1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 1: Body bags with Joseph's gotten more. Probably the fondest memory 2 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: I have from my childhood has to do with my 3 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: mother's father and my father's mother, and both of those 4 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:25,959 Speaker 1: centered on fishing on both sides of the family. I remember, 5 00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: even as at a very young age, of having a 6 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:33,839 Speaker 1: cane pole in my hand and fishing with kataba worms 7 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:37,280 Speaker 1: that my grandmother had, like I don't know, six or 8 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 1: seven of these bohemoths in her yard. And kataba worms 9 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: are very resilient. You can go and you take a 10 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: long pole and you knock them off the leaves, and 11 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: you gather them up and you put them in peat 12 00:00:48,880 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 1: moss and you can freeze them. And they are the 13 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 1: best bait in the world, particularly in Louisiana, where the 14 00:00:56,720 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: water is black and dark deep. You catch all manner 15 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:05,920 Speaker 1: of fish. You catch what are called bull brim these 16 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:13,800 Speaker 1: big big brim panfish, if you will, and catfish as well. 17 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:19,319 Speaker 1: And I spent many years fishing both the black value 18 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:24,559 Speaker 1: and by you de seared in Monroe, Louisiana with my grandparents, 19 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 1: and pleasant memories. And the thing about being on a 20 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 1: by you is this, It is a kind of beauty 21 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 1: that if you've never experienced it. It's striking when you 22 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:41,400 Speaker 1: sit there and you contemplate, because one of my favorite 23 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 1: things in the world is to see cypress knees coming 24 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 1: up out of the water, allowing these trees to breathe 25 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: and to grow the shade they provide, and to watch 26 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: the Spanish moss kind of drift back and forth in 27 00:01:56,080 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 1: the breeze. Something very peaceful about it. But what if 28 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: what if you're walking along a byou somewhere in the 29 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 1: Southern United States, particularly in the Houston area, and you 30 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: happen to look over into the water and you see 31 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 1: what you think is a body, and you say, certainly, 32 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: that's not a human body, But as you approach, you 33 00:02:23,800 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: see that it is. And it's one of many bodies 34 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: that have been recovered over a very short period of 35 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,280 Speaker 1: time that have drawn the attention of the media, not 36 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: just in the United States, but from around the world. Today, 37 00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about the bodies that seem to 38 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: be popping up in the byus of Houston, Texas. I'm 39 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:58,560 Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan and this is body Bags, Dave. I 40 00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: got to tell you, man, most people I've found don't 41 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 1: know what a by you is. I think that some 42 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:11,959 Speaker 1: people languish under this idea that it's a lake by. 43 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 2: You Labatry, Alabama. I thought it was from wrest Gumbe. 44 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 1: Oh boy. Yeah, and I've actually been to buy you labattery. 45 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:23,799 Speaker 1: It's not too far away from one of my favorite 46 00:03:23,880 --> 00:03:26,080 Speaker 1: vacation spots. Tell me what it is. 47 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:28,639 Speaker 2: Tell me what we're talking about here when we talk 48 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 2: about the Bayous around Houston. What is a by you? 49 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 2: And yea, is Houston really built on a swamp? I 50 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 2: mean that's what it sounds like. 51 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:38,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it is, it is, and it's I'm not 52 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 1: knocking Houston by the way. Love Houston, Yeah, yeah, I 53 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 1: love Houston too. And but I got to tell you 54 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 1: if you if you think Atlanta traffic is bad, which 55 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: is bad, go to Houston. There's always somebody that will 56 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: that will want up. Yet, Yeah, Houston is no pleasure 57 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:59,040 Speaker 1: cruise when it comes to sitting in traffic. So many 58 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 1: highways everywhere, and it's a massive I mean it's a 59 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: massive city. You know. People forget how big Houston is. 60 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: It's always in the top five, you know, in the country, 61 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: and it is expansive to say the very least. But 62 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:16,559 Speaker 1: you know what they say, everything's bigger in Texas. And yeah, 63 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 1: so Houston, which essentially sits back a few miles from 64 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 1: the Gulf of Mexico, sits in what would be reclaimed land. 65 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 1: I guess if you want to frame it that way, 66 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:37,720 Speaker 1: it's marshy, swampy, you know, and it's not at all 67 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 1: dissimilar from the area that I grew up in Louisiana, 68 00:04:40,839 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 1: and you know those points south. We've got bayous literally 69 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:49,280 Speaker 1: in Louisiana, and of course in our state here in Alabama, 70 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 1: we have bayous here you got to go down to 71 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: the coast essentially to get close to them. And throughout 72 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 1: Mississippi you have bayous. So yeah, they're all over the 73 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 1: southern the United States, and they're they're very unique. I 74 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: think the beauty of them is all of the wildlife 75 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:09,360 Speaker 1: that live in them. It's just this it's a world 76 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: in and of itself, very peaceful, by the way, because 77 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: you don't really detect that the water is moving, but 78 00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:20,720 Speaker 1: it actually is. There's actually a current that flows through 79 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:21,560 Speaker 1: a byu. 80 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 2: And sitting there it's not though it's not it's not 81 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:27,719 Speaker 2: sitting there. 82 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's like being you know, on the 83 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: Colorado River or something where you're going to get swept 84 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: away by a huge current, but there is a current there. 