Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, get this. We're coming probably to a city
Speaker 1: near you this year. We've got all of our shows
Speaker 1: scheduled and Chuck's gonna tell you about them right now.
Speaker 2: That's right. We're gonna be in Medford, Massachusetts, Washington, DC,
Speaker 2: and New York City on May twenty, thirtieth and thirty first.
Speaker 2: Right then we're going to be going to Chicago, Minneapolis,
Speaker 2: and Indianapolis on the seventh, eighth, and ninth of August. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and they're gonna wind it up in Durham, North Carolina
Speaker 2: on the fifth of September, and then Atlanta on the seventh.
Speaker 1: And tickets are on sale now. You can go to
Speaker 1: stuff youshould Know dot com or go to link tree
Speaker 1: slash sysk and we would love to see you there.
Speaker 1: Tickets are on sale now, so we'll see you soon.
Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and there's
Speaker 1: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and we're just futzing around
Speaker 1: having fun doing what we do. You're on Stuff you
Speaker 1: Should Know that right tex Stuff Edition It is heads
Speaker 1: off to John Strickland, who's still doing it all these.
Speaker 2: Years, we're all still doing it.
Speaker 1: I know they won't let us stop.
Speaker 2: My god, we're still doing it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I think he's in year fifteen now.
Speaker 2: Uh I was, Yeah, he was like shortly after us, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, right out on the heels. I can always
Speaker 1: feel them breathing on our neck. It's really gross. He
Speaker 1: has a very humid breath.
Speaker 2: Gross.
Speaker 1: So yeah, the reason you said this is Tech Stuff
Speaker 1: Edition is because this is super tech. Ye, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of technical stuff that we're going to dance around.
Speaker 1: It's future facing m hm, and it's the kind of
Speaker 1: thing that everybody hopes will hurry up and come but
Speaker 1: probably doesn't know very much about. So here we go
Speaker 1: tech stuff.
Speaker 2: Ahoy, everyone except me.
Speaker 1: You don't want this.
Speaker 2: I know. The whole time I was reading it, I
Speaker 2: was like, man, it just sounds like a lot of
Speaker 2: work to just not have to plug in your phone.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is a lot of word to just not
Speaker 1: have to plug in your phone. But I mean, haven't
Speaker 1: you ever like looked around your house and been like,
Speaker 1: these wires are just so stupid, Like I hate having
Speaker 1: chords and stuff you have to plug in. You have
Speaker 1: to like put something where the outlet is or else
Speaker 1: you have to use a drop cord. It's just it's
Speaker 1: a it's a little more of a pain if you
Speaker 1: stop and think about it, then it appears because we're
Speaker 1: used to it. We've lived under the tyranny of courts
Speaker 1: for so long. It's normal to us. But it's not normal, Chuck.
Speaker 2: Oh, so you're thinking of future where nothing in your
Speaker 2: house is plugged in precisely? Oh no, sure, great, I.
Speaker 1: Can't wait for that day. I cannot wait for that.
Speaker 1: And not only that, there's a there's the The last
Speaker 1: thing we're going to talk about is what I'm really
Speaker 1: jazzed about.
Speaker 2: Uh Okay, I don't want to spoil.
Speaker 1: It, so don't don't don't bring it up. But everybody,
Speaker 1: just stay with us through the end and you'll be rewarded.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And what we're talking about is wireless electricity, or
Speaker 2: more appropriately, wireless power transfer. Because if you think about
Speaker 2: your your cell phone that you can just sit on
Speaker 2: a little pad and charge it wirelessly. That thing's plugged
Speaker 2: into the wall. So what you're doing is you're transferring
Speaker 2: power from one thing to another.
Speaker 1: But imagine if that that charger, that pad that you
Speaker 1: lay your phone on is your house or no, it
Speaker 1: was like mounted on the ceiling of your of your room. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and when you walked into that room, immediately your phone
Speaker 1: just started charging in your pocket. You turned your TV
Speaker 1: on and it was going full blast, no problem. And
Speaker 1: then you look behind it and you faint dead away
Speaker 1: because it's not even plugged in, and you think there's
Speaker 1: a ghost in your house or God is messing with you.
Speaker 2: I just I don't think it. Jazz is me, like it,
Speaker 2: Jazz is you.
Speaker 1: That's fine.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to try to convince I've never looked
Speaker 2: behind a TV on a wall to look for gable, so.
Speaker 1: Oh, well, then you haven't.
Speaker 2: But we can talk about the history of it, right,
Speaker 2: because this is not a new thing. People have been
Speaker 2: trying to do this basically since there was electricity.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would have traced it back to Tesla. Tesla
Speaker 1: was very, famously, very interested in trying to figure out
Speaker 1: how to create wireless electricity that he planned on sending
Speaker 1: through the Earth from one end to the other, basically
Speaker 1: a global wireless electrical network. Right. He didn't, as we'll see.
Speaker 1: But what I didn't realize is it predates him even.
Speaker 2: Yeah, before him, there was a German physicist name Heinrich Hertz,
Speaker 2: who he was a guy who said, hey, manet, electromagnetic
Speaker 2: waves are a thing. I can prove it. And he
Speaker 2: was able to send energy in the form of radio
Speaker 2: as between two antennas in the eighteen eighties, which predated
Speaker 2: Tesla's little party trick that I think all of us
Speaker 2: probably saw in science or not saw but read about
Speaker 2: in science class, or saw on the prestige. Yeah, some
Speaker 2: point where he's like, I'm going to make this light
Speaker 2: bulb light up, Uncle Fester style, except I won't even
Speaker 2: put it in my mouth.
Speaker 1: Right, And it was a different light bulb. It was
Speaker 1: the predecessor of the fluorescent light. So the gases, when
Speaker 1: they came into the presence of a either a magnetic
Speaker 1: field or electrical current, it would glow, it would light up.
