's talk about your new music. Because with

891
00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 1: that guy saying first of all that the music is

892
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,239
Speaker 1: not as good, I love this music. I think it's

893
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:40,759
Speaker 1: so great for you and it's completely to me, Well,

894
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:43,960
Speaker 1: completely different from where you started, and it really feels

895
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 1: like you've found your voice, your style, your vibe. How

896
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: how does it feel to you? So this record I

897
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:57,360
Speaker 1: made with Jaren Johnston, who is three, it makes everything

898
00:47:57,400 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 1: makes so much more sense. Say what you mean then,

899
00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:01,239
Speaker 1: because I feel like there was a lot of like

900
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 1: garage band rock vibe to the back of it, and

901
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: I just I didn't totally recognize that immediately. And when

902
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:11,040
Speaker 1: you say Jared and like literally he uses garage, Well

903
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:14,359
Speaker 1: there you go. Because he's so he's kind of a

904
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:18,839
Speaker 1: little yeah, he's kind of he's grunge, a little grunge e.

905
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:21,799
Speaker 1: And I, guys don't know Jaren Johnson. He's the lead

906
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 1: singer of Cadillac. Also has had tons of hits I

907
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:28,719
Speaker 1: think probably like five or six number ones as a writer. Um,

908
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:30,880
Speaker 1: and he's a Nashville native. So what's funny is we

909
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:32,719
Speaker 1: were both in high school at the same time. We

910
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,080
Speaker 1: didn't go to the same high schools, but we had

911
00:48:35,160 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 1: a lot of common friends. Didn't didn't know each other then,

912
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:43,240
Speaker 1: But making this record, I felt really relaxed because Jaren

913
00:48:43,600 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 1: is he's just one. He's really confident, He's like he

914
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:53,680
Speaker 1: is one of those people that is really confident in themselves,

915
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:56,839
Speaker 1: but not in an asshole way, and so he's just like,

916
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 1: this is baller. He's just like this is bad, this

917
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:05,040
Speaker 1: is amazing, and I'm like, is this good? You know? So? Um,

918
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 1: that was really fun. And there were also a lot

919
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:10,360
Speaker 1: of Nashville natives on the project and in the studio,

920
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 1: which was really lucky and cool and doesn't happen that often.

921
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 1: That was awesome, and I think I just felt a

922
00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:19,280
Speaker 1: lot of freedom because when you're not making a project

923
00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: for anyone else, Yeah, a lot of freedom. So you've

924
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:26,440
Speaker 1: done this completely on your own. This, yeah, I have

925
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 1: no money. Now hopefully you can make some of that.

926
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: It was really about the album, not until October October eleven,

927
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,560
Speaker 1: but the single out right now, let's talk about It's

928
00:49:40,600 --> 00:49:43,280
Speaker 1: called Boys Don't Crap. Right. So I did this profile

929
00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:46,280
Speaker 1: you sent out to a couple of us girls in Nashville,

930
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 1: a breakup profile. It was my favorite thing we've ever done.

931
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,399
Speaker 1: It was so fun and I think funny, but thank

932
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:55,360
Speaker 1: you for doing it. Of course, of course does she

933
00:49:55,400 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: posted on her Instagram all these breakup profiles. Let's do

934
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:01,200
Speaker 1: some of the questions because I think they're kind of fun. Um,

935
00:50:01,239 --> 00:50:03,799
Speaker 1: but this is interesting. You're married. I'm married, so how

936
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:05,600
Speaker 1: are you like you're going back to the back of

937
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 1: the day. I mean, I had to think back really hard.

938
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:10,399
Speaker 1: And also I was just like, as we were kind

939
00:50:10,400 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 1: of brainstorming this idea, I did say, I'm like, is

940
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:16,080
Speaker 1: it creepy for me to do a breakup profile like

941
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 1: when I'm married and I've been married for this song

942
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 1: my marriage was like, but I think we just I mean,

943
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:24,960
Speaker 1: I actually had a lot of women, like a lot

944
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: of my buddies reached out once they saw it, saw

945
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:30,600
Speaker 1: it on instant and they were out. Yeah. So I

946
00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,280
Speaker 1: think it's more just the fun of of it, and

947
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:36,440
Speaker 1: you're just relating to us single girls. Yeah, I get it,

948
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:38,000
Speaker 1: and you have a lot of friends who have probably

