WEBVTT - 11. Tail End

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<v Speaker 1>I'm floating in water, naked. Salt burns my eyes, but

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't matter. There of no use. Everything is black.

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<v Speaker 1>I hold my hand an inch from my face, but

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<v Speaker 1>I can't see my fingers. Total silence. I'm in an

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<v Speaker 1>isolation tank. Picture a big horizontal egg, half filled with water.

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<v Speaker 1>You climb in, pull down the hatch, seal yourself in,

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<v Speaker 1>and float. The idea is to eliminate sensory overload, relieve anxiety,

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<v Speaker 1>boost creativity, focus, or conversely go blank. I don't zen out, though,

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<v Speaker 1>I think about this story, about how the missing men

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<v Speaker 1>likely crashed into water and drowned, About the violence of

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<v Speaker 1>nature and the brutality of loss, About my burning eyes.

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<v Speaker 1>From my heart Media, This is Missing in Alaska, the

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<v Speaker 1>story of two congressmen who vanished in nineteen two, and

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<v Speaker 1>my quest to figure out what happened to them. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>your host, John Wallzac. Full disclosure, This was supposed to

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<v Speaker 1>be our final episode, but we're getting so many new

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<v Speaker 1>leads that we'll likely be back in the future with updates.

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<v Speaker 1>For now, though, let me examine sixteen critical questions about

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<v Speaker 1>the disappearance and give you some unexpected answers. You'll hear

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<v Speaker 1>it back and forth between me and Paul Deckett are

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<v Speaker 1>supervising producer one. Is it really so bizarre for a

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<v Speaker 1>small plane to disappear in Alaska and never be found. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>of course planes do vanish in Alaska without a trace,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's not the norm. In nineteen two, Air Force

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<v Speaker 1>Major Henry Stocker, the search commander, told reporters, quote, of

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<v Speaker 1>what we're looking for, we locate. Of the previous twelve

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<v Speaker 1>hundred planes to disappear, one official said only three had

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<v Speaker 1>never been found. An Air Force document I obtained says, quote,

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<v Speaker 1>had the aircraft or its occupants have been able to

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<v Speaker 1>send an electronic signal, the probability of detection of this

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<v Speaker 1>signal was. The probability of detection of fires or other

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<v Speaker 1>visual signals from survivors was the probability of detection of

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<v Speaker 1>the aircraft if intact in the search area was an

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<v Speaker 1>excess of nine. The probability of locating aircraft, wreckage or

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<v Speaker 1>survivors without fires or signaling devices was an excess of

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<v Speaker 1>in all search areas, and an excess of in the

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<v Speaker 1>highest probability area end quote. So, according to the Air Force,

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<v Speaker 1>there was a chance of finding wreckage in the highest

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<v Speaker 1>probability surge area, but still nothing, no debris, no oil

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<v Speaker 1>slick nothing from the plane. And even when planes do disappear,

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<v Speaker 1>they're often located years or decades later. Take the case

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<v Speaker 1>of Clearance Road, a U. S. Fish and Wildlife Service

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<v Speaker 1>official who vanished on a small plane in Alaska in

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen fifty. Despite a hundred and forty seven thousand square

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<v Speaker 1>miles search, his plane was never found either until nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>seventy nine, when hikers stumbled upon it in a remote

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<v Speaker 1>part of the Brooks Range, high above the Arctic Circle two.

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<v Speaker 1>Where did the plane crash, probably into Prince William Sound,

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<v Speaker 1>somewhere between Portage Pass and Henson Brook Island. The last

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<v Speaker 1>time anyone heard from the plane was right before it

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<v Speaker 1>entered the pass, but searchers found no wreckage in the past,

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<v Speaker 1>nor has any sign of it surfaced there in the

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<v Speaker 1>last fifty years. We also have a critical clue. Around

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<v Speaker 1>am on the morning of October six, nineteen seventy two,

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<v Speaker 1>at least one to three people described in various accounts

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<v Speaker 1>as a dock worker, construction worker, and or fisherman, heard

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<v Speaker 1>a small plane fly over Whittier, The only plane in

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<v Speaker 1>the vicinity of Whittier at that time was the baggage

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<v Speaker 1>Boggs plane, so it seems that the missing plane did

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<v Speaker 1>make it through Portage Pass over Whittier and onto Prince

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<v Speaker 1>William Sound. At that point, it would have been about

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<v Speaker 1>seventy five miles from Johnstone Point on the northern tip

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<v Speaker 1>of Hension Brook Island. At Johnstone there was a radio

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<v Speaker 1>relay that would have allowed the pilot, Don John's to

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<v Speaker 1>speak with the flight service specialist in Anchorage, but Don

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<v Speaker 1>never radioed in after crossing through Portage Pass. Why. There

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<v Speaker 1>are a few possible explanations. Don's radio broke at that

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<v Speaker 1>very moment, right after he crossed through Portage Pass, but

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<v Speaker 1>before he was within range of Johnstone. Verdict possible, but

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<v Speaker 1>very unlikely. Since Dawn wasn't required to make contact at Johnstone,

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<v Speaker 1>he chose not to, so he actually made it past

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<v Speaker 1>Hinsion Brook without checking in. But Don was known to

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<v Speaker 1>radio in three to four times when flying between Anchorage

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<v Speaker 1>and Juno, and he probably would have wanted to check

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<v Speaker 1>in to see if there were any new weather updates.

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<v Speaker 1>Verdict possible but unlikely. Don crashed right after he got

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<v Speaker 1>through Portage Pass, but before he was within range of Johnstone.

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<v Speaker 1>This would have had to occur during a narrow window

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<v Speaker 1>of time, though, say five to fifteen minutes, because once

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<v Speaker 1>he got through the pass he would have been within

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<v Speaker 1>range of the radio relay pretty quickly. Verdict possible, but

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<v Speaker 1>less likely. Don had a sudden emergency while he was

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<v Speaker 1>within range of Johnstone and then crashed. In this case,

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<v Speaker 1>even if he could radio in, he would have been

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<v Speaker 1>preoccupied with saving the plane. Verdict possible. On this note,

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<v Speaker 1>there's also a chance Don was within range of Johnstone

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<v Speaker 1>but too low to make contact. Maybe there was an

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<v Speaker 1>emergency and he wanted to call in, but he couldn't.

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<v Speaker 1>His radio was line of sight, so terrain like mountains

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<v Speaker 1>could have blocked a transmission. Verdict possible. Some people speculate

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<v Speaker 1>that Don did not cross through Portage Pass. They think

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<v Speaker 1>he took an alternate route without notifying the authorities. Maybe

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<v Speaker 1>he followed a rail line down to seward, crossed over water,

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<v Speaker 1>and then disappeared. But this doesn't take into account witness

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<v Speaker 1>reports of a plane crossing over Whittier that morning. Verdict possible,

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<v Speaker 1>but very unlike so to recap based on available evidence,

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<v Speaker 1>it's still most likely that the plane craft somewhere between

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<v Speaker 1>Portage Pass and Henshon Brook Island, probably into Prince William Sound.

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<v Speaker 1>Three was the Cessina tail Bob Martinson found around right

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<v Speaker 1>off Henshon Brook Island, part of the Beggage Bogg's plane.

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<v Speaker 1>Maybe the coloration, size and tail number all apparently match,

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<v Speaker 1>so does the location. Poor Duchess is only about ten

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<v Speaker 1>miles south of V three one seven, the route Don

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<v Speaker 1>John's planned to take on October six ninety two. That day,

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<v Speaker 1>if Don flew low under a cloud ceiling, he would

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<v Speaker 1>have had to circle around Hension Brook, not over it

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<v Speaker 1>by heading north or south. If he flew south trying

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<v Speaker 1>to circle around the island, and if he had an emergency,

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<v Speaker 1>he would have likely turned east into port Us instead

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<v Speaker 1>of heading out over open ocean. Once in port Ches,

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<v Speaker 1>he likely would have tried to cross through a low

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<v Speaker 1>pass of about a thousand feet and then attempted to

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<v Speaker 1>land either somewhere on Hension Book or in Cordova. Four.