Speaker 1: But he did actually demonstrate this. He showed that you
Speaker 1: can loved it, you can wirelessly power things. And yeah,
Speaker 1: this is still the nineteenth century. There's a legend that
Speaker 1: a lot of times is repeated as fact by a
Speaker 1: lot of legitimate sources, but supposedly there's no actual evidence
Speaker 1: of this happening. There's a legend that he lit up
Speaker 1: a crop of light bulbs, like I think twenty five
Speaker 1: miles away from his research station in Colorado, and that
Speaker 1: would be like the far and away the longest transmission
Speaker 1: of wireless power in history. No one's even come close
Speaker 1: to that here in the twenty first century. So they
Speaker 1: think that it probably didn't happen. But he was trying
Speaker 1: to do that, but he didn't actually do it.
Speaker 2: I have a question, sure, will you remember what's it
Speaker 2: called when you say like a gaga lo geese or whatever?
Speaker 2: We did that short stuff on it whatever? You just said,
Speaker 2: a crop of light bulbs? Is that the term for
Speaker 2: a lot of light bulbs?
Speaker 1: I say, I say it is? Sure?
Speaker 2: Oh okay, I thought that.
Speaker 1: Was a pronoun. Was it a collective pronoun?
Speaker 2: I don't know. But did you just make that up?
Speaker 2: Or is that a thing?
Speaker 1: I mean, it just came out of my mouth.
Speaker 2: Okay, do you like it? Sure? Sounds like you're growing
Speaker 2: light bulbs out in the field or something.
Speaker 1: By light bulbs. They'll say, you got a crop of
Speaker 1: light bulbs here I can buy.
Speaker 2: I love it. I mean that's probably a use for crop.
Speaker 2: I just didn't know about.
Speaker 1: I know, I will say, hey, man, clerk me a
Speaker 1: crop of light bulbs.
Speaker 2: So Tesla's got his party tricks happening. May or may
Speaker 2: not have done this to a crop of light bulbs
Speaker 2: over a greater distance. World War two rolls around, and
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, we're using radar and we're learning
Speaker 2: how to generate like more improved and more directional and
Speaker 2: precise beams of microwaves and things like that. In nineteen
Speaker 2: sixty four, and you can watch this video on YouTube.
Speaker 2: It's kind of fun to watch a William Brown of
Speaker 2: Raytheon kept up a little sort of I mean, it's
Speaker 2: a helicopter, looks like it's made out of a rector
Speaker 2: set maybe yeah, about sixty feet off the ground for
Speaker 2: ten hours with no wires.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And they could have gone longer, but the novelty
Speaker 1: wore off, so he just stopped after ten hours.
Speaker 2: Yeah, He's like, all right, does everyone get it right?
Speaker 1: Can we go home? Now?
Speaker 2: Like? How many times in part to pass this hula
Speaker 2: hoop over it? Right?
Speaker 1: Right? So that that was a huge, huge accomplishment, And
Speaker 1: I believe the same William Brown of Raytheon created another
Speaker 1: record that stood until from nineteen seventy five until from
Speaker 1: what I can tell, this past January, like a month ago.
Speaker 1: In nineteen seventy five, NASA's Jet Propulsion Lab transmitted I
Speaker 1: think thirty five kilowatts of power, and like fifty percent
Speaker 1: of what they transmitted I think a quarter of a
Speaker 1: mile away or something like that, was received and lit
Speaker 1: up another crop of light bulbs. That's what people do,
Speaker 1: They light up crops of light bulbs when they're demonstrating
Speaker 1: what matters electrical.
Speaker 2: Trans because they light up and everyone's like, ooh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and actually I'm sorry. It was more than a
Speaker 1: quarter mile. I think it was basically a slat mile.
Speaker 1: It was like one point five to four kilometers.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's a really long way. And it stood
Speaker 1: from nineteen seventy five till twenty twenty four, almost fifty years,
Speaker 1: and then I believe the Korean Space Agency just broke
Speaker 1: it by like three tenths of a kilometer. Really, it's
Speaker 1: not like we've jumped by leaps and bounds. And almost
Speaker 1: if I were William Brown would be like, really, you
Speaker 1: could just wait until you could beat it by like
Speaker 1: ten times that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not very sports have been.
Speaker 1: Like no, it's like if you made the world's biggest bagel, right,
Speaker 1: and somebody made another world's biggest bagel by like ten
Speaker 1: more pounds. What's the point Are we really just gonna
Speaker 1: go back and forth year after year with a new
Speaker 1: world's biggest bagel? No, you need to really like double
Speaker 1: it up at least before you break somebody's record. It's
Speaker 1: just common courtesy.
Speaker 2: You know, how to really get their goat. It's just
Speaker 2: drop one extra poppy seat on top o me has
Speaker 2: more mats.
Speaker 1: Man, I would just start bleeding out of my ears.
Speaker 2: So this can happen in a couple of ways, and
Speaker 2: who knows what the future holds. We are going to
Speaker 2: get to that stuff like you were talking about, Like
Speaker 2: you walk in and everything's just like charging the second
Speaker 2: U inner. But these days we have what's called nearfield
Speaker 2: and what I like to call further afield, but farfield
Speaker 2: wireless transfer. When you think of nearfield, you're already doing that.
Speaker 2: If you have an electric toothbrush, if you have a
Speaker 2: modern smartphone that can wirelessly charge. We'll talk about the
Speaker 2: two different ways those are happening, but those are examples
Speaker 2: of nearfield. And I think a lot of people like
Speaker 2: I was, are amazed to know that when you put
Speaker 2: that little electric toothbrush on its stand. Unless I'm wrong,
Speaker 2: That little nubbin is only there to keep that thing upright.
Speaker 2: It's not conducting electricity at all, is it?
Speaker 1: As far as I know, No, because the whole thing's
Speaker 1: fully sealed, so the electricity is going from plastic to
Speaker 1: plastic via waves.
Speaker 2: So it looks like a little like a charging stump.
Speaker 2: But you could just assume lay it down on top
Speaker 2: of that thing, right.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I think for an electric toothbrush, what
Speaker 1: we're talking about at this point is called wireless in duction.
