WEBVTT - Golf Architecture Mailbag: Walkability, 2025 Course Openings, and More 0:00:00.040 --> 0:00:02.800 I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When 0:00:02.800 --> 0:00:04.920 I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. 0:00:05.000 --> 0:00:05.880 And when I find my. 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:09.319 Ball in a brid egg Friday Egg, the dreaded Frida Egg, Friday, 0:00:09.560 --> 0:00:12.360 Frida Egg, Brian Egg, fridagg Bride Egg, Lie, I'm about 0:00:12.360 --> 0:00:13.640 ready to run off of the hump. 0:00:37.560 --> 0:00:41.320 Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast. 0:00:42.040 --> 0:00:44.920 I am your co host, Andy Johnson. I am joined 0:00:45.000 --> 0:00:48.440 by our other co host, Garrett Morrison. Garrett, welcome on. 0:00:49.040 --> 0:00:50.760 You've demoted yourself to co host. 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:54.840 Well, if I'm hosting by myself, I say I'm the host. 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:55.960 I see. 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:58.600 But if I'm hosting with you, I would say I'm 0:00:58.600 --> 0:00:59.840 a co host because. 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:04.240 You're it's situational. Yeah, I also do host some Friday podcasts, 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:06.319 but you did found this podcast, so I feel like 0:01:06.400 --> 0:01:09.880 you should be giving yourself the host title without the co. 0:01:10.880 --> 0:01:13.840 Well today, I'm the co Okay. This is a joint, 0:01:14.319 --> 0:01:17.759 you know, and you're a humble man. It begs the question, 0:01:17.840 --> 0:01:19.399 if there's two hosts, do you have one? 0:01:20.480 --> 0:01:23.160 If there's three hosts, do you have one. Joseph is 0:01:23.200 --> 0:01:26.360 also a host. He talked to Dodo that was hosting. 0:01:26.160 --> 0:01:29.000 He is he's a new host has entered the ring. 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:32.440 That was an interesting podcast. I like that really good. Yeah, 0:01:32.480 --> 0:01:34.919 people should listen to that one. In addition to listening 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:39.119 to this one. Dodo explain the virtues of the old course. 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:42.560 Yeah. Who who would have thought that the old course 0:01:43.000 --> 0:01:46.520 would be would be one of the few strategic courses left, 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:48.720 and that Augusta National would in fact be a good 0:01:49.200 --> 0:01:52.200 driving course. I mean we've we've heard all along that 0:01:52.280 --> 0:01:55.440 these are just hipster courses that only golf architecture nuts like. 0:01:56.000 --> 0:01:58.160 But it turns out that was that was not correct. 0:01:58.560 --> 0:02:00.800 You know, this is completely off topic. We're going to 0:02:00.880 --> 0:02:04.920 do a golf architecture mail bag, but it was it 0:02:05.000 --> 0:02:08.799 was interesting just to hear how like you know, he's 0:02:08.919 --> 0:02:12.960 obviously data heavy pro golfer, just like the through line 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:15.240 of all the things he likes about a golf course 0:02:15.280 --> 0:02:20.040 are fair. Like he likes the if the more you 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:22.919 miss it offline, the more the penalty should be. Right, 0:02:22.960 --> 0:02:25.359 And the one thing that he doesn't like about about 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:28.640 Augusta National is how how tight the line is? 0:02:29.080 --> 0:02:32.040 You know, like how I'm thirteen and fifteen, Yeah. 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.120 Yeah, how if you can hit a great approach shot 0:02:34.400 --> 0:02:37.880 or a good approach shot in it, and it's penalized. 0:02:37.560 --> 0:02:41.400 Right, I think, to Dodo's credit or in his defense, 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:46.119 I guess the reason that he likes the graded penalties 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:48.640 off the tee, Like, if you miss the fairway by 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:50.840 a little bit, it's a little bit of a penalty. 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:52.480 If you missed the fairway by a lot, it's a 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:55.200 lot of a penalty. I think he likes that, not 0:02:55.280 --> 0:03:00.680 necessarily because it's fair, but because it makes play think 0:03:00.720 --> 0:03:04.639 in interesting ways on the tee. If the penalties are 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:07.760 all kind of the same off the fairway, then there's 0:03:07.880 --> 0:03:10.800 not much thinking to be done off the tee. If 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:15.480 there are these different areas that are more penal than others, however, 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:21.000 then some thought enters into club selection and target and 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:24.800 all that for the pro golfer. That's something to keep 0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:27.120 in mind here is that he thinks of these things 0:03:27.120 --> 0:03:30.480 in terms of pro golf, and he acknowledges that as well. 