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<v Speaker 1>What happened to the tailpiece Bob found Bob is fuzzy

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<v Speaker 1>on whether he, his father and only Resa there fishing

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<v Speaker 1>partner left the tail in the water, if they brought

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<v Speaker 1>it back to Cordova, or if they sent it back

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<v Speaker 1>on a tender, a type of supply boat. Bob thinks

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<v Speaker 1>they sent it back to Cordova on a tender. Five.

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<v Speaker 1>If it made it back to Cordova to the Alaska

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<v Speaker 1>State troopers, what happened, then where is it? Honestly, I

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<v Speaker 1>have no idea. I tried to track down troopers who

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<v Speaker 1>were stationed in Cordova around nineteen to ask them, because

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<v Speaker 1>even if they determined that it belonged to a different plane,

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<v Speaker 1>that's not the type of thing you forget. There should

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<v Speaker 1>be documentation of which plane it belonged to. Unfortunately, the

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<v Speaker 1>only troopers I could find have died six What happened

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<v Speaker 1>to the plane on October sixteenth? Why did it crash again?

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<v Speaker 1>There are multiple possible explanations, including a mechanical failure, be

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<v Speaker 1>whether see pilot error or d a bomb or some

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<v Speaker 1>other black swan event. I don't buy option a catastrophic

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<v Speaker 1>mechanical failure. The plane had just undergone a hundred hour

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<v Speaker 1>inspection the day before it disappeared, and then that night

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<v Speaker 1>Dawn flew it safely from Fairbanks to Anchorage. I know

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<v Speaker 1>at this very moment some pilots are squirming in their seats,

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<v Speaker 1>so let me explain to the general public what these

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<v Speaker 1>pilots have explained to me. The odds of a small

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<v Speaker 1>plane suffering a mechanical failure actually go up after a

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<v Speaker 1>through inspection because everything gets jostled around, etcetera. But the

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<v Speaker 1>higher odds are still extremely low. So option B, whether

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<v Speaker 1>this is what most people believe brought down the plane, specifically,

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<v Speaker 1>ice turbulence seems less likely. It would have been most

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<v Speaker 1>severe in portage pass, but the plane apparently made it

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<v Speaker 1>through the pass through the worst of it, So again ice.

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<v Speaker 1>To be clear, there's zero doubt that icing conditions were

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<v Speaker 1>present that day. The weather was undeniably bad. But it's

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<v Speaker 1>important to explain a few things first. When you think

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<v Speaker 1>of a small plane icing up and crashing, what do

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<v Speaker 1>you picture? Do you see it freezing into an ice

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<v Speaker 1>cube and just falling out of the sky, Because if so,

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<v Speaker 1>that's not how it works. The real reason ice is

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<v Speaker 1>so dangerous, as Don himself pointed out in his article

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<v Speaker 1>Ice Without Fear, which ran the same month he disappeared,

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<v Speaker 1>is not the weight it adds. It's because ice can

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<v Speaker 1>interfere with airflow, making it hard, if not impossible, for

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<v Speaker 1>small planes to climb. So you risk losing altitude, stalling

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<v Speaker 1>and then eventually crashing. Second, why does nearly everyone believe

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<v Speaker 1>ice brought down the missing plane? There are two important

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<v Speaker 1>reasons here. No wreckage was ever found, so zero evidence

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<v Speaker 1>that everyone wants some explanation. And that brings me to

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<v Speaker 1>Don John's the pilot. He's an easy scapegoat. In Ice

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<v Speaker 1>Without Fear, which again was on news stands when the

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<v Speaker 1>plane disappeared, Don made several inflammatory comments, including quote, playing

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<v Speaker 1>with ice is like playing with the devil. Fun but

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<v Speaker 1>don't play unless you can cheat. But that's only a

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<v Speaker 1>single line. Read the whole article. Don was wicked, smart,

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<v Speaker 1>and a damn good pilot. He survived more than seventeen

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<v Speaker 1>thousand hours flying and often brutal Arctic conditions. Yes, he

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<v Speaker 1>was arrogant, but there's a difference between arrogance born of

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<v Speaker 1>inexperienced youth and arrogance born of actually being good at

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<v Speaker 1>what you do. Now, grizzled pilots like to say there

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<v Speaker 1>are old pilots and bold pilots, but no old bold pilots,

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<v Speaker 1>And there's some truth to that. If you take risks,

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<v Speaker 1>your odds of dying obviously go up to these old Timers.

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<v Speaker 1>Don is a very polarizing figure. They see him as

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<v Speaker 1>either a genius or a fool. And this polarization is

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<v Speaker 1>very important because when you can bind bad weather and

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<v Speaker 1>Don's article, conditions were right for Don to take the

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<v Speaker 1>fall for the cocky pilot who iced up and crashed

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<v Speaker 1>narrative to dominate, even though since no wreckage was ever found,

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<v Speaker 1>that theory, too, is based entirely on speculation. Furthermore, while

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<v Speaker 1>evaluating the ice theory, let's take a closer look at

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<v Speaker 1>weather conditions that a by Alaska standards, they were actually

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<v Speaker 1>pretty mild. The surface temperature along much of the plane's

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<v Speaker 1>route was in the forties, well above freezing, and in

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<v Speaker 1>the air the freezing level was at about five to

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<v Speaker 1>six thousand feet. What does this tell us For argument's sake,

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<v Speaker 1>Let's say Don did encounter moderate to severe icing conditions. First,

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<v Speaker 1>as an experienced pilot, he would have known quickly that

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<v Speaker 1>he was in trouble. Second, it's extremely unlikely, almost impossible,

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<v Speaker 1>that ice could have built up so quickly that it

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<v Speaker 1>caused the plane to suddenly plummet into the sea. If

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<v Speaker 1>Don was flying high enough and to accumulate a significant

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<v Speaker 1>amount of ice, that day he would have had to

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<v Speaker 1>have been he would have had time to descend into

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<v Speaker 1>warmer air. And even if he iced up while crossing

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<v Speaker 1>through Portage Pass, he still had seventy five miles ago

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<v Speaker 1>before reaching hnsin Brooke. He would have been over open

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<v Speaker 1>water most of the time. He had time to escape

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<v Speaker 1>into warmer air, and he had room. Now, let's look

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<v Speaker 1>at the plane itself, a twin engine Cessna three ten.

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<v Speaker 1>See the three ten is not intended to find icing

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<v Speaker 1>conditions for any extended period of time, no matter what. Regardless,

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<v Speaker 1>just because the three ten encounters icing conditions doesn't mean

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<v Speaker 1>it will automatically crash. So other than pilot experience, the

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<v Speaker 1>vital question is what kind of icing equipment did the

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<v Speaker 1>plane have. First, you have to delineate between anti ice

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<v Speaker 1>equipment and d ice equipment. Anti ice equipment helps prevent

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<v Speaker 1>ice build up, d ice equipment helps remove it. According

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<v Speaker 1>to the NTSB's final accident report, the missing plane had

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<v Speaker 1>only a single piece of icing equipment, a heated pet tube,

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<v Speaker 1>which is a device that prevents ice from interfering with

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<v Speaker 1>air speed measurements. Past that, the NTSB report states explicitly

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<v Speaker 1>that the plane had no other anti I equipment, and

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<v Speaker 1>it makes no mention of any d ice equipment either.