85 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 1: And most of the time when you see, like most 86 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 1: of the bayous in America are kind of concentrated around 87 00:05:43,680 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 1: the Mississippi Delta, Okay, so they are these kind of 88 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 1: little offshoots, you know, of these waterways that come off, 89 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 1: and of course everything eventually flows, you know, towards or 90 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: down to the Gulf of Mexico, and it's not too 91 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:01,919 Speaker 1: much different. You know, over in Houston, everything's flowing. So 92 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 1: one of the problems that you have as a medical 93 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:09,279 Speaker 1: legal death investigator, Dave, is when you find when you 94 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 1: find a body that is actually a float in water, 95 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:17,919 Speaker 1: one of the biggest questions that you ask is is 96 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: there a boat ramp nearby? Where could and here's a 97 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:24,040 Speaker 1: term that we use, this is an industry term. If 98 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:30,280 Speaker 1: you want to where did they make entry? You know, 99 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:32,720 Speaker 1: how did the body get into the water. Is there 100 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 1: a bridge that they could have fallen off of? Is 101 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:36,919 Speaker 1: there a boat ramp where they could have been deposited from? 102 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 1: And also if there, if you suspect that it's a homicide, 103 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,720 Speaker 1: is there a boat launch where they somebody could have 104 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:46,520 Speaker 1: launched a boat gotten into the water and taken the 105 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 1: body and deposited it there. Another consideration is is that 106 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:58,479 Speaker 1: if you have malevolent intent, if you will to do 107 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:04,280 Speaker 1: something with a victim, say someone that's already dead, one 108 00:07:04,279 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: of the things you begin to think about, David is disposal. 109 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 1: And you got to admit, I'd say, I'd argue that 110 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: probably the apex predator in the United States swims in 111 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,280 Speaker 1: these waters, and that's the alligator. And so they're like 112 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:25,360 Speaker 1: garbage cans. They eat anything they can, particularly bodies that 113 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 1: are advanced in a state of decomposition, because they don't 114 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 1: chew real well. They bite, tear, and swallow. 115 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:37,320 Speaker 2: And so that's why about all you can tell you 116 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 2: can keep a show with duct tape, right because. 117 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you've seen people do that and people holding 118 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 1: the jaws together and that sort of thing. They don't 119 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:46,920 Speaker 1: have a great chewing now, they don't have a great 120 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 1: they've got a great tearing motion. Uh. But most of 121 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: the time, with alligators in particular, you'll see, and I 122 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: think I've talked about this before, they create, for lack 123 00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 1: of better term, their own kind of meat locker under 124 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 1: the banks of bayous streams rivers that sort of thing. 125 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 1: They swish it out with their tail and they can 126 00:08:09,200 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: go beneath and depose it prey under there and let 127 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: how can I phrase this, Let the meat tender ese okay, 128 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:21,240 Speaker 1: and then they'll go back and they'll eat it. I 129 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 1: had a buddy of mine, I know I've said this before, 130 00:08:23,560 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 1: that fell through as he was bank fishing, fell through 131 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 1: one of these meat lockers that an alligator had had 132 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 1: established there, and there were deer carcasses in there, like 133 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: little baby deer like fun. Wow, yeah, yeah, It's quite terrifying. 134 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: And he's he's like a manly man, not like me. 135 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:48,720 Speaker 1: I mean, he's like a real, you know, manly man. 136 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 1: And you could see the terror in his eyes. You 137 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:52,520 Speaker 1: know that. Do it all right? 138 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 2: Now, let's get down to the nitty gritty here of 139 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: what actually is happening. We've got a story that is 140 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 2: coming out of Houston that is making headlines. And for 141 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 2: those in the industry, the headline it means so much. 142 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 2: And if you can put a number, double digit number 143 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:13,480 Speaker 2: and the term serial killer in the same headline, you're 144 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 2: going to get views. And I was looking through this 145 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 2: because a couple of days ago, Joe, there was a 146 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 2: story it said sixteen bodies found in and US state 147 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:33,840 Speaker 2: as police address sellerial killer theories. Retired detective gives warning 148 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 2: after serial killer fears grow in US. Fifty three bodies 149 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 2: have been found in Houston. These are the types of things. 150 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 2: And I've got sixteen nineteen, twenty twenty four. Those are 151 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:53,000 Speaker 2: the numbers of bodies that have been pulled out of 152 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 2: the byous around Houston. Why is there such a difference 153 00:09:56,520 --> 00:10:00,400 Speaker 2: in numbers because people don't do their accurate reas search. 154 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:02,839 Speaker 2: So here's the reality. If you actually go to the 155 00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:06,840 Speaker 2: Harris County Institute of Forensic Sciences. Doesn't that sound official? 156 00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 1: It does sound efficial. 157 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:13,439 Speaker 2: It is official. It's the Harris County Institute of Forensic Sciences. 158 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:15,239 Speaker 2: For crying out loud in twenty. 159 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 1: Twenty place where all of the forensic pathologists would hang out. 160 00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 2: I'm thinking they have a cigar club. You know they 161 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 2: have trivia nights on Tuesday. Yeah. Twenty twenty three, there 162 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:28,480 Speaker 2: were nine bodies pulled out of the bayous around Houston, 163 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 2: Texas in twenty twenty four. Twenty bodies were pulled so 164 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:37,840 Speaker 2: far in twenty twenty five, twenty four. Now that is 165 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 2: an incremental increase from last year. This year, but it's 166 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 2: a sizable increase from the nine in twenty twenty three. 167 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: Those numbers are worth looking at. That's where the fifty 168 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,760 Speaker 2: three bodies comes from. But to actually break it down. 169 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 2: Of the fifty three since twenty twenty three, according to 170 00:10:55,840 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 2: the Harris County Institute of Forensic Sciences, the manner of 171 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 2: death Joe YEP fifteen accident and thirteen of those were 172 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 2: accidental drowning. Nine are pending, three suicide, three homicide. And 173 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 2: of those three I did find out they have two 174 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:24,719 Speaker 2: arrests that have been made and the third one is 175 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 2: still under investigation. And then there's this number twenty three 176 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 2: undetermined manner of death undetermined in twenty three bodies pulled 177 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:43,120 Speaker 2: out of the bayous around Houston, Texas. That's the number 178 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 2: I want to focus on. Joseph Scott Morgan. Yeah, that's 179 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:48,480 Speaker 2: the scary one. 180 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, it is, And particularly when you use the U word, 181 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 1: uh huh undetermined, because it's got a I don't know, tonally, 182 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:01,600 Speaker 1: it's got this kind of ominous sense about it, doesn't it. 183 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 1: You know, it's undetermined. We don't know what it is. 184 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:05,839 Speaker 1: Let me tell you why. You know, how I was 185 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:09,719 Speaker 1: talking about how beautiful. I think values are I truly do. 186 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:11,680 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just one of these things. I've got 187 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 