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:32.920 But it brings to mind what I think is a 0:03:32.919 --> 0:03:36.320 great role for a modern golf architect who designs to 0:03:36.520 --> 0:03:39.800 or courses, and that is to retain a little bit 0:03:39.800 --> 0:03:43.720 of randomness and a little bit of unfairness, and an 0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:47.440 impulse to introduce some whimsy and some things that bother 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:51.400 pros into their designs, because if they just do what 0:03:51.520 --> 0:03:56.760 pros like, then courses will become pretty predictable and manuscactured 0:03:57.240 --> 0:04:01.400 the same. Right, So it's the architect's job to retain 0:04:01.520 --> 0:04:06.280 a little bit of that spirit of randomness and eccentricity 0:04:06.280 --> 0:04:09.240 in their designs, as well as learning what they can 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:12.720 learn from modern pros and from analytics. 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:16.880 I mean, whimsy and things. All I can think about 0:04:16.960 --> 0:04:20.640 is the social reel. I just watched you do that 0:04:20.720 --> 0:04:24.240 about Saint George Golf and how dozens of people might 0:04:24.279 --> 0:04:26.359 be watching j tour event there is that? 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:28.280 Is that a whimsical moment for me? Yeah? 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:31.360 It was a whimsy call. It was. It was filled 0:04:31.360 --> 0:04:34.400 with whimsy and character. We can't allow we can't allow 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:36.800 all of our golf course social reels just to become 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:39.960 AI generated scripts. You know. 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:43.120 Yeah, we've We've been exchanged. It's a scourge on Instagram. 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:47.200 I didn't even realize the proportions of it. Our colleagues 0:04:47.200 --> 0:04:49.960 Matt Rusius and Cameron Hurtis have been sending me Slack 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:52.920 messages of all the different reels out there about Saint 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:56.160 George Golf. Just these accounts that I've never heard of 0:04:56.480 --> 0:05:00.320 that have one hundred thousand followers and have completely AI 0:05:00.520 --> 0:05:05.360 generated or just soullessly chat bought written content. I can't 0:05:05.400 --> 0:05:08.360 believe what's going on on Instagram. What's happening here? 0:05:08.880 --> 0:05:12.520 It's it's people could play it about acts, but but 0:05:12.720 --> 0:05:17.240 the the the Instagram accounts that are recommending golf courses 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:21.640 without ever stepping foot on them is uh is amazing and. 0:05:21.680 --> 0:05:25.159 Using not their footage, footage that they shot. 0:05:25.800 --> 0:05:30.200 Yeah, well this they can take anything. That's the That's 0:05:30.240 --> 0:05:31.320 the world of the internet. 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:31.880 It's on. 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:36.080 Dot e A. Let's get into it, Donnie, do the 0:05:36.120 --> 0:05:36.560 mail bag. 0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:38.520 Just to be clear, yea, extra clear to people. You 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:41.240 mentioned this already, Andy. What we're doing here is a 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:43.520 golf architecture mail bag. We put out a call for 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:47.080 questions in Club tf E, which is Fridagg's membership, the 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:49.720 Friday dot Com slash membership check it out. We put 0:05:49.760 --> 0:05:51.920 out a call for questions in there as well as 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:54.080 on Twitter. So we're going to be doing a grab 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:56.320 bag of questions from people about calf architecture. 0:05:56.480 --> 0:06:00.680 This is why your co host, right rre some. 0:06:00.440 --> 0:06:02.840 Some clarity, some scaffolding let's it's you. 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:06.120 Know, if I was the host and you were my guest, 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:09.680 that's right that you wouldn't be That would be crossing 0:06:09.720 --> 0:06:10.280 a line you. 0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:11.400 I wouldn't feel licensed. 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:13.520 So for stepping your bounds. 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:17.520 Have been totally rude. Yeah, absolutely, dot e A. 0:06:18.200 --> 0:06:21.159 What did Garrett think of Highland Links on Cape Cod? 0:06:21.240 --> 0:06:23.760 This is from one of your recent trips. 