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<v Speaker 1>Since ice is most often cited as the reason the

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<v Speaker 1>plane crashed, this is extremely important. Now listen closely to

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm about to tell you, because to my knowledge,

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<v Speaker 1>nobody has ever reported it until now. There appeared to

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<v Speaker 1>be major errors in the NTSB report discrepancies and omissions.

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<v Speaker 1>Before I go on, let me credit Mike Travis, a

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<v Speaker 1>pilot based in Washington State who has extensive experience flying

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<v Speaker 1>in Alaska, as the first person to notice this. Mike

0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:40.680
<v Speaker 1>and I both obtained the missing planes airworthiness records from

0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:43.840
<v Speaker 1>the f a A. Mike also obtained copies of the

0:15:43.880 --> 0:15:48.240
<v Speaker 1>plane's original records from Cessna. In these records, we found

0:15:48.320 --> 0:15:52.520
<v Speaker 1>something fascinating. It appears that the missing plane was outfitted

0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:56.160
<v Speaker 1>with three pieces of anti ice and d ice equipment

0:15:56.400 --> 0:16:00.080
<v Speaker 1>that we're not mentioned in the NTSB accident report. This

0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:04.480
<v Speaker 1>is a huge deal. Specifically, Mike and I found documentation

0:16:04.600 --> 0:16:08.200
<v Speaker 1>that the plane had one pneumatic d ice boots on

0:16:08.280 --> 0:16:11.920
<v Speaker 1>both its wings and horizontal stabilizer part of its tail.

0:16:12.600 --> 0:16:15.360
<v Speaker 1>Pilots inflate d ice boots to crack ice off a

0:16:15.400 --> 0:16:19.360
<v Speaker 1>plane's airframe and allow wind to carry it away. Two

0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:24.040
<v Speaker 1>an alcohol based anti ice propeller system which pumps anti

0:16:24.120 --> 0:16:29.360
<v Speaker 1>ice fluid onto propeller blades, and three a d ice light.

0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:33.240
<v Speaker 1>According to Andrew Kalett, a Georgia based pilot who co

0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:36.960
<v Speaker 1>hosts the defense security podcast, d ice lights let you

0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:39.640
<v Speaker 1>light up the leading edge of wings at night to

0:16:39.680 --> 0:16:43.240
<v Speaker 1>see if you're picking up ice. So why did the

0:16:43.320 --> 0:16:47.640
<v Speaker 1>NTSB mentioned none of this? How did the NTSB missed

0:16:47.720 --> 0:16:51.360
<v Speaker 1>three pieces of anti ice and d ice equipment on

0:16:51.440 --> 0:16:54.920
<v Speaker 1>a plane presumed have been felled by ice. The most

0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:59.440
<v Speaker 1>generous explanation is gross negligence that d NTSB just missed

0:16:59.440 --> 0:17:03.200
<v Speaker 1>the equipment. It beyond that, it's possible that the icing

0:17:03.200 --> 0:17:07.920
<v Speaker 1>equipment was removed sometime before the plane disappeared, but if

0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:12.600
<v Speaker 1>it was removed, that should have been documented. Finally, it's

0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:16.000
<v Speaker 1>possible that the icing equipment was there but it didn't work.

0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:20.120
<v Speaker 1>It was inoperative, so the NTSB just didn't mention it.

0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:23.679
<v Speaker 1>But the NTSB did mention a different system on the

0:17:23.720 --> 0:17:27.439
<v Speaker 1>plane that was functional but inoperative, an oxygen system that

0:17:27.480 --> 0:17:31.000
<v Speaker 1>worked but had not been serviced with oxygen. So even

0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:34.640
<v Speaker 1>if the plane had an operative icing equipment, the NTSB

0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:38.600
<v Speaker 1>should have mentioned it, as it did with the oxygen system.

0:17:38.640 --> 0:17:42.280
<v Speaker 1>For clarification, I called Phil Hewith, the mechanic who worked

0:17:42.280 --> 0:17:45.359
<v Speaker 1>on the missing plane the day before it disappeared. Phil

0:17:45.400 --> 0:17:48.800
<v Speaker 1>remembers that at the very least, the plane did have

0:17:49.000 --> 0:17:52.680
<v Speaker 1>functioning d ice boots, meaning not only were they not removed,

0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:58.680
<v Speaker 1>but they worked to recap According to FAA records, CESSNA records,

0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:03.160
<v Speaker 1>and Phil Hewith, the missing plane apparently had three pieces

0:18:03.160 --> 0:18:06.919
<v Speaker 1>of icing equipment not included in the NTSB accident report.

0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:11.080
<v Speaker 1>Why did the NTSB exclude this equipment, I don't know,

0:18:11.760 --> 0:18:15.239
<v Speaker 1>but by not including it, the NTSB helped further the

0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:18.720
<v Speaker 1>iced up and crashed narrative, the narrative that most people

0:18:18.840 --> 0:18:22.800
<v Speaker 1>to this day still believe. Now. The fact that the

0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:26.280
<v Speaker 1>plane had this extra equipment does not mean it's impossible

0:18:26.320 --> 0:18:28.880
<v Speaker 1>that it iceed up and crashed. It means it's less

0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:33.120
<v Speaker 1>likely the extra equipment should have bought Don John's, the pilot,

0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:36.600
<v Speaker 1>at least an additional five to ten minutes to escape

0:18:36.680 --> 0:18:41.560
<v Speaker 1>into better conditions and or warmer air. All together, when

0:18:41.560 --> 0:18:47.040
<v Speaker 1>you combine Don's experience, mild temperatures, and extra unreported icing

0:18:47.040 --> 0:18:50.680
<v Speaker 1>equipment not cited by the NTSB, the ice up and

0:18:50.760 --> 0:18:54.520
<v Speaker 1>crash theory seems much less likely today than at any

0:18:54.560 --> 0:19:24.680
<v Speaker 1>point in the last fifty years. So I've examined two

0:19:24.720 --> 0:19:29.200
<v Speaker 1>possible explanations for why the plane crashed, mechanical failure and weather.

0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:34.040
<v Speaker 1>What about the others options? See? Is pilot error? Now,

0:19:34.359 --> 0:19:38.119
<v Speaker 1>Dawn was very smart and very experienced, but that doesn't

0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:41.080
<v Speaker 1>rule out pilot error. It just means it's less likely.

0:19:41.760 --> 0:19:45.000
<v Speaker 1>For argument's sake, let's say pilot error did play a

0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:48.760
<v Speaker 1>role here. There are many possible scenarios, and we can't

0:19:48.800 --> 0:19:52.560
<v Speaker 1>examine them all but one, perhaps the likeliest, is that

0:19:52.680 --> 0:19:56.200
<v Speaker 1>Dawn flew too low and slammed into a mountain or glacier.

0:19:56.880 --> 0:20:00.600
<v Speaker 1>But this doesn't make sense. Remember when US has heard

0:20:00.640 --> 0:20:04.919
<v Speaker 1>a plane, probably this plane pass over Whittier, and beyond

0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:09.600
<v Speaker 1>Whittier it's mostly open water until hension brooke. That leaves

0:20:09.640 --> 0:20:13.160
<v Speaker 1>us with option D, the black Swan event, a bomb

0:20:13.400 --> 0:20:19.360
<v Speaker 1>or something else unexpected and extreme. Seven. Was the plane bombed?

0:20:19.920 --> 0:20:24.720
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. Eight? Could the plane have been bombed? Yes,

0:20:25.359 --> 0:20:28.920
<v Speaker 1>how maybe with the bomb triggered by a barometric pressure

0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:33.240
<v Speaker 1>or a timer or a radio receiver. The possibilities are endless.