Speaker 1: In charging, it's the same kind of principle that you
Speaker 1: use for an induction cook top. Magnetic fields are generated
Speaker 1: that create an electric current that's passed to another coil
Speaker 1: on the other side that's received, and then that's attached
Speaker 1: to a battery that gets recharged. Right, And I think
Speaker 1: for something like a toothbrush, it has to be really precise,
Speaker 1: so the coils have to basically line up as close
Speaker 1: to one another as possible, but they don't have to
Speaker 1: physically touch, which is why you can encase it in
Speaker 1: plastic and seal it off and use it for an
Speaker 1: application that's around water, like an electric toothbrush. But I
Speaker 1: do think that has to be precise. I think you
Speaker 1: can get a little more jiggy with it with the
Speaker 1: resonant induction charging, where the coils are bigger or there's
Speaker 1: more coils. But they also have I don't know how
Speaker 1: they do this, but they make the frequencies that come
Speaker 1: out of one coil and go into received by the
Speaker 1: other perfectly in sync, so that the the coils are
Speaker 1: basically tuned to one another. So you can actually keep
Speaker 1: something a little further away and still get a charge
Speaker 1: out of it.
Speaker 2: Okay, so I was wrong, then that stump serves the
Speaker 2: purpose of probably aligning it perfectly, probably, although it's not
Speaker 2: actually you know, like a charging stump. You probably could
Speaker 2: not just set your toothbrush down with a butt in
Speaker 2: near that stump, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: No, but if you're talking about like your phone on
Speaker 1: like a pad charger, you just kind of set it down. Sure,
Speaker 1: Sure it'll still charge, even though it's not like perfectly
Speaker 1: centered on the charger, depending on the type of charging station.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I have seen those to be fairly hit
Speaker 2: or miss through the years. Yes, the little charging pad
Speaker 2: sometimes they work. Sometimes you've got to move your phone
Speaker 2: around it and it makes more sense now than I
Speaker 2: know how it works why you may have to move
Speaker 2: your phone around. And it's also slower than like a
Speaker 2: wall charge, which you know is one of the the
Speaker 2: humps to get over that we'll get.
Speaker 1: To it is, and they have basically gotten over that hump.
Speaker 1: So for a while I didn't realize this, but Nokia
Speaker 1: was the first to be like, hey, everybody, check out
Speaker 1: our wireless charge. Well back in twenty twelve, I had
Speaker 1: no idea. Yeah, and that set off like a whole
Speaker 1: stampede where every phone company wanted to create a wireless
Speaker 1: charging pad, right, and so everybody was coming up with
Speaker 1: different protocols, different structures on how to make this happen,
Speaker 1: and finally a group called the Wireless Power Consortium basically
Speaker 1: emerged with their cheese standard key like the Chinese traditional
Speaker 1: medicine concept of the life force that flows through.
Speaker 2: Everything, Yeah, like gigong exactly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's also associated with this wireless power transfer to
Speaker 1: where everybody builds it the exact same way. Right, So
Speaker 1: that's pretty cool. But it wasn't like you had to
Speaker 1: get it pretty much dead on to get a decent
Speaker 1: charge out of it, like you said it was. It
Speaker 1: transferred far less power, I think about five watts rather
Speaker 1: than the standard fifteen eighteen or more that you get
Speaker 1: from plugging your phone in. Yeah, so they came up
Speaker 1: with G two point zero and you know the new
Speaker 1: Apple Apple chargers that like snap onto the back of
Speaker 1: your your phone with a magnet.
Speaker 2: No, oh, really, do you have my iPhone? I do?
Speaker 1: Is it fairly new?
Speaker 2: Uh? Let me see what I usually get, like every
Speaker 2: third or fourth version.
Speaker 1: Okay, you may or may not have this. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I couldn't even tell you what if you told me
Speaker 1: the the which one it was, I'd be like, oh,
Speaker 1: actually I don't know. So I don't know why you've
Speaker 1: been asked to that. But the newer iPhones, yeah, that
Speaker 1: should have it. I think that's what I have too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is and it works. So there's a there's a
Speaker 1: type of charge you can get called a mag safe charger.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I got that.
Speaker 1: Okay, so then this you have what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: It snaps into place, so like magnet, it holds the
Speaker 1: phone in place, right, Yeah, I got one of those
Speaker 1: in my car. Okay, So what that's doing is it's
Speaker 1: holding the coil to the coil, so that in addition
Speaker 1: to them being powerful and tuned to the same frequency,
Speaker 1: they're also precisely interlocked, so the transfer of power is
Speaker 1: way more efficient. And now they're reaching like power transfer
Speaker 1: like fifteen, eighteen, twenty watts, just like you would have
Speaker 1: with a traditional like pluging cord.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know what, I'm not much of a
Speaker 2: what do you call it? Buzz marketer, but I have
Speaker 2: to say the car charger from Spiegel is what I like.
Speaker 2: The catalog I don't know, it's SPI E G E L.
Speaker 2: Is that spelled to save? Yeah, spell the same. I
Speaker 2: mean their charger. It's fifty bucks and it works flawlessly,
Speaker 2: and it looks good.
Speaker 1: And it just says a pompadour.
Speaker 2: Well it sticks on, you know, but the little stick
Speaker 2: on base is smaller than other ones I've seen, so
Speaker 2: if you know, sometimes your car you can't get it
Speaker 2: in like a great place or whatever. But anyway, I
Speaker 2: think it works great, and so I do actually use
Speaker 2: this technology very nice.
Speaker 1: Okay, so make safe so you have that. But the
Speaker 1: thing is is we've actually kind of gone backwards in
Speaker 1: that sense where you're getting more power transfer again wirelessly,
Speaker 1: like you're not plugging your phone into anything. It's laying
Speaker 1: on something that is connected to a power source, but
Speaker 1: your phone's not plugged in, so it is wireless power transfer.