1: a couple of watercolors that that I have of by 188 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 1: you settings. The reason that I think that they are undetermined, Dave, 189 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:29,559 Speaker 1: is that not only are vyu's beautiful, but they are 190 00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 1: savage as well, Dave. They you know, uh, these environments, 191 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,080 Speaker 1: I don't know that people fully appreciate how dynamic they 192 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 1: are and how difficult it is to survive in a 193 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: by you That's why, you know, the Cajuns are so 194 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 1: renowned because they were dumped out there after the British 195 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 1: random ran them out of Canada and they settled in 196 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: southwestern Louisiana and they've turned it into, you know, a 197 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 1: grand place to live. But that comes through hardship and 198 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 1: you have to make your way in that environment or 199 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: the environment will consume you. And it'll consume you if 200 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 1: you allow it to. And of course, uh Cajun culture, 201 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 1: Uh they haven't. They They've leaned into it. And boy, 202 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 1: you know what a grand place of is if you 203 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:35,080 Speaker 1: ever get a chance to go to southwestern Louisiana and 204 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 1: listen to that beautiful music and of course the food, 205 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 1: Oh my lord, the food. I love. 206 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 2: How good you are on that place, Joe. If you 207 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:45,080 Speaker 2: don't have a place in your life that you talk 208 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 2: about the way Joe talks about Louisiana, go find it. 209 00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:52,319 Speaker 2: You haven't lived life until you have that attachment. 210 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 1: I'm serious. Well, I mean you talk about I don't know, 211 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:57,800 Speaker 1: you know, I'm really hoping that Louisiana Bureau of Tourism 212 00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:00,440 Speaker 1: will will hook us up with a sponsorship up here. 213 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: And uh, we're gonna be doing live broadcast on BYUE TESH. 214 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 1: How's that sound. So we'll go down there and do that. 215 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 2: But yeah, uh, I'll be back in the studio, you'll 216 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 2: be on remote. 217 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 1: I'll do it, brother. Yeah. And but you know the 218 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:18,679 Speaker 1: thing about it is in these environments, they are very harsh. 219 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:21,479 Speaker 1: You know, I talked about the animal life relative to allegators. 220 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:24,520 Speaker 1: It's not just that, you know, it's it's the fact 221 00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: that the BYU, much like swamps, it consumes everything around it. 222 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 1: You know, you're you're going to become fodder at some 223 00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 1: point in time. Uh, and how much more so the dead? Right? 224 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 1: So if you when we have these undetermined deaths like 225 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: they're talking about in Houston. What was that number again? 226 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 1: Brother that you twenty three was twenty three. 227 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,720 Speaker 2: Three undetermined of the fifty three bodies in the last 228 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 2: three years. 229 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: You look at that and the the environment that a 230 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 1: decendent is found in where the body is actually deposited 231 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 1: in that area. When I say deposited, don't that's not sinister. 232 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 1: It just means that it's the location the body wound 233 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,880 Speaker 1: up in and it can be deposited by another person. 234 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: If it's a homicide, I suppose, and I've got a 235 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: story I want to talk about that in just a second. 236 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: But it can also mean that the person may have 237 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: just fallen over dead, they drowned, fell off a bridge, 238 00:15:27,880 --> 00:15:29,840 Speaker 1: they may have had a heart attack while sitting on 239 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 1: the side of the bank, you know, cane pole fishing, 240 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 1: who knows, you know. But the thing about it is 241 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 1: the body changes so rapidly in that environment. It is 242 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 1: not surprising on any level whatsoever that they wouldn't have 243 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 1: a causal effect here. Let me rephrase that they don't 244 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: necessarily have a cause. That's a parent and one of 245 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 1: the things that you're going to be looking for, as 246 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 1: we've talked about on body backs, you know, through our lessons, 247 00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 1: you know, we're looking for hemorrhage. Right, Well, if you 248 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:02,680 Speaker 1: don't have any soft tissue left, or the soft tissue 249 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 1: you have is so compromised, you're not going to be 250 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 1: able to appreciate things like marks on the neck and 251 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:11,720 Speaker 1: maybe some types of other trauma. You're going to be looking, say, 252 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: for instance, for a defect in the skull, like a 253 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:19,360 Speaker 1: gunshot wound. Okay, well, if you're absent that, you can 254 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 1: exclude that. But then you're scratching your head and you're thinking, well, 255 00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 1: what else could it be. Well, if the body is 256 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: also so decomposed or degraded at that point in time, 257 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 1: guess what other problem you run into. You can't do 258 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: an effective talks panel and that and it would not 259 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 1: surprise me in the least bit if you know a 260 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: certain percentage of these deaths, the twenty three that you 261 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 1: mentioned that they say that are undetermined might very well 262 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: remain undetermined or you just can't come up with an 263 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: answer for the immediate cause of death. And of course 264 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:58,359 Speaker 1: the manner of death undetermined is just an overall classification. 265 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:00,880 Speaker 1: But you're still not going to the heart of the 266 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:04,159 Speaker 1: matter relative to what brought about the death, What was 267 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:08,520 Speaker 1: the mechanism that brought this person to their end. And 268 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 1: in that spirit, you don't want to commit to something 269 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 1: I think scientifically and not be able to back it 270 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:19,120 Speaker 1: up with data. And right now I submit to you, 271 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 1: brother Dave, that there is no data at this point 272 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 1: in time. There are certain things where maybe just maybe 273 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:33,680 Speaker 1: they are absent something that's viable that they can actually 274 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:39,120 Speaker 1: use to make an assessment with. Because many times bodies 275 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 1: in water like this, Dave, and particularly around marine life 276 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: will disarticulate. You might be missing pieces, you know, if 277 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:48,919 Speaker 1: you're thinking about if you're thinking of a death investigation 278 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 1: as a big puzzle, and I think that's a great analogy. 279 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:53,919 Speaker 1: You have to have all the pieces to make it 280 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 1: come together, and sometimes body particulates and you're not going 281 00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 1: to have everything there to examine. 