0:20:33.760 --> 0:20:36.919
<v Speaker 1>Where would you hide it? Probably in the tail compartment.

0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:40.959
<v Speaker 1>Why would anyone bomb it? Well, that gets the motive

0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:46.360
<v Speaker 1>that gets to Jerry Paisley and his claims. Nine do

0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:51.000
<v Speaker 1>you think Jerry Paisley lied? I think there's a strong

0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:54.639
<v Speaker 1>possibility that he did tell the truth, at least in part.

0:20:55.160 --> 0:20:57.960
<v Speaker 1>And I'm not alone in that opinion. The three members

0:20:58.000 --> 0:21:01.320
<v Speaker 1>of law enforcement and the NBC producer who interviewed him

0:21:01.440 --> 0:21:04.920
<v Speaker 1>all agree with me. Look, if I thought everything Paisley

0:21:04.920 --> 0:21:07.720
<v Speaker 1>said was bullshit, I would tell you. I'm not here

0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:09.879
<v Speaker 1>to lie to you. I'm here to tell the truth

0:21:10.160 --> 0:21:12.760
<v Speaker 1>to the best of my ability. I've tried to keep

0:21:12.800 --> 0:21:15.600
<v Speaker 1>speculation to a minimum. I want you to make up

0:21:15.640 --> 0:21:18.880
<v Speaker 1>your own mind. But come on, you mean to tell

0:21:18.920 --> 0:21:22.800
<v Speaker 1>me that one year after congressman vanished, by pure coincidence,

0:21:23.119 --> 0:21:26.400
<v Speaker 1>his widows stumbled into a mobster, married him. And by

0:21:26.440 --> 0:21:29.480
<v Speaker 1>the way, this guy murdered five or six people, bombed

0:21:29.520 --> 0:21:32.400
<v Speaker 1>a judge's house, and had close ties to two prominent

0:21:32.440 --> 0:21:37.440
<v Speaker 1>mafia families. For argument's sake, okay, chalk it up to coincidence.

0:21:37.920 --> 0:21:42.720
<v Speaker 1>Twenty years after this coincidence, this guy, Jerry Paisley, tells

0:21:42.800 --> 0:21:46.679
<v Speaker 1>law enforcement a shocking story. He claims that Peggy Begett

0:21:46.840 --> 0:21:49.679
<v Speaker 1>met with mob boss Joe Bonano in Tucson in the

0:21:49.720 --> 0:21:53.520
<v Speaker 1>summer of nineteen seventy two, right before her husband, Congressman

0:21:53.600 --> 0:21:58.320
<v Speaker 1>Nick Beggett, disappeared. He claims that shortly thereafter, a Banano

0:21:58.400 --> 0:22:02.119
<v Speaker 1>lieutenant named Joe I Trolla or Joey the I asked

0:22:02.200 --> 0:22:05.159
<v Speaker 1>him to fly a suitcase to Anchorage. He claims he

0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:08.600
<v Speaker 1>did fly a suitcase to Anchorage. He claims that two men,

0:22:08.920 --> 0:22:11.720
<v Speaker 1>Danny Zivanich and Jean Fowler, picked him up at the

0:22:11.720 --> 0:22:14.720
<v Speaker 1>Anchorage airport, and that later that night the three of

0:22:14.760 --> 0:22:17.760
<v Speaker 1>them met up with Jean's brother Larry. He claims that

0:22:17.920 --> 0:22:21.520
<v Speaker 1>after he, Peggy and Zivinich went into business in nineteen

0:22:21.560 --> 0:22:25.199
<v Speaker 1>seventy four, Zivinas told him that Peggy owed him because

0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:29.440
<v Speaker 1>he quote blew her old man out of the sky. Now,

0:22:29.640 --> 0:22:33.840
<v Speaker 1>what of Paisley's story? Can we prove? Paisley did marry

0:22:33.840 --> 0:22:38.480
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Baggage. Paisley and Peggy did go into business with Zivinage.

0:22:39.200 --> 0:22:43.000
<v Speaker 1>Paisley did have close ties to to mob families, the

0:22:43.000 --> 0:22:47.159
<v Speaker 1>Bananas and the Lick of Olie's. Paisley did murder people

0:22:47.440 --> 0:22:51.520
<v Speaker 1>and conduct bombings. The rest I'm not a hundred percent sure,

0:22:52.160 --> 0:22:56.720
<v Speaker 1>but if Paisley's claims are true, if I'd speculate the

0:22:56.760 --> 0:23:01.320
<v Speaker 1>following things. One, Jean and Larry four were bit players.

0:23:01.840 --> 0:23:03.960
<v Speaker 1>Jeane was paid to pick up Paisley at the airport

0:23:04.040 --> 0:23:06.800
<v Speaker 1>and not ask questions, and the three men just hung

0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:10.879
<v Speaker 1>out that night with Larry. Two Joeyah Tarrola was also

0:23:10.960 --> 0:23:14.879
<v Speaker 1>a bit player. He ran an errand for his boss. Three.

0:23:15.080 --> 0:23:17.480
<v Speaker 1>Paisley knew more than he led on, but he was

0:23:17.560 --> 0:23:22.080
<v Speaker 1>still mostly a bit player. Four. As for Danny Zivinag,

0:23:22.320 --> 0:23:25.360
<v Speaker 1>he's a cipher. I don't know much about him. He

0:23:25.400 --> 0:23:28.719
<v Speaker 1>was in the military, moved to Alaska and was a bartender.

0:23:29.280 --> 0:23:32.080
<v Speaker 1>Next thing you know, he owns fifty of Max Inc.

0:23:32.320 --> 0:23:36.720
<v Speaker 1>The company he started with Peggy and Paisley. Five. The

0:23:36.760 --> 0:23:40.200
<v Speaker 1>Mob would have gotten involved for one of two reasons. First,

0:23:40.320 --> 0:23:43.280
<v Speaker 1>there's always a direct payment. Give us money, We'll give

0:23:43.320 --> 0:23:46.000
<v Speaker 1>you a bomb. Second, and I think this is more

0:23:46.080 --> 0:23:49.600
<v Speaker 1>likely if Peggy won nick seat and she did run

0:23:49.680 --> 0:23:52.680
<v Speaker 1>for it, the mob would have had Alaska's only congress

0:23:52.720 --> 0:23:55.640
<v Speaker 1>person in its back pocket. During a gold rush time,

0:23:55.960 --> 0:23:58.919
<v Speaker 1>the oil boom, when there were moves and money to

0:23:59.000 --> 0:24:02.359
<v Speaker 1>be made. You could ask well, why go through all

0:24:02.400 --> 0:24:06.480
<v Speaker 1>that trouble? Why not bribe or blackmail Nick Baggage instead?

0:24:07.080 --> 0:24:10.400
<v Speaker 1>And my answer would be that every single person I've interviewed,

0:24:10.480 --> 0:24:13.600
<v Speaker 1>and I mean every person, said Nick was clean and

0:24:13.640 --> 0:24:16.399
<v Speaker 1>a man of integrity. I don't think he could be

0:24:16.480 --> 0:24:21.080
<v Speaker 1>bought off or blackmailed. Six If the plane was bombed,

0:24:21.240 --> 0:24:24.280
<v Speaker 1>why do it with hail bogs on board? To that,

0:24:24.440 --> 0:24:27.480
<v Speaker 1>I'd say, if someone bombed the plane, they would have

0:24:27.520 --> 0:24:30.040
<v Speaker 1>had the factor in the likelihood that wreckage would be

0:24:30.119 --> 0:24:33.560
<v Speaker 1>found and a bomb identified as the cause of the crash.