949
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:40,680
Speaker 1: gone through stuff recently that um okay. So in the

950
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:43,359
Speaker 1: breakup profile, one of the first questions is describe your

951
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 1: last breakup with a movie. What did you say? I

952
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:50,879
Speaker 1: did how to lose a guy in ten days? Because, honestly, girl,

953
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:54,160
Speaker 1: I had a really bad well no, but just I

954
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:56,799
Speaker 1: had a really bad breakup in college right before Jeff

955
00:50:56,840 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 1: and I. Jeff was my rebound from like my worst heartbreak. Wow,

956
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 1: it was this like super sweeping, over dramatic, like he

957
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:07,279
Speaker 1: was like in Africa and like FedExing me letters. And

958
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:09,560
Speaker 1: then we met in London for like a couple of

959
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:11,200
Speaker 1: days because I was going to be there, and we

960
00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 1: over left for a few days, and then he came

961
00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:17,160
Speaker 1: here to meet my family. No, this is like whirlwind

962
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:21,600
Speaker 1: my last breakup. How literally he comes here to meet

963
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 1: my family and when he wakes up and he's just

964
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,840
Speaker 1: like I gotta go. Oh. I was like, what he's like,

965
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:29,359
Speaker 1: I like book myself a flight. I'm gonna like, I'm

966
00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 1: gonna like fly home. I was like, yeah, cool. So

967
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:40,000
Speaker 1: that was fun. So yeah, still singles. That does not

968
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 1: surprise me because it sounds like maybe he had some commitment.

969
00:51:42,280 --> 00:51:47,080
Speaker 1: Is what did you answer? That was like misery. I

970
00:51:47,080 --> 00:51:48,880
Speaker 1: don't even know what that movie is about, but that

971
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:51,319
Speaker 1: title in and of itself just describe my last break

972
00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:56,080
Speaker 1: I'm trying to remember somebody did ice age and four

973
00:51:56,160 --> 00:52:02,080
Speaker 1: year old virgin? Definitely so funny? Okay I did. I

974
00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:03,960
Speaker 1: can't honestly can't remember find it. How to lose a

975
00:52:03,960 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: guy in today's or he's just not that into youse

976
00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:10,320
Speaker 1: a guy in Sinday's reminds me of when she brings

977
00:52:10,360 --> 00:52:16,160
Speaker 1: the plant and she's like, this could be our baby.

978
00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:20,400
Speaker 1: Doesn't she name his? Oh my gosh, yeah, and we

979
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 1: won't say what. Yeah, if you haven't seen that, maybe

980
00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 1: give watch it. Okay, ideal revenge hook up. What did

981
00:52:26,600 --> 00:52:31,760
Speaker 1: you say? I said, Um, one of the Ryan's, naturally

982
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:37,439
Speaker 1: like Goslstling. Yeah, what's the other one? Reynolds Reynolds. Yeah,

983
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:39,880
Speaker 1: I think I said, Goslinger Reynolds, one of the Ryan's.

984
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:41,919
Speaker 1: You can't go wrong. And then one of my guy

985
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:44,479
Speaker 1: friends filled it out and he for that answer, he said,

986
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:48,560
Speaker 1: I'm told the correct answer is Ryan Reynolds. So many people,

987
00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:52,520
Speaker 1: but Ryan Reynolds is there. Okay, Ryan Reynolds does not

988
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:55,120
Speaker 1: do it for me that much. Okay, let's talk about it.

989
00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:58,360
Speaker 1: Ryan Gosling, for sure. I'm not sure what it is

990
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 1: about Ryan Reynolds. He's like the perfect guy, and maybe

991
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 1: that's the problem. That's sometimes when and honestly, this is

992
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:08,360
Speaker 1: a lesson that I am learning about myself is that

993
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:13,319
Speaker 1: sometimes like the perfect, cleaned up, pristine version of you

994
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:17,479
Speaker 1: is just not as sexy and not as compelling as

995
00:53:17,760 --> 00:53:21,360
Speaker 1: the you know, the one real vulnerable. That's why I

996
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 1: think Gosling, I'm like, you know, I was about to

997
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:29,799
Speaker 1: say sliding off my chair, but that's probably sorry. You

998
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:33,319
Speaker 1: said anything that ends with him's worth. I thought that

999
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:37,320
Speaker 1: was right, though specifically Chris because he's probably more in