Speaker 1: But rather than making it easier to just toss your
Speaker 1: phone onto a pad or a table or something like
Speaker 1: that and it immediately starts charging, it has to be
Speaker 1: more precise. Hence the magnets. Sure, we want to be
Speaker 1: going in the opposite direction to where your phone doesn't
Speaker 1: even really have to be anywhere near that charging pad
Speaker 1: to get a charge, and that's where people are moving toward.
Speaker 1: But the cool thing about the sheet two point zero
Speaker 1: is that this protocol is it's spreading out so that
Speaker 1: if you had, say like an Android phone and iPhone,
Speaker 1: you would be able to use the same charger for both,
Speaker 1: which is brand new. That's a new thing, and that's
Speaker 1: a really great way for the industry to be going
Speaker 1: because it cuts out on packaging, cuts out a manufacturing,
Speaker 1: it cuts down on all sorts of stuff it costs.
Speaker 1: So it's a good direction to be going in.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and divided houses can come together once again exactly
Speaker 2: this kind of charging. There is a future application that
Speaker 2: might be kind of cool. If you drive an electric
Speaker 2: car to where you pull in your garage and you
Speaker 2: just pull over charging Matt much like your telephone basically
Speaker 2: to where you wouldn't have to plug it in or whatever. Again,
Speaker 2: for me, it's like it's no trouble to plug something in,
Speaker 2: so it's not that big of a deal. But I
Speaker 2: imagine these little conveniences are a big deal to a
Speaker 2: lot of people for sure.
Speaker 1: I think the one that I'm really excited about is
Speaker 1: like that plus application, which is putting those kind of
Speaker 1: coils that transmit electricity wirelessly to a receiver coil in
Speaker 1: your car in asphalt, so when you're driving on the highway,
Speaker 1: your car is actually charging. That would do it. That
Speaker 1: would do it for gas engine cars people, you would
Speaker 1: have to just be a total jerk to have like
Speaker 1: an internal combustion engine after that point, because that's the
Speaker 1: big problem with it. Like do you remember that stupid
Speaker 1: electric car that I rented in Seattle and drove to
Speaker 1: Portland and I had to sit for forty five minutes
Speaker 1: in this little town doing nothing but waiting for the
Speaker 1: stupid rental car to charge. That is no way to live.
Speaker 1: But if I had just been able to drive down
Speaker 1: what is that five? The five, and that what they
Speaker 1: call it.
Speaker 2: I think that's a California think.
Speaker 1: Okay, well, if I had just been able to drive
Speaker 1: down I five and my car's charging the whole time, perfect,
Speaker 1: there's no reason for any any fossil fuel car all.
Speaker 2: Now, is the idea there that every road in America
Speaker 2: has is redone with charging capabilities underneath it.
Speaker 1: What I would guess is they would you would probably
Speaker 1: just need to do one lane.
Speaker 2: And then and then maybe only on expressways or something.
Speaker 1: Right, So one lane on an expressway and you like,
Speaker 1: if your car has over some amount of charge, like
Speaker 1: the Cultural Folk Way would be, you don't go on
Speaker 1: that lane. You leave it open for people who really.
Speaker 2: Need to charge the car. That'll go over well exactly
Speaker 2: in the United States. That'll that'll become the uh look
Speaker 2: at that jerk lane.
Speaker 1: Exactly. Yeah, it'll be like the new driving slow in
Speaker 1: the fast lane thing.
Speaker 2: I look forward to that day. I'm gonna be old
Speaker 2: and feeble and I just you can send me updates
Speaker 2: on how things are going from the road.
Speaker 1: But that's but that's all. But you just need one
Speaker 1: lane like that on a stretch of highway, and I
Speaker 1: think that would do it, at least at first, all right,
Speaker 1: I we get this done like tomorrow, all.
Speaker 2: Right, But in the meantime we should take a break, okay,
Speaker 2: because we're gonna have to buy some tools. Okay, all right,
Speaker 2: we'll be right back. All right, So we're back. Josh's boy.
Speaker 2: Look at the smile on your face thinking about driving
Speaker 2: untold miles without having to stop.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just going to change everything.
Speaker 2: Peeing in a gatorade bottle. You're not stopping for.
Speaker 1: Nothing, No, no way.
Speaker 2: Just think of the cannonball run I have.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna take this opportunity, all right, But yes,
Speaker 1: the cannonball run would work really well with that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: if you I see this enough that I feel like
Speaker 1: this is worth mentioning. If you ever find yourself in
Speaker 1: an emergency situation where you have to pee into a
Speaker 1: water bottle or a mountain dew bottle or something like that,
Speaker 1: that's fine, that's fine. Like that is a thing you
Speaker 1: have to do sometimes. I never have, but people do it,
Speaker 1: and I get it. But you don't leave that on
Speaker 1: the side of the road for somebody else to pick up.
Speaker 1: That is yours to hang on to until you're able
Speaker 1: to dispose of it. In the trash where it belongs. Yeah,
Speaker 1: put the cap on, get it out of your way,
Speaker 1: make sure it doesn't spill or anything like that. But
Speaker 1: you do not set that outside of your car until
Speaker 1: it goes into the trash. That is, it's tied for
Speaker 1: first with throwing your dental floss stick down on the
Speaker 1: ground for someone else to pick up.
Speaker 2: Yeah. The only time I will do that is camping.
Speaker 2: If it's rainy or really really cold, then I'm in
Speaker 2: my tent. I will have the forethought to bring an
Speaker 2: appropriate bottle smart so I can just get out of
Speaker 2: my sleeping bag and you know, and ppe in the bottle.
Speaker 1: A big wide mouth bottle, Am I right?
Speaker 2: And then I just leave it there in the woods.
Speaker 1: No, no, of course not okay, okay, I was shocked.
Speaker 2: All right. So we're back and we're getting started now
Speaker 2: on far field wireless transfer. Because your phone on your nightstand,
Speaker 2: that's great. Driving over a mat in your garage would
Speaker 2: be amazing, But you really are cooking with gas, as
Speaker 2: they say, ironically, not with gas. If you can start
Speaker 2: figuring out how to do this over longer and longer frequencies,
Speaker 2: and they are figuring that stuff out by ways of
Speaker 2: electromagnetic waves or which you know, what you do is
Speaker 2: you send it out as an electromagnetic wave, it transmits
Speaker 2: it as a beam, then it converts it to power
Speaker 2: or through laser beams.