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:27.880 Doni A. I really enjoyed Highland Links. For those who 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:30.760 haven't heard of it, it's way out on Cape Cod. 0:06:30.720 --> 0:06:33.440 Like so far yea, so far out, the. 0:06:33.760 --> 0:06:36.960 Farthest golf course out by a lot on Cape Cod. 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:41.000 It's pretty damn near Provincetown. So it's in a place 0:06:41.040 --> 0:06:43.560 where you just don't see many golf courses and where 0:06:43.600 --> 0:06:46.640 you wouldn't build a golf course now because it's National 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:49.120 parkland for one thing, and a lot of that area 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:52.960 is protected. But it's in a beautiful location, kind of 0:06:53.000 --> 0:06:56.440 on high cliffs above the ocean. You know. The word 0:06:56.560 --> 0:06:58.800 on Highland Links. The thing that people always say about 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.720 it is that it's one of the few truly authentic 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.360 links golf courses in America. I'm not sure I would 0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:09.200 go that far that this isn't exactly sand dunes out here, 0:07:09.640 --> 0:07:12.440 but it is sandy soil, which is fun to see 0:07:12.480 --> 0:07:15.400 in the Greater Boston area because most of the courses 0:07:15.400 --> 0:07:18.880 there are built on rock and heavy clay. This is 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:23.160 definitely lighter sandy or soil that this very old golf 0:07:23.200 --> 0:07:26.320 course is built on. So it's built long ago by 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:29.840 who knows which architect, basically an amateur architect. There is 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:31.800 a name out there, I'm sorry, I don't know it, 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:37.440 but it's just a humble nine hole course, public affordable 0:07:37.520 --> 0:07:39.920 to play, not super affordable to play, but you can 0:07:39.960 --> 0:07:41.720 go out there and pay a green fee and not 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:46.120 feel like you've gotten fleeced. And it's just nine holes 0:07:46.160 --> 0:07:51.440 of very straightforward natural golf. The site is surprisingly hilly. 0:07:51.720 --> 0:07:55.360 That's one thing that kind of took me by surprise 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:57.360 when we were going around that golf course. There's a 0:07:57.360 --> 0:07:59.920 lot of up and down, but it's really all about 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:04.040 location there and just the general vibe of playing golf 0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:09.239 on these beautiful, you know, sort of environmentally sensitive looking, 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:15.640 very well preserved cliffs above the ocean next to a 0:08:15.800 --> 0:08:19.720 very old lighthouse. So just being out there was a 0:08:19.760 --> 0:08:23.680 delight In terms of park, right, it's a national park. Yeah, 0:08:23.760 --> 0:08:26.800 and so we went out there and I went up 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:30.560 to the pro shop person as I usually do at 0:08:30.600 --> 0:08:33.640 public courses that we want to shoot and haven't contacted 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:35.880 people before, and I said, hey, do you think it 0:08:35.920 --> 0:08:38.920 would be okay if we flew our drone out here? 0:08:39.440 --> 0:08:43.480 And right at that moment my colleague Cameron realized at 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:46.080 the same time that the pro shop person was telling 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:48.800 me you can't fly a drone here because it's a 0:08:48.880 --> 0:08:52.640 national park. Don't do that. It's against the law. You 0:08:52.679 --> 0:08:55.000 get in big trouble if you've done it. So if 0:08:55.040 --> 0:09:00.880 you see any Highland Links footage out there, chance somewhere 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:03.839 on the internet. If you go, if somebody has drone 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:06.160 footage of Highland Links, just keep in mind that they're 0:09:06.679 --> 0:09:09.199 not supposed to have that. But it's a very cool course. 