282 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 2: Right We've got again twenty three bodies pulled from the 283 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 2: bodies in the last three years that we do not 284 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 2: have a manner of death that they've settled on. But 285 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:15,640 Speaker 2: there are some things that as we all, I think 286 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 2: and understand those of you listening to podcasts like Body 287 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:21,600 Speaker 2: Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan and some of the other 288 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:24,280 Speaker 2: crime podcasts and other shows that you and I are 289 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 2: both on, there are a lot of people paying attention 290 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 2: to a lot of different crimes, and they kind of 291 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:34,720 Speaker 2: focus in on certain aspects of crime and run with it. 292 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:39,399 Speaker 2: And when we've got twenty three bodies over three years undetermined, 293 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:42,239 Speaker 2: how the matter of death, that's got people thinking, and 294 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 2: that thought process goes immediately to serial killer. I found 295 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 2: it fascinating when we were doing fascinating That sounds disrespectful. 296 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,840 Speaker 1: No, no, no, it is. It's fascinating for our purposes. No, 297 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 1: you go right ahead, you use that word. That's fine, 298 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:55,639 Speaker 1: that's okay. 299 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,040 Speaker 2: When we were talking about ed Gean, you and I 300 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:03,320 Speaker 2: both were like, he is lumped together or labeled as 301 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 2: a serial killer, but in reality, I don't think he was. 302 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 2: I think you're dead on right that he was a 303 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 2: grave robber and he was a sick file. Yeah, I 304 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 2: mean to the worst order. But that's different than a 305 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 2: serial killer. He's not like Ted Bundy. And when I 306 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 2: look at what's happening here in the Bayous, I'm curious 307 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:27,080 Speaker 2: because I'm noticing that we've got male and female YEP 308 00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 2: ages from twenty to the sixties. We don't have any 309 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:35,439 Speaker 2: kind of pattern, like if we had ten college age 310 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 2: males found with certain things, clothing, whatever, just something common, 311 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 2: one thing common other than age. I would say, maybe 312 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 2: there's something to really look at here. And I'm not 313 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 2: saying that it shouldn't be studied. But Joe, what are 314 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,640 Speaker 2: we really seeing when we look at this whole picture? 315 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:57,879 Speaker 2: Is there any kind of common thread? 316 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 1: Well, I don't know. I mean, can't look at this 317 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:04,480 Speaker 1: name that comes to mind, John Wayne Gacy. You know 318 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:09,480 Speaker 1: you mentioned males. You know, you can't crawl space. You know, 319 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:11,879 Speaker 1: you go down there and you've got these males of 320 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,120 Speaker 1: a certain age that are all found in there. We're 321 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,879 Speaker 1: looking for patterns, right, And that's what you always have 322 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 1: to you know, you always have to look for. Do 323 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 1: you have a perpetrator that's out there? 324 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 2: That is. 325 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 1: You know you even look at like the green really 326 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: green river killer? Yeah, you know, and there's a pattern, yeah, Gar, Yeah, absolutely. 327 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:34,560 Speaker 1: And you begin to think of Ted Mundy. You know, 328 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,720 Speaker 1: you hate saying his name. He gets said all the time. 329 00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 1: We've got to come up with a new example. But yeah, 330 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:44,480 Speaker 1: I mean we have so many you know, how sick 331 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 1: is that? Yeah? Oh, I know it really is. Uh. 332 00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:51,120 Speaker 1: And you begin to look for these patterns, uh, and 333 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:54,400 Speaker 1: certain patterns that you know that many of our listeners, 334 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 1: I know friends are fully aware of, you know, what 335 00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:02,160 Speaker 1: was the cause of death, because if you're thinking about strangulation, 336 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:07,280 Speaker 1: if you're thinking about gunshot, wound, bludgeoning, stabbing, you know, 337 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:09,720 Speaker 1: all those sorts of things. Most of the time these 338 00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,639 Speaker 1: individuals are going to stick with a specific methodology for killing. 339 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 1: And I'm not seeing this here. You know, you're talking 340 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: about a city, well, let's just say Harris County, Texas, 341 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 1: which is where Houston is. You've got a population of 342 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:34,760 Speaker 1: roughly five million people. Okay, You're gonna have people die, 343 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 1: all right, and then you've got hundreds and hundreds of 344 00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:43,640 Speaker 1: miles of shoreline in this area. Remember you're talking about 345 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:47,399 Speaker 1: a city that is built in on the surface. You know, 346 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 1: it's built on this kind of marshy environment. You know, 347 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 1: you've got values that run everywhere by you. By the way, 348 00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: is a slow moving body of water. They can have 349 00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:03,199 Speaker 1: tributaries that come off of stream Thames creeks, rivers, and 350 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,439 Speaker 1: they can be feeders to other locations and there is 351 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 1: a current you know, that flows through them. A lot 352 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:13,159 Speaker 1: of these values that they have there, and this is 353 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:17,880 Speaker 1: fascinating to me, actually flow beneath the bridges that are 354 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:23,199 Speaker 1: underneath major interstate highways. How much stuff happens on interstate highways. Oh, 355 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 1: my lord, particularly in big cities. You're talking about tons 356 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:31,879 Speaker 1: of homeless encampments all over the place. And I wanted, 357 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:33,800 Speaker 1: I got to tell you the story. I was actually 358 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 1: just talking about graduate assistant about this. She was saying, 359 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 1: Professor Maurty, what are you all going to talk about today? 360 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 1: And I said, well, David and I are going to 361 00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:44,639 Speaker 1: speak about the the Houston, all these Houston discries. I 362 00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:48,120 Speaker 1: really said. I saw this in the news. I was like, yeah, yeah, 363 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: I said, there's a lot to be made of the 364 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:59,120 Speaker 1: idea that there's a huge homeless population in Houston. Well, why, well, 365 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:02,240 Speaker 1: it's very climate. You know, I got to tell you, 366 00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:05,399 Speaker 1: if I'm going to be homeless, I don't want to 367 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:10,080 Speaker 1: be homeless like in Detroit or Chicago or any place 368 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:12,360 Speaker 1: like that in the wintertime. You know, Now it's miserable 369 00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 1: down in Houston during summertime, but you know, you're not 370 00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 1: fighting off frostbite down there. So it attracts a lot 371 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:25,040 Speaker 1: of homeless or as they say now the unhoused population. 