1000
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:41,319
Speaker 1: my age range. But you know Liam's single. Now, I think, yeah,

1001
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 1: well put it out there. Okay, what's your post breakup anthem? Well,

1002
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:49,160
Speaker 1: we of course said voice don't cry. Oh naturally it

1003
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:52,239
Speaker 1: should be. It's a lot of people. But there's so

1004
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:54,040
Speaker 1: many great songs. I need to do a playlist I'm

1005
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:56,719
Speaker 1: going to do because we were talking about this whole

1006
00:53:56,719 --> 00:53:59,040
Speaker 1: idea came out of talking about the idea of a

1007
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:02,759
Speaker 1: breakup antha almost like not a way to celebrate, but

1008
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,840
Speaker 1: a way, you know, break up suck. And then worst

1009
00:54:06,239 --> 00:54:08,760
Speaker 1: when when you just like embrace the fact that's it's happened,

1010
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:12,239
Speaker 1: you're not going back, Like then you can actually have

1011
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 1: a really kind of fun time and whether it's rebounds

1012
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:18,799
Speaker 1: or yeah, or it's you know, just like hanging out

1013
00:54:18,840 --> 00:54:20,360
Speaker 1: with your girls. So I need to do a good

1014
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:22,799
Speaker 1: playlist that's just like all the best, and I got

1015
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 1: a good playlist with all of our songs. Always say

1016
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:26,440
Speaker 1: that I said, actually, I should just do all this

1017
00:54:26,960 --> 00:54:29,320
Speaker 1: set that people mentioned. That's like the best playlist to

1018
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:31,520
Speaker 1: make it a Spotify. What did you say? I said,

1019
00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:34,279
Speaker 1: truth hurts by Lizzo. I mean, if they're that to me,

1020
00:54:34,360 --> 00:54:37,240
Speaker 1: I'm like, there is not a better breakup song except

1021
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:44,360
Speaker 1: for boys Don't Cry. Thank you hashtag most likely to

1022
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:48,160
Speaker 1: stop you from drunk dialing your egg answer. And I

1023
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:51,080
Speaker 1: also said her earlier. Obviously Mary Hilliard is the one

1024
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: who calms me. I really was thinking that Mary Hilliard is, like,

1025
00:54:54,440 --> 00:54:57,400
Speaker 1: why is this woman that I've never met literally tagging

1026
00:54:57,400 --> 00:55:03,200
Speaker 1: me in nineteen posts? She's like she did all she

1027
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:05,480
Speaker 1: did was text me and say whose tires are we slashing?

1028
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:11,319
Speaker 1: That's cute. I said Carrie Underwood for that, because I think,

1029
00:55:11,719 --> 00:55:13,920
Speaker 1: truly that was still one of my favorite songs that

1030
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:17,360
Speaker 1: she's like a crow slash tire person. Yeah, I remember

1031
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:19,680
Speaker 1: you say that. Okay, well, so you have all this

1032
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:21,520
Speaker 1: music coming out, you guys go check it out. But

1033
00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:24,120
Speaker 1: I have to talk about your podcast because I've been binging.

1034
00:55:24,520 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 1: Did you accidentally fall into this like I did? Okay?

1035
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:30,759
Speaker 1: I so this actually ties into like when I was

1036
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 1: leaving my record deal, I was looking for ways to

1037
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 1: connect to fans and take my story back because I

1038
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:41,319
Speaker 1: felt like my story had been being told by other

1039
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:43,759
Speaker 1: people but not I didn't have control around the way

1040
00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:46,040
Speaker 1: that I was telling it and how much of it

1041
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:51,240
Speaker 1: and what parts. So and that's not anything specifically negative

1042
00:55:51,280 --> 00:55:53,640
Speaker 1: about the record label. That's just what people that are

1043
00:55:53,640 --> 00:55:57,200
Speaker 1: like PR people do, and what marketing does is they

1044
00:55:57,239 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 1: package it, of course because they have to. That's how

1045
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:02,440
Speaker 1: you sense, so I kind of want to unwrap it.