Speaker 1: Yes, so you can do laser you can do millimeter waves,
Speaker 1: you can do I think microwaves is are the big
Speaker 1: ones because they'll I mean they'll they're electromagnetic waves, so
Speaker 1: they're an energy carrier and all you need is a
Speaker 1: way to convert electricity to electromagnetic energy and then a
Speaker 1: way to convert it back on the other side, and
Speaker 1: then you've just transmitted power from a distance.
Speaker 2: That's what they're possible already, right, They just absolutely haven't
Speaker 2: figured out a great consumer application because it's not efficient
Speaker 2: or great jeap.
Speaker 1: That's the problem. It's not cheap and it's inefficient. So
Speaker 1: yes that I believe there are consumer products out there,
Speaker 1: just a handful of them that you can spend a
Speaker 1: lot of money on and be like, look, this thing's charging.
Speaker 1: It takes forty eight hours to get to five percent,
Speaker 1: but it's charging wirelessly. That's where we're at right now.
Speaker 1: But it is possible. People have figured it out. But
Speaker 1: just like with that CHI protocol, with like the charging
Speaker 1: pads that the industry is in the same place right
Speaker 1: now with figuring out a a common protocol for everybody
Speaker 1: to use now. So it's kind of the wild West
Speaker 1: any they're trying to figure out the best way to
Speaker 1: efficiently do it and also safely do it, as we'll see.
Speaker 2: Yeah, in one application they can use it on today
Speaker 2: that does make sense. And Livia dug this up and
Speaker 2: helped out, and this one makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 2: With RFID tags radio frequency identification tags, and you've probably
Speaker 2: heard of these. There's all kinds of applications for these,
Speaker 2: but one of the big applications is if you have
Speaker 2: like a warehouse full of stuff, instead of having a
Speaker 2: barcode on every single thing that you have to walk
Speaker 2: up to with a bar code scanner like several inches
Speaker 2: away or whatever, you can track your inventory more efficiently
Speaker 2: because it can if you do it through RFID, you
Speaker 2: can group things together, you can scan a bunch of
Speaker 2: stuff at once, you can scan it from three, four
Speaker 2: or five feet away, maybe you don't have to be
Speaker 2: right there up on it. So using this technology to
Speaker 2: have little RFID tags that don't require batteries is a
Speaker 2: realistic application.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you just said a mouthful with that. They
Speaker 1: don't require batteries, because that's a big reason why you
Speaker 1: would want to use something like wireless power transfer is
Speaker 1: with the little RFID tags, they have an antenna in them,
Speaker 1: but they don't actually have any power. They're not internally powered.
Speaker 1: But when that radio wave hits it, it carries just
Speaker 1: enough energy to make contact with it, give it a
Speaker 1: little juice. There's a modulator inside that takes that radio
Speaker 1: wave and converts it back to shoot back out to
Speaker 1: the scanner with a little with its number associated with it.
Speaker 1: All without batteries. It just uses They figured out how
Speaker 1: to use the energy in that electromagnetic wave in the
Speaker 1: form of radio waves, and so we're already doing this again.
Speaker 1: It's just really inefficient. But they're onto something with that
Speaker 1: because you know, we've entered the Internet of Things. I
Speaker 1: think we did a whole episode on that way. I'll
Speaker 1: bet that needs so much updating.
Speaker 2: Yeah, probably so.
Speaker 1: But all the little like sensors in your refrigerator, all
Speaker 1: the little little gadgets, the thing that connects your refrigerator,
Speaker 1: the to Wi Fi. Now all of these things are
Speaker 1: like really tiny little components and the smaller the component.
Speaker 1: The harder it is to put a decent battery in there,
Speaker 1: and you also kind of want a rechargeable battery too,
Speaker 1: but some of them don't have batteries. They still are
Speaker 1: going to report that say like you're running it low
Speaker 1: on ketchup or something like that. Wireless energy would be
Speaker 1: able to do the same thing that we're doing with
Speaker 1: RFID tags, but with the little sensors and chargers that
Speaker 1: make up the Internet of things that make your home
Speaker 1: a smart home.
Speaker 2: Yeah, or to not have to have a follow up
Speaker 2: surgeries to replace batteries in your pacemaker would be pretty.
Speaker 1: Remarkable, Yeah, Because that's another like really big part of this,
Speaker 1: in addition to like the whole g whiz aspect of
Speaker 1: it and the no chords they which I'm really happy about.
Speaker 1: The bigger point in the near term is that it
Speaker 1: will do weigh with disposable batteries. All will have is
Speaker 1: rechargeable batteries. If we have any batteries at all. Some
Speaker 1: things won't need it, but things that do need a
Speaker 1: battery to keep going without a power source, those will
Speaker 1: be rechargeable and they'll be more easily replenished with wireless
Speaker 1: power transmission. So you can say goodbye to buying batteries
Speaker 1: at the store. They'll just be gone and the earth
Speaker 1: will breathe a deep, deep, happy sigh.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well that is, and now we're getting into sort
Speaker 2: of your utopia, which is these companies that are exploring
Speaker 2: initially probably like a room system and then eventually a
Speaker 2: whole home system to where what you described at the
Speaker 2: beginning of the show would be possible, where you can
Speaker 2: walk in your house the second you walk in, your
Speaker 2: phone is charging in your pocket. If you have a
Speaker 2: smart home and you have like powered blinds on your windows,
Speaker 2: those are always charged. They're not plugged in. If you
Speaker 2: have remote control for your TV and everything else in
Speaker 2: your home, they actually have a tiny battery made by
Speaker 2: the company. In this case, I mean, we can go
Speaker 2: back and talk about Guru, but there's a company called
Speaker 2: Oca inc Ossia, and they have a system called the
Speaker 2: Kota system Ota, and that's the idea is you have
Speaker 2: a unit in your house. It looks sort of like
Speaker 2: a well it's a little smaller than a board game
Speaker 2: and a little more square, and it's just a little
Speaker 2: transmitting stand and it shoots power across the room. It
Speaker 2: bounces it around and you have receivers that are attached
Speaker 2: to your devices, like your receiver would be built into
Speaker 2: your phone case in the case of a phone. Or
Speaker 2: they're making what they're calling forever batteries, which is a
Speaker 2: little double a battery that actually has a tiny receiver
Speaker 2: in it, so that remote control battery will never die
Speaker 2: and it essentially just makes any device in your house
Speaker 2: compatible with this transmitter. The one thing I wondered about, though,
Speaker 2: was like, well, when is duras El gonna buy them
Speaker 2: out and just shut it down?