372 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: So you've got these people that will inhabit these areas, 373 00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 1: particularly under overpasses, and Dave, I got to tell you 374 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: the story real quick. I was just telling my grave 375 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:36,919 Speaker 1: assistant about this. Did you know I worked a case 376 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:43,440 Speaker 1: one time at a homeless encampment that is, and you've 377 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:48,920 Speaker 1: actually driven over this homeless encampment. It's under I eighty 378 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 1: five in Atlanta. As soon as seventy five and eighty 379 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:55,959 Speaker 1: five split, it goes off to the northeast like you're 380 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: heading in Greenville, South Carolina. Dave, I got called out 381 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:03,719 Speaker 1: on a death there one time where there were and 382 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: I talked to the cops that worked this area because 383 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 1: I was amazed. It was like when I walked into 384 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: When I walked into I felt like Dorothy in a 385 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 1: Wizard of Oz when they opened the doors to Oz 386 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:21,880 Speaker 1: and she walks in and it's all marvelous and everything. 387 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,840 Speaker 1: It's just the opposite. I got called out to this 388 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: overpass or beneath the overpass, Dave, there was a population 389 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:34,160 Speaker 1: of close to four hundred people living under this bridge 390 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 1: out there in this specific area where we as far 391 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 1: as I could see, there was nothing but homeless palettes, 392 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: laid out tents, sleeping bags, all these sorts of things. 393 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: And in this particular case that I got called out on, 394 00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 1: just to give me an idea of the flavor of 395 00:24:55,960 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: life in this dwelling. There was a lady that was 396 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:06,120 Speaker 1: decomposing beneath the bridge. There there were two palettes that 397 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:10,520 Speaker 1: were laid immediately adjacent to her. She's been dead for 398 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 1: six months, and the guys that were living next to 399 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: her had not left. They laid there were her body decomposed. 400 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:21,399 Speaker 1: Oh come on, yeah, yeah, I got to talk to 401 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: one of them. One of them was off doing something 402 00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:26,679 Speaker 1: else while we were doing the investigation. But you know, 403 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 1: we're in that cramp space and I'll never forget. I 404 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: had to stoop over to go in there, and I 405 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 1: had to stay stooped over for a protracted period of time. 406 00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 1: And you just you look and you take the measure 407 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,200 Speaker 1: of it. And it's really hard to take the measure 408 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: of it because you're seeing You're sitting here saying, I 409 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:44,879 Speaker 1: can't believe what I'm seeing. This is it's so vast, 410 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:49,000 Speaker 1: it just goes on forever. Well, Atlanta is tempered. It's 411 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 1: not as comfortable in the wintertime as Houston is, though, 412 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,160 Speaker 1: and so that population down there is even larger. Well, 413 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 1: you've got homeless encampments that are around bodies of water, 414 00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:04,600 Speaker 1: you know, the vyues, maybe underneath overpasses, which will get 415 00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: a lot of those. It's not surprising that you might 416 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 1: find people that have died and have either gone into 417 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,200 Speaker 1: the water on their own or have been cast off. 418 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,720 Speaker 1: You say, well, why would somebody cast off the body. Well, 419 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,800 Speaker 1: I'm here to answer that question for you. If you're 420 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 1: involved in illegal behavior, and you, along with your compatriots 421 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 1: that you're in dwelling with, are also in the same lifestyle, 422 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:36,600 Speaker 1: the last thing you want to draw attention to is 423 00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: a dead body among you. And so I've had bodies 424 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 1: that have been taken out of like drug houses and 425 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,879 Speaker 1: wrapped in carpets, wrapped in blankets, dumped like a mile 426 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:52,439 Speaker 1: away from where their point of origin was. Just and 427 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 1: it's not that the people did anything nefarious, they just 428 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:58,280 Speaker 1: don't want a dead body around them because if they 429 00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:02,200 Speaker 1: find a dead body around them, you run the risk 430 00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 1: of having the cops investigating what you're doing. And so 431 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: it's like guilt by association in their minds, you know, 432 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,640 Speaker 1: so they'll cast a body off. 433 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,880 Speaker 2: Wow, that actually makes sense, though, Joe, because going back 434 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 2: to the story about Atlanta, where You've got a decomposing 435 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,879 Speaker 2: woman for six months, and people are still right there 436 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,760 Speaker 2: because what are their options? You know, if we call 437 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,000 Speaker 2: attention to this, we could all be in trouble here, 438 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,240 Speaker 2: even though we might not have done anything to cause 439 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,640 Speaker 2: their death. So talking about the homeless in the cabinet, 440 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 2: and that leads me to the next part of this, 441 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 2: which is again of the people's bodies that are the 442 00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:43,080 Speaker 2: manner of death is undetermined. Being at twenty three over 443 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 2: the last three years, I wonder how many people have 444 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 2: been matched up against those who might be missing, you know, 445 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 2: in that area, in an area that is like Houston, 446 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,920 Speaker 2: you've got twenty three people a day going missing. I 447 00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:56,680 Speaker 2: would imagine, you know, you've got a lot of people 448 00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 2: that go missing on a fairly regular basis. They would 449 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:03,240 Speaker 2: be checking against these two, correct. 450 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 1: I would think so, And a lot of that is 451 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:09,640 Speaker 1: going to be heavily depended upon. I hate to break 452 00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 1: it down like this, but and it's cold. I mean, 453 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 1: it's cold, and it's cruel, but it's the reality. What 454 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: kind of manpower do you have in order to go 455 00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:20,080 Speaker 1: through each and every one of these cases to try 456 00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:24,040 Speaker 1: to marry it up. And there will be people you know. 457 00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: I know for a fact there will be people that 458 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:30,160 Speaker 1: will say, well, you know, they need to commit all 459 00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 1: resources to this to try to figure this out. Well, 460 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 1: it's been going on for a long long time, you know, 461 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:41,880 Speaker 1: just like indigent burials. You know, you people get buried 462 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 1: in enginent graves, indigent graves all the time, and you know, 463 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,720 Speaker 1: no one ever really thinks about it at all. Well, 464 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 1: there are people that are dying day in and day out, 465 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,640 Speaker 1: and you never have the cause of death. Sometimes you 466 00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: don't know who they are, knows that they've come to 467 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 1: the end of their life in this one specific location. 