1046
00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 1: So and I love I just was obsessed with podcasting

1047
00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:09,760
Speaker 1: in general. I just think it's such a cool, intimate

1048
00:56:09,800 --> 00:56:13,600
Speaker 1: way to learn stuff and just fan out or you know,

1049
00:56:13,719 --> 00:56:15,440
Speaker 1: hear other people's perspectives. I just love it from a

1050
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:20,040
Speaker 1: storytelling perspective. Also love some of the more elaborate podcasts

1051
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:23,000
Speaker 1: that really have a high production value, Like I mean,

1052
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:25,280
Speaker 1: I listen to both, Like I listened to my Favorite Murder,

1053
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:28,239
Speaker 1: which is a pretty low production value. I don't mean

1054
00:56:28,239 --> 00:56:29,960
Speaker 1: that it's in a rude way, but it's it's just

1055
00:56:30,120 --> 00:56:33,680
Speaker 1: very casual. And then there then I listened to things

1056
00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:37,000
Speaker 1: like Radio Lab and reply All that are highly highly

1057
00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:39,880
Speaker 1: produced um and I love those two and I just

1058
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:42,560
Speaker 1: think it's a really unique genre. So that was like

1059
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:46,760
Speaker 1: ninety more seconds on that answer than you probably ever needed.

1060
00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:49,840
Speaker 1: But I just was obsessed with podcasts, so it made sense.

1061
00:56:50,080 --> 00:56:51,719
Speaker 1: And then we just were like, well, what do I

1062
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:54,200
Speaker 1: know about? What can I talk about? So you talk

1063
00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:58,120
Speaker 1: about the music industry. It's called this Nashville Life, and

1064
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:00,759
Speaker 1: it's from the perspective, which is so cool if someone

1065
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:03,560
Speaker 1: going through it, because you're telling your stories, but you

1066
00:57:03,600 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 1: also bring in other people to do interviews and just

1067
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 1: tell how to get in the industry. Even things like

1068
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:12,240
Speaker 1: I was listening to one about how songwriters are paid

1069
00:57:12,640 --> 00:57:14,319
Speaker 1: and I work in the industry, and I was I

1070
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:18,040
Speaker 1: thought that was so fascinating to the using it's so

1071
00:57:18,120 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 1: confused that most people, I mean even a lot of

1072
00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:22,919
Speaker 1: songwriters don't know how they get paid. And so that's

1073
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 1: one piece was like I went to school studying something else,

1074
00:57:26,840 --> 00:57:29,360
Speaker 1: so I didn't study any of this, so I had

1075
00:57:29,360 --> 00:57:31,360
Speaker 1: to learn a lot of stuff just on the job.

1076
00:57:32,080 --> 00:57:34,320
Speaker 1: And the other thing that's been really cool about the

1077
00:57:34,320 --> 00:57:37,680
Speaker 1: podcast is I think it's a place for people who

1078
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 1: maybe haven't moved to Nashville yet, but they're thinking about it,

1079
00:57:40,720 --> 00:57:43,439
Speaker 1: and they can kind of test out some of their

1080
00:57:43,480 --> 00:57:46,720
Speaker 1: ideas and learn, you know, about what it's really like,

1081
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:50,120
Speaker 1: and I hope it's it's kind of like a tutorial well,

1082
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:51,800
Speaker 1: because I know a question I get all the time

1083
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:53,640
Speaker 1: is well how did you get into this? Or I

1084
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:56,240
Speaker 1: don't even know the answer really, but I do think

1085
00:57:56,640 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 1: you know this time is a lot about connections or

1086
00:57:58,520 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: who you know are knowing where to go, and your

1087
00:58:01,400 --> 00:58:05,000
Speaker 1: podcast does give some insight into that. Even yeah, like

1088
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:06,960
Speaker 1: there you said, you know b m I has an

1089
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,600
Speaker 1: open door, Like I wouldn't have known that that's a

1090
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 1: publishing company. It's a p r O, which is essentially no, no,

1091
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:16,880
Speaker 1: don't worry. It sounds like A M I is a

1092
00:58:16,920 --> 00:58:21,480
Speaker 1: publishing company. Um. Probably still it's been, but B m

1093
00:58:21,480 --> 00:58:25,120
Speaker 1: I is essentially the way you get paid. But they

1094
00:58:25,360 --> 00:58:29,200
Speaker 1: have incredible relationships with publishers and with writers because they

1095
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:32,760
Speaker 1: represent there's only three companies that really do this as CAPSI,

1096
00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:35,880
Speaker 1: SAC and bm I. So they're going to represent a