0:24:33.840 --> 0:24:37.000
<v Speaker 1>And then who would everyone pinpoint as the target, the

0:24:37.119 --> 0:24:41.240
<v Speaker 1>nerdy first term congressman from Alaska or the House Majority

0:24:41.320 --> 0:24:45.320
<v Speaker 1>leader who served on the Warrant Commission seven? Why would

0:24:45.359 --> 0:24:49.800
<v Speaker 1>Peggy get involved? Though her son Tom denies it, multiple

0:24:49.840 --> 0:24:52.520
<v Speaker 1>people told me that Peggy's marriage to Nick was strained,

0:24:52.760 --> 0:24:56.600
<v Speaker 1>that they were separated and considering a divorce. Peggy met

0:24:56.680 --> 0:24:59.400
<v Speaker 1>Nick in Minnesota when Nick was a young twenties something

0:24:59.520 --> 0:25:03.320
<v Speaker 1>high school teacher, her high school teacher. They got married,

0:25:03.600 --> 0:25:06.560
<v Speaker 1>moved to Alaska, had six kids, and then Nick was

0:25:06.640 --> 0:25:10.240
<v Speaker 1>gone most of the time. Working documents show that Peggy

0:25:10.280 --> 0:25:15.440
<v Speaker 1>got about a million dollars in today's dollars after Nick disappeared. Eight.

0:25:15.960 --> 0:25:20.000
<v Speaker 1>Even if Paisley told the truth, it's possible Peggy did

0:25:20.000 --> 0:25:23.040
<v Speaker 1>not know what she was getting herself into. She could

0:25:23.080 --> 0:25:27.920
<v Speaker 1>have been manipulated and used. Nine. Paisley might have told

0:25:27.960 --> 0:25:31.240
<v Speaker 1>the truth in part. It might not be so simple

0:25:31.320 --> 0:25:34.960
<v Speaker 1>as he lied or he told the truth. Maybe he

0:25:35.080 --> 0:25:39.679
<v Speaker 1>told part of the truth. And this leads me to

0:25:39.760 --> 0:25:43.480
<v Speaker 1>an interesting theory. When I sat down with Tom Davis,

0:25:43.520 --> 0:25:46.800
<v Speaker 1>the Arizona investigator who observed Paisley's wedding to Peggy in

0:25:46.840 --> 0:25:51.880
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy four and interviewed Paisley in he pointed out

0:25:51.960 --> 0:25:56.080
<v Speaker 1>something interesting in the red dot photos, the Peggy Paisley

0:25:56.080 --> 0:25:59.920
<v Speaker 1>wedding photos. Every person connected to organized crime is tie

0:26:00.320 --> 0:26:04.600
<v Speaker 1>primarily to the lick of OLiS, not the bananas. Heck,

0:26:04.720 --> 0:26:08.040
<v Speaker 1>even Pete Lackavoli Jr. Himself is there, but none of

0:26:08.040 --> 0:26:12.679
<v Speaker 1>the bananas. In addition, the Conti Qui, where Paisley claimed

0:26:12.680 --> 0:26:15.880
<v Speaker 1>Peggy met with Joe Bonano, was owned, at least in part,

0:26:16.320 --> 0:26:18.919
<v Speaker 1>not by the bananas but by the lick of OLiS.

0:26:19.720 --> 0:26:24.200
<v Speaker 1>Also in nineteen seventy four, Joeya Tarola or Joey the I,

0:26:24.840 --> 0:26:28.640
<v Speaker 1>the man who allegedly gave Paisley the suitcase filled with explosives,

0:26:29.119 --> 0:26:32.320
<v Speaker 1>was secretly photographed at a Tucson golf tournament with two

0:26:32.400 --> 0:26:38.360
<v Speaker 1>of Paisley's friends, Sal Spinelli and Pete Likavoli Jr. Finally,

0:26:38.720 --> 0:26:43.240
<v Speaker 1>in FBI records, I found something very interesting. An FBI

0:26:43.359 --> 0:26:47.800
<v Speaker 1>memo dated October six, nineteen seventy two, only ten days

0:26:47.880 --> 0:26:51.840
<v Speaker 1>before the congressman disappeared, states that Jerry Paisley was spotted

0:26:51.840 --> 0:26:55.520
<v Speaker 1>in September nineteen seventy two, around the same time he

0:26:55.600 --> 0:26:59.879
<v Speaker 1>claimed to have transported explosives to Anchorage with Pete Likavoli Sr.

0:27:00.240 --> 0:27:03.480
<v Speaker 1>The Big Boss. Here's part of the memo with the

0:27:03.480 --> 0:27:08.679
<v Speaker 1>word blank substituted in for redacted sections. Quote source advised

0:27:08.680 --> 0:27:12.520
<v Speaker 1>that on nine, nineteen seventy two, Jerry Max Paisley and

0:27:12.560 --> 0:27:15.879
<v Speaker 1>Pete Lookavoli Senior had been in the Hilton Inn bar together.

0:27:16.600 --> 0:27:19.200
<v Speaker 1>During the time they were in the bar, they blank.

0:27:19.760 --> 0:27:22.640
<v Speaker 1>Source stated that she had heard that Paisley was presently

0:27:22.680 --> 0:27:27.359
<v Speaker 1>residing at the Hilton Inn motel. End quote. And there's

0:27:27.359 --> 0:27:32.040
<v Speaker 1>a second FBI memo quote On September twenty one, nineteen

0:27:32.119 --> 0:27:36.520
<v Speaker 1>seventy two, p x T DASH two advised that on Blank,

0:27:37.000 --> 0:27:40.399
<v Speaker 1>Jerry Max Paisley and Pete Lookavoli Senor had been in

0:27:40.440 --> 0:27:43.440
<v Speaker 1>the Hilton Inn bar together. During the time that they

0:27:43.440 --> 0:27:46.520
<v Speaker 1>were in the bar together, they were also joined by blank.

0:27:47.160 --> 0:27:50.520
<v Speaker 1>Source stated he had heard that Paisley was presently residing

0:27:50.600 --> 0:27:55.280
<v Speaker 1>at the Hilton Inn motel end quote. So, per two

0:27:55.440 --> 0:28:00.280
<v Speaker 1>FBI memos, Jerry Paisley was observed with Pete Lackavoli year

0:28:00.600 --> 0:28:05.360
<v Speaker 1>in Tucsson on September nineteenth, nineteen seventy two, only twenty

0:28:05.400 --> 0:28:10.080
<v Speaker 1>seven days before the congressman disappeared again. Paisley claimed that

0:28:10.119 --> 0:28:14.639
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Beggett visited Tusson sometime around August nineteen seventy two,

0:28:14.840 --> 0:28:17.720
<v Speaker 1>and that about two weeks later he transported a lock

0:28:17.840 --> 0:28:22.560
<v Speaker 1>suitcase with explosives to Anchorage. So why would Paisley blame

0:28:22.640 --> 0:28:26.120
<v Speaker 1>the bananas instead of the lick of OLiS. I don't know.

0:28:26.880 --> 0:28:29.800
<v Speaker 1>Maybe he wanted to protect them, Maybe he wanted to

0:28:29.800 --> 0:28:34.840
<v Speaker 1>protect himself by changing key details. At this point, let

0:28:34.840 --> 0:28:37.480
<v Speaker 1>me pause because I need to correct an error I

0:28:37.520 --> 0:28:41.520
<v Speaker 1>made in two previous episodes. In episodes four and eight,

0:28:41.800 --> 0:28:45.480
<v Speaker 1>I stated that Peggy Beggett and Jerry Paisley were accompanied

0:28:45.480 --> 0:28:48.520
<v Speaker 1>on their honeymoon to Mexico in nineteen seventy four by

0:28:48.560 --> 0:28:52.320
<v Speaker 1>Pete lick of Ol Jr. And his wife Cathy. That's incorrect.