468 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:10,560 Speaker 1: And I got to tell you, just because somebody does 469 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:12,920 Speaker 1: in fact come to their end and is found in 470 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:17,160 Speaker 1: a bayou, it doesn't necessarily mean that they wound up 471 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 1: there at the hand of a serial killer. You know, Dave. 472 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:42,000 Speaker 1: A few years ago, I went to Texas with Kim 473 00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:50,520 Speaker 1: kimy Sue in tow and went to crime Con and 474 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 1: crime Con was being held in Austin. Never been to 475 00:29:55,320 --> 00:30:01,280 Speaker 1: Austin and had a grand time, absolutely grand tom favorite restaurant, 476 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 1: Terry Black's Barbecue. Oh my god, Yeah, I got I 477 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:08,960 Speaker 1: got beef ribs there. They look like you remember the 478 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:13,360 Speaker 1: opening scene from Flintstones where the car turns over. That's 479 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 1: what the ribs look like. Yeah, oh my lord, just 480 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 1: Terry Black's just incredible, I mean, absolutely incredible. But something 481 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:30,240 Speaker 1: I don't like about Austin is the Lady Bird Lake deaths. 482 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: And we how many times have we heard about this 483 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 1: over there? And they tried, you know, they tried to 484 00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 1: stir the pot over this for so long where they're 485 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:43,400 Speaker 1: saying that there is an active serial killer in Austin, 486 00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 1: Texas and two and it isn't it funny? You know? 487 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: It kind of ebbs and flows, doesn't it. You know, 488 00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: we were hearing about that in the news all the time, 489 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:55,520 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden it kind of fell off 490 00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 1: the map, now, didn't it. Because and this goes back 491 00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 1: to your earlier, earlier comment, I love that you said this. Yeah, 492 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:05,320 Speaker 1: going from them clicks, baby, trying to get those clicks, 493 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,440 Speaker 1: you know, any any way that you possibly can. And 494 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 1: just because you have people that turn up dead and 495 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:13,480 Speaker 1: a body of water does not mean that you've got 496 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,920 Speaker 1: some kind of serial killer at work here. And you know, 497 00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: those those cases as well, you know, cut across all 498 00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:26,360 Speaker 1: kinds of demographic lines, you know, and causal effects as well. 499 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 2: You know something you were talking about a minute ago. 500 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 2: It made me remember Michael Jordan's father, when Michael Jordan's dad, 501 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 2: when his body was found, arguably Michael Jordan, when his 502 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,479 Speaker 2: father was murdered. Michael Jordan had just won his first 503 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:49,800 Speaker 2: three p you know, won the world championship three times 504 00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,680 Speaker 2: in a row. It was ninety three, and he is, 505 00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:55,160 Speaker 2: you know, probably the most famous person on the planet. 506 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 2: And yet when his father died, you know, they're actually 507 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 2: looking for him for weeks, you know, he was out 508 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 2: of contact with him. And when they did find him, 509 00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:08,000 Speaker 2: it wasn't his whole body because he had actually his 510 00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:11,840 Speaker 2: body had been recovered in water in South Carolina or 511 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 2: right there on the North Carolina South Carolina. 512 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:17,280 Speaker 1: Border Marlboro County, South Carolina. 513 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 2: And they didn't have a place to store him, couldn't 514 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:22,200 Speaker 2: afford to really store him. And so after a certain 515 00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 2: period of time, they saved his hands, right yeah. 516 00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:30,360 Speaker 1: And I think they saved they and I might be misremembering, 517 00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 1: but I could have sworn they saved his jaws was 518 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,400 Speaker 1: teeth If I'm not myself or they might not, I 519 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,840 Speaker 1: know that they documented, they did a very thoroughdental examination 520 00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 1: on him. 521 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, and then they cremated the remains. And the reason 522 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 2: I'm pointing this out is because sometimes it sounds like 523 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 2: we're being cold or cruel about people who are homeless 524 00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:53,880 Speaker 2: or less fortunate financially. You're talking about a man who 525 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,600 Speaker 2: was unidentified, but his son was the most famous guy 526 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 2: on the planet and very wealthy, and it didn't matter. 527 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:03,640 Speaker 2: I mean, they didn't have a place to store mister 528 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,880 Speaker 2: Jordan's body, so they did what they had to do. 529 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 2: They documented that they could prove who he was when 530 00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 2: they actually were able to get the And so as 531 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:13,840 Speaker 2: we look at this, I approach it from that angle 532 00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 2: that talk about a real color blind society here, you know, 533 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 2: not seeing any green, black, red, doesn't matter. It's a 534 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 2: human being whose body has just turned up in the 535 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 2: vayu and we've got to figure out how. And I'm 536 00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:31,720 Speaker 2: going to guess they've been in the water, even for 537 00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 2: a short period of time in the water is not good. 538 00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:37,680 Speaker 2: And I can't imagine these are fresh. I imagine them 539 00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:39,960 Speaker 2: being in there for a while before they are recovered. 