1097
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 1: ton of people and if you come in and you're good,

1098
00:58:38,920 --> 00:58:41,240
Speaker 1: they're going to connect you with someone. And that's not

1099
00:58:41,280 --> 00:58:43,840
Speaker 1: going to immediately get you a publishing deal or immediately

1100
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 1: get you songs on the radio, but that's going to

1101
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:48,960
Speaker 1: be that I think all we're ever looking for is

1102
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:53,320
Speaker 1: the next step forward one stef It might feel so small,

1103
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:56,120
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. It's like one step closer. But in

1104
00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:59,520
Speaker 1: Nashville too, it is literally one connection leads you to

1105
00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:01,520
Speaker 1: the net that leads you to the next And like,

1106
00:59:01,840 --> 00:59:03,800
Speaker 1: do you have that story that's like that for you?

1107
00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:06,360
Speaker 1: I mean everything has been like that for me. It's

1108
00:59:06,520 --> 00:59:09,200
Speaker 1: literally from the first makeup artist that I worked with

1109
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:12,440
Speaker 1: two then I was in you know, some music videos

1110
00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:14,520
Speaker 1: back in the day, and but yeah, you need crew

1111
00:59:14,560 --> 00:59:16,440
Speaker 1: people that way, and I met people that worked at

1112
00:59:16,440 --> 00:59:18,760
Speaker 1: production companies that could help me get to the next step.

1113
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:22,200
Speaker 1: Then that met Then through that working and doing extras

1114
00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:25,240
Speaker 1: hair and makeup, I met Mary Hilliard and Dirks and

1115
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:27,720
Speaker 1: like started working with him. And then because I was working,

1116
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:29,320
Speaker 1: you know, it was just like it just yes, it

1117
00:59:29,480 --> 00:59:32,440
Speaker 1: just kept going and it's still to this day does that.

1118
00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:36,800
Speaker 1: And that is why you you cannot prejudge any one

1119
00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:40,520
Speaker 1: person's value. I agree that, or your story or where

1120
00:59:40,520 --> 00:59:42,640
Speaker 1: you want to go. And not to be calculated about it,

1121
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 1: but kind of you don't know who is going to

1122
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:48,920
Speaker 1: connect you to that next thing, And not to go

1123
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:50,960
Speaker 1: around looking like who's going to connect me? But the

1124
00:59:50,960 --> 00:59:53,680
Speaker 1: person that you. Okay, I have a job that we

1125
00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:55,600
Speaker 1: aren't really allowed to talk about yet, but that will

1126
00:59:55,640 --> 00:59:58,920
Speaker 1: be announcing in um like it's another part of like

1127
00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:01,480
Speaker 1: what I'll be doing, probably in a bigger way next

1128
01:00:01,560 --> 01:00:03,280
Speaker 1: year maybe later that she will get to talk about it.

1129
01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 1: And the whole way I got to this job was

1130
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:09,880
Speaker 1: this girl who was a recent college graduate had listened

1131
01:00:09,880 --> 01:00:13,400
Speaker 1: to my podcast. And then when the woman who ended

1132
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:15,880
Speaker 1: up hiring me for this gig went out starting to

1133
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:18,840
Speaker 1: search for talent, she just asked this girl, like, who

1134
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 1: do you know in Nashville? And she was like, I

1135
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:22,120
Speaker 1: don't really know anybody, but listen to this girl's podcast,

1136
01:00:22,160 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 1: and it's like everybody matters, like the random and she

1137
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:27,480
Speaker 1: had just had like taken the time to meet with

1138
01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:30,280
Speaker 1: her after she'd been speaking on a panel, and like,

1139
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:33,200
Speaker 1: meets with this little college kid. And I'm not sorry,

1140
01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:35,480
Speaker 1: if you're in college, you're not like a little college kid,

1141
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:39,400
Speaker 1: but you matter too. You gotta do. But she took

1142
01:00:39,400 --> 01:00:42,080
Speaker 1: the time to meet with this girl, and then this

1143
01:00:42,120 --> 01:00:43,920
Speaker 1: girl is how you know she found her way to me,

1144
01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,520
Speaker 1: it's just you never ever ever ever know how you're

1145
01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:49,680
Speaker 1: going to make your way. I agree with that, and

1146
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:52,560
Speaker 1: I have for me, and I know in my career specifically,

1147
01:00:52,720 --> 01:00:56,360
Speaker 1: relationships have been extremely important. So I think that goes

1148
01:00:56,440 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 1: for Nashville. I think that's like entertainment industry kind of

1149
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:01,800
Speaker 1: any is straight. It's just like you're saying, like, never

1150
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:05,960
Speaker 1: count out anybody and be kind. Yeah, there you go.