0:28:52.880 --> 0:28:57.400
<v Speaker 1>Cathy is Pete's sister, not his wife. So my correction

0:28:57.480 --> 0:29:01.200
<v Speaker 1>is this. Peggy Beggett and Jerry pay Easily were accompanied

0:29:01.200 --> 0:29:04.040
<v Speaker 1>in March nineteen seventy four on their honeymoon to Mexico

0:29:04.440 --> 0:29:07.320
<v Speaker 1>by Pete lack of Ole Jr. And his sister Cathy

0:29:07.880 --> 0:29:37.800
<v Speaker 1>two of mob boss Pete look Ofoly seniors children ten.

0:29:38.440 --> 0:29:41.440
<v Speaker 1>Whether or not his claims are true, why did Paisley

0:29:41.440 --> 0:29:44.360
<v Speaker 1>make them at all? Why did he speak to law enforcement?

0:29:44.960 --> 0:29:48.320
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. However, I've said it before and I'll

0:29:48.320 --> 0:29:52.200
<v Speaker 1>say it again. It is possible Paisley just lied. Maybe

0:29:52.200 --> 0:29:55.440
<v Speaker 1>there's no good reason why. Maybe he was just an asshole.

0:29:56.080 --> 0:29:58.920
<v Speaker 1>But beyond lying for the fun of it, I struggled

0:29:58.920 --> 0:30:01.640
<v Speaker 1>to see any logic a reason why he would make

0:30:01.720 --> 0:30:04.800
<v Speaker 1>these claims if they were false. He got no time

0:30:04.800 --> 0:30:08.880
<v Speaker 1>off his sentence, no media attention, no money, and he

0:30:08.920 --> 0:30:12.680
<v Speaker 1>did not express a boiling hatred of Peggy Baggage. In fact,

0:30:12.840 --> 0:30:16.160
<v Speaker 1>if you read the transcript, even Paisley speculates that she

0:30:16.200 --> 0:30:19.800
<v Speaker 1>didn't really know what she got herself into. In an email,

0:30:20.120 --> 0:30:23.520
<v Speaker 1>Tom Beggatt told me, quote, my family is wearied by

0:30:23.520 --> 0:30:26.160
<v Speaker 1>the things people like Jerry have said for their moment

0:30:26.240 --> 0:30:30.200
<v Speaker 1>of fame or notoriety. End quote. But to Tom, I'd

0:30:30.240 --> 0:30:35.520
<v Speaker 1>ask this, what fame? What notoriety? Paisley spoke about this

0:30:35.600 --> 0:30:38.760
<v Speaker 1>with one journalist before he died. He did not embark

0:30:38.800 --> 0:30:43.040
<v Speaker 1>on a publicity campaign. Paisley even asked his biographer Sean

0:30:43.080 --> 0:30:46.840
<v Speaker 1>Atwood to use a pseudonym after he died, and in

0:30:47.040 --> 0:30:50.680
<v Speaker 1>Atwood's book The Mafia Philosopher, there's no mention of the

0:30:50.720 --> 0:30:54.280
<v Speaker 1>alleged bombing, something you'd figure Paisley would want if he

0:30:54.400 --> 0:30:59.720
<v Speaker 1>craved fame. Finally, if what he wanted was fame and glory,

0:30:59.720 --> 0:31:03.880
<v Speaker 1>why would Paisley downplay his role, Because in the bombing narrative,

0:31:04.120 --> 0:31:07.880
<v Speaker 1>he's not some badass mob guy. He's a glorified delivery

0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:14.160
<v Speaker 1>man who flew a suitcase from Tucson to Anchorage. Past speculation,

0:31:14.760 --> 0:31:18.160
<v Speaker 1>is there anything that backs up paisley story, even parts

0:31:18.160 --> 0:31:22.920
<v Speaker 1>of it? In short? Maybe Paisley told investigators that when

0:31:22.920 --> 0:31:27.000
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Begetts visited Tucson around August nineteen seventy two, he

0:31:27.160 --> 0:31:29.200
<v Speaker 1>used a fake name to book her a room at

0:31:29.240 --> 0:31:33.120
<v Speaker 1>the Spanish Trail Motel. In the FBI records I obtained,

0:31:33.400 --> 0:31:38.239
<v Speaker 1>there are conveniently multiple memos detailing where Paisley lived at

0:31:38.400 --> 0:31:42.720
<v Speaker 1>various points during the summer of nineteen seventy two. June one,

0:31:42.920 --> 0:31:48.400
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy two, the Thailand's Motel August eighteen, nineteen seventy two,

0:31:48.760 --> 0:31:53.520
<v Speaker 1>the Spanish Trail Motel September twenty one, nineteen seventy two,

0:31:53.880 --> 0:31:57.640
<v Speaker 1>the Hilton Inn. So the FBI records document that not

0:31:57.720 --> 0:32:00.280
<v Speaker 1>only did Paisley live at the Spanish Trail Mode Tell

0:32:00.320 --> 0:32:04.320
<v Speaker 1>in August nineteen seventy two, when Peggy Baggage allegedly stayed there,

0:32:04.680 --> 0:32:09.720
<v Speaker 1>but also that Paisley moved frequently. So if Paisley lied,

0:32:10.000 --> 0:32:13.160
<v Speaker 1>he had an amazing ability twenty four years later to

0:32:13.240 --> 0:32:16.320
<v Speaker 1>remember exactly where he lived during one month in the

0:32:16.320 --> 0:32:19.440
<v Speaker 1>summer of nineteen seventy two, so that he could incorporate

0:32:19.480 --> 0:32:23.920
<v Speaker 1>that detail into his lie twelve. Did you find anything

0:32:23.920 --> 0:32:29.760
<v Speaker 1>else in the FBI records? Yes, and it's weird again.

0:32:29.960 --> 0:32:32.720
<v Speaker 1>Let me read you part of an FBI memo using

0:32:32.760 --> 0:32:37.400
<v Speaker 1>the word blank for redacted sections. Quote on August twenty three,

0:32:37.560 --> 0:32:41.600
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy two Blank telephone. Blank advised that he had

0:32:41.640 --> 0:32:45.080
<v Speaker 1>received information from his Blank that during the early part

0:32:45.120 --> 0:32:48.200
<v Speaker 1>of August nineteen seventy two, Blank had told her that

0:32:48.240 --> 0:32:50.320
<v Speaker 1>he had been brought to the Tucson area by the

0:32:50.360 --> 0:32:53.440
<v Speaker 1>chief of the FBI in New Orleans. He stated that

0:32:53.480 --> 0:32:56.200
<v Speaker 1>this trip had been made on an FBI jet aircraft

0:32:56.520 --> 0:32:59.960
<v Speaker 1>and at several other agents, possibly from the Albuquerque area,

0:33:00.360 --> 0:33:03.160
<v Speaker 1>had a companied Blank and the agent from New Orleans.

0:33:03.680 --> 0:33:06.400
<v Speaker 1>Blank stated that he was told by Blank that upon

0:33:06.480 --> 0:33:10.160
<v Speaker 1>their arrival at Tucson, all of the individuals interviewed Jerry

0:33:10.160 --> 0:33:13.280
<v Speaker 1>Paisley at the airport, and that Paisley had been taken

0:33:13.320 --> 0:33:17.440
<v Speaker 1>to the airport by local Tucson FBI agents end quote.