540 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,440 Speaker 2: The conditions can't be good. 541 00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:46,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, and death investigation is Here's the thing about 542 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:53,600 Speaker 1: it is that many people always took exception, and I've 543 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: had to check myself, okay, so I can be chief 544 00:33:56,720 --> 00:34:00,600 Speaker 1: among sinners here where you got to see or you're 545 00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 1: in the autopsy room and you say, well, I've seen 546 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 1: this before. You have to be very careful of using 547 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:10,600 Speaker 1: that phraseology. And here's why, because no two deaths are 548 00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 1: the same the dynamics. You might have something that closer resembles, 549 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:18,000 Speaker 1: and you've learned lessons from from that event and how 550 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:20,279 Speaker 1: to work the case and that sort of thing. No 551 00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,080 Speaker 1: two deaths are the same. There's going to be some 552 00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,319 Speaker 1: little nuance in there that's going to separate it from 553 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 1: the other. Now is it your job to find that 554 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 1: nuance every single time? Well, no, not necessarily, because we're 555 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:34,719 Speaker 1: not doing are comparison and contrast seminar here. We're doing 556 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,600 Speaker 1: a death investigation. But there are certain things that you're 557 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:40,799 Speaker 1: going to look for to either include or exclude the 558 00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,759 Speaker 1: scientific information. And I think that that's going to be 559 00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:48,440 Speaker 1: very important here in these cases. You know you've got 560 00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 1: and I can only imagine what the Mayor's office is 561 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:56,600 Speaker 1: like in Houston about this particular topic. I can assure 562 00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:00,200 Speaker 1: you they have one person that's on this where they've 563 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 1: been assigned it's going to be some press person where 564 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:07,120 Speaker 1: they're going to be talking about being consistent with our 565 00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:11,120 Speaker 1: statements every single time, because this thing has created such 566 00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:13,719 Speaker 1: a I'm not going to say firestorm, but let's face 567 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,120 Speaker 1: it, it's been cycling through the news now for a couple 568 00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:18,480 Speaker 1: of weeks, and they're going to have to have, you know, 569 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 1: people on task here. So it's going to be involved 570 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,640 Speaker 1: not just the press office with the mayor's office, but 571 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,880 Speaker 1: also more importantly law enforcement, you know, whether it's Harris 572 00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:33,759 Speaker 1: County law enforcement or City of Houston law enforcement. Dave, 573 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,960 Speaker 1: you've got and kind of just throw this at you 574 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 1: real quick, because this was fascinating to me. You know, 575 00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:47,600 Speaker 1: there is one Byue in particular that has come up 576 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:53,480 Speaker 1: in statements about these bodies that have been recovered, and 577 00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:00,600 Speaker 1: I think this goes back to let's see yet. So 578 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:04,440 Speaker 1: we've got twenty two bodies that this total has risen 579 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:09,240 Speaker 1: to in twenty twenty five, but over period of eleven 580 00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:15,160 Speaker 1: days in this past September. Davi's not just one by you. 581 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:19,840 Speaker 1: We've got white Oak by you, We've got Buffalo by you, 582 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:24,200 Speaker 1: we've got braize by you, we've got greens by you, 583 00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:29,120 Speaker 1: and we've got hunting by you, and we're talking about literally, 584 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,000 Speaker 1: if we want to measure it by shoreline, we're talking 585 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,520 Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds of miles of shoreline. You said, well, Morgan, 586 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 1: how can that be because we're talking about a city, 587 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,600 Speaker 1: and yes, it's a big city. You're talking hundreds and 588 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 1: hundreds of miles of shoreline. Yeah, you bet, you, you 589 00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,120 Speaker 1: bet you I am And this is why, because when 590 00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:49,160 Speaker 1: you have byus, they have these little interesting twists and 591 00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,040 Speaker 1: turns and eddy's that people don't think about, and they 592 00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:55,959 Speaker 1: curve through neighborhoods. You'll have homes built on byus. You'll 593 00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:58,600 Speaker 1: have these things that you never ever see. You know. 594 00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:00,800 Speaker 1: It's talking about the homeless in camp that you've driven 595 00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:04,000 Speaker 1: over before heading up to South Carolina, North Carolina. You 596 00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:06,120 Speaker 1: didn't know it was there, but you know you've got 597 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,919 Speaker 1: these you know, you've got these interstate highways that are 598 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,319 Speaker 1: passing over these values and people don't give it a 599 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: second thought. But the people that live around there, like 600 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: the homeless population, or maybe somebody steps out in their 601 00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:20,800 Speaker 1: backyard to have a smoked cigarette, drink c up coffee 602 00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:22,960 Speaker 1: out there and just look at the beauty of the bayue. 603 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:25,600 Speaker 1: They look down and they see, you know, an individual 604 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:28,479 Speaker 1: doing literally the dead man's float out there, and they're 605 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,040 Speaker 1: going to summon the authorities and come in. Or they 606 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:35,080 Speaker 1: find just an element of a body, maybe they see 607 00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 1: a whitewashed skull that's just floating out there, and there's 608 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:41,160 Speaker 1: some attachments that are still left and other things are missing, 609 00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:45,720 Speaker 1: and it is an absolute nightmare to try to narrow 610 00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: this thing down to work it, to work a case 611 00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:54,719 Speaker 1: that is waterborne as opposed to an event where say 612 00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:57,279 Speaker 1: we walk into somebody's backyard and they've been shot or 613 00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,759 Speaker 1: into their house and you've got hanging or you know, 614 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:05,360 Speaker 1: where everything is contained dave, when this vast geographic area 615 00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:09,560 Speaker 1: is so daunting that most people that have never been 616 00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,879 Speaker 1: in this kind of environment they can't fully they can't 617 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: fully appreciate or grasp it, right. And so that's one 618 00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:19,120 Speaker 1: of the things that investigators and cops in particular, you know, 619 00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:20,640 Speaker 1: are are struggling with right now. 620 00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:22,760 Speaker 2: All right, let me let me ask you this because 621 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,279 Speaker 2: we talked about it with Long Island serial killer with Lisk, 622 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,720 Speaker 2: about the possibility of there being more than one killer 623 00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:33,440 Speaker 2: using that dumping ground. Well here where we've got twenty 624 00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 2: three different bodies that are the manner of death has 625 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:40,919 Speaker 2: not been determined. There are theories. I want to throw 626 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:43,279 Speaker 2: one out to you, because if you get twenty three 627 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 2: bodies that you don't know how they doe, you don't 628 00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:49,719 Speaker 2: know the manner of death, you could have two or 629 00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:55,040 Speaker 2: three killers using these bayous as a dumping ground for 630 00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,279 Speaker 2: five or six of their victims, you. 631 00:38:57,239 --> 00:39:00,400 Speaker 1: Know, yeah, and you could, yes, absolutely. 