1151
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:08,560
Speaker 1: I mean, don't you don't have to kiss everybody's ass,

1152
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:12,240
Speaker 1: but just be a nice human to work for and

1153
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:18,840
Speaker 1: show up prepared, do your job, Do your job. Oh

1154
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:21,480
Speaker 1: my gosh. Okay, So the podcast is this Nashville Live.

1155
01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:24,520
Speaker 1: Where can people find that? All the places anyway you

1156
01:01:24,520 --> 01:01:28,200
Speaker 1: listen to podcasts, search this Nashville Life. New music is

1157
01:01:28,280 --> 01:01:32,400
Speaker 1: out um but the album is fully out October left.

1158
01:01:32,520 --> 01:01:35,160
Speaker 1: You can pre save preorder it right now. We actually

1159
01:01:35,160 --> 01:01:37,920
Speaker 1: have some like a really cute merch too sorry to

1160
01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:40,040
Speaker 1: be that person, but like I actually am obsessed with

1161
01:01:40,080 --> 01:01:41,840
Speaker 1: some of the stuff that we dreamed up. So the

1162
01:01:41,880 --> 01:01:44,120
Speaker 1: next single that comes out is a song called Diamonds,

1163
01:01:44,600 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 1: and the hook is Diamonds Are the Way I Get Stoned,

1164
01:01:47,640 --> 01:01:50,439
Speaker 1: almost like a take on Marilyn Monroe's Diamonds Are Girl's

1165
01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: Best Friend. But it's really about like a love story.

1166
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:56,440
Speaker 1: So like one of our teas is like stoned, and

1167
01:01:56,440 --> 01:01:59,200
Speaker 1: then it's like like with a little diamond in the middle,

1168
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:03,760
Speaker 1: and yeah, that's my website, so just Kelly Banner dot

1169
01:02:03,800 --> 01:02:06,280
Speaker 1: com and then can order our music there and stuff.

1170
01:02:06,320 --> 01:02:09,120
Speaker 1: And in the podcast, I'm actually we've already like we

1171
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:11,600
Speaker 1: aren't in a new season yet, but we're hopefully about

1172
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: to be soon. Um, and we've got some episodes with

1173
01:02:15,800 --> 01:02:21,240
Speaker 1: like Leslie Framm took a lot about women in radio

1174
01:02:21,360 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 1: and also about mentoring people and kind of paying it forward.

1175
01:02:25,640 --> 01:02:27,480
Speaker 1: And then I had do you know who the Traca

1176
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:31,200
Speaker 1: Burg is? I've heard that night songwriter a songwriter and

1177
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:35,400
Speaker 1: she wrote Strawberry Wine. Oh yeah, okay, so she her

1178
01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:39,200
Speaker 1: stories from like being nineteen and twenty in the business

1179
01:02:39,280 --> 01:02:42,960
Speaker 1: in this old boys club are just insane in her episode.

1180
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:44,600
Speaker 1: I mean, none of these are out yet, but that's

1181
01:02:44,640 --> 01:02:46,920
Speaker 1: what's coming in the next month or so hopeful. I think.

1182
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:49,080
Speaker 1: What's so cool is you know. I was like, oh, well,

1183
01:02:49,120 --> 01:02:51,680
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to make it in the music, which

1184
01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:53,320
Speaker 1: sounds kind of due because I work in the music industry,

1185
01:02:53,360 --> 01:02:56,520
Speaker 1: but like it was fascinating to me and I'm not

1186
01:02:56,560 --> 01:02:59,240
Speaker 1: even a songwriter or like really, I'm not that doesn't

1187
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:02,440
Speaker 1: really any thing that I can relate to in my

1188
01:03:02,520 --> 01:03:07,360
Speaker 1: big people like everyone you know, you're right, so maybe

1189
01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:09,520
Speaker 1: that's why. But I just think it's interesting for everybody,

1190
01:03:09,680 --> 01:03:11,640
Speaker 1: so I hope too. I mean it's kind of like