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:12.160 People should go and check it out for sure. In 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:15.600 terms of golf course design, pure golf course design, a 0:09:15.640 --> 0:09:18.040 lot of nine whole courses in New England are more 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:21.560 sophisticated than this one. I would point to Old Salem Greens, 0:09:21.679 --> 0:09:24.400 which I saw on this same trip and kind of 0:09:24.400 --> 0:09:28.679 blew my mind how good it was. But just for 0:09:29.160 --> 0:09:32.040 an absolute throwback to golf as it was in an 0:09:32.120 --> 0:09:34.680 earlier time, Highland Links pretty cool place to go. 0:09:35.640 --> 0:09:38.319 It seems like just the journey out there is the 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:40.120 part of the allure of it too. 0:09:40.200 --> 0:09:41.920 That's what I was excited about. We kind of we 0:09:41.960 --> 0:09:44.880 stopped in a town that's like just across the street 0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:47.760 basically from Highland Links, and went to a little market 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:50.360 there to get some sandwiches, and they were super friendly, 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:52.680 and it was just a whole well experience. You know, 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:55.480 it's almost like island living out there because you're so 0:09:55.600 --> 0:09:56.520 far out on the cape. 0:09:57.120 --> 0:09:58.240 Awesome, awesome. 0:09:59.200 --> 0:10:04.160 All right, Andy, I have a question for you. Let's 0:10:04.160 --> 0:10:07.880 talk about walkability. Got an interesting question from Jake R. 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:12.640 Schambeau in Club TF and his question is, basically, is 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:16.160 it even fair to judge a walkable routing versus an 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:19.640 unwalkable one. One of the most difficult things about routing 0:10:19.640 --> 0:10:22.680 a course is stitching eighteen holes closely enough together so 0:10:22.760 --> 0:10:25.600 it's walkable. So if a course doesn't accomplish that, it's 0:10:25.600 --> 0:10:28.440 not even playing by the same set of rules. So 0:10:29.720 --> 0:10:34.280 I'll reframe the question slightly. If a course is unwalkable 0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:39.680 but otherwise really great, how do you go about assessing it? 0:10:39.720 --> 0:10:42.600 Is there a ceiling to how good a golf course 0:10:42.640 --> 0:10:44.440 can be if you can't walk it. 0:10:46.240 --> 0:10:49.040 Yeah, I think if the I think this is an 0:10:49.080 --> 0:10:54.600 interesting question to me, if if you could have come 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:57.200 up with a walkable routing, I think it's probably a 0:10:57.240 --> 0:10:59.720 slight to merit, but I think there are certain places, 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:03.160 like on a mountain golf course, where he just might 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:06.280 not be able to do it. A great Yeah, Capellou 0:11:06.320 --> 0:11:10.040 would be a great example. This is an architecture team 0:11:10.080 --> 0:11:13.520 that's made like you know, that's turned so many places 0:11:13.600 --> 0:11:16.880 that a lot of people thought were unwalkable into walkable 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:21.839 golf courses. And you know, from that standpoint, I do 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:23.880 think it is so I think it's like kind of 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:30.440 like like anything. I think there's an economy vale like 0:11:30.559 --> 0:11:33.839 the value of economy, and that's part of great golf 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:39.960 architecture is being able to pack things in and provide 0:11:40.000 --> 0:11:44.719 a you know, a great eighteen hole experience over a 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:48.560 you know, finite piece of property. You know you could 0:11:48.960 --> 0:11:52.000 you know, think about you could if you had sand hills. 0:11:52.840 --> 0:11:55.439 Think about how spectacular the golf course could have been 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:59.400 if you had five hole by hole with if you 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:03.160 had had five minute cart rides between each hole right now. 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:05.319 And if you just go looking for like the best 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:09.040 golf holes. Yeah, like there would have done that. Yeah, 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:11.600 you would have taken that approach to the site for sure. 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:13.440 And you have like a five minute cart ride. But 0:12:13.600 --> 0:12:18.600 like the when you have them close together, that adds 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:23.280 the experience of that kind of like flow to the round, 0:12:23.480 --> 0:12:27.080 which I think is super important. And that's like a 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:30.040 subliminal thing that a lot of people might not realize, 0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:33.840 but like you know when you are when you're close together. 