0:33:18.120 --> 0:33:21.840
<v Speaker 1>So here in an FBI memo we have an allegation

0:33:22.040 --> 0:33:25.000
<v Speaker 1>that Jerry Paisley was taken to the Tucson airport in

0:33:25.080 --> 0:33:30.320
<v Speaker 1>early August nineteen seventy two and interviewed by FBI agents.

0:33:31.560 --> 0:33:35.760
<v Speaker 1>Does the idea of the plane being bombed make any sense? Yes,

0:33:36.480 --> 0:33:39.400
<v Speaker 1>here's what we know. The missing plane likely made it

0:33:39.400 --> 0:33:42.840
<v Speaker 1>through Portage Pass within five to fifteen minutes. It would

0:33:42.840 --> 0:33:45.920
<v Speaker 1>have been within range of the radio relay at Johnstone Point.

0:33:46.400 --> 0:33:50.239
<v Speaker 1>But the pilot Don John's never radioed in again. So,

0:33:50.280 --> 0:33:53.400
<v Speaker 1>as far as I can tell, something catastrophic and sudden

0:33:53.560 --> 0:33:56.160
<v Speaker 1>caused the plane to crash. I've told you why. I

0:33:56.200 --> 0:34:00.400
<v Speaker 1>think mechanical failure and pilot error are unlikely. So what

0:34:00.520 --> 0:34:05.040
<v Speaker 1>does that leave fourteen? Aren't you reading too much into this?

0:34:05.560 --> 0:34:08.879
<v Speaker 1>The simplest explanations still is that the plane iced up

0:34:08.880 --> 0:34:12.799
<v Speaker 1>and crashed. The weather was bad that day. Yes, the

0:34:12.800 --> 0:34:17.040
<v Speaker 1>weather was bad, But let's do an exercise. Let's say

0:34:17.080 --> 0:34:19.080
<v Speaker 1>you put a bomb in my trunk and I drive

0:34:19.120 --> 0:34:22.600
<v Speaker 1>off a cliff during a blizzard. Nobody finds me. Does

0:34:22.640 --> 0:34:24.279
<v Speaker 1>the fact that I drove off a cliff in a

0:34:24.320 --> 0:34:29.359
<v Speaker 1>blizzard mean the bomb wasn't in my trunk? Aren't you

0:34:29.440 --> 0:34:33.960
<v Speaker 1>being extremely unfair to Peggy begat in my opinion? No.

0:34:34.760 --> 0:34:37.760
<v Speaker 1>I gave Miss Baggett and her family plenty of opportunities

0:34:37.800 --> 0:34:40.439
<v Speaker 1>to tell their side of the story. Except for Tom

0:34:40.440 --> 0:34:44.840
<v Speaker 1>Beggatt's emails, they declined to answer any questions, and Charles

0:34:44.840 --> 0:34:48.960
<v Speaker 1>wolf Fourth, their friend, the author who investigated Paisley's claims

0:34:49.000 --> 0:34:52.880
<v Speaker 1>but never published them, posted a message with multiple inaccuracies

0:34:52.880 --> 0:34:56.040
<v Speaker 1>on Facebook last year warning people not to work with me.

0:34:56.760 --> 0:34:59.240
<v Speaker 1>I still want to tell Peggy side of the story.

0:34:59.680 --> 0:35:02.760
<v Speaker 1>She always has an open invitation to do an interview.

0:35:03.239 --> 0:35:06.000
<v Speaker 1>The Beggage is probably figured it was wise not to

0:35:06.080 --> 0:35:09.520
<v Speaker 1>speak with me to deny the story oxygen and hey,

0:35:09.680 --> 0:35:13.040
<v Speaker 1>it worked to some degree. As of this recording, no

0:35:13.200 --> 0:35:16.839
<v Speaker 1>media in Alaska except the Fairbanks Daily News Miner has

0:35:16.880 --> 0:35:21.560
<v Speaker 1>reported this story. Still, it's especially egregious, in my opinion,

0:35:21.960 --> 0:35:24.880
<v Speaker 1>that the Anchorage Daily News hasn't covered it at all.

0:35:25.840 --> 0:35:31.600
<v Speaker 1>Six So what now? Two things? First, the FBI should

0:35:31.600 --> 0:35:35.920
<v Speaker 1>reopen its investigation into Jerry Paisley's claims. There are people

0:35:35.960 --> 0:35:40.239
<v Speaker 1>alive who have answers. It's not too late. Also, the

0:35:40.280 --> 0:35:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Bureau should examine how the case was handled in the

0:35:43.000 --> 0:35:47.680
<v Speaker 1>nineteen nineties. Second, someone should conduct a full search for

0:35:47.719 --> 0:35:51.320
<v Speaker 1>the plane in and around port Edges where Bob Martinson

0:35:51.360 --> 0:35:55.960
<v Speaker 1>found the tailpiece. We searched, but obviously we don't have

0:35:56.040 --> 0:36:00.320
<v Speaker 1>the resources of say the federal government or James camp Rent.

0:36:00.719 --> 0:36:03.920
<v Speaker 1>Now we could go back with more equipment, So if

0:36:03.920 --> 0:36:07.200
<v Speaker 1>you're listening and you want to fund another search, email

0:36:07.320 --> 0:36:11.200
<v Speaker 1>us seriously. If we go back to Port Uches. In

0:36:11.239 --> 0:36:14.640
<v Speaker 1>addition to r o v s or remotely operated vehicles,

0:36:14.680 --> 0:36:18.680
<v Speaker 1>we need at least three other things, a magnetometer, a

0:36:18.760 --> 0:36:23.080
<v Speaker 1>toe behind metal detector, and side scan sonar. A magnetometer

0:36:23.120 --> 0:36:26.480
<v Speaker 1>would allow us to detect certain metals ferris metals like

0:36:26.600 --> 0:36:30.520
<v Speaker 1>iron and steel, but not aluminum. It would allow us

0:36:30.520 --> 0:36:33.040
<v Speaker 1>to search for parts of the plane like the engines.

0:36:33.719 --> 0:36:36.600
<v Speaker 1>A toe behind metal detector, on the other hand, would

0:36:36.640 --> 0:36:40.040
<v Speaker 1>allow us to detect aluminum, and side scan sonar would

0:36:40.040 --> 0:36:43.600
<v Speaker 1>allow us to look at the sea floor. With this equipment,

0:36:43.960 --> 0:36:47.239
<v Speaker 1>if the baggage box plane is in port edges, there's

0:36:47.280 --> 0:36:51.040
<v Speaker 1>a good chance we could find it. Regardless of what

0:36:51.200 --> 0:36:54.480
<v Speaker 1>comes of this show, whether or not the FBI reopens

0:36:54.520 --> 0:36:58.000
<v Speaker 1>its investigation or another search is conducted in Port Uches,

0:36:58.440 --> 0:37:01.520
<v Speaker 1>I will continue to investigate new leads, and we are

0:37:01.600 --> 0:37:05.560
<v Speaker 1>getting them every day. For now, though, this is a

0:37:05.640 --> 0:37:09.600
<v Speaker 1>story with no ending, but even stories with no ending

0:37:09.960 --> 0:37:17.960
<v Speaker 1>deserve to be told. But wait, only a few days

0:37:17.960 --> 0:37:22.239
<v Speaker 1>ago after we finalize this episode, we got some startling

0:37:22.280 --> 0:37:25.560
<v Speaker 1>new information. So even though this was supposed to be

0:37:25.600 --> 0:37:29.520
<v Speaker 1>our final episode, we'll be back. However, at this point

0:37:29.880 --> 0:37:32.960
<v Speaker 1>we're reporting the story in real time, meaning we can't

0:37:32.960 --> 0:37:41.360
<v Speaker 1>publish every week. Stay tuned. No task this week. Instead,

0:37:41.840 --> 0:37:45.920
<v Speaker 1>Questions for the Alaska news media, especially the Anchorage Daily News.