1191
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:15,720
Speaker 1: like I listened to like Freakonomics and stuff like that,

1192
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:17,560
Speaker 1: and it's like I don't like, I'm not like into

1193
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:20,640
Speaker 1: not doing to do that, but I think that their

1194
01:03:20,680 --> 01:03:23,360
Speaker 1: storytelling is great. So hopefully there's something for everyone. But

1195
01:03:23,600 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 1: where else can people find you? Like, what's your social

1196
01:03:25,360 --> 01:03:28,240
Speaker 1: media handles? Social media? So my name is Kelly K

1197
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:30,560
Speaker 1: E L L E I g H, which is where

1198
01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:33,080
Speaker 1: we're different. Pain in the ass. I can't tell you

1199
01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:36,400
Speaker 1: if I have envy other than your thighs, I probably

1200
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:38,840
Speaker 1: also have envy for the fact that you're just a why,

1201
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:43,000
Speaker 1: just a why simple. I can't tell you. I I

1202
01:03:43,040 --> 01:03:48,120
Speaker 1: spell that for someone every single day, and I was

1203
01:03:48,160 --> 01:03:50,600
Speaker 1: like named after a little old Irish lady. So it's

1204
01:03:50,600 --> 01:03:53,200
Speaker 1: a it's a Gaelic spelling and has some family family

1205
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:55,240
Speaker 1: history or whatever. But it's a pain in the ass.

1206
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:57,960
Speaker 1: But if you get there, if you can get to

1207
01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:00,640
Speaker 1: Kelly with an E I G H, you'll find me

1208
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:04,000
Speaker 1: really easily. And it's Bannon b A N N E N.

1209
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:07,080
Speaker 1: I used to think it was O N. Yeah. Yeah,

1210
01:04:07,120 --> 01:04:11,320
Speaker 1: it's so asked Kelly Bannon and Kelly Bannon dot com

1211
01:04:11,360 --> 01:04:13,880
Speaker 1: this Nashville Live. Oh and if this is coming out

1212
01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:15,920
Speaker 1: this week? Yeah? Wait we should? Can we ask your

1213
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:18,680
Speaker 1: listeners to fill out a breakup profile? Really? I was

1214
01:04:18,720 --> 01:04:21,520
Speaker 1: just gonna say, for boys, don't cry. Go to Kelly's

1215
01:04:21,560 --> 01:04:26,080
Speaker 1: Instagram and she has a blank right, the breakup blank

1216
01:04:26,120 --> 01:04:28,520
Speaker 1: blank and you can fill it out too, and what

1217
01:04:28,640 --> 01:04:30,960
Speaker 1: submit them back to you? Right? Just tag me? Yeah,

1218
01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:32,320
Speaker 1: and then I'll see him and I can share them

1219
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,560
Speaker 1: and we post them or whatever. Yeah, it was super fun.

1220
01:04:34,600 --> 01:04:38,760
Speaker 1: I actually liked to do that. You punic or something.

1221
01:04:39,160 --> 01:04:42,040
Speaker 1: I'm thinking through that. Okay, I'm really glad we finally

1222
01:04:42,120 --> 01:04:44,960
Speaker 1: did you guys to check out Kelly and thank you

1223
01:04:44,960 --> 01:04:48,960
Speaker 1: for listening. I this is Kelly Henderson and you've been

1224
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:52,640
Speaker 1: listening to the Velvet's Edge podcast. I truly believe that

1225
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:54,800
Speaker 1: every one of us has a little velvet and a

1226
01:04:54,840 --> 01:04:57,600
Speaker 1: little edge, so it's so important to remember that to

1227
01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:00,960
Speaker 1: be strong, you must be soft too. Thank you so

1228
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:03,600
Speaker 1: much for sharing in those stories with me. You can

1229
01:05:03,640 --> 01:05:06,960
Speaker 1: follow Velvet's Edge on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter, as well

1230
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:09,560
Speaker 1: as velvet's edge dot com. If you have it yet,

1231
01:05:09,680 --> 01:05:13,640
Speaker 1: go to Apple Podcasts and subscribe, rate and review this podcast.

1232
01:05:14,080 --> 01:05:18,200
Speaker 1: Join me every Wednesday for more conversations on lifestyle, beauty,

1233
01:05:18,240 --> 01:05:20,320
Speaker 1: and relationships. Thanks for listening.