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:36.200 One thing I noticed recently. I played golf in a 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:42.960 cart recently and it was a foursome and what we 0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:46.960 you like, you don't talk to each other very much, 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:49.680 like I knew that, like you talk to the person 0:12:49.760 --> 0:12:52.040 in your cart, you don't talk as a group. But 0:12:52.080 --> 0:12:54.520 what I noticed we just spent more time on tea 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:59.240 boxes and greens talking as a group because of it, 0:13:00.400 --> 0:13:03.719 like versus when you're walking right, you're like going from 0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:08.400 area to area. But I think like the best thing 0:13:08.520 --> 0:13:10.920 is like when it's like a tight green to tea, 0:13:11.640 --> 0:13:14.440 you know when part of the beauty of that is 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:18.440 like how you're you're all on the green together and 0:13:18.480 --> 0:13:21.480 you just like easily walk over to the tee and 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:24.520 you all together. The longer you walk if you're in 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:30.200 a walking group, the more likely you you part likewise 0:13:30.280 --> 0:13:33.600 in a cart round, the closer the tee is to 0:13:33.720 --> 0:13:37.000 the green the next tee, the more likely you're going 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:39.840 to park the cart close to the tee and you 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:41.680 don't have to get back in the cart and move 0:13:41.720 --> 0:13:44.880 it to the te So there is like walkable courses 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:49.360 are also better cartball courses because. 0:13:49.040 --> 0:13:49.800 It's interesting point. 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:55.120 They keep you as as group together more with the proximity, right, 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:55.800 it's more like. 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:59.360 Time spent in proximity and less just like driving by yourself. 0:13:59.480 --> 0:14:04.240 Yeah, and you're able to carry conversations easier from green 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:07.480 to tea. Like. Part of the reason you play golf 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:11.200 is for that, like the conversation and the camaraderie with 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:15.440 your group. And the better design the golf course is, 0:14:15.480 --> 0:14:19.120 the better routed it is as a whole, the more 0:14:19.240 --> 0:14:21.960 conducive of it is to that camaraderie. 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:26.640 Yes, there's a whole silent element to golf course design 0:14:26.880 --> 0:14:30.880 and routing that is social in nature. Having greens and 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:34.240 teas close to each other, yes, between holes, but also 0:14:35.560 --> 0:14:38.520 between one part of the round and the other. That 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:41.800 that whole social experience of a golf course that's designed 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:44.200 that way is to me a lot more fulfilling than 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.360 a golf course that prioritizes isolating holes from each other 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.600 and making each hole feel like a world unto itself. 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:53.080 So there are many ways that golf course design and 0:14:53.160 --> 0:14:55.880 routing can enhance the social experience of being on a 0:14:55.880 --> 0:14:58.760 golf course, which I think most people would agree is 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.920 the greatest thing about golf is getting to know other 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:05.560 golfers and spending that long amount of time with them. 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:08.000 I mean, when else do we get to spend that 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.280 amount of time with people. Basically four hours straight or 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:14.040 if it's slow out there, five hours straight. That's a 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:16.200 good amount of time to get to know somebody. It's 0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:19.240 a great social experience if you enjoy the people, and 0:15:19.480 --> 0:15:23.080 a golf course design that can certainly enhance that. But 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:28.000 to get back to the question walkable courses versus unwalkable courses, 0:15:28.040 --> 0:15:31.000 do we give like a little bump to the walkable ones? 