Speaker 1: Oh? Man, I hope we don't run into something like that.
Speaker 1: I mean, big battery is a major threat to democracy, true,
Speaker 1: but I don't know. I think I don't know. I
Speaker 1: think these other startups have some pretty good clout too.
Speaker 2: Well, should we talk about Guru then, sure? Jumping back
Speaker 2: a little, Guru.
Speaker 1: Got together with Motorola and two years ago they debuted
Speaker 1: basically a charger, an over the air charger, a wireless
Speaker 1: power charger that was very similar in design. It seems
Speaker 1: like to that Coda charger, and it can I think,
Speaker 1: charge four phones at once up to ten feet away
Speaker 1: with one hundred degree field of vision, which is pretty cool.
Speaker 1: It's still not out to market. I think people are like, yeah,
Speaker 1: but you guys didn't mention how efficient it is, like
Speaker 1: how many watts does it transfer? And motoroles like stop
Speaker 1: asking questions and they went back to the drawing board.
Speaker 1: But the code of stuff seems like it's so close
Speaker 1: it might actually already be available in some areas.
Speaker 2: And didn't see it for sale yet, but I might
Speaker 2: be wrong.
Speaker 1: They are touting their wireless power security camera, the archos AR.
Speaker 2: Now that's a good use, yeah for sure. Yeah, because
Speaker 2: if you have a house where you didn't have like
Speaker 2: you if you have security cameras whatever, you didn't have
Speaker 2: them built in and wired initially, and you're just like, oh,
Speaker 2: I want to get a Nest cameras or any other brand,
Speaker 2: Like you got to plug those things in. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: if they're outdoor cameras, you're either running wire to an
Speaker 2: outdoor plug that someone could just unplug right or you're
Speaker 2: drilling holes in your wall. So I think this is
Speaker 2: a really realistic, like worthy application.
Speaker 1: It's part of like my week to go around and
Speaker 1: connect the charger, the outdoor charger to the outdoor cameras
Speaker 1: and just top them off because they're not hardwired. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree with you. I think it's a great application.
Speaker 1: Now imagine that for your TV.
Speaker 2: Although kind of make one complaint real quick about security cameras. Yeah,
Speaker 2: they're great to have. They can help out with different
Speaker 2: things and help out with neighbors. Hey I saw someone
Speaker 2: and them like breaking into my car. Your neighbor has
Speaker 2: a camera pointing, like we can all help. But in
Speaker 2: my experience in Atlanta, with car break ins and house
Speaker 2: break ins, I've had both, they don't help you catch anybody.
Speaker 2: They don't help stop anyone. So it's almost more like, hey,
Speaker 2: you want to watch some guys steal your stuff? Right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: police can't really do much with them, and it certainly
Speaker 2: doesn't keep anyone from doing anything. So I don't know
Speaker 2: it's good for more than just like break in security.
Speaker 2: I think there are a lot of if you have
Speaker 2: dogs and you're like, want to see what your dog's doing,
Speaker 2: is eating the wrong thing or throwing up or you know,
Speaker 2: it's beneficial for a lot of different reasons, but catching
Speaker 2: a bad guy at my experience, security cameras don't really
Speaker 2: help with that.
Speaker 1: No, you're likelier to have some weird footage from your
Speaker 1: camera end up on the national news or America's funniest.
Speaker 2: Toying exactly catch a UFO or something.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you are likelier to catch a UFO
Speaker 1: than somebody stealing packages off of your porch with your
Speaker 1: security camera.
Speaker 2: Sort of. The real deal here is like one day
Speaker 2: when they can come up with a system where it's
Speaker 2: built into Amtrak and subways and airports, so all of
Speaker 2: these sort of heavily used public spaces are just charging
Speaker 2: everyone's everything.
Speaker 1: Yes, And the problems are the same with the wireless
Speaker 1: phone charging just across the board. Anytime we're talking about
Speaker 1: wireless power transfer, it's the inefficiency is what's the big
Speaker 1: stumbling block right now. Yeah, the further you get away
Speaker 1: from the charger, Yeah, the less power the receiver is getting.
Speaker 1: The most i've seen, I think that ar Chose security
Speaker 1: camera gets like less than a wt thirty feet away
Speaker 1: at its maximum distance, which is still I mean thirty
Speaker 1: feet is a decent.
Speaker 2: Decent Is that enough to power it?
Speaker 1: I think as long as it had you probably would
Speaker 1: have to charge it first, plug in when you first
Speaker 1: get it, and then if it had continuous contact it
Speaker 1: was constantly receiving it.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I would hope that they would design it so that
Speaker 1: it uses less energy than that can get it its
Speaker 1: maximum distance. I don't know, but that could be a
Speaker 1: challenge right now. That's the kind of inefficiency problems that
Speaker 1: it's running into. I think typically when you try to
Speaker 1: transmit electricity through an electromagnetic beam, you get about twenty
Speaker 1: percent on the other end of what you sent out.
Speaker 1: And that's even a step backwards from what the Jet
Speaker 1: Propulsion Lab did. They got forty nine percent across a mile.