632 00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:03,520 Speaker 2: Based on that one theory. And this is the only 633 00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,839 Speaker 2: one I really want to talk about because I'm this 634 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:11,560 Speaker 2: keeps popping up now. The Smiley Faced Killers plural. This 635 00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:16,640 Speaker 2: is a theory and it's controversial, but it's still a 636 00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:20,879 Speaker 2: theory and people are throwing it out there that it's 637 00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 2: a group of serial killers responsible for the deaths of 638 00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 2: dozens of college aged men across the country and primarily 639 00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:33,120 Speaker 2: in the Midwest, but still even like in Alabama a 640 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,680 Speaker 2: couple of years ago, college age guy after a football 641 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:40,640 Speaker 2: game out drinking, goes missing and is found in the 642 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:45,640 Speaker 2: river a couple of days later, and they still haven't 643 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,600 Speaker 2: solved that one, I don't think, And so that's one 644 00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:51,120 Speaker 2: of those could have been the Smiley Faced Killers, Like 645 00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 2: these are organized, disorganized groups of men, you know that 646 00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:02,280 Speaker 2: are gathering together to kill people and like fight club 647 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:04,560 Speaker 2: or something. Instead of a fight club, it's the smiley 648 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,160 Speaker 2: face club where they're finding people of a certain you 649 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,520 Speaker 2: know type and killing them and putting their bodies in water. 650 00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,040 Speaker 2: That's a theory, Joe, and it's getting some traction because 651 00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:16,799 Speaker 2: of all the crime related programs that are out there. 652 00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:19,040 Speaker 2: Because anybody with a computer and a connection to the 653 00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:22,719 Speaker 2: Internet can create something and put it out there. You 654 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:24,160 Speaker 2: don't know what's real and what isn't. 655 00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:32,479 Speaker 1: Okay, here's my response to that. Is it incumbent upon 656 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:38,319 Speaker 1: the police and the investigators the forensic scientists to disprove 657 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:44,839 Speaker 1: that theory or should it be taken into consideration at all? 658 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:50,160 Speaker 1: But should they be spending time looking for that pattern? Okay? 659 00:40:50,320 --> 00:40:53,440 Speaker 1: Well yeah, but I'd have to look at the intellectual 660 00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:58,120 Speaker 1: underpinning of this, the scientific underpinning. More specifically, how are 661 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:01,520 Speaker 1: you arriving at this conclusion. I'm not saying you, I'm 662 00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:06,800 Speaker 1: saying the universal you this kind of nebulous environment that's 663 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:14,279 Speaker 1: that's out there that creates, you know, these these questions. 664 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:18,520 Speaker 1: What conclusions are you arriving at that draw you to 665 00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:21,319 Speaker 1: this idea that you've got a group a network, if 666 00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:26,040 Speaker 1: you will, of killers that are coalescing around this one 667 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:29,720 Speaker 1: area and then not just this one area, but they've 668 00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:33,880 Speaker 1: apparently networked because they're involved in other geographic locations around 669 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:41,719 Speaker 1: the country. Now, is that possible? Uh? Yeah, I guess 670 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:46,680 Speaker 1: it is. Is it probable? I'd say probably not, you know, 671 00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:50,040 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know. Do they have meetings, you know, 672 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,800 Speaker 1: back to my my flintstones referenced to, you know, the 673 00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 1: the Royal Order of the Buffalo, you know, where they 674 00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:58,799 Speaker 1: wear the hats and the horns coming out of it. 675 00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:02,560 Speaker 1: I don't know. I means that is that plausible that 676 00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,440 Speaker 1: they're all getting together and that they're I guess they're 677 00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,480 Speaker 1: exchanging messages with one another on the dark web and 678 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,680 Speaker 1: they're saying, hey, guys, okay, we're getting together in Houston 679 00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:17,200 Speaker 1: and we're going to deposit these bodies and g Fred, 680 00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:19,120 Speaker 1: what kind of methodology are you going to use to 681 00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:22,000 Speaker 1: take this person's life? And are we all going to 682 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:25,480 Speaker 1: stay with the same group? I mean, are you know 683 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,799 Speaker 1: Fred likes to kill males and Sam likes to kill females? 684 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:34,279 Speaker 1: You know, I don't. I don't know, And so I 685 00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:38,399 Speaker 1: think that it's it's certainly interesting to sit around and entertaining, 686 00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:41,799 Speaker 1: as you know, as a verse as I am to 687 00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:44,719 Speaker 1: saying that, to have a lively discussion over a cup 688 00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:48,200 Speaker 1: of coffee about it, or maybe it's your computer screen. 689 00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:53,960 Speaker 1: But is it actually plausible? Is that possible? I don't know, 690 00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:59,440 Speaker 1: but I do know this compared to the other cases 691 00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:04,640 Speaker 1: right now now that we have been speaking about for 692 00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:08,680 Speaker 1: some time. Now, you know, we've got lisk Okay, Long 693 00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:14,239 Speaker 1: Island serial killer. We've got Ladybird Lake in Austin. Now 694 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:17,360 Speaker 1: we have and I'm wondering what name they're going to 695 00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:21,200 Speaker 1: give to give to this one down in Houston. I'm 696 00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:24,399 Speaker 1: still holding out for that. Oh and by the way, 697 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:27,600 Speaker 1: hey Dave, I forgot about another one. We've gotten this 698 00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:32,640 Speaker 1: as well. That's up in the northeast, right and you've 699 00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:35,640 Speaker 1: got an individual that is apparently or individuals that are 700 00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:38,560 Speaker 1: floating around this area, you know, that's up in the northeast. 701 00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:42,399 Speaker 1: Remember we we actually I was actually with our friends 702 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:46,759 Speaker 1: from cross Space podcast and did taped an episode of 703 00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:51,319 Speaker 1: their podcast at Crime con in Denver back in September 704 00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:56,759 Speaker 1: about that specific topic. Is there connectivity between any of this? Well, 705 00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:00,319 Speaker 1: right now, from what I can see is that there 706 00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:08,560 Speaker 1: are several points of connection. Primarily people are dead. We 707 00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:12,920 Speaker 1: don't have causal factors. We don't have any kind of 708 00:44:13,160 --> 00:44:19,080 Speaker 1: connection relative that we're aware of between some specter that's 709 00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:23,440 Speaker 1: out there killing people. But yet we do know that 710 00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:28,680 Speaker 1: they're being grouped together, they're being called specific things. And 711 00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:32,279 Speaker 1: remember those are buzzwords or buzz terms that you know, 712 00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:36,359 Speaker 1: we'll wind up with a lot of clicks. But at 713 00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:38,799 Speaker 1: the end of the day, this is what we have 714 00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:45,839 Speaker 1: to keep in mind. Each individual that is found dead, 715 00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:52,160 Speaker 1: whether it be in a bayou in southeast Texas, or 716 00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:58,440 Speaker 1: maybe along a Long Island Expressway, or maybe just outside 717 00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:08,000 Speaker 1: of Boston or maybe in Austin, Texas, every individual was 718 00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:12,839 Speaker 1: loved by somebody at one point in time. They're dead, 719 00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:18,839 Speaker 1: they're gone. Let's try to keep sanity as our watchword here, 720 00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:22,560 Speaker 1: and let's follow these cases and see where the science 721 00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:31,640 Speaker 1: leads us. I'm Jesseph Scott Morgan and this is Bodybags