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:34.640 I met out where you do where I look at 0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:38.120 the piece of land and consider what this course is 0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:41.680 trying to be. If it's a big time mountain course 0:15:41.720 --> 0:15:44.240 and it's hard to walk, then there's a reason for that. 0:15:44.240 --> 0:15:47.680 The piece of land just wouldn't allow for a super 0:15:47.760 --> 0:15:51.800 walkable course to be built, and that is understandable. You 0:15:51.840 --> 0:15:56.200 look at a course like Wolf Creek and Mesquite which 0:15:56.240 --> 0:16:01.200 is so unwalkable that it's almost undrivable. There are parts 0:16:01.280 --> 0:16:04.880 where your cart is like skidding downhill at that course, 0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:09.840 it's like, it's pretty wild. I don't look at that 0:16:09.880 --> 0:16:13.400 course and say it's unwalkable, because it's almost redundant to 0:16:13.440 --> 0:16:16.000 say that. From the beginning, it was going to be 0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:19.360 this kind of amusement park ride golf course. And it's 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:20.920 cool that they got to build a course on this 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:22.960 piece of land because you wouldn't be able to do 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.840 it if we didn't have golf court golf carts. So 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.360 there's that. But I find that when I'm thinking about 0:16:30.040 --> 0:16:33.520 how much I like a course, I give a subconscious 0:16:33.560 --> 0:16:37.440 bump to the ones that are a pleasant walk that 0:16:37.480 --> 0:16:40.480 are more walkable than others. I start giving a bump 0:16:40.520 --> 0:16:44.960 to courses that are flatter because I just more fondly 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:48.200 remember the experience of playing them. It took less out 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:51.480 of me to walk them. It allowed me energy for 0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:55.320 other things, for looking at the architecture, for talking to 0:16:55.880 --> 0:16:59.480 my playing partners, for appreciating my surroundings. Because I wasn't 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:02.520 putting f into the walk, I was able to enjoy 0:17:02.560 --> 0:17:04.840 so many other things. More I think of, of course, 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:08.920 like caper Rundle, great golf course, I might overrat it 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:09.440 a little bit. 0:17:10.680 --> 0:17:12.040 I think I overrated it too. 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.479 I think there are aspects of that course that are 0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:17.440 maybe not great, Like the routing is kind of back 0:17:17.480 --> 0:17:20.639 and forth. Sometimes it's pretty flat out there. But one 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:23.239 of the reasons I overrat it. Obviously, the greens are 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:26.160 world class, and that's the whole thing about the course. 0:17:26.200 --> 0:17:28.960 But I think the reason I overrat it is that 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:33.560 it's so easily walkable, and I fondly remember my experience 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:37.639 there partly for that reason. So that would be my 0:17:37.680 --> 0:17:41.600 answer to that. I have a bias toward super walkable courses. 0:17:42.160 --> 0:17:44.639 And I'm not sure whether I feel good about that 0:17:44.760 --> 0:17:46.560 or bad about that. It's just something I do. 0:17:57.480 --> 0:17:59.920 All right, Let's take a quick break to talk about 0:18:00.080 --> 0:18:04.359 one of our partners, Stripe. This is a partner. We're 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:08.480 a customer of Stripe. We love Stripe at Frida Egg. 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:12.040 What Stripe does for us is it helps us run 0:18:12.080 --> 0:18:17.040 our business. It is effectively like our payment processing, so 0:18:17.359 --> 0:18:21.160 it allows our pro shop It allows our membership club 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:25.400 TFE to function. It takes away a lot of our headaches. 0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:29.160 It helps us do this, It helps millions of other 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:33.199 businesses of all sizes do these types of things. They 0:18:33.280 --> 0:18:36.360 have a few products. They have the Optimized Checkout Suite. 0:18:36.640 --> 0:18:40.240 This is something that we use that has Stripe billing, 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.800 so it lets you kind of invoice and bill like it. 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:49.160 It can go get super complex. They help over three 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:53.840 hundred thousand businesses more than anybody else do this. It's 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:58.160 got advanced billing software to handle the most complex business models. 