0:37:46.600 --> 0:37:49.279
<v Speaker 1>How long can you ignore the story? When will you

0:37:49.320 --> 0:37:53.319
<v Speaker 1>report it? And why haven't you reported it? Ever? You

0:37:53.360 --> 0:37:56.000
<v Speaker 1>can reach us by phone at one eight three three

0:37:56.480 --> 0:38:00.520
<v Speaker 1>m I A Tips. That's one eight three three six

0:38:00.560 --> 0:38:05.359
<v Speaker 1>four two eight four seven seven again one eight three

0:38:05.440 --> 0:38:09.920
<v Speaker 1>three six four two eight four seven seven, Or you

0:38:09.920 --> 0:38:13.080
<v Speaker 1>can reach us via email at tips at iHeart media

0:38:13.160 --> 0:38:16.799
<v Speaker 1>dot com. That's tips, T I P s at I

0:38:16.960 --> 0:38:20.920
<v Speaker 1>heeart media dot com. And you've already been very helpful.

0:38:21.360 --> 0:38:24.319
<v Speaker 1>Among other things, you helped us find Joe Tatum, the

0:38:24.400 --> 0:38:27.600
<v Speaker 1>last man alive who heard the bizarre radio transmission the

0:38:27.719 --> 0:38:31.080
<v Speaker 1>day of the plane vanished. You helped us find Alex Dressler,

0:38:31.360 --> 0:38:35.080
<v Speaker 1>the reporter who observed Peggy and Paisley's wedding. Dressler did

0:38:35.080 --> 0:38:39.480
<v Speaker 1>not respond to interview requests regardless, thanks to Michael Knacka

0:38:39.560 --> 0:38:43.319
<v Speaker 1>for helping us find him. Finally, you also helped us

0:38:43.360 --> 0:38:46.200
<v Speaker 1>figure out that the photo everyone thought was the last

0:38:46.239 --> 0:38:49.360
<v Speaker 1>known photo of the missing congressman is actually not the

0:38:49.440 --> 0:38:53.600
<v Speaker 1>last known photo of them. There are others. Unfortunately, the

0:38:53.640 --> 0:38:56.600
<v Speaker 1>photographer who did take the final known photos did not

0:38:56.719 --> 0:39:01.000
<v Speaker 1>respond to interview requests. An important note, none of the

0:39:01.040 --> 0:39:04.200
<v Speaker 1>people Jerry Paisley claimed took part in or had knowledge

0:39:04.239 --> 0:39:09.200
<v Speaker 1>of the alleged bombing. Joe Banano, joeyat Tarrola, Danny Zevinich,

0:39:09.600 --> 0:39:13.960
<v Speaker 1>Gene Fowler, Larry Fowler, or Peggy Begat where ever charged

0:39:13.960 --> 0:39:16.920
<v Speaker 1>with or convicted of any crimes tied to any of

0:39:16.920 --> 0:39:22.360
<v Speaker 1>Paisley's allegations. Peggy Begat and Danny Zevenich declined multiple interview requests.

0:39:22.760 --> 0:39:26.960
<v Speaker 1>Gene Fowler was unavailable for an interview. Joe Banano, joeyat Trolla,

0:39:27.120 --> 0:39:30.640
<v Speaker 1>and Larry Fowler are dead. Pete Lacavoli Jr. And Mike

0:39:30.719 --> 0:39:34.359
<v Speaker 1>Lackavoli did not respond to multiple interview requests. We were

0:39:34.440 --> 0:39:38.359
<v Speaker 1>unable to reach Kathy Lookavoli. Pete Lakavoi Senior is dead.

0:39:39.200 --> 0:39:42.239
<v Speaker 1>Ben Bowen is our executive producer. Paul Decant is our

0:39:42.239 --> 0:39:46.640
<v Speaker 1>supervising producer. Chris Brown is our assistant producer. Seth Nicholas

0:39:46.680 --> 0:39:50.719
<v Speaker 1>Johnson is our producer. Sam T. Garden is our research assistant.

0:39:51.000 --> 0:39:54.360
<v Speaker 1>And I'm your host and executive producer, John Wallzac. You

0:39:54.400 --> 0:39:57.200
<v Speaker 1>can find me on Twitter at at John Wallzac, j

0:39:57.400 --> 0:40:01.920
<v Speaker 1>O n w A l se z A k. Our

0:40:02.000 --> 0:40:07.080
<v Speaker 1>team has been amazing. Ben Paul, Chris Seth, and Sam

0:40:07.120 --> 0:40:09.719
<v Speaker 1>thank you and thank you to I Heart for supporting

0:40:09.760 --> 0:40:13.560
<v Speaker 1>this show. Paul is also a filmmaker. He directed a

0:40:13.560 --> 0:40:16.520
<v Speaker 1>movie that came out last year called Annie in the City.

0:40:16.680 --> 0:40:19.840
<v Speaker 1>Check it out on Amazon, A, n n E y

0:40:20.160 --> 0:40:23.080
<v Speaker 1>in the City. On a personal note, thank you to

0:40:23.160 --> 0:40:26.560
<v Speaker 1>my friends and family, especially the three fearless women who

0:40:26.640 --> 0:40:30.160
<v Speaker 1>helped raise me, my mom, aunt and grandma and my

0:40:30.280 --> 0:40:34.200
<v Speaker 1>dad too. A shout out to my alma mater umc Asheville,

0:40:34.480 --> 0:40:37.160
<v Speaker 1>and a special thanks to Jen and Rob for studio

0:40:37.239 --> 0:40:40.840
<v Speaker 1>space and for your support. Missing in Alaska is a

0:40:40.880 --> 0:40:45.800
<v Speaker 1>work of investigative journalism. I spent nine years researching this story,

0:40:45.840 --> 0:40:48.880
<v Speaker 1>but most journalists don't have the luxury of spending years,

0:40:49.040 --> 0:40:52.279
<v Speaker 1>or months or even weeks on a single story. To

0:40:52.400 --> 0:40:56.799
<v Speaker 1>that end, please support local media, regardless of your politics.

0:40:56.840 --> 0:41:00.000
<v Speaker 1>A strong local press is vital to hold everyone accountable,

0:41:00.600 --> 0:41:03.319
<v Speaker 1>and I'd like to ask you a favor. If you can,

0:41:03.760 --> 0:41:07.520
<v Speaker 1>please donate to the Lens, a small nonprofit news outlet

0:41:07.560 --> 0:41:10.880
<v Speaker 1>in my city, New Orleans. Go to the Lens NOLA

0:41:11.080 --> 0:41:16.319
<v Speaker 1>dot org. That's the Lens Nola dot org. Finally, there's

0:41:16.400 --> 0:41:19.719
<v Speaker 1>also an amazing nonprofit that cleans up marine debris and

0:41:19.760 --> 0:41:23.400
<v Speaker 1>Prince William Sound called Gulf of Alaska Keeper or go

0:41:23.600 --> 0:41:26.560
<v Speaker 1>a k Thank you to Chris Pallister, who founded the

0:41:26.640 --> 0:41:29.960
<v Speaker 1>organization for consulting with us before our trip to henshin

0:41:30.000 --> 0:41:32.920
<v Speaker 1>Brook Island. You can learn more about and donate to

0:41:33.600 --> 0:41:37.560
<v Speaker 1>go a K at go a k dot org. That's

0:41:37.640 --> 0:41:41.480
<v Speaker 1>go a k dot org. Missing in Alaska is a

0:41:41.520 --> 0:41:46.719
<v Speaker 1>co production of I Heart Media and Greenfork Media.