Speaker 1: So I guess they just didn't tell anybody how to
Speaker 1: do what they did, because we're still catching up to
Speaker 1: what they did in nineteen seventy five. But so even
Speaker 1: if you're like, okay, we're getting twenty percent of the
Speaker 1: electricity that we are generating converting to an electromagnetic wave,
Speaker 1: transmitting to another receiver, and then converting back to electricity,
Speaker 1: we're losing eighty percent of that. That is ridiculously inefficient.
Speaker 1: And people in the industry, which is basically just nothing
Speaker 1: but startups and venture capitalists right now are saying, well, well, yes,
Speaker 1: that's true, that's ridiculously inefficient. But we're talking about replacing
Speaker 1: batteries right here, and the cost of the electricity that
Speaker 1: is wasted is like five thousand times less than the
Speaker 1: cost of a double a disposable battery. So really, if
Speaker 1: you look at it in terms like that, it's we're
Speaker 1: not that far off from it being cost effective if
Speaker 1: we can use it to replace batteries.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And one of the cool pieces of or cool
Speaker 2: parts of this tech is let's say you have a
Speaker 2: room that's set up to charge everything in there. It's
Speaker 2: apparently with this OSA system, it is it's bouncing all
Speaker 2: over the room, pinging like one hundred times a second.
Speaker 2: So it's not like if you turn your back, it's
Speaker 2: not shooting waves through your body and we'll get to
Speaker 2: safety here after the break. But regardless of that, it
Speaker 2: bounces around you. If you have your phone up to
Speaker 2: your head, it will bounce around your head off the
Speaker 2: back wall to hit the back of that phone.
Speaker 1: Oh really, the OSA system does.
Speaker 2: That, Yeah, supposedly, and only delivers power like if something
Speaker 2: needs it, so it's not constantly on and supposedly we'll
Speaker 2: prioritize whatever's in the room that needs juice the.
Speaker 1: Most smart Yeah, because just like RFI D tags that
Speaker 1: chargers constantly surveying the stuff in the room that has
Speaker 1: right a coder receiver attached to it and saying like,
Speaker 1: where are you at, what's your levels? You need some
Speaker 1: you need some juice. I got some for you. They're like, no,
Speaker 1: not right now. I'm good, okay, but I'm here if
Speaker 1: you need it kind of thing. Yeah, So I didn't
Speaker 1: know that it actually went around people, though, which is
Speaker 1: a big deal, because that's a genuine concern at this point.
Speaker 1: If you're beaming electricity throughout a home, if you're creating
Speaker 1: an electrical field that's just indiscriminately moving everywhere in a room,
Speaker 1: it's going to come in contact with things that are conductive. So,
Speaker 1: like someone one issue I've seen raised is the idea
Speaker 1: that you're just yeah, your pots and pants are going
Speaker 1: to get super hot just sitting in the drawer in
Speaker 1: your kitchen. Yeah, if you're using microwaves, if the microwave
Speaker 1: is powerful enough it can cook you from the inside out,
Speaker 1: that doesn't seem to be a threat. I mean, the
Speaker 1: people who are designing these things are like well aware
Speaker 1: of the dangers of microwaves cooking human beings. So the
Speaker 1: stuff they're they're like deliberately setting these things at levels
Speaker 1: that wouldn't be able to do that, but it just
Speaker 1: kind of goes to show like that's the stage that
Speaker 1: where i'd is like, that's still technically possible with what
Speaker 1: we're doing. Laser beams can still shoot you in the eye.
Speaker 1: They could still burn your skin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, those are the ones that don't hang around the room.
Speaker 2: If it's laser base, then you have to have a
Speaker 2: direct line.
Speaker 1: Yes, and supposedly if you get in between the laser
Speaker 1: and the receiver, it just automatically turns off. But you know,
Speaker 1: there's still that moment that singes your hair.
Speaker 2: Yeah, or you could have the high tech mirrored system
Speaker 2: like any bank security in the movies, or I'm sorry,
Speaker 2: museum security. Probably, Oh yeah, like that, like shooting the
Speaker 2: lasers all around grid.
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, that's awesome.
Speaker 2: And then before you know it, Catherine Zada Jones is
Speaker 2: slinking underneath one of those things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you're like, what are you doing in my kitchen?
Speaker 2: You're too old to be slinking around like that lady.
Speaker 2: You know, pull a muscle.
Speaker 1: So what else is there?
Speaker 2: Well, we should take a break probably, oh yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: and then we'll come back and bush up with the
Speaker 2: serious future right after this.
Speaker 1: All right, Chuck, So we're talking about future applications that like,
Speaker 1: this is the real whiz bang stuff that I'm just
Speaker 1: really jazzed about because we're approaching that dream that Tesla
Speaker 1: had of fulfilling that dream of basically creating a world
Speaker 1: where everything's just getting wireless power all the time.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So there's a group called the Persistent Optical. This
Speaker 2: is a plan the Persistent and we love our acronyms.
Speaker 2: Is one of the best assistant optical wireless energy relay.
Speaker 2: What does that spell?
Speaker 1: Power? What have you got power?
Speaker 2: It's a great one. I love it when it perfectly
Speaker 2: aligns like that. And that was proposed by the US
Speaker 2: Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency, which we all know is DARPA.
Speaker 2: And this is a situation where they could beam electricity
Speaker 2: from a web of aircraft flying above onto the ground
Speaker 2: into let's say, either you know Libya's aid a conflict zone,
Speaker 2: but maybe a disaster zone where there's no power on
Speaker 2: the ground anymore and people are dying. Potentially a web
Speaker 2: of aircraft above could shoot this stuff down to the ground.
Speaker 1: Yes, but it does have immediate military applications because just
Speaker 1: like how you know, people were saying, like, wait a minute,
Speaker 1: we have twenty percent efficiency of the electricity where we're
Speaker 1: transmitting here. Yeah, the same thing is running into this
Speaker 1: problem too, Like there's a loss of efficiency. But even
Speaker 1: if there's a massive loss of efficiency, it's still more
Speaker 1: efficient than literally flying in tanks of oil and gasoline. Yeah,
Speaker 1: into a conflicts owner disaster area, filling up generators and
Speaker 1: then plugging into those. It'd be still much more efficient
Speaker 1: than that. And because it'd be more efficient, because it
Speaker 1: would just give such a ridiculous advantage on the battlefield.