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.560 A few enterprises, big companies you know, we use it. 0:19:01.680 --> 0:19:03.959 We're not really and I don't think they consider us 0:19:03.960 --> 0:19:06.119 an enterprise customer. We got to see if we can 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:08.359 get them to add us on here. But these are 0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:13.640 a few of the big companies. AMC might have heard 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:20.120 of them. 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What are some of the 0:20:06.520 --> 0:20:09.359 projects that will finish in twenty twenty five that you 0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:13.440 two are most interested in? Also, yeah, we'll just start 0:20:13.440 --> 0:20:13.800 with that. 0:20:14.600 --> 0:20:17.159 Oh yeah, he has an additional question there. Yeah, why 0:20:17.160 --> 0:20:20.760 don't we just quickly mention some ongoing projects that are interesting? 0:20:21.320 --> 0:20:24.879 All pick out two or three? You pick out two 0:20:25.000 --> 0:20:29.679 or three really high potential golf course being built in 0:20:29.720 --> 0:20:35.359 Minnesota by Ogilvy Cocking and Mead Tepatanka looks pretty awesome. 0:20:35.680 --> 0:20:37.760 I'm not sure exactly when they're planning to open, but 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:40.080 I assume, since we're talking about Minnesota here, it's going 0:20:40.119 --> 0:20:42.240 to be when it warms up next year. 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:43.359 Honest, it could be. 0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:45.600 It could be a little longer some of these courses 0:20:45.640 --> 0:20:48.880 that we're talking about as twenty twenty five courses. Timelines 0:20:48.920 --> 0:20:52.520 with golf course builds, especially right now that a lot 0:20:52.560 --> 0:20:56.760 of the contractors are are really busy and not necessarily 0:20:56.760 --> 0:20:59.000 available at the times that you predict that they'll be 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:02.280 available at irrigation and drainage and all that stuff that 0:21:02.359 --> 0:21:04.439 you need to build a golf course. As a result 0:21:04.520 --> 0:21:07.320 of that, timelines are getting a bit messy, But that 0:21:07.480 --> 0:21:10.520 course I have my eye on. I also am really 0:21:10.800 --> 0:21:14.800 looking forward to seeing what they do at wild Spring Dunes, 0:21:15.280 --> 0:21:19.360 which is the new Kaiser family project out in Texas. 0:21:19.960 --> 0:21:22.280 I think that looks like a fantastic piece of land. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:25.960 I'm curious to see what the architects that they're working 0:21:26.040 --> 0:21:28.879 with there will do with that land. It is the 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:32.040 you know, the usual architects that the Kaiser family works with, 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:35.879 initially Corn Crenshaw and Tom Doak, and so I think 0:21:35.960 --> 0:21:39.040 those courses will be will be quite good. And then 0:21:39.480 --> 0:21:42.280 you know a project that might not be wrapping up 0:21:42.359 --> 0:21:44.960 in twenty twenty five. I'm not sure exactly what the 0:21:45.000 --> 0:21:51.200 timeline is. Cabot Pacific out in the wilds of British Columbia, 0:21:51.280 --> 0:21:52.639 I'm not sure when I'm going to get to this 0:21:52.760 --> 0:21:54.520 golf course, which you could say about a lot of 0:21:54.880 --> 0:21:58.639 a lot of Cabot owned resorts. It's pretty remote. But 0:21:58.880 --> 0:22:02.159 this is a whitman excellent and cutting golf course in 0:22:02.240 --> 0:22:04.600 the mountains. I'm sure that there's going to be some 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:08.879 inspiration from Stanley Thompson because of the the location and 0:22:08.960 --> 0:22:12.639 the environment and the architects involved. So that should be 0:22:12.880 --> 0:22:17.160 a fun project to follow as well. Possibly twenty twenty five. 0:22:17.240 --> 0:22:19.640 I know they're working on the course, but not sure 0:22:19.680 --> 0:22:22.000 exactly when when they're planning to open. What are you 0:22:22.080 --> 0:22:22.639 looking forward to. 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:29.960 One off the bat seven mile beach down in Tasmania. Absolutely, 0:22:30.000 --> 0:22:33.399 the photos, the land look out of this world. 0:22:34.160 --> 0:22:40.359 Yeah, that not only location which is amazing, but also terrain. 0:22:40.800 --> 0:22:43.040 This is a course that's not only in a very 0:22:43.200 --> 0:22:46.280 cool seaside location kind of a spit of land right 0:22:46.320 --> 0:22:49.040 outside Hobart, but the terrain. 0:22:50.280 --> 0:22:52.879 That's that's the thing that draws me. It just looks 0:22:53.080 --> 0:22:58.399 like great scaled golf. And I think you know, I 0:22:58.600 --> 0:23:01.359 was with Mike Devree a couple of weeks ago and 0:23:01.480 --> 0:23:04.280 he said it's like the best piece of piece of 0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:07.680 land for golf he's ever seen. And obviously, you know, 0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:09.840 if we went down, if we trust, if we said 0:23:10.200 --> 0:23:13.399