Speaker 1: This is probably coming down the pike.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but like you said, they have a leg up
Speaker 2: because it's so inefficient. The alternative that we've been using
Speaker 2: is that it doesn't have to be as efficient as
Speaker 2: like a home version that we're talking about for people
Speaker 2: to get on board, because that's one of the problems
Speaker 2: is people aren't gonna start buying this stuff up. Even
Speaker 2: that cool system we were talking about out for like
Speaker 2: one room, you'd have to be a really you have
Speaker 2: to have a lot of money and be a super
Speaker 2: into early tech adoption to just kind of show it
Speaker 2: off to friends. At this point, to make it mass marketed,
Speaker 2: they have to make it so everybody sees the benefit
Speaker 2: and can afford it, and that's not the case with
Speaker 2: these potential military applications.
Speaker 1: No, but it's sad but true that the military research
Speaker 1: and development has trickled down to a lot of really
Speaker 1: important consumer items for short years too. And this could
Speaker 1: be the same exact thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, there's another There's a group in New Zealand called
Speaker 1: EMROD and they are basically creating line of sight towers
Speaker 1: to where that just beams from one to the other,
Speaker 1: basically like those bonfire towers and Lord of the Rings. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just the same thing, but rather than like line
Speaker 1: of sight, you're transmitting electromagnetic waves carrying energy, and then
Speaker 1: at the other end, or probably at each of one
Speaker 1: of these transmitters, you're able to convert it to usable
Speaker 1: electricity and then you know, power up a disaster area,
Speaker 1: a rural area, whatever area you want to.
Speaker 2: I don't remember that from Lord of the Rings. Is
Speaker 2: it just a signal over long distance? Yeah, like that,
Speaker 2: like a bit visually signal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, from like mountaintop to mountain top. They had like
Speaker 1: a bomb fire and then at anybody else noticed it
Speaker 1: and they let their bombfire and it was like a
Speaker 1: transmission of information. That's what we're talking about in much
Speaker 1: the same way that Wi Fi transmits information. We're talking
Speaker 1: about the same exact thing, using the same essentially kind
Speaker 1: of electromagnetic spectrum, but instead to transmit energy rather than information.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, Like people don't freak out over a Wi
Speaker 2: Fi being being through their house and it's essentially the
Speaker 2: same thing.
Speaker 1: Some people do, like Chuck McGill from Wood.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, I haven't seen that, but I know there
Speaker 2: are people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So there's a really exciting application with that New
Speaker 1: Zealand structure where to tower. Yeah, the emrod one is
Speaker 1: they could you could transfer wind energy from remote places
Speaker 1: to an urban area that really needs that electricity, all
Speaker 1: those renewables. So it's like the fatal flaws like you
Speaker 1: they they're too far away from the grid. Nope, not
Speaker 1: any longer. You can transmit it wirelessly through New Zealand
Speaker 1: at least.
Speaker 2: Well talking about being too far away, too far away.
Speaker 2: The think about being an outer space and having a
Speaker 2: web of satellites outfitted with these huge solar panels far
Speaker 2: above the Earth that could transmit energy down as microwaves.
Speaker 2: That is not out of the realm of possibility. In fact,
Speaker 2: it's even been done just last year in twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: cal Tech, Yes, Caltech Space Power Project, they sent a
Speaker 2: detectable amount of energy from a satellite to Earth.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: You know, I don't think they were charging a car
Speaker 2: or anything like that, but they showed that it's possible.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and get this, Chuck, I mean, aside from the
Speaker 1: infrastructure costs involved, that's free energy. You're just taking solar
Speaker 1: energy and transmitting it, even if it's just a little
Speaker 1: bit and there's a massive loss of efficiency. You're not
Speaker 1: burning coal to get that. You're just you just built
Speaker 1: a satellite that's harvesting it out and outer space, which
Speaker 1: is a huge advantage, you know.
Speaker 2: Totally.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's like the first step toward a Dyson sphere. Really,
Speaker 1: if you think about it, I love it. That's the
Speaker 1: one I was jazz the most.
Speaker 2: About the satellite one.
Speaker 1: Yes, harvesting solar injury in space and transmitting it as
Speaker 1: a usable power down on Earth. That is jazz worthy
Speaker 1: for sure.
Speaker 2: Totally.
Speaker 1: You got anything else?
Speaker 2: I got nothing else?
Speaker 1: All right, Well, Chuck has nothing else. Neither do I.
Speaker 1: We'll just have to sit and wait and see what
Speaker 1: the future holds. And while we do that, let's say
Speaker 1: It's time for listener now.
Speaker 2: This is an email again from our old buddy Mark Konts.
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Speaker 2: and this is what Marcu has to say. And you
Speaker 2: might remember Mark. He's an art therapist, Hey guys, licensed
Speaker 2: art therapists and the director of mental health services at
Speaker 2: the Clark County Education Service Center in Springfield, Ohio. My
Speaker 2: team work extremely hard to provide Sources of Strength to
Speaker 2: as many students as we can in the state for free.
Speaker 2: Most people assume that suicide prevention work focuses on sad,
Speaker 2: shock and trauma, but we run a program in our
Speaker 2: schools called Sources of Strength, which capital s capital s
Speaker 2: by the way, which focuses on hope, help and strength.
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Speaker 2: Sources of Strength is more than just suicide preventions, an
Speaker 2: overall wellness program focusing on eight protective factors, some of
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Speaker 2: Only skimming the surface here, guys, So if you live
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Speaker 2: dot org to learn more about it and become one
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Speaker 2: our old buddy Mark Goods.
Speaker 1: Well, thanks a lot for that. Mark. Good to hear
Speaker 1: from you as always. And if you want to be
Speaker 1: like Mark and